Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52550
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Superstars and attendance (was Teemu Selanne, was +/- leaders)


Dean J. Falcione (posting from jrmst+8@pitt.edu) writes:
[I wrote:]

>>When the Pens got Mario, granted there was big publicity, etc, etc,
>>and interest was immediately generated.  Gretzky did the same thing for LA. 
>>However, imnsho, neither team would have seen a marked improvement in
>>attendance if the team record did not improve.  In the year before Lemieux
>>came, Pittsburgh finished with 38 points.  Following his arrival, the Pens
>>finished with 53, 76, 72, 81, 87, 72, 88, and 87 points, with a couple of
                          ^^
>>Stanley Cups thrown in.
      
>It was at this point the Pens attendance was near capacity (34 out of 40 
>sellouts) yet they hadn't made the playoffs since 1982.  How do you explain
>a 6th place team breaking attendance records when they haven't been to the
>playoffs in 7 years?  Mario Lemieux is the explanation, IMHO.  

>You could make a case that the *expectation* of an improving team that
>would make the playoffs is the reason. 

Funny you should mention it...this is exactly the case I was going to make.

>But I think the reason is Lemieux
>had a 168 point season and was the first non-Gretzky to win the Hart and
>Ross since 1980.  People turned out to watch him play. 

I will grant that a star like Mario will draw fans, even if the team sucks. 
But this is short term only; I still do not think the attendance increase 
will last, unless the team is a winning/competitive/improving/butt-kicking
one.  Pittsburgh was still getting better, so people continued to support
them.  If they suddenly dropped to, say, 50 points, you'd have knee surgery
for some of the people jumping off the bandwagon.  

>Also, the following year (88-89) the Pens had 89 points not 87. 

Ok.  My numbers came from the NHL Guide and Record Book. 

>They made the transaction to try and build a winner around Mario, that is 
>true.  But the improvement in attendance came before they started doing
>this (Coffey late in 1987) and before they even had a playoff bound team.
>A doubling of attendance occured in 1984-85 from the previous year.  An
>increase from 38 points to 53 points is not going to do that.  The arrival
>of Mario Lemieux is what did it. 

You can give the credit to Mario since he deserves it.  But my point is that
it wasn't Mario himself, but it was the *expectation* of things to come (i.e.
a winning team) that he created by being the next great hockey superstar. And
before anybody jumps in and says I'm nit-picking and mincing words, go back
and read from where this thread started...

It might help to think about what would go through a fan's mind who suddenly
found an interest in Mario and the Pens.  Was it "gee, Mario Lemieux is
amazing, I'll go watch him play", or was it "gee, now we've got a *kick*
*ass* guy on *our* side, I'll go watch him play".  I think it was the latter.

> Similar thing happened in L.A.   Before
>Gretzky's arrival, about 12000 per game.  After, constant sellouts.  They
>are STILL selling out every game despite showing little or no improvement
>since Gretzky's first year there.  How do you explain it?  People are going
>to see Gretzky.  they certainly aren't going to see a winner, they haven't
>GOT a winner.  They've had MUCH better teams in their past history than
>they currently have, yet they didn't draw as well then.

I don't think this is accurate.  The *tickets* sell, but people don't go to
the games.  I think this thread has already been discussed...season ticket
holders in LA don't always use their tickets.  So in effect, after the Kings
initial success following Gretzky's arrival (68 to 91 points, same source)
and corresponding attendance jump, there has been an effective drop in
attendance even though ticket sales may not have changed much.  

Whether or not the Kings are a 'winner' is debatable.  I claim that since
Gretzky's arrival they have at the very least been competitive...I also claim
that McNall has made a stupid move in trying to reassemble the Oiler
dynasty...but that's another story and included only because I don't like
McNall:-).  Anyway,  McNall did do some heavy marketing around Gretzky, and
that undoubtedly was also responsible for the attendance and merchandising
sales, etc.  But as I said, when the Kings have been in there little
tailspins over the past couple of years there have been empty seats at the
Forum even if the tickets were sold.

>I think in the case of a Lemieux or Gretzky, the player can transcend
>winning as the major drawing power.  

For the short term, IMO.  Although I think that it's inevitable that the team
will improve with a player such as Lemieux or Gretzky, simply because they
make people around them better.

>But winning sure as hell helps.  ;-)

Well, at least we are in full agreement here!

>This does not make Roger's point any more valid, but the Jets aren't

So are you saying Roger has ever had a valid point? <couldn't resist...>

>getting a HUGE jump in productivity, yet they ARE getting a huge
>jump in attendance.  This is due to the emergence of Teemu Selanne.
>They have the 17th best record in hockey, it sure as hell isn't because
>they are winning.

Yes, but they are doing no worse than last year.  I think the same type of
reasoning I applied to a new Pittsburgh fan applies to all the extra people
showing up at Winnipeg games.  It's difficult to predict, but do you think
that if the Jets miss the playoffs next season that in the year after they
will maintain their attendance levels?  I seriously doubt it, because in that
case the expectation of an improving team would be gone, with or without
Selanne.

I did provide the example of Rocket Ismail and the Toronto Argonauts of the 
CFL...did you leave it out because you don't know much about the CFL?  If 
that's the case then fair enough, but if it isn't the case then I'm curious
to hear your explanation.



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52551
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: NHL team leaders in +/-

In article <1993Mar29.190650.28940@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:

>The Jets use the "breakaway pass" scheme to create a scoring sensation
>in order to generate interest.  If teams score as many or more goals
>against Winnipeg when Selanne is on the ice as Winnipeg scores when
>he is on the ice then I can't see how his contribution can be described
>as impressive.  

Implicitly you are assuming that goals scored against Winnipeg with Selanne
on the ice can be blamed on him...Roger, he is a FORWARD.  Winnipeg has a
lousy defensive record anyway.  Let's put it another way.  John Cullen's +/-
is terrible.  What's your excuse for him?  That his powerplay points don't
count?  Neither do Selanne's... 

>The object of the game is not to feed Selanne - it is 
>to win.  And feeding Selanne does not contribute in any meaningful way
>to winning.

Knowledgeable hockey observers the world over would agree that
feeding Selanne so he can score does contribute in a meaningful way to
winning. 

>Pat Burns wouldn't have a goal suck like this on his team.

You're worried about Teemu when you have Glenn Anderson on your team?

>We DON'T KNOW what Selanne does best.  We do know what Jet's management
>wants.  And again, the object of the exercise is not to allow Selanne to
>do what he does best, it is to win hockey games.

What he does best is score...so I refer you to my comment above.

>As it is now, Selanne
>is a grandstanding goal suck.  Did you see the way he parades around
>with his arms outstretched after scoring a goal?  You would think the
>Messiah had returned...

Nope, didn't see it.  I was too busy watching Foligno jump up and down after
_his_ goal....




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52552
From: jbarrett@aludra.usc.edu (Jonathan Barrett)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

I can only comment on the Kings, but the most obvious candidate for pleasant
surprise is Alex Zhitnik. He came highly touted as a defensive defenseman, but
he's clearly much more than that. Great skater and hard shot (though wish he
were more accurate). In fact, he pretty much allowed the Kings to trade away
that huge defensive liability Paul Coffey. Kelly Hrudey is only the biggest
disappointment if you thought he was any good to begin with. But, at best, he's
only a mediocre goaltender. A better choice would be Tomas Sandstrom, though
not through any fault of his own, but because some thugs in Toronto decided 
to threaten his career in order to avoid conceding a goal. Other than that, the
award goes to Robert Lang, an uninspiring Czech. Robitaille could easily be
MVP, but I'd prefer to give it to Rob Blake who is quietly becoming one of the
league's premier defensemen, and if the Kings manage to hold onto him and the 
rest of our young defense, it could one day mean that we'll let in fewer
goals than Hartford. Honorable mentions to Majestic Marty and Warren Rychel.
Jon

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52553
From: assist@orion.oac.uci.edu (ASSIST Coordination Site)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <C4zCII.Ftn@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca> smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale) writes:
>                         MVP           Biggest       Biggest
>                                       Suprise       Disappointment

>Los Angeles Kings       Robitaille     Donnelly      Hrudey


I would have chosen Alex Zhitnik for biggest suprise.  They
did expect that he would become a great defenseman, but I don't
think anyone knew that he was going to be this impressive in his 
rookie year.  His speed, skating ability, and puck control is
exceptional -- he is the one to watch on the Kings.


Kris
kris@fs2.assist.uci.edu

GO KINGS!

--

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52554
From: ching@coyote.WPI.EDU (Jay Heminger)
Subject: Re: NCAA finals...Winner????


Maine beat LSSU 5-4.


-- 
------------------------THE LOGISTICIAN REIGNS SUPREME!!!----------------------
|									      |
|   GO BLUE!!!   GO TIGERS!!!   GO PISTONS!!!   GO LIONS!!!   GO RED WINGS!!! |
-------------------------------ching@wpi.wpi.edu-------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52555
From: ayim@leibniz.uwaterloo.ca (Alfred Yim)
Subject: And... THEY'RE OFF!!!!!

Well, I gotta tell ya,

last night's Leafs game vs the Devils was a nail-bitter LET ME TELL YOU!
It was a well played game by BOTH teams (I thought) but according to the
Don and Ron it was the an "off-night" for the Leafs and the Devils 
were outplaying Toronto. Well, I BEG to differ....

IMHO, Clark deserved to be a first star as much as Gilmour did. His
fast breaks towards the net and the good opportunites that he
created reminded me of the Clark of old. (But not to take any of the
credit away from Gilmour).

I think the Leafs are playing GREAT hockey. WHY? 
Well first look at their injury list which includes, Cullen, Ellet,
Zezel, Macoun. Of course my question is this....how will the Leafs
fare when they are once again "healthy" if they are playing this well
so far??

Second, just look at their standings, still second in defence,
moved from 11th overall to 6th over in the last month, haven't lost
at home in last 12 games, 8 game undefeated streak..etc.
(BTW, am I wrong or was this Potvin's first shut-out? I can't 
remember him having any as of yet.)

Well, as of April 3 we see that the race for first in the Norris
has truly begun and it will be a VERY CLOSE race between Chicago and
Toronto. And the best game of the season will probably be their last
against each other. (is anyone lucky enough to have tickets to
see this one?)

Coming to the stretch and still a ROAR'IN!!!!!
Go LEAFS Go!!!!
-- 
****************************************** 
*  Alfred (Yong-Jeh) Yim                 *   Toronto wins the  
*  4B Mathematics (Actuarial Science)    *     (   ?    )    CUP.
*  University of Waterloo, Canada.       *  i like "coca-cola" idea personally
*  E-mail: ayim@descartes.waterloo.edu   *  
*****************************************************************************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52556
From: jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM (Jason Cockroft)
Subject: Re: "Give Blood" Tee Shirts


>The shirts are believe or not from a Bob Probert line of clothes.
>The whole shirt says "Give Blood - Fight Probie".


Cool.  They sound like a cult classic.  Can someone post a address or
phone # of a store that sells these?

Thanks,

-jake.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52557
Subject: NCAA finals...Winner????
From: ktgeiss@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu

Lake State/Maine in finals...WHO WON?   Please post.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52558
From: MWEINTR@auvm.american.edu
Subject: Re: Trade rumor: Montreal/Ottawa/Phillie

Also sprach slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca ...

>TSN Sportsdesk just reported that the OTTAWA SUN has reported that
>Montreal will send 4 players + $15 million including Vin Damphousse
>and Brian Bellows to Phillidelphia, Phillie will send Eric Lindros
>to Ottawa, and Ottawa will give it's first round pick to Montreal.
>
>If this is true, it will most likely depend on whether or not Ottawa
>gets to choose 1st overall.  Can Ottawa afford Lindros' salary?
>
>Personally, I can't see Philli giving up Lindros -- for anything.
>They didn't give away that much to Quebec just to trade him away
>again.  Not to mention that Lindros seems to be a *huge* draw in
>Phillie -- and that he represents a successful future for the
>franchise.
>
>Ottawa may be better off taking the 4 players +$15 from Montreal
>for the pick.
>
>Stephen Legge
>SLEGGE@kean.ucs.munc.ca

Two things:

1. Didn't the trade deadline pass two weeks ago?

2. The FLYERS would never ever EVER give up Lindros, simple as that.

Go Flyers, Cup in '94...

Mike
---
***Yes-Rush-Marillion-ELP-Genesis-King Crimson-Dream Theater-Beatles***
* Mike Weintraub, aka Jvi on IRC              "Courageous convictions *
* mweintr@american.edu                         will drag the dream    *
* jedi@wave.cerf.net                           into existence"        *
* The American University, Washington DC        - Rush (NOT Limbaugh) *
***Go Philadelphia Flyers, Vancouver Canucks & Philadelphia Phillies***

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52559
From: galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin)
Subject: Re: Re-Alignnment, Expansion

In article <C4zHJ1.7xB@idacom.hp.com> andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott) writes:
>In article <1993Apr2.175946.7727@nntpd2.cxo.dec.com> nixdorf@etre (Eric Nixdorf) writes:
>>
>>     Looking at the way the divisions were re-aligned, there are six teams each
>>in the Central (Norris) and Pacific (Smyth) divisions, while there are seven
>>teams each in the Northeast (Adams) and Atlantic (Patrick) divisions.  The
>>thought occurs to me that inherent in the realignment is expansion of one team
>>in the Central division and one team in the Pacific division, although I've
>>seen nothing published that indicates that.
>
>Actually, when the NHL expansion committee was formed a couple of years back
>(before the Ottawa and Tampa Bay expansion), John Zeigler stated at the time
>that it was the NHL's expansion plan to grow to 28 teams (7 per division) by
>the turn of the century.
>
>-- 
>Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
>HP IDACOM Telecom Division      | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253
>
>During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Last night during a Sharks' broadcast, Commissioner Bettman was
interviewed during the first intermission.  He made no bones about it,
the expansion to 28 is on permanent hold until he is satisfied that
the current allotment of 26 are fully stable.  This means that cities
looking for a club in the foreseeable future will have to wait until
one team in some location fails or looks to relocate.

This is good, IMO.  There's no sense in expanding if it only means
more failing franchises are in the mold.

-Tom Galvin             galvint@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52560
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Sat, April 3, 1993
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)

Tampa Bay                        1 1 0--2
Philadelphia                     3 2 1--6
First period
     1, Philadelphia, Carkner 3 (unassisted) 1:24.
     2, Philadelphia, Hawgood 9 (Recchi, Lindros) pp, 5:56.
     3, Philadelphia, Lindros 37 (Recchi, Hawgood) pp, 9:52.
     4, Tampa Bay, Beers 12 (Zamuner, Chambers) pp, 15:06.
Second period
     5, Tampa Bay, Andersson 13 (Hamrlik, Lafreniere) pp, 1:58.
     6, Philadelphia, Conroy 3 (Butsayev, Faust) 12:10.
     7, Philadelphia, Beranek 13 (Galley, Hawgood) pp, 18:53.
Third period
     8, Philadelphia, Recchi 51 (Brind'Amour, Galley) pp, 17:56.

Philadelphia: 6    Power play: 5-4
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Beranek            1    0    1
Brind'Amour        0    1    1
Butsayev           0    1    1
Carkner            1    0    1
Conroy             1    0    1
Faust              0    1    1
Galley             0    2    2
Hawgood            1    2    3
Lindros            1    1    2
Recchi             1    2    3

Tampa Bay: 2    Power play: 7-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Andersson          1    0    1
Beers              1    0    1
Chambers           0    1    1
Hamrlik            0    1    1
Lafreniere         0    1    1
Zamuner            0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Vancouver                        1 0 0--1
Detroit                          2 2 1--5
First period
     1, Detroit, Kozlov 4 (Fedorov, Chiasson) 5:20.
     2, Detroit, Drake 17 (Ciccarelli, Coffey) pp, 7:48.
     3, Vancouver, Ronning 24 (Slegr, Bure) pp, 17:35.
Second period
     4, Detroit, Sheppard 30 (Drake, Hiller) 6:54.
     5, Detroit, Ciccarelli 38 (Chiasson, Drake) pp, 12:13.
Third period
     6, Detroit, Ysebaert 31 (Fedorov, Cheveldae) sh, 4:59.

Detroit: 5    Power play: 5-2   Special goals:  pp: 2  sh: 1  Total: 3
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Cheveldae          0    1    1
Chiasson           0    2    2
Ciccarelli         1    1    2
Coffey             0    1    1
Drake              1    2    3
Fedorov            0    2    2
Hiller             0    1    1
Kozlov             1    0    1
Sheppard           1    0    1
Ysebaert           1    0    1

Vancouver: 1    Power play: 6-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bure               0    1    1
Ronning            1    0    1
Slegr              0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Buffalo                          1 1 0--2
Boston                           1 1 1--3
First period
     1, Buffalo, Audette 12 (Corkum, Wood) 16:40.
     2, Boston, Juneau 30 (Neely, Oates) 18:39.
Second period
     3, Buffalo, Errey 9 (LaFontaine, Khmylev) 10:51.
     4, Boston, Douris 3 (D.Sweeney, Bourque) 17:57.
Third period
     5, Boston, Donato 12 (unassisted) 17:42.

Boston: 3    Power play: 4-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bourque            0    1    1
Donato             1    0    1
Douris             1    0    1
Juneau             1    0    1
Neely              0    1    1
Oates              0    1    1
Sweeney D          0    1    1

Buffalo: 2    Power play: 5-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Audette            1    0    1
Corkum             0    1    1
Errey              1    0    1
Khmylev            0    1    1
LaFontaine         0    1    1
Wood               0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Calgary                          1 1 0 1--3
San Jose                         0 2 0 0--2
First period
     1, Calgary, Suter 21 (Reichel, MacInnis) pp, 17:47.
Second period
     2, San Jose, Zmolek 5 (Odgers, Evason) 3:03.
     3, San Jose, Kisio 24 (Garpenlov, Gaudreau) pp, 7:23.
     4, Calgary, Lindberg 9 (MacInnis) pp, 12:43.
Third period
     No scoring.
Overtime
     5, Calgary, Fleury 31 (Otto, Yawney) 3:06.

Calgary: 3    Power play: 8-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Fleury             1    0    1
Lindberg           1    0    1
MacInnis           0    2    2
Otto               0    1    1
Reichel            0    1    1
Suter              1    0    1
Yawney             0    1    1

San Jose: 2    Power play: 9-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Evason             0    1    1
Garpenlov          0    1    1
Gaudreau           0    1    1
Kisio              1    0    1
Odgers             0    1    1
Zmolek             1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
Pittsburgh                       0 3 2--5
Quebec                           2 1 0--3
First period
     1, Quebec, Kamensky 15 (Huffman) 6:05.
     2, Quebec, Young 27 (Lapointe, Huffman) 16:52.
Second period
     3, Pittsburgh, Mullen 29 (Lemieux, Murphy) 3:54.
     4, Pittsburgh, Lemieux 60 (Tocchet, U.Samuelsson) 5:07.
     5, Pittsburgh, Lemieux 61 (Tocchet, Stevens) 8:12.
     6, Quebec, Young 28 (Sundin, Kovalenko) pp, 14:52.
Third period
     7, Pittsburgh, Tippett 4 (unassisted) sh, 3:52.
     8, Pittsburgh, Tippett 5 (McEachern, Mullen) 8:25.

Pittsburgh: 5    Power play: 1-0   Special goals:  sh: 1  Total: 1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Lemieux            2    1    3
McEachern          0    1    1
Mullen             1    1    2
Murphy             0    1    1
Samuelsson U       0    1    1
Stevens            0    1    1
Tippett            2    0    2
Tocchet            0    2    2

Quebec: 3    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Huffman            0    2    2
Kamensky           1    0    1
Kovalenko          0    1    1
Lapointe           0    1    1
Sundin             0    1    1
Young              2    0    2

-----------------------------------------
New Jersey                       0 0 0--0
Toronto                          0 0 1--1
First period
     No scoring.
Second period
     No scoring.
Third period
     1, Toronto, Gilmour 32 (Andreychuk, Anderson) 16:22.

Toronto: 1    Power play: 5-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Anderson           0    1    1
Andreychuk         0    1    1
Gilmour            1    0    1

New Jersey: 0    Power play: 3-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------
Ottawa                           1 0 2--3
Hartford                         5 1 1--7
First period
     1, Ottawa, Maciver 17 (Baker, Luongo) 4:22.
     2, Hartford, Kron 11 (Nylander, Gosselin) 5:13.
     3, Hartford, Burt 4 (Cassels, Verbeek) 7:59.
     4, Hartford, Cunneyworth 4 (Yake, Nylander) 9:59.
     5, Hartford, Sanderson 42 (Cassels, Houda) 11:11.
     6, Hartford, Verbeek 35 (Cassels, Zalapski) pp, 15:50.
Second period
     7, Hartford, Sanderson 43 (Cassels, Zalapski) pp, 18:38.
Third period
     8, Hartford, Kron 12 (Poulin, Burt) 4:57.
     9, Ottawa, Turgeon 23 (Lamb) 8:57.
     10, Ottawa, Baker 17 (Luongo, Maciver) pp, 16:17.

Hartford: 7    Power play: 3-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Burt               1    1    2
Cassels            0    4    4
Cunneyworth        1    0    1
Gosselin           0    1    1
Houda              0    1    1
Kron               2    0    2
Nylander           0    2    2
Poulin             0    1    1
Sanderson          2    0    2
Verbeek            1    1    2
Yake               0    1    1
Zalapski           0    2    2

Ottawa: 3    Power play: 7-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Baker              1    1    2
Lamb               0    1    1
Luongo             0    2    2
Maciver            1    1    2
Turgeon            1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
Winnipeg                         1 3 2--6
Edmonton                         1 0 3--4
First period
     1, Winnipeg, Tkachuk 27 (Housley, Zhamnov) pp, 14:38.
     2, Edmonton, Klima 31 (Ciger, Elik) 16:05.
Second period
     3, Winnipeg, King 8 (unassisted) 3:54.
     4, Winnipeg, Zhamnov 21 (Selanne) 10:25.
     5, Winnipeg, Domi 5 (Selanne, Housley) 18:44.
Third period
     6, Edmonton, Manson 15 (unassisted) 10:58.
     7, Winnipeg, Eagles 8 (Numminen, Bautin) pp, 14:13.
     8, Winnipeg, Zhamnov 22 (Ulanov, Selanne) 15:27.
     9, Edmonton, Gelinas 8 (Kravchuk, Ranford) 16:48.
     10, Edmonton, Kravchuk 10 (Buchberger) 18:42.

Winnipeg: 6    Power play: 5-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bautin             0    1    1
Domi               1    0    1
Eagles             1    0    1
Housley            0    2    2
King               1    0    1
Numminen           0    1    1
Selanne            0    3    3
Tkachuk            1    0    1
Ulanov             0    1    1
Zhamnov            2    1    3

Edmonton: 4    Power play: 3-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Buchberger         0    1    1
Ciger              0    1    1
Elik               0    1    1
Gelinas            1    0    1
Klima              1    0    1
Kravchuk           1    1    2
Manson             1    0    1
Ranford            0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Chicago                          0 3 0 0--3
St. Louis                        1 2 0 0--3
First period
     1, St. Louis, Shanahan 46 (Janney, Hull) pp, 4:09.
Second period
     2, Chicago, Murphy 4 (Chelios, Roenick) pp, 0:50.
     3, St. Louis, Shanahan 47 (Hedican, Janney) 1:18.
     4, Chicago, Noonan 16 (Murphy, Chelios) pp, 5:24.
     5, St. Louis, Bozon 6, ps, 12:13.
     6, Chicago, Roenick 43 (Sutter, Murphy) pp, 18:39.
Third period
     No scoring.
Overtime
     No scoring.

St. Louis: 3    Power play: 4-1   Special goals:  pp: 1  ps: 1  Total: 2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bozon              1    0    1
Chelios            0    1    1
Hedican            0    1    1
Hull               0    1    1
Janney             0    2    2
Murphy             0    1    1
Shanahan           2    0    2

Chicago: 3    Power play: 3-3
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Chelios            0    2    2
Murphy             1    2    3
Noonan             1    0    1
Roenick            1    1    2
Sutter             0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Montreal                         0 1 2--3
NY Islanders                     0 2 0--2
First period
     No scoring.
Second period
     1, Montreal, Brunet 10 (Carbonneau, Daigneault) 4:39.
     2, NY Islanders, Turgeon 51 (Thomas, Kurvers) pp, 9:14.
     3, NY Islanders, Mullen 16 (unassisted) 15:13.
Third period
     4, Montreal, Bellows 38 (Desjardins, Dipietro) 3:01.
     5, Montreal, Damphousse 38 (Desjardins, Bellows) pp, 10:11.

Montreal: 3    Power play: 5-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bellows            1    1    2
Brunet             1    0    1
Carbonneau         0    1    1
Daigneault         0    1    1
Damphousse         1    0    1
Desjardins         0    2    2
Dipietro           0    1    1

NY Islanders: 2    Power play: 5-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Kurvers            0    1    1
Mullen             1    0    1
Thomas             0    1    1
Turgeon            1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
Minnesota                        2 1 0--3
Los Angeles                      0 0 0--0
First period
     1, Minnesota, Dahlen 33 (unassisted) 2:34.
     2, Minnesota, Courtnall 33 (Dahlen, Modano) pp, 9:30.
Second period
     3, Minnesota, McPhee 14 (Sjodin, Hatcher) pp, 7:24.
Third period
     No scoring.

Minnesota: 3    Power play: 11-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Courtnall          1    0    1
Dahlen             1    1    2
Hatcher            0    1    1
McPhee             1    0    1
Modano             0    1    1
Sjodin             0    1    1

Los Angeles: 0    Power play: 5-0
No scoring

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52561
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Sun, April 4, 1993
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)

NY Rangers                       3 1 0--4
Washington                       0 0 0--0
First period
     1, NY Rangers, Graves 33 (Turcotte, Lowe) 9:13.
     2, NY Rangers, Gartner 44 (Messier) 11:21.
     3, NY Rangers, Olczyk 21 (Messier, Amonte) 14:57.
Second period
     4, NY Rangers, Beukeboom 2 (unassisted) 3:30.
Third period
     No scoring.

NY Rangers: 4    Power play: 4-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Amonte             0    1    1
Beukeboom          1    0    1
Gartner            1    0    1
Graves             1    0    1
Lowe               0    1    1
Messier            0    2    2
Olczyk             1    0    1
Turcotte           0    1    1

Washington: 0    Power play: 3-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------
Boston                           0 2 1--3
Buffalo                          0 0 0--0
First period
     No scoring.
Second period
     1, Boston, Leach 24 (Wesley, Oates) pp, 1:03.
     2, Boston, Oates 44 (Douris, Poulin) 9:00.
Third period
     3, Boston, Douris 4 (Bourque) sh, 0:55.

Boston: 3    Power play: 5-1   Special goals:  pp: 1  sh: 1  Total: 2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bourque            0    1    1
Douris             1    1    2
Leach              1    0    1
Oates              1    1    2
Poulin             0    1    1
Wesley             0    1    1

Buffalo: 0    Power play: 6-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------
Pittsburgh                       1 3 1--5
New Jersey                       0 1 1--2
First period
     1, Pittsburgh, Francis 23 (Lemieux, Tocchet) pp, 13:25.
Second period
     2, Pittsburgh, Murphy 21 (Francis, Mullen) sh, 0:38.
     3, Pittsburgh, Francis 24 (Tocchet, Lemieux) pp, 7:14.
     4, Pittsburgh, Jagr 33 (Tocchet, Francis) pp, 15:22.
     5, New Jersey, Zelepukin 17 (Driver, Lemieux) pp, 19:07.
Third period
     6, New Jersey, MacLean 23 (Nicholls, Stevens) 6:45.
     7, Pittsburgh, Lemieux 62 (Jagr) en, 19:51.

Pittsburgh: 5    Power play: 9-3   Special goals:  pp: 3  sh: 1  en: 1  Total: 5
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Francis            2    2    4
Jagr               1    1    2
Lemieux            1    2    3
Mullen             0    1    1
Murphy             1    0    1
Tocchet            0    3    3

New Jersey: 2    Power play: 9-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Driver             0    1    1
Lemieux            0    1    1
MacLean            1    0    1
Nicholls           0    1    1
Stevens            0    1    1
Zelepukin          1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
Toronto                          0 0 0--0
Philadelphia                     2 1 1--4
First period
     1, Philadelphia, Dineen 31 (Beranek, Hawgood) 8:10.
     2, Philadelphia, McGill 3 (Lindros, Recchi) 19:55.
Second period
     3, Philadelphia, Lindros 38 (Recchi, Galley) 7:55.
Third period
     4, Philadelphia, Dineen 32 (Hawgood, Galley) pp, 18:39.

Philadelphia: 4    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Beranek            0    1    1
Dineen             2    0    2
Galley             0    2    2
Hawgood            0    2    2
Lindros            1    1    2
McGill             1    0    1
Recchi             0    2    2

Toronto: 0    Power play: 6-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------
Vancouver                        0 2 1--3
Ottawa                           0 0 0--0
First period
     No scoring.
Second period
     1, Vancouver, Plavsic 6 (Craven) 13:05.
     2, Vancouver, Momesso 17 (Nedved, Plavsic) pp, 15:52.
Third period
     3, Vancouver, Bure 57 (unassisted) 13:27.

Vancouver: 3    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bure               1    0    1
Craven             0    1    1
Momesso            1    0    1
Nedved             0    1    1
Plavsic            1    1    2

Ottawa: 0    Power play: 5-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------
St. Louis                        2 0 2--4
Chicago                          4 0 1--5
First period
     1, Chicago, Sutter 18 (Murphy, Chelios) pp, 1:08.
     2, St. Louis, Janney 20 (Shanahan, J.Brown) pp, 6:49.
     3, Chicago, Roenick 44 (Chelios, Smith) pp, 8:20.
     4, Chicago, Roenick 45 (Sutter, Chelios) pp, 13:14.
     5, Chicago, Graham 19 (Gilbert, Ruuttu) 13:42.
     6, St. Louis, Janney 21 (Shanahan, Crossman) 19:38.
Second period
     No scoring.
Third period
     7, Chicago, Murphy 5 (Chelios, Belfour) 0:20.
     8, St. Louis, Miller 21 (Hull, Janney) pp, 7:04.
     9, St. Louis, Janney 22 (Miller, Shanahan) 19:32.

Chicago: 5    Power play: 8-3
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Belfour            0    1    1
Chelios            0    4    4
Gilbert            0    1    1
Graham             1    0    1
Murphy             1    1    2
Roenick            2    0    2
Ruuttu             0    1    1
Smith              0    1    1
Sutter             1    1    2

St. Louis: 4    Power play: 4-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Brown J            0    1    1
Crossman           0    1    1
Hull               0    1    1
Janney             3    1    4
Miller             1    1    2
Shanahan           0    3    3

-----------------------------------------
Calgary                          1 2 1--4
San Jose                         1 0 2--3
First period
     1, Calgary, Otto 19 (Yawney, Ashton) pp, 5:29.
     2, San Jose, Odgers 10 (Pederson, Wilkinson) 18:33.
Second period
     3, Calgary, Nieuwendyk 34 (Johansson, Reese) 2:03.
     4, Calgary, Reichel 35 (Skrudland, Berube) 12:22.
Third period
     5, Calgary, Ashton 7 (Otto, Fleury) 1:30.
     6, San Jose, Pederson 9 (Odgers, Evason) 2:24.
     7, San Jose, Odgers 11 (Gaudreau, Evason) pp, 19:30.

Calgary: 4    Power play: 5-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Ashton             1    1    2
Berube             0    1    1
Fleury             0    1    1
Johansson          0    1    1
Nieuwendyk         1    0    1
Otto               1    1    2
Reese              0    1    1
Reichel            1    0    1
Skrudland          0    1    1
Yawney             0    1    1

San Jose: 3    Power play: 5-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Evason             0    2    2
Gaudreau           0    1    1
Odgers             2    1    3
Pederson           1    1    2
Wilkinson          0    1    1

-----------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52562
From: "Justin R. Fortun" <jf4f+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Playoff Predictions

>B(--> Stanley Cup Champion: Vancouver Canucks
> 
>Sorry, Pittsburgh in a walk.
> 
>- Jack

First of all, the Penguins WILL win the cup again.  Who is going to stop them?
Definitely not the Canucks! 

My predictions:

Patrick Division winner:  Pittsburgh
Adams Division winner:  Quebec or Montreal
Norris Division winner:  Detroit
Smythe Division winner:  Winnipeg

Wales conference champ:  Pittsburgh
Campbell Conference champ:  Detroit

Stanley Cup Champions(again):  Pittsburgh

Canucks suck.  They'll lose in the first round, compliments of Winnipeg
and Teemu Selanne.  

The Pens are almost unstoppable with Mario Lemieux.  


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52563
From: U16028@uicvm.uic.edu
Subject: Re: Coloured puck (was: CHANGES NOT NOTED YET!)

In article <1993Apr5.171006.22196@bnr.ca>, dwarf@bcarh601.bnr.ca (W. Jim Jordan)
says:
>The precedent was set by the WHA in their first season.  They used a red
>puck for exhibition games and a blue one for the regular season.
>Thankfully, they abandoned it in favour of black before the next season
>began.
>
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
One reason that the WHA abandoned the blue puck was the fact that it
crumbled very quickly during play.  The blue dye that was used somehow
affected the vulcanized rubber of the puck, decreasing its cohesiveness.

Terry
U16028@uicvm.uic.edu
&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52564
From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
Subject: Re: WC Pool B : GB win the gold

In <1993Apr5.130317.8175@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca writes:

> In article <1porp4$1c0@zaphod.axion.bt.co.uk> nmcglynn@axion.bt.co.uk writes:
> >
> >GB has now risen from nowhere to Pool A in 5 seasons. They pulled out of the
> >World Championships in 1981, and did not re-enter until 1989 when we took part
> >in Pool D. In 1990, we hosted Pool D and won all our game to progress to
> >Pool C. In 1991 GB finished 5th in Pool C, and then last year we hosted
> >Pool C, again winning all our games. Now after Pool B, GB won all 7 games
> >and in now in Pool A. World Champions next year perhaps :-)
> >
> 
> Just goes to show you what using Canadians can do for a hockey team...
> France, Italy, and now Great Britain all use a significant number of
> Canadians on "their" hockey teams.

Yup. Then again, there are lots of foreign-born players on the Canadian
national soccer team so the Brits give something back to you in the end:-)
---
For the record, former NY Rangers coach Ted "Darth" Sator recently led
Lion Milan (Jari Kurri's former team, only the nickname's changed
[Devils->Lion]) to their second straight Italian championship. They made the
European Final Four last autumn after losing to Swedish champs Malmo in the
semis...and accomplished this feat using FIFTEEN Canadian-born players!! Mamma
mia!

MARCU$
 
> Gerald
> 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52565
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <C51CJB.L5z@ccu.umanitoba.ca> umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner) writes:
>They were, and even if Washington might consider Patty a bust, I'd rework
>that trade in a minute.  Druce has been a complete and utter bust here,
>only 5 goals.

	Well, Druce pretty much sucked when he was with the Caps. He had one
good **playoffs** (not season). oh well. The Caps are notorious for making
stupid trades anyway, as can be seen with the Cicarelli and Hrivnak trades.
Sigh.
	In another note... I'd have to say the Caps biggest surprise was 
Cote, as many Caps fans had been expecting a lot from Bondra already.
 


-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52566
Subject: canadian silver dollar-stanley cup centennial
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)


Hi.  According to my always questionable newspaper, there's a silver
dollar being minted in Canada, the back of which commemorates the
anniversary of the Stanley Cup.  Now, I know full well what coins are
used every day in Canada.  I can easily fish a few out of my pocket
change right now, in fact.  My question is, since the loon is the only
dollar coin that I know is legal tender, is this just a commemorative
coin with no monetary exchange value, or what?  Is it the sort of
thing that only hockey buffs and coin collectors might covet, with no
chance of it being circulated?  If it is an uncirculated coin, what's
the current cost and what's its potential value?  Just curious.  If no
one knows, I'll take this to soc.culture.canada and rec.collecting (or
whatever it is).  Thanks again

-- 
Valerie Hammerl			"Some days I have to remind him he's not 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu	Mario Lemieux."  Herb Brooks on Claude
acscvjh@ubms.cc.buffalo.edu	Lemieux, top scorer for the Devils, but 
v085pwwpz@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu  known for taking dumb penalties.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52567
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Superstars and attendance (was Teemu Selanne, was +/- leaders)

In <1993Apr5.182124.17415@ists.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:

>Dean J. Falcione (posting from jrmst+8@pitt.edu) writes:

>>But I think the reason is Lemieux
>>had a 168 point season and was the first non-Gretzky to win the Hart and
>>Ross since 1980.  People turned out to watch him play. 

>I will grant that a star like Mario will draw fans, even if the team sucks. 
>But this is short term only; I still do not think the attendance increase 
>will last, unless the team is a winning/competitive/improving/butt-kicking
>one.  Pittsburgh was still getting better, so people continued to support
>them.  If they suddenly dropped to, say, 50 points, you'd have knee surgery
>for some of the people jumping off the bandwagon.  

I disagree.  McNall has demonstrated with Gretzky that a star brings out the
crowds whether or not the team is expected to do well.  Very few fans real-
istically expect the Kings to do well this year (although I do) and yet they
still go out to see Gretzky.  This is the marketing strategy - selling the
game by selling the stars - that is employed by Baseball and, notably, the
NBA and this is the attitude that the new Bettman/McNall leadership is 
bringing to the league.  They have gone on record as stating that they are
trying to sell the game on its stars.  Timo Salami and Brett Hull are perfect 
examples of players that real fans know aren't worth a damn and yet, being
benificiaries of marketing-oriented coaching strategies, have goal totals
that would indicate to the casual observer, the very fans the NHL wants to
attract, that these players are indeed superstars.

>>They made the transaction to try and build a winner around Mario, that is 
>>true.  But the improvement in attendance came before they started doing
>>this (Coffey late in 1987) and before they even had a playoff bound team.
>>A doubling of attendance occured in 1984-85 from the previous year.  An
>>increase from 38 points to 53 points is not going to do that.  The arrival
>>of Mario Lemieux is what did it. 

>It might help to think about what would go through a fan's mind who suddenly
>found an interest in Mario and the Pens.  Was it "gee, Mario Lemieux is
>amazing, I'll go watch him play", or was it "gee, now we've got a *kick*
>*ass* guy on *our* side, I'll go watch him play".  I think it was the latter.

It ain't nearly so simple as this.  The casual fan doesn't think about much 
at all.  Can you actually find an adult with a 3 digit IQ who believes that
McDonalds makes good hamburgers?
 
>I did provide the example of Rocket Ismail and the Toronto Argonauts of the 
>CFL...did you leave it out because you don't know much about the CFL?  If 
>that's the case then fair enough, but if it isn't the case then I'm curious
>to hear your explanation.

Yes but apparently the Rocket has not lived up to his marketing responsi-
bilities has he?  He was hyped, initially, as a superstar, but outside of
one Grey Cup game he has done very little to maintain/enhance that assess-
ment of his talents.  Most Argo fans probably feel the team would be better
off without him. 

cordially, as always,

rm

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52568
From: r_turgeo@oz.plymouth.edu (Randy S. Turgeon)
Subject: Re: Ottawa/Montreal/Philly trade


  Here we go again. Is this the same idiot who posted the Gretzky
trade to Toronto????   Sheeeesh!  You should have waited until we got
over that one before this garbage, maybe we would have believed it for
half a second (NOT!).

   By the way, I just heard from Mother Goose that Mario Lemieux was
traded to Winnpeg for Tie Domi!!!!!


Randy
PSC (I know noone has heard of it, it's a tiny college in Hicksville
New Hampshire. Plymouth State College)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52569
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: NHL team leaders in +/-

In <1993Apr5.185633.17843@ists.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:

>Implicitly you are assuming that goals scored against Winnipeg with Selanne
>on the ice can be blamed on him...Roger, he is a FORWARD.  Winnipeg has a
>lousy defensive record anyway.  Let's put it another way.  John Cullen's +/-
>is terrible.  What's your excuse for him?  That his powerplay points don't
>count?  Neither do Selanne's... 

Are you comparing Cullen to Salami?  I would say that that is valid.  If
Winnipeg is such a lousy defensive team then why the hell does Salami
stand around the other team's blueline when the puck is in his own end?

>>The object of the game is not to feed Selanne - it is 
>>to win.  And feeding Selanne does not contribute in any meaningful way
>>to winning.

>Knowledgeable hockey observers the world over would agree that
>feeding Selanne so he can score does contribute in a meaningful way to
>winning. 

Excuse me?  Are the Jets playing .500 hockey?  Let me check...yes - but just
barely.  They have allowed more goals than they have scored.  Sounds an
awful lot like Salami's +/- to me.  Sounds like they would be just as well
off - or better - if he played the solid two-way game that our friends in
Finland claim he is capable of.  But if he did that he wouldn't be chal-
lenging for the league lead in goals would he?  The Bi-Planes might be
challenging for first however...

>You're worried about Teemu when you have Glenn Anderson on your team?

Now let's see...you have compared Timo to Anderson and Cullen.  Who's
next?  Mike Foligno?

>>We DON'T KNOW what Selanne does best.  We do know what Jet's management
>>wants.  And again, the object of the exercise is not to allow Selanne to
>>do what he does best, it is to win hockey games.

>What he does best is score...so I refer you to my comment above.

Some of our Finnish friends who have watched him play claim that he
can play a solid two-way game.  I would have to say that this style
of contribution would be more conducive to winning.  Or don't you 
think so?

>>As it is now, Selanne
>>is a grandstanding goal suck.  Did you see the way he parades around
>>with his arms outstretched after scoring a goal?  You would think the
>>Messiah had returned...

>Nope, didn't see it.  I was too busy watching Foligno jump up and down after
>_his_ goal....

I don't believe it!  You did compare him to Foligno!  (And I honestly hadn't
read this far).

It would help if you used a little discrimination in your thinking.  Your
contributions would be more highly valued if we could see that you weren't
trying to be merely argumentative.

cordially, as always,

rm

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52570
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: In memoriam: Dan Kelly and Danny Gallivan

In article <burke.1-290393150052@burkemac.oshag.nd.edu> burke.1@nd.edu (R. P. Burke) writes:
>When talking about hockey broadcasters, let's give a moment of silence to
>remember the St. Louis Blues' great, Dan Kelly. (Many of you may have heard
>him in the late 60s and early 70s on CBS.) He used to do Hockey Night In
>Canada intermissions, with another recently deceased great, Danny Gallivan
>of the Canadiens.

Agreed here...I'll never forget Dan Kelly calling the play-by-play in the '87
Canada Cup.  He was masterful!

And Danny Gallivan will _never_ be replaced; even now when I watch HNIC I
remember his voice...when I see an Al MacInnis or Al Iafrate (hey, what's with
these guys named Al who can shoot??) shot from the point I still think
"blistering blast"...THN had a tribute to Gallivan in the issue following his
death; in the story they included a quote from one of the games he did.  It
went: 

"It appears Risebrough has pugnaciously construed that check," he said, "and 
will undoubtedly make a visitation to the box of punition."

Classic, vintage Gallivan!  He's sorely missed.  So here's to two of the best
there was and best that ever will be.


dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52571
From: smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale)
Subject: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...


I was thinking about who on each of the teams were the MVPs, biggest
surprises, and biggest disappointments this year. Now, these are just
my observations and are admittedly lacking because I have not had an
opportunity to see all the teams the same amount. Anyway....
  
MVP = most valuable player to his team both in terms of points and
      in terms of leadership ("can't win without him")
  
Biggest surprise = the player who rose above expectation -- the player
      that may have raised the level of his game to a new height, even
      if that new level doesn't necessarily warrant an allstar berth
      (includes those players who at the outset of the season, may not
      even have been in the team's plans).
   
Biggest disappointment = the player from whom we expected more (e.g., I
      picked Denis Savard in Montreal because with the new emphasis on
      offence brought by Demers, shouldn't Savard have done better?)
   
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
  
                        Team           Biggest       Biggest
Team:                   MVP:          Surprise:    Disappointment:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Boston Bruins           Oates          D.Sweeney     Wesley
Buffalo Sabres          Lafontaine     Mogilny       Audette (jinx?)
Calgary Flames          Roberts        Reichel       Petit
Chicago Blackhawks      Roenick        Ruuttu        Goulet
Detroit Red Wings       Yzerman        Chaisson      Kozlov
Edmonton Oilers         Manson         Buchberger    Mellanby
Hartford Whalers        Sanderson      Cassells      Corriveau
Los Angeles Kings       Robitaille     Donnelly      Hrudey
Minnesota North Stars   Modano      Tinordi(not expected back)  Broten
Montreal Canadiens      Muller         Lebeau        Savard
New Jersey Devils       Stevens        Semak         MacLean
New York Islanders      Turgeon        King(finally) Marois
New York Rangers        Messier        Kovalev       Bourque
Ottawa Senators         MacIver        Baker         Jelinek
Philadelphia Flyers     Lindros/Recchi Fedyk/Galley  Eklund
Pittsburgh Penguins     Lemieux        Tocchet(even for him)  Jagr
Quebec Nordiques        Sakic/Ricci    Kovalenko     Pearson
San Jose Sharks         Kisio          Gaudreau      Maley
St Louis Blues          Shanahan       C.Joseph      Ron Sutter
Tampa Bay Lightening    Bradley        Bradley       Creighton/Kasper
Toronto Maple Leafs     Gilmour        Potvin        Ellett/Anderson
Vancouver Canucks       Bure           Nedved(finally)    Momesso
Washington Capitals     Hatcher        Bondra/Cote   Elynuik
Winnipeg Jets           Selanne        Selanne       Druce
----------------------------------------------------------------------
  
As I mentioned up top, these are my *impressions* from where I sit. I
would welcome any opinions from those fans nearer their teams (in other
words, *anywhere* away from a Toronto newspaper!)
   
Bryan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52572
From: dscy@eng.cam.ac.uk (D.S.C. Yap)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale) writes:

>                        Team           Biggest       Biggest
>Team:                   MVP:          Surprise:    Disappointment:
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Washington Capitals     Hatcher        Bondra/Cote   Elynuik
>Winnipeg Jets           Selanne        Selanne       Druce

                                                      ^^^^^^^^
                                                      weren't these two
                                                      traded for each
                                                      other?  Poetic justice.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52573
From: SHOE@PHYSICS.watstar.uwaterloo.ca (Mark Shoesmith)
Subject: Re: Let's talk sticks...

In article <C50pt4.6CM@odin.corp.sgi.com> dptom@endor.corp.sgi.com (Tom Arnold) writes:

>Okay you hockey playing fans/finatics out there. I'm looking over the wide 
>range of aluminum sticks for the first time. I've been playing with pieces
>of lumbar that seem to weigh alot and break after a few uses, so I'm 
>thinking of changing to an aluminum shaft so when I break the blade all I 
>have to do is change it. The problem is that there is such a wide reange of
>models and selections out there that I'm not certain which to consider. Can
>any of you post some of your suggestions and experiences with the aluminum 
>sticks? What is the difference between models? What do you like/dislike about
>them? And, which brands are best?
>
>

I've had, and still have a few aluminum sticks.  I got my first when I was 15
(a Christian), and broke the shaft halfway through the season, two years 
later.  I bought another (a Canadian) at the beginning of the next season, 
and I still have it.  I also have an Easton, that a friend was getting rid 
off, after giving up the game.  I find that Easton blades are easier to get, 
but all brands of blades are pretty well interchangeable.  Watch out for 
dried up bits of firewood, that some stores pass off as blades.  In my 
experiences, the blades of an aluminum break more often than regular sticks, 
but I've only ever broken one aluminum shaft.

I like aluminum sticks.  The blades are quickly changed, even on the bench 
if you have to.  On the downside, the shaft won't break if you decide to 
impale yourself on it :-)

Ciao,
Mark S.

"This is between me and the vegetable"   - Rick Moranis in
                                           Little Shop of Horrors
Mark Shoesmith
shoe@physics.watstar.uwaterloo.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52574
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <C4zCII.Ftn@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca> smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale) writes:
>
>I was thinking about who on each of the teams were the MVPs, biggest
>surprises, and biggest disappointments this year. Now, these are just
>my observations and are admittedly lacking because I have not had an
>opportunity to see all the teams the same amount. Anyway....
>  
>Team:                   MVP:          Surprise:    Disappointment:
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Edmonton Oilers         Manson         Buchberger    Mellanby

Well, since the Oilers didn't win a heck of a lot of games, I'm not sure
they deserve and MVP ("can't win without him").  However, I'd suggest Kelly
Buchberger instead of Dave Manson, who has had a brutal year, his pick for
the All-Star game notwithstanding.

As for biggest surprise, I'd say that Buchberger had higher expectations
this year due to his "breakthrough" year (for him) last year, so he didn't
really raise his game.  My suggestion would be Shjon Podein, one of the
callups from Cape Breton during the year.  He was quite far down on the
depth chart in the Oilers stable of prospects, but made a big impact on
the team.  He has 12 goals in his 33 games and is only -1.  Those are decent
numbers for a third-line player who was seemingly doomed to minor-league
oblivion.  The Oilers coaching staff likens his style to John Tonelli.
I think he'll be on the full-time roster next year.

As for biggest disappointment, you could name any of the players the Oilers
dumped for lousy production this year (Nicholls, Gilchrist, Tikkanen) or
even Shayne Corson, but Mellanby isn't far off.

-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Division      | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52575
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re:  Potvin's new goalie mask


Stephen Legge (SLEGGE@kean.ucs.munc.ca) writes:
>I was wtahcing RIGHT GUARD HOCKEY WEEK on TSN yesterday and they had
>a feature on this guy that does a lot (most?) of the masks for NHL
>goalies.  They talked about how they are made, what they are made of,
>and the designs that are put on them, etc.

Actually, this part was really interesting.  It turns out that the mask is
custom-fit to the goalie's face.  The goalie puts his/her face through a
piece of wood (or was it plastic?) with a hole in it that allows only the face
and forehead to show.  Hair is covered by a cap, eyes are covered by a plastic
wrap-type material, and vaseline is put on the goaltender's face.  Then, a
plaster is spread on their cheeks, forehead, and chin which takes about 12
minutes to dry sufficiently.  When it dries, it is effectively a mold of the
goalie's face.  This is used as the basis of the mask (the rest involves
padding the inside, hardening the exterior, fitting the cage, etc. etc.  
John Blue of the Bruins actually demonstrated the procedure on the show. 

>He exhibited a couple masks he is currently working on, namely, a
>new mask for Andy Moog which is a basic re-working of his current
>mask with the bear on it, and new mask for Bob Essensa which was 
>*really* cool -- the Jets logo was on the chin, and there were two
>fighter jets on either side on the forehead with an air-brushed
>back-ground.

Yeah, Essensa's mask looked really good.
 
>The best one of all was one he never talked about, he just held it up.
>It has the current Leafs crest on the chin and an awesome looking 
>black panther on the forehead -- it *has* to be a new mask for Felix
>Potvin, but he never said whose it was.

Actually, I thought I heard him say that it _was_ Potvin's for certain.  I
would bet money on it either way...and it did look awesome!


dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca
 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52576
From: mjr4u@Virginia.EDU ("Matthew J. Rush")
Subject: Re: NCAA finals...Winner????

ktgeiss@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu writes:
> Lake State/Maine in finals...WHO WON?   Please post.

Maine 5-4. 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52577
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <C4zCII.Ftn@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca> smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale) writes:
>
>                        Team           Biggest       Biggest
>Team:                   MVP:          Surprise:    Disappointment:
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Boston Bruins           Oates          D.Sweeney     Wesley
>Buffalo Sabres          Lafontaine     Mogilny       Audette (jinx?)
>Calgary Flames          Roberts        Reichel       Petit
>Chicago Blackhawks      Roenick        Ruuttu        Goulet

Chelios is by far the MVP on Chicago...

>Detroit Red Wings       Yzerman        Chaisson      Kozlov
>Edmonton Oilers         Manson         Buchberger    Mellanby

Manson, by his own admission, had a terrible year...the Oilers
don't really have a team MVP...by default, it should go to Craig
MacTavish.  Shjon Podein was the biggest surprise...Tikkanen the
biggest disappointment.

>Hartford Whalers        Sanderson      Cassells      Corriveau
>Los Angeles Kings       Robitaille     Donnelly      Hrudey
>Minnesota North Stars   Modano      Tinordi(not expected back)  Broten

Tinordi was back by mid-season last year...and when he plays he is the MVP.

>Montreal Canadiens      Muller         Lebeau        Savard
>New Jersey Devils       Stevens        Semak         MacLean
>New York Islanders      Turgeon        King(finally) Marois

King had a great year last year also.

>New York Rangers        Messier        Kovalev       Bourque

How can Kovalev be a surprise?

>Ottawa Senators         MacIver        Baker         Jelinek
>Philadelphia Flyers     Lindros/Recchi Fedyk/Galley  Eklund

Fence-sitting...look at Philly's record with Eric and without...
there is no doubt.  Soderstrom is probably the biggest surprise.

>Pittsburgh Penguins     Lemieux        Tocchet(even for him)  Jagr

Tocchet had a near 100 point season in Philly with Mike Bullard as
his center...why shouldn't he be able to do that with Mario?

>Quebec Nordiques        Sakic/Ricci    Kovalenko     Pearson
>San Jose Sharks         Kisio          Gaudreau      Maley
>St Louis Blues          Shanahan       C.Joseph      Ron Sutter

Really Joseph deserves the MVP nod.

>Tampa Bay Lightening    Bradley        Bradley       Creighton/Kasper
>Toronto Maple Leafs     Gilmour        Potvin        Ellett/Anderson
>Vancouver Canucks       Bure           Nedved(finally)    Momesso
>Washington Capitals     Hatcher        Bondra/Cote   Elynuik
>Winnipeg Jets           Selanne        Selanne       Druce

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52578
From: hse31913@vax1.utulsa.edu (hse31913@vax1.utulsa.edu(Scott H.), U of Tulsa)
Subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE DOUBTERS NOW?  HMM?

In article <1993Apr4.051942.27095@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca>,
 maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
 
> And after the Leafs make cream cheese of the Philadelphia side tomorrow
> night the Leafs will be without equal.
> 
> The Leafs are the best team in the Campbell Conference.
> 
> cordially, as always,
> 
> rm
>  
> -- 
> Roger Maynard 
> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

More like Philadelphia making dust out of dead Leafs.
Roger why do you continue to embarass yourself with your brash predictions?

They got whitewashed by a last place team.  Granted Philly is pretty decent
but the "best team in the Cambell Conference" would have beaten a last
place team.

-- 
Scott E. Humphrey,  Chemical Engineering, University of Tulsa
hse31913@vax1.utulsa.edu
Bruins for The Cup!!!
Opinions expressed are those of the individual, not of the U of Tulsa.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52579
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: re:  Don Cherry's Coach's Corner Summary - April 3, 1993


allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan) writes:

Before I begin lambasting Don Cherry, let me first say that I've been sort of
a Cherry fan for a while...admittedly stuff he says has to be taken lightly,
but he's more-or-less harmless.  On Saturday, however, he crossed the lines of
good taste:

>According to Don, the entire article wasn't perfect, and there
>were some 'shots' by Frank Musil and Alpo Suhonen. 
>Don noted that Musil wasn't much of a player (didn't
>score many goals last year). He also made fun of their names...
>One guy has a name like dog food, the other like a laxitive
>(meta-Musil).

This is the best he can do?!!  Gee Don, tremendous amounts of professionalism
here.  The CBC looks just as bad as he looks foolish letting him get away with
this nonsense...making fun of names??  It's bad enough that he makes asinine
blanket statements about European players, but he's now resorted to making fun
of their names too?  He sounded like an idiot, much like he did last week
when he said that Teemu would never make it to his 'Rock 'em, Sock 'em' video
until he dropped the gloves...

>On the subject of realignment, Don said that he liked the
>new division names.

Well, what he _said_ was that even though he's been around the league for quite
some time, he still doesn't know who's where w.r.t. conference and division
names.  HELLO??!! McFly??  The names have been around for a couple of decades
or so....he also invited the audience to "Name the teams in the Wales...quick,
quick!" Followed by "Ah, you don't know, I don't know...."  

Sorry Don.  Wrong on this one.

>Ron (to Don): "I don't know wy I like you on your show
>for 30 minutes... I can hardly stand you on this show for 5."

This was absolutely hilarious.

Don's argument about the basketball and baseball brawls was fairly
good...unfortunately he neglected to mention the fines that were levelled in
the NBA case.  Serious money...oh well, he's never been one for objectivity,
has he?

Don's question to Gretzky:

>Wouldn't it be better
>for you to change your friends so that they like the game, than for
>us to change the game for your friends?"

Now this I liked.



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52580
From: slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca
Subject: Trade rumor: Montreal/Ottawa/Phillie

TSN Sportsdesk just reported that the OTTAWA SUN has reported that
Montreal will send 4 players + $15 million including Vin Damphousse 
and Brian Bellows to Phillidelphia, Phillie will send Eric Lindros
to Ottawa, and Ottawa will give it's first round pick to Montreal.
 
If this is true, it will most likely depend on whether or not Ottawa
gets to choose 1st overall.  Can Ottawa afford Lindros' salary?
 
Personally, I can't see Philli giving up Lindros -- for anything.  
They didn't give away that much to Quebec just to trade him away 
again.  Not to mention that Lindros seems to be a *huge* draw in
Phillie -- and that he represents a successful future for the 
franchise.
 
Ottawa may be better off taking the 4 players +$15 from Montreal
for the pick.
 
Stephen Legge
SLEGGE@kean.ucs.munc.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52581
From: darling@cellar.org (Thomas Darling)
Subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE DOUBTERS NOW?  HMM?

jason@studsys.mscs.mu.edu (Jason Hanson) writes:

> In article <1993Apr4.051942.27095@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.
> >
> >And after the Leafs make cream cheese of the Philadelphia side tomorrow
> >night the Leafs will be without equal.
> 
> Then again, maybe not.

To put it mildly.  As I watched the Flyers demolish Toronto last night, 4-0,
I realized that no matter how good the Leafs' #1 line may be, they'll need
one or two more decent lines to go far in the playoffs.  And, of course, a
healthy Felix Potvin.

^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^\\\^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^
Thomas A. Darling \\\ The Cellar BBS & Public Access System: 215.539.3043
darling@cellar.org \\\ GEnie: T.DARLING \\ FactHQ "Truth Thru Technology"
v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~\\\~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52582
From: darling@cellar.org (Thomas Darling)
Subject: Re: Good for hockey/Bad for hockey

jmd@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (joseph.m.dakes) writes:

> In article <1ppdccINNbe1@dev-null.phys.psu.edu>, stimpy@dev-null.phys.psu.edu
> > In article <C4wxnF.Bx1@constellation.ecn.uoknor.edu> mfoster@alliant.backbo
> > >I prefer the Miami Colons myself.  Headline: FLAMES BLOW OUT COLONS, 9-1
> > 
> > Would Kevin Dineen play for the Miami Colons???
> 
> As a Flyers fan, I resent you making Kevin Dineen the butt of your
> jokes:-)!

Aw, just take a moment to digest it and I'm sure you'll see the humour...

^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^\\\^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^
Thomas A. Darling \\\ The Cellar BBS & Public Access System: 215.539.3043
darling@cellar.org \\\ GEnie: T.DARLING \\ FactHQ "Truth Thru Technology"
v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~\\\~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52583
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <1993Apr5.212018.25066@eng.cam.ac.uk> dscy@eng.cam.ac.uk (D.S.C. Yap) writes:
>smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale) writes:
>
>>                        Team           Biggest       Biggest
>>Team:                   MVP:          Surprise:    Disappointment:
>>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>Washington Capitals     Hatcher        Bondra/Cote   Elynuik
>>Winnipeg Jets           Selanne        Selanne       Druce
>
>                                                      ^^^^^^^^
>                                                      weren't these two
>                                                      traded for each
>                                                      other?  Poetic justice.

They were, and even if Washington might consider Patty a bust, I'd rework
that trade in a minute.  Druce has been a complete and utter bust here,
only 5 goals.

Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52584
From: mac18@po.CWRU.Edu (Michael A. Cornell)
Subject: Hey FLYERS Fans!


Did you ever notice how many people on the net have trouble in the
comparitively easy task of spelling the nick name of our fair city?  I
never knew that Philadelphia becomes Phillie or Philli when spoken of.  So
for all you who don't know yet here's a _little_ clue.

	IT IS SPELLED:       P H I L L Y

OK...thank you.

Oh yeah, about that drug-induced trade rumor....I don't think the Sniders
are that stupid...the rumor you should be looking into is Mike Keenan
coming back to coach the FLYERS.

later

Mike

-- 
Mike Cornell     | "There are a great many people in the country today who,
mac18@po.cwru.edu|  through no fault of their own, are sane." -Monty Python
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Let's Go Flyers!  Stanley Cup in '94!  "OH! My brain hurts!"- Mr D. P. Gumby

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52585
From: seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr)
Subject: Re: Adams Division Race

In article <1993Apr2.175052.22810@thunder.mcrcim.mcgill.edu>, breton@McRCIM.McGill.EDU (Pierre Breton) writes:
> 
> 
> The Adams division race is certainly interesting this year.  Here are
> important data to keep in mind in the eventuality of a tie for a given
> standing position.
> 
> In head to head games:
> Quebec wins over Montreal, 4-3-0;
> Boston leads against Quebec, 3-1-1 with two games remaining;
> Montreal and Boston are tied, 4-4-0 with one game remaining.
> 
>       (..)        Pierre Breton   (aka Fluide Glacial)

Pierre,
For purposes of the tie breaker, you only count the first three games in
each city. Therefore, Quebec cannot possibly be ahead of Montreal 4-3,
and there's probably only one game that counts remaining between Boston
and Quebec, which means Boston has probably already won.

pete clark - rsh FLYERS contact

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52586
From: pereira@CAM.ORG (Dean Pereira)
Subject: Canadiens - another Stanley Cup???


		With the kind of team Montreal has now,  they can take the
cup easily.  The only problem they have right now is that everyone is
trying to steal the show and play alone.  They need some massive teamwork.
	They are also in a little of a slump because long-time hockey
Montreal Canadiens announcer Claude Mouton died last tuesday and it was
rough on everybody because he has worked with the organization for 21
years.  But I know that is no excuse.  But if the Habs manage to get some
good teamwork and get into the spirit,  they should have no problem
winning in May.

						Dean

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52587
From: drbombay@netlink.cts.com (Walter Ladwig)
Subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE DOUBTERS NOW?  HMM?

The Blackhawks shall triumph.

Walter Ladwig             @ "This is the weather the cuckoo likes,
Net Link                  @  armored division submissive to 
DrBombay@Netlink.cts.com  @  vernacular the world into a gambling
                          @  birdhouse velocity."
                                                -The Cut-Ups

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52588
From: rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser)
Subject: Re: Canadiens - another Stanley Cup???

pereira@CAM.ORG (Dean Pereira) writes:


>		With the kind of team Montreal has now,  they can take the
>cup easily.  The only problem they have right now is that everyone is
>trying to steal the show and play alone.  They need some massive teamwork.
>	They are also in a little of a slump because long-time hockey
>Montreal Canadiens announcer Claude Mouton died last tuesday and it was
>rough on everybody because he has worked with the organization for 21
>years.  But I know that is no excuse.  But if the Habs manage to get some
>good teamwork and get into the spirit,  they should have no problem
>winning in May.

   I agree. I also think Roy needs a good kick sometimes...that horrible
4-0 loss to the Capitals last week...yeeeech!

   Here's to Cup #23...this year!

 
-- 
Richard J. Rauser        "You have no idea what you're doing."
rauser@sfu.ca            "Oh, don't worry about that. We're professional
WNI                          outlaws - we do this for a living."
-----------------
"Remember, no matter where you go, there you are." -Dr.Banzai

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52589
From: rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser)
Subject: Too Many Europeans in NHL



   Ten years ago, the number of Europeans in the NHL was roughly a quarter
of what it is now. Going into the 1992/93 season, the numbers of Euros on
NHL teams have escalated to the following stats:

Canadians: 400
Americans: 100
Europeans: 100

   Please note that these numbers are rounded off, and taken from the top
25 players on each of the 24 teams. My source is the Vancouver Sun.

   Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. I am sick
of watching a game between an American and a Canadian team (let's say, the
Red Wings and the Canucks) and seeing names like "Bure" "Konstantinov" and
"Borshevshky". Is this North America or isn't it? Toronto, Detriot, Quebec,
and Edmonton are particularly annoying, but the numbers of Euros on other
teams is getting worse as well. 

    I live in Vancouver and if I hear one more word about "Pavel Bure, the
Russian Rocket" I will completely throw up. As it is now, every time I see
the Canucks play I keep hoping someone will cross-check Bure into the plexiglassso hard they have to carry him out on a stretcher. (By the way, I'm not a
Canucks fan to begin with ;-). 

    Okay, the stretcher remark was a little carried away. But the point is that
I resent NHL owners drafting all these Europeans INSTEAD of Canadians (and
some Americans). It denies young Canadians the opportunity to play in THEIR
NORTH AMERICAN LEAGUE and instead gives it to Europeans, who aren't even
better hockey players. It's all hype. This "European mystique" is sickening,
but until NHL owners get over it, Canadian and American players will continue
to have to fight harder to get drafted into their own league.

    With the numbers of Euros in the NHL escalating, the problem is clearly
only getting worse.

    I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let the Bures
and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.

    I just don't want them on mine.


 
 
-- 
Richard J. Rauser        "You have no idea what you're doing."
rauser@sfu.ca            "Oh, don't worry about that. We're professional
WNI                          outlaws - we do this for a living."
-----------------
"Remember, no matter where you go, there you are." -Dr.Banzai

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52590
From: shadow@r-node.hub.org (Jay Chu)
Subject: Lindros will be traded!!!

True rumor.  Fact!  A big three way deal!

Eric Lindros going to Ottawa Senators.  And Senators get $15mill from
Montreal.

Montreal gets Alexander Daigle (the first round pick from Senators)

Philly gets Damphousse, Bellow, Patrick Roy and a draft pick.

-- 
        ______                shadow@r-node.gts.org
       | |__| |   If it's there and you can see it       - it's real
       |  ()  |   If it's there and you can't see it     - it's transparent
       |______|   If it's not there and you can't see it - you erased it!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52591
From: jslam@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (joseph.lam)
Subject: Re: Request for Islanders e-mail list

In article <1993Apr3.014237.20959@sifon.cc.mcgill.ca> bui@ee470.ee.mcgill.ca (BUI/DON/MR) writes:
>In article <16b5xvf@rpi.edu> wangr@rpi.edu writes:
>>>If anyone out there is keeping an Islanders e-mail list, could you
>>>please add me to it? Thanks in advance.
>>
>>>Ercu
>>	
>>	Can u add me onto the list too....Thanks...
>>
>>Rex
>
>Count me IN !!!!
>
>Go Isles!
>
>						-Don
>
>bui@ee470.ee.mcgill.ca
>

Please count me in also...

Just can't tell you how excited I was when the Islanders beat the Rangers
in overtime on last Friday!!!

Go Isles!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52592
From: mfoster@alliant.backbone.uoknor.edu (Marc Foster)
Subject: Re: Expansion

In article <PATRICK.93Apr2201529@blanco.owlnet.rice.edu> patrick@blanco.owlnet.rice.edu (Patrick L Humphrey) writes:
>On Fri, 2 Apr 1993 22:05:16 GMT, vamwendt@atlas.cs.upei.ca (Michael Wendt) said

>>16.   Albany (New York), Boise (Idaho)--A couple of cities with fair interest
>>but size and closeness to other teams is a question.

>Albany has their AHL franchise (though it goes by the Capital District label),
>but Boise?  Forget it.  The CHL made an attempt at that part of the country in
>1983-84, with a franchise in Great Falls -- and no one showed up.  Folks up in
>that part of the PNW just aren't interested in hockey.

Hey Patrick, the Montana Magic played in Billings, not Great Falls...

>--PLH, I know where I'd put the next two NHL expansion teams: Phoenix and
>Houston, assuming the Whalers don't pack up and move in the meantime...

Marc, Phoenix and Houston it is... 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
        _/_/    _/         _/_/   _/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/   _/_/     _/_/_/ 
     _/    _/  _/       _/    _/      _/  _/       _/    _/  _/
    _/    _/  _/       _/    _/     _/   _/       _/    _/  _/
   _/_/_/    _/       _/_/_/_/    _/    _/_/_/   _/_/_/      _/_/
  _/    _/  _/       _/    _/   _/     _/       _/    _/        _/
 _/    _/  _/       _/    _/  _/      _/       _/     _/       _/    _ _ _____
_/_/_/    _/_/_/_/ _/    _/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/      _/ _/_/_/     - - /____/
...............................................................................
Marc Foster, r.s.h contact for the Oklahoma City Blazers, 1993 Central Hockey
University of Oklahoma Geography Department               League Adams Cup
Internet: mfoster@geohub.gcn.uoknor.edu                   Champions
          mfoster@alliant.backbone.uoknor.edu 

To be placed on the CHL Mailing List, send email to either address above.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52593
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Trade rumor: Montreal/Ottawa/Phillie

In article <1993Apr5.203552.1@kean.ucs.mun.ca> slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca writes:
>TSN Sportsdesk just reported that the OTTAWA SUN has reported that
>Montreal will send 4 players + $15 million including Vin Damphousse 
>and Brian Bellows to Phillidelphia, Phillie will send Eric Lindros
>to Ottawa, and Ottawa will give it's first round pick to Montreal.
>

Obviously some reporter for the Ottawa Sun got taken by an April
Fools joke...probably started by someone with the Nordiques or the
Bruins.  

Like for example...who is going to reimburse the Flyers for the
$15 million they paid to the Nordiques...like the Senators are
going to get Lindros and $15 million.  The Flyers sent the
equivalent of 6 or 7 players (when you include the draft choices)
to Quebec, and they are going to get only four back.

Some reporter was had real badly and someone must be having a
real good laugh seeing as how the so much of the sports media
has chosen to publicize this utter nonsense.

>If this is true, it will most likely depend on whether or not Ottawa
>gets to choose 1st overall.  Can Ottawa afford Lindros' salary?
>

Can you think...it cannot possibly be true...no need for the "if"!

>Personally, I can't see Philli giving up Lindros -- for anything.  
>They didn't give away that much to Quebec just to trade him away 
>again.  Not to mention that Lindros seems to be a *huge* draw in
>Phillie -- and that he represents a successful future for the 
>franchise.
> 
>Ottawa may be better off taking the 4 players +$15 from Montreal
>for the pick.
> 

I can't believe that anyone would consider giving such crap even
the remotest consideration.

Gerald       


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52594
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In <rauser.734062608@sfu.ca> rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard "The Racist" Rauser) writes:

[all kinds of unacceptably racist drivel deleted]

And after that we find the man has absolutely nothing to say.

Richard J. Rauser, you are a dishonourable little man.

caustically, when necessary,

rm
    
-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52595
From: jbarrett@aludra.usc.edu (Jonathan Barrett)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:

>    Okay, the stretcher remark was a little carried away. But the point is that
>I resent NHL owners drafting all these Europeans INSTEAD of Canadians (and
>some Americans). It denies young Canadians the opportunity to play in THEIR
>NORTH AMERICAN LEAGUE and instead gives it to Europeans, who aren't even
>better hockey players. It's all hype. This "European mystique" is sickening,
>but until NHL owners get over it, Canadian and American players will continue
>to have to fight harder to get drafted into their own league.

According to what reasonable principle of justice does standing in intimate
geographical and psychological relations to a league give one some privileged
right to play in it?

A European

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52596
From: coulman@cs.Usask.CA (Randy Coulman)
Subject: Re: Playoff Predictions

In article <1993Apr04.223559.7129@rose.com>, jack.petrilli@rose.com (jack petrilli) writes:

[... stuff deleted ...]
>
>I don't understand why so many people are predicting an upset against 
>Pittsburgh. The team has won 12 in a row coming into the playoffs. 
>They've won practically every game that they've really wanted to win 
>all year (including critical victories against the Caps and one 
>against a hot Bruins team **at the Gaahden**). The team is probably at 
>its peak (stronger than the previous 2 Stanley Cup winners). I mean, I 
>know they can lose but it would be a **large** upset. I personally 
>think teams are going to be hard pressed to win 1 or 2 games in any 
>series against the Pens (and I'm **not** a Pittsburgh fan).
>

I have to agree here.  As I heard on TSN tonight, "You want to pick
someone else, but you just don't see how you can".  And I'm a Bruins
fan.  Maybe this year will be different, but it doesn't look good.
Time will tell, though.

[... lots more deleted ...]

Randy
-- 
Randy A. Coulman, M.Sc.         |       ARIES Laboratory
Research Assistant              |       Department of Computational Science
                                |       University of Saskatchewan
coulman@cs.Usask.ca             |       Saskatoon, SK   S7N 0W0             

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52597
From: kozloce@wkuvx1.bitnet
Subject: Re: Good for hockey/Bad for hockey

In article <Rs2J2B8w164w@cellar.org>, darling@cellar.org (Thomas Darling) writes:
> jmd@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (joseph.m.dakes) writes:
> 
>> In article <1ppdccINNbe1@dev-null.phys.psu.edu>, stimpy@dev-null.phys.psu.edu
>> > In article <C4wxnF.Bx1@constellation.ecn.uoknor.edu> mfoster@alliant.backbo
>> > >I prefer the Miami Colons myself.  Headline: FLAMES BLOW OUT COLONS, 9-1
>> > 
>> > Would Kevin Dineen play for the Miami Colons???
>> 
>> As a Flyers fan, I resent you making Kevin Dineen the butt of your
>> jokes:-)!
> 
> Aw, just take a moment to digest it and I'm sure you'll see the humour...
> 
> ^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^\\\^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^
> Thomas A. Darling \\\ The Cellar BBS & Public Access System: 215.539.3043
> darling@cellar.org \\\ GEnie: T.DARLING \\ FactHQ "Truth Thru Technology"
> v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~\\\~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v


If anybody is having problems following the thread be sure to ask the
origonal poster to rectify your misunderstanding.

KOZ
LETS GO CAPS!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52598
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Canadiens - another Stanley Cup???

In <rauser.734062534@sfu.ca> rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:

>pereira@CAM.ORG (Dean Pereira) writes:


>>		With the kind of team Montreal has now,  they can take the
>>cup easily.  The only problem they have right now is that everyone is
>>trying to steal the show and play alone.  They need some massive teamwork.

This is known as the Savard syndrome - and we are talking Denis, not Serge.
No team will ever win squat with the likes of Denis Savard in their lineup.

>>	They are also in a little of a slump because long-time hockey
>>Montreal Canadiens announcer Claude Mouton died last tuesday and it was
>>rough on everybody because he has worked with the organization for 21
>>years.  But I know that is no excuse.  But if the Habs manage to get some
>>good teamwork and get into the spirit,  they should have no problem
>>winning in May.

They could tell Savard to stay home and watch the games on TV.

>   I agree. I also think Roy needs a good kick sometimes...that horrible
>4-0 loss to the Capitals last week...yeeeech!

>   Here's to Cup #23...this year!

Sounds like #12 to me.

cordially, as always, 

rm

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52599
From: slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca
Subject: Re:Re: Trade rumor: Montreal/Ottawa/Phillie

>>TSN Sportsdesk just reported that the OTTAWA SUN has reported    
>>tht Montreal will send 4 players + $15 million including Vin 
>>Damphousse and Brian Bellows to Philldelphia, Phillie will send 
>>Eric Lindros to Ottawa, and Ottawa will give it's first round pick 
>>to Montreal.

>>Personally, I can't see Philli giving up Lindros -- for anything.    
  
> Here we go again. Is this the same idiot who posted the Gretzky     
> trade to Toronto????               ^^^^^?!!!

Listen, *ASSHOLE*, I'm just commenting on what I heard 
reported on the sports news!!

You'll notice my skeptical comment!  Sheesh... I thought this group 
wasfor conversation!  Guess I was wrong. }-<

Stephen Legge
SLEGGE@kean.ucs.munc.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52600
From: daniell@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Daniel Lyddy)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <rauser.734062608@sfu.ca> rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:
>
>
>   Ten years ago, the number of Europeans in the NHL was roughly a quarter
>of what it is now. Going into the 1992/93 season, the numbers of Euros on
>NHL teams have escalated to the following stats:
>
>Canadians: 400
>Americans: 100
>Europeans: 100
>
>
>   Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. I am sick

You know, you're absolutely right.  I think we should round up all those
players of European descent and ship 'em back to where they came from.  Let's
see, with whom should we start?  I dunno, Lemieux?  Hmmm...sounds like he
has *French* blood in him!!!  Hey!  France is part of Europe!  Send that
Euro-blooded boy back!!!

Sheesh.

>    I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let the Bures
>and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.
>
>    I just don't want them on mine.

I don't think it would be hard to find some Native Americans (or Native
Canadians, for that matter) who would dispute your claim to this great 
continent of *ours.*  Ya see, if you believe the anthropologists, we're *all*
immigrants of some sort.  If you really don't think that Mogilny, Bure,
Selanne, et al have improved the NHL, then I'm not sure you understand the
game.
-- 
******************************************************************************
Dan Lyddy    daniell@cory.berkeley.edu    University of California at Berkeley
"No, I don't play hockey.  Not too many brothers do."  -- Deion Sanders

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52601
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: Good for hockey/Bad for hockey

>>> > >I prefer the Miami Colons myself.  Headline: FLAMES BLOW OUT COLONS, 9-1
>>> > Would Kevin Dineen play for the Miami Colons???
>>> As a Flyers fan, I resent you making Kevin Dineen the butt of your
>>> jokes:-)!
>> Aw, just take a moment to digest it and I'm sure you'll see the humour...
>If anybody is having problems following the thread be sure to ask the
>origonal poster to rectify your misunderstanding.

	What about his rectum?






-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52602
From: slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca
Subject: Re: Too Many European in NHL

RA>    Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. 
R> I am sick of watching a game between an American and a Canadian 
RA> team (let's say, the Red Wings and the Canucks) and seeing names 
R> like "Bure" "Konstantinov" and "Borshevshky". Is this North America 
RA> isn't it?
 
I disagree.  I think the NHL should feature the best hockey talent in
the world -- regardless of nationality.  I have to admit that when I 
see players like Gretzky and Messier traded off to the US because the
Canadian teams can't afford them, I have been know to say (only half-
seriously) that we'd probably be better off if we had our own Canadian
hockey league for Canadian players! ;-)

RA> I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let 
RA> te Bures and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.    

RA> 
RA> I just don't want themon mine.   
 
Again, it doesn't matter to me -- Russian, Finnish, Mexican, Albertan,
New Yorker, black, white, korean, martian, plutoneon, ... it doesn't
matter.
 
Any of them can put a Leafs' jersey on if they can put the puck in! 
:-)

Stephen Legge
SLEGGE@kean.ucs.munc.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52603
From: stimpy@dev-null.phys.psu.edu (Gregory Nagy)
Subject: Re: Good for hockey/Bad for hockey

In article <91548@hydra.gatech.EDU> gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak) writes:
>>>> > >I prefer the Miami Colons myself.  Headline: FLAMES BLOW OUT COLONS, 9-1
>>>> > Would Kevin Dineen play for the Miami Colons???
>>>> As a Flyers fan, I resent you making Kevin Dineen the butt of your
>>>> jokes:-)!
>>> Aw, just take a moment to digest it and I'm sure you'll see the humour...
>>If anybody is having problems following the thread be sure to ask the
>>origonal poster to rectify your misunderstanding.
>
>	What about his rectum?

It's bad jokes like that which draws crohns, I mean groans from the crowd...
Don't bother looking it up in the appendix, it's useless anyway.
         
Just one more word of advice...

If you go to a Miami game, stay away from any foods made with "natural casings"

:)
--

      __-----__     _______________________
     / _______ \   /                       \
    |_// \/ \ \_| / Hockey! Hockey! Hockey! \
    /__|O||O|__U\ \   Joy!    Joy!    Joy!  /
   |/_ \_/\_/ _U | \_______________________/
   | | (____) | ||  //    Stimpson J Kat
   \/\___/\__/  // //     stimpy@dev-null.phys.psu.edu
   (_/  _5_  ~~~| //      nagy@physci.psu.edu           
    |   \*/     |\/       nagy@cs.psu.edu
     \___v_____/_/        nagy@crayola.cs.psu.edu
      \____/---//         nagy@love-shack.com
     __|| _-----               and oh yeah...              
    (____(____)           GGN100@psuvm.[psu.edu,bitnet]     
     ~~~~ ~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52604
From: "Terence M. Rokop" <tr2i+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: NCAA finals...Winner????

ktgeiss@miavx1.acs.muohi writes:

>Lake State/Maine in finals...WHO WON?   Please post.

Maine 5, LSSU 4.



                                                Terry

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52605
From: v124p7kk@ubvmsc.cc.buffalo.edu (Darryl S Brooks)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL (Euro-bashing?)

In article <rauser.734062608@sfu.ca>, rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes...
> 
> 
>   Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. I am sick
>of watching a game between an American and a Canadian team (let's say, the
>Red Wings and the Canucks) and seeing names like "Bure" "Konstantinov" and
>"Borshevshky". Is this North America or isn't it? Toronto, Detriot, Quebec,
>and Edmonton are particularly annoying, but the numbers of Euros on other
>teams is getting worse as well. 
> 
>    I live in Vancouver and if I hear one more word about "Pavel Bure, the
>Russian Rocket" I will completely throw up. As it is now, every time I see
>the Canucks play I keep hoping someone will cross-check Bure into the plexiglassso hard they have to carry him out on a stretcher. (By the way, I'm not a
>Canucks fan to begin with ;-). 
> 
>    Okay, the stretcher remark was a little carried away. But the point is that
>I resent NHL owners drafting all these Europeans INSTEAD of Canadians (and
>some Americans). It denies young Canadians the opportunity to play in THEIR
>NORTH AMERICAN LEAGUE and instead gives it to Europeans, who aren't even
>better hockey players. It's all hype. This "European mystique" is sickening,
>but until NHL owners get over it, Canadian and American players will continue
>to have to fight harder to get drafted into their own league.
> 
>    With the numbers of Euros in the NHL escalating, the problem is clearly
>only getting worse.
> 
>    I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let the Bures
>and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.
> 
>    I just don't want them on mine.
> 
> 
	Ah, so now we're into European player bashing?  What next?  
No more French Canadiens?  Yeah, there's an idea!  Let them French-
speaking Canadiens have their own hockey league!  We don't want them!
	Are you _CRAZY_?  The NHL is one of the true international
leagues, and yes, there _ARE_ many Europeans who deserve to play in
the NHL and are better than some North Americans, look at Teemu!!!
I, for one, am glad to see Europeans in the NHL and I hope the
NHL soon expands to Europe.  Its nice to see all these different
people come together to form the (soon to be) 26 hockey teams.
	
> 
> 
>-- 
>Richard J. Rauser        "You have no idea what you're doing."
>rauser@sfu.ca            "Oh, don't worry about that. We're professional
>WNI                          outlaws - we do this for a living."
>-----------------
>"Remember, no matter where you go, there you are." -Dr.Banzai

Darryl Brooks                    University at Buffalo
                __                 ______                        ///
       | |     /  \  \ \     / /  / _____          / /         ////
       | |    / /\ \  \ \___/ /  (  \          ---/-/---       ///
       | |   / /__\ \   \   /      \  \       ---/-/---       ///
| |____| |  /  ____  \   | |     ____\  )       / /          ///
 \______/  / /      \ \  | |     ______/                  ///////

                   Go Bills, Sabres, and Magic!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52606
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Stan Fischler, 4/4


At the Lester Patrick Awards lunch, Bill Torrey mentioned that one of his
options next season is to be president of the Miami team, with Bob Clarke
working for him.  At the same dinner, Clarke said that his worst mistake
in Philadelphia was letting Mike Keenan go -- in retrospect, almost all
players came realize that Keenan knew what it took to win.  Rumours are
now circulating that Keenan will be back with the Flyers.

Nick Polano is sick of being a scapegoat for the schedule made for the
Red Wings; After all, Bryan Murray approved it.

Gerry Meehan and John Muckler are worried over the Sabres' prospects;
Assistant Don Lever says that the Sabres have to get their share now,
because a Quebec dynasty is emerging ...

The Mighty Ducks have declared that they will not throw money around
loosely to buy a team.

Oilers coach Ted Green remarked that "There some guys around who can
fill Tie Domi's skates, but none who can fill his helmet."

Senators' Andrew McBain told off a security guard at Chicago Stadium
who warned him of the stairs leading down to the locker room; McBain
mouthed off at him, after all being a seasoned professional ... and
tumbled down the entire steep flight.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52607
From: "Patricia L. Bruno" <pb37+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Hockey Hell

> 
>In article <C4nq5G.EKB@noose.ecn.purdue.edu>,
>rgemeinh@separator.ecn.purdue.edu (Richard A Gemeinhart) wrote:
>> 
>> In article <1993Mar26.155933.9669@ncsu.edu> fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu
(FRANK MICH
>AE SALVATORE) writes:
>> >
>> >
>> >I am originally from New York State, and I go to school
>> >in North Carolina.  Yet, I don't constantly gripe about
>> >the lack of hockey.  Wouldn't some of you who chose to go
>> >to school in the South realize (most who gripe are Clemson students)
>> >that hockey isn't quite as popular in South Carolina
>> >when you chose a school?
>> >
>> >Why did you all (excuse me - y'all) choose schools in
>> >the South if hockey was this important to you?  
>> 
>> Not everyone has the luxury of deciding on a college by making sure the 
>> hockey coveraage is what you want it to be.  I am a Pittsburgh transplan
>> to S. C. when at home and the coveraage sucks.  Sports south didn't
even show
>> the final game of the Stanley Cup laast year while it was happening.  They
>> put it on ktape delay and cut the intermissions then went off the air.  
>> When you move you take the good with the bad and deal with it;  it doesn't
>> mean thaat you can't complain about it.
> 
>I was transplanted by my parents from the Greater Hartford area to the
>Greater Cleveland, Ohio area.  This was not an action of my choice.  The
>only hockey coverage I could get there regularly was Red Wings and Penguins
>(explaining, in part, why I follow these teams today).  In Cleveland you
>couldn't even find hockey scores on the 11 o'clock news because they
>figured that if they didn't have it, it wasn't a sport.
> 


At least your parents didn't move you Idaho.  The only things that get
any coverage there are football, basketball and baseball!

Patty


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52608
From: ddf@mips.com (Dee Dee France)
Subject: European/Russian Hockey team addresses?

Does anyone have the addresses to any of the following hockey teams
located in the Czech/Slovak Republics, Finland, Russia or Sweden?
Any information on how to find these addresses would also be appreciated.

Aik
Assat
Brynas
Budejovice
Chelabinsk
Djurgarden
Dynamo
Eskulap
Espoo
Farjestad
Frolunda
HPK
HV-71
Hifk
Ilves
JYP HT
Jihlava
Jokerit
Jokp
Kalpa
Khimik
Kladno
Kristall
Lada
Leksand
Litvinov
Lukko
Lulea
Malmo
Metallurg
Modo
Olomouc
Pardubice
Red Army
Rogle
Skoda
Slovan
Soviet Wings
Sparta
Spartak
TPS
Tappara
Trencin
Tuto
Vantaa
Vasteras
Yaroslavl
Zlin

-- 
Dee Dee France
ddf@sgi.com 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52609
From: adams@hunter.unr.edu (Brian Adams)
Subject: Re: In memoriam: Dan Kelly and Danny Gallivan

In article <1993Apr5.194440.18546@ists.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:
>In article <burke.1-290393150052@burkemac.oshag.nd.edu> burke.1@nd.edu (R. P. Burke) writes:
>>When talking about hockey broadcasters, let's give a moment of silence to
>>remember the St. Louis Blues' great, Dan Kelly. (Many of you may have heard
>>him in the late 60s and early 70s on CBS.) He used to do Hockey Night In
>>Canada intermissions, with another recently deceased great, Danny Gallivan
>>of the Canadiens.
>

I *loved* Dan Kelly!  He was on USA when I first got hooked on Hockey back
in 1980 or so.  No, he wasn't always spot on top of the play, and he
wasn't overly cute, but those pipes!  That lusty, barrel chested, voice!
No pipsqueak was he (unlike some fellas we know!)

I rode into hockey mania on the coattails of Gretzky and the Boys on the
Bus.  My first Finals saw the Islanders sweep them.  But I'll never
forget the night, a year later, when the Oilers closed it out at home in
the pandemonium, the smoke from a million sparklers, the long empty-net
goal near the end, and Dan Kelly letting the crowd's reaction tell the
story for a few long seconds, then that voice barking through the din
"Dave Lumley ... sews it up for Edmonton!"  It sounds stupid, but that
early (for me) hockey memory will always bring a thrill.  Since then
I've grown a lot more jaded about the game, but I was really saddened
by Dan Kelly's passing.  He was one of the good guys.

Brian Adams
Reno




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52610
From: mjacques@flute.calpoly.edu (Michael Jacques)
Subject: Re: Playoff Predictions

In article <1pn4qhINNsm1@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU> boudreau@athena.mit.edu (Carol V. Boudreau) writes:
>


>
>In the Smythe:
>This one is the toughest for me to call, because I have to put
>personal bias aside (Go Calgary).  I think a lot depends on who
>wins the division.  Winnipeg will move into third by the end of
>the season, and the first place winner will have a clear advantage.
>It will be a lot easier to build momentum against a team like the
>Kings.  Whoever plays the Kings in the first round will take the
>division.  Much as it hurts, I have to pick,
>Division Winner - Vancouver Canucks

I'll have to disagree with you on this one. I think Vancouver will go as
Bure goes, and if he continues on his goal scoring slump, then they
won't even make it out of the first round. I think the Kings will make
it out of the first round, regardless of who they play. They seem to be
doing pretty well, even with that bad game against Minnesota on
Saturday. I think it'll be either Calgary or Los Angeles to win the
Smythe (i.e. go on to the conference finals). 
>
>Wales Conference Trophy:
>Islanders and Bruins will fight to the end, but I think the
>Islanders have enough steam to overtake the Bruins in seven.
>
>Campbell Conference Trophy:
>a walk for Vancouver, maybe in 5 or 6 but definately not 7.
>
>Stanley Cup Final:
>Islanders and Vancouver.  Islanders will have nothing left by
>this point and will succumb fairly easily to the Canucks.
>
>Stanley Cup Champion: Vancouver Canucks

Still have to disagree with you here. I think it'll be Pittsburg to
get the hat trick in Stanley Cups. They just look
toooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo good. 
>
>I hope you have enjoyed my predictions.  I hope they are not
>all correct (Go Calgary).
>
Neither do I. Well, may the best team win it all (Pittsburg). That's
just my $.02 worth.
>
>-- 
>----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>message from the terminal of:
>Carol Boudreau  <boudreau@Athena.mit.edu>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52611
From: peterson@pms001.pms.ford.com (Doug Peterson)
Subject: NCAA Hockey Final

I haven't seen anyone post this so I will do the honors.

Maine beat LSSU 5-4 in Milwaukee on Saturday night.  It was quite a game.
Maine stormed to a 2-0 lead in the first and looked like they might run away
with it.  Maine's first goal came inside the first thirty seconds of the game.
LSSU came back at the end of the period to cut the lead to 2-1.

LSSU came out in the second dominating the play particularly along the boards.
The play went quickly with the refs running a no-holds-barred type of game.
LSSU scored three more unanswered goals to lead 4-2 at the end of the second.
Now it looked like LSSU might just walk away with the game.

Coach Walsh, of Maine, replaced the starting goalie Dunham with Snow, who won
the game against Michigan.  Snow proved to be a much more aggressive goalie.
The third period, like the second, belonged to the team behind.  Maine scored
three unanswered goals in a span of five minutes after the four minute mark.
They were all scored by Jim Montgomery, the tournament MVP, and all assisted by
Paul Kariya.

The last minute of the game bears highlighting.  The change to Snow also
proved the difference in the end.  With one minute to go and with the LSSU
goalie pulled, Snow dueled with a LSSU forward in a amazing set of moves by
both.  Snow won.  It was a great way to end the game.

This year's three championships games were sold out last year in about one
month.  The Bradley Center holds approximately 17,700.  

-- 
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
Douglas J. Peterson                   Have         _--____    ____
peterson@pms860.pms.ford.com            you        `   /  ----        / 
Safety Laboratories Department            driven     -/- __  ____ _  /
Ford Motor Company                           a    .  /  / \--/___/ \/
(313) 390-8089                                    \_/  ,\_/ /    \_/_   lately?

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52612
From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In <rauser.734062608@sfu.ca> rauser@fraser.sfu.ca writes:

> 
> 
>    Ten years ago, the number of Europeans in the NHL was roughly a quarter
> of what it is now. Going into the 1992/93 season, the numbers of Euros on
> NHL teams have escalated to the following stats:
> 
> Canadians: 400
> Americans: 100
> Europeans: 100
> 
>    Please note that these numbers are rounded off, and taken from the top
> 25 players on each of the 24 teams. My source is the Vancouver Sun.
> 
>    Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. I am sick
> of watching a game between an American and a Canadian team (let's say, the
> Red Wings and the Canucks) and seeing names like "Bure" "Konstantinov" and
> "Borshevshky". Is this North America or isn't it? Toronto, Detriot, Quebec,
> and Edmonton are particularly annoying, but the numbers of Euros on other
> teams is getting worse as well. 

That's why we have expansion - to create more jobs. NHL teams can't afford to
import role players from Europe, they pick the stars but will continue to build
their teams around local players.
> 
>     With the numbers of Euros in the NHL escalating, the problem is clearly
> only getting worse.
> 
>     I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let the Bures
> and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.

I'd *LOVE* to see a European NHL division but can't see it happen for some
time. There's simply not enough fan interest at the moment in several
"crucial" markets like Germany, Italy and France while Sweden and Finland
probably can't afford to shell out $20-$30 for tickets the way
American/Canadian fans do. Call it "the Minnesota North Stars" effect:
Scandinavians do love hockey but we prefer to watch local, inexpensive
hockey to the NHL. The National Hockey League should love the idea, though.
Pan-European TV channels such as Eurosport could bring in the millions the
American networks likely never will pay.
 
>     I just don't want them on mine.
> 
> 
>  
>  
> -- 
> Richard J. Rauser        "You have no idea what you're doing."
> rauser@sfu.ca            "Oh, don't worry about that. We're professional
> WNI                          outlaws - we do this for a living."
> -----------------
> "Remember, no matter where you go, there you are." -Dr.Banzai

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52613
From: seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <1993Apr5.221541.28537@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca>, golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
> In article <C4zCII.Ftn@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca> smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale) writes:
> >
> >                        Team           Biggest       Biggest
> >Team:                   MVP:          Surprise:    Disappointment:
> >-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >Philadelphia Flyers     Lindros/Recchi Fedyk/Galley  Eklund
> 
> Fence-sitting...look at Philly's record with Eric and without...
> there is no doubt.  Soderstrom is probably the biggest surprise.

Re Eric: True, but fortunately we didn't get to find out what they would be
like without Recchi for 30 games.

Soderstrom: Absolutely. 4 shutouts in 39 games for a rookie without a lot
of defense in front of him. Runnerups to Galley and Fedyk who are scoring
a ton over their career best. But Galley thinks he's Paul Coffey (puts scoring
ahead of defending) and Fedyk has tailed off big time.

Eklund: Was a big question mark this year and was coming off injuries. 42
points in 49 games is not bad at all, and recently he's been a huge factor
in the wins they've gotten. Eklund has never had a point a game season in
his career, his production is very typical for him. How does he qualify as
a disappointment? If anything he's a surprise.

My choice would be Roussel if I went strictly by what was expected of players,
but I never thought that he had what it takes to be a #1 goalie. My biggest
disappointment is Bill Dineen. I thought that he was going to be the perfect
coach for this young team, instead he's made too many bad moves and IMHO
has cost them enough games to keep them out of the playoffs this year. Any
coach that thinks putting Eric Lindros at the point on power plays is a
bright idea needs to go back to coaching school.

pete clark jr - rsh FLYERS contact and mailing list owner

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52614
From: seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr)
Subject: FLYERS notes 4/5



The FLYERS team that can beat any team on any night showed up at the Spectrum
Sunday night, and dominated the Maple Leafs thoroughly en route to a 4-0
shutout. Tommy Soderstrom will get credit for the shutout, but he barely broke
a sweat until the third period as the FLYERS defense kept the Leafs from
mounting any serious attack.

Injuries:

Pelle Eklund is day-to-day with a bruised thigh.

Roster Moves:

Jason Bowen was added to the lineup for his first NHL game. Jason was the FLYERS
second pick in the first round (15th overall) of the 1992 entry draft. 19 years
old, 6'4", 210 lbs. In 62 games with the tri-city Americans he had 10 goals,
12 assists and 219 PIM. He plays left wing and defense, he played defense in
this game although Bobby Taylor said that Bill Dineen was planning to use him
up front as well.

Andre Faust was returned to Hershey. He actually left after the second period
of the Kings game, flew to Albany, got the game tying goal in a Bears OT win,
and played again for Hershey Sunday night.

Lines:

Fedyk-Lindros-Recchi
Beranek-Brind'Amour-Dineen
Lomakin-Butsayev-Conroy
Acton-Brown

Galley-McGill
Yushkevich-Cronin
Carkner-Hawgood
Bowen

Tommy Soderstrom in goal.

Acton replaced Lomakin in the 3rd period.

Game Summary:

If the FLYERS played like this every night, they'd be in the playoffs this
year. The FLYERS hit everything that moved. They created scoring chance after
scoring chance. They snuffed out everything that the Leafs tried to do.

Jason Bowen made a good play on his first NHL shift that almost created a goal.
He had the puck in the top of the left offensive circle all alone, but instead
of taking the shot he found Brind'Amour crashing the net on the other side.
A perfect pass and a good shot across Daren Puppa's body should have been a
goal, but Puppa made a great save reading the play.

Garry Galley gave the Maple Leafs 7th ranked power play the first chance when
he hooked Doug Gilmour at 4:25. The FLYERS lowly 21st ranked penalty killing
unit was almost flawless the entire game, and set the tone on this kill. The
Maple Leafs got almost nothing but long unscreened shots, and the defense swept
away every rebound.

After the power play, the FLYERS got a goal on an ugly play. Rod Brind'Amour
gave the puck to Greg Hawgood at the right point, and he sent a drive at the
net. Puppa made the save and kicked the rebound right into the feet of Josef
Beranek and Bob Rouse, who were wrestling in the slot. Beranek was able to
get his stick on the puck and push it out to Dineen who was skating into
the slot from the right circle, and he lifted a backhander over Puppa for
a 1-0 FLYERS lead at 8:10.

The FLYERS kept the pressure on, and Puppa was the only Leaf keeping the FLYERS
from building on their lead for a while. Eventually things settled down and
defense prevailed. Each team got an occasional scoring chance, but the goalies
were strong. Bowen started giving some Lindros-like checks in his own corners.
Then Lindros, who was looking to avenge a hit Foligno gave him, thought he had
a chance to even the score. He had Foligno lined up at center ice, leaned into
him, and rode him into the center ice boards. The only problem was that Foligno
was a little far from the boards, and Mike "Mister" McGeough felt that it
warranted a boarding call at 15:38

The Leafs couldn't get anything going on the power play as the FLYERS were
very aggressive (for a change) on the kill.

With time running out in the period, Recchi carried through the neutral zone
and handed to Lindros as they approached the Leaf's blue line. They were in
a crowd with Wendell Clark and Jamie Macoun, Lindros tried a backhand pass
to Recchi through the feet of Macoun that connected to Recchi, but then Clark
checked Recchi off the puck. Macoun then tried to clear, but it was weak and
went right to McGill who had manned the point. He drove it from just inside
the blue line. Macoun got his stick on it and deflected it past his own
goalie at 19:55.1. Shots were 13-8 FLYERS in the period.

The FLYERS finally got their first chance on the power play when Dave Andreychuk
tripped up Rod Brind'Amour in his offensive zone. During the power play, the
FLYERS got cheated a little when the puck popped up into the air and Eric
gloved it down, but McGeough thought it hit his stick above his head. We
could see from our seats at the other end of the ice that it only hit his glove
and the replay confirmed, but the faceoff went to the other end. As time was
running out in the advantage, Lindros found Galley with a pass across the goal
mouth but Puppa made the save. The rebound kicked back to the right corner where
Recchi picked it up, passed it out to Eric crashing through the right circle,
and Eric one-timed past Puppa at 7:55. With the assist, Recchi moves past
Bobby Clarke's 74-75 season, the second best one season total for a FLYER at
117.  Eric moves up to 4th all time in FLYERS rookie scoring with 67 points.

Mike Eastwood took down Al Conroy at 8:30 to give the FLYERS another chance on
the power play. Not much pressure before Garry Galley ended the power play with
a slash at 9:19. Not much happened on the 4 on 4, although the Leafs had most
of the possession. The FLYERS smothered the Leafs short power play. Tempers
flared a little at 13:14. Bowen and Pearson got roughing minors, Keith Acton
got a bloody face. Dave McLlwain then took a dive and got Greg Hawgood a
hooking minor at 13:46 to set up a 4 on 3. The replay showed that Hawgood's
stick stopped making contact with McLlwain long before he spun around and fell.
Again the FLYERS smothered the Leafs power play, led by Dimitri Yushkevich.
Bowen made a thundering hit when he came out of the box on Pearson. Berehowski
tried to perplex everybody with his sloooowball. He had the puck at the point,
and just trickled a pass down the slot. He made all the FLYERS look silly as
nobody could get a stick on it, and it got to Gilmour at the side of the net,
but Soderstrom stoned him.

The FLYERS picked things up offensively after the kill was over, but didn't
get anything home. Shots were 13-10 FLYERS.

The FLYERS were content with the 3 goal lead in the third period, and they
decided that if Tommy wanted a shutout, he was going to have to work for it a
little.

The FLYERS got most of the scoring chances in the first 7 or so minutes of the
period, but couldn't get past Puppa. Then the Leafs got tired of Lindros making
road kill out of them, and tempers flared. 2 each for Doug Gilmour and Lindros 
(unsportsmanlike conduct) and 2 each for Glenn Anderson and McGill (roughing)
all at 7:02. Terry Carkner then took a kneeing penalty at 7:51 on Gilmour.

Again the FLYERS smothered the Leafs power play.

At about the 12 minute mark, Dave Andreychuk got a shot away from his left
circle that got through Soderstrom. The puck was rolling on it's side, and
as luck would have it it turned away from the net instead of turning towards
it (think of how a rolling quarter inevitably starts to lean one way or the
other). Seconds later Rod Brind'Amour tripped up Gilmour at 12:24 to give the
Leafs another chance on the power play. On the advantage, after Soderstrom
stoned Andreychuk while lying down, Andreychuk got the rebound through
Soderstrom, but from behind the net and it went straight through and was swept
away by one of his defensemen. They kept the pressure on, but Soderstrom was
equal and preserved the shutout.

Recchi cross checked Ken Baumgartner to get tempers hot and start a brawl
at 16:01. No punches thrown, Recchi got the initial minor, Krushelnyski
Baumgartner and Lindros each got roughing minors. At 17:02 Rouse and Beranek
expressed their mutual dislike for each other and got 2 each for slashing to
set up another 4 on 4. Mike Eastwood shoved down Ryan McGill in the FLYERS
zone as they were battling for the puck, and while McGill was down he ran
his stick across McGill's face. The FLYERS were not happy with that at all.
5-8 Al Conroy paired up with 6-1 Berehowski, and started throwing punches.
Upward. Well, Al held his own, much to the delight of the crowd. Each got
a couple punches in before going down in a head, and Al got a standing O!
Penalties: Eastwood 5 (cross check) + game, Clark, Carkner 10 each. Berehowski
and Conroy 5 each (fighting) at 17:49.

So a major penalty for the rest of the game for the FLYERS. The had no interest
in stting on the lead. Hawgood, Galley and Brind'Amour played catch until
Hawgood found Dineen all alone in the left circle, he controlled the puck and
blasted it past Puppa at 18:39.

That was all the fireworks, Tommy Soderstrom would not face another shot. Puppa
did, but kept the FLYERS off the board. 4-0 FLYERS, shots were 9-8 FLYERS in the
3rd. Probably the strongest game I've seen from the FLYERS since the All Star
break. Shutout number 4 for Soderstrom, all since 1/10. Tied for 2nd most in
the NHL, but he's played fewer games than Belfour (6) or the goalie I can't
remember that he's tied with.

Next up it's the Winnipeg Selannes Tuesday night in Winnipeg. The FLYERS cannot
be eliminated if they win, but a loss coupled with an Islander win that night
in Washington would be the official end.

FLYERS up to 71 points on the season in 78 games. Last year they had 75 points
in 80 games (5 under .500), so they need at least 8 points in their last 6
games to improve on that only by percentage points (5 under in 84 is better
than 5 under in 80).

Tragic number holds at 3 points with 6 games left. The tragic number for 5th
is 5 points, I watched the Rangers blow a 4-2 third period lead at home to
lose 5-4 before I finished this up. Why 5 points instead of 4? Well, the FLYERS
will win the tie-breaker if they catch them, whereas the Islanders win tie
breakers against the FLYERS and so need only a tie. The Rangers could crumble
down the stretch as they play the Devils, the Pens twice, the FLYERS, and
finish up with 2 games against the Caps. So I guess 5th place could be the
goal for the team to focus on.

FLYERS team record watch:

Eric Lindros:

38 goals, 29 assists, 67 points

(rookie records)
club record goals:			club record points:
Eric Lindros	38 1992-93		Dave Poulin	76 1983-84
Brian Propp	34 1979-80		Brian Propp	75 1979-80
Ron Flockhart	33 1981-82		Ron Flockhart	72 1981-82
Dave Poulin	31 1983-84		Eric Lindros	67 1992-93
Bill Barber	30 1972-73		Pelle Eklund	66 1985-86

Mark Recchi:

51 goals, 66 assists, 117 points.

club record goals:			club record points:
Reggie Leach	61 1975-76		Bobby Clarke	119 1975-76
Tim Kerr	58 1985-86,86-87	Mark Recchi	117 1992-93
Tim Kerr	54 1983-84,84-85	Bobby Clarke	116 1974-75
Mark Recchi	51 1992-93		Bill Barber	112 1975-76
Rick Macliesh	50 1972-73		Bobby Clarke	104 1972-73
Bill Barber	50 1975-76		Rick Macliesh	100 1972-73
Reggie Leach	50 1979-80

FLYERS career years:

Player		Points	Best Prior Season
Mark Recchi	117	113 (90-91 Penguins)
Rod Brind'Amour	79	77 (91-92 FLYERS)
Garry Galley	58	38 (84-85 Kings)
Brent Fedyk	58	35 (90-91 Red Wings)

That's all for now...

pete clark jr - rsh FLYERS contact and mailing list owner


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52615
From: hahietanen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi
Subject: Strange phenomens in NHL (was: Team leaders in +/-)

In article <1993Apr5.195705.29227@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca>, maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
> In <1993Apr5.185633.17843@ists.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:
> 
>>Implicitly you are assuming that goals scored against Winnipeg with Selanne
>>on the ice can be blamed on him...Roger, he is a FORWARD.  Winnipeg has a
>>lousy defensive record anyway.  Let's put it another way.  John Cullen's +/-
>>is terrible.  What's your excuse for him?  That his powerplay points don't
>>count?  Neither do Selanne's... 
> 
> Are you comparing Cullen to Salami?  I would say that that is valid.  If
> Winnipeg is such a lousy defensive team then why the hell does Salami
> stand around the other team's blueline when the puck is in his own end?

  I thought that he was comparing Cullen to TEEMU SEL[NNE. I always thought
  that salami is some sort of sausage, BUT IF YOU, dear Roger, ARE ABLE TO
  SEE SALAMI ON THE ICE PLAYING HOCKEY... I don't know what to do, but you
  surely should do something and very quickly!!!

  Maybe you think that if you keep on talking some rubbish, after some time
  everybody will consider it to be really true... You should take care of
  your LEAFS, they surely need it more.
  
> 
>>What he does best is score...so I refer you to my comment above.
> 
> Some of our Finnish friends who have watched him play claim that he
> can play a solid two-way game.  I would have to say that this style
> of contribution would be more conducive to winning.  Or don't you 
> think so?

  At least we have seen him playing... 
> 
>>>As it is now, Selanne
>>>is a grandstanding goal suck.  Did you see the way he parades around
>>>with his arms outstretched after scoring a goal?  You would think the
>>>Messiah had returned...

 During the latest Philly game the Leaf players didn't parade... Philly
 crunched them 4-0 !!!  Maybe you need some more two way players who can
 score, too !!???
> 
> 
> cordially, as always,
> 
> rm
> 
> -- 
> Roger Maynard 
> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

  just cordially,

  Hannu

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> GO  JETS  GO ! >>>>>>>> TEEMU ! >>>>>>> TEPPO ! >>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> TAPPARA >>>>>> CANADIENS >>>>>>> BLACKHAWKS >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
 


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52616
Subject: Re: Trade rumor: Montreal/Ottawa/Phillie
From: <JER108@psuvm.psu.edu>

In article <93095.210625MWEINTR@auvm.american.edu>, <MWEINTR@auvm.american.edu>
says:
>
>Also sprach slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca ...
>
>>TSN Sportsdesk just reported that the OTTAWA SUN has reported that
>>Montreal will send 4 players + $15 million including Vin Damphousse
>>and Brian Bellows to Phillidelphia, Phillie will send Eric Lindros
>>to Ottawa, and Ottawa will give it's first round pick to Montreal.
>>
>>If this is true, it will most likely depend on whether or not Ottawa
>>gets to choose 1st overall.  Can Ottawa afford Lindros' salary?
>>
>>Personally, I can't see Philli giving up Lindros -- for anything.
>>They didn't give away that much to Quebec just to trade him away
>>again.  Not to mention that Lindros seems to be a *huge* draw in
>>Phillie -- and that he represents a successful future for the
>>franchise.
>>
>>Ottawa may be better off taking the 4 players +$15 from Montreal
>>for the pick.
>>
>>Stephen Legge
>>SLEGGE@kean.ucs.munc.ca
>
>Two things:
>
>1. Didn't the trade deadline pass two weeks ago?
>
>2. The FLYERS would never ever EVER give up Lindros, simple as that.
>
3. With Soderstrom and Roussel, why the hell would the Flyers want to
   pick up an older and slumping Roy?

(BYW, I could come up with a group of players they'd trade for.... but
they wouldn't be from the same team.)

>Go Flyers, Cup in '94...
>
>Mike
>---
>***Yes-Rush-Marillion-ELP-Genesis-King Crimson-Dream Theater-Beatles***
>* Mike Weintraub, aka Jvi on IRC              "Courageous convictions *
>* mweintr@american.edu                         will drag the dream    *
>* jedi@wave.cerf.net                           into existence"        *
>* The American University, Washington DC        - Rush (NOT Limbaugh) *
>***Go Philadelphia Flyers, Vancouver Canucks & Philadelphia Phillies***

                                          John E. Runski
                                           <jer108@psuvm>

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52617
From: mtjensen@nbivax.nbi.dk
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <C4zCII.Ftn@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca>, smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale) writes:
> 
> I was thinking about who on each of the teams were the MVPs, biggest
> surprises, and biggest disappointments this year. Now, these are just
> my observations and are admittedly lacking because I have not had an
> opportunity to see all the teams the same amount. Anyway....
>   
> MVP = most valuable player to his team both in terms of points and
>       in terms of leadership ("can't win without him")
>   
> Biggest surprise = the player who rose above expectation -- the player
>       that may have raised the level of his game to a new height, even
>       if that new level doesn't necessarily warrant an allstar berth
>       (includes those players who at the outset of the season, may not
>       even have been in the team's plans).
>    
> Biggest disappointment = the player from whom we expected more (e.g., I
>       picked Denis Savard in Montreal because with the new emphasis on
>       offence brought by Demers, shouldn't Savard have done better?)
>    
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>   
>                         Team           Biggest       Biggest
> Team:                   MVP:          Surprise:    Disappointment:
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> Boston Bruins           Oates          D.Sweeney     Wesley
> Buffalo Sabres          Lafontaine     Mogilny       Audette (jinx?)
> Calgary Flames          Roberts        Reichel       Petit
> Chicago Blackhawks      Roenick        Ruuttu        Goulet
> Detroit Red Wings       Yzerman        Chaisson      Kozlov
> Edmonton Oilers         Manson         Buchberger    Mellanby
> Hartford Whalers        Sanderson      Cassells      Corriveau
> Los Angeles Kings       Robitaille     Donnelly      Hrudey
> Minnesota North Stars   Modano      Tinordi(not expected back)  Broten
> Montreal Canadiens      Muller         Lebeau        Savard
> New Jersey Devils       Stevens        Semak         MacLean
> New York Islanders      Turgeon        King(finally) Marois
> New York Rangers        Messier        Kovalev       Bourque
> Ottawa Senators         MacIver        Baker         Jelinek
> Philadelphia Flyers     Lindros/Recchi Fedyk/Galley  Eklund
> Pittsburgh Penguins     Lemieux        Tocchet(even for him)  Jagr
> Quebec Nordiques        Sakic/Ricci    Kovalenko     Pearson
> San Jose Sharks         Kisio          Gaudreau      Maley
> St Louis Blues          Shanahan       C.Joseph      Ron Sutter
> Tampa Bay Lightening    Bradley        Bradley       Creighton/Kasper
> Toronto Maple Leafs     Gilmour        Potvin        Ellett/Anderson
> Vancouver Canucks       Bure           Nedved(finally)    Momesso
> Washington Capitals     Hatcher        Bondra/Cote   Elynuik
> Winnipeg Jets           Selanne        Selanne       Druce
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>   
> As I mentioned up top, these are my *impressions* from where I sit. I
> would welcome any opinions from those fans nearer their teams (in other
> words, *anywhere* away from a Toronto newspaper!)
>    
> Bryan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52618
From: tervio@katk.Helsinki.FI (TERVI| MARKO J)
Subject: Realignment in 2000

   Well, here it is, NHL in the year 2000.
I got these from a very reliable source in a dream some years ago and 
although I initially thought I had just been taking too many too strong 
drugs now it seems the realization has really begun...  You can see the 
league has already started to move to this direction.

   *The Walt Disney Conference*
Anaheim Mighty Chipmunks    -Franchise name to be changed after each new 
LA Kings                      hockey movie         
LA Flames                   -We've seen some of that
San Jose Sharks
San Diego Bruins
Tijuana Red Wings   -Detroit's hockey team will follow its car industry...
Dallas Stars           
Houston Oilers
Texas Rangers
Seattle Canucks

   *The Norm Green Conference*
Alabama White Hawks
Biloxi Blues
Tampa Bay Lightning
Miami Blades
Helsinki Jets        -You've heard them starting getting used to the anthem
Montreal Quebecois (sp?)                 -There will be no 'Canada'
Atlanta Devils
Orlando Penquins
Key West Islanders
Hartford Whalers                        The Whalers will never move, huh?
Palm Beach Capitals

  Now that the Anahaim team is becomming real I'm really beginning to believe
the rest of the 'message'.  I'm sure the future will turn you into believers 
too.  After 2000 the NHL will abandond ice-rinks.  It's so expensive to cool 
down the rinks in the subtropics and the locals hardly know what ice is 
anyway.  NHL will become a roller skating hockey league.  That way it can 
create more public interest in the game when local supporteres can play the 
game in their back yards !

         I hope I'm just out of my mind.
        There won't REALLY be a Disney team in Anaheim, will there?
        The Stars aren't REALLY moving...
        

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52619
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: NHL Swedes: Stats, April 5


 Scoring stats for the Swedish NHL players, April 5:
 ===================================================

 Mats Sundin watch:

   Most points during a season:
 
    131  Kent Nilsson, Calgary Flames       1980-81  (49+82)
    110  Mats Naslund, Montreal Canadiens   1985-86  (43+67)
  * 109  Mats Sundin, Quebec Nordiques      1992-93  (43+66)
    106  Hakan Loob, Calgary Flames         1987-88  (50+56)
    104  Kent Nilsson, Calgary Flames       1982-83  (46+58)
     99  Kent Nilsson, Calgary Flames       1984-85  (37+62)

   Most goals during a season:

     50  Hakan Loob, Calgary Flames         1987-88
     49  Kent Nilsson, Calgary Flames       1980-81
     46  Kent Nilsson, Calgary Flames       1982-83
     45  Tomas Sandstrom, LA Kings          1990-91
     43  Mats Naslund, Montreal Canadiens   1985-86
  *  43  Mats Sundin, Quebec Nordiques      1992-93

   Most assists during a season:

     82  Kent Nilsson, Calgary Flames       1980-81
     67  Mats Naslund, Montreal Canadiens   1985-86
     66  Borje Salming, Toronto Maple Leafs 1976-77
  *  66  Mats Sundin, Quebec Nordiques      1992-93
     62  Kent Nilsson, Calgary Flames       1984-85
     61  Borje Salming, Toronto Maple Leafs 1977-78
     61  Thomas Steen, Winnipeg Jets        1988-89

 Ulf Samuelsson watch:

   Most penalty minutes during a season:

  *  243  Ulf Samuelsson, Pittsburgh Penguins   1992-93   (through 3/25)
     211  Ulf Samuelsson, Pittsburgh Penguins   1990-91
     206  Ulf Samuelsson, Pittsburgh Penguins   1991-92
     184  Kjell Samuelsson, Philadelphia Flyers 1988-89
     181  Ulf Samuelsson, Hartford Whalers      1988-89
     174  Ulf Samuelsson, Hartford Whalers      1985-86
     170  Borje Salming, Toronto Maple Leafs    1980-81
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RL Rk Name             Team J# Ps Ht   Wt  Born      G  A  Pts  PL  Comment
-- -- ---------------- ---- -- -- ---  --- --------  -- -- ---  --  -------
    1 Mats Sundin       QUE 13 C  6-2  189  2/13/71  43 66 109   7  
    2 Ulf Dahlen        MIN 22 RW 6-2  195  1/12/67  33 38  71   5    
    3 Thomas Steen      WIN 25 C  5-10 195  6/ 8/60  21 43  64   5
    4 Johan Garpenlov   SJS 10 LW 5-11 185  3/21/68  21 40  61   5 
    5 Fredrik Olausson  WIN  4 D  6-2  200 10/ 5/66  13 38  51   4
    6 Tomas Sandstrom   LAK  7 LW 6-2  207  9/ 4/64  22 24  46   2
    7 Per-Erik Eklund   PHI  9 LW 5-10 175  3/22/63   8 34  42      Injured
    8 Calle Johansson   WAS  6 D  5-11 205  2/14/67   6 35  41   1
    9 Nicklas Lidstrom  DET  5 D  6-2  180  4/28/70   7 33  40   2 
   10 Tommy Sjodin      MIN 33 D  5-11 190  8/13/65   7 29  36     
   11 Ulf Samuelsson    PIT  5 D  6-1  195  3/26/64   2 24  26   1 
   12 Mikael Andersson  TBL 34 LW 5-11 185  5/10/66  13 11  24   1 
   13 Michael Nylander  HFD 36 LW 5-11 176 10/ 3/72   5 16  21   2 
   14 Roger Johansson   CGY 34 D  6-1  185  4/ 7/67   4 15  19   1
   15 Jan Erixon        NYR 20 LW 6-0  196  7/ 8/62   5 10  15      
   16 Peter Andersson   NYR 25 D  6-0  187  8/29/65   4  7  11   1 
   17 Kjell Samuelsson  PIT 28 D  6-6  235 10/18/58   3  6   9   2 
   18 Tommy Albelin     NJD  6 D  6-1  190  5/21/64   1  5   6      
   19 Per Djoos         NYR 44 D  5-11 176  5/11/68   1  1   2      Binghampton?
   20 Niclas Andersson  QUE 46 LW 5-8  169  5/20/71   0  1   1      Halifax
   21 Thomas Forslund   CGY 27 LW 6-0  185 11/24/68   0  1   1      Salt Lake
   22 Patrik Carnback   MON 20 LW 6-0  189  2/ 1/68   0  0   0      Injured
   23 Patrik Kjellberg  MON 27 LW 6-2  196  6/17/69   0  0   0      Fredericton

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
RL=Rank Last week, Rk=Rank, J#=Jersey Number, Ps=Position, Born (mm/dd/yy)
G=Goals, A=Assists, Pts=Points, PL=Points scored since Last posted list
===============================================================================

 Goalie stats:

 Name             Team J# Ps Ht   Wt  Born     
 ---------------- ---- -- -- ---  --- --------
 Tommy Soderstrom  PHI 30 G  5-9  163  7/17/69

                                       / - - - - -  T  O  T  A  L  - - - - - \

 mm/dd   vs   res  r  w/l/t  sh - sv   GP   MP  GA  GAA    SOG   SV  SV%   SO A
 -----  ---- ----  -  -----  --   --   --   --  --  ---    ---  ---  ---   -- --
 12/17   PIT  4-5  L  0-1-0  27 - 22    1   62   5  4.84    27   22  0.815
 12/19   CHI  3-1  W  1-1-0  28 - 27    2  122   6  2.95    55   49  0.891
 12/20  @TBL  1-4  L  1-2-0  31 - 27    3  182  10  3.30    86   76  0.884
 12/23   PIT  0-4  L  1-3-0  26 - 22    4  242  14  3.47   112   98  0.875
 12/26  @WAS  5-5  T  1-3-1  41 - 36    5  307  19  3.71   153  134  0.876
 12/29  @LAK 10-2  W  2-3-1  43 - 41    6  367  21  3.43   196  175  0.893
 12/30  @SJS  6-2  W  3-3-1  35 - 33    7  427  23  3.23   231  208  0.900
  1/ 2  @CGY  3-7  L  3-4-1  32 - 26    8  486  29  3.58   263  234  0.890
  1/ 3  @EDM  2-2  T  3-4-2  33 - 31    9  551  31  3.38   296  265  0.895
  1/ 7   WAS  8-2  W  4-4-2  33 - 31   10  611  33  3.24   329  296  0.900
  1/ 9   NYR  4-3  W  5-4-2  26 - 23   11  671  36  3.22   355  319  0.899
  1/10   EDM  4-0  W  6-4-2  29 - 29   12  731  36  2.95   384  348  0.906  1
  1/14   CGY  4-4  T  6-4-3  27 - 23   13  796  40  3.02   411  371  0.903
  1/16  @BOS  5-4  W  7-4-3  37 - 33   14  856  44  3.08   448  404  0.902
  1/17   DET  4-7  L  7-5-3  36 - 29   15  916  51  3.34   484  433  0.895
  1/21   BOS  4-5  L  7-6-3  32 - 27   16  976  56  3.44   516  460  0.891
  1/23  @NYI  4-8  L  7-7-3  31 - 23   17 1036  64  3.71   547  483  0.883    1
  1/24   HFD  5-4  W  8-7-3  25 - 21   18 1098  68  3.72   572  504  0.881
  1/30  @PIT  2-4  L  8-8-3  35 - 32   19 1157  71  3.68   607  536  0.883
  2/ 3  @NYR  2-2  T  8-8-4  38 - 36   20 1222  73  3.58   645  572  0.887
  2/ 9   OTT  8-1  W  9-8-4  28 - 27   21 1282  74  3.46   673  599  0.890
  2/11   MTL  0-0  T  9-8-5  23 - 23   22 1347  74  3.30   696  622  0.894  2
  2/13  @NJD  4-6  L  9-9-5  32 - 26   23 1407  80  3.41   728  648  0.890
  2/14   NJD  2-5  L  9-10-5 26 - 21   24 1467  85  3.48   754  669  0.887
  2/16  @CGY  4-4  T  9-10-6 29 - 29   25 1512  85  3.37   783  698  0.891
  2/18  @VAN  3-2  W 10-10-6 30 - 28   26 1572  87  3.32   813  726  0.893
  2/20  @MIN  2-5  L 10-11-6 33 - 28   27 1632  92  3.38   846  754  0.891
  2/22   DET  5-5  - 10-11-6 15 - 12   28 1653  95  3.45   861  766  0.890
  3/ 2   PIT  5-4  W 11-11-6 22 - 21   29 1689  96  3.41   883  787  0.891
  3/ 5  @WAS  3-0  W 12-11-6 36 - 36   30 1749  96  3.29   919  823  0.896  3
  3/ 7  @NJD  4-7  L 12-12-6 41 - 35   31 1808 102  3.38   960  858  0.894
  3/ 9  @NYI  2-4  L 12-13-6 24 - 21   32 1867 105  3.37   984  879  0.893
  3/11   WAS  6-4  W 13-13-6 28 - 24   33 1927 109  3.39  1012  903  0.892
  3/16   MIN  4-3  W 14-13-6 34 - 31   34 1987 112  3.38  1046  934  0.893
  3/20  @PIT  3-9  L 14-14-6 27 - 20   35 2027 119  3.52  1073  954  0.889
  3/21   NJD  2-3  L 14-15-6 27 - 24   36 2086 122  3.51  1100  978  0.889
  3/24  @NYR  5-4  W 15-15-6 45 - 41   37 2146 126  3.52  1145 1019  0.890    2
  3/27  @QUE  3-8  L 15-16-6 25 - 19   38 2186 132  3.62  1170 1038  0.887
  4/ 1   LAK  1-3  L 15-17-6 26 - 23   39 2246 135  3.61  1196 1061  0.887
  4/ 4   TOR  4-0  W 16-17-6 26 - 26   40 2306 135  3.51  1222 1087  0.890  4
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
res=result, sh=shots, sv=saves
GP=Games Played, MP=Minutes Played, GA=Goals Against, GAA=Goals Against Average
SOG=Shots On Goal, SV=SaVes, SV%=SaVing Percentage, SO=ShutOuts, A=Assists
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Staffan
--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52620
From: wsa@poe.acc.Virginia.EDU (Warren S. Arbogast)
Subject: Re: Spelling Error on the Stanley Cup??

r_turgeo@oz.plymouth.edu  writes:
>   I was reading a newspaper tidbit that mentioned that there is a
> grammatical error on the Stanley Cup. This newspaper, "The 
> Union Leader"  (Manchester, New Hampshire), stated that one of the
> years that the New York Islanders won the cup, the printing on the
> actual cup stated "New York Ilanders". Can anyone verify this?? I
> forgot the exact year that this supposedly occured. Any die-hard
> Islander fans know about this?? The reason why I am asking is
> because the paper is not very reliable, we call it "The Union
> Mis-leader".
> 
> 
> Randy
> Plymouth State College
> r_turgeo@oz.plymouth.edu

Speaking of spelling errors on the Cup, I wonder if the "h" in
Pittsburgh made it to the Cup.  You know how funny people can
be about spelling Pittsburgh.
--
Warren Arbogast
Darden Visual Communications          "with 10 miles behind them           
University of Virginia                            and 10,000 more to go"
  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52621
From: euatno@eua.ericsson.se (Tomas Nopp)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:



>   Ten years ago, the number of Europeans in the NHL was roughly a quarter
>of what it is now. Going into the 1992/93 season, the numbers of Euros on
>NHL teams have escalated to the following stats:

>Canadians: 400
>Americans: 100
>Europeans: 100

>   Please note that these numbers are rounded off, and taken from the top
>25 players on each of the 24 teams. My source is the Vancouver Sun.

>   Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. I am sick
>of watching a game between an American and a Canadian team (let's say, the
>Red Wings and the Canucks) and seeing names like "Bure" "Konstantinov" and
>"Borshevshky". Is this North America or isn't it? Toronto, Detriot, Quebec,
>and Edmonton are particularly annoying, but the numbers of Euros on other
>teams is getting worse as well. 

Is the answer as simple as that you dislike russians???

>    I live in Vancouver and if I hear one more word about "Pavel Bure, the
>Russian Rocket" I will completely throw up. As it is now, every time I see
>the Canucks play I keep hoping someone will cross-check Bure into the 
>plexiglass so hard they have to carry him out on a stretcher. (By the way, 
>I'm not a Canucks fan to begin with ;-). 

>Okay, the stretcher remark was a little carried away. But the point is that
>I resent NHL owners drafting all these Europeans INSTEAD of Canadians (and
>some Americans). It denies young Canadians the opportunity to play in THEIR
>NORTH AMERICAN LEAGUE and instead gives it to Europeans, who aren't even
>better hockey players. It's all hype. This "European mystique" is sickening,
>but until NHL owners get over it, Canadian and American players will continue
>to have to fight harder to get drafted into their own league.

>    With the numbers of Euros in the NHL escalating, the problem is clearly
>only getting worse.

And where would canadian hockey be today without the europeans?? Dont say
that the european influence on the league has been all bad for the game.
I mean, look at the way you play these days. Less fights and more hockey.
Imho, canadian hockey has had a positive curve of development since the
70's when the game was more brute than beauty......

>    I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let the Bures
>and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.

Oh, look!! You don't like Finns either....

>    I just don't want them on mine.
Too bad almost all of you northamericans originates from europe.....

Hmmm... And what kind of a name is Rauser. Doesn't sound very "canadian" to
me. ;-)

PS. When analyzing teams like Italy, France and Great Britain you find that
a lot of their players are "Canadians" with double citizenship... DS
> 
> 
>-- 
>Richard J. Rauser        "You have no idea what you're doing."
>rauser@sfu.ca            "Oh, don't worry about that. We're professional
>WNI                          outlaws - we do this for a living."
>-----------------
>"Remember, no matter where you go, there you are." -Dr.Banzai
         _________________       __________
          /         _  ,     /l /
        _/__()_/))_(/_/)_  _/ L/_()_/)_/)_
                                   /  /
********************************************************************
* Tomas Nopp                    Tel   : +46 8 727 33 24            *
* Ellemtel Telecom Systems Labs Fax   : +46 8 647 80 59            *
* Box 1505                      Email : Tomas.Nopp@eua.ericsson.se *
* S-125 25 ALVSJO       <------ Snailmail                          *
********************************************************************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52622
From: westerhold@batgirl.rtp.dg.com ()
Subject: wanted: mail order hockey equipment


Could anyone recommend a mail order distributor for
hockey equipment.

				Thanks in Advance
				Wayne
--
 /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
<  Wayne E. Westerhold                    wester@dg-rtp.dg.com             >
<  Data General Corporation               Research Triangle Park, NC       >
 \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52623
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <rauser.734062608@sfu.ca> rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:
>   Ten years ago, the number of Europeans in the NHL was roughly a quarter
>of what it is now. Going into the 1992/93 season, the numbers of Euros on
>NHL teams have escalated to the following stats:
>
>Canadians: 400
>Americans: 100
>Europeans: 100
>
>   Please note that these numbers are rounded off, and taken from the top
>25 players on each of the 24 teams. My source is the Vancouver Sun.
>
>   Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. I am sick
>of watching a game between an American and a Canadian team (let's say, the
>Red Wings and the Canucks) and seeing names like "Bure" "Konstantinov" and
>"Borshevshky". Is this North America or isn't it? Toronto, Detriot, Quebec,
>and Edmonton are particularly annoying, but the numbers of Euros on other
>teams is getting worse as well. 
>

From where I come from in Canada, Borshevsky sounds more Canadian than
Smith! -)

Anyways, crawl back into the hole you crawled out of...the NBA doesn't
care where they get basketball players from, major league baseball
doesn't give a damn where they get baseball players from (except Cuba,
that is).

Canada is in no imminent danger of being overtaken as the primary 
supplier of players...Sweden, Finland, the Czech Republic, and Slovakia
are all relatively small countries, and cannot really produce players
at a greater rate than they are already producing them, and the
potential influx from the former Soviet Union is severely blunted
because the system has been raided and is starved for finances and
will take a decade or two, to recover and become a real threat, and
the US will just maintain its slow increase.  Canada should continue
to supply 60% plus of the top hockey players in the world for the
forseeable future.

Besides we need the European hockey market if hockey is to take
its rightful place besides soccer as the two predominant world
sports...and since soccer is essentially boring, unlike hockey.

>    I live in Vancouver and if I hear one more word about "Pavel Bure, the
>Russian Rocket" I will completely throw up. As it is now, every time I see
>the Canucks play I keep hoping someone will cross-check Bure into the plexiglassso hard they have to carry him out on a stretcher. (By the way, I'm not a
>Canucks fan to begin with ;-). 
>
>    Okay, the stretcher remark was a little carried away. But the point is that
>I resent NHL owners drafting all these Europeans INSTEAD of Canadians (and
>some Americans). It denies young Canadians the opportunity to play in THEIR
>NORTH AMERICAN LEAGUE and instead gives it to Europeans, who aren't even
>better hockey players. It's all hype. This "European mystique" is sickening,
>but until NHL owners get over it, Canadian and American players will continue
>to have to fight harder to get drafted into their own league.
>
>    With the numbers of Euros in the NHL escalating, the problem is clearly
>only getting worse.
>

Canadians are under no threat...the European numbers will soon saturate,
if they haven't already...and by the time Russia comes online again,
the NHL should be a world league, and there will be many more teams
to stock and many more jobs for Canadian hockey players.  In the near
team, the percentage of Canadians will mostly decline because of 
Americans, not because of Europeans.

>    I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let the Bures
>and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.
>
>    I just don't want them on mine.
>

Crawl into a hole and die...   


Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52624
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <1993Apr6.044323.22829@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> daniell@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Daniel Lyddy) writes:
>
>You know, you're absolutely right.  I think we should round up all those
>players of European descent and ship 'em back to where they came from.  Let's
>see, with whom should we start?  I dunno, Lemieux?  Hmmm...sounds like he
>has *French* blood in him!!!  Hey!  France is part of Europe!  Send that
>Euro-blooded boy back!!!
>

Don't you Americans study history...the French settled in North America
as early or before the British...Lemieux can probably trace back his
North American heritage back a lot further than most of us.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52625
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Lindros will be traded!!!

In article <1993Apr5.163209.576@r-node.hub.org> shadow@r-node.hub.org (Jay Chu) writes:
>True rumor.  Fact!  A big three way deal!
>
>Eric Lindros going to Ottawa Senators.  And Senators get $15mill from
>Montreal.
>
>Montreal gets Alexander Daigle (the first round pick from Senators)
>
>Philly gets Damphousse, Bellow, Patrick Roy and a draft pick.
>

Another person incapable of rational thought!

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52626
From: lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <rauser.734062608@sfu.ca> rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:
>
>
>   Ten years ago, the number of Europeans in the NHL was roughly a quarter
>of what it is now. Going into the 1992/93 season, the numbers of Euros on
>NHL teams have escalated to the following stats:
>
>Canadians: 400
>Americans: 100
>Europeans: 100

Xenophobic trash deleted.

>    I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let the Bures
>and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.
>
>    I just don't want them on mine.

If you're going to go to those extremes, I guess you'd better start 
packing.  Because unless you're a Native North American, this isn't
your continent either.  

Lori




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52627
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Mon, April 5, 1993

Hartford                         1 1 3--5
NY Rangers                       1 2 1--4
First period
     1, Hartford, Cunneyworth 5 (Janssens, Greig) 12:21.
     2, NY Rangers, Graves 34 (Turcotte, Zubov) 18:39.
Second period
     3, NY Rangers, Kovalev 19 (Turcotte, Graves) 2:12.
     4, Hartford, Sanderson 44 (Cassels) pp, 4:54.
     5, NY Rangers, Amonte 30 (Andersson, Vanbiesbrouck) pp, 19:13.
Third period
     6, NY Rangers, M.Messier 25 (Amonte, Andersson) 2:26.
     7, Hartford, Sanderson 45 (Cassels) sh, 5:23.
     8, Hartford, Nylander 6 (Ladouceur) 8:35.
     9, Hartford, Verbeek 36 (Zalapski) 17:43.

Hartford: 5    Power play: 4-1   Special goals:  pp: 1  sh: 1  Total: 2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Cassels            0    2    2
Cunneyworth        1    0    1
Greig              0    1    1
Janssens           0    1    1
Ladouceur          0    1    1
Nylander           1    0    1
Sanderson          2    0    2
Verbeek            1    0    1
Zalapski           0    1    1

NY Rangers: 4    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Amonte             1    1    2
Andersson          0    2    2
Graves             1    1    2
Kovalev            1    0    1
Messier M          1    0    1
Turcotte           0    2    2
Vanbiesbrouck      0    1    1
Zubov              0    1    1

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52628
From: damelio@progress.COM (Stephen D'Amelio)
Subject: Re: What was Ray doing?

daveb@thewho.East.Sun.COM (Dave Brewer) writes:

>In yesterday's fracus between Rob Ray and Brent Hughes, was it the camera angle or was
>Ray actually punching Hughes where it appeared he was punching him? (For those that didn't
>see the game - it was several inches below the belt and he punched him there quite a few
>times.) Dreadful.

>Also, why did Poulin get four minutes?


I've been watching & playing hockey for a good long time now, and
I've seen players with questionable tactics, but never have I seen
what Ray did on Sunday. This guy gets my all time loser award. It's
one thing to repeatedly cross check someone to the back of the neck
when they are down, it's another thing to have a fist fight with
someones balls. Ray should be thrown out of the league, what an
a**hole.

-Steve




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52629
From: bks2@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (bryan.k.strouse)
Subject: NHL RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4-05-93



NHL RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4/05/93.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                  STANDINGS
      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE
 TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT
 
xPIT  53 21  6 112  yMON  47 27  6 100  yDET  44 28  9  97  yVAN  42 28  9  93
 WAS  40 31  7  87  yBOS  46 26  7  99  yCHI  43 25 11  97  yCAL  40 29 10  90
 NJ   38 35  6  82  yQUE  44 25 10  98  yTOR  42 26 11  95  yLA   37 33  9  83
 NYI  37 34  6  80  yBUF  38 31 10  86   STL  35 34 10  80  yWIN  37 35  7  81
 NYR  34 33 11  79   HAR  24 49  5  53   MIN  34 35 10  78   EDM  26 45  8  60
 PHL  30 37 11  71   OTT   9 66  4  22   TB   22 51  5  49   SJ   10 68  2  22

x - Clinched Division Title
y - Clinched Playoff Berth

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hartford Whalers   (24-49-5)   1   1   3   -   5
New York Rangers  (34-33-11)   1   2   1   -   4

1st period: HAR, Cunneyworth 5 - (Janssens, Greig) 12:21
	    NYR, Graves 34 - (Turcotte, Zubov) 18:39

2nd period: NYR, Kovalev 19 - (Turcotte, Graves) 2:12
	    HAR, Sanderson 44 - (Cassels) (pp) 4:54
	    NYR, Amonte 30 - (Andersson, Vanbiesbrouck) (pp) 19:13

3rd period: NYR, M.Messier 25 - (Amonte, Andersson) 2:26
	    HAR, Sanderson 45 - (Cassels) (sh) 5:23
	    HAR, Nylanders 6 - (Ladouceur) 8:35
	    HAR, Verbeek 36 - (Zalapski) 17:43

Powerplay Opportunities-Whalers 1 of 4
			Rangers 1 of 4

Shots on Goal-	Whalers   7   8   8  -  23
		Rangers   9  10  12  -  31

Hartford Whalers--Gosselin (4-7-1) (31 shots - 27 saves)
New York Rangers--Vanbiesbrouck (20-18-7) (23 shots - 18 saves)

ATT-17,806

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


\|||||/
-SPIKE-




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52630
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Hockey Draft week 26 standings

Here are the standings after the April 6 update.  I'll be leaving for Japan
in 1.5 hours, and I won't be back until April 17.  Consequently, I will not
post  the week 27 results until April 18.  Email sent between April 13 and
April 18 will be processed using the numbers available April 18.

	- Andrew

USENET Hockey Draft Standings
Week 26

Posn	Team				Pts	Proj	Cash	Last Posn

1.	Dave Wessels                    1478	1575.3	1.9	(1)
2.	Gilles Carmel                   1389	1533.8	56.3	(5)
3.	Bob Hill                        1418	1530.8	24.0	(2)
4.	The Awesome Oilers              1366	1509.9	68.6	(3)
5.	Seppo Kemppainen                1372	1508.9	47.2	(6)
6.	Mak "The Knife" Paranjape       1376	1501.8	31.0	(4)
7.	Hillside Raiders                1397	1490.7	7.0	(7)
8.	Jan Stein                       1354	1478.8	35.3	(9)
9.	Rangers Of Destiny              1346	1472.5	42.0	(10)
10.	this years model                1368	1471.8	17.6	(8)
11.	Tapio Repo                      1354	1461.0	19.6	(12)
12.	FRANK'S BIG FISH                1341	1448.3	22.0	(14)
13.	The Underachievers              1309	1446.5	65.4	(16)
14.	On Thin Ice                     1333	1445.5	32.3	(11)
15.	Lindros Losers                  1349	1436.9	1.7	(13)
16.	littlest giants                 1319	1435.7	35.6	(15)
17.	Go Flames                       1290	1422.6	64.4	(17)
18.	Mopar Muscle Men                1328	1411.7	3.7	(19)
19.	DIE Penguin Bandwaggoners       1304	1409.7	20.2	(18)
20.	Samuel Lau (Calgary, Alberta)   1298	1383.2	4.9	(21)
21.	General Accounting Office       1272	1373.8	20.9	(22)
22.	Migods Menschen                 1259	1367.0	31.6	(20)
23.	Boomer's Boys                   1285	1366.1	0.2	(23)
24.	Delaware Wombats                1285	1356.2	1.3	(24)
25.	Wellsy's Buttheads DEC NH       1223	1354.4	52.6	(27)
26.	Rocky Mountain High             1270	1349.3	1.8	(29)
27.	Fife Flyers                     1232	1346.3	31.4	(26)
28.	Gerald Olchowy                  1231	1343.0	33.7	(25)
29.	Fluide Glacial                  1246	1338.5	18.0	(28)
30.	Gaoler                          1227	1318.3	11.2	(30)
31.	SmegHeads                       1238	1313.0	0.3	(32)
32.	The Young And The Skateless     1185	1299.7	42.9	(31)
33.	Artic Storm                     1179	1291.8	39.3	(43)
34.	Sam & His Dogs                  1206	1289.0	11.6	(33)
35.	Neural Netters                  1199	1287.9	11.3	(35)
36.	Youngbucs                       1157	1286.6	101.7	(34)
37.	Soft Swedes                     1154	1275.3	46.9	(58)
38.	Jeff Horvath                    1188	1262.7	5.6	(39)
39.	Yan The Man Loke                1180	1261.3	0.7	(40)
40.	Milton Keynes Kings             1180	1259.6	2.8	(42)
41.	Hamster from Hoboken            1178	1257.5	8.7	(36)
42.	Le Fleur de Lys                 1159	1257.3	25.3	(46)
43.	ice legion                      1157	1256.6	28.8	(37)
44.	Simmonac                        1133	1254.4	87.6	(44)
45.	Kuehn Crushers                  1137	1253.1	45.1	(72)
46.	The Finnish Force               1149	1249.4	22.5	(48)
47.	Streaks                         1117	1247.1	54.8	(38)
48.	Legion of Hoth                  1156	1246.3	15.8	(52)
49.	Goaldingers                     1146	1240.6	22.0	(45)
50.	Grant Marven                    1155	1236.0	2.9	(50)
51.	bemybaby                        1161	1235.2	7.3	(49)
52.	T C OverAchievers               1162	1232.8	2.9	(47)
53.	Skriko Wolves                   1151	1232.4	5.4	(53)
54.	Bozrah Bruins                   1117	1230.7	45.2	(41)
55.	Brian Bergman                   1132	1229.3	23.3	(51)
56.	LIPPE                           1132	1214.7	13.9	(65)
57.	Randy Coulman                   1140	1214.5	5.2	(56)
58.	LAMP LIGHTERS                   1138	1214.2	5.9	(66)
59.	Dave Snell                      1089	1212.5	182.5	(60)
60.	Steven And Mark Dream Team      1133	1210.6	3.1	(53)
61.	Houdini's Magicians             1126	1209.9	18.3	(59)
62.	Real Bad Toe Jam                1096	1208.6	48.9	(63)
63.	rec.sport.hockey choices        1137	1208.3	1.3	(63)
64.	Iowa Hockeyes                   1118	1205.7	16.3	(55)
65.	buffalo soldiers                1085	1204.6	62.1	(57)
66.	Indianapolis Bennies            1114	1200.6	20.8	(67)
67.	Bloom County All Stars          1121	1199.2	4.3	(61)
68.	Tom                             1109	1194.0	13.1	(68)
69.	Phil and Kev's Karma Dudes      1121	1192.6	0.8	(69)
70.	AIK Exiles                      1078	1188.1	34.5	(70)
71.	Doug Bowles                     1099	1186.4	20.0	(62)
72.	Bruins                          1117	1184.9	0.1	(75)
73.	smithw                          1095	1184.3	21.0	(71)
74.	The Great Pumpkin               1057	1178.6	54.4	(73)
75.	shooting seamen                 1111	1177.8	0.1	(77)
76.	Frank Worthless                 1099	1176.6	6.3	(82)
77.	NON!                            1089	1175.7	16.4	(74)
78.	Invisible Inc                   1104	1173.5	1.1	(79)
79.	Brad Gibson                     1075	1169.0	27.2	(89)
80.	Chubby Checkers                 1074	1165.6	16.3	(85)
81.	PLP Fools                       1092	1164.8	0.1	(76)
82.	John Zupancic                   1063	1164.2	27.1	(78)
83.	Staffan Axelsson                1082	1163.0	15.1	(80)
84.	David Wong                      1038	1162.5	66.1	(87)
85.	Kortelaisen Kovat               1041	1160.7	164.1	(92)
86.	Chocolate Rockets               1083	1158.9	2.5	(83)
87.	Ken DeCruyenaere                1078	1158.8	5.0	(94)
88.	Cougarmania                     1061	1154.7	24.8	(86)
89.	garryola                        1073	1152.9	9.7	(81)
90.	Derrill's Dastardly Dozen       1062	1149.6	22.1	(88)
91.	No Namers                       1033	1147.6	58.2	(91)
92.	The Campi Machine               1022	1145.8	65.3	(90)
93.	Gary Bergman Fan Club           1071	1145.1	5.1	(98)
94.	Fisher Dirtbags                 1073	1144.1	0.7	(93)
95.	KODIAKS                         1076	1141.0	1.3	(84)
96.	Arsenal Maple Leafs             1066	1136.0	3.8	(99)
97.	The Kamucks                     1020	1134.1	76.1	(105)
98.	BSC Oranienburg                 1067	1132.1	7.1	(102)
99.	Bloodgamers                     1018	1127.1	42.1	(97)
100.	Ellis Islanders                 1055	1125.5	7.6	(100)
101.	Mombasa Mosquitos               1053	1125.4	6.1	(95)
102.	Edelweiss                       1049	1122.8	2.9	(101)
103.	Zachmans Wingers                1006	1117.7	49.8	(103)
104.	Wormtown Woosbags               1001	1114.6	72.6	(96)
105.	Dirty White Socks               1008	1113.6	43.4	(106)
106.	Hurricane Andrew                1040	1113.5	7.6	(104)
107.	Larry                           1034	1113.2	11.8	(109)
108.	VoteNoOct26                     1010	1108.5	31.8	(108)
	Bruce's Rented Mules            1033	1108.5	11.9	(110)
110.	King Suke                       1042	1108.2	0.1	(112)
111.	Teem Kanada                     1030	1105.3	16.0	(115)
112.	Bjoern Leaguen                  987	1104.7	61.4	(123)
113.	Frank's Follies                 1020	1101.2	24.2	(117)
114.	Neil Younger                    985	1100.9	77.7	(120)
115.	Het Schot Is Hard               1027	1100.8	18.1	(121)
116.	PSV Dartmouth                   1033	1100.7	7.1	(107)
117.	Pond Slime                      1034	1096.8	0.7	(111)
118.	Stanford Ice Hawks              1008	1096.5	28.2	(114)
119.	SPUDS                           1019	1096.4	12.6	(113)
120.	Mark Sanders                    1020	1091.9	11.1	(116)
121.	Oklahoma Stormchasers           1004	1089.9	28.3	(137)
122.	Timo Ojala                      1015	1084.2	0.3	(130)
123.	Nesbitt                         1025	1083.0	1.1	(118)
124.	Aye Carumba!!!                  1016	1082.4	3.9	(124)
125.	Kokudo Keikaku Bunnies          976	1081.2	40.3	(119)
126.	Blue Talon                      1007	1080.0	13.3	(129)
127.	Apricot Fuzzfaces               1001	1078.3	23.3	(125)
128.	Haral                           1013	1077.8	7.3	(122)
129.	garys team                      995	1076.5	17.1	(126)
130.	Late Night with David Letterman 1013	1075.3	0.0	(133)
131.	Arctic Circles                  974	1075.2	37.6	(132)
132.	The Lost Poots                  1000	1072.9	6.7	(127)
	Seattle PFTB                    988	1072.9	22.9	(134)
134.	boutch 92-93                    987	1071.5	20.0	(135)
135.	Dirty Rotten Puckers            1001	1071.2	1.2	(147)
136.	Flying Kiwis                    998	1069.8	9.1	(130)
	Cluster Buster                  996	1069.8	7.6	(136)
138.	Scott Glenn                     999	1068.7	10.2	(142)
139.	Dree Hobbs                      988	1068.5	13.4	(146)
140.	GO BRUINS                       999	1066.6	6.2	(144)
141.	Le Groupe MI                    975	1065.4	30.2	(141)
142.	team gold                       992	1065.1	16.7	(128)
143.	Closet Boy's Boys               955	1063.4	48.0	(140)
144.	Gary Bill Pens Dynasty          982	1063.2	19.6	(151)
	McKees Rocks Rockers            998	1063.2	5.1	(151)
146.	Tim Rogers                      987	1061.9	8.1	(148)
147.	Andy Y F WONG                   982	1061.1	21.5	(143)
148.	Buttered Waffles                947	1059.6	46.0	(145)
149.	Bob's Blues                     951	1059.2	46.8	(139)
150.	Princeton Canucks               945	1058.9	124.2	(154)
151.	GO HABS GO                      989	1058.7	8.0	(149)
152.	Wembley LostWeekenders          998	1057.6	0.3	(157)
153.	Wild Hearted Sons               993	1057.5	4.9	(138)
154.	Einstein's Rock Band            994	1054.8	0.0	(160)
155.	Tap                             989	1053.0	0.5	(150)
156.	Goddess Of Fermentation         964	1051.0	30.2	(156)
157.	HUNTERS & COLLECTORS            945	1050.6	42.4	(163)
158.	Dr Joel Fleishman               985	1048.7	3.7	(159)
159.	furleys furies                  983	1048.6	3.6	(153)
160.	convex stars                    979	1047.9	5.6	(161)
161.	Les Nordiques                   939	1046.9	60.4	(155)
162.	MY TEAM                         932	1045.3	174.8	(167)
163.	Hubert's Hockey Homeboys        980	1043.9	0.6	(162)
	Book 'em Danno's Bushbabies     977	1043.9	10.5	(169)
165.	riding the pine                 956	1038.7	20.7	(158)
166.	Sundogs                         975	1037.1	0.4	(166)
167.	Jeff Nimeroff                   927	1037.0	48.8	(172)
168.	Slap Shot Marco                 930	1036.0	51.8	(164)
169.	Daryl Turner                    976	1035.8	2.4	(179)
170.	The Dreamers                    921	1033.1	63.7	(180)
171.	East City Jokers                919	1031.6	69.1	(173)
172.	Flowers                         921	1031.4	113.6	(168)
173.	Satan's Choice                  961	1030.1	14.5	(171)
174.	The Leafs Rule!!!!              943	1030.0	25.8	(165)
175.	Pierre Mailhot                  969	1029.9	2.6	(174)
176.	voyageurs                       968	1029.4	2.7	(170)
177.	Spinal Tap                      928	1029.1	41.4	(176)
178.	San Jose Mahi Mahi              939	1026.7	31.8	(185)
	Stimpy ADG Zeta                 949	1026.7	21.0	(182)
180.	Jeff Bachovchin                 916	1024.7	46.7	(175)
181.	Bulldogs                        941	1024.5	23.4	(184)
182.	LANA Inc                        940	1021.0	27.3	(177)
183.	Big Bad Bruins                  939	1020.6	18.5	(186)
184.	Mike Mac Cormack Sydney NS CAN  904	1019.1	107.2	(183)
185.	Darse Billings                  925	1017.8	34.7	(178)
186.	Chappel's Chumps                934	1017.6	24.0	(181)
187.	JimParker                       903	1014.5	179.0	(192)
188.	Republican Dirty Tricksters     894	1008.0	66.0	(189)
189.	Enforcers                       924	1007.8	28.1	(191)
190.	Absolut Lehigh                  937	1007.7	8.9	(190)
191.	Yellow Plague                   933	1005.0	14.2	(187)
192.	Dr.D And The S.O.D.             929	1003.8	17.1	(198)
193.	Bunch of Misfits                916	1003.3	23.8	(188)
194.	Ninja Turtles                   942	1000.8	1.3	(194)
195.	Great Expectations              934	999.3	2.3	(196)
196.	Cherry Bombers                  939	998.1	1.2	(200)
197.	Henry's Bar B Q                 941	998.0	0.7	(195)
198.	Robyns Team                     907	993.5	30.0	(198)
199.	Team Melville                   891	991.8	46.9	(202)
200.	Umpire 4 life                   919	990.9	11.1	(193)
201.	Acadien                         914	988.9	18.3	(197)
202.	Kaufbeuren Icebreakers          894	988.2	37.6	(207)
203.	Firebirds                       926	986.5	3.9	(201)
204.	Jayson's Kinky Pucks            904	986.1	26.9	(203)
205.	Cobra's Killers                 891	982.5	31.7	(208)
206.	Outlaws                         871	981.6	164.9	(206)
207.	Kuta Papercuts                  912	981.5	18.5	(204)
208.	Killer Apes                     902	979.9	24.3	(205)
209.	DARMAN'S Dragons                896	979.4	28.3	(211)
210.	Roger Smith                     882	978.2	39.6	(212)
211.	Those 1st few weeks hurt!       862	975.1	55.9	(210)
212.	Thundering Herd                 860	972.8	163.6	(218)
213.	IKEA Wholesale                  910	970.2	1.7	(214)
214.	Believe it or dont              895	968.7	21.1	(215)
215.	fred mckim                      861	966.8	93.0	(217)
216.	400 Hurricane                   880	966.4	32.1	(216)
217.	Creeping Death                  886	965.0	21.3	(220)
218.	Knee Injuries                   897	964.9	10.4	(213)
219.	The 200 Club                    902	964.7	6.8	(209)
220.	Crazy Euros                     888	962.1	17.9	(219)
221.	Frack Attack                    875	961.8	27.3	(226)
222.	Todd's Turkeys                  898	957.0	1.9	(229)
223.	Ryan's Renegades                858	956.4	50.9	(225)
224.	Cafall and Crew                 862	955.9	38.3	(222)
225.	pig vomit                       894	955.2	1.3	(227)
226.	Ice Strykers                    848	954.4	105.4	(221)
227.	Fighting Geordies               850	954.1	141.6	(223)
228.	CDN Stuck in Alabama            886	945.7	10.3	(231)
229.	Ship's Way                      884	943.4	8.7	(233)
230.	Swillbellies                    870	942.8	18.7	(228)
231.	Oz                              851	941.8	35.0	(235)
232.	Chris of Death                  835	939.3	83.6	(234)
233.	Banko's Beer Rangers            875	938.6	4.2	(230)
234.	NY Flames                       872	938.1	7.8	(232)
235.	Laubsters II                    828	937.4	201.6	(237)
236.	dayton bomber                   882	935.1	0.0	(241)
237.	Zipper Heads                    847	931.7	33.9	(224)
238.	Ninja Bunnies                   826	928.1	44.9	(236)
239.	Joliet Inmates                  832	926.0	45.8	(239)
240.	Widefield White Wolves          832	924.1	36.9	(242)
241.	Daves Team                      834	920.9	32.0	(238)
242.	Great Scott                     814	917.8	73.3	(240)
243.	South Carolina Tiger Paws       806	915.1	78.4	(243)
244.	SANDY'S SABRES                  854	910.8	4.7	(245)
245.	Florida Tech Burgh Team         809	904.6	49.3	(250)
246.	The Ice Holes                   850	903.9	2.7	(246)
247.	Leos Blue Chips                 845	902.9	10.4	(244)
248.	For xtc                         837	897.8	8.2	(248)
249.	roadrunners                     826	895.9	18.5	(249)
250.	Mudville Kings                  816	894.0	27.6	(251)
251.	Redliners                       820	890.8	15.9	(253)
252.	Pat Phillips                    827	889.1	10.1	(247)
253.	New Jersey Rob                  835	883.0	0.7	(252)
254.	Stewart Clamen                  821	869.4	1.6	(255)
255.	Demon Spawn                     782	860.1	25.0	(254)
256.	Sunnyvale Storm                 772	813.5	0.2	(256)
257.	Allez les Blues                 713	810.7	476.9	(257)
258.	Up For Sale Hockey Club         725	795.0	23.0	(260)
259.	Petes Picks                     689	788.1	168.5	(258)
260.	RINACO                          682	781.6	114.0	(259)
261.	Brenz Revenge                   669	718.5	4.0	(261)
262.	Dinamo Riga                     571	663.8	571.6	(262)
-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52631
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Hockey Draft week 26 price list

Here is the price list for the week April 6 to April 12.

	- Andrew

Buy	Sell	Pts	Team	Player
157.5	141.8	150	PIT	Mario_Lemieux
152.1	136.9	143	BUF	Pat_LaFontaine
139.3	125.4	131	BOS	Adam_Oates
133.8	120.4	129	DET	Steve_Yzerman
132.9	119.6	125	WPG	Teemu_Selanne
132.9	119.6	125	TOR	Doug_Gilmour
130.9	117.8	120	NYI	Pierre_Turgeon
129.7	116.7	122	BUF	Alexander_Mogilny
126.0	113.4	117	PHI	Mark_Recchi
120.2	108.2	113	LA	Luc_Robitaille
115.9	104.3	109	QUE	Mats_Sundin
111.3	100.2	106	PIT	Kevin_Stevens
108.5	97.7	102	STL	Craig_Janney
108.5	97.7	102	VAN	Pavel_Bure
106.3	95.7	100	CHI	Jeremy_Roenick
105.3	94.8	99	QUE	Joe_Sakic
104.0	93.6	99	PIT	Rick_Tocchet
103.1	92.8	97	STL	Brett_Hull
102.1	91.9	96	BOS	Joe_Juneau
102.1	91.9	96	TOR	Dave_Andreychuk
101.9	91.7	97	PIT	Ron_Francis
99.8	89.8	95	MTL	Vincent_Damphousse
98.9	89.0	93	MIN	Mike_Modano
98.9	89.0	93	WPG	Phil_Housley
98.9	89.0	93	CGY	Theoren_Fleury
97.8	88.0	92	BUF	Dale_Hawerchuk
97.7	87.9	93	MTL	Kirk_Muller
96.0	86.4	88	NYR	Mark_Messier
94.6	85.1	89	STL	Brendan_Shanahan
94.4	85.0	91	DET	Dino_Ciccarelli
91.4	82.3	86	LA	Jari_Kurri
91.4	82.3	87	PIT	Jaromir_Jagr
90.3	81.3	86	MTL	Brian_Bellows
88.3	79.5	82	WSH	Peter_Bondra
87.3	78.6	80	HFD	Geoff_Sanderson
87.2	78.5	82	CGY	Robert_Reichel
87.2	78.5	82	QUE	Steve_Duchesne
87.1	78.4	84	DET	Paul_Coffey
86.1	77.5	83	DET	Sergei_Fedorov
85.1	76.6	79	TB	Brian_Bradley
85.1	76.6	79	PHI	Rod_Brind'Amour
85.1	76.6	81	PIT	Larry_Murphy
84.0	75.6	77	HFD	Andrew_Cassels
84.0	75.6	77	HFD	Pat_Verbeek
84.0	75.6	79	LA	Tony_Granato
84.0	75.6	78	WSH	Mike_Ridley
84.0	75.6	77	NYI	Steve_Thomas
83.0	74.7	79	MTL	Stephan_Lebeau
81.8	73.6	76	WSH	Dale_Hunter
80.8	72.7	76	QUE	Mike_Ricci
80.8	72.7	76	BOS	Ray_Bourque
78.6	70.7	73	WSH	Kevin_Hatcher
77.7	69.9	74	SJ	Kelly_Kisio
77.6	69.8	73	VAN	Cliff_Ronning
77.6	69.8	73	STL	Jeff_Brown
77.6	69.8	73	TOR	Nikolai_Borschevsky
76.6	68.9	72	NJ	Claude_Lemieux
76.6	68.9	72	MIN	Dave_Gagner
76.6	68.9	72	MIN	Russ_Courtnall
76.4	68.8	70	NYR	Tony_Amonte
75.5	68.0	71	VAN	Murray_Craven
75.5	68.0	71	LA	Jimmy_Carson
75.5	68.0	71	CGY	Gary_Suter
75.5	68.0	71	MIN	Ulf_Dahlen
74.4	67.0	70	VAN	Geoff_Courtnall
74.4	67.0	70	BOS	Dmitri_Kvartalnov
74.3	66.9	69	WSH	Michal_Pivonka
74.2	66.8	68	NYI	Derek_King
74.2	66.8	68	NYI	Benoit_Hogue
73.4	66.1	69	QUE	Owen_Nolan
73.4	66.1	69	CHI	Steve_Larmer
73.4	66.1	69	NJ	Alexander_Semak
73.1	65.8	67	NYR	Mike_Gartner
72.3	65.1	68	STL	Nelson_Emerson
72.3	65.1	68	CHI	Chris_Chelios
72.2	65.0	67	PHI	Eric_Lindros
71.1	64.0	66	WSH	Al_Iafrate
70.2	63.2	66	VAN	Trevor_Linden
70.2	63.2	66	LA	Mike_Donnelly
70.0	63.0	65	WSH	Dmitri_Khristich
69.3	62.4	66	PIT	Joe_Mullen
69.1	62.2	65	CGY	Joe_Nieuwendyk
69.1	62.2	65	NJ	Stephane_Richer
68.1	61.3	64	WPG	Alexei_Zhamnov
68.1	61.3	64	WPG	Thomas_Steen
68.1	61.3	64	QUE	Andrei_Kovalenko
68.1	61.3	64	VAN	Petr_Nedved
66.5	59.9	61	NYR	Adam_Graves
66.5	59.9	61	HFD	Zarley_Zalapski
66.4	59.8	64	DET	Ray_Sheppard
64.9	58.4	61	TOR	Glenn_Anderson
64.1	57.7	61	SJ	Johan_Garpenlov
63.8	57.4	60	OTT	Norm_Maciver
63.0	56.7	60	MTL	Mike_Keane
63.0	56.7	60	PIT	Shawn_McEachern
62.7	56.4	59	LA	Rob_Blake
62.7	56.4	59	LA	Wayne_Gretzky
62.5	56.3	58	PHI	Garry_Galley
62.5	56.3	58	PHI	Brent_Fedyk
61.1	55.0	56	NYI	Pat_Flatley
60.6	54.5	57	CGY	Sergei_Makarov
60.6	54.5	57	NJ	Bernie_Nicholls
60.1	54.1	58	DET	Steve_Chiasson
59.5	53.6	56	CHI	Steve_Smith
59.5	53.6	56	QUE	Scott_Young
59.1	53.2	57	DET	Paul_Ysebaert
58.9	53.0	54	NYR	Sergei_Nemchinov
58.5	52.7	55	NJ	Valeri_Zelepukin
58.2	52.4	54	WSH	Pat_Elynuik
58.2	52.4	54	TB	John_Tucker
58.2	52.4	54	PHI	Kevin_Dineen
57.4	51.7	54	VAN	Greg_Adams
56.4	50.8	53	WPG	Darrin_Shannon
55.6	50.0	51	NYR	Darren_Turcotte
55.3	49.8	52	NJ	Scott_Stevens
55.0	48.8	51	CHI	Christian_Ruuttu
55.0	48.8	51	VAN	Dixon_Ward
55.0	48.8	51	WPG	Fredrik_Olausson
55.0	48.2	49	NYR	Ed_Olczyk
55.0	47.9	50	WPG	Keith_Tkachuk
55.0	47.2	48	NYI	Jeff_Norton
55.0	46.9	49	TOR	John_Cullen
55.0	46.9	49	VAN	Anatoli_Semenov
55.0	46.9	49	CGY	Al_MacInnis
55.0	46.9	49	BOS	Stephen_Leach
55.0	45.9	48	CHI	Brent_Sutter
55.0	45.4	48	MTL	Denis_Savard
55.0	45.2	46	HFD	Terry_Yake
55.0	45.0	47	NJ	John_MacLean
55.0	44.6	46	WSH	Sylvain_Cote
55.0	44.0	46	EDM	Petr_Klima
55.0	44.0	46	EDM	Shayne_Corson
55.0	44.0	46	LA	Tomas_Sandstrom
55.0	44.0	46	EDM	Craig_Simpson
55.0	43.5	46	MTL	Gilbert_Dionne
55.0	43.2	44	NYI	Vladimir_Malakhov
55.0	43.0	45	BOS	Dave_Poulin
55.0	43.0	45	STL	Kevin_Miller
55.0	43.0	45	LA	Alexei_Zhitnik
55.0	43.0	45	QUE	Martin_Rucinsky
55.0	43.0	45	WPG	Evgeny_Davydov
55.0	42.7	44	WSH	Kelly_Miller
55.0	42.1	44	EDM	Doug_Weight
55.0	42.1	44	EDM	Dave_Manson
55.0	41.2	42	HFD	Patrick_Poulin
55.0	41.1	43	CHI	Michel_Goulet
55.0	40.7	42	PHI	Pelle_Eklund
55.0	40.2	42	MIN	Mark_Tinordi
55.0	39.7	42	MTL	Mathieu_Schneider
55.0	39.2	41	CGY	Paul_Ranheim
55.0	39.2	41	EDM	Todd_Elik
55.0	39.2	41	BOS	Vladimir_Ruzicka
55.0	39.2	41	OTT	Sylvain_Turgeon
55.0	37.4	39	TOR	Dave_Ellett
55.0	37.4	40	DET	Niklas_Lidstrom
55.0	37.4	40	DET	Bob_Probert
55.0	36.4	38	NJ	Peter_Stastny
55.0	36.4	37	NYR	Esa_Tikkanen
55.0	36.4	38	OTT	Brad_Shaw
55.0	36.4	38	TOR	Wendel_Clark
55.0	36.4	38	BUF	Yuri_Khmylev
55.0	35.4	37	VAN	Sergio_Momesso
55.0	35.4	37	OTT	Bob_Kudelski
55.0	35.4	36	NYR	Brian_Leetch
55.0	35.4	37	NJ	Bobby_Holik
55.0	34.5	36	TOR	Rob_Pearson
55.0	34.5	36	MIN	Mike_McPhee
55.0	34.4	35	NYR	Alexei_Kovalev
55.0	33.9	35	TB	Adam_Creighton
55.0	33.5	35	EDM	Zdeno_Ciger
55.0	32.6	34	LA	Corey_Millen
55.0	32.6	34	CHI	Dirk_Graham
55.0	31.6	33	TOR	Peter_Zezel
55.0	30.6	32	BOS	Ted_Donato
55.0	30.6	32	QUE	Valery_Kamensky
55.0	30.2	32	MTL	Gary_Leeman
55.0	29.9	32	DET	Keith_Primeau
55.0	29.7	31	BUF	Wayne_Presley
55.0	29.7	31	MIN	Neal_Broten
55.0	29.7	31	BOS	Steve_Heinze
55.0	29.1	30	PHI	Josef_Beranek
55.0	28.7	30	CHI	Stephane_Matteau
55.0	28.7	30	BUF	Richard_Smehlik
55.0	28.7	30	TOR	Dmitri_Mironov
55.0	28.4	29	NYI	Brian_Mullen
55.0	27.2	28	PHI	Dmitri_Yushkevich
55.0	26.8	28	CHI	Brian_Noonan
55.0	26.8	28	EDM	Scott_Mellanby
55.0	26.5	28	SJ	Pat_Falloon
55.0	25.8	27	STL	Igor_Korolev
55.0	25.6	26	NYR	James_Patrick
55.0	24.8	26	BUF	Petr_Svoboda
55.0	23.9	25	OTT	Mark_Lamb
55.0	23.2	24	TB	Mikael_Andersson
55.0	22.6	23	NYI	Scott_LaChance
55.0	22.1	23	EDM	Kevin_Todd
55.0	21.3	22	WSH	Bob_Carpenter
55.0	21.1	22	TOR	Bill_Berg
55.0	21.1	22	WPG	Sergei_Bautin
55.0	20.8	22	MTL	Benoit_Brunet
55.0	20.6	21	NYI	David_Volek
55.0	20.6	21	HFD	Mikael_Nylander
55.0	20.1	21	MIN	Brent_Gilchrist
55.0	19.6	20	NYR	Phil_Bourque
55.0	19.6	20	NYI	Ray_Ferraro
55.0	18.6	19	HFD	Yvon_Corriveau
55.0	18.2	19	EDM	Martin_Gelinas
55.0	17.7	19	DET	Jim_Hiller
55.0	17.6	18	NYI	Darius_Kasparaitis
55.0	17.5	18	PHI	Andrei_Lomakin
55.0	17.2	18	BUF	Donald_Audette
55.0	15.5	16	TB	Roman_Hamrlik
55.0	15.1	16	SJ	Mark_Pederson
55.0	14.2	15	PIT	Martin_Straka
55.0	12.4	13	NJ	Janne_Ojanen
55.0	12.4	13	OTT	Tomas_Jelinek
55.0	11.5	12	CHI	Joe_Murphy
55.0	10.8	11	NYR	Peter_Andersson
55.0	10.6	11	TB	Steve_Kasper
55.0	10.5	11	BOS	Cam_Neely
55.0	9.5	10	MIN	Bobby_Smith
55.0	9.5	10	SJ	Ray_Whitney
55.0	8.8	9	HFD	Robert_Petrovicky
55.0	8.6	9	BUF	Viktor_Gordijuk
55.0	7.7	8	QUE	Mikhail_Tatarinov
55.0	7.7	8	TOR	Joe_Sacco
55.0	7.6	8	SJ	Peter_Ahola
55.0	6.7	7	CHI	Rob_Brown
55.0	6.7	7	BOS	Glen_Murray
55.0	5.9	6	HFD	Tim_Kerr
55.0	4.9	5	WSH	Reggie_Savage
55.0	4.8	5	STL	Vitali_Prokhorov
55.0	4.8	5	LA	Robert_Lang
55.0	4.8	5	EDM	Shaun_Van_Allen
55.0	3.9	4	BOS	Jozef_Stumpel
55.0	3.9	4	MIN	Dan_Quinn
55.0	3.8	4	PIT	Bryan_Fogarty
55.0	3.7	4	DET	Viacheslav_Kozlov
55.0	2.9	3	TB	Stan_Drulia
55.0	2.9	3	MIN	Brian_Propp
55.0	2.9	3	MTL	Olav_Petrov
55.0	2.0	2	WSH	Jason_Woolley
55.0	1.9	2	NJ	Claude_Vilgrain
55.0	0.0	0	VAN	Igor_Larionov
55.0	0.0	0	TB	Brent_Gretzky
55.0	0.0	0	OTT	Alexei_Yashin
55.0	0.0	0	QUE	Peter_Forsberg
55.0	0.0	0	EDM	Dean_McAmmond
55.0	0.0	0	WSH	Brian_Sakic
55.0	0.0	0	WSH	Randy_Burridge
55.0	0.0	0	MTL	Patrick_Kjellberg
55.0	0.0	0	CGY	Cory_Stillman
55.0	0.0	0	CHI	Sergei_Krivokrasov
55.0	0.0	0	BUF	Jason_Dawe
-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52632
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Playoff Pool

As I've mentioned in the rules posting, I will be out of town until the
day before the entry deadline, so I won't be able to respond to your
messages until April 18.

I would be grateful if someone could repost the rules and instructions for
the playoff pool sometime next week, for the benefit of those who missed the
first two postings.

Thanks.

-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52633
From: jyturunen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL 

In article <rauser.734062608@sfu.ca>, rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:
>
>    Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. I am sick
> of watching a game between an American and a Canadian team (let's say, the
> Red Wings and the Canucks) and seeing names like "Bure" "Konstantinov" and
> "Borshevshky". Is this North America or isn't it? Toronto, Detriot, Quebec,
> and Edmonton are particularly annoying, but the numbers of Euros on other
> teams is getting worse as well.

    I'm sick too watching all-american names like GRETZKY etc.

    Which names you accept ? Sitting bull and dances with wolves ?

    It is North America. What are you doing here ?


    Jyri


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52634
From: hahietanen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi
Subject: TPS will stay on the top...

MIGHTY ONES GET MIGHTIER:

TPS, the Finnish Champions 1992/3, are getting still stronger!

I just heard some news, according to which TPS has acquired
the next Finnish hockey superstar(??) Jere Lehtinen from Kiekko-Espoo!

There are also some rumours about Erik Kakko (Reipas) and Marko Jantunen
(KalPa) being traded to TPS. Both of this players are currently on the
Finnish olympic team. I think that Jantunen is drafted to the NHL, too.

BTW. Is Juha Yl|nen (centre, HPK) drafted by the Jets?? During last year
he has reached the top level among Finnish centres. He had very good
playoff games against TPS!

  Hannu

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> GO  JETS  GO ! >>>>>>>> TEEMU ! >>>>>>> TEPPO ! >>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> TAPPARA >>>>>> CANADIENS >>>>>>> BLACKHAWKS >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
 


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52635
From: patchman@lion.WPI.EDU (Peter Bruce Harper)
Subject: Personal to Ulf Samuellsson


Dear Ulf,

	Would you possibly consider helpiMontreal Canadiens fans everywhere
by throwing a knee-check in the direction of Denis Savard during your upcoming
game against Montreal? We just can't seem to win WITH him!

						Thanx alot,
						Pete H.


:-)


###############################################################################
!Pete Harper          ! Baby, baby don't you hesitate 'cause I just can't wait!
!patchman@wpi.wpi.edu ! Lady once you get me down on my knees,                !
!OR                   ! then you can do what you please . . .                 !
!U_HARPER@jake.wpi.edu! COME ON AND LOVE ME!                                  !
!                     !         -Skid Row, "Come On and Love Me"              !
*******************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52636
From: r_turgeo@oz.plymouth.edu (Randy S. Turgeon)
Subject: Division by zero error in JACK NICKALUS TOURNAMENT GOLF


    I was playing this golf game and something interesting happened.
On the 7th hole, I drove the ball down the fairway, when the ball was
in mid-flight, the game completely froze. A couple seconds later, the
screen went completely black, with an error message in large "Bubble"
letters that said DIVISION BY ZERO. I thought it was funny considering
I am a computer programmer, and I had never seen an error like this on
an actual video game system like Sega or Nintendo (or even Atari or
Intellevision years ago). Oh yeah, after the message, there was also
what must have been an address, in hexadecimal. I forget the exact hex
code that was given. HAS THIS HAPPENED TO ANYONE ELSE??? It must have,
my game shouldn't have been the only one to do this.

Thanks
Randy
PSC
r_turgeo@oz.plymouth.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52637
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Observations

On the Lindros "trade":  Like Ottawa would be stupid enough to get
Lindros.  Why do you think Quebec traded him?  Lindros would go on
personal strike again...maybe I should talk to Ottawa mgmt. about
arranging such a trade....  ;-)

On that xenophobe:  Thankfully nobody agreed with him publicly.  Maybe we
should look at baseball, the supposed "American" pasttime (sp?).  Look at
all the damn Latin Americans playing there!  They should all be deported! 
They aren't American!  (add sarcasm to taste)

To Roger:  Wow, for once we agree.  I hope this isn't a sign of things to
come.... I'll become a ranting lunatic who talks about nothing but the
Leafs being the best in the Campbell.  ;-)

On the Rangers:  I told someone that nothing that happened in the Patrick
would surprise me anymore.  I lied.  How the hell can a team go into
Washington, earn a shutout, then come back home and lose to pitiful
Hartford?  The absolute *pinnacle* of mediocrity.  I can't stand it.
From what I've read, the goalie is to blame this time, as Beezer played
pretty poorly.  Smith is talking about calling up Corey Hirsch from
Binghamton, everybody is pointing fingers... this is definitely not the
same team which wanted to prove itself in Washington.  *Now* nothing that
happens in the Patrick will surprise me.  (Yeah, right... ;-)



--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

"Next time you go over my head, I'll have yours on a platter."
						-- Cmdr. Benjamin Sisko, 1993

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52638
From: mjr4u@Virginia.EDU ("Matthew J. Rush")
Subject: Re: Sad day for hockey

dvb@ick  writes:
> 
> 1. Foul (Any illegal contact with the other player or his stick with your
>    body or stick). If you get 5 you are out for the game.

I've never seen a game where one player has committed 5
penalties.  Something like this would require more attention by
the referee.

> 
> 2. Unsportsmanlike contact. (An intentional foul). This inlcludes all the
>    current flavours of roughing, fighting and boarding. If you get two you
>    are thrown out of the game, and fined.
> 
> 3. Technical foul. Bad mouthing the ref, by player or coach. Penalty shot
>    is awarded. Two and you are thrown out of the game.
> 
> Besides the penalty shot for one technical, if the team gets 5 penalties
> in a period, the opposing team gets a penalty shot for every additional one,
> until the end of the period. The victim gets two shots if he/she was in
> the act of shooting when the foul ocured.
> 
> This works well for several reasons. First, penalty shots are the most
> exciting thing in hockey, right? So, it follows that the more the better.
> Next, when the player is setting up for a penalty shot, the network can
> take a commercial. Finally, with only three penalties, the network
> announcers (Don Meredith, Dick Vitale, John Madden, Pat Summerall, and
> Marv Levy, among others) will be able to tell the viewers what happened before
> the PA announcer says it.
> 

But you're creating a scoring opportunity where there might not
have been one before.  I can see the relationship between free
throws awarded after a certain number of fouls, but it's
obviously easier to score in basketball, there are more
opportunities.  If a basketball team scores 100 points, that's
at least fifty chances made.  The average number of shots taken
by each team in a hockey game (and this is a total guess) is
probably around 40, and a team is lucky to capitalize on maybe
5 of them.  You have some good ideas concerning the other
penalties, but I think that a player should be awarded a
penalty shot only when they had a chance to score and was
interfered with.

Also, later in the post, you talked about how boring the NBA
game you attended was, that play was stopped too often.
Wouldn't your penalty shot rule take up more time during a
hockey game?

Matt att UVA

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52639
From: ayari@judikael.loria.fr (Ayari Iskander)
Subject: Re: Lemieux, NHLPA'93, and other thoughts

I think that NHLPA' 93 is the best video game available now.
of course many things could be done better, but i really appreciate that
the names of players are the real ones, no matter if it lacks some logos...
I am still playing it since November leading different teams to the finals
and making scorers from the same team compete for the top scoring:
Yesterday I won the title using Toronto against Hartford (4 games to two),
I played the playoffs in a 7 games fashion (5 minutes for each period) and
the best scorer and shooter was Gilmour (116 shots if I remember well)
-- 
_____________________________________________________

  Iskander AYARI
 
  Email : Iskander.Ayari@loria.fr ou ayari@loria.fr
_____________________________________________________


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52640
From: joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <1993Apr6.170330.12314@is.morgan.com> scairns@fsg.com writes:
>
>			   MVP		  Surprise	  Disappointment
>			   ---------------------------------------------
>|> New York Rangers        Messier        Kovalev         Bourque
>		           Gartner	  Zubov		  Bourque
>
...
>Bourque - the Penguin's GM must laugh his head off every time he thinks
>of the Rangers and this loser.
>
>+------------------------------------------------------------------+
>| Scott Cairns           	|   email: scairns@fsg.com         |
>| Fusion Systems Group		|  usmail: 225 Broadway, 24th Fl   |
>| New York, New York, USA   	|          New York, NY  10007     |
>+------------------------------------------------------------------+
>| Standard disclaimers apply.   				   | 
>+------------------------------------------------------------------+
>| I hope in the future Americans are thought of as a warlike,      |
>| vicious people, because then I bet a lot of high schools would   |
>| pick 'Americans' as their mascot.				   |
>|    					- Jack Handey		   |
>+------------------------------------------------------------------+

Please.  Have a care with Phil.  We liked him a lot in Pittsburgh.  He
didn't score a lot if you look at his stats last year but he worked his
butt off.  It was his speed that created opportunities in the offensive
zone that allowed the Pens to utilize his potential.  I haven't been
paying attention to him this year so I can't say I know what you're 
objecting to.  He has been out with injuries though, hasn't he?  And
if the offense isn't there, there's not much his speed will do for you.
Like I said, he created opportunities but he didn't score much.  I thought
the money offered from the Rangers was a little high, and so did the Pens,
I guess.

Joseph Stiehm





















In article <1993Apr6.170330.12314@is.morgan.com> scairns@fsg.com writes:
>
>			   MVP		  Surprise	  Disappointment
>			   ---------------------------------------------
>|> New York Rangers        Messier        Kovalev         Bourque
>		           Gartner	  Zubov		  Bourque
>
...
>Bourque - the Penguin's GM must laugh his head off every time he thinks
>of the Rangers and this loser.
>
>+------------------------------------------------------------------+
>| Scott Cairns           	|   email: scairns@fsg.com         |
>| Fusion Systems Group		|  usmail: 225 Broadway, 24th Fl   |
>| New York, New York, USA   	|          New York, NY  10007     |
>+------------------------------------------------------------------+
>| Standard disclaimers apply.   				   | 
>+------------------------------------------------------------------+
>| I hope in the future Americans are thought of as a warlike,      |
>| vicious people, because then I bet a lot of high schools would   |
>| pick 'Americans' as their mascot.				   |
>|    					- Jack Handey		   |
>+------------------------------------------------------------------+

Please.  Have a care with Phil.  We liked him a lot in Pittsburgh.  He
didn't score a lot if you look at his stats last year but he worked his
butt off.  It was his speed that created opportunities in the offensive
zone that allowed the Pens to utilize his potential.  I haven't been
paying attention to him this year so I can't say I know what you're 
objecting to.  He has been out with injuries though, hasn't he?  And
if the offense isn't there, there's not much his speed will do for you.
Like I said, he created opportunities but he didn't score much.  I thought
the money offered from the Rangers was a little high, and so did the Pens,
I guess.

Joseph Stiehm

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52641
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <1993Apr6.155743.18798@adobe.com> snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols) writes:
>In article <1993Apr6.141557.8864@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>>Anyways, crawl back into the hole you crawled out of...the NBA doesn't
>>care where they get basketball players from, major league baseball
>>doesn't give a damn where they get baseball players from (except Cuba,
>>that is).
>
>MLB is perfectly willing to take players from Cuba.  They just have to
>defect first.  
>
>Sort of like the situation used to be with Russian/Czech/etc hockey
>players, until the political situation in those countries changed.
>

Major league baseball has told the Blue Jays and the Expos not to
sign Oscar Linares (I think that is his name)
...Canada does not have the restrictions against
Cubans that the US has and other major league teams have told the
Canadian teams that they would be very unhappy if the Expos or the
Blue Jays would do this.  Cubans players would not have to defect
to play in Canada and could play the 81 home games for the Expos
and Blue Jays without any trouble.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52642
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <1993Apr6.170330.12314@is.morgan.com> scairns@fsg.com writes:
>Messier is a joke this year - bad back not withstanding.  His play is
>the reason the Rangers will be on the golf course in a couple of weeks.
>Gartner is my choice - the guy works his butt off every game.
>
>Kovalev - no surprise.  He's played adequately but as bad defensively

Kovalev is too talented a player to play for Roger Nielson...Roger needs
players who can't think for themselves and can only skate in straight
lines up and down the ice.  Dudley and Nielson are the only two coaches
bad enough in the league to take talents like Mogilny and Kovalev and
not know how to turn them into Bure and Selanne.

>as was predicted in preseason.  Perhaps he'll pull an Alex Mogilny in
>a couple of years and surprise us then.  Zubov wasn't expected to make
>it out of the minors this season and owing to the number of injuries,
>has proved to be a very pleasant surprise.
>

Get Muckler as coach, and Kovalev will look like Mogilny.

The trouble with the Rangers is that Neil Smith went out and got
players like Messier, Kovalev, and Graves who have been schooled in
taking the game to their opponent and attacking, while hiring coaches
who are interested in "rope-a-dope" strategies.  If you want the
Roger Nielsons of the world to be your coach you don't go out and
get a Mark Messier, who is an old dog who can't learn new tricks
from a known loser, and you don't waste your draft picks on players
like Kovalev.

Gerald

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52643
From: snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <1993Apr6.195022.6362@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>Major league baseball has told the Blue Jays and the Expos not to
>sign Oscar Linares (I think that is his name)

Linares has not defected; as I pointed out, MLB requires that the player
defect first.

>...Canada does not have the restrictions against
>Cubans that the US has and other major league teams have told the
>Canadian teams that they would be very unhappy if the Expos or the
>Blue Jays would do this.

What a surprise.  As long as the pool of talent is not accessible to all
teams, MLB won't let a few teams sign it.  Seems perfectly reasonable to
me.  

>  Cubans players would not have to defect
>to play in Canada and could play the 81 home games for the Expos
>and Blue Jays without any trouble.

Except that MLB won't allow it, which is all I ever said.

Sherri Nichols
snichols@adobe.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52644
From: J056600@LMSC5.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM
Subject: Re: Lindros will be traded!!!

In <1993Apr5.163209.576@r-node.hub.org>, Jay Chu writes:

>True rumor.  Fact!  A big three way deal!

>Eric Lindros going to Ottawa Senators.  And Senators get $15mill from
>Montreal.

>Montreal gets Alexander Daigle (the first round pick from Senators)

>Philly gets Damphousse, Bellow, Patrick Roy and a draft pick.

Sheesh.  The rumor mill strikes again.  But let's just assume this were true.
My question is this:

What would Montreal give San Jose if the Sharks got first pick and took Daigle?


Tim Irvin
*****************************************************************************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52645
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Sad day for hockey

In article <1pq50fINN15b@abyss.West.Sun.COM> dvb@ick (David Van Beveren) writes:
>NO NO NO! since all the penalties fall into three classes, there should
>only be three penalties:
>
>1. Foul (Any illegal contact with the other player or his stick with your
>   body or stick). If you get 5 you are out for the game.
>
>2. Unsportsmanlike contact. (An intentional foul). This inlcludes all the
>   current flavours of roughing, fighting and boarding. If you get two you
>   are thrown out of the game, and fined.
>
>3. Technical foul. Bad mouthing the ref, by player or coach. Penalty shot
>   is awarded. Two and you are thrown out of the game.
>
>Besides the penalty shot for one technical, if the team gets 5 penalties
>in a period, the opposing team gets a penalty shot for every additional one,
>until the end of the period. The victim gets two shots if he/she was in
>the act of shooting when the foul ocured.

These new rule changes are great!  However, I think that your rules are
MUCH too complicated.  How will the normal average fan be able to count
how many fouls a player has?  And then we would even have to remember the
names of the players, in order to determine who drew the foul!  And, of
course, there will have to be new "sub-positions", like the power center
who just sits in the slot until the (blue, of course) puck comes near him,
and the "shooting defenseman" and the "point defenseman".  Finally, we'll
be able to keep stats on the best and the worst penalty-shot takers. 
Since almost everyone on the ice will be getting fouled, we'll be able to
see Ulf Samuellson (sp?) and Tie Domi miss penalty shots like crazy.  

;-) ;-) ;-)

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

"Next time you go over my head, I'll have yours on a platter."
						-- Cmdr. Benjamin Sisko, 1993

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52646
From: dvb@ick (David Van Beveren)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

assist@orion.oac.uci.edu (ASSIST Coordination Site) writes:
: In article <C4zCII.Ftn@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca> smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale) writes:
: >                         MVP           Biggest       Biggest
: >                                       Suprise       Disappointment
: 
: >Los Angeles Kings       Robitaille     Donnelly      Hrudey
: 
: 
: I would have chosen Alex Zhitnik for biggest suprise.  They
: did expect that he would become a great defenseman, but I don't
: think anyone knew that he was going to be this impressive in his 
: rookie year.  His speed, skating ability, and puck control is
: exceptional -- he is the one to watch on the Kings.
: 

I agree, with Marty McSorely and Warren Rychel running a close second and 
third. I am surprised more people have not noted Knickle as the biggest
surprise, even though I personally do not really rate him well. The biggest 
disappointment has to be Carson. Though this is really unfair, since too much 
was expected of him. The second biggest disappointment is Melrose, with his 
adolescent handling of the goaltending problems. Putting Hrudey on the bench 
for a month is just stupid. It did not contribute to the team coming out of 
its slump. MVP is surely Robitaille.

dvb

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52647
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: New Name for the Stanley Cup

In article <1993Apr2.202146.22837@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> phoenix@startide.ctr.columbia.edu (Ali Lemer) writes:
>
>Of course we need new position names for those unable to remember the 
>very complicated hockey terminology:
>
>Old Name	New Name
>--------	--------	
>
>Centre		The Guy in the Middle
>Left Wing	The Guy on the Left
>Right Wing	The Guy on the Right
>Defenceman	The Guy Back There
>Goaltender	The Guy in the Net (or "cage", as my mother calls it)
>Referee		The Guy with the Whistle
>Linesman	The Guy with the Arms
>Coach		The Guy in the Suit
>GM		The Head Guy
>Puck		The Black Thing
>Red Line	The Line in the Middle
>Blue Line	The Line on the Side
>Crease		The Place in front of the Guy in the Net
>Faceoff Circle	The Round Thing Where They Stand
>Slot or Point	Over There (must point to accompany term)
>Bench		The Place Where They Sit
>Penalty Box	The Place Where They Sit When They're Bad

Mr. Bettman	The Guy in the Wrong Sport
Mr. Stein	The Guy Who Should Be In Charge But Isn't

Of course, we also need new names for the individual awards, and other
stuff like the President's Cup.

President's Cup		The Trophy Given To the Best Regular-Season Team
Hart winner		The Most Valuable Player, chosen from the
				Guys in the Middle, the Guys on the
				Right, the Guys on the Left, the Guys
				Back There, and the Guy in the Net,
				though typically given only to the
				Guys in the Middle and the Guys on 
				the Left and on the Right
Norris winner		The Best Guy in the back; or, the Guy who was
				awarded for something even though he
				is not one of the Guys in the Middle
				or on the Left or the Right

...ad nauseum.

:-)

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

"Next time you go over my head, I'll have yours on a platter."
						-- Cmdr. Benjamin Sisko, 1993

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52648
Subject: Paul Kuryia and Canadian World Team
From: apland@mala.bc.ca

Heard last night that Paul Kuryia will be playing for the Canadian World
Hockey team this year.  He was on a local radio station when a friend of
the familty called to congratulate him on the invitation.  Meekly Paul told
the host that he didn't think they wanted it out yet.  This morning I heard
that he is destined to play on a line with Lindros and Recci{unsure of this
one}.  If he plays well in this arena, he could go #1 or 2 in the draft.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52649
Subject: Re: JETS FANS!  Hrivnak or Tabaracci??
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)

In article <1993Apr6.172313.29469@wam.umd.edu> giant@next14pg2.wam.umd.edu (Thundarr) writes:
>After seeing Hrivnak and Tabarraci play, who
>would you prefer to have?  And how about
>Tyler Larter?  What ever happened to him??

	You know what my answer will be: Hrivnak! The choice is obvious.



-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52650
From: fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu (FRANK MICHAE SALVATORE)
Subject: Re: JETS FANS!  Hrivnak or Tabaracci??



> >After seeing Hrivnak and Tabarraci play, who
> >would you prefer to have?  And how about
> >Tyler Larter?  What ever happened to him??
> 
> 	You know what my answer will be: Hrivnak! The choice is obvious.
> 
> 
> 

Ok, but have you seen Tabaracci play yet?  In his two starts and
his relief effort for Beaupre, he has looked mighty sharp - don't
forget the shutout.  I think he's let in just four goals over eight
periods of play.  I like Hrivnak, but we might actually have to give
some credit to David Poile for a change after this trade.

Hopefully if Tabaracci starts against the Isles tonight, I haven't
jinxed him.

Frank Salvatore
fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52651
From: steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...



Bryan Smale (smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca) writes:
> I was thinking about who on each of the teams were the MVPs, biggest
> surprises, and biggest disappointments this year.
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>                         Team           Biggest       Biggest
> Team:                   MVP:           Surprise:     Disappointment:
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> Hartford Whalers        Sanderson      Cassells      Corriveau

My votes (FWIW):

Team MVP: Pat Verbeek. He fans on 25% of goal mouth feeds, but he still has 
36 goals after a terrible start and has been an examplary (sp?) team captain
throughout a tough couple of seasons. Honorable mention: Nick Kypreos and
Mark Janssens. Probably more appropriate in the unsung heroes category than
MVP, but Kypreos (17 goals, 320+ PIM) has been the hardest working player on
the team and Janssens is underrated as a defensive center and checker. I guess
I place a greater emphasis on hard work than skill when determining value.

Biggest surprise: Geoff Sanderson. He had 13 goals and 31 points last season
as a center, then moved to left wing and has so far put up 45 goals and 80+
points. He now has a new Whaler record 21 power play goals, most all coming
from the right wing faceoff circle, his garden spot. Honorable mention: Andrew
Cassels and Terry Yake. The kiddie quartet of Sanderson, Poulin, Nylander, and
Petrovicky have been attracting the most attention, but Cassels is just 23
and will score close to 90 points this season. He has quite nicely assumed the
role of number one center on the team and works very well with Sanderson. Yake
bounced around the minors for a number of seasons but is still 24 and will put
up about 20 goals and 50 points this season. Yake, like Sanderson, started
performing better offensively once he was converted from center to wing, 
although lefty Sanderson went to the left wing and righty Yake went to the
right side.

Biggest disappointment: Hands down, John Cullen. Cullen had a disasterous 77
point season last year, his first full season after The Trade. Cullen started
the season off of summer back surgery, and fell flat on his face (appropriate,
since he spent all of his Whaler career flat on his ass, and whining about it).
Cullen scored just 9 point on 19 games, was a clubhouse malcontent, commanded
the powerplay to a 9% success percentage (>21% with Sanderson), and sulked his
way out of town. Worst of all, his 4 year, $4M contract had three years left
to run, so no one would give up any more than the 2nd round draft pick the 
Maple Leafs offered to Hartford. Honorable mention: Steve Konroyd, also subpar
after signing a 3 year, $2.1M contract; Eric Weinrich, who showed flashes of
competence, but overall has played poorly; Jim McKenzie, who was a much better
hockey player two seasons ago than he is now; and Frank Pietrangelo, who only
seemed to play well when Sean Burke was out for an extended period and he got
to make a number of starts in a row.

-SG (a real live Hartford Whalers season ticket holder)
-steveg@cadkey.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52652
From: Raj Ramnarace <ACPS6992@RyeVm.Ryerson.Ca>
Subject: Maple Leafs Update

For those Leaf fans who are concerned, the following players are slated for
return on Thursday's Winnipeg-Toronto game :
    Peter Zezel, John Cullen

  Mark Osborne and Dave Ellett are questionable to return on Thursday.

All regular players who were injured (including Dimitri Mironov) should be back
for Saturday's home game against the Flyers.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52653
From: J056600@LMSC5.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM
Subject: Does the FAQ crash YOUR newsreader?


   The r.s.h FAQ sheet never fails to crash my newsreader.  The only way I
can avoid crashing (and restarting the machine) is to look at the headers and
avoid reading the FAQ.  Does anyone else have problems reading the FAQ?


Tim Irvin
******************************************************************************
The season is near a merciful end...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52654
From: khettry@r1w2.pub.utk.edu (23064RFL)
Subject: Testing!!!



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52655
From: pavalin@bnr.ca (Paul Valin)
Subject: Re: Canadiens - another Stanley Cup???

In article <1993Apr6.044045.5215@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca>,
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) wrote:
> 
> In <rauser.734062534@sfu.ca> rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:
> 
>>pereira@CAM.ORG (Dean Pereira) writes:
> 
> 
>>>		With the kind of team Montreal has now,  they can take the
>>>cup easily.  The only problem they have right now is that everyone is
>>>trying to steal the show and play alone.  They need some massive teamwork.
> 
>This is known as the Savard syndrome - and we are talking Denis, not Serge.
>No team will ever win squat with the likes of Denis Savard in their lineup.
> 
> 
>They could tell Savard to stay home and watch the games on TV.

If life were so simple!  Savard has not played in three of the last 
four games and they are still playing like crap.  Montreal's problems
run deeper than Savard (and Mouton) unfortunately; I hope they can
get their act together before the playoffs.

The line-up in their game coming up against PittsburgH is said to be
the one they're likely to use for the playoffs.  Let's hope they can
forget about the nice weather we're having and play hockey.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Paul Valin                                     Tel: + 1 613 763 7394
Bell-Northern Research Ltd.                    Email: pavalin@bnr.ca
P.O. Box 3511, Station C
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada K1Y 4H7               'only my opinions...'

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52656
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <rauser.734062608@sfu.ca> rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:
>
>   Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. I am sick
>of watching a game between an American and a Canadian team (let's say, the
>Red Wings and the Canucks) and seeing names like "Bure" "Konstantinov" and
>"Borshevshky". Is this North America or isn't it? Toronto, Detriot, Quebec,
>and Edmonton are particularly annoying, but the numbers of Euros on other
>teams is getting worse as well. 

Gee, you'd think Winnipeg would be tops on that list, what with 8 regulars
being European.


>
>    I live in Vancouver and if I hear one more word about "Pavel Bure, the
>Russian Rocket" I will completely throw up. As it is now, every time I see
>the Canucks play I keep hoping someone will cross-check Bure into the plexiglassso hard they have to carry him out on a stretcher. (By the way, I'm not a
>Canucks fan to begin with ;-). 

Well, being a Jet fan, I sometimes wish that Bure would get knocked silly
too.  (Nothing serious, just enough to keep him out of a game. :)


>
>    Okay, the stretcher remark was a little carried away. But the point is that
>I resent NHL owners drafting all these Europeans INSTEAD of Canadians (and
>some Americans). It denies young Canadians the opportunity to play in THEIR
>NORTH AMERICAN LEAGUE and instead gives it to Europeans, who aren't even
>better hockey players. It's all hype. This "European mystique" is sickening,
>but until NHL owners get over it, Canadian and American players will continue
>to have to fight harder to get drafted into their own league.

In most cases, the owners have very little to do with it.  They give their
general managers one order when it comes to the draft...find me the best
players so that our team will win the Stanley Cup.  Whether that player is
in Kindersley, Saskatchewan or Chelyabinsk, Russia, if the GM believes him
to be the better player, the GM should be drafting him.

Where do you get off calling the NHL THEIR league, when referring to Canadian
players.  It doesn't belong to them, it belongs to the owners.  The owners
can do what they want.  While a 'Canadian content' rule might be enforcable
here in Canada, there is enough doubt that it would be enforcable in the US
that the CFL (sorry for the football reference) didn't even TRY to push their
import ratio rule on the Sacromento Goldminers.

Increasing the competition for the 'elite' positions, in most cases, would
make players better anyways.  (Oh yeah, and how many Europeans play at the
lower levels of professional hockey in North America?  While there are some
that play in the AHL, or the IHL where that's an NHL team's primary farm
club, you don't hear of many Europeans playing in the CHL, the ECHL, or on
the secondary farm teams in the IHL.  (ie. the Jets do have a few Russian
players in Moncton, but I don't believe there are any Europeans in Ft. Wayne.))
So with all those teams, there are plenty of positions for hockey players
in North America.

>
>    With the numbers of Euros in the NHL escalating, the problem is clearly
>only getting worse.
>
>    I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let the Bures
>and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.
>
>    I just don't want them on mine.

I'm in favour of the NHL being the league for the premier players in the
world.  I've grown up with Europeans playing on 'my' team, and some of those
players were the among the best in the world.  From Hedberg, Nilsson, and
Sjoberg, to Sel{nne, Zhamnov, and Olausson, and all those in between and to
come, I wouldn't have it any other way.

Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52657
From: macro@cup.hp.com (Patrick MacRoberts)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL


%>I dunno, Lemieux?  Hmmm...sounds like he
%>has *French* blood in him!!!  Hey!  France is part of Europe!  Send that
%>Euro-blooded boy back!!!
%
% Don't you Americans study history...the French settled in North America
% as early or before the British...Lemieux can probably trace back his
% North American heritage back a lot further than most of us.


<friendly-jibe mode on>

Don't you Canadians understand sarcasm?  Sometimes the reader must
decide that what he's reading is so ludicrous that it must mean
the opposite of what it said...

Kinda like the "Toronto's going to win the Cup" posts.  Yeah.  Right.
And cows can fly...

<friendly-jibe mode off>

Geez, Gerald.  Like anyone reading rec.flamefest.hockey.pens.are.great
didn't know that Le-Mow was from Quebec.

-Patrick

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52658
From: snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <1993Apr6.141557.8864@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>Anyways, crawl back into the hole you crawled out of...the NBA doesn't
>care where they get basketball players from, major league baseball
>doesn't give a damn where they get baseball players from (except Cuba,
>that is).

MLB is perfectly willing to take players from Cuba.  They just have to
defect first.  

Sort of like the situation used to be with Russian/Czech/etc hockey
players, until the political situation in those countries changed.

Sherri Nichols
snichols@adobe.com




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52659
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: Re: TPS will stay on the top...

In article <1993Apr6.171611.1@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi> hahietanen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi writes:
>MIGHTY ONES GET MIGHTIER:
>
>TPS, the Finnish Champions 1992/3, are getting still stronger!

Oh no!  Say it isn't so!

>
>BTW. Is Juha Yl|nen (centre, HPK) drafted by the Jets?? During last year
>he has reached the top level among Finnish centres. He had very good
>playoff games against TPS!

Yes, Yl|nen is a draft choice of the Jets.  (Assuming, of course, this
is the same Yl|nen that played for Kiekko-Espoo in 1990-91.)  He was a
5th round, 91st overall pick of the Jets in the 1991 entry draft.

I noticed in the summaries that Yl|nen had really begun to play well in
the playoffs.

Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52660
From: lsa@ll.mit.edu (lisa s anderson)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <1993Apr6.142037.9246@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca>, golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:

|>
|>In article <1993Apr6.044323.22829@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> daniell@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Daniel Lyddy) writes:
|>>
|>>You know, you're absolutely right.  I think we should round up all those
|>>players of European descent and ship 'em back to where they came from.  Let's
|>>see, with whom should we start?  I dunno, Lemieux?  Hmmm...sounds like he
|>>has *French* blood in him!!!  Hey!  France is part of Europe!  Send that
|>>Euro-blooded boy back!!!
|>>
|>
|>Don't you Americans study history...the French settled in North America
|>as early or before the British...Lemieux can probably trace back his
|>North American heritage back a lot further than most of us.
|>
|>Gerald
|>


Uh, Gerald, I think he was joking...


-lisa

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52661
From: ac942@Freenet.carleton.ca (Marc Gregoire)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL


Somebody wrote:
>I'd *LOVE* to see a European NHL division but can't see it happen for some
>time. There's simply not enough fan interest at the moment in several
>"crucial" markets like Germany, Italy and France while Sweden and Finland
>probably can't afford to shell out $20-$30 for tickets the way
>American/Canadian fans do. Call it "the Minnesota North Stars" effect:
>Scandinavians do love hockey but we prefer to watch local, inexpensive
>hockey to the NHL. The National Hockey League should love the idea, though.
>Pan-European TV channels such as Eurosport could bring in the millions the
>American networks likely never will pay.

This brings up a question I asked myself (no answer) when it was mentionned
that the NHL could expand in Europe.

Would most of the North-americans now playing in the NHL be willing
to play for a team in Europe?

I do not think that the majority of hockey players are necessarily
interested in expanding their cultural experience to that level.
(I know I would but I am not a pro hockey player)

When one recalls some players remarks in the last few years it makes
me wonder how a European expansion could be achieved.  Remember these:

- Lindros did not want to play in Quebec (for more than $ reasons)
- Nicholls ... in Edmonton.
- R. Courtnall wanted to be traded to LA only.
- C. Lemieux said he would refuse to go to Edmonton earlier this year.

I know there are many non-cultural reasons behind these but there is more:

- Some american players who played for the Expos complained about the french
  fact and that the city was not quite like the other US cities.  One
  players' wife trying to make her point went on to complain that she could
  not even find her favorite brand of nacho chips in Montreal.

Anybody knows what happened when all these US football players moved
to London, Spain, etc .. for the one year of that new football league
(2 years ago?)

I wonder what the players association thinks about going to Europe.

Myself I would like to see some European teams, but what would be 
the best way to do it? 

Marc

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52662
From: dvb@ick (David Van Beveren)
Subject: Sad day for hockey

ee0i+@andrew.cmu.edu ("Ethan Z. Evans") writes:
: 
: Of course, penalties will have to be changed:
: 
: Roughing:	Chauvanistic Males Being Aggressive
: Slashing:	Chauvanistic Males Venting Frustration
: Fighting:	Proof That Males Cannot Cope With Their Feelings
: 

NO NO NO! since all the penalties fall into three classes, there should
only be three penalties:

1. Foul (Any illegal contact with the other player or his stick with your
   body or stick). If you get 5 you are out for the game.

2. Unsportsmanlike contact. (An intentional foul). This inlcludes all the
   current flavours of roughing, fighting and boarding. If you get two you
   are thrown out of the game, and fined.

3. Technical foul. Bad mouthing the ref, by player or coach. Penalty shot
   is awarded. Two and you are thrown out of the game.

Besides the penalty shot for one technical, if the team gets 5 penalties
in a period, the opposing team gets a penalty shot for every additional one,
until the end of the period. The victim gets two shots if he/she was in
the act of shooting when the foul ocured.

This works well for several reasons. First, penalty shots are the most
exciting thing in hockey, right? So, it follows that the more the better.
Next, when the player is setting up for a penalty shot, the network can
take a commercial. Finally, with only three penalties, the network
announcers (Don Meredith, Dick Vitale, John Madden, Pat Summerall, and
Marv Levy, among others) will be able to tell the viewers what happened before
the PA announcer says it.

Oh, one other rule. When a goal is scored (10-20 times a period), the play
cannot resume until the PA announcer announces it. This way, the network
can sneak in a few more commercials. Then, once the PA announcer has told
them who scored, the TV announcer can tell you the viewer, and even have a 
chance of pronouncing his name right.

Seriously, though, I actually went to see a NBA basketball game last week,
for the first time in my life. I was amazed how boring it was. The play is
so slow they actually had fans come out for things like free-throw shooting
contests DURING THE PERIOD!. Of course the 'Laker Girls' get to do their 
routines at least 6-8 times during the game, and not just between periods
either. There is a whistle every 30 seconds on average, maybe less. The
game is 48 minutes, with 2 minutes between quarters 1-2 and 3-4 and a
10 minute halftime, and it still takes over 2 hours.

The reason for this has to be TV. There is plenty of room to throw in
commercials, and have the announcer jabber while nothing else is happening.
On TV, basketball is fairly entertaining, IMHO. But, it is better to watch
it on TV than to be there. If this is the road the NHL is following, then
it truly is a sad day.

Enough for now.

dvb

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52663
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL
From: riel@unixg.ubc.ca (William Riel)

How long has Don Cherry been a student at SFU? (or is that Arche Bunker?)

Please, keep this racist drivel off of the net.  You're an embarassment
to Canadians everywhere.

Bill 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52664
From: tvartiai@vipunen.hut.fi (Tommi Vartiainen)
Subject: Re: TPS will stay on the top...

In <1993Apr6.171611.1@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi> hahietanen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi writes:
>BTW. Is Juha Yl|nen (centre, HPK) drafted by the Jets?? During last year
>he has reached the top level among Finnish centres. He had very good
>playoff games against TPS!

I'm not sure about Juha, but another top center, Rauli Raitanen([ss{t)
is drafted by Jets. Raitanen had very good year and he has played in the
Finnish nationalteam. I believe that he'll be one of the best finns in
this year's WC, if Matikainen(Head coach) elects him to the team.

>  Hannu

   Tommi



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52665
From: pbarone@x102a.ess.harris.com (barone philip 00309)
Subject: USENET Playoff Pool

I saw a previous request for the Rules and Instructions for the USENET 
playoff pool but I haven't seen any responce. Does anybody have this info?
If so post away or you could mail it to me. Thanks in advance.


--
============================================================================
Phil Barone                  \       Internet:  pbarone@x102a.ess.harris.com
Harris Corporation GISD       \
Cape Canaveral A.F.S.          \
407-853-8169                    \
============================================================================




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52666
From: LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall)
Subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE DOUBTERS NOW?  HMM?

In article <1993Apr4.051942.27095@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca>
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
 
>
>For those of you who can only decide which team is best after you have
>seen the standings:
>
>TOR  42 25 11  95   .609
>CHI  42 25 11  95   .609
>DET  44 28  9  97   .599
>VAN  41 28  9  91   .583
>
>No team in the Campbell Conference has a better record than Toronto.
 
  That's true, but according to your stats, Chicago has just as good a
record as Toronto.  It's interesting that you should list Toronto ahead
of Chicago.
 
 Laurie Marshall
 Wayne State University
 Detroit, Michigan
 Go Wings!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52667
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: Miami's name?

In article <1993Apr6.160042.4953@vax.cns.muskingum.edu> da_tinker1@vax.cns.muskingum.edu writes:
>When will the new Miami franchise team announce it's name?
>Just curious.

	The South Florida Colons.

	:)

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52668
From: khettry@r1w2.pub.utk.edu (23064RFL)
Subject: Testing !!

	Just Testing !!!
	No flames please !

Bye



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 52669
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL


You're right ... I'm sick of seeing all those white guys on skates
myself ... the Vancouver Canucks should be half women, and overall 
one-third Oriental.



(-; (-; (-; (-; (-; (-; 

And I'll gladly volunteer myself for the overage draft. (-;

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53468
From: hamlet@stein.u.washington.edu (Mitch McGowan)
Subject: rec.sport.hockey Frequently Asked Questions

Archive-name: hockey-faq

rec.sport.hockey answers to Frequently Asked Questions and other news:
 
Contents:

0. New Info.
1. NHL
2. NHL Minor Leagues
3. College Hockey (North America)
4. Other leagues (e.g. Europe, Canada Cup tournament)
5. E-mail files
6. USENET Hockey Pool
7. Up-coming Dates
8. Answers to some frequently asked questions
9. Miscellaneous
 
 Send comments, suggestions and criticisms regarding this FAQ list via e-
mail to hamlet@u.washington.edu.
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
 0. New Info.
 
 This section will describe additions since the last post so that you can 
decide if there is anything worth reading. Paragraphs containing new 
information will be preceded by two asterisks (**).

 1.: New Anaheim contact, Winnipeg to keep affiliate in Moncton.
 2.: New Milwaukee contact, IHL broadcaster of the year named, Rheaume to 
start against Cyclones, San Diego sets record.
 3.: Ticket info included for 1994 NCAA Division I Championships.
 4.: World Championship Pool B results listed, Sweden Hockey Games final 
standings listed, Swedish Elite League final standings listed, new Olypmic 
Hockey mailing list.
 5.: New Montreal mailing list address.
 6.: 
 7.: 
 8.: 
 9.: 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
  1. NHL - National Hockey League
 
 For detailed information concerning a team (particularly where to get 
tickets and merchandise, where to watch games in town....), send e-mail to 
the net contact(s) for the team.

                             First   # of   Last
 Team                   Div  Season  Cups   Cup    Net Contacts
 ---------------------  ---  ------  ----  ------ ----------------------
**
 Anaheim Mighty Ducks    -   93-94      -    -    Kris Myers
                                                  kris@fs2.assist.uci.edu
 Boston Bruins           A   24-25      5  71-72  
 Buffalo Sabres          A   70-71      0    -    Jeff Horvath
                                                  jhorvath@macc.wisc.edu
 Calgary Flames          S   80-81*     1  88-89  CALDWELL8102@mtroyal.ab.ca
 Chicago Blackhawks      N   26-27      3  60-61  John Scholvin
                                                  scholvin@casbah.acns.nwu.edu
 Detroit Red Wings       N   33-34*     7  54-55  SGLENN@cmsa.gmr.com
 Edmonton Oilers         S   79-80*     5  89-90  Andrew Scott
                                                  andrew@idacom.hp.com
 Hartford Whalers        A   79-80*     0    -    Matthew Olsen
                                                  dmolsen@athena.mit.edu
 Los Angeles Kings       S   67-68      0    -    Stan Willis
                                                  willis@empire.dnet.hac.com
 Minnesota North Stars   N   67-68*     0    -    Mitch McGowan
                                                  hamlet@u.washington.edu
 Montreal Canadiens      A   17-18     22  85-86  
 New Jersey Devils       P   82-83*     0    -    
 New York Islanders      P   72-73      4  82-83  Mark Anania
                                                  ananim@rpi.edu
 New York Rangers        P   26-27      3  39-40  Paul Romano
                                                  romano@monolith.bellcore.com
 Ottawa Senators         A   92-93      0    -    Scott Simpson
                                                  simpson@bnr.ca
 Philadelphia Flyers     P   67-68      2  74-75  Pete Clark
                                                  seth@hos1cad.att.com
 Pittsburgh Penguins     P   67-68      2  91-92  Lori Iannamico
                                                  lli+@cs.cmu.edu
                                                  Thomas Sullivan
                                                  tms@cs.cmu.edu
 Quebec Nordiques        A   79-80*     0    -
 St. Louis Blues         N   67-68      0    -    Joseph Achkar
                                                  jca2@cec1.wustl.edu
 San Jose Sharks         S   91-92      0    -    Nelson Lu
                                                  claudius@leland.stanford.edu
**
 South Florida           -   93-94      -    -    
 Tampa Bay Lightning     N   92-93      0    -    Tom Wilson
                                                  wilson@eola.cs.ucf.edu
 Toronto Maple Leafs     N   26-27*    11  66-67  Darryl Gamble
                                                  darryl@cs.yorku.ca
 Vancouver Canucks       S   70-71      0    -    Alan Chim
                                                  chim@sfu.ca
 Washington Capitals     P   74-75      0    -    David Lu
                                                  david@eng.umd.edu
 Winnipeg Jets           S   79-80*     0    -    umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca
 
 A=Adams N=Norris P=Patrick S=Smythe
 
 *Calgary: formerly Atlanta Flames (72/73-79/80)
  Detroit: formerly Detroit Cougars (26/27-29/30) -> Detroit Falcons 
(30/31-32/33)
  Edmonton: formerly Alberta Oilers (WHA) (72/73) -> Edmonton Oilers (WHA) 
(72/73-78/79)
  Hartford: formerly New England Whalers (WHA) (72/73-78/79)
  Minnesota: Cleveland Barons were merged with Minnesota for the 1978/79 
season.
  New Jersey: formerly Kansas City Scouts (74/75-75/76) -> Colorado 
Rockies (76/77-81/82)
  Quebec: formerly Quebec Nordiques (WHA) (72/73-78/79)
  Toronto: formerly Toronto Arenas (17/18-18/19) -> Toronto St. Patricks 
(19/20-25/26)
  Winnipeg: formerly Winnipeg Jets (WHA) (72/73-78/79)

 Teams with mailing lists, see section 5 for addresses: Boston, Buffalo, 
Los Angeles, Montreal, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, St. Louis, San Jose, 
Tampa Bay, Vancouver, Washington.

-----
 
- Schedule

 1992-1993 Schedule for the NHL

                                 April
    Sun       Mon       Tue       Wed       Thu       Fri       Sat
+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+
!         !         !         !         ! 1       ! 2       ! 3       !
!         !         !         !         !Min @ Cal!Mon @ Was!Buf @ Bos!
!         !         !         !         !Det @ Chi!NYI @ NYR!Cal @ SJ !
!         !         !         !         !Har @ Pit!         !Chi @ StL!
!         !         !         !         !Que @ Ott!         !Van @ Det!
!         !         !         !         !Tor @ Phi!         !Win @ Edm!
!         !         !         !         !Win @ SJ !         !Ott @ Har!
!         !         !         !         !Van @ TB !         !Min @ LA !
!         !         !         !         !         !         !Mon @ NYI!
!         !         !         !         !         !         !NJ  @ Tor!
!         !         !         !         !         !         !TB  @ Phi!
!         !         !         !         !         !         !Pit @ Que!
+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+
! 4       ! 5       ! 6       ! 7       ! 8       ! 9       !10       !
!Bos @ Buf!Har @ NYR!Bos @ Que!Edm @ Van!Que @ Bos!Van @ Cal!Bos @ Mon!
!Cal @ SJ !         !Buf @ Min!Har @ Ott!Chi @ NYI!Pit @ NYR!Buf @ Det!
!StL @ Chi!         !Cal @ LA !Mon @ Pit!Det @ TB !         !Chi @ TB !
!Pit @ NJ !         !Edm @ SJ !NYR @ NJ !SJ  @ LA !         !Har @ Que!
!NYR @ Was!         !NYI @ Was!         !Was @ Phi!         !LA  @ SJ !
!Van @ Ott!         !Phi @ Win!         !Tor @ Win!         !StL @ Min!
!         !         !StL @ TB !         !         !         !NJ  @ Was!
!         !         !         !         !         !         !Ott @ NYI!
!         !         !         !         !         !         !NYR @ Pit!
!         !         !         !         !         !         !Phi @ Tor!
+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+
!11       !12       !13       !14       !15       !16       !17       !
!Ott @ Bos!Was @ Mon!Mon @ Buf!Bos @ Ott!Phi @ Buf!         !         !
!Que @ Buf!NYR @ Phi!Cal @ Edm!NYI @ Har!SJ  @ Cal!         !         !
!Cal @ Van!         !Chi @ Min!Pit @ NJ !Tor @ Chi!         !         !
!TB  @ Chi!         !LA  @ Van!Was @ NYR!Min @ Det!         !         !
!Win @ Edm!         !Ott @ Que!         !Edm @ Win!         !         !
!Tor @ Har!         !StL @ Tor!         !Har @ NYI!         !         !
!Min @ StL!         !TB  @ Win!         !Van @ LA !         !         !
!NYI @ NJ !         !         !         !NJ  @ Pit!         !         !
!         !         !         !         !TB  @ StL!         !         !
+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+

 The season will begin on 10/6 and end on 4/15. Playoffs will begin on 
4/18 and end on or before 6/14. 24 NHL regular season games will be played 
in non-NHL cities during 92-93 season. Cities: Milwaukee (2), Sacramento 
(2), Cleveland (2), Indianapolis, Phoenix, Miami, Oklahoma City, Dallas, 
Atlanta, Cincinnati, Providence, Peoria, Hamilton (4), Saskatoon (4), 
Halifax.

 Here is a chart showing the number of games between the teams (84 games 
each):

      N N N P P W   B B H M O Q   C D M S T T   C E L S V W
      J Y Y h i a   o u a o t u   h e i t B o   a d A J a i
        I R i t s   s f r n t e   i t n L   r   l m     n n
      = = = = = =   = = = = = =   = = = = = =   = = = = = =
 NJ : - 7 7 7 9 7   4 4 4 3 4 4   2 2 2 2 2 2   2 2 2 2 2 2
 NYI: 7 - 7 9 7 7   4 3 4 4 3 3   2 2 2 3 2 2   2 3 2 2 2 2
 NYR: 7 7 - 7 7 9   3 4 3 4 3 4   2 2 2 2 3 2   2 2 2 3 2 2
 Phi: 7 9 7 - 7 7   4 3 3 4 3 4   2 3 2 2 2 2   3 2 2 2 2 2
 Pit: 9 7 7 7 - 7   5 4 3 3 4 3   2 2 2 2 2 2   2 3 2 2 2 2
 Was: 7 7 9 7 7 -   3 4 4 3 4 3   3 3 2 2 2 2   2 2 2 2 2 2

 Bos: 4 4 3 4 5 3   - 7 7 9 7 7   2 2 2 2 2 2   2 2 2 2 2 2
 Buf: 4 3 4 3 4 4   7 - 9 7 7 7   2 2 2 2 2 2   2 2 2 2 3 2
 Har: 4 4 3 3 3 4   7 9 - 7 7 7   2 2 2 3 2 2   2 2 2 2 2 3
 Mon: 3 4 4 4 3 3   9 7 7 - 7 7   2 2 2 2 2 2   2 2 3 3 2 2
 Ott: 4 3 3 3 4 4   7 7 7 7 - 9   2 2 2 2 2 3   2 2 2 2 2 3
 Que: 4 3 4 4 3 3   7 7 7 7 9 -   2 2 2 2 3 3   2 2 2 2 2 2

 Chi: 2 2 2 2 2 3   2 2 2 2 2 2   - 9 7 7 7 7   3 4 5 3 4 3
 Det: 2 2 2 3 2 3   2 2 2 2 2 2   9 - 7 7 7 7   4 3 4 4 3 3
 Min: 2 2 2 2 2 2   2 2 2 2 2 2   7 7 - 9 7 7   4 4 3 3 5 4
 StL: 2 3 2 2 2 2   2 2 3 2 2 2   7 7 9 - 7 7   4 3 3 3 4 4
 TB : 2 2 3 2 2 2   2 2 2 2 2 3   7 7 7 7 - 9   3 4 3 4 3 4
 Tor: 2 2 2 2 2 2   2 2 2 2 3 3   7 7 7 7 9 -   4 3 4 4 3 3

 Cal: 2 2 2 3 2 2   2 2 2 2 2 2   3 4 4 4 3 4   - 7 7 9 7 7
 Edm: 2 3 2 2 3 2   2 2 2 2 2 2   4 3 4 3 4 3   7 - 7 7 7 9
 LA : 2 2 2 2 2 2   2 2 2 3 2 2   5 4 3 3 3 4   7 7 - 7 9 7
 SJ : 2 2 3 2 2 2   2 2 2 3 2 2   3 4 3 3 4 4   9 7 7 - 7 7
 Van: 2 2 2 2 2 2   2 3 2 2 2 2   4 3 5 4 3 3   7 7 9 7 - 7
 Win: 2 2 2 2 2 2   2 2 3 2 3 2   3 3 4 4 4 3   7 9 7 7 7 -

 Valerie Hammerl <hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu> has posted this year's version 
of nhl.c, a schedule program for NHL games.  For example, users can find 
out the games played on a certain date or find out the next ten games 
played by team x. A copy can be obtained by e-mailing 
<hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu>

 Following is the neutral site schedule:

 Tue 10/13:  Calgary vs. Minnesota @ Saskatoon
 Tue 10/20:  Ottawa vs. Toronto @ Hamilton
 Tue 11/03:  Chicago vs. Washington @ Indianapolis
 Tue 11/17:  Toronto vs. Quebec @ Hamilton
 Wed 11/18:  Buffalo vs. New Jersey @ Hamilton
 Tue 12/01:  Los Angeles vs. Chicago @ Milwaukee
 Tue 12/08:  Montreal vs. Los Angeles @ Phoenix
 Wed 12/09:  Tampa Bay vs. New York Rangers @ Miami
 Sun 12/13:  Edmonton vs. New York Islanders @ Oklahoma City
 Tue 12/15:  New York Islanders vs. St. Louis @ Dallas
 Mon 01/04:  San Jose vs. Montreal @ Sacramento
 Mon 01/18:  Hartford vs. Winnipeg @ Saskatoon
 Mon 02/08:  Boston vs. Pittsburgh @ Atlanta
 Mon 02/08:  St. Louis vs. Hartford @ Peoria
 Tue 02/16:  Philadelphia vs. Calgary @ Cincinnati
 Sat 02/20:  Quebec vs. Tampa Bay @ Halifax
 Mon 02/22:  New York Rangers vs. San Jose @ Sacramento
 Mon 02/22:  Detroit vs. Philadelphia @ Cleveland
 Tue 02/23:  Winnipeg vs. Ottawa @ Saskatoon
 Mon 03/01:  Vancouver vs. Buffalo @ Hamilton
 Thu 03/11:  Minnesota vs. Vancouver @ Saskatoon
 Tue 03/16:  Washington vs. Detroit @ Milwaukee
 Tue 03/16:  New Jersey vs. Boston @ Providence  *
 Sun 03/21:  Pittsburgh vs. Edmonton @ Cleveland

 * Location subject to change

NHL Playoff Schedule:

Wales Conference Division Semifinals: April 18, 20, 22, 24, 26*, 28*, 30*
Campbell Conference Division Semifinals: April 19, 21, 23, 25, 27*, 29*, May 1*
Wales Conference Division Finals: May 2, 4, 6, 8, 10*, 12*, 14*
Campbell Conference Division Finals: May 3, 5, 7, 9, 11*, 13*, 15*
Wales Conference Final: May 16, 18, 20, 22, 24*, 26*, 28*
Campbell Conference Final: May 17, 19, 21, 23, 25*, 27*, 29*
Stanley Cup Final: June 1, 3, 5, 7, 9*, 11*, 14*

* - if neccessary

-----
 
- News & Scores
 
 SPIKE (bryan.k.strouse) <bks@cbnewsh.cb.att.com> posts weekday news and 
box scores (Sunday through Thursday). John P. Curcio 
<jpc@philabs.philips.com> posts weekend news and box scores. Both maintain 
e-mail lists for faster delivery.
 Net contacts post team news as they see/hear/read it.
 
-----
 
- Notable team news (transactions and announcements)
 
 Note that this information is culled from press releases and posts.  It 
is updated each month and only information currently under discussion or 
of continuing importance or interest will be listed for more than two 
postings.
 
 Boston Bruins
  Boston legislators and the developers proposing a new Boston Garden 
finally agreed to a deal that puts the 19,000-seat, $160 million project 
back on track to be finished in September 1995.
  Right wing Daniel Marois will be sidelined indefinitely following 
surgery to repair a herniated disc in his back.
**
  Sent defenseman Glen Murray to Providence of the American Hockey League.

 Buffalo Sabres
1-800-333-PUCK (1-800-333-7825)
  Acquired left winger Bob Errey from Pittsburgh for defenseman Mike 
Ramsey.
**
  Veteran Buffalo Sabres broadcaster Ted Darling will be inducted into the 
club's Hall of Fame Sunday, April 11.  Darling, who joined the expansion 
Sabres in 1970, was the team's play-by-play announcer on both television 
and radio until illness forced him out of the booth during last season.
**
  Recalled forwards Viktor Gordiouk and Doug MacDonald from Rochester of 
American Hockey League.

 Calgary Flames
  Acquired veteran right wing Greg Paslawski from Philadelphia for future 
considerations.
**
  Recalled center Todd Harkins and left winger Tomas Forslund from Salt 
Lake City of International Hockey League.

 Chicago Blackhawks
        The $175 million, privately financed United Center, scheduled to 
open in August 1994, will be home to the NBA's Chicago Bulls and NHL's 
Chicago Blackhawks. The stadium is owned by entities controlled by the two 
teams. The owners apparently still have not made a decision on whether the 
old Chicago Stadium will be razed for parking space once the new facility, 
located directly across the street, opens.
  Suspended defenseman Craig Muni indefinitely for failing to report 
following a trade with Edmonton.

 Detroit Red Wings
  Acquired defenseman Steve Konroyd from Hartford for a sixth-round draft 
pick.
  Annnounced the signing of right wing Joe Frederick, their 13th pick in 
the 1989 National Hockey League entry draft.
**
  Two contrite hockey fans have returned the stolen Michigan Sports Hall 
of Fame plaque honoring Detroit Red Wing great Gordie Howe. The bronze 
plaque was stolen more than four years ago from Cobo Hall in Detroit, site 
of the Michigan Hall of Fame.

 Edmonton Oilers
  Sent forward Esa Tikkanen to the New York Rangers for center Doug 
Weight.
  Traded defenseman Craig Muni to Chicago for forward Mike Hudson.
  NHL commissioner Gary Bettman said the Edmonton Oilers' lease with 
Northlands Coliseum must be improved if the team is to survive in the 
city. Edmonton Northlands is a non-profit agency set up by the city to 
administer exhibition facilities including the Coliseum.  Oilers owner 
Peter Pocklington calls his lease with Northlands horrendous and has 
threatened to move the team if he doesn't get a better deal. He makes no 
money from parking, concessions or building advertising. The 17,313-seat 
Coliseum also has few of the lucrative private boxes that produce 
significant revenues for other owners.
  Announced center Kevin Todd will not need surgery but will miss the 
remainder of the season with a separated shoulder.

 Hartford Whalers
  Sent defenseman Steve Konroyd to Detroit for a sixth-round draft pick.
  Acquired left winger Robert Kron and a third-round draft pick from 
Vancouver for left winger Murray Craven and a fifth-round draft pick.
**
  The state of Connecticut will begin negotiations to buy the Civic Center 
from the city in an effort to keep the financially struggling Hartford 
Whalers franchise in the city.

 Los Angeles Kings
  Sent center John McIntyre to the New York Rangers for defenseman Mark 
Hardy and Ottawa's fifth-round 1993 draft pick.

 Minnesota North Stars
1-800-800-0435 if calling from the U.S.
1-800-800-0458 if calling from Canada
  The Dallas City Council has approved an agreement with the Minnesota 
North Stars that will bring the NHL club to Reunion Arena next season.
  Defenseman Mark Tinordi, captain of the North Stars, will be sidelined 
the rest of the season, including any postseason games the North Stars 
might play, because of a broken collarbone.
  Acquired defenseman Mark Osiecki from Winnipeg for ninth- and 10th-round 
draft picks in 1993.
  Added defenseman Travis Richards from the University of Minnesota.
  A former employee filed a sexual harassment suit against Minnesota North 
Star owner Norman Green. Karen (Kari) Dziedzic, Green's former executive 
assistant, claims Green often instructed her to wear cosmetics, described 
her outfits as "very hot" and "very sexy," once slapped her hand as she 
was about to eat and humiliated her by grabbing her hand and rubbing it 
through a client's hair.
  The Minnesota North Stars, who will move to Dallas after this season, 
announced that nearly 11,000 season ticket reservations have been made for 
their new home at Reunion Arena, which has a capacity of 16,800.
  The Met Center commission has told the Minnesota North Stars that it 
wants the club out - with its keys returned - at midnight after the last 
home game.  The club is moving to Dallas for next season.  The club must 
pay unpaid interest of $4,492.80 on the team's late rent payment for 1992, 
which was made earlier this month, and has been instructed not to take 
property such as the scoreboard and Zamboni ice-surfacing machine.
**
  Derian Hatcher's game-misconduct penalty was rescinded by the NHL, 
allowing the Minnesota defenseman to play in the North Stars' last two 
regular-season games.  Hatcher was given the penalty during a fight at the 
end of a loss at St. Louis on Sunday, April 11.  But the league didn't 
rescind the game-misconduct penalty Shane Churla received.  The Stars 
recalled center Cal McGowan from their top minor league club in Kalamazoo, 
Mich., to replace Churla.

 Montreal Canadiens
  Acquired defenseman Rob Ramage from Tampa Bay for minor league 
defensemen Eric Charron and Alain Cote and future considerations.

 New Jersey Devils
**
  Bernie Nicholls publicly apologized for his criticism of referee Denis 
Morel after the Devils' 5-2 loss to the Buffalo Sabres.  Nicholls was 
ejected by Morel for being the third man in on a fight late in the second 
period of that game and afterward Nicholls called Morel "a homer" and "an 
embarrassment to the referee's association."

 New York Islanders
  Traded right wing Daniel Marois to Boston for a conditional draft 
choice.

 New York Rangers
  Obtained forward Esa Tikkanen from Edmonton for center Doug Weight.
  Acquired left winger Mike Hartman from Tampa Bay 
  Acquired center John McIntyre from Los Angeles for defenseman Mark Hardy 
and Ottawa's fifth-round 1993 draft pick.
  Defenseman Brian Leetch will undergo additional surgery on the right 
ankle he broke in a non-skating fall and is not expected to play again 
this season. Leetch suffered the broken ankle March 19 following a victory 
over San Jose. The team said he slipped on an icy patch of pavement as he 
was getting out of a taxi cab in front of his apartment.
**
  Announced that defenseman James Patrick will require surgery on a 
herniated disc in his back and will not play again this season.
**
  Returned goaltender Corey Hirsch to Binghamton of the American Hockey 
League.

 Ottawa Senators
        The Ottawa Senators received the go-ahead to build the 18,500-seat 
Palladium on the proposed location in nearby Kanata, Ont.  The projected 
cost is C$150 million. Construction will be postponed until the 1995-96 
season, one year behind schedule.
  The Ottawa Senators lost their 37th consecutive NHL road game to tie the 
1974-75 Washington Capitals for most road losses in a row.
**
  Assigned left wing Martin St. Amour to New Haven of the American Hockey 
League.

 Philadelphia Flyers
  The opening date of Spectrum II has been pushed back to fall 1995. 
Formal groundbreaking has been postponed indefinitely.
  Traded veteran right wing Greg Paslawski to the Calgary Flames for 
future considerations.

 Pittsburgh Penguins
  Traded left winger Bob Errey to Buffalo for defenseman Mike Ramsey.
  Reacquired defenseman Peter Taglianetti from Tampa Bay Lightning for a 
third-round 1993 draft choice.
**
  Revolutionary Comics of San Diego agreed to destroy all available copies 
of a Mario Lemieux comic book in a settlement with the Pittsburgh Penguins 
over a trademark infringement lawsuit.  The Penguins sued in February 
charging that the "Sport Stars Mario Lemieux" comic infringed on the 
team's logo and uniform, which are registered trademarks.

 Quebec Nordiques
1-800-463-3333

 St. Louis Blues
  St. Louis Blues center Ron Sutter will miss the rest of the season as a 
result of separating his right shoulder.

 San Jose Sharks
  The San Jose Sharks announced that ticket prices will increase by about 
30% for the 1993-94 season when they move from the Cow Palace into a new 
$155-million arena in San Jose.
**
  Recalled defenseman Tom Pederson from Kansas City of the International 
Hockey League.
**
  Reached agreement in principle with left wing Alexander Cherbayev.

 Tampa Bay Lightning
1-800-881-2639
        At least two investor groups are poised to build a sports arena in 
downtown Tampa if the delay-plagued company that holds a lease from the 
Tampa Bay Lightning bows out. Tampa Coliseum Inc. has a lease with the 
National Hockey League team to develop an entertainment and sports arena 
next to Tampa Stadium, but has been unable to raise enough money for the 
project.
  Sent left winger Mike Hartman to the New York Rangers for center Randy 
Gilhen.
  Sent defenseman Peter Taglianetti to Pittsburgh for a third-round 1993 
draft choice.
  Sent defenseman Rob Ramage to the Montreal Canadiens for minor league 
defensemen Eric Charron and Alain Cote and future considerations.
**
  Manon Rheaume's first starting appearance in goal for the Atlanta 
Knights was impressive enough for her coach to say she has a chance to be 
a backup goalie for another minor league team next season. Rheaume, the 
first female to play professional hockey, stopped 25 shots and gave up six 
goals against the Cincinnati Cyclones on Saturday night, April 10. After 
the game, her coach, Gene Ubriaco, said Rheaume performed well enough to 
compete for the No. 2 goalie spot with the Louisville IceHawks of the East 
Coast Hockey League next season. The Knights and the IceHawks are minor 
league clubs of the Tampa Bay Lightning.
**
  As their first season comes to a close, there are rumors swirling that 
the Tampa Bay Lightning just might become the Atlanta Lightning.  Or the 
Minnesota Lightning.  But they are just rumors, according to Lightning 
general manager Phil Esposito.  ESPN reported on Sunday, April 11, that 
the Lightning, who have been playing in 10,400-seat Expo Hall, are 
exploring opportunities to move to either Atlanta or Minneapolis.  But 
Esposito said there was no truth to the report.  "We were disappointed 
with ESPN's irresponsible comment," Esposito said.  "There is just no 
substance to the rumor." Rumors have been swirling for the past two years 
regarding a move by Tampa Bay, which is presently discussing plans to 
build a new arena.

 Toronto Maple Leafs
**
  Defenseman Matt Martin, who helped Maine win the 1993 NCAA hockey 
championship, gave up his final year of eligibility and signed a contract 
with the Toronto Maple Leafs.

 Vancouver Canucks
       The Vancouver Canucks have cleared the last hurdle in their effort 
to build a new stadium. Vancouver council has given the green light for 
the 100 million dollar complex. It will seat 20 thousand people and will 
have an adjoining office tower. It will be built between the viaducts near 
B.C. Place in Vancouver. Site preparation will begin this summer, with a 
completion date of Fall 1995.
  Traded left winger Robert Kron and a third-round draft pick to Hartford 
for left winger Murray Craven and a fifth-round draft pick.
  Obtained defenseman Dan Ratushny from Winnipeg for a ninth-round draft 
pick.
**
  Signed right wing Brian Loney to a multi-year contract and assigned him 
to Hamilton of American Hockey League (AHL).

 Washington Capitals
(301) 808-CAPS
  Traded goaltender Jim Hrivnak and future considerations to Winnipeg for 
goaltender Rick Tabaracci.

 Winnipeg Jets
        Winnipeg Jets have been allowed economic assistance in order to 
keep them in the Smythe division as a result of expansion.
  Sent defenseman Mark Osiecki to Minnesota for ninth- and 10th-round 
draft picks in 1993.
  Sent goaltender Rick Tabaracci to Washington for Jim Hrivnak and future 
considerations.
  Sent defenseman Dan Ratushny to Vancouver for a ninth-round draft pick.
  Winnipeg's Teemu Selanne broke the NHL's rookie points record. The Jets 
rookie tied the record of 109 points, set by Peter Stastny with Quebec 
(1980-81), with a goal, his 66th of the season, and moved ahead on an 
assist in a 5-4 loss to Toronto.
**
  The Fort Wayne Komets said they have been told by Winnipeg that the Jets 
will keep a minor league affiliation with Moncton of the American Hockey 
League. There have been reports the Jets would move players from Moncton 
to Fort Wayne next season.

-----

- Expansion news:

  The National Hockey League announced that the expansion Anaheim and 
South Florida franchises will join the league for the 1993- 1994 season.

        Disney and National Hockey League officials announced Monday, 
March 1, that the Mighty Ducks of Anaheim, Disney's expansion team, will 
take to the ice next fall. Michael Eisner, chairman and chief executive 
officer of the Walt Disney Co., said the Mighty Ducks will play at the 
Pond, the new Anaheim sports arena, near Disney's flagship theme park. The 
arena is under construction and will be completed in June. The Pond seats 
17,350. The team still must meet the league's requirement that it sell at 
least 10,000 season tickets for the final grant of NHL membership.

        Anaheim named Jack Ferreira general manager and Pierre Gauthier 
assistant general manager.
**
  Veteran NHL scout Al Godfrey has been hired as the Midwest regional 
scout for the Anaheim Mighty Ducks.

        Philadelphia Flyers' senior vice president Bobby Clarke was named 
Monday, March 1, to the post of general manager for Miami's NHL expansion 
team. Franchise owner H. Wayne Huizenga made the announcement at the Miami 
Arena, three months after being awarded a franchise. Huizenga said he 
plans to have a team on the ice in time for the beginning of the NHL 
season in October.

-----

- Realignment:

Eastern Conference

Atlantic Division

Washington Capitals, New Jersey Devils, New York Islanders, New York 
Rangers, Philadelphia Flyers, South Florida, Tampa Bay Lightning

Northeast Division

Boston Bruins, Buffalo Sabres, Hartford Whalers, Montreal Canadiens, 
Ottawa Senators, Pittsburgh Penguins, Quebec Nordiques

Western Conference

Central Division

Chicago Blackhawks, Dallas Stars, Detroit Red Wings, St. Louis Blues, 
Toronto Maple Leafs, Winnipeg Jets

Pacific Division

Anaheim Mighty Ducks, Calgary Flames, Edmonton Oilers, Los Angeles Kings, 
San Jose Sharks, Vancouver Canucks

  Schedule: Eastern Conference teams will play five games against each of 
six divisional opponents (30); four games against each of the seven teams 
in the conference's other division (28) and two games against each of the 
12 Western Conference members (24).

Western Conference teams will play six games against each of five 
divisional opponents (30); four games against each of the six teams in the 
conference's other division (24) and two games against each of the 14 
Eastern Conference clubs (28).

  Playoffs: The system will be conference-based, with the No. 1 team 
meeting the No. 8 team in the first round, No. 2 vs. No. 7, No. 3 vs. No. 
6 and No. 4 vs. No. 5. Matchups will be based on overall points with the 
four division champions being placed in the first- or second-place seeds 
in each conference and being assured of home-ice in the first two playoff 
rounds. All series will be best of seven (2-2-1-1-1 rotation) except 
matchups between Central and Pacific teams.  Those series will rotate 2-3-
2 to reduce travel.  In those cases, the team with the most regular-season 
points will choose whether to start the series at home or away.

-----

- Draft news:

        Under terms of the new expansion draft, which will be held in 
June, each of the 24 existing clubs will be allowed to protect one 
goaltender, five defensemen and nine forwards. The most recent expansion 
drafts allowed teams to protect two goalies and did not make a distinction 
between forwards and defensemen.
        First-year pros only will be exempt from the draft, which is down 
from the two-year exemption teams had last season. San Jose, Tampa Bay and 
Ottawa still will be allowed to exempt second-year pros.
        Each of the 24 teams will lose two players, with a maximum loss of 
one goaltender and a maximum loss of one defenseman. The one exception is 
that a team which loses a goaltender can then no longer lose a defenseman.
        At the end of the first phase of the draft, the two new franchises 
will have three goaltenders, eight defensemen and 13 forwards for a total 
of 24 players. A second phase then will be conducted where San Jose, Tampa 
Bay and Ottawa will select two players each from the rosters of the two 
new teams.
        Ottawa, Tampa Bay and San Jose will be guaranteed priority 
drafting selection in the 1993 draft as long as they have the three worst 
records. Anaheim and Miami will choose no lower than fourth and fifth. The 
expansion franchises will move up in the draft should either San Jose, 
Tampa Bay or Ottawa not finish in the bottom three positions.
        The two new teams will pick first and second in the 1994 Entry 
Draft, regardless of their finish in 1993-94. Should either of the two new 
teams not play next season they would have priority drafting position in 
1994.

        The owners announced the 1994 draft will be in Hartford and the 
1995 draft in Winnipeg. The 1994 draft was scheduled for Boston, but a 
delay in the construction of a new arena required the draft be moved.

-----
 
- League news:

Disputes:

  The NHL owners and players have resolved differences over salary 
arbitration procedures, clearing the way for about 40 hearings.  NHLPA 
executive director Bob Goodenow didn't disclose how the issues were 
resolved, but the prior sticking point had been the manner in which 
statistics were used in arbitration hearings.

Olympics:

  The NHL announced February 26, 1993, it will not make professional 
players available to compete in the 1994 Winter Olympics.

League Leadership:

        Los Angeles Kings owner Bruce McNall succeeded Blackhawks owner 
Bill Wirtz as chairman of the NHL's powerful Board of Governors. Appointed 
to join McNall on the Executive Committee were Ron Corey of the Montreal 
Canadiens, Mike Ilitch of the Detroit Red Wings, Peter Pocklington of the 
Edmonton Oilers and Ed Snider of the Philadelphia Flyers.

        Gary Bettman, vice president and general counsel of the National 
Basketball Association, was named commissioner of the National Hockey 
League, Friday, December 11, 1992.

Miscellaneous:

        Henri Richard, Bernie Parent and Billy Smith have been named 
special ambassadors for the Stanley Cup Centennial, a season-long 
celebration of the NHL championship trophy. The trio will appear at 
league-wide function such as the All-Star Game and Stanley Cup playoffs.

        The National Hockey League named John N. Turner, former Prime 
Minister of Canada, to serve on Board of Directors of Hockey Hall of Fame 
and Museum and nominated Scotty Morrison, David M. Taylor, Larry Bertuzzi, 
Robert G. Bundy, Walter Bush, Murray Costello, Jim Gregory, Leslie Kaplan, 
Lawrence G. Meyer and Alan Tonks to serve on Board, which takes office 
March 30.

  NHL President Gil Stein was one of four individuals elected to the 
Hockey Hall of Fame Builder's category. The others were Buffalo Sabres' 
Chairman of the Board and President Seymour Knox III, Vancouver Canucks' 
Chairman Frank Griffiths and veteran Canadian hockey executive Fred Page. 
Former NHL linesman John D'Amico was selected in the Hall of Fame's 
Referee-Linesman category.

-----
 
- NHL TV

 Games are carried on TSN and CBC in Canada, on ESPN in the U.S.  Check 
your local listings.

        The National Hockey League has struck a conditional five-year deal 
with ESPN to televise professional hockey through the 1996-97 season.
        The series of agreements grants ESPN exclusive national coverage 
of the NHL starting with the 1992-93 season, and the cable network has an 
option to extend the term of that domestic agreement for four more years. 
The deal also grants ESPN exclusive international television distribution, 
excluding Canada, for the next five years.
        The league's new TV contract calls for ESPN to televise up to 25 
regular-season games to its domestic audience this coming season and 37 
playoff games, including the entire Stanley Cup Final. The majority of 
ESPN's regular-season games will be televised on Friday nights.

        NHL Commissioner Gary Bettman announced Wednesday, March 3, that 
ABC Sports will televise five Stanley Cup playoff games starting next 
month. ABC will carry the playoff games on its network through an 
arrangement with ESPN, the U.S. rightsholder for NHL games. ESPN will 
provide the production of the games. ABC owns ESPN.
  April 18 - Wales Conference Game #1 Quarterfinals
  April 25 - Campbell Conference Game #4 Quarterfinals
  May 2 - Wales Conference Game #1 Semifinals
  May 9 - Campbell Conference Game #4 Semifinals
  May 16 - Wales Conference Game #1 Finals

-----
 
- Award winners, all-star teams, hall of fame inductees, and draft picks
 
 91-92 Award Winners:
 Hart Trophy (MVP): Mark Messier (NYR)
 Vezina Trophy (best goalie): Patrick Roy (Mon)
 Norris Trophy (best defenseman): Brian Leetch (NYR)
 Calder Trophy (best rookie): Pavel Bure (Van)
 Selke Trophy (best defensive forward): Guy Carbonneau (Mon)
 Lady Byng Trophy (sportsmanship): Wayne Gretzky (LA)
 Jack Adams Award (best coach): Pat Quinn (Van)
 Bill Masterton Memorial Trophy (perseverance): Mark Fitzpatrick (NYI)
 King Clancy Trophy (contribution to community): Ray Bourque (Bos)
 Jennings Trophy (lowest team GAA): Patrick Roy (Mon)
 Art Ross Trophy (most scoring points): Mario Lemieux (Pit)

        Hall of Famer players Frank Boucher and Red Dutton and executives 
Bruce McNall and Gil Stein Thursday were named the 1993 winners of the 
Lester Patrick Award for ``outstanding service to hockey in the United 
States''. The award is selected each year by a committee representing a 
wide cross-section of the hockey community.

 91-92 1st All-Star Team: Patrick Roy (G, Mon), Ray Bourque (D, Bos), 
Brian Leetch (D, NYR), Mark Messier (C, NYR), Brett Hull (RW, StL), Kevin 
Stevens (LW, Pit)

 92-93 All-Star Game Starters (as voted by fans):
Wales Conference: Mario Lemieux (C, Pittsburgh), Jaromir Jagr (W, 
Pittsburgh), Kevin Stevens (W, Pittsburgh), Ray Bourque (D, Boston), Brian 
Leetch (D, Rangers), Patrick Roy, (G, Montreal).
Campbell Conference: Steve Yzerman (C, Detroit), Brett Hull (W, St. 
Louis), Pavel Bure (W, Vancouver), Chris Chelios (D, Chicago), Paul Coffey 
(D, Los Angeles), Ed Belfour (G, Chicago)

 91-92 All-rookie team: Gilbert Dionne (LW, Mon), Tony Amonte (RW, NYR), 
Kevin Todd (C, NJ), Vladimir Konstantinov (D, Det), Nicklas Lidstrom (D, 
Det), Dominik Hasek (G, Chi).

 1992 Hall of Fame Inductees: Marcel Dionne, Bob Gainey, Lanny McDonald, 
and Woody Dumart.

 First round of the 1992 entry draft:
  # Player (pos, team)
  1 Roman Hamrlik (D, TB)
  2 Alexei Yashin (C, Ott)
  3 Mike Rathje (D, SJ)
  4 Todd Warriner (LW, Que)
  5 Darius Kasparaitis (D, NYI)
  6 Cory Stillman (C, Cal)
  7 Ryan Sittler (LW, Phi)
  8 Brandon Convery (C, Tor)
  9 Robert Petrovicky (C, Har)
 10 Andrei Nazarov (LW, SJ)
 11 David Cooper (D, Buf)
 12 Sergei Krivokrasov (LW, Chi)
 13 Joe Hulbig (LW, Edm)
 14 Sergei Gonchar (D, Was)
 15 Jason Bowen (LW, Phi)
 16 Dmitri Kvartalnov (LW, Bos)
 17 Sergei Bautin (D, Win)
 18 Jason Smith (D, NJ)
 19 Martin Straka (C, Pit)
 20 David Wilkie (D, Mon)
 21 Libor Polasek (C, Van)
 22 Curtis Bowen (LW, Det)
 23 Grant Marshall (RW, Tor)
 24 Peter Ferraro (C, NYR)

-----

- New NHL Rules

 Game ejection for instigating a fight.
 Helmets are optional.
 Grabbing an opponent's stick as a defensive move is a penalty.
 Diving to draw a penalty is a penalty.
 Coincidental minors when both teams are full-strength result in 4 vs. 4 
play.
 High sticking is from the waist up.

 - New CBA - ratified by NHLPA on 4/11/92
 
 Term: September 16, 1991 to September 15, 1993.
 
 Licensing and endorsements: Players own exclusive rights to their 
individual personality, including their likenesses.
 
 Salary arbitration: New rules negotiated; 8 salary arbitrators to be 
jointly agreed upon.
 
 Free agency: Compensation scale reduced for players age 30 and under. 
Group III free agent age reduced to 30 from 31. A player who has completed 
10 or more professional seasons (minor or NHL) and who in last year of 
contract didn't earn more than the average NHL salary, can elect once in 
his career to become an unrestricted free agent at the end of his 
contract.
 
 Salary and awards: Players' playoff fund increased to $7.5M in 1991-92 & 
$9M in 92-93. New minimum salary of $100,000.
 
 Insurance: $200,000 disability coverage. Dental & broad-based medical 
improvements. 100% increase in life insurance for players; coverage for 
wives.
 
 Pension: Improved pension contributions of $8000 to $12500 per player per 
year, depending on the player's number of NHL games. Agreement on language 
to guarantee continuation of Security Plan negotiated in 1986.
 
 Regular season: Increased from 80 to 84 games in 92-93. For 2 games 
played at neutral sites, all arrangements and revenues to be shared.
 
 Rosters: Kept at 18 skaters and 2 goaltenders for 92-93.
 
 Entry draft: Reduced to 11 rounds from 12.
 
 Supplemental draft: One selection for each non-playoff team.
 
 Joint study group: Examine financial state of NHL & issue report to 
assist in preparing for 1993 negotiations

-----
 
 NHL free agency categories (effective until 9/15/93)

 Group I:
  - players aged 24 and under
  - player's choice of player equalization or draft pick compensation
  - for compensation, old club has right to match offer from new club
  - for equalization, old club has no right to match offer
  - equalization, which can consist of players, draft picks, and/or cash,
    must be agreed upon between two clubs or submitted to arbitration

 Group II:
  - players aged 25 to 29
  - player's choice of player equalization or draft pick compensation
  - for equalization, old club has right to match offer only if it is
    at least $351,000
  - for compensation, schedule is:
    one first round pick if player signs for $350,000-$500,000/year
    two first round picks if player signs for $500,000-$1 million/year
    extra first round pick for each additional $1M over $1M/year

 Group III:
  - players aged 30 and over
  - old club gets no compensation, but has right to match offer
  - to receive right to match, old club must make qualifying offer of 15%
    over player's salary in prior season

 Group IV:
  - players considered defected free agents

 Group V:
  - player with 10 years of experience whose salary is below NHL average
    can choose to be a free agent without compensation once in his career.
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
2. NHL Minor Leagues

 The NHL minor leagues are the International Hockey League, the American 
Hockey League and the East Coast Hockey League.  Information on the 
Central Hockey League and the American Hockey Association can be found in 
section 4.

-----
 
 IHL
 
 contacts:
  IHL: Rob Springall <rgs7077@ultb.isc.rit.edu>
  Atlanta Knights: Scott Clarkson <gt3394c@prism.gatech.edu>
  Cincinnati Cyclones: Joseph Combs <jgcombs@uceng.UC.EDU>
  Cleveland Lumberjacks: Rob Gasser <CSRAG@uoft02.utoledo.edu>
  Ft. Wayne Komets: Rob Gasser <CSRAG@uoft02.utoledo.edu>
**
  Milwaukee Admirals: Jason Hanson <jason@studsys.mscs.mu.edu>
  Salt Lake Golden Eagles: Roland Behunin <behunin@logdis1.oo.aflc.af.mil>

  The International Hockey League has granted a franchise to a Las Vegas 
group headed by Henry Stickney for the 1993-1994 season.

**
        The International Hockey League named Bob Chase. voice of the Fort 
Wayne Komets, as the league's broadcaster of the year. The IHL also said 
the annual award, effective next year, will be named in Chase's honor.
        Also honored by the IHL were Jim Loria of the Kansas City Blades 
as marketing director of the year, Shelly Gartner of the Phoenix 
Roadrunners as merchandise manager of the year and Steve Doherty of the 
Kalamazoo Wings as public relations director of the year.

**
        The Atlanta Knights of the International Hockey League announced 
Thursday, April 8, that Manon Rheaume will be the starting goaltender in a 
home game Saturday night, April 10, against the Cincinnati Cyclones. 
Rheaume will become the first female to start in a regular season 
professional hockey game.

**
Fort Wayne -- Announced winger Scott Gruhl will retire at the end of the 
International Hockey League season. Gruhl will join the Muskegon Fury of 
the Colonial League.
**
  The Fort Wayne Komets said they have been told by Winnipeg that the Jets 
will keep a minor league affiliation with Moncton of the American Hockey 
League. There have been reports the Jets would move players from Moncton 
to Fort Wayne next season.

**
  The San Diego Gulls of the International Hockey League set a record with 
their 61st victory, 5-1, over the Salt Lake Golden Eagles. The Gulls (61-
11-8) became the first team in professional hockey to win that many games 
in a season. The 1976-77 Montreal Canadiens won 60 games.

  IHL's 1992 Turner Cup: The Kansas City Blades defeated Muskegon 
Lumberjacks 4 games to 0.

-----
 
 AHL

 contacts:
  AHL: Rob Springall <rgs7077@ultb.isc.rit.edu>
       Bri Farenell <farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu>
       Mark Anania <ananim@rpi.edu>

See Section 5 for newsletter information.

 Atlantic Division: Cape Breton, Fredericton, Halifax, Moncton, St. John's
 Northern Division: Adirondack, Capital District, Providence, New Haven, 
Springfield
 Southern Division: Baltimore, Binghamton, Hershey, Rochester, Utica, 
Hamilton

       The New Haven Senators have been sold by Peter Shipman to the 
Ottawa Senators NHL organization. They are the only Canadian NHL team with 
an American AHL affiliate, and have made it clear they intend to move the 
team to somewhere in the Canadian Atlantic Provinces. This sale and move 
has yet to be approved by the AHL head office, but is expected to pass 
easily at the general meeting in May.
  The Baltimore Skipjacks, the Washington Capitals' American Hockey League 
affliate, will skate next season as the Portland Pirates.
  The Calgary Flames will base their farm team in the AHL in St. John, New 
Brunswick next season.  The team will be called the St. John Blue Flames.
**
  The Fort Wayne Komets of the IHL said they have been told by Winnipeg of 
the NHL that the Jets will keep a minor league affiliation with Moncton of 
the American Hockey League. There have been reports the Jets would move 
players from Moncton to Fort Wayne next season.

  AHL's 1992 Calder Cup: The Adirondack Red Wings beat the St. John's 
Maple Leafs 4 games to 3. The home-ice curse held true as all games in the 
final were won by the visiting team. 
  John Anderson (New Haven) is 1992 winner of Les Cunningham Plaque as AHL 
MVP.
 
-----
 
 ECHL

contacts:
  ECHL, Toledo Storm: Rob Gasser <CSRAG@uoft02.utoledo.edu>

        The Toledo Storm hockey team is asking SeaGate Convention Center 
to consider becoming its host site beginning with the 1994-95 season. The 
Storm, which has played its last two seasons in the Toledo Sports Arena, 
said it asked for 55 dates in the downtown facility. The Storm also has 
been talking with backers of a proposed ice complex in suburban Sylvania 
to become a primary tenant.

 ECHL's 1992 Riley Cup: Hampton Roads beat Louisville 4 games to 0.

See Section 5 for newsletter information.

-----
 
 Minor League Affiliates for NHL teams:
 
 Bos: Providence Bruins (AHL), Johnstown Chiefs (ECHL)
 Buf: Rochester Americans (AHL), Erie Panthers (ECHL)
 Cal: Salt Lake Golden Eagles (IHL), Roanoke Valley Rebels (ECHL)
 Chi: Indianapolis Ice (IHL), Columbus Chill (ECHL), St. Thomas (Col. HL)
 Det: Adirondack Red Wings (AHL), Toledo Storm (ECHL)
 Edm: Cape Breton Oilers (AHL), Winston-Salem Thunderbirds (ECHL)
 Har: Springfield Indians (AHL), Louisville Icehawks (ECHL)
 LA : Phoenix Roadrunners (IHL), Raleigh Icecaps (ECHL)
 Min: Kalamazoo Wings (IHL), Dayton Bombers (ECHL)
 Mon: Fredericton Canadiens (AHL), Winston-Salem Thunderbirds (ECHL), 
Flint (Col. HL)
 NJ : Utica Devils (AHL), Birmingham Bulls (ECHL)
 NYI: Capital District Islanders (AHL), Richmond Renegades (ECHL)
 NYR: Binghamton Rangers (AHL)
 Ott: New Haven Senators (AHL), Thunder Bay (Col. HL)
 Phi: Hershey Bears (AHL)
 Pit: Cleveland Lumberjacks (IHL), Knoxville Cherokees (ECHL)
 Que: Halifax Citadels (AHL), Greensboro Monarchs (ECHL)
 SJ : Kansas City Blades (IHL), Nashville Knights (ECHL)
 StL: Peoria Rivermen (IHL), Dayton Bombers (ECHL), Flint (Col. HL)
 TB : Atlanta Knights (IHL)
 Tor: St. John's Maple Leafs (AHL), Raleigh Icecaps (ECHL), Brantford 
(Col. HL)
 Van: Columbus Chill (ECHL), Hamilton Canucks (AHL)
 Was: Baltimore Skipjacks (AHL), Hampton Roads Admirals (ECHL)
 Win: Moncton Hawks (AHL), Thunder Bay (Col. HL)
 
 Ind: Cincinnati Cyclones (IHL)
      Fort Wayne Komets (IHL)
      Michigan Falcons (Colonial HL)
      Milwaukee Admirals (IHL)
      San Diego Gulls (IHL)
      St. Thomas (Colonial HL)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
3. College Hockey
 
contacts:
  NCAA: Mike Machnik <nin15b34@merrimack.edu>
  Wisconsin Badgers: Jeff Horvath <horvath@cs.wisc.edu>
  CCHA, Bowling Green State: Keith Instone <instone@euclid.bgsu.edu>
  ECAC, Clarkson: Bri Farenell <farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu>

- e-mail lists:
 Wayne Smith <wts@maine.maine.edu> maintains 2 lists, one for discussions 
(HOCKEY-L) and one for news (HOCKEY-D):
 
 send e-mail to <listserv@maine.maine.edu> with body:
 SUBSCRIBE HOCKEY-L <name & favorite team>
 or
 SUBSCRIBE HOCKEY-D <name>
   (a read-only list containing news from HOCKEY-L)

Up-to-date Division I standings and scores can be obtained through the 
archives of the College Hockey Mailing List.  Send a message to the server 
at listserv@maine.maine.edu with the body containing ONLY the commands 
(either or both)

 - ftp site: andy.bgsu.edu
  The directory "pub/Hockey" contains CCHA press releases, scores, 
standings, and rosters. The sub-directory "Archives" has archives of the 
Division I college hockey mailing list since 1989. Also, archives from the 
Division III list since May 1992 are available.

  NCAA hockey championship:
Semi-finals:  Maine 4, Michigan 3 (OT)
              Lake Superior State 6, Boston University 1
Finals:  Maine 5, Lake Superior State 4

  Freshman Paul Kariya who was named winner of the 1992-93 Hobey Baker 
Award as college hockey's top player.

**
  The NCAA Division I Hockey Championships will be held at the St. Paul 
Civic Center in St. Paul, Minnesota, on March 31 and April 2, 1994.
  For priority seating call the University of Minnesota Ticket Office at 
(612) 624-8080, between 8:00 a.m. and 5:00 p.m., Monday through Friday or 
send a postcard to:

University of Minnesota Ticket Office
1994 NCAA Hockey Championships
516 15th Avenue SE
Minneapolis  MN  55455

- NCAA Division I Teams
 
 CCHA (Central Collegiate Hockey Association):
Bowling Green, Ferris State, Illinois-Chicago, Lake Superior, Miami, 
Michigan, Michigan State, Ohio State, Western Michigan, Notre Dame, Kent 
State, Alaska-Fairbanks (affiliate member )
 
        CCHA Playoff structure:  The top 6 will host the bottom 6 (1 vs 
12, 2 vs 11, etc) in a two-of-three weekend series The six winners will 
advance to Joe Louis Arena for single elimination the rest of the way. The 
top 2 remaining seeds get a bye while 3 plays 6 and 4 plays 5 on the first 
night. On the second night, the 4 remaining teams battle it out, leaving 
only two to play for the championship, on the third night. Alaska-
Fairbanks, as an affiliate member, will be seeded from #7 to #12 by the 
league office.

 ECAC (Eastern College Athletic Conference) (men's):
Brown, Clarkson, Colgate, Cornell, Dartmouth, Harvard, Princeton, RPI, St. 
Lawrence, Union, Vermont, Yale

 ECAC (Eastern College Athletic Conference) (women's):
Brown, Colby, Cornell, Dartmouth, Harvard, New Hampshire, Northeastern, 
Princeton, Providence, Rochester Institute of Technology, St. Lawrence, 
Yale

        The Eastern Collegiate Athletic Conference unveiled the nation's 
first intercollegiate women's ice hockey league and announced the 12 teams 
will begin play in the 1993-94 season. The top eight finishers in the ECAC 
Women's Ice Hockey League will qualify for a post-season tournament. The 
league replaces an informal 15-team conference of nine Division I and six 
Division III schools, which held their own respective division tournaments 
at the end of the regular season. The ECAC said it would discontinue its 
Division III women's tournament after the 1992-93 season.

 Hockey East:
Boston College, Boston University, UMass-Lowell, Maine, Merrimack, New 
Hampshire, Northeastern, Providence
 
 WCHA (Western Collegiate Hockey Association):
Colorado College, Denver, Michigan Tech, Minnesota, Minnesota-Duluth, 
North Dakota, Northern Michigan, St Cloud, Wisconsin
 
Alaska-Anchorage has joined the WCHA as a full-fledged member for 93-94
 
 Independents:
Air Force, Alabama-Huntsville, Alaska-Anchorage, Alaska-Fairbanks, Army

-----

 - Canadian Intercollegiate Athletic Union

 CIAU Championships:
 Finalists:
 Team:                                         Division:
 University of Alberta Golden Bears            West
 University of Guelph Gryphons                 Ontario West
 University of Toronto Varsity Blues           Ontario East
 University of Acadia Axemen                   East

 Semi-finals:  Acadia 9, Alberta 4
               Toronto 3, Guelph  2
 Finals:  Acadia 12, Toronto 1

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
4. Other Hockey Leagues
 
 - 1992 World Championships in Czechoslovakia
 
 Sweden defeated Finland 5-2 (gold medal match)
 Czechoslovakia defeated Switzerland 5-2 (bronze medal match)
 
 Final Standings (round robin):
 
 GROUP A   W T L  GF GA Pts   GROUP B  W T L  GF GA PTS
 Finland   5 0 0  32  8  10   Russia   4 1 0  23 10   9
 Germany   4 0 1  30 14   8   Czech    4 0 1  18  7   8
 USA       2 1 2  14 15   5   Switz    2 2 1  12 11   6
 Sweden    1 2 2  14 12   4   Canada   2 1 2  15 18   5
 Italy     1 1 3  10 18   3   Norway   1 0 4   8 16   2
 Poland    0 0 5   8 41   0   France   0 0 5   8 22   0
 
 Austria will replace Poland in Pool A of 1993 WC in Germany
 
  The 1993 World Championships (Pool A) is scheduled to run from Apr 18 to 
May 2 in Munich, Germany.

-----
**
 - 1993 World Championships (Pool B) in Eindhoven, the Netherlands

                    #g    w l t    pts      gf    ga
1. Great Britain     7    7 0 0    14       50    13
2. Poland            7    6 1 0    12       71    12
3. Netherlands       7    5 2 0    10       47    20
4. Denmark           7    4 3 0     8       38    24
5. Japan             7    3 4 0     6       34    31
6. Romania           7    2 5 0     4       20    44
7. China             7    1 6 0     2       12    79
8. Bulgaria          7    0 7 0     0        9    58

Great Britain advances to Pool A.  Bulgaria is relegated to Pool C.

-----
 
 - 1992 Olympic Games
**
- e-mail lists:
 Charlie Slavin <slavin@maine.maine.edu> maintains OlymPuck - The Olympic 
Hockey Discussion List:
 
 send e-mail to <listserv@maine.maine.edu> with body:
SUBSCRIBE   OlymPuck   your_name   favorite country(ies)

 CIS won the gold, Canada the silver, and Czechoslovakia the bronze 
(defeated USA).
 
 Yale hockey coach Tim Taylor was named coach for the '94 US Olympic Team.
 
 Dany Dube from the UQTR Patriotes (CIAU) and Tom Renney from the Kamloops 
Blazers (WHL) are co-coaches of Canada's national program.

     The 1998 Nagano Winter Olympic Organizing Committee said it has 
approved the addition of women's ice hockey and curling to the list of 
official medal events at the Games.  The decision, which came at the 
organizing committee meeting here, followed an accord reached in Nagano 
between the committee and the IOC Coordination Committee.  The decision 
will be formally ratified by an Executive Board meeting of the 
International Olympic Committee (IOC) and its Session.  As a result, the 
number of total events at Nagano will increase to 64 in seven sports.

-----
 
- 1991 Canada Cup
 
 Team Canada defeated Team USA 2 games to 0.
 
-----

 - 1992 Izvestia hockey tournament

 Final:  Russia II - Czechoslovakia  2-1
 Game for 3rd and 4th place:  Russia I - Sweden  4-1
 Game for 5th and 6th place:  Finland - Switzerland  3-1
 Game for 7th and 8th place:  Canada - Germany  6-1

 Final Standings for the 25th Izvestia Cup:
  1. Russia II (the Russian Olympic team)
  2. Czechoslovakia
  3. Russia I
  4. Sweden
  5. Finland
  6. Switzerland
  7. Canada
  8. Germany

-----

- 1992 Germany Cup

        Russia defeated Team Canada 6-3 to win the $170,000 four-team 
Germany Cup for the third time. The Russian team, coached for the first 
time by the legendary Boris Michailov, assured itself of the $67,000 
winner's check after a 3-1 win over Czechoslovakia. The former Soviet 
Union and Commonwealth of Independent States captured the tournament in 
1988 and 1991 under Viktor Tikhonov.

-----

- 1992 Spengler Cup

        Canada, with Fabian Joseph scoring his second goal of the game at 
3:47 of overtime, beat Farjestad (Sweden) 6-5 in the final of the Spengler 
Cup at Davos, Switzerland. The Canadians overcame a two-goal deficit in 
the final two minutes of regulation and went on to earn their second 
overtime victory within 15 hours.

 Final:

 Team Canada - Farjestad (Sweden)  6-5 (1-1,2-2,2-2,1-0)  OT

-----

- 1992 European cup finals

Duesseldorf, December 30, 1992

Bronze:  Jokerit Helsinki - Lions Milano 4-2.

Gold:  Malmoe IF - Dynamo Moscow 4-3 (Shootout)

  This was the third successive European championship for a Swedish team: 
in 1990 and 1991 the champion was Djurgaarden (Stockholm).

-----

- 1993 Sweden Hockey Games
**
 Final Standings:

                     GP  W T L  GF-GA      P
 1. Sweden            3  2 0 1  13- 8  +5  4
 2. Czech Republic    3  2 0 1  16-11  +5  4
 3. Russia            3  1 1 1   9-11  -2  3
 4. Canada            3  0 1 2  13-21  -8  1

 Sweden wins due to head-to-head result vs the Czech republic.

-----
 
- Junior Leagues
 
 contact:
  WHL: Randy Coulman <coulman@skdad.usask.ca>
       Mitch McGowan <hamlet@u.washington.edu>

        The site for the 75th Memorial Cup Tournament has yet to be 
chosen.  It will be staged in Ontario but the exact location won't be 
determined until next spring.
        In March of '93, the two regular-season division champions from 
the Ontario Hockey League will meet in a best-of-seven series at the start 
of the playoff season.  The winner of the series earns the right to host 
the Memorial Cup, traditionally held in May.
        The eventual OHL champion will also participate in the tourney. 
But if the league champs also happen to be the club hosting the Memorial 
Cup, then the league finalists will advance as well."

 Charles Poulin (Mon draft) of St-Hyacinthe (QMJHL) is '92 Canadian Hockey 
League Player of the Year.
 
 1992 Memorial Cup at Seattle
 
 Round-robin standings              W  L  GF  GA
 Sault Ste. Marie Greyhounds (OHL)  3  0  14   8
 Kamloops Blazers (WHL)             2  1  10   7
 Seattle Thunderbirds (WHL host)    1  2   9  10
 Verdun College Francais (QMJHL)    0  3   5  13 
 
 Semifinal   Kamloops 8  Seattle 3
 Final       Kamloops 5  Sault Ste. Marie 4
 
-----

 - Central Hockey League
 
 contact:
  Marc Foster <mfoster@metgem.gcn.uoknor.edu>
              <mfoster@alliant.backbone.uoknor.edu>
  Ted Wollnik <twollnik@rdxsun11.aud.alcatel.com>

See Section 5 for newsletter information.

 CHL:
Fort Worth Fire, Wichita Thunder, Dallas Freeze, Tulsa Oilers, Memphis 
River Kings, Oklahoma City Blazers

  Six non-affiliated teams play a 60 game schedule extending from early 
November to mid March. Each team is owned by the league, with local 
interests controlling day to day operations. Each team has a $100,000 
salary cap for 17 total players (16 dress up). Unlike the ECHL, players 
are not limited to three years in the league.
  A Western Division may be added to the Central Hockey League for the 93-
94 season if the plans of CHL president Ray Miron materialize.  Miron 
confirmed that El Paso, Amarillo, Tuscon, and Albuquerque are cities under 
consideration for the Western Division, which would play some interlocking 
games with the Eastern Division.  Meanwhile, San Antonio and Houston are 
close to being confirmed as the league's newest members.

-----

 - Major League Hockey
 
        A new hockey league with franchises throughout the United States 
and Canada will begin play in the fallof 1993, officials announced 
Wednesday, February 10.
        Major League Hockey was founded by Roy Boe, former president of 
the New York Islanders of the National Hockey League and the New York/New 
Jersey Nets of the American and National Basketball associations.
        According to Boe, the league will debut with six to eight teams 
playing a schedule of approximately 80 games. Franchise applications have 
been received from groups in Chicago, Cleveland, Dallas, Denver, Detroit, 
Houston, Minneapolis-St. Paul, Phoenix, San Francisco, Saskatoon, Toronto 
and Worcester, Mass., Boe said.
        Although the league will not raid existing leagues to stock its 
rosters, Boe said it will seek the ``world's finest hockey players.''
        Boe said league play will have an international flair and 
discussed implementing some rules which are reminiscent of those of the 
IIHF.
        ``We're removing the red line, moving the goal nets forward and 
eliminating all tie games,'' said Boe.
        The MLH office will operate out of Stamford, Conn.

-----
 
- British Premier Division:
 
 contacts:
  Neil A. McGlynn: <nmcglynn@axion.bt.co.uk> (from NA)
                   <nmcglynn@uk.co.bt.axion> (from Europe)
  Steve Salvini: <steve@cs.hw.ac.uk>
 
 Contact Steve for the GB USENET draft.

 e-mail list: send e-mail to <uk-hockey-request@cee.hw.ac.uk> to 
subscribe.

 Durham Wasps defeated Nottingham Panthers 7-6 in '92 British championship 
game.
 
-----
 
- Finnish Elite League (SM-LIIGA):

 contacts:
  Juha Koivisto & Kimmo Kauranen  <hockey@tac.fi>
  Vesa J Pyyluoma <veikko@vipunen.hut.fi>

Final standings 91-92:
  1) Jokerit, Helsinki 2) JyP HT, Jyvaskyla  3) HIFK, Helsinki
  4) Assat, Pori       5) TPS, Turku         6) Lukko, Rauma
  7) KalPa, Kuopio     8) HPK, Hameenlinna   9) Ilves, Tampere
  10) Reipas, Lahti   11) Tappara, Tampere  12) JoKP, Joensuu
  JoKP dropped and Kiekko-Espoo from Espoo qualified to the SM-LIIGA

Individual stats leaders 91-92:
  Points:  Makela Mikko, TPS      25+45=70   (+ playoffs:  2+3=5 )
  Scoring: Selanne Teemu, Jokerit 39+23=62   (+ playoffs: 10+7=17)

All Stars 91-92:
  Briza Petr (Lukko),  Virta Hannu (TPS),  Laurila Harri (JyP HT),
  Makela Mikko (TPS),  Janecky Otakar (Jokerit),  Selanne Teemu (Jokerit)

-----
 
- German Hockey League:
 
 contact:
  Andreas Stockmeier <stocki@cs.tu-berlin.de> or <stocki@tub.UUCP>
 
 Duesseldorfer Eishockey-Gemeinschaft defeated SB Rosenheim in '92 German 
final

-----

 - Swedish Elite League (Elitserien):

 contact:
  Staffan Axelsson <etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se>

**
 1992-93 regular season final standings:
 1. Vasteras      2. Brynas        3. Malmo         4. Farjestad
 5. MoDo          6. Lulea         7. Leksand       8. Djurgarden
 9. HV 71        10. Rogle        11. Frolunda     12. AIK

 Brynas defeated Lulea 3 games to 2 for the 1993 Swedish hockey 
championship.

-----
 
 - Swiss First Division:

 Kloten became the 1992-93 champions of the Swiss League Nationale A
by beating Fribourg-Gotteron 4-2 to sweep the final series 3-0.

-----
 
 - 1992 Women's World Championships at Finland
  1 Canada, 2 USA, 3 Finland, 4 Sweden, 5 China, 6 Norway, 7 Denmark, 
  8 Switzerland
 
-----

 1993 World Junior Hockey Championships at Sweden

 Final Standings:

                   GP  W T L  GF-GA  +/-   P
 1. Canada          7  6 0 1  37-17  +20  12
 2. Sweden          7  6 0 1  53-15  +38  12
 3. Czechoslovakia  7  4 1 2  38-27  +11   9
 4. USA             7  4 0 3  32-23  + 9   8
 5. Finland         7  3 1 3  31-20  +11   7
 6. Russia          7  2 2 3  26-20  + 6   6
 7. Germany         7  1 0 6  16-37  -21   2
 8. Japan           7  0 0 7   9-83  -74   0

 Canada wins gold due to head-to-head result vs Sweden.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
5. Info available via e-mail

  When requesting items via e-mail please include your preferred address 
in the body of the message.  Sometimes the reply-to address is not a good 
thing to go by.

 - ftp site: wuarchive.wustl.edu (128.252.135.4)
        In directory /doc/misc/sports/nhl there are some new hockey files.
        Get the README file for information and contents.

---

 - E-mail lists:
 
 List Topic (Freq.)                      To Subscribe
 Boston Bruins                           bruins-request@cs.Usask.CA
     List Address                        bruins@cs.Usask.CA
 Buffalo Sabres                          sabres-request@potter.csh.rit.edu
     List Address                        sabres@potter.csh.rit.edu
 Los Angeles Kings                       kings-request@cs.stanford.edu
     List Address                        kings@cs.stanford.edu
**
 Montreal Canadiens                      habs-request@janus.sdsu.edu
     List Address                        habs@janus.sdsu.edu
 Philadelphia Flyers                     seth@hos1cad.att.com
 Pittsburgh Penguins                     gp2f+@andrew.cmu.edu
     List Address                        gp2f@andrew.cmu.edu
 St. Louis Blues                         jca2@cec1.wustl.edu
 San Jose Sharks                         sharks-request@medraut.apple.com
     List Address                        sharks@medraut.apple.com
 Tampa Bay Lightning                     wilson@cs.ucf.edu
 Vancouver Canucks                       boey@sfu.ca
     List Address                        vancouver-canucks@sfu.ca
 Washington Capitals                     david@eng.umd.edu
     List Address                        caps@monster.umd.edu
 NHL Boxscores (M-F)                     bks@cbnewsh.cb.att.com
 NHL Boxscores (S-S)                     jpc@philabs.philips.com
 NHL Goalie Stats (d)                    coulman@cs.Usask.CA
 NHL Scores (n)                          wilson@cs.ucf.edu
 NHL Team Stats (w)                      wilson@cs.ucf.edu
 AHL Newsletter                          ahl-news-request@hamlet.cmu.edu
     List Address                        ahl-news@hamlet.cmu.edu
 ECHL Newsletter                         echl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu
     List Address                        echl-news@andrew.cmu.edu
 US College Hockey                       (see section 3)
 NCAA Division III Hockey                hockey3-request@hooville.mitre.org
     List Address                        hockey3@request.mitre.org
 CHL Newsletter                          mfoster@geohub.gcn.uoknor.edu
 British League                          uk-hockey-request@uk.ac.hw.cs
**
Olympic Hockey                           (see section 4)

 Freq: M-F=Monday-Friday, S-S=Saturday-Sunday, d=daily, n=nightly, 
w=weekly
 
 If you have something interesting, make it available. When requesting, 
use the keyword in the body or subject. Also, specify team, date, etc., 
where applicable.
 
 Available from Eric Rickin <ab870@cleveland.freenet.edu>:
 Keyword    Description
 AHLADDR    AHL team addresses
 CANJUNIORS Canada junior teams
 NHLTV      TV stations for each team
 NHLRADIO   Radio stations for each team
 USJUNIORS  US junior teams
 XXXXDRAFT  XXXX (for XXXX=1989-1992) NHL Entry Draft
 1991EXP    1991 NHL Expansion & Dispersal Draft
 
 Available from Rob Springall <rgs7077@ultb.isc.rit.edu>:
 Keyword    Description
 AHL        Up-to-date info on the AHL
 IHL        Up-to-date info on the IHL
 NHL.C      A C program that prints the 91-92 NHL schedule for a specified 
            day
 
 Available from Stan Willis <willis@empire.dnet.hac.com>:
 Keyword    Description
 ATTEND     91-92 NHL team home attendance report by quarters
 PSLOGOS    NHL team logos in PostScript
 
 Available from David Anthony Wyatt <wyatt@ccu.umanitoba.ca>:
 Keyword    Description
 ALLLIST    All-time List of Professional Hockey Franchises
 
 Available from Roland Behunin <behunin@logdis1.oo.aflc.af.mil>:
 Keyword    Description
 SATINFO    Satellite info for NHL teams
 
 Available from Mike Machnik <nin15b34@merrimack.edu>:
 Keyword    Description
 DIV1SCHED  92-93 NCAA Division I scores
 Mike can also provide a schedule for any of the 46 Division I teams to 
people who ask.  E-mail him for details.

 Available from Bill Clare <Clare@Kodak.COM>:
 Keyword    Description
 RETIRED    List of retired numbers for NHL players
 
 Available from Staffan Axelsson <etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se>:
 Keyword    Description
 WCMEDALS   World Championships Medalists 1920-1992
 WCSTAND    World Championships All-Time Standings, Pool A 1920-1992
 WCALSTAR   World Championships All-Star Teams 1961-1992
 WCROSTXX   World Championships Gold Winning Teams' Rosters 1958-1992 
            (Specify XX=58-92)
 WJHC       History of medals given at the World Junior Hockey 
            Championships
 WJHCSTAT   Team and player stats from the World Junior Hockey 
            Championships.

 Available from Paul Brownlow <paul@data-io.com>:
 Keyword    Description
 CHLPOY     Past Canadian Hockey League players of the year
 MEMCUP     Past Memorial Cup winners

 Available from <wilson@cs.ucf.edu>:
 To use the statsmailer, send e-mail to "wilson@cs.ucf.edu" with subject 
"statsmailer" and a body containing the word HELP to receive a list of 
allowable commands. Things available: NHL team/league schedules/calendars, 
a plethora of team statistics, scores of games, and some assorted hockey 
files. Seasons 1988-1992 available. New material was added on 1/19/93.

 Available from Mitch McGowan <hamlet@u.washington.edu>
 Keyword    Description
 ROSTERS    1993 NHL All-Star Game rosters
 NHLLEAD    1991-92 NHL Leaders (Scoring, Goals, Assists, Power-play 
            goals, Short-handed goals, Game-winning goals, Shots, Goals-
            against average, Victories, Save percentage, Shutouts)
 ZAMBONI    Alan Thicke's "Book of Zamboni" opening from the 1991 NHL  
            Awards broadcast

 Available from Matt Militzok <mmilitzo@skidmore.edu>
 Keyword    Description
 STATS      Up-to-date NHL statistics

 Available from Harry Peltz <hbpeltz@mailbox.syr.edu>
 Keyword    Description
 SCORES     Compilation of NHL scores for the current month (in compressed 
and uuencoded format)
Dates can also be specified for specific box scores, but try not to 
request too many at one time (Max 5 box scores or three days).

 Available from Richard Stueven <gak@wrs.com>
 Keyword    Description
 DIRECT     Current NHL directory file

 Available from Michael Burger <mmb@lamar.colostate.edu>
 Keyword    Description
 TVINFO     TV/Radio stations for all teams along with network 
            information.

Up-to-date Division I standings and scores can be obtained through the 
archives of the College Hockey Mailing List.  Send a message to the server 
at listserv@maine.maine.edu with the body containing ONLY the commands 
(either or both)

GET 9293CONF STAND (for all Division I conference standings)
GET 9293COMP SCHEDULE (for a full-season listing of Division I scores)

The schedule is about 1000 lines long and the standings file is about 50 
lines.  These files are updated more-or-less weekly around Monday.  
Contact Mike Machnik (nin15b34@merrimack.edu) with any questions.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
6. USENET Hockey Pool
 
 send e-mail to <andrew@idacom.hp.com>.
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
 7. Up-coming Dates

 Apr 18 - May 2: The 1993 World Championships (Pool A), Munich, Germany.
 Jun 26: NHL entry draft, Quebec City, Quebec.
 Feb 12 - Feb 27, 1994: XVII Olympic Winter Games, Lillehammer, Norway.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
 8. Answers to some frequently asked questions:
 
 Q: Why are the Montreal Canadiens called the Habs?
 A: Most of the team during the 40-50's was made up of people who lived in 
and around Montreal. Hence they were called "Les Habitants" (natives of 
Montreal). This was then shortened to the Habs.
 
 Q: Why is the Montreal Canadiens logo a large C with an H within it?
 A: In 1914-15, the Canadiens logo consisted of C with an A within it to 
signify Club Athletique Canadien (CAC). The next year, CAC no longer 
existed and it was changed to what it is now to signify Club de Hockey.

 Q: What is the most informative hockey publication?
 A: The Hockey News is preferred by most North American hockey fans. It is 
a weekly journal with up-to-date info.
Phone: 800-268-7793 (Canada and US)
Phone/fax: 0483 776141 (UK and rest of Europe)
 
 Q: How does a 5-minute power-play count in the penalty killing stats in 
the NHL?
 A: If X goals are scored, then the team gets credit for X goals in X+1 
chances.
 
 Q: How is +/- computed in the NHL?
 A: First, +/- only applies to skaters. Except for a power-play goal, when 
a goal is scored, each skater on the ice for the scoring team is given a 
+, and each skater on the ice for the other team is given a -. Short-
handed goals do count for +/-.
 
 Q: What is the five-hole?
 A: The space between a goalie's pads. There are five major scoring zones: 
(1) upper left corner of goal, (2) upper right, (3) lower left, (4) lower 
right, and (5) five-hole.
 
 Q: What is the meaning of throwing an octopus on the ice?
 A: This tradition began in Detroit in the 1950's when two best-of-seven 
series were required to win the Stanley Cup. Every time Detroit won a 
game, an octopus with one less arm was thrown on the ice.

 Q: Who was the first woman to play in an NHL game?
 A: Manon Rheaume, a 20-year-old goaltender, became the first woman ever 
to play in an NHL game on September 23, 1992 when she started in net for 
the expansion Tampa Bay Lightning in an exhibition against the St. Louis 
Blues. Rheaume played the first period before 8,223 at the 10,400-seat 
Expo Hall on the Florida State Fairgrounds and allowed two goals on nine 
shots. She left with the score tied 2-2, although the Lightning ultimately 
lost the game, 6-4.

 Q: What is the richest contract in NHL history?
 A: Mario Lemieux, the superstar center of the Pittsburgh Penguins, signed 
the richest contract in NHL history, a seven-year deal believed to be 
worth about $42 million. Lemieux will earn between $6 million and $7 
million a year, nearly twice as much as any other player in the league.

 Q: Who is the new commissioner of the NHL?
 A: Gary Bettman, vice president and general counsel of the National 
Basketball Association, was named commissioner of the National Hockey 
League, Friday, December 11, 1992. Bettman joined the NBA in 1981 as 
assistant general counsel. He became the league's chief legal officer in 
September of 1984. A New York resident, Bettman graduated from Cornell 
University in 1974 and from New York University School of Law in 1977.

 Q: How many professional hockey leagues are there in North America?
 A: Six:  National, American, International, East Coast, Central and 
Colonial Hockey Leagues.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
9. Miscellaneous:
 
 For field hockey discussions, go to the newsgroup rec.sport.hockey.field.
 For skating discussions, go to the newsgroup rec.skate.
 
 Some sites get another hockey group, called clari.sports.hockey. c.s.h 
consists of the UPI feed for all UPI news articles that are related to 
hockey, including game results, summaries, scores, standings, etc.  Much 
of the information in the NHL team news section comes from this newsgroup.
 
  The rec.sport.hockey Frequently Asked Questions posting is posted semi-
monthly, usually on the 1st and 15th of each month, during the hockey 
season.  This file was originally created by Tom Wilson, who posted it 
during the 1991-92 season.  It was taken over by Mitch McGowan for the 
1992-93 season.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
  Please make corrections via e-mail, indicating "r.s.h FAQ" as the 
subject line. Feel free to start a discussion on any previously mentioned 
topic (but use an appropriate subject line).
 
Mitch McGowan <hamlet@u.washington.edu>

1



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53521
From: Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Barasso - the cheap shot master?

After watching the Pengiuns all year (and as many other teams as
possible), I've really noticed an increase in Tom Barasso's cheap shots
this year (and not noticed a corrsponding increase with other
goaltenders). I've also noticed that he usually gets away with it. Just
as examples last night, I noticed him elbowing Scott Stevens in the
head, which basically started the whole shoving match that got Stevens
(Scott) and Tocchet 2 minute minors. He also KICKED John McLean. Of
course he wasn't called for that. Isn't kicking an automatic match
penalty and 10 game suspension? I think Glenn Anderson got one a few
years ago for kicking Gaetan Duchesne in the chest. There's no doubt in
my mind that Barasso is the dirtiest golatender since Hextall. He's also
very good.

How about that Tocchet head-butt? Is there an automatic susppension that
goes along with a (non-kicking) match penalty? I can't remember anymore.

Oh, the playoffs should be fun,
Ralph


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53522
From: Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: How to beat Pittsburgh!

from Anna Matyas:
>>Now if we could just clone Chelios's personality and transplant it
>>into all of the defensemen on the Islanders, Capitals, and Devils...
>> 
>>Gerald
> 
>In other words, you want to turn them all into assholes so they
>will spend lots of time in the penalty box and get lots of
>misconducts?
> 
>And this comes from a Chelios fan...

Yeah, and also be second in the team in scoring and play about 35
minutes a game and play on the power play and kill penalties and be the
best defenseman in the league. I'd take a whole team of Chelioses if I
could. (That way, when one got a penalty the others could kill it!)

Ralph


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53523
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: Re: Bruins-Pens: the Ulf-Neeley fight

mattb@hawk.samsung.com (Matt Brown) writes:
[more about the Messier-Samuelsson incident]
>While this is true, strictly speaking, it was the Rocksteady replicant who
>initially used his stick illegally to measure Messier's ribcage. There is no
>question in my mind, from seeing the replay in slo-mo, that Ulf-2000 was
>coming at Messier with intent-to-"hasta la vista" in mind, and should have
>been gone for that. 
>
 I agree with Rick that Ulf's cross check wasn't illegal. It was the kind
 of check you see a dozen times during a game without being called. Slo-mos
 sometimes have a tendency to make things look worse than they really are.
 Besides, if Messier can't take the heat, he should stay out of the kitchen.

>So Staffan, how is Mattias Timmander doing this year? And any impression
>on Markus Czeriew??? (lost my roster list) on Hammerby? Does it look like
>they will make it to the Eliteserien for next year? And then get stomped
>if Markus goes to Boston?
>
 Well Matt, Mattias Timmander hasn't been playing with the MoDo elite league
 team yet (just the MoDo junior team), so I predict he needs a few more years
 here before he can join the B's. I saw him play in the Swedish championship
 game for junior players this year, and he played very well, a physical game,
 but not the kind of rough stuff that Ulfie does (I suspect you would like to
 have a Ulf type-of-player on the B's team too? :)
 As for Mariusz Czerkawski, he has had a *great* season for Hammarby in
 division 1. He scored -if I remember correctly- 93 points this season,
 and then we have to keep in mind that a 50+ point season in Sweden is
 considered *very good* due to the limited number of games. Mariusz is
 Djurgarden property (he was just on loan to Hammarby), so he will play
 in Elitserien next season, unless the B's can get him of course.
 I would say that Mariusz has to be one of the most exciting player to
 watch in Swedish hockey this season.

 Staffan
--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53524
From: accgsg@vaxa.hofstra.edu (Gary Graffagnino)
Subject: Isles / Hockey Ramblings


	Well, the Patrick Division got a little more interesting last night. 
The Islanders lost in OT and the Devils tied the Pens.  That means if the Isles
beat the Devils on Friday, the will meet the Caps in the playoffs.

	However, I have some more comments on the Islanders and hockey in
general that I need to get off my chest :).  First of all, with the Islanders 
back-to-back lackluster performances against the Whalers, one may think that 
the Islanders are out of shape.  These guys always suck wind in the 2nd period,
come on a little in the 3rd and run out of gas too soon.  It is unbelieveable
how many one goal games these guys have lost.  Anyway, the games was pretty 
wide open.  The Isles still have tons of trouble scoring.  The Whalers played 
a golie in is 1st NHL start, I think his name was Lenarduzzi (sp?).  (His NHL 
debut was the Tuesday tie against the Isles).  Like I mentioned before, this 
guy looked like the best golie on the planet for a while (until he misplayed a 
Mahlakov slap shot to go to OT).  I say it's because the Isles don't shoot 
correctly.  Has anyone else noticed this?

	Also, I think it is really a shame for hockey when I guy like Mick
Vukota gets as much ice time as he does.  This guy has about as much hockey
talent as Jiggs MacDonald (who did play hockey, I think).  Anytime he gets the
puck it gets stolen, and he always starts fights and gets needless penalties. 
Richard Pilon is another guy who is on the ice to stir up crap.  And he's a
defenseman.  He's got to be approaching negative infinity for his plus/minus. 
This guy gets beaten all the time.  Why the need for such "enforcers"?  Not
only do fights slow the game down ALOT, but it takes away from the guys who are
really trying to play the game.  I'll be one of the few to admit, I do enjoy a 
good fight once in a while, but only when it's "called for".  You know, when a
guy checks the goalie too hard.  In other words, a violation of "hockey ethics"
might cause you to get puched.  But there is no need to start crap when you are
losing or becuase you can get away with it!! Does anyone agree that referees
need to be a little less lenient in the 3rd and OT?  I mean COME ON already. 
I'm sick of seeing teams pulling guys down, holding guys etc. just becuase the
referee doesn't call it.  OT and late in the 3rd should be a time for strategy,
not physical prowess.  Trying to set up a goal should be first and foremost. 
If you are so afraid that the other team is going to score that you have to
pull a guy down to prevent it, you don't deserve to win in the first place.

Just My Honest Opinion,

Gary at Hofstra
ACCGSG@VAXB.HOFSTRA.EDU
ACCGSG@HOFSTRA.BITNET

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53525
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: Re: Pens Info needed


Kevin L. Stamber writes:
>If there's anyone who can help me on these items, please
>let me know.
>
>*  Markus Naslund -- I saw that MoDo lost early in the National
>                     tournament and that he was playing for the national
>                     team at the World Championships.  Any stats
>                     available?  Any word on how he's playing?  When
>                     is he expected to join the club?  
>

 Markus had a good season in MoDo in the Swedish elite league, scoring
 22 goals, 17 assists, 39 points and 67 PIM in 39 games.

 As Daryl points out, Markus won't be joining the Pens for this year's
 playoffs, since the World Championships starts April 18th.

 But there is a good chance that Markus will join the Pens before next
 season. MoDo, though, naturally wants to keep their superstars Forsberg
 and Naslund, so the latest news on this is that MoDo is looking for
 personal sponsors for Forsberg and Naslund in order to match the kind
 of money they would receive in NHL.

Daryl Turner writes:
>By 'the club', I would assume you mean the Pens.  Don't hold your breath,
>you aren't going to see Naslund this year.  The World Championship
>Tournament doesn't start until 18 April.  So NHL teams won't see any
>influx of Europeans, and no team playing in the WC will see a sudden
>influx of 'eliminated' NHLers.  The earliest a player on a playoff bound
>team could join a WC-team is the last game of the round robin, and I
>doubt any coach is going to want to play short one player for that long.

 Actually, Swedish coach Curt Lundmark is thinking about leaving two
 spots open for additions from eliminated NHLers. It is Mats Sundin and
 Calle Johansson that Curt hopes can join the team, although in a late
 stage of the tournament. Technically, I seem to recall that you can leave
 spots open until 24 hrs before the WC final.

 Staffan
--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53526
From: pkortela@snakemail.hut.fi (Petteri Kortelainen)
Subject: expanding to Europe:Dusseldorf

In article <1993Apr13.091859.29570@abo.fi> MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF) writes:
>I didn't say every team MUST have a number of local players. Rather, the
>European teams should get the CHANCE to sign their top players before the rest
>of the league comes in. I agree that birthplace isn't that important,
>Dusseldorfer EG of the German league average close to 10,000 fans and they
>don't have a single German-born forward! Lion Milan made the European Final
>Four with fifteen Canadian-born players... But nationality is going to be an
>issue in Sweden and Finland, I think. We really need an issue preventing
>Lindros and Mario from ending up being drafted by a European team and vice
>versa. Player trades are a different matter - any player can end up anywhere
>after being drafted.

DEG has many german-born forwards in the team. In fact the majority of players
are german-born. 1992-93 DEG had 11150 average in 11800 spectator arena.

My Possible-NHL(European league)-site list:
Switzerland  : Berne, Zurich (Lugano and 1-2 others)
Germany      : Dusseldorf, Cologne, Berlin, Munich (Mannheim, Rosenheim)
Sweden       : Stockholm, Gothenburg (Malmo, Gavle)
Finland      : Helsinki (Turku, Tampere)
Italy        : Milan
France       : Paris (Chamonix, Ruoen?)
Norway       : (Oslo)
Austria      : (Vienna, Villach)
Chech        : (Prag)
Slovakia     : (Bratislava)
Russia       : (Moscow, St. Petersburg)
Great Britain: ?
Netherlands  : ? 

Petteri Kortelainen

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53527
From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
Subject: Re: Sweden-Finland, April 14

In <1993Apr15.063253.17375@ericsson.se> etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se writes:

> 
>  Played in Stockholm Globe arena, April 14 1993:
>  ===============================================
> 
>  SWEDEN - FINLAND  4-3 (2-0,0-2,2-1)
> 
>  1st: SWE 1-0 Jan Larsson        (Stefan Nilsson,Patrik Juhlin)       3:15
>       SWE 2-0 Peter Popovic      (Mikael Renberg,Thomas Rundqvist)   16:20
>  2nd: FIN 2-1 Mika Nieminen      (Ville Siren,Mikko Haapakoski)       0:40
>       FIN 2-2 Timo Saarikoski    (Vesa Viitakoski,Harri Laurila)     17:48 (sh)
>  3rd: SWE 3-2 Fredrik Stillman   (Stefan Nilsson,Patrik Juhlin)       7:35 (pp)
>       SWE 4-2 Mikael Renberg                                          8:40
>       FIN 4-3 Saku Koivu         (Mika Alatalo)                      13:17
> 
>              Shots on goal:      Penalties:     Attendance:    Referee:
>  Sweden      14 12 15 - 41       4*2min         12,470         Borje Johansson
>  Finland     12  9  9 - 30       9*2min                        (Sweden)
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well, if things were different and I had my way, the headline would be: "NHL,
European Division regular season game: Stockholm Storm vs. Helsinki Tornado
4-3..." Two games against every North American-based team (46 in all), and this
might have been the ninth and final regular season encounter between Helsinki
and Stockholm. The remaining 27 games would involve Paris, Dortmund, Milan...
A nice dream.

MARCU$

> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> --
>  ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
>   \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
> \\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53528
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Leaf slump over


On March 21, 1993 Roger Maynard wrote (in reply to an article by Graham
Hudson):

>> will still have the Jennings Trophy at the end of the year.  Potvin is very
>> good, and I do believe that he will be a star, but I want to see him
>> perform in the playoffs under pressure.

>You don't think he is performing "under pressure" now?  The major
>differences  between playoff hockey and normal hockey is 1. play-
>ing every other night which is physically exhausting and 2.   You
>play  the  same  team  in a consecutive string of games.  Is this
>what you mean by pressure?  Have you even thought about what  you
>mean  by pressure, or are your thoughts, like most of the rest of
>this drivel, simply half-baked?

This was <1993Mar21.223936.6192@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca>, for anybody who
would like to check.

He went on (in another article) to say [paraphrased]

>"Playoff hockey" is just an expression used by announcers to convince
>simple-minded folks like yourself that what you are seeing is a better
>product than a regular-season game.

*NOW*, however, in article <1993Apr12.013939.23016@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> 
(Roger Maynard) writes:

>With a 4-2 win over a tough Whaler squad the Leafs showed all doubters
>what playoff hockey is all about.  
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

So, Roger, what exactly *is* playoff hockey all about?  Or is it a convenient
phrase to use in certain circumstances only?

You see, when you spout off with flame bait too many times, sooner or later
it catches up with you....



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53529
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Mogilny must be benched.

In article <C5C68r.5sq@acsu.buffalo.edu> v057p7nk@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu 
(Andrew W Korbut) writes:

>Anyway, this game continued a trend that has sadly been taking shape for
>a couple of weeks now.  I had hoped it was fatigue, or an aberration, but
>I can't snow myself any longer.  Alex Mogilny must be benched as a
>disciplinary action, and soon.

>His explanation for Ysebaert jumping between him and LaFontaine to score the
>winning goal yesterday?  "Wasn't my guy, ask Patty about it."

Actually this stuff from Mogilny doesn't surprise me all that much.  About 4
or 5 weeks ago I read in the Toronto Sun a quote from Alex; it went something
like [sarcastically]:

"Yep, Patty's the man.  He's responsible for the team's success...I'm a 
nobody around here."

I was going to post it at the time...I must have forgot since nobody else 
was talking about him being a problem.

>If I heard that in the locker room, I'd beat the shit out of him on the spot.
>Patty took responsibility in the press, taking the heat off of Alex.  That's
>because LaFontaine is the epitome of class, and a consummate team player.

Yep, I'd beat the shit out of him too.  LaFontaine really must be a team
player...makes you wonder what the Islander management was thinking.
My question is what the hell is Muckler doing?  Whether he wishes to admit it
or not, the team is his to coach, and if he can't do the job then maybe the
job should be given to somebody who can.  

Gee, kinda like Alex's spot on the team, isn't it?

> Dr.D [The Devils Advocate]        



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53530
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Canadians - another Stanley Cup

In article <93097.094815MECE7187@RyeVm.Ryerson.Ca> <MECE7187@RyeVm.Ryerson.Ca>
writes:

>Im sorry to tell you this, but unless they pull off another 1986 miracle, there
> is no way the HABS will win this year.   Ever since they traded for
>Ramage, and since Savard came off injury, they have been playing shinny.  And
>you cant blame Roy for the 4-0 loss to Washington, when 20 players could not
>score one goal.  I know, you think
>I am a Boston fan, but all of my years have been dedicated to Les HABS.

>David Degan

Well, it seems that the Habs have been much talked-about of late, so here's my
$0.02.  These guys have absolutely no concept of how to play in front of the
damn net!!!  Watch them in the offensive zone, especially on the powerplay. 
Damphousse or Lebeau will skate all over the bloody zone, maybe pass to the
point, get it back, skate some more, pass it around....BUT WHERE'S THE SHOT??!
Answer: the shot is totally useless because they lack a forward who stands
in front of the net a la` Neely, Shanahan, Tocchet, etc etc.  Too bad 
Demers won't put Dipietro or LeClair on the powerplay more often.  Dammit,
even Ewen would at least cause some disruptions.  Montreal desperately needs
a power forward with some talent, IMO.

Then watch them in their own zone. Patrick Roy is screened on everything. Say
what you want about his performance; IMNSHO he cannot stop what he cannot see. 
And Montreal's defence does a miserable job of clearing the front of the net. 
Last night against Washington Roy played a *great* game.  The first goal came
on the most ridiculous goalmouth scramble I've seen in a long time, and he
didn't have a hope in hell of stopping the shot.  The second goal came on a
deflection of a shot he only partially saw anyway.  Pathetic defence.  The
third goal was EN.

No wonder he gets pissed off at his defencemen.


dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53531
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Vlad's Playoff Picks

In article <vzhivov.734637613@cunews> vzhivov@alfred.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov) writes:

Wales Conference, Adams Division, Semifinal
>Boston vs. Buffalo:
>The Bruins are playing some excellent hockey, and with Cam Neely back
>and Moog his old self again this should be a cake-walk.  BRUINS IN 5.

I'm hoping for a Fuhr miracle, but I agree that Boston will likely win the
series.  Goaltending is about equal, top offensive players are about equal
(Mogilny-LaFontaine vs. Oates-Juneau), but Buffalo has no answer to Neely
(not to imply that Neely is not a top offensive player btw, in fact he's one
of my favourites even though he's a damn Bruin :) ).  And the rest of the
matchup wrt lineup favours Boston anyway.  But I think it will go six.

>Quebec vs. Montreal:
>This one is very tough to call. Montreal certainly has the experience
>factor, but Quebec is more talented IMHO. It'll come down to the
>goalies.  I'll go with experience and Roy. CANADIENS IN 7.

Agreed here...but Montreal will be pushed to the limit.  Is it just me, or
does everything Montreal does in the playoffs come down to Roy?  Go Habs!!

Final
>Boston vs. Montreal:
>Will Bruin domination continue in this rivalry? Yes. Moog has
>consistently outperformed Roy in the playoffs (after 1986)..[other stuff]
> Bruins in five.

I can't predict a Montreal victory because I've been watching them play for
6 weeks and IMO they severly need some tougher players, especially to play
in the Garden.  Last time they beat the B's 5-2 but Boston had a clear
territorial advantage; the victory was Roy's.  At the same time, I can't
bring myself to predict the possibility of a loss, so I'll just say I will
not be putting money on this series. :-)

>Patrick Division, semifinal

>Pittsburgh vs. NY Islanders:
>What can I say? The Pens are flying high and have the most talent in
>the league. 

Agreed.  NY doesn't have the goaltending to stop the onslaught, independent
of the trouble they have given Pittsburgh this year.  Pens in five, which is
credit to NY.

>Washington vs. New Jersey:
>CAPITALS IN 5.

Agreed here too, but I think it will go at least six.  Jersey has a decent
team, and Washington has done poorly against the division this year.

>Pittsburgh vs. Washington:
>If the Caps had Bill Ranford I might see an upset, but Don Beaupre
>just doesn't inspire my hopes.  PENGUINS IN 6.

I think they will use Tabaracci more after Beaupre gets shelled.  I don't
think it will go six either...*maybe* five.

>CONFERENCE FINAL:
>Pittsburgh vs. Boston:
>A replay of last year. The Penguins are just as good as 12 months ago,
>and the Bruins are much improved. But... PENGUINS IN 6.

If Pittsburgh plays Boston, IMO they win in likely five, possibly six.  They
own the Bruins.  If they play Montreal, I think it will go to seven, and once
again I won't be putting money on the seventh game.  I say seven because the
Habs have played Pittsburgh very tough this season.

>Campbell Conference, Norris Division, semifinal

>Chicago vs. St. Louis (or Minnesota):
> BLACKHAWKS IN 5.

Chicago will win, but I think in at least six.  Chicago is not that good,
IMO.  And remember that they take ridiculous numbers of penalties.

>Detroit vs. Toronto:
>The Leafs have had an excellent season, but they've been playing
>playoff hockey all year - the Habs under Burns were the same way and
>always wilted in the playoffs.  RED WINGS IN 5.

Very true.  The Leafs have much to be proud of, but they will soon find out
why Montreal did so lousy in the playoffs.  Toronto might win two or three 
at MLG though.  Wings in six, maybe even seven.

>FINAL:
>Chicago vs. Detroit:
> This will be a war. Fedorov will win it in OT. RED WINGS IN 7.

It _will_ be a war...possibly the most intense playoff series of them all. 
And yes, I think Detroit will win.  Probert will have to come up big though.

>Smythe Division SEMI-FINALS:

>Vancouver vs. Winnipeg:
> CANUCKS IN 7.

Our first disagreement.  Canucks are playing like shit.  They don't use their
size *at* *all*, which may explain why they get hammered 8-1 by a team
chasing them (Calgary)....Winnipeg in six.

>Calgary vs. Los Angeles:
>This would have been tough to call, except for three things. 1/ The
>Kings don't have a goalie; 2/ Gary Roberts will be back; 3/ the Kings
>shot themselves in the foot by trading a proven winner (Paul Coffey)
>for a proven loser (Jimmy Carson). Gretzky is just too weary to carry
>this group. FLAMES IN 5.

This is also tough for me to call, because I haven't seen the Smythe enough. 
I don't think Roberts will be well enough to figure in, Coffey is a
non-issue, who cares what Carson has done before, and *never* underestimate
Gretzky.  LA in six.

>FINAL:
>Vancouver vs. Calgary:
> FLAMES IN 6.

If it is these two, Calgary will not need six games.  But I think it will be
LA-Winnipeg anyway, and LA in seven, because of home ice.

>COFERENCE FINAL:
>Detroit vs. Calgary:
> RED WINGS IN 7.

Wow, must've been tough to go against your team.  But let's see, I picked
LA-Detroit.  Detroit will win, probably in six.

>STANLEY CUP FINAL:
>Pittsburgh vs. Detroit:
>Three in a row and official 'dynasty' status for the Pens? Or can the
>Wings complete a dream season? Well, the Wings are better in goal (not
>sufficiently so though IMHO) and have better D-men. However, Mario and
>the boys can sure score. Look for Jagr to shine in the playoffs,
>though I sure would love to see Probert beat some sense into him. The
>Pens are just too much, especially since Detroit will have a tougher
>battle to get here. PENGUINS IN 5.

If Pittsburgh plays Detroit, it will go longer than five, and I wouldn't bet
against the Wings.  They are very strong, IMO, and nobody knows *how* strong
because they've been underachieving most of the year.  If forced to choose,
though, I'd have to take the Penguins.

A side note.  Vlad, last week you said that Selanne was a better player than
Gilmour.  NO WAY.  He is a more talented pure goal scorer...but aside from
the age difference, there is no way I would take him over Gilmour on my team.
I'm not asking for flames, either, btw....I've spent more than enough time
arguing on behalf of Selanne and I still say he's a great player.  But while
he and Gilmour are both dangerous offensively (give Teemu an edge),
Gilmour *does* *it* *all*.  I know a lot of Gilmour-bashing goes on, esp.
from Flame fans.  But IMO you guys are letting your dislike of Gilmour cloud
your judgement when it comes to his skill.  He is easily one of the best
all-round players in the NHL.



dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53532
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Wed, April 14, 1993

Boston                           2 2 0--4
Ottawa                           0 1 1--2
First period
     1, Boston, Roberts 5 (Juneau) 7:19.
     2, Boston, Wiemer 1(Juneau, Oates) 17:47.
Second period
     3, Boston, Neely 11 (Juneau, Murphy) 6:10.
     4, Boston, Hughes 5 (Richer, Kimble) 7:55.
     5, Ottawa, Archibald 9 (Rumble, Lamb) 11:37.
Third period
     6, Ottawa, Boschman 9 (Kudelski) 5:10.

Boston: 4    Power play: 2-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Hughes             1    0    1
Juneau             0    3    3
Kimble             0    1    1
Murphy             0    1    1
Neely              1    0    1
Oates              0    1    1
Richer             0    1    1
Roberts            1    0    1
Wiemer             1    0    1

Ottawa: 2    Power play: 4-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Archibald          1    0    1
Boschman           1    0    1
Kudelski           0    1    1
Lamb               0    1    1
Rumble             0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Washington                       0 0 2--2
NY Rangers                       0 0 0--0
First period
     No scoring.
Second period
     No scoring.
Third period
     1, Washington, Bondra 36 (Pivonka, Cavallini) 6:54.
     2, Washington, Bondra 37 (Cote, Pivonka) 10:10.

Washington: 2    Power play: 2-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bondra             2    0    2
Cavallini          0    1    1
Cote               0    1    1
Pivonka            0    2    2

NY Rangers: 0    Power play: 1-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------
NY Islanders                     2 1 1 0--4
Hartford                         2 1 1 1--5
First period
     1, NY Islanders, Ferraro 13 (Malakhov, King) 1:29.
     2, NY Islanders, Hogue 32 (Thomas, Turgeon) 1:57.
     3, Hartford, Yake 21(Poulin) 4:15.
     4, Hartford, Yake 22 (Nylander, Poulin) 16:44.
Second period
     5, Hartford, Verbeek 39 (Cassels, Weinrich) pp, 2:43.
     6, NY Islanders, Thomas 35 (King, Ferraro) 7:58.
Third period
     7, Hartford, Burt 5 (Sanderson, Cassels) 13:41.
     8, NY Islanders, Malakhov 14 (Hogue) 17:45.
Overtime
     9, Hartford, Janssens 12 (Poulin) 1:08.

Hartford: 5    Power play: 3-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Burt               1    0    1
Cassels            0    2    2
Janssens           1    0    1
Nylander           0    1    1
Poulin             0    3    3
Sanderson          0    1    1
Verbeek            1    0    1
Weinrich           0    1    1
Yake               2    0    2

NY Islanders: 4    Power play: 3-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Ferraro            1    1    2
Hogue              1    1    2
King               0    2    2
Malakhov           1    1    2
Thomas             1    1    2
Turgeon            0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Pittsburgh                       2 3 1 0--6
New Jersey                       2 4 0 0--6
First period
     1, Pittsburgh, Daniels 5 (Needham, Tippett) 4:14.
     2, New Jersey, Lemieux 29 (Semak, Driver) 10:19.
     3, Pittsburgh, Stevens 55(Tocchet, Murphy) pp, 12:40.
     4, New Jersey, Zelepukin 22 (Driver, Niedermayer) 17:26.
Second period
     5, Pittsburgh, Lemieux 68 (Stevens, Tocchet) 1:42.
     6, New Jersey, Semak 36 (Lemieux, Zelepukin) 2:27.
     7, Pittsburgh, McEachern 28 (Jagr, Barrasso) 4:24.
     8, New Jersey, Stevens 12 (Guerin, Pellerin) 5:45.
     9, Pittsburgh, Lemieux 69 (unassisted) sh, 12:40.
     10, New Jersey, Richer 37 (Nicholls) 15:53.
     11, New Jersey, Lemieux 30 (Semak, Zelepukin) 17:40.
Third period
     12, Pittsburgh, Mullen 33 (Jagr, Lemieux) 18:54.
Overtime
     No scoring.

Pittsburgh: 6    Power play: 5-1   Special goals:  pp: 1  sh: 1  Total: 2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Barrasso           0    1    1
Daniels            1    0    1
Jagr               0    2    2
Lemieux            2    1    3
McEachern          1    0    1
Mullen             1    0    1
Murphy             0    1    1
Needham            0    1    1
Stevens            1    1    2
Tippett            0    1    1
Tocchet            0    2    2

New Jersey: 6    Power play: 3-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Driver             0    2    2
Guerin             0    1    1
Lemieux            2    1    3
Nicholls           0    1    1
Niedermayer        0    1    1
Pellerin           0    1    1
Richer             1    0    1
Semak              1    2    3
Stevens            1    0    1
Zelepukin          1    2    3

-----------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53533
Subject: Re: Rheaume start
From: S960121@UMSLVMA.UMSL.EDU

Just a quick note about Manon's immediate future: Rumor has it(USA Today's spor
ts page) that she will be playing with Tampa Bay's affiliate in the ECHL(I Thin
k. It's been a couple of days. :)) She will supposedly be competing for the num
ber 2 goaltender spot.  I think, after her performance, which was damn good for
 someone who hasn't played squat all year, that we'll be seeing a lot more of h
er in Atlanta in the years to come.
 
 
Ward
 
-Go Blades!! Bring home the Turner Cup, again!!
 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53534
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: What's so bad about the new playoff format?

In article <115330@bu.edu> icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera) writes:
>
>   What's so bad about the new playoff format? Do you really believe teams
>that finish fourth in their div. deserve to be in the playoffs? 
>With the new format, you have more of a chance to see more teams. Do you
>really want to see the Bruins against the Sabres umpteen times or would
>you rather see the Bruins and the Capitals in the secound round of playoffs?

There is really nothing inherently wrong with it but they tried it just
a little over a decade ago, and noone showed up for the early rounds in
the playoffs...whereas soon after they went to the divisional set-up
arenas were mostly filled in the early rounds.  

The empirical evidence of the last two decades is that more people will
show up to see the Bruins play the Sabre umpteen times than see the
Bruins play the Captials in the first round.

Maybe hockey has increased in popularity sufficiently that this will
no longer be the case.  The experiment is worthwhile with the uneven
distribution of the expansion teams, but I prefer the divisional 
playoff.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53535
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: For sale; Edmonton Oilers.

In article <mcm12B2w165w@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca> mbevan@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Mark Bevan) writes:
>
>He was already offered $65 million for them from Northlands Coliseum
>but refused the offer.... I don't think he is going to sale. I think he
>may decide to move the team to the States though where he can draw
>more revenue from the team.
>

Pocklington just wanted to wake up the powers that be holding political
office, in Northlands, and in the business community that the Oilers
with their current lease arrangement are in a state where on a yearly
basis they will likely have an operating loss based on "normal" hockey
revenues and expenses.  That he did this was a good thing...it is better
he complain early, and make the city aware of a potential looming crisis
before he begins to lose millions and millions of dollars...which would
truly jeopardize the franchise.

Pocklington's first option is not to sell or to move, but to sell
a minority share of the team (to realize some of the appreciated value
of the team) and to get a better arena deal, either in Northlands, or
via a new building.  Pocklington probably isn't going to get exactly
what he wants...but ultimately he will probably get enough, or will
sell to someone who will probably get enough.

There are a lot of risks in moving a team also...

...one has to remember "Peter Puck's principle"...it is better to
spend other people's money than one's own if at all possible.

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53536
From: saross01@starbase.spd.louisville.edu (Stacey A. Ross)
Subject: Re: Hockey and the Hispanic community

In <C5I2s2.3Bt@odin.corp.sgi.com> rickc@wrigley.corp.sgi.com (Richard Casares) writes:
>You'll have a hard time selling any sport to a community that
>can't play it on account of availability or financial reasons.
>Hockey is pretty much a sport for the white and well off.

What?! White, yes. Well off, definitely not. Hockey season ticket owners have
the lowest average income of any of the four major North American sports.

And think of where the majority of hockey players come from. From a farm out
in Boondock, Saskatchewan or Weedville, Alberta.

>When was the last time you saw a hockey league in the inner city.
>The insurance alone is a big enough barrier.

The inner city isn't the only place that is poor.
I think the biggest barrier to hockey in the inner city is... no ICE to play on.

						  Stace


>-- 
>+===================================================================+
>| Rick Casares			            Silicon Graphics        |	
>| cubfan@wrigley.corp.sgi.com		    2011 N. Shoreline Blvd  |
>| "Just wait till next year."               Mountain View, CA 94039 |
>+===================================================================+

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53537
From: <AJS147@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: Winning Streaks

   You might want to clarify the 11 game winning streak.  That Pens streak
is a PLAYOFF streak (tied by the Chicago Blackhawks, who had won 11 in a row
until they met the Pens in the finals last year)  The 18 game unbeaten, so far,
is a regular season unbeaten streak.  But hey, don't take it personally.  I'm a
Flyers fan and two in a row is a stretch.  But with a healthy Lindros, Recchi,
Brind'amour and Tommy Soderstrom, they'll be there next year!
By the way, since the Flyers need defenseman, what kind of trade would
anybody suggest from the existing Flyers roster since the scuttlebutt is that

Terry Carkner won't be there next year and apart from him a piece of notebook
paper would be better defense.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Matt Weaver (properly found at AJS147@psuvm.psu.edu).  Hey, at least we're not
                                                       the Whalers!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53538
From: galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin)
Subject: Re: Washington To Beat Pitt

In article <93105.052120RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>In article <1993Apr14.015415.10176@mprgate.mpr.ca>, tasallot@galaxy.mpr.ca
>(Mathew Tasalloti) says:
>>chances this year), but it seems to me like Washington is the ONLY
>>team that can stop the Penguins from winning their next Stanley Cup.
>
>  Really? I think both the Islanders and Devils would have a better chance
>at the Penguins than the Capitals, IMO.
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>** Robbie Po **          PGH PENGUINS!!!    "It won't be easy, but it
>Contact for the '93-'94  '91 STANLEY CUP    will have greater rewards.
>Penn State Lady Lions    '92 CHAMPIONS      Mountains and Valleys are
>rap115@psuvm.psu.edu     11 STRAIGHT WINS!  better than nothing at all!"

Really?  What makes you think the Islanders have a better shot?  They
couldn't even beat the Whalers in two games!

(Well, since you're a Pens fans the whole question is moot.  I think
the teams most likely to beat the Pens are the Bruins, Nordiques, and
Blackhawks but I don't think they can really do it.  :-))

-Tom Galvin       galvint@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53539
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Bruins vs Canadiens: Talentwise

In article <1993Apr14.235849.15397@amc.com> richard@amc.com (Richard Wernick) writes:
>The bottom line is the Bruins are the better team this year.
>Montreal fans have been screaming for years that their beloved Canadiens deserve
>another cup. Since the removal of the French Canadien rule, they have been screaming
>foul. Welcome to league parity, something the rest of the league has had for years.
>Even if the Habs do beat Boston in the playoffs, they won't get by the Pens.
>I do agree with you, Boston is the more taleneted team.
>

The French Canadian rule was an extremely short term feature when the
universal draft was instituted in the sixties and only lasted for a
few years...and really didn't have any substantial effect during that
period.  The Canadiens Stanley Cup achievements were earned on a
level playing field.

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53540
From: smithw@col.hp.com (Walter Smith)
Subject: Re: Playoff predictions

OK, I'll join in the fun and give my playoff predictions: 

1st round: 
----------

PITT vs NYI:  PITT in 4.  
WASH vs NJD:  WASH in 6. 

BOS  vs BUF:  BOS  in 5. 
QUE  vs MON:  MON  in 7. 

CHI  vs STL:  CHI in 4. 
DET  vs TOR:  DET in 6. 

VAN  vs WIN:  WIN in 6. 
CAL  vs  LA:  CAL in 5. 

2nd round: 
----------

PITT vs WASH: PITT in 4. 
BOS  vs MON:  BOS  in 6. 

CHI  vs DET:  CHI  in 7. 
WIN  vs CAL:  CAL  in 5. 

3rd round: 
----------

PITT vs BOS:  PITT in 5. 
CHI  vs CAL:  CHI  in 5. 

Finals:
------

PITT vs CHI: PITT in 5. 


=============================================
Walter


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53541
From: lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico)
Subject: Re: Giveaways 

In article <1993Apr14.173826.29856@philabs.philips.com> jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio) writes:
>

>That's probably because they couldn't find anyone to sponser it... Maybe USS
>could sponser the Pittsburgh Penguins/US Steel Steel Rod Night-- close enough?

Maybe in the 60's, but not now.  Steel is a dead industry in Pgh. 

No, a giveaway night in the 90's for Pgh would be "Baboon Liver Night"
sponored by The Pittsburgh Zoo...

Lori


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53542
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Goalie masks


	I'm starting an informal poll on goalie masks. I'd like to know
who's mask you think looks the best. I've always like Curtis Joseph's
of the Blues the best. Anyway, send your nominations to me, or post your
vote here on r.s.h. My e-mail adress is: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

	Thanks for your time.

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53543
From: ayari@judikael.loria.fr (Ayari Iskander)
Subject: NHLPA poll (Stats/2nd uptade)

2nd uptade:

Here are the standings for the poll after 29 votes: 5 points for 1st, 4 for 2nd,... 1 point for 5th: 

EA/ NHLPA game

1. DET 78
2. CHI 67 
3. VAN 60
4. NY  59
5. MTL 54
6. PIT 23
7. WAS 20
8. BOS 17
9..QUE  9 
10.CAL  8
11.ASW  7
12.LA   5
   TOR  5
14.ASE  4
   WIN  4
16.BUF  3
   PHI  3
18.SJ   2
19.MIN  1
   OTW  1
   Atlanta to win Turner Cup 1 (not in the game, but 1 person vote)


Continue to send your votes in this format (until April 20th, approximately)
------------------------------------------------
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
------------------------------------------------


__

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53544
From: bdown@vis.toronto.edu (Brian Down)
Subject: Re: Barasso - the cheap shot master?

Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:

>After watching the Pengiuns all year (and as many other teams as
>possible), I've really noticed an increase in Tom Barasso's cheap shots
>this year (and not noticed a corrsponding increase with other
>goaltenders).

Have a look at Ed Belfour.

>He also KICKED John McLean. Of
>course he wasn't called for that. 

Belfour kicked Gerrard Gallant when the Wings played the 'Hawks
a couple of weeks ago. No penalty. No review. No suspension.
This was after he attacked Bob Probert in the previous period.
He was penalized for that.

>There's no doubt in
>my mind that Barasso is the dirtiest golatender since Hextall.
>He's also very good.

Likewise Belfour. Too bad he goes down so much! :-)

>Ralph

Brian Down (bdown@vis.toronto.edu)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53545
From: franti@polaris.utu.fi (Pasi Fr{nti)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

lor@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (edward.lor) writes:

>>	Player:		Points:		+/-	Subtraction:
>>	-------		-------		----	------------
>>	Lemieux		  157		 53	  -104
>>	LaFontaine 	  145		 13	  -132
>>	Oates 		  141		 12	  -129
>>	Yzerman		  138		 33	  -105
>>	Selanne		  137		  8	  -129

>This is wrong. Among Lemieux's 157 points, we do NOT know how many
>are power play points. We may be able to find out how many PP goal he
>scored, but not how many PP assist he accumulated. We also don't know
>the # times he was on the ice but not credited on the goals the Pens 
>scored.

That is what my point really was. There is not straight dependency between
the +/- and scored points. Apparently most of the netters have realized
it by themselves.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53546
From: cubrj@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Brian Johnson)
Subject: the hawks WILL return to the finals!!!!!

Well now that the hawks have won the division the road is a little
easier for the playoffs. Let toronto and detroit beat the hell out of
each other while Chicago sweeps st.louis. That just makes it easier in
the second round with all the rest they will get and tor/det getting
none. For the conf. champ they will have a hard time versus the division
but that div. will be pretty battered also so the advantage goes to the
Hawks again. Then bring pitt. and sure the Hawks will probably lose but
its better to get that far and lose than to not go.

brian


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53547
From: gjp@sei.cmu.edu (George Pandelios)
Subject: Re: Washington To Beat Pitt


In article <1993Apr14.185059.27513@ncsu.edu>, fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu (FRANK MICHAE SALVATORE) writes:
|> 
|>  
|> 
|> > 
|> > What makes you think so?  I'd like to understand your reasoning.
|> > From my seat, the Caps don't really appear to believe that they can 
|> > defeat Pittsburgh.  Therefore, they don't.  I think their spirit was 
|> > broken in last year's playoffs and hasn't really recovered.  I don't know 
|> > what the season series numbers were, but I believe that the Pens won it.
|> > I think that either the Devils or the Islanders will cause more problems for
|> 
|> 
|> What is this spirit crap?  I'm a Caps fan and hope they win
|> if they end up facing Pittsburgh,
|> but I don't think the Caps lose to Pitt because of lack
|> of spirit.  Yes, the Penguins won the season series against the
|> Caps.  They've won eighteen games in a row for God's sake.
|> Did you ever think the Penguins might be good, and that's
|> why they win?

I re-read what I wrote and it didn't say exactly what I thought.  

Sure the Pens are a better team.  They've got size and the best skill players
in the league.  They've also got the best clutch goaltending.  They're the 
best team in the league.

But, my point was the Caps have not played to their ability level vs the
Pens since last year's choke.  And that's the mental problem (the one they've
had for a number of years) I tried to point out.  Spirit, mental preparedness,
will to win, whatever you want to call it, it's missing when the Caps play the
Pens.  Actually, you're right - it won't make any difference.

George

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53548
From: wong@fraser.sfu.ca (Sam S. Wong)
Subject: Re: Mogilny must be benched.

dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:

>Actually this stuff from Mogilny doesn't surprise me all that much.  About 4

>or 5 weeks ago I read in the Toronto Sun a quote from Alex; it went something
>like [sarcastically]:

>"Yep, Patty's the man.  He's responsible for the team's success...I'm a 
>nobody around here."

>I was going to post it at the time...I must have forgot since nobody else 
>Gee, kinda like Alex's spot on the team, isn't it?



How can you assume it was a sarcastic remark?

For someone whose first language is not English, I would interpret
that comment to mean that he believes Pat is the MVP on the team and that
he is just one of the other normal players.  Quite modest I might say.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53549
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Leaf slump over

In <1993Apr13.190225.29001@newshub.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:


>On March 21, 1993 Roger Maynard wrote (in reply to an article by Graham
>Hudson):

>>You don't think he is performing "under pressure" now?  The major
>>differences  between playoff hockey and normal hockey is 1. play-
>>ing every other night which is physically exhausting and 2.   You
>>play  the  same  team  in a consecutive string of games.  Is this
>>what you mean by pressure?  Have you even thought about what  you
>>mean  by pressure, or are your thoughts, like most of the rest of
>>this drivel, simply half-baked?

>This was <1993Mar21.223936.6192@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca>, for anybody who
>would like to check.

>He went on (in another article) to say [paraphrased]

>>"Playoff hockey" is just an expression used by announcers to convince
>>simple-minded folks like yourself that what you are seeing is a better
>>product than a regular-season game.

>*NOW*, however, in article <1993Apr12.013939.23016@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> 
>(Roger Maynard) writes:

>>With a 4-2 win over a tough Whaler squad the Leafs showed all doubters
>>what playoff hockey is all about.  
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

>So, Roger, what exactly *is* playoff hockey all about?  Or is it a convenient
>phrase to use in certain circumstances only?

>You see, when you spout off with flame bait too many times, sooner or later
>it catches up with you....

Nice try Deepak, but "tough Whaler squad" should have clued you in to the
fact that my Leaf woofing was tongue-in-cheek.

If playoff hockey is any more intense than the regular season variety then
it is because the teams are facing each other at least 4 consecutive times
in 7 days and hockey being the contact sport that it is, some things will
be carried over that might dissipate during the regular season.  But that is
only for some of the players.  Many of the rest, who have been playing with
injuries, who miss their families, or who, like Grant Fuhr, would really
rather be playing golf, don't really give a damn.  Of course I can't say this
for sure, but I believe that this is fairly typical of human nature and I
don't think that hockey players are above having what I consider typically
human attitudes.  

With the recent salary escalations the key players are actually losing 
money by participating in the playoffs.  The ones who regard the playoff
"take" as some kind of a bonanza are fringe players who are unlikely
to consistently be a force in the playoffs.  Now I know some of you are
going to come back with "winning spirit" and all of that crap but these
players are professionals after all.  While they may love to play the 
game that love is entirely incidental to their purpose, which is, to make
a decent living. 

Of course, the coach is a professional as well, and part of what he is 
being paid to do is motivate the players.  So, if the coach does his
job well enough the players may respond with a winning effort.

The second season, is after all, merely an exhibition.  The true Champions
of the league are the division winners, the teams that come out on top 
after the long struggle of the season.  The Stanley cup playoffs merely
accord victory to the team that has remained healthy and "hot".  The 
emphasis on the playoffs, with their "sudden death" appeal has been promoted
by the media and the owners with profit purely in mind.  Even if Pittsburgh
loses the playoffs, we all know that they were really the best team in the
league over the year.  They proved it.

cordially, as always,

rm

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53550
From: s4lawren@sms.business.uwo.ca (Stephen Lawrence)
Subject: Re: Playoff predictions

smithw@col.hp.com (Walter Smith) writes:

> OK, I'll join in the fun and give my playoff predictions: 
> 
> 1st round: 
> ----------
> 
> PITT vs NYI:  PITT in 4.  
> WASH vs NJD:  WASH in 6. 
> 
> BOS  vs BUF:  BOS  in 5. 
> QUE  vs MON:  MON  in 7. 
> 
> CHI  vs STL:  CHI in 4. 
> DET  vs TOR:  DET in 6. 
> 
> VAN  vs WIN:  WIN in 6. 
> CAL  vs  LA:  CAL in 5. 
> 
> 2nd round: 
> ----------
> 
> PITT vs WASH: PITT in 4. 
> BOS  vs MON:  BOS  in 6. 
> 
> CHI  vs DET:  CHI  in 7. 
> WIN  vs CAL:  CAL  in 5. 
> 
> 3rd round: 
> ----------
> 
> PITT vs BOS:  PITT in 5. 
> CHI  vs CAL:  CHI  in 5. 
> 
> Finals:
> ------
> 
> PITT vs CHI: PITT in 5. 
> 
> 
> =============================================
> Walter
> 

        Not bad, you only got 2 wrong,...
        Cal over Chi in 5
        and Cal over Pit in 6 (or 7) to take the SC

s4lawren@sms.business.uwo.ca (Stephen Lawrence)
Western Business School  --  London, Ontario

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53551
From: gjp@sei.cmu.edu (George Pandelios)
Subject: Re: Patrick Playoffs Look Like This


In article <BSON.93Apr14154548@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu>, bson@gnu.ai.mit.edu (Jan Brittenson) writes:
|> In article <1993Apr13.132133.16224@sei.cmu.edu> gjp@sei.cmu.edu (George Pandelios) writes:
|> 
|>  > The Pens won't be playing Montreal, because Boston will win Adams
|>  > divisional play.  Buffalo and Quebec will make decent showings.
|>  > Boston, out of sheer determination, will win a game against the Pens,
|>  > but no more.  They have heart, but the Pens have too many big guns and
|>  > too many ways to win.
|> 
|>    If Boston does indeed win the Adams (nothing is certain), and
|> indeed gets to play the Pens, then I think you'll find a very
|> different Boston team this year. Boston will use every trick in the
|> book to shut down the Pens offense -- something they didn't even try
|> last year. The Pens' weak spot is defense and goaltending -- if Boston

First, I enjoyed reading your post.  Second, I disagree with the Pen's weak
spot being defense and goaltending - for a couple of reasons.  Barrasso has
had a spectacular year - no slow start, consistently sharp, GAA < 3.0, and 
leads the league in wins.  Tommy deserves the Vezina.  Given the lack of 
respect he commands, though, I doubt he will win it.  The other reason 
concerns the Pens' team defense.  They are hovering around 3rd or 4th in the
fewest goals allowed.  That is a big improvement for them, and it indicates
that they are playing better team defense.

|> can shut down the Pens' offense and get an early goal, then you have a
|> real game. If the Pens score first, then it's practically over. I
|> don't think the Pens have the discipline to stick to the team game if
|> they're held scoreless 5 minutes into the second.
|> 
|>    Boston doesn't have the guns of the Pens, but the Pens doesn't have
|> the defense, goaltending, and discipline of Boston. Still, Boston can
|> put the puck in the net. Remember that Boston is not a "run-and-gun"
|> Patrick-style team, although they played run-and-gun hockey for the
|> better part of the regular season (who doesn't). Even Neely backchecks
|> all the way in behind his own net if necessary.
|> 
|>    Penalty-killing will be a big factor. Boston are, I believe +2 over
|> the last 40-something short-handed situations, meaning they have
|> scored 4 SHG while giving up 2 PPG (one in a lackluster game against
|> Ottawa).
|> 
|>    I'd say the series will go to 5 or 6. But I'm much less certain
|> whether it will be in favor of the Pens or the B's. Their styles going
|> into the playoffs are too different to make it predictable. Still, I'd
|> place my bets on the Pens I think. My prediction is that if the B's
|> can get the first goal in four of the games, they'll take the series.
|> Otherwise the Pens will.
|> 
|>    But I'd rather wait and see whether the B's will actually get out
|> of the Adams to begin with... Buffalo, Quebec, and Montreal aren't
|> exactly planning to call it a game and go home!
|> 
|> --
|> 						-- Jan Brittenson
|> 						   bson@gnu.ai.mit.edu

We'll see.  It'll be fun.

George
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
  George J. Pandelios				Internet:  gjp@sei.cmu.edu
  Software Engineering Institute		usenet:	   sei!gjp
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  Pittsburgh, PA 15213				FAX:	   (412) 268-5758
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Disclaimer:  These opinions are my own and do not reflect those of the
	     Software Engineering Institute, its sponsors, customers, 
	     clients, affiliates, or Carnegie Mellon University.  In fact,
	     any resemblence of these opinions to any individual, living
	     or dead, fictional or real, is purely coincidental.  So there.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53552
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: Playoff telecasts in Atlanta

In article <1q9noa$d90@hsdndev.harvard.edu> nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219) writes:
>In article <IflYr6y00WB4A6F60A@andrew.cmu.edu> Mamatha Devineni Ratnam <mr47+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>>
>>Does anyone know if all the Patrick division games are going to be televised
>>on ESPN and ABC? If some games are going to be left out(Or blanked out by
>>dumb southern ABC affiliates), I was wondering if anyone out there knows
>>of any sports bars in Atlanta which are frequented by hockey fans. I don't
>>want to miss out on any of the Pens games. I am sure that there are some
>>Islander fans(now that the rangers are dead) who would want to watch every
>>Pens-Islanders game in Atlanta.
>
>
>Circle Tuesday,April 20th on your TV calendar. ESPN will carry Game#2
>from Pittsburgh's Civic Arena or as they are advetising it : Pittsburgh vs.
>4th place Partick Div. finisher. Personally, Bruins-Buffalo or Montreal-
>Quebec City is a much better matchup but ESPN is hoping for a spoiler
>in the Pens series which it's not likely to get the way Mario has been
>playing for the past month or so.

I'd personally prefer Buffalo-Boston, as a birthday gift from ESPN,
but I don't think the folks at ESPN will accomodate that for me ;-)
ESPN has this inexplicable affinity for the Patrick division, it
seems.  

-- 
Valerie Hammerl			"Some days I have to remind him he's not 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu	Mario Lemieux."  Herb Brooks on Claude
acscvjh@ubms.cc.buffalo.edu	Lemieux, top scorer for the Devils, but 
v085pwwpz@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu  known for taking dumb penalties.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53553
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: David Polie's future

In article <92821@hydra.gatech.EDU> gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak) writes:
>In article <gfmoD2e00iV1892owC@andrew.cmu.edu> gp2f+@andrew.cmu.edu (Gary James Patalsky) writes:
>>Bad news for the Patrick division next year.  Caps GM David Polie is
>>reportedly trying to get a front office job with the NHL.  I can't
>>believe Polie has not been fired despite 10 years of mediocrity.
>
>	YES! YES! THE IDIOT'S GONE! THE IDIOT'S GONE!!!!!!! I wish
>this happened before he traded Hrivnak. Anyway, THE IDIOT'S GONE!!!
>

He's not gone yet.  The position opening is down to Polie and the
Sabres' GM Gerry Meehan.  I think I'd like to see Meehan gone...

-- 
Valerie Hammerl			"Some days I have to remind him he's not 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu	Mario Lemieux."  Herb Brooks on Claude
acscvjh@ubms.cc.buffalo.edu	Lemieux, top scorer for the Devils, but 
v085pwwpz@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu  known for taking dumb penalties.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53554
From: jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM (Jason Cockroft)
Subject: Re: Playoff predictions

1st round: 
----------

PITT vs NYI:  PITT in 4. 

It looks like a safe bet.  NYI has been bagging it of late.
NYI and NJD have a showdown Friday night for the honour
of Pittsburg anyway.  Pigsburg in 4.

WASH vs NJD:  WASH in 6. 
I think that NJD have a solid team and will compete with
WASH.  I agree though with WASH in 6.

BOS  vs BUF:  BOS  in 5. 
The B's have been playing awesome hockey in the last
two weeks.  The only question is how long will it last?
Fuhr is a dud.  BOS in 4.

QUE  vs MON:  MON  in 7.
It seems to me that MON is much like the VAN - no chemistry.
The Habs seem to be not in stride. QUE in 5.  

CHI  vs STL:  CHI in 4. 
STL should not be in the playoffs. CHI in 4.

DET  vs TOR:  DET in 6.
I am a diehard Leaf fan but ... It seems that the Leafs
offense is shutting down in the last week.  Can they
turn it around against Detroit.  As I recall, the last
couple of time these two teams met, the Leafs were pummelled.
I don't know if Bobbie is allowed in Canada yet.  If he is,
DET in 5.  If not, DET in 6.

VAN  vs WIN:  WIN in 6.

Upset in the making here.  Another team with bad chemistry.
There is something gone foul among Linden, Momesso and Bure.
WIN in 6.

CAL  vs  LA:  CAL in 5.
Anybody that says that LA could possibly beet CAL does
not watch the Smythe a whole lot.  LA is a bunch of Geritols.
CAL in 4.


2nd round: 
----------

PITT vs WASH: PITT in 4. 
It seems to me that Pigsburg has some egos on their team.  Their
saving grace though is Bowman.  He can put anybody in their place.
However, if PIGS have a quick first round, they may be a little
too high.  WASH could be there for a surprise.  Having said that,
I will say PITT in 6.

BOS  vs MON:  BOS  in 6.
MON will not be there.  BOS is surprising me of late. Cam is great.
The couple of wins against QUE last week have sold me with the
B's.  B's in 6.


CHI  vs DET:  CHI  in 7.
Yikes.  This will not be pretty.  But DET is running like a machine
of late.  They've had a non-busy end of the season in which they played
like killers.  DET in 6.

WIN  vs CAL:  CAL  in 5.
CAL has a solid team, a little weak in the nets.  CAL will out
muscle WIN.  CAL in 5.

3rd round: 
----------

PITT vs BOS:  PITT in 5. 

I hate PITT.  My logic eludes me.  The dark side will take over
and give BOS the extra push it needs to dump PITT.  There may
be something to this - if you think of the rivalry.  BOS in 7.
CHI  vs CAL:  CHI  in 5. 

Finals:
------

PITT vs CHI: PITT in 5. 

NO, no, no.  We have BOS vs DET.  I don't know what to say
here.  Both teams will be flying and overdue.  I will go
with goaltending and muscle and say DET in 7.


-jake.





Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53555
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat


In article 6143@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca, maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>In <1993Apr14.201910.13370@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:

>>1. You have completely missed the point with the Selke trophy.  It goes
>>to the best defensive forward.  This is the forward who forgoes points
>>to help his team out defensively.  It is an unsung hero of sorts.  Yes,
>>Lemieux and Gilmour are good defensive players, but they play a more
>>offensively oriented style than a true defensive forward.  This year,
>
>You mean guys that check but can't score?  The guys who can both check
>and score shouldn't be candidates?  Is that right?

The Selke candidate forwards main purpose on a shift is to prevent goals
from being scored- not to score them.  When Lemieux or Gilmour play their
number one purpose is to score- defence is secondary- especially considering
the line that plays against them is probably a defensive one.  That is
why they are not Selke candidates.

>>2. When Tarasov called Bob Gainey the best player in the world, it was
>>assumed that he meaned the best _technical_ player- the one who knew
>>every intricacy about playing hockey and never made a technical error.
>
>And who was it that made this assumption?  All of your friends maybe?
>Sorry Greg, but 2 people aren't enough...you can "assume" all that you
>want to, but if you think Tarasov was serious then you are an idiot.

Someone posted something about this assumption being lost in translation
(it was a few months ago).  Whoever this was please repost it.

>>I agree with this assessment.  Bob Gainey may have been the best technical
>>player ever.
>
>Right Greg.  Did you see this in the Sun or something?  What did you think
>of Claude Provost?  Gainey was nothing more than a journeyman player who's
>outstanding abilities were entirely political.  He might have had a col-
>lection of defensive skills but he had absolutely no offensive skills at
>all.  None.  But perhaps you think that the abilities to pass the puck, shoot
>the puck and deke a goalie or defenseman are not technical skills?  

Gainey is the best defensive forward ever.  I stand by that assessment.
He was a very good player who belongs in the hall of fame.  Did you
ever watch him play? He never made a technical error.

<Babbling deleted>

>Gee Greg, the pundits were calling Gilmour the best two-way player in the
>league way back when he was with St. Louis.  I would have expected you to
>have picked up on that. 

Who are these pundits??  Gilmour was good with St Louis- but he was not the
best two-way player in the game when he was with them.  You have overhyped
Gilmour on this net for months.  He is a very good forward- but hardly the
best in the NHL.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53556
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat


In article 1@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi, hahietanen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi () writes:
>In article <1993Apr14.174139.6604@sol.UVic.CA>, gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:
>> 
>> 
>> +/- is a good stat because it is the only stat that I am aware of that
>> takes into account defensive play.  It isn't a measure of defensive
>> play- it takes into account offense and defence- all aspects of play.
>                                                   
>  If we are interested of real all-round players, the power play stats
>  should be considered, too. Because the power play is also one aspect 
>  of play! There is still something to be done with these player evaluation
>  tools!!

IMO any good player should score on power plays because of the man
advantage.  Very good power play scorers tend to become overrated
because their point totals are inflated by power play points.
+/- tends to expose these overrated players such as Brett Hull,
John Cullen and Dave Andreychuck.

Given the opportunity to play power play consistently, any player can
inflate his totals.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53557
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat


In article 1676@mala.bc.ca, apland@mala.bc.ca (Ron Apland) writes:
>In article <1993Apr14.174139.6604@sol.UVic.CA>, gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:
>> 
>> To adjust +/-:
>> 
>> 1. First calculate a teams +/-.  (Goals Scored - PP Goals Scored) -
>> (Goals allowed - PP Goals Allowed (when they were penalty killing)).
>> 
>> 2.  Divide this number by 5 to take into account of the fact that there
>> are 5 players on the ice and each is 1/5 responsible for the team +/-.
>> 
>> 3.  A players adjusted +/- is (His raw +/-) - (Team Adjustment).
>> 
>> BTW  If anyone could calculate and post adjusted +/- ratings it would be
>> greatly appreciated.  I might find the time to do so- but don't count on
>> it.
>
>I have a database filter set up for the player stats.  When it is posted for
>the end of season I'll repost the team averages.  You don't need to go through
>the complicated team adjustment you are using - all you need is the team
>average by summing all the individual players' +\- and divide by the total
>number of players on the team.  This will be a little distorted because the
>players who have been traded recently will have come with +\- scores based
>on their original teams.  This shouldn't distort it too bad though.  If you
>want to look at individual players from this perspective then go ahead -
>you'll require the original player stats though.

Question:
If a team uses 40 players in a season do you merely divide the total +/-
by 40?  If so, a player who plays in only 1 game is considered equally
valuable as a player who plays in all of them.

>Another way of looking at the same thing is to compare the deviation from
>the mean for the team of the player to the standard deviation for the team.
>I'll post both.

Since the standard deviation for each team is different, I am unsure how 
"transferable" between teams that these stats are.  Shouldn't the average
standard deviation in the league be used?

I am interested in seeing each method.
But I still think that mine is the best. If for no other reason than familiarity.

Gregmeister






Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53558
From: hamlet@stein.u.washington.edu (Mitch McGowan)
Subject: Minnesota recalls McGowan (HELP!!!)

  Derian Hatcher's game-misconduct penalty was rescinded by the NHL, 
allowing the Minnesota defenseman to play in the North Stars' last two 
regular-season games.  Hatcher was given the penalty during a fight at 
the end of a loss at St. Louis on Sunday, April 11.  But the league 
didn't rescind the game-misconduct penalty Shane Churla received.  The 
Stars recalled center Cal McGowan from their top minor league club in 
Kalamazoo, Mich., to replace Churla.

The above is courtesy of The Washington Times on-line service.

Now, here's where I need help.  If anyone out there has a tape of Tuesday's
Chicago-Minnesota game, please contact me.  Terms will be favorable.

Also, if anyone can tape tonight's Minnesota-Detroit game, please contact
me.  This could be quite important.  Once again, I will make it worth
your trouble.

Thanks to all.

--
rec.sport.hockey contact for Minnesota North Stars
and maintainer of the r.s.h FAQ file
Mitch McGowan a.k.a.    | KALAMAZOO WINGS  | MINNESOTA NORTH STARS |
hamlet@u.washington.edu | ST. KILDA SAINTS | TORONTO BLUE JAYS     |

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53559
From: franti@polaris.utu.fi (Pasi Fr{nti)
Subject: Re: Helsinki/Stockholm & NHL expansion?

MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF) writes:

>Not too low perhaps, but surely not as high as that of an European NHL
>division. The Finnish team, for example, would contain all players currently on
>the national team plus a top-class foreigner or two. They would be in an
>entirely different league than TPS or Jokerit, both of whom have perhaps a
>dozen players of international class - if even that. Why settle for a minor
>league when you could have the best?

It is no matter what you call the teams, Jokerit and TPS, or Helsinki Tornado
and Turku Typhoon, the best palyers in Finland would eventually end up in
those teams anyway, if they were in the "big" league. 


>I'd rather spend 150 Marks to watch the Helsinki Tornado play Montreal, the NY
>Rangers or Los Angeles than 50 Marks(?) for the privilege to see Jokerit vs.
>JypHT or even Djurgardens IF. There's nothing like the NHL, period.

Unrealistic for now. Maybe we should first just expand Finnish league to
allow teams from Baltic countries to entry!  Then others will get interested
in the idea, that maybe one should settle something bigger. The ultimate 
goal, as you want it, would be European Division in NHL. Btw. does that 
make a final with an Europan team against Norht American?

 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53560
From: rrmadiso@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca (*** CHUCK ***)
Subject: Re: Playoff predictions


Everybody.  Please send me your predictions for the Stanley Cup Playoffs!
I want to see who people think will win.!!!!!!!

Please Send them in this format, or something comparable:

1. Winner of Buffalo-Boston
2. Winner of Montreal-Quebec
3. Winner of Pittsburgh-New York
4. Winner of New Jersey-Washington
5. Winner of Chicago-(Minnesota/St.Louis)
6. Winner of Toronto-Detroit
7. Winner of Vancouver-Winnipeg
8. Winner of Calgary-Los Angeles

9. Winner of Adams Division (1-2 above)
10. Winner of Patrick Division (3-4 above)
11. Winner of Norris Division (5-6 above)
12. Winner of Smythe Division (7-8 above)

13. Winner of Wales Conference (9-10 above)
14. Winner of Campbell Conference (11-12 above)

15. Winner of Stanley Cup (13-14 above)

I will summarize the predictions, and see who is the biggest
INTERNET GURU PREDICTING GUY/GAL.

Send entries to Richard Madison
rrmadiso@napier.uwaterloo.ca

PS:  I will send my entries to one of you folks so you know when I say
I won, that I won!!!!!

:)




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53561
From: cr292@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Jim Schenk)
Subject: Re: the hawks WILL return to the finals!!!!!


The Hawks won the Norris div, and sealed their fate.  It's bad luck
to win the Norris.  The Hawks will sweep the Blues in their dreams but will
lose in 6 in reality.  I predict that in the 6 game with the Blues Belfour
will go down on his knees 7000 time s and will spend the rest of the time 
looking behind him self.  Butcher will pound Roenick and The warthawks have
no one tough enough to prevent it

Bye Bye Wart HAwks

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53562
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: My predictions

Smythe Division
---------------

Vancouver vs. Winnipeg - Jets in 7
The Jets have played the Canucks tough the last three games.  Everyone is
healthy for the Jets.  I'm biased.  :)

Calgary vs. Los Angeles - Flames in 6
From what I have seen, the Kings have looked flat lately.  I just can't see
them getting by the Flames.

Final- Jets in 6.
The Jets haven't lost to the Flames in '93.  They will, but it will be a
close series that will come down to how well Roberts has recovered.  I
don't think he'll be 100%, and while it will help, it won't be enough.

Norris Division
---------------

Chicago vs. St. Louis/Minnesota
Chicago in 6 against the Blues, 7 against the Stars.  

Detroit vs. Toronto - Wings in 6.
The Wings should be able to shutdown Gilmour and Andreychuk.  Chelvadae is
more experienced than Potvin.

Final - Hawks in 7.  Brutal series.  Probert and Chelios will go at it.
Belfour is better than Chelvadae, IMHO.

Conference Final - Hawks in 6.  It hurts, but the Hawks are more experienced,
and that will carry them through to the final.

Prince of Wales Conference
--------------------------

Adams Division
--------------

Boston vs. Buffalo - Bruins in 6.
B's can check, Juneau is darn good, and Neely.  The Sabres rely too much
on Lafontaine and Mogilny.

Quebec vs. Montreal - Montreal in 7.
Classic battle, the inexperience will hurt the Nords, this year.

Final - Bruins in 5.  Habs will be hurting from their series with the Nords,
and Boston has been able to control the scorers on the Habs.

Patrick Division
----------------

Pittsburgh vs Islanders/Devils - Pens in 5.
One word.  Mario.

Washington vs. Devils/Islanders - Caps in 6 / Devils in 7.
I think the Caps can beat the Isles, but not the Devils.  Tabaracci has been
strong in goal, and if he plays like last year, he could carry the team.
It doesn't matter, though.

Final - Pens in 5.  Two more words.  Stevens.  Jagr.

Cup Final - Pens in 6.  Three last words.  Tocchet.  Murphy.  Barrasso.

The only thing I don't like about this is that the Pens woofers are going to
be out in full force again.  (I don't mean the regular Penguin fans...it's
just like the bunch around here that if these predictions are true will post
like nuts while the Jets are winning, but we won't hear from again when they
lose.)

(Oh yeah...next year's Cup prediction...Jets in 7 over the Nords.)



Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53563
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

In <1993Apr15.160450.27799@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:

>The Selke candidate forwards main purpose on a shift is to prevent goals
>from being scored- not to score them.  When Lemieux or Gilmour play their
>number one purpose is to score- defence is secondary- especially considering
>the line that plays against them is probably a defensive one.  That is
>why they are not Selke candidates.
>Gainey is the best defensive forward ever.  I stand by that assessment.
>He was a very good player who belongs in the hall of fame.  Did you
>ever watch him play? He never made a technical error.

I watched him over his entire career.  I have NEVER seen a player, and that
includes Russell Courtnall and Davie Keon, screw up as many breakaways as
Bob Gainey.  And I will never forget the time Denis Potvin caught Gainey
with his head down.  You have been sold a bill of goods on Bob Gainey.

Gainey was a plugger.  And when the press runs out of things to say about 
the stars on dynasties they start to hype the pluggers.  Grant Fuhr, Essa
Tikkannen, Butch Goring, Bob Nystrom, Bob Gainey, Doug Jarvis, Derek
Sanderson, Wayne Cashman, Bob Baun, Bob Pulford, Ralph Backstrom, Henri
Richard, Dick Duff...and so on...

cordially, as always,

rm

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53564
From: JBE5 <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA>
Subject: WFAN (STEVE & CHIEF ON 48 HOURS)

Greetings!

Steve Summers and the Chief were on 48 Hours last night shmoozing
sports.  I unfortunately missed it.  Those of you who saw it, can
you please provide a synopsis.

Thanx.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Czar of Mainframe Computing <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA>
McGill University

---> I'M TOO SEXY FOR COBOL.

---> Habs...it doesn't look good!

---> Let's Go Expos!
                ======================================
                | Peter Peter Pumkin Eater,          |
                | Knew a chick but couldn't meet her.|
                | Saw her brother one fine day,      |
                | Sucked his cock now he's gay!      |
                |           --Andrew Dice Clay       |
                ======================================

 DISCLAIMER:
************************************************************************
*   Needless to say that the opinions expressed by THE CZAR represent  *
*   those of the faculty, staff, and students of McGill University.    *
************************************************************************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53565
From: lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico)
Subject: Pens box score 4/14

Pens-6 NJ Devils-6

FIRST PERIOD: SCORING: 1, Pittsburgh, Daniels(Needham, Tippett)4:14.
2, NJ Devils, C. Lemieux(Semak, Driver)10:19.  3, Pittsburgh, Stevens
(Tocchet, Murphy)12:40ppg.  4, NJ Devils, Zelepukin(Driver, Niedermayer)
17:26.  PENALTIES: PGH, Stevens(roughing)1:30.  NJD, Pellerin-double
minor(cross-checking)1:30.  NJD, Zelepukin(tripping)7:21.  NJD,
Stasny(holding)11:15.  PGH, Taglianetti(roughing)13:51.  NJD, Lemieux
(roughing)13:51.  PGH, Jagr(tripping)15:23.

SECOND PERIOD: SCORING: 5, Pittsburgh, Lemieux(Murphy, Tocchet)1:42.
6, NJ Devils, Semak(Lemieux, Zelepukin)2:27.  7, Pittsburgh, McEachern
(Jagr, Barrasso)4:24.  8, NJD, Stevens(Guerin, Pellerin)5:45.  9,
Pittsburgh, Lemieux(unassisted)12:40shg.  10, NJ Devils, Richer
(Nicholls)15:53.  11, NJ Devils, Lemieux(Zelepukin)17:40.  PENALTIES:
PGH, Stevens(roughing)3:06.  NJD, McKay(roughing)3:06.  PGH, Mullen
(hooking)10:42.  PGH, Tocchet(roughing)12:06.  NJD, Stevens(slashing)
12:06.  NJD, Lemieux(unsportsmanlike conduct)12:40.  PGH, U.
Samuelsson(cross checking)20:00.  PGH, Barrasso-double minor(spearing)
served by McEachern, 20:00.  NJD, Holik(cross checking)20:00.  NJD,
Lemieux(roughing)20:00.

THIRD PERIOD: SCORING: 12, Pittsburgh, Mullen(Jagr, Lemieux)18:54.
PENALTIES: NJD, Daneyko(interference)3:37.  PGH, Stevens(roughing)
9:18.  NJD, Holik(roughing)9:18.  PGH, match penalty-game misconduct,9:50.
NJD, Zelepukin(tripping)12:01.  PGH, Stevens(roughing)18:41.  NJD,
Daneyko(roughing)18:41.

OVERTIME: SCORING: No scoring.  PENALTIES: No penalties.

SHOTS ON GOAL:
Pittsburgh: 9-11-8-2=30
NJ Devils: 12-15-9-3=39

GOALIES:
Barrasso(39 shots, 33 saves. 43-14-5)
Billington(30 shots, 24 saves)

REF: Devorski  Linesmen: Gauthier, Vines

Lori
Contact for the Penguins
lli+@cs.cmu.edu


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53566
From: jae2001@andy.bgsu.edu (Jason Ehas)
Subject: Re: Giveaways

In article <1qi44l$kqr@access.digex.net>, steveg@cadkey.com (Steve
Gallichio) wrote:
> 
> 
> John P. Curcio (jpc@philabs.philips.com) responded to my drivel:
> 
> >steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio) writes:
> > 
> >>I still am surprised that no one has tried giving away the goodies at the end
> >>of the game. The two problems with that, of course, are that you would want
> >>to make sure the first people in the building would be assured of getting
> >>them (probably redeemable vouchers), and that the building managers want to
> >>avoid at all costs delaying people as they leave the building, if, for
> >>instance, the goodies are given to people as they exit.
> >
> >I went to the New Jersey Devils/Carvel Ice Cream Puck Night (tm) last year to
> >see the beloved Bruins play.  The pucks were given out at the end of the game.
> >I could just imagine what would have happened late in the third if the Bruins
> >were winning....
> 
> It figures, after I posted the first article, I found out that the Whalers are
> going to be using coupons for the the giveaway on Friday Night. I believe that
> is is the "Some Big Corporation (Probably a Bank) Flying Disk Night." I think
> that we could all see the potential for danger here...
> 
> >|> All in all, I have seen a whole bunch of giveaways land on the ice, and it
> >|> never ceases to amuse me. I'm just thankful for the players that no one has
> >|> yet to sponsor 'Lead Pipe Night' at any arenas...
> >
> >That's probably because they couldn't find anyone to sponser it... Maybe USS
> >could sponser the Pittsburgh Penguins/US Steel Steel Rod Night-- close enough?
> 
> Naah, it'd probably bounce off of Jay Caufield.
> 
> -SG

I was at a Cincinnati Cyclones game a year ago when the local country
station sponsored a kazoo giveaway.  After a particularly bad call by the
underexperienced ECHL ref, it was Kazoostorm time down on the ice.  I
thought this was a pathetic display by the fans, but they were rightfully
unhappy.

Jason

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53567
From: ad215@Freenet.carleton.ca (Rachel Holme)
Subject: Re: Canucks clinch, Bure to score 20 playoff goals


In a previous article, steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio) says:
>
>Ron Apland (apland@mala.bc.ca) writes:
>> Quinn will resign as head coach (this is no secret) and HOPEFULLY they will 
>> BRING IN someone who looks at the game spatially and institutes some team 
>> disciplined play.  How about Keenan?  Give him what he wants, GM and Coach,
>> and have Quinn upstairs as president.
>
>I was under the impression that Rick Ley was in line for the Canucks job
>should Quinn step off the bench. Ley coached in the Canucks' organization

BRING BACK HARRY!  (NEALE)  At least he was witty...

-- 
ad215@freenet.carleton.ca (Rachel Holme)]

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53568
From: loh@fraser.sfu.ca (Keith Meng-Wei Loh)
Subject: Re: Hockey and the Hispanic community

rickc@wrigley.corp.sgi.com (Richard Casares) writes:

>In article <115331@bu.edu>, icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera) writes:
>|> 
>|> 	The presence of the new team in Miami(I can't say South Florida;
>|> it's too long) makes me think of an interesting question. Can you sell
>|> the Hispanic community on Hockey? Miami is 60-70% Hispanic. This
>|> community
>|> has no experience and no previous exposure to Hockey that I know of.
>|> The
>|> teams in NY and LA which also have big Hispanic groups do not seem to
>|> try
>|> to woo this group. What will Miami do? Could they get Spanish-language
>|> tv and radio coverage?
>|> 

>You'll have a hard time selling any sport to a community that
>can't play it on account of availability or financial reasons.
>Hockey is pretty much a sport for the white and well off.

Well, suffice to say that it is a sport for those able to make the
substantial investment in equipment, etc. But here's something, do 
you think that the availability of in-line skates and road hockey
could contribute to a rise in awareness of ice hockey? I would
argue this is having an effect here. Kids play ice hockey in the
winter and road hockey in the summer with in-line skates. 


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53569
From: tvartiai@vipunen.hut.fi (Tommi Vartiainen)
Subject: Re: Suhonen will NOT go to Jokerit

In <tvartiai.734823058@vipunen.hut.fi> tvartiai@vipunen.hut.fi (Tommi Vartiainen) writes:

>According to the inside information, Alpo Suhonen won't be the next headcoach
>of Jokerit. It's pretty sure that Boris Majorov will continue, although owner
>of the team previously said that he will chance the coach.

>Tommi
Wrong information. They just announced that Suhonen has made a deal with 
Jokerit.
 

Tommi

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53570
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Mogilny must be benched.

In article <wong.734890713@sfu.ca> wong@fraser.sfu.ca (Sam S. Wong) writes:
>> About 4 or 5 weeks ago I read in the Toronto Sun a quote from Alex; it
>> went something like [sarcastically]:
>> "Yep, Patty's the man.  He's responsible for the team's success...I'm a 
>> nobody around here."

>How can you assume it was a sarcastic remark?
>For someone whose first language is not English, I would interpret
>that comment to mean that he believes Pat is the MVP on the team and that
>he is just one of the other normal players.  Quite modest I might say.

Well, I don't recall assuming anything, except perhaps that the columnist 
who reported the incident was telling the truth i.e. the sarcastic impression
came from _him_ (Steve Simmons?).  Besides, to my knowledge Alex has a pretty
fair grasp of the English language...and his recent comment after the Detroit
game would indicate that this remark _is_ what I think it to be.  Very low.


dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53571
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat


In article 20009@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca, maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>In <1993Apr15.160450.27799@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:

>>Gainey is the best defensive forward ever.  I stand by that assessment.
>>He was a very good player who belongs in the hall of fame.  Did you
>>ever watch him play? He never made a technical error.
>
>I watched him over his entire career.  I have NEVER seen a player, and that
>includes Russell Courtnall and Davie Keon, screw up as many breakaways as
>Bob Gainey.  And I will never forget the time Denis Potvin caught Gainey
>with his head down.  You have been sold a bill of goods on Bob Gainey.
>
>Gainey was a plugger.  And when the press runs out of things to say about 
>the stars on dynasties they start to hype the pluggers.  Grant Fuhr, Essa
>Tikkannen, Butch Goring, Bob Nystrom, Bob Gainey, Doug Jarvis, Derek
>Sanderson, Wayne Cashman, Bob Baun, Bob Pulford, Ralph Backstrom, Henri
>Richard, Dick Duff...and so on...

These players all are pretty good players.  They are the depth that the
dynasties had to win Stanley Cups.  They tend to be the very good second
line guys- who would be first liners on most weaker clubs in the NHL.
They were all important to their clubs.  Probably, several of these
Stanley Cup winning teams would not have won the cups they did if it
were not for the depth provided by these players.

They compare to Rick Tocchet and Ron Francis of the Penguins.  Very good
players who can lead lesser teams (Francis-Hartford, Tocchet-Philly) who
provide the depth to the team that is currently best in the NHL.

As a defensive forward, there have been none better than Bob Gainey.  That
doesn't mean he was the best player (or even the best forward) the Canadians
had at that time, but he was excellent at what he did.  Gainey could
dominate games with his defence.  He didn't need to get goals to dominate.
He shut down the opposition and was thus valuable.  There has never been
anyone any better at doing this.  Not ever.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53572
From: horse@dead.duc.auburn.edu (John Horstman)
Subject: Re: Washington To Beat Pitt

In article KKq@acsu.buffalo.edu, v128r82w@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Ralph L d'Ambrosio) writes:
>In article <1993Apr14.015415.10176@mprgate.mpr.ca>, tasallot@galaxy.mpr.ca (Mathew Tasalloti) writes...
>> 
>>If the Penguins get out of the Patrick, they will win the
>>cup.  However, their hardest task is to get out of that division.
>>I'm sure that Washington will most definitly throw a rench into the
>>Penguin plans.  I'm a Canucks fan (not that I think much of their
>>chances this year), but it seems to me like Washington is the ONLY
>>team that can stop the Penguins from winning their next Stanley Cup.
>
>I was under the impression that the Penguins has had the Caps number for 
>most of the season.
>
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>=============================================******>>
>> 
>>  Mathew Tasalloti
>>  MPR Teltech Ltd.
>>  Vancouver, BC, Canada    
>> 
>>              <<******==================================================
>********************************************************************************
>Of course no one asked me, I always interject my opinions on matters I have no
>concern over.
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Go Islanders, Playoffs here we come
>Go Jets for '93
>********************************************************************************


And last year the Capitals had the Pens number up until about game 3 of the playoffs.




John Horstmann

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53573
From: grogers@slacvx.slac.stanford.edu (Greg Rogers)
Subject: Hockey on TV in the Bay area, NOT!

Hi all,

I don't get the sport's channel and I'm desparate for some playoff action
(especially the Cannucks).  Does anyone know of a sports bar on the Bay
Peninsula that will be showing hockey games.  I'm looking for something 
between redwood City and Mountain View.

Thanks a lot,
Greg

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53574
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Goalie mask poll


	Here is an update on the Goalie mask poll...
	First, since so many people gave me their 3 best, I decided to
give 3 pts for their favorite, 2 pts for 2nd, 1 for 3rd. If you e-mailed
a response with only one, I gave it 3 pts. Please feel free to send me
your 2 other favorites, if you only sent one before. 
	Also, votes are still welcome! Any mask you like will do, as I 
have received votes for players not in the NHL. Please mention what team
they play for, though.
	So here are the up-to-date results so far:

Player                 Team              Pts     Votes
-------------------------------------------------------
1. Ed Belfour          Chicago            8        4
   Andy Moog           Boston             8        3
3. Curtis Joseph       St. Louis          5        2
4. Brian Hayward       San Jose           4        2
5. Grant Fuhr          Buffalo            3        1
   Ron Hextall         Quebec             3        1
7. Clint Malarchuk     Buffalo            2        1
   Manon Rheaume       Atlanta (IHL)      2        1
9. John Casey          Minnesota          1        1
   Rick Wamsley        Toronto (retired)  1        1

	Thanks to all that voted, and keep 'em coming!

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53575
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Washington To Beat Pitt

In article <C5J59C.GED@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil> galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin) writes:
>In article <93105.052120RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>>In article <1993Apr14.015415.10176@mprgate.mpr.ca>, tasallot@galaxy.mpr.ca
>>(Mathew Tasalloti) says:
>>>chances this year), but it seems to me like Washington is the ONLY
>>>team that can stop the Penguins from winning their next Stanley Cup.
>>
>>  Really? I think both the Islanders and Devils would have a better chance
>>at the Penguins than the Capitals, IMO.
>
>Really?  What makes you think the Islanders have a better shot?  They
>couldn't even beat the Whalers in two games!

Yes, but as has been mentioned many times before, the Islanders play at
the talent level of their opponent.  Since Hartford is pitiful, the
Islanders played pitiful.  Since Pittsburgh is great, the Isles will most
likely play great.  This is most likely due to inexperience and very poor
shooting.  To Greg: yes, I have noticed that the Islanders couldn't hit
the broad side of a barn with the puck if they were two feet in front of
it.  Does anyone have shooting percentages?  I don't know if that would
help, since they often miss the net completely, but it might shed some
light on the subject.

And, my playoff pool is running!!!  Exact rules to be posted tomorrow, but
don't hesitate to send in picks!!!

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53576
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Goalie masks

My vote goes to John Vanbiesbrouck.  His mask has a skyline of New York
City, and on the sides there are a bunch of bees (Beezer).  It looks
really sharp.

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53577
From: cbn7g@Virginia.EDU (Christopher Bass Nystrom)
Subject: Re: ESPN Tonight

swartzjh@RoseVC.Rose-Hulman.Edu writes:
> Has anyone heard what game ESPN is showing tonight.  They said they will
> show whatever game means the most playoff-wise. I would assume this would
> be the Blues-Tampa game or the Minnesota-Red Wings game...  Anyone heard for
> sure???
> 
> 
> 		Jeff Swartz


It's going to be the Stars - Wings game

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53578
From: sclark@epas.utoronto.ca (Susan Clark)
Subject: Who picks first?

	According to THE FAN here in T.O., Ottawa has won the Daigle e
sweepstakes.  They didn't mention why, but San Jose had more goals
than the Sen-sens, so I have a hunch this is why Ottawa would pick
first.....

Susan


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53579
From: 35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca
Subject: Re: Stop predicting

In article <1993Apr16.060010.10012@ncsu.edu>, cdkaupan@eos.ncsu.edu (CARL DAVID KAUPANG) writes:
> 
> It is really annoying to see all of these
> predictions on the Net.  Who really cares
> who you think will win?  Please stop with
> the predictions, we all know the Caps are
> going to win the Cup, so let it go at that.
> 
> 
In the words of Doktor Kultur, in the Ottawa Citizen,
"Remember to unhook the Nitrous Oxide before you leave
the Dentist Chair!"  8^)

GO JETS (for once, in the playoffs, please, I beg of you...)
Paul Badertscher
35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53580
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Stan Fischler, 4/16 (Keenan stuff!)

In article <1993Apr17.015225.29031@news.columbia.edu> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>
>* The Oilers will charge to eat in the Press Room next year.
>

There was an article in one of the Toronto papers about this a few
months ago...probably the Globe and Mail...

...any ethical "journalist", even a sports journalist should not
accept free meals from a team in any case, which was the one of
the points the article was making.

Admittdly, most sports reporting is mostly with any ethical
standards...

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53581
From: apland@mala.bc.ca (Ron Apland)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

In article <1993Apr16.222846.17764@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca>, golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
> It is meaningless to compare one player's plus/minus statistic with
> another players' out of the context of the role and the playing time
> of the players involved.    

It's just as meaningless to compare goals, assists, PIM and any other stat I
can think of.  Each player is asked to take a unique role for his team.  The
contexts will never be the same from one player to another playing on the
same team or different teams.  And yet ... awards are given and promotions
received based in part on these meaningless stats.  The operative words are
"in part" - stats must be interpreted, tempered with other information one
has about the player.  


> To compare Jagr's and Francis's plus/minus is ridiculous and absurd...

And comparing Jagr's and Francis's points is just as ridiculous and absurd...
but not more ridiculous and absurd as comparing goals, assists, points, +\-
for Selanne, Lindros, Juneau, Potvin, and the other rookies in the league...
and yet...

How about looking at them for what they are and enjoy the game.

Ron

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53582
From: "James J. Murawski" <jjm+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: This Year's vs. Next Year's Playoffs


Well, since someone probably wanted to know, here's this year's playoff
matchups on the left, and what the matchups would be next year under the
new alignment and playoff-matchup rules.  The same 16 teams make the playoffs
under next year's rules, and three of the first round matchups are the same
(QUE-MTL, CHI-STL, VAN-WIN).

PIT --+                      +-- CHI | PIT --+                      +-- CHI
      +---+              +---+       |       +---+              +---+
NJ  --+   |              |   +-- STL | BUF --+   |              |   +-- STL
          +---+      +---+           |           +---+      +---+
WAS --+   |   |      |   |   +-- DET | QUE --+   |   |      |   |   +-- TOR
      +---+   |      |   +---+       |       +---+   |      |   +---+
NYI --+       |      |       +-- TOR | MTL --+       |      |       +-- CAL
              +------+               |               +------+
BOS --+       |      |       +-- VAN | WAS --+       |      |       +-- VAN
      +---+   |      |   +---+       |       +---+   |      |   +---+
BUF --+   |   |      |   |   +-- WIN | NJ  --+   |   |      |   |   +-- WIN
          +---+      +---+           |           +---+      +---+
QUE --+   |              |   +-- CAL | BOS --+   |              |   +-- DET
      +---+              +---+       |       +---+              +---+
MTL --+                      +-- LA  | NYI --+                      +-- LA


====================================================================
    Jim Murawski
    Sr. Software Engineer               (412) 268-2650  [office]
    Administrative Computing and        (412) 268-6868  [fax]
         Information Services           jjm+@andrew.cmu.edu
    Carnegie Mellon University          Office: UCC 155
    4910 Forbes Avenue
    Pittsburgh, PA 15213-3890

    "Le Mieux!  Le Magnifique!  Soixante Six!  Claude...NON!"

There are 1374 days until Clinton (Clinocchio) leaves office (1373 too many).


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53583
From: seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr)
Subject: FLYERS notes 4/17



The FLYERS closed out the season last night with their 8th straight victory,
a 5-4 OT winner over the Hartford Whalers. The OT game winner came from Dimitri
Yushkevich, just his 5th of the season and his first game winner. The FLYERS
never led up until that point in the game. For the Whalers, the loss marked an
NHL record 9th OT loss this season.

Roster move:

Gord Hynes was called to to play in place of Ryan McGill

Injuries:

Ryan McGill injured his hand in a fight 4/15 and was scratched.

Lines:

Eklund-Lindros-Recchi
Beranek-Brind'Amour-Dineen
Lomakin-Butsayev-Conroy
Faust-Acton-Brown

Galley-Bowen
Yushkevich-Hawgood
Carkner-Hynes

Dominic Roussel

Game Summary:

I didn't get TV coverage of the game, and since it was stormy in these parts
I didn't have the best radio coverage either. Here's the box score followed by
a few things I did pick up:

First Period:
	Hartford, Nylander 10, 8:51
	Philadelphia, Recchi 53 (Lindros, Brind'Amour), 19:59.8 (pp)
Penalties - Verbeek, Har (holding), :55; Carkner, Phi (roughing), 13:53; Houda,
Har (interference) 18:43

Second Period:
	Hartford, Burt 6 (Cunneyworth, Kron), 2:00
	Philadelphia, Bowen 1 (Eklund, Recchi), 7:09
	Hartford, Nylander 11 (Zalapski, Sanderson), 9:38
Penalties - Galley, Phi, major-game misconduct (spearing) :58; Verbeek, Har
major-game misconduct (spearing), :58; Brown, Phi (tripping), 3:22; Zalapski,
Har (tripping), 15:51; Brind'Amour, Phi (slashing), 19:50

Third Period:
	Hartford, Kron 14 (Sanderson, Cassels), 1:24 (pp)
	Philadelphia, Beranek 15 (Lomakin, Yushkevich), 3:11
	Philadelphia, Faust 2 (Brind'Amour, Roussel), 3:38
Penalties - Houda, Har (tripping), 4:20; Hawgood, Phi (holding), 5:30

Overtime:
	Philadelphia, Yushkevich 5 (Faust), 1:15.
Penalties - None

Power Play:
	Philadelphia 1 of 4, Hartford 1 of 4

Goalies:
	Philadelphia, Roussel 14-11-5 (30 shots - 26 saves)
	Hartford, Lenarduzzi, 1-1-1 (38 - 33)

On the first Hartford goal, Gord Hynes misplayed the puck at the FLYERS blue
line and Nylander stripped him and took off.

The Recchi goal was a 2 on 1 with Lindros.

The Bowen goal was just a puck he threw at the net, got a good carom and it
ended up behind the goalie.

On the second Nylander goal he got three whacks at the puck before it went in.
This is the most frustrating part of the FLYERS defense. Take the body, and if
they get one shot and beat you fine. Don't give them another chance. Carkner,
Galley and McGill are all terrible about this, I'll bet money at least one of
them was the closest FLYER to the play.

That's all I have, my radio got bad after that and I was lucky to know who it
was that scored, much less how.

From what I heard, Roussel had a very strong game. After the game, Gene Hart
asked Bobby Taylor to pick the three stars of the season rather than of the
game. It was Garry Galley #3 for his career high point total (I'm surprised
that a former goalie wouldn't look closer at his defensive play), Tommy 
Soderstrom #2 for his team record tying 5 shutouts in only about 1/2 a season
and, Mark Recchi #1 for his all time high team single season scoring mark.
But here's the odd part. He couldn't decide between Lindros and Recchi for
number 1. If he picks Recchi as #1 after he had a hard time choosing between
him and Lindros, doesn't that make Lindros #2????

What? You wanna know my three stars of the season? Well, since you asked...

#1 Eric Lindros. Eric dominates a game simply by stepping out onto the ice.
The difference between the team's record with him and without him is no
accident. I believe that the team could have been almost as successful without
Recchi. There is no question that this team is significantly better with Eric
Lindros on it, and I think that he will deservedly wear the 'C' on his jersey
next season.

#2 Tommy Soderstrom. 5 shutouts was second in the league to only Ed Belfour,
and Tommy didn't have a Chris Chelios (booo) in front of him. He also didn't
play a complete season due to heart problems (sentimental edge here, my family
has a history of heart problems). There's no question in my mind that Tommy
Soderstrom is this teams goalie of the future, and if Roussel complains again
about being number 2 look for him to be traded within 2 years.

#3 Mark Recchi. Again, you can't argue with an all-time team high single season
scoring mark. There are an awful lot of teams that didn't have a single player
get as many points. Plus, Mark is the only FLYER to play the entire season.
Not a tough choice.

Honorable mentions: Rod Brind'Amour topped his single season high point total
which he set last year. The difference was that he wasn't on the top line
this year and didn't get as much playing time. Then again, he didn't get the
defensive attention that he got last year from the other team either.

Dimtri Yushkevich was the teams most consistent defenseman. Yes, he made rookie
mistakes, but he was usually fast enough to make up for them. I have a feeling
that with his shot he'll score a few more points next year without giving up
anything in his own zone, and I suspect that he'll be the teams top defenseman
in years to come.

Garry Galley was the team's point leader from defensemen. Again, there are some
things you just can't argue with. And he battled with chronic fatigue syndrome,
he certainly deserves kudos for only missing one game, and that was against his
wishes under doctors orders. But his defensive play often negates his offensive
contribution. A little more caution, and a little bit smarter in his own end
will make him a much more important part of the team next year.

Brent Fedyk was the leagues biggest improvement over last years point total.
But consistency became a problem for him.

A couple misc notes mostly for mailing list members:

Tom Misnik, a member of the mailing list, would like to exchange E-mail
addresses with any list members who want to keep in touch over the summer.
If you're interested, you can send him mail at:

att!ACR.ORG!TMISNIK

The FLYERS end the season 1 game below .500 in 5th place, their best winning
percentage since going .500 in 1988-89. 14-20-3 within the division (4th in
Patrick), 23-14-5 at home. They finished 17th overall, will draft 10th in
next years entry draft (Quebec had the 1st rounder, though). They scored as
many goals as they allowed, 319.

The 8 straight wins is the most since they won 13 in a row in 1985.

I will be sending out final stats as soon as I get the issue of the Hockey
News that contains them, since there are no more games for me to go to I have
no other way of getting them.

I hope you've all enjoyed this years hockey season as much as I have. Knowing
the future that we have coming to us made missing the playoffs one more time
almost bearable.

FLYERS team record watch:

Eric Lindros:

41 goals, 34 assists, 75 points

(rookie records)
club record goals:			club record points:
Eric Lindros	40 1992-93		Dave Poulin	76 1983-84
Brian Propp	34 1979-80		Brian Propp	75 1979-80
Ron Flockhart	33 1981-82		Eric Lindros	75 1992-93
Dave Poulin	31 1983-84		Ron Flockhart	72 1981-82
Bill Barber	30 1972-73		Pelle Eklund	66 1985-86

Mark Recchi:

53 goals, 70 assists, 123 points.

club record goals:			club record points:
Reggie Leach	61 1975-76		Mark Recchi	123 1992-93*
Tim Kerr	58 1985-86,86-87	Bobby Clarke	119 1975-76
Tim Kerr	54 1983-84,84-85	Bobby Clarke	116 1974-75
Mark Recchi	53 1992-93*		Bill Barber	112 1975-76
Rick Macliesh	50 1972-73		Bobby Clarke	104 1972-73
Bill Barber	50 1975-76		Rick Macliesh	100 1972-73
Reggie Leach	50 1979-80

*More than 80 games.

FLYERS career years:

Player		Points	Best Prior Season
Mark Recchi	123	113 (90-91 Penguins)
Rod Brind'Amour	86	77 (91-92 FLYERS)
Garry Galley	62	38 (84-85 Kings)
Brent Fedyk	59	35 (90-91 Red Wings)

That's all for now...

pete clark jr - rsh FLYERS contact and mailing list owner


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53584
From: 06paul@ac.dal.ca
Subject: My Predictions of a classic playoff year!

Here is yet another prediction for them great playoffs!
(you may laugh at your convenience!) :)

	Adams Division (I hate the NE (name) divisoin!!!)

BOS vs BUF   BOS in 5  (the B's are hot lately!)

MON vs QUE   MON in 7  (This will be the series to watch in the first round!)


BOS vs MON   MON in 7  (this may be a bit biased but I feel the Canadiens will
		       (smarten up and start playing they played two months ago
			( i.e. bench Savard !!!)
	Patrick Division 

PIT vs NJD   PIT in 6  (It wont be a complete cake walk... there be a few lumps
			(in the cake batter!)

WAS vs NYI   WAS in 6  	(This will not be an exciting series..IMO)


PITT vs WAS  PIT in 4   (Washington will be tired after the NYI)

	Norris Division

CHI vs StL    CHI in 5   (StL will get a lucky game in)

TOR vs DET    TOR in 7   (THis , like MON vs QUE, will be another intense 
			 (series to watch!)

CHI vs TOR    TOR in 7   (Potvin will be settling in nicely by this point.)

	Smythe Division

VAN vs WIN     VAN in 5  (Teemu is great, but Vancouver better as a team!)

CAL vs LAK     CAL in 6  (Gretzky is great, but Calgary has been on fire lately)
				...sorry for the pun... um, no I am not! :)

VAN vs CAL     VAN in 6  (This will be a great series! but VAN has proven they
			 (Will not lie down and get beat!)

	Wales Conference finals

Pittsburgh vs Montreal    	Montreal in 6 (Montreal IMHO is the only team
					      (that has a chance against 
						Pittsburgh.)

	Campbell Conference finals

Vancouver vs Toronto		Toronto in 6  (Potvin will be series MVP)


	STANLEY CUP FINALS  

Toronto Maple Leafs    vs    Montreal Canadiens    
	(The Classic Stanley Cup Final matchup!!) <---also a dream come true!

	Montreal wins the Stanley cup in the 7th game 1 - 0 in double overtime.
Roy and Potvin are spectacular throughout the series and share series MVP (if 
that is possible) Vincent Damphouse nets game winner from a brilliant pass by
Brian Bellows! Canadiens star(?) Denis Savard watched his buddies play from the
owners box nursing that splinter on his thumb which has left him on the 
disabled list since the first game of the playoffs (awww shucks). 

***************************************YEE HAA!!*******************************
*poof* And I wake up :)
Well that is my predictions...I hope and dream they come true. and you can stop
laughing anytime :)

							Paul
						Die hard Habs Fan living with
						3 Die hard Leafs fans!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53585
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL playoff results, 4/16

AHL CALDER CUP PLAYOFF GAME(S) PLAYED ON 4/16
Providence 3	SPRINGFIELD 2	(OT)	
Baltimore 4	BINGHAMTON 3		
Utica 3		ROCHESTER 2	(OT)	
Cape Breton 5	FREDERICTON 2		

GAME(S) SCHEDULED FOR 4/17
Capital District at Adirondack		
Providence at Springfield
Baltimore at Binghamton
Utica at Rochester			
Moncton vs St John's at Halifax		
					
SERIES STATI (plural of status? :)
Adirondack leads CDI, 1-0
Springfield leads Providence, 2-1
Baltimore leads Binghamton 1-0
Utica leads Rochester, 1-0
St John's leads Moncton, 1-0
Cape Breton tied w/Fredericton, 1-1
	
=================================================
=================================================
FULL 1993 CALDER CUP PLAYOFF SCHEDULE AND RESULTS	
home team in CAPS		*=if necesary

FIRST ROUND					
Springfield Indians vs Providence Bruins
Gm 1:	Springfield 3	PROVIDENCE 2	
Gm 2:	Springfield 5	PROVIDENCE 4
Gm 3:	Providence 3	SPRINGFIELD 2
Gm 4:	4/17	Providence at Springfield
Gm 5:	4/22	Springfield at Providence	
Gm 6:	4/24	Providence at Springfield	*
Gm 7:	4/27	Springfield at Providence	*

CD Islanders vs Adirondack Red Wings
Gm 1:	ADIRONDACK 6	CDI 2
Gm 2:	4/17	CDI at Adirondack
Gm 3:	4/18	Adirondack at CDI
Gm 4:	4/21	Adirondack at CDI
Gm 5:	4/23	CDI at Adirondack	*
Gm 6:	4/24	Adirondack at CDI	*
Gm 7:	4/26	CDI at Adirondack	*

Baltimore Skipjacks at Binghamton Rangers
Gm 1:	Baltimore 4	BINGHAMTON 3	
Gm 2:	4/17	Baltimore at Binghamton
Gm 3:	4/23	Binghamton at Baltimore
Gm 4:	4/24	Binghamton at Baltimore
Gm 5:	4/26	Baltimore at Binghamton	*
Gm 6:	4/28	Binghmaton at Baltimore	*
Gm 7:	4/30	Baltimore at Binghamton	*
		
Utica Devils vs Rochester Americans
Gm 1:	Utica 3		Rochester 2	(OT)
Gm 2:	4/17	Utica at Rochester
Gm 3:	4/20	Rochester at Utica
Gm 4:	4/22	Rochester at Utica
Gm 5:	4/24	Utica at Rochester	*
Gm 6:	4/26	Rochester at Utica	*
Gm 7:	4/28	Utica at Rochester	*

Moncton Hawks vs St John's Maple Leafs
Gm 1:	St John's 4	Moncton 2
Gm 2:	4/17	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax
Gm 3:	4/21	St John's at Moncton
Gm 4:	4/23	St John's at Moncton
Gm 5:	4/26	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax	*
Gm 6:	4/28	St John's at Moncton		*
Gm 7:	4/30	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax	*

Cape Breton Oilers vs Fredericton Canadiens
Gm 1:	FREDERICTON 4	Cape Breton 3	(2OT)
Gm 2:	Cape Breton 5	FREDERICTON 2
Gm 3:	4/20	Fredericton at Cape Breton
Gm 4:	4/22	Fredericton at Cape Breton
Gm 5:	4/24	Cape Breton at Fredericton	
Gm 6:	4/26	Fredericton at Cape Breton	*
Gm 7:	4/28	Cape Breton at Fredericton	*

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL and ECAC contact for rec.sport.hockey		Go USA Hockey!	   +	
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    + CONGRATS TO THE BOSTON BRUINS, 1992-93 ADAMS DIVISION CHAMPIONS      +
    + PHOENIX SUNS, 1992-93 PACIFIC DIVISION CHAMPIONS			   +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++






Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53586
From: downec@crockett1a.its.rpi.edu (Christopher Stevan Downey)
Subject: Re: This Year's vs. Next Year's Playoffs

Let's fill in some winners here:

|> 
|> Well, since someone probably wanted to know, here's this year's playoff
|> matchups on the left, and what the matchups would be next year under the
|> new alignment and playoff-matchup rules.  The same 16 teams make the playoffs
|> under next year's rules, and three of the first round matchups are the same
|> (QUE-MTL, CHI-STL, VAN-WIN).
|> 
|> PIT --+                      +-- CHI | PIT --+                      +-- CHI
|>       +PIT+              +CHI+       |       +---+              +---+
|> NJ  --+   |              |   +-- STL | BUF --+   |              |   +-- STL
|>           +NYI+      +DET+           |           +---+      +---+
|> WAS --+   |   |      |   |   +-- DET | QUE --+   |   |      |   |   +-- TOR
|>       +NYI+   |      |   +DET+       |       +---+   |      |   +---+
|> NYI --+       | *BOS*|       +-- TOR | MTL --+       |      |       +-- CAL
|>               +------+               |               +------+
|> BOS --+       |  DET |       +-- VAN | WAS --+       |      |       +-- VAN
|>       +BOS+   |      |   +VAN+       |       +---+   |      |   +---+
|> BUF --+   |   |      |   |   +-- WIN | NJ  --+   |   |      |   |   +-- WIN
|>           +BOS+      +VAN+           |           +---+      +---+
|> QUE --+   |              |   +-- CAL | BOS --+   |              |   +-- DET
|>       +QUE+              +CAL+       |       +---+              +---+
|> MTL --+                      +-- LA  | NYI --+                      +-- LA
|> 

Just my thoughts,
Chris
downec@rpi.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53587
From: downec@crockett1a.its.rpi.edu (Christopher Stevan Downey)
Subject: Re: My Predictions of a classic playoff year!

In article <1993Apr17.152611.12934@ac.dal.ca>, 06paul@ac.dal.ca writes:
|> Here is yet another prediction for them great playoffs!
|> (you may laugh at your convenience!) :)
|> 
|> 	Adams Division (I hate the NE (name) divisoin!!!)
|> 
|> BOS vs BUF   BOS in 5  (the B's are hot lately!)
|> 
|> MON vs QUE   MON in 7  (This will be the series to watch in the first round!)
|> 
|> 
|> BOS vs MON   MON in 7  (this may be a bit biased but I feel the Canadiens will
|> 		       (smarten up and start playing they played two months ago
|> 			( i.e. bench Savard !!!)
|> 	Patrick Division 
|> 
|> PIT vs NJD   PIT in 6  (It wont be a complete cake walk... there be a few lumps
|> 			(in the cake batter!)
|> 
|> WAS vs NYI   WAS in 6  	(This will not be an exciting series..IMO)
|> 
|> 
|> PITT vs WAS  PIT in 4   (Washington will be tired after the NYI)
|> 
|> 	Norris Division
|> 
|> CHI vs StL    CHI in 5   (StL will get a lucky game in)
|> 
|> TOR vs DET    TOR in 7   (THis , like MON vs QUE, will be another intense 
|> 			 (series to watch!)
|> 
|> CHI vs TOR    TOR in 7   (Potvin will be settling in nicely by this point.)
|> 
|> 	Smythe Division
|> 
|> VAN vs WIN     VAN in 5  (Teemu is great, but Vancouver better as a team!)
|> 
|> CAL vs LAK     CAL in 6  (Gretzky is great, but Calgary has been on fire lately)
|> 				...sorry for the pun... um, no I am not! :)
|> 
|> VAN vs CAL     VAN in 6  (This will be a great series! but VAN has proven they
|> 			 (Will not lie down and get beat!)
|> 
|> 	Wales Conference finals
|> 
|> Pittsburgh vs Montreal    	Montreal in 6 (Montreal IMHO is the only team
|> 					      (that has a chance against 
|> 						Pittsburgh.)
|> 
|> 	Campbell Conference finals
|> 
|> Vancouver vs Toronto		Toronto in 6  (Potvin will be series MVP)
|> 
|> 
|> 	STANLEY CUP FINALS  
|> 
|> Toronto Maple Leafs    vs    Montreal Canadiens    
|> 	(The Classic Stanley Cup Final matchup!!) <---also a dream come true!
|> 
|> 	Montreal wins the Stanley cup in the 7th game 1 - 0 in double overtime.
|> Roy and Potvin are spectacular throughout the series and share series MVP (if 
|> that is possible) Vincent Damphouse nets game winner from a brilliant pass by
|> Brian Bellows! Canadiens star(?) Denis Savard watched his buddies play from the
|> owners box nursing that splinter on his thumb which has left him on the 
|> disabled list since the first game of the playoffs (awww shucks). 
|> 
|> ***************************************YEE HAA!!*******************************
|> *poof* And I wake up :)
|> Well that is my predictions...I hope and dream they come true. and you can stop
|> laughing anytime :)
|> 
|> 							Paul
|> 						Die hard Habs Fan living with
|> 						3 Die hard Leafs fans!

I only have one comment on this:  You call this a *classic* playoff year
and yet you don't include a Chicago-Detroit series.  C'mon, I'm a Boston
fan and I even realize that Chicago-Detroit games are THE most exciting
games to watch.

Chris
downec@rpi.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53588
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Who picks first?

Ottawa picks first, because they had fewer wins during the season, the
first tiebreaker.

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53589
From: jason@studsys.mscs.mu.edu (Jason Hanson)
Subject: Re: NHL team in Milwaukee

Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: NHL team in Milwaukee
Summary: 
Expires: 
References: <1qhsfe$80v@access.digex.net> <1993Apr15.093354.14844@abo.fi> <1993Apr16.131843.24012@walter.cray.com>
Sender: 
Followup-To: 
Distribution: 
Organization: Marquette University - Department MSCS
Keywords: 

In article <1993Apr16.131843.24012@walter.cray.com> cbetz@radioman.cray.com (Charles Betz  {x66442 CF/ENG}) writes:
>
>Bradley Center in Milwaukee is home to the Milwaukee Admirals minor leauge
>hockey team.  The owner of the Admirals (sorry, I can't remember his name)
>either owns or at least shelled out the majority of the funds to build the
>Bradley Center.

Lloyd Pettit married into Allen-Bradley Corp. (ab.com) family and owns the
Admirals.  He donated the Bradley Center and the new Pettit National Ice
Center.

>Supposedly he was approached by the NHL about an expansion franchise, but 
>turned it down because he thought the franchise fee of $50 million was too
>high.

This is not the way I have heard it.  See, Lloyd (as he is affectionately
referred to by Milwaukeeans and Bob Uecker) bought the Bradley Center *TO* get
the NHL to come here.

>Like I said, I don't know whether this story is true or just a rumor, but if
>it's true, don't look for an NHL team in Milwaukee anytime soon.  The Admirals
>aren't going to be forced out of the building and you won't see an NHL club
>and a minor league club in the same building, especially since the NBA's
>Milwaukee Bucks play there as well.

Yeah, the Bucks, the Milwaukee Wave (soccer), the Admirals, the Marquette
Warriors, concerts and a bunch of other things...
-- 
Jason Hanson         |  915 W. Wisconsin Ave #1010  |  (414) 288-2179
Marquette University |   Milwaukee, WI 53233-2373   |  Ham Radio: N9LEA/AE
--  jason@studsys.mscs.mu.edu    ==+==    n9lea@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na  --

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53590
From: mep@phoenix.oulu.fi (Marko Poutiainen)
Subject: Re: Finland/Sweden vs.NHL teams (WAS:Helsinki/Stockholm & NH

: you mention could cut it as stars in the NHL! Even "Rexi" in his prime was more
: of a good regular in New York/Edmonton than a superstar in his own right,
: although some blamed that on lack of effort on his behalf.
:
I think that the NY management made a mistake, and remember how Edmonton 
called Reksa in the middle of the season to win the cup ? Why did they call
him?
 
: Yeah, we've had a tendency to beat ourselves in the past. I almost knifed my
: brother in anger when Sweden scored two in the final minute of the WC 
: semifinals back in 1986:-) Or what about the three goals Antero Kivela let in
: with five minutes to go against the Russkies in Lake Placid'80? Ugh . . . 

O.K., that was BAD luck. If Penguins have the same kind of luck this year in
the playoffs, they'll never win the cup. They are still the best team.

--
***********************************************************************
* 'Howl howl gargle howl gargle howl howl howl gargle howl gargle howl* 
*  howl gargle gargle howl gargle gargle gargle howl slurrp uuuurgh'  *
*                                       -Prostetnic Vogon Jeltz       *
***********************************************************************
	-Marko Poutiainen
	 mep@phoenix.oulu.fi

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53591
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Playoff pool

Well, I looked at the scoring plan I had, and have decided to modify it. 
Here is the new, finalized scoring:

Pick 1st round winner, way off on games:	2
"     "    "     "     pick within one game:	3
"     "    "     "     pick exact games:	4

Pick 2nd round winner, way off on games:	4
"     "    "     "     pick within one game:	5
"     "    "     "     pick exact games:	7

Pick conference champ, way off on games:	7
"	"	"      pick within one game:	10
"	"	"      pick exact games:	13

Pick Stanley Cup winner, way off on games:	13
"	"    "	   "	pick within one game:	17
"	"    "	   "	pick exact games:	20
Pick loser in 7, series goes 7:			2
Pick loser in 7, game 7 decided in OT:		4

These are now final.  Anyone needing a copy of the entry sheet, email me
at the address below. 

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53592
From: cobra@ravel.udel.edu (KING COBRA)
Subject: Re: NHLPA poll (partial stats/results)

In article <ofnmaO_00iV1A6kYd2@andrew.cmu.edu> Young-Soo Che <yc25+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>All these people who send in their polls should take a closer look at
>NJD, they are a very deep team, with two very capable goalies, and
>excellent forwards and defensemen.  Shooter in Richer, an all around do
>it all in Todd, chef Stasny-master of a thousand dishes, power play
>captain-Stevens.  Take a look at the numbers, or play with them and see
>for yourselves.

  Yup. I agree with ya. I think Devils can beat Red Wings easily. SO I think
  all those who send in their votes should try all these diffrent teams
  before voting. I think Islanders and Quebec are much better then I had
  expected.

  COBRA



*******************************************************************************
**   ___  ____  ____  ____  ____  **                                         **
**  /    /   / /___/ /___/ /___/  **   Sex is not the answer, sex is the     **
** /___ /___/ /___/ / \_  /   /   **   question. Yes is the answer.          **
**                                **                                         **
** E-mail: cobra@chopin.udel.edu  **                                         **
**                                **                                         **
*******************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53593
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Finland/Sweden vs.NHL teams (WAS:Helsinki/Stockholm & NH

In article <1993Apr17.170255.23800@abo.fi> MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF) writes:
>
>Jutila was a failure, I think, while Makela (and Ari Haanpaa) had an
>on-again/off-again career with the Islanders. Both players had to play in the
>minors. Of course I "like" our players, I just don't think the names
>you mention could cut it as stars in the NHL! Even "Rexi" in his prime was more
>of a good regular in New York/Edmonton than a superstar in his own right,
>although some blamed that on lack of effort on his behalf.
>

Ruotsaleinen was a more than competent NHL'er...his choice of where
to play when did not bear on his hockey playing ability.

He was crucial to the Oilers Stanley Cup victory in 1990, the one
without Gretzky, because he made an Oiler power play which was
lethargic that year until he arrived slide into overdrive.  The
Oilers missed him more the following year than Kurri, and I think
the Oilers would have make the finals if Ruotsaleinen has stayed
around the following season, and would have beaten Pittsburgh
with Ruotsaleinen and a healthy Messier...and delayed Pittsburgh's
dynasty by a season.  

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53594
From: kerney@ecn.purdue.edu (John Kerney)
Subject: Re: FLYERS notes 4/17



Could someone post the Flyers record with and without Eric Lindros in
the lineup


I have a guy that is trying to compare the Quebec/Flyers trade to the 

Dallas/Minnesota trade in the NFL(Hershel Walker)

I just need the stat to back up my point that Eric will be one of the next

great players

thanks

john

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53595
From: Derek_Juntunen@abcd.houghton.mi.us (Derek Juntunen)
Subject: Who will be #1 pick in NHL draft?

I recently bought a pack of prospect hockey cards which had various
players that were coming into the NHL. I got this particular card of
a Russian named Viktor Kozlov. It says "many scouts believe he will
be the #1 pick in 1993". Another guy is quoted as saying "He's as 
good as Mario Lemieux". Anyone know who this guy is?????

-- Via DLG Pro v0.995


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53596
From: j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
Subject: Plus minus stat

>Post: 51246 of 51422
>Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
>From: j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
>Subject: Plus minus stat
>Organization: University of Western Ontario
>Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1993 04:42:11 GMT
>Nntp-Posting-Host: sms.business.uwo.ca
>Lines: 165
 
>I'm not defending Bob Gainey...frankly, I don't care for him all
>that much.  But your dismissal of him as something less than an
>effective hockey player is tiresome...it has no basis in
>anything.  How many Calders did he win? I think it was four (go
                     ^^^^^^^
Ooops...that should read Selke...forgive me for my insolence.
 
congenially, as always,
 
jd
 
-- 
James David 
j3david@student.business.uwo.ca

j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
Western Business School  --  London, Ontario

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53597
From: mdell+@pitt.edu (Michael G Dellinger)
Subject: Re: Stop predicting

In article <1993Apr16.233148.9711@rose.com> jack.petrilli@rose.com (jack petrilli) writes:
>On April 16,  cdkaupan@eos.ncsu.edu (CARL DAVID KAUPANG) wrote:
>
>C(--> It is really annoying to see all of these
>C(--> predictions on the Net.  Who really cares
>C(--> who you think will win?  Please stop with
>C(--> the predictions, we all know the Caps are
>C(--> going to win the Cup, so let it go at that.
>C(--> 
>
>Haa!!! That's one of the things I find **most** interesting in this 
>newsgroup. It's a good way of cluing into the "collective wisdom" of 
>the average hockey fans. That doesn't mean they're always right, 
>however. For example, the Habs are going to come out of the Adams and 
>hardly anyone believes that right now.
>
>- Jack
>
> * It's hard to be humble when you're perfect.

Well, as long as we're being unduly cocky here, It's obvious that the Pens
will cone out of the Patrick Division *not* the Caps, and also that
they will win thier third Stanley Cup. "Collective Wisdom" is a very polite
way of putting it, I don't know if I'd be so gracious.
And, for what it's worth (Probably not much) I think the Habs will come out of
the Adams too.
                       Not new, Long absent,
                                       Mikey D.
__
*****************************************************************************
Mike Dellinger
Computer Lab Consultant
Sutherland Hall Computer Lab and Grill
University of Pittsburgh
****************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53598
From: icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera)
Subject: Hockey & Hispanic market


In article <saross01.734885336@starbase.spd.louisville.edu>, saross01@starbase.spd.louisville.edu (Stacey A. Ross) writes:
|> In <C5I2s2.3Bt@odin.corp.sgi.com> rickc@wrigley.corp.sgi.com (Richard Casares) writes:
|> >You'll have a hard time selling any sport to a community that
|> >can't play it on account of availability or financial reasons.
|> >Hockey is pretty much a sport for the white and well off.

What is this crap? I'm only interested in intelligent discussion. If you 
can't answer my question, just say so. Can anyone else answer the ques.?


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53599
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: hawks vs leafs lastnight

In article <93106.082502ACPS6992@RyeVm.Ryerson.Ca> Raj Ramnarace <ACPS6992@RyeVm.Ryerson.Ca> writes:
>did anyone else see this game last night ? just like a playoff game!!
>lots of hitting...but I was disappointed by the video goal judge...
>on all replays, joe murphy's goal shouldn't have counted ! it didn't go in net
>!! and according to the tsn broadcasters, the video goal judge said that he
>saw the water bottle on top of the cage move so he assumed the puck went in!
>this is terrible...hope crap like this doesn't occur in the playoffs!
>the game would have ended in 2-2 tie !

I thought the red light went on...thus, in the review, the presumption
would be to find conclusive evidence that the puck did not go in the
net...from the replays I say, even from the rear, the evidence wasn't
conclusive that the puck was in or out...in my opinion...

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53600
From: ndallen@r-node.hub.org (Nigel Allen)
Subject: Brown University Ordered To Restore Two Women's Varsity Teams

I found this press release from Trial Lawyers for Public Justice on
another system, and thought it would be of interest on campuses 
where the administration or the athletics department wants to 
eliminate the women's ice hockey team.

 Women Athletes, TLP Win Sex Discrimination Ruling: Brown University
Ordered to Restore Two Women's Varsity Teams
To: National Desk, Sports Writer
 Contact: Lynette Labinger, 401-421-9794, home 401-274-7507, or
          Ray Marcaccio, 401-831-8900, both of Trial Lawyers For
          Public Justice

   WASHINGTON, April 16 -- The U.S. Court of Appeals
for the First Circuit in Boston has upheld a U.S. District Court
order requiring Brown University to immediately reinstate its women's
gymnastics and volleyball teams to full varsity status. The ruling in
Cohen et al. v. Brown University is the first appeals court decision
in the nation applying Title IX to intercollegiate athletics.  Trial
Lawyers for Public Justice (TLPJ), is the national public interest
law firm representing the women athletes.
   "This ruling makes clear what we have said all along -- if a
school wants to eliminate teams before women have their fair share of
opportunities to participate, they can only eliminiate men's teams,"
said TLPJ Executive Director Arthur Bryant, co-counsel in the case.
   The class action, filed April, 1992, charged Brown with violating
Title IX of the Education Amendments of 1972, the federal law that
prohibits sex discrimination by all educational institutions
receiving federal funds.  Brown terminated the two women's teams as
university-funded sports in May 1991, allowing them to continue to
compete against varsity teams if they could raise their own funds for
uniforms, travel, coaches, and all other expenses.  They had also
been denied admission preferences for use in recruiting new members.
   "This is a major victory for women and the cause of equal rights,"
said TLPJ lead counsel Lynette Labinger of Providence's Roney &
Labinger.  "Universities across America need to reevaluate their
programs quickly. Title IX is the law and it's going to be enforced."
   Three similar Title IX appeals await decision.  Colorado State
University, Indiana University of Pennsylvania (IUP), and Colgate
University are asking federal appeals courts to overturn court orders
requiring them to reinstate or establish specific women's varsity
teams.  Continuing its cutting-edge Title IX activities, TLPJ is
representing women athletes at IUP.
   In addition to Labinger and Bryant, TLPJ's legal team included:
Ray Marcaccio of Blish & Cavanagh and Amato DeLuca of Mandell, DeLuca
& Schwartz in Providence; and Sandra Duggan of Philadelphia.  The
National Women's Law Center, Women's Sports Foundation, and National
Association for Girls and Women in Sports filed an amicus brief in
support of TLPJ's appeal.
 -30-

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53601
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: hawks vs leafs lastnight

In <1993Apr18.153820.10118@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:

>In article <93106.082502ACPS6992@RyeVm.Ryerson.Ca> Raj Ramnarace <ACPS6992@RyeVm.Ryerson.Ca> writes:
>>did anyone else see this game last night ? just like a playoff game!!
>>lots of hitting...but I was disappointed by the video goal judge...
>>on all replays, joe murphy's goal shouldn't have counted ! it didn't go in net
>>!! and according to the tsn broadcasters, the video goal judge said that he
>>saw the water bottle on top of the cage move so he assumed the puck went in!
>>this is terrible...hope crap like this doesn't occur in the playoffs!
>>the game would have ended in 2-2 tie !

>I thought the red light went on...thus, in the review, the presumption
>would be to find conclusive evidence that the puck did not go in the
>net...from the replays I say, even from the rear, the evidence wasn't
>conclusive that the puck was in or out...in my opinion...

It seemed pretty conclusive to me.  The puck clearly hit the crossbar
and then came down on the line.  And the announcers, admittedly homers,
kept harping about how they "must have had a different view upstairs"
because it was obvious to them, and, I would have thought, to anyone who
saw the replay, that the puck didn't go in.  The referee originally 
signalled no goal but the video replay "judges" initiated contact with
the referee to claim that a goal was in fact scored.  This, to me, is
unheard of.  Seeing stuff like this happen gives me a bad feeling about
the Leaf chances this year.

cordially, as always,

rm

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53602
From: e8l6@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (Rocket)
Subject: NHL Final point standings


    Individual leaders by total points (Final standings)
    NOTE: Games played and points per games not accurate !!

    Player       Team   GP  G   A  Pts ppg  Prj PIM +/-

    M.Lemieux    PIT    59  69  91 160 2.71 160  38  53
    LaFontaine   BUF    82  53  95 148 1.80 148  63  13
    Oates        BOS    83  45  97 142 1.71 142  32  12
    Yzerman      DET    83  58  79 137 1.65 137  44  33
    Turgeon      NYI    80  58  74 132 1.65 132  26  -2
    Selanne      WIN    82  76  56 132 1.61 132  45   6
    Mogilny      BUF    75  76  51 127 1.69 127  40   9
    Gilmour      TOR    81  32  95 127 1.57 127  96  32
    Robitaille   LA     82  63  62 125 1.52 127 100  16
    Recchi       PHI    81  53  70 123 1.52 123  95  -2
    Sundin       QUE    79  47  67 114 1.44 114  96  19
    Stevens      PIT    71  55  57 112 1.58 112 169  16
    Bure         VAN    82  60  50 110 1.34 110  67  37
    Tocchet      PIT    79  48  61 109 1.38 109 240  28
    Roenick      CHI    82  50  57 107 1.30 107  82  15
    Janney       STL    82  24  82 106 1.29 106  12   1
    Sakic        QUE    77  48  57 105 1.36 105  40  -4
    Juneau       BOS    83  32  70 102 1.23 102  33  21
    Hull         STL    78  54  47 101 1.29 101  41 -21
    Andreychuk   TOR    81  55  45 100 1.23 100  56   4
    Fleury       CAL    82  34  66 100 1.22 100  88  15
    Francis      PIT    83  24  76 100 1.20 100  68   6
    Housley      WIN    78  18  79  97 1.24  97  52 -13
    Ciccarelli   DET    81  41  56  97 1.20  97  81  12
    Damphousse   MON    82  39  58  97 1.18  97  96   5
    Hawerchuk    BUF    79  16  80  96 1.22  96  48 -14
    Shanahan     STL    69  51  43  94 1.36  94 168   9
    Muller       MON    79  37  57  94 1.19  94  75   9
    Jagr         PIT    80  34  60  94 1.18  94  69  31
    Modano       MIN    80  33  60  93 1.16  93  81  -6
    Messier      NYR    72  25  66  91 1.26  91  70  -3
    Sanderson    HAR    79  46  43  89 1.13  89  28 -24
    Reichel      CAL    78  40  48  88 1.13  88  54  23
    Bellows      MON    80  40  48  88 1.10  88  42   4
    Fedorov      DET    72  34  53  87 1.21  87  72  33
    Thomas       NYI    76  37  50  87 1.14  87 109   0
    Coffey       DET    79  12  75  87 1.10  87  77  16
    Kurri        LA     81  27  60  87 1.07  88  38  20
    Bradley      TB     78  42  44  86 1.10  86  90 -22
    Brind'Amour  PHI    78  37  49  86 1.10  86  87  -9
    Ronning      VAN    77  29  56  85 1.10  85  30  16
    Bondra       WAS    80  37  48  85 1.06  85  70   3
    Cassels      HAR    81  21  64  85 1.05  85  57 -15
    Murphy       PIT    82  22  62  84 1.02  84  73  42
    Bourque      BOS    78  19  63  82 1.05  82  40  38
    Granato      LA     79  37  45  82 1.04  83 165   3
    Verbeek      HAR    81  39  43  82 1.01  82 180 -11
    Ridley       WAS    81  26  56  82 1.01  82  38   4
    Duchesne     QUE    81  20  62  82 1.01  82  57  15
    C.Lemieux    NJ     75  30  51  81 1.08  81 149   0
    Suter        CAL    80  23  58  81 1.01  81 112  -1
    Lebeau       MON    69  31  49  80 1.16  80  20  23
    Roberts      CAL    57  38  41  79 1.39  79 172  31
    Semak        NJ     80  37  42  79 0.99  79  70  22
    Hatcher      WAS    80  34  45  79 0.99  79 110 -12
    D.Hunter     WAS    81  20  59  79 0.98  79 194   2
    Courtnall    MIN    82  36  43  79 0.96  79  49  -2
    Brown        STL    69  25  53  78 1.13  78  56  -4
    Ricci        QUE    76  27  51  78 1.03  78 121   9
    Kisio        SJ     77  26  52  78 1.01  78  90 -15
    Craven       VAN    76  25  52  77 1.01  77  30   0
    G.Courtnall  VAN    82  31  46  77 0.94  77 167  23
    Nolan        QUE    72  36  40  76 1.06  76 185  -6
    King         NYI    74  38  38  76 1.03  76  45  -1
    Amonte       NYR    80  33  43  76 0.95  76  47   0
    Gagner       MIN    82  33  43  76 0.93  76 141 -15
    Lindros      PHI    58  41  34  75 1.29  75 143  25
    Hogue        NYI    67  33  42  75 1.12  75 106   6
    Nieuwendyk   CAL    77  38  37  75 0.97  75  52   8
    Pivonka      WAS    66  21  53  74 1.12  74  51  12
    Borschevsky  TOR    76  34  40  74 0.97  74  26  32
    Dahlen       MIN    81  35  39  74 0.91  74   6 -18
    Richer       NJ     76  38  35  73 0.96  73  44   0
    Emerson      STL    80  22  51  73 0.91  73  60  -1
    Nedved       VAN    82  38  35  73 0.89  73  94  18
    Chelios      CHI    82  15  58  73 0.89  73 282  13
    Carson       LA     84  37  36  73 0.87  74  30   2
    Zhamnov      WIN    66  25  47  72 1.09  72  58   5
    Kvartalnov   BOS    72  30  42  72 1.00  72  14   9
    Steen        WIN    78  22  50  72 0.92  72  75  -8
    Linden       VAN    82  33  39  72 0.88  72  60  15
    Mullen       PIT    71  33  37  70 0.99  70  12  21
    Larmer       CHI    82  35  35  70 0.85  70  48  22
    Donnelly     LA     82  29  40  69 0.84  70  45  18
    Kovalenko    QUE    80  27  41  68 0.85  68  57  10
    Gartner      NYR    81  45  23  68 0.84  68  55  -2
    Khristich    WAS    61  31  36  67 1.10  67  26  26
    Sheppard     DET    70  32  34  66 0.94  66  29   7
    Garpenlov    SJ     78  22  44  66 0.85  66  56 -25
    Iafrate      WAS    81  25  41  66 0.81  66 169  15
    Gretzky      LA     43  16  49  65 1.51  67   6   6
    Zalapski     HAR    80  14  51  65 0.81  65  86 -32
    Graves       NYR    81  36  29  65 0.80  65 148  -4
    Anderson     TOR    74  21  43  64 0.86  64 117  19
    Zelepukin    NJ     76  23  41  64 0.84  64  66  16
    MacIver      OTT    78  17  46  63 0.81  63  80 -42
    Dineen       PHI    80  35  28  63 0.79  63 199  11
    Chiasson     DET    78  12  50  62 0.79  62 151  15
    Ysebaert     DET    79  34  28  62 0.78  62  42  19
    Galley       PHI    80  13  49  62 0.78  62  98  14
    McEachern    PIT    83  28  33  61 0.73  61  46  21
    Nicholls     NJ     67  13  47  60 0.90  60  80 -13
    Keane        MON    75  15  45  60 0.80  60  93  28
    Flatley      NYI    77  13  47  60 0.78  60  61   3
    S.Young      QUE    81  30  30  60 0.74  60  20   4
    Shannon      WIN    82  20  40  60 0.73  60  91  -4
    Fedyk        PHI    74  21  38  59 0.80  59  48  14
    Blake        LA     76  16  43  59 0.78  60 152  18
    Olausson     WIN    66  16  41  57 0.86  57  22  -5
    Makarov      CAL    70  18  39  57 0.81  57  40   0
    Smith        CHI    76  10  47  57 0.75  57 212  13
    Elynuik      WAS    77  22  35  57 0.74  57  66   2
    Stevens      NJ     79  12  45  57 0.72  57 116  16
    Adams        VAN    51  25  31  56 1.10  56  14  33
    Tucker       TB     76  17  39  56 0.74  56  69 -10
    MacInnis     CAL    48  11  43  54 1.13  54  59  15
    Sutter       CHI    63  20  34  54 0.86  54  65   9
    Bodger       BUF    80   9  45  54 0.68  54  87  14
    Nemchinov    NYR    81  23  31  54 0.67  54  34  15
    Driver       NJ     81  14  40  54 0.67  54  64  -9
    Ruuttu       CHI    82  17  37  54 0.66  54 134  14
    Yake         HAR    63  22  31  53 0.84  53  44   5
    Turcotte     NYR    68  25  28  53 0.78  53  40  -2
    Sandstrom    LA     37  25  27  52 1.41  53  51  11
    Malakhov     NYI    61  14  38  52 0.85  52  59  14
    Ward         VAN    68  22  30  52 0.76  52  82  32
    Otto         CAL    74  19  33  52 0.70  52 150   2
    Kontos       TB     66  27  24  51 0.77  51  12  -7
    Leach        BOS    78  26  25  51 0.65  51 126  -6
    Poulin       HAR    78  20  31  51 0.65  51  37 -19
    Tkachuk      WIN    81  28  23  51 0.63  51 199 -14
    Savard       MON    62  16  34  50 0.81  50  90   2
    Norton       NYI    63  12  38  50 0.79  50  45  -6
    Cullen       TOR    64  18  32  50 0.78  50 109 -23
    Cote         WAS    74  21  29  50 0.68  50  34  28
    Eklund       PHI    52  11  38  49 0.94  49  16   8
    Olczyk       NYR    68  21  28  49 0.72  49  52  -1
    Semenov      VAN    74  12  37  49 0.66  49  32  16
    Davydov      WIN    77  28  21  49 0.64  49  64  -2
    Miller       STL    80  24  25  49 0.61  49  96   0
    Poulin       BOS    83  16  33  49 0.59  49  62  30
    Klima        EDM    66  32  16  48 0.73  48  98 -15
    Dionne       MON    73  20  28  48 0.66  48  55   6
    Baker        OTT    74  19  29  48 0.65  48  52 -21
    Rucinsky     QUE    76  18  30  48 0.63  48  51  14
    Weight       EDM    76  17  31  48 0.63  48  65   5
    Zhitnik      LA     76  12  36  48 0.63  49  78  -2
    MacLean      NJ     78  24  24  48 0.62  48 100  -7
    Corson       EDM    78  16  31  47 0.60  47 207 -16
    Sweeney      BUF    79  21  26  47 0.59  47 118   4
    Simpson      EDM    60  24  22  46 0.77  46  36 -14
    Hawgood      PHI    66  11  35  46 0.70  46  68  -9
    Johansson    WAS    74   7  38  45 0.61  45  54   0
    Miller       WAS    81  18  27  45 0.56  45  32  -1
    Manson       EDM    81  15  30  45 0.56  45 210 -26
    Desjardins   MON    81  13  32  45 0.56  45  98  19
    Schneider    MON    58  13  31  44 0.76  44  89   9
    Goulet       CHI    63  23  21  44 0.70  44  41  10
    Leclair      MON    70  19  25  44 0.63  44  33  11
    Drake        DET    71  18  26  44 0.62  44  91  14
    Lumme        VAN    73   8  36  44 0.60  44  55  29
    Gaudreau     SJ     58  23  20  43 0.74  43  18 -17
    Gill         TOR    68  11  32  43 0.63  43  64   4
    Turgeon      OTT    70  25  18  43 0.61  43 104 -26
    Probert      DET    79  14  29  43 0.54  43 292  -9
    Wood         BUF    80  18  25  43 0.54  43  77   7
    Ranheim      CAL    82  21  22  43 0.52  43  26  -4
    Zamuner      TB     82  15  28  43 0.52  43  72 -25
    Tinordi      MIN    69  15  27  42 0.61  42 157  -1
    Paslawski    CAL    71  18  24  42 0.59  42  12   0
    Ruzicka      BOS    60  19  22  41 0.68  41  38  -6
    Elik         EDM    60  14  27  41 0.68  41  56  -4
    Kudelski     OTT    61  24  17  41 0.67  41  28 -25
    McSorley     LA     79  15  26  41 0.52  42 393   0
    Shaw         OTT    79   7  34  41 0.52  41  34 -47
    Lidstrom     DET    83   7  34  41 0.49  41  28   7
    Stastny      NJ     60  17  23  40 0.67  40  20  -3
    Ellett       TOR    68   6  34  40 0.59  40  46  17
    Tikkanen     NYR    78  16  24  40 0.51  40  94 -22
    Niedermayer  NJ     78  11  29  40 0.51  40  47   8
    Racine       DET    79   9  31  40 0.51  40  80   8
    McPhee       MIN    82  18  22  40 0.49  40  44  -4
    Millen       LA     40  23  16  39 0.98  40  42  15
    Chambers     TB     53  10  29  39 0.74  39  34 -23
    Holik        NJ     59  20  19  39 0.66  39  72  -2
    Clark        TOR    65  17  22  39 0.60  39 187   3
    Khmylev      BUF    66  20  19  39 0.59  39  26   6
    Creighton    TB     81  19  20  39 0.48  39 110 -21
    Krushelnyski TOR    82  19  20  39 0.48  39  60   3
    Kurvers      NYI    49   8  30  38 0.78  38  38   8
    Crossman     STL    57  10  28  38 0.67  38  28  -6
    Kovalev      NYR    63  20  18  38 0.60  38  79  -8
    Craig        MIN    68  15  23  38 0.56  38 106 -10
    Krupp        NYI    79   9  29  38 0.48  38  67   8
    Momesso      VAN    82  18  20  38 0.46  38 193  11
    Kamensky     QUE    31  15  22  37 1.19  37  14  13
    Numminen     WIN    65   7  30  37 0.57  37  33   4
    Pearson      TOR    76  23  14  37 0.49  37 196  -2
    Graham       CHI    82  20  17  37 0.45  37 141   1
    Leetch       NYR    36   6  30  36 1.00  36  26   2
    Ciger        EDM    62  13  23  36 0.58  36   8 -14
    Beers        TB     62  12  24  36 0.58  36  70 -24
    Reid         BOS    65  20  16  36 0.55  36  10  12
    Lapointe     QUE    73  10  26  36 0.49  36  98   4
    Sjodin       MIN    75   7  29  36 0.48  36  30 -25
    Weinrich     HAR    76   7  29  36 0.47  36  76 -10
    Borsato      WIN    65  15  20  35 0.54  35  38  -1
    Zezel        TOR    68  12  23  35 0.51  35  24  -1
    Burr         DET    79  10  25  35 0.44  35  74  18
    Donato       BOS    81  15  20  35 0.43  35  61   2
    Benning      EDM    55  10  24  34 0.62  34 152  -1
    Howe         DET    59   3  31  34 0.58  34  22  20
    Guerin       NJ     63  14  20  34 0.54  34  63  16
    Hull         OTT    67  13  21  34 0.51  34  14 -21
    D.Sweeney    BOS    83   7  27  34 0.41  34  66  34
    Nylander     HAR    56  11  22  33 0.59  33  36  -5
    Beranek      PHI    63  15  18  33 0.52  33  78  -6
    Wesley       BOS    64   8  25  33 0.52  33  47  -2
    Matteau      CHI    77  15  18  33 0.43  33  96   6
    Broten       MIN    80  12  21  33 0.41  33  22   7
    Leeman       MON    50  15  17  32 0.64  32  24  14
    Dalgarno     NYI    55  15  17  32 0.58  32  60  16
    Mellanby     EDM    67  15  17  32 0.48  32 147  -4
    Primeau      DET    73  15  17  32 0.44  32 152  -6
    Gilbert      CHI    75  13  19  32 0.43  32  57   5
    Mullen       NYI    78  18  14  32 0.41  32  28   7
    Presley      BUF    78  15  17  32 0.41  32  92   5
    Leschyshyn   QUE    81   9  23  32 0.40  32  55  22
    Zubov        NYR    46   8  23  31 0.67  31   4   1
    Mironov      TOR    57   7  24  31 0.54  31  38  -2
    Bureau       TB     63  10  21  31 0.49  31 111 -12
    Brisebois    MON    68  10  21  31 0.46  31  77   8
    Heinze       BOS    72  18  13  31 0.43  31  24  21
    Smehlik      BUF    78   4  27  31 0.40  31  59  10
    Lemieux      CHI    79  10  21  31 0.39  31 109   4
    Yushkevich   PHI    79   5  26  31 0.39  31  71  10
    Evason       SJ     83  12  19  31 0.37  31 132 -33
    McInnis      NYI    56  10  20  30 0.54  30  24   7
    Noonan       CHI    61  16  14  30 0.49  30  82   1
    Gallant      DET    66  10  20  30 0.45  30 186  20
    Kennedy      DET    67  19  11  30 0.45  30  46  -1
    Hough        QUE    77   8  22  30 0.39  30  69 -11
    Gusarov      QUE    78   8  22  30 0.38  30  57  16
    MacTavish    EDM    80  10  20  30 0.38  30 110 -15
    Buchberger   EDM    81  12  18  30 0.37  30 133 -24
    Janssens     HAR    73  12  17  29 0.40  29 233 -12
    U.Samuelson  PIT    76   3  26  29 0.38  29 247  37
    Sydor        LA     78   6  23  29 0.37  29  59   0
    Duchesne     MIN    82  16  13  29 0.35  29  30   6
    Falloon      SJ     41  14  14  28 0.68  28  12 -25
    Sandlak      VAN    59  10  18  28 0.47  28 122   2
    Carpenter    WAS    65  11  17  28 0.43  28  63 -16
    Kron         HAR    42  14  13  27 0.64  27  18   7
    Ferraro      NYI    43  14  13  27 0.63  27  38  -5
    Kravchuk     EDM    55  10  17  27 0.49  27  32   3
    Plavsic      VAN    56   6  21  27 0.48  27  51  27
    Ron Sutter   STL    59  12  15  27 0.46  27  99 -11
    Cole         TB     65  12  15  27 0.42  27  21  -4
    Odgers       SJ     65  12  15  27 0.42  27 251 -25
    Fitzgerald   NYI    74   9  18  27 0.36  27  32  -1
    Fetisov      NJ     74   4  23  27 0.36  27 158   7
    Korolev      STL    74   4  23  27 0.36  27  20  -1
    Kypreos      HAR    75  17  10  27 0.36  27 325  -5
    Andersson    TB     75  16  11  27 0.36  27  14 -14
    Huddy        LA     80   2  25  27 0.34  27  62  20
    Rich Sutter  STL    82  13  14  27 0.33  27 100  -6
    Slegr        VAN    40   4  22  26 0.65  26 109  16
    Svoboda      BUF    40   2  24  26 0.65  26  59   3
    Patrick      NYR    60   5  21  26 0.43  26  61   1
    Jones        WAS    68  12  14  26 0.38  26 124  16
    Lamb         OTT    69   7  19  26 0.38  26  62 -40
    Osborne      TOR    75  12  14  26 0.35  26  87  -7
    May          BUF    80  13  13  26 0.33  26 238   3
    Eagles       WIN    82   8  18  26 0.32  26 131  -1
    Brunet       MON    45  10  15  25 0.56  25  19  13
    T.Green      NYI    58   7  18  25 0.43  25  43   6
    Stern        CAL    69  10  15  25 0.36  25 207   2
    Lidster      VAN    71   6  19  25 0.35  25  36   9
    Haller       MON    72  11  14  25 0.35  25 117   8
    Tippett      PIT    73   6  19  25 0.34  25  56   7
    Peluso       OTT    79  15  10  25 0.32  25 318 -32
    DiMaio       TB     54   9  15  24 0.44  24  62   0
    Brady        OTT    55   7  17  24 0.44  24  57 -25
    Freer        OTT    61  10  14  24 0.39  24  39 -32
    Cavallini    QUE    66   9  15  24 0.36  24  34  10
    Lachance     NYI    74   7  17  24 0.32  24  67  -2
    Shaw         BOS    76  10  14  24 0.32  24 108   9
    Berg         TOR    78  13  11  24 0.31  24 103   2
    Ozolinsh     SJ     37   7  16  23 0.62  23  40  -9
    Klatt        MIN    45   4  19  23 0.51  23  38   6
    Loach        LA     53  10  13  23 0.43  23  27   3
    Todd         EDM    55   9  14  23 0.42  23  26  -9
    Ashton       CAL    56  10  13  23 0.41  23  52   8
    McBain       OTT    57   7  16  23 0.40  23  43 -35
    Gelinas      EDM    63  11  12  23 0.37  23  30   2
    Bautin       WIN    69   5  18  23 0.33  23  92  -2
    Krygier      WAS    74  11  12  23 0.31  23  60 -14
    Johnson      MIN    79   3  20  23 0.29  23 105   9
    Acton        PHI    80   8  15  23 0.29  23  51 -11
    Barnes       WIN    37  12  10  22 0.59  22  10  -3
    Huffman      QUE    52   4  18  22 0.42  22  54   0
    Sutton       BUF    61   8  14  22 0.36  22  30   0
    McKay        NJ     71  11  11  22 0.31  22 199   1
    Konstantinov DET    81   5  17  22 0.27  22 135  23
    Pellerin     NJ     44  10  11  21 0.48  21  37  -1
    Sillinger    DET    51   4  17  21 0.41  21  16   0
    Volek        NYI    56   8  13  21 0.38  21  34  -1
    Lindberg     CAL    61   9  12  21 0.34  21  18  -4
    Evans        PHI    65   8  13  21 0.32  21  70  -9
    Hamrlik      TB     65   6  15  21 0.32  21  65 -20
    Gilchrist    MIN    68  10  11  21 0.31  21  49 -12
    Churla       MIN    73   5  16  21 0.29  21 286  -8
    Kasparaitis  NYI    77   4  17  21 0.27  21 166  14
    Loney        PIT    81   5  16  21 0.26  21  99   3
    Courtenay    SJ     38   7  13  20 0.53  20  10 -15
    Wilson       SJ     42   3  17  20 0.48  20  40 -28
    T.Pederson   SJ     43   7  13  20 0.47  20  31 -14
    Lomakin      PHI    48   8  12  20 0.42  20  34  14
    Druce        WIN    48   6  14  20 0.42  20  37  -5
    Hannan       BUF    53   5  15  20 0.38  20  41  10
    Corriveau    HAR    54   8  12  20 0.37  20  12 -20
    Bourque      NYR    54   6  14  20 0.37  20  39  -9
    Hiller       DET    60   8  12  20 0.33  20 109   6
    Maltais      TB     61   7  13  20 0.33  20  35 -19
    Burt         HAR    62   6  14  20 0.32  20 116 -14
    Johansson    CAL    75   4  16  20 0.27  20  60  11
    Marchment    CHI    76   5  15  20 0.26  20 309  13
    Diduck       VAN    78   6  14  20 0.26  20 163  29
    Podein       EDM    38  13   6  19 0.50  19  25  -1
    Berehowsky   TOR    40   4  15  19 0.48  19  61   1
    Babych       VAN    41   3  16  19 0.46  19  42   4
    Audette      BUF    42  12   7  19 0.45  19  51  -5
    Chorske      NJ     50   7  12  19 0.38  19  25  -1
    Bassen       STL    51   9  10  19 0.37  19  59  -4
    Hatcher      MIN    65   4  15  19 0.29  19 176 -26
    Kucera       CHI    70   5  14  19 0.27  19  59   7
    Wilson       STL    76   8  11  19 0.25  19  44  -7
    Macoun       TOR    76   4  15  19 0.25  19  55   3
    King         WIN    77   8  11  19 0.25  19 203   4
    Beukeboom    NYR    79   2  17  19 0.24  19 153  10
    Carkner      PHI    80   3  16  19 0.24  19 146  16
    Neely        BOS    12  11   7  18 1.50  18  25   4
    Foligno      TOR    54  13   5  18 0.33  18  84   1
    Christian    CHI    60   4  14  18 0.30  18  12   6
    Errey        BUF    61   9   9  18 0.30  18  80   1
    Gavin        MIN    63  10   8  18 0.29  18  59  -4
    McLlwain     TOR    65  14   4  18 0.28  18  30 -17
    Daigneault   MON    65   8  10  18 0.28  18  57  24
    Ramage       MON    74   5  13  18 0.24  18 146 -24
    Smith        EDM    76   4  14  18 0.24  18  30 -11
    Paek         PIT    76   3  15  18 0.24  18  64  15
    Murphy       CHI    17   7  10  17 1.00  17  18  -4
    DiPietro     MON    27   4  13  17 0.63  17  14  10
    M.Pederson   SJ     40  10   7  17 0.43  17  24 -20
    Nattress     PHI    44   7  10  17 0.39  17  29   1
    Carbonneau   MON    59   4  13  17 0.29  17  20  -8
    Yawney       CAL    61   1  16  17 0.28  17  65   5
    Kasatonov    NJ     63   3  14  17 0.27  17  55   7
    Roberts      BOS    64   5  12  17 0.27  17 103  22
    MacDermid    WAS    72   9   8  17 0.24  17  80 -13
    Odjick       VAN    74   4  13  17 0.23  17 360   4
    Conacher     LA     79   9   8  17 0.22  17  20 -15
    Cavallini    WAS    79   6  11  17 0.22  17  56   4
    Erickson     WIN    39   4  12  16 0.41  16  12   2
    Straka       PIT    41   3  13  16 0.39  16  29   3
    Erixon       NYR    42   5  11  16 0.38  16  10  13
    Murphy       BOS    48   5  11  16 0.33  16  60 -14
    Ledyard      BUF    48   2  14  16 0.33  16  43   0
    Butsayev     PHI    49   2  14  16 0.33  16  57   2
    Ulanov       WIN    54   2  14  16 0.30  16 122   6
    Carter       SJ     55   7   9  16 0.29  16  81 -25
    Glynn        EDM    62   4  12  16 0.26  16  58 -12
    Boschman     OTT    68   9   7  16 0.24  16  95 -27
    Rumble       OTT    68   3  13  16 0.24  16  61 -26
    Stanton      PIT    76   4  12  16 0.21  16  97   8
    Murzyn       VAN    77   5  11  16 0.21  16 179  36
    Musil        CAL    78   6  10  16 0.21  16 129  26
    May          WAS    80   6  10  16 0.20  16 266   0
    Foote        QUE    80   4  12  16 0.20  16 168   3
    Odelein      MON    81   2  14  16 0.20  16 201  35
    Andersson    NYR    29   4  11  15 0.52  15  16   7
    Archibald    OTT    42   9   6  15 0.36  15  32 -15
    Taylor       LA     46   6   9  15 0.33  15  49   2
    Lowe         NYR    47   3  12  15 0.32  15  58  -1
    Domi         WIN    59   5  10  15 0.25  15 340   1
    McCrimmon    DET    60   1  14  15 0.25  15  71  21
    Konroyd      DET    65   3  12  15 0.23  15  67 -15
    Zombo        STL    69   0  15  15 0.22  15  78  -4
    Butcher      STL    82   5  10  15 0.18  15 209   0
    Zmolek       SJ     83   5  10  15 0.18  15 229 -51
    Fergus       VAN    36   5   9  14 0.39  14  20   1
    Skrudland    CAL    38   7   7  14 0.37  14  65   4
    Pantaleyev   BOS    39   8   6  14 0.36  14  12  -6
    Pearson      QUE    41  13   1  14 0.34  14  95   3
    C.J.Young    BOS    43   7   7  14 0.33  14  32  -6
    Smail        OTT    51   4  10  14 0.27  14  51 -34
    Hardy        LA     53   1  13  14 0.26  14  89  -1
    Broten       NYR    58   5   9  14 0.24  14  48  -6
    Barr         NJ     60   6   8  14 0.23  14  44   3
    Taglianetti  PIT    71   2  12  14 0.20  14 182  15
    Ewen         MON    74   5   9  14 0.19  14 191   7
    Bergevin     TB     76   2  12  14 0.18  14  66 -16
    Finn         QUE    79   5   9  14 0.18  14 160  -4
    Lefebvre     TOR    79   2  12  14 0.18  14  90   6
    M.Sullivan   SJ     81   6   8  14 0.17  14  30 -42
    Ojanen       NJ     31   4   9  13 0.42  13  14  -2
    Reekie       TB     42   2  11  13 0.31  13  69   2
    Lindsay      QUE    44   4   9  13 0.30  13  16   0
    Ramsey       PIT    44   3  10  13 0.30  13  28  16
    Valk         VAN    46   6   7  13 0.28  13  73   5
    Jelinek      OTT    49   7   6  13 0.27  13  52 -21
    Needham      PIT    55   8   5  13 0.24  13  24  -2
    Lowry        STL    56   5   8  13 0.23  13 101 -18
    Rychel       LA     68   6   7  13 0.19  13 293 -14
    McGill       PHI    70   3  10  13 0.19  13 221   7
    Stapleton    PIT    78   4   9  13 0.17  13  10  -8
    Richardson   EDM    80   3  10  13 0.16  13 140 -18
    Rouse        TOR    80   3  10  13 0.16  13 128   8
    Daneyko      NJ     82   2  11  13 0.16  13 222   4
    Ogrodnick    DET    18   6   6  12 0.67  12   2  -3
    S. King      NYR    24   7   5  12 0.50  12  16   4
    Joseph       EDM    31   2  10  12 0.39  12  46  -6
    Petit        CAL    34   3   9  12 0.35  12  50  -6
    Williams     SJ     39   1  11  12 0.31  12  49 -25
    B.Smith      MIN    43   5   7  12 0.28  12   8  -6
    Bozon        STL    52   6   6  12 0.23  12  55  -1
    Ronan        MON    53   5   7  12 0.23  12  20   6
    Dirk         VAN    67   4   8  12 0.18  12 146  22
    Hunter       VAN    72   5   7  12 0.17  12 182  -5
    Luongo       OTT    74   3   9  12 0.16  12  68 -42
    Berube       CAL    75   4   8  12 0.16  12 209  -6
    Wilson       CAL    22   4   7  11 0.50  11   8  10
    Vujtek       EDM    28   1  10  11 0.39  11   8  -1
    Konowalchuk  WAS    36   4   7  11 0.31  11  16   4
    Snuggerud    PHI    39   4   7  11 0.28  11  14  -3
    Murray       CHI    49   4   7  11 0.22  11  57 -14
    Donnelly     BUF    58   3   8  11 0.19  11 219   6
    Dahl         CAL    59   2   9  11 0.19  11  52   9
    Kasper       TB     66   4   7  11 0.17  11  20 -16
    More         SJ     73   5   6  11 0.15  11 179 -35
    Quintal      STL    73   1  10  11 0.15  11 100  -6
    Ludwig       MIN    76   1  10  11 0.14  11 149   0
    Muni         CHI    79   0  11  11 0.14  11  73 -15
    Lazaro       OTT    26   6   4  10 0.38  10  16  -8
    Norwood      STL    32   3   7  10 0.31  10  63  -5
    Featherstone BOS    34   5   5  10 0.29  10 102   6
    Murphy       OTT    42   3   7  10 0.24  10  28 -18
    DeBrusk      EDM    49   8   2  10 0.20  10 199 -14
    Wells        NYR    50   1   9  10 0.20  10 105  -2
    Kimble       BOS    54   7   3  10 0.19  10 177   4
    Corkum       BUF    67   6   4  10 0.15  10  38  -2
    Dahlquist    CAL    73   3   7  10 0.14  10  66  -2
    Gordijuk     BUF    16   3   6   9 0.56   9   0   4
    Hurlbut      NYR    23   1   8   9 0.39   9  16   4
    Boivin       PHI    30   5   4   9 0.30   9  76  -5
    Moller       BUF    35   2   7   9 0.26   9  83   6
    Cunneyworth  HAR    36   5   4   9 0.25   9  61  -1
    Petrovicky   HAR    42   3   6   9 0.21   9  45 -10
    McRae        STL    45   3   6   9 0.20   9 167 -13
    Cirella      NYR    52   3   6   9 0.17   9  83   4
    Maley        SJ     55   2   7   9 0.16   9 143 -27
    Daniels      PIT    57   5   4   9 0.16   9  14  -6
    Hughes       BOS    61   5   4   9 0.15   9 191  -5
    Lalor        WIN    62   1   8   9 0.15   9  74 -13
    K.Samuelson  PIT    63   3   6   9 0.14   9 106  25
    McKenzie     HAR    63   3   6   9 0.14   9 202  -9
    Kocur        NYR    64   3   6   9 0.14   9 129  -9
    Loewen       OTT    77   4   5   9 0.12   9 145 -25
    Houlder      BUF    13   3   5   8 0.62   8   6   7
    T.Sweeney    BOS    14   1   7   8 0.57   8   6   1
    Douris       BOS    18   4   4   8 0.44   8   4   5
    Keczmer      HAR    21   4   4   8 0.38   8  28  -2
    Greig        HAR    22   1   7   8 0.36   8  27 -11
    Day          HAR    24   1   7   8 0.33   8  47  -8
    Werenka      EDM    27   5   3   8 0.30   8  24   1
    Tatarinov    QUE    28   2   6   8 0.29   8  28   6
    McDonough    SJ     30   6   2   8 0.27   8   6 -21
    Hill         MON    30   2   6   8 0.27   8  47  -5
    K.Brown      CHI    31   2   6   8 0.26   8  37   4
    Loiselle     NYI    38   5   3   8 0.21   8  84  -4
    Hudson       EDM    39   1   7   8 0.21   8  44  -8
    Hedican      STL    40   0   8   8 0.20   8  30  -4
    Roberge      MON    48   4   4   8 0.17   8 140   3
    Ahola        SJ     49   3   5   8 0.16   8  36 -11
    McIntyre     NYR    57   3   5   8 0.14   8  82 -14
    Anderson     WAS    57   2   6   8 0.14   8  18  -1
    Houda        HAR    57   2   6   8 0.14   8 163 -21
    Hartman      TB     58   4   4   8 0.14   8 154  -7
    Wilkinson    SJ     58   1   7   8 0.14   8  96 -48
    Hammond      OTT    61   4   4   8 0.13   8 104 -40
    Barrasso     PIT    62   0   8   8 0.13   8  20   0
    Kennedy      WIN    77   1   7   8 0.10   8 105  -4
    Eastwood     TOR    12   1   6   7 0.58   7  21  -2
    Quintin      SJ     14   2   5   7 0.50   7   4  -4
    R.Brown      CHI    15   1   6   7 0.47  33  33   6
    Godynyuk     CAL    26   3   4   7 0.27   7  17   7
    Rice         EDM    26   2   5   7 0.27   7  13  -5
    Murray       BOS    27   3   4   7 0.26   7   8  -6
    Wiemer       BOS    27   1   6   7 0.26   7  48  -1
    Berezan      SJ     28   3   4   7 0.25   7  28 -18
    Marois       NYI    28   2   5   7 0.25   7  35  -3
    Mallette     NJ     34   4   3   7 0.21   7  56   3
    Hynes        PHI    36   3   4   7 0.19   7  16  -3
    Gilhen       TB     42   3   4   7 0.17   7  12 -13
    Chase        STL    49   2   5   7 0.14   7 204  -9
    Vukota       NYI    71   2   5   7 0.10   7 199   4
    Zettler      SJ     79   0   7   7 0.09   7 150 -48
    Lafreniere   TB      9   3   3   6 0.67   6   4  -5
    Propp        MIN    15   3   3   6 0.40   6   0  -8
    Belanger     MON    18   4   2   6 0.33   6   4   1
    Kerr         HAR    22   0   6   6 0.27   6   7 -11
    Shuchuk      LA     23   2   4   6 0.26   6  14   4
    Bergland     TB     25   3   3   6 0.24   6  11  -9
    Vaske        NYI    25   1   5   6 0.24   6  30   6
    Carney       BUF    29   2   4   6 0.21   6  51   2
    Dinnen       OTT    31   2   4   6 0.19   6  30 -19
    Albelin      NJ     34   1   5   6 0.18   6  14  -1
    Patterson    BUF    35   4   2   6 0.17   6  18  -2
    Ladouceur    HAR    59   2   4   6 0.10   6 107 -17
    Russell      CHI    66   2   4   6 0.09   6 151   5
    Lang         LA     11   0   5   5 0.45   5   2  -3
    Lipuma       TB     13   0   5   5 0.38   5  32   1
    Brown        NJ     15   0   5   5 0.33   5   2   3
    Kozlov       DET    16   4   1   5 0.31   5  14  -1
    Savage       WAS    16   2   3   5 0.31   5  12  -4
    Bruce        SJ     17   2   3   5 0.29   5  33 -14
    Byers        SJ     18   4   1   5 0.28   5 122  -2
    Conroy       PHI    18   3   2   5 0.28   5  17   0
    Van Allen    EDM    21   1   4   5 0.24   5   6  -2
    Richer       BOS    23   1   4   5 0.22   5  18  -9
    Wolanin      QUE    23   1   4   5 0.22   5  49   8
    Leach        HAR    24   3   2   5 0.21   5   4  -7
    Prokhorov    STL    26   4   1   5 0.19   5  15  -4
    Kruse        CAL    26   2   3   5 0.19   5  41   3
    Richter      NYR    35   0   5   5 0.14   5   2   0
    Bawa         SJ     41   5   0   5 0.12   5  47 -24
    Osiecki      MIN    42   1   4   5 0.12   5  19 -20
    Matvichuk    MIN    51   2   3   5 0.10   5  26  -7
    Pedersen     HAR    58   1   4   5 0.09   5  60   2
    Jennings     PIT    58   0   5   5 0.09   5  65   7
    Essensa      WIN    66   0   5   5 0.08   5   2   0
    Ray          BUF    68   3   2   5 0.07   5 211  -3
    McKim        BOS     7   1   3   4 0.57   4   0   2
    Faust        PHI     8   2   2   4 0.50   4   4   3
    Smolinski    BOS     8   1   3   4 0.50   4   0   3
    Fogarty      PIT    12   0   4   4 0.33   4   4  -3
    Hervey       TB     15   0   4   4 0.27   4  36  -4
    Picard       SJ     25   4   0   4 0.16   4  24 -17
    Reese        CAL    25   0   4   4 0.16   4   4   0
    Romaniuk     WIN    28   3   1   4 0.14   4  22   0
    Thompson     LA     28   0   4   4 0.14   4  79  -3
    Pilon        NYI    41   1   3   4 0.10   4 146  -3
    Giles        STL    48   0   4   4 0.08   4  40  -2
    Baron        STL    53   2   2   4 0.08   4  59  -5
    Cheveldae    DET    66   0   4   4 0.06   4   4   0
    Hankinson    NJ      4   2   1   3 0.75   3   9   2
    McDougall    EDM     4   2   1   3 0.75   3   4   2
    Felsner      STL     4   0   3   3 0.75   3   0   0
    Ruff         TB      8   2   1   3 0.38   3   8  -1
    Petrov       MON     9   2   1   3 0.33   3  10   2
    Black        MIN    10   2   1   3 0.30   3   4   0
    Morris       SJ     14   0   3   3 0.21   3   6 -11
    Walter       VAN    23   3   0   3 0.13   3   8  -2
    Hrivnak      WIN    29   0   3   3 0.10   3   0   0
    Wakaluk      MIN    29   0   3   3 0.10   3  20   0
    Dufresne     MON    30   1   2   3 0.10   3  30   0
    Cronin       PHI    34   2   1   3 0.09   3  37   0
    Smyth        CAL    34   1   2   3 0.09   3  95   3
    Hrudey       LA     48   0   3   3 0.06   3   8   0
    Marsh        OTT    57   0   3   3 0.05   3  30 -25
    Casey        MIN    58   0   3   3 0.05   3  28   0
    Berry        MIN    61   0   3   3 0.05   3 107   4
    Ranford      EDM    66   0   3   3 0.05   3  10   0
    Belfour      CHI    69   0   3   3 0.04   3  28   0
    Rivers       TB      4   0   2   2 0.50   2   2  -2
    Forslund     CAL     5   0   2   2 0.40   2   0   0
    Capuano      TB      6   1   1   2 0.33   2   2  -4
    Djoos        NYR     6   1   1   2 0.33   2   2   0
    Cummins      DET     7   1   1   2 0.29   2  58   0
    Otevrel      SJ      7   0   2   2 0.29   2   0  -6
    Kolstad      SJ     10   0   2   2 0.20   2  12  -9
    Osborne      TB     11   1   1   2 0.18   2   8  -1
    Wood         SJ     12   1   1   2 0.17   2  71  -5
    Brickley     WIN    12   0   2   2 0.17   2   2   0
    Eakins       WIN    14   0   2   2 0.14   2  38   2
    Simon        QUE    15   1   1   2 0.13   2  67  -2
    Bennett      CHI    16   0   2   2 0.13   2   8  -2
    Gillis       HAR    18   1   1   2 0.11   2  38   0
    Carlyle      WIN    22   1   1   2 0.09   2  14  -6
    Nylund       NYI    22   1   1   2 0.09   2  43  -2
    Blue         BOS    22   0   2   2 0.09   2   6   0
    Watters      LA     22   0   2   2 0.09   2  18  -3
    Woolley      WAS    23   0   2   2 0.09   2  10   0
    Whitmore     VAN    29   0   2   2 0.07   2   2   0
    Stauber      LA     30   0   2   2 0.07   2   2   0
    W.Young      TB     31   0   2   2 0.06   2   2   0
    Roussel      PHI    32   0   2   2 0.06   2  11   0
    Twist        QUE    34   0   2   2 0.06   2  64   0
    Fiset        QUE    37   0   2   2 0.05   2   2   0
    Jablonski    TB     42   0   2   2 0.05   2   7   0
    Soderstrom   PHI    43   0   2   2 0.05   2   4   0
    Healy        NYI    46   0   2   2 0.04   2   2   0
    Burke        HAR    50   0   2   2 0.04   2  25   0
    Hextall      QUE    53   0   2   2 0.04   2  56   0
    Roy          MON    61   0   2   2 0.03   2  16   0
    Vernon       CAL    63   0   2   2 0.03   2  42   0
    Joseph       STL    66   0   2   2 0.03   2   8   0
    Brown        PHI    67   0   2   2 0.03   2  76  -5
    Grimson      CHI    76   1   1   2 0.03   2 186   2
    Barnaby      BUF     1   1   0   1 1.00   1   0   0
    Ratushny     VAN     1   0   1   1 1.00   1   0   0
    Zholtok      BOS     1   0   1   1 1.00   1   0   1
    Sullivan     NJ      2   0   1   1 0.50   1   0  -1
    Duncanson    NYR     3   0   1   1 0.33   1   0   0
    Beaufait     SJ      4   1   0   1 0.25   1   0  -1
    Bowen        PHI     4   1   0   1 0.25   1   2   0
    MacDonald    BUF     4   1   0   1 0.25   1   2   0
    Esau         QUE     4   0   1   1 0.25   1   2   1
    D.Smith      MIN     9   0   1   1 0.11   1   2  -2
    Vial         DET     9   0   1   1 0.11   1  20   1
    Brown        BUF    10   0   1   1 0.10   1   6  -5
    Draper       BUF    11   0   1   1 0.09   1   2   0
    Karpa        QUE    11   0   1   1 0.09   1  13  -6
    Tichy        CHI    13   0   1   1 0.08   1  30   7
    Gosselin     HAR    15   0   1   1 0.07   1   2   0
    Fortier      LA     16   0   1   1 0.06   1  11  -9
    Hayward      SJ     18   0   1   1 0.06   1   2   0
    McGill       TOR    19   1   0   1 0.05   1  34   5
    Bergeron     TB     19   0   1   1 0.05   1   0   0
    Potvin       LA     19   0   1   1 0.05   1  52  -9
    Berthiaume   OTT    23   0   1   1 0.04   1   2   0
    Racicot      MON    25   0   1   1 0.04   1   6   0
    Wregget      PIT    25   0   1   1 0.04   1   6   0
    Ciccone      MIN    29   0   1   1 0.03   1 106   3
    Puppa        TOR    32   0   1   1 0.03   1   0   0
    Hackett      SJ     36   0   1   1 0.03   1   4   0
    Fitzpatrick  NYI    37   0   1   1 0.03   1   2   0
    Billington   NJ     40   0   1   1 0.03   1   8   0
    Potvin       TOR    46   0   1   1 0.02   1   4   0
    Vanbiesbrouk NYR    48   0   1   1 0.02   1  18   0
    McLean       VAN    54   0   1   1 0.02   1  16   0
    Moog         BOS    54   0   1   1 0.02   1  14   0
    Beaupre      WAS    57   0   1   1 0.02   1  20   0
    Baumgartner  TOR    61   1   0   1 0.02   1 155 -11
    Bales        BOS     1   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Burridge     WAS     1   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Chabot       MON     1   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    D'Alessio    HAR     1   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Littman      TB      1   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Parks        NYI     1   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Semchuk      LA      1   0   0   0 0.00   0   2   0
    St. Amour    OTT     1   0   0   0 0.00   0   2   0
    Cimellaro    OTT     2   0   0   0 0.00   0   0  -2
    Cote         TB      2   0   0   0 0.00   0   0  -1
    Marcinyshyn  NYR     2   0   0   0 0.00   0   2  -1
    O'Neill      WIN     2   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Raglan       TB      2   0   0   0 0.00   0   2   0
    Williams     LA      2   0   0   0 0.00   0  10   0
    Charron      MON     3   0   0   0 0.00   0   2   0
    Ciavaglia    BUF     3   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Cloutier     QUE     3   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Hamr         OTT     3   0   0   0 0.00   0   0  -3
    Wamsley      TOR     3   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Hirsch       NYR     4   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    O'Connor     NJ      7   0   0   0 0.00   0   9  -4
    J.Messier    NYR     9   0   0   0 0.00   0   6   0
    Knickle      LA     10   0   0   0 0.00   0   2   0
    Chapdelaine  LA     13   0   0   0 0.00   0  12  -6
    Shannon      TOR    15   0   0   0 0.00   0  11  -2
    Agnew        HAR    16   0   0   0 0.00   0  68   3
    Waite        CHI    20   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Langway      WAS    21   0   0   0 0.00   0  20 -13
    Riendeau     DET    22   0   0   0 0.00   0   2   0
    Hebert       STL    23   0   0   0 0.00   0   2   0
    Tabaracci    WAS    23   0   0   0 0.00   0  12   0
    Tugnutt      EDM    25   0   0   0 0.00   0   2   0
    Caufield     PIT    26   0   0   0 0.00   0  60  -1
    Hasek        BUF    27   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Pietrangelo  HAR    30   0   0   0 0.00   0   4   0
    Irbe         SJ     35   0   0   0 0.00   0  10   0
    Terreri      NJ     47   0   0   0 0.00   0   6   0
    Fuhr         BUF    56   0   0   0 0.00   0  10   0
    Sidorkiewicz OTT    63   0   0   0 0.00   0   8   0
-- 

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-                                                                           -
-    Maurice Richard                                                        -

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53603
From: The Always Fanatical: Patrick Ellis <IO11330@MAINE.MAINE.EDU>
Subject: Re: Bruins vs Canadiens:

un, you better add at least another plus to the Pederson
for Neely trade, the Bruins also received a number 1 round
draft pick, didn't play great this year but Wesley's still a
decent defenseman....  And the Bruins got Pederson back eventually
anyway.....

             Pat Ellis


P.S.  GO BRUINS    GO UMAINE BLACK BEARS    42-1-2       NUMBER 1......

                   HOCKEY EAST REGULARS SEASON CHAMPIONS.....
                   HOCKEY EAST TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONS>......
                   PAUL KARIYA, HOBEY BAKER AWARD WINNER.......
         NCAA DIV. 1 HOCKEY TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


                    M-A-I-N-E      GGGGOOOOOOO    BBBLLLUUEEEE!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53604
From: The Always Fanatical: Patrick Ellis <IO11330@MAINE.MAINE.EDU>
Subject: Keenan signs, Plus WALSH????????


Well I just read in the Boston Globe that while not confirming
(or denying) anything, Walsh may end up with the Rangers organizations
as an (assistant Coach?).  Keenan has talked with Walsh in the past
(he came up to see Kariya as he will be coaching him in the worlds,
funny I guess he got to watch the Ferraro brothers as well.....) I'm
not sure if walsh will go, but if Keenan is getting 700,000 and walsh
even gets 100,000 that's a 30% pay raise for walsh (not to mention
a nice career move....) Anyone from New York Hear anything about
this????????

               Pat Ellis




P.S.  GO BRUINS    GO UMAINE BLACK BEARS    42-1-2       NUMBER 1......

                   HOCKEY EAST REGULARS SEASON CHAMPIONS.....
                   HOCKEY EAST TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONS>......
                   PAUL KARIYA, HOBEY BAKER AWARD WINNER.......
         NCAA DIV. 1 HOCKEY TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


                    M-A-I-N-E      GGGGOOOOOOO    BBBLLLUUEEEE!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53605
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: div. and conf. names

In <1993Apr18.073540.6871@hubcap.clemson.edu> jwodzia@dlite.uucp (john wodziak) writes:

>Sorry Roger but Mr Basketbal should what he really means here. IE he should
>have said that he hopes "fans in the _American_ Southeast can follow the
>names of the divisions." The odds that these people other than those who
>are displaced "Notherners" (who are probably already fans) is on the order
>of the proverbial snowball's in hell.

I am not at all clear about what you are trying to say here.   If  you
asked  somone,  who  had never heard of hockey before, if LA played in
the Smythe division what do you think  that  the  response  would  be?
What  if you asked this person if LA played in the West division?  The
naming of  divisions  after  long-dead  entrepreneurs  is  unnecessary
obfuscation.

>>I am glad that the names are being changed for another reason.  The names
>>Patrick, Smythe, Norris, Adams and Campbell are all the names of so-called
>>"builders" of the game.  This is the same type of thinking that put Stein
>>in the Hall of Fame.  This is absolute nonsense.  The real builders of the
>>game are Richard, Morenz, Howe, Conacher, Orr, etc.  If you are going to
>>name the divisions after people at least name the divisions after people
>>who deserve it.

>Yes these people deserve recognigtion as hockey greats but the old division
>names took into account Messers Patrick, Norris, Smythe and the Prince who 
>had alot more to do with the ORIGINS of the league than people who came into
>an already established situation. It is much easier to be an element of change

Hardly.  The "established" situation existed prior to Smythe,  et  al.
The  Stanley  Cup was a challenge trophy up for grabs to whatever team
could successfully mount the challenge.  What our  dear  founders  did
was formalize the challenge.  They created a closed league, an oligop-
olistic professional system, in the interests of making money.  Wheth-
er  or  not  that system has contributed to better hockey is certainly
debatable.  We are, however, stuck with their invention and  that  de-
bate  is  academic.   The  point  to  be made, however, is that people
played hockey and people enjoyed watching hockey  long  before  Smythe
and his pals showed up.

>or a standout in an existing situation than it is to be someone who creates
>a new situation.  If you want to honor players like Bobby Orr than I'm sure
>you can find a reason to name a torphy after him such as best offensive 
>defenseman.

What's wrong with best defenceman, period?  Was there  ever  a  better
defenceman?   Was  there  ever a better player?  And if you think that
Bruce Norris' contribution was somehow  more  significant  than  Bobby
Orr's  then,  in the interests of education, why don't you take a poll
and find out how many people know who Norris was?  But you don't  have
to, do you?

>No I can't for the reasons I gave above. I'm in the same boat as Jason and I
>grew up with the current divisonal names and learned them when I was about 
>10 years old and who played in what division. If a 10 year old _American_
>can learn this why would it be hard for an "Occasional Fan" to pick up 
>on who plays in what division?

So you don't feel that you should have to make the effort to  remember
that  Vancouver  plays in the West division?  (Or Pacific, or whatever
other intuitively understandable moniker is chosen.)

>>Oh.  Now I see your point.  Your intention has been to alert us to the erosion
>>of purity.  I'll bet you like hockey because it's, for the most part, played
>>by whites of European extraction. 

>Probably not. In my case I'm sure of this. What you said would be like me
>saying that All Maple Leafs fans are as biased, closed minded, ignorant,

And of course you neatly deleted Jason's  jingoistic  rant  about  the
game  losing  its  "Canadianization".   Quoting me out of context does
more to erode your credibility than it  does  mine.   My  position  is
clearly  progressive  and  is anything but "biased, closed minded, ig-
norant".  Arrogant, I will grant you.

>arrogant, and moronic as you.  Just because someone A) doesn't like what
>Mr Basketball is doing, B) voices their opinion. and C) Likes the senerio of
>you going to Antartica does not mean that you have the right to insult them.

Nice try John.  But for a flame to be truly effective you have to
display  at  least  enough  intelligence  to  earn  your target's
respect.

cordially, as always,

rm 

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53606
From: mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger)
Subject: TEAM POOL - Tabulations

Thanks for the 41 people who have entered this year's TEAM POOL.

Here is a summary of what was picked:

1st Round:
Pittsburgh 41, New Jersey 0
Chicago 40, St. Louis 1
Boston 40, Buffalo 1
Vancouver 30, Winnipeg 11
Calgary 27, Los Angeles 14
Detroit 26, Toronto 15
Washington 24, New York Islanders 15 (2 people picked New Jersey)
Quebec 23, Montreal 18

2nd Round:
Pittsburgh 38, Washington 2, New York Islanders 1
Boston 31, Quebec 6, Montreal 4
Detroit 21, Chicago 15, Toronto 5
Calgary 18, Vancouver 14, Los Angeles 8, Winnipeg 1

3rd Round:
Pittsburgh 31, Boston 7, Quebec 2, Washington 1
Detroit 18, Chicago 11, Toronto 5, Vancouver 3, Calgary 2, Los Angeles 2

Finals:
Pittsburgh 26, Boston 5, Detroit 4, Toronto 2, Quebec 2, Los Angeles 1, Chicago
1

Good luck to all!


*******************************************************************************
*  Mike Burger                    *  My Canada includes, Quebec, Ontario,     *
*  mmb@lamar.colostate.edu        *  the Maritimes, the Prairies, and Florida *
*  A Beginning Computing TA Stud  *  four months a year.                      *
*  over 500 students served       *    --Royal Canadian Air Farce             *
*******************************************************************************
*      University of Michigan - 1990  --  Colorado State University - 199?    *
*******************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53607
From: nittmo@camelot.bradley.edu (Christopher Taylor)
Subject: Anyone Have Official Shorthanded Goal Totals?

Does anyone out there have the shorthanded goal totals of the NHL players
for this season?  We're trying to finish our rotisserie stats and need SHG
to make it complete.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53608
From: holland@geop.ubc.ca (Stephen Holland)
Subject: Re: My Predictions of a classic playoff year!

In article 12934@ac.dal.ca, 06paul@ac.dal.ca () writes:
>
>	STANLEY CUP FINALS
>Toronto Maple Leafs    vs    Montreal Canadiens    
>	(The Classic Stanley Cup Final matchup!!) <---also a dream come true!
>	Montreal wins the Stanley cup in the 7th game 1 - 0 in double overtime.

You know... after I finished laughing I thought:  This would be a great
final.  Two Canadian teams with lots of tradition and all that Don Cherry
nonsense behind them and a nail-biter finish.

Of course, I would prefer a Vancouver--Montreal final with Vancouver
scoring the final goal....

Pity neither will happen.

steve holland




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53609
From: Karim Edvard Ahmed <ka0k+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Truly a sad day for hockey

>A fine 26 year history came to a close tonight, as the Minnesota North Stars, 
>or Norm's Stars (whichever you prefer) lost to the Red Wings by a score of
>5-3.  The Stars goals were scored by Mike McPhee and Ulf Dahlen, who netted
>two including the final one in franchise history, with less than a minute to
>play.


Yes, it's a shame that the NHL lost a fine team in one of the best
hockey markets in the country.  Being a North Stars fan, it is sad to
see all of the tradition of the last 26 years get thrown into oblivion
at the hands of a truly crappy owner.

Hopefully the NHL will install an expansion franchise in the Twin Cities
within the next five years.  Even if this is the case, a lot has been
lost in the North Stars move...

KEA

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53610
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Possible Canadian WC Team?

nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>
>CENTERS
>Mark Messier, N. Y. Rangers

Messier was not invited due to his nagging injuries.  While the press
made an issue of it, and attempted to link it to the Rangers' internal
political woes, Mike Keenan repeated that to Messier personally during
the MSG press conference.  It makes sense ... Messier would probably
have not declined the invitation if it were made for publicity ...

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53611
From: dmoney@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Dean R Money)
Subject: How difficult is it to get Penguin tickets?

The subject line says it all.  Is it terribly difficult to get tickets
to Penguins games, especially now that they are in the playoffs?  Would
it be easy to find scalpers outside of the Igloo selling tickets?

Dean Money
dmoney@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53612
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Hockey Draft week 27 standings

Well, I'm back from Tokyo, so here are the standings after the April 13 update.

	- Andrew

USENET Hockey Draft Standings
Week 27

Posn	Team				Pts	Proj	Cash	Last Posn

1.	Dave Wessels                    1536	1572.8	1.9	(1)
2.	Bob Hill                        1481	1538.1	24.0	(3)
3.	Gilles Carmel                   1492	1529.9	1.0	(2)
4.	Seppo Kemppainen                1430	1514.0	47.2	(5)
5.	The Awesome Oilers              1412	1504.4	68.6	(4)
6.	Hillside Raiders                1456	1495.2	7.0	(7)
7.	Mak "The Knife" Paranjape       1424	1491.7	31.0	(6)
8.	Jan Stein                       1412	1483.2	35.3	(8)
9.	this years model                1428	1479.3	17.6	(10)
10.	Rangers Of Destiny              1401	1475.9	42.0	(9)
	Tapio Repo                      1422	1475.9	19.6	(11)
12.	FRANK'S BIG FISH                1398	1453.9	22.0	(12)
13.	The Underachievers              1409	1452.9	10.1	(13)
14.	On Thin Ice                     1380	1440.9	32.3	(14)
15.	Go Flames                       1367	1438.1	40.3	(17)
16.	littlest giants                 1370	1437.7	35.6	(16)
17.	Mopar Muscle Men                1400	1431.4	3.7	(18)
18.	Lindros Losers                  1396	1431.2	1.7	(15)
19.	DIE Penguin Bandwaggoners       1357	1411.0	20.2	(19)
20.	Samuel Lau (Calgary, Alberta)   1360	1396.3	4.9	(20)
21.	Boomer's Boys                   1341	1371.6	0.2	(23)
22.	General Accounting Office       1316	1369.4	20.9	(21)
23.	Delaware Wombats                1341	1367.5	1.3	(24)
24.	Migods Menschen                 1307	1366.8	31.6	(22)
25.	Wellsy's Buttheads DEC NH       1280	1362.3	52.6	(25)
26.	Rocky Mountain High             1325	1357.2	1.8	(26)
27.	Fife Flyers                     1283	1348.4	31.4	(27)
28.	Gerald Olchowy                  1275	1340.2	33.7	(28)
29.	Dave Snell                      1281	1335.7	25.0	(59)
30.	Fluide Glacial                  1291	1333.7	18.0	(29)
31.	Gaoler                          1279	1321.5	11.2	(30)
32.	SmegHeads                       1289	1315.8	0.3	(31)
33.	The Young And The Skateless     1235	1305.6	42.9	(32)
34.	Sam & His Dogs                  1262	1297.3	11.6	(34)
35.	Neural Netters                  1251	1294.2	11.3	(35)
36.	Youngbucs                       1206	1288.1	101.7	(36)
37.	Artic Storm                     1220	1287.7	39.3	(33)
38.	Soft Swedes                     1205	1281.5	46.9	(37)
39.	Jeff Horvath                    1239	1268.6	5.6	(38)
40.	Milton Keynes Kings             1229	1262.5	2.8	(40)
41.	Hamster from Hoboken            1223	1257.0	8.7	(41)
	Kuehn Crushers                  1185	1257.0	45.1	(45)
43.	Le Fleur de Lys                 1202	1256.9	25.3	(42)
44.	Yan The Man Loke                1225	1255.5	0.7	(39)
45.	Legion of Hoth                  1208	1251.1	15.8	(48)
46.	Simmonac                        1169	1249.4	87.6	(44)
47.	The Finnish Force               1192	1245.1	22.5	(46)
48.	ice legion                      1193	1244.8	28.8	(43)
49.	Streaks                         1161	1242.8	54.8	(47)
50.	Brian Bergman                   1190	1241.0	23.3	(55)
51.	Goaldingers                     1190	1239.3	22.0	(49)
52.	T C OverAchievers               1209	1237.0	2.9	(52)
53.	Grant Marven                    1196	1231.2	2.9	(50)
54.	Bozrah Bruins                   1155	1223.9	45.2	(54)
55.	Real Bad Toe Jam                1150	1223.4	48.9	(62)
56.	Houdini's Magicians             1181	1222.4	18.3	(61)
57.	Skriko Wolves                   1186	1221.5	5.4	(53)
58.	rec.sport.hockey choices        1196	1221.1	1.3	(63)
59.	buffalo soldiers                1142	1220.3	62.1	(65)
60.	bemybaby                        1140	1219.9	54.2	(51)
61.	LIPPE                           1179	1215.2	13.9	(56)
62.	Randy Coulman                   1185	1214.8	5.2	(57)
63.	LAMP LIGHTERS                   1180	1211.6	5.9	(58)
64.	Steven And Mark Dream Team      1174	1206.2	3.1	(60)
65.	Indianapolis Bennies            1160	1205.4	20.8	(66)
66.	Tom                             1160	1202.8	13.1	(68)
67.	Bloom County All Stars          1164	1198.8	4.3	(67)
68.	Bruins                          1174	1198.5	0.1	(72)
69.	Phil and Kev's Karma Dudes      1172	1198.0	0.8	(69)
70.	smithw                          1146	1194.5	21.0	(73)
71.	Iowa Hockeyes                   1149	1193.8	16.3	(64)
72.	Doug Bowles                     1146	1190.6	20.0	(71)
73.	The Great Pumpkin               1108	1187.3	54.4	(74)
74.	NON!                            1145	1186.4	16.4	(77)
75.	shooting seamen                 1161	1183.3	0.1	(75)
76.	Frank Worthless                 1149	1182.7	6.3	(76)
77.	AIK Exiles                      1116	1179.8	34.5	(70)
78.	Invisible Inc                   1156	1177.4	1.1	(78)
79.	Brad Gibson                     1126	1176.9	27.2	(79)
80.	Cougarmania                     1114	1165.7	24.8	(88)
81.	Kortelaisen Kovat               1086	1165.2	164.1	(85)
82.	PLP Fools                       1135	1163.1	0.1	(81)
83.	David Wong                      1082	1161.6	66.1	(84)
84.	John Zupancic                   1102	1160.7	27.1	(82)
85.	garryola                        1121	1159.4	9.7	(89)
86.	Gary Bergman Fan Club           1128	1157.6	5.1	(93)
87.	Staffan Axelsson                1120	1157.1	15.1	(83)
88.	Chubby Checkers                 1110	1156.2	16.3	(80)
89.	Derrill's Dastardly Dozen       1109	1155.0	22.1	(90)
90.	Chocolate Rockets               1121	1150.7	2.5	(86)
91.	Ken DeCruyenaere                1113	1147.9	5.0	(87)
92.	Fisher Dirtbags                 1119	1147.4	0.7	(94)
93.	KODIAKS                         1122	1146.0	1.3	(95)
94.	No Namers                       1067	1145.8	58.2	(91)
95.	The Campi Machine               1061	1145.2	65.3	(92)
96.	BSC Oranienburg                 1115	1142.4	7.1	(98)
97.	The Kamucks                     1064	1141.5	76.1	(97)
98.	Arsenal Maple Leafs             1108	1138.4	3.8	(96)
99.	Ellis Islanders                 1096	1128.0	7.6	(100)
100.	Mombasa Mosquitos               1090	1122.4	6.1	(101)
101.	Zachmans Wingers                1051	1122.1	49.8	(103)
102.	Edelweiss                       1091	1121.0	2.9	(102)
103.	Bjoern Leaguen                  1039	1118.5	61.4	(112)
104.	Dirty White Socks               1050	1116.5	43.4	(105)
105.	Wormtown Woosbags               1039	1116.1	72.6	(104)
106.	Neil Younger                    1036	1115.0	77.7	(114)
107.	Hurricane Andrew                1082	1114.8	7.6	(106)
108.	King Suke                       1089	1114.5	0.1	(110)
109.	Larry                           1078	1114.3	11.8	(107)
110.	Het Schot Is Hard               1076	1113.6	18.1	(115)
111.	VoteNoOct26                     1056	1112.6	31.8	(108)
112.	Bloodgamers                     1046	1111.6	42.1	(99)
	Bruce's Rented Mules            1077	1111.6	11.9	(108)
114.	Teem Kanada                     1075	1110.6	16.0	(111)
115.	Frank's Follies                 1063	1106.5	24.2	(113)
116.	Oklahoma Stormchasers           1053	1103.6	28.3	(121)
117.	SPUDS                           1068	1103.4	12.6	(119)
118.	Pond Slime                      1081	1102.3	0.7	(117)
119.	PSV Dartmouth                   1071	1101.4	7.1	(116)
120.	Mark Sanders                    1065	1099.2	11.1	(120)
121.	Blue Talon                      1062	1096.5	13.3	(126)
122.	Stanford Ice Hawks              1043	1094.7	28.2	(118)
123.	Aye Carumba!!!                  1063	1089.6	3.9	(124)
124.	Kokudo Keikaku Bunnies          1021	1088.0	40.3	(125)
125.	Timo Ojala                      1059	1085.7	0.3	(122)
126.	Haral                           1057	1085.3	7.3	(128)
127.	Cluster Buster                  1048	1083.4	7.6	(136)
128.	Dirty Rotten Puckers            1054	1082.7	1.2	(135)
129.	Apricot Fuzzfaces               1037	1081.1	23.3	(127)
130.	The Lost Poots                  1048	1080.5	6.7	(132)
131.	Nesbitt                         1058	1078.6	1.1	(123)
132.	Gary Bill Pens Dynasty          1035	1077.8	19.6	(144)
133.	garys team                      1035	1076.2	17.1	(129)
134.	Arctic Circles                  1012	1074.1	37.6	(131)
135.	Seattle PFTB                    1028	1074.0	22.9	(132)
136.	Late Night with David Letterman 1049	1073.7	0.0	(130)
137.	Le Groupe MI                    1020	1073.2	30.2	(141)
138.	GO BRUINS                       1046	1072.7	6.2	(140)
139.	Scott Glenn                     1038	1069.7	10.2	(138)
140.	Flying Kiwis                    1035	1068.7	9.1	(136)
141.	team gold                       1029	1067.4	16.7	(142)
142.	Closet Boy's Boys               995	1064.6	48.0	(143)
143.	Wild Hearted Sons               1036	1064.4	4.9	(153)
144.	boutch 92-93                    1023	1063.2	20.0	(134)
145.	Andy Y F WONG                   1019	1062.6	21.5	(147)
	Wembley LostWeekenders          1040	1062.6	0.3	(152)
147.	McKees Rocks Rockers            1036	1062.4	5.1	(144)
148.	Book 'em Danno's Bushbabies     1032	1062.1	10.5	(163)
149.	Dree Hobbs                      1020	1060.2	13.4	(139)
150.	GO HABS GO                      1027	1058.1	8.0	(151)
151.	Goddess Of Fermentation         1005	1057.8	30.2	(156)
152.	Tim Rogers                      1024	1056.8	8.1	(146)
153.	convex stars                    1026	1055.9	5.6	(160)
154.	Einstein's Rock Band            1033	1055.7	0.0	(154)
155.	Princeton Canucks               979	1055.5	124.2	(150)
156.	Tap                             1028	1055.2	0.5	(155)
157.	Hubert's Hockey Homeboys        1030	1053.9	0.6	(163)
	Buttered Waffles                981	1053.9	46.0	(148)
159.	MY TEAM                         977	1052.0	174.8	(162)
160.	Bob's Blues                     980	1050.9	46.8	(149)
161.	furleys furies                  1021	1046.6	3.6	(159)
162.	HUNTERS & COLLECTORS            982	1045.9	42.4	(157)
	Les Nordiques                   974	1045.9	60.4	(161)
164.	Satan's Choice                  1012	1045.3	14.5	(173)
165.	Dr Joel Fleishman               1020	1043.9	3.7	(158)
166.	Sundogs                         1017	1040.9	0.4	(166)
167.	Pierre Mailhot                  1017	1039.9	2.6	(175)
168.	Slap Shot Marco                 966	1037.8	51.8	(168)
169.	San Jose Mahi Mahi              989	1037.6	31.8	(178)
170.	The Leafs Rule!!!!              990	1037.3	25.8	(174)
171.	Jeff Nimeroff                   963	1036.5	48.8	(167)
172.	Stimpy ADG Zeta                 996	1035.2	21.0	(178)
173.	The Dreamers                    958	1034.6	63.7	(170)
174.	East City Jokers                956	1033.7	69.1	(171)
175.	Daryl Turner                    1008	1033.1	2.4	(169)
176.	riding the pine                 988	1031.8	20.7	(165)
177.	Flowers                         957	1030.4	113.6	(172)
178.	Darse Billings                  975	1029.3	34.7	(185)
179.	Chappel's Chumps                984	1027.9	24.0	(186)
180.	LANA Inc                        982	1027.2	27.3	(182)
181.	Spinal Tap                      963	1026.6	41.4	(177)
182.	JimParker                       949	1025.9	179.0	(187)
183.	Enforcers                       980	1023.9	28.1	(189)
184.	Jeff Bachovchin                 949	1020.7	46.7	(180)
	Big Bad Bruins                  981	1020.7	18.5	(183)
186.	Mike Mac Cormack Sydney NS CAN  944	1020.6	107.2	(184)
187.	Bulldogs                        973	1019.7	23.4	(181)
188.	voyageurs                       996	1017.2	2.7	(176)
189.	Absolut Lehigh                  984	1015.4	8.9	(190)
190.	Republican Dirty Tricksters     930	1010.4	66.0	(188)
191.	Henry's Bar B Q                 990	1007.7	0.7	(197)
192.	Dr.D And The S.O.D.             968	1007.3	17.1	(192)
193.	Bunch of Misfits                957	1006.9	23.8	(193)
194.	Robyns Team                     955	1005.5	30.0	(198)
195.	Yellow Plague                   969	1003.4	14.2	(191)
196.	Ninja Turtles                   982	1003.0	1.3	(194)
197.	Team Melville                   930	999.1	46.9	(199)
198.	Acadien                         962	998.6	18.3	(201)
199.	DARMAN'S Dragons                950	998.4	28.3	(209)
200.	Kuta Papercuts                  961	998.2	18.5	(207)
201.	Great Expectations              972	998.0	2.3	(195)
202.	Cobra's Killers                 942	996.4	31.7	(205)
203.	Cherry Bombers                  971	995.6	1.2	(196)
204.	Jayson's Kinky Pucks            943	989.9	26.9	(204)
205.	Killer Apes                     947	989.7	24.3	(208)
206.	Kaufbeuren Icebreakers          929	989.1	37.6	(202)
207.	Umpire 4 life                   950	987.8	11.1	(200)
208.	Roger Smith                     927	987.0	39.6	(210)
209.	Firebirds                       960	983.8	3.9	(203)
210.	Those 1st few weeks hurt!       905	982.9	55.9	(211)
211.	IKEA Wholesale                  958	982.0	1.7	(213)
212.	Outlaws                         903	975.6	164.9	(206)
213.	The 200 Club                    944	969.4	6.8	(219)
214.	Thundering Herd                 887	966.7	163.6	(212)
215.	Believe it or dont              926	966.6	21.1	(214)
216.	Creeping Death                  924	965.7	21.3	(217)
217.	Knee Injuries                   932	965.6	10.4	(218)
218.	Crazy Euros                     927	965.3	17.9	(220)
219.	Frack Attack                    918	965.0	27.3	(221)
	Todd's Turkeys                  942	965.0	1.9	(222)
221.	Ryan's Renegades                893	961.7	50.9	(223)
222.	fred mckim                      889	961.5	93.0	(215)
223.	400 Hurricane                   909	960.4	32.1	(216)
224.	pig vomit                       936	958.3	1.3	(225)
225.	Ice Strykers                    882	955.4	105.4	(226)
226.	Fighting Geordies               882	953.7	141.6	(227)
227.	CDN Stuck in Alabama            925	951.6	10.3	(228)
228.	dayton bomber                   932	951.5	0.0	(236)
229.	Cafall and Crew                 892	948.2	38.3	(224)
230.	Chris of Death                  872	945.0	83.6	(232)
231.	Swillbellies                    902	941.9	18.7	(230)
232.	Banko's Beer Rangers            913	940.4	4.2	(233)
	Zipper Heads                    892	940.4	33.9	(237)
234.	NY Flames                       907	938.8	7.8	(234)
235.	Ship's Way                      913	938.7	8.7	(229)
236.	Laubsters II                    861	937.6	201.6	(235)
237.	Oz                              878	934.1	35.0	(231)
238.	Joliet Inmates                  872	933.5	45.8	(239)
239.	Ninja Bunnies                   858	925.9	44.9	(238)
240.	Great Scott                     853	924.6	73.3	(242)
241.	Widefield White Wolves          861	919.7	36.9	(240)
242.	The Ice Holes                   890	912.7	2.7	(246)
243.	SANDY'S SABRES                  886	910.8	4.7	(244)
244.	Daves Team                      858	910.7	32.0	(241)
245.	South Carolina Tiger Paws       835	909.0	78.4	(243)
246.	Florida Tech Burgh Team         844	908.9	49.3	(245)
247.	Leos Blue Chips                 874	902.5	10.4	(247)
248.	For xtc                         874	900.0	8.2	(248)
249.	roadrunners                     861	899.7	18.5	(249)
250.	Mudville Kings                  851	897.8	27.6	(250)
251.	New Jersey Rob                  876	894.2	0.7	(253)
252.	Redliners                       856	893.3	15.9	(251)
253.	Pat Phillips                    859	887.6	10.1	(252)
254.	Stewart Clamen                  851	869.6	1.6	(254)
255.	Demon Spawn                     820	866.1	25.0	(255)
256.	Sunnyvale Storm                 804	818.4	0.2	(256)
257.	Allez les Blues                 738	809.1	476.9	(257)
258.	Up For Sale Hockey Club         749	789.4	23.0	(258)
259.	Petes Picks                     721	788.0	168.5	(259)
260.	RINACO                          709	781.8	114.0	(260)
261.	Brenz Revenge                   691	713.3	4.0	(261)
262.	Dinamo Riga                     595	663.9	571.6	(262)
-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53613
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Hockey Draft week 27 price list

Here is the price list for the week April 13 to April 19.

	- Andrew

Buy	Sell	Pts	Team	Player
158.9	143.0	157	PIT	Mario_Lemieux
148.5	133.7	145	BUF	Pat_LaFontaine
142.7	128.4	141	BOS	Adam_Oates
137.6	123.8	136	DET	Steve_Yzerman
132.1	118.9	129	WPG	Teemu_Selanne
131.7	118.5	127	NYI	Pierre_Turgeon
130.1	117.1	127	TOR	Doug_Gilmour
126.0	113.4	123	BUF	Alexander_Mogilny
123.4	111.1	119	PHI	Mark_Recchi
121.9	109.7	119	LA	Luc_Robitaille
113.3	102.0	112	QUE	Mats_Sundin
111.3	100.2	110	PIT	Kevin_Stevens
110.6	99.5	108	VAN	Pavel_Bure
108.6	97.7	106	STL	Craig_Janney
108.3	97.5	107	PIT	Rick_Tocchet
107.6	96.8	105	CHI	Jeremy_Roenick
105.3	94.8	104	QUE	Joe_Sakic
103.5	93.2	101	STL	Brett_Hull
102.4	92.2	100	CGY	Theoren_Fleury
101.2	91.1	100	PIT	Ron_Francis
100.4	90.4	98	TOR	Dave_Andreychuk
100.2	90.2	99	BOS	Joe_Juneau
98.3	88.5	96	WPG	Phil_Housley
98.3	88.5	96	MTL	Vincent_Damphousse
96.3	86.7	94	MTL	Kirk_Muller
96.1	86.5	95	DET	Dino_Ciccarelli
95.3	85.8	93	BUF	Dale_Hawerchuk
95.3	85.8	93	MIN	Mike_Modano
94.4	85.0	91	NYR	Mark_Messier
93.2	83.9	91	STL	Brendan_Shanahan
93.1	83.8	92	PIT	Jaromir_Jagr
88.1	79.3	86	MTL	Brian_Bellows
88.1	79.3	86	LA	Jari_Kurri
88.0	79.2	87	DET	Sergei_Fedorov
87.1	78.4	85	CGY	Robert_Reichel
87.0	78.3	86	DET	Paul_Coffey
86.1	77.5	83	WSH	Peter_Bondra
86.1	77.5	83	HFD	Geoff_Sanderson
86.0	77.4	84	TB	Brian_Bradley
85.0	76.5	82	NYI	Steve_Thomas
84.0	75.6	83	PIT	Larry_Murphy
84.0	75.6	81	PHI	Rod_Brind'Amour
83.0	74.7	82	BOS	Ray_Bourque
83.0	74.7	82	QUE	Steve_Duchesne
83.0	74.7	80	HFD	Andrew_Cassels
82.0	73.8	80	LA	Tony_Granato
81.9	73.7	79	WSH	Dale_Hunter
81.9	73.7	79	WSH	Mike_Ridley
80.9	72.8	78	HFD	Pat_Verbeek
80.9	72.8	79	MTL	Stephan_Lebeau
80.9	72.8	79	CGY	Gary_Suter
78.9	71.0	77	VAN	Cliff_Ronning
78.9	71.0	77	NJ	Claude_Lemieux
78.9	71.0	78	QUE	Mike_Ricci
77.9	70.1	76	VAN	Murray_Craven
77.9	70.1	76	STL	Jeff_Brown
77.8	70.0	75	WSH	Kevin_Hatcher
77.8	70.0	75	NYR	Tony_Amonte
76.9	69.2	76	SJ	Kelly_Kisio
76.8	69.1	75	NJ	Alexander_Semak
76.8	69.1	75	MIN	Russ_Courtnall
75.8	68.2	74	MIN	Dave_Gagner
75.8	68.2	74	TOR	Nikolai_Borschevsky
75.7	68.1	73	PHI	Eric_Lindros
74.8	67.3	73	LA	Jimmy_Carson
73.8	66.4	72	CGY	Joe_Nieuwendyk
73.8	66.4	72	VAN	Geoff_Courtnall
73.8	66.4	72	MIN	Ulf_Dahlen
73.6	66.2	71	NYI	Derek_King
73.6	66.2	71	WSH	Michal_Pivonka
72.9	65.6	72	QUE	Owen_Nolan
72.9	65.6	72	BOS	Dmitri_Kvartalnov
72.7	65.4	71	STL	Nelson_Emerson
72.7	65.4	71	CHI	Chris_Chelios
72.6	65.3	70	NYI	Benoit_Hogue
71.7	64.5	70	NJ	Stephane_Richer
71.7	64.5	70	WPG	Thomas_Steen
71.7	64.5	70	WPG	Alexei_Zhamnov
71.7	64.5	70	CHI	Steve_Larmer
69.8	62.8	69	PIT	Joe_Mullen
69.5	62.6	67	NYR	Mike_Gartner
68.6	61.7	67	VAN	Petr_Nedved
68.6	61.7	67	VAN	Trevor_Linden
68.6	61.7	67	LA	Mike_Donnelly
68.4	61.6	66	WSH	Dmitri_Khristich
68.4	61.6	66	WSH	Al_Iafrate
66.8	60.1	66	DET	Ray_Sheppard
66.8	60.1	66	QUE	Andrei_Kovalenko
66.4	59.8	64	HFD	Zarley_Zalapski
66.4	59.8	64	NYR	Adam_Graves
65.8	59.2	65	SJ	Johan_Garpenlov
64.5	58.1	63	TOR	Glenn_Anderson
63.5	57.2	62	LA	Wayne_Gretzky
63.5	57.2	62	OTT	Norm_Maciver
62.2	56.0	60	PHI	Garry_Galley
61.7	55.5	61	DET	Steve_Chiasson
61.7	55.5	61	DET	Paul_Ysebaert
61.5	55.4	60	NJ	Valeri_Zelepukin
61.5	55.4	60	MTL	Mike_Keane
61.2	55.1	59	PHI	Brent_Fedyk
60.7	54.6	60	PIT	Shawn_McEachern
60.4	54.4	59	LA	Rob_Blake
60.1	54.1	58	NYI	Pat_Flatley
59.7	53.7	59	QUE	Scott_Young
59.4	53.5	58	WPG	Darrin_Shannon
59.1	53.2	57	PHI	Kevin_Dineen
58.4	52.6	57	NJ	Bernie_Nicholls
58.4	52.6	57	CGY	Sergei_Makarov
58.4	52.6	57	CHI	Steve_Smith
58.1	52.3	56	WSH	Pat_Elynuik
57.4	51.7	56	VAN	Greg_Adams
57.4	51.7	56	NJ	Scott_Stevens
57.4	51.7	56	TB	John_Tucker
56.3	50.7	55	WPG	Fredrik_Olausson
56.0	50.4	54	NYR	Sergei_Nemchinov
55.0	49.5	53	NYR	Darren_Turcotte
55.0	48.9	53	CGY	Al_MacInnis
55.0	48.9	53	CHI	Christian_Ruuttu
55.0	48.0	52	CHI	Brent_Sutter
55.0	47.6	51	HFD	Terry_Yake
55.0	47.0	51	VAN	Dixon_Ward
55.0	47.0	51	WPG	Keith_Tkachuk
55.0	46.4	51	BOS	Stephen_Leach
55.0	46.1	50	TOR	John_Cullen
55.0	46.1	50	MTL	Denis_Savard
55.0	45.7	49	NYR	Ed_Olczyk
55.0	45.2	49	VAN	Anatoli_Semenov
55.0	44.8	48	WSH	Sylvain_Cote
55.0	44.8	48	NYI	Vladimir_Malakhov
55.0	44.8	48	NYI	Jeff_Norton
55.0	44.8	48	HFD	Patrick_Poulin
55.0	44.6	49	BOS	Dave_Poulin
55.0	44.3	48	LA	Tomas_Sandstrom
55.0	44.3	48	EDM	Petr_Klima
55.0	44.3	48	NJ	John_MacLean
55.0	44.3	48	EDM	Doug_Weight
55.0	43.3	47	MTL	Gilbert_Dionne
55.0	43.3	47	LA	Alexei_Zhitnik
55.0	43.3	47	EDM	Shayne_Corson
55.0	42.8	47	QUE	Martin_Rucinsky
55.0	42.4	46	WPG	Evgeny_Davydov
55.0	42.4	46	STL	Kevin_Miller
55.0	42.4	46	EDM	Craig_Simpson
55.0	42.0	45	WSH	Kelly_Miller
55.0	42.0	45	PHI	Pelle_Eklund
55.0	40.6	44	CHI	Michel_Goulet
55.0	40.6	44	EDM	Dave_Manson
55.0	39.6	43	OTT	Sylvain_Turgeon
55.0	38.7	42	CGY	Paul_Ranheim
55.0	38.7	42	MTL	Mathieu_Schneider
55.0	38.7	42	MIN	Mark_Tinordi
55.0	38.3	42	DET	Bob_Probert
55.0	37.8	41	EDM	Todd_Elik
55.0	37.4	40	NYR	Esa_Tikkanen
55.0	37.4	41	BOS	Vladimir_Ruzicka
55.0	36.9	40	OTT	Bob_Kudelski
55.0	36.9	40	NJ	Peter_Stastny
55.0	36.9	40	TOR	Dave_Ellett
55.0	36.9	40	OTT	Brad_Shaw
55.0	36.5	40	DET	Niklas_Lidstrom
55.0	36.0	39	NJ	Bobby_Holik
55.0	36.0	39	TOR	Wendel_Clark
55.0	35.5	38	NYR	Alexei_Kovalev
55.0	35.0	38	BUF	Yuri_Khmylev
55.0	35.0	38	MIN	Mike_McPhee
55.0	34.1	37	TOR	Rob_Pearson
55.0	34.1	37	VAN	Sergio_Momesso
55.0	33.6	36	NYR	Brian_Leetch
55.0	33.2	36	CHI	Dirk_Graham
55.0	33.2	36	TB	Adam_Creighton
55.0	32.8	36	QUE	Valery_Kamensky
55.0	32.3	35	EDM	Zdeno_Ciger
55.0	32.3	35	LA	Corey_Millen
55.0	31.9	35	BOS	Ted_Donato
55.0	31.3	34	TOR	Peter_Zezel
55.0	30.4	33	MIN	Neal_Broten
55.0	29.5	32	MTL	Gary_Leeman
55.0	29.5	32	EDM	Scott_Mellanby
55.0	29.5	32	BUF	Wayne_Presley
55.0	29.2	32	DET	Keith_Primeau
55.0	28.9	31	NYI	Brian_Mullen
55.0	28.9	31	PHI	Josef_Beranek
55.0	28.6	31	CHI	Stephane_Matteau
55.0	28.3	31	BOS	Steve_Heinze
55.0	28.0	30	PHI	Dmitri_Yushkevich
55.0	28.0	30	HFD	Mikael_Nylander
55.0	27.6	30	BUF	Richard_Smehlik
55.0	27.6	30	TOR	Dmitri_Mironov
55.0	25.8	28	CHI	Brian_Noonan
55.0	25.5	28	SJ	Pat_Falloon
55.0	24.9	27	STL	Igor_Korolev
55.0	24.3	26	WSH	Bob_Carpenter
55.0	24.3	26	NYR	James_Patrick
55.0	23.9	26	BUF	Petr_Svoboda
55.0	23.0	25	OTT	Mark_Lamb
55.0	22.4	24	NYI	Scott_LaChance
55.0	22.1	24	MTL	Benoit_Brunet
55.0	22.1	24	TB	Mikael_Andersson
55.0	21.2	23	EDM	Martin_Gelinas
55.0	21.2	23	WPG	Sergei_Bautin
55.0	21.2	23	TOR	Bill_Berg
55.0	21.2	23	EDM	Kevin_Todd
55.0	19.6	21	NYI	David_Volek
55.0	19.6	21	NYI	Ray_Ferraro
55.0	19.4	21	MIN	Brent_Gilchrist
55.0	18.6	20	HFD	Yvon_Corriveau
55.0	18.6	20	NYR	Phil_Bourque
55.0	18.6	20	NYI	Darius_Kasparaitis
55.0	18.2	20	DET	Jim_Hiller
55.0	17.7	19	PHI	Andrei_Lomakin
55.0	17.6	19	BUF	Donald_Audette
55.0	16.6	18	TB	Roman_Hamrlik
55.0	15.5	17	BOS	Cam_Neely
55.0	15.5	17	SJ	Mark_Pederson
55.0	14.6	16	PIT	Martin_Straka
55.0	13.9	15	CHI	Joe_Murphy
55.0	12.2	13	NYR	Peter_Andersson
55.0	12.0	13	OTT	Tomas_Jelinek
55.0	12.0	13	NJ	Janne_Ojanen
55.0	10.2	11	TB	Steve_Kasper
55.0	10.2	11	MIN	Bobby_Smith
55.0	9.1	10	SJ	Ray_Whitney
55.0	8.4	9	HFD	Robert_Petrovicky
55.0	8.3	9	BUF	Viktor_Gordijuk
55.0	7.4	8	TOR	Joe_Sacco
55.0	7.3	8	QUE	Mikhail_Tatarinov
55.0	7.3	8	SJ	Peter_Ahola
55.0	6.5	7	CHI	Rob_Brown
55.0	6.4	7	BOS	Glen_Murray
55.0	5.6	6	HFD	Tim_Kerr
55.0	5.5	6	MIN	Brian_Propp
55.0	4.7	5	WSH	Reggie_Savage
55.0	4.6	5	STL	Vitali_Prokhorov
55.0	4.6	5	LA	Robert_Lang
55.0	4.6	5	EDM	Shaun_Van_Allen
55.0	3.7	4	MIN	Dan_Quinn
55.0	3.6	4	DET	Viacheslav_Kozlov
55.0	3.6	4	BOS	Jozef_Stumpel
55.0	3.6	4	PIT	Bryan_Fogarty
55.0	2.8	3	MTL	Olav_Petrov
55.0	2.8	3	TB	Stan_Drulia
55.0	1.9	2	WSH	Jason_Woolley
55.0	1.8	2	NJ	Claude_Vilgrain
55.0	0.0	0	MTL	Patrick_Kjellberg
55.0	0.0	0	OTT	Alexei_Yashin
55.0	0.0	0	WSH	Randy_Burridge
55.0	0.0	0	EDM	Dean_McAmmond
55.0	0.0	0	CGY	Cory_Stillman
55.0	0.0	0	TB	Brent_Gretzky
55.0	0.0	0	BUF	Jason_Dawe
55.0	0.0	0	WSH	Brian_Sakic
55.0	0.0	0	VAN	Igor_Larionov
55.0	0.0	0	CHI	Sergei_Krivokrasov
55.0	0.0	0	QUE	Peter_Forsberg
-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53614
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Aargh!  Great Hockey Coverage!! (Devils)


Locked away, waiting for the tape-delay to start ...

It's nice that the Devils are starting out their playoffs on network
television ... too bad that their playoff game has been preempted on
WABC-AM for an early-season Yankees baseball game!

It's a 12-2 win by the Texas Rangers ... and they're delaying the
tape-delay by another half-hour for the ballgame "highlights"!!!

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53615
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Fri, April 16, 1993

Philadelphia                     1 1 2 1--5
Hartford                         1 2 1 0--4
First period
     1, Hartford, Nylander 10 (unassisted) 8:51.
     2, Philadelphia, Recchi 53 (Lindros, Brind'Amour) pp, 19:59.
Second period
     3, Hartford, Burt 6 (Cunneyworth, Kron) 2:00.
     4, Philadelphia, Bowen 1 (Eklund, Recchi) 7:09.
     5, Hartford, Nylander 11 (Zalapski, Sanderson) 9:38.
Third period
     6, Hartford, Kron 14 (Sanderson, Cassels) pp, 1:24.
     7, Philadelphia, Beranek 15 (Lomakin, Yushkevich) 3:11.
     8, Philadelphia, Faust 2 (Brind'Amour, Roussel) 3:38.
Overtime
     9, Philadelphia, Yushkevich 5 (Faust) 1:15.

Philadelphia: 5    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Beranek            1    0    1
Bowen              1    0    1
Brind'Amour        0    2    2
Eklund             0    1    1
Faust              1    1    2
Lindros            0    1    1
Lomakin            0    1    1
Recchi             1    1    2
Roussel            0    1    1
Yushkevich         1    1    2

Hartford: 4    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Burt               1    0    1
Cassels            0    1    1
Cunneyworth        0    1    1
Kron               1    1    2
Nylander           2    0    2
Sanderson          0    2    2
Zalapski           0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
New Jersey                       0 3 1--4
NY Islanders                     3 3 2--8
First period
     1, NY Islanders, Turgeon 56 (unassisted) 4:11.
     2, NY Islanders, Thomas 36 (Malakhov, King) pp, 5:58.
     3, NY Islanders, Ferraro 14 (Dalgarno, Malakhov) 18:16.
Second period
     4, New Jersey, Niedermayer 11 (Richer, Nicholls) 0:41.
     5, NY Islanders, Mullen 18 (Vaske, Dalgarno) 1:15.
     6, NY Islanders, Thomas 37 (Hogue, Norton) 2:12.
     7, New Jersey, Zelepukin 23 (unassisted) 17:11.
     8, New Jersey, Richer 38 (Nicholls, Daneyko) 17:23.
     9, NY Islanders, Hogue 33 (Flatley, Ferraro) 18:42.
Third period
     10, NY Islanders, Turgeon 57 (unassisted) 3:45.
     11, New Jersey, Semak 37 (Lemieux, Driver) 9:06.
     12, NY Islanders, Turgeon 58 (King, Pilon) 10:21.

NY Islanders: 8    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Dalgarno           0    2    2
Ferraro            1    1    2
Flatley            0    1    1
Hogue              1    1    2
King               0    2    2
Malakhov           0    2    2
Mullen             1    0    1
Norton             0    1    1
Pilon              0    1    1
Thomas             2    0    2
Turgeon            3    0    3
Vaske              0    1    1

New Jersey: 4    Power play: 2-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Daneyko            0    1    1
Driver             0    1    1
Lemieux            0    1    1
Nicholls           0    2    2
Niedermayer        1    0    1
Richer             1    1    2
Semak              1    0    1
Zelepukin          1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
NY Rangers                       1 0 1--2
Washington                       1 1 2--4
First period
     1, NY Rangers, Graves 36 (Zubov, Andersson) 6:17.
     2, Washington, Ridley 26 (unassisted) 18:33.
Second period
     3, Washington, Hatcher 34 (Johansson) 12:19.
Third period
     4, Washington, Jones 12 (May) 2:49.
     5, Washington, Cote 21 (Khristich, Pivonka) pp, 18:55.
     6, NY Rangers, Gartner 45 (Amonte, Andersson) pp, 19:50.

Washington: 4    Power play: 7-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Cote               1    0    1
Hatcher            1    0    1
Johansson          0    1    1
Jones              1    0    1
Khristich          0    1    1
May                0    1    1
Pivonka            0    1    1
Ridley             1    0    1

NY Rangers: 2    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Amonte             0    1    1
Andersson          0    2    2
Gartner            1    0    1
Graves             1    0    1
Zubov              0    1    1

-----------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53616
From: stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber)
Subject: Re: How difficult is it to get Penguin tickets?

In article <1993Apr18.201811.28965@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>, dmoney@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Dean R Money) writes:
> The subject line says it all.  Is it terribly difficult to get tickets
> to Penguins games, especially now that they are in the playoffs?  Would
> it be easy to find scalpers outside of the Igloo selling tickets?
> 
> Dean Money
> dmoney@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu

     Here is my traditional experience with tickets, playoffs and otherwise,
at the Civic Arena.

     Scalping is illegal but nonetheless present outside the Arena.  Best 
strategy, given that you don't mind missing the Anthem (which is OK if B.E.
Taylor decides to come back ever again :) ) is to wait until 7:40 or 7:45,
when the game is rolling; the scalpers are at this point desperate to sell
and will reduce to near or at face value to get rid of their tickets.

     Playoffs are a little different in that good seats will go early on; 
what's left at 7:45 may be nosebleed material (D, E sections).

Others can add on their opinions as well.

Kevin L. Stamber
Purdue University
PENGUINS 6 DEVILS 3 -- Pens lead series 1 game to none



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53617
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Did The Blues Pull It Out?

When I left, it was 4-3, Blues with 2:00 to go!  As I predicted in
"@#$%! I was right in the first place!!!"  Blues in 6!  YES!!!

Of course it's only one game -- that could be the 'Hawks stab in the face to
wake them up -- that's what playoffs are about, on any given day... :-)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          PGH PENGUINS!!!    "We do what comes naturally!
Patrick Division Semi's  '91 STANLEY CUP    You see now, wait for the
PENGUINS 6, Devils 3     '92 CHAMPIONS      possibility, don't you see a
Penguins lead, 1-0       12 STRAIGHT WINS!  strong resemblance..."-DG '89

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53618
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Playoff pool entry form

Well, thanks to everyone who has entered so far.  There are at least 40
entries, and hopefully more people will enter before the deadline, which
is 7:30 pm Today, Sunday, April 18, 1993!  In the interest of fairness,
since I will win anyway, I feel it is only right to actually tell everyone
my picks, so that you all won't cry "rigged" after I declare myself the
winner.  Here they are:


	Series			Your Pick		Games

   Division Semifinals

Pittsburgh-New Jersey		Pittsburgh		5
Washington-NY Islanders	NY Islanders		6

Boston-Buffalo			Boston			5
Quebec-Montreal			Quebec			7

Chicago-St. Louis		Chicago			4
Detroit-Toronto			Detroit			6

Vancouver-Winnipeg		Winnipeg		7
Calgary-Los Angeles		Calgary			7

   Division Finals

Patrick				Pittsburgh		6
Adams				Quebec			7
Norris				Chicago			7
Smythe				Calgary

   Conference Finals

Wales				Pittsburgh		5
Campbell			Chicago			4


Stanley Cup winner		Pittsburgh		6

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53619
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Playoff Pool (IMPORTANT)

I got back from my trip to discover that my email spool file got blown
away.  I am missing all the playoff pool entries sent between April 5
and April 17.  It looks like about 200 entries got lost.  *Sigh*.

Therefore, I would like to ask each person that sent me a team to resend
it ASAP.  I am relying on your honesty to not make changes after the
deadline today.

Thanks in advance, and I apologize for the problem.

-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53620
From: gp2011@andy.bgsu.edu (George Pavlic)
Subject: Re: Aargh!  Great Hockey Coverage!! (Devils)

In article <1993Apr18.203823.28597@news.columbia.edu>,
gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) wrote:
> 
> 
> Locked away, waiting for the tape-delay to start ...
> 
> It's nice that the Devils are starting out their playoffs on network
> television ... too bad that their playoff game has been preempted on
> WABC-AM for an early-season Yankees baseball game!
> 
> It's a 12-2 win by the Texas Rangers ... and they're delaying the
> tape-delay by another half-hour for the ballgame "highlights"!!!
> 
You think that's bad?  I'm in Bowling Green, OH, and we get ABC from
Toledo.  Well, the cable co. decided to totally pre-empt the game (no tape
delay, no nothing) for a stupid telethon!  Hockey is very big around here,
too.  I had to listen to "my" Penguins win on my car radio out in the
parking lot.  I can just be thankful for a strong radio because being 230
miles from Pittsburgh, the reception usually isn't good at all.  I can't
believe I picked it up during the middle of the day.

George

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53621
From: wangr@vccsouth22.its.rpi.edu ( Rex Wang )
Subject:  Tie Breaker....(Isles and Devils)

	Are people here stupid or what??? It is a tie breaker, of cause they
have to have the same record. How can people be sooooo stuppid to put win as
first in the list for tie breaker??? If it is a tie breaker, how can there be
different record???? Man, I thought people in this net are good with hockey.
I might not be great in Math, but tell me how can two teams ahve the same points
with different record??? Man...retard!!!!!! Can't believe people actually put
win as first in a tie breaker......



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53622
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: Blues steal game 1 from Hawks


  The Blues scored two power-play goals in 17 seconds in the third period
and the beat the Chicago Blackhawks 4-3 Sunday afternoon at Chicago Stadium.
Brendan Shanahan tied the game 3-3 and Brett Hull scored the game winner 17
seconds later. Jeff Brown and Denny Felsner scored the other Blues goals.
Brian Noonan had the hat trick for the Hawks, who also had some very good
goaltending from Ed Belfour. Blues goalie Curtis Joseph was solid down the
stretch to preserve the Blues lead.

The Hawks came out strong in the first period, outshooting the Blues 6-1 and
taking a 1-0 lead on Noonan's first goal. Right after an interference penalty
on Rick Zombo had expired, Keith Brown intercepted a clearing attempt at the
blue line and passed the puck to Steve Larmer in the right circle. Larmer fired
a long slap shot, and Noonan deflected the puck between Joseph's pads. After
the goal, the Blues picked up the intensity and went on to outshoot the Hawks
10-9 in the first period.

Jeff Brown tied the game 1-1 at 3:12 of the second. Nelson Emerson broke in on
the left side, got by Craig Muni and pushed the puck across the slot. Belfour
came out to play the pass and shoveled it to the right boards, where Brown
collected it and slapped it in before Belfour could get back to the goal.

Two minutes later on a Hawks power play, Belfour stopped Rich Sutter on a
short-handed break-in. Chris Chelios picked up the puck and passed it to Jeremy
Roenick who carried it on right wing and found an open Noonan with a nice pass
across the slot. Noonan fired it past Joseph at 5:30 for the 2-1 lead.

Noonan completed his hat trick 3:11 later to increase the Hawks' lead to 3-1.
Stephane Matteau made a nice pass from the right boards to Noonan who beat
Stephane Quintal by driving to the net. Joseph had no chance as Noonan
deflected the puck in the net.

Denny Felsner reduced the Blues deficit to 3-1 at 12:49 after picking up the
rebound of Basil McRae's slap shot from the slot. Janney set up McRae for
the shot, and the puck sailed wide of the net and bounced off the end boards
to Felsner. Felsner sticked the rebound into the partially open net. The Blues
outshot the Hawks 10-5 in the second period.

With the Blackhawks leading 3-2 at 9:56 of the third, Stephane Matteau picked
up a high sticking penalty. Just 53 seconds into the power play, Steve Smith
was called for slashing, giving the Blues a 5-on-3 advantage for 1:07.

The Blues didn't waste time as Brendan Shanahan scored just 23 seconds into
the two-man advantage to tie the game 3-3. Janney found Hull in the slot,
and Hull fired a rocket at Belfour. Jeff Brown collected the rebound and
passed it to Shanahan in the left circle. Shanahan beat Belfour from a sharp
angle.

Just 17 seconds later, Hull scored the game winner for the Blues. Nelson
Emerson broke in on right wing, carried the puck behind the net along with
two Hawks defensemen. Emerson made a nice pass to an unchecked Hull in the
slot, and Hull beat Belfour to put the Blues up 4-3.

The Hawks had several chances to tie the game in the final minutes, but Joseph
made some brilliant saves to prevent the Hawks from scoring. He stopped Troy
Murray point blank from just right of the crease with 2:30 left in the game.
The Blues killed off a late Hawks power play, with Rich Sutter clearing the
puck with his hand as it was trickling along the goal line. The Blues held
on to win the game. The Hawks oushot the Blues 13-7 in the third period,
totaling 27 shots on goal for each team. The Blues special teams were excellent
in the game. The Blues killed 6 of 7 Hawks power plays, and scored twice on
on four power play chances. The Blues ranked among the best special teams in
the league. They rank 2nd in penalty killing and 3rd on the power play.
 
The game was carried live on ABC, the first time an NHL game other than an
All-Star game has been shown on network television since May 24, 1980, when
CBS carried Game 6 of the Stanley Cup finals.

The best-of-seven series continues Wednesday in Chicago and Friday and Sunday
in St. Louis.

Box score
---------
Blues 4, Blackhawks 3

BLUES       0    2    2   --   4
CHICAGO     1    2    0   --   3

FIRST PERIOD

   CHI -- Noonan 1 (Larmer, K.Brown), 8:17.

   Penalties -- Shanahan, StL (holding), 2:28; Zombo, StL (interference), 6:00;
Murphy, Chi (high-sticking), 11:30; Grimson, Chi (boarding), 14:39; Zombo, StL
(holding), 18:46.

SECOND PERIOD

   STL -- Brown 1 (Shanahan, Emerson), 3:12.
   CHI -- (PPG) Noonan 2 (Roenick, Chelios), 5:40.
   CHI -- Noonan 3 (Matteau, Sutter), 8:51.
   STL -- Felsner 1 (McRae, Janney), 12:49.

   Penalties -- Baron, StL (interference), 4:33; Wilson, StL (tripping), 9:31.

THIRD PERIOD

   STL -- (PPG) Shanahan 1 (J.Brown, Hull), 11:12.
   STL -- (PPG) Hull 1 (Emerson, J.Brown), 11:29.

   Penalties -- Shanahan, StL (roughing), 1:54; Matteau, Chi (high-sticking),
9:56; Smith, Chi (slashing), 10:49; Baron, StL (roughing), 14:23.

SHOTS ON GOAL

BLUES       10    10     7   --   27
CHICAGO      9     5    13   --   27

Power-play Opportunities -- St. Louis 2 of 4; Chicago 1 of 7.

Goaltenders -- St. Louis, Joseph, 1-0-0 (27 shots-24 saves).
               Chicago, Belfour, 0-1-0 (27-23).

Referee -- Kerry Fraser. Linesmen -- Kevin Collins, Brian Murphy. A -- 16,199.

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53623
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Tie Breaker....(Isles and Devils)

In <lrw509f@rpi.edu> wangr@vccsouth22.its.rpi.edu ( Rex Wang ) writes:

>I might not be great in Math, but tell me how can two teams ahve the same points
>with different record??? Man...retard!!!!!! Can't believe people actually put
>win as first in a tie breaker......

Well I don't see any smileys here.  I am trying to figure out if the poster
is a dog or a wordprocessor.  Couldn't be neither.  Both are smarter than
this.

"I might not be great in Math"


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53624
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: Aargh! Great Hockey Coverage!! (Devils)

In article <1993Apr18.203823.28597@news.columbia.edu>,
gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) says:
>Locked away, waiting for the tape-delay to start ...

I think this guy is going to be just a little bit disappointed.  Lemieux
two, Tocchet, Mullen, Tippett, and Jagr.  I buzzed my friend because I forgot
who had scored Mullen's goal.  I said, "Who scored?  Lemieux two, Tocchet,
Tippett, Jagr."  The funny part was I said the "Jagr" part non-chalantly as
he was in the process of scoring while I was asking this question!!! :-)

All in all ABC's coverage wasn't bad.  On a scale of 1-10, I give it about
an 8.  How were the games in the Chi/St. Louis/LA area???

>It's nice that the Devils are starting out their playoffs on network
>television ... too bad that their playoff game has been preempted on
>WABC-AM for an early-season Yankees baseball game!

That's stupid!!!  I'd complain to the television network!  If I were to even
see a Pirates game on instead of a Penguins game at this time of the year, I
and many other Pittsburghers would surely raise hell!!!

>It's a 12-2 win by the Texas Rangers ... and they're delaying the
>tape-delay by another half-hour for the ballgame "highlights"!!!

Texas is off to a good start, they may pull it out this year.  Whoops!  That
belongs in rec.sport.baseball!!!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          PGH PENGUINS!!!    "We do what comes naturally!
Patrick Division Semi's  '91 STANLEY CUP    You see now, wait for the
PENGUINS 6, Devils 3     '92 CHAMPIONS      possibility, don't you see a
Penguins lead, 1-0       12 STRAIGHT WINS!  strong resemblance..."-DG '89

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53625
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: @#$%! I was right in the first place!!!

In article <vzhivov.735059801@cunews>, vzhivov@superior.carleton.ca (Vladimir
Zhivov) says:
>
>In <93107.091503RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>
>>2-Red Wings vs. 3-Maple Leafs               Maple Leafs in 6
>
>>  Comment : It's kind of tough to rely on Yzerman as the team's main weapon.
>>            He's a great palyer, but Dino knows all about choking, which
>>            puts the burden on Steve even more.  Potvin's had a hell of a
>>            season and goaltending is what you need in the playoffs.
>
>For a great prognosticator:), you seem to remember very little playoff
>history. Dino always shows up in the playoffs, which is why he is a
>great "sleeper" pick in pools. Don't forget about Fedorov, one of the
>top players in the NHL, IMHO, and Coffey who has the most Stanley Cup
>rings of any active players (correct me if I'm wrong). Wings in a
>cakewalk.

Oh yeah, how come Dino could never take the Caps out of the Patrick
Division?  He choked up 3 games to 1 last year and got swept away in
the second round two years ago.  He rarely, if ever, makes it out of the
division.

>>1-Canucks vs. 4-Jets                        Canucks in 5
>
>>  Comment : It's more like Vancouver vs. Selanne.  King and Domi (for
>>            enforcing) help Winnipeg out a little, maybe a game.  Canucks
>>            have their number.
>
>Except that the Canuck are playing like shit. Winnipeg can win this
>one, though I think Vancouver will manage to slip by.

So are the Islanders, but they can still pull it out.  Vancouver has Winnipeg's
 number, so it really doesn't matter.

>>2-Flames vs. 3-Kings                        Flames in 7
>
>>  Comment : 7 games looks good as the Kings always seem to battle it out.
>>            Flames are back in running and won't know memories of last year's
>>            season.  Gretzky is on a tear, but there are too many ?????
>>            surrounding the Kings.

>Kings "always seem to battle it out"? When? Where?

 Kings always seem to go at least 6 or 7, they never play a four or five
game serious.  There's a difference between battling it out and pulling it
out, as I take Calgary to pull it out in 7.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          PGH PENGUINS!!!    "We do what comes naturally!
Patrick Division Semi's  '91 STANLEY CUP    You see now, wait for the
PENGUINS 6, Devils 3     '92 CHAMPIONS      possibility, don't you see a
Penguins lead, 1-0       12 STRAIGHT WINS!  strong resemblance..."-DG '89

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53626
From: ddlin@athena.mit.edu (David D Lin)
Subject: Daigle/Kariya

I hear Daigle will eb the first pick next year. What is the word on Kariya???
Anybody ever seen him play on TV???? Is he also entering the draft???

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53627
From: doyle@cs.umass.edu (Jim Doyle)
Subject: UMass Big East hockey underway



The mission to revive hockey at UMass is now underway. At the  4 PM Saturday
afternoon press conference held at the new Mullins Center Arena - former
Boston College Asst. Coach Joe Mallen was awarded the 4 year, $85,000/year
contract as Head Coach for the UMass Minutemen. 

Mallen was the third viable pick for the position, right behind Jeff Jackson
(Lake Superior) and second behind Shawn Walsh (UMaine). Previous offers for 
the position were rumored to have been offered to the asst. coaches of
Brown, RPI and the head coach of the AHL Springfield Indians.

UMass hockey was disbanded in 1979 due to financial constraints that had
undermined the team's position over a period of years. In late November
of last year, the $52 million Mullins Sports Center was opened following
its one year construction deadline. 

The Minutemen are slated to play an independent Div II/Div III schedule this
upcoming winter before officially entering Hockey East for the Winter 1994
season. Mallen has yet to comment on player recruitment strategies or
potential team candidates for the Minutemen - it is expected that he will
leverage off his inside contacts within New England, the Bay State and
Europe to draw on competitive, top ice players for the University.

UMass has slated 18 hockey scholarships for the upcoming Fall semester ; 
expect to hear more from me as I hear more from my sources.

.... J.D.


+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
Jim Doyle 	Univ. of Massachusetts - Dept. of Computer Science

Staff Programmer	PUMA/DCC/CNET	 email:	doyle@gaia.cs.umass.edu

office:		Lederle GRC Room A203	 Tel.  413-545-3179
home  :		91 Blackberry Ln         Tel.  413-549-1409
		Amherst,MA 01002-1516	
							

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53628
From: gomer+@pitt.edu (Richard J Coyle)
Subject: Re: How difficult is it to get Penguin tickets?

In article <1993Apr18.201811.28965@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> dmoney@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Dean R Money) writes:
>The subject line says it all.  Is it terribly difficult to get tickets
>to Penguins games, especially now that they are in the playoffs?  Would
>it be easy to find scalpers outside of the Igloo selling tickets?

There are ALWAYS scalpers with tickets outside the Arena.  You might have
to pay a few bucks extra, but you can always find them.  Look on the
street under the message board, or out on the street in front of the Hyatt,
or even around Gate 1.  The later you buy them, the less money you'll pay,
and during the regular season you could usually find some for near face
value or below if you wait until game time.  Might be better to pick them
up earlier now, though.

rick

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53629
From: umfu0009@ccu.umanitoba.ca (J. M. K. Fu)
Subject: Re: Tie Breaker....(Isles and Devils)

In <lrw509f@rpi.edu> wangr@vccsouth22.its.rpi.edu ( Rex Wang ) writes:

>	Are people here stupid or what??? It is a tie breaker, of cause they
>have to have the same record. How can people be sooooo stuppid to put win as
>first in the list for tie breaker??? If it is a tie breaker, how can there be
>different record???? Man, I thought people in this net are good with hockey.
>I might not be great in Math, but tell me how can two teams ahve the same points
>with different record??? Man...retard!!!!!! Can't believe people actually put
>win as first in a tie breaker......

Why not? I believe both the Devils and Islanders got 87 points.
Say for example, another team had this record : 20-37-47;
they had 20*2+47*1+37*0=87 which is the same as their points total.
(The Islanders' and Devils' records are both 40-37-7.

It is simple arithmetics and involve no Calculus.


John.
(a computer science graduate who pretends to be a mathematican)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53630
From: rjtapp@neumann.uwaterloo.ca (Riston Tapp)
Subject: Re: Bruins vs Canadiens:

In article <1993Apr16.213513.7683@rose.com> jack.petrilli@rose.com (jack petrilli) writes:
>On April 14,  richard@amc.com (Richard Wernick) wrote:
>
>or Boston? You know Sinden's going to find some way of screwing up 
>even this good Boston team. He'll fire Suter or trade away a vital 
>star. (Admittedly, his last few trades have been good ones but how 
>long before his luck runs out and he starts making Esposito-for-
>Ratelle type trades again?) 
>

How was this trade bad? I seem to recall Ratelle and Middleton making a pretty
good centre - right wing combination, and the Bruins also got Brad Park in the
deal (and they also lost Vadnais and somebody else). After the trade, the 
Bruins were in two finals and one semi-final, all of which, of course, they 
lost to Montreal (which should please you to no end). I doubt, however, keeping
Esposito would have made a difference in those series, as he did not for
the Rangers in '79 (or any of his years in Boston, for that matter).

Riston
-- 
Riston
------
            _  ___  _
	   //^/o o\^\\

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53631
From: Martin D. Hill <32GFKKH@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: NHL team in Milwaukee

Well put, Jason.  I am not from Wisconsin, but I have close relatives who
live in Port Washington (about 30 minutes north of Milwaukee), I visit the
city regularly, and I have been in the Bradley four times to see the Admirals
play  and the NCAA Hockey Championships.  It is a beautiful building.  The
Pettits and the city like to promote it as the best facility for hockey in
North America.
As to what will happen with the Admirals if Milwaukee does acquire a
franchise, word is the team will move to Green Bay and play in the Brown
County Arena.
Once again, the Admirals are an independent franchise, and the people of
Milwaukee have been supporting them well.  The games I have been to have seen
crowds anywhere from 10,000 to 13,000, which are numbers some NHL teams (i.e.
the Islanders, Hartford, New Jersey) would be envious of having on some nights.
Plus the fact that the city is able to support a minor league franchise without
the glamour of having an NHL club affiliated to it is testimony to the amount
of hockey interest exists in the city.

Sincerely,

Martin Hill, Rt. 2, Box 155B, Sault Ste. Marie, MI (Home of LSSU:  Go Lakers!)

P.S.  Anybody know what the attendance figures are for the IHL and how
Milwaukee stacks up against other IHL cities such as Atlanta, Phoenix, San
Diego, Cleveland, and Cincinnati?  If so, please reply.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53632
From: epritcha@s.psych.uiuc.edu ( Evan Pritchard)
Subject: Re: div. and conf. names

maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>In <115873@bu.edu> Jason Gibson writes:

>>I can live with the other changes that have been made (e.g. the playoff format
>>change), but the change to the division and conference names really annoys me.
>>"Batman" was on TSN last night saying that changing the names would make the
>>game easier for the "occasional fan to follow".  He should have said what he
>>meant: that changing the names will make the game easier for _Americans_ in 
>>non-hockey cities to follow.  I don't know of too many of my friends who had 
>>a hard time following which teams were in each division. Even a minimal amount
>>of exposure to the game allows a person to quickly pick up on this.

>There is nothing wrong with making the game easier for "_Americans_" to
>follow.  The more fans the merrier and even if you dislike the "occasional"
>fan there is always the chance that these fans will become fanatics.

>I am glad that the names are being changed for another reason.  The names
>Patrick, Smythe, Norris, Adams and Campbell are all the names of so-called
>"builders" of the game.  This is the same type of thinking that put Stein
>in the Hall of Fame.  This is absolute nonsense.  The real builders of the
>game are Richard, Morenz, Howe, Conacher, Orr, etc.  If you are going to
>name the divisions after people at least name the divisions after people
>who deserve it.

	I think that you are incorrect, Roger.  Patrick,
Smythe and Adams all played or coached in the league before becoming
front office types.  Hence, they did help build the league, although
they were not great players themselves.  

	I agree that a name is a name is a name, and if some people
have trouble with names that are not easily processed by the fans,
then changing them to names that are more easily processed seems like
a reasonable idea.  If we can get people in the (arena) door by being
uncomplicated, then let's do so.  Once we have them, they will realize
what a great game hockey is, and we can then teach them something
abotu the history of the game.  
 
>The history of the names can be put rather succinctly.  All of the aforemen-
>tioned used the game of hockey to make money.  Can you imagine a Pocklington
>division?  A Ballard division?  Or how about a Green division?

	No, I would not want to see a Ballard division.  But to say
that these owners are assholes, hence all NHL management people are
assholes would be fallacious.  Conn Smythe, for example, was a classy
individual (from what I have heard). 

	Also, isn't the point of "professional" hockey to make money
for all those involved, which would include the players.  What I think
you might be saying is that the players have not made as much money as
should have been their due, and it is the players that are what make
the game great not the people who put them on the ice, so naming
division after management people rather than players is adding insult
(in the form of lesser recognition) to injury (less money than was
deserved).   

_______________________
Evan Pritchard --------  Number 1 or 9 depending on the hockey pool 
=======================
epritcha@psych.uiuc.edu  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53633
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Aargh! Great Hockey Coverage!! (Devils)

Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) says:
>>Locked away, waiting for the tape-delay to start ...
>
>I think this guy is going to be just a little bit disappointed.

Why?  I'm calling this Penguins ... in 6.  Only that with the way 
things stand, the only radio game at that hour is from the Devils
on WABC, 770 AM.  It'd be nice to have a Sony Watchman, but ...

No need to be paranoid, Robbie.  Don't judge me by my geographic
coordinates ...

Jets over Nordiques in the final ... 7.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53634
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: div. and conf. names

In <C5pDGI.LJL@news.cso.uiuc.edu> epritcha@s.psych.uiuc.edu ( Evan Pritchard) writes:

>	I think that you are incorrect, Roger.  Patrick,
>Smythe and Adams all played or coached in the league before becoming
>front office types.  Hence, they did help build the league, although
>they were not great players themselves.  

Punch Imlach's contributions as a coach and GM were far greater than
those of the above combined.  Should we name a division or trophy after
him?  Smythe and Norris and the bunch were honoured purely because they
were powerful owners.  As owners they certainly did help to build the
league but whether they developed the game is another question altogether.
Are we going to honour those who contributed to the league's evolution
or are we going to honour those who contributed to the glory of the 
sport itself?   

>	I agree that a name is a name is a name, and if some people
>have trouble with names that are not easily processed by the fans,
>then changing them to names that are more easily processed seems like
>a reasonable idea.  If we can get people in the (arena) door by being
>uncomplicated, then let's do so.  Once we have them, they will realize
>what a great game hockey is, and we can then teach them something
>abotu the history of the game.  

I can't disagree with you here.

>>The history of the names can be put rather succinctly.  All of the aforemen-
>>tioned used the game of hockey to make money.  Can you imagine a Pocklington
>>division?  A Ballard division?  Or how about a Green division?

>	No, I would not want to see a Ballard division.  But to say
>that these owners are assholes, hence all NHL management people are
>assholes would be fallacious.  Conn Smythe, for example, was a classy
>individual (from what I have heard). 

What have you heard?  The Major was the *definitive* little asshole!  He
originated the phrase "if you can't beat 'em in the alley you can't beat
'em on the ice."  That was his idea of hockey.  Do you think, by chance,
that Don Cherry is a classy individual?

>	Also, isn't the point of "professional" hockey to make money
>for all those involved, which would include the players.  What I think
>you might be saying is that the players have not made as much money as
>should have been their due, and it is the players that are what make
>the game great not the people who put them on the ice, so naming
>division after management people rather than players is adding insult
>(in the form of lesser recognition) to injury (less money than was
>deserved).   

The money issue is irrelevant to the point that we would agree on, and
that is: "it is the players that are what make the game great and not the
people who put them on the ice"

Exactly true.  Naming divisions and trophies after Smythe and the bunch
is the same kind of nepotism that put Stein in the hall of fame.  I have
always thought that this was nonsense.


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53635
From: roney@selkirk.sfu.ca (Chris J. Roney)
Subject: Re: div. and conf. names

epritcha@s.psych.uiuc.edu ( Evan Pritchard) writes:


>	No, I would not want to see a Ballard division.  But to say
>that these owners are assholes, hence all NHL management people are
>assholes would be fallacious.  Conn Smythe, for example, was a classy
>individual (from what I have heard). 

     Depends on what you mean by classy. From what I've heard about
him, he was about as classy as Harold Ballard.  Only difference was
that back then almost all the owners were like that, so he seemed okay
by comparison.  Read the book "Net Worth" for one view of what Smythe
(and Norris and Adams and Campbell) were like. 

>	Also, isn't the point of "professional" hockey to make money
>for all those involved, which would include the players.  What I think
>you might be saying is that the players have not made as much money as
>should have been their due, and it is the players that are what make
>the game great not the people who put them on the ice, so naming
>division after management people rather than players is adding insult
>(in the form of lesser recognition) to injury (less money than was
>deserved).   


     Even more specifically, I think what Roger was saying (and I said
it previously too) is that these are NOT the people who made the
league great, so why should divisions, conferences etc. be named after
them instead of Morenz, Vezina, Howe, Orr etc., the people who DID
make it great.  Instead, the NHL has chosen to immortalize the men who
got rich off of the men who made the game great.  

-- 
Chris Roney  (e-mail chris_roney@sfu.ca)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53636
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: Re: Numerical Nothingness

In article <1993Apr18.140401.18439@freenet.carleton.ca> ad684@Freenet.carleton.ca (Bob Wilson) writes:
>
>Mario averaged 2.66666666666666666666666666666666666666666666
>points per game ... the Antigretz

Gretzky averaged 2.69 pts/game

>Mario projected over 80 games.
>213 points (beats Wayne's record by 1)

Check your information before posting, Gretzky's record is 215 pts in 80 games.


>Over 84 games 97 g + 127 a = 224 points.
>
Over 84 games, Gretzky's total projected 226 points.

>Pitt's winning percentage with Mario (45-10-5) over 84 games
>-> 133 points.   Would this have been a record?
>I know Mtl had 132 one year.

The 76-77 Canadiens had .825 percentage, 132 pts in 80 games. (60-8-12).
The 29-30 Bruins had a .875 winning percentage.
Also the 77-78 Canadiens had a .806 percentage with a 59-10-11 record.

>Bob Wilson
>ad684@freenet.carleton.ca

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53637
From: mmilitzo@scott.skidmore.edu (matthew militzok)
Subject: NHL Playoff Stats & Scores

For updated playoff updates (scores, stats, summaries)
e-mail me. (mmilitzo@skidmore.edu) with the subject STATS.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53638
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Rangers name Keenan coach

clarinews@clarinet.com (UPI) writes in clari.sports.hockey:

>	NEW YORK (UPI) -- Mike Keenan, whose NHL coaching history
>has been to wear out his welcome despite an impressive penchant for 
>winning, has come to the city that embraces victors above all else.

Well, I could become a fan ... (-;

Seriously, this news coming since Thursday has effectively robbed the
Islanders and the Devils of any airtime on sports talk shows almost
everywhere that I've sampled ... in fact, the playoffs almost don't
exist now. )-; Ranger fans calling in to WFAN or to New York One's
midnight sports talk were in a mix of fury over this season and near-
orgasm over Keenan's hiring.  (Summarizing: Keenan is a winner and
will give the Broadway Bums 'da business' in pursuing the next Cup
chase ...)

>	The Chicago Blackhawks cut their last tie with Keenan when
>he was forced out as general manager in November. He had given up
>Chicago's coaching duties a year ago and his thirst for the power
>of a GM now increases the pressure on beleaguered Rangers GM Neil
>Smith.

This will be an interesting combination to watch ... Keenan has been
paid enough money to put up and shut up and just be a coach, but his
advice on any player moves will be listened to closely.  A lot of big
player moves will happen --- remember that Keenan got rid of Denis
Savard.  The country club days are over ...

>	``When Keenan left Chicago I couldn't help but think about 
>him as our coach,'' Smith said. ``There was an indication he would 
>be taken off the market. I feared that and couldn't let that happen.''

If Paramount had given Smith an earlier sign of support and offered
Keenan the big money to put-up-and-shut-up back in January, the
Rangers might not be heading for golf now ...

>	Keenan, 43, takes on a demoralized team that offers him a
>chance to fashion yet another of his reclamation projects -- at the
>highest salary ever commanded by an NHL coach. The Rangers -- owned
>by Gulf & Western -- have bestowed upon Keenan an unprecedented $3
>million, four-year deal,

>	``I've known Mike a long time,'' Messier said. ``We've won two
>Canada Cups together. He's been to the finals three times. Maybe we
>miss just one more element to win the Stanley Cup. I don't think he's
>the same person he was 10 years ago or even five years ago. I think he
>has changed and bettered himself with experience.''

One of Keenan's first statements was a reaffirmation that Mark Messier
will be the team's captain.

>	The timing of the move gives the Rangers' new coach 2 1-2
>months to prepare for the NHL draft (June 26), and Neil Smith may 
>not back off the their trade-happy pattern.

By then, Smith might have some bargains on Keenan's advice ... like
maybe unloading Phil Bourque for Tie Domi ... (-;

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53639
From: boora@kits.sfu.ca (The GodFather)
Subject: LA ON ABC IN CANADA

	Was the ABC coverage of the Kings/Flames game supposed to be the
way it was shown in BC with CBC overriding the ABC coverage?  When I flipped
to ABC, it was the same commentators, same commercials even.  My question
is:  Was this the real ABC coverage or did CBC just "black out" the 
ABC coverage for its own?


	comment:

	CBC had a great chance for some double headers:  Toronto/Detroit
and Vancouver/Winnipeg, but today they said that the East gets the Leafs
and the West get the Vancouver game.  I thought that they would show them
both.

		The GodfAther


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53640
From: Martin D. Hill <32GFKKH@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Subject:    college hockey all-star game

Does anybody know the details of the Shriners All-Star game that featured the
best seniors in college hockey in a game in Orono, Maine?  If you do, please
reply.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53641
From: rrmadiso@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca (*** CHUCK ***)
Subject: CORRECTIONS --- Re: Playoff predictions


Everyone... Read this.  If you have already sent your predictions, please
correct the Patrick division if you would like.  You have until midnight
on monday (my time.)

You may need to correct these games...


3 - Pittsburgh vs. New Jersey
4 - New York Islanders vs. Washington

10 - Patrick Division Winner

13 - Wales Conference Winner

15 - Stanley Cup Winner

Please forward all corrections to

Richard Madison
rrmadiso@napier.uwaterloo.ca



>1st rd:	Pens over Isles in 4.
>	Devils over Caps in 6.
>2nd:	Pens over Devils in 7.



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53642
From: andy.bgsu.edu (Ryan )
Subject: What are you smoking? (wasRe: My Predictions of a classic playoff year!)


> 	Norris Division
> 

> 
> TOR vs DET    TOR in 7   (THis , like MON vs QUE, will be another intense 
> 			 (series to watch!)
> 
> CHI vs TOR    TOR in 7   (Potvin will be settling in nicely by this point.)
> 

> 
> Vancouver vs Toronto		Toronto in 6  (Potvin will be series MVP)
> 
 *This is what kills me:
> 	STANLEY CUP FINALS  
> 
> Toronto Maple Leafs    vs    Montreal Canadiens    
> 	(The Classic Stanley Cup Final matchup!!) <---also a dream come true!
> 
> 	Montreal wins the Stanley cup in the 7th game 1 - 0 in double overtime.
> Roy and Potvin are spectacular throughout the series and share series MVP (if 
> that is possible) Vincent Damphouse nets game winner from a brilliant pass by
> Brian Bellows! Canadiens star(?) Denis Savard watched his buddies play from the
> owners box nursing that splinter on his thumb which has left him on the 
> disabled list since the first game of the playoffs (awww shucks). 

> 							Paul
> 						Die hard Habs Fan living with
> 						3 Die hard Leafs fans!
*******************************************************************************
Speaking of "die hard", that's what I did when I read this, died hard
laughing!

Toronto, to the Cup finals???

First of all, has anyone on the planet heard of the team from Detroit?  Al
Morgani (or however you spell the idiot's name) must be from Chicago,
because on ESPN, he said "it's not even close--Chicago will definatly win
the Norris Division in the Playoffs, no other team is close."  Everyone is
picking Chicago!  I don't get it, he says it's an "easy choice"?
God, Chicago was 1-4-1 against the Wings, and they won the division by a
point or two, followed closely by Toronto, who is also a good team!
As for the Leafs beating Detroit--doubt it, but even if they do, they
aren't going to get by Chicago.  If (even more amazingly) they get past the
Hawks, they would probably face Vancouver, and lose.
As for The Habs reaching the Finals, forget it.  Even I, as a devoted Wings
fan, will watch the Penguins easily three-peat as Cup winners.  Lemieux,
Jagr, Tocchet, Stevens, and Barrasso, its a done deal.  Sorry Detroit, wait
til next year.
But hey, these were Paul's picks, and everyone has a right to their own
opinnions, but the Leafs to the Finals??? Yeah. If they make it there, I'll
walk to Toronto to get some tickets, and that's a 700 mile walk!  

--Ryan--

Detroit Red Wings--the forgotten team!  Go Wings!!  Let's hope the Penguins
go out
early!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53643
From: colling@ann-arbor.applicon.slb.com (Michael Collingridge)
Subject: NHL Team Captains

In the mist of the Rangers soap box (i.e. Captain neMesis-ier/ex-coach 
Roger Nebula bad blood bath) and with high hopes turned to new coach 
Mr. Klean (Commissar Keenan)... I would like to know what procedures 
hockey teams use to select their captains (including A's). Are they 
selected by the coaching staff, do the players vote for a captain, or 
are they appointed by management?

And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
team captain trivia would be appreciated.

-- Mike

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53644
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

In <1993Apr19.022113.12134@ann-arbor.applicon.slb.com> colling@ann-arbor.applicon.slb.com (Michael Collingridge) writes:

>And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
>resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 

The Leafs have always been kind of comical.  During the second  Imlach
era, when Darryl Sittler was called a "cancer on the team", he tore the
C off his sweater and for a while the Leafs didn't have a Captain.

Sittler eventually ended up in Philly and he was promised  the  Philly
captaincy  by  new  GM  (and Sittler's friend) Bobby Clarke.  Instead,
Sittler got traded to Detroit.

Rick Vaive was the Leaf Captain for awhile but he slept in one day and
they took the captaincy away from him.  Then he was traded to Chicago.

During Doug Carpenter's tenure as Leaf coach, in an  attempt  to  kiss
the  ass of a sulking Gary Leeman, the Leafs took the A away from Brad
Marsh to give to Leeman.  Leeman wouldn't take it and when they  tried
to give it back to Marsh, he wouldn't take it neither.

The best story I remember about a captain concerned Mel Bridgman, late
of the Senators.  While he was in Philadelphia, Bobby Clarke, arguably
one of the great captains of all time, was bumped up to the status  of
playing coach and so he had to relinquish the captaincy.  Bridgman be-
came the new captain.  A reporter asked a Flyer what Bridgman did as a
captain  since  Clarke  was  still  the  undisputed leader amongst the
players.  The reporter was told that Bridgman was in charge of  making
sure that the soap dispensers in the showers were always full.


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53645
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Tie Breaker....(Isles and Devils)

In article <lrw509f@rpi.edu> wangr@rpi.edu writes:
>
>	Are people here stupid or what??? It is a tie breaker, of cause they
>have to have the same record. How can people be sooooo stuppid to put win as
>first in the list for tie breaker??? If it is a tie breaker, how can there be
>different record???? Man, I thought people in this net are good with hockey.
>I might not be great in Math, but tell me how can two teams ahve the same points
>with different record??? Man...retard!!!!!! Can't believe people actually put
>win as first in a tie breaker......

Golly, I love stupid people. :-)
Listen, Rex, this is hockey.  The NHL, to be precise.  And in the NHL,
there exist these things called "ties".  A tie occurs when a game ends
with the score for each team equal.  Each team gets one point for a tie. 
There also exits these things called "wins".  A win is when one team has a
higher score than the opponent.  (Oh yeah, only two teams play each other
at a time, so I can say "the opponent".)  A team gets two points for a
win.  So, let's say that a team has a record of 38 wins, 36 losses, and 10
ties.  Another team has a record of 40 wins, 38 losses and 6 ties.  The
first team has (38*2)+10 = 86 points.  The second team has (40*2)+6 = 86
points.  WOW!  They *both* have the same number of points, but the number
of wins is different!  How did they do that??!?!?!?!  That's amazing.  So,
Rex, when people talk about wins being the first tiebreaker, well, then
that's what it means.  In our example, the second team would win the
tiebreaker and therefore have the "better" record, even though both teams
had the same number of points.  If you didn't understand this post, Rex,
maybe you should go back and read it again, very slowly.
:-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-)

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53646
From: Mamatha Devineni Ratnam <mr47+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Atlanta Hockey Hell!!


Well, it's not that bad. But I am still pretty pissed of at the
local ABC coverage. They cut off the first half hour of coverage by playing
David Brinkley at 12:30 instead of an earlier time slot. I don't
even understand their problem. If they didnt think enough people would

not watch the game why would they decide to show most of the game? And
if they showed the remaining 2.5 hours of the game, would it hurt to play
David Brinkley at its regular time? They dont have any decent programming
before noon anyway. I called the sports dept and blasted them on their
machine. I called gain and someone picked it up. When I asked him why they
premepted the first half hour of the Stanley Cup playoffs, he seemed a bit
confused. When I explained a bit more in detail, he then said that's upto
to our programming dept. call back on  Monday. weel, I understand that the
sports dept is not responsible for this preemption. BUt I can't understand
how someone in the sports dept. can't even recognise the name of playoffs
shown on the very same station he works for.

Anyway, I am going to call them tomorrow and blast them on the phone again.
I urge all Atlanta hockey fans to call WSB 2 and ask them not to do the
same thing for the next 4 weeks.

-Pravin Ratnam(Oh by the way, Pens rule!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53647
From: sclark@epas.utoronto.ca (Susan Clark)
Subject: OOOPS!

Picture if you will, the Habs going into the last couple minutes of the
game, leading 2-0.  The Nords get a power play, pull Hextall, and get
a goal.  Bout a minute later, they get another one.  Then they win in
overtime......

A bad dream?.......

How's that Red Hot Chili Peppers song go...
"Give it away,give it away, give it away now...."

Oh well.  Suppose I can always watch the Leafs win tomorrow night....
   (smilies.....)

Am I the only female hockey fan in the world?

Susan Carroll-Clark
sclark@epas.utoronto.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53648
From: JBE5 <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA>
Subject: Nords 3 - Habs 2 in O.T. We was robbed!!

Aargh!

Paul Stewart is the worst and most biased ref. presently in the NHL.
He called a total of 4 penalties on the Habs and one on the Nordiques.
The Nords' penalty came in O.T.  Stewart, being an ex-Nordique himself,
was looking to call penalties on the Habs while letting the Nords
get away with murder...WE WAS ROBBED!!!!

It was an excellent game with plenty of end-to-end rushes and tremendous
goalkeeping.  The Nords tied it with over 1 minute to go while Lebeau
was serving a penalty.  I don't mind Stewart calling a penalty in the
last 5 min. of the game, but AT LEAST BE FAIR ABOUT IT.  The Nords were
caught with their hand in the cookie jar more than once.  Stewart turned
the other cheek...BASTARD!

Patrick Roy collapsed after letting in the tieing goal. He was shaky and
on his knees for the rest of the night.  The winning goal shouldn't have
gone in.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not blaming the loss on Stewart.  The Habs had
plenty of chances to capitalize, Muller, LeClair, Haller, etc. but
failed to put the puck in the net.  That's what did them in.  But
Mr. Stewart didn't help matters at all.

Oh well, at least the Bruins lost in O.T. also Ha, Ha!!--)

                               ,,,
                              (0-0)
============================oOO(_)OOo===================================
The Czar of Mainframe Computing <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA>
McGill University

 --> I'M TOO SEXY FOR COBOL.

---> Habs...will beat the Nords in 7!!!!

---> Let's Go Expos!
             ===========================================
             | Hickory, dickory doc,                   |
             | She took a good look at your cock.      |
             | It's really scary all rinkled and hairy,|
             | It smells like a 10 year old sock!      |
             |           --Andrew Dice Clay            |
             ===========================================

 DISCLAIMER:
************************************************************************
*   Needless to say that the opinions expressed by THE CZAR represent  *
*   those of the faculty, staff, and students of McGill University.    *
************************************************************************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53649
From: colling@ann-arbor.applicon.slb.com (Michael Collingridge)
Subject: Re: Truly a sad day for hockey

In article 27089, alvstad@mari.acc-admin.stolaf.edu (Mad Dog) reports:

>A fine 26 year history came to a close tonight, as the Minnesota North Stars, 
>or Norm's Stars (whichever you prefer) lost to the Red Wings by a score of
>5-3.  The Stars goals were scored by Mike McPhee and Ulf Dahlen, who netted
>two including the final one in franchise history, with less than a minute to
>play.

Are there any further stories to report on the eve' of Norm's farewell 
from the twin cities? In an earlier post, it was announced that Norm 
Green was given until midnight of the last home-game of the North Stars
to cleanup his belongings and turn in the keys to the arena. 
Did this happen? Was Norm run-out-of-town?

Rumor has it that while he was attempting to remove the score board, 
the score-board fell to the ice and flattened Mr. Greedy to a large
piece of green paper. Arena management had to use the Zamboni (which 
they confiscated from Norm's truck) to clean-up the useless remains. 

-- Mike

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53650
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Atlanta Hockey Hell!!

Mamatha Devineni Ratnam <mr47+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>
>I can't understand how someone in the sports dept. can't even recognise
>the name of playoffs shown on the very same station he works for.

You think that's bad ... one year, we had all three New York teams in
the playoffs and the cableco operator (SCNY once shared a channel with
BET but someone forgot to throw the switch at 6PM) didn't know what I
was talking about ...

While it's nice that the NHL is back on American network TV, it faces
the same problems as it did with the All Star game.  Local preemptions
and zero promotion (okay, I don't watch that much TV so I'm just foaming
all right?).  The league should have made sure that it was solid on cable
before going to the networks.  In year one of the new ESPN contract, the
saturation coverage of SCA (all other games shown to completion, like
the Quebec-Montreal and Sabres-Bruins overtimes) is missed around here.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53651
From: vzhivov@superior.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov)
Subject: Flames Truly Brutal in Loss

As the subject suggests the Flames were not impressive this afternoon,
dropping a 6-3 decision to the LA Kings. Most of the Flames neglected
to show up, especially in their own zone, as the Kings hit at least
five posts! The Flames best line was probably
Skrudland-Paslawski-Berube (which tells how bad the Flames were). Gary
Suter scored a great goal (in fact all three Flame goals were scored
by D-men - Yawney and Dahlquist getting the others), but also made
some bonehead plays. For the Kings, Pat Conacher was especially
impressive. 

The games was VERY chippy, as Dan Mirouelli lost control early and
never recovered it; there were high-sticks, cross-checks, punches,
hits from behind. Fleury got a game misconduct for rubbing out Warren
Rychel from behind. Flames dominated the game physically, but failed
to take advantage due to horrendous defensive lapses (I don't think
Vernon can be blamed for any of the goals). Calgary went with 7 D-men,
as Roger Johansson played LW; he looked lost IMHO - I hope King
inserts Chris Lindbergh, Paul Kruse, or Sergei Makarov for Wednesday's
game. Gretzky left the game in the 2nd period with a charley-horse; no
idea how serious - he didn't return.

I still think the Flames should win this series, but they better
buckle down.

- Vlad the Impaler


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53652
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Playoff pool update

Well, I have compiled some statistics on the entries of my pool.  There
are unofficially 52 entrants.  Here are the stats on what teams were
picked to win it all:

Pittsburgh:	34 (1 sweep, 14 in 5, 15 in 6, 4 in 7)
Boston:		6  (1 in 5, 5 in 6)
Detroit:	4  (3 in 6, 1 in 7)
Montreal:	2  (1 in 5, 1 in 7)
Toronto:	2  (1 in 6, 1 in 7)
   (no, this wasn't Roger)
Calgary:	1  (in 6)
Quebec:		1  (in 6)
Vancouver:	1  (in 7)
Washington:	1  (in 6)

Why the hell hasn't anybody picked Chicago???  NOBODY!  Quebec got a pick,
Detroit got 4, but absolutely no Chicago!  How odd.

Here are the "losers":

Detroit:	20
Chicago:	16	(so there they are!)
Pittsburgh:	6
Vancouver:	4
Boston:		2
Calgary:	2
Los Angeles:	1	what?!?
Toronto:	1

LOS ANGELES???????  Are you out of your mind?!?!?  Good luck to you,
you'll need it!

So Pittsburgh is the consensus winner of the Stanley Cup.  They'll
statistically beat Detroit in 6 games.  HAHA  that's happening!  NOT!  As
I said, every one of my picks will come true, and I picked Chicago to lose
to Pittsburgh in the finals, so tough luck to all you who picket Detroit.  
Well, tough luck to all of ya!  I am a genius!!!  ;-)

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

	   "A cow is not a vegetarian dish."  -- Keith Keller, 1993

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53653
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Flames Truly Brutal in Loss


This game would have been great as part of a double-header on ABC or
ESPN; the league would have been able to push back-to-back wins by
Le Magnifique and The Great One.  Unfortunately, the only network
that would have done that was SCA, seen in few areas and hard to
justify as a pay channel. )-;

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53654
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Possible Canadian WC Team?

In article <1993Apr18.194657.26319@news.columbia.edu> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>>
>>CENTERS
>>Mark Messier, N. Y. Rangers
>
>Messier was not invited due to his nagging injuries.  While the press
>made an issue of it, and attempted to link it to the Rangers' internal
>political woes, Mike Keenan repeated that to Messier personally during
>the MSG press conference.  It makes sense ... Messier would probably
>have not declined the invitation if it were made for publicity ...
>

Actually, Messier was invited, but declined due to nagging injuries...
Keenan and Messier have always gotten along...Keenan dumped Steve
Yzerman from the last Canada Cup team, even though Yzerman had
endured the training camp, when Messier who had missed essentially the
entire camp recovering from injuries became available at the
last moment.

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53655
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Daigle/Kariya

In article <1qsmhtINNt5l@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU> ddlin@athena.mit.edu (David D Lin) writes:
>I hear Daigle will eb the first pick next year. What is the word on Kariya???
>Anybody ever seen him play on TV???? Is he also entering the draft???

People are seeming to be less concerned about Kariya's size as he leads
teams to championships (World Junior and US College) and collects
awards...everyone is watching with interest as to how he will perform
on left wing with Eric Lindros and Mark Recchi at the world
championships.

4 months of go...chances were not very good that he would go in the
top five...now it has become probable...a great world championship
could put him in the top 3 with Daigle and Pronger.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53656
From: <JOLD@vma.cc.nd.edu>
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

In Detroit, the octopus is a symbol from the old days of the league. In
the era of the Original 6, four teams made the playoffs.  To win the Cup,
a team had to win two seven-game series - in other words it took 8
playoff wins to win the Cup.  The octopus (8 legs) has become a common
Detroit symbol.  Every year around playoff time people start sneaking
octopus (octopi?) into the Joe Louis Arena and throwing them onto the ice.

                                J. Old
                                e-mail: JOLD@vma.cc.nd.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53657
From: allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan)
Subject: Don Cherry - Coach's Corner summary - April 18, 1993



Here is a summary of Don Cherry's coach's corner from April 18, 1993.
It took place in the first intermission of game 1 of the Montreal-Quebec
series. 

Pre-game comments
-----------------
Don's pregame comments were mostly aimed at the goalies... The goalie
who gets back his all-star form (Roy or Hextall) can win the series
for his team.

Eposode Summary
---------------
This episode took place rinkside. Don was holding a hot dog that
he bought from the concession stand.

Ron Maclean started out by showing a cartoon which appeared in the
Toronto Sun. It featured a picture of Don, who just saw his shadow
and proclaimed "Will you look at dat, eh? Means another 6 weeks
of me. Beauty."

Next, Don talked about the hot dog he was holding. According to
him, the hot dogs at the Quebec stadium are the best food in all
the arenas in the NHL.

From there, Don commented on the Quebec-Montreal game. The game
had great flow, because Referee Paul Stewart calls the best game
in the NHL. In contrast, the Calgary-LA game was terrible... All
stop-and-go, over 50 minutes of penalties called against Calgary
by Dan Marouelli. Its getting so that the ref who calls the most
penalties gets to ref in the finals.

Next, Ron showed an old picture of Don, when he was playing for
the Rochester Americans of the AHL. Don recalled some of the
wins that he had in the Quebec arena... during the Memorial cup
and the AHL championships.

Finally, Don and Ron discussed Keenan becoming coach of the
Rangers. The rangers were a talented team who underachieved.
Don feels sorry for temporary coach Ron Smith, who had
several key injuries (to Leetch and Patrick) and goalies who
went cold.

Don had some criticism for the Rangers team... The party's over,
Adolf (Keenan) is there. The Rangers organization will no longer
be a 'country club'.... "NY should be achamed of themselves... If
they go in the tank with Adolf there, they'll be hanging from the
yardarm by their thumbs."


Rating
------
Nothing too special in this episode.

I'll give it a 5.5 out of 10.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   \  \                   |Allan Sullivan (allan@cs.ualberta.ca)
    \  \                  |Department of Computing Science,
     \  \_______          |University of Alberta, Edmonton, Alberta, Canada.
      \    ###  \     _   |---------------------------------------------------
       \___###___\   (_)  |My opinions are mine and mine alone.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It is amazing how much can be accomplished if no one cares who gets the
 credit..."          - U. of A. Golden Bears Hockey Motto (C. Drake)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
        

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53658
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Flames Truly Brutal in Loss

In article <vzhivov.735193129@cunews> vzhivov@superior.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov) writes:
>As the subject suggests the Flames were not impressive this afternoon,
>dropping a 6-3 decision to the LA Kings. Most of the Flames neglected
>to show up, especially in their own zone, as the Kings hit at least
>five posts! The Flames best line was probably

Mike Vernon is now 3 wins 11 losses plus that All-Star game debacle in
afternoon games during his career...with another afternoon game with
Los Angeles next Sunday...has the ABC deal doomed the Flames?

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53659
From: Karim Edvard Ahmed <ka0k+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Goodbye, good riddance, get lost 'Stars

>        Goodbye Minnesota,...you never earned the right to have an NHL 
>franchise in the first place!
>        Hope you enjoy your Twin city wide mania for HIGH SCHOOL HOCKEY
>(hey, by the way my old pee wee team is having a reunion in Regina, care 
>to come up and film the event?)
>        Yee haa Golden Gophers
>Whatta weird town!!!!!

What's with you stupid dorks from the "Western Business School"???!!! 
First there was that Cary asshole, and now you.  Don't you have anything
better to do instead of being obnoxious, antagonistic little shits over
the network???  Why don't you just take a hike, and stop embarrasing
yourself, your school, and Canada!

-KEA

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53660
From: Ryan J. Thieme <33CWDTR@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: How to beat Pittsburgh!

How do you beat the Penguins?


Crash the team plane.


Ryan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53661
From: epp@mala.bc.ca (Lorne Epp)
Subject: Re: LA ON ABC IN CANADA

In article <boora.735182771@sfu.ca>, boora@kits.sfu.ca (The GodFather) writes:
> 	Was the ABC coverage of the Kings/Flames game supposed to be the
> way it was shown in BC with CBC overriding the ABC coverage?  When I flipped
> to ABC, it was the same commentators, same commercials even.  My question
> is:  Was this the real ABC coverage or did CBC just "black out" the 
> ABC coverage for its own?
> 
> 

Here in Nanaimo (on Vancouver Island, for you furriners out there) we
got the ABC coverage on KOMO.  It probably depends on your cable company.

I started off switching between the CBC and ABC broadcasts, but finally
settled on ABC.  I can't stand Don Whitman, and Al Michaels was doing a
decent job.  He followed the play pretty well, knew all the players'
names, and only made a couple of "rookie" mistakes that I noticed.
One thing that surprised me is that they never once attempted to explain
the offside rule.

Am-I-paranoid-or-is-this-really-happening department:
There were no fights in the game, but there were a couple of occasions
where it looked like a fight was about to start.  Both times ABC cut
away to show a closeup of a coach or McNall or something.  Has ABC
decided to adopt the "Spicer policy?"

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lorne Epp                                               epp@mala.bc.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53662
From: ayim@laplace.uwaterloo.ca (Alfred Yim)
Subject: Re: Blackhawks win!!! 

In article <1993Apr16.140953.5025@vax.cns.muskingum.edu>, jbrown@vax.cns.muskingum.edu writes:
> The Hawks win!!  Jermey Roenick scored his 50 th goal and the Hawks put the
> Leafs in their place, the losers column.  If the Leafs can not even beat the
> Hawks in a match that had little or no meaning I will hate to see them against
> the Wings.  
> 
> Oh btw I laugh at rm, that jerky!!!
> 
> GO HAWKS!!!
> 
> JB

But I gotta tell ya,

If the Hawks can't beat the Blues in a game that
IS significant I can't wait to see how the Blues
might do against Toronto ;)

BTW, if you think that the Hawks deserved to win that game
I think you were not watching the same one everyone else
was.

ROAR'IN LEAF FAN
-- 
****************************************** 
*  Alfred (Yong-Jeh) Yim                 *   
*  4B Mathematics (Actuarial Science)    * 
*  University of Waterloo, Canada.       *   
*  E-mail: ayim@descartes.waterloo.edu   *   
*****************************************************************************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53663
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: Wings will win


In article 735249453@vela.acs.oakland.edu, ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:

>I also think that they will have a hard time with Pittsburgh if they
>face them in the finals (which is what all the Detroit sportswriters 
>are predicting).  Although I think Bryan Murray is probably the best GM
>I have ever seen in hockey

How do you figure that??  When Bryan Murray took over the Wings they were
a pretty good team that was contending for the Stanley Cup but looked
unlikely to win it.  Now they are a pretty good team that is contending for
the Stanley Cup but looks unlikely to win it.  A truly great GM would
have been able to make the moves to push the team to the upper echelon
of the NHL and maybe win the Stanley Cup.  A good GM (like Murray) can
maintain the team's success but can't push them to the next level.

In the history of hockey there have been several better GM's than Murray-
way too many to name.  Murray isn't even the best GM in the league today.
He fails in comparison to Sinden, Sather, Savard, Caron, Fletcher and
Quinn in my estimation.

I can't imagine how Bryan Murray can be the best GM anyone has ever seen
in hockey- unless they have seen VERY few GM's.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53664
From: neath@brazil.psych.purdue.edu (Ian Neath)
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN

jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:
> It was nice to see ESPN show game 1 between the Wings and Leafs since
> the Cubs and Astros got rained out. Instead of showing another baseball
> game, they decided on the Stanley Cup Playoffs. A classy move by ESPN.

Not in Indiana:  they showed a tape-delay of Chicago v Boston, because
WGN had the rainout of the cubs.  So WGN showed reruns of Hitchcock.
No hockey (at least in this part of the state).

Go Aeros!
--
      Ian Neath        | There are four kinds of people in this world:
neath@psych.purdue.edu | cretins, fools, morons and lunatics - U. Eco

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53665
From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
Subject: Re: expanding to Europe:Dusseldorf

In <PKORTELA.93Apr15164732@lk-hp-17.hut.fi> pkortela@snakemail.hut.fi writes:

> 
> DEG has many german-born forwards in the team. In fact the majority of players
> are german-born. 1992-93 DEG had 11150 average in 11800 spectator arena.

Interesting! One of our German friends here (Robert?) told me their forwards
were all Canadian-Germans. Perhaps somebody can sort this out for us?
 
> My Possible-NHL(European league)-site list:
> Switzerland  : Berne, Zurich (Lugano and 1-2 others)

OK, "this ain't North America" and so on, but I still doubt that _any_ city
having a pop. of 500,000 and below could support an NHL team. Of course,
Switzerland probably should be judged as one large city because of small
distances between cities but still. 

> Germany      : Dusseldorf, Cologne, Berlin, Munich (Mannheim, Rosenheim)

Dusseldorf? YES, although the arena is an anachronism (an OPEN wall behind one
of the goals - essentially an outdoor arena!). Cologne's arena only seats about
7,000-8,000, Berlin is about 6,000 and no new facility will be built
unless their Olympic bid is successful. Munich does have an arena. 

> Sweden       : Stockholm, Gothenburg (Malmo, Gavle)

Malmo is big enough, but they also need a new arena...the current one has 
5,000 seats I think.

> Finland      : Helsinki (Turku, Tampere)

If we're talking about the NHL, even Helsinki would struggle to make it work.
Turku (despite an excellent arena) and Tampere are nowhere near big enough for
major league hockey.

> Italy        : Milan

...Rome and the south are out of the question; this could as well be Africa
to hockey fans. Romans were given the chance to host some WC'94 games but
showed no interest whatsoever. All teams in the Italian league come from Milan
and the smaller cities in the north.

> France       : Paris (Chamonix, Ruoen?)

Paris had their own "Volans Francais"(sp) pro team a couple of years ago.
I believe they even made it to the European Club Championship finals 
tournament one year, but eventually folded due to lower-than-hoped-for 
attendances. The remaining cities seem to be too small to support a minor 
sport like hockey.

> Norway       : (Oslo)
> Austria      : (Vienna, Villach)
> Chech        : (Prag)
> Slovakia     : (Bratislava)
> Russia       : (Moscow, St. Petersburg)

The easter cities lack the money and infrastructure to support pro hockey.

> Great Britain: ?

Perhaps . . . Most European teams will have to be like the Tampa Bay Lightning
anyway; playing in a small 10,000 seat arena, backed by Japanese money, run by 
enthusiasts (Phil Esposito), heavy
marketing, fans that have difficulty telling what "icing" means... London has
been mentioned, Sheffield and Birmingham also have large arenas and a new
mega-facility (16,000 seats!) might be built in Bristol in a couple of years.

> Netherlands  : ?

No facilities to speak of; their biggest arena (in Eindhoven) seats 2,500 
fans for hockey. 
> 
> Petteri Kortelainen

MARCU$

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53666
From: j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
Subject: Plus minus stat...

Roger Maynard shares his views, with the masses, on Bob Gainey
and life in general:
 
>In <1993Apr15.160450.27799@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@hudson.UVic.CA
>(Greg  Ballentine) writes:
 
>>The Selke candidate forwards main purpose on a shift is to
>>prevent goals from being scored- not to score them.  When
>>Lemieux or Gilmour play their number one purpose is to score-
>>defence is secondary- especially considering the line that
>>plays against them is probably a defensive one.  That is why
>>they are not Selke candidates.
>>Gainey is the best defensive forward ever.  I stand by that
>>assessment. He was a very good player who belongs in the hall
>>of fame.  Did you ever watch him play? He never made a
>>technical error.
 
>I watched him over his entire career.  I have NEVER seen a
>player, and that includes Russell Courtnall and Davie Keon,
>screw up as many breakaways as Bob Gainey.  And I will never
>forget the time Denis Potvin caught Gainey with his head down. 
>You have been sold a bill of goods on Bob Gainey.
 
It was Bryan Trottier, not Denis Potvin.  It was a vicious
'boarding' from behind...Trottier was given a major.
 
But Roger, what the hell does this have to do with Gainey's skill
as a hockey player?  If Probert smashes Gilmour's head into the
boards next week, will that diminish your assessment of Gilmour's
skills?
 
>Gainey was a plugger.  And when the press runs out of things to
>say about  the stars on dynasties they start to hype the
>pluggers.  Grant Fuhr, Essa Tikkannen, Butch Goring, Bob
>Nystrom, Bob Gainey, Doug Jarvis, Derek Sanderson, Wayne
>Cashman, Bob Baun, Bob Pulford, Ralph Backstrom, Henri Richard,
>Dick Duff...and so on...
 
I would take Fuhr and Sanderson off of the latter.
 
I think Gainey would be honoured to know that you've included him
on this list.  I also think you have a relatively naive view
about what wins a hockey game...pluggers are an integral part of
any team.  The Selke is designed to acknowledge their
contribution...I think that most people understand that it's not
the Nobel Prize...so settle down.
 
>cordially, as always,
 
>rm
 
>-- 
>Roger Maynard 
>maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
 
congenially, as always,
 
jd
 
--
James David
david@student.business.uwo.ca

j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
Western Business School  --  London, Ontario

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53667
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Rangers give NHL another blackeye...

News reports in Toronto say that the Rangers are insisting that
Kovalev, Zubov, and Andersson play for Binghampton in the Calder
Cup playoffs, rather than return to play for their "home" countries
in the World Championships.

...shame on the Rangers.

Another black eye for the NHL in Europe.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53668
From: rrmadiso@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca (*** CHUCK ***)
Subject: Re: Playoff predictions

Here are my predictions (try not to laugh hysterically)
Somebody save this so I can laugh when I win my own pool.
I don't have prizes, but we all love BRAGGING RIGHTS, so winner takes them.

Also.  If somebody has some sort of scoring system let me know.
I was thinking 1 for 1st round victories, 2 for second, 3 for 3rd, 4 for 4th
But we may get alot of ties.  Any ideas?



1. BUFFALO
2. MONTREAL
3. PITTSBURGH
4. WASHINGTON
5. CHICAGO
6. TORONTO
7. WINNIPEG
8. LOS ANGELES

9. MONTREAL
10.PITTSBURGH
11.CHICAGO
12.WINNIPEG

13.MONTREAL
14.CHICAGO

15. MONTREAL

Richard Madison
rrmadiso@napier.uwaterloo.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53669
From: farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: Re: AHL Calder Cup Playoff preview

Daryl Turner (umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca) wrote:
: In article <1993Apr14.193524.25755@news.clarkson.edu> farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy) writes:
: >
: >ATLANTIC DIVISION
: >	
: >	ST JOHN'S MAPLE LEAFS VS MONCTON HAWKS
: >	MONCTON HAWKS
: >See CD Islanders. Moncton is a very similar team to CDI. Low scoring,
: >defensive, good goaltending. John Leblanc and Stu Barnes are the only
: >noticable guns on the team. But the defense is top notch and 
: >Mike O'Neill is the most underrated goalie in the league.
: >

: Bri, as I have tried to tell you since 2 February, Michael O'Neill
: might be the most underrated goalie in the AHL, but he ISN'T in the
: AHL.  He's on the Winnipeg Jets' injury list, as he has been since
: his first NHL start against the Ottawa Senators.  He's out until
: next year after surgery to repair a shoulder separation.

: Stu Barnes might be an AHL gun for the Hawks, but he's now the third
: line center with the Jets, and has been since mid January or so.

Sorry, my memory is gone. I thought that O'Neill got sent back
down in February but I must have been given incorrect info. I guess
this says it all about Moncton because Barnes is still one of
their top 3 or so scorers even though he's been out since January.

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL and ECAC contact for rec.sport.hockey		Go USA Hockey!	   +	
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    + CONGRATS TO THE BOSTON BRUINS, 1992-93 ADAMS DIVISION CHAMPIONS      +
    + PHOENIX SUNS, 1992-93 PACIFIC DIVISION CHAMPIONS			   +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53670
From: dwk@cci632.cci.com (Dave Kehrer)
Subject: Individual Winners (WAS: Re: WHERE ARE THE DOUBTERS NOW? HMM?)

Well, since you mentioned it...

In article <1993Apr12.142028.6300@jarvis.csri.toronto.edu>, migod@turing.toronto.edu (Mike Godfrey) writes:
  
> Lemieux is clearly the MVP

No question here.  Chip in the Masterson as well...

> Selanne wins the Calder

Yep. 

> Chelios the Norris,

If you asked me 30 days ago, I'd agree with you.  I now give the nod to
Raymond Bourque; his play took off the same time the B's did.  Chelios
gets a close second...

> dunno who wins the Vezina, but I suspect not Potvin.  
  
Barrasso finally gets his due, in a close one over Eddie the Eagle...

> Coach of the year is tricky:  Burns did the most with the least raw talent,
> King did a good job but the Flames clearly underachieved last year, Brian
> Sutter has done exceptionally well in his first year with a new team, ditto
> Demers, Page has been blessed by the ripening and acquisition of young
> talent, Darryl Sutter is having a good year for a rookie coach, Berry made
> the best of a bad situation, Terry Crisp worked minor miracles, and Bowman
> was Bowman.  I'd pick Burns, but I'm mildly biased.

In *your* case, that bias is acceptable :-)... Mine shows with the Norris pick,
so we're even...

I'm impressed with what all the coaches you mentioned did, but my pick would be 
Al Arbour.  Not too many folks thought the Isles would be in the playoffs, let 
alone contend for 3rd in their division... Granted that they *did* have a little
help from their cousins on Broadway... :-)

And I like the Islanders about as much as I like mowing my lawn...

> Mike Godfrey
--------
David Kehrer (dwk@sunsrvr2.cci.com)-Northern Telecom NAS-Rochester, New York 
"It's nothing for me to eat six or seven pieces of pizza, then go out to
dinner with my wife and not remember I had the pizza." - Jacques Demers

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53671
From: desperate fan
Subject: HELP! WC coverage in Europe

Vielen dank
Desperate Fan

PS. Sweden vs Finland finished 6-6 in Gothenburg 15th Apr.



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53672
From: swartzjh@RoseVC.Rose-Hulman.Edu
Subject: ESPN Tonight

Has anyone heard what game ESPN is showing tonight.  They said they will
show whatever game means the most playoff-wise. I would assume this would
be the Blues-Tampa game or the Minnesota-Red Wings game...  Anyone heard for
sure???


		Jeff Swartz

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53673
From: fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu (FRANK MICHAE SALVATORE)
Subject: Re: Patrick Division Correction!


In article <93105.013653RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>, Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
> 
> Well, I was a little off in those predictions!  One, I didn't count on the
> Devils scoring 6 goals tonight in a 6-6 tie, hence, there goes the streak!
> 
> Secondly, I didn't count on the Islanders getting just 1 point out of 4
> against the Whalers in two games.  So, no more Isles/Capitals.
> 
> New predicitons :
> 
> 1-PENGUINS VS 4-ISLANDERS                  Penguins in 6 or 7
 
> 
> 2-CAPITALS VS 3-DEVILS                     Devils in 7
> 
Why should we pay your predictions any heed, considering
you couldn't even predict the proper matchups?  Maybe
you should try forecasting the weather instead.

Frank Salvatore
fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53674
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Plus minus stat...

In <4LD32B2w165w@sms.business.uwo.ca> j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David) writes:

>It was Bryan Trottier, not Denis Potvin.  It was a vicious
>'boarding' from behind...Trottier was given a major.

Perhaps it was Trottier.  It happened behind the Habs goal if I recall.
Gainey simply didn't have his head up as he was picking up the puck.

>But Roger, what the hell does this have to do with Gainey's skill
>as a hockey player?  If Probert smashes Gilmour's head into the
>boards next week, will that diminish your assessment of Gilmour's
>skills?

If Gilmour was taken completely by surprise, as Gainey was, then yeah,
I would have to say that Doug wasn't playing "technically" smart 
hockey.  In any case, to claim as Greg did, that Gainey *never* made 
a technical mistake is absolutely ludicrous.

>>Gainey was a plugger.  And when the press runs out of things to
>>say about  the stars on dynasties they start to hype the
>>pluggers.  Grant Fuhr, Essa Tikkannen, Butch Goring, Bob
>>Nystrom, Bob Gainey, Doug Jarvis, Derek Sanderson, Wayne
>>Cashman, Bob Baun, Bob Pulford, Ralph Backstrom, Henri Richard,
>>Dick Duff...and so on...
> 
>I would take Fuhr and Sanderson off of the latter.

Good for you.  You'd only be displaying your ignorance of course, but to 
each his own...

>I think Gainey would be honoured to know that you've included him

I think Gainey should feel honoured to know that he is remembered at 
all.

>on this list.  I also think you have a relatively naive view
>about what wins a hockey game...pluggers are an integral part of

Certainly pluggers are an integral part of any team.  And that is
simply because there are not enough solid two-way players to go 
around.  Who would you rather have as your "checking" centre?  Doug
Gilmour or Doug Jarvis?  For that matter I would take either Gretzky
or Mario as my "checking" centres.  Do you think Gretzky could cover
Bob Gainey? 

>any team.  The Selke is designed to acknowledge their
>contribution...I think that most people understand that it's not
>the Nobel Prize...so settle down.

You're wrong again.  The Selke is awarded to the forward that does the
best job defensively and this may or may not be the best plugger.  If 
Gilmour does the best defensive job in the league I don't see why he 
should be out of the running simply because he also contributes offen-
sively.

Settle down?  If you think that I have likened the Selke to the Nobel
prize then I suggest that you had best "settle down".  And if you are
going to try to put words in my mouth, let me suggest that you "settle 
down" before you bother following up on my postings. 

>congenially, as always,
> 
>jd
> 
>--
>James David
>david@student.business.uwo.ca

You might consider developing your own style.  After all, imitation is 
the sincerest form of flattery and I am quite sure that flattery is not 
your intention.

cordially, as always,

rm

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53675
From: brifre1@ac.dal.ca
Subject: European expansion and our f*cked system

Everyone keeps talking about European expansion by 2010 thinking
wishful thoughts, but being totally off the ball.

The league format we use here is incompatible with that in Europe.
(for those that don't know, the best teams from lower divisions get
promoted and the worst get demoted).

Would European fans put up with our "if you've paid, you can play" 
attitude??

How long would they support teams that are run on Ranger-based 
corporate thinking (I use the term lightly).  (We don't need a good
product because these duffuses in NYC would fill the arena for Ottawa's
record every year......1940!! haha (sorry, had ta say it)).

If hockey (and other pro sports) had a similar system to Europe, maybe
teams like the Rangers would be forced to compete (or get demoted the fourth 
division).  We'd have many more teams...centres that aren't as big (like
Halifax or Adirondack....ok, so Halifax isn't a good example) would 
eventually get promoted, and every team would be somewhat competetive within
its own division (unlike Ottawa, SJ, Edmonton, etc.). Fans would eventually
get rewarded for their loyalty (or penalized for their neglect), and the
league would be more interesting and dynamic every year because of the influx
of newly promoted teams (and the Halifax Citadels win the Stanley Cup...I can
dream, can't I??)

Look at British (or any European) soccer as an example (they never have fan
problems).

Just someone who thinks our system really sucks

Barfly

(feel free to flame me, my account ends today...hahahaha)

1940!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53676
From: formeza@panix.com (The Owl)
Subject: Re: Rangers Top Ten

In <120365@netnews.upenn.edu> kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller) writes:

>> 
>>7.   Carol Alt, Head Coach In 93-94?

>I wish!  She can be *my* head coach any time!!!!  (Sorry Ali!  Back to
>real hockey.)

Hmmmmmm. I think I'll let everyone make there own comment on this one.


>>THE BAD
>> 
>>Alexei Kovalev.
>>What did the Rangers think when they signed him? Did they think he
>>was another Domi?  Just let him play! And not on a 4th line.  Better
>>that he stays in the minors and gets ice-time ALL the time.

>Whose "bad"?  It has been Neilson and Smith's decision to play him there,
>if that's what you mean, then that's bad.  But Kovalev himself is a very
>good player.  You're right, if he weren't stranded on the fourth line
>maybe he'd produce.  Sound familiar?  Darren Turcotte?

Neilson and Smith are bad. Kovalev is magical.


Lets Go Pens!
The Owl

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53677
From: igor@pravda.tse.su
Subject: Who will broadcast the WC

Which GERMAN satellite channels will show the World Championship action
from Dusseldorf & Munich?
Someone please tell me (must be able to root for the Red Machine)!

Thank you
 
***Russians for the world title, Nordiques for the Cup!!!***



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53678
From: seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr)
Subject: Re: Flyers [Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...]

In article <1993Apr14.165617.3215@cbnewsm.cb.att.com>, jmd@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (joseph.m.dakes) writes:
> In article <1993Apr13.144030.28994@cbnewsh.cb.att.com>, seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr) writes:
> 
> >So Roussel was giving up almost another goal a game while facing a proportional
> >number of shots for the number of minutes he played, and while I have't
> >actually checked I believe that he faced a lower quality of opponent.
> 
> Make that less than half a goal a game.  The lower quality of opponet
> argument is immaterial as neither Roussel nor Soderstrom had any say in
> the matter.  That was Dineen's decision.

So in other words, if Roussel shuts out the Sharks and Soderstrom shuts out
the Penguins, that's immaterial because it was the coaches decision? Come on,
Joe, think about what you're saying! Who they played is VERY significant.
Why they played them is what's irrelevent. A low GAA against good teams
is better than a low GAA against bad teams in the context of comparing two
goaltenders. A low GAA is better then a higher GAA. A low GAA against good
teams is much, much better than a higher GAA against bad teams in the context
of comparing two goaltenders.

> > The fact of the matter is that, despite last nights shutout, he doesn't
> > have what it takes. Last night was due to an inept Ranger team much more
> > than Roussel's skill. A 3 on 1 and they don't get a shot away? A 2 on none
> > and one guy just passes and stops, the other guy shoots into Roussel's pad?
> 
> C'mon, Pete?  So the Rangers were inept.  A shutout is a shutout.  During
> both of Soderstrom's masterpieces against Toronto, Mike Emerich was quoted
> as saying he didn't think the Leafs had much offensive firepower past their
> first line.  Does that make Soderstrom's shutouts less impressive because of
> Toronto's lack of offense?

YES IT DOES! Absolutely. **In the context of comparing two goaltenders**.
Of course, at the end of the season 2 points is 2 points no matter how you
get them. And on the score sheets shutouts are shutouts. But if you're a
coach deciding between two goalies, or a GM looking to make a trade, you
have got to look deeper than the stat sheets. I didn't see the second Toronto
game, but the first one was a defensive masterpiece. There was nothing in
that game to judge Tommy Soderstrom on because he wasn't tested. The same
for Roussel in the Ranger game. Two real scoring chances, one he made a
great play, the other he was saved by a mistake from the other player. If
you were judging Roussel on that game alone, you have very little to go by.

But if you were to look at the 0-0 tie against the Habs, you saw a goalie
stand on his head to get that shutout. THAT was a #1 goalie in action. Roussel
doesn't have a game like that in him.

> Well if you look back to November when Roussel was the #1 goalie (Soderstrom
> was being treated for his heart ailment).  The Flyers finished November at
> 6-3-1 and were 9-10-4 overall.  And there's no way of knowing where the Flyers
> would have finished if Soderstom wasn't wearing the oragne 'n black.  I'm glad
> we don't have to find out anytime soon either because he is one hell of a
> player.  I would take him over Roussel right now, but I still think Dom has
> what it takes to be the #1 guy.  He outperformed Hextall enough during the
> '91-92 season to make Flyers management think that way too.

Don't be so sure of that. FLYERS management never says bad thing about
Roussel, but they don't say too much on the good side either. I've seen
at least two interviews where every time Farwell was asked how happy he was
to have two good goaltenders, it was Tommy this, Tommy that, and oh, yeah,
Dom has played well too.

> By the way, what was the final card on Monday night?  Team picture by any
> chance?

FLYERS in the NHL Hall of Fame. Kinda dull, really. They handed out a
team picture to everybody who walked in from Pizza Hut, but it was the
same picture they sold in the programs in mid-season. Had names like Benning,
Kasper...

> And how did the Flyers choose the fans who received "the shirts off our
> backs?"  Winning Recchi's jersey after breaking the club's single season
> point record would have been nice.  But knowing your luck you would have
> won Roussel's:-)!

Mostly random seat locations, some were given out by having certain
autographs on the team photos. I don't like that method since I've seen
guards help out people get things like Lindros pictures, surely if they
got their hands on an autographed picture they'd hold 'em for their buddies.

pete clark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53679
From: brifre1@ac.dal.ca
Subject: Re: Goalie masks

In article <93102@hydra.gatech.EDU>, gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak) writes:
> 
> 	I'm starting an informal poll on goalie masks. I'd like to know
> who's mask you think looks the best. I've always like Curtis Joseph's
> of the Blues the best. Anyway, send your nominations to me, or post your
> vote here on r.s.h. My e-mail adress is: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu
> 
> 	Thanks for your time.

I saw a mask once that had drawings of band-aids, presumably for every puck
that goalie stopped with his face/head.  I can't remember who it was or even
if it was NHL (I see quite a few AHL games here).

This is by far the funniest mask I've seen, and for me funny=cool

> 
> -- 
> GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
> GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
> GO HORNETS!  ||
> GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu
Barfly

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53680
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: Plus minus stat...


In article 1443@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca, maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:

>Certainly pluggers are an integral part of any team.  And that is
>simply because there are not enough solid two-way players to go 
>around.  Who would you rather have as your "checking" centre?  Doug
>Gilmour or Doug Jarvis?  For that matter I would take either Gretzky
>or Mario as my "checking" centres.  Do you think Gretzky could cover
>Bob Gainey? 

Gretzky, Lemieux, Gilmour etc do not play the role of checking centreman.
They play an offensive role as opposed to a defensive one.  If they
were used as defensive centres it would be a waste of their offensive
abilities. 

When you compare Gretzky et al to Jarvis, Gainey etc you are comparing 
apples and oranges.  It is like me telling you that Felix Potvin isn't 
very good because a team would be better if the had Lemieux instead of
him.  Sure Lemieux is a better player, but he is a different type of
player.  For a team to be successful, they need to have all types of
players- this includes defensive forwards.

When compared with other defensive forwards, Bob Gainey is the greatest
defensive forward ever.  He is the player who's talents best suited being
a defensive forward- who completely dominated the game when he played.

Maybe if a more talented player such as Gretzky had decided to waste his
offensive talents and play defensively, he could have been a better
defensive forward, but he wasn't.

Bob Gainey is the best defensive forward that has ever played hockey.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53681
From: filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu (Geoff Filinuk)
Subject: Get Real.  Caps have no chance


	Anyone who really believes that the Caps can beat
the Pens are kidding themselves.  The Pens may not loose
one game in the playoffs.

Geoff Filinuk
Flyers Fan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53682
From: vzhivov@superior.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov)
Subject: Re: Individual Winners (WAS: Re: WHERE ARE THE DOUBTERS NOW? HMM?)

In <1993Apr15.170226.11074@cci632.cci.com> dwk@cci632.cci.com (Dave Kehrer) writes:

>Well, since you mentioned it...

>In article <1993Apr12.142028.6300@jarvis.csri.toronto.edu>, migod@turing.toronto.edu (Mike Godfrey) writes:
>  
>> Chelios the Norris,

>If you asked me 30 days ago, I'd agree with you.  I now give the nod to
>Raymond Bourque; his play took off the same time the B's did.  Chelios
>gets a close second...

How about Kevin Hatcher? Scored roughly 35 goals, plays 30 minutes a game.

>> dunno who wins the Vezina, but I suspect not Potvin.  
>  
>Barrasso finally gets his due, in a close one over Eddie the Eagle...

That's really sad when two second-rate goalies (Barasso and Belfour)
are the main contenders for the Vezina. Call me crazy, but how about
Tommy Soderstrom - five shutouts for a 6th place team that doesn't
really play defense. It's really unfortunate that the better goalies
in the league (McLean, Essensa, Vernon) had unspectacular years. BTW,
if you are going to award the Norris on the basis of the last 30 days,
why not give the Vezina to Moog? He has been the best goalie over the
past month.

>> Coach of the year is tricky:  Burns did the most with the least raw talent,
>> King did a good job but the Flames clearly underachieved last year, Brian
>> Sutter has done exceptionally well in his first year with a new team, ditto
>> Demers, Page has been blessed by the ripening and acquisition of young
>> talent, Darryl Sutter is having a good year for a rookie coach, Berry made
>> the best of a bad situation, Terry Crisp worked minor miracles, and Bowman
>> was Bowman.  I'd pick Burns, but I'm mildly biased.

>In *your* case, that bias is acceptable :-)... Mine shows with the Norris pick,
>so we're even...

>I'm impressed with what all the coaches you mentioned did, but my pick would be 
>Al Arbour.  Not too many folks thought the Isles would be in the playoffs, let 
>alone contend for 3rd in their division... Granted that they *did* have a little
>help from their cousins on Broadway... :-)

>And I like the Islanders about as much as I like mowing my lawn...

Arbour or King. Burns will probably win, since playoffs aren't taken
into consideration - he's OK in the regular season, but I'm not sure
if he's beaten anyone other than Hartford in the playoffs.

- Vlad the Impaler

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53683
From: tva1@gmuvax.gmu.edu
Subject: Re: David Polie's future

In article <1993Apr14.010305.1737@ncsu.edu>, fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu
(FRANK MICHAE SALVATORE) writes:
> 
>> Bad news for the Patrick division next year.  Caps GM David Polie is
>> reportedly trying to get a front office job with the NHL.  I can't
>> believe Polie has not been fired despite 10 years of mediocrity.
>> 

	You know what Frank? It's not David Poile's fault that the Caps
have mired in mediocrity for so long. Blame it on the owner, Abe Polin!
This guy owns both the NBA's Bullets and the NHL's Capitals. How dumb
and selfish could this guy be? He's unwilling to spend the bucks in 
order to get a big star to Landover...no wonder both teams STINK!

	I've heard that the Capitals had a chance to get Detroit's
Steve Yzerman last summer but they pulled out at the last minute. Why?
Because our good man, Abe, is afraid to spend the cash!

	Nevertheless, I'm still faithful and hoping that one day
this devilish dictator will be replaced.

>> Frank Salvatore
>> fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu

 Tuan A. Van
 "Does it matter where you buy your underwear ?!" --> Tom Cruise, RAIN MAN
 =========================================================================
 |  T. A. Van -- a.k.a. ARCHMAGE   |  Q: What's orange, black, and ugly  |
 |   George Mason University       |     and dwells in the basement ?    |
 |  Electrical Engineering '93     |  A: da Philadelphia FLYERS!         |
 |     TVA1@gmuvax.gmu.edu	   |     			         |
 |     TVA1@mason1.gmu.edu	   | 	 ** Let's go CAP-I-TALS! **      |
 =========================================================================

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53684
From: rvpst2+@pitt.edu (Richard V Polinski)
Subject: Re: Winning Streaks

In article <93105.053748RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu (Robbie Po) writes:
 
>
>      The Penguins 18 game unbeaten streak carries over to next season.
>Meaning, if they start the season with another 18 game unbeaten streak, they
>will have eclipsed the Flyers record.  Right now, the Penguins are on an 11
>game winning streak, as streaks carry over from one year to another.

Hmmmm, I'm not sure this is true.  According to Mike Lang and good old
Stagie, along with the rest of the TV crews in pittsburgh, they 
winning streak could have stopped because it is a regular season mark.
I would think this would also hold with an unbeaten streak for regular
season games.

However, you are right that the playoff streak does carry over from
last year.  And with 1 more win, I believe they tie an Edmonton record
(but don't quote me on that one).
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>** Robbie Po **          PGH PENGUINS!!!    "It won't be easy, but it
>Contact for the '93-'94  '91 STANLEY CUP    will have greater rewards.
>Penn State Lady Lions    '92 CHAMPIONS      Mountains and Valleys are
>rap115@psuvm.psu.edu     11 STRAIGHT WINS!  better than nothing at all!"



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53685
From: apland@mala.bc.ca (Ron Apland)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

In article <1993Apr15.161737.28377@sol.UVic.CA>, gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:
> 
> In article 1@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi, hahietanen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi () writes:
>>In article <1993Apr14.174139.6604@sol.UVic.CA>, gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> +/- is a good stat because it is the only stat that I am aware of that
>>> takes into account defensive play.  It isn't a measure of defensive
>>> play- it takes into account offense and defence- all aspects of play.
>>                                                   
>>  If we are interested of real all-round players, the power play stats
>>  should be considered, too. Because the power play is also one aspect 
>>  of play! There is still something to be done with these player evaluation
>>  tools!!
> 
> IMO any good player should score on power plays because of the man
> advantage.  Very good power play scorers tend to become overrated
> because their point totals are inflated by power play points.
> +/- tends to expose these overrated players such as Brett Hull,
> John Cullen and Dave Andreychuck.
> 
> Given the opportunity to play power play consistently, any player can
> inflate his totals.
> 
> Gregmeister

Except for Vancouver, of course.  Bure has a hard time scoring on that
power play.  He's got 7 shorthanded goals and 13 pp goals I think!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53686
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Playoff pool, rules, entry form

Well, the tentative rules, anyway.  And, of course, since the season is
not entirely over, tentative entry form.  But who cares?  The real hockey
season is starting!!!!!

Here's the deal:  You email (preferably) or post your predictions, AND the
number of games you think each series will go.  Each round will be
weighted, so that the Stanley Cup finals will be very important, but the
early rounds will still be important.  Here is the scoring:

Pick 1st round winner, way off on games:  2 points
Pick 1st round winner, within one game:   3 points
Pick 1st round winner, pick # of games:   5 points

Pick 2nd round winner, way off on games:  3 points
Pick 2nd round winner, within one game:   4 points
Pick 2nd round winner, pick # of games:   6 points

Pick conference champ, way off on games:  5 points
Pick conference champ, within one game:   6 points
Pick conference champ, pick # of games:   9 points

Pick Stanley Cup champ, way off on games: 8 points
Pick Stanley Cup champ, within one game:  10 points
Pick Stanley Cup champ, pick # of games:  14 points
Pick loser in 7, series goes 7:           2 points
Pick loser in 7, series decided in Game 7, OT: 4 points
(these last two are sympathy points, probably won't happen anyway)

Obviously, picking the Stanley Cup champion is important.  I will do some
tests to see if the format is fair, but probably I will be too lazy to
modify it, so the scoring will probably be like this.  As for entry forms,
well, this post is getting too long, so see next post. 

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53687
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Entry form for playoff pool

Okay, here's the entry sheet.  Keep in mind that not all spots are
decided, so it may change.

     Series  			Your Pick		Games

  Division Semis

NY Islanders-Pittsburgh
New Jersey-Washington

Buffalo-Boston
Montreal-Quebec

St. Louis-Chicago
Toronto-Detroit

Winnipeg-Vancouver
Los Angeles-Calgary

  Division Finals

Patrick
Adams
Norris
Smythe

  Conference Finals

Wales
Campbell


Stanley Cup winner


See previous post for scoring.  Good luck!

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53688
From: slacelle@gandalf.ca (Stephane Lacelle)
Subject: Bridgman is out

The Ottwawa Senators fired Mel Bridgman at 1:00 PM today.
Randy Sexton is gonna replace him.

-- 
=====================================================================
Stephane Lacelle				
S/W engineer                    Insert .sig here				
Gandalf Data Ltd                                                    

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53689
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: Playoff telecasts in Atlanta

In article <C5JABD.812@acsu.buffalo.edu> hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl) writes:
>
>I'd personally prefer Buffalo-Boston, as a birthday gift from ESPN,
>but I don't think the folks at ESPN will accomodate that for me ;-)
>ESPN has this inexplicable affinity for the Patrick division, it
>seems.  
>

First,Happy Birthday,Val. Second, ESPN's affinity with Patrick has probably
more to do with the travel/production costs for a once a week NHN(National Hockey
Night) affair.(ESPN-ABC owner,Capital Cities, is a company known for being
quite thrifty with minimal overhead costs. It's quite possible that Jim
Schoenfeld may be working for doughnuts :-).

Gary Thorne and Bill Clement are both NJ-based and the rest of ESPN crew
resides in the suburban CT with a very close proximity to tri-state area.
Plus,it makes sense in terms of solid hockey following in the NorthEast
corridor(PA-NY-NJ-DC/Maryland). Whereas,in the Adams you have only
3-American based teams, out of which 2(Buffalo and Hartford) are not
in Top-20  US TV-markets.

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53690
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL Season in review (off ice stuff)

Here is a review of some of the off-ice things that have
affected the AHL this year.


ST JOHN'S MAPLE LEAFS PROBLEMS
The St John's Maple Leafs sophomore season has been plagued by
problems. On-ice, the Leafs won the Atlantic Division title but
off ice was less happy. A strike by public workers has forced the
leafs out of the Newfoundland city for much of the last half of
the seaosn (since mid-Jan). They have played "home" games in places
like Montreal, Cornwall and Charlottetown. Their playoff "home"
games will be played in the Metro Center in Halifax, NS. One
demostration got violent. Workers attacked a Leafs' bus and
rocked it and broke windows in the St John's Memorial Stadium.
Despite the problems, Toronto officials insist that the Leafs
will return to St John's once the strike ends.
===================================================
SENATORS SOLD
The New Haven Senators have been sold by Peter Shipman to
the Ottawa Senators NHL organization. They are the only Canadian
NHL team with an American AHL affiliate, and have made it clear
they intend to move the team to somewhere in the Canadian Atlantic
Provinces. This sale and move has yet to be approved by the AHL
head office, but is expected to pass easily at the general meeting
in May. The quote in the story from Jack Butterfield made it 
clear the league was more interested in the stability of the 
AHL franchise accompanied by NHL ownership, rather than maintaining
the 56-year history of the AHL in New Haven. 

The Senators are currently in serious negotiations with Charlottetown
New Brunswick and are expected to move there.
==================================================
DALLAS HELPS HAWKS STAY IN MONCTON
After announcing that they would pull their affiliation out
of Moncton, the Winnipeg Jets changed their mind. 

The Jets announced the move when they said that they would be slashing
their minor league roster from 20-something to around a dozen; and they
wanted to share with an existing AHL or IHL franchise.

Enter the Dallas Lone Stars. Dallas agreed to supply the remaining
6 or 8 players to the Moncton franchise. Thus keeping the Hawks
in the New Brunswick city.

The deal is for one year and will be extended to three years if
the season ticket base increases to over 3000. The Hawks only sold
1400 for this year.
============================================================
SAINT JOHN FLAMES OFFICIAL
The Calgary Flames have officially signed a deal with the city of
Saint John, NB. The Saint John Blue Flames will play in the 6200
Exhibition Center. The Flames still have to apply for an expansion
frnachise from the AHL but are expected to have no trouble.
=========================================================
CAPS FOLLOW JACKS TO MAINE
Despite rumors to the contrary, the Capitals will follow the Baltimore
Skipjacks to Maine. The Caps' current farm team, the Baltimore Skipjacks,
announced that they would move to Maine and become the Portland Pirates.
There was much doubt as to if the Caps would follow but they announced
a limited deal with Portland. They would supply a dozen or so players
including 2 goalies. They become the third team to announce a limited
farm team along with Moncton and the Capital District Islanders.
======================================================
AHL GAME OF THE WEEK
In early January, the AHL started a game of the week. The game, produced
by, I believe, Pyman Productions, was televised across the Canadian
Maritimes and northeastern US. The first few weeks saw two games of
the week, one in Canada and another in the US but since then, there
has been only one. Sunday afternoon and night games were covered and
shown on Sportschannel NY and NE in the US and, I believe, Atlantic
Sports Network in Canada (but I'm not sure about that). I am not
sure if playoff games will be covered.
=====================================================
UTICA GONE? SYRACUSE ADDED?
There were heavy rumors that the Utica Devils will not be around next
season. There were rumors that they might be headed to a midwestern
city and that the city of Syracuse is trying to lure them.
=====================================================
WHAT THE AHL MIGHT LOOK LIKE NEXT YEAR

ONE OPTION				ANOTHER OPTION
			
Northern Division			Southern Division
ADIRONDACK RED WINGS			ADIRONDACK
SPRINGFIELD INDIANS			SPRINGFIELD
PROVIDENCE BRUINS			PROVIDENCE
CD ISLANDERS				CDI
PORTLAND PIRATES			HERSHEY
					BINGHAMTON
Southern Division			ROCHESTER
HERSHEY BEARS				HAMILTON
BINGHAMTON RANGERS			UTICA
ROCHESTER AMERICANS
HAMILTON CANUCKS			Atlantic Division
UTICA (?) DEVILS			PORTLAND 
					ST JOHN'S
Atlantic Division			SAINT JOHN
ST JOHN'S MAPLE LEAFS			MONCTON
MONCTON HAWKS				HALIFAX
HALIFAX CITADELS			FREDERICTON
CAPE BRETON OILERS			CAPE BRETON
FREDERICTON CANADIENS			CHARLOTTETOWN
SAINT JOHN BLUE FLAMES
CHARLOTTETOWN SENATORS (move is unofficial as yet)

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu +
    + AHL and ECAC contact for rec.sport.hockey		Go USA Hockey!	 +	
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	 +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champ: '66  '91  '93		 +
    + Glens Falls High School, Division II NY State Champs: '90  '91 	 +
    + Join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu    	 +
    + CONGRATS TO CLARKSON GOLDEN KNIGHTS HOCKEY: 1993 ECAC CHAMPIONS!!! +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53691
From: farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL News

DALLAS HELPS HAWKS STAY IN MONCTON
After announcing that they would pull their affiliation out
of Moncton, the Winnipeg Jets changed their mind. 

The Jets announced the move when they said that they would be slashing
their minor league roster from 20-something to around a dozen; and they
wanted to share with an existing AHL or IHL franchise.

Enter the Dallas Lone Stars. Dallas agreed to supply the remaining
6 or 8 players to the Moncton franchise. Thus keeping the Hawks
in the New Brunswick city.

The deal is for one year and will be extended to three years if
the season ticket base increases to over 3000. The Hawks only sold
1400 for this year.

SAINT JOHN FLAMES OFFICIAL
The Calgary Flames have officially signed a deal with the city of
Saint John, NB. The Saint John Blue Flames will play in the 6200
Exhibition Center. The Flames still have to apply for an expansion
frnachise from the AHL but are expected to have no trouble.

CAPS FOLLOW JACKS TO MAINE
Despite rumors to the contrary, the Capitals will follow the Baltimore
Skipjacks to Maine. The Caps' current farm team, the Baltimore Skipjacks,
announced that they would move to Maine and become the Portland Pirates.
There was much doubt as to if the Caps would follow but they announced
a limited deal with Portland. They would supply a dozen or so players
including 2 goalies. They become the third team to announce a limited
farm team along with Moncton and the Capital District Islanders.

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL and ECAC contact for rec.sport.hockey		Go USA Hockey!	   +	
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    + CONGRATS TO THE BOSTON BRUINS, 1992-93 ADAMS DIVISION CHAMPIONS      +
    + PHOENIX SUNS, 1992-93 PACIFIC DIVISION CHAMPIONS			   +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

					

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53692
From: j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
Subject: Plus minus stat

>Post: 51213 of 51227
>Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
>From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
>Subject: Re: Plus minus stat...
>Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, Laurentian University,
>Sudbury, ON Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1993 21:41:29 GMT
 
>In <4LD32B2w165w@sms.business.uwo.ca>
>j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David) writes:
 
>>It was Bryan Trottier, not Denis Potvin.  It was a vicious
>>'boarding' from behind...Trottier was given a major.
 
>Perhaps it was Trottier.  It happened behind the Habs goal if
>I recall. Gainey simply didn't have his head up as he was
>picking up the puck.
 
>But Roger, what the hell does this have to do with Gainey's
>skill as a hockey player?  If Probert smashes Gilmour's head
>into the boards next week, will that diminish your assessment
>of Gilmour's skills?
 
>If Gilmour was taken completely by surprise, as Gainey was, then
>yeah, I would have to say that Doug wasn't playing
>"technically" smart  hockey.  In any case, to claim as Greg did,
>that Gainey *never* made  a technical mistake is absolutely
>ludicrous.
 
Later on, in your posting, you make reference to "putting words
into other people's mouths"...I would suggest that your last
paragraph can only be interpreted in one way...namely, that I,
along with Greg, claim that Gainey never made a technical
mistake.  If you actually read what I've written, you will find
that I make no such claim...soooo, if logic serves me well,
you're contradicting yourself.
 
>>>Gainey was a plugger.  And when the press runs out of things
>>>to say about  the stars on dynasties they start to hype the
>>>pluggers.  Grant Fuhr, Essa Tikkannen, Butch Goring, Bob
>>>Nystrom, Bob Gainey, Doug Jarvis, Derek Sanderson, Wayne
>>>Cashman, Bob Baun, Bob Pulford, Ralph Backstrom, Henri
>>>Richard, Dick Duff...and so on...
 
>>I would take Fuhr and Sanderson off of the latter.
 
>Good for you.  You'd only be displaying your ignorance of
>course, but to each his own...
 
Roger, I'm not sure here, but I think "ignorance" is really a
function of "a lack of knowledge" and not "formulating an
opinion"...but hey, if you need to take a cheap shot, then by all
means go ahead...that's if it makes you feel better.
 
>>I think Gainey would be honoured to know that you've included
>>him
 
>I think Gainey should feel honoured to know that he is
>remembered at  all.
 
 
My word, such vehemence against poor ol' Bob Gainey.  Why does
he bother you so much...he was an effective player for his style
of play.
 
>>on this list.  I also think you have a relatively naive view
>>about what wins a hockey game...pluggers are an integral part
>>of
 
>Certainly pluggers are an integral part of any team.  And that
>is simply because there are not enough solid two-way players to
>go  around.  Who would you rather have as your "checking"
>centre?  Doug Gilmour or Doug Jarvis?  For that matter I would
>take either Gretzky or Mario as my "checking" centres.  Do you
>think Gretzky could cover Bob Gainey? 
 
I'm really sorry Roger, but you have lost me completely here. 
Why don't you ask me if I would rather have Jesus Christ,
himself, in nets?
 
Now, if you were to compare, say for example, Bob Gainey with Guy
Carbonneau, you would have a balanced comparison.
 
>>any team.  The Selke is designed to acknowledge their
>>contribution...I think that most people understand that it's
>>not the Nobel Prize...so settle down.
 
>You're wrong again.  The Selke is awarded to the forward that
>does the best job defensively and this may or may not be the
>best plugger.  If  Gilmour does the best defensive job in the
>league I don't see why he  should be out of the running simply
>because he also contributes offen-sively.
 
I'm wrong AGAIN...hmmm, let's see...where was I wrong in the
first place?  I'm only guessing here, Rog, but I have a feeling
that you've setup a "You're wrong again" macro key on your
machine.
 
I agree that my use of the word plugger is simplistic...but I
think you know what I'm getting at.  I would also like to point
out that Gilmour's potential as a Selke-winner was never part of
the debate...are you asking me for an opinion?  If so, I think
there are far too many other deserving players to include Gilmour
among the candidates.
 
>>Settle down?  If you think that I have likened the Selke to the
>>Nobel prize then I suggest that you had best "settle down". 
>>And if you are going to try to put words in my mouth, let me
>>suggest that you "settle  down" before you bother following up
>>on my postings. 
 
I would suggest that your comment: "And when the press runs out
of things to say about  the stars on dynasties they start to hype
the pluggers.  Grant Fuhr, Essa Tikkannen, Butch Goring, Bob
Nystrom, Bob Gainey, Doug Jarvis, Derek Sanderson, Wayne Cashman,
Bob Baun, Bob Pulford, Ralph Backstrom, Henri Richard, Dick
Duff...and so on..." demonstrates a blanket disregard for these
individuals as contributors to the game...so yes, settle
down...nobody has claimed that they are hockey gods.
 
>>congenially, as always,
>> 
>>jd
>> 
>>--
>>James David
>>david@student.business.uwo.ca
 
>You might consider developing your own style.  After all,
>imitation is  the sincerest form of flattery and I am quite sure
>that flattery is not  your intention.
 
C'mon...it has a nice ring to it...and admit it, you had a good
laugh.
 
congenially, as always,
 
jd
 
--
James David
david@student.business.uwo.ca

j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
Western Business School  --  London, Ontario

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53693
From: maX <maX@maxim.rinaco.msk.su>
Subject: Only test message

It's only test message.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53694
From: kfrank@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Kevin D Frank)
Subject: NHL Team Items...

I live in the desolate MidWest (as far as hockey is concerned) and our "sports"
stores around here carry VERY LITTLE hockey stuff, except for San Jose, Tampa
Bay, L.A., Pittsburgh, and if you're lucky Chicago.

I would like to know if anyone knows of any m,ail order, phone order stores that
I might be able to get in contact with.  I am dying for some real hockey stuff
(hats, shirts, key chains, etc.) for some other teams (Edmonton, Montreal, etc.)
so if you have any information, PLEASE e-mail me DIRECTLY.  Most appreciated!

Good luck to your teams in the Stanley Cup playoffs!

GO EDMONTON (likely...NOT!!)  Maybe next year...
-- 
	"If you assult someone you get 5 years--In hockey, 5 minutes.
			Is this a great sport or what?!"

Kevin D. Frank					kfrank@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53695
From: brifre1@ac.dal.ca
Subject: Yet more crazy predictions


Well here it goes...my crazy predictions (which never come true, but hey..)

Adams
	Bos vs. Buf - Bos in 5 (cakewalk for the hot Bruins)
	Que vs. Mon - Que in 6 (best series of the first round)

Patrick
	Pit vs. NYI - Pit in 5 (NYI wins fourth game)
	Was vs. NJD - NJD in 7 (a grueling upset, possibly OT in game 7)

Norris
	Chi vs. StL - Chi in 5 (StL is no match for Keenan's Krew)
	Det vs. Tor - Tor in 6 (Clark steps it up in playoffs this year)

Smythe (who cares?)
	Van vs. Win - Win in 7 (so I'm caught up in Teemu-mania, sue me!)
	Cal vs. LAK - Cal in 5 (LA sucks!!!!!!!!! IMO)

Division finals
	Bos vs. Que - Bos in 7 (killer games, watch for Cam to shine)
	Pit vs. NJD - Pit in 6 (NJD go insane, kill all on ice, but Pit wins)
	Chi vs. Tor - Tor in 7 (Tor defense finally get it together)
	Cal vs. Win - Cal in 6 (Win too tired after 1st series)

Conference finals
	Pit vs. Bos - Bos in 6 (Pit too beat up by NJD to play (I hope))
	Cal vs. Tor - Tor in 6 (Vernon turns into a sieve)

Stanley Cup
	Bos vs. Tor - Tor in 7 (Two totally different teams, who knows? Dreams
				can come true, pig might one day evolve wings)

Feel free to laugh at my predictions, I always do!

Barfly

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53696
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Plus minus stat

In <VFq32B2w165w@sms.business.uwo.ca> j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David) writes:

>>If Gilmour was taken completely by surprise, as Gainey was, then
>>yeah, I would have to say that Doug wasn't playing
>>"technically" smart  hockey.  In any case, to claim as Greg did,
>>that Gainey *never* made  a technical mistake is absolutely
>>ludicrous.
> 
>Later on, in your posting, you make reference to "putting words
>into other people's mouths"...I would suggest that your last
>paragraph can only be interpreted in one way...namely, that I,
>along with Greg, claim that Gainey never made a technical
>mistake.  If you actually read what I've written, you will find
>that I make no such claim...soooo, if logic serves me well,
>you're contradicting yourself.

Nonsense.  I quite clearly state that it was Greg that made the claim
that Gainey never made an error.  And he made the claim. Read below.

From rec.sport.hockey Thu Apr 15 21:22:49 1993
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Message-ID: <1993Apr15.160450.27799@sol.UVic.CA>

[nonsense deleted]

Gainey is the best defensive forward ever.  I stand by that assessment.
He was a very good player who belongs in the hall of fame.  Did you
ever watch him play? He never made a technical error.

[more nonsense deleted]

>>Good for you.  You'd only be displaying your ignorance of
>>course, but to each his own...
> 
>Roger, I'm not sure here, but I think "ignorance" is really a
>function of "a lack of knowledge" and not "formulating an
>opinion"...but hey, if you need to take a cheap shot, then by all
>means go ahead...that's if it makes you feel better.

To knowledgeable observers of the game my meaning is obvious.  Your
hockey education is not my responsibility.
 
>My word, such vehemence against poor ol' Bob Gainey.  Why does
>he bother you so much...he was an effective player for his style
>of play.

He was just another player.  To laud him as anything more I find
bothersome.  I hated the Habs.  I hated Lafleur until I realized
that he was likely the most aesthetically pleasing player to ever 
skate in my lifetime.  Why would anyone talk about Gainey?
  
>>go  around.  Who would you rather have as your "checking"
>>centre?  Doug Gilmour or Doug Jarvis?  For that matter I would
>>take either Gretzky or Mario as my "checking" centres.  Do you
>>think Gretzky could cover Bob Gainey?

>I'm really sorry Roger, but you have lost me completely here. 
>Why don't you ask me if I would rather have Jesus Christ,
>himself, in nets?

Did he play hockey at a high level?  Was he any good?  If not, why
would you bother to bring JC up?  I am talking about hockey players
here.  If you can't follow the conversation don't follow up.  As I
said previously, it is not my responsibility to educate you.

>Now, if you were to compare, say for example, Bob Gainey with Guy
>Carbonneau, you would have a balanced comparison.

Sure.  Two journeymen.  Big deal.  Neither one of them is worth
discussing.

>I'm wrong AGAIN...hmmm, let's see...where was I wrong in the

>>>I would take Fuhr and Sanderson off of the latter.

>first place?  I'm only guessing here, Rog, but I have a feeling
>that you've setup a "You're wrong again" macro key on your
>machine.

That is an excellent idea and if I decide to waste any more time
responding to any of your, or Greg's, postings then I will be sure
to implement that very macro.
 
>I would suggest that your comment: "And when the press runs out
>of things to say about  the stars on dynasties they start to hype
>the pluggers.  Grant Fuhr, Essa Tikkannen, Butch Goring, Bob
>Nystrom, Bob Gainey, Doug Jarvis, Derek Sanderson, Wayne Cashman,
>Bob Baun, Bob Pulford, Ralph Backstrom, Henri Richard, Dick
>Duff...and so on..." demonstrates a blanket disregard for these
>individuals as contributors to the game...so yes, settle
>down...nobody has claimed that they are hockey gods.

Tarasov claimed that Gainey was a "hockey god."  And Greg ate it up.
And that is what this thread is all about.  If you didn't know 
that then why are you responding?

And as for "blanket disregard for these individuals", I can remember 
Leaf teams, purely populated by such "individuals", winning four 
Stanley Cups.  Teams.  No one ran around telling us that George
Armstrong was the best hockey player in the world.

>>>congenially, as always,
>>> 
>>>jd
>>> 
>>>--
>>>James David
>>>david@student.business.uwo.ca
> 
>>You might consider developing your own style.  After all,
>>imitation is  the sincerest form of flattery and I am quite sure
>>that flattery is not  your intention.
> 
>C'mon...it has a nice ring to it...and admit it, you had a good
>laugh.

Right.  I had to get to the end of your posting before I realized you were 
a complete joke.

In the future, if you are going to respond to my postings I would appreciate
it if you could present a cogent argument supported by facts gleaned from a
version of reality that most of the rest of us would recognize.

cordially, as always, 

rm

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53697
From: apanjabi@guvax.acc.georgetown.edu
Subject: Re: How to beat Pittsburgh!

In article <AfnKOVK00UhB01RDtJ@andrew.cmu.edu>, Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
> 	<kfnJYea00Uh_I1VmUs@andrew.cmu.edu>
> NNTP-Posting-Host: po5.andrew.cmu.edu
> In-Reply-To: <kfnJYea00Uh_I1VmUs@andrew.cmu.edu>
> 
> from Anna Matyas:
>>>Now if we could just clone Chelios's personality and transplant it
>>>into all of the defensemen on the Islanders, Capitals, and Devils...
>>> 
>>>Gerald
>> 
>>In other words, you want to turn them all into assholes so they
>>will spend lots of time in the penalty box and get lots of
>>misconducts?
>> 
>>And this comes from a Chelios fan...
> 
> Yeah, and also be second in the team in scoring and play about 35
> minutes a game and play on the power play and kill penalties and be the
> best defenseman in the league. I'd take a whole team of Chelioses if I
> could. (That way, when one got a penalty the others could kill it!)
> 
> Ralph

>HOW TO BEAT PITTSBURGH???

	I.Mario Lemieux
		A.Death
			1.Too much Kimo
			2.Slash to skull
			3.Ask the Rangers (Slashing his wrist????)
	II.Jaromir Jagr
		A.Deportation
			1.Send him back to whatever Commie country 
			  he's from
			2.Tell him that Bill Clinton is going too
	III.Kevin Stevens
		A.Fighting
			1.Call Bob Probert
			2.Call Tie Domi
			3.Call my grandmother (She'd kick his ass)
 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53698
From: dale@odie.cs.mun.ca (Dale Fraser)
Subject: Re: AHL News: St John's news, part XXXVIII

brifre1@ac.dal.ca writes:

>In article <1993Apr13.132906.1827@news.clarkson.edu>, farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy) writes:
>> Pete Raymond emailed me this piece of info. Not sure if Game 7 was
>> intentionally or unintentionally omitted (ie date not set).	
>> 
>> BRI
>> ================================================================
>> [begin quoted material]
>> 
>> Because of the Moncton win Friday night Halifax was eliminated thus St.
>> John's will make Halifax home. The first round of play-offs wil take place
>> on these dates.
>> 
>> 	April 14 - Halifax Metro Center (Leafs Home Game)
>>         April 17 - Halifax Metro Center
>>      
>> 	April 21 - Moncton
>> 	April 23 - Moncton
>> 
>> 	April 26 - Halifax Metro Center
>> 
>> 	April 30 - Moncton
>> 
>This is a Halifax (or at least this Halifax) resident's dream come true!!
>The leafs are my favorite NHL team (and no, I don't know why)!!!!!!!!!
>I'd say that this is even better than the Citadels making the playoffs (a
>Quebec farm team; who cares??).

>By the way, for any NFLD fans....I'm sure ASN will carry some of the games
>(they'd be stupid not to....but then this is ASN)
I haven't heard any news about ASN carrying any games but the local
cable station here in St. John's (Cable 9) is carrying the games live!

Hey, it's better than nothing!

GO LEAFS GO!!!

Dale

|-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-|
|   "Why sex is so popular    |    Dale Fraser  dale@odie.cs.mun.ca   |
|       Is easy to see:       | Memorial University of Newfoundland   |
|    It contains no sodium    |     CS Undergrad  -  Class of '92     |
| And it's cholesterol free!" |-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-| 
|       Shelby Friedman       | BLUE JAYS 1992 WORLD SERIES CHAMPS!!  |
|-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-|
| *OPINIONS EXPRESSED ABOVE DO NOT BELONG TO ME OR THIS INSTITUTION!* |
|-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-|

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53699
From: dale@odie.cs.mun.ca (Dale Fraser)
Subject: Re: Hockey and the Hispanic community

icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera) writes:


>	The presence of the new team in Miami(I can't say South Florida;
>it's too long) makes me think of an interesting question. Can you sell
>the Hispanic community on Hockey? Miami is 60-70% Hispanic. This community
>has no experience and no previous exposure to Hockey that I know of. The
>teams in NY and LA which also have big Hispanic groups do not seem to try
>to woo this group. What will Miami do? Could they get Spanish-language
>tv and radio coverage?
I think, as do the owners, that hockey will do well in Miami since there
is a lot of people from the Northeast that spend their winters in
Florida every year. As for the coverage, someone will have to come up
with some money for that since broadcast rights can be expensive!

Just my $0.02!

Dale

|-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-|
|   "Why sex is so popular    |    Dale Fraser  dale@odie.cs.mun.ca   |
|       Is easy to see:       | Memorial University of Newfoundland   |
|    It contains no sodium    |     CS Undergrad  -  Class of '92     |
| And it's cholesterol free!" |-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-| 
|       Shelby Friedman       | BLUE JAYS 1992 WORLD SERIES CHAMPS!!  |
|-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-|
| *OPINIONS EXPRESSED ABOVE DO NOT BELONG TO ME OR THIS INSTITUTION!* |
|-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-|

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53700
From: monack@helium.gas.uug.arizona.edu (david n monack)
Subject: Re: ESPN Tonight

In <1qkj1kINN3g1@master.cs.rose-hulman.edu> swartzjh@RoseVC.Rose-Hulman.Edu writes:

>Has anyone heard what game ESPN is showing tonight.  They said they will
>show whatever game means the most playoff-wise. I would assume this would
>be the Blues-Tampa game or the Minnesota-Red Wings game...  Anyone heard for
>sure???

>		Jeff Swartz

I heard it will be the Minnesota-Detroit game. Don't know the time
though.

Dave

--
David Monack        e-mail: monack@gas.uug.arizona.edu
"Love is the delusion that one woman differs from another." H.L. Mencken

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53701
From: richard@amc.com (Richard Wernick)
Subject: Bruins in the Playoffs

Well Bruins fans it's playoff time again.
It looks like the B's have peaked at the right time.
Getting out of the Adams is going to be a cat fight to the end.
After what they did to Montreal and Quebec, these teams will be out for
revenge. If Neely can stay healthy, and both Bourque and Moog stay sharp,
we should get to see Neely finally take out two years of frustration 
on Ulf (I don't fight) Samuelson. I don't agree with fighting in the NHL,
but if there is one guy who deserves to be taken out good, it's him.

This is going to be a good series, Go Bruins!!!!


Rchard
richard@amc.com


 



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53702
From: j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
Subject: Plus minus stat

>Post: 51240 of 51243
>Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
>From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
>Subject: Re: Plus minus stat
>Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, Laurentian University,
>Sudbury, ON Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1993 01:59:36 GMT
 
<discussion deleted>
 
>>>Good for you.  You'd only be displaying your ignorance of
>>>course, but to each his own...
>> 
>>Roger, I'm not sure here, but I think "ignorance" is really a
>>function of "a lack of knowledge" and not "formulating an
>>opinion"...but hey, if you need to take a cheap shot, then by
>>all means go ahead...that's if it makes you feel better.
 
>To knowledgeable observers of the game my meaning is obvious. 
>Your hockey education is not my responsibility.
 
MY HOCKEY EDUCATION?  What the f--- are you talking about?  I'm
not even going to try to refute this absolutely insane statement. 
 
>>My word, such vehemence against poor ol' Bob Gainey.  Why does
>>he bother you so much...he was an effective player for his
>>style of play.
 
>He was just another player.  To laud him as anything more I find
>bothersome.  I hated the Habs.  I hated Lafleur until I realized
>that he was likely the most aesthetically pleasing player to
>ever  skate in my lifetime.  Why would anyone talk about Gainey?
 
"I hate the Habs" ?...you sound like a 10-year old.  This
statement is just further exemplifies your total inability to
argue objectively about hockey.  Don't give me this crap about
"cogent arguments"...I've yet to read something of yours that is
cogent.  You consistently argue with: (1) emotion; (2) huge,
sweeping statements
 
Frankly, you have a very unconvincing style.
 
I'm not defending Bob Gainey...frankly, I don't care for him all
that much.  But your dismissal of him as something less than an
effective hockey player is tiresome...it has no basis in
anything.  How many Calders did he win? I think it was four (go
ahead and refresh my memory).  What about the Conn Smythe?  Was
that a fluke?  Yeah, not the makings of a hockey superstar, I
know, but try to have a reason, any reason, to shoot him down.
 
>>>go  around.  Who would you rather have as your "checking"
>>>centre?  Doug Gilmour or Doug Jarvis?  For that matter I would
>>>take either Gretzky or Mario as my "checking" centres.  Do you
>>>think Gretzky could cover Bob Gainey?
 
>>I'm really sorry Roger, but you have lost me completely here. 
>>Why don't you ask me if I would rather have Jesus Christ,
>>himself, in nets?
 
>Did he play hockey at a high level?  Was he any good?  If not,
>why would you bother to bring JC up?  I am talking about hockey
>players here.  If you can't follow the conversation don't follow
>up.  As I said previously, it is not my responsibility to
>educate you.
 
Hey cowboy!  You're the "expert" who introduced the idiotic
comparison of Gainey with Gretzky and Lemieux...you figure it
out.
 
>>Now, if you were to compare, say for example, Bob Gainey with
>>Guy Carbonneau, you would have a balanced comparison.
 
>Sure.  Two journeymen.  Big deal.  Neither one of them is worth
>discussing.
 
How many individual awards between them? Eight...I don't remember
(once again, please feel free to refresh my memory...and try to
be as sarcastic as possible about my "hockey education").
 
>I'm wrong AGAIN...hmmm, let's see...where was I wrong in the
 
>>>I would take Fuhr and Sanderson off of the latter.
 
OH MY GOD!!!  Did I say that?  Roger...what's your point?  Fuhr
is a goaltender, goaltender's don't "plug"...in his prime, he was
one of the best.  Sanderson was a scrapper...if you stick him on
you may as well include half the Flyers team of the same era.
 
>>first place?  I'm only guessing here, Rog, but I have a feeling
>>that you've setup a "You're wrong again" macro key on your
>>machine.
 
>That is an excellent idea and if I decide to waste any more time
>responding to any of your, or Greg's, postings then I will be
>sure to implement that very macro.
 
Oh Roger, you shouldn't...really.  I don't deserve this...you are
far too accomodating already.
 
>>I would suggest that your comment: "And when the press runs out
>>of things to say about  the stars on dynasties they start to
>>hype the pluggers.  Grant Fuhr, Essa Tikkannen, Butch Goring,
>>Bob Nystrom, Bob Gainey, Doug Jarvis, Derek Sanderson, Wayne
>>Cashman, Bob Baun, Bob Pulford, Ralph Backstrom, Henri Richard,
>>Dick Duff...and so on..." demonstrates a blanket disregard for
>>these individuals as contributors to the game...so yes, settle
>>down...nobody has claimed that they are hockey gods.
 
>Tarasov claimed that Gainey was a "hockey god."  And Greg ate
>it up. And that is what this thread is all about.  If you didn't
>know  that then why are you responding?
 
You seem to have allowed all of these other players fall into
your sweeping, vacuous statement...that's why.  If you want to
debate Gainey, go ahead...but why bring up everybody else?  How
does it support your argument?  Do you have an argument, or do
you just like to throw around a few names hoping to impress us?
 
 
>And as for "blanket disregard for these individuals", I can
>remember  Leaf teams, purely populated by such "individuals",
>winning four Stanley Cups.  Teams.  No one ran around telling
>us that George Armstrong was the best hockey player in the
>world.
 
Great.  I couldn't agree more.  The Flyers won two cups for the
same reasons...deservedly so.  So what?  I don't get it.  Are you
angry that the Leafs didn't get more recognition?  
 
You seem to think these pluggers are "hyped"...I don't
agree...plain and simple.  If you're last statement is some sort
of compromise, fair enough.
 
>>>You might consider developing your own style.  After all,
>>>imitation is  the sincerest form of flattery and I am quite
>>>sure that flattery is not  your intention.
>> 
>>C'mon...it has a nice ring to it...and admit it, you had a good
>>laugh.
 
>Right.  I had to get to the end of your posting before I
>realized you were  a complete joke.
 
Not a pleasant bone in your body, eh Rog?  Why are you so
unhappy?  Not getting invited to enough parties?  What?
 
>In the future, if you are going to respond to my postings I
>would appreciate it if you could present a cogent argument
>supported by facts gleaned from a version of reality that most
>of the rest of us would recognize.
 
Roger, why are you under the impression that responding to your
posts is some great honour?  You really should stop...it sounds
a little bit pathetic.  Frankly, it's about as honourable as a
good fart.
 
congenially, as always, 
 
jd
 
-- 
James David 
j3david@student.business.uwo.ca/s

j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
Western Business School  --  London, Ontario

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53703
From: farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: Re: Playoff predictions

PATRICK
1st rd:	Pens over Isles in 4.
	Devils over Caps in 6.
2nd:	Pens over Devils in 7.

ADAMS
1st rd: B's over Sabres in 5.
	Nords over Habs in 5.
2nd:	B's over Nords in 6.

NORRIS
1st:	Hawks over Stars/Blues in 5.
	Wings over Leafs in 7.
2nd:	Hawks over Wings in 5.

SMYTHE
1st:	Jets over Canucks in 7.	(call it a hunch)
	Flames over Kings in 5.
2nd:	Jets over Flames in 6.

WALES
Pens over B's in 7.	

CAMPBELL
Hawks over Jets in 5.

STANLEY
Pens over Hawks in 5.

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL and ECAC contact for rec.sport.hockey		Go USA Hockey!	   +	
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    + CONGRATS TO THE BOSTON BRUINS, 1992-93 ADAMS DIVISION CHAMPIONS      +
    + PHOENIX SUNS, 1992-93 PACIFIC DIVISION CHAMPIONS			   +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53704
From: mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger)
Subject: TV Schedule for Next Week

United States TV Schedule:
April 18   Devils/Islanders at Pittsburgh   1 EST  ABC  (to Eastern time zone)
April 18   St. Louis at Chicago             12 CDT ABC  (to Cent/Mou time zones)
April 18   Los Angeles at Calgary           12 PDT ABC  (to Pacific time zone)
April 20   Devils/Islanders at Pittsburgh   7:30   ESPN
April 22   TBA                              7:30   ESPN
April 24   TBA                              7:30   ESPN

If somebody would send me the CBC/TSN schedule I'll post that as well.


*******************************************************************************
*  Mike Burger                    *  My Canada includes, Quebec, Ontario,     *
*  mmb@lamar.colostate.edu        *  the Maritimes, the Prairies, and Florida *
*  A Beginning Computing TA Stud  *  four months a year.                      *
*  over 500 students served       *    --Royal Canadian Air Farce             *
*******************************************************************************
*      University of Michigan - 1990  --  Colorado State University - 199?    *
*******************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53705
From: "Steve Hayman" <sahayman@cs.indiana.edu>
Subject: Re: Hockey and the Hispanic community

In article <C5I2s2.3Bt@odin.corp.sgi.com> rickc@wrigley.corp.sgi.com (Richard Casares) writes:
>When was the last time you saw a hockey league in the inner city.

Well, actually now that you mention it, a few weeks ago the CBC ran a
documentary on "Ice Hockey in Harlem".  the Canadian Club of New York
(something like that) sponsors a league for kids in Harlem and based on
the TV report they all seemed to be having a lot of fun.  All playing
with regular equipment, jerseys, etc etc, on a proper outdoor rink.  It
looked just like kids playing hockey anywhere else.

Some of the kids were even fortunate to get a trip to a hockey camp in Alberta.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53706
From: jrmst8+@pitt.edu (Joseph R Mcdonald)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

In article <1993Apr15.000256.24403@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA writes:
>What it comes down to is that Jagr, despite being an arrogant asshole, is a
>very good hockey player who has had a better season this year than Ron Francis.
>Jagr has more points and a better +/-.

Jagr has a higher +/-, but Francis has had more points.  And take it from
an informed observer, Ronnie Francis has had a *much* better season than
Jaromir Jagr.  This is not to take anything away from Jaro, who had a 
decent year (although it didn't live up to the expectations of some).
 
>Gregmeister

Dean
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dean J. Falcione                                      "Badges? What badges? We 
(using jrmst8 by permission                            Don't need no stinkin'
 of the owner, Joe McDonald)                           badges!"

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53707
From: gsu0033@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Eric Molas)
Subject: Re: Playoff predictions


>1st round: 
>----------

>PITT vs NYI:  PITT in 4.  
>WASH vs NJD:  WASH in 6. 

>BOS  vs BUF:  BOS  in 5. 
>QUE  vs MON:  MON  in 7. 
I'd have to take Quebec in 6.

>CHI  vs STL:  CHI in 4. 

Hawks will win, but it will take 5.
>DET  vs TOR:  DET in 6. 

>VAN  vs WIN:  WIN in 6. 
>CAL  vs  LA:  CAL in 5. 
Cal in 7.
>2nd round: 
>----------

>PITT vs WASH: PITT in 4. 
>BOS  vs MON:  BOS  in 6. 
Boston will beat Quebec in 6.
>CHI  vs DET:  CHI  in 7. 
>WIN  vs CAL:  CAL  in 5. 

>3rd round: 
>----------

>PITT vs BOS:  PITT in 5. 
Pitt in 6. The Bruins arent a pushover.
>CHI  vs CAL:  CHI  in 5. 
The hawks havent had problems with them  all year. Yep, I agree.
>Finals:
>------

>PITT vs CHI: PITT in 5. 
Unless the Hawks can somehow change fate, you're right.  

Who knows, though.  Maybe some intensive forechecking aka normal Hawks
style will nullify a seemingly unbeatable team.  Maybe the Pens are due
for a let-down.  Hell, how could they _possibly_ extend their record
making play all the way through the playoffs.? 

>=============================================
>Walter

-- 
//Damien Endemyr the Unpure Knight of Doom                          //
//"So I've acquired a taste for blood and have adopted a nocturnal  //
//lifestyle.  That Doesnt mean I'm a vampire....."                  //

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53708
From: fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu (FRANK MICHAE SALVATORE)
Subject: Re: Get Real.  Caps have no chance


In article <1993Apr15.162719@staff.dccs.upenn.edu>, filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu (Geoff Filinuk) writes:
] 	Anyone who really believes that the Caps can beat
> the Pens are kidding themselves.  The Pens may not loose
> one game in the playoffs.


Let's be honest.  The Pens may not 'loose' one game as you
put it, but they will definitely lose one game.  Remember,
the regular season doesn't mean much when it comes to 
playoff time.  The Caps have a shot at least - the Flyers
sure don't

Frank Salvatore
fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53709
From:  (Proust)
Subject: Re: Individual Winners (WAS: Re: WHERE ARE THE DOUBTERS NOW? HMM?)

In article <1993Apr15.170226.11074@cci632.cci.com>, dwk@cci632.cci.com
(Dave Kehrer) wrote:
> 
> Well, since you mentioned it...
> 
> In article <1993Apr12.142028.6300@jarvis.csri.toronto.edu>, migod@turing.toronto.edu (Mike Godfrey) writes:
>   
> > Lemieux is clearly the MVP
> 
> No question here.  Chip in the Masterson as well...


Lemieux for the Masterson? No doubt he had an awe inspiring season,
but what personal records did he set this year? Lemieux should have
Hart locked up...but how about Mike Gartner for the Masterson?

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53710
From: jwodzia@fadel.uucp (john wodziak)
Subject: Re: Goalie masks

In article <120666@netnews.upenn.edu> kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller) writes:
>My vote goes to John Vanbiesbrouck.  His mask has a skyline of New York
>City, and on the sides there are a bunch of bees (Beezer).  It looks
>really sharp.

Doesn't it also have the Statue of Liberty on it or is that Richter's Mask?

The back actually has a Bee followed by a Z to represent the Beezer. It 
also has something that looks like the three interconnecting circles from
the Led Zepplin 4 album cover. Is that what it is supposed to be? and if
it is does anybody know why he would put it there? Ali?

>    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
>            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

John
"The official Language of Golf is Profanity"




In Hockey Hell...............jwodzia@eng.clemson.edu............John R. Wodziak
The REAL Black and Gold     |In Memorium: #7 Alan Kulwicki 1954-1993   | Bean
Will Triumph over those who |A Polish Yankee Mechanical Engineer,      | Town
are Pretenders to the Crown.|1992 Winston Cup Champion & a great Person| ROCKS!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53711
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: Re: Pens Info needed

In article <1993Apr15.140541.28465@ericsson.se> etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson) writes:
>
> Actually, Swedish coach Curt Lundmark is thinking about leaving two
> spots open for additions from eliminated NHLers. It is Mats Sundin and
> Calle Johansson that Curt hopes can join the team, although in a late
> stage of the tournament. Technically, I seem to recall that you can leave
> spots open until 24 hrs before the WC final.
>
Hmmm...I also heard through the grapevine that Team Finland might try and
leave a spot open for at least one NHLer. (Some guy named Sel{nne, ever
hear of him? :)  They might have to be content with Kurri, though, I hope. :)


Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53712
From: DMJEWLAL@CHEMICAL.watstar.uwaterloo.ca (Derrick M. Jewlal)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

In article <1993Apr14.174828.13445@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
>Subject: Re: plus minus stat
>Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1993 17:48:28 GMT
>In <DREIER.93Apr14092901@jacobi.berkeley.edu> dreier@jacobi.berkeley.edu (Roland Dreier) writes:
>
>>Selanne's +7 leads the Jets; Teppo Numminen is +4.  Who do you think
>>is better defensively?  Ron Francis of the Penguins is +5, although he
>>has 97 points, while Jaromir Jagr has only 87 points but is +30.  Is
>>Jagr really better on defense than Francis?  And how exactly should we
>>interpret the fact that Mario Lemieux has by far the highest +/- in
>>the league?  Does he get the Selke as well as the Ross?
>
>The plus/minus does not measure defense alone.  It attempts to measure
>a  player's  total contribution to the team effort.  And certainly, it
>is far from perfect and my posting never implied otherwise.  All  that
>my  posting  suggested  was  that  the +/- was a better indicator of a
>player's effectiveness, when examined in the context of that  player's
>team's  performance, than mere scoring totals alone.  And as for Mario
>getting the Selke - why not?  After Doug Gilmour, I would rather  have
>Lemieux  on the ice in any situation (other than as an enforcer, obvi-
>ously) than any player in the game.  I used to call the Selke the "Bob
>Gainey  Award".   It  came  about as a result of the statement made by
>Anatoli Tarasov: "Bob Gainey is the best hockey player in the  world."
>I am sure that Tarasov was either misquoted, originally, or had a tiny
>bit too much Vodka and was toying with a reporter.  In any event,  the
>NHL  decided  to honour one dimensional checkers along with one dimen-
>sional scorers.  Maybe the league should start awarding the "Doug Gil-
>mour Award" anually  to the league's most effective, all-round player.
>
>cordially, as always,
>
>rm
>
>-- 
>Roger Maynard 
>maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

	Hey, what about the "Roger Maynard Award" for the most
	annoying fan....?
======================================================== 
Derrick M. Jewlal 
34 Laurel St. , Apt. #1 
Waterloo 
747 4804 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53713
From: nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: SHARKS REVIEW Part 1: Goaltenders

As the Sharks' season came to a close tonight, I will start a series of posts,
trying to revisit the players, the trades, the moves, etc., that went through
for the Sharks for the past season.  If you are uninterested, since I will
have the words SHARKS REVIEW in the subject heading in these postings, you can
kill them.

I will first try to evaluate how the players did.  These ratings, of course,
are subject to my own biases, but I hope that I can try to be as objective as
possible.  I will evalute players who finished the season with the Sharks
and/or did not play for another NHL team this season.

Thus, then, let's go to the goaltenders...

#1	BRIAN HAYWARD		Season:	11th
Acquired:	'91-92 from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		P (D)

It is sad that his career has to come to this dim an end, a career that
featured sharing three Jennings Trophies (with Patrick Roy, in '87, '88, and
'89).  It would indeed be unfair for me to do anything but give him a passing
grade (and skip the letter grading), but he had simply been awful on ice this
year, save for a bright spot or two, and even if he had been healthy, he would
not be any more than the 3rd-string goalie.

But Hayward was a classy individual, who also figured in on the Sharks' first
ever victory, the 3rd game of the season last year against the Calgary Flames.
As he retires, the fans will remember what a good guy he was.

#30	JEFF HACKETT		Season: 3rd
Acquired:	'91-92, from N. Y. Islanders in expansion draft
Grade:		C

Hackett, after (deservedly) winning the team MVP honors last season, simply
wasted the year.  Other than a few good spots (57 saves against Los Angeles,
almost-shutout against Tampa Bay, etc.), Hackett, finishing with 85.6% save
percentage and a 5.28 GAA, watched his status go from the team's #1 goalie to
bench decoration at the end of the season.  He was expected, early, to carry
the team along; instead, he apparently became frustrated, but the an early
injury that forced him to miss 12 games may have been a contributing factor,
but upon return, he simply wasn't up to the task.  He may not return next
year.

#31	WADE FLAHERTY		Season: 1st (still eligible as rookie)
Acquired:	'91-92, signed as undrafted free agent
Grade:		I (A-)

It is pretty hard to evaluate a goaltender on just one game alone, thus the
incomplete grade, but yet in the one start that he did get (against the Calgary
Flames), Flaherty was nothing but sharp for at least two periods.  He started
the season poorly in Kansas City, but finished strong, prompting the Blades'
owner Ron Parker to comment that he should be a candidate for the IHL MVP
honors.  The upcoming IHL playoffs would be a major challenge for him as he
tries to make it into the NHL; last year, he was a capable backup for Arturs
Irbe in the throughout the season and in the Turner Cup playoffs, picking up
all-star honors along with Irbe; now it's time for him to show that he can
share the job with Irbe next year, because with prospects Dan Ryder, Trevor
Robins, and Scott Cashman coming along, if he doesn't make it next year, he
may not ever.

#32	ARTURS IRBE		Season:	1st
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		B+

I may yet be overly critical of Irbe in a year that he clearly established that
he's a bona fide NHL goaltender, perhaps a bona fide #1 goaltender.  He has
provided most of the little highlight footage that the Sharks team had, getting
the team's first ever shut-out against the Los Angeles Kings on December 26.
He has been fearless in and out of the net, aggressively playing the puck and
making passes, reminding people of a young Ron Hextall (except, of course, the
goonism).  Yet he still needs to develop more consistency, which is hard to do
with such a bad defense in front of him, but if the Sharks are to challenge for
a playoff spot next season, Irbe's the key, as he demonstrated in being named
as a star of the game 13 times in 32 starts.

===============================================================================
GO CALGARY FLAMES!  Al MacInnis for Norris!  Gary Roberts for Hart and Smythe!
GO EDMONTON OILERS!  Go for playoffs next year!  Stay in Edmonton!
===============================================================================
Nelson Lu (claudius@leland.stanford.edu)
rec.sport.hockey contact for the San Jose Sharks

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53714
From: nmcglynn@buffalo.axion.bt.co.uk (Neil A. McGlynn)
Subject: British Championship Playoffs (16 Apr 93)

Group A					Group B
~~~~~~~					~~~~~~~

Cardiff Devils  7-3  Bracknell Bees	Nottingham Panthers  8-3  Billingham
Humberside      7-7  Whitley Warriors	Murrayfield Racers  11-2  Fife Flyers
Whitley Bay     6-9  Cardiff Devils     Billingham Bombers   6-8  Murrayfield
Humberside      8-5  Bracknell Bees	Nottingham Panthers 11-5  Fife Flyers
Cardiff Devils 10-4  Humberside		Murrayfield Racers   6-4  Nottingham
Bracknell Bees  4-9  Whitley Bay	Fife Flyers          2-5  Billingham
Bracknell Bees  3-8  Cardiff Devils	Billingham Bombers   2-8  Nottingham
Whitley Bay     5-7  Humberside		Fife Flyers          3-12 Murrayfield

		P W D L  F  A  P			     P W D L  F  A  P
Cardiff Devils  4 4 0 0 34 16  8*	Murrayfield Racers   4 4 0 0 37 15  8*
Humberside      4 2 1 1 26 27  5	Nottingham Panthers  4 3 0 1 31 16  6*
Whitley Bay     4 1 1 2 27 27  3	Billingham Bombers   4 1 0 3 16 26  2
Bracknell Bees  4 0 0 4 15 32  0	Fife Flyers	     4 0 0 4 12 39  0

* indicates qualified for Championship Finals

Relegation/Promotion A			Relegation/Promotion B
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~			~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Basingstoke    10-4  Swindon Wildcats   Sheffield Steelers  12-8  Peterborough
Durham Wasps   13-5  Romford Raiders	Slough Jets          1-9  MK Kings
Basingstoke     6-0  Durham Wasps	Sheffield Steelers   9-4  Milton Keynes
Swindon         8-5  Romford Raiders    Milton Keynes Kings  4-6  Peterborough
Durham Wasps   17-2  Swindon Wildcats	Slough Jets          2-12 Sheffield
Romford         4-10 Basingstoke 	Peterborough        10-2  Slough Jets
Romford        *8-3* Durham Wasps	Peterborough	     8-5  Sheffield
Swindon         7-11 Basingstoke        Milton Keynes Kings 10-4  Slough Jets

		P W D L  F  A  P			     P W D L  F  A  P
Basingstoke     4 4 0 0 37 15  8	Sheffield Steelers   4 3 0 0 38 22  6
Durham Wasps    4 2 0 2 33 21  4	Peterborough         4 3 0 1 32 23  6
Swindon         4 1 0 3 21 43  2	Milton Keynes Kings  4 2 0 2 27 20  4
Romford Raiders 4 1 0 3 22 34  2	Slough Jets	     4 0 0 4  9 41  0


  /-- / /-- /--   /-- / \ / /-- /-/ --- o Neil A. McGlynn   +44 473 645659
 /-- / /__ /--   /-- /   / /-- /_/ /__  o nmcglynn@axion.bt.co.uk
/   / /   /--   /   /__ / /-- /\  ___/  o British Telecom Laboratories, 
---------------------------------------	  Martlesham Heath, Ipswich, UK



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53715
From: cdkaupan@eos.ncsu.edu (CARL DAVID KAUPANG)
Subject: Stop predicting


It is really annoying to see all of these
predictions on the Net.  Who really cares
who you think will win?  Please stop with
the predictions, we all know the Caps are
going to win the Cup, so let it go at that.


David Kaupang
cdkaupan@eos.ncsu.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53716
From: mikkot@romulus.math.jyu.fi (Mikko Tarkiainen)
Subject: Re: Pens Info needed

In article <C5K9E8.M3@ccu.umanitoba.ca> umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner) writes:

>Hmmm...I also heard through the grapevine that Team Finland might try and
>leave a spot open for at least one NHLer. (Some guy named Sel{nne, ever
>hear of him? :)  They might have to be content with Kurri, though, I hope. :)

True, coach Matikainen is ready to keep a spot for Teemu all the way
until the medal games. He wants Teppo Numminen, too. And Kurri, but for
them the spots cannot be left open for too long. Esa Tikkanen we have
already. 

Even without these players I think we have pretty good team. Young,
hungry, talented guys, no old players that have got everything (except
the gold). Yesterday's practise game, SWE-FIN 6-6, shows that the two
world's best hockey teams ;) are in prime shape.  The Finn line
Riihijarvi(slightly injured)-Saarikoski-Viitakoski shined. I bet these
two teams are the best in the NHL, too. Roger, Roger?

What do you people think about Team Canada with Lindros, Brind'Amour,
Burke, Ranford, Recchi, Dineen...? Can they beat the Finns:?

Coaching news: 

	       Alpo Suhonen (ex-Jets) to Jokerit (now verified), 
               Boris Majorov (ex-Jokerit) to Tappara,
	       Vasili Tichonov (ex-Assat) to San Jose Sharks 
                                             (assistant coach),
	       Sakari Pietila to Lulea (silver team in Elite-serien)

FW Mikko Makela (ex-TPS) to Malmo IF.
G Markus Ketterer (Jokerit) still has no contract.
FW Timo Saarikoski to Jokerit, watch out for him in next week.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53717
From: voecking@Informatik.TU-Muenchen.DE (Volker Voecking)
Subject: Re: expanding to Europe:Dusseldorf


In article <1993Apr15.192231.27574@abo.fi>, MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF) writes:
|> In <PKORTELA.93Apr15164732@lk-hp-17.hut.fi> pkortela@snakemail.hut.fi writes:
|> 
|> > 
|> > DEG has many german-born forwards in the team. In fact the majority of players
|> > are german-born. 1992-93 DEG had 11150 average in 11800 spectator arena.
|> 
|> Interesting! One of our German friends here (Robert?) told me their forwards
|> were all Canadian-Germans. Perhaps somebody can sort this out for us?

As far as I know Dusseldorf has only one Canadian-German forward (i.e. a  player
who was born in Canada but now has a German passport). 
Benoit Doucet became german by marriing a german and he is going to play 
for Germany in the WC.

The other Canada-born forwards are:
	Peter-John Lee (has British passport)
	Chris Valentine
	Dale Dercatch
	Steve Gootas
 	Earl Spry (?)

At the moment there are only three German-born forwards coming into my mind:
	Bernd Trunschka, Andreas Brockmann, Ernst Koepf


Volker


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53718
From: sforsblo@vipunen.hut.fi (Svante Forsblom)
Subject: Re: Suhonen will NOT go to Jokerit


>In <tvartiai.734823058@vipunen.hut.fi> tvartiai@vipunen.hut.fi (Tommi Vartiainen) writes:

>>According to the inside information, Alpo Suhonen won't be the next headcoach
>>of Jokerit. It's pretty sure that Boris Majorov will continue, although owner
>>of the team previously said that he will chance the coach.

>>Tommi
>Wrong information. They just announced that Suhonen has made a deal with 
>Jokerit.
> 

>Tommi

And Boris Majorov has made a 1+1 year deal with Tappara.

Svante

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53719
From: montana@pinetree.org (David Wong)
Subject: hockey playoff pool: LAST CHANCE!

This will be my last post ( promotion ) of the hockey pool.. I will 
update the pool ( or try to ) every wednesday
 
Subject: Please join my hockey playoff pool. 
Deadline for pool: Midnight Saturday
Rules: Read on
Cost: NONE
PRIZES: NONE
Send replies to : Montana@pinetree.org
 
Note: if your entries is send by midnight saturday it will be accepted
      please include your name
 
               Rules to the ACME hockey playoff pool 
 
Critierias
 Pick 9 forwards  ( as long as they are forwards LW=RW=C is okay)
 Pick 6 defensemen
 ( arrange them in a lines, 3 forwards and two defense = 1 line 
 ( and arranged them in line order , which of your players would       
 ( play in the first line and which plays in the second line 
 Pick 1 designated playmaker   
      ( can be any positions...try a defensemen )
 Pick 1 designated scorer ( can be any positions )
 Pick 1 goal-tender
 Pick a team   ( the one you think may win the cup )           
                 
 *note: players can only be chosen once !
 ie Cannot have Sakic as forward and again as designated passer
 -----------------------------------------------------------------        
                 
 Calculation of points: 
  ( except for designated scorer and playmaker)
   1 assist  = 1 pt   IXI  1 goal = 1 pt  II 
   ( for players in line 1, their pt totals will be *2 )
          line 1 = pts * 2
          line 2 = pts * 1.5
          line 3 = pts * 1
   1 win     = 2 pt  ( for goalies)
   
   The team that wins the Cup = 10 pts
   
For the designated playmaker         Designated
Calculation will be as follows       Scorer:Goal    = 3 pts
Every goal scored = 0.5 points             Assists = 0.5 pts
Every assists     = 2 points
   
  In the event of a tie, the tie will be broken by unmodified 
  Goal totals and then by game winning goals
  ----SAMPLE-------------------------------------
   eg designated scorer = Jeremy Roenick
      Actual: G=12, A=10, Pts=22  Modified G=(12*3) + A=(10*0.5) = 41
   .    
       designated playmaker = Steve Smith
      Actual: G=1,  A=11, Pts=12  Modified G=(1*0.5)  + A=(11*2) = 22.5
   .
   line 1 = J Murphy(24)- G Courtnall(14)- M Messier(14)
                   Dave Manson(12)-  Iafrate(7)
       Total points = 142 points for that line!


--
  Internet: montana@pinetree.org (David Wong)
  UUCP: pinetree!montana
  Gordon's Pinetree -- Ottawa, ON, Canada -- +1 613 526 0702 -- v.32bis/v.42bis


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53720
From: juvirtan@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Jukka A Virtanen)
Subject: Re: Plus minus stat

In <1993Apr16.015936.11303@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:

>>>Good for you.  You'd only be displaying your ignorance of
>>>course, but to each his own...
>> 
>>Roger, I'm not sure here, but I think "ignorance" is really a
>>function of "a lack of knowledge" and not "formulating an
>>opinion"...but hey, if you need to take a cheap shot, then by all
>>means go ahead...that's if it makes you feel better.

>To knowledgeable observers of the game my meaning is obvious.  Your
>hockey education is not my responsibility.
 
Just curious, Roger, but since you have such a vast knowledge of the
game and the league, how come you haven't made a living out of it?
There must be a lot of demand for expertise in the field. I'm sure
you'd be of great help to, say, the Leafs as an assistant coach or
a scout. Or maybe try a career as a reporter or tv commentator...
 
I might be wrong, of course, and you already have.
-- 
Jukka A Virtanen
                                                    juvirtan@cc.helsinki.fi
                       University of Helsinki

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53721
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: Sweden-Finland, April 15


 Played in Scandinavium, Gothenburg, April 15 1993:
 ==================================================

 SWEDEN - FINLAND  6-6 (1-2,3-1,2-3)

 1st: SWE 1-0 Peter Popovic      (Markus Naslund)                     6:10
      FIN 1-1 Ville Siren        (Keijo Sailynoja)                    8:44 (pp)
      FIN 1-2 Juha Riihijarvi    (Timo Saarikoski,Vesa Viitakoski)   13:12 (pp)
 2nd: FIN 1-3 Jari Korpisalo     (Kari Harila,Rauli Raitanen)         6:48
      SWE 2-3 Jan Larsson        (Mikael Renberg,Stefan Nilsson)      7:25
      SWE 3-3 Hakan Ahlund       (Thomas Rundqvist)                   8:56
      SWE 4-3 Roger Akerstrom    (Roger Hansson)                      9:13
 3rd: SWE 5-3 Stefan Nilsson     (Patrik Juhlin,Charles Berglund)     2:20
      FIN 5-4 Keijo Sailynoja                                         9:23
      FIN 5-5 Keijo Sailynoja                                         9:44 (ps)
      SWE 6-5 Mikael Renberg     (Hakan Ahlund,Thomas Rundqvist)     17:16
      FIN 6-6 Jari Korpisalo                                         17:44

             Shots on goal:      Penalties:     Attendance:    Referee:
 Sweden       8 10 10 - 28       5*2min         6,799          Peter Andersson
 Finland     12 10 11 - 33       6*2min,1*10min                (Sweden)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Sweden opened the scoring as Markus Naslund made a drop pass at the Finnish
 blue line, Popovic picked it up and advanced towards the Finnish goal and
 shot a nice hard wrist shot in Ketterer's top corner. Ville Siren's slap
 shot from the blue line on power play made it 1-1, and Juha Riihijarvi
 scored a nice goal in another power play when he close in front of goal
 put the puck high over Aslin, 1-2 after the first period.
 The Finns started the second period with really good pressure. Korpisalo
 made it 1-3 with another goal from close range high over Aslin. Then,
 during the Finnish pressure, Sweden turned the game around in 1:47.
 Mikael Renberg worked hard behind the Finnish goal, and passed the puck to
 Jan Larsson in front, who backhanded the puck low, 2-3. Rundqvist entered
 the Finnish zone and passed to Ahlund, and the Finnish defense let Ahlund 
 skate in and take a shot that Ketterer dropped into the goal, 3-3.
 Next, Roger Hansson -behind the goal- sent the puck back to the blue line
 where Roger Akerstrom took a slap shot and Ketterer didn't see the puck since
 there was traffic in front, 4-3.
 Third period started with a nice goal by Stefan "the Shadow" Nilsson. Stefan
 and Patrik Juhlin entered the Finnish zone, Patrik passed the puck back to
 Stefan who alone with Ketterer made no mistake, 5-3.
 Then, Keijo Sailynoja show started. He reduce and equalized the lead in only
 21 seconds! First he scored the 5-4 goal, and after that he came in alone 
 with Aslin but was tripped by Aslin to get a penalty shot. Sailynoja
 made a nice penalty shot, showed forehand and put in with a low backhand shot.
 The Swedes seemed to head for a win when Mikael Renberg scored the 6-5 goal
 late in the game on a nice power play combination. Renberg waited in the slot,
 showed that he wanted the puck on the backhand side, Ahlund passed the puck
 and Renberg took a turnaround shot low in Ketterer's goal's far side.
 But Jari Korpisalo had other plans as he only 28 seconds later scored the
 game's final goal to make it 6-6. Korpisalo took a slap shot from a narrow
 angle that -maybe- Aslin should have saved.

 All in all, a decent game where the defense wasn't the best.
 Both teams juggled around the lines a bit in the second and third period
 to try no combinations.

 Renberg and Rundqvist plays well together in the Swedish team. Larsson-
 Nilsson-Juhlin best line overall again, it seems to be a working WC line.
 Stillman good on defense.
 Some players aren't good enough for the WC though. Hakan Ahlund (faell ner
 hjaelmen och jobba!), Roger Hansson, Challe Berglund, Kenny Jonsson
 will likely have to leave for NHL pros.

 Two-goal scorers Jari Korpisalo and Keijo Sailynoja played well in the
 Finnish team. Markus Ketterer didn't have a very good game, we've seen him
 a lot better, so Lindfors is probably Finland's starting goalie in the WC.
 I heard that Esa Tikkanen will join the Finnish team. It would be inter-
 resting to know which other pros coach Matikainen counts on for the WC.
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Starting lines:

 	SWEDEN					FINLAND

  35. Peter Aslin			30. Markus Ketterer

   8. Kenneth Kennholt			 2. Mikko Haapakoski
  14. Fredrik Stillman			 3. Ville Siren

  10. Hakan Ahlund			28. Jarkko Varvio
   9. Thomas Rundqvist			40. Mika Nieminen
  29. Mikael Renberg  			18. Keijo Sailynoja

  27. Roger Akerstrom			 4. Erik Hamalainen
   7. Arto Blomsten			 8. Kari Harila

  20. Jan Larsson 	 		25. Rauli Raitanen
   4. Stefan Nilsson 			26. Petri Varis
   5. Patrik Juhlin			14. Jari Korpisalo

   3. Peter Popovic			 5. Timo Jutila
  32. Stefan Larsson			44. Harri Laurila

  11. Roger Hansson			24. Juha Riihijarvi
  33. Fredrik Nilsson			22. Timo Saarikoski
  24. Peter Ottosson			11. Vesa Viitakoski

					 6. Pasi Sormunen
					12. Janne Laukkanen

  19. Markus Naslund			29. Juha Ylonen
  21. Peter Forsberg			27. Timo Peltomaa
  18. Jonas Bergqvist			17. Marko Palo

 Played parts of the game:
  22. Charles Berglund			15. Mika Alatalo
   6. Kenny Jonsson			16. Saku Koivu
					20. Marko Palo

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53722
From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
Subject: Finland/Sweden vs.NHL teams (WAS:Helsinki/Stockholm & NHL expansion)

In <tervio.40@katk.Helsinki.FI> tervio@katk.Helsinki.FI writes:

>    Now what if the two teams were merged (this has been proposed in Tampere 
> with Ilves ( =Lynx) and Tappara ( =Axe).  The fans wouldn't take it !
> They rather see their teams out of the playoffs most of the time or even 
> relegated than merged.  It's not that difficult to understand, it's just 
> like here in Helsinki.  You *grow up* being either a Jokerit- or HIFK -fan.
> The other team is the last team in the world you would support.  I'm not 
> talking about 'hate' but about extremely deeply rooted rivalry.

"Deeply rooted rivalry?" Ahem, Jokerit have been around since 1967 and joined
the top flight only in the early '70s. Helsingfors IFK have been around since
1897 but fans only started taking hockey seriously in the 1960s so I think
you're exagerating here.

>    However, it's been proved that both fan groups can cheer the same team
> - that's "the Finnish national team".  Maybe that's how you could set up a 
> huge franchise in Finland.  No one has ever said that the team must be 
> called after one city or play all its games on one arena.  Just one Team 
> Finland and Team Sweden in the NHL just wouldn't make any sense - we have 
> way more talent than 1/24th of the total of North American talent.  After a 
> couple of seasons you would never see the cup going anywhere outside the 
> Nordic  (presuming that our teams would have the advantage in  drafting 
> local talent, as prooposed).

That's a rather bold claim, in the light of how successful the Canadian &
American Olympic teams have been . . . and they've had to play according to our
set of rules and on international ice. The 1992 Olympic teams contained about
as much talent as your average expansion team. Canada had Eric Lindros, Sean
Burke, Joe Juneau and Chris Kontos. Another four or five have been deep subs in
the NHL. As for the Yanks, Keith Tkachuk, Scott Lachance, Bret Hedican, Shawn 
McEachern, Steve Heintze, Ted Donato, Joe Sacco and Bill Guerin have been 
3rd/4th line players in the NHL, while Robb Stauber has done well for the 
Kings in goal. Nothing more. In fact, I'm sure that an All-Star team assembled
from the best Finnish League teams would do no better in the NHL than Hartford 
or Tampa Bay currently are doing.
---
But what happens if _all_ top-class Finnish & Swedish players gradually end up
with Helsinki & Stockholm as the North American-based ones gradually retire and
no Canadian/American team is allowed to draft new players from Scandinavia? 
Here is what THE HOCKEY NEWS scouts think of our NHL-based players:

(28-30=superstar)
(23-27=star)
(18-22=NHL regular+)
(13-17=NHL regular)
( 8-12=role player)

FINLAND:  

D-Jyrki Lumme.......20
D-Teppo Numminen....20
D-Peter Ahola.......13

C-Jari Kurri........25
C-Christian Ruuttu..16

R-Teemu Selanne.....27

L-Esa Tikkanen......20
(Obviously, Selanne's ratings would be higher today than they were in January)

SWEDEN:
D-Ulf Samuelsson....21
D-Fredrik Olausson..20
D-Niklas Lidstrom...18
D-Calle Johansson...18
D-Kjell Samuelsson..17
D-Tommy Sjodin......13
D-Tommy Albelin......7

C-Mats Sundin.......26
C-Thomas Steen......18

R-Thomas Sandstrom..22
R-Ulf Dahlen........18
R-Michael Nylander..13

L-Per-Erik Eklund...18
L-Johan Garpenlov...16
L-Mikael Andersson..15
L-Jan Erixon........14

This would be interesting. Clearly, Finland's top five players (Winnipeg's
Selanne & Numminen, Vancouver's Lumme, Los Angeles' Jari Kurri and New York's
Tikkanen) are right up there with any five-man unit Pittsburgh & co. have. But
I have my doubts about the home-based Finnish players - the national team did
well in the Canada Cup and World Championships largely due to the efforts of
Markus Ketterer (the goalie), 3-4 or the players listed above and luck. There's
presumably a lot of decent players in Finland that wouldn't be superstars at
the highest level but still valuable role players, however. My guess would be
that the Finnish Canada Cup team would be a .500 team in the NHL.
---
Sweden is easier to judge because they have more players in North America.
Their points total (16 players) is 274 - seven more than Ottawa's 22 top
players combined! If we estimate there are six more NHL regulars back home in 
Sweden, an all-Swedish team would assemble about 350-360 skill points.
Deducting some points from Pittsburgh, NY Rangers and other teams that rely on
Swedish players, the Swedish team would finish in sixth place - about as high
as Boston, Vancouver, Calgary and Montreal on paper! So, the "dynasty" talk
isn't completely unfounded here. An all-Finnish/all-Swedish team might have an
advantage because the players would be playing at home half of the time,
won't have to adapt to a foreign country and a foreign language, and presumably
play the wide-open European variant of hockey rather than have to learn the
North American checking game. However, if free agency becomes a factor the top 
Scandinavian players still might end up playing for large-market teams after a 
couple of years the same way Edmonton's "dynasty" crumbled in the late '80s. 
Some fringe players likely will be drafted by other NHL teams as having an 
exclusive talent pool might be a bit unfair after all. I'd settle for a 
compromise, prohibit all European teams from signing a North American during 
the first two rounds but allow them to keep their top two players. After this, 
the amateur draft should be open to anyone. 

> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>  J O O   J O O   J O K E R I T  !  !  !    Finland over Czech in the Final
>    B R U I N P O W E R ! ! !               Bruins over Blackhawks in 6 
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

MARCU$
     

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53724
From: ayari@judikael.loria.fr (Ayari Iskander)
Subject: NHLPA poll (Stats/3rd uptade)

3rd uptade:

Here are the standings for the poll after 39 votes: 5 points for 1st, 4 for 2nd,... 1 point for 5th: 

EA/ NHLPA game

1. DET 102
2. CHI  97 
3. NY   74
4. VAN  73
5. MTL  69
6. PIT  33
7. WSH  29
8. BOS  21
9..ASW  16 
10.CGY  10
11.QUE   9
12.ASE   8
13.WPG   7
14.LA    5
   OTW   5
   STL   5
   TOR   5
18.BUF   3
   PHI   3
   TBY   3
21.SJ    2
22.MIN   1
   Atlanta to win Turner Cup 1 (not in the game, but 1 person vote)
24.EDM   0
   HTF   0
   LI    0
   NJ    0

4 teams have no point
Continue to send your votes in this format (until April 20th, approximately)
------------------------------------------------
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
------------------------------------------------


Keywords: 


-- 
_____________________________________________________

  Email : Iskander.Ayari@loria.fr ou ayari@loria.fr
_____________________________________________________


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53725
From: alvstad@mari.acc-admin.stolaf.edu (Mad Dog)
Subject: Truly a sad day for hockey


A fine 26 year history came to a close tonight, as the Minnesota North Stars, 
or Norm's Stars (whichever you prefer) lost to the Red Wings by a score of
5-3.  The Stars goals were scored by Mike McPhee and Ulf Dahlen, who netted
two including the final one in franchise history, with less than a minute to
play.

Tonight, on the air on the Stars TV telecast, announcer Al Shaver, the voice
of the North Stars, stated basically that he will not follow the team to 
Dallas.  Shaver, when asked by his son (who was doing the broadcast with him),
"What will you do now?" responded, "First I'm going to get me a new pair of
slippers.  Then I'm going to sit in my easy chair and watch the world go by."

Thank you North Stars, and thank you Al Shaver, for 26 years of Minnesota
memories.

Joel Alvstad



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53726
From: pkortela@snakemail.hut.fi (Petteri Kortelainen)
Subject: Re: New Finnish Star is born?

In article <1993Apr15.114041.1@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi> hahietanen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi writes:

>I saw yesterday on TV a game between Team Sweden and Team Finland.
>Most of us might know that it was played in Stockholm and the result
>was 4:3 for the home team. That's nothing very special... But I was
>very surprised of Saku Koivu. I must admit that he surprised me 
>already in the Finnish playoffs. And now on team Finland!

>Saku Koivu is a light weight player, if we consider his size: According
>to my stats he is only 172cm and 68kgs! And he is only 18! (23.11.74).
>But he is a real two-way player! Skates well, can score, gives nice
>passes, does even bodycheckings!!? He is really something to watch
>in the WC. 

>The size isn't always everything. Maybe we remember Harlamov...
>And they say that Saku is still growing up (3cm during last year)...

Saku isn't that small any longer I guess I heard he is 177cm tall at the
moment and will still grow 6-8cm.

Petteri Kortelainen


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53727
From: pkortela@snakemail.hut.fi (Petteri Kortelainen)
Subject: Re: Helsinki/Stockholm & NHL expansion?

In article <1993Apr15.095653.17514@abo.fi> MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF) writes:

>In <C5H9wr.6J3@polaris.utu.fi> franti@polaris.utu.fi writes:


>Not too low perhaps, but surely not as high as that of an European NHL
>division. The Finnish team, for example, would contain all players currently 
 on
>the national team plus a top-class foreigner or two. They would be in an
>entirely different league than TPS or Jokerit, both of whom have perhaps a
>dozen players of international class - if even that. Why settle for a minor
>league when you could have the best?

How many players of international class an average NHL team has. 6-10?
Top players just play more in smaller rinks. Is the quality of European hockey
really poor, then recent years only few north-american (usually good farm 
players) players have got place in Finnish league or Elitserien, while most 
have been shipped back. 

Petteri Kortelainen

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53728
From: stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber)
Subject: Re: Radio stations

In article <ragraca.735252641@vela.acs.oakland.edu>, ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:
> greanias@texas.mitre.org (Steve Greanias) writes:
> 
> 
> 
> >	I do not have cable and on the nights the Caps don't play, I
> >would like to tune in other games.  Does anyone have a list of
> >the radio stations which broadcast the games for the NHL teams?
> 
> 
> >			Thanks in advance
> 
> I can give you a couple.  In Detroit, WJR (760) will be broadcasting
> at least the first couple of games of the Wings-Toronto series, and 
> since they broadcast at 50000 Watts, you may be able to pick it up
> after dark where you are at.  The Pittsburgh Penguins games used to be
> broadcast on KDKA 1020, but I don't know whether they will be pre-empted
> by baseball (and moved to another station) or not.  You can try those
> if the local baseball teams aren't playing at the same time, anyway.
> 
> --Randy
> 

KDKA has first rights to Pirates games, and will split probably 50-50
in conflicts; for Penguins games which are preempted, check out 
102.5 WDVE FM (that's right, DVE).  It is also 50,000 watts.

Kevin L. Stamber
Purdue University
no funny .sig today


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53729
From: jimg@cybernet.cse.fau.edu (Jim Gorycki)
Subject: New Franchise name

The new name is Florida Panthers.  
The panther is an endangered species, mostly located in the Everglades.
A couple of years ago, there were license plates made with Panthers on
them (part of the revenue were to go to some protection fund).

The name of the new President of the Panthers should be announced today.

As of yesterday's paper, Huizenga's new hockey team will take the ice at
the Miami Arena this fall.  The team has a guaranteed two-year lease with
the arena, with four one-year options that could run through 1999.

"It's not our choice", James Blosser, a lawyer and Huizenga Aid said
about ruling out the arena as a long term option.  "The NHL told us we 
can't stay there.  It's not economically feasible."

One reason is because the Miami Heat basketball team controls skybox
and advertising revenue at the arena, reducing the hockey team's profit
potential.

The hockey team is attracting arena site proposals from Broward, Dade, 
and Palm Beach counties.

A leading site is vacant land near Joe Robbie Stadium, where residents
10 days ago agreed to drop their opposition to a hockey arena, ending
an eight-year battle of wills.

Compliments of the News/Sun-Sentinel.

Jim G.

"Fitz...Sanchez...Castranova..."

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53730
From: jimg@cybernet.cse.fau.edu (Jim Gorycki)
Subject: Panther's President

As I promised, I would give you the name of the Panther's president.
After Huizenga announced the team name, he announced that Bill
Torrey is named the first president of the Panthers.

A little Bio from _Sun-Sentinel_
Torrey, the architect of four consecutive Stanley Cup champions as 
persident and general manager of the New York Islanders.
Throughout his 27 years in the NHL, Bill Torrey's bow ties have become
as much of a signature as Andre Agassi's hair.

The Panthers will introduce a uniform, insignia, and ticket-price 
information in early next month.  In the meantime, Huizenga leaves the
day-to-day operation in the hands of Torrey and Bob Clarke, the VP and
GM.

The Florida Panthers was chosen as the name of South Florida's NHL team
to focus attention on an endangered species.  There are 30 to 50 Florida
Panthers in the Everglades National Park, the Big Cypress National 
Preserve and other parts of southwestern Florida.

"The Panther is the quickest-striking of all cats," Torrey said.  
"Hopefully that's the way we'll play on ice."

More BIO:
In Torrey, Huizenga has the first man hired by the expansion Islanders
in 1972 and the one most responsible for guiding the Islanders to four
consecutive Stanley Cup championships (their first after only eight
seasons) and 14 consecutive winning seasons.  As executive vice president
of the California Golden Seals, Torrey watched the Seals go to the play-
offs in 1968, only their second NHL season.

"I guess this completes my own personal hat trick", said Torrey, 58, a
native of Montreal but a resident of Bear Lakes Country Club in Palm
Beach.

Jim G.
other accounts:
gorycki@sol.cse.fau.edu
jimg@cybernet.cse.fau.edu

--------------------------------------------------------------------
"I repeat myself when under stress. I repeat myself when under stress.
I repeat myself when under stress. I repeat myself when under stress.
I repeat..."  Adrian Belew, "Indicipline"
---------------------------------------------------------------------


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53731
From: lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico)
Subject: Pens playoff radio coverage (was:Re: Radio stations)

In article <ragraca.735252641@vela.acs.oakland.edu> ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:
>greanias@texas.mitre.org (Steve Greanias) writes:
>
>I can give you a couple.  In Detroit, WJR (760) will be broadcasting
>at least the first couple of games of the Wings-Toronto series, and 
>since they broadcast at 50000 Watts, you may be able to pick it up
>after dark where you are at.  The Pittsburgh Penguins games used to be
>broadcast on KDKA 1020, but I don't know whether they will be pre-empted
>by baseball (and moved to another station) or not.  You can try those
>if the local baseball teams aren't playing at the same time, anyway.

According to this morning's Post-Gazette:

The Pens will be carried by KDKA-Radio(1020 am), unless the Pirates
are playing.  When the Pirates play, the games will be carried by 
WDVE(102.5 fm).  WDVE will carry 12 games, starting with tonight's
game.

In fact, after this season, KDKA will no longer be the flagship
station for the Pens.  The Penguins and KBL have struck a new 
deal regarding the TV and radio rights to the games.  It seems
more than likely that WDVE will be the flagship radio station next 
season.  KBL will carry 62 games on tv,  with 17 of the games to be 
simulcast on KDKA-TV.  The remaining 22 games, as well as some of the 
early round playoff games, will be available by "subscription tv" only.
To receive the games, you'll have to pay a one time hook up fee, and
then a monthly fee of $11-12 dollars.

Also, under the new deal, there will no longer be radio/tv 
simulcasts.  There will be a TV broadcast team, and a radio
broadcast team.  

No word on who the announcers will be.  Mike Lange and Paul Steigerwald
are both under contract with KDKA, but their contracts expire at the
end of this season.  KBL President Bill Craig said he'd like to hire
Lange and Steigerwald.

Lori
Contact for the Penguins
lli+@cs.cmu.edu



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53732
From: Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Wirtz is a weenie

So what's the deal with Bill Wirtz? Apparently, the Blackhawks - St.
Louis game was a standing room only sell out as usual, but the Hawks
reported the attendace as 16,199. Gee, I wonder if Wirtz is planning to
use this as justification for continuing to keep home games off of TV?
What a schmuck.

In other TV news, the Penguins announced yesterday that they will have 3
fewer broadcast TV games, and will have 22(!) games on some sort of
subscription / pay-per-view system. Yuck.

Ralph


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53733
From: jwh@sei.cmu.edu (John Huber)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains


In article <1993Apr19.213015@IASTATE.EDU>, njdevils@IASTATE.EDU (Cire Y. Trehguad) writes:
|> Anna Matyas (am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu) wrote:
|> : Michael Collingridge writes:
|> : >And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
|> : >resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
|> : >team captain trivia would be appreciated.
|> ;
|> : Wasn't Ron Francis captain of the Whalers when he was traded to
|> : Pittsburgh?
|> 
|>   And Rick Tochett was the captain of the Flyers when traded to the Pens
|> recently...
|> 

And of course, Mike Ramsey was (at one time) the captain in Buffalo prior to
being traded to Pittsburgh.  Currently, the Penguins have 3 former captains
and 1 real captain (Lemieux) playing for them.  They rotate the A's during the
season (and even the C while Mario was out).  Even Troy Loney has worn the C
for the Pens.

-Jay


John W. Huber, Jr. - aka Jay   | Penguins - 1991,1992 Stanley Cup Champions
Software Engineering Institute | Pirates - 1990,1991,1992 NL East Champions
SEI 3409        (412) 268-3550 | MasterCraft - The ONLY boat for skiing

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53734
From: seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr)
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN

In article <1993Apr20.032017.5783@wuecl.wustl.edu>, jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:
> 
>  It was nice to see ESPN show game 1 between the Wings and Leafs since
> the Cubs and Astros got rained out. Instead of showing another baseball
> game, they decided on the Stanley Cup Playoffs. A classy move by ESPN.

What, did you leave the room each of the 100 or so times they said that
there WERE NO OTHER NIGHT BASEBALL GAMES? Every break they took back at
the studio mentioned it, followed by 'so...we're gonna show you hockey
instead.' My wife and I are hoping for rain at every baseball game they
have a feed for tommorrow night...

Point is, be glad they showed hockey, but if baseball was available
anywhere else you can bet you would've watched baseball last night.

pete clark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53735
Subject: Travesty at the Joe Louis
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

(Detroit, April 19)

In a development that shocked most knowledgable observers, the Detroit Redwings
scored no less than six goals against the best goaltender in the world en
route to a 6-3 win over the best team in the NHL, the Toronto Maple Leafs. 

The Leafs could not be faulted, as they completely dominated the inferior
Detroit squad and clearly deserved to win. Only the biased officiating of
Andy Van Hellemond and the idiots that insisted upon throwing an octopus on
the ice at every stoppage in an obvious attempt to distract the superior 
visiting side prevented an all-out massacre of the Wings by the league's best 
team. 

       							    Alan

P.S. This is sweet, Roger. So sweet. I look forward to the next installment on
Wednesday night. I trust you do, too. 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53736
Subject: Re: Who picks first?
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <1993Apr17.181421.14349@epas.toronto.edu>, sclark@epas.utoronto.ca (Susan Clark) writes:
> 	According to THE FAN here in T.O., Ottawa has won the Daigle e
> sweepstakes.  They didn't mention why, but San Jose had more goals
> than the Sen-sens, so I have a hunch this is why Ottawa would pick
> first.....

If I'm not mistaken, San Jose had more wins than Ottawa. First tiebreaker in
the NHL is always most wins.

								Alan


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53737
From: ccohen@pitt.edu (Caleb N Cohen)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage

Anna Matyas (am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu) wrote:

: Antonio Pera writes:

: >	I loved the ABC coverage. The production was excellent. The appearance
: >was excellent. It had a sleek modern look. This was the first time I heard
: >Thorne & Clement & I thought they were great. My only request is to leave
: >Al Micheals out of this. He annoys me. 
:
: I was skeptical before the game but was pleasantly surprised at the
: coverage.  I was particularly impressed by the close range camera coverage
: of work in the corners and behind the play without losing a beat getting
: back to the puck.

   Boy - everyone has been ripping on ESPN's hockey coverage (or is it just
Pittsburgher's who are thrilled with Lange & Steigy?)  For all of you
who are unaware -> ESPN bought the air time from ABC and did all the 
production, advertising sales, commentating, etc -> and even 
reaped any $ made...

Enjoy,
Caleb

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53738
From: arsenaul@ERE.UMontreal.CA (Arsenault Michel)
Subject: Looking for boxscores


I am looking for all the 84 boxscores of any NHL team for 
some personal research.  Can someone help me ?

Michel Arsenault

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53739
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: div. and conf. names

In <1993Apr19.191126.27651@newshub.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:

>However, that aside, the real question is whether you like the idea of
>changing the names based on the reasons given for it (making it easier for
>the 'casual fan'), or whether you like the idea of unique divisional names
>based on individuals who do deserve the honour.  IMO, the latter is a nice
>and unique touch that differs from other sports.  In addition, I do not
>think that changing divisional names will have an effect on the number of
>people that are interested in hockey, so it's a pointless exercise anyway.

There are several problems with the way the game is being presented to the
fans.  I feel that geographical names would enhance regional loyalties
more than names honouring personages.  And of course, they would not appear
nearly as confusing to one approaching the sport for the first time.  
Another thing that bothers me is the points system.  Percentages, as used in
the other major sports are clearly more informative.  When I look at the
NHL standings the first thing I have to do is make a quick calculation to
account for games in hand (which is almost always the case).  Some will
object to percentages, claiming perhaps, that it is an "Americanization"
of the sport but I feel that using percentages is more informative and
whether it is "American" or not is irrelevant.
 
>If the current names are inappropriate, then that is a separate issue, not 
>central to the original article.  Something to consider additionally is
>whether or not players like Orr who 'contributed to the glory of the sport'
>would have been able to do so _without_ an organized professional league to
>play in.  In this case, honouring builders of the _league_ as opposed to
>builders of the _sport_ becomes a chicken-and-egg type question. (although
>it was the chicken.....)

Even if Orr couldn't have contributed without the likes of Norris, you would
have to agree that Norris couldn't have contributed without the likes of Orr.
And taking a poll of most fans would quickly tell you who the fans feel made
the more meaningful contribution.

>>Exactly true.  Naming divisions and trophies after Smythe and the bunch
>>is the same kind of nepotism that put Stein in the hall of fame.  I have
>>always thought that this was nonsense.

>Dunno if the Stein comparison is justifiable, since it doesn't look as though
>his 'unanimous acceptance' to the Hall will hold up.

It doesn't look as if the division names are going to hold up either does it?


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53740
From: Scott.Marks@launchpad.unc.edu (Scott Marks)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

>And of course, Mike Ramsey was (at one time) the captain in Buffalo prior to
>being traded to Pittsburgh.  Currently, the Penguins have 3 former captains
>and 1 real captain (Lemieux) playing for them.  They rotate the A's during the
>season (and even the C while Mario was out).  Even Troy Loney has worn the C
>for the Pens.

I had heard(perhaps incorrectly) that while Lemieux was out, noone wore a
C on their jersey.  The As took turns doing captain duties(whatever they
are).

Scott...
scott.marks@launchpad.unc.edu
scott.marks@launchpad.unc.edu
--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  laUNChpad.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53741
From: steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains



Anna Matyas (am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu) wrote:
> Wasn't Ron Francis captain of the Whalers when he was traded to
> Pittsburgh?

No.

In what still, IMHO, ranks as the all-time greatest PR blunder (not to
mention on-ice blunder) the Whalers ever committed, GM Eddie Johnston and
Coach Rick Ley 'decided' that Francis was incapable as a leader and stripped
him of the Captain's "C" in December of 1990. The whole organization (read:
EJ and Ley, and by default owner Richard Gordon because he was too much of
a dupe to know how much he was being blind-sided by EJ) dumped on Francis all
season, starting with refusing to sign him to a new contract, publicly 
humiliating him, stripping him of the "C", and then trading him that Spring
to the Penguins. Classy guy, that EJ.

The loss of Francis (and too a lesser extent, Ulf), was one of a series of
decimating player moves by EJ which stripped the personality and fan-awareness
from the team that has put them in the precarious position they are in today.

[Gratuitous good EJ note...he did preside over the organization when it
acquired Verbeek, Cassels, Sanderson, Poulin, Nylander, etc. He stripped the
roster but he DID lay a foundation.]

-SG (a real live Hartford Whalers season ticket holder)
-steveg@cadkey.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53742
From: steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio)
Subject: The Most Average Player in the NHL


And now, I interrupt your regularly scheduled news reading to bring you 
another message sponsored by the Department of Really Mundane Statistics:

I passed the final individual player stats posted here the other day through
a filter to average out games, goals, assists, points, and penalty minutes
for the mythical average NHL pro who played in the league this season. (Why?
Because it's Monday and I didn't feel like writing any REAL code...)

Anyway, after I wiped out the 60-odd goalies in the list, I came up with:

NHL average:		55 GP      11 G      19 A      30 Pts      69 PIM

Then I passed the list through a second time to come up with the players who
had the smallest percentage difference in each of the categories.

Marty McInnis (NYI)	56 GP (1%) 10 G (9%) 20 A (5%) 30 Pts (0%) 24 PIM (65%)
Igor Kravchuk (EDM)	55 GP (0%) 10 G (9%) 17 A (10%) 27 Pts (9%) 27 PIM (53%)

These two are close in games, goals, assists, and points, but are too far off
in PIM. This leaves, as the most average player in the NHL:

Bobby Carpenter (WAS)	65 GP (18%) 11 G (0%) 17 A (10%) 28 Pts (6%) 63 PIM (8%)

What an honor.

I also passed the list through with the goalies still included. Kravchuk and
Carpenter were still in the top three, but Rob DiMaio came flying up from 
behind to take the title:

NHL average:		53 GP      10 G      17 A      27 Pts      64 PIM
Igor Kravchuk (EDM)     55 GP (3%) 10 G (0%) 17 A (0%) 27 Pts (0%) 27 PIM (50%)
Bobby Carpenter (WAS)   65 GP (22%) 11 G (10%) 17 A (0%) 28 Pts (3%) 63 PIM (1%)
Rob DiMaio (TB)		54 GP (1%) 9 G (9%) 15 A (11%) 24 Pts (11%) 62 PIM (3%)


It's all really kind of underwhelming when you think about it.

-SG

	    And now, back to our regularly scheduled programming...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53743
From: steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio)
Subject: Re: NHL team in Milwaukee




Charlie Betz (cbetz@romulus.cray.com) writes:
> After reading some of the reports of possible NHL moves to Milwaukee or that
> Milwaukee should have an NHL team, I thought I'd pass along a story I heard
> recently.  This is second hand, so I don't know how true it is, but I have
> no reason to doubt it either.
> 
> Bradley Center in Milwaukee is home to the Milwaukee Admirals minor leauge
> hockey team.  The owner of the Admirals (sorry, I can't remember his name)
> either owns or at least shelled out the majority of the funds to build the
> Bradley Center.

Lloyd Pettit.

> 
> Supposedly he was approached by the NHL about an expansion franchise, but 
> turned it down because he thought the franchise fee of $50 million was too
> high.
> 
> Like I said, I don't know whether this story is true or just a rumor, but if
> it's true, don't look for an NHL team in Milwaukee anytime soon.  The Admirals
> aren't going to be forced out of the building and you won't see an NHL club
> and a minor league club in the same building, especially since the NBA's
> Milwaukee Bucks play there as well.

Yes, it is true that he refused to buy a franchise from the NHL for $50M; but
at the time the reason was that the established market for teams was much 
less than that. He felt that no one would pay $50M for an expansion team, and
that he would simply wait to buy an existing franchise for less than that. But
the market fooled him, and 5 teams have been created for $50M apiece in the
last three years, and even the existing teams can't be moved for less than 
$50M and I doubt that he could get one for that little.

Pettit gambled and lost. Now he'll have to pay more.

-SG

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53744
From: steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio)
Subject: Re: Possible Canadian WC Team?



> This is an all-point team for the Canadian NHLers who are not playoff bound...

CENTERS
[...]
> Geoff Sanderson, Hartford
[...]

Sanderson will be on Team Canada, but he'd be out of position as a center.
Although he was drafted as a center and played there as a rookie, Sanderson
scored 46 goals this season as a left wing.

-SG

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53745
From: steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio)
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 18



Gerald Olchowy (golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca) writes:
> Podein is an interesting case...because he was eligible to
> play in Cape Breton in the AHL playoffs like Kovalev, Zubov,
> and Andersson...obviously Sather and Pocklington are not
> the total scrooges everyone makes them out to be...certainly
> in this case they've massively outclassed Paramount and the
> New York Rangers.

What is the policy regarding players and the minor league playoffs versus WC?
I know that the Rangers are holding back Kovalev, Zubov, and Andersson for
Binghamton, but I also know that the Whalers wanted Michael Nylander to play
for Springfield, while Nylander wanted to play for Sweden. The Whalers allowed
the NHL to decide, and the NHL chose the WCs. How does this differ from the
Rangers and Oilers? Did the Whalers have to go through the league, or could
they have forced Nylander to play in Springfield?

-SG

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53746
From: steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio)
Subject: Re: Tie Breaker....(Isles and Devils)



Rex Wang (wangr@vccsouth22.its.rpi.edu) spews forth stupidly:
> 	Are people here stupid or what??? It is a tie breaker, of cause they
> have to have the same record. How can people be sooooo stuppid to put win as
> first in the list for tie breaker??? If it is a tie breaker, how can there be
> different record???? Man, I thought people in this net are good with hockey.
> I might not be great in Math, but tell me how can two teams ahve the same
> points with different record??? Man...retard!!!!!! Can't believe people
> actually put win as first in a tie breaker......

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE tell me that you don't actually ATTEND Rensselaer, and
that you just work for ITS. Or that this was tounge-in-cheek.

Does this mean that I should be cutting off my alumni contributions, or 
increasing them?

-SG

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53747
From: leunggm@odin.control.utoronto.ca (Gary Leung)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

In article <1993Apr20.151818.4319@samba.oit.unc.edu> Scott.Marks@launchpad.unc.edu (Scott Marks) writes:
>>And of course, Mike Ramsey was (at one time) the captain in Buffalo prior to
>>being traded to Pittsburgh.  Currently, the Penguins have 3 former captains
>>and 1 real captain (Lemieux) playing for them.  They rotate the A's during the
>>season (and even the C while Mario was out).  Even Troy Loney has worn the C
>>for the Pens.
>

I think that Mike Foligno was the captain of the Sabres when he
got traded to the Leafs. Also, wasn't Rick Vaive the captain of
the Leafs when he got traded to Chicago (with Steve Thomas for
Ed Olcyzk and someone). Speaking of the Leafs, I believe that
Darryl Sittler was their captain (he'd torn the "C" off his
jersey but I think he re-claimed the captaincy later on) when he
was traded to the Flyers.

Oh yeah, of course, Gretzky was the captain of the Oilers before
he was traded wasn't he? 

Gary

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53748
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Mon, April 19, 1993

Toronto                          1 1 1--3
Detroit                          1 4 1--6
First period
     1, Detroit, Yzerman 1 (Gallant, Ciccarelli) 4:48.
     2, Toronto, Cullen 1 (Clark, Gill) 10:44.
Second period
     3, Detroit, Sheppard 1 (Probert, Coffey) pp, 5:04.
     4, Detroit, Burr 1 (Racine) sh, 6:42.
     5, Detroit, Chiasson 1 (Coffey) pp,11:00.
     6, Detroit, Howe 1 (Yzerman, Drake) 14:46.
     7, Toronto, Gilmour 1 (Borschevsky, Ellett) pp, 19:59.
Third period
     8, Detroit, Racine 1 (Primeau, Drake) 5:10.
     9, Toronto, Lefebvre 1 (Cullen, Pearson) 7:45.

Detroit: 6    Power play: 6-2   Special goals:  pp: 2  sh: 1  Total: 3
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Burr               1    0    1
Chiasson           1    0    1
Ciccarelli         0    1    1
Coffey             0    2    2
Drake              0    2    2
Gallant            0    1    1
Howe               1    0    1
Primeau            0    1    1
Probert            0    1    1
Racine             1    1    2
Sheppard           1    0    1
Yzerman            1    1    2

Toronto: 3    Power play: 5-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Borschevsky        0    1    1
Clark              0    1    1
Cullen             1    1    2
Ellett             0    1    1
Gill               0    1    1
Gilmour            1    0    1
Lefebvre           1    0    1
Pearson            0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Winnipeg                         1 0 1--2
Vancouver                        2 0 2--4
First period
     1, Vancouver, Adams 1 (Linden, Bure) pp, 1:23.
     2, Vancouver, Craven 1 (Bure, Murzyn) 9:56.
     3, Winnipeg, Steen 1 (Shannon, Housley) pp, 17:53.
Second period
     No scoring.
Third period
     4, Winnipeg, King 1 (Barnes) 3:43.
     5, Vancouver, Linden 1(Courtnall, McLean) 12:16.
     6, Vancouver, Ronning 1 (Courtnall) 18:31.

Vancouver: 4    Power play: 6-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Adams              1    0    1
Bure               0    2    2
Courtnall          0    2    2
Craven             1    0    1
Linden             1    1    2
McLean             0    1    1
Murzyn             0    1    1
Ronning            1    0    1

Winnipeg: 2    Power play: 3-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Barnes             0    1    1
Housley            0    1    1
King               1    0    1
Shannon            0    1    1
Steen              1    0    1

-----------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53749
From: riel@unixg.ubc.ca (William Riel)
Subject: Re: Travesty at the Joe Louis

In article <1993Apr20.005512.3382@mtroyal.ab.ca> caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca writes:
>(Detroit, April 19)
>
>In a development that shocked most knowledgable observers, the Detroit Redwings
>scored no less than six goals against the best goaltender in the world en
>route to a 6-3 win over the best team in the NHL, the Toronto Maple Leafs. 

Not only that, but if I'm not mistaken Detroit scored 4 goals on their first
five shots on net...looks like Toronto's cream cheese run continues (or is
that swiss cheese? after watching Potvin I'm leaning towards the latter)

Bill   

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53750
From: chuck@mks.com (Chuck Lownie)
Subject: Re: Tie Breaker....(Isles and Devils)

In article <lrw509f@rpi.edu> wangr@rpi.edu writes:
>	Are people here stupid or what??? It is a tie breaker, of cause they
>have to have the same record. How can people be sooooo stuppid to put win as
>first in the list for tie breaker??? If it is a tie breaker, how can there be
>different record???? Man, I thought people in this net are good with hockey.
>I might not be great in Math, but tell me how can two teams ahve the same points
>with different record??? Man...retard!!!!!! Can't believe people actually put
>win as first in a tie breaker......
>
>


I didn't see any smilies in this message so.......

                W     T    L    PTs
   Team A      50    30    4    104
   Team B      52    32    0    104


There you go.  Two teams that tie in points without identical records.


-- 





Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53751
From: wdsst3@cislabs.pitt.edu (William D Sands)
Subject: request for video in Pittsburgh area


	There was apparently a 30 minute special here on the Penguins' 
season on ABC (WTAE - channel 4), immediately preceding the opening 
game against the Devils on Sunday.  I only turned it on in time to 
watch the credits.  If anyone taped it and is willing to let me borrow 
it to dub it, I would appreciate it.  I would be willing to come pick 
it up, and I'll return it the next day and buy you a beer.  Please 
respond via e-mail.  Thanks a lot.
	Oh yeah.  Was it any good?
						-Billy


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53752
From: galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin)
Subject: Re: Bay area media (Wings-Leafs coverage)

In article <DREIER.93Apr19195132@durban.berkeley.edu> dreier@durban.berkeley.edu (Roland Dreier) writes:
>The San Francisco Bay area media is reporting tonight that the Detroit
>Red Wings beat the Toronto Maple Leafs 6-3.  Can someone who is not
>part of the media conspiracy against the Leafs tell me how the game
>really went (I am expecting a 4-0 win for the Leafs, shutout for
>Potvin, hat trick for Andreychuk and a goal and 3 assists for
>Gilmour).  If the Leafs really lost, how many penalties did whichever
>biased ref was at the game have to call against the Leafs to let the
>Red Wings win?
>
>Thank you very much.
>--
>Roland Dreier                                        dreier@math.berkeley.edu


Sorry to disappoint you but the Red Wings earned the victory...easily.

I watched most of the game on ESPN (as soon as I realized that they
were televising the game which was at the beginning of the second).
The Maple Leafs were flat.  Very flat.  Meanwhile, the Red Wings were
skating very freely and dictating the pace of the game.  I didn't
detect any bad penalty calls (Van Hellemond did his usual good job).
Toronto looked like how I expected them to for their first playoff
game in a few years -- nervous.

For the Leafs sake, I hope they can rid themselves of the butterflies
for game 2.  If game 1 is indicative of the series, it's gonna go
quick.

-Tom Galvin       galvint@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53753
From: galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin)
Subject: Re: Schedule...

In article <121411@netnews.upenn.edu> kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller) writes:
>In article <1qup1lINNotb@master.cs.rose-hulman.edu> swartzjh@RoseVC.Rose-Hulman.Edu writes:
>>Does anyone have the games ESPN will be airing this week???  Hopefully the
>>Detroit/Toronto game tongiht.  I though ABC did a decent job by getting some
>
>F**king *NO* hockey games televised nationally tonight!  What the hell is
>this???  Why the hell is ESPN showing some stupid baseball game, when
>baseball is not even three weeks into the season and hockey is in the
>playoffs???  No, wait, I know the answer: $$$$$$  But still!  It really
>pisses me off to no end.  They better start putting some more f*cking
>games on, or they will never make any money off of the deal that brought
>hockey back to ESPN.  AARGH!!!!  (not that I'd watch anyway, but hockey
>needs all the publicity it can get)
>
>--
>    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
>						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
>	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!
>
>	   "A cow is not a vegetarian dish."  -- Keith Keller, 1993

You obviously don't understand how TV scheduling works.  ESPN had
prior contracts to baseball to show Monday night games and had
contracted all the other bs shows well in advance.  The NHL TV deal
was very late in the scheduling process (you normally have to do this
one-plus year out.  The NHL package was finished two weeks before the
season started).  ESPN has shown tremendous commitment to the NHL by
squeezing in extra telecasts when it could (like the last Minnesota
game) and putting Stanley Cup games as backup to their baseball
telecasts (which by favorable circumstances they could pull off last
night).

But the bottom line is that ESPN cannot break contracts at will.  They
must honor the previous deals they made.  $$$$ _does_ have something
to do with it, especially if you risk a $$$$$$$$ lawsuit for breach of
contract with baseball.

So relax.  I'm happy.  (I don't get SportsChannel anyway).

-Tom Galvin              galvint@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53754
From: aa711@Freenet.carleton.ca (Ken Darcovich)
Subject: west coast NHL playoff games


Us easterners who have newspapers with editors
unsympathetic to playoff pools, often don't get
summaries from west coast games since they
finish too late at night for the morning edition.

I (and I'm sure others too) would greatly appreciate
it if scoring summaries of west coast playoff games
could be posted to this group right away.
basically, all we need are goal scorers and assists,
don't bother with times, penalties, shots etc...

this would make a lot of pool-obsessed people very
happy.

I guess with the Senators out golfing now, the 
local papers have lost interest.  ;-)

thanks.

kd.

-- 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53755
From: bks2@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (bryan.k.strouse)
Subject: NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4-19-93



NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR 4/19/93.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                  CONFERENCE SEMI-FINALS        BEST OF SEVEN
      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE
 
 NJ                  BUF   (leads 1-0)   STL   (leads 1-0)   WIN               
 PIT   (leads 1-0)   BOS                 CHI                 VAN   (leads 1-0)

 NYI                 MON                 TOR                 LA    (leads 1-0) 
 WAS   (leads 1-0)   QUE   (leads 1-0)   DET   (leads 1-0)   CAL              

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Toronto Maple Leafs                       1   1   1   -   3
Detroit Red Wings    (leads series 1-0)   1   4   1   -   6

1st period: DET, Yzerman 1 - (Gallant, Ciccarelli) 4:48
	    TOR, Cullen 1 - (Clark, Gill) 10:44

2nd period: DET, Sheppard 1 - (Probert, Coffey) (pp) 5:04
	    DET, Burr 1 - (Racine) (sh) 6;42
	    DET, Chiasson 1 - (Coffey) (pp) 11:00
	    DET, Howe 1 - (Yzerman, Drake) 14;46
	    TOR, Gilmour 1 - (Borschevsky, Ellett) (pp) 19:59

3rd period: DET, Racine 1 - (Primeau, Drake) 5:10
	    TOR, Lefebvre 1 - (Cullen, Pearson) 7:45

Powerplay Opportunities-Maple Leafs 1 of 5
			Red Wings   2 of 6

Shots on Goal-	Maple Leafs   5   9   9  -  23
		Red Wings    13   8  12  -  33

Toronto Maple Leafs--Potvin (0-1) (33 shots - 27 saves)
Detroit Red Wings--Cheveldae (1-0) (23 shots - 20 saves)

ATT-19,875

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Winnipeg Jets                           1   0   1   -   2
Vancouver Canucks  (leads series 1-0)   2   0   2   -   4

1st period: VAN, Adams 1 - (Linden, Bure) (pp) 1:23
	    VAN, Craven 1 - (Bure, Murzyn) 9:56
	    WIN, Steen 1 - (Shannon, Housley) (pp) 17:53

2nd period: NONE

3rd period: WIN, King 1 - (Barnes) 3:43
	    VAN, Linden 1 - (Courtnall, McLean) 12:16
	    VAN, Ronning 1 - (Courtnall) 18:31

Powerplay Opportunities-Jets    1 of 3
			Canucks 1 of 6

Shots on Goal-	Jets      7   5  10  -  22
		Canucks   9  12  12  -  33

Winnipeg Jets--Essensa (0-1) (33 shots - 29 saves)
Vancouver Canucks--McLean (1-0) (22 shots - 20 saves)

ATT-15,918

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


\|||||/
-SPIKE-




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53756
From: willis@oracle.SCG.HAC.COM (Stan Willis)
Subject: Series 1, game 1; Kings 6 @ Flames 3

1992-93 Los Angeles Kings notes and game reports.
-------------------------------------------------
Kings 6 @ Calgary Flames 3 - 04/18/93

The third place Kings opened the 1993 Stanley Cup Playoffs in Calgary, against
the second place Flames and came out with an impressive 6-3 victory in front of
a non-sellout crowd of 18,605 at the Saddledome in Calgary.

Symthe Division playoff hockey this was.  Both teams seemed a bit tense in the
opening period though the Kings scored off the opening face-off.  The Kings got
into the flow of the game much earlier than the Flames as they played out-
standing team defense.  It took the Flames 9:45 of the first period to record
their first shot on goal.  The Kings, ranked 16th of the 16 playoff teams on
penalty killing, shut down the Flames.  The Flames went 0-8 on the power play 
and could record only 8 shot on goal in those 8 opportunities.  The Kings had
their problems on the power play, yet they did manager to score 2 goals in 10
tries.

The Kings forwards back-checked while the defense stood the Flames up at the
blue line, allowing the Kings to take took the home ice advantage away from the 
Flames.  Rob Blake missed the game due to the lower back contusion but is ex-
pected to be in the lineup on Wednesday. Wayne Gretzky suffered a charlie horse
in his right leg.  He took a few shifts in the second period before retiring to 
the dressing room for the rest of the game.  Interviewed on the radio this 
morning, he stated that he was fine and would be in the lineup on Wednesday.

1st period: 
1-0. The Kings got things started right off the opening face-off.  Gretzky won
the draw with the puck going to Sydor.  He crossed center ice and slapped the
puck into the Flames zone and behind the net.  The puck carried around to the
far side where Robitaille wacked at it and the rebound bounced to Sandstrom. He
put the puck behind the Flames net where Gretzky picked it up.  Gretzky set up
in 'his office', moved to the near side and passed into the near circle where
Sydor had moved in.  Sydor, who got the puck between the face-off dot and the 
hash mark, shot off the pass, beating Vernon low and between the legs.

Millen and Fleury went off at 4:57.  Skrudland went off at 12:25 but the Kings
failed to convert.  Carson went off at 14:53 and the Flames failed to convert.
Dahlquist went off at 18:34 and Dahl went off at 19:30, giving the Kings a 30
second 5on3 which they failed to convert.  The Kings recorded 2 goal posts in
the period.

2nd period: 
The Kings opened with a 5on3 carried over from the 1st period which they failed
to convert on.  With 6 seconds left in the 5on4, Vernon put a bouncing puck into
the stands and received a delay of game.

1-1. Calgary evened the score on the ensuing Kings power play.  Kurri, with the
puck in the neutral zone, tried to put the puck into the Flames zone but it hit 
the stick of Fleury and bounced to Suter at the Flames blue line.  Suter skated 
down the near wing and into the Kings zone.  He faked a shot at the circle and
skated around Kurri. As he cut thorugh the crease, he got Hrudey to go with him 
and he put the puck behind Hrudey, on his stick side for a short hander.

2-1. The Kings reclaimed the lead 25 seconds later on the same power play.
Shuchuk, in the far circle passed to Sydor at the top of the slot and headed
for the net.  Sydors shot hit Shuchuk in the back and dropped into the low slot 
where 2 Kings (Shuchuk and Granato) were being checked by 3 Flames.  Carson
came from the far corner, picked up the loose puck and snapped a wrist shot
between the legs of Vernon from 5 feet above the crease.

3-1. The Kings widened their lead just 24 seconds later.  Rychel was checked off
the puck at the Flames blue line.  Taylor picked up the puck and sent a pass
cross the slot to Huddy.  Huddy shot off the pass, from the near face-off dot,
beating a diving Vernon on the glove side.

4-1. 2:59 later, the Kings had a 3 goal lead.  McSorley took a shot form the
near point that hit a Flame and deflected towards the boards.  Marty got his
own rebound, skated to the bottom of the circle and sent a pass into the low
slot that hit Dahlquist on the leg and deflected past the stick of Vernon.

Skrudland went off at 10:53 but the Kings could not convert.  Sydor went off at
12:35 and Watters went off at 14:40, giving the Flames a 5 second 5-3 but they
failed to convert.  McSorley went off at 17:19 and the Flames had 3 consecutive
power plays but the Flames killed it themselves when Suter went off for high
sticking at 17:31.  Sandstrom went off at 18:03 to close out the period.  The
Kings hit 3 goal post in the period.

3rd period:
The Kings used the phrase "Initiate, not retaliate" and it was very evident here
in the 3rd period as the Kings continued to pound the body and the Flames 
continued to take bad penalties to take themselves out of the game.

5-1. The Kings extended their lead to 4 goals at the 1:06 mark.  The Kings shot
the puck into the near corner of the Flames zone.  Vernon went behind the net to
cut off the puck but he could not control it.  Donnelly, who was behind him,
wacked at the puck, sending it into the low slot.  As Vernon slid back in to the
crease, Granato got a shot that hit a Flame and bounced to the left of the net
where Millen fired the rebound behind Vernon.

Sydor went off at 1:24; Nieuwendyk went off at 3:22 as the teams skated 4 on 4.

5-2. Otto, skating down the far side, stepped around McSorley, cut to the net
and passed to Dahlquist in the low slot.  Dahlquist cut through the top of the 
crease and put the puck in under a diving Hrudey.

Carson and Rychel came in on a 2-1.  When Carson passed across to Rychel, Fleury
tripped Rychel with no call.  The puck got shoveled into the far corner where 
Fleury knocked Rychel down and checked him from behind into the boards, drawing 
a 5-minute major and a game misconduct at the 6:08 mark.  Unfortunately, the 
Kings squandered the 5 minute power play when Granato (at 6:44) and Watters (at 
8:19) took penalties.  

5-3. The Flames closed to within 2 at the 8:47 mark.  MacInnis, at the near 
point, passed to Yawney at the far point.  He took a few strides towards the
net, wound up and drove a shot off the near post and in over the glove of
Hrudey.  The play started on another faceoff that the Kings lost.  Timeout - LA.

6-3. MacInnis took a penalty at 9:56 and the Kings converted on the power play
to seal the victory.  Sandstrom, skating down the far wing in the Flames zone 
cut towards the back of the net.  Just as he crossed the goal line, he passed 
the puck into the low slot, on the far side, to Carson who shot off the pass, 
beating Vernon on the ice, stick side.

At the 16:17 mark, Skrudland went off for slashing and Stern went crazy as he
went after Shuchuk.  Stern wound up with a double minor for roughing, a single
minor for cross checking and a 10 minute misconduct, and he took the Flames
right out of the game.

On the plus side:  The Kings, for the most part, played very disciplined hockey
as they let Calgary retaliate.  The Kings played good team defense and excellent
penalty killing.

On the minus side:  The Kings lost almost every face-off.  This must improve or
the Flames will surely get that power play back on track.

Notes:
------
The Kings recalled Guy Leveque, Brandy Semchuk and Jim Thomson from Phoenix.

Wayne Gretzkys 1st period assist was his 307th career playoff point.

The Kings entered the game 24th in the league in shots per game against, giving
the opposing team an average of 34.4 shots per game.

Flames goaltender Mike Vernon entered the game with a 3-9-1 record in afternoon 
games.  The Flames entered the game with a 34% success rate on the power play
over their last 9 games.

The teams were 3-3-1 against each other in the regular season.

Playoffs:
Campbell Conference:
Smythe Division:
LA  6  @ CAL 3 		LA leads 1-0
WIN    @ VAN

Norris Division:
STL 4  @ CHI 3		STL leads 1-0
TOR    @ DET

Wales Conference:
Adams Division:
BUF 5  @ BOS 4 (OT)	BUF leads 1-0
MON 2  @ QUE 3 (OT)	QUE leads 1-0

Patrick Division:
NJ  3  @ PIT 6		PIT leads 1-0
NYI 1  @ WAS 3		WAS leads 1-0

Records:
--------
vs	Smythe	 Norris	 Patrck	Adams	Overall
================================================
Home:    0- 0-0  0-0-0   0-0-0  0-0-0    0- 0-0 
Road:    1- 0-0  0-0-0   0-0-0  0-0-0    1- 0-0
==============================================================
Total:   1- 0-0  0-0-0   0-0-0	0-0-0	 1- 0-0  

Box Score:
=========================
Calgary      0 1 2 - 3
Los Angeles  1 3 2 - 6
=========================

1st period: 
LA  Sydor 1 (Gretzky, Sandstrom), 0:16
    LA  Millen - high sticking, 4:57
    CAL Fleury - high sticking, 4:57
    CAL Skrudland - interference, 12:25
    LA  Carson - tripping 14:53
    CAL Dahlquist - holding stick, 18:34
    CAL Dahl - roughing 19:30

2nd period: 
    CAL Verson - delay of game (served by Ashton), 1:34
CAL Suter 1 (Fleury), 2:48 (sh)
LA  Carson 1 (Shuchuk, Sydor), 3:13 (pp)
LA  Huddy 1 (Taylor, Rychel), 3:37
LA  McSorley 1 (unassisted), 6:36
    CAL Skrudland - elbowing, 10:53
    LA  Sydor - tripping, 12:35
    LA  Watters- hooking, 14:40
    LA  McSorley - holding, 17:19
    CAL Suter - high sticking, 17:31
    LA  Sandstrom - hooking, 18:03

3rd period:
LA  Millen 1 (Granato, Donnelly), 1:06
    LA Sydor - hooking, 1:24
    CAL Nieuwendyk - tripping, 3:22
CAL Dahlquist 1 (Otto), 4:23
    CAL Fleury - major (boarding), game misconduct, 6:08
    LA  Granato - tripping, 6:44
    LA  Watters - interference, 8:19
CAL Yawney 1 (MacInnis, Reichel), 8:47
    CAL MacInnis - roughing, 9:56
LA  Carson 2 (Sandstrom, Robitaille), 10:32 (pp)
    LA  Hardy - holding, 11:38
    CAL Skrudland - slashing, 16:17
    CAL Stern - double roughing, cross-checking, 10 min. misconduct, 16:17

Overtime: none

Shots:
------
Los Angeles   8  9 14 - 31
Calgary       5  8 11 - 24

Power play conversions:
-----------------------
For:      2 of 10; for the year:  2 of  10,  20.00%
Against:  0 of  8; for the year:  8 of   8, 100.00%

Goalies:
--------
Los Angeles - Hrudey (1-0-0)
Calgary - Vernon (0-1-0)

Attendance: 18,605

Scratches:
----------
Rob Blake - back contusion
Guy Leveque - numbers
Lonnie Loach - numbers
Marc Potvin - numbers
Brandy Semchuk - numbers
Robb Stauber - numbers
Brent Thompson - numbers
Jim Thomson - numbers

Lines - Forwards:
----------------
*Robitaille - Gretzky - Sandstrom 
Donnelly - Millen - Kurri
Rychel - Conacher - Taylor
Granato - Carson - Shuchuk

Lines - Defense:
----------------
*Huddy - Sydor
Watters - Zhitnik
Hardy - McSorley

* denotes starting lineup

Next game:
----------
Wednesday, April 21 @ Calgary Flames; 6:30pm Pacific Time on Prime Ticket
===============================================================================
Stan Willis (willis@empire.dnet.hac.com)
net contact: L.A. Kings

 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
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================================================================================

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53757
From: smorris@venus.lerc.nasa.gov (Ron Morris )
Subject: Murray as GM  (was: Wings will win

In article <1993Apr19.204348.8254@sol.UVic.CA>, gballent@hudson.UVic.CA writes...
> 
>In article 735249453@vela.acs.oakland.edu, ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:
> 
>>are predicting).  Although I think Bryan Murray is probably the best GM
>>I have ever seen in hockey
> 
>How do you figure that??  When Bryan Murray took over the Wings they were
>a pretty good team that was contending for the Stanley Cup but looked
>unlikely to win it.  Now they are a pretty good team that is contending for
>the Stanley Cup but looks unlikely to win it.  A truly great GM would
>have been able to make the moves to push the team to the upper echelon
>of the NHL and maybe win the Stanley Cup.  A good GM (like Murray) can

I think Murray has done a great job.  He's picked up Ciccarelli,
Sheppard, Ysebaert, Howe, Coffey, and Riendeau (plus some depth players) 
without giving up anything the Wings needed or any of his top prospects.
All of this in three years.  Has anyone done better?

The year before he took over, the Wings didn't even make the playoffs.
There was about a year and a half during Demers' stint that the Wings
did OK, but that was due to Demers' motavational skills and clutch
and grab style.  They didn't have much talent.

Gerald, Murray wasn't responsible for Primeau (although I'm not
ready to admit that's a horrible pick).  They hired him after the
draft (which has never made sense to me).  His first pick was
Lapointe.

Ron 

**********
"And one of my major goals is to leave the next president a new set
of things to worry about.  I'm getting bored reading the same problems
in the paper, decade after decade.  I want people to have to deal
with new problems."
                    ... President Bill Clinton   2-4-93

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53758
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Wings will win

In article <ragraca.735249453@vela.acs.oakland.edu> ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:
>
>I also think that they will have a hard time with Pittsburgh if they
>face them in the finals (which is what all the Detroit sportswriters 
>are predicting).  Although I think Bryan Murray is probably the best GM
>I have ever seen in hockey, I'm not as impressed with his abilities as
>a bench coach or in general as a motivator.  With the amount of talent he
>has on this team, he should have blown away everyone in the Norris.  There
>is not another team in the Norris, maybe even in the Campbell conference,
>that can hold a candle to Detroit on paper in terms of pure talent.  But,
>some guys have not been pulling their weight at times this year.  Scotty
>Bowman, on the other hand, who has won (I think, correct me if I'm wrong)
>nine (9) stanley cups, is an outstanding coach, and I think he could
>outcoach Murray if they faced each other.  
>

Bryan Murray has done very little as GM...Yzerman, Fedorov, Cheveldae,
Chaisson, the whole Russian strategy was a product of the previous
GM...Murray has made a couple of decent trades...that's about it...
that would hardly rank him as the best GM.

Wasn't Primeau, Murray's first decision as GM...

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53759
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 18

In article <1993Apr19.211406.22528@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com> spiegel@sgi413.msd.lmsc.lockheed.com (Mark Spiegel) writes:
>	According to the SJ Murky News the Team USA roster is (names and
>	teams played for in 1992-93 listed):
>
>		Goalies
>		-------
........
>		Forwards
>		--------
>	Tony Amonte	New York Rangers
>	Ted Drury	Harvard Univ
>	Rob Gaudreau	San Jose' Sharks
>	Craig Johnson	Univ of Minnesota
>	Jeff Lazaro	Ottawa Senators
>	Mike Modano	Minnesota North Stars
>	Ed Olczyk	New York Rangers
>	Derek Plante	Univ of Minnesota-Duluth
>	Shion Podein	Edmonton Oilers
>	David Sacco	Boston University
>	Darren Turcotte New York Rangers
>	Doug Weight	Edmonton Oilers
>

It looks like the Edmonton Oilers just decided to take a European
vacation this spring...

Ranford, Tugnutt, Benning, Manson, Smith, Buchberger, and Corson
are playing for Canada.

Podein and Weight are playing for the US.

Is Kravchuk playing for the Russians...I know he had nagging
injuries late in the season.

Podein is an interesting case...because he was eligible to
play in Cape Breton in the AHL playoffs like Kovalev, Zubov,
and Andersson...obviously Sather and Pocklington are not
the total scrooges everyone makes them out to be...certainly
in this case they've massively outclassed Paramount and the
New York Rangers.

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53760
From: John Michael Santore <jsbh+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

>Michael Collingridge writes:
> 
>>And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
>>resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
>>team captain trivia would be appreciated.
> 
>Wasn't Ron Francis captain of the Whalers when he was traded to
>Pittsburgh?
>
>Mom.

Rick Tocchet was captain of the Flyers for several years before he was
traded to the Pens...

                                    -John Santore


=============================================================================
 ____________________                                
/                    \                   "We break the surface tension 
\_________     ____   \                   with our wild kinetic dreams"
/             /    \   \                        -Rush, Grand Designs
\_______     /  (*) )   )
/           / /\___/   /                 Go Philadelphia Flyers!
\_____     / /        /
/         /  \_______/                   John Santore (jsbh@andrew.cmu.edu)
\________/   
          
Rush-Yes-King Crimson-Emerson, Lake and Palmer-Marillion-Genesis (w/ Gabriel)
=============================================================================


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53761
From: snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols)
Subject: Re: SHARKS:  Kingston Fired!!!

In article <1993Apr20.085337.27224@leland.Stanford.EDU> terry@garfield.Stanford.EDU (Terry Wong) writes:
>I think that Jack Ferreira's firing eventually led to Kingston's
>firing.  You mention consistency of vision.  I think the
>Sharks lost that with the loss of Ferreira.  There has never
>been a 3 headed G.M. that has ever worked.  You need one
>person making the personnel decisions at the top, not
>management by committee.  The conventional wisdom
>from around the league is that Ferreira would have
>made the moves that would have fielded a better product
>on the ice.

How exactly would Ferreira accomplished this?  The three-headed GM-ship has
taken a lot of heat, but nobody's explained how things would have been any
different had Ferreira still been there.  Would Ferreira have made more
trades?  Who would have he had traded?  Would he have made fewer trades?
Who should not have been traded?

Sherri Nichols
snichols@adobe.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53762
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: Wings will win


In article 735307970@vela.acs.oakland.edu, ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:

>gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:
>
>>In article 735249453@vela.acs.oakland.edu, ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:
>
>>>I also think that they will have a hard time with Pittsburgh if they
>>>face them in the finals (which is what all the Detroit sportswriters 
>>>are predicting).  Although I think Bryan Murray is probably the best GM
>>>I have ever seen in hockey
>
>>How do you figure that??  When Bryan Murray took over the Wings they were
>>a pretty good team that was contending for the Stanley Cup but looked
>>unlikely to win it.  Now they are a pretty good team that is contending for
>>the Stanley Cup but looks unlikely to win it.  A truly great GM would
>>have been able to make the moves to push the team to the upper echelon
>>of the NHL and maybe win the Stanley Cup.  A good GM (like Murray) can
>>maintain the team's success but can't push them to the next level.
>
>When Jacques Demers brought the Wings to the conference finals twice a
>few years back, he had everyone on the team giving 100 percent, but he 
>had very little talent.  He had Yzerman, Bob Probert (who had drinking
>problems at the time), and a couple of decent goaltenders in Hanlon and
>Stefan who got hot.  That's about it.  Can you name one player on those
>earlier teams who even deserved to be in the all-star game, much less 
>actually got there, other than Yzerman and Probert?  Like, Petr Klima?
>Give me a break!  When they faced Edmonton in both of those conference
>finals, as hard as they played, it was clear they faced a team that simply
>had superior talent to the Wings.  That's why they could not get to the
>finals.  Also, at that time the Norris division was still the weakest 
>division in hockey, and getting past Chicago, and Toronto was not as
>impressive as it is today.
>
>Murray has brought scoring talent to the Wings that they did not have a
>few years ago when Devellano was GM and Demers was coach.  To name a few,
>Ysebaert, Kozlov, and Paul Coffey (who has made a definite positive impact on
>the power play especially).  

>Murray has built one of the most talented teams in hockey at the present, with
>the possible exception of the Pittsburgh Penguins.  The Wings have at least
>five 30 goal scorers that I can think of, and a couple of defenseman with over
>100 games worth of playoff experience.  Murray's one failing is that unlike
>the other GM's you mentioned (who are definitely also good, don't get me
>wrong), he has not found for himself a strong coach to motivate the team to
>go out and give 100 percent for the full 60 minutes every night like they 
>did the last time they made a cup run.  When a team wins or loses, it's a
>reflection of the GM *and* the coach, which was the point of my original 
>post.  If the team outmatches their opponent in terms of talent but loses
>anyway (which has been the case this year when the Wings have struggled),
>that indicates that the GM has done his job in building up the team but the
>coach has failed to motivate them.  If, as in the case of the last run the
>Wings made in the playoffs before Murray came, they gave opponents a hard
>time who should have beaten them easily, that indicates good coaching making
>up for a lack of talent.

All of this is fine.  I never said that Murray was a bad GM.  I merely said
that he isn't the best GM in hockey- or even a contender for that honor.
If Murray is as great as you claim- the Wings would have won the Stanley Cup
by now- probably more than once.  If he was as great a GM as you claim
and he was as poor a coach as you claim- he would have been intelligent
enough to hire the coach to push the team to the next level of success.
But Murray is an average (unspectacular) NHL coach and a pretty good GM
so none of this is true anyway.

Gregmeister


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53763
From: Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Ron Francis


Matthew Rush writes:

>Is there an award for "best back-up behind a hockey great"?
>Underneath all the hype about Lemieux, Stevens, Jagr, Ulf,
>etc., Ron Francis has quietly put together a 100 point season
>(24 goals and 76 assists in 84 games).  That was probably the
>best acquisition the Penguins have made since getting Lemieux
>(apologies to Rick Tocchet, who has had a hell of a year
>himself).  The Pens got just the right person at just the right
>time when they got Francis before the playoffs two years ago to
>back-up Mario.  Who was the second-line center before they got
>Francis?  I remember Randy Gilhen (who really plays tough, an
>ace in the face-off circle), but nobody with all the skills
>Francis has: scoring, passing, winning face-offs, and putting
>100% into every game, every night.  Just wanted to glow a
little.

I know what you mean!  I glow everytime Ronnie's out on the ice.
In fact, one of the neatest things about seeing the Pens in person
is that I can key in on him instead of watching what I'd probably
be seeing on tv.  He does so many subtle things behind the play.

He said in an interview recently that when he was a kid his dad
stressed the importance of playing two-way hockey; that you have to
learn how to play defense as well as offense and he obviously took
that advice to heart.  He was a breath of fresh air when he arrived
in Pittsburgh to the team whose forwards, for the most part, couldn't
and wouldn't play a lick of defense.

It's really difficult to assess what the key trades were that brought
all of this success to the Pens.  You mention Rick Tocchet and he has
certainly helped, and even ol' Kjell has been steady.  But looking at
this team you could almost take any one of them out of the line-up
permanently and replace them with an extremely mediocre player and it
wouldn't matter.

If I had to pick the top three acquisitions in recent years they would
be 1) Tom Barrasso; 2) Ron Francis; 3) Larry Murphy.  (I'd love to put
Francis first but I do think the only thing that could really damage
the Pens right now would be to lose Barrasso.)

Mom.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53764
From: "James J. Murawski" <jjm+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - Coach's Corner summary - April 19, 1993


On 20-Apr-93 in Don Cherry - Coach's Corner..
user Allan Sullivan@cs.UAlber writes:
>Next, a clip was shown from an earlier episode, in which Don was
>proclaiming Doug Gilmour to be the best player, not only in
>the NHL, but in the world. What about players like Lemieux?
>Don said that Gilmour was the best PLAYER, not "Designated point getter".
>Its not like baseball, where you have a "designatted hitter" who
>can score runs but can't play defense. Gilmour is a good two way player.

This clip was shown on local news in Pittsburgh last night (KDKA), complete
with animated sarcasm by the sportscaster.  It's the second time Cherry
has been shown on local Pittsburgh news in the last couple of weeks.  Both
times he was blasting Lemieux.


====================================================================
    Jim Murawski
    Sr. Software Engineer               (412) 268-2650  [office]
    Administrative Computing and        (412) 268-6868  [fax]
         Information Services           jjm+@andrew.cmu.edu
    Carnegie Mellon University          Office: UCC 155
    4910 Forbes Avenue
    Pittsburgh, PA 15213-3890

    "Le Mieux!  Le Magnifique!  Soixante Six!  Claude...NON!"

There are 1371 days until Clinton (Clinocchio) leaves office (1370 too many).


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53765
From: snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - Coach's Corner summary - April 19, 1993

In article <allan.735284991@swanlake> allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan) writes:
>Next, a clip was shown from an earlier episode, in which Don was
>proclaiming Doug Gilmour to be the best player, not only in
>the NHL, but in the world. What about players like Lemieux?
>Don said that Gilmour was the best PLAYER, not "Designated point getter".
>Its not like baseball, where you have a "designatted hitter" who
>can score runs but can't play defense. Gilmour is a good two way player.

What can you expect from a buffoon who said that the Pens should have
drafted Kirk Muller instead of Mario Lemieux?  

Perhaps once upon a time Don Cherry had some insight into the game of
hockey, but he's really degenerated into a parody of himself.

Sherri Nichols
snichols@adobe.com



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53766
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Nords 3 - Habs 2 in O.T. We was robbed!!

In article <18APR93.25909598.0086@VM1.MCGILL.CA> JBE5 <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA> writes:
>Aargh!
>
>Paul Stewart is the worst and most biased ref. presently in the NHL.
>He called a total of 4 penalties on the Habs and one on the Nordiques.
>The Nords' penalty came in O.T.  Stewart, being an ex-Nordique himself,
>was looking to call penalties on the Habs while letting the Nords
>get away with murder...WE WAS ROBBED!!!!

No.  Patrick Roy is the reason the game was lost, and Ron Hextall is the
reason Quebec won.  Everybody said it would come down to goaltending, that
goaltending was the key, etc etc.  Well, the key doesn't quite fit if you're
Montreal.  The Dionne penalty was kind of a cheesy call, but let's face it;
he literally left his feet to throw an elbow.  Blaming Stewart is just an
excuse to avoid facing the fact that Roy allowed what was one of the worst
goals he could possibly allow.  He even saw the whole shot, dammit.  Besides,
Stewart evened things up a bit by calling a Quebec penalty in OT.

Montreal played a solid game (although they still don't know how to clear
traffic in front of the net; the loss of Schneider will hurt even more). 
Normally I would say that any team that blows a 2-goal lead with less than 
five, let alone two, minutes to go in regulation time IN A PLAYOFF GAME 
ESPECIALLY needs to be smacked upside their collective heads.  But I don't
think this was a team loss (although Keane should have been able to clear 
the zone just prior to the first Quebec goal).  Roy is paid big money to 
play.  He looked like a player in an industrial league on Sakic's shot.

Demers should start Racicot in the next game.  If not that, he should let
the damn team read the papers for the next day or two....and maybe this
article, if possible.

>Patrick Roy collapsed after letting in the tieing goal. He was shaky and
>on his knees for the rest of the night.  The winning goal shouldn't have
>gone in.

I didn't think the wrap-around was as bad as the second goal.  I also didn't
think Scott Young should have gotten around the defender (can't remember who)
in the first place.  But you are correct, it shouldn't have gone in
regardless.

>Oh well, at least the Bruins lost in O.T. also Ha, Ha!!--)

Yep.  Moog looked bad on Mogilny's goal with five seconds left in the second,
IMO.  How about Neely though?   Holy shit, what a player.

Speaking of great players, man-oh-man can Quebec skate.  I haven't seen a
team so potent on the rush in a long time.  Watching them break out of their
zone, especially Sundin, is a treat to watch.  They remind me of the Red 
Army.  

But I still hate the team.

On the rest of the games:  Didn't St. Louis' winning goal come on a
powerplay?  Penalties will cost Chicago dearly, especially against Detroit. 
Same goes for Calgary; very, very undisciplined.  When Marty McSorely is
waving guys to the bench to *avoid* fights, you know something's up.  New
Jersey was overmatched, Terreri's heroics notwithstanding.  Mario is
unbelievable, and Jagr for some reason shows up in the playoffs.  But I 
hate that team anyway.



dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (pissed-off Habs fan)




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53767
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Atlanta Hockey Hell!!

In article <0foVj7i00WB4MIUmht@andrew.cmu.edu> Mamatha Devineni Ratnam <mr47+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>
>Well, it's not that bad. But I am still pretty pissed of at the
>local ABC coverage. They cut off the first half hour of coverage by playing

[stuff deleted]

Ok, here's the solution to your problem.  Move to Canada.  Yesterday I was able
to watch FOUR games...the NJ-PITT at 1:00 on ABC, LA-CAL at 3:00 (CBC), 
BUFF-BOS at 7:00 (TSN and FOX), and MON-QUE at 7:30 (CBC).  I think that if
each series goes its max I could be watching hockey playoffs for 40-some odd
consecutive nights (I haven't counted so that's a pure guess).

I have two tv's in my house, and I set them up side-by-side to watch MON-QUE
and keep an eye on BOS-BUFF at the same time.  I did the same for the two
afternoon games.

Btw, those ABC commentaters were great!  I was quite impressed; they seemed
to know that their audience wasn't likely to be well-schooled in hockey lore
and they did an excellent job.  They were quite impartial also, IMO.



dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (not suffering from a shortage of hockey here)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53768
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: div. and conf. names

In article <1993Apr19.003221.11964@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
[Evan Pritchard writes:]

>>	I think that you are incorrect, Roger.  Patrick,
>>Smythe and Adams all played or coached in the league before becoming
>>front office types.  Hence, they did help build the league, although
>>they were not great players themselves.  
>
>Punch Imlach's contributions as a coach and GM were far greater than
>those of the above combined.  Should we name a division or trophy after
>him?  [owner vs. player contributions deleted...]
>Are we going to honour those who contributed to the league's evolution
>or are we going to honour those who contributed to the glory of the 
>sport itself? 

[stuff deleted...]

>The money issue is irrelevant to the point that we would agree on, and
>that is: "it is the players that are what make the game great and not the
>people who put them on the ice"
  
As I recall, the author of the _original_ article that started the thread
claimed that he disliked the changing of the names for a variety of reasons. 
Roger, on one front you flamed him rather severely on the grounds that his
was a "jingoistic rant", but you also supported the name-changing on the
grounds that the current names are inappropriate because of the individuals
they represent. FWIW, I do not think the flaming was warranted, nor do I 
think you enhanced what credibility you have with it at all.  Just an 
observation...

However, that aside, the real question is whether you like the idea of
changing the names based on the reasons given for it (making it easier for
the 'casual fan'), or whether you like the idea of unique divisional names
based on individuals who do deserve the honour.  IMO, the latter is a nice
and unique touch that differs from other sports.  In addition, I do not
think that changing divisional names will have an effect on the number of
people that are interested in hockey, so it's a pointless exercise anyway.

If the current names are inappropriate, then that is a separate issue, not 
central to the original article.  Something to consider additionally is
whether or not players like Orr who 'contributed to the glory of the sport'
would have been able to do so _without_ an organized professional league to
play in.  In this case, honouring builders of the _league_ as opposed to
builders of the _sport_ becomes a chicken-and-egg type question. (although
it was the chicken.....)

>Exactly true.  Naming divisions and trophies after Smythe and the bunch
>is the same kind of nepotism that put Stein in the hall of fame.  I have
>always thought that this was nonsense.

Dunno if the Stein comparison is justifiable, since it doesn't look as though
his 'unanimous acceptance' to the Hall will hold up.


--
dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53769
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: hawks vs leafs lastnight

In article <1993Apr18.153820.10118@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:

>>on all replays, joe murphy's goal shouldn't have counted ! 
>>the game would have ended in 2-2 tie !

>I thought the red light went on...thus, in the review, the presumption
>would be to find conclusive evidence that the puck did not go in the
>net...from the replays I say, even from the rear, the evidence wasn't
>conclusive that the puck was in or out...in my opinion...

I was under the impression that the objective is to find conclusive
evidence that the puck _did_ cross the line.  And, the replays I saw showed 
fairly conclusively that the puck did _not_ cross the goal line at any
time anyway.  Somebody screwed up.  


dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53770
From: e2s@icf.hrb.com (Eric M. Sebastian)
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN

In article <1993Apr20.032017.5783@wuecl.wustl.edu>, jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:
> 
>  It was nice to see ESPN show game 1 between the Wings and Leafs since
> the Cubs and Astros got rained out. Instead of showing another baseball
> game, they decided on the Stanley Cup Playoffs. A classy move by ESPN.
> 
   It was good to see the Wings play, but lets not give ESPN too much credit.
There weren't any other late baseball games on so they didn't have another
option.

Eric Sebastian
Go Pens...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53771
From: smorris@venus.lerc.nasa.gov (Ron Morris )
Subject: Re: Wings take game one

In  <1qvos8$r78@cl.msu.>, vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu (David Vergolini) writes...
>  The Detroit Red Wings put a lot of doubter on ice tonight with a 6 - 3
>washing of the Toronto Maple Leafs.  All you Toronto fans have now seen the
>power of the mighty Red Wing offense.  Toronto's defense in no match for the
>Wing offense.  As for the defense, Probert, Kennedey and Primeau came out
>hitting hard.  Toronto players were being thrown left and right.  Not even
>Wendell Clark was tough enough for the Wings tough guys.  The Wings only gave
>up three goals, a low total for what they say is a mediocre defense.
>  All you Leaf fans better speak up now.  You team will probable have its
>season ended soon.  Wings fans, keep up the support.

There's quite a few Wings fans lurking about here, they just tend
to be low key and thoughtful rather than woofers.  I suppose every
family must have a Roger Clinton, though.  But remember (to paraphrase
one of my favorite Star Trek lines), "if we adopt the ways of the Leaf
fans, we are as bad as the Leaf fans".

Ron

**********
"And one of my major goals is to leave the next president a new set
of things to worry about.  I'm getting bored reading the same problems
in the paper, decade after decade.  I want people to have to deal
with new problems."
                    ... President Bill Clinton   2-4-93

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53772
From: ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca)
Subject: Re: Wings will win

golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:

>Bryan Murray has done very little as GM...Yzerman, Fedorov, Cheveldae,
>Chaisson, the whole Russian strategy was a product of the previous
>GM...Murray has made a couple of decent trades...that's about it...
>that would hardly rank him as the best GM.

>Wasn't Primeau, Murray's first decision as GM...

>Gerald

There are many teams in the NHL who have taken a liking to Russian players.
The "whole Russian strategy" is not specific to Detroit or to Devellano,
who was GM before Murray.  What the previous GM also did was to trade 
away several players who have gone on to do well with other teams, most
notably (in my memory) Murray Craven, who had a few very good years with
Philly after leaving here.  Also, it's not the volume of trades that will 
necessarily improve a team, but the quality of them.  Trading Adam Oates
for Bernie Federko was just plain stupid, even if Federko used to be a 
great player at one time.  Most of Murray's trades have worked significantly
to the Wings' advantage, with those that didn't being soured mainly by 
injury to the players involved (such as Troy Crowder, who suffered back
problems from which he never really recovered).

Put Scotty Bowman, Pat Burns, or any of the other better coaches in the 
league behind the bench of this Detroit team, and they could beat anybody.

--Randy
 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53773
From: ferguson@cs.rochester.edu (George Ferguson)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage


In article <cfoy0MW00Uh_41JndV@andrew.cmu.edu> Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>Thorne is good and I've always been a fan of Clement (but I miss
>Mike Emrick!).  My boyfriend, who is not a hockey fan, even looked up
>at one point and said, "These guys are pretty good announcers."  (This
>is the same guy who said that Rick Tocchet looks like Charles Bronson...:)

Did your boyfriend comment on the fact that Clement looks like a
walking ad for Brillo pad hair replacement therapy? The guy's just a
stuffed shirt who thinks he's the greatest hockey analyst since Howie
Meeker (for gosh sakes). I'll take Schoenie any day.

George

-- 
George Ferguson                 ARPA: ferguson@cs.rochester.edu
Dept. of Computer Science       UUCP: rutgers!rochester!ferguson
University of Rochester         VOX:  (716) 275-2527
Rochester  NY  14627-0226       FAX:  (716) 461-2018

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53774
From: ferguson@cs.rochester.edu (George Ferguson)
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN


In article <1993Apr20.032017.5783@wuecl.wustl.edu> jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:
> It was nice to see ESPN show game 1 between the Wings and Leafs since
>the Cubs and Astros got rained out. Instead of showing another baseball
>game, they decided on the Stanley Cup Playoffs. A classy move by ESPN.

They tried their best not to show it, believe me. I'm surprised they
couldn't find a sprint car race (mini cars through pigpens, indeed!)
on short notice.

George
-- 
George Ferguson                 ARPA: ferguson@cs.rochester.edu
Dept. of Computer Science       UUCP: rutgers!rochester!ferguson
University of Rochester         VOX:  (716) 275-2527
Rochester  NY  14627-0226       FAX:  (716) 461-2018

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53775
From: ferguson@cs.rochester.edu (George Ferguson)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage


In article <9454@blue.cis.pitt.edu> ccohen@pitt.edu (Caleb N Cohen) writes:
>   Boy - everyone has been ripping on ESPN's hockey coverage (or is it just
>Pittsburgher's who are thrilled with Lange & Steigy?)  For all of you
>who are unaware -> ESPN bought the air time from ABC and did all the 
>production, advertising sales, commentating, etc -> and even 
>reaped any $ made...

In the interests of saving badnwidth during this "heated" time of the
year (viz. the early flurry of "retard" comments coming from a certain
state whose name starts with P and ends with A), why don't you tell us
something we don't already know?

George
-- 
George Ferguson                 ARPA: ferguson@cs.rochester.edu
Dept. of Computer Science       UUCP: rutgers!rochester!ferguson
University of Rochester         VOX:  (716) 275-2527
Rochester  NY  14627-0226       FAX:  (716) 461-2018

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53776
From: r_turgeo@oz.plymouth.edu (Randy S. Turgeon)
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN

In article <1993Apr20.032017.5783@wuecl.wustl.edu> jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:
>
> It was nice to see ESPN show game 1 between the Wings and Leafs since
>the Cubs and Astros got rained out. Instead of showing another baseball
>game, they decided on the Stanley Cup Playoffs. A classy move by ESPN.
>


The only reason ESPN showed that hockey came was because there was no
other baseball game scheduled for the evening.

Randy
r_turgeo@oz.plymouth.edu



>
>  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
>  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
>  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
>  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
>  %     \    ________/                                                   *
>  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
>  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
>  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
>  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
>  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53777
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage

ccohen@pitt.edu (Caleb N Cohen) writes:
>
>   Boy - everyone has been ripping on ESPN's hockey coverage (or is it
>just Pittsburgher's who are thrilled with Lange & Steigy?)  For all of 
>you who are unaware -> ESPN bought the air time from ABC and did all 
>the production, advertising sales, commentating, etc -> and even 
>reaped any $ made...

No, Caleb, it's not the quality of ESPN that I have a problem with;
it is superb, whereas it did not evolve beyond the point where ESPN
left off when hockey went to SC (this is excepting SC's use of feeds
from CBC (-;).  It's the amount of hockey they're showing, or lack
of it, that we're complaining about.  They had rights to two OT's
that could've been shown on Sunday night after baseball ... and
they had pickup trucks racing through oversized pigpens followed
by Super-8 home movies of old car races (yes, I was checking in
desperation for Canucks-Jets) last night after SportsCenter.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53778
From: dvb@ick (David Van Beveren)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

colling@ann-arbor.applicon.slb.com (Michael Collingridge) writes:
: 
: And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
: resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
: team captain trivia would be appreciated.
: 

Luc Robitaille was captain of the Kings the first third of the season,
until The Great One came back from his disc injury. It was kind of
awkward, but Melrose appointed (anointed?) TGO as captain immediately upon
his return, after which he did not score a goal for something like 10
games.

I think Luc should have remained Captain all season.

dvb

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53779
From: joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage

In article <cfoy0MW00Uh_41JndV@andrew.cmu.edu> am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu (Anna Matyas) writes:
>
>I was skeptical before the game but was pleasantly surprised at the
>coverage.  I was particularly impressed by the close range camera coverage
>of work in the corners and behind the play without losing a beat getting
>back to the puck.
>
>Thorne is good and I've always been a fan of Clement (but I miss
>Mike Emrick!).  My boyfriend, who is not a hockey fan, even looked up
>at one point and said, "These guys are pretty good announcers."  (This
>is the same guy who said that Rick Tocchet looks like Charles Bronson...:)
>
>Mom.



I have one complaint for the cameramen doing the Jersey-Pitt series:  Show
the shots, not the hits.  On more than one occassion the camera zoomed in
on a check along the boards while the puck was in the slot.  They panned
back to show the rebound.  Maybe Mom's camera people were a little more 
experienced.



Joseph Stiehm






Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53780
From: gp2011@andy.bgsu.edu (George Pavlic)
Subject: Re: Ron Francis

Not to mention, Mr. Francis is an incredibly nice person.  Over Christmas
break, a friend of mine had a little Xmas gathering.  The two of us drove
to Ron's house.  While I stayed in the car out of shyness, my friend went
to the door and rang the bell.  Ron answered and my friend introduced
himself.  He then proceeded to invite Francis to the party.  Ron declined
because he "had to watch his daughter."  He then reached out and shook my
friend's hand!  I know this isn't r.s.b., but I don't think Barry Bonds
would be this polite in this situation.

George

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53781
From: nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: SHARKS REVIEW Part 5: Left Wings

Apparently, Part 2 (defensemen numbered 2 through 19) was lost when I posted
it; to make things worse, I lost my own copy.  I have asked on the Sharks
mailing list, on which it did get out, to see if someone can mail me a copy
back.  If someone responds, I will repost it when I get it; otherwise, I will
re-write it in a day or two and post it.  Sorry about that.

#8	LARRY DEPALMA		Season:	3rd
Acquired:	'91-92, free agent from Minnesota
Grade:		I (C-/D+)

No netter/fan watching the Sharks, including me, knows where DePalma was at
the end of the season; the Sharks appeared to still have his rights, but he
wasn't in San Jose, he wasn't in Kansas City, and his name hasn't appeared on
the waiver wire.  And that kind of invisibility was prevalent for the most part
for DePalma.  After being called up October 30 against the Tampa Bay Lightning,
DePalma had an excellent week, scoring 5 points in 3 games while playing good
defense.  Unfortunately, the 27-year-old DePalma then disappeared the rest of
the way, getting just 3 more points in 15 more games, and generally looked
lethargic and uninterested on both ends of the ice.  He then was sent down to
Kansas City, walked out from there, and was suspended and later reinstated
when it was revealed that he was injured; he then promptly disappeared from
the watching eyes of Shark Bytes (as the mailing list is now known to Sharks
officials) faithful, and neither the Sharks nor we miss him.

#10	JOHAN GARPENLOV		Season: 3rd
Acquired:	'91-92, trade with Detroit for D Bob McGill and 8th round
		pick in '92 entry draft from Vancouver
Grade:		A/A-

After an early slump, Garpenlov was nothing short of inspirational the rest
of the way, finishing with 66 points in 79 games, second highest total on the
team, as he clicked well with team MVP Kelly Kisio and right wing Rob
Gaudreau.  Kisio got most of the credit, but Garpenlov, finishing second in
the MVP voting, clearly demonstrated his playmaking and scoring skills, as he
was seen making excellent centering passes as well as finishing passes to him
by putting the puck past opposing goaltenders, getting a club-high 14 power-
play goals.  Contrary to his previous rep, Garpenlov also showed that despite
his small size (5' 11", 183 lbs.), he was willing to throw himself around
when necessary, albeit not very successful yet.  He also still needs to work
on his defense, although he improved tremendously throughout the season, and
was actually quite a good penalty killer by the end of the season.  He will
be a major key to the offense next year.

#15	DAVID BRUCE		Season: 5th
Acquired:	'91-92, from St. Louis in expansion draft
Grade:		I (?)

After a banner '91-92, when he led the team in power-play goals (10) and
was third in total scoring (38 points in 60 games), Bruce was bothered
virtually all of this season with a groin injury, which kept him out of the
lineup for all by 17 games this season.  Of course, it is difficult to
speculate how well he would have done this season had he not been affected by
the injury, but the 28-year-old Bruce was effective with a man up or a man
short in the Sharks' first season, and was expected to be a strong offensive
leader this season as well.  The injury appears serious, which is a shame,
because otherwise he may have a much brighter future for now; instead, his
future with the Sharks next season appears clouded.

#18	MARK PEDERSON		Season:	3rd
Acquired:	'92-93, trade with Philadelphia for C/LW Dave Snuggerud
Grade:		I (B)

It is difficult for me to understand the Flyers' decision to unload Pederson,
after a very good offensive season last season (40 points in 58 games), but
after riding the pine early in the season, Pederson was summarily sent to the
Sharks in exchange of the defensive-minded Snuggerud, and he finished with
41 games combined with the Flyers and the Sharks.  He was also limited by
injuries this season, and this limited his production (17 points).  But when
healthy, Pederson appears impressive, with a good scoring touch, good size
(and the willingness to throw it around, although he's not considered a
physical forward), and good speed.  He also does not appear to be a liability
on defense, but the Sharks probably have to wait until next season to see how
much, exactly, Pederson can do.

#20	JOHN CARTER		Season: 4th
Acquired:	'91-92, free agent from Boston
Grade:		I (B+/B)

Carter was definitely one of the hardest workers on the team, and the hard
work worked wonders, as at times he looked great on ice.  However, although he
did look great at times, the fact that he received just 16 points (in 55
games) for his efforts is a sign that there is only so much his hard work can
do, and the Sharks confirmed that by sending him to Kansas City with about
20 games left in the season.  Carter, who will turn 30 on May 6, always
hussled, but as a result, was sometimes trapped too deep within the offensive
zone while forechecking, but he was generally a credit on the defensive end,
but he is probably of limited utility in that capacity, and he did not impress
offensively, although he was one of the best Sharks at drawing penalties.  He
is very unlikely to be back next season.

#28	JEAN-FRANCOIS QUINTIN	Season: 1st
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		I (B+/B)

I don't understand why the Sharks didn't let Quintin play any more than the
14 games he played this season.  He was generally hard-working and creating
opportunities offensively, and appeared, at age 23, ready for regular NHL
duty, at least for a team like the Sharks, finishing with 7 points in those
14 games while not being a defensive liability.  Shoulder injury in training
camp before the '91-92 season limited Quintin, the team's leading scorer in
exhibition games despite sitting out the final two, to just 29 games with the
Sharks and the Blades that season, but he looked impressive.  He should be a
solid contender for regular duty next season.

#41	MARK BEAUFAIT		Season: 1st
Acquired:	2nd round pick in 1991 supplemental draft
Grade:		I (?)

After a all-star season at Kansas City, Beaufait got a cup of coffey with the
Sharks late in the season when the Blades knocked down a playoff spot and the
Sharks decimated with injuries, playing 5 games and scoring a goal for his only
NHL point thus far.  Despite small size (5' 9", 165 lbs.), Beaufait was not shy
to throw himself around when necessary, and looked pretty good at times,
although it's too early to judge him based on 5 NHL games, in which he played
mostly left wing, away from his center position at Northern Michigan and
Kansas City.

#42	JAROSLAV OTEVREL	Season: 1st
Acquired:	8th round pick in 1991 entry draft
Grade:		I (?)

Like Beaufait, Otevrel also played away from his normal position when he was
up for his cup of tea (7 games) midway through the season.  He was generally
very much of a defensive liability, and did not show much offensively either,
although that may be more indicative of the lack of ice time he got in those
7 games.  He may need another season to work on his defense, but once his
defense is acceptable, he should be ready.

#44	MICHEL PICARD		Season: 1st
Acquired:	'92-93, trade with Hartford for LW Yvon Corriveau
Grade:		I (B-/C+)

The 23-year-old Picard, although he perennially tore up the minors, seems to
be close to being out of chances, for some reason, after being acquired by the
Sharks but failing to impress the management in 25 games, scoring 4 goals for
his only points, and he spent most of the rest of the way in Kansas City.
He was not particularly strong defensively, and despite his offensive
brilliance in the minors, he has failed thus far to score in the NHL, although
he has been given limited opportunities.  He may be the Sharks' bait in the
expansion draft.

#45	DODY WOOD		Season: 1st
Acquired:	3rd round pick in 1991 entry draft
Grade:		I (D+/D, although perhaps I shouldn't give a grade at all)

I have been accused of knocking on Wood too much. :-)  Then, it is probably
no surprise to you that I am thoroughly unimpressed by Wood thus far, although
13 games is a small example.  He was generally a nonfactor on offense, was
not particularly good defensively, and took too many silly penalties, losing
many fights in the process and gathering 69 penalty minutes in those 13 games,
projecting to to 446(!) in an 84-game season.  He's not ready, and needs at
least another season at KC, where he can work on his fighting skills, if
nothing else.  His relatively small size (5' 11", 181 lbs.) does not give much
possibility that he can survive, at this stage, as an enforcer.

===============================================================================
GO CALGARY FLAMES!  Al MacInnis for Norris!  Gary Roberts for Hart and Smythe!
GO EDMONTON OILERS!  Go for playoffs next year!  Stay in Edmonton!
===============================================================================
Nelson Lu (claudius@leland.stanford.edu)
rec.sport.hockey contact for the San Jose Sharks

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53782
From: nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: SHARKS REVIEW Part 2: Defensemen (2-19)

I finally got it back, with great thanks to Mark Spiegel for saving and sending
it.



#2	ROB ZETTLER		Season:	4th
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		C/C-

Zettler gave the Sharks every bit he's got this year; unfortunately, this still
wasn't enough to make him any more than a marginal NHLer, if that.  He works
hard, for sure, but is no better than average on defense, and is prone to
costly penalties and defensive lapses at times, while being basically an
offensive zero (0 goal and 7 assists in 79 games).  He would be hardpressed
to make the team next year.

#3	DAVID WILLIAMS		Season: 2nd
Acquired:	'91-92, free agent from New Jersey
Grade:		C/C-

IMO, Williams was the most valuable defenseman for the Sharks in '91-92,
playing a combination of good offense (3 goals and 25 assists in 56 games) and
good defense.  But he, playing the first part of this season in Kansas City,
was good neither offensively nor defensively this year; it, then, appears that
'91-92 was a fluke.  Although he improved towards the end of the season, he
was prone to being out of position defensively, and did not demonstrate the
playmaking skills that made him the team's leading scorer among defensemen last
year.  He would also be hardpressed to make the team next year.

#4	JAYSON MORE		Season: 2nd
Acquired:	'91-92, from Montreal in expansion draft
Grade:		B+

After being touted as the team's top defensive prospects in training camp
before '91-92, More had a rather disappointing '91-92, as he was not
particularly good defensively, and had just 17 points in 46 games.  He, then,
proceeded to improve his game massively this season, becoming the team's most
reliable defenseman, whom the team can count on night in and night out to play
steady defense and providing occasional (but only occasional) offensive flash.
Offensively, he was even more disappointing than last year (11 points in 73
games), but his defense improved tremendously.  He is probably best as the
defensive part of a defense combination with an offensive defenseman.

#5	NEIL WILKINSON		Season: 4th
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		B-

Wilkinson was probably the team's top defensive defenseman in '91-92.  However,
partially because of injuries, he was not the same this year, as he missed 25
games total due to nagging knee and back injuries, and seemed to be slowed
even when playing.  He, then, had often to be saved by his defensive partners;
that is, if they are there at all.  But he also had some solid games, and if
he can be complete healthy, he can still be a force.

#6	SANDIS OZOLINSH		Season: 1st
Acquired:	'91-92, 2nd round pick in entry draft
Grade:		I (A)

At the time of his injury (December 30, against the Philadelphia Flyers),
Ozolinsh was well on track to be, IMO, the team's MVP.  A serious knee injury
in that game, though, forced him to miss the rest of the season (47 games),
but he still finished as the team's top scorer among defensemen (23 points),
which, of course, tells more about the lack of offense the Sharks had from
their defensemen, but it also tells of Ozolinsh's abilities.  At the time, he
was playing very good defense along with excellent offense; he was still
susceptible to so-called "rookie mistakes," but was probably the defenseman who
made the least of them on the team, rookie or veteran.  If he can come back
from his injuries, he is ready to be a star.

#19	DOUG ZMOLEK		Season: 1st
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		B

Zmolek had basically a solid and durable year, being one of the only two Sharks
to play in all 84 games of the season.  He was solid on defense, but
after being billed as an offensive defenseman, he didn't show it (15 points).
He was also prone to penalties, and his 229 penalty minutes was second on the
team; however, that was also an indication that he was fearly when facing tough
physical opponents, and he was at his best when playing physically.  But to
become a fixture in this league, he needs to improve both offensively and
defensively, and cut down on the number of power-plays he gives to opponents.

===============================================================================
GO CALGARY FLAMES!  Al MacInnis for Norris!  Gary Roberts for Hart and Smythe!
GO EDMONTON OILERS!  Go for playoffs next year!  Stay in Edmonton!
===============================================================================
Nelson Lu (claudius@leland.stanford.edu)
rec.sport.hockey contact for the San Jose Sharks





Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53783
From: adavis@mcl.bdm.com (Arthur Davis)
Subject: Re: Ron Francis

In article <1993Apr19.171223.11311@Virginia.EDU> mjr4u@Virginia.EDU ("Matthew J. Rush") writes:
> I forgot to ask: Is this the highest points total Francis has
>had in a season?  Has he ever had a 100 point season before,
>either with the Pens or the Whalers?
>

Francis got 101 in 89-90, his last full season with Hartford.

In agreement with your previous post, I think Francis is a tremendous and
generally underrated complete player.  I would LOVE to have him here in a
Capitals uniform where he would certainly be the #1 center (even though
Pivonka is also a very good complete player who is generally underrated).
Francis impresses me in many ways as an "ethical Dale Hunter".  Tons of
heart and can-do attitude with a lot of different skills, but none of
the cheap shots and few penalty minutes.  Not to mention nearly always
coming through when it's important.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53784
From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
Subject: Re: expanding to Europe:Dusseldorf

In <1993Apr16.073716.16514@Informatik.TU-Muenchen.DE> voecking@Informatik.TU-Muenchen.DE writes:

> 
> In article <1993Apr15.192231.27574@abo.fi>, MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF) writes:
> |> In <PKORTELA.93Apr15164732@lk-hp-17.hut.fi> pkortela@snakemail.hut.fi writes:
> |> 
> |> > 
> |> > DEG has many german-born forwards in the team. In fact the majority of players
> |> > are german-born. 1992-93 DEG had 11150 average in 11800 spectator arena.
> |> 
> |> Interesting! One of our German friends here (Robert?) told me their forwards
> |> were all Canadian-Germans. Perhaps somebody can sort this out for us?
> 
> As far as I know Dusseldorf has only one Canadian-German forward (i.e. a  player
> who was born in Canada but now has a German passport). 
> Benoit Doucet became german by marriing a german and he is going to play 
> for Germany in the WC.
> 
> The other Canada-born forwards are:
> 	Peter-John Lee (has British passport)
> 	Chris Valentine
> 	Dale Dercatch
> 	Steve Gootas
>  	Earl Spry (?)
> 
> At the moment there are only three German-born forwards coming into my mind:
> 	Bernd Trunschka, Andreas Brockmann, Ernst Koepf
 
Hm, do you think Dusseldorf fans would like it if their team joined the NHL?
Or do we have to include Koln as well (Cologne to you Anglophiles) to make 
them happy?:-)
 
> Volker

MARCU$
> 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53785
From: kerryy@bnr.ca (Kerry Yackoboski)
Subject: Re: Goalie masks

In article <1993Apr15.184750.12889@ac.dal.ca>, brifre1@ac.dal.ca writes:
|> I saw a mask once that had drawings of band-aids, presumably for every puck
|> that goalie stopped with his face/head.  I can't remember who it was or even
|> if it was NHL (I see quite a few AHL games here).

Gerry Cheevers used to have a mask that had stitches painted all over
it.

Ken Dryden's mask is a classic - an archetype of our time.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53786
From: wangr@rs6410.ecs.rpi.edu ( Isles' Fan!! )
Subject: Islanders sux!!!!

	Need I say more???????


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53787
From: lmcdapi@noah.ericsson.se (Daniel Piche)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

In article K00WBM850Z5v@andrew.cmu.edu, am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu (Anna Matyas) writes:
>
>Michael Collingridge writes:
>
>>And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
>>resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
>>team captain trivia would be appreciated.
>
>Wasn't Ron Francis captain of the Whalers when he was traded to
>Pittsburgh?
>
>Mom.

Chris Chelios was Montreal's co-captain with Guy Carbonneau when he was traded to Chicago for Denis Savard, and Peter Stastny was captain of the Quebec Nordiques when he was traded to New-Jersey. Also Mark Messier was captain of the Edmonton Oilers when he was traded to New-York. How about Dale Hawerchuk with Winnipeg when he was traded to Buffalo, was he captain too ? I think so. I should not forget Wayne (you know who) when he was traded to L.A. he was captain. Didn't they strip Wendel Clark of his capta



incy in Toronto ?

Just some updates and thoughts.

Cheer...

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Daniel Piche (LMC/U/DET - Design)
Ericsson Communications Inc.
8400 Decarie Blvd, 1rd floor
Town of Mont Royal, Quebec. H4P 2N2
(514)-738-8300 ext. 2178. 
E-mail: LMCDAPI@LMC.ERICSSON.SE
MEMOid: LMC.LMCDAPI

CHEERS.....
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53788
From: au021@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Roland Behunin)
Subject: Does anybody have the schedule for games Sunday 25 Apr 93


Hello Hockey fans.
Bonjour tout le monde!

Well, in Salt Lake City this past Sunday, the local ABC station decided not
to televise the hockey games.  La directrous de programme est la tete de merde!
Anyway, I have a satellite dish, and a few of my friends from hockey have invited themselves over to watch the games this coming Sunday (25 Apr), and I can
not find correct game times.  For the Calgary at LA game I have times showing
everything from 11:00 AM MDT, to 5:00 PM MDT.

I am not even sure what games are going to be played this coming Sunday, now
that ABC has mucked up the schedule.  I think I should be able to
pull in
three games (11:00 am, 2:00 pm, and 5:30 pm MDT) off the dish, but I am
not sure.

IF anybody has a schedule, pleas emial it to me.  As you can see, I have to
telent to get rec.sport.hockey, and it is sometimes difficult to get a link.

Thanks in advance
Merci d'avance

P.S.  Anglais ou francais d'accord.


Roland Behunin

behunin@oodis01.af.mil
behunin@oodis01.hill.af.mil
-- 
Roland

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53789
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Wings take game one

In article <1993Apr20.032350.18885@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>In <1qvos8$r78@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu (David Vergolini) writes:
>
>>  The Detroit Red Wings put a lot of doubter on ice tonight with a 6 - 3
>>washing of the Toronto Maple Leafs.  All you Toronto fans have now seen the
>>power of the mighty Red Wing offense.  Toronto's defense in no match for the
>>Wing offense.  As for the defense, Probert, Kennedey and Primeau came out
>
>Did they move Probert back to defense?  Why did I see him parking his ass
>in front of Potvin all night?  Somebody is going to have to discipline
>Probert if the Leafs want to win the series.  Perhaps a fresh Clark should
>hit the ice at the end of a long Probert shift and straigten him out for
>a while...
>

During the regular season, when the intensity is down, not many teams
have forwards who will continually go and park themselves in front of
the opposing teams net...and the inadequacy of the Leafs defense in
this regard thus didn't matter...however, the playoffs are a different
story...every good team is going to have players who are going to
become potted plants in front of Potvin...and the Leafs relatively
unphysical defensive core will finally be exposed as weak an inept.

Hard work will go a long way during the regular season...almost
to 100 points...and the Leafs deserve credit for that...but in the 
playoffs talent matters, because everyone begins working hard.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53790
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - Coach's Corner summary - April 19, 1993

In article <Yfoz1lm00WBOQ13hYq@andrew.cmu.edu> "James J. Murawski" <jjm+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>
>On 20-Apr-93 in Don Cherry - Coach's Corner..
>user Allan Sullivan@cs.UAlber writes:
>>Next, a clip was shown from an earlier episode, in which Don was
>>proclaiming Doug Gilmour to be the best player, not only in
>>the NHL, but in the world. What about players like Lemieux?
>>Don said that Gilmour was the best PLAYER, not "Designated point getter".
>>Its not like baseball, where you have a "designatted hitter" who
>>can score runs but can't play defense. Gilmour is a good two way player.
>
>This clip was shown on local news in Pittsburgh last night (KDKA), complete
>with animated sarcasm by the sportscaster.  It's the second time Cherry
>has been shown on local Pittsburgh news in the last couple of weeks.  Both
>times he was blasting Lemieux.
>

His designated point-getter remarks were not only meant for Lemieux,
but for Gretzky, Bure, etc. etc. .... and he made those particular
remarks last December before Lemieux was diagnosed with Hodgkin's,
and as the Leafs started their second half roll, and before
Gilmour's great season was being recognized by many people.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53791
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage

In article <cfoy0MW00Uh_41JndV@andrew.cmu.edu> Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>
>Thorne is good and I've always been a fan of Clement (but I miss
>Mike Emrick!).  My boyfriend, who is not a hockey fan, even looked up
>at one point and said, "These guys are pretty good announcers."  (This
>is the same guy who said that Rick Tocchet looks like Charles Bronson...:)
>

IMHO...

Clement, although he has a pleasant personality (aggravatingly pleasant
in my opinion), is a terrible
analyst, because he is almost alway wrong...the prototypical example
being New Jersey's first goal last Sunday.

I grew up with Dick Irvin doing color beside Danny Gallivan...I knew
did Irvin, Dick Irvin was a friend of mine...Bill Clement you aren't
any Dick Irvin.

As long as the teams involved do not include the US national team or
the New York Rangers, I'd take John Davidson over Bill Clement any
day.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53792
From: gp2011@andy.bgsu.edu (George Pavlic)
Subject: Re: Pens playoff radio coverage (was:Re: Radio stations)

In article <C5sFJv.FA1.1@cs.cmu.edu>, lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico)
wrote:

> According to this morning's Post-Gazette:
> 
> The Pens will be carried by KDKA-Radio(1020 am), unless the Pirates
> are playing.  When the Pirates play, the games will be carried by 
> WDVE(102.5 fm).  WDVE will carry 12 games, starting with tonight's
> game.
> 
> In fact, after this season, KDKA will no longer be the flagship
> station for the Pens.  The Penguins and KBL have struck a new 
> deal regarding the TV and radio rights to the games.  It seems
> more than likely that WDVE will be the flagship radio station next 
> season.  KBL will carry 62 games on tv,  with 17 of the games to be 
> simulcast on KDKA-TV.  The remaining 22 games, as well as some of the 
> early round playoff games, will be available by "subscription tv" only.
> To receive the games, you'll have to pay a one time hook up fee, and
> then a monthly fee of $11-12 dollars.
> 
> Also, under the new deal, there will no longer be radio/tv 
> simulcasts.  There will be a TV broadcast team, and a radio
> broadcast team.  
> 
> No word on who the announcers will be.  Mike Lange and Paul Steigerwald
> are both under contract with KDKA, but their contracts expire at the
> end of this season.  KBL President Bill Craig said he'd like to hire
> Lange and Steigerwald.
> 
> Lori
> Contact for the Penguins
> lli+@cs.cmu.edu

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!  Who's the mindscheme(?) behind this one -- Ted
Simmons?  As the saying goes, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."  I'm 230
miles from home (during the school year) and will never be able to pick up
DVE.  At least now I can sort of make out what Mike and Steigy say through
all the static on KDKA.  This just may be enough reason for me to transfer
to Duquesne and live at home.  Who's going to announce on DVE anyway? 
Paulson and Krenn?  (Just kidding.)

George

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53793
From: jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM (Jason Cockroft)
Subject: If You Were Pat Burns ...



What are the Leafs to do?  I am a Leaf supporter and
I say the Leafs are going down in four unless there
is nothing short of a miracle or a stroke of genenius hits
Pat Burns.

If you were Pat Burns what would you do?

Living in the Bay area, I do not get enough Leaf coverage
to pull something out of the bag,  (I would appreciate comments
on the Leaf/Detroit 3rd line match-ups)  but here is the basic
idea...

Andreychuck and Borchevsky have no business playing against 
the Wings.  They are too small.  The key to any Leafs success
will have to be Clark.  He is the only centre who can have
any presence within 3-stick lengths of the slot.  Where the
hell is Anderson?  Anderson can (in days past) get under peoples
skin.  Put a little more bluntly, Anderson has to be an asshole.
He used to be good at it.  We need him now.  

Perhaps, perhaps the Leafs can shut down Detroit's second line.
I was dissappointed to see Shepard and Yserbeart flying last night.
These guys are the "swing" players for the Wings.  Last year they
did a major choke in the playoffs and were to blame for the quick
exit of the Wings.  **THis has to happen again**.   Clark-Anderson-Gilmour
should be able to out hustle this line.  Anderson should do a
nasty on Yserbeart.  Clark should bang the hell out of Sheppard.  
Score Gilmour score!

Suggestions:  Clarke-Anderson-Gilmour vs. Sheppard-Yserbeart-??
	      Andreychuck-Borchevsy-??  vs. Detroit checking line
	      Toronto's checking line  vs. Yzerman-Fedorov-Probert (pray lots)

* as suggested - i would bench Andreychuck and Borchevsky to stir things up
		 and through a monkey wrench into Detroits game plan.  However,
		if the Detroit coaching would be dumb enough to play their
		checking line against these "finesse" players - well then
		let them play.

** Potvin can not be faulted on 5 of the goals - keep him in.
** Van Hellamond can not be faulted for the Leafs demise either.
** The Wings defense shut down the Leafs (especially in the slot).

I hope Pat Burns realizes that his team was out-hit, out-skated, and
out-coached on Monday night.  This was not a loss because of poor goaltending
or officiating.  This calls for drastic measures ... or tee off is next Monday.


-jake.


GO LEAFS !!!




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53794
From: caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz)
Subject: Re: Radio stations


In article <ragraca.735252641@vela.acs.oakland.edu>,
ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes: 

|>  The Pittsburgh Penguins games used to be
|> broadcast on KDKA 1020, but I don't know whether they will be pre-empted
|> by baseball (and moved to another station) or not.  You can try those
|> if the local baseball teams aren't playing at the same time, anyway.
|> 
|> --Randy
|> 

The Pens are now being broadcast on 102.5 WDVE.  

Carol

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53795
From: Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Bowman whining already

I should have guessed. It's time for the annual Pittsburgh Penguins
whine-a-thon. Bowman was complaning about cheap shots by the Devils in
Game 1. I'm sorry, Mr. Bowman, you're a great coach, but those "cheap
shots" were nothing compared to what's going to come. Also, I guess you
were only able to notice the cheap shots made by the guys not in white.
It's amazing what those black and gold colored glasses will do. 

PS - Nice dive on that high stick Mario. Everyone knew it was a high
stick, you could have stayed on your feet and saved your diving talent
for later.

just stirring it up a bit,
Ralph


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53796
From: ad215@Freenet.carleton.ca (Rachel Holme)
Subject: Re: CBC Game Choices (was LA ON CBC...)


In a previous article, 35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca () says:

>In article <boora.735182771@sfu.ca>, boora@kits.sfu.ca (The GodFather) writes:
>> 
>> 	CBC had a great chance for some double headers:  Toronto/Detroit
>> and Vancouver/Winnipeg, but today they said that the East gets the Leafs
>> and the West get the Vancouver game.  I thought that they would show them
>> both.

I'm totally p*-o'd, too!  Vancouver-Winnipeg is great west-coast hockey -
fast-paced and loads of talent.  What I've seen so far is hardly
entertaining, with the exception of the odd shift every now & then (of
course I missed Calgary-LA & Pitts-Jersey...)

>No, because the PINHEADS at CBC figure everyone here in Ontario cares
>for the Leafs, the Maple Leafs, and nothing but the Leafs.  Half of
>Southern Ontario is people who moved from out west, but the good folks
>in Toronto couldn't care less.  They should show the doubleheader
>(heck the second game would have two Canadian teams!), and let those
>desperate for news watch The National on Newsworld, but they don't.
>Why? Because Canada ends at Windsor, don'cha know!   Grrrrr.

Amen...

>Now I have to get updates every 30 mins. on CNN Headline News, for
>crying out loud...

That's cheaper than what I do - PHONE CALLS.  (There must be a better
system - one ring, Adams to Linden, he SCORES; two rings Bure rushes up
the ice, he SCORES, etc etc :-))

-- 
ad215@freenet.carleton.ca (Rachel Holme)]

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53797
From: gp2011@andy.bgsu.edu (George Pavlic)
Subject: Matt Militzok please read!


Sorry to everyone for wasting space.  Matt, the other day you posted that
you were doing a mailing list of playoff stats.  I lost your address. 
Please put me on that list.  Thanks.

George 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53798
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Wings will win

In article <ragraca.735309624@vela.acs.oakland.edu> ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:
>golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>
>>Bryan Murray has done very little as GM...Yzerman, Fedorov, Cheveldae,
>>Chaisson, the whole Russian strategy was a product of the previous
>>GM...Murray has made a couple of decent trades...that's about it...
>>that would hardly rank him as the best GM.
>
>There are many teams in the NHL who have taken a liking to Russian players.
>The "whole Russian strategy" is not specific to Detroit or to Devellano,
>who was GM before Murray.  What the previous GM also did was to trade 
>away several players who have gone on to do well with other teams, most
>notably (in my memory) Murray Craven, who had a few very good years with
>Philly after leaving here.  Also, it's not the volume of trades that will 
>necessarily improve a team, but the quality of them.  Trading Adam Oates
>for Bernie Federko was just plain stupid, even if Federko used to be a 
>great player at one time.  Most of Murray's trades have worked significantly
>to the Wings' advantage, with those that didn't being soured mainly by 
>injury to the players involved (such as Troy Crowder, who suffered back
>problems from which he never really recovered).
>

Devallano went earlier and more extensively to the Russian strategy
than anyone else...and was the first GM to "waste" high draft choices
on young Russians...Devallano would still be GM but he succombed to
Demers pleading to make the Oates-Federko et al trade...which is the
deal that sealed his fate.

Murray has made some decent trades...no doubt...but these are more
due to the stupidity or cheapness of other teams than brilliance on
his part...Washington was too cheap to pay Ciccarelli so they
essentially gave him away...and Carson was really a big anchor to
the team, and he was able to sucker a rookie GM to give him Paul
Coffey for deadweight.

If Detroit still fails this year because he was one defenseman short...
then he will have wasted an opportunity because Manson was available,
and he was unable to pull the trigger.  It is his judgement that he
has enough with what he's got...Yzerman doesn't have that many more
years in his prime.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53799
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Murray as GM  (was: Wings will win

In article <20APR199312512640@venus.lerc.nasa.gov> smorris@venus.lerc.nasa.gov (Ron Morris ) writes:
>
>Gerald, Murray wasn't responsible for Primeau (although I'm not
>ready to admit that's a horrible pick).  They hired him after the
>draft (which has never made sense to me).  His first pick was
>Lapointe.
>

I don't think Primeau is necessarily a bad pick...I'm was just trying
to locate the beginning of Murray's decisions...he slowness in trading
Carson has delayed Primeau's development...and you have to wait longer
for big players often...and Primeau can be a very good player without
being a point-a-game-player, especially on a team that has Yzerman and
Fedorov...if Primeau becomes Joel Otto, and gets 20 goals a season,
and plays mean...it will have been an extremely good pick.

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53800
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Panther's President

In article <0P6a3B1w165w@cybernet.cse.fau.edu> jimg@cybernet.cse.fau.edu (Jim Gorycki) writes:
>
>A little Bio from _Sun-Sentinel_
>Torrey, the architect of four consecutive Stanley Cup champions as 
>persident and general manager of the New York Islanders.
>Throughout his 27 years in the NHL, Bill Torrey's bow ties have become
>as much of a signature as Andre Agassi's hair.
>
>The Panthers will introduce a uniform, insignia, and ticket-price 
>information in early next month.  In the meantime, Huizenga leaves the
>day-to-day operation in the hands of Torrey and Bob Clarke, the VP and
>GM.
>

The San Jose Sharks and Ottawa Senators are each on their second GM
already...I'd be willing to wager that both the Sharks and Senators
will probably see their 3rd GM's and perhaps their 4th, before we
see the Panthers second.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53801
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 18

In article <1r1439$c9t@access.digex.net> steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio) writes:
>
>Gerald Olchowy (golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca) writes:
>> Podein is an interesting case...because he was eligible to
>> play in Cape Breton in the AHL playoffs like Kovalev, Zubov,
>> and Andersson...obviously Sather and Pocklington are not
>> the total scrooges everyone makes them out to be...certainly
>> in this case they've massively outclassed Paramount and the
>> New York Rangers.
>
>What is the policy regarding players and the minor league playoffs versus WC?
>I know that the Rangers are holding back Kovalev, Zubov, and Andersson for
>Binghamton, but I also know that the Whalers wanted Michael Nylander to play
>for Springfield, while Nylander wanted to play for Sweden. The Whalers allowed
>the NHL to decide, and the NHL chose the WCs. How does this differ from the
>Rangers and Oilers? Did the Whalers have to go through the league, or could
>they have forced Nylander to play in Springfield?
>

Obviously, it is ultimately the teams choice...the NHL would obviously
prefer not to annoy the European hockey federations, but the NHL right
now cannot force NHL teams to free their players...the Whalers probably
did it this way so as to not annoy their farm team affiliate.

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53802
From: shah@pitt.edu (Ravindra S Shah)
Subject: Re: Nords 3 - Habs 2 in O.T. We was robbed!!

Deepak Chhabra (dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca) wrote:

: Speaking of great players, man-oh-man can Quebec skate.  I haven't seen a
: team so potent on the rush in a long time.  Watching them break out of their
: zone, especially Sundin, is a treat to watch.  They remind me of the Red 
: Army.  

: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (pissed-off Habs fan)

Yeah, the Nords look like they're going to be good...but (excuse the
bias) have you ever watched the Pens on a rush?...Don't answer: everyone
has seen this footage.  Near the end of the season when the Pens played
the Nords it was like watching a (younger) double of the Pens.  ...The
Nords looked good right up to the point when they lost. 
--
Ravi Shah
shah+@pitt.edu

"La mu'sica ideas portara'  	approx. translation: "Music will bring ideas
y siempre continuara'				     and will continue forever
sonido electro'nico				     electronic sound
decibel sinte'tico"	-Musique non stop-	     synthetic decibel"
                           -Kraftwerk

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53803
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN

In article <C5sCLK.8B5@cbnewsh.cb.att.com> seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr) writes:
>
>What, did you leave the room each of the 100 or so times they said that
>there WERE NO OTHER NIGHT BASEBALL GAMES? Every break they took back at
>the studio mentioned it, followed by 'so...we're gonna show you hockey
>instead.' My wife and I are hoping for rain at every baseball game they
>have a feed for tommorrow night...
>
>Point is, be glad they showed hockey, but if baseball was available
>anywhere else you can bet you would've watched baseball last night.
>
>pete clark

 I know that there wasn't other games on the schedule, but ESPN sometimes
shows classic games from previous season to fill in the time slot.

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53804
From: cal2d@csissun11.ee.Virginia.EDU (Craig Allen Lorie)
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN

With everyone bitching about the hockey coverage by ESPN its almost like the 
Detroit-Toronto game was not televised last nite.  I was just thankful to see
hockey on a night that it wasn't supposed to be carried.  Thanks to ESPN, no
matter why they televised the game

Craig


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53805
Subject: Remarks by President Clinton to NCAA Division I Champion Hockey Team
From: "nigel allen" <nigel.allen@canrem.com>


Here is a press release from the White House.

 Remarks by President Clinton to NCAA Division I Champion Hockey Team
April 19; Q&A Following
 To: National Desk
 Contact: White House Office of the Press Secretary, 202-456-2100

   WASHINGTON, April 19 -- Following is a transcript
of remarks by President Clinton to the University of Maine "Black
Bears" NCAA Division I hockey champions:

                           The Rose Garden

 9:58 A.M. EDT

     THE PRESIDENT:  Good morning ladies and gentlemen.  It's
an honor for me to welcome the University of Maine Black Bears, the
winner of the NCAA Division I hockey national championship to the
Rose Garden and the White House.  I understand from Senator Mitchell
that this is the first team from the University of Maine every to win
a national championship.  And we're glad to have them here.

     I'm inspired not only by how the team pulled together to
win the championship, but how the entire state pulled together to
cheer them onto victory.

     Coming from a state that is also relatively small in
size, but also filled with pride and tradition and community, I can
understand how the people of Maine must feel about the Black Bears.
In our state people are still talking about the time we won the
Orange Bowl over the number one ranked football team, and that was
back in 1978.  I'm sure that 15 years from now, the people of Maine
will as proud of this team as they are today.

     You know, in my state football is a slightly more
popular sport than hockey.  We don't have a lot of ice.  (Laughter.)
But after spending three months getting banged around in this town, I
can understand a little more about hockey than I did before I came
here.  Hockey is a tough game.  It's a hard-hitting sport.  It does
have one virtue though, there's a penalty for delay of game.  I wish
we had that rule in the Senate.  (Laughter.)

     In government as in hockey, leadership is important.  In
the United States Senate, our team has a great captain, the Majority
Leader and the senior Senator from Maine, George Mitchell; junior
Senator -- Cohen looks so young, I can't imagine.  (Laughter.)  I'm
actually bitter about Senator Cohen because he looks so much younger
than me.

     On your hockey team, the captain Jim Montgomery has done
a great job.  He scored the winning goal late in the championship
game, leading you to a come-from-behind victory -- something else I
know a little bit about.

     Sport brings out the best in individuals and in teams
and in communities.  I share the pride that Senator Mitchell and
Senator Cohen and Congressman Andrews and all the people of Maine
must feel for the Black Bears who have shown us all how to play as a
team, how to bring out the best in one another, and how to come from
behind.

     I think it's important, as I ask young people from
around America who have achieved outstanding things in working
together, to come here to the White House to be recognized and
appreciated by their country, to remember that those kinds of values
and those kinds of virtues need to be ingrained in all of us for all
of our lives.

     We now have another role model, and I'm glad to have
them here today.  (Applause.)

     (The President is presented with team jersey.)
(Applause.)

     THE PRESIDENT:  That's great.  I love it.  It's beautiful.
(Applause.)

     (The President is presented with an autographed stick.)

     THE PRESIDENT:  Thank you.  That's great.  (Applause.)

                             * * * * * *

     Q  Mr. President, did you authorize the move on Waco
this morning, sir?

     THE PRESIDENT:  I was aware of it.  I think the Attorney
General made the decision.  And I think I should refer all questions
to her and to the FBI.

     Q  Did you have any instructions for her as to how it
should be executed?

     THE PRESIDENT:  No, they made the tactical decisions.
That was their judgment, the FBI.

     Q  Is this a raid?

     THE PRESIDENT:  And I will -- I want to refer you to --
talk to the Attorney General and the FBI.  I knew it was going to be
done, but the decisions were entirely theirs, all the tactical
decisions.

     Q  What did you and Senator Mitchell talk about this
morning?

     Q  Any chance for that stimulus package?

     THE PRESIDENT:  Senator Mitchell ought to pay my
quarter.  (Laughter.)  I was in there -- (laughter).

     SENATOR MITCHELL:  You have to pay that quarter.

     THE PRESIDENT:  I was ready.  (Laughter.)  Senator
Mitchell, he's worth a quarter any day.

     Q  Any chance for your bill, sir?

     THE PRESIDENT:  We talked about what was going to happen
this week in the Senate and about what other meetings we're going to
have for the rest of the week.  We only had about five minutes to
talk.  And we agreed we'd get back together later, around noon, and
talk some more.

     Q  Senator Dole said over the weekend that your
compromise is no compromise.

     THE PRESIDENT:  Well, I know he did, but, look, Senator
Dole and a lot of the other Republicans now in the Senate voted for
the same kind of thing for Ronald Reagan in 1983; and our research
indicates that a majority of them over time voted for a total of 28
emergency spending measures totalling over $100 billion when Reagan
and Bush were President, in those administrations.  And many of those
purposes were not nearly as worthy as putting the American people
back to work.  I don't want to go back and revisit every one, but you


can do it.  You can look at the research there.  So this position
they're taking is not credible.  We have a very tough five-year
deficit reduction plan.  All these costs are covered during that time
and then some.  And the very people that are saying this has all got
to be paid for don't have much of a history on which to base their
position.  They've got 12 years of vote for stimulus measures of this
kind that had very little to with putting the American people back to
work.  So I think we've got a chance to work it out, and I'm hopeful.
We'll see what happens today and tomorrow.  I'm feeling pretty good
about it.

     THE PRESS:  Thank you

                                 END       10:10 A.M. EDT

 -30-

--
Canada Remote Systems - Toronto, Ontario
416-629-7000/629-7044

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53806
From: jrmst8+@pitt.edu (Joseph R Mcdonald)
Subject: Re: Wirtz is a weenie

In article <wfozwMi00Uh_E1kyE=@andrew.cmu.edu> rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu (Robert Angelo Pleshar) writes:
>In other TV news, the Penguins announced yesterday that they will have 3
>fewer broadcast TV games, and will have 22(!) games on some sort of
>subscription / pay-per-view system. Yuck.

This is incorrect.  This year the Pens had 61 games on "free" TV and 6
games on PPV.  Next year they will have 62 games on free TV and 22 on 
a subscription basis.  

You actually get 1 more free game than last year, and there will be no
more "radio-only" games.

Its a good deal.  Last year, everybody bitched about Baldwin "breaking
up the team".  Now, he goes out of his way to keep the nucleus of this
team together and that takes money.  He comes up with a creative way
to generate more revenue so he can afford this team, and people bitch
some more.

Everybody wants something for nothing.

Dean

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dean J. Falcione                                      "Badges? What badges? We 
(using jrmst8 by permission                            Don't need no stinkin'
 of the owner, Joe McDonald)                           badges!"

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53807
From: shah@pitt.edu (Ravindra S Shah)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage

Joseph B Stiehm (joe13+@pitt.edu) wrote:


: I have one complaint for the cameramen doing the Jersey-Pitt series:  Show
: the shots, not the hits.  On more than one occassion the camera zoomed in
: on a check along the boards while the puck was in the slot.  They panned
: back to show the rebound.  Maybe Mom's camera people were a little more 
: experienced.



: Joseph Stiehm

Exactly.  That is my biggest complaint about the coverage so far.
Follow that damn puck!




--
Ravi Shah
shah+@pitt.edu

"La mu'sica ideas portara'  	approx. translation: "Music will bring ideas
y siempre continuara'				     and will continue forever
sonido electro'nico				     electronic sound
decibel sinte'tico"	-Musique non stop-	     synthetic decibel"
                           -Kraftwerk

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53808
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: If You Were Pat Burns ...

In article <1r1chb$5l2@jethro.Corp.Sun.COM> jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM writes:
>
>
>What are the Leafs to do?  I am a Leaf supporter and
>I say the Leafs are going down in four unless there
>is nothing short of a miracle or a stroke of genenius hits
>Pat Burns.
>
>If you were Pat Burns what would you do?
>

Pray for the Wings to become lazy and overconfident...the Wings
can only lose the series...Toronto cannot win it.  Take away
Doug Gilmour and the Leafs are an old Tampa Bay.

The Leafs deserve a lot of credit for their diligent effort
during the regular season...but if Detroit puts in a reasonable
effort, this is not a contest.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53809
From: LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall)
Subject: Re: If You Were Pat Burns ...

In article <1r1chb$5l2@jethro.Corp.Sun.COM>
jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM (Jason Cockroft) writes:
 
>Suggestions:  Clarke-Anderson-Gilmour vs. Sheppard-Yserbeart-??
>              Andreychuck-Borchevsy-??  vs. Detroit checking line
>              Toronto's checking line  vs. Yzerman-Fedorov-Probert (pray lots)
>
 
 Well, I'm a Wings fan and I think the FIRST thing that you should do is to
get the opponent's line combinations correct before you try to match up anyone
with them.  There is no Yzerman-Fedorov-Probert line, except for maybe on a
powerplay.  These three players usually play on three different lines.
Which would mean that Toronto's checking line would have to pull a triple
shift.
The Wings' lines usually look like this:
 
                      Gallant-Yzerman-Ciccarelli
 
                      Kozlov-Fedorov-Drake
 
                      Kennedy-Burr-Probert
 
                      Ysebaert-Primeau-Sheppard
 
Oh by the way:  Start praying! : )
 
Laurie Marshall
Wayne State University
Detroit, Michigan
Go Wings!!!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53810
From: franjion@spot.Colorado.EDU (John Franjione)
Subject: Re: Bay area media (Wings-Leafs coverage)

maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:

>In <DREIER.93Apr19195132@durban.berkeley.edu> dreier@durban.berkeley.edu (Roland Dreier) writes:

>>The San Francisco Bay area media is reporting tonight that the Detroit
>>Red Wings beat the Toronto Maple Leafs 6-3.  Can someone who is not
>>part of the media conspiracy against the Leafs tell me how the game
>>really went (I am expecting a 4-0 win for the Leafs, shutout for
>>Potvin, hat trick for Andreychuk and a goal and 3 assists for
>>Gilmour).  If the Leafs really lost, how many penalties did whichever
>>biased ref was at the game have to call against the Leafs to let the
>>Red Wings win?

>Ah yes.  California.  Did the San Francisco Bay area media report that
>Joe Montana is rumoured to be the leading candidate to replace fired
>San Jose Sharks coach George Kingston?  Apparently Montana is not only
>coveted for his winning attitude, but as a playing coach he will be
>expected to quarterback the powerplay.

Good comeback, Rog.  Your quick wit and intelligence continues to
amaze everyone.

-- 
John Franjione
Department of Chemical Engineering
University of Colorado, Boulder
franjion@spot.colorado.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53811
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: If You Were Pat Burns ...

In <1993Apr20.181549.11414@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:

>Pray for the Wings to become lazy and overconfident...the Wings
>can only lose the series...Toronto cannot win it.  Take away
>Doug Gilmour and the Leafs are an old Tampa Bay.

Right Gerald.  And take away Bob Probert and the Wings are dead Octopuses.

>The Leafs deserve a lot of credit for their diligent effort
>during the regular season...but if Detroit puts in a reasonable
>effort, this is not a contest.

Let's wait for the body to get cold before we start in with the eulogies
hm?  They have only lost ONE game.  The game was in Detroit after all and
Potvin did not have his best evening.  Nobody that I saw thought that the
Leafs would sweep the Wings.  It looks like it might go six.  The Leafs
will take the Wings home advantage away in the next game.


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53812
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: Goalie masks

In article <1993Apr16.164811.21637@newshub.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:


>[...] and I'll give Fuhr's new one an honourable mention, although I haven't
>seen it closely yet (it looked good from a distance!).  

This is the new Buffalo one, the second since he's been with the
Sabres?  I recall a price tag of over $700 just for the paint job on
that mask, and a total price of almost $1500.  Ouch.  




-- 
Valerie Hammerl			Birtday -(n)- An event when friends get 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu	together, set your dessert on fire, then
acscvjh@ubms.cc.buffalo.edu	laugh and sing while you frantically try 
v085pwwpz@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu  to blow it out.  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53813
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

In article <1993Apr17.062622.25380@news.clarkson.edu> farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy) writes:

>In fact, the tradition has been passed down to their affiliate
>in Adirondack. In Gm 6 of last yr's finals, an 8 legged creature was
>hurled onto the frozen pond and landed right at the feet of ref
>Lance Roberts.

It may have been passed to Toronto, but I've even seen an octopus at
the Aud -- last year's Bruins-Sabres game.  I knew all about the
Detroit version, but seeing at the Aud was a bit puzzling.  :-)

-- 
Valerie Hammerl			Birtday -(n)- An event when friends get 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu	together, set your dessert on fire, then
acscvjh@ubms.cc.buffalo.edu	laugh and sing while you frantically try 
v085pwwpz@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu  to blow it out.  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53814
From: stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber)
Subject: Re: Pens playoff radio coverage (was:Re: Radio stations)

In article <gp2011-200493131949@m248-68.bgsu.edu>, gp2011@andy.bgsu.edu (George Pavlic) writes:
> 
> NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!  Who's the mindscheme(?) behind this one -- Ted
> Simmons?  As the saying goes, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."  I'm 230
> miles from home (during the school year) and will never be able to pick up
> DVE.  At least now I can sort of make out what Mike and Steigy say through
> all the static on KDKA.  This just may be enough reason for me to transfer
> to Duquesne and live at home.  Who's going to announce on DVE anyway? 
> Paulson and Krenn?  (Just kidding.)
> 
> George

Don't kid around... They just might listen.

Kevin L. Stamber
Purdue University
waiting to hear 'Free Bird' as the new Penguins theme


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53815
From: stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber)
Subject: LIST OF TEE TIMES AT METROPOLITAN TORONTO GOLF COURSES FOR MONDAY

;^)

Kevin L. Stamber
Purdue University
...and Phil Kirzyc (The Kielbasa Kid) will roam the Arena for interviews.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53816
From: jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio)
Subject: ABC's announcers, ESPN's (lack of) coverage (WAS: Re: Atlanta ...)


In article <1993Apr19.160356.19160@newshub.ists.ca>, dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:
 
|> Ok, here's the solution to your problem.  Move to Canada.  Yesterday I was able
|> to watch FOUR games...the NJ-PITT at 1:00 on ABC, LA-CAL at 3:00 (CBC), 
|> BUFF-BOS at 7:00 (TSN and FOX), and MON-QUE at 7:30 (CBC).  I think that if
|> each series goes its max I could be watching hockey playoffs for 40-some odd
|> consecutive nights (I haven't counted so that's a pure guess).

The worst thing is that this is exactly what I did last year.  I had the Rangers
on MSG, and the two different games on SCNY and SCA on at the same time.  Yes,
I'd rather have SC cover it, just for the amount of coverage.

 
|> Btw, those ABC commentaters were great!  I was quite impressed; they seemed
|> to know that their audience wasn't likely to be well-schooled in hockey lore
|> and they did an excellent job.  They were quite impartial also, IMO.

I think Thorne earns his money.  The best part is that he is the same way when 
he is earning his $$ from SportsChannel as the Devils announcer (i.e.,
unbiased).  He goes orgasmic for goals, despite which team scores, and even more 
excited (if possible) for great saves.  He did a good job of explaining certain 
things to non-hockey types without offending those of us who follow the sport
(unlike NBC's clowns for the ASG).

-JPC

(Ob. Playoff-time flame-bait)

      Don't any of you Pittsburgh fans tell me how Mike Lang(e) is better. 
      Maybe if he were a little spontaneous, rather than reading rehearsed
      lines of B.S having nothing to do with hockey he would be better.

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John P. Curcio 		          Go Bruins!		   Philips Laboratories
jpc@philabs.philips.com 			           345 Scarborough Road
(914) 945-6442               	 		     Briarcliff Manor, NY 10510 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53817
From: lee139@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (Steve Lee)
Subject: Re: LIST OF TEE TIMES AT METROPOLITAN TORONTO GOLF COURSES FOR MONDAY


In article <C5spEC.EuC@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber) writes:

>Kevin L. Stamber
>Purdue University
>...and Phil Kirzyc (The Kielbasa Kid) will roam the Arena for interviews.


Woops!  This is rec.sport.hockey! Not rec.sport.golf!  Hope you check the
newsgroup header next time before posting!

Steve

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Lee      *      University of Western Ontario      *      London, Canada 
                      lee139@obelix.gaul.csd.uwo.ca          
_______________________________________________________________________________


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53818
From: ingo@sunee.uwaterloo.ca (Electroholic)
Subject: Re: Hockey & Hispanic market

In article <115868@bu.edu> icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera) writes:
>
>In article <saross01.734885336@starbase.spd.louisville.edu>, saross01@starbase.spd.louisville.edu (Stacey A. Ross) writes:
>|> In <C5I2s2.3Bt@odin.corp.sgi.com> rickc@wrigley.corp.sgi.com (Richard Casares) writes:
>|> >You'll have a hard time selling any sport to a community that
>|> >can't play it on account of availability or financial reasons.
>|> >Hockey is pretty much a sport for the white and well off.
>
>What is this crap? I'm only interested in intelligent discussion. If you 
>can't answer my question, just say so. Can anyone else answer the ques.?
>

	It's not really crap you know... only half crap ;-)   From what i 
understand it's very expensive to play hockey south of the border... 
(actually it's not that cheap up hear either... though once you have all the
equipement it's not more than $300 a year... actually i haven' played in
about 8 years so i could be off a bit... )  In the states, where ice time
is considerably more expensive it can cost over a thousand a year... compare 
this to baseball and you'll see that hockey is a sport for the well-to-do...
And this brings up the fact that the well-to-do in the US are majority white...

BTW: what was the original question... i think it has to do with the Hispanic
communtiy and playing hockey.... 


					Cheers!
						i.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|  ingo@sunee.uwaterloo.ca                   | The more violent the body     |
|  iwweigel@descartes.uwaterloo.ca           | contact of the sports you     | 
|  ingo@electrical.watstar.uwaterloo.ca      | watch, the lower your class.  |
|  iwweigele@electrical.watstar.uwaterloo.ca |         -- Paul Fussell       |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If the University of Waterloo had on opinion, this probably wouldn't be it...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53819
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

In article <1993Apr20.130822.603@exu.ericsson.se> lmcdapi@noah.ericsson.se writes:
>In article K00WBM850Z5v@andrew.cmu.edu, am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu (Anna Matyas) writes:
>>
>>Michael Collingridge writes:
>>
>>>And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
>>>resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
>>>team captain trivia would be appreciated.
>>
>>Wasn't Ron Francis captain of the Whalers when he was traded to
>>Pittsburgh?
>>
>>Mom.
>
>Chris Chelios was Montreal's co-captain with Guy Carbonneau when he
>was traded to Chicago for Denis Savard, and Peter Stastny was captain 
>of the Quebec Nordiques when he was traded to New-Jersey. Also Mark 
>Messier was captain of the Edmonton Oilers when he was traded to New
>York. How about Dale Hawerchuk with Winnipeg when he was traded to
>Buffalo, was he captain too ? I think so. I should not forget Wayne 
>(you know who) when he was traded to L.A. he was captain. Didn't they 
>strip Wendel Clark of his captaincy in Toronto ?
>

Buffalo seems to have started a tradition of trading its captains.

Pat LaFontaine was awarded the Captaincy when Mike Ramsey was forced
to give it up (Ramsey's now a Penguin).  Ramsey inherited it from Mike
Foligno (who's now a leaf).  He in turn had inherited it from Lindy
Ruff, who went I forget where.  Ruff had it from Perreault, who
retired, so I guess that's where the streak started.  Or did it?
After all, Danny Gare was captain before him, and he went to Detroit.
Jim Scoenfeld, Gerry Meehan, and Floyd Smith are the others, in
reverse order, last to first.  I was a bit young at the time, so I'm
not sure of the fate of Schoenfeld, but he ultimately went to Detroit
and Boston.  Meehan went to Vancouver, Atlanta and Washington.  Smith
seems to have hung up his skates after Buffalo, but I don't know if
the captaincy was removed before or after that, or how many games he
played for Buffalo.  This is actually getting fascinating.  :-)

Captaincy in Buffalo is a sure sign you're to be traded, almost,
unless you're a franchise player.

-- 
Valerie Hammerl			Birtday -(n)- An event when friends get 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu	together, set your dessert on fire, then
acscvjh@ubms.cc.buffalo.edu	laugh and sing while you frantically try 
v085pwwpz@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu  to blow it out.  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53820
From: spiegel@sgi413.msd.lmsc.lockheed.com (Mark Spiegel)
Subject: Re: Bay area media (Wings-Leafs coverage)

In article <1993Apr20.031840.18636@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>In <DREIER.93Apr19195132@durban.berkeley.edu> dreier@durban.berkeley.edu (Roland Dreier) writes:
>
>>The San Francisco Bay area media is reporting tonight that the Detroit
>>Red Wings beat the Toronto Maple Leafs 6-3.  Can someone who is not
>>part of the media conspiracy against the Leafs tell me how the game
>>really went (I am expecting a 4-0 win for the Leafs, shutout for
>>Potvin, hat trick for Andreychuk and a goal and 3 assists for
>>Gilmour).  If the Leafs really lost, how many penalties did whichever
>>biased ref was at the game have to call against the Leafs to let the
>>Red Wings win?
>
>Ah yes.  California.  Did the San Francisco Bay area media report that
>Joe Montana is rumoured to be the leading candidate to replace fired
>San Jose Sharks coach George Kingston?  Apparently Montana is not only
>coveted for his winning attitude, but as a playing coach he will be
>expected to quarterback the powerplay.

	Close Roger, but no banana, er avocado or is it artichoke ?!?

	Geracie in the Murky News said Kingston will be the new 49ers
	quarterback.  I'm still trying to determine if he is kidding
	or not :).  If I happen to pound down enuff pints sometime 
	this week I'll go back and check what stooper idiot Purdy
	said in his column.  That ought to be worth a few Leafs, I
	mean Laughs.   If I'm really depressed I'll read the SF Comicle.

	mark

 just say

 #####  #     #    #    ######  #    #   #####           ____                  
#     # #     #   # #   #     # #   #   #     #            -_ --__             
#       #     #  #   #  #     # #  #    #                    \    --_          
 #####  ####### #     # ######  ###      #####                \      -_        
      # #     # ####### #   #   #  #          #                |       \       
#     # #     # #     # #    #  #   #   #     #    __________ /         \_____ 
 #####  #     # #     # #     # #    #   #####  ___________ /            \_____
______________________________________________________________________________
Mark Spiegel  spiegel@lmsc.lockheed.com   Cow Palace:108/K/8  Epicenter: ?


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53821
From: slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

NJ> : >And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been 
traded,  
NJ> : >resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any 
other 
NJ> : >team captain trivia would be appreciated.    
 
Mike Foligno was captain of the Buffalo Sabres when he was traded to
Toronto.
 
Stephen Legge
SLEGGE@kean.ucs.mun.ca
\

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53822
From: e8l6@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (Rocket)
Subject: NHL Playoff leaders as of April 19, 1993

    Playoff leaders as of April 19, 1993

    Player       Team   GP  G   A  Pts +/- PIM

    M.Lemieux    PIT     1   2   2   4   0   0
    Juneau       BOS     1   1   3   4   0   0
    Noonan       CHI     1   3   0   3   0   0
    Mogilny      BUF     1   2   1   3   0   0
    Neely        BOS     1   2   1   3   0   0
    Brown        STL     1   1   2   3   0   0
    Jagr         PIT     1   1   2   3   0   0
    Oates        BOS     1   0   3   3   0   0
    Carson       LA      1   2   0   2   0   0
    Hunter       WAS     1   2   0   2   0   0
    Stevens      NJ      1   2   0   2   0   0
    Cullen       TOR     1   1   1   2   0   0
    Hull         STL     1   1   1   2   0   0
    Khristich    WAS     1   1   1   2   0   0
    Linden       VAN     1   1   1   2   0   0
    Racine       DET     1   1   1   2   0   0
    Shanahan     STL     1   1   1   2   0   0
    Sydor        LA      1   1   1   2   0   0
    Yzerman      DET     1   1   1   2   0   0
    Bure         VAN     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Coffey       DET     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Drake        DET     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Emerson      STL     1   0   2   2   0   0
    G.Courtnall  VAN     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Johansson    WAS     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Lapointe     QUE     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Niedermayer  NJ      1   0   2   2   0   0
    Ramsey       PIT     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Sandstrom    LA      1   0   2   2   0   0
    Smehlik      BUF     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Stevens      PIT     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Adams        VAN     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Barr         NJ      1   1   0   1   0   0
    Bellows      MON     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Burr         DET     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Chiasson     DET     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Craven       VAN     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Dahlquist    CAL     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Dionne       MON     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Felsner      STL     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Ferraro      NYI     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Francis      PIT     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Gilmour      TOR     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Hannan       BUF     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Heinze       BOS     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Howe         DET     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Huddy        LA      1   1   0   1   0   0
    King         WIN     1   1   0   1   0   0
    LaFontaine   BUF     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Lefebvre     TOR     1   1   0   1   0   0
    McSorley     LA      1   1   0   1   0   0
    Millen       LA      1   1   0   1   0   0
    Ronning      VAN     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Rucinsky     QUE     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Sakic        QUE     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Sheppard     DET     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Steen        WIN     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Suter        CAL     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Sweeney      BUF     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Tipett       PIT     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Yawney       CAL     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Young        QUE     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Barnes       WIN     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Borschevsky  TOR     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Brunet       MON     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Chelios      CHI     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Ciccarelli   DET     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Clark        TOR     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Desjardins   MON     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Dipietro     MON     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Donnelly     LA      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Driver       NJ      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Duchesne     QUE     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Ellett       TOR     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Elynuik      WAS     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Flatley      NYI     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Fleury       CAL     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Gallant      DET     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Gill         TOR     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Granato      LA      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Gretzky      LA      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Guerin       NJ      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Hawerchuk    BUF     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Holik        NJ      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Housley      WIN     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Janney       STL     1   0   1   1   0   0
    K.Brown      CHI     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Khmylev      BUF     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Krygier      WAS     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Larmer       CHI     1   0   1   1   0   0
    MacInnis     CAL     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Matteau      CHI     1   0   1   1   0   0
    McEachern    PIT     1   0   1   1   0   0
    McLean       VAN     1   0   1   1   0   0
    McRae        STL     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Mullen       PIT     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Muller       MON     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Murphy       PIT     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Murzyn       VAN     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Otto         CAL     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Pearson      TOR     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Pivonka      WAS     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Primeau      DET     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Probert      DET     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Reichel      CAL     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Ricci        QUE     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Robitaille   LA      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Roenick      CHI     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Samuelsson   PIT     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Semak        NJ      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Shannon      WIN     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Shuchuk      LA      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Sundin       QUE     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Sutter       CHI     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Taylor       LA      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Tocchet      PIT     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Vaske        NYI     1   0   1   1   0   0
-- 

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-                                                                           -
-    Maurice Richard                                                        -

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53823
From: slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca
Subject: Leafs versus Wings

How long can the Leafs play short-handed and still be expected to
score?  They did some fine penely-killing in the first (2 men down
for a couple of minutes at one point) but they just couldn't keep it 
up.  They spent virtually the entire game either short-handed or
just coming off a penelty -- as soon as they'd get re-grouped, they're
penalized again!
 
Sheesh -- like Gilmour said after the 1st -- you can't go calling 
every little push an shove in a game like that.  And if you're going
to, you have to do it for both teams.
 
Pearson (one of my four favorite Leafs) played like a bonehead -- I
saw him personally screw up at least 2 good scoring opportunities, and
then he got that *bonehead* 5-minute major high-sticking penalty.
 
Cullen has gotten stronger since his return from injury a hand-full of
games ago and he played a good game.  If the other players on his line
can smarten up, that line should do okay.  Clark's got to get tough --
he's got to intimidate and go for the net.  Send Clark up the left 
wing over the blue line a couple times... his patented wrist shot will
put some numbers on the board... and Pearson... heck, maybe he should
be benched.
 
I hate to repeat Grapes, but where the heck was Foligno?  Zezel can't
do all the checking himself -- and get MacLlwain on the move... we 
need some speed out there!  Keep Potvin in net, he did okay 
considering... although (like I said a couple weeks ago) Potvin 
messed up in a couple games in the AHL playoffs last year -- he can 
easily do it again.
 
My prediction last week was Toronto in 7 -- that the games DET wins 
will be blow-outs and the game TOR wins will be close -- I still stand
by that.
 
Don't fret, Leafs fans, in order to win in 7, the other team has to
win 3! :-)
 
Burns is going to make some magic -- he'll mix up some lines.  Match
the Wings line-per-line.  He'll have his team checking hard, and he'll
never let them get out-numbered in their own end.  The Leafs will win
Wednesday night... and will take 1 or their home games (probably the
first one).
 
Stephen LEAF Legge
SLEGGE@kean.ucs.mun.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53824
From: filipows@spk.hp.com (Dennis Filipowski)
Subject: ? Octopus

   During the Detroit game Mon night there were octopus thrown on
   the ice what is the meaning or symbolism here?  They used to
   throw fish on the ice here in Spokane afew years ago. I never 
   knew where this came from.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53825
Subject: Re: NHLPA poll (partial stats/results)
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <ofnmaO_00iV1A6kYd2@andrew.cmu.edu> Young-Soo Che <yc25+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>All these people who send in their polls should take a closer look at
>NJD, they are a very deep team, with two very capable goalies, and
>excellent forwards and defensemen.  Shooter in Richer, an all around do
>it all in Todd, chef Stasny-master of a thousand dishes, power play

Kevin Todd is an Oiler and has been one for months. How closely do you follow
the Devils, anyway? Jeez....

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53826
Subject: Re: Tie Breaker....(Isles and Devils)
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <lrw509f@rpi.edu>, wangr@vccsouth22.its.rpi.edu ( Rex Wang ) writes:
> 	Are people here stupid or what??? It is a tie breaker, of cause they
> have to have the same record. How can people be sooooo stuppid to put win as
> first in the list for tie breaker??? If it is a tie breaker, how can there be
> different record???? Man, I thought people in this net are good with hockey.
> I might not be great in Math, but tell me how can two teams ahve the same points
> with different record??? Man...retard!!!!!! Can't believe people actually put
> win as first in a tie breaker......

Then allow me to enlighten you, Rex. You see, there's a thing called a tie. 
A tie is worth one point (I know, I know. You're not good at math. But bear
with me). A win is worth two points. So, getting two ties is the same as 
getting one win. If your team played two games, won one and lost one, you'd
have two points. If my team played two games and tied them both, we'd also
have two points. We'd be tied in the standings even though our records are
different.

Perhaps you should learn something about hockey before posting again. (I am
starting to sound like Roger or what?)

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53827
From: ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca)
Subject: Re: Wings will win

gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:

>All of this is fine.  I never said that Murray was a bad GM.  I merely said
>that he isn't the best GM in hockey- or even a contender for that honor.
>If Murray is as great as you claim- the Wings would have won the Stanley Cup
>by now- probably more than once.  If he was as great a GM as you claim

I think you missed one of my points there.  It takes *more* than a great
GM to win a stanley cup, even once.  Some of the guys on the list you
gave earlier never won one.  I agree that you and I could probably argue
back and forth for days to no avail about who is the best GM in hockey-
that is a matter of opinion, and who is to say my opinion is any better 
than yours or yours than mine?  But the point of my *original* original
post (if not well stated) was that Murray has the GM abilities but not
the coaching abilities.  Which leads to below:

>and he was as poor a coach as you claim- he would have been intelligent
>enough to hire the coach to push the team to the next level of success.

I think at this point there's a personal, emotional element involved here
which transcends Murray's logical thought.  As outsiders, it's fine for 
us to say, "He should hire a different coach."  In fact, he has talked about
doing so in the past.  But, the press (here in Detroit, at least) has so
built up this business about Murray never getting past the second round of
the playoffs as a coach, that I think he has taken it upon himself to 
prove to the world that he *is* capable of coaching a team past the second
round.  He needs to, as the papers say, "get that monkey off his back."
So it becomes a matter not of intelligence, but of pride.  Is it foolish
to let pride stand in the way of sound logic?  Perhaps, but we're all
a little that way from time to time.  I think eventually he'll step down
from behind the bench and concentrate on his GM duties, and the team will
improve as a result.

I think his coaching duties take away time he might have otherwise spent
on GM work.  In that sense, once he steps down as coach, we'll see how
good of a GM he really is.

>But Murray is an average (unspectacular) NHL coach and a pretty good GM
>so none of this is true anyway.

I may not agree with everything you've said, but it's been fun discussing
it with you.

>Gregmeister

--Randy


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53828
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Subject: Re: Schedule...

In article <1993Apr20.052907.1625@news.columbia.edu> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>I can't believe that ESPN is making SportsChannel America look good.

But only in NY,NJ, Philadelphia, and Chicago. Everywhere else, the only
reason SportsChannel was available was for local baseball broadcasts.
And local baseball pre-empted the NHL playoffs. Thus far into this
playoff season, ESPN/ABC has given me more hockey in 2 days (1 game)
than SportsChannel did (0 games).

If people want hockey on TV, they should watch hockey on TV. I bet the
ratings for hockey on Sunday on ABC went into the toilet. Next week, there
will be far fewer ABC affiliates with hockey.

Someone in this thread said that he wouldn't watch the games even if
they were on TV, and this is a r.s.h. regular contributor!

Xenophobes north of border needn't fear the US-Americanization of "our"
game, because US-Americans will never figure out how to market hockey
here. Support your team; support your game.
-- 
 Mike Eisler, mre@Eng.Sun.Com  ``Not only are they [Leafs] the best team, but
 their fans are even more intelligent and insightful than Pittsburgh's.  Their
 players are mighty bright, too.  I mean, he really *was* going to get his
 wallet back, right?'' Jan Brittenson 3/93, on Leaf/Pen woofers in
 rec.sport.hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53829
From: yaska@eecg.toronto.edu (Yaska Sankar)
Subject: Re: Nords 3 - Habs 2 in O.T. We was robbed!!

In article <1993Apr19.141842.18456@newshub.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:
>In article <18APR93.25909598.0086@VM1.MCGILL.CA> JBE5 <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA> writes:
>>Aargh!
>>
>>Paul Stewart is the worst and most biased ref. presently in the NHL.
>>He called a total of 4 penalties on the Habs and one on the Nordiques.
>>The Nords' penalty came in O.T.  Stewart, being an ex-Nordique himself,
>>was looking to call penalties on the Habs while letting the Nords
>>get away with murder...WE WAS ROBBED!!!!
>
>No.  Patrick Roy is the reason the game was lost, and Ron Hextall is the
>reason Quebec won.  Everybody said it would come down to goaltending, that
>goaltending was the key, etc etc.  Well, the key doesn't quite fit if you're
>Montreal.  

I don't buy this at all. Roy was the reason the game was tied... and that
would *not* have been the case had Dionne kept his cool. 
Hextall gave up 2 very questionable goals himself ...
Both Dionne's and Bellows' shots were misplayed by Hextall, but just because
his gaffes were early in the game, no one seems to care. Roy stood on his head 
for the first 15 minutes of the game when the Nords were rushing from 
end-to-end. Kamensky's mini-break after the tying goal and the first shot by 
Young in OT were both excellent chances stopped by Roy. Roy outplayed Hextall 
for most of the game, but Roy becomes the villain and Hextall the hero 
because Roy's team didn't make full use of their opportunities.

Hextall, on the other hand, had a lot of lucky bounces ... he played very 
well, but the Haller shot off the post in OT, the rebound bouncing over 
Bellows' stick, the Brunet breakaway, the 3 chances for LeClair ... all 
those opportunities were *not* finished off by Montreal, and it cost them.
Hextall wasn't particularly brilliant on those plays ... 

>Blaming Stewart is just an
>excuse to avoid facing the fact that Roy allowed what was one of the worst
>goals he could possibly allow.  He even saw the whole shot, dammit.

Sure, no excuse ... but it was just the 1 goal. The timing stank, but against
an explosive team like Quebec, they gave them 1 opportunity too many with
a powerplay that was totally unnecessary.

>Montreal played a solid game (although they still don't know how to clear
>traffic in front of the net; the loss of Schneider will hurt even more). 

I disagree. Roy played well because he wasn't screened the whole night. 
The defense, for the 1st time this season, played remarkably, keeping Sakic,
Nolan, and Sundin  out of the slot most of the night.

>Normally I would say that any team that blows a 2-goal lead with less than 
>five, let alone two, minutes to go in regulation time IN A PLAYOFF GAME 
>ESPECIALLY needs to be smacked upside their collective heads. But I don't
>think this was a team loss (although Keane should have been able to clear 
>the zone just prior to the first Quebec goal).  

This most certainly was a team loss... Leclair missed his opportunities,
as did Bellows and Brunet. Dionne took a bad penalty. Damphousse and Lebeau
were *silent*. Carbonneau and Savard were a step behind all night. Roy gave
up the bad goal. Roy, by no means, can be singled out for this loss.

>Roy is paid big money to 
>play.  He looked like a player in an industrial league on Sakic's shot.

And Hextall didn't on Dionne's goal? Please. Roy is paid big money because
that is his value compared to other goalies ... and he still is in the top 5,
when you consider the defense, or lack of one, that played in front of him
for most of the season.

>Demers should start Racicot in the next game.  If not that, he should let
>the damn team read the papers for the next day or two....and maybe this
>article, if possible.

The Montreal media is the quickest to heap praise and then hurl derogatory
comments against the Habs. They are no better than uninformed fans. Why should
they read the papers? They played 58 minutes of "Burnsian" hockey to shut
down Quebec. All they need tonight, and for the rest of the series is the 
extra 2.

Red Light to face Quebec...rubbish. That's a guaranteed way to end the
series 4-0. Who would be taught a lesson by this ?
The fans, the media, and Racicot, perhaps. Certainly not the rest of the team.

>I didn't think the wrap-around was as bad as the second goal.  I also didn't
>think Scott Young should have gotten around the defender (can't remember who)
>in the first place.  But you are correct, it shouldn't have gone in
>regardless.

If you mean the goal should never have gone in, because there should never
have been an OT, then I agree. But the goal itself was a great piece of work
by Young. Roy had both the near and far posts covered, but Young flipped the
puck up under Roy's arm as he wrapped-around the net ... not a bad goal at all.

Yaska  ! yaska@eecg.toronto.edu ! Dept. of Electrical & Computer Engineering
Sankar !                        ! University of Toronto, Toronto, Canada

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53830
From: gp2011@andy.bgsu.edu (George Pavlic)
Subject: Re: Matt Militzok please read!

In article <gp2011-200493132808@m248-68.bgsu.edu>, gp2011@andy.bgsu.edu
(George Pavlic) wrote:
> 
> 
> Sorry to everyone for wasting space.  Matt, the other day you posted that
> you were doing a mailing list of playoff stats.  I lost your address. 
> Please put me on that list.  Thanks.
> 
> George 

Sorry again.  I guess you need my address.

gp2011@mailserver.bgsu.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53831
From: 900073s@dragon.acadiau.ca (Donald Smith)
Subject: Re: LIST OF TEE TIMES AT METROPOLITAN TORONTO GOLF COURSES FOR MONDAY

lee139@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (Steve Lee) writes:


>In article <C5spEC.EuC@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber) writes:

>Woops!  This is rec.sport.hockey! Not rec.sport.golf!  Hope you check the
>newsgroup header next time before posting!

>Steve Lee      *      University of Western Ontario      *      London, Canada 
>                      lee139@obelix.gaul.csd.uwo.ca          

  Actually Steve, I think he was refering to the Leafs, and when they can
be expected to hit the greens...

-- 
  ACADIA AXEMEN! CIAU CHAMPIONS, 1993! 
  Donald.Smith@dragon.acadiau.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53832
From: sclark@epas.utoronto.ca (Susan Clark)
Subject: Re: Bay area media (Wings-Leafs coverage)

	Yeah, the news is true...the Leafs lost to the Wings 6-3.
Wish I could say I'd seen the whole game but my husband wanted
to watch "Young Guns II" on another channel. Sometime between
the first time I tuned in and d saw the Leafs tie and the next time
I tuned in and heard the score was 5-1, something happened.
	Please no woofing from Red Wings fans.  They're my third
favourite team, and if they make it past the Leafs I'll wish them
luck.  As for Potvin...well, it WAS his fist playoff game.

Susan Carroll-Clark
Who likes ANYONE Doug Gilmour plays for

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53833
From: steve@sep.Stanford.EDU (Steve Cole)
Subject: Re: SHARKS:  Kingston Fired!!!

In article <1993Apr20.165132.9777@adobe.com>, snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols) writes:
|> In article <1993Apr20.085337.27224@leland.Stanford.EDU> terry@garfield.Stanford.EDU (Terry Wong) writes:
|> >I think that Jack Ferreira's firing eventually led to Kingston's
|> >firing.  You mention consistency of vision.  I think the
|> >Sharks lost that with the loss of Ferreira.  There has never
|> >been a 3 headed G.M. that has ever worked.  You need one
|> >person making the personnel decisions at the top, not
|> >management by committee.  The conventional wisdom
|> >from around the league is that Ferreira would have
|> >made the moves that would have fielded a better product
|> >on the ice.
|> 
|> How exactly would Ferreira accomplished this?  The three-headed GM-ship has
|> taken a lot of heat, but nobody's explained how things would have been any
|> different had Ferreira still been there.  Would Ferreira have made more
|> trades?  Who would have he had traded?  Would he have made fewer trades?
|> Who should not have been traded?

I think the three-headed GM's guiding principle was to keep veterans
in favor of youngsters only if they offered a "significant" advantage.
At the end of last season, the contracts of several veterans with somewhat
maginal contributions (Fenton, Bozek, Anderson, and a couple others I
can't remember) were bought out. The idea was that youngsters could
play almost as well, and had the potential to improve where these
older guys did not. 
And they traded Mullen, because he wanted to go, not because he
wasn't good enough, but I think they were a bit too optimistic
in thinking they could make up for his contributions.
An example from this season, Skriko was brought in on a trial basis
but not kept, because of his age. I thought he was a decent
contributor worth keeping around.

The youth movement has its advantages; look at Gaudreau who
might still be in KC if more veterans had been kept around. But
you have to find the right balance.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Cole  (steve@sep.stanford.edu, apple!sep!steve)
Department of Geophysics, Stanford University, Stanford, CA 94305

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53834
From: kozloce@wkuvx1.bitnet
Subject: Re: Tie Breaker....(Isles and Devils)DIR

In article <1993Apr18.222115.6525@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca>, maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
> In <lrw509f@rpi.edu> wangr@vccsouth22.its.rpi.edu ( Rex Wang ) writes:
> 
>>I might not be great in Math, but tell me how can two teams ahve the same points
>>with different record??? Man...retard!!!!!! Can't believe people actually put
>>win as first in a tie breaker......
> 
> Well I don't see any smileys here.  I am trying to figure out if the poster
> is a dog or a wordprocessor.  Couldn't be neither.  Both are smarter than
> this.
> 
> "I might not be great in Math"
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
>                                            "So many morons...
> rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Roger? Lecture someone on not using smileys? What sweet hipocracy...

KOZ

LETS GO CAPS!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53835
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Playoff Hockey Pool: Game 1 standings

Here are the standings after game 1 of each of the divisional semi-finals.
(Hey, look who's #4!)  I'll try to post the standings after "each game"
(i.e. every two days).

I managed to recover the email lost up to Saturday night, so all I'm missing
is mail that arrived between early Saturday morning and Sunday afternoon.
Many people re-sent their teams, so you may have received two replies back
from me.  If your team name is not on this list, please resend your team
to me and I'll see what I can do.  Any kind of "proof" you sent it on the
weekend will help your case.  :-)  Seriously, this is only a fun pool and
I trust each person to be honest.

Again, sorry for any inconvenience, and I hope the pool is still fun for you.

	- Andrew


USENET Hockey Playoff Draft Standings

Posn	Team				Pts	Rem	Last Posn

1.	Sneddon Scorers                 43	25	(--)
2.	The Borg                        42	25	(--)
	Dave Wessels                    42	25	(--)
4.	Bruce's Rented Mules            41	25	(--)
	Great Expectations              41	25	(--)
	Hurricane Andrew                41	25	(--)
	Jerky Boys                      41	24	(--)
	Homesick Hawaiian               41	25	(--)
9.	give you money monday           40	25	(--)
	Einstien's Punk Band            40	25	(--)
11.	Zipper Heads                    39	25	(--)
	Tapio Repo                      39	25	(--)
	Detroit Homeboy                 39	25	(--)
	the dead ducks                  39	25	(--)
	Mike Burger                     39	25	(--)
	Test Department                 39	25	(--)
	Team Elvis                      39	25	(--)
	Craig team                      39	25	(--)
19.	Skate or Die                    38	25	(--)
	Debbie Bowles                   38	25	(--)
	Fuzzfaces Galore                38	25	(--)
	suds                            38	25	(--)
	The Campi Machine               38	25	(--)
	zachmans wingers                38	25	(--)
	Sean Forbes                     38	25	(--)
	Threepeat                       38	25	(--)
	Flamming Senators               38	25	(--)
	Team Awesome                    38	25	(--)
	A.P. BURY                       38	25	(--)
	PURDUE RICKS PENS               38	25	(--)
	GB Flyers                       38	25	(--)
	Seppo Kemppainen                38	25	(--)
33.	Paige Faults                    37	25	(--)
	weenies                         37	25	(--)
	chris roney                     37	25	(--)
	Rednecks from Hockey Hell       37	25	(--)
	Dog's Hog's                     37	25	(--)
	Mind Sweepers                   37	25	(--)
	Teem Kanada                     37	25	(--)
	Northern Lights                 37	25	(--)
	Fugazi                          37	25	(--)
	Delaware Destroyers             37	25	(--)
	Mopar Muscle Men                37	25	(--)
	Lance Hill The Boston Bruins Fa 37	25	(--)
	garryola                        37	25	(--)
	Oakville Brothers               37	25	(--)
	Sam & His Dogs                  37	25	(--)
	Cluster Buster                  37	24	(--)
	Jan Stein                       37	25	(--)
	frank's little wankers          37	25	(--)
	Milton Keynes Kings             37	25	(--)
	The promise land                37	25	(--)
	Rangers Of Destiny              37	25	(--)
54.	New Zealand Leafs               36	25	(--)
	Loaded Weapons                  36	25	(--)
	Bloom County All-Stars          36	25	(--)
	Robarts Research Rebels         36	25	(--)
	Tiger Chung Lees                36	25	(--)
	goddess of fermentation         36	25	(--)
	make beliefs                    36	25	(--)
	Rob Del Mundo                   36	25	(--)
	Heikki Salmi                    36	25	(--)
	The Underwriters                36	25	(--)
	Muller n Walker                 36	25	(--)
	Controversy Warriors            36	25	(--)
	Bjorkloven                      36	25	(--)
	Norway Killerwhales             36	25	(--)
	Holsteins SFB                   36	25	(--)
	buffalo soldiers                36	25	(--)
	Lemon Pepper Grizzly Bears      36	25	(--)
	FRACK ATTACK                    36	25	(--)
	Houdini's Magicians             36	25	(--)
	The ^&#@$#$% Rangers of 1940    36	24	(--)
	Rangers Blow                    36	25	(--)
75.	Dave Hiebert                    35	25	(--)
	Yan Loke                        35	25	(--)
	Canadian Gladiators             35	25	(--)
	littlest giants                 35	25	(--)
	Alf's All-Stars                 35	25	(--)
	The Ice Kickers                 35	25	(--)
	Beer Makes Me An Expert         35	25	(--)
	Force 25                        35	25	(--)
	Mr Creosote                     35	25	(--)
	The Goobmeister                 35	25	(--)
	The Mulberry Maulers            35	25	(--)
	Rev's Rebels                    35	25	(--)
	BOSSE                           35	25	(--)
	Zippety Doodah                  35	25	(--)
	Kramer George and Jerry         35	25	(--)
	DehraDun Maawalis               35	25	(--)
	Sludge                          35	25	(--)
	j's rock'em sock'ems            35	25	(--)
	brians bloodletters             35	25	(--)
	Grant Marven                    35	25	(--)
	Arctic Circles                  35	25	(--)
	all the kane's men              35	25	(--)
	trevor's triumph                35	25	(--)
	Mark And Steve Dreaming Again   35	25	(--)
	Goaldingers                     35	25	(--)
	Bjoern Leaguen                  35	25	(--)
	Habs Playing Golf               35	25	(--)
102.	Shigella                        34	25	(--)
	New Jersey Rob                  34	25	(--)
	Steves Superstars               34	25	(--)
	Big Bay Bombers                 34	25	(--)
	Doug Bowles                     34	25	(--)
	Neural Netters                  34	25	(--)
	LIPPE                           34	25	(--)
	Lets Go Pandas                  34	25	(--)
	Les Raisins                     34	25	(--)
	Daves knee jerk picks           34	25	(--)
	Monica Loke                     34	25	(--)
	Jason team                      34	25	(--)
	RENEB                           34	25	(--)
	Schott Shooters                 34	25	(--)
	Gilles Carmel                   34	25	(--)
	Lewey's Lakers                  34	25	(--)
	smithw                          34	25	(--)
	East City Jokers                34	25	(--)
	Daryl Turner                    34	25	(--)
	Doug Mraz                       34	25	(--)
	Skriko Wolves                   34	25	(--)
	IceMachine                      34	25	(--)
	Lamp Lighters                   34	25	(--)
	On Thin Ice                     34	25	(--)
	JOE'S A CRAK HEAD               34	25	(--)
127.	Samuel Lau (Calgary, Alberta)   33	25	(--)
	Comfortably Numb                33	25	(--)
	Reksa fans of Oulu              33	25	(--)
	Gail Hiebert                    33	25	(--)
	gee man                         33	25	(--)
	But Wait Theres more            33	25	(--)
	marcs maulers                   33	25	(--)
	Danielle Leblanc                33	25	(--)
	Bobby Schmautz Fan Club         33	25	(--)
	Ottawa Bearcats                 33	25	(--)
	Boops Bets                      33	25	(--)
	triple X                        33	25	(--)
	Timo Ojala                      33	25	(--)
	Flying pigs                     33	25	(--)
141.	The Eradicators                 32	25	(--)
	Van Isle Colonists              32	25	(--)
	Commitments                     32	25	(--)
	bure's blur                     32	25	(--)
	Great Scott                     32	25	(--)
	weasels                         32	25	(--)
	Tequila Shooters                32	25	(--)
	Whiters                         32	25	(--)
	Frasses Faceplants              32	25	(--)
	High Stickers                   32	25	(--)
	Mak Paranjape                   32	25	(--)
	Lord Stanley's Favourites       32	25	(--)
	San Jose Mahi Mahi              32	25	(--)
	Oz                              32	25	(--)
	E.I.S                           32	25	(--)
	Mann Mariners                   32	24	(--)
	JFZ Dream Team                  32	25	(--)
	Stacey Ross                     32	25	(--)
	Louisiana Psycho Killers        32	25	(--)
	La Coupe Stainless              32	25	(--)
161.	fighting amish                  31	25	(--)
	Evan Pritchard                  31	25	(--)
	Stanias Stars                   31	25	(--)
	Pens Dynasty                    31	25	(--)
	oceanweavers                    31	25	(--)
	go go gagit                     31	25	(--)
	Myllypuro Hedgehogs             31	25	(--)
	Arm & Hammer                    31	25	(--)
	Legzryx                         31	25	(--)
	Chapman Chaps                   31	25	(--)
	Dean Martin                     31	25	(--)
	Cherry Bombers                  31	25	(--)
173.	Sluggo's Hosers                 30	25	(--)
	Anson Mak                       30	25	(--)
	Knights on a Power Play         30	25	(--)
176.	Canuck Force                    29	25	(--)
	butt ends                       29	25	(--)
	beam team                       29	25	(--)
	JUKURIT                         29	25	(--)
	Chapman Sticks                  29	25	(--)
	Ken De Cruyenaere               29	25	(--)
	gax goons                       29	25	(--)
	Tampere Salami                  29	25	(--)
	Sparky's Select                 29	25	(--)
185.	Hillside Raiders                28	25	(--)
	Eldoret Elephants               28	25	(--)
	Jane's World                    28	25	(--)
	the ALarmers                    28	25	(--)
189.	Rolaids Required                27	25	(--)
	Chip n Dale                     27	25	(--)
	Brian Bergman                   27	25	(--)
192.	Killer Kings                    26	25	(--)
	Montys Nords                    26	25	(--)
194.	Arsenal Maple Leafs             25	18	(--)
	Martin's Gag                    25	25	(--)
196.	Equipe Du Jour                  24	25	(--)
197.	lisa's luggers                  23	25	(--)

-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53836
From: plarsen@sanjuan (P Allen Larsen)
Subject: Re: Canada 3 Sweden 1 at the World Champioships

In article <20APR199319243244@venus.cc.hollandc.pe.ca> white@venus.cc.hollandc.pe.ca (Take me Baby!) writes:
>
>	Today at the World Championships in Munich, Canada scored an 
>impressive 3-1 victory over the defending World Champs, Sweden. 

I believe that was 4-1.  Rod Brind-Amour scored at 19.59 of the third.

>
>Kevin White
>white@venus.cc.hollandc.pe.ca 


--
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
P. Allen Larsen                                           University of Victoria
plarsen@sanjuan.uvic.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53837
From: randolin@polisci.umn.edu (Robert Andolina)
Subject: minnesota scene

  To those who are wondering what is happening in Minnesota:

  From what I have seen in the local news (TV and newspaper), various people 
in the area are trying to get a new hockey team.  A columnist for the St. 
Paul "Pioneer Press" wrote an article giving the "inside scoop" on the 
issue.  There are three local sites competing for a team and three possible 
candiates to move to the Twin Cities.  First the sites: Target Center, Civic 
Center (St. Paul), and yes, even the Met Center.  The columnist was pretty 
confident that Minnesota will get a team, and that the Target Center will 
ultimately win out.  He argued, however, that the competition from the other 
two sites will delay the process considerably.  Without the 
inter-site competition, the columnist (sorry, I can't remember his name) 
believes that Minnesota would have a team by the 1994-95 season.  Also, 
because of the situation with the Timberwolves, things will be delayed 
until (unless) the city of Minneapolis takes over the Target Center.  
However, they are unlikely to do so until the Met Center is destroyed, 
because the city will lose money if there is competition from the Met for 
conventions and short-term events (even with hockey at Target).  To add to 
this mess, a STUDY (6 to 12 months) is going to be conducted on the future 
viability of the Met Center, which obviously delays the process even 
further.  I hope that the study is cancelled, which will have the effect of 
knocking the Met Center out of the running and perhaps encouraging 
Minneapolis to take over the Target Center sooner. The city would be
be even more encourged if the wrecking ball is taken to the Met, 
which may happen.
	Regarding possible candidates, the three teams are 
Hartford, Tampa Bay, and New Jersey.  I would prefer the Devils (Minnesota "
Ice Demons?") although the Lightning may have potential.  Although it hasn't 
been announced yet, it looks like 6 neutral site games will be played at the 
Target Center next year.  Apparently the Devils are interested in playing in 
as many of those six games as possible, and I wouldn't be surprised to see 
Hartford and Tampa show up there either.	So, Minnesota may end up 
getting another team, but it may take a few years.

	
	Go Sabres!
	
	Robert Andolina (former Buffalonian living in Minneapolis)
	randolin@polisci.umn.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53838
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Aargh! Great Hockey Coverage!! (Devils)

Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) says:
>>>
>>>I mean that the original poster was looking for a Devils victory
>>>on the tape delay, and it didn't happen in game 1.
>>
>>I was the original poster, and it was just a complaint about the
>>coverage (meaningless Yankee game before playoff Devils game).
>
>Oh!  I apologize then...I misinterpreted you!

No problem, no offence taken ...

>Of all the teams in the Patrick, I least dislike the Devils.

It is sad, just as a lover of the sport, that this team can be in
the metro New York area for over a decade and still exist as just
a non-entity ...

>How is ESPN's coverage anyways??? I think it starts tonight.

We're getting the Sabres-Bruins as the replacement game (and probably
so are you) while the Devils-Penguins game is played on SCNY and the
Islanders-Caps are the overflow game on the SCA (SCNY Plus).  If the
Sabres-Bruins ends early then we'll go to the Devils-Penguins game
(assuming that ESPN follows their previous patterns; we got the last
minute of the Islanders-Rangers and all of the overtime two weeks
ago).  ESPN's coverage started last night, by accident, but as one
or more other writers have pointed out, they could've gone to wild
hog wrestling for the evening instead ...

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53839
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Schedule...

mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler) writes:
>gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>>I can't believe that ESPN is making SportsChannel America look good.
>
>But only in NY,NJ, Philadelphia, and Chicago. Everywhere else, the only
>reason SportsChannel was available was for local baseball broadcasts.

Yes, a point well-taken ... however, even in areas that finally got
some games, there's something nagging in the back of your skull when
the network that has the national rights in its pocket says on its
sports news, "There's an awesome overtime going on in Quebec City,
and we'll *try* to get you an update through the show ..." when you
know that it's on a satellite's feedhorn somewhere up there ...

>If people want hockey on TV, they should watch hockey on TV. I bet 
>the ratings for hockey on Sunday on ABC went into the toilet. 

From today's Times, ABC got great ratings in Chicago and St. Louis (a
4.2), and the Kings-Flames got a 2.9 on the West Coast, but only a 2.2
in metro New York (i.e., the Devils squandered their newfound support
from a year ago when they played the Rangers )-;).  In comparison,
Seniors Golf did better ...

>Next week, there will be far fewer ABC affiliates with hockey.

I fear that the overall national numbers will not be so great ...
I can't tell if ABC did any advance marketing or not, 'cos I don't
watch much TV ... the NHL should have made sure that it was solid
on cable before going on the air.  Even ESPN could've sold second
rights to third party systems (i.e., non-SportsChannel) since they
are not making any extra money by sitting on the games ... hockey
fans will not necessarily be watching pre-season beach volleyball
if playoffs games aren't being shown somewhere ...

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53840
From: ching@bigwpi.WPI.EDU ("The Logistician")
Subject: #77's?


I am in need of all of the players wearing #77 in the NHL.  I know now only
of one, Ray Borque for the Bruins.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanx.

-- 
------------------------THE LOGISTICIAN REIGNS SUPREME!!!----------------------
|									      |
|   GO BLUE!!!   GO TIGERS!!!   GO PISTONS!!!   GO LIONS!!!   GO RED WINGS!!! |
-------------------------------ching@wpi.wpi.edu-------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53841
From: kozloce@wkuvx1.bitnet
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN

I agree. It was great for the ESPN people to show the Detroit game. (My
roommate just about sh*t when they threw the octopus on the ice. (Thanks
for explaining the significance of that BTW)) The only problem I had was
when they blotted out the local commentators with the baseball ads and
music. Especially when the wings player hit the rut and went into the
boards injuring his shoulder and they blotted out the injury report. Other
then that, hats off to ESPN. Now if they'll only make a habit of this. Yeah
right! Baseball seasons started (Zzzzzz.....) =)

KOZ 

LETS GO CAPS!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53842
From: kozloce@wkuvx1.bitnet
Subject: Re: Atlanta Hockey Hell!!DIR

> Someone give SportChannel a call (or maybe Ted Turner).
> Wasn't USA network covering the playoffs years ago?
> 
> Jim G.

Oh to be back in the good old days when I lived in Florida (Florida for
Petes sake!!) and could watch hockey every night as ESPN and USA alternated
coverage nights. Oh well I guess it would be too simple for the home office
to look back into their past to solve a problem in the present...

Of course I shouldn't complain. At least I'm getting to watch the playoffs
for a change. (Hooray!!) Now if the ESPN schedulers will realise there are
other teams except Pittsberg in the Patrick. (Sounds like a Dr Suess Book
=)

KOZ

LETS GO CAPS!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53843
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: If You Were Pat Burns ...

In article <C5suH3.3q0@tsegw.tse.com> mhembruc@tsegw.tse.com (Mattias Hembruch) writes:
>>hell is Anderson?  Anderson can (in days past) get under peoples
>>skin.  Put a little more bluntly, Anderson has to be an asshole.
>>He used to be good at it.  We need him now.  
>
>Agreed. Anderson was nowhere last night.
>

Well what do you expect...Burns was playing him with Krushelnyski
and Baumgartner...Anderson is a finisher...unless you play him with
someone to can get him the puck in a finishing position...he ain't
going to do much scoring!

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53844
From: c115110@cs.UAlberta.CA (Keith Scott Alan)
Subject: Hockey coverage

This is a general question for US readers:

How extensive is the playoff coverage down there?  In Canada, it is almost
impossible not to watch a series on TV (ie the only two series I have not had
an opportunity to watch this year are Wash-NYI and Chi-Stl, the latter because
I'm in the wrong time zone!).  We (in Canada) are basically swamped with 
coverage, and I wonder how many series/games are televised nationally or even
locally in the US and how much precedence they take over, say, local news if
the games go into double-OT.

Email me so as not to waste bandwidth, please.  My news feed is kind of slow
anyways.

l8tr


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53845
From: vergolin@haydn.lbs.msu.edu (David Vergolini)
Subject: Probert and Wendall

  Game two of the Detroit - Toronto series will be a rougher game.  I believe
that Clark will be coming out hitting on all cylindars.  I believe that Probert
will take exception to this and a fight between Clark and Probert will result.
  I know this sounds kind of ridiculous, but I know game two Toronto will come
out hitting.
  Any takers on this issue?

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53846
From: grogers@slacvx.slac.stanford.edu (Greg Rogers)
Subject: Hey, What about teh Cannucks?

Hi all,

Due to living in the Bay Area, I as unable to see Vancouver's victory over
the Jets last night.  I know the score, but that rarely describes the game.
Could someone please post a brief sonapsis (sp?) of waht happened.  How well
did each team play?  Were the cannucks deserving of the victory?

Also, could some kind soul please email me the end of season, individual
player stats?

Greg

-- Vancouver for the cup (in a virtual reality)--

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53847
From: dvb@ssd.kodak.com (Dave Blaszyk)
Subject: Re: If You Were Pat Burns ...

Jason Cockroft (jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM) wrote:

: What are the Leafs to do?  I am a Leaf supporter and
: I say the Leafs are going down in four unless there
: is nothing short of a miracle or a stroke of genenius hits

Root for another team. ;-)

: Andreychuck and Borchevsky have no business playing against 
: the Wings.  They are too small.  The key to any Leafs success
: will have to be Clark.  He is the only centre who can have
..
Andreychuk, is NOT small, slow and sloth-like, maybe, but he is
about 6'4" and that is not what I would consider as small.

As an aside, The big AndreyCHUNK as I call him has been known to
disappear come playoff time.  This was one of his main problems when
playing for Buffalo.

: GO LEAFS !!!
GO SABRES !!!




--
      /-//   \\-\Dave Blaszyk	e-mail	: dvb@snowmass.ssd.kodak.com
     /-//\   /\\-\(716) 253-7953  mail	: Eastman Kodak
  ///d// \\v// \\b\\\   		  C Plant, Bldg. 10 MC 39011
  \\\//   \//   \\///			  Rochester, New York 14620

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53848
From: un026300@wvnvms.wvnet.edu
Subject: Re: How to beat the Pens


	You can't.  But good luck trying.

	Jim



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53849
From: ayari@judikael.loria.fr (Ayari Iskander)
Subject: Re: How to beat Pittsburgh!

In article <1993Apr15.214902.3372@guvax.acc.georgetown.edu>, apanjabi@guvax.acc.georgetown.edu writes:
|> In article <AfnKOVK00UhB01RDtJ@andrew.cmu.edu>, Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
|> > 	<kfnJYea00Uh_I1VmUs@andrew.cmu.edu>
|> > NNTP-Posting-Host: po5.andrew.cmu.edu
|> > In-Reply-To: <kfnJYea00Uh_I1VmUs@andrew.cmu.edu>
|> > 
|> > from Anna Matyas:
|> >>>Now if we could just clone Chelios's personality and transplant it
|> >>>into all of the defensemen on the Islanders, Capitals, and Devils...
|> >>> 
|> >>>Gerald
|> >> 
|> >>In other words, you want to turn them all into assholes so they
|> >>will spend lots of time in the penalty box and get lots of
|> >>misconducts?
|> >> 
|> >>And this comes from a Chelios fan...
|> > 
|> > Yeah, and also be second in the team in scoring and play about 35
|> > minutes a game and play on the power play and kill penalties and be the
|> > best defenseman in the league. I'd take a whole team of Chelioses if I
|> > could. (That way, when one got a penalty the others could kill it!)
|> > 
|> > Ralph
|> 
|> >HOW TO BEAT PITTSBURGH???
|> 
|> 	I.Mario Lemieux
|> 		A.Death
|> 			1.Too much Kimo
|> 			2.Slash to skull
|> 			3.Ask the Rangers (Slashing his wrist????)
|> 	II.Jaromir Jagr
|> 		A.Deportation
|> 			1.Send him back to whatever Commie country 
|> 			  he's from
|> 			2.Tell him that Bill Clinton is going too
|> 	III.Kevin Stevens
|> 		A.Fighting
|> 			1.Call Bob Probert
|> 			2.Call Tie Domi
|> 			3.Call my grandmother (She'd kick his ass)
|>  

Since everybody wants to see Pittsburgh players not playing, the
Stanley cup would be devaluated.

-- 
_____________________________________________________

  Iskander AYARI

  Email : Iskander.Ayari@loria.fr ou ayari@loria.fr
_____________________________________________________


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53850
Subject: Re: Smiths birthday goal was LEAFS GO ALL THE WAY !!!
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <C4wty9.40u@mcs.anl.gov>, mwm@aps.anl.gov (Michael W. McDowell) writes:
> In article 5KL@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca, kwk2chow@descartes.uwaterloo.ca (KEVIN C.) writes:
>> (Thanks for the goals by Steve Smith) 
> I don't see why more people don't blame grant fuhr for the goal that smith 
> put in his own net, it's common to play the puck back to your own goalie when
> deep in your own end and under little or no pressure from the offensive team.
> If fuhr had been in position the puck would have never crossed the line.

From this account, it doesn't sound like you even saw the goal, Mike. Smith
came out from behind his own net and fired a breakout pass that hit Fuhr in the
back of the leg. Fuhr was backing up at the time and never saw what
happened. The puck went straight off Fuhr's leg and into the net. Fuhr never
had a chance. There was no play back to the goaltender, in fact Perry Berezan
of Calgary had just dumped it in and Smith was retrieving it. 

It was unfortunate that it happened; Smith is a nice guy and was only a rookie
at the time, and on his birthday too. But all the blame lies with him. Starting
in pee-wee coaches tell players never to make a cross-ice pass in front of 
their own net. Too much chance of having it intercepted, or hitting the 
goaltender, or whatever.

And to the people who say that Smith cost the Oilers the series, I can only
say that he certainly didn't cause the team to lose the other three games.
There was no reason for a powerhouse team like Edmonton to be tied late
in the third period of the 7th game of the second round. Everybody on the team
has to take responsibility for them even being in that situation.

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53851
Subject: Re: Potvin's new goalie mask
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <allan.734333484@swanlake>, allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan) writes:
> slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca writes:
> 
>>I was wtahcing RIGHT GUARD HOCKEY WEEK on TSN yesterday and they had
>>a feature on this guy that does a lot (most?) of the masks for NHL
>>goalies.  They talked about how they are made, what they are made of,
>>and the designs that are put on them, etc.
> 
>>The best one of all was one he never talked about, he just held it up.
>>It has the current Leafs crest on the chin and an awesome looking 
>>black panther on the forehead -- it *has* to be a new mask for Felix
>>Potvin, but he never said whose it was.
> 
> Are you sure this program was current? I know that Grant Fuhr
> had a black panther on the forehead of his mask when he played with
> the Leafs. 

It would seem logical that the mask is Potvins. His nickname is "The Cat", 
which would go a long ways towards explaining the panther. 

Of course, it could be an old story and the mask is Fuhrs, too.....

								Alan


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53852
From: v103r4g8@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (We will NOT cave in....GODS OF WAR, Def Leppard)
Subject: HELP HELP HELP


Does anyone have the NHL STANDINGS for March 28th? I need them IMMEDIATELY
for a project. Please post or email. THANKS.




*************************************************************************
                Andy Hillery --- School Of Architecture	  	
                State University of New York at Buffalo 
*************************************************************************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53853
From: schock@cpsc.ucalgary.ca (Craig Schock)
Subject: Re: Smiths birthday goal was LEAFS GO ALL THE WAY !!!

In article <C5JunA.4vH@cpsc.ucalgary.ca> layfield@cpsc.ucalgary.ca (Colin Layfield) writes:
>In article <C4wty9.40u@mcs.anl.gov> mwm@aps.anl.gov writes:
>>In article 5KL@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca, kwk2chow@descartes.uwaterloo.ca (KEVIN C.) writes:
>>> (Thanks for the goals by Steve Smith) 
>>I don't see why more people don't blame grant fuhr for the goal that smith 
>>put in his own net, it's common to play the puck back to your own goalie when
>>deep in your own end and under little or no pressure from the offensive team.
>>If fuhr had been in position the puck would have never crossed the line.
>>
>>Mike McDowell
>
>I have to disagree with you on this one.  It is anything BUT common.  In the
>4 or 5 years I have been watching hockey I have NEVER seen this happen EVER.
>
>I am not sure what league you have been watching.  :-)
>
>Anyone else agree with this?

Yes, Colin... I have to agree with you here...  I've put the puck in
my own net the same way Smith did... (only once, mind you :-) and it
was definitely my fault.  It is NOT a common play to play the puck the
way that Smith did.  

Luckily, for me...  when I did it... it was only a scrimmage :-)

Craig

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53854
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: Blues into playoffs, beat TB 6-5

By Dave Luecking Of The Post-Dispatch Staff

At 9:11 Thursday night, the scoreboard watchers at The Arena began to cheer.
Their cheer quickly turned into a roar, and finally, the sellout crowd of
17,816 rose as one to rock the old barn at 5700 Oakland Avenue in a salute to
the playoff-bound Blues.

The scoreboard had just flashed the news from Detroit -- Red Wings 5, Stars 3.
With the North Stars' loss, the Blues officially clinched fourth place and the
final playoff spot in the Norris Division. Good thing, because the Blues quit
playing.

They held a 5-1 lead over Tampa Bay when the Detroit-Minnesota final appeared
with 3 minutes 52 remaining in the second period. They promptly went to sleep
and barely held on for a 6-5 victory that nearly slipped away at the buzzer.
Tampa's Bob Beers tipped in a pass from Shawn Chambers, but officiating
supervisor John D'Amico and video goal judge Rich Schweigler ruled that the
shot had gone into the net after time had expired.

``I'm glad I didn't see it go in at the end," Blues coach Bob Berry said.

If the goal had counted, he'd have been more upset than he was by the Blues'
disappearance in the final 24 minutes. Holding on for the victory and making
the playoffs tempered Berry's anger.

``It wasn't pretty at the end," he said. ``We played 36, 37 great minutes, as
good as we played all year. It slipped away at the end. It shouldn't have, but
it did."

Still, the Blues won, prompting another ovation from the crowd at game's end.
Despite their shoddy effort in the third period and all the turmoil this
season, the Blues still made the playoffs. They'll meet the Chicago Blackhawks
in a best-of-seven Norris Division semifinal, beginning at noon Sunday at
Chicago Stadium.

The Blues finished the regular-season with a record of 37-36-11 for 85 points,
their fourth consecutive plus-.500 season. Minnesota finished three points
behind in fifth place, with a record of 36-38- 10 for 82 points. Tampa Bay,
which played spoiler last week by tying the Blues 2-2 at Tampa, ended its
first season with a record of 23-54-7 for 53 points.

The poor finish cast an unnecessary shadow over what should have been a joyous
Blues locker room. Instead, the mood was one of relief and some disappointment.

``It's a shame we let down," said Kevin Miller, one of three Blues to score
two goals. Brendan Shanahan and Bob Bassen were the others.
``There was no need for a letdown. If we'd have kept working, it would have
ended 6-2 and everyone would be happy."

Instead, a lot of players were happy just to make the playoffs.
``We won, and that's all that matters," said Brett Hull, scoreless and minus-3
for the night. ``Once we got up 4-0, it was really tough to play."

Some players didn't have a problem.

``Just because the score was announced, our line didn't quit," said Rich
Sutter, who played with Bassen and Miller. ``We still had a game to play. You
can't allow five goals like we did, that's not right.

``It was disappointing to see what was going on."

Bassen was almost frantic on the bench because of the Blues' effort. Somehow,
he missed the announcement of Minnesota's loss.

``I didn't know it was final," he said. ``I was kind of looking around on the
bench. I didn't realize it was a final for some reason. We're in the playoffs,
and that's great, but it's a little disappointing to play like we did at the
end."

The letdown was precisely the reason that Berry had instructed the scoreboard
operators to keep the Minnesota-Detroit score off of the board. The score
showed 0-0 until it first popped up with Detroit leading 4-2 in the third
period. The Blues already led 4-0 at the time.

``I told them I didn't want to see the score, I didn't want to know the score,"
Berry said. ``I felt we had to win the game, and that's the approach we took."

If Minnesota took a lead, Berry feared, the pressure of having to win might
bother the Blues. If Detroit led, he worried, the Blues might quit.

Until the announcement, the Blues played splendidly. Shanahan got the crowd
going at 10:44 of the first period, scoring his 50th of the season. Then,
Miller and Bassen took charge late in the period.

With the teams playing four on four, Miller broke in on left wing, deked
defenseman Roman Hamrlik and beat former Blues goalie Pat Jablonski with the
rebound of his own shot with 21.6 seconds remaining in the period.

Then, just 10.5 seconds later, Bassen rifled a long slap shot past Jablonski
after defenseman Rick Zombo intercepted a Tampa pass in the neutral zone.

Bassen made it 4-0 just 14 seconds into the second period, scoring on the 
rebound of Bret Hedican's shot. The goal gave him his first two-goal game of
the season and reminded him of a special friend.

Last year, Bassen befriended young Oliver Mulvihill, who died of a rare form
of cancer at age 6 on Feb. 23.

``I was thinking of my buddy Oliver," Bassen said. ``He's in heaven now, and
I know he was watching. I know he's happy."

Miller increased the Blues lead to 5-0 on a break-away goal set up by Zombo
at 11:09. Then, Steve Maltais broke Curtis Joseph's shutout just 18 seconds
later, making it 5-1.

Less than a minute after the North Stars' final was announced, Tim Bergland
scored and cut the lead to 5-2. But Shanahan scored his 51st, converting a pass
from Nelson Emerson with 21.3 seconds remaining in the  second period.

Then, it was all Lightning. Adam Creighton scored 40 seconds into the third
period, prompting Berry to rest the overworked Joseph. Guy Hebert allowed goals
to Shawn Chambers and Danton Cole in a span of 1:21 midway through the third
period.

The goals by Chambers and Cole made Shanahan's second goal stand up as the
winner. ``We were in there," Shanahan said. ``The game was over. We were in."

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53855
From: bks2@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (bryan.k.strouse)
Subject: NHL RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4-14-93



NHL RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4/14/93.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                  STANDINGS
      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE
 TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT
 
xPIT  56 21  7 119  xBOS  51 26  7 109  xCHI  46 25 12 104  xVAN  45 29  9  99
yWAS  42 34  7  91  yQUE  47 27 10 104  yDET  46 28  9 101  yCAL  42 30 11  95
yNJ   40 36  7  87  yMON  48 30  6 102  yTOR  44 28 11  99  yLA   39 34 10  88
yNYI  39 37  7  85  yBUF  38 35 10  86   STL  36 36 11  83  yWIN  39 37  7  85
 PHL  34 37 11  79   HAR  26 51  6  58   MIN  36 37 10  82   EDM  26 49  8  60
 NYR  34 38 11  79   OTT  10 70  4  24   TB   23 53  7  53   SJ   11 70  2  24

x - Clinched Division Title
y - Clinched Playoff Berth

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Boston Bruins    (51-26-7)   2   2   0   -   4
Ottawa Senators  (10-70-4)   0   1   1   -   2

1st period: BOS, Roberts 5 - (Juneau) 7:19
	    BOS, Wiemer 1 - (Juneau, Oates) 17:47

2nd period: BOS, Neely 11 - (Juneau, Murphy) 6:10
	    BOS, Hughes 5 - (Richer, Kimble) 7:55
	    OTT, Archibald 9 - (Rumble, Lamb) 11:37
	  
3rd period: OTT, Boschman 9 - (Kudelski) 5:10

Powerplay Opportunities-Bruins   0 of 2
			Senators 0 of 4

Shots on Goal-	Bruins    13  11  10  -  34
		Senators   5   9  12  -  26

Boston Bruins--Moog (36-14-3) (8 shots - 8 saves)  Blue (9:38 second) 
	       (18 shots - 16 saves)
Ottawa Senators--Sidorkiewicz (8-46-3) (27 shots - 23 saves)  Berthiaume
		 (6:36 third) (7 shots - 7 saves)

ATT-10,500

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Washington Capitals   (42-34-7)   0   0   2   -   2
New York Rangers     (34-38-11)   0   0   0   -   0

1st period: NONE

2nd period: NONE

3rd period: WAS, Bondra 36 - (Pivonka, Cavallini) 6:54
	    WAS, Bondra 37 - (Cote, Pivonka) 10:10

Powerplay Opportunities-Capitals 0 of 2
			Rangers  0 of 1

Shots on Goal-	Capitals  16  11  12  -  39
		Rangers    8   7   8  -  23

Washington Capitals--Tabaracci (7-11-0) (23 shots - 23 saves)
New York Rangers--Richter (13-17-3) (39 shots - 37 saves)

ATT-17,897

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

New York Islanders  (39-37-7)   2   1   1   0   -   4
Hartford Whalers    (26-51-6)   2   1   1   1   -   5

1st period: NYI, Ferraro 13 - (Malakhov, King) 1:29
	    NYI, Hogue 32 - (Thomas, Turgeon) 1:57
	    HAR, Yake 21 - (Poulin) 4:15
	    HAR, Yake 22 - (Nylander, Poulin) 16:44

2nd period: HAR, Verbeek 39 - (Cassels, Weinrich) (pp) 2:43
	    NYI, Thomas 35 - (King, Ferraro) 7:58

3rd period: HAR, Burt 5 - (Sanderson, Cassels) 13:41
	    NYI, Malakhov 14 - (Hogue) 17:45

Overtime:   HAR, Janssens 12 - (Poulin) 1:08

Powerplay Opportunities-Islanders 0 of 3
			Whalers   1 of 3

Shots on Goal-	Islanders  16   8   7   1  -  32
		Whalers     7  13   7   1  -  28

New York Islanders--Fitzpatrick (16-15-5) (28 shots - 23 saves)
Hartford Whalers--Lenaduzzi (1-0-1) (32 shots - 28 saves)

ATT-10,915

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Pittsburgh Penguins  (56-21-7)   2   3   1   0   -   6
New Jersey Devils    (40-36-7)   2   4   0   0   -   6

1st period: PIT, Daniels 5 - (Needham, Tippett) 4:14
	    NJD, C.Lemieux 29 - (Semak, Driver) 10:19
	    PIT, K.Stevens 55 - (Tocchet, Murphy) (pp) 12:40
	    NJD, Zelepukin 22 - (Driver, Niedermayer) 17:26

2nd period: PIT, M.Lemieux 68 - (Stevens, Tocchet) 1:42
	    NJD, Semak 36 - (C.Lemieux, Zelepukin) 2:27
	    PIT, McEachern 28 - (Jagr, Barrasso) 4:24
	    NJD, S.Stevens 12 - (Guerin, Pellerin) 5:45
	    PIT, M.Lemieux 69 - (sh) 12:40
	    NJD, Richer 37 - (Nicholls) 15:53
	    NJD, C.Lemieux 30 - (Semak, Zelepukin) 17:40

3rd period: PIT, Mullen 33 - (Jagr, M.Lemieux) 18:54

Overtime:   NONE

Powerplay Opportunities-Penguins 1 of 5
			Devils   0 of 3

Shots on Goal-	Penguins   9  11   8   2  -  30
		Devils    12  15   9   3  -  39

Pittsburgh Penguins--Barrasso (43-14-5) (39 shots - 33 saves)
New Jersey Devils--Billington (21-14-4) (30 shots - 24 saves)

ATT-14,796

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


\|||||/
-SPIKE-



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53856
From: layfield@cpsc.ucalgary.ca (Colin Layfield)
Subject: Re: Smiths birthday goal was LEAFS GO ALL THE WAY !!!

In article <C4wty9.40u@mcs.anl.gov> mwm@aps.anl.gov writes:
>In article 5KL@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca, kwk2chow@descartes.uwaterloo.ca (KEVIN C.) writes:
>> (Thanks for the goals by Steve Smith) 
>I don't see why more people don't blame grant fuhr for the goal that smith 
>put in his own net, it's common to play the puck back to your own goalie when
>deep in your own end and under little or no pressure from the offensive team.
>If fuhr had been in position the puck would have never crossed the line.
>
>Mike McDowell

I have to disagree with you on this one.  It is anything BUT common.  In the
4 or 5 years I have been watching hockey I have NEVER seen this happen EVER.

I am not sure what league you have been watching.  :-)

Anyone else agree with this?

 Colin Layfield            | "Religion and Sex are power plays,
                           |  Manipulate the people for the money they pay,
 The University of Calgary |  Selling Skin, Selling God
 Computer Science          |  The numbers look the same on their CREDIT CARDS!"
 layfield@cpsc.ucalgary.ca |                          - Queensryche


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53857
From: jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio)
Subject: Re: European expansion and our f*cked system


 
|> How long would they support teams that are run on Ranger-based 
|> corporate thinking (I use the term lightly).  (We don't need a good
|> product because these duffuses in NYC would fill the arena for Ottawa's
|> record every year......1940!! haha (sorry, had ta say it)).

Look how long the Maple Leafs and Nordiques used similar logic....  Not that
they fielded bad teams solely to field bad teams, but the Maple Leafs (and a
certain dead man who was in charge) were one of the cheapest teams in the
history of the sport.  Guess what-- they were immensely popular at the
gate.  The Nordiques have also done well for a team that had missed the
playoffs so many years in a row.

|> Look at British (or any European) soccer as an example (they never have fan
|> problems).

Ha!  Such humor!  They have MAJOR fan problems, namely that on occasion some of
them don't make it home from the match!  The soccer fans tend to be fanatical,
much like the Montreal fans who firebomb the players and coaches houses when
they play pathetically.
 
-JPC

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John P. Curcio 		          Go Bruins!		   Philips Laboratories
jpc@philabs.philips.com 			           345 Scarborough Road
(914) 945-6442               	 		     Briarcliff Manor, NY 10510 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53858
From: jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio)
Subject: Re: TV Schedule for Next Week


In article <Apr16.043426.69352@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU>, mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger) writes:

|> United States TV Schedule:
|> April 18   Devils/Islanders at Pittsburgh   1 EST  ABC  (to Eastern time zone)
|> April 18   St. Louis at Chicago             12 CDT ABC  (to Cent/Mou time zones)
|> April 18   Los Angeles at Calgary           12 PDT ABC  (to Pacific time zone)
|> April 20   Devils/Islanders at Pittsburgh   7:30   ESPN
|> April 22   TBA                              7:30   ESPN
|> April 24   TBA                              7:30   ESPN

Does anyone know if there will be alternate games in cities where local
broadcast rights are being protected?  I'd really love to see the Bruins a
couple times, and with this pro-Patrick bias shown by ESPN something tells me
that I will have to wait until the conference finals to see them :-}.

-JPC
 
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John P. Curcio 		          Go Bruins!		   Philips Laboratories
jpc@philabs.philips.com 			           345 Scarborough Road
(914) 945-6442               	 		     Briarcliff Manor, NY 10510 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53859
From: saz@hook.corp.mot.com (Scott Zabolotzky)
Subject: Re: the hawks WILL return to the finals!!!!!

In article <1qk0k4$itg@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu> cubrj@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Brian Johnson) writes:
>Well now that the hawks have won the division the road is a little
>easier for the playoffs. Let toronto and detroit beat the hell out of
>each other while Chicago sweeps st.louis. That just makes it easier in
>the second round with all the rest they will get and tor/det getting
>none. For the conf. champ they will have a hard time versus the division
>but that div. will be pretty battered also so the advantage goes to the
>Hawks again. Then bring pitt. and sure the Hawks will probably lose but
>its better to get that far and lose than to not go.
>
>brian
>

Hopefully, a miracle (o.k. not quite a miracle, but close!) will occur and
Pittsburgh will be elminated prior to the finals.  If they make it again, 
they will probably keep the Cup.  If they don't, it's the Hawks' turn!

GO BLACKHAWKS!!

CONGRATS TO JEREMY ROENICK FOR BEING ONLY THE 2ND HAWKS PLAYER TO POST 
BACK TO BACK 50 GOAL SEASONS!!

Scott


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53860
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: Re: the hawks WILL return to the finals!!!!!

In article <1qk0k4$itg@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu> cubrj@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Brian Johnson) writes:
>Well now that the hawks have won the division the road is a little
>easier for the playoffs. Let toronto and detroit beat the hell out of
>each other while Chicago sweeps st.louis. That just makes it easier in
                  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>brian
>
    Don't be so sure, the Blues played the Hawks pretty well this season,
and won twice at the Stadium. The Blues will give the Hawks a hard time.
This series is one of the best first round matchups, could go either way.
The Hawks will probably prevail in seven games.

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53861
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Thur, April 15, 1993

Philadelphia                     1 2 4--7
Buffalo                          0 3 1--4
First period
     1, Philadelphia, Recchi 52 (Galley, Lindros) 0:18.
Second period
     2, Philadelphia, Hawgood 11 (Dineen, Eklund) pp, 2:15.
     3, Philadelphia, Dineen 33 (McGill) sh, 5:40.
     4, Buffalo, Barnaby 1 (Hawerchuk, Smehlik) pp, 7:48.
     5, Buffalo, Wood 18 (LaFontaine, Ledyard) pp, 17:34.
     6, Buffalo, Mogilny 75 (Hawerchuk, Carney) pp, 18:56.
Third period
     7, Philadelphia, Eklund 11 (Dineen, Beranek) 4:42.
     8, Buffalo, Mogilny 76 (Errey, LaFontaine) 5:24.
     9, Philadelphia, Dineen 34 (Brind'Amour) pp, 6:44.
     10, Philadelphia, Dineen 35 (Brind'Amour, Galley) sh, 8:39.
     11, Philadelphia, Acton 8 (Dineen, Brind'Amour) 19:48.

Philadelphia: 7    Power play: 5-2   Special goals:  pp: 2  sh: 2  Total: 4
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Acton              1    0    1
Beranek            0    1    1
Brind'Amour        0    3    3
Dineen             3    3    6
Eklund             1    1    2
Galley             0    2    2
Hawgood            1    0    1
Lindros            0    1    1
McGill             0    1    1
Recchi             1    0    1

Buffalo: 4    Power play: 10-3
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Barnaby            1    0    1
Carney             0    1    1
Errey              0    1    1
Hawerchuk          0    2    2
LaFontaine         0    2    2
Ledyard            0    1    1
Mogilny            2    0    2
Smehlik            0    1    1
Wood               1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
Minnesota                        1 1 1--3
Detroit                          0 2 3--5
First period
     1, Minnesota, McPhee 18 (Ludwig) 1:23.
Second period
     2, Minnesota, Dahlen 34 (Courtnall, Gagner) pp, 0:31.
     3, Detroit, Drake 18 (Howe, Ogrodnick) 9:14.
     4, Detroit, Ysebaert 34 (Lidstrom, Howe) pp, 17:37.
Third period
     5, Detroit, Ciccarelli 41 (Coffey, Chiasson) pp, 0:32.
     6, Detroit, Kennedy 19 (Burr, Probert) 3:42.
     7, Detroit, Yzerman 58 (Ciccarelli, Gallant) 6:17.
     8, Minnesota, Dahlen 35 (Courtnall, Gagner) 19:11.

Detroit: 5    Power play: 4-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Burr               0    1    1
Chiasson           0    1    1
Ciccarelli         1    1    2
Coffey             0    1    1
Drake              1    0    1
Gallant            0    1    1
Howe               0    2    2
Kennedy            1    0    1
Lidstrom           0    1    1
Ogrodnick          0    1    1
Probert            0    1    1
Ysebaert           1    0    1
Yzerman            1    0    1

Minnesota: 3    Power play: 2-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Courtnall          0    2    2
Dahlen             2    0    2
Gagner             0    2    2
Ludwig             0    1    1
McPhee             1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
Edmonton                         0 0 0--0
Winnipeg                         1 2 0--3
First period
     1, Winnipeg, Shannon 20 (Steen, Davydov) pp, 2:08.
Second period
     2, Winnipeg, Selanne 76 (Olausson) 5:25.
     3, Winnipeg, Zhamnov 25 (Selanne) 19:42.
Third period
     No scoring.

Winnipeg: 3    Power play: 6-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Davydov            0    1    1
Olausson           0    1    1
Selanne            1    1    2
Shannon            1    0    1
Steen              0    1    1
Zhamnov            1    0    1

Edmonton: 0    Power play: 3-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------
Toronto                          1 1 0--2
Chicago                          0 2 1--3
First period
     1, Toronto, Baumgartner 1 (unassisted) 18:40.
Second period
     2, Chicago, Roenick 50 (Murphy, Chelios) 1:29.
     3, Toronto, Andreychuk 55 (Mironov, Lefebvre) 13:22.
     4, Chicago, Murphy 7 (Roenick, Chelios) pp, 19:05.
Third period
     5, Chicago, Matteau 15 (unassisted) 10:51.
Error: Power play goal mismatch. Assuming calc value.
Error: Team: Toronto  Calc: 0  Read: 1

Chicago: 3    Power play: 7-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Chelios            0    2    2
Matteau            1    0    1
Murphy             1    1    2
Roenick            1    1    2

Toronto: 2    Power play: 3-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Andreychuk         1    0    1
Baumgartner        1    0    1
Lefebvre           0    1    1
Mironov            0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
First period
     1, St Louis, Shanahan 50 (Brown, Felsner) 10:44.
     2, St Louis, Miller 23 (Bassen, Brown) 19:38.
     3, St Louis, Bassen 8 (Zombo) 19:48.
Second period
     4, St Louis, Bassen 9 (Hedican, Miller) 0:14.
     5, St Louis, Miller 24 (Zombo, Hedican) 11:09.
     6, Tampa Bay, Maltais 7(Hamrlik) 11:27.
     7, Tampa Bay, Bergland 3 (Hervey, Gilhen) 17:16.
     8, St Louis, Shanahan 51 (Emerson) 19:38.
Third period
     9, Tampa Bay, Creighton 19 (Bergland, Bergevin) 0:40.
     10, Tampa Bay, Chambers 10 (Zamuner, Cole) 10:37.
     11, Tampa Bay, Cole 12 (Beers, Bradley) 11:58.

St Louis: 6    Power play: 4-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bassen             2    1    3
Brown              0    2    2
Emerson            0    1    1
Felsner            0    1    1
Hedican            0    2    2
Miller             2    1    3
Shanahan           2    0    2
Zombo              0    2    2

Tampa Bay: 5    Power play: 3-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Beers              0    1    1
Bergevin           0    1    1
Bergland           1    1    2
Bradley            0    1    1
Chambers           1    0    1
Cole               1    1    2
Creighton          1    0    1
Gilhen             0    1    1
Hamrlik            0    1    1
Hervey             0    1    1
Maltais            1    0    1
Zamuner            0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
San Jose                         0 1 2--3
Calgary                          0 4 3--7
First period
     No scoring.
Second period
     1, San Jose, Garpenlov 22 (Odgers, Gaudreau) pp, 3:37.
     2, Calgary, Nieuwendyk 38 (MacInnis, Suter) pp, 5:26.
     3, Calgary, Ranheim 21 (Otto, Suter) 10:43.
     4, Calgary, Yawney 1 (Nieuwendyk, Roberts) 11:26.
     5, Calgary, Berube 4 (Paslawski, Skrudland) 13:45.
Third period
     6, San Jose, Wood 1 (Odgers, Kisio) 8:00.
     7, Calgary, Reichel 40 (unassisted) 9:26.
     8, Calgary, Roberts 38 (Musil, Paslawski) pp, 12:27.
     9, San Jose, Kisio 26 (unassisted) 13:10.
     10, Calgary, Paslawski 18 (Ashton, Stern) 16:16.

Calgary: 7    Power play: 4-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Ashton             0    1    1
Berube             1    0    1
MacInnis           0    1    1
Musil              0    1    1
Nieuwendyk         1    1    2
Otto               0    1    1
Paslawski          1    2    3
Ranheim            1    0    1
Reichel            1    0    1
Roberts            1    1    2
Skrudland          0    1    1
Stern              0    1    1
Suter              0    2    2
Yawney             1    0    1

San Jose: 3    Power play: 3-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Garpenlov          1    0    1
Gaudreau           0    1    1
Kisio              1    1    2
Odgers             0    2    2
Wood               1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
Vancouver                        1 2 5--8
Los Angeles                      2 3 1--6
First period
     1, Los Angeles, Robitaille 63 (Gretzky, Sandstrom) 1:39.
     2, Vancouver, Babych 3 (Craven, Nedved) pp, 9:43.
     3, Los Angeles, Sandstrom 25 (Gretzky, Robitaille) 10:06.
Second period
     4, Vancouver, Linden 32 (Ronning, Courtnall) pp, 0:54.
     5, Vancouver, Ward 22 (Hunter, Nedved) 1:24.
     6, Los Angeles, Gretzky 16 (Sandstrom, Robitaille) 6:57.
     7, Los Angeles, Zhitnik 12 (Kurri, Robitaille) pp, 14:02.
     8, Los Angeles, Millen 23 (Hardy) pp, 16:57.
Third period
     9, Vancouver, Ronning 27 (Dirk) 5:28.
     10, Vancouver, Ronning 28 (Courtnall, Linden) pp, 11:15.
     11, Vancouver, Linden 33 (Courtnall, Ronning) 11:27.
     12, Los Angeles, Donnelly 29 (Millen, Granato) pp, 14:35.
     13, Vancouver, Courtnall 31 (Ronning, Ratushny) 14:54.
     14, Vancouver, Ronning 29 (Linden, Diduck) en, 18:47.

Vancouver: 8    Power play: 6-3   Special goals:  pp: 3  en: 1  Total: 4
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Babych             1    0    1
Courtnall          1    3    4
Craven             0    1    1
Diduck             0    1    1
Dirk               0    1    1
Hunter             0    1    1
Linden             2    2    4
Nedved             0    2    2
Ratushny           0    1    1
Ronning            3    3    6
Ward               1    0    1

Los Angeles: 6    Power play: 10-3
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Donnelly           1    0    1
Granato            0    1    1
Gretzky            1    2    3
Hardy              0    1    1
Kurri              0    1    1
Millen             1    1    2
Robitaille         1    3    4
Sandstrom          1    2    3
Zhitnik            1    0    1

-----------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53862
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Goalie Mask Update


	Here are the results after three days of voting. Remember 3pts for 
1st, 2 for 2nd, and 1 for 3rd. Also, you can still turn in votes! And.. if
the guy isn't a regular goalie or he is retired, please include the team! 
Thanks for your time, and keep on sending in those votes!

Player                  Team                  Pts     Votes
-----------------------------------------------------------
1. Brian Hayward        San Jose              15        6
   Andy Moog            Boston                15        6
3. Curtis Joseph        St. Louis             11        5
4. Ed Belfour           Chicago               10        5
5. Gerry Cheevers       Boston (retired)       5        3 
   Manon Rheaume        Atlanta (IHL)          5        2
   Ron Hextall          Quebec                 5        2
8. Don Beaupre          Washington             4        2
-----------------------------------------------------------
Others receiving 1 vote: Artus Irbe (SJ), Tim Cheveldae (Det),
 Clint Malarchuck (Buf/SD,IHL), Grant Fuhr (Buf), Rick Wamsley 
 (Tor,ret), Jon Casey (Minn), John Vanbiesbrouck (NYR),
 Ken Dryden (Mon,ret), Bob Essensa (Win), Mike Vernon (Cal),
 Glenn Healy (NYI), Tommy Soderstron (???), Ray LeBlanc (USA).


-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53863
From: farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL Calder Cup Playoff schedule and results

1993 CALDER CUP PLAYOFF SCHEDULE AND RESULTS	
home team in CAPS		*=if necesary
=============================================

FIRST ROUND					
Springfield Indians vs Providence Bruins
Gm 1:	Springfield 3	PROVIDENCE 2	
Gm 2:	Springfield 5	PROVIDENCE 4
Gm 3:	4/16	Providence at Springfield

CD Islanders vs Adirondack Red Wings
Gm 1:	Last night, CDI at Adirondack
Gm 2:	4/17	CDI at Adirondack
Gm 3:	4/18	Adirondack at CDI
Gm 4:	4/21	Adirondack at CDI
Gm 5:	4/23	CDI at Adirondack	*
Gm 6:	4/24	Adirondack at CDI	*
Gm 7:	4/26	CDI at Adirondack	*

Baltimore Skipjacks at Binghamton Rangers
Gm 1:	4/16	Baltimore at Binghamton
Gm 2:	4/17	Baltimore at Binghamton
Gm 3:	4/23	Binghamton at Baltimore
Gm 4:	4/24	Binghamton at Baltimore
Gm 5:	4/26	Baltimore at Binghamton	*
Gm 6:	4/28	Binghmaton at Baltimore	*
Gm 7:	4/30	Baltimore at Binghamton	*

Utica Devils vs Rochester Americans
Gm 1:	4/16	Utica at Rochester
Gm 2:	4/17	Utica at Rochester
Gm 3:	4/20	Rochester at Utica
Gm 4:	4/22	Rochester at Utica
Gm 5:	4/24	Utica at Rochester	*
Gm 6:	4/26	Rochester at Utica	*
Gm 7:	4/28	Utica at Rochester	*

Moncton Hawks vs St John's Maple Leafs
Gm 1:	St John's 4	Moncton 2
Gm 2:	4/17	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax
Gm 3:	4/21	St John's at Moncton

Cape Breton Oilers vs Fredericton Canadiens
Gm 1:	Fredericton 4	Cape Breton 3	(2OT)
Gm 2:	4/16	Cape Breton at Fredericton	

Unfortunately the newspaper didnt list complete playoff skeds for
series that already began. Also, the paper has not listed final
standings so their posting might be delayed until early next
week (Hockey News).

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL and ECAC contact for rec.sport.hockey		Go USA Hockey!	   +	
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    + CONGRATS TO THE BOSTON BRUINS, 1992-93 ADAMS DIVISION CHAMPIONS      +
    + PHOENIX SUNS, 1992-93 PACIFIC DIVISION CHAMPIONS			   +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53864
From: bdown@vis.toronto.edu (Brian Down)
Subject: Re: Bridgman is out

slacelle@gandalf.ca (Stephane Lacelle) writes:

>The Ottwawa Senators fired Mel Bridgman at 1:00 PM today.
>Randy Sexton is gonna replace him.

Trashy move from a trashy organization. After the front
office stated that nobody would lose their job over the
Sens. poor performance, Bridgeman is gone within 24 hours
of the teams final game.

Yes...I know he screwed up letting the King's grab Loach.

Sexton's qualifications (aside from being cheap)??

	- he played some US college hockey,
	- he's pals with club president Bruce Firestone.

Just the kind of experience you need when trying to build
an expansion franchise. He'll probably be in the Hall of
Fame next year! :-)

This continues a tradition of front office gaffs:
- Paul Anka and the arena deal
- Denis Potvin and the GM postion
- Mike Bossy and the scoring coach.

How do people in Ottawa feel about how the club is being run??

>Stephane Lacelle				

Brian Down (bdown@vis.toronto.edu)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53865
From: klaty@atchafalaya.engin.umich.edu (Brad Alan Klaty)
Subject: Goalies


I've heard that you can score on Belfour by shooting high 
because he goes down a lot, and on Potvin by shooting high 
on him and then getting the rebound in because he plays so
deep in the net.  Any truth to these?


			Brad

A Wings fan, but no predictions.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53866
From: yatrou@INRS-Telecom.Uquebec.CA (Paul Yatrou)
Subject: Re: Stop predicting

In <1993Apr16.060010.10012@ncsu.edu> cdkaupan@eos.ncsu.edu (CARL DAVID KAUPANG) writes:


>It is really annoying to see all of these
>predictions on the Net.  Who really cares
>who you think will win?  Please stop with
>the predictions, we all know the Caps are
>going to win the Cup, so let it go at that.
>
>
>David Kaupang
>cdkaupan@eos.ncsu.edu

Yeah, but first they have to deal with the Devils,
who've had their number all year. I'm not saying
the Caps aren't a good team (they've been a thorn
on the Habs side for the past 10 years!!!), just
that they won't get past NJ...

Paul Yatrou
yatrou@inrs-telecom.uquebec.ca
(running my pool today, wish me luck!!!!!!!!!!!)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53867
From: dwarf@bcarh601.bnr.ca (W. Jim Jordan)
Subject: Re: Truly a sad day for hockey

Farewell, Minnesota fans.  Get stuffed, Dallas Stars.

As the North Stars fade to black, I hope that Minneapolis/St. Paul are
not long without an NHL team.  It just seems "right" that the hotbed of
amateur hockey in the USA should have an NHL team as well.  The loss of
the team is certainly not the fault of the fans (though the start of the
1989-90 season made it look real bad for a while).

I wish now that I kept the North Stars cap I bought at Maple Leaf
Gardens the morning after they eliminated Montreal in 1980.  (I got it
to spite the Montreal fans in the small town where I grew up.)  What a
glorious season that was for the North Stars!

     dwarf
--
W. Jim Jordan                           "I don't mean to tell you how to live
dwarf@x400gate.bnr.ca (Internet)         your life--that's what the TV's for--
I work for BNR; I do not speak for it.   but if I didn't believe in Jesus, I'd
                                         be going to hell."      - Peter Heath

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53868
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: Goalie Mask Update

In article <93289@hydra.gatech.EDU> gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak) writes:
>
>	Here are the results after three days of voting. Remember 3pts for 
>1st, 2 for 2nd, and 1 for 3rd. Also, you can still turn in votes! And.. if
>the guy isn't a regular goalie or he is retired, please include the team! 
>Thanks for your time, and keep on sending in those votes!

> Glenn Healy (NYI), Tommy Soderstron (???), Ray LeBlanc (USA).
                     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Soderstrom plays with Philly, but he doesn't have a moulded mask.
He's got the helmet and cage variety, in white.  Or at least that's
what he wore thirteen hours ago.

-- 
Valerie Hammerl			"Some days I have to remind him he's not 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu	Mario Lemieux."  Herb Brooks on Claude
acscvjh@ubms.cc.buffalo.edu	Lemieux, top scorer for the Devils, but 
v085pwwpz@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu  known for taking dumb penalties.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53869
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)
Subject: Re: AHL Season in review (off ice stuff)

In article <1993Apr16.001323.10308@news.clarkson.edu> farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy) writes:
>==================================================
>SENATORS SOLD
<stuff deleted>
>
>The Senators are currently in serious negotiations with Charlottetown
>New Brunswick and are expected to move there.
>==================================================

It has been announced that the Senators will move their AHL franchise to
Charlottetown, P.E.I. (Prince Edward Island), not New Brunswick.

Charlie Cook
charlie@calvin.cs.unb.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53870
From: yvon@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Yvon Lavoie)
Subject: Hot, Cold Streaks ???


Ok guys, I need a list of the teams who have been hot or cold during the
last 25 games.  Doesn't need to be accurate, a rough guess will do.  I'm
about to enter a playoff pool and I want to know who is hot going into
the playoffs.  Don't need to mention Pittsburgh.  They can't get any hotter
than they are now.


P.S. I need this by Sunday

Yvon Lavoie




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53871
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL playoff results (4/15)

GAME(S) OF 4/15
---------------
ADIRONDACK 6	CDI 2	(Adirondack leads series, 1-0)

=================================================			
FIRST ROUND					
Springfield Indians vs Providence Bruins
Gm 1:	Springfield 3	PROVIDENCE 2	
Gm 2:	Springfield 5	PROVIDENCE 4
Gm 3:	4/16	Providence at Springfield
Gm 4:	4/17	Providence at Springfield
Gm 5:	4/22	Springfield at Providence	*
Gm 6:	4/24	Providence at Springfield	*
Gm 7:	4/27	Springfield at Providence	*

CD Islanders vs Adirondack Red Wings
Gm 1:	ADIRONDACK 6	CDI 2
Gm 2:	4/17	CDI at Adirondack
Gm 3:	4/18	Adirondack at CDI
Gm 4:	4/21	Adirondack at CDI
Gm 5:	4/23	CDI at Adirondack	*
Gm 6:	4/24	Adirondack at CDI	*
Gm 7:	4/26	CDI at Adirondack	*

Baltimore Skipjacks at Binghamton Rangers
Gm 1:	4/16	Baltimore at Binghamton
Gm 2:	4/17	Baltimore at Binghamton
Gm 3:	4/23	Binghamton at Baltimore
Gm 4:	4/24	Binghamton at Baltimore
Gm 5:	4/26	Baltimore at Binghamton	*
Gm 6:	4/28	Binghmaton at Baltimore	*
Gm 7:	4/30	Baltimore at Binghamton	*

Utica Devils vs Rochester Americans
Gm 1:	4/16	Utica at Rochester
Gm 2:	4/17	Utica at Rochester
Gm 3:	4/20	Rochester at Utica
Gm 4:	4/22	Rochester at Utica
Gm 5:	4/24	Utica at Rochester	*
Gm 6:	4/26	Rochester at Utica	*
Gm 7:	4/28	Utica at Rochester	*

Moncton Hawks vs St John's Maple Leafs
Gm 1:	St John's 4	Moncton 2
Gm 2:	4/17	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax
Gm 3:	4/21	St John's at Moncton
Gm 4:	4/23	St John's at Moncton
Gm 5:	4/26	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax	*
Gm 6:	4/28	St John's at Moncton		*
Gm 7:	4/30	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax	*

Cape Breton Oilers vs Fredericton Canadiens
Gm 1:	Fredericton 4	Cape Breton 3	(2OT)
Gm 2:	4/16	Cape Breton at Fredericton	
Gm 3:	4/20	Fredericton at Cape Breton
Gm 4:	4/22	Fredericton at Cape Breton
Gm 5:	4/24	Cape Breton at Fredericton	*
Gm 6:	4/26	Fredericton at Cape Breton	*
Gm 7:	4/28	Cape Breton at Fredericton	*

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL and ECAC contact for rec.sport.hockey		Go USA Hockey!	   +	
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    + CONGRATS TO THE BOSTON BRUINS, 1992-93 ADAMS DIVISION CHAMPIONS      +
    + PHOENIX SUNS, 1992-93 PACIFIC DIVISION CHAMPIONS			   +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53872
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat


In article 9088@blue.cis.pitt.edu, jrmst8+@pitt.edu (Joseph R Mcdonald) writes:

>Jagr has a higher +/-, but Francis has had more points.  And take it from
>an informed observer, Ronnie Francis has had a *much* better season than
>Jaromir Jagr.  This is not to take anything away from Jaro, who had a 
>decent year (although it didn't live up to the expectations of some).

Bowman tended to overplay Francis at times because he is a Bowman-style
player.  He plays hard at all times, doesn't disregard his defensive
responsibilities and is a good leader.  Bowman rewarded him be increasing his
ice time.

Jagr can be very arrogant and juvenile and display a "me first" attitude.
This rubbed Bowman the wrong way and caused him to lose some ice time.

Throughout the year, Francis consistently recieved more ice time than
Jagr.  Althouhg I have never seen stats on this subject, I am pretty
sure that Jagr had more points per minute played that Francis.  When
you add to that Jagr's better +/- rating, I think it becomes evident
that Jagr had a better season- not that Francis had a bad one.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53873
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Goalie masks

In article <120666@netnews.upenn.edu> kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller) writes:
>My vote goes to John Vanbiesbrouck.  His mask has a skyline of New York
>City, and on the sides there are a bunch of bees (Beezer).  It looks
>really sharp.

Funny you should mention this; one time on HNIC Don Cherry pointed out
Vanbiesbrouck's mask.  He _hated_ it.  I think he said something to the effect
of:
"You see?  He was great last year; now he goes out and gets that dopey mask 
and he can't stop a beachball!"

You may or may not take Cherry seriously at all, but I cracked up when I heard
it.

I think Ed Belfour has the current best mask in the NHL btw.  I also like
Moog's, and I'll give Fuhr's new one an honourable mention, although I haven't
seen it closely yet (it looked good from a distance!).  What's also neat is
Chevaldae's in Detroit; they call him "Chevy" so he has two checkered flags
painted at the top as in an auto race.



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53874
From: drozinst@db.erau.edu (Drozinski Tim)
Subject: Re: Ulf and all...

layfield@cpsc.ucalgary.ca (Colin Layfield) writes:

>In article <1pdlksINNmq7@GIRAFFE.ZOO.CS.YALE.EDU> wuziyun%suned@cs.yale.edu (You wanna know?) writes:
>>
>>
>>Let me give my two cents worth in this whole thing:
>>
>>  I am very sick of Pittsburg fans(and they are my second favorite team) 
>>talk about how " why can't Bruins forget about Ulf Samuelsson when we have
>>forgotten all about Adam Graves"  Beside the obvious fact that Lemeuix's career
>>was never endangered by Graves' slash while Neely is still bother by his injury,
>>I think the most important reason is:
>>
>>        ADAM GRAVES HAS PLAYED CLEAN HOCKEY EVER SINCE!  WHILE ULF SAMULESSON
>>        CONTINUES TO PLAY DIRTY(YES, TRYING TO HIT A PLAYER WHERE HE'S INJURED
>>        IS DIRTY).  FANS HAVE CAN FORGET ABOUT ONE DIRTY PLAY BUT HOW CAN YOU
>>        FORGET ABOUT ULF SAMULESSON WHEN EVERYNIGHT, WHEN I WATCH HOCKEY HIGH
>>        LIGHTS, I GET REMINDED OF HOW DIRTY HE IS.

>Hitting a player when he's injured is dirty?  Can you explain this statement?
>Do you mean a player who was just injured on the ice(?) or do you mean a player
>who is playing hurt.  If a player is hurt he should not bother playing because
>I don't belive ANY PLAYER should be let up on just because they are playing
>hurt.

>I'm not an Ulf fan but at least I can spot the fact he is like Calgary's
>Theoren Fleury in the respect that part of his game is to really piss other
>players off as that's part of his job (But he lacks Ulf's size!).

I AM an Ulf (and Pgh) fan, and what pisses me off about the whole Adam Graves/
Ulf Samuesson debate is that Ulf plays hard-hitting hockey (nothing wrong with 
that) while Graves does what he does when the only way to win a game is to 
intentionally hurt someone (which bites!).

>Players that REALLY piss me off are the ones who insist on hitting from behind
>or try to go for the knees to injure the players.  This kind of garbage has
>got to go (I would really like to see Muni get pasted as he is one of the
>worst offenders).

I thought they had instituted all kinds of new rules this season to stop crap 
like that?!?  Is it just me, or does the officiating just still stink to high
heaven?  IMHO, if they could get rid of the existing refs, and institute a new
system with more than one ref on the ice to keep an eye on the trouble-makers
then a lot of these things would stop, and then the game would be ruled by the
finnesse players:  Mario, Selanne, Bure, Messier, et.al...

>Just my $0.02.

> Colin Layfield            | "Religion and Sex are power plays,
>                           |  Manipulate the people for the money they pay,
> The University of Calgary |  Selling Skin, Selling God
> Computer Science          |  The numbers look the same on their CREDIT CARDS!"
> layfield@cpsc.ucalgary.ca |                          - Queensryche


Tim Drozinski
Embry-Riddle Aero. Univ.
drozinst@erau.db.erau.edu


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53875
From: bks2@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (bryan.k.strouse)
Subject: NHL RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4-15-93



NHL RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4/15/93.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                  STANDINGS
      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE
 TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT
 
xPIT  56 21  7 119  xBOS  51 26  7 109  xCHI  47 25 12 106  xVAN  46 29  9 101
yWAS  42 34  7  91  yQUE  47 27 10 104  yDET  47 28  9 103  yCAL  43 30 11  97
yNJ   40 36  7  87  yMON  48 30  6 102  yTOR  44 29 11  99  yLA   39 35 10  88
yNYI  39 37  7  85  yBUF  38 36 10  86  ySTL  37 36 11  85  yWIN  40 37  7  87
 PHL  35 37 11  81   HAR  26 51  6  58   MIN  36 38 10  82   EDM  26 50  8  60
 NYR  34 38 11  79   OTT  10 70  4  24   TB   23 54  7  53   SJ   11 71  2  24

x - Clinched Division Title
y - Clinched Playoff Berth

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Minnesota North Stars  (36-38-10)   1   1   1   -   3
Detroit Red Wings       (47-28-9)   0   2   3   -   5

1st period: MIN, McPhee 18 - (Ludwig) 1:23
	
2nd period: MIN, Dahlen 34 - (Courtnall, Gagner) (pp) 0:31
	    DET, Drake 18 - (Howe, Ogrodnick) 9:14
	    DET, Ysebaert 34 - (Lidstrom, Howe) (pp) 17:37

3rd period: DET, Ciccarelli 41 - (Coffey, Chiasson) (pp) 0:32
	    DET, Kennedy 19 - (Burr, Probert) 3:42
	    DET, Yzerman 58 - (Ciccarelli, Gallant) 6:17
	    MIN, Dahlen 35 - (Courtnall, Gagner) 19:11

Powerplay Opportunities-North Stars 1 of 2
			Red Wings   2 of 4

Shots on GOal-	North Stars  10   9  11  -  30
		Red Wings     6  15   8  -  29

Minnesota North Stars--Casey (26-26-5) (29 shots - 24 saves)
Detroit Red Wings--Cheveldae (34-24-7) (30 shots - 27 saves)

ATT-19,749

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Philadelphia Flyers  (35-37-11)   1   2   4   -   7
Buffalo Sabres       (38-36-10)   0   3   1   -   4

1st period: PHL, Recchi 52 - (Galley, Lindros) 0:18

2nd period: PHL, Hawgood 11 - (Dineen, Eklund) (pp) 2:15
	    PHL, Dineen 33 - (McGill) (sh) 5:40
	    BUF, Barnaby 1 - (Hawerchuk, Smehlik) (pp) 7:48
	    BUF, Wood 18 - (LaFontaine, Ledyard) (pp) 17:34
	    BUF, Mogilny 75 - (Hawerchuk, Carney) (pp) 18:56

3rd period: PHL, Eklund 11 - (Dineen, Beranek) 4:42
	    BUF, Mogilny 76 - (Errey, LaFontaine) 5:24
	    PHL, Dineen 34 - (Brind'Amour) (pp) 6:44
	    PHL, Dineen 35 - (Brind'Amour, Galley) (sh) 8:39
	    PHL, Acton 8 - (Dineen, Brind'Amour) 19:48

Powerplay Opportunities-Flyers 2 of  5
			Sabres 3 of 10

SHots on Goal-	Flyers   6   7  13  -  26
		Sabres   8  19  18  -  45

Philadelphia Flyers--Soderstrom (20-17-6) (45 shots - 41 saves)
Buffalo Sabres--Fuhr (10 shots - 7 saves)  Hasek (11-10-4) (5:40 second) 
		(16 shots - 12 saves)

ATT-15,042

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Edmonton Oilers  (26-50-8)   0   0   0   -   0
Winnipeg Jets    (40-37-7)   1   2   0   -   3

1st period: WIN, Shannon 20 - (Steen, Davydov) (pp) 2:08
	
2nd period: WIN, Selanne 76 - (Olausson) 5:25
	    WIN, Zhamnov 25 - (Selanne) 19:42

3rd period: NONE

Powerplay Opportunities-Oilers 0 of 3
			Jets   1 of 6

SHots on GOal-	Oilers   7   8  16  -  31
		Jets    10  16  16  -  42

Edmonton Oilers--Ranford (17-38-6) (42 shots - 39 saves)
Winnipeg Jets--Essensa (33-26-6) (31 shots - 31 saves)

ATT-12,229

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Toronto Maple Leafs  (44-29-11)   1   1   0   -   2
Chicago BlackHawks   (47-25-12)   0   2   1   -   3

1st period: TOR, Baumgartner 1 - 18:40

2nd period: CHI, Roenick 50 - (Murphy, Chelios) 1:29
	    TOR, Andreychuk 55 - (Mironov, Lefebvre) 13:22
	    CHI, Murphy 7 - (Roenick, Chelios) (pp) 19:05

3rd period: CHI, Matteau 15 - 10:51

Powerplay Opportunities-Maple Leafs 1 of 3
			BlackHawks  1 of 7

Shots on Goal-	Maple Leafs  14   4   8  -  26
		BlackHawks   10  13  13  -  36

Toronto Maple Leafs--Potvin (25-15-7) (36 shots - 33 saves)
Chicago BlackHawks--Belfour (41-18-11) (26 shots - 24 saves)

ATT-17,856

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Tampa Bay Lightning   (23-54-7)   0   2   3   -   5
St. Louis Blues      (37-36-11)   3   3   0   -   6

1st period: STL, Shanahan 50 - (Brown, Felsner) 10:44
	    STL, Miller 23 - (Bassen, Brown) 19:38
	    STL, Bassen 8 - (Zombo) 19:48

2nd period: STL, Bassen 9 - (Hedican, Miller) 0:14
	    STL, Miller 24 - (Zombo, Hedican) 11:09
	    TBL, Maltais 7 - (Hamrlik) 11:27
	    TBL, Bergland 3 - (Harvey, Gilhen) 17:16
	    TBL, Shanahan 51 - (Emerson) 19:38

3rd period: TBL, Creighton 19 - (Bergland, Bergevin) 0:40
	    TBL, Chambers 10 - (Zamuner, Cole) 10:37
	    TBL, Cole 12 - (Beers, Bradley) 11:58

Powerplay Opportunities-Lightning 0 of 3
			Blues     0 of 4

SHots on GOal-	Lightning   5  12  14  -  31
		Blues      11  11   4  -  26

Tampa Bay Lightning--Jablonski (8-24-4) (22 shots - 16 saves)  Bergeron (0:00
		     third) (4 shots - 4 saves)
St. Louis Blues--Joseph (29-28-9) (18 shots - 15 saves)  Hebert (19:20 third)
	         (13 shots - 11 saves)

ATT-17,816

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

San Jose Sharks   (11-71-2)   0   1   2   -   3
Calgary Flames   (43-30-11)   0   4   3   -   7

1st period: NONE

2nd period: SJS, Garpenlov 22 - (Odgers, Gaudreau) (pp) 3:37
	    CAL, Nieuwendyk 38 - (MacInnis, Suter) (pp) 5:26
	    CAL, Ranheim 21 - (Otto, Suter) 10:43
	    CAL, Yawney 1 - (Nieuwendyk, Roberts) 11:26
	    CAL, Berube 4 - (Paslawski, Skrudland) 13:45

3rd period: SJS, Wood 1 - (Odgers, Kisio) 8:00
	    CAL, Reichel 40 - 9:26
	    CAL, Roberts 38 - (Musil, Paslawski) (pp) 12:27
	    SJS, Kisio 26 - 13:10
	    CAL, Paslawski 18 - (Ashton, Stern) 16:16

Powerplay Opportunities-Sharks 1 of 3
			Flames 2 of 4

Shots on Goal-	Sharks   5  11   9  -  25
		Flames  11  14   7  -  32

San Jose Sharks--Irbe (7-25-0) (32 shots - 25 saves)
Calgary Flames--Vernon (29-26-9) (25 shots - 22 saves)

ATT-19,532

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Vancouver Canucks   (46-29-9)   1   2   5   -   8
Los Angeles Kings  (39-35-10)   2   3   1   -   6

1st period: LAK, Robitaille 63 - (Gretzky, Sandstrom) 1:39
	    VAN, Babych 3 - (Craven, Nedved) (pp) 9:43
	    LAK, Sandstrom 25 - (Gretzky, Robitaille) 10:06

2nd period: VAN, Linden 32 - (Ronning, Courtnall) (pp) 0:54
	    VAN, Ward 22 - (Hunter, Nedved) 1:24
	    LAK, Gretzky 16 - (Sandstrom, Robitaille) 6:57
	    LAK, Zhitnik 12 - (Kurri, Robitaille) (pp) 14:02
	    LAK, Millen 23 - (Hardy) (pp) 16:57

3rd period: VAN, Ronning 27 - (Dirk) 5:28
	    VAN, Ronning 28 - (Courtnall, Linden) (pp) 11:15
	    VAN, Linden 33 - (Courtnall, Ronning) 11:27
	    LAK, Donnelly 29 - (Millen, Granato) (pp) 14:35
	    VAN, Courtnall 31 - (Ronning, Ratushny) 14:54
	    VAN, Ronning 29 - (Linden, Diduck) (en) 18:47

Powerplay Opportunities-Canucks 3 of  6
			Kings   3 of 10

Shots on Goal-	Canucks   8   6  16  -  30
		Kings    10  21  10  -  41

Vanocuver Canucks--Whitmore (18-8-4) (41 shots - 35 saves)
Los Angeles Kings--Stauber (23 shots - 17 saves)  Hrudey (17-21-6) (11:27
		   third) (6 shots - 5 saves)

ATT-16,005

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


\|||||/
-SPIKE-



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53876
From: Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Truly a sad day for hockey


Joel Alvstad writes:

>A fine 26 year history came to a close tonight, as the Minnesota North Stars, 
>or Norm's Stars (whichever you prefer) lost to the Red Wings by a score of
>5-3.  The Stars goals were scored by Mike McPhee and Ulf Dahlen, who netted
>two including the final one in franchise history, with less than a minute to
>play.

This is very sad indeed.  My condolences to the Minnesota fans who are
losing their team.

I fear that within the next decade or so the only professional sports team
left in Pittsburgh will be the Steelers.

We should always enjoy things when we can.  You never know when they'll
be taken away from us.

Mom.



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53877
From: twork@egr.msu.edu (Michael Twork)
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN

>Especially when the wings player hit the rut and went into the
boards injuring his shoulder and they blotted out the injury report.

The Wings player was Yves Racine, and he returned later in that same period.

Mike

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53878
From: cs902043@ariel.yorku.ca (SHAWN LUDDINGTON)
Subject: Re: 1993 NHL Draft

In article <93109.134719IO91748@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> Jon Carr <IO91748@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> writes:
>When is the draft this year?  And will there be any coverage?
>I know the upcomming NFL draft is on ESPN.
>
>Anyone got the details?
>
>Paul Kariya 1993 #1 Pick! (No. 2 perhaps?  He won't last long!) :-)
>
I don't know the exact coverage in the states.  In Canada it is covered
by TSN, so maybe ESPN will grab their coverage!  I don't know!

As for the picks
Ottawa picks #1 which means it is almost 100% that Alexander Daigle will 
go #1. He'll either stay or be traded in Montreal or Quebec.  IMO I would
take Kariya.  He should alot of leadership in the NCAA and so far in
the World Championships.  Daigle didn't show this for his junior team.

San Jose will then get Kariya.

Tampa Bay will either go for a russian Kozlov (I think that's it) or a 
    defenseman Rob Niedemeyer (probably spelt the last name wrong)

Because of expansion I won't go further but I will name other of the
blue chip prospects

   - Chris Gratton
   - Chris Pridham
   - a swedish player who I can't remember his name

Draft Order
-----------
1) Ottawa
2) San Jose
3) Tampa Bay
4) South Florida or Anahiem
5) South Florida or Anahiem
6) Hartford
7) Edmonton
8) Dallas
9) NY Rangers
10) Philadelphia

the 8th thru 10th picks could be wrong - I don't have the standings here
and am guessing 

(In my mind there are 8 top notch prospects in the draft, with Kariya 
 leading the way but not going #1)

Shawn - GO CAPS (two first round picks for the next three years - THANKS
                 ST.LOUIS or should I say RON CARON and SCOTT STEVENS)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53879
From: duncan@ (Nicholas Duncan)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here

In article <1993Apr21.144033.15925@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca>, golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
|> In article <MfpIRbO00WBLI1ispC@andrew.cmu.edu> "William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
|> >
|> >     As a person who has rarely even SEEN Don Cherry and doesn't know
|> >anything about him, I don't know whether it is just this area
|> >(Pittsburgh) of the USA that is "deprived" of his broadcasts or whether
|> >he's a Canadian thing altogether.  Seriously, what is he all about?  I
|> >know he was a coach at one time, and from the volume of posts about him,
|> >SOMEONE surely is getting a steady diet of him somehow, but my question
|> >is, what is the deal with him?  Secondly, are the comments of his that I
|> >read about on the net merely flame bait, or do people actually take him
|> >seriously?  I gotta tell you, from what I see, he really sounds like an
|> >ass.  Let me know - maybe I'm missing something.
|> >
|> 
|> For those of you who complain about Don Cherry, and wonder why he is
|> popular...
|> 
|> the reply is Dick Vitale and John Madden and Bobby Knight and
|> Joe Garagiola and Howard Cosell.
|> 
|> John Madden picks Gary Clark of the Redskins for his All-Madden team
|> a lot, over much better receivers...for much the same reasons Cherry
|> sings the praises of Doug Gilmour...a little guy with heart...yet one
|> doesn't see a string of American posts saying that John Madden has
|> lost his marbles.
|> 
|> Dick Vitale is always promoting this kid from this high school or
|> that college with outrageous statements.
|> 
|> Why should Americans expect that Canada would not have such characters
|> in relation to our greatest passion...which is hockey?   Canadians
|> are very similar to Americans...culturally our sports are just hockey
|> and curling, whereas with Americans it is football/basketball/baseball
|> and bowling.
|> 
|> Gerald

I'd like to add that I think Canadian hockey fans like Don because his kind of hockey (the hockey he promotes in his TV appearances) is the kind that they think used to get played in the old 6 team NHL. So there's a kind of nostagia for the old days, before expansion, the Soviet series, Gretzky and even Bobby Orr, when guys weren't afraid to take a hit, nobody floated and defensemen played defence. Who cares that that probably never really existed, the myth is still around in Canada and all the European in



fluence on the game has diminished it in some people's eyes.

Personally, I'd like to add before I get flamed, I love the fast-paced "European" game and think Don Cherry is a bit of an idiot. I have to say that I missed him when I was living in the States, though. He is entertaining, even if you end up throwing your popcorn at the screen when he's on.
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
         
I stand by all the misstatements that I've made.
		-- Vice President Dan Quayle to Sam Donaldson, 8/17/89

Me Too -- Nick Duncan <duncan@mprgate.mpr.ca>

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53880
From: stimpy@dev-null.phys.psu.edu (Gregory Nagy)
Subject: Re: ESPN UP YOURS .........

In article <C5u542.3CD@news.udel.edu> tmavor@earthview.cms.udel.edu writes:
>>
>>[Various justifiable rantings on ESPN coverage by several deleted]
>>
>
>The only way to change ESPN's thinking, if it is even possible, is to complain
>to them directly.  Anyone know there telephone # in Bristol, Ct?  

Heh... Try the rec.autos.sport FAQ. They are always calling ESPN to complain.
I'm sure you could find the number for ABC there too, as many west-coast 
viewers were compaining about how something as boring as hockey cut into
the Long Beach GP. =)

>
>I do find it hard to believe that ESPN doesn't think viewers will simply
>change the channel from a boring game....I know I did.  And then, when
>they didn't show the NYI-Wash overtime(s), I was livid!  If I wanted
>to watch baseball, I could have turned on the Phillies-Padres extra
>inning game....instead, I went to bed angry......I boycotted ESPN's
>morning Sportscenter today, I was still so incensed.

Were you (and several of the other people here it seems) asleep the day
"contracts" were explained? ASPN has a piece of paper saying it MUST
show that baseball game if it happens. Many businesses payedd money to
have their commercials run during a baseball game. This is a business,
not your own personal video servant.

>
>My wife says I shouldn't go to bed angry, but last nite.........GRRRRRRR!
>

Maybe you should put that anger into something positive. For example, I saw
ads for the new Dodge both on the ESPN and KBL broadcasts. Why not write to
Dodge saying that "thanks to the ads run during the STANLEY CUP PLAYOFFS, 
you will now concider their products in the future. They love to hear stuff
like that and in the future will be more willing to buy commercial time
for hockey games, giving ESPN (and other networks) more incentive to carry
games (just one example)

Come on people, as great as we think it is, Hockey does not leapfrog the
"big three" overight.

> 
>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>Tim Mavor		   |  "I am known by many names.......
>College of Marine Studies  |   some call me.........Tim."
>Univ. of Delaware	   |    
>Newark, DE 19716	   |  "You know much that is hidden, O' Tim!"
>tmavor@pandora.cms.udel.edu|  	Monty Python and the Holy Grail	---------------------------------------------------------------------
>



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53881
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: LIST OF TEE TIMES AT METROPOLITAN TORONTO GOLF COURSES FOR MONDAY

In article <1993Apr20.194441.23595@julian.uwo.ca> lee139@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (Steve Lee) writes:
>Woops!  This is rec.sport.hockey! Not rec.sport.golf!  Hope you check the
>newsgroup header next time before posting!

	Duh! He was making a joke about how long the Leafs would last in the
playoffs. (Y'know, hit the courses in the off season). Sheesh... People are
so quick to complain...


-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53882
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: NHLPA poll (partial stats/results)

In article <1993Apr20.124012.3383@mtroyal.ab.ca> caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca writes:
>>All these people who send in their polls should take a closer look at
>>NJD, they are a very deep team, with two very capable goalies, and
>>excellent forwards and defensemen.  Shooter in Richer, an all around do
>>it all in Todd, chef Stasny-master of a thousand dishes, power play


>Kevin Todd is an Oiler and has been one for months. How closely do you follow
>the Devils, anyway? Jeez....

	Sigh.
	This was written about the game NHLPA Hockey '93. Which does not
have precise up-to-date rosters. Why don't people think before they post?
Jeez...


-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53883
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

In article <1993Apr20.113953.18879@jarvis.csri.toronto.edu> leunggm@odin.control.utoronto.ca (Gary Leung) writes:
>In article <1993Apr20.151818.4319@samba.oit.unc.edu> Scott.Marks@launchpad.unc.edu (Scott Marks) writes:
>>>And of course, Mike Ramsey was (at one time) the captain in Buffalo prior to
>>>being traded to Pittsburgh.  Currently, the Penguins have 3 former captains
>>>and 1 real captain (Lemieux) playing for them.  They rotate the A's during the
>>>season (and even the C while Mario was out).  Even Troy Loney has worn the C
>>>for the Pens.
>>
>
>I think that Mike Foligno was the captain of the Sabres when he
>got traded to the Leafs. Also, wasn't Rick Vaive the captain of
>the Leafs when he got traded to Chicago (with Steve Thomas for
>Ed Olcyzk and someone). Speaking of the Leafs, I believe that
>Darryl Sittler was their captain (he'd torn the "C" off his
>jersey but I think he re-claimed the captaincy later on) when he
>was traded to the Flyers.
>
>Oh yeah, of course, Gretzky was the captain of the Oilers before
>he was traded wasn't he? 

Dale Hawerchuk and Troy Murray were both captains of the Jets
when they were traded.  (Murray this year in mid-season, Hawerchuk
a few years ago in the off-season.)

Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53884
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: If You Were Pat Burns ...

Mark D. Whitten <347NFET@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU> writes:

>If I were Pat Burns I'd throw in the towel. The wings dominated every
>aspect of the game.  Trying to mix up the lines is a dead end.

As the Rangers found out in last year's playoffs, it's too late to
try line-juggling at this point.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53885
From: htilney@vax.clarku.edu
Subject: Bruins - Klingon Connection?

I was wondering if any Star Trek TNG fans in this newsgroup knew of a
possible relationship between the Bruins' players Douris & Moog and the
Klingon names Duras and Worf (Son of Moog). I suppose it's a coincidence.

Just curious,

Bart

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53886
From: bittle@niktow.canisius.edu (Jason Bittle)
Subject: * Sabres are playing well...

But I have to agree.. Boston is a good team..  But streaky...  They put
together a great streak to capture first place in the Adams, but for what?

They have lost the home ice advantage for at least the first round, and might
not make it out of it.

I would love to see the Sabres win the first round, even though I bet on the
Bruins (a 12-pack).  

Oh well, perhaps I should start betting against the Sabres more often! ;-)



-- 
ciao,                             
Jason Bittle (bittle@canisius.edu) 
(a.k.a. Pillsbury Dough Boy )
Quote: "I compute... therefore, I. B. M."

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53887
From: cdash@moet.cs.colorado.edu (Charles Shub)
Subject: Thumbs WAY WAY WAY DOWN to ESPN

Tuesday, and the isles/caps game is going into overtime.
what does ESPN do.....

Tom Mees says,  "we are obligated to bring you baseball"

I hate to say this, but last year the coverage of the playoffs on
sports channel america (out in colorado) was vastly superior
to what espn is giving us this year.
-- 

charlie shub  cdash@cs.Colorado.EDU       -or-         (719) 593-3492     
on leave at the University of Iowa  cdash@cs.uiowa.edu (319) 335-0739

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53888
From: Patrick Walker <F1HH@UNB.CA>
Subject: Red Wings Goespel...

Detroit's going to beat Toronto in 6 or LESS!!!

 Granted, Gilmour should get the Hart Trophy, NOT Lemieux... Just
Look at what Gilmour did for Toronto.  When you think of Toronto,
who comes to mind, Gilmour, Andreychuk, Potvin...ah...did I mentio
n Gilmour?

Back to Detroit...  There really isn't a team that could stand up
to them if all the players on the team play to their potential,
no one could stop them.  Yzerman, Fedorov, Coffey, Lindstrom...
there's more firepower there than Pittsburgh... and they don't tri
p over their own skates!
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
  /------------/ Detroit over Toronto in 5     Patrick Walker
 / /--\------/   Detroit over Chicago in 6     University of New Bruns.
 ! !  !---/      Detroit over Vancouver in 6   Canada
 \ \__/ /        Detroit over Nords in 6       "Disco Still Sucks!"
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53889
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Subject: Re: Panther's President

In article <1993Apr20.180241.10263@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>The San Jose Sharks and Ottawa Senators are each on their second GM
>already...I'd be willing to wager that both the Sharks and Senators
>will probably see their 3rd GM's and perhaps their 4th, before we
>see the Panthers second.

Actually, fired-coach George Kingston was a third of the GM
triumvirate.  Now that the trio is now duo (Dean Lombardi and Chuck
Grillo), the Sharks are already on their 3rd "office of the GM". And a
4th is likely to happen before September; they'll either add the new
coach to the OofGM, or name a single GM. So your wager should be
amended to read that Sharks are likely to have their 5th GM before the
Panther's get their 2nd. Can't wait to see how the next season's NHL
Guide and Record Book lists the GM history of the Sharks.

Given the depth of next year's draft, the expansion draft rules, and
the reputation of their GMs, Anaheim and Miami look pretty good as the
first 90s expansion teams to win a Cup.  San Jose and Ottawa have
instability at the GM position, something that Philly, NYI, Edmonton,
and Calgary did not have when they won their first Cups. Pittsburgh
did, but they needed a quarter century.
-- 
Mike Eisler, mre@Eng.Sun.Com  ``Not only are they [Leafs] the best team, but
 their fans are even more intelligent and insightful than Pittsburgh's.  Their
 players are mighty bright, too.  I mean, he really *was* going to get his
 wallet back, right?'' Jan Brittenson 3/93, on Leaf/Pen woofers in
 rec.sport.hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53890
From: dwarf@bcarh601.bnr.ca (W. Jim Jordan)
Subject: Re: #77's?

In article <1r23on$4p6@bigboote.WPI.EDU> ching@bigwpi.WPI.EDU ("The Logistician") writes:
>I am in need of all of the players wearing #77 in the NHL.  I know now only
>of one, Ray Borque for the Bruins.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.

I believe that Phil Esposito was the first to wear #77 when he played
with the Rangers in the '70s.  This was the season that they put the
Rangers crest and "modern-style" numbers on the jerseys instead of the
"NEW YORK" or "RANGERS" block letters and two-colour numbers.  He took #77
because the Rangers already had a #7.

(Hockey Night in Canada made a big thing out of it, saying it was the
biggest uniform style change in a long time.  This was before Pittsburgh
and Vancouver changed their colours.)

     dwarf
--
W. Jim Jordan                           "I don't mean to tell you how to live
dwarf@x400gate.bnr.ca (Internet)         your life--that's what the TV's for--
I work for BNR; I do not speak for it.   but if I didn't believe in Jesus, I'd
                                         be going to hell."      - Peter Heath

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53891
From: chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Subject: Re: SHARKS REVIEW Part 5: Left Wings

nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:

>#8	LARRY DEPALMA		Season:	3rd
>Acquired:	'91-92, free agent from Minnesota
>Grade:		I (C-/D+)

>No netter/fan watching the Sharks, including me, knows where DePalma was at
>the end of the season; the Sharks appeared to still have his rights, but he
>wasn't in San Jose, he wasn't in Kansas City, and his name hasn't appeared on
>the waiver wire.

Sorry, Nelson, but you forgot to ask me. If you check the THN stats for
Kansas City, you'll find that Larry has been playing for the games, having
played in 8 games in the period covered in the stats between 3/26 and the
4/16 issue (1-3-4 with 13 PIM). Not exactly invisible.

>He then was sent down to
>Kansas City, walked out from there, and was suspended and later reinstated
>when it was revealed that he was injured; he then promptly disappeared from
>the watching eyes of Shark Bytes (as the mailing list is now known to Sharks
>officials) faithful, and neither the Sharks nor we miss him.

Well, having gotten to a chance to talk to him a few times, this isn't quite
accurate. He injured his back (a disk injury) and did one stupid thing,
which was to hide it from the Sharks and he tried to play through it because
he knew he was on the bubble. The Sharks then sent him to K.C., at which
point he disclosed the injury. Since he didn't disclose it, the Sharks and
he disagreed about the responsibility and he was suspended for not
reporting. That was eventually worked out, the Sharks re-instated him as
injured and put him into therapy, and when he was able to play then shipped
him down to K.C. He fully expects to play in the NHL again, although clearly
not with the Sharks (hiding injuries is a stupid no-no, beyond just a
no-no).

Very nice guy. Always hustled his butt off. He disappeared because he was
hurt. I expect he'll surface with another team at some point (probably
another expansion team), but is likely to be a bubble player for the rest of
his career. Has a good work ethic and is good at getting other players
motivated. Unfortunately, he played himself out of the Sharks future with a
bad judgement call.


>#20	JOHN CARTER		Season: 4th
>Acquired:	'91-92, free agent from Boston
>Grade:		I (B+/B)

> He
>is very unlikely to be back next season.

Always gave 110%, best work ethic on the club (except maybe Kisio), but
hustle isn't always enough. His future with the Sharks was made clear to me
one night against the Flames when he went behind the crease and tried to
hold Joel Otto against the board. He literally had one arm around Otto's
neck and another wrapped around Otto's stick arm. Otto casually turned
around and fed the puck in front of the crease for a goal, as though Carter
wasn't there. Hustle can only cover size so far.

The Sharks have told me, point blank, that he's gone for good (ditto HUbie
McDonough). He was one of the favorites of the staff, but as one said to me
"you have to make room for the kids". Carter, in fact, refused to report to
K.C. and has been suspended by the Sharks. That might be a defacto
retirement, but I haven't heard anything official. His only hope in hockey
now is the Gulls.

>#28	JEAN-FRANCOIS QUINTIN	Season: 1st
>Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
>Grade:		I (B+/B)

>I don't understand why the Sharks didn't let Quintin play any more than the
>14 games he played this season.

Because, at least from the games I saw him in, he was outmatched and looked
fairly lost on the ice. I think he shows potential, but I didn't think he
was quite ready to make the jump to the NHL.

> He should be a solid contender for regular duty next season.

Agreed (BTW, I still think a lot of your grades are more based on how you
wish they'd performed than how they actually performed. I wonder whether you
can really judge talent from radio and television, Nelson? I know I have
trouble, since you don't see the off-puck action. your views from home and
my views from the ice differ in numerous ways)

>#41	MARK BEAUFAIT		Season: 1st
>Acquired:	2nd round pick in 1991 supplemental draft
>Grade:		I (?)

>After a all-star season at Kansas City, Beaufait got a cup of coffey with the

Coffee. Coffey is with the Red Wings.

>#45	DODY WOOD		Season: 1st
>Acquired:	3rd round pick in 1991 entry draft
>Grade:		I (D+/D, although perhaps I shouldn't give a grade at all)

>I have been accused of knocking on Wood too much.

You? Nah... 

He was seriously unimpressive, even as a tough guy (his rep). However, as
few games as he had in a season that was at that point meaningless, I hate
to judge the talent too quickly. Butn in Dody's case, I"m tempted to make an
exception.

But I won't.

-- 
 Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= chuq@apple.com
   Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms =+=  GEnie: MAC.BIGOT =+= ALink:CHUQ 
  Minor League fans: minors-request@medraut.apple.com (San Jose Giants: A/1/9)
  San Francisco Giants fans: giants-request@medraut.apple.com (The Stick?NOT!)
   San Jose Sharks fans: sharks-request@medraut.apple.com (New seat: 127/TBD)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53892
From: Patrick Walker <F1HH@UNB.CA>
Subject: They guy who bad-mouthed Ulf...

Ditto...

If we allow people like him to continue to do what he does, it's a
shame.  People say that cheap shots and drawing penalties by fake-
ing is part of the game, I say "Bullsh-t!".  If he ever tried some
like that on a Yzerman, he'd would have to deal with Probert now
wouldn't he?  What Ulf does isn't even retaliatory!  There's now
way one could justify what he does and if they do they're fools.


 /----\==========/  Patrick Walker
/ /--\ =========/   University of New Brunswick
I I()I ======/      Canada
\ \--/ /            Detroit Fan Extraordinaire.
 \----/


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53893
From: Patrick Walker <F1HH@UNB.CA>
Subject: Did you really expect Toronto to go anywhere?  REALLY!

Detroit is a very disciplined team.  There's a lot of Europeans
in Detroit which would make the game fast, so Toronto would have
to slow the game down, which means drawing penalties, as a last
resort anyway.  Toronto will be a good team as soon as they get
more good players.  Toronto is just an average team, Detroit isn't
Ballard screwed Toronto when he was owner.  Everyone knows that.
and it's going to take time for Toronto to become a real force.
I expect Gilmour to be burnt out next year.  He can't pull the
whole team forever.

Patrick Walker
University of New Brunswick


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53894
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: ESPN sucks: OT or Baseball?  Guess which.

Showing a meaningless (relatively) baseball game over the overtime of
game that was tied up with less than 3 seconds left on the clock?
Gimme a break!  Where does ESPN get these BRILLIANT decisions from?

Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53895
From: stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber)
Subject: ESPN, the network with a heart...


     Dale Hunter ties the game, scoring his third goal of the game
with 2.7 seconds remaining in regulation.

     You could feel it coming on.

     "Due to contractual agreements, ESPN will be unable to carry
the rest of this game live, so that we may show you a worthless
early-season battle between those two pennant contenders, the 
Cleveland Indians and the California Angels.  When the winning
goal is scored, we WILL do the grave injustice of breaking into the
baseball game -- something reserved only for the deaths of Presidents
or the trading of Joe Montana to the Chiefs -- to show you the 
goal on instant replay.
     "Aren't you SO lucky to have national coverage of hockey?"

     It's HEIDI all over again, dammit!

Kevin L. Stamber
Purdue University
PENGUINS 7, DEVILS 0 -- ROLL TRAIN, ROLL!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53896
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Thumbs WAY WAY WAY DOWN to ESPN

cdash@moet.cs.colorado.edu (Charles Shub) writes:
>Tuesday, and the isles/caps game is going into overtime.
>what does ESPN do.....
>
>Tom Mees says,  "we are obligated to bring you baseball"

We're probably stuck, as Mike Burger pointed out that the baseball
deal was made far in advance of the NHL contract.  WABC did the same
thing; they were thankful that the Devils were wiped out by 9:30,
because they had to switch over to Yankees baseball.  The proof of 
the reasons for this is left to the reader ...

It's too bad, but I wonder if ESPN is stuck with other US local team
coverage for their alternate games?  We got NESN's coverage of the
Bruins-Sabres with the Boston homers ... they were awful!!!  I've read
that Derek Sanderson is the colour analyst ... I wonder if he spent
his early years after hockey as an intern at PRAVDA before landing
this job?  *Everything* had to be twisted into something good to say
about the Bruin(s) involved ... not even Bill Wirtz's shills on SC
Chicago (Pat Foley, Dale Tallon) were this bad.  And just to be fair,
SC used to take their feed from ESN (Empire Sports Network), the Sabre
homers and they were horrible too ... but they were spacy.

From the CNN highlights, I hear Chris Cuthbert's voice from the CBC
coverage of the Habs-Nords series.  Too bad that we couldn't get it
on ESPN, with all due respect to the Sabres and the Bruins.

Mike Emrick is substituting on the Devils SCNY team for Gary Thorne.
Mike was the original Devils TV play-by-play announcer, by the way.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53897
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: The guy who bad-mouthed Ulf...

Patrick Walker <F1HH@UNB.CA> writes:
>
>If he ever tried some like that on a Yzerman, he'd 
>would have to deal with Probert now wouldn't he?

Do you realize how many smiles are crossing faces after you wrote that?
(-;

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53898
From: The Always Fanatical: Patrick Ellis <IO11330@MAINE.MAINE.EDU>
Subject: Re: 1993 NHL Draft

>San Jose will then get Kariya

    ya know that kind of funny cause I've seen Kariya on Campus
with a Sharks hat on.......



             Pat Ellis


P.S.  GO BRUINS    GO UMAINE BLACK BEARS    42-1-2       NUMBER 1......

                   HOCKEY EAST REGULARS SEASON CHAMPIONS.....
                   HOCKEY EAST TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONS>......
                   PAUL KARIYA, HOBEY BAKER AWARD WINNER.......
         NCAA DIV. 1 HOCKEY TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


                    M-A-I-N-E      GGGGOOOOOOO    BBBLLLUUEEEE!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53899
From: kozloce@wkuvx1.bitnet
Subject: ESPN Thumbs Up your $%#@*!!

Jesus Christ!!!

The score is now 6-0. The Pens are beating the shit out of the Devils who
gave up in the middle of the 2nd period. ESPN does something smart. The
announcer states "well folks this game is getting out of hand. Lets go to
the Islander/Capitals game." I celebrate as I was actually making progress in
my CS homework because I was so bored by the scheduled game.  I tear down and
throw on my jersey, Hunter scores I go ape shit 'cause this is the first
caps game I've been able to watch all season. And what does ESPN do? they
go back to the blowout that NJ hasn't a chance in hell of winning!
     The period ends and the sportscaster (CAPITOLS JUST TIED IT UP!! YES!!
oops excuse me =) goes into his penguin worship mode (Dont freak pens fans!
They are worthy of this! I'm so glad we wont have to play them as much next
year!) and here comes the 3rd period...what? its the blowout again. Oh they
were just waiting for the Cap/Isles to get out of intermission. Good
they've put a close game back on. Wait! WHATS THIS SHIT?!! THEY'RE SHOWING
THE BLOWOUT AGAIN!


AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG!

(Oh guess what the score is now 7-0 penguins! Switch games you $%&*#@!!!)

Holy shit they're changing games! ITS ABOUT GODDAMNED TIME!! Lets see if
they'll stay.

Later

I think this proves by $#%&* point. The Caps game goes into overtime but
"due to contractual obligations" they have to switch to the fucking baseball.
(Sorry for my language but im PISSED!) What the hell were they going to do
if their scheduled game went into overtime? ESPN get your head out of your
ass.

Now I know there are a lot 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53900
From: thomas@cmgm.stanford.edu (Thomas Kiefhaber)
Subject: Re: German audience is lunatic??

In article <1993Apr21.114335.7071@ousrvr.oulu.fi>, golf@phoenix.oulu.fi
(Jouko Kylmaoja) wrote:
> 
> I watched the game Germany-Czechs in WC today...and i was astonished about
> the behaviour of the German audience!
> The German team got a few penalties in the last period and the crowd went
> grazy! They threw coins, extra pucks and other trash into the rink...is
> that stupid or what?? I guess the Canadian referee (one of the
> Isostar-bros ;) gave the German team a penalty for that, but it didn't help
> much.
> I guess the Germans just are proud over their Nazi-Kill-'em-All-Everyone-
> But-Us-Germans-Sucks attitude...they just seem to have that kind of attitude
> in every possible sport (remember the European champs in Stockholm in soccer)
> It really pisses me off!
> I do not mean that every single German has this attitude that sucks, but 
> most of them seem to do...

I can understand your anger about the German audience. I mean, it was the
Finnish team they played and they were taking advantage of the ridiculous
penalties the Canadien ref called in the last period. The Germans got a
match penalty and a 10 minutes misconduct for practically nothing and
seconds after that the German goalie got two minutes for "delay of game"
for a shot that was deflected and went into the crowd. The resulting 5:3
skating advantage lead to the deciding goal at a point, when the Germans
were starting to come up strong.
I am also sick of the nationalism that is going on in German sports events.
If you watch for example a tennis Davis Cup match the players are often not
able to play for minutes, because the crowd is so obnoxious. But I have to
admit that this kind of nationalism is as strong or even stronger in most
other countries (you should go to the US and watch the way they present the
Olympics on television; or the soccer crowds in England; or the Finnish
spectators at nordic skiing events.....). I mean it makes me sick to see
all this nationalism all over the world and I would rather see the best
team/player win and get cheared at. I do not mind if my favorite team
looses to somebody that is better or plays more attractive and I have to
admit that in most sports the German national site is not my favorite team
to watch (the German soccer team is boring to watch, for example).
But, reading the above posting, I think that you are on the same level as
these crowds you are criticizing. It is easy to talk of (nearly all)
Germans as Nazis and nationalists; thats the kind of propaganda that all
ultraconservative people use against Germany. It is true that there is a
great danger of re-arising nationalism in Germany but from my experience
most of the people (at least of the people that i know) also regard this as
a big threat and are trying to demonstrate this attitude now. Why can't we
just look at people as human beeings and not try to put them into drawers
corresponding to their nationality (eg. all Russians are Communists; all
Americans are Capitalists; all Germans are Nazis, all Fins are hanging
around beeing drunk on ferries...). 
In my opinion, your comment shows the narrowness of your mind and that you
don't seem to be different from the Nazis you are talking about.

Thomas


"There's no time to hate, barely time to wait" (Jerry Garcia/Robert Hunter)

       

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53901
From: mjr4u@Virginia.EDU ("Matthew J. Rush")
Subject: Re: ESPN UP YOURS .........

Actually, I was angry when they went away from the Pens game.
Being a Pens fan in central Virginia is kinda tough.  I only
get to see them on ESPN, and when they play the Caps, cause
we're close enough to DC to get all the Caps games, so when
ESPN switched to the Caps, . . . AAAGGGHHH!

Matt

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53902
From: filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu (Geoff Filinuk)
Subject: Re: FLYERS:with & without Eric

In article <1993Apr20.211124.23075@btree.uucp>, terry@btree.uucp (Terry Whalen)
writes:
|>Path:
netnews.upenn.edu!newsserver.jvnc.net!howland.reston.ans.net!usc!news.se
ervice.uci.edu!network.ucsd.edu!btree!terry
|>From: terry@btree.uucp (Terry Whalen)
|>Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
|>Subject: Re: FLYERS:with & without Eric
|>Message-ID: <1993Apr20.211124.23075@btree.uucp>
|>Date: 20 Apr 93 21:11:24 GMT
|>References: <1993Apr19.030101.116104@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu>
|>Organization: Brooktree Corporation
|>Lines: 47
|>
|>In article <1993Apr19.030101.116104@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu> ksc2@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu
(KEVIN S. CARRAGHER) writes:
|>>The Philadelphia Inquirer posted the following stats:
|>>
|>>
|>>WITH LINDROS:
|>>
|>>    29-23-9
|>>    GOALS AGAINST AVERAGE: 3.49
|>>    GOALS SCORED AVERAGE: 4.27
|>>
|>>
|>>WITHOUT LINDROS:
|>>
|>>    7-14-2
|>>    GOALS AGAINST AVERAGE: 3.92
|>>    GOALS SCORED AVERAGE: 2.52
|>>
|>>
|>>I THINK THE DIFFERENCE IS OBVIOUS.  HE'S A DOMINANT PLAYER
|>>
|>>
|>>SKIP
|>
|>
|>Yes he is!
|>
|>He will become a major franchise player and bring the Flyers to the cup
|>in ............
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>...6 or 7 years
|>
	Will they name Lindros captain next year or Recchi.
Geoff

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53903
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: WC 93: Scores and standings, April 20


 1993 World Championships in Germany:
 ====================================

   Group A standings (Munich)          Group B standings (Dortmund)
   --------------------------          ----------------------------

              GP  W T L GF-GA +/- P                  GP  W T L GF-GA +/- P

   Canada      2  2 0 0  6-1  +5  4    Czech republic 2  1 1 0  6-1  +5  3
   Russia      2  1 1 0  6-4  +2  3    Finland        2  1 1 0  3-1  +2  3
   Italy       2  1 1 0  3-2  +1  3    Germany        2  1 0 1  6-5  +1  2
   Sweden      2  1 0 1  2-4  -2  2    USA            2  0 2 0  2-2   0  2
   --------------------------------    -----------------------------------
   Austria     2  0 0 2  2-5  -3  0    France         1  0 0 1  0-2  -2  0
   Switzerland 2  0 0 2  0-3  -3  0    Norway         1  0 0 1  0-6  -6  0

 
 April 18:  Italy - Russia        2-2       Norway - Germany          0-6
            Sweden - Austria      1-0       USA - Czech republic      1-1

 April 19:  Canada - Switzerland  2-0
            Russia - Austria      4-2       Finland - France          2-0

 April 20:  Sweden - Canada       1-4       Czech republic - Germany  5-0
            Switzerland - Italy   0-1       Finland - USA             1-1

 April 21:                                  Germany - France		15:30
            Italy - Sweden                  Czech republic - Norway	20:00

 April 22:  Switzerland - Russia            USA - France		15:30
            Austria - Canada                Norway - Finland		20:00

 April 23:  Switzerland - Austria           Germany - Finland		20:00

 April 24:  Russia - Sweden                 Czech republic - France	15:30
            Canada - Italy                  USA - Norway		20:00

 April 25:  Sweden - Switzerland            Finland- Czech republic  	15:30
            Russia - Canada                 Germany - USA		20:00

 April 26:  Austria - Italy                 France - Norway		20:00

 
 PLAYOFFS:
 =========

 April 27:	Quarterfinals
		A #2 - B #3						15:30
		A #3 - B #2						20:00

 April 28:	Quarterfinals
		A #1 - B #4						15:30
		A #4 - B #1						20:00

 April 29:	Relegation
		A #5 - B #6						15:30
		A #6 - B #5						20:00

 April 30:	Semifinals
		A #1/B #4 - A #3/B #2					15:30
		A #4/B #1 - A #2/B #3					20:00

 May 1:		Relegation						14:30
		Bronze medal game 					19:00

 May 2:		FINAL							15:00

--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53904
From: boora@kits.sfu.ca (The GodFather)
Subject: ABC: The Real Thing?


	Ok, it seems that everyone else in canada was treated to the 
REAL ABC telecast while only the people on ROGERS TV in Surrey BC 
were treated to two channels with Don "I stink as a Commentator" Whitman
doing the play-by-play.

	The GodFather.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53905
From: nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: Re: 1993 NHL Draft

In article <1993Apr20.184627.4585@newshub.ariel.yorku.ca> cs902043@ariel.yorku.ca (SHAWN LUDDINGTON) writes:

>As for the picks
>Ottawa picks #1 which means it is almost 100% that Alexander Daigle will 
>go #1. He'll either stay or be traded in Montreal or Quebec.  IMO I would
>take Kariya.  He should alot of leadership in the NCAA and so far in
>the World Championships.  Daigle didn't show this for his junior team.
>
>San Jose will then get Kariya.
>
>Tampa Bay will either go for a russian Kozlov (I think that's it) or a 
>    defenseman Rob Niedemeyer (probably spelt the last name wrong)

The last name is Niedermayer, as in New Jersey's Scott's last name, because
(you guessed it) they are brothers.  But Rob Niedermayer is a center, not
a defenseman.

I am not sure that the Sharks will take Kariya.  They aren't saying much, but
they apparently like Niedermayer and Victor Kozlov, along with Kariya.  Chris
Pronger's name has also been mentioned.  My guess is that they'll take
Niedermayer.  They may take Pronger, except that they already have too many
defensive prospects.

===============================================================================
GO CALGARY FLAMES!  Al MacInnis for Norris!  Gary Roberts for Hart and Smythe!
GO EDMONTON OILERS!  Go for playoffs next year!  Stay in Edmonton!
===============================================================================
Nelson Lu (claudius@leland.stanford.edu)
rec.sport.hockey contact for the San Jose Sharks

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53906
From: holger.ohlwein@ap.mchp.sni.de (Holger Ohlwein)
Subject: Re: Canada 3 Sweden 1 at the World Champioships

In article <20APR199319243244@venus.cc.hollandc.pe.ca>, white@venus.cc.hollandc.pe.ca (Take me Baby!) writes:
> 
> 	Today at the World Championships in Munich, Canada scored an 
> impressive 3-1 victory over the defending World Champs, Sweden. 
 
In the game *I* have seen yesterday in the Olympiahalle of Munich
Canada won 4-1 against Sweden! The last goal for Canada was at 19:59 in
the 3rd period. Maybe you shouldn't go and get you another beer 
before the game is over and then post imaginary results...

Holger

-- 
S I E M E N S    Holger Ohlwein   AP153   Otto-Hahn-Ring 6    8000 Muenchen 83
-------------    Tel: + 49 (89) 636-3746  Email: holger.ohlwein@ap.mchp.sni.de
N I X D O R F    Never put off till tomorrow what you can avoid all together.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53907
From: kirk@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (ANDREW KIRK)
Subject: Re: Goodbye, good riddance, get lost 'Stars

In article <9505@blue.cis.pitt.edu> gomer+@pitt.edu (Richard J Coyle) writes:
>In article <1993Apr19.232038.26593@julian.uwo.ca> kirk@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (ANDREW KIRK) writes:
>>First off, anyone accepted into the Western Business School is not a dork. 
>>Second, just because one person out of a country of 27 Million doesn't think
>>before he/she posts an article, does NOT mean that he/she is embarrasing
>>Canada. This network is for expressing what you feel are your thoughts. Just
>>because someone doesn't agree with you, this does not give you the right to
>>call them assholes. Anyways, the North Stars are SHIT!!!!!!!!!
>
>Actually, I think it does give people the privilege of calling folks
>like you assholes.   Although my own asshole might take offense at being
>grouped in with a bunch of losers like you.
>
>I've never heard of the Western Business School, anyhow.  Probably a
>chickenshit place.
>
>rick

Losers like us? You are the fucking moron who has never heard of the Western
Business School, or the University of Western Ontario for that matter. Why 
don't you pull your head out of your asshole and smell something other than
shit for once so you can look on a map to see where UWO is! Back to hockey,
the North Stars should be moved because for the past few years they have
just been SHIT. A real team like Toronto would never be moved!!!

Andrew--



-- 
Andrew Kirk
University of Western Ontario
London, Ontario
GO LEAFS GO!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53908
From: caine@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Lord Vader)
Subject: Trivia:  the Habs?


OK, I'm sure that this has been asked 100's of times before, but I
have wondered since I heard it...  Where the hell did the nickname
of the "Habs" come from for the Montreal Canadiens?

Thanks in advance,
Caine Schneider

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53909
From: willis@oracle.SCG.HAC.COM (Stan Willis)
Subject: 1992-93 NHL Regular Season Final Attendance Report


                        *** NATIONAL HOCKEY LEAGUE ***
                                 92-93 SEASON

                            HOME ATTENDANCE REPORT

 Each Qtr. represents 10 home games,   Qtr. 4 will have 11 home games.
 Neutral site games are not included.  S/O indicates the number of sell-outs.

Team
Name   Qtr. 1   S/O  Qtr. 2   S/O  Qtr. 3   S/O  Qtr. 4   S/O   Totals   Average
================================================================================
BOS    140,573   5   142,694   7   142,768   6   152,468   8    578,503   14,109
BUF    144,701   0   148,516   3   152,133   5   168,878   4    614,228   14,981
CAL    190,125   1   196,174   3   196,982   4   217,346   5    800,627   19,527
CHI    176,372  10   176,746   9   177,981  10   196,749  11    727,848   17,752
DET    196,330  10   196,670  10   197,228  10   217,167  10    807,395   19,692
EDM    139,038   0   149,422   2   152,831   2   165,384   2    606,675   14,796
HAR     92,994   0   110,670   2   108,651   0   122,123   0    434,438   10,596
LA     154,065   5   159,014   8   160,050  10   176,055  11    649,184   15,833
MIN    130,710   2   140,933   3   139,986   1   160,213   4    571,842   13,947
MON    168,097   8   169,671  10   168,784  10   190,186  11    696,738   16,993
NJ     127,053   0   124,011   2   145,856   2   163,050   1    559,970   13,657
NYI    114,706   1   108,502   1   123,167   3   139,946   0    486,321   11,861
NYR    178,200   7   179,990   6   182,000  10   199,337   8    739,527   18,037
OTT    104,713  10   105,000  10   104,602  10   115,330  11    429,645   10,479
PHI    172,372   4   172,967   3   172,613   2   190,520   5    708,472   17,279
PIT    160,379   6   161,475   8   161,280   6   177,705  10    660,839   16,118
QUE    149,452   3   147,911   3   147,394   2   168,830   8    613,587   14,965
SJ     110,890  10   110,374   8   110,120   7   121,745  10    453,129   11,051
STL    156,313   3   170,531   5   171,249   5   187,849   7    685,942   16,730
TB      97,269   5    99,621   6    99,611   4   114,059   9    410,560   10,013
TOR    155,500   4   157,779   9   157,014   8   172,888  11    643,181   15,687
VAN    144,120   0   154,184   4   157,094   6   176,751   8    632,149   15,418
WAS    153,209   0   163,563   1   161,479   2   171,711   2    649,962   15,852
WIN    131,072   0   135,902   1   133,414   1   154,956   2    555,344   13,544
 
     3,488,253     3,582,320     3,624,287     4,021,246     14,716,106
 
Avg.    14,534        14,926        15,101        15,231                  14,955

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53910
From: willis@oracle.SCG.HAC.COM (Stan Willis)
Subject: Kings playoff notes: Stauber, TV ratings, etc.

1992-93 Los Angeles Kings notes.
--------------------------------
Playoffs:
---------
*Stauber disturbed by third-man theme
by Rick Sadowski, Daily News

Barry Melrose's decision to stick Robb Stauber in the stands rather than in the
crease or even on the bench for the Stanley Cup playoffs does not sit well with
the rookie goaltender.

"I want to be a part of the team at the most crucial time of the year, the most
fun time of the year, and I'm not,"  Stauber said with some emotion Monday.  "I
think I have worked hard enough for that."

Stauber said he accepts Melrose's choice of Kelly Hrudey as the teams top goalie
in their playoff series with the Calgary Flames. Hrudey made 21 saves in Sundays
6-3 opening victory.

But Stauber clearly is upset with his sudden status as the No. 3 man behind Rick
Knickle.  Stauber had a 4-1-2 record and 2.98 goals-against average down the
stretch in the regular season and nearly wrestled the No. 1 job from Hrudey.

Knickle?  He won 2 of 3 decisions but had a bloated 5.26 average, twice was 
yanked from games (once for stomach cramps) and hasn't played since March 29.

Yet, when the series resumes Wednesday, Knickle will serve as Hrudey's backup
again and Stauber will have to satisfy his playoff hunger by munching on Olympic
Saddledome popcorn.

"If I'm supposedly close to being the starter or could have been the starter...I
dropped too. 3.  What happened to No. 2?"  Stauber wondered.  "Not that I'd be
happy with No. 2, but I feel I should at least be a part of this team in the
playoffs."

Perhaps Stauber eventually will get his chance, but Melrose apparently is not
convinced the 25-year old is capable of handling playoff pressure.

While insisting he is the Kings' "goalie of the future," Melrose said Stauber
flubbed all four of the big games he was asked to win this season.  They were,
according to Melrose: a 7-2 loss to San Jose on Dec. 26; An 8-3 loss to the New
York Rangers on Jan. 23; a 6-6 tie with Detroit on Feb. 11; an 8-6 loss to 
Vancouver on Thursday.

"Four times this season Robb could have emerged as the elite goalie, he could
have taken it away from Kelly Hrudey, and he didn't do it," Melrose said.  "An
elite goaltender has to carry the ball when you give it to him.  The mark of a
great goalie is that he isn't satisfied to be a backup."

"I'm not blaming Robb for the losses, but if you're going to be No. 1, you've
got to be able to walk your talk.  You've got to be able to play when everything
is on the line.  Robb Stauber has a great deal of ability, but maybe I expect
more from him than he does."

Ouch.  That remark stung Stauber.  He began the season 9-0-1, struggled when the
team hit a mid-season slump, didn't play for a month after Knickle was signed
off the San Diego Gulls roster, then came on at the end.

"I expect more from myself than anybody, including Barry Melrose," said Stauber,
a three-year star at the University of Minnesota who left school in 1989, only 
to have his development hampered by a string of serious injuries.

"What I've been through the last four years - two knee operations, a herniated
disk in my back, shoulder surgery - what more can I go through?  I obviously do
expect a lot from myself, otherwise I wouldn't be here."

"Anybody who would disagree with that doesn't know me.  I'm not saying Barry 
doesn't know me, but don't say I've been without expectations.  If anything, I'm
a perfectionist."

Stauber acknowledged he played poorly in the four games Melrose mentioned. "But 
even though I didn't play well, I get knocked down from maybe on to three? It's 
a bit of a jump," he said.  "You're almost No. 1, or if you play a good game 
you're No. 1 and if you don't you're No. 3?  Why does Jack Nicklaus shoot a 67 
and then a 75?  Can you explain that?  That's what barry wanted me to explain 
to him, why I didn't come through when he counted on me.  I don't know. What I 
do know is, it's a sport.  I'll be there."

Melrose's "goalie of the future" statement doesn't mean much to Stauber. "Before
you know it, I'll be 30 and there will be no future," he said.

------

*Game 1 of the Kings @ Flames playoff series drew a 4.2 Nielsen rating on ABC 
Channel 7 here in LA.  The Kings averaged a 2.1 Nielsen rating in the 10 regular
season games aired on Channel 5.

Around the NHL:
---------------
*San Jose fired Coach George Kingston, who lead the team to a 11-71-2 mark in 
their 2nd NHL season.  Kingston was 28-129-7 over the past 2 years with the
Sharks.

------

*Former Islander executive Bill Torrey was named as President of the expansion
Florida Panthers.  Bobby Clarke was named as the clubs General Manager.

*Last nights games:
-------------------
WIN  2 @ VAN  4 (VAN leads 1-0)
TOR  3 @ DET  6 (DET leads 1-0)

===============================================================================
Stan Willis (willis@empire.dnet.hac.com)
net contact: L.A. Kings

 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
      talk with the L.A. Kings Mailing List ...... kings@cs.stanford.edu
      to subscribe or unsubscribe: ....... kings-request@cs.stanford.edu
 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
===============================================================================

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53911
From: willis@oracle.SCG.HAC.COM (Stan Willis)
Subject: Re: Schedule...

In article <121411@netnews.upenn.edu> kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller) writes:
>In article <1qup1lINNotb@master.cs.rose-hulman.edu> swartzjh@RoseVC.Rose-Hulman.Edu writes:
>F**king *NO* hockey games televised nationally tonight!  What the hell is
>this???  Why the hell is ESPN showing some stupid baseball game, when
>baseball is not even three weeks into the season and hockey is in the
>playoffs???  No, wait, I know the answer: $$$$$$  But still!  It really
.
.
.

ESPN had the Houston Astros @ Chicago Cubs game scheduled for last night on the
west coast. 

Since the game was rained out, they showed the Toronto Maple Leafs at the
Detroit Red Wings game instead.

Stan Willis
net contact: LA Kings

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53912
From: Bjornar.Steinbakken@edb.uib.no
Subject: Re: #77's?

In article <1r23on$4p6@bigboote.WPI.EDU> ching@bigwpi.WPI.EDU ("The
Logistician") writes:
>
>I am in need of all of the players wearing #77 in the NHL.  I know now
only
>of one, Ray Borque for the Bruins.  Any help would be greatly
appreciated.

Paul Coffey of Detroit RedWings


Bjoernar Steinbakken


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53913
From: mvs1@cec2.wustl.edu (Michael Virata Sy)
Subject: Re: Red Wings Goespel...

	Don't forget Paul Ysebaert, ex-Devil.  He's a good team player.
Michael Sy
mvs1@cec2.wustl.edu
 			    /|______|\
                           ||||||||||||
                            \||||||||/  
                  .---.      )|||||/'   
                 /|||||\    /|||||/   
                /|||||||\  /|||||/     NEW JERSEY DEVILS
               /|||||||||\/|||||/      
              /||||||||||||||||/      
             /||||||||||||||||/     
            /||||||||||||||||/       
           /||||||/\||||||||/        
          /||||||/  \||||||/      
         ''''' .____/|||||/             
           ../|||||||||||'           
     /|./||||||||||||||'            
    /|||||'       '''                    
   //|\                               

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53914
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: WC 93: Results, April 20


 1993 World Championships in Germany:
 ====================================

 Group A results:

 SWEDEN - CANADA  1-4 (0-0,1-1,0-3)

 1st:
 2nd: CAN 0-1 Geoff Sanderson      (Kevin Dineen)                  7:24
      SWE 1-1 Patrik Juhlin        (Jan Larsson)                  15:23 (pp)
 3rd: CAN 1-2 Geoff Sanderson                                      5:54 (ps)
      CAN 1-3 Mike Gartner         (Greg Johnson,Adam Graves)     10:44 
      CAN 1-4 Rod Brind'Amour      (Shayne Corson)                19:59

            Shots on goal:    Penalties:    Attendance:     Referee:
 Sweden     10 15 12 - 37     4*2min        6,500           Rob Hearn (USA)
 Canada     10 13  6 - 29     6*2min

 Bill Ranford stopped 36 shots to lead Canada to a 4-1 victory in a very well
 played game.

 The first period started with a give away from a Canadian defenseman and
 Rundqvist came in alone on Ranford but couldn't put the puck over a sliding
 Ranford. Later on, Kevin Dineen had a great opportunity but Soderstrom 
 played very well too. Stefan Nilsson had a couple of great dekes and set up
 Jan Larsson but again Ranford came up big. Period ended scoreless but the edge
 to Sweden in creating more opportunities.
 Second period action saw Tommy Soderstrom making a GREAT save. Mark Recchi
 made a backhanded cross ice pass to Lindros, Eric one timed the puck but
 Soderstrom was there to make a glove hand save. At the 7-minute mark, Canada
 started applying pressure on the Swedes. Sanderson-Dineen-Brind'Amour worked
 hard and kept the puck in the Swedes' zone. Dineen gave the puck to Sanderson
 who skated around a screened Swedish defenseman, came in on Soderstrom and
 made a wrist shot that went it by Soderstrom's far post, 1-0 Canada.
 The Swedes picked up their game after that, and Peter Forsberg had a shot
 that hit Ranford's post (the inside), went parallel to the goal line and out.
 Then Gartner got a penalty and the Swedes a power play. Jan Larsson took
 a shot from the slot, Ranford gave a rebound to Larsson who saw Juhlin by
 the far post, passed the puck and Ranford was beat, 1-1.
 Third period started as the other periods, Swedes having most of the pressure
 but the Canadians always dangerous once they were close to the Swede goal.
 At 5:54, Canada created some great chances and Arto Blomsten was forced to
 cover the puck in the Swede goal crease since Soderstrom lost sight of it.
 That resulted in a penalty shot, since a defenseman can't cover the puck in 
 the goal crease. Geoff Sanderson took the penalty shot (his first ever, he
 explained afterwards), and he put it low on Soderstrom's stick side, close
 to the post. Excellent penalty shot to give Canada a go ahead goal.
 Canada increased the lead on a very suspect offside, Gartner volleyed a
 bouncing puck past Soderstrom to make it 3-1. The Swedes ran out of gas
 then and couldn't produce as good scoring chances as they had for 2,5 periods.
 The 4-1 goal came with only 1 second left, Rod Brind'Amour scoring on a
 rebound from Soderstrom, where the Swedish defense already had their minds
 in the dressing room.

 A very good game (the best in the WC so far?), with both goalies playing
 great. Soderstrom best player in Sweden, but Ranford even played better
 than Soderstrom, that tells you something about Ranford. Probably the best
 goalie in the world, were some comments after the game.
 Canada played a very disciplined defense, Ranford pointed out that it is
 easy to play well with a good defense. Lindros played A LOT and played well,
 Sanderson naturally game hero with two goals.

 The Forsberg-Naslund-Bergqvist line Sweden's best along with Larsson-Juhlin-
 Nilsson. Swedish defense played well, 197 cm 104 kg Peter Popovic had the
 task of neutralizing 192 cm 107 kg Eric Lindros, and managed this very well.
 Ranger defenseman Peter Andersson finally got to go to the WC, and considering
 that he landed in Germany just a few hours before the game, he played very
 well. Swedish coach Curt Lundmark was irritated after the game, partly because
 of the Swedes inability to score, and partly because of the linesman's mistake
 on the 1-3 goal.

 Lines information follows further below.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

 ITALY - SWITZERLAND  1-0 (0-0,1-0,0-0)

 1st:
 2nd: ITA 1-0 Orlando          15:47
 3rd:

 Penalties: ITA 10*2min, SWI 8*2min
 Referee: Anton Danko, Slovakia
 Attendance: 3,500

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Group B results:

 CZECH REPUBLIC - GERMANY  5-0 (0-0,3-0,2-0)

 1st:
 2nd: CZE 1-0 Kamil Kastak        1:51
      CZE 2-0 Jiri Dolezal       12:26
      CZE 3-0 Petr Hrbek         19:10
 3rd: CZE 4-0 Radek Toupal        8:28
      CZE 5-0 Josef Beranek      17:07

 Penalties: CZE 7*2min, GER 6*2min 1*5min 1*10min game penalty
 Referee: Darren Loraas, Canada
 Attendance: 10,200

 The Czechs were clearly better than the Germans, and the German crowd
 showed their discontent by throwing in stuff on the ice after a while.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

 FINLAND - USA  1-1 (0-0,1-0,0-1)

 1st:
 2nd: FIN 1-0 Jarkko Varvio      4:00
 3rd: USA 1-1 Ed Olczyk          4:26

 Penalties: FIN 7*2min, USA 6*2min
 Referee: Valeri Bokarev, Russia
 Attendance: 2,800

 I hope some Finns can provide information from this game (I didn't see the
 whole game). The Finns took the lead on a Jarkko Varvio slap shot from the
 blue line, and a soft goal for an unscreened Mike Richter.
 As far as the play in the second period goes, the Finns seemed to have the
 most control, so a 1-0 lead was warranted as I saw it.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

		   SWEDEN			   CANADA

 Goaltender:	30 Tommy Soderstrom		30 Bill Ranford

 Defense:	 8 Kenneth Kennholt		 5 Norm Maciver
		14 Fredrik Stillman		24 Dave Manson

		 3 Peter Popovic		25 Geoff Smith
		55 Peter Andersson		19 Brian Benning

		 7 Arto Blomsten		 6 Terry Carkner
		28 Roger Akerstrom		 3 Garry Galley

						 4 Derek Mayer

 Forwards:	29 Mikael Renberg		15 Dave Gagner
		 9 Thomas Rundqvist		27 Adam Graves
		34 Mikael Andersson		22 Mike Gartner

		19 Markus Naslund		20 Paul Kariya
		21 Peter Forsberg		88 Eric Lindros
		18 Jonas Bergqvist		 8 Mark Recchi

		 5 Patrik Juhlin		17 Rod Brind'Amour
		20 Jan Larsson			 9 Shayne Corson
		 4 Stefan Nilsson		11 Kevin Dineen

		22 Charles Berglund		10 Geoff Sanderson
		26 Michael Nylander		12 Greg Johnson
		(34 Andersson/18 Bergqvist)	14 Brian Savage

						16 Kelly Buchberger

--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53915
From: delarocq@eos.ncsu.edu (DERRELL EMERY LAROCQUE)
Subject: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!






   Tonight in Boston, the Buffalo Sabres blanked the Boston
Bruins 4-0 tonight in Boston. Looks like Boston can hang
this season up, because Buffalo's home record is awesome!!!!
This is great.. Buffalo fans might get to see revenge for
last year!!!!! :)
-- 
delarocq@eos.ncsu.edu


      
---------------------------------------------------------------------------   
1988,1989,1990,1991 AFC East Division Champions
1991,1992, AND 1993 AFC Conference Champions!!!!!!!!  :)

Squished the Fish ............... Monday Night Football, November 16, 1992..
SQUISHED THE TRASH TALKING FISH.. AFC CHAMPIONSHIP, JANUARY 17, 1992..

If you are a Buffalo Bills fan, email me at delarocq@eos.ncsu.edu
so we can talk all about the games, insight, etc.
If you are a Packers fan, let me know. I am interested in any news
out of Green Bay...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53916
From: bart@splunge.uucp (Barton Oleksy)
Subject: Re: LA ON ABC IN CANADA

plarsen@sanjuan (P Allen Larsen) writes:

>In article <boora.735182771@sfu.ca> boora@kits.sfu.ca (The GodFather) writes:
>>	Was the ABC coverage of the Kings/Flames game supposed to be the
>>way it was shown in BC with CBC overriding the ABC coverage?  When I flipped
>>to ABC, it was the same commentators, same commercials even.  My question
>>is:  Was this the real ABC coverage or did CBC just "black out" the 
>>ABC coverage for its own?
>>

>Yes, it's called simulcast.  In Canada, when a Canadian station and an 
>American station are showing the same thing whether a sporting event or
>Cheers on Thursday night, the Canadian signal is broadcast over the American
>station. They even do this during the Superbowl, which has the best commercials
>of any television.  What do we get here, dumb Canadian commercials, the same
>ones we've seen for that last year or so.

I'm in Edmonton, and while that's usually (or at least OFTEN) the case,
here we were "treated" to the actual ABC telecast of the Kings/Flames
game.  I'm with whoever said it earlier - Don Witless (er, Whitman) is
a poor commentator, and not just for hockey.  Normally, if the Oilers
were still playing (augh), I would turn off the sound and listen to 
the radio broadcast to get decent play-by-play announcing.

Bart, Edmonton

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53917
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Bay area media (Wings-Leafs coverage)

In <DREIER.93Apr19195132@durban.berkeley.edu> dreier@durban.berkeley.edu (Roland Dreier) writes:

>The San Francisco Bay area media is reporting tonight that the Detroit
>Red Wings beat the Toronto Maple Leafs 6-3.  Can someone who is not
>part of the media conspiracy against the Leafs tell me how the game
>really went (I am expecting a 4-0 win for the Leafs, shutout for
>Potvin, hat trick for Andreychuk and a goal and 3 assists for
>Gilmour).  If the Leafs really lost, how many penalties did whichever
>biased ref was at the game have to call against the Leafs to let the
>Red Wings win?

Ah yes.  California.  Did the San Francisco Bay area media report that
Joe Montana is rumoured to be the leading candidate to replace fired
San Jose Sharks coach George Kingston?  Apparently Montana is not only
coveted for his winning attitude, but as a playing coach he will be
expected to quarterback the powerplay.

Good thing those walls are so soft, eh Rollie?


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53918
From: njdevils@IASTATE.EDU (Cire Y. Trehguad)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

Anna Matyas (am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu) wrote:
: Michael Collingridge writes:
: >And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
: >resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
: >team captain trivia would be appreciated.
;
: Wasn't Ron Francis captain of the Whalers when he was traded to
: Pittsburgh?

  And Rick Tochett was the captain of the Flyers when traded to the Pens
recently...

Caleb

And let us not forget that the New Jersey Devils traded
captain Kirk Muller for Stephen Richer and Chorske

Man I hated that trade!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53919
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Wings take game one

In <1qvos8$r78@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu (David Vergolini) writes:

>  The Detroit Red Wings put a lot of doubter on ice tonight with a 6 - 3
>washing of the Toronto Maple Leafs.  All you Toronto fans have now seen the
>power of the mighty Red Wing offense.  Toronto's defense in no match for the
>Wing offense.  As for the defense, Probert, Kennedey and Primeau came out

Did they move Probert back to defense?  Why did I see him parking his ass
in front of Potvin all night?  Somebody is going to have to discipline
Probert if the Leafs want to win the series.  Perhaps a fresh Clark should
hit the ice at the end of a long Probert shift and straigten him out for
a while...


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53920
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 18

dstein@oak.math.ucla.edu (David Stein) writes:
>  What's going on?  The Russians and the Czechs are unable to beat easy
>opponents, and the Swedes beat Austria only 1:0?!?
>
 It's the "opening-game effect" maybe. Pros arrive late, nervousness for
 rookie WC players, and problems to get the lines clicking may make things
 hard to get it going against these "worse" nations.
 I'd guess that the better team you face in the opening game, the better
 it is, since the chances of an upset are greater then.

 Some other reasons why the "worse" teams are so tough to beat was presented
 by Hans "Virus" Lindberg (former coach in Switzerland).

 1) The "worse" teams (referring to France, Switzerland, Austria, Italy etc)
    have now usually world class goalies.

 2) Their defensive play have become much more disciplined, they take much
    less unnecessary penalties.

 3) They use four lines which makes it harder to make them "run out of gas."

 4) The ice quality in the German WC rinks is poor.

>  The only convincing winner was... Germany.  Wierd.
>
 Another weird thing was that the Czechs played entertaining hockey..
 err.. just kidding, David.

>p.s. Alex, I would like to see the Czech roster, including, if possible,
>the clubs from which the players come.  How many are "Finnish", "German", 
>or "Swiss"?
>
 Alex? That's a new name for me ;)

 OK, I forgot the Czech roster at home yesterday, but now I have it.
 I don't know the teams for all players, so I would appreciate if
 you guys could fill in the blanks for me (especially I think some
 of these players play in Finland).

 The Czech Republic
 ------------------

 Goaltenders:	 1. Petr Briza		(Finland somewhere, right?)
		 2. Roman Turek		Motor C. Budejovice

 Defense:	 3. Leo Gudas		?
		 4. Milos Holan		TJ Vitkovice
		 5. Drahomir Kadlec	?
		 6. Bedrich Scerban	Brynas, Sweden
		 7. Antonin Stavjana	HV 71, Sweden
		 8. Miroslav Horava	MoDo, Sweden
		 9. Ales Flasar		TJ Vitkovice
	
 Forwards:	10. Petr Rosol		?
		12. Kamil Kastak	HV 71, Sweden
		13. Richard Zemlicka	?
		14. Jiri Kucera		?
		16. Jan Caloun		HC Litvinov
		18. Petr Hrbek		?
		19. Tomas Kapusta	?
		20. Otakar Janecky	(Finland?)
		21. Roman Horak		Motor C. Budejovice
		22. Martin Hostak	MoDo, Sweden
		24. Radek Toupal	?
		26. Jiri Dolezal	?


 Staffan
--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53921
From: icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera)
Subject: Hockey & The Hispanic community


	Relying on Canadian tourists and transplanted Northeasterners to
support a team in Miami is crazy; espaecially when you have really deserving 
cities without a team such as San Diego & Milwaukee. I wish the Panthers or
whatever their name is well but if they can't sell to Hispanics, they're in
deep doo-doo. Already, there are rumors that Tampa may move to Milwaukee.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53922
From: icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera)
Subject: ABC coverage


	I loved the ABC coverage. The production was excellent. The appearance
was excellent. It had a sleek modern look. This was the first time I heard
Thorne & Clement & I thought they were great. My only request is to leave
Al Micheals out of this. He annoys me. 
	I'm hoping this leads to a regular-season contract. My guess would
be is that it will be roughly a weekly game from Feb.-April and then the 
playoffs. I envy you Canadians with your TSN & CBC. Maybe I'll get a dish
to pick up Canadian TV. How much are those things, BTW?

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53923
From: Karim Edvard Ahmed <ka0k+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Goodbye, good riddance, get lost 'Stars

>First off, anyone accepted into the Western Business School is not a dork. 
>Second, just because one person out of a country of 27 Million doesn't think
>before he/she posts an article, does NOT mean that he/she is embarrasing
>Canada. This network is for expressing what you feel are your thoughts. Just
>because someone doesn't agree with you, this does not give you the right to
>call them assholes. Anyways, the North Stars are SHIT!!!!!!!!!
> 
>C'mon Leafs...


Whoa there!  Lighten up, Andrew!  When I was referring to "you dorks at
the Western Business School", I was specifically referring to those
assholes writing obnoxious comments insulting the state and people of
Minnesota for no apparent reason.  Being Canadian, and one who has
friends who attended UWO, I personally don't want to be associated with
the idiots who wrote those messages.  One more thing, Andrew...until
this season, the Leafs have sucked pretty badly over the last umpteen
years (have they won the Cup during our lifetime?)...so the North Stars
haven't been the only "shit" team in the Norris.

-KEA 


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53924
From: filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu (Geoff Filinuk)
Subject: Selfish hockey fans..


	On Tuesday, when it was raining in Chicago, ESPN provided 
bonus hockey coverage.  Now it seems as though some fans are ticked off
that the NY-Wash OT was replaced with the Angels-?? game.  People must
realize that there are more baseball fans instead of hockey fans in the U.S  
The baseball game was scheduled to air and advertisers money was paid so
they can't skip the baseball game.  Why don't you people CHILL OUT
and enjoy whatever coverage you can get.

Geoff Filinuk

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53925
From: CCDB@MUSICA.MCGILL.CA (CCDB)
Subject: Habs Late

Quebec dominated Habs for first 2 periods and only Roy kept
this one from being rout, although he did blow 2nd goal.
Canadians showed up in third but Nords were playing dump &
pull back most of the time. Hextall made some good saves but
really this one was lost in first period when nords scored 3
& could have had 5, plus another 4 in 2nd. Canadians are dead
meat, they may take one or 2 but this one is over. Tee it up
Jacques, next time you might rest players & forget about 1st
place, welcome to the Adams division.

    Dennis

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53926
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Sun, April 18, 1993

New Jersey                       1 0 2--3
Pittsburgh                       2 3 1--6
First period
     1, Pittsburgh, Tocchet 1 (Stevens, Lemieux) pp, 1:40.
     2, New Jersey, Barr 1 (Guerin, Holik) 6:24.
     3, Pittsburgh, Lemieux 1 (Jagr, Ramsey) 9:33.
Second period
     4, Pittsburgh, Lemieux 2 (Stevens, Murphy) pp, 4:11.
     5, Pittsburgh, Francis 1 (Ramsey, Mullen) 12:57.
     6, Pittsburgh, Tippett 1 (Jagr, McEachern) 17:13.
Third period
     7, Pittsburgh, Jagr 1 (Samuelsson, Lemieux) pp, 8:35.
     8, New Jersey, Stevens 1 (Niedermayer, Driver) pp, 11:48.
     9, New Jersey, Stevens 2 (Semak, Niedermayer) 18:56.

Pittsburgh: 6    Power play: 8-3
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Francis            1    0    1
Jagr               1    2    3
Lemieux            2    2    4
McEachern          0    1    1
Mullen             0    1    1
Murphy             0    1    1
Ramsey             0    2    2
Samuelsson         0    1    1
Stevens            0    2    2
Tippett            1    0    1
Tocchet            1    0    1

New Jersey: 3    Power play: 8-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Barr               1    0    1
Driver             0    1    1
Guerin             0    1    1
Holik              0    1    1
Niedermayer        0    2    2
Semak              0    1    1
Stevens            2    0    2

-----------------------------------------
St Louis                         0 2 2--4
Chicago                          1 2 0--3
First period
     1, Chicago, Noonan 1 (Larmer, Brown) 8:17.
Second period
     2, St Louis, Brown 1 (Shanahan, Emerson) 3:12.
     3, Chicago, Noonan 2 (Roenick, Chelios) pp, 5:40.
     4, Chicago, Noonan 3 (Matteau, Sutter) 8:51.
     5, St Louis, Felsner 1 (McRae, Janney) 12:49.
Third period
     6, St Louis, Shanahan 1 (Brown, Hull) pp, 11:12.
     7, St Louis, Hull 1 (Emerson, Brown) pp, 11:29.

St Louis: 4    Power play: 4-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Brown              1    2    3
Emerson            0    2    2
Felsner            1    0    1
Hull               1    1    2
Janney             0    1    1
McRae              0    1    1
Shanahan           1    1    2

Chicago: 3    Power play: 7-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Brown              0    1    1
Chelios            0    1    1
Larmer             0    1    1
Matteau            0    1    1
Noonan             3    0    3
Roenick            0    1    1
Sutter             0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Los Angeles                      1 3 2--6
Calgary                          0 1 2--3
First period
     1, Los Angeles, Sydor 1 (Gretzky, Sandstrom) 0:16.
Second period
     2, Calgary, Suter 1 (Fleury) sh, 2:48.
     3, Los Angeles, Carson 1 (Shuchuk, Sydor) pp, 3:13.
     4, Los Angeles, Huddy 1 (Taylor, Rychel) 3:37.
     5, Los Angeles, McSorley 1 (unassisted) 6:36.
Third period
     6, Los Angeles, Millen 1 (Granato, Donnelly) 1:06.
     7, Calgary, Dahlquist 1 (Otto) 4:23.
     8, Calgary, Yawney 1 (MacInnis, Reichel) 8:47.
     9, Los Angeles, Carson 2 (Sandstrom, Robitaille) pp, 10:32.

Los Angeles: 6    Power play: 10-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Carson             2    0    2
Donnelly           0    1    1
Granato            0    1    1
Gretzky            0    1    1
Huddy              1    0    1
McSorley           1    0    1
Millen             1    0    1
Robitaille         0    1    1
Rychel             0    1    1
Sandstrom          0    2    2
Shuchuk            0    1    1
Sydor              1    1    2
Taylor             0    1    1

Calgary: 3    Power play: 8-0   Special goals:  sh: 1  Total: 1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Dahlquist          1    0    1
Fleury             0    1    1
MacInnis           0    1    1
Otto               0    1    1
Reichel            0    1    1
Suter              1    0    1
Yawney             1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
First period
     1, NY Islanders, Ferraro 1 (Flatley, Vaske) 5:56.
Second period
     No scoring.
Third period
     2, Washington, Hunter 1 (Elynuik, Krygier) 3:18.
     3, Washington, Hunter 2 (Khristich, Johansson) pp, 7:01.
     4, Washington, Khristich 1 (Pivonka, Johansson) pp, 15:25.

Washington: 3    Power play: 5-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Elynuik            0    1    1
Hunter             2    0    2
Johansson          0    2    2
Khristich          1    1    2
Krygier            0    1    1
Pivonka            0    1    1

NY Islanders: 1    Power play: 5-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Ferraro            1    0    1
Flatley            0    1    1
Vaske              0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Buffalo                          2 1 1 1--5
Boston                           0 2 2 0--4
First period
     1, Buffalo, Hannan 1 (unassisted) 2:32.
     2, Buffalo, LaFontaine 1 (Mogilny) 9:26.
Second period
     3, Boston, Juneau 1 (Neely, Oates) pp, 7:20.
     4, Boston, Neely 1 (Oates, Juneau) 14:42.
     5, Buffalo, Mogilny 1 (Hawerchuk, Smehlik) 19:55.
Third period
     6, Buffalo, Mogilny 2 (unassisted) 3:46.
     7, Boston, Neely 2 (Juneau, Oates) 15:44.
     8, Boston, Heinze 1 (Juneau) 17:00.
Overtime
     9, Buffalo, Sweeney 1 (Khmylev, Smehlik) 11:03.

Buffalo: 5    Power play: 3-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Hannan             1    0    1
Hawerchuk          0    1    1
Khmylev            0    1    1
LaFontaine         1    0    1
Mogilny            2    1    3
Smehlik            0    2    2
Sweeney            1    0    1

Boston: 4    Power play: 7-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Heinze             1    0    1
Juneau             1    3    4
Neely              2    1    3
Oates              0    3    3

-----------------------------------------
Montreal                         1 1 0 0--2
Quebec                           0 0 2 1--3
First period
     1, Montreal, Dionne 1 (Dipietro, Brunet) 5:52.
Second period
     2, Montreal, Bellows 1 (Muller, Desjardins) 9:58.
Third period
     3, Quebec, Rucinsky 1 (Lapointe, Sundin) pp, 18:31.
     4, Quebec, Sakic 1 (Lapointe) 19:12.
Overtime
     5, Quebec, Young 1 (Ricci, Duchesne) 16:49.

Quebec: 3    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Duchesne           0    1    1
Lapointe           0    2    2
Ricci              0    1    1
Rucinsky           1    0    1
Sakic              1    0    1
Sundin             0    1    1
Young              1    0    1

Montreal: 2    Power play: 1-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bellows            1    0    1
Brunet             0    1    1
Desjardins         0    1    1
Dionne             1    0    1
Dipietro           0    1    1
Muller             0    1    1

-----------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53927
Subject: College Hockey All-Star Roster
From: bdhissong@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu

Could someone please post the rosters for the College Hockey All-Star game East
and West Rosters?  Thanks in advance.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53928
From: holger.ohlwein@ap.mchp.sni.de (Holger Ohlwein)
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 18

In article <1993Apr21.085435.6895@ericsson.se>, etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson) writes:
 
>  OK, I forgot the Czech roster at home yesterday, but now I have it.
>  I don't know the teams for all players, so I would appreciate if
>  you guys could fill in the blanks for me (especially I think some
>  of these players play in Finland).
> 
>  The Czech Republic
>  ------------------
> 
>  Goaltenders:	 1. Petr Briza		(Finland somewhere, right?)
					signed contract for EV Landshut, Germany
					for the 1993/94 season
 
>  Defense:	 3. Leo Gudas		?
					EC Hedos Muenchen, Germany
					since 1992. 

Holger 

-- 
S I E M E N S    Holger Ohlwein   AP153   Otto-Hahn-Ring 6    8000 Muenchen 83
-------------    Tel: + 49 (89) 636-3746  Email: holger.ohlwein@ap.mchp.sni.de
N I X D O R F    Never put off till tomorrow what you can avoid all together.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53929
From: icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera)
Subject: request for list of Boston Univ. players in NHL


	Being a proud BU alumnus, I'd like to get a list of BU players in 
the NHL so I can keep an eye on their progress. A lot of Terriers are
graduating this year so I hope to see them soon in the NHL. If somebody
could post or send me a list, I'd appreciate it. Please note if the player
graduated from here or not.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53930
From: Gibson.Bill@applelink.apple.com (Bill Gibson)
Subject: SHARKS:  Kingston Fired!!!

I just overheard that San Jose Coach George Kingston was officially
terminated today...  Maybe good news, maybe bad.  I kinda liked him, but he
seemed to lack a certain fire.


Bill Gibson                  : Gibson.Bill@applelink.apple.com
Chief Technical Sponge       : AppleLink:  GIBSON.BILL
Apple Computer, Inc.         : Just say: SHARKS!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53931
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Detroit-Toronto?

What's the deal?  c.s.h. has nothing on it yet.  Is it in OT, is it over,
what?  I want to know!  We all want to know!  Where's Roger when you need
him?!?!?!?!  :-)

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

	   "A cow is not a vegetarian dish."  -- Keith Keller, 1993

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53932
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Goalie mask poll

In article <93743@hydra.gatech.EDU> gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak) writes:
>Current votes for favorite goalie masks (3pts - 1st, 2pts - 2nd, 1pt - 3rd)
>Others receiving less than 4pts: Mike Vernon (Cal), Clint
> Glenn Healy (NYI), Toy Espo (???), Gilles Gratton (???),
		     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Is this Tony Esposito?  If memory serves me correctly, Chicago.  God I
hope I am right, otherwise I will never hear the end of it. ;-)

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

	   "A cow is not a vegetarian dish."  -- Keith Keller, 1993

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53933
From: mfoster@alliant.backbone.uoknor.edu (Marc Foster)
Subject: Final season CHL stuff

Here are the final stats for the CHL for the 1992-1993 season.

                       Central Hockey League

                       5840 S. Memorial Drive
                             Suite 205
                          Tulsa, OK  74145
                       Phone:  (918) 664-8881
                       Fax:    (918) 664-2215

Founder and President - Ray Miron
Commissioner - Monte Miron
Marketing Director - Jim Goodman
Information Director - Eric Kolb

Each team is owned by the league, with local intrests controlling day to
day operations.  Working agreements and NHL affiliations are up to each
team.

Each team has a $100,000 salary cap for 17 total players
(16 dress up).

Each team is limited to 11 visas, meaning at least 6 players must be
Americans (Ignore this rule if you are Tulsa, they only had 2 Americans
on the roster during the playoffs).

Teams play in Wichita, Tulsa, Oklahoma City, Memphis, Fort Worth, and Dallas.

Future expansion plans include Houston, San Antonio, Baton Rouge, Little Rock,
El Paso, Albuquerque, Tuscon, and Amarillo.  Austin is a possibility if Dallas
has to move.  Houston and San Antonio are in for this fall, with Baton Rouge
and Little Rock likely for 94-95.

TEAMS:
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
          Fort Worth Fire                 | Wichita Thunder
                                          |
Arena:    Tarrant Co. Conv. Cen. (11,342) | Kansas Coliseum (9,686)
Colors:   Red and Black                   | Blue , silver, and black
GM:       George Branum                   | Bill Shuck
Coach:    Pete Mahavolich                 | Doug Sheddan
Phone #:  (817) 335-FIRE                  | (316) 264-4625
Season Tix: $300 / $240                   | $250 / $170
Single Tix: $12 / $10                     | $9 / $6
Radio:                                    |
Announcers:                               |
                                          |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
          Dallas Freeze                   | Tulsa Oilers
                                          |
Arena:    Fair Park Coliseum (7,500)      | Civic Center (6,847)
Colors:   Teal and Black                  | Orange and Blue
GM:       Tom Koch                        | Jeff D. Lund
Coach:    Ron Flockhart                   | Gary Unger      Personal Guardians
Phone #:  (214) 421-PUCK                  | (918) 663-5888  ------------------
Season Tix: $300 / $240                   |                    Ray and Monte
Single Tix: $12 / $10 / $7                | $9 / $6                Miron
Radio:    KSKY-AM 660                     | KTRT-AM 1270
Announcers-Bruce LeVine                   | Jeff Brucculeri
           Mark Stone                     | Jeff Bowen
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
          Memphis River Kings             | Oklahoma City Blazers
                                          |
Arena:    Mid-South Coliseum (9,384)      | Myriad (13,399) & State Fair Arena 
Colors:   Gold and Black                  | Red, Yellow, and Black   (9,760)
GM:       Jim Riggs                       | Brad Lund                
Coach:    Steve Carlson                   | Mike McEwen
Phone #:  (901) 278-9009                  | (405) 235-PUCK
Season Tix:                               | $250 / $170
Single Tix: $9 / $6                       | $9 / $6
Radio:    KREC-AM 600                     | WWLS-AM 640
Announcers-Dave Woloshin                  | John Brooks
           Tom Stocker                    | Brian Barnhart
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

92-93 regular season standings
 
                           W  L OTL PTS   GF   GA   PIM  AVG ATTDNCE (% cap)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Oklahoma City Blazers.... 39 18  3   81  291  232  1561  7,827   64.2 %
Tulsa Ice Oilers......... 35 22  3   73  270  230  1430  5,547   81.0 %
Dallas Freeze............ 31 25  4   66  276  242  1604  4,427   59.0 %
Memphis RiverKings....... 26 27  7   59  253  272  1670  5,590   59.6 %
Fort Worth Fire.......... 24 29  7   55  252  288  1747  4,920   43.7 %
Wichita Thunder.......... 25 33  2   52  242  320  1876  4,474   46.2 %

Playoffs:  Tulsa defeated Dallas, 4 games to 3 (WLLWWLW)
           Oklahoma City defeated Memphis, 4 games to 2 (WWLLWW)

Levin Trophy Finals:  Tulsa defeated Oklahoma City, 4 games to 1 (WWLWW)

Playoff MVP:  Tony Fiore, Tulsa (special votes to Ray and Monte Miron)

Team vs. Team: 92-93
--------------------
                Dallas  Fort Worth  Memphis  Oklahoma City  Tulsa  Wichita
Dallas.......... -----     9-2-1     5-5-2       5-6-1      5-7-0   7-5-0
Fort Worth...... 3-7-2     -----     4-6-2       4-8-0      8-3-1   5-5-2
Memphis......... 7-4-1     8-3-1     -----       2-8-2      2-8-2   7-4-1
Oklahoma City... 7-4-1     8-3-1    10-2-0       -----      6-6-0   8-3-1
Tulsa........... 7-5-0     4-7-1    10-2-0       6-6-0      -----   8-2-2
Wichita......... 5-7-0     7-3-2     5-7-0       4-8-0      4-8-0   -----

       Power Play Statistics               Penalty Killng Statistics
             PPG  Opp  ShGA   Pct.               PPG Saves Opp  ShG   Pct.
Okla. City    70  275     2  25.45  Okla. City    58   241 299   16  80.60
Tulsa         72  291    12  24.74  Dallas        68   278 346   14  80.34
Dallas        64  286    10  22.37  Tulsa         77   276 353   16  78.18
Fort Worth    85  387    16  21.96  Wichita       75   235 310    5  75.806
Wichita       81  396    24  20.45  Memphis       83   260 343   12  75.801
Memphis       65  329    12  19.75  Fort Worth    76   237 313   13  75.71

Penalty Record
                                            10-Min  Game Gross        Oppn
             PIM  Avg.  Minor  Major  Bench   Misc  Misc  Misc  Match  PIM
Wichita     1876  31.3   433     84     20     22    24     0     3   1998
Fort Worth  1747  29.1   471     59     29     26    23     2     0   1911
Memphis     1670  27.8   480     56     28     28    13     1     1   1593
Dallas      1604  26.7   477     60      2     20    15     0     0   1534
Okla. City  1561  26.0   438     67     14     14    21     0     0   1609
Tulsa       1430  23.8   505     26      6     21     8     0     0   1243

Scoring By Period
            1st Period  2nd Period  3rd Period  Overtime  Shootout  Totals
              GF  GA      GF  GA      GF  GA     GF  GA    GF  GA   GF  GA
Dallas        76  82     106  82      90  74      0   1     4   3   276 242
Fort Worth    70  81      92 112      84  88      3   5     3   2   252 288
Memphis       66  88     101  89      82  88      2   3     2   4   253 272
Okla.City     98  87      82  71     108  71      1   1     2   2   291 232
Tulsa         99  58      92  83      76  86      3   1     0   2   270 230
Wichita       79  92      73 109      84 117      2   0     4   2   242 320

                          92-93 All-Star Team
                          -------------------

Position      First Team                    Second Team
--------      ----------                    -----------
Goaltender... Tony Martino, Tulsa           Robert Desjardins, Wichita (tie)
                                            Alan Perry, Oklahoma City (tie)

Defensemen... Dave Doucette, Dallas         Mike Berger, Dallas
              Guy Girouard, Oklahoma City   Tom Karalis, Tulsa

Center....... Carl Boudreau, Oklahoma City  Joe Burton, Oklahoma City

Left Wing.... Sylvain Fleury, Oklahoma City Doug Lawrence, Tulsa

Right Wing... Daniel Larin, Oklahoma City   Tom Mutch, Memphis (tie
                                            Sylvain Naud, Tulsa (tie)

Regular Season MVP:  Sylvain Fleury, Oklahoma City
Rookie of the Year:  Bobby Desjardins, Wichita
Leading Defenseman:  Dave Doucette, Dallas
Leading Goaltender:  Tony Martino, Tulsa

Scoring Leaders:
----------------
POINTS              Team  GP  G  A  PTS   GOALS             Team  GP  G
Fleury, Sylvain     OKC   59 48 53  101   Fleury, Sylvain   OKC   53 48
Lawrence, Doug      TUL   57 22 73   95   Larin, Daniel     OKC   48 43
Naud, Sylvain       TUL   58 39 48   87   Mutch, Tom        MEM   59 43
Mutch, Tom          MEM   59 43 38   81   Thibodeau, Ken    MEM   54 40
Hall, Taylor        TUL   58 35 45   80   Naud, Sylvain     TUL   58 39
Thibodeau, Ken      MEM   54 40 35   75   Taylor, Jason     DAL   60 38
Anchikoski, Wayne   DAL   57 35 37   72   
Boudreau, Carl      OKC   48 27 44   71   ASSISTS           Team  GP  A
Larin, Daniel       OKC   48 43 27   70   Lawrence, Doug    TUL   57 73
Taylor, Jason       DAL   60 38 32   70   Fleury, Sylvain   OKC   59 53
Dent, Ted           WCH   60 25 44   69   Naud, Sylvain     TUL   58 48
Sanderson, Mike     FTW   60 37 31   68   Doucette, Dave    DAL   50 46
Gatti, Dave         WCH   58 35 32   67   Hall, Taylor      TUL   58 45
Nobili, Mario       TUL   54 31 34   65   Girouard, Guy     OKC   60 45
Cyr, Keith          WCH   58 21 44   65 
D'Amario, Peter     MEM   60 28 35   63   PENALTY MINUTES   Team  GP PIM 
Johnston, Scot      MEM   51 23 40   63   Aubrey, Ron       FTW   28 237
Burton, Joe         OKC   55 35 26   61   Karalis, Tom      TUL   56 235
Simoni, Steve       OKC   56 33 28   61   Johnson, Craig    OKC   50 219
Hornak, Ernest      FTW   52 22 37   59   Neish, Greg       WCH   34 212
Fiore, Tony         TUL   37 23 35   58   Batten, John      MEM   29 210
Doucette, Dave      DAL   50 10 46   56   Taylor, Jason     DAL   60 210

LEADING GOALTENDERS (20 or more games)
                   TEAM GPI  MIN  GAA  W-L-OTL  EN SO   GA  Saves  Save Pct.
Martino, Tony       TUL  39 2182 3.66  23-13-2   0  2  133  1186   .899
Perry, Alan         OKC  40 2406 3.72  25-13-2   3  0  149  1304   .897
Zanier, Mike        DAL  40 2384 3.78  24-14-2   3  1  150  1223   .891
Mindjimba, Antoine  MEM  56 3097 4.15  26-21-6   4  1  214  1603   .882
Smith, Greg         DAL  21 1243 4.15   7-11-2   0  0   86   753   .897
Desjardins, Bobby   WCH  52 2849 4.63  21-26-2   6  1  220  1877   .895
Belley, Roch        FTW  33 1728 4.75  14-13-2   3  0  141   974   .874

Other Goalies       
                   TEAM GPI  MIN  GAA  W-L-OTL  EN SO   GA  Saves  Save Pct.
Flatt, Brian        TUL  11  488  3.44   4-3-1   1  1   28  274    .907
Krake, Paul         OKC  17 1029  3.50  13-3-1   0  0   60  583    .907
Loewen, Jamie       TUL  13  681  3.79   6-5-0   1  0   43  399    .903
Ocello, Matt        FTW   4  179  3.69   3-1-0   1  0   11  100    .901
Ocello, Matt        TUL   1   34  5.29   0-0-0   0  0    3   13    .813
(Totals)                  5  213  3.94   3-1-0   1  0   14  113    .890
Raymond, Eric       TUL   3  181  3.98   2-1-0   0  0   12   87    .879
O'Hara, Michael     FTW  18  911  4.28   6-6-2   0  0   65  559    .896
Vasko, Steve        MEM  15  535  5.16   0-6-1   4  0   46  235    .836
Trentadue, Rocco    FTW  17  746  4.99   1-9-3   3  0   62  365    .855
Trentadue, Rocco    OKC   2  120  6.50   0-2-0   0  0   13   93    .877
(Totals)                 19  866  5.20  1-11-3   3  0   75  458    .859
Harvey, Alain       WCH   5  240  5.50   2-2-0   2  0   22  126    .851
Gosselin, Yannick   WCH  10  345  6.43   2-3-0   0  0   37  227    .860
Gosselin, Yannick   OKC   1   60  5.00   1-0-0   0  0    5   26    .839
(Totals)                 11  405  6.22   3-3-0   0  0   42  253    .896
Caton, Murray       WCH   2  120  9.00   0-2-0   0  0   18   84    .824
McDonnell, Dan      TUL   1   34  8.83   0-0-0   0  0    5   24    .828
Sauer, E.J.         TUL   1   12 10.00   0-0-0   0  0    2    4    .667
Clark, Joel         WCH   2   48 10.00   0-0-0   0  0    8   29    .784
Wachter, Steve      WCH   2   24 12.50   0-0-0   0  0    5    6    .545


Marc Dee Foster, r.s.h contact for the CHL


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53934
From: njs@mrtoad.lahabra.chevron.com (n.j.spera)
Subject: Re: Upcoming TV schedule

In article <1r4af2$qve@hsdndev.harvard.edu>, nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219) writes:
|> Hey,guess what's coming to ESPN for a change? A playoff which doesn't
|> involve the Pens. Not that there is anything wrong with that...
|> 
|> ESPN games :
|> 
|> Thursday  Game3 Pens at Devils at 7:30(Gary Thorne and Bill Clement)
|> Saturday  Game4 Caps at NY Isles at 7:30(Tom Mees and John Davidson)
|> 
|> ABC game :
|> 
|> Sunday    Game4 Pens at Devils at 1:00 (Gary Thorne and Bill Clement)
|> 
    Only if you are in the eastern time zone - pacific will get the 
    Kings vs Calgary 

|> ESPN named its #2 broadcast team on Tuesday. It paired Tom Mees(play by
|> play) with John Davidson(analyst).
|> 
|> -PPV Mark

-- 
 Nancy J. Spera, IMT Division           # "If I didn't know for a fact that   P
 Chevron Petroleum Technology Co.       G  Elvis was working in a donut shop  E
 P.O. Box 446, La Habra, CA 90633-0446  O  in Beaver Falls, I'd swear he was  N
 Tel: (310) 694-7761  njs@chevron.com   # driving this truck." Scotty Baldwin S

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53935
From: reif@sun8.ruf.uni-freiburg.de (Berthold BENNY Reif)
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 18

etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson) writes:

>	
> Forwards:

>		13. Richard Zemlicka	?
              In the season 92/93 playing for EHC Freiburg/Germany

Benny.
--
   _ _ _                                                         _ _ _
 _I I I I    Benny Reif  email:reif@sun1.ruf.uni-freiburg.de    I I I I_
I I I I I_______________________________________________________I I I I I
I_I I I I    Disclaimer: this text reflects MY opinion,         I I I I_I

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53936
From: dvb@ick (David Van Beveren)
Subject: Re: Red Wings Goespel...

F1HH@UNB.CA (Patrick Walker) writes:
: Detroit's going to beat Toronto in 6 or LESS!!!
: 
:  Granted, Gilmour should get the Hart Trophy, NOT Lemieux... Just
: Look at what Gilmour did for Toronto.  When you think of Toronto,
: who comes to mind, Gilmour, Andreychuk, Potvin...ah...did I mentio
: n Gilmour?
: 

When you think of the NHL, who comes to mind? Gilmour? Gretzky? Mario?
.. ah... did I mention Mario? If you said Gretzky, you haven't really
been following along, have you. If you said Gilmour, you are a true
Maynard. 

I don't even think the selection of the HArt deserves serious discussion on
this group. It is a no-brainer.

dvb

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53937
From: phoenix@startide.ctr.columbia.edu (Ali Lemer)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

In article <13904.664.uupcb@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca> steven.kipling@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Steven Kipling)  writes:
> -=> Quoting Cire Y. Trehguad to All <=-
>CYT> : Michael Collingridge writes:
> : >And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
> : >resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
> : >team captain trivia would be appreciated.


Kelly Kisio was the captain of the Rangers when he left for San Jose.


-- Ali.

-- 
Ali "Procrastination" Lemer || "But not a real green || "Conjunction Junction,
Columbia University (NYC)   || dress, that's cruel." ||  What's your function?"
phoenix@ctr.columbia.edu    || -- Barenaked Ladies   ||  -- Schoolhouse Rock
***************** BE KIND TO ANIMALS...HUG A HOCKEY PLAYER! *******************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53938
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Habs Late

In article <21APR93.05114955.0057@VM1.MCGILL.CA> CCDB <CCDB@MUSICA.MCGILL.CA> writes:
>Quebec dominated Habs for first 2 periods and only Roy kept
>this one from being rout, although he did blow 2nd goal.
>Canadians showed up in third but Nords were playing dump &
>pull back most of the time.

Do you notice that _nobody_ on the team is willing to take charge?
A dominant defenceman would be nice....too bad Schneider got hurt.
He reminds me of Chris Chelios sometimes.  Speaking of Chelios, I 
wonder if Serge Savard feels like a moron for making that trade.
I also wish we still had Corson.

Rob Ramage on the ice is less useful than a Gatorade bottle on the 
bench.

Vincent Damphousse has decided to take a vacation, apparently.  I have
no idea why Demers is playing Denis Savard on the checking line with
Carbonneau.  Savard is skating well, and is one of the only dangerous
Canadiens in Quebec's zone with the puck.  Too bad nobody is in front
most of the time.

Do you also notice that in the defensive zone, not a single Nordique
gets knocked down?  It's disgusting.  We also have Lebeau (5'10", 172)
getting pasted at centre ice by Wolaninn (6'3", 205) with no reply
from the team, except to yell for a penalty.  Dammit, Denis Savard 
threw the best (only?) Montreal hit of the night when he knocked
Sundin off-balance.  When Denis Savard is your team's enforcer, there's
big trouble someplace...

>Hextall made some good saves but
>really this one was lost in first period when nords scored 3
>& could have had 5, plus another 4 in 2nd.

Aside from that second goal, Roy did stand on his head.  The third 
period at least provided something to look forward to.  Habs won the
period, IMO, and I guess somebody finally came along to smack them a
couple of times in the second intermission to remind them that a game
had started at 7:30.  Hopefully they play that way at home.  Roy made 
the saves (we'll ignore that second goal), so now it's up to the team.


--
dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca


P.S.  To all those Grant Fuhr doubters.....Buffalo 4, Boston 0.  
'nuff said.  And did somebody say Dale Hunter was a playoff choker?
I'd rethink that position :-)



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53939
From: joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm)
Subject: Bruins




Come on Boston, where the hell are you? Seven wins in a row and what, choke?

I'd much rather see the Bruins in the Wales Conference finals vs. Pitt than
Buffalo or Quebec, if only because it would be more interesting.  Not that
Buffalo or Quebec can't put up a good fight, but I'd much more enjoy a 7-0
pasteing of the Bruins than the Devils.  You have to feel for Terrerri(sp?).

Ah, well, maybe the Devils will pull it out, or maybe the Pens will lose in
the second round, but if not, I hope the Bruins are there to meet them.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53940
From: v003nnc3@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (MR. BUNGLE)
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

In article <1993Apr21.142357.14164@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca>, golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes...
>In article <1993Apr21.063836.4412@ncsu.edu> delarocq@eos.ncsu.edu (DERRELL EMERY LAROCQUE) writes:
>>
>>   Tonight in Boston, the Buffalo Sabres blanked the Boston
>>Bruins 4-0 tonight in Boston. Looks like Boston can hang
>>this season up, because Buffalo's home record is awesome!!!!
>>This is great.. Buffalo fans might get to see revenge for
>>last year!!!!! :)
> 
>I'm glad Grant Fuhr will never be as over-confident after two wins
>as you are...it takes four wins to defeat an opponent...each tougher
>to obtain than the previous one.  Buffalo is off to a good start...
>Fuhr is proving the Fuhr-bashers wrong, but Boston is an awfully
>good team.
> 
>Gerald

Awesome home record or not, you need to remember the 7th game last year at the
Aud.  I'd like to see some playoff games since I'm stuck in Buffalo at UB, but
I think Boston isn't giving up so easy.

mr. bungle

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53941
From: coulman@cs.Usask.CA (Randy Coulman)
Subject: WHL: Playoff Results - 04/18/93


Monday, April 12, 1993

Kamloops 4 @ Spokane 1 (Kamloops wins 3-0)

***
Western Final Matchup

Kamloops @ Portland
***

Tuesday, April 13, 1993

No games necessary.

Wednesday, April 14, 1993

No games necessary.

Thursday, April 15, 1993

No games scheduled.

Friday, April 16, 1993

Regina 2 @ Swift Current 7 (Series: 0-1)
Kamloops 3 @ Portland 6 (Series: 0-1)

Saturday, April 17, 1993

Kamloops 4 @ Portland 8 (Series: 0-2)

Sunday, April 18, 1993

Swift Current 5 @ Regina 2 (Series: 2-0)


WHL Playoff Scoring Leaders
April 18, 1993

Player                                   GP  G   A  Pts
-------------------------------------------------------
Jamie Black, Tacoma                       7   7  15  22
Andy Schneider, Swift Current             8   7  13  20
Valeri Bure, Spokane                      9   6  11  17
Allan Egeland, Tacoma                     7   9   7  16
Dean McAmmond, Swift Current              8   9   6  15
Jason Krywulak, Swift Current             8   6   9  15
Cam Danyluk, Medicine Hat                10   9   5  14
Todd Holt, Swift Current                  8   5   9  14
Tyler Wright, Swift Current               8   5   9  14
Mike Mathers, Kamloops                   10   5   9  14
Jeff Friesen, Regina                     11   5   9  14
Rick Girard, Swift Current                8   3  11  14


WHL Playoff Leading Goaltenders
April 18, 1993
(minimum 60 minutes)

Player                                   MP  GA  SO GAA
-------------------------------------------------------
Scott Langkow, Portland                 295  12  0 2.44
Milan Hnilicka, Swift Current           497  21  1 2.54
Trevor Robins, Brandon                  258  11  0 2.56
Steve Passmore, Kamloops                341  16  1 2.82
Mark Dawkins, Red Deer                  269  13  0 2.90


-- 
Randy A. Coulman, M.Sc.         |       ARIES Laboratory
Research Assistant              |       Department of Computational Science
                                |       University of Saskatchewan
coulman@cs.Usask.ca             |       Saskatoon, SK   S7N 0W0             

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53942
From: coulman@cs.Usask.CA (Randy Coulman)
Subject: Final Regular Season Individual Goalie Stats

I would appreciate it if someone could volunteer to verify the shots on goal
and save percentage numbers for me, so I can put these stats on the archive
site.  Contact me by mail if you want to volunteer.

Here are the individual goalie stats as of: Wed Apr 21 09:09:38 CST 1993

These stats include games up to and including the Sunday previous to the date
listed above.  They have been verified against what is printed in my newspaper
every Tuesday.  They don't print shots and save percentage numbers, so those
are not verified.  These stats are available by mail every weekday and
sometimes on weekends, if I'm in town and I can get late game results.  Just
send me a note if you would like to receive these stats by mail.

If you have any questions, comments or suggestions, let me know.

Randy

-------
MP = Minutes Played, GA = Goals against,
SO = Shutouts, GAA = Goals against average
W = Wins, L = Losses, T = Ties
SOG = Shots on Goal, SV = Save Percentage

 MP   GA SO   GAA  W  L  T  SOG   SV  TM Player
=======================================================
   1   0  0  0.00  0  0  0    0 1.000 WAS Byron Dafoe
  11   0  0  0.00  0  0  0    3 1.000 HAR Corrie D'Alessio
  40   1  0  1.50  0  0  0   19 0.947 MTL Frederick Chabot
  25   1  0  2.40  0  0  0   10 0.900 BOS Mike Bales
2781 116  2  2.50 25 15  7 1287 0.910 TOR Felix Potvin
4106 177  7  2.59 41 18 11 1879 0.906 CHI Ed Belfour
1322  64  1  2.90  9  8  4  596 0.893 BOS John Blue
 996  49  2  2.95  6  7  1  414 0.882 CHI Jim Waite
3702 186  4  3.01 43 14  5 1889 0.902 PIT Tom Barrasso
3890 196  1  3.02 29 28  9 2194 0.911 STL Curtis Joseph
1817  94  1  3.10 18  8  4  858 0.890 VAN Kay Whitmore
1429  75  0  3.15 11 10  4  716 0.895 BUF Dominik Hasek
3194 168  3  3.16 37 14  3 1354 0.876 BOS Andy Moog
1311  70  1  3.20 14  4  1  629 0.889 CAL Jeff Reese
3595 192  2  3.20 31 25  5 1813 0.894 MTL Patrick Roy
 168   9  0  3.21  1  1  1   87 0.897 HAR Mike Lenarduzzi
1193  64  0  3.22 13  4  2  522 0.877 DET Vincent Riendeau
1785  96  2  3.23 17  7  4  938 0.898 TOR Daren Puppa
3880 210  4  3.25 34 24  7 1898 0.889 DET Tim Cheveldae
3732 203  2  3.26 29 26  9 1805 0.888 CAL Mike Vernon
2655 146  1  3.30 22 20  2 1314 0.889 NYI Glenn Healy
3359 185  1  3.30 24 24  6 1726 0.893 BUF Grant Fuhr
2757 152  4  3.31 20 18  7 1519 0.900 NYR John Vanbiesbrouck
3282 181  1  3.31 27 23  5 1531 0.882 WAS Don Beaupre
3476 193  3  3.33 26 26  5 1683 0.885 MIN Jon Casey
3261 184  3  3.39 28 21  5 1620 0.886 VAN Kirk McLean
2672 151  2  3.39 19 21  3 1322 0.886 NJ  Chris Terreri
1433  81  1  3.39 17  5  1  686 0.882 MTL Andre Racicot
1939 110  0  3.40 18  9  4  947 0.884 QUE Stephane Fiset
2512 143  5  3.42 20 17  6 1329 0.892 PHI Tommy Soderstrom
1368  78  0  3.42 13  7  2  691 0.887 PIT Ken Wregget
 542  31  0  3.43  5  4  0  225 0.862 BOS Reggie Lemelin
2988 172  0  3.45 29 16  5 1525 0.887 QUE Ron Hextall
2253 130  0  3.46 17 15  5 1067 0.878 NYI Mark Fitzpatrick
3855 227  2  3.53 33 26  6 2119 0.893 WIN Bob Essensa
1601  96  0  3.60 15 10  2  777 0.876 WIN Jim Hrivnak
1596  97  1  3.65 10 12  5  803 0.879 MIN Darcy Wakaluk
1591  97  0  3.66  7 19  2  757 0.872 TB  Wendell Young
1163  71  0  3.66  8 10  1  573 0.876 TB  JC Bergeron
2389 146  2  3.67 21 16  4 1180 0.876 NJ  Craig Billington
1210  74  1  3.67  8  8  2  628 0.882 STL Guy Hebert
1302  80  2  3.69  8 12  0  664 0.880 WAS Rick Tabaracci
 664  41  0  3.70  5  6  0  344 0.881 BUF Tom Draper
 224  14  0  3.75  1  2  1  116 0.879 NYR Corey Hirsch
1769 111  1  3.76 13 11  5  932 0.881 PHI Dominic Roussel
2105 134  1  3.82 13 19  3 1184 0.887 NYR Mike Richter
 157  10  0  3.82  1  2  0   78 0.872 NYI Danny Lorenz
3753 240  1  3.84 17 38  6 2069 0.884 EDM Bill Ranford
1735 111  0  3.84 15  8  4  987 0.888 LA  Robb Stauber
2718 175  2  3.86 18 21  6 1545 0.887 LA  Kelly Hrudey
 154  10  0  3.90  0  2  1   66 0.848 QUE Jacques Cloutier
 867  57  0  3.94  5  9  1  499 0.886 HAR Mario Gosselin
 532  35  0  3.95  6  4  0  294 0.881 LA  Rick Knickle
2268 150  1  3.97  8 24  4 1197 0.875 TB  Pat Jablonski
2074 142  1  4.11  7 26  0 1250 0.886 SJ  Arturs Irbe
2656 184  0  4.16 16 27  3 1470 0.875 HAR Sean Burke
1338  93  0  4.17  9 12  2  763 0.878 EDM Ron Tugnutt
1326  95  0  4.30  2 17  1  743 0.872 OTT Daniel Berthiaume
 802  59  0  4.41  3  9  0  405 0.854 PHI Stephane Beauregard
3388 250  0  4.43  8 46  3 1711 0.854 OTT Peter Sidorkiewicz
  65   5  0  4.62  0  0  1   39 0.872 CAL Andrei Trefilov
1373 111  0  4.85  4 15  1  784 0.858 HAR Frank Pietrangelo
  73   6  0  4.93  0  0  1   34 0.824 WIN Mike O'Neill
  60   5  0  5.00  0  1  0   46 0.891 SJ  Wade Flaherty
2000 176  0  5.28  2 30  1 1220 0.856 SJ  Jeff Hackett
 930  86  0  5.55  2 14  1  559 0.846 SJ  Brian Hayward
 160  15  0  5.63  0  3  0   91 0.835 TOR Rick Wamsley
  20   2  0  6.00  0  0  0    7 0.714 WAS Olaf Kolzig
  90  10  0  6.67  0  2  0   44 0.773 OTT Darrin Madeley
 249  30  0  7.23  0  5  0  146 0.795 OTT Steve Weeks
  98  13  0  7.96  0  2  0   51 0.745 LA  David Goverde
  45   7  0  9.33  0  1  0   21 0.667 TB  David Littman

-- 
Randy A. Coulman, M.Sc.         |       ARIES Laboratory
Research Assistant              |       Department of Computational Science
                                |       University of Saskatchewan
coulman@cs.Usask.ca             |       Saskatoon, SK   S7N 0W0             

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53943
From: coulman@cs.Usask.CA (Randy Coulman)
Subject: Final Regular Season Team Goalie Stats

I would appreciate it if someone could volunteer to verify the shots on goal
and save percentage numbers for me, so I can put these stats on the archive
site.  Contact me by mail if you want to volunteer.

Here are the team goalie stats as of: Wed Apr 21 09:09:38 CST 1993

These stats include games up to and including the Sunday previous to the date
listed above.  They have been verified against what is printed in my newspaper
every Tuesday.  They don't print shots and save percentage numbers, so those
are not verified.  

If you have any questions, comments or suggestions, let me know.

Randy

-------
MP = Minutes Played, GA = Goals against,
SO = Shutouts, GAA = Goals against average
W = Wins, L = Losses, T = Ties
SOG = Shots on Goal, SV = Save Percentage

 MP   GA SO   GAA  W  L  T  SOG   SV  TM Player
=======================================================
4106 177  7  2.59 41 18 11 1879 0.906 CHI Ed Belfour
 996  49  2  2.95  6  7  1  414 0.882 CHI Jim Waite
--------------------------------------------------------------
5108 230  9  2.70 47 25 12 2296 0.900 CHI

 479  18  2  2.25  6  2  0  232 0.922 TOR Daren Puppa
2781 116  2  2.50 25 15  7 1287 0.910 TOR Felix Potvin
1665  87  1  3.14 13  9  4  823 0.894 TOR Grant Fuhr
 160  15  0  5.63  0  3  0   91 0.835 TOR Rick Wamsley
--------------------------------------------------------------
5097 241  5  2.84 44 29 11 2438 0.901 TOR

  25   1  0  2.40  0  0  0   10 0.900 BOS Mike Bales
1322  64  1  2.90  9  8  4  596 0.893 BOS John Blue
3194 168  3  3.16 37 14  3 1354 0.876 BOS Andy Moog
 542  31  0  3.43  5  4  0  225 0.862 BOS Reggie Lemelin
--------------------------------------------------------------
5096 268  4  3.16 51 26  7 2190 0.878 BOS

3702 186  4  3.01 43 14  5 1889 0.902 PIT Tom Barrasso
1368  78  0  3.42 13  7  2  691 0.887 PIT Ken Wregget
--------------------------------------------------------------
5083 268  5  3.16 56 21  7 2582 0.896 PIT

3890 196  1  3.02 29 28  9 2194 0.911 STL Curtis Joseph
1210  74  1  3.67  8  8  2  628 0.882 STL Guy Hebert
--------------------------------------------------------------
5110 278  2  3.26 36 36 11 2825 0.902 STL

1817  94  1  3.10 18  8  4  858 0.890 VAN Kay Whitmore
3261 184  3  3.39 28 21  5 1620 0.886 VAN Kirk McLean
--------------------------------------------------------------
5087 278  4  3.28 46 29  9 2449 0.886 VAN

1193  64  0  3.22 13  4  2  522 0.877 DET Vincent Riendeau
3880 210  4  3.25 34 24  7 1898 0.889 DET Tim Cheveldae
--------------------------------------------------------------
5088 280  4  3.30 47 28  9 2425 0.885 DET

  40   1  0  1.50  0  0  0   19 0.947 MTL Frederick Chabot
3595 192  2  3.20 31 25  5 1813 0.894 MTL Patrick Roy
1433  81  1  3.39 17  5  1  686 0.882 MTL Andre Racicot
--------------------------------------------------------------
5087 280  3  3.30 48 30  6 2522 0.889 MTL

1311  70  1  3.20 14  4  1  629 0.889 CAL Jeff Reese
3732 203  2  3.26 29 26  9 1805 0.888 CAL Mike Vernon
  65   5  0  4.62  0  0  1   39 0.872 CAL Andrei Trefilov
--------------------------------------------------------------
5120 282  3  3.30 43 30 11 2476 0.886 CAL

   1   0  0  0.00  0  0  0    0 1.000 WAS Byron Dafoe
 343  10  2  1.75  3  2  0  162 0.938 WAS Rick Tabaracci
3282 181  1  3.31 27 23  5 1531 0.882 WAS Don Beaupre
1421  83  0  3.50 13  9  2  681 0.878 WAS Jim Hrivnak
  20   2  0  6.00  0  0  0    7 0.714 WAS Olaf Kolzig
--------------------------------------------------------------
5085 286  3  3.37 43 34  7 2391 0.880 WAS

3476 193  3  3.33 26 26  5 1683 0.885 MIN Jon Casey
1596  97  1  3.65 10 12  5  803 0.879 MIN Darcy Wakaluk
--------------------------------------------------------------
5090 293  4  3.45 36 38 10 2489 0.882 MIN

1429  75  0  3.15 11 10  4  716 0.895 BUF Dominik Hasek
1694  98  0  3.47 11 15  2  903 0.891 BUF Grant Fuhr
1306  78  0  3.58 11  5  4  706 0.890 BUF Daren Puppa
 664  41  0  3.70  5  6  0  344 0.881 BUF Tom Draper
--------------------------------------------------------------
5104 297  0  3.49 38 36 10 2674 0.889 BUF

2655 146  1  3.30 22 20  2 1314 0.889 NYI Glenn Healy
2253 130  0  3.46 17 15  5 1067 0.878 NYI Mark Fitzpatrick
 157  10  0  3.82  1  2  0   78 0.872 NYI Danny Lorenz
--------------------------------------------------------------
5088 297  1  3.50 40 37  7 2470 0.880 NYI

1939 110  0  3.40 18  9  4  947 0.884 QUE Stephane Fiset
2988 172  0  3.45 29 16  5 1525 0.887 QUE Ron Hextall
 154  10  0  3.90  0  2  1   66 0.848 QUE Jacques Cloutier
--------------------------------------------------------------
5101 300  0  3.53 47 27 10 2536 0.882 QUE

2672 151  2  3.39 19 21  3 1322 0.886 NJ  Chris Terreri
2389 146  2  3.67 21 16  4 1180 0.876 NJ  Craig Billington
--------------------------------------------------------------
5080 299  4  3.53 40 37  7 2505 0.881 NJ 

2757 152  4  3.31 20 18  7 1519 0.900 NYR John Vanbiesbrouck
 224  14  0  3.75  1  2  1  116 0.879 NYR Corey Hirsch
2105 134  1  3.82 13 19  3 1184 0.887 NYR Mike Richter
--------------------------------------------------------------
5108 308  5  3.62 34 39 11 2826 0.891 NYR

2512 143  5  3.42 20 17  6 1329 0.892 PHI Tommy Soderstrom
1769 111  1  3.76 13 11  5  932 0.881 PHI Dominic Roussel
 802  59  0  4.41  3  9  0  405 0.854 PHI Stephane Beauregard
--------------------------------------------------------------
5107 319  6  3.75 36 37 11 2672 0.881 PHI

3855 227  2  3.53 33 26  6 2119 0.893 WIN Bob Essensa
 180  13  0  4.33  2  1  0   96 0.865 WIN Jim Hrivnak
 959  70  0  4.38  5 10  0  502 0.861 WIN Rick Tabaracci
  73   6  0  4.93  0  0  1   34 0.824 WIN Mike O'Neill
--------------------------------------------------------------
5084 320  2  3.78 40 37  7 2755 0.884 WIN

1591  97  0  3.66  7 19  2  757 0.872 TB  Wendell Young
1163  71  0  3.66  8 10  1  573 0.876 TB  JC Bergeron
2268 150  1  3.97  8 24  4 1197 0.875 TB  Pat Jablonski
  45   7  0  9.33  0  1  0   21 0.667 TB  David Littman
--------------------------------------------------------------
5088 332  1  3.92 24 53  7 2557 0.870 TB 

3753 240  1  3.84 17 38  6 2069 0.884 EDM Bill Ranford
1338  93  0  4.17  9 12  2  763 0.878 EDM Ron Tugnutt
--------------------------------------------------------------
5099 337  1  3.97 26 50  8 2836 0.881 EDM

1735 111  0  3.84 15  8  4  987 0.888 LA  Robb Stauber
2718 175  2  3.86 18 21  6 1545 0.887 LA  Kelly Hrudey
 532  35  0  3.95  6  4  0  294 0.881 LA  Rick Knickle
  98  13  0  7.96  0  2  0   51 0.745 LA  David Goverde
--------------------------------------------------------------
5100 340  2  4.00 39 35 10 2858 0.881 LA 

  11   0  0  0.00  0  0  0    3 1.000 HAR Corrie D'Alessio
 168   9  0  3.21  1  1  1   87 0.897 HAR Mike Lenarduzzi
 867  57  0  3.94  5  9  1  499 0.886 HAR Mario Gosselin
2656 184  0  4.16 16 27  3 1470 0.875 HAR Sean Burke
1373 111  0  4.85  4 15  1  784 0.858 HAR Frank Pietrangelo
--------------------------------------------------------------
5097 369  0  4.34 26 52  6 2851 0.871 HAR

1326  95  0  4.30  2 17  1  743 0.872 OTT Daniel Berthiaume
3388 250  0  4.43  8 46  3 1711 0.854 OTT Peter Sidorkiewicz
  90  10  0  6.67  0  2  0   44 0.773 OTT Darrin Madeley
 249  30  0  7.23  0  5  0  146 0.795 OTT Steve Weeks
--------------------------------------------------------------
5074 395  0  4.67 10 70  4 2656 0.851 OTT

2074 142  1  4.11  7 26  0 1250 0.886 SJ  Arturs Irbe
  60   5  0  5.00  0  1  0   46 0.891 SJ  Wade Flaherty
2000 176  0  5.28  2 30  1 1220 0.856 SJ  Jeff Hackett
 930  86  0  5.55  2 14  1  559 0.846 SJ  Brian Hayward
--------------------------------------------------------------
5077 414  1  4.89 11 71  2 3079 0.866 SJ 


-- 
Randy A. Coulman, M.Sc.         |       ARIES Laboratory
Research Assistant              |       Department of Computational Science
                                |       University of Saskatchewan
coulman@cs.Usask.ca             |       Saskatoon, SK   S7N 0W0             

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53944
From: georgeh@gjhsun (George H)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here

LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall) writes:

>Don got his nickname 'Grapes' but I'm not sure.  Don use to coach the
>Boston Bruins.  I don't know exactly when that was.  Could someone fill
>me in on this info?

I think that the name 'grapes' came because as coach (for the Bruins ?
or in the minors ?) he used to chew on grapes to keep from getting 
dehydrated during the games.  His dog Blue may have been named 
'cause he liked Labatts beer ... anyone know about that ?


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53945
From: dheath@superior.carleton.ca (David Heath)
Subject: Re: Grant Fuhr leads Sabres

In <1993Apr21.211038.12363@newshub.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca
(Deepak Chhabra) writes: 

>In article <1993Apr21.161633.25624@wuecl.wustl.edu>
jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes: 
>>  Buffalo is up 2-0 is the series with Boston, and the reason....Grant Fuhr ?
>>  Fuhr is playoff hungry, and he's proving once again why they call him
>>  money goaltender. Fuhr might not be one of the best goaltenders in the
>>  league anymore (Statistically at least), but he's proving that he can
>>  make the big save at the right time.
>>  The Leafs should have kept Fuhr, and probably would have had a chance 
>>  against powerhouse Detroit. But again.......where was Andreychoke in game 1?

>I applauded the Sabres for making the deal to get Fuhr, specifically because I
>thought it would help them win at least one playoff series.  However, I don't
>think the Leafs can be faulted either...there is nothing to say that Felix
>won't be winning playoff series by himself in years to come.  

I agree with Joseph.  Felix Potvin is a great goalie.  Besides,
I thought that the Leafs could only protect goalie in the up-coming
expansion draft.  If so, then it's better to get rid of one good
goalie and get a good forward in return.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53946
From: co398@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Theodore G. Benjamin)
Subject: Re: Radio stations


In messge 51890 on Mon Apr 19 15:46:40 1993, greanias@texas.mitre.org (Steve Greanias) wrote:

>        I do not have cable and on the nights the Caps don't 
>play, I would like to tune in other games.  Does anyone have a 
>list of the radio stations which broadcast the games for the NHL
>teams?

Here are the ones I can remember offhand:

     KDKA    1020 AM   Pittsburgh Penguins
     WABC     770 AM   New Jersey Devils
     WBBM     780 AM   Chicago Blackhawks
     WJM (?)  720 AM   Detroit Redwings
     KMOX    1120 AM   St. Louis Blues

Are the Flyers on 1210?
That's all I can think of.
-- 
 _|__                                Ted Benjamin
<_|__+     GO CARDS!!    GO CAVS!!   tedb@tyrell.msfc.nasa.gov
__|___>    GO BLUES!!    GO VOLS!!   (205) 544 - 9402
  |___     GO BROWNS!! (A 4-Line sig can cramp one's art.)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53947
From: gwittt@alleg.edu (Tom Gwitt)
Subject: Re: #77's?

In article <1r23on$4p6@bigboote.WPI.EDU> ching@bigwpi.WPI.EDU ("The  
Logistician") writes:
> 
> I am in need of all of the players wearing #77 in the NHL.  I know now  
only
> of one, Ray Borque for the Bruins.  Any help would be greatly  
appreciated.
> 
> Thanx.


Pierre Turgeon, formely of the Sabres and now of the Isles wears #77 (at  
least he did in Buffalo ...)
--
Tom Gwitt     gwittt@alleg.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53948
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: LET'S GO BUFFALO!

In article <AfpIKNm00WBLI1isJ1@andrew.cmu.edu>, "William K. Willis"
<ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> says:
>
>     You know, I never really appreciated them before!

Looks like Bob Errey's ring really sparkles in that locker room, and everyone
else wants one, too! :-)  Correct me if I'm wrong though, (just through
the net, not through e-mail, I don't need 100 rl's in my e-mail!) but wasn't
Boston down 2-0 vs. Buffalo last year?Boston lost 1 and 2 at home and won
3 and 4 in Buffalo.  Whoever wins game 3 will advance.  Simple as that!!! :-)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          PGH PENGUINS!!!    "We do what comes naturally!
Patrick Division Semi's  ALL TIME RECORD    You see now, wait for the
PENGUINS 7, Devils 0     SEASON WIN STREAK+ possibility, don't you see a
Penguins lead, 2-0       PLAYOFF WIN STREAK strong resemblance..."-DG '89

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53949
From: ua256@freenet.Victoria.BC.CA (Tom Moffat)
Subject: Pwter Forsberg


Can some on e give me some stats on Forsrg in the World Championships

If sao mail to ua256@freenet.victoria.bc.ca

-- 
Tom Moffat
Victoria B.C.
Canada

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53950
From: caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz)
Subject: Trivia question


While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash" that
Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had his
jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not positive.
Does anyone remember/know his name?  What has happened to him since?  What
about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?  Has this ever
happened before in a hockey game?   

Thanks,

Carol
Go Pens!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53951
From: gwittt@alleg.edu (Tom Gwitt)
Subject: Re: Buffalo Sabres

In article <1r8pc7$sa5@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu  
(David Vergolini) writes:
>   Ok, Buffalo fans.  I am a Red Wings fan, but am amazed at how the  
Sabres are
> beating up on the Bruins.  Is there any reason for this?  Is it Grant  
Fuhr or
> Mogilny and Lafontaine?  I would like to hear from you since I do not  
know much
> about the Sabres.
> 


Two words: Grant Fuhr.
--
Tom Gwitt     gwittt@alleg.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53952
From: keast@qucis.queensu.ca (Liam John Keast)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

In article <1993Apr23.102811.623@sei.cmu.edu> caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz) writes:
>
>While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash" that
>Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had his
>jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not positive.
>Does anyone remember/know his name?  What has happened to him since?  What
>about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?

That was Clint Malarchuk.  That was a very dangerous accident.  He could he
died right there on the ice.  However, he has played since  
but I don't know where he is now.  I think he is still playing but I'm
not positive.  He was a Sabre at the time.
I don't know who skated into him though.

>Has this ever happened before in a hockey game?   
>

I remember a couple of seasons before the Malarchuk incident Borje
Salming of Toronto fell down in the crease and someone skated into
his face.  That took a lot of stiches to fix.

>Thanks,
>
>Carol
>Go Pens!

Liam
Go Toronto (they'd better start going soon)!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53953
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

Just a side note, squid/octopi made their way to the ice in Buffalo.
I still don't understand why Buffalo, but maybe it's lucky.  :-)  btw,
they shovel them up from the ice here, using the shovel used to scoop
up the snow the zamboni leaves as it leaves the ice.  Although Blue
did give some technical directions on its removal, motioning with his
stick.  



-- 
Valerie Hammerl 	       John Sr. would lift Pat over the boards, grab 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu       his hand, and start running around the outside,
V085PWPZ@UBVMS.CC.BUFFALO.EDU  faster and faster.  "I wanted to learn how to 
get that feeling, and the only way was to learn how to skate."  P. LaFontaine

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53954
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: LET'S GO BUFFALO!

In article <ltdi2pINN7km@appserv.Eng.Sun.COM> mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler) writes:
>In article <93111.205214RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>>In article <AfpIKNm00WBLI1isJ1@andrew.cmu.edu>, "William K. Willis"
>><ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> says:
>>>
>>>     You know, I never really appreciated them before!
>>
>>Looks like Bob Errey's ring really sparkles in that locker room, and everyone
>>else wants one, too! :-)  Correct me if I'm wrong though, (just through
>
>No, Fuhr's 5 rings out sparkle Errey's. And doesn't Bob have 2 rings?

Regardless, they'd have to sparkle from the pressbox.  Errey's been
out a couple games with a hip injury.



-- 
Valerie Hammerl 	       John Sr. would lift Pat over the boards, grab 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu       his hand, and start running around the outside,
V085PWPZ@UBVMS.CC.BUFFALO.EDU  faster and faster.  "I wanted to learn how to 
get that feeling, and the only way was to learn how to skate."  P. LaFontaine

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53955
From: lmcmasc@noah.ericsson.se (Mauro Schena)
Subject: Stats

Does anyone have the player stats for games played up until
April 22,1993.

Mauro.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53956
From: mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger)
Subject: More TV Info

United States Coverage:
Sunday April 18
  N.J./N.Y.I. at Pittsburgh - 1:00 EDT to Eastern Time Zone
  ABC - Gary Thorne and Bill Clement

  St. Louis at Chicago - 12:00 CDT and 11:00 MDT - to Central/Mountain Zones
  ABC - Mike Emerick and Jim Schoenfeld

  Los Angeles at Calgary - 12:00 PDT and 11:00 ADT - to Pacific/Alaskan Zones
  ABC - Al Michaels and John Davidson

Tuesday, April 20
  N.J./N.Y.I. at Pittsburgh - 7:30 EDT Nationwide
  ESPN - Gary Thorne and Bill Clement

Thursday, April 22 and Saturday April 24
  To Be Announced - 7:30 EDT Nationwide
  ESPN - To Be Announced


Canadian Coverage:

Sunday, April 18
  Buffalo at Boston - 7:30 EDT Nationwide
  TSN - ???

Tuesday, April 20
  N.J.D./N.Y. at Pittsburgh - 7:30 EDT Nationwide
  TSN - ???

Wednesday, April 21
  St. Louis at Chicago - 8:30 EDT Nationwide
  TSN - ???




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53957
From: Chad Nicholas Hunter <ch3g+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: ESPN

I don't know if anyone has posted a message like this yet, but i'm
getting really sick of espn showing the last minute of a hockey
game, in which the score was just tied, and then cutting out and saying
"sorry we can't show you this we have to show baseball tonight" (not
even a game. a friggin HIGHLIGHT show).
gee, sure would have been nice to see the isles/caps in overtime.
I live in Pittsburgh (yes i'm a pens fan) where hockey gets a lot
of coverage.  i can only imagine how a caps fan residing in Texas
must feel.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53958
From: jwh@sei.cmu.edu (John Huber)
Subject: Re: Leafs Crushed Again; Blues Win; Flames Back.


In article <1993Apr22.220409.10862@wuecl.wustl.edu>, jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:
|> In article <vzhivov.735454735@cunews> vzhivov@alfred.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov) writes:
|> >
|> >The Blues, led by the best goalie in the NHL this season, Curtis
|> >Joseph, shut-out the Hawks 2-0. The Blues are playing like they did in
|> >'86 - clutch 'n grab, shoot the puck out. It's incredibly boring to
|> >watch, but if it works...
|> >
|>  Finally a non Blues fan agrees that Joseph is a great goalie. I think he
|> should win the Vezina this year or at least share it with Barrasso who also
|> has been shadowed by Mario's amazing performance.
|> 

I too think that Joseph has had a GREAT year and should be considered for the
Vezina.  I think Barrasso and Joseph should be the two strongest candidates
this year.  I don't believe ALL of the hype that Roy, Belfour and now Potvin
receive for their goaltending.  I do think that they are great in the nets,
but I would rather have Curtis, Tommy or Fuhr in the nets during this years
playoffs.  The big name tenders always seem to have a strong defense in front
of them and the goaltenders get the most credit.  I would rather face 25 shots
a game, than have to rely on Joseph saving 35, but if the goalie is going to
face 35 shots, I would rather have Joseph or Barrasso facing them.

-Jay

ps Go Quebec!!!  And I know that McLean and several others should be mentioned
as candidates for this years Vezina, but I am partial to Joseph and Barrasso
this season.


John W. Huber, Jr. - aka Jay   | Penguins - 1991,1992 Stanley Cup Champions
Software Engineering Institute | Pirates - 1990,1991,1992 NL East Champions
SEI 3409        (412) 268-3550 | MasterCraft - The ONLY boat for skiing

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53959
From: Harold Zazula <DLMQC@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Subject: Octopus in Detroit?

I was watching the Detroit-Minnesota game last night and thought I saw an
octopus on the ice after Ysebaert scored to tie the game at two. What gives?
(is there some custom to throw octopuses on the ice in Detroit?)
-------
Not Responsible -- Dain Bramaged!!

Harold Zazula
dlmqc@cunyvm.cuny.edu
hzazula@alehouse.acc.qc.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53960
From: jmd@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (joseph.m.dakes)
Subject: Re: Flyers [Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...]

In article <1993Apr15.190132.29787@cbnewsh.cb.att.com>, seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr) writes:
> So in other words, if Roussel shuts out the Sharks and Soderstrom shuts out
> the Penguins, that's immaterial because it was the coaches decision? Come on,
> Joe, think about what you're saying! Who they played is VERY significant.
> Why they played them is what's irrelevent. A low GAA against good teams
> is better than a low GAA against bad teams in the context of comparing two
> goaltenders. A low GAA is better then a higher GAA. A low GAA against good
> teams is much, much better than a higher GAA against bad teams in the context
> of comparing two goaltenders.

Let's start over.  I'm not arguing about who is the better goaltender.  I'd
take Soderstrom right now.  What I am saying is that Roussel can be a #1
netminder.  The GAA difference is less than half a goal per game (less than
that after last night), their save percentages are close, and their records
are similar.  And with that, I just don't see how you can label Roussel as
the most disappointing player on the Flyers this season.

You say Soderstrom played against better competition.  That may very well
be, but there is no way of knowing how Roussel would have performed in
those games.  Besides, against the better scoring teams like Pittsburgh,
the defense is more keyed up than they are against San Jose.

> The same
> for Roussel in the Ranger game. Two real scoring chances, one he made a
> great play, the other he was saved by a mistake from the other player. If
> you were judging Roussel on that game alone, you have very little to go by.

But I'm not just judging Roussel on that game alone.  I've seen him play
for the past two seasons in Philly and before that in Hershey.  It's just
my opinion, but I think he's got what it takes.  Of course, I thought that
about Mark LaForest, too.  But I never did about Wendell Young.  So I'm
batting .500 in judging Hershey talent since the Hextall-era.

As for the Rangers game, you can say he was saved by a mistake by the
offensive player if you like.  But Rou had his leg in position to make the
save.  If he didn't, it wouldn't have mattered if the Rangers player didn't
get the puck up or not.  It would have been a goal.  On a breakaway that's
what the goalie wants to do, take away as much as possible and force the
shooter to beat him.

> But if you were to look at the 0-0 tie against the Habs, you saw a goalie
> stand on his head to get that shutout. THAT was a #1 goalie in action. Roussel
> doesn't have a game like that in him.

I seem to remember Roussel doing an excellent job against Pittsurgh on
opening night to give the Flyers a tie against the two-time defending
champs.  And not to take anything away from Soderstrom because he was
senational in that game agains the Habs.  But you can't tell me that a
Montreal player had an open net to shoot at some point during that game
and just flat out missed it.  Mistakes, both on offense and defense are
part of the game.  Or there'd never be shutouts.

Anyway, I'm happy the Flyers have both Soderstrom and Roussel and
I'm not going to argue about it anymore.  Besides, with the current
7-game winning streak and expectations soaring for next year, I
don't want to piss you off to the point that you don't sell me any
tickets next season:-).

                                         \ \
Joe Dakes                                 \/\
AT&T Microelectronics                      \/\
555 Union Boulevard                         \ \
Allentown, PA  18103                     LET'S GO FLYERS! 
alux1!jmd                                     \ \
jmd@aluxpo.att.com                             \ \__________
                                                \____/_//__/


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53961
From: lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico)
Subject: Re: Goalie masks


Tom Barrasso wore a great mask, one time, last season.  He unveiled it
at a game in Boston.  

It was all black, with Pgh city scenes on it.  The "Golden Triangle"
(Pgh's downtown area where the 3 rivers meet) graced the top, along
with a steel mill on one side and the Civic Arena (I think) on the 
other.   On the back of the helmet was the old Pens' logo (the really
fat little penguin with the blue scarf) the current (at the time) Pens
logo, and a space for the "new" (now current) logo.

Tommy had designed the mask, and his mother (an artist) painted it
for him.  

But while wearing the mask, the Pens got thumped by the Bruins.  The
very next game, Tommy was back to the old paint job.  A great mask
done in by a goalie's superstition.

Lori



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53962
From: nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: Re: Pens Info needed

In article <1993Apr16.074054.3124@jyu.fi> mikkot@romulus.math.jyu.fi (Mikko Tarkiainen) writes:

>Coaching news: 
>
>	       Alpo Suhonen (ex-Jets) to Jokerit (now verified), 
>               Boris Majorov (ex-Jokerit) to Tappara,
>	       Vasili Tichonov (ex-Assat) to San Jose Sharks 
>                                             (assistant coach),
>	       Sakari Pietila to Lulea (silver team in Elite-serien)

Wow.  So that's probably the reason why current assistant coach Drew Ramenda
hinted that he won't be back.  Thanks for the news, Mikko; can you (or any
of our Finnish netters) comment on Tichonov?

===============================================================================
GO CALGARY FLAMES!  Al MacInnis for Norris!  Gary Roberts for Hart and Smythe!
GO EDMONTON OILERS!  Go for playoffs next year!  Stay in Edmonton!
===============================================================================
Nelson Lu (claudius@leland.stanford.edu)
rec.sport.hockey contact for the San Jose Sharks

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53963
From: d_jaracz@oz.plymouth.edu (David R. Jaracz)
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

In article <93106.092246DLMQC@CUNYVM.BITNET> Harold Zazula <DLMQC@CUNYVM.BITNET> writes:
>I was watching the Detroit-Minnesota game last night and thought I saw an
>octopus on the ice after Ysebaert scored to tie the game at two. What gives?

No no no!!!  It's a squid!  Keep the tradition alive!  (Kinda like the
fish at UNH games....)

>(is there some custom to throw octopuses on the ice in Detroit?)
>-------
>Not Responsible -- Dain Bramaged!!
>
>Harold Zazula
>dlmqc@cunyvm.cuny.edu
>hzazula@alehouse.acc.qc.edu



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53964
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: TV Schedule for Next Week

In article <Apr16.043426.69352@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU> mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger) writes:
>United States TV Schedule:

>April 18   Devils/Islanders at Pittsburgh   1 EST  ABC  (to Eastern time zone)
>April 18   St. Louis at Chicago             12 CDT ABC  (to Cent/Mou time zones)
>April 18   Los Angeles at Calgary           12 PDT ABC  (to Pacific time zone)
>April 20   Devils/Islanders at Pittsburgh   7:30   ESPN
>April 22   TBA                              7:30   ESPN
>April 24   TBA                              7:30   ESPN
>

A little supplement Basic Mike's info  :

For Sundday's opener on ABC, these are the announcing crews :

Devils/Isles at Pittsburgh - Gary Thorne(play-by-play),Bill Clement(color)
and Al Morganti roaming the halls outside the dressing rooms.
This telecast will primarily seen on the East Coast.

St.Louis at Chicago - Mike Emrick(play - by play),Jim Schoendfeld(color)
and Tom Mees roaming the halls.
This telecast will primarily be seen in the Midwest and parts of the South.

LA at Calgary - Al "Do You Believe in Mircales?" Michaels(play by play),
John Davidson(color) and Mark Jones as a roaming reporter.
This telecast will be seen in the Western USA.

Montreal's naitive,Jon Saunders will be hosting in the studio.

ABC will do "Up and Close and Personal" with Mario during Saturday's
Wide World of Sports(4:30EDT).

Sunday will be the first NHL playoff or regular network telecast in 13 years...
not counting those silly All-Star games on NBC for the last few years...

For Sunday's games,ABC will use 8 mikes(2 behind on the goal),super-super-slo-mo,
close-ups of player's faces at face-offs. ESPN/ABC will not be able to
use its new favorite toy,the ice-level shot, in Pittsburgh where too many
seats would have to removed to employ it...


In case of a blowout in progress in Pittsburgh,ABC will switch to Chicago
game but will come back to the Pittsburgh game for updates or if the game
gets closer(Ha!)..

ABC expects huge ratings(by hockey standards) since all 3 Top US TV-markets
are involved - NY metro area(NY Islanders/NJ Devils),Chicago(BlackHawks),
and LA(Kings).

Stay tuned,

Thanks Mike,

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53965
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: RUMOUR - Keenan signs with Rangers?


UPI Clarinet has just relayed a "scoop" from the Toronto Sun
(or was that Star?  I like the Star myself ...) that Iron Mike
Keenan has come to an agreement with the New York Rangers for
next season.  Interestingly, this comes the day after the Times
Sports had an editorial about how the Rangers need their own
Pat Riley ... who cares about what happens after next season?

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53966
From: gibson@nukta.geop.ubc.ca (Brad Gibson)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

In article <1993Apr16.160228.24945@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@hudson.UVic.CA writes:
>
>In article 9088@blue.cis.pitt.edu, jrmst8+@pitt.edu (Joseph R Mcdonald) writes:
>
>>Jagr has a higher +/-, but Francis has had more points.  And take it from
>>an informed observer, Ronnie Francis has had a *much* better season than
>>Jaromir Jagr.  This is not to take anything away from Jaro, who had a 
>>decent year (although it didn't live up to the expectations of some).
>
>Bowman tended to overplay Francis at times because he is a Bowman-style
>player.  He plays hard at all times, doesn't disregard his defensive
>responsibilities and is a good leader.  Bowman rewarded him be increasing his
>ice time.
>
>Jagr can be very arrogant and juvenile and display a "me first" attitude.
>This rubbed Bowman the wrong way and caused him to lose some ice time.
>
>Throughout the year, Francis consistently recieved more ice time than
>Jagr.  Althouhg I have never seen stats on this subject, I am pretty
>sure that Jagr had more points per minute played that Francis.  When
>you add to that Jagr's better +/- rating, I think it becomes evident
>that Jagr had a better season- not that Francis had a bad one.
>

  Actually, what I think has become more evident, is that you are determined to
  flaunt your ignorance at all cost.  Jagr did not have a better season than
  Francis ... to suggest otherwise is an insult to those with a modicum of
  hockey knowledge.  Save your almost maniacal devotion to the almighty
  plus/minus ... it is the most misleading hockey stat available.

  Until the NHL publishes a more useful quantifiable statistic including ice
  time per game and some measure of its "quality" (i.e., is the player put out
  in key situations like protecting a lead late in the game; is he matched up
  against the other team's top one or two lines; short-handed, etc), I would
  much rather see the +/- disappear altogether instead of having its dubious
  merits trumpeted by those with little understanding of its implications.

  Brad

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Brad K. Gibson                           INTERNET: gibson@geop.ubc.ca
  Dept. of Geophysics & Astronomy         
  #129-2219 Main Mall                      PHONE: (604)822-6722
  University of British Columbia           FAX:   (604)822-6047
  Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
  V6T 1Z4
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53967
From: alan@lancaster.nsc.com (The Hepburn)
Subject: Re: Hockey and the Hispanic community

In article <saross01.734885336@starbase.spd.louisville.edu>, saross01@starbase.spd.louisville.edu (Stacey A. Ross) writes:
|> In <C5I2s2.3Bt@odin.corp.sgi.com> rickc@wrigley.corp.sgi.com (Richard Casares) writes:
|> >You'll have a hard time selling any sport to a community that
|> >can't play it on account of availability or financial reasons.
|> >Hockey is pretty much a sport for the white and well off.
|> 
|> What?! White, yes. Well off, definitely not. Hockey season ticket owners have
|> the lowest average income of any of the four major North American sports.

Do you have a basis for this claim?  Try these stats (taken from Playboy Magazine
June 1989):

Percentage of pro football fans who have attended college:    39.7
Percentage of pro baseball fans who have attended college:    41.5
Percentage of pro basketball fans who have attended college:  39.9
Percentage of pro hockey fans who have attended college:      54.6

Percentage of pro football fans who earn more than $50K:      34.9
Percentage of pro baseball fans who make more than $50K:      22.7
Percentage of pro basketball fans who make more than $50K:    27.7
Percentage of pro hackey fans who make more than $50K:        44.0

|> 
|> And think of where the majority of hockey players come from. From a farm out
|> in Boondock, Saskatchewan or Weedville, Alberta.
|> 

The biggest advantage that kids from Boondock or Weedville have is the
availability of ice.  In the San Jose area we have a population of 800,000
and that population is served by 2 ice arenas.  In contrast, Kamloops,
British Columbia has a population of about 50,000 and has 5 rinks!  There
are also myriad ponds, pools, etc that freeze in the winter.  Down here
it's hard to find a kid without a bicycle; up there it's hard to find a kid
without a pair of skates.  And before you say "what does he know? He's from
California." let me say that I was born and raised in Trail, British Columbia,
a town of about 8,000 with lots of ice in the winter.  My father did radio
play by play for the local team, the Trail Smokeaters, who by  the way, were
the last Canadian team to win the World Championship (back in 1961).  I was
on skates almost as soon as I could walk, and have been playing recreational
hockey for about 35 years.

|> >When was the last time you saw a hockey league in the inner city.
|> >The insurance alone is a big enough barrier.
|> 
|> The inner city isn't the only place that is poor.
|> I think the biggest barrier to hockey in the inner city is... no ICE to play on.


Lack of ice is a big factor, but costs is a bigger factor.  Both my kids play for
the Santa Clara Valley Hockey Association and this season, which just ended,
cost me $75 per kid for membership in Hockey USA, plus $750 per kid for club
dues.  The Hockey USA fees cover excess medical insurance, and the club dues
cover ice time, officials, trophies, etc.  Other areas have similar fees, unless
the city government subsidises some of the costs, as Stockton does.

By the way; most ice arenas are located in what could be called the "inner city"
areas.  Eastridge and Vallco are exceptions ... Redwood City's rink is in an
industrial area on Bay Rd, near 101, Berkeley's is near Ashby and Martin Luther
King, Stockton's is in Oak Park, Sacramento's is in an older section of downtown
(I forget the name of the street), Fresno's is out on the edge of town, just west
of 99.  Santa Rosa's is a nice rink, but it's in an older section of town.
Dublin's is outside of town, off 580.  Most of the rinks are old, and expensive
to run, with huge electric bills and insurance premiums.  If you want to buy ice
time expect to pay around $100 per hour at any of these rinks.  Some of them
give you a 60 minute hour for your money; others give you a 50 minute hour and
include the resurfacing time in the fee.


-- 
Alan Hepburn           "A man doesn't know what he knows
National Semiconductor       until he knows what he doesn't know."
Santa Clara, Ca              
alan@berlioz.nsc.com                              Thomas Carlyle

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53968
From: wein1@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (david weinberg)
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

David



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53969
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: RUMOUR - Keenan signs with Rangers?

In article <1993Apr16.171347.784@news.columbia.edu> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>
>UPI Clarinet has just relayed a "scoop" from the Toronto Sun
>(or was that Star?  I like the Star myself ...) that Iron Mike
>Keenan has come to an agreement with the New York Rangers for
>next season.  Interestingly, this comes the day after the Times
>Sports had an editorial about how the Rangers need their own
>Pat Riley ... who cares about what happens after next season?
>

The rumour was basically everywhere in Toronto based on reports
that Keenan has told both San Jose and Philadelphia that he
was no longer interested in pursuing further negotiations with
either team. 

The Ranger announcement is supposed to happen tomorrow supposedly.

The Rangers have so many veterans that they had to get a coach
with "weight" and a proven record...and whom they know Messier respects.

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53970
From: jbrown@vax.cns.muskingum.edu
Subject: Blackhawks win!!! 

The Hawks win!!  Jermey Roenick scored his 50 th goal and the Hawks put the
Leafs in their place, the losers column.  If the Leafs can not even beat the
Hawks in a match that had little or no meaning I will hate to see them against
the Wings.  

Oh btw I laugh at rm, that jerky!!!

GO HAWKS!!!

JB

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53971
From: georgeh@gjhsun (George H)
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

Harold Zazula <DLMQC@CUNYVM.BITNET> writes:

>I was watching the Detroit-Minnesota game last night and thought I saw an
>octopus on the ice after Ysebaert scored to tie the game at two. What gives?
>(is there some custom to throw octopuses on the ice in Detroit?)

It is a long standing good luck Redwing's tradition to throw an octopus 
on the ice during a Stanley Cup game. They say it dates back to '52
at the Olympia when the Wings became the 1st team (I think) to sweep 
the cup in 8 games. A lot hardet to throw one from Joe Louis seats
than from the old Olympia balcony, though.

Funniest I ever saw was when some Tiger fans threw one on the field
during a Detroit/Toronto baseball game ...  I was living in California
and the folks I was watching with had never heard of hockey and were 
incredulous when I recognized the octopus BEFORE the camera closeup !!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53972
From: smorris@venus.lerc.nasa.gov (Ron Morris )
Subject: Re: Blackhawks win!!!

In <1993Apr16.140953.5025@vax.cns..edu>, jbrown@vax.cns.muskingum.edu writes...
>The Hawks win!!  Jermey Roenick scored his 50 th goal and the Hawks put the
>Leafs in their place, the losers column.  If the Leafs can not even beat the
>Hawks in a match that had little or no meaning I will hate to see them against
>the Wings.  
> 
>Oh btw I laugh at rm, that jerky!!!

I would appreciate it if you would not refer to Mr. Maynard by his
initials.  Thanks, see you in the Norris finals.

Ron

**********
"And one of my major goals is to leave the next president a new set
of things to worry about.  I'm getting bored reading the same problems
in the paper, decade after decade.  I want people to have to deal
with new problems."
                    ... President Bill Clinton   2-4-93

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53973
From: dreier@jaffna.berkeley.edu (Roland Dreier)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

In article <1qmtd1INNr1l@iskut.ucs.ubc.ca> gibson@nukta.geop.ubc.ca (Brad Gibson) writes:

   In article <1993Apr16.160228.24945@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@hudson.UVic.CA writes:
   >
   >In article 9088@blue.cis.pitt.edu, jrmst8+@pitt.edu (Joseph R Mcdonald) writes:
   >
   >>Jagr has a higher +/-, but Francis has had more points.  And take it from
   >>an informed observer, Ronnie Francis has had a *much* better season than
   >>Jaromir Jagr.  This is not to take anything away from Jaro, who had a 
   >>decent year (although it didn't live up to the expectations of some).
   >
   >Bowman tended to overplay Francis at times because he is a Bowman-style
   >player.  He plays hard at all times, doesn't disregard his defensive
   >responsibilities and is a good leader.  Bowman rewarded him be increasing his
   >ice time.
   >
   >Jagr can be very arrogant and juvenile and display a "me first" attitude.
   >This rubbed Bowman the wrong way and caused him to lose some ice time.
   >
   >Throughout the year, Francis consistently recieved more ice time than
   >Jagr.  Althouhg I have never seen stats on this subject, I am pretty
   >sure that Jagr had more points per minute played that Francis.  When
   >you add to that Jagr's better +/- rating, I think it becomes evident
   >that Jagr had a better season- not that Francis had a bad one.
   >

     Actually, what I think has become more evident, is that you are determined to
     flaunt your ignorance at all cost.  Jagr did not have a better season than
     Francis ... to suggest otherwise is an insult to those with a modicum of
     hockey knowledge.  Save your almost maniacal devotion to the almighty
     plus/minus ... it is the most misleading hockey stat available.

     Until the NHL publishes a more useful quantifiable statistic including ice
     time per game and some measure of its "quality" (i.e., is the player put out
     in key situations like protecting a lead late in the game; is he matched up
     against the other team's top one or two lines; short-handed, etc), I would
     much rather see the +/- disappear altogether instead of having its dubious
     merits trumpeted by those with little understanding of its implications.

Thank you for posting this.  As the person who first brought up the
fact that Jagr has a much higher +/- than Francis, I can assure you
that I brought it up as an example of the absurdity of +/-
comparisons, even on the same team.  I never, ever thought that anyone
would argue that Jagr's higher +/- actually reflected better two-way
play.

In my opinion, Francis's low +/- is purely a result of him being asked
to play against opponents top scorers at all times; the fact that he
can chip in 100 points while neutralizing the other team's top center
is a testament to how valuable he is, even if his +/- suffers.  On the
other hand, Jagr, for how big, fast and skilled he is, can't even get
90 points, no matter how inflated his +/- is.

(By the way, don't get me wrong -- I like Jagr.  He may be a lazy
floater, but he turns it on at exactly the right times -- like
overtime of playoff games).

--
Roland Dreier                                        dreier@math.berkeley.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53974
From: georgeh@gjhsun (George H)
Subject: Re: President Trophy winner missing playoffs ???

jstrangi@hora.seas.upenn.edu (Jim Strangio) writes:

>In article <13APR93.17376172.0059@VM1.MCGILL.CA> CCDB@MUSICA.MCGILL.CA (CCDB000) writes:

>When was the last time a President's Trophy winner fell to last place
>the following year?  A long time, I'd bet.
>--

Well I think it in 1969 the Montreal Canadians finished 1st (although
there was no President's cup in those days) and missed the playoffs 
in 1970. I do recall that the 1970 playoff picture wasn't decided until
the final day, when the NY Rangers defeated the RedWings. The tie-breaker was
the number of goals for (if I remember correctly), so the Rangers played
with an empty net for the entire game. Some Hab loyalists accused 
the Wings of 'throwing' the game to keep them out, but as I recall, 
Gordie and Delvecchio had the flu, so coach Sid Abel sat them out,
and the Rangers swarmed the RedWings most of the night. 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53975
From: gak@wrs.com (Richard Stueven)
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

It's in the FAQ.

have fun
gak

---
Richard Stueven       AHA# 22584 |----------| He has erected a multitude of new
Internet:            gak@wrs.com |----GO----| offices, and sent hither swarms
ATTMAIL: ...!attmail!gakhaus!gak |---SHARX--| of officers to harass our people,
Cow Palace:            107/H/3-4 |----------| and eat out their substance.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53976
From: cpc4@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (CONNIN PATRICK COLGAIN)
Subject: Keenan signs with the Rangers!!

Just heard on the news that Mike Keenan formerly of the Blackhawks, Flyers,
and General of a Siberian Prison has just signed to coach the Rangers.  The
Rangers, who won the President's Cup last year have slipped just a bit at the
end of the season and are destined to finish last behind the lowly Flyers.
The Flyers' fans are going to be disappointed on Keenans decision, because
they were very interested in him.  Oh well.

Go CAPS!!!!!!!

Connin
-- 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53977
From: farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL final standings

FINAL 1992-93 AMERICAN HOCKEY LEAGUE STANDINGS

NORTHERN DIVISION	W	L	T	PTS	GF	GA	LYF*
Providence Bruins	46	32	2	94	384	348	56
Adirondack Red Wings	36	35	9	81	331	308	84
Capital District Isles	34	34	12	80	280	285	75
Springfield Indians	25	41	14	64	282	336	94
New Haven Senators	22	47	11	55	262	343	--

SOUTHERN DIVISION	W	L	T	PTS	GF	GA	LYF
Binghamton Rangers	57	13	10	124#	392	246	91
Rochester Americans	40	33	7	87	348	332	86
Utica Devils		33	36	11	77	325	354	74
Baltimore Skipjacks	28	40	12	68	318	353	66
Hershey Bears		27	41	12	66	316	339	83
Hamilton Canucks	29	45	6	64	284	327	--

ATLANTIC DIVISION	W	L	T	PTS	GF	GA	LYF
St John's Maple Leafs	41	26	13	95	351	308	90
Fredericton Canadiens	38	31	11	87	314	278	96
Cape Breton Oilers	36	32	12	84	356	336	82
Moncton Hawks		31	33	16	78	292	306	74
Halifax Citadels	33	37	10	76	312	348	67

*- Last year's point total
#- League record total			

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53978
From: enolan@sharkbite.esd.sgi.com (Ed Nolan)
Subject: Devils and Islanders tiebreaker????

If the Islanders beat the Devils tonight, they would finish with
identical records.  Who's the lucky team that gets to face the Penguins
in the opening round?   Also, can somebody list the rules for breaking
ties.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53979
From: cbetz@radioman.cray.com (Charles Betz  {x66442 CF/ENG})
Subject: NHL team in Milwaukee


After reading some of the reports of possible NHL moves to Milwaukee or that
Milwaukee should have an NHL team, I thought I'd pass along a story I heard
recently.  This is second hand, so I don't know how true it is, but I have
no reason to doubt it either.

Bradley Center in Milwaukee is home to the Milwaukee Admirals minor leauge
hockey team.  The owner of the Admirals (sorry, I can't remember his name)
either owns or at least shelled out the majority of the funds to build the
Bradley Center.

Supposedly he was approached by the NHL about an expansion franchise, but 
turned it down because he thought the franchise fee of $50 million was too
high.

Like I said, I don't know whether this story is true or just a rumor, but if
it's true, don't look for an NHL team in Milwaukee anytime soon.  The Admirals
aren't going to be forced out of the building and you won't see an NHL club
and a minor league club in the same building, especially since the NBA's
Milwaukee Bucks play there as well.

Charlie Betz
Cray Research, Inc.   Chippewa Falls, WI
cbetz@romulus.cray.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53980
From: joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm)
Subject: Re: How to beat Pittsburgh!

In article <1993Apr15.214902.3372@guvax.acc.georgetown.edu> apanjabi@guvax.acc.georgetown.edu writes:
...
>>HOW TO BEAT PITTSBURGH???
...
>	III.Kevin Stevens
>		A.Fighting
>			1.Call Bob Probert
>			2.Call Tie Domi
>			3.Call my grandmother (She'd kick his ass)
> 

Yeah...I've seen you're grand mother...I bet she could.

Joseph Stiehm







Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53981
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: RUMOUR - Keenan signs with Rangers?

golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>
>The Ranger announcement is supposed to happen tomorrow supposedly.

Press conference at 1PM ...

>The Rangers have so many veterans that they had to get a coach with
>"weight" and a proven record...and whom they know Messier respects.

Interestingly, Keenan's co-coach (or is it his "Number One"?) on Team
Canada at the World Championships is Roger Neilsen.  

It'd be interesting if the Rangers call in the balance of Neilsen's
contract to be Keenan's assistant ...  Roger did do a very good job
with the mediocre players, just as he handled the Cinderella Canucks
of 10 years ago ... but his mistake was playing the Rangers like those
Canucks last May ...

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53982
From: "Terence M. Rokop" <tr2i+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Patrick Playoffs Look Like This

Jan Brittenson writes:

>last year. The Pens' weak spot is defense and goaltending -- if Boston

            ...

>   Boston doesn't have the guns of the Pens, but the Pens doesn't have
>the defense, goaltending, and discipline of Boston. Still, Boston can

Why do you say this?  As of now, the Pens and Bruins have played the
same number of games, and given up the same number of goals.  They are
tied for the third and fourth best defenses in the league, behind
Chicago first and Toronto second.  The Pens' weak spot is defense?  Only
by comparison to their offense, which is second in the league to
Detroit.  But the Pens are no weaker on defense and goaltending than the
Bruins are; that is, they are both very strong.



                                                Terry

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53983
From: mep@phoenix.oulu.fi (Marko Poutiainen)
Subject: Re: Finland/Sweden vs.NHL teams (WAS:Helsinki/Stockholm & NHL expansion)

: FINLAND:  
: 
: D-Jyrki Lumme.......20
: D-Teppo Numminen....20
: D-Peter Ahola.......13
: 
Well well, they don't like our defenders (mainly Lumme and Numminen)...

: C-Jari Kurri........25
: C-Christian Ruuttu..16
: 
Now, do YOU think that Ruuttu is only worth 16 ? I think it might be 20.

: R-Teemu Selanne.....27
: 
Compared to Kurri, Selanne's points are too high, lets make it 25 or 26.


: well in the Canada Cup and World Championships largely due to the efforts of
: Markus Ketterer (the goalie), 3-4 or the players listed above and luck. There's
: presumably a lot of decent players in Finland that wouldn't be superstars at
: the highest level but still valuable role players, however. My guess would be
: that the Finnish Canada Cup team would be a .500 team in the NHL.

Wow, now, it looks like you don't like our players? What about guys like:
Nieminen, Jutila, Riihijarvi, Varvio, Laukkanen, Makela, Keskinen and (even
if he is aging) Ruotsalainen? The main difference between finnish and North-
American players is, that our players tend to be better in the larger rink.
The Canadian defenders are usually slower that defenders in Europe. 
And I think that there was more in our success than Ketterer and luck (though
they helped). I think that the main reason was, that the team worked well
together.
--
***********************************************************************
* 'Howl howl gargle howl gargle howl howl howl gargle howl gargle howl* 
*  howl gargle gargle howl gargle gargle gargle howl slurrp uuuurgh'  *
*                                       -Prostetnic Vogon Jeltz       *
***********************************************************************
	-Marko Poutiainen
	 mep@phoenix.oulu.fi

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53984
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: ESPN2 - Tell us about it 

Geoff Filinuk (filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu) wrote:

: 	This comes indirectly from Al Morgani who works in the studio
: for ESPN hockey.
[Some text deleted]
: 	ESPN is under contractual obligation to show baseball and COULD NOT
: broadcast the OT of the hockey game.  Next year, ESPN2 will be introduced so 
: baseball fans can watch baseball and hockey fans can watch hockey.

I hadn't heard about this new ESPN2. When is this new network
supposed to start? Sounds great to me! (as long as my cable co.
offers it)

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53985
From: v120qldp@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (A REAL KNEEBITER)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

In article <1993Apr23.102811.623@sei.cmu.edu>, caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz) writes...
> 
>While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash" that
>Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had his
>jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not positive.
>Does anyone remember/know his name?  What has happened to him since?  What
>about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?  Has this ever
>happened before in a hockey game?   

It was Clint Malarchuk's neck cut by Uwe Krupp's skate.  I know it happened in
Buffalo, but I can't tell you against whom.

Krupp was defending an opposing attacker charging the net.

Malarchuk became the fourth goalie (behind Hasek, Puppa and Draper) after
suffering from Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder.  He's been playing in San Diego
for former Sabre coach Rick Dudley.

Krupp is now playing for the Islanders after the LaFontaine/Turgeon trade.

What do I win?  =)

---
Patrick Ferrel - v120qldp@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu   "I always said there was
State University of New York at Buffalo           something fundamentally wrong
                                                  with the Universe."
<aka> Jay Walker, WWIVnet 1@7659                            -- Arthur Dent

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53986
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Sabres/Bruins notes


 
It was unlikely, improbable.  For the Bruins, it was the stuff of
nightmares; for the Sabres, it was a taste of heaven.  
   For the first time since 1983, the Sabres have won the first three
games of a series.  Last time was a three games to none victory in a
best of five against the Canadiens.  It takes a little more work this
time.  The Sabres seem ready to put in the extra work.
   On the heels of a shutout, one that took away Boston's home ice
advantage, the Sabres came back with a four to three overtime win.  It
wasn't easy.  It wasn't always pretty.  It still worked.
   John Blue got the nod for Boston, supplanting Andy Moog as starting
goaltender.  Moog was pulled midway through game 2 on Tuesday.
Buffalo started with a goal by Mogilny, his fourth of the playoffs, on
the powerplay, with Boston's Don Sweeney and Gord Roberts in the box.
LaFontaine and Hawerchuk had the assists.  Goal number two was
Khmylev's first of the playoffs, a pretty goal scored when the Sabres
stole the puck and passed to an open and waiting Khmylev.  Smehlik and
Hannan assisted.  Determined not to be shut out, Boston tallied on a
shot by Ray Bourque on the powerplay, with Colin Patterson and Bob
Sweeney both in the box.  Period two was scoreless, a split of
penalties between the two clubs.  The third saw Boston's Smolinski get
his first, courtesy of Oates.  Buffalo resecured the lead two minutes
later, from former Bruin Bob Sweeney (Khmylev and Carney).  Neely tied
the game 3/4 of the way through the third, sending it into overtime.
Last year overtime meant a Bruin win.  Last night, it spelled sweet
revenge, as Buffalo scored with Ray Bourque in the penalty box, on a
tip in by Khmylev (Hawerchuk and LaFontaine) a minute into overtime.
Both teams finished with 34 shots.  
        Power-play conversions--Boston 5-1. Buffalo 7-2.
        Referee--Rob Shick.

Comments:  Shick pocketed the whistle in the third, allowing a lot of
clutching and grabbing.  Buffalo's penalty killing unit was fantastic
again.  Mogilny was checking.  Granted he missed once and instead
flung his body into the boards, but checking like this is a novel idea
to Mogilny.  The crowd was unbelievable.  I don't think I've ever
heard a crowd that loud in the Aud for a Sabres game (remember, I was
only five when they played for the cup.  I don't remember it and no
one took me to the games).  Doug Bodger, in a postgame interview,
noted that he tried to say something to Hawerchuk, but the crowd was
too loud, even though he was shouting.  It didn't seem to matter, as
most of the Sabres and even Muckler said it was great.  Yuri Khmylev
didn't seem to realize that he was the game's third star and didn't
skate out when his name was called.  Sweeney (2) and Fuhr (1) each
were out before Yuri made his appearance, sans jersey.  When asked in
an interview later whether he knew how big a goal that was, he
responed yes (ok, it was through an interpreter and he said more than
that, even more than the interpreter said, but I digress).  The
interviewer seemed to think just because he doesn't speak English, he
must not understand playoffs.  Uh-huh. 

-- 
Valerie Hammerl 	       John Sr. would lift Pat over the boards, grab 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu       his hand, and start running around the outside,
V085PWPZ@UBVMS.CC.BUFFALO.EDU  faster and faster.  "I wanted to learn how to 
get that feeling, and the only way was to learn how to skate."  P. LaFontaine

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53987
From: Bhullar@BLDG_HSC_CAMPUS (Raj BHULLAR)
Subject: Re: Montreal versue Quebec

In article <1r8p64$kj6@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu (David Vergolini) writes:

>  Did anyone see the Montreal - Quebec game yesterday?  It was tight right down
>to the last second of the third period.  In the overtime Roy and Hextall played
>like they were gods.
>  Ok, so Montreal won!  They deserved it after getting their first goal in
>overtime waved off because the puck was hit in with a high stick.  Their second
>goal in overtime was also replayed, but I could not tell if it was the Montreal
>player who kicked it in.  The puck definitely was not directed in by a stick.
>Anyways, Montreal is back into the series.







>                                                Dave Vergolini
>                                                Michigan State University
>                                                vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu
The replay clearly showed that the winning goal for Montreal went off the 
skate of the Quebec defenceman who was checking Kirk Muller in front of 
Hextall.
  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53988
From: chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Subject: Re: SHARKS: Jack Feirerra (was Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!)

gak@wrs.com (Richard Stueven) writes:

>On the other hand, I'm hard pressed to think of any other real mistakes
>Fereirra made.  Imagine indeed, but then again we have the benefit of
>hindsight.

Well, the "jettison for youth fast" strategy was his. Also in hindsight, it
didn't work all that well, but I think it was more because it left the
Sharks on a tightrope without a net, not that it was inherently flawed. It
was the injuries that caused us to fall.

>Let's say that in the view of the Sharks' upper management, the attempt
>to trade Kisio was a major factor in the decision to fire Feirerra.

From all indications, it wasn't the "major" factor, but the "last straw".
There were personality conflicts among Shark management, and disagreements
over how personnel were going to be handled (not just who was being traded
vs. kept, but who was being sent to KC. What Ferriera did, if rumors are
right, was not always what the folks behind the bench wanted or needed).

>I'm inclined to take exactly the opposite view:  they should have kept
>him...he's obviously the luckiest man in hockey!

I think if they'd kept Ferriera, they would have lost some of their other
management staff. Depending on which sources you trust, we might have lost
Grillo AND Lombardi AND Murdoch over the summer. Frankly, I want to keep
those three. (we may well ahve also lost Kingston, which, of course, is now
a moot point). 

The Sharks have been building an organizational staff that is highly
consensual and cooperative. Ferriera wanted to run things his way. There
were conflicts. Ferriera lost. That says nothing about his skills or
accomplishments -- at that level, a lot is personality and politics. 

I think he did some good things for the Sharks, but that he never fit in as
a "Shark person". I hope he succeeds beyond his wildest dreams down in
Anaheim, too, because it'll be good for hockey. (but I want the Ducks to be
doormats for a couple of years, so the Sharks succeeed first).

-- 
 Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= chuq@apple.com
   Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms =+=  GEnie: MAC.BIGOT =+= ALink:CHUQ 
  Minor League fans: minors-request@medraut.apple.com (San Jose Giants: A/1/9)
  San Francisco Giants fans: giants-request@medraut.apple.com (The Stick?NOT!)
   San Jose Sharks fans: sharks-request@medraut.apple.com (New seat: 127/TBD)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53989
From: rzuback@alumni.Lakeheadu.Ca
Subject: Re: Leafs v.s. Wings

I agree! Rob Shick sucks big time.  He did the same thing last night's game 
between Boston & Buffalo.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53990
From: rzuback@alumni.Lakeheadu.Ca
Subject: Re: POTVIN & HIS STICK

Nothing wrong with what Felix did.  The only problem was that he didn't Dino 
hard enough.  Next time Felix aim for the ankles!!!!!!!!!!

GO LEAFS.  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53991
From: steven.kipling@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Steven Kipling) 
Subject: Re: Buffalo Sabres

 -=> Quoting Bill Gregory to All <=-

 

 BG> hey I saw that game!  I thought the Sabres looked better that you
 BG> described. It's Boston that looked weak and unsure of themselves.  Even
 BG> if (big if) they (bruins) win the third game what's that going to
 BG> prove?  They be lucky!


     Well now the Sabres are up 3 - 0 in games, and its to
     bad that Boston isn't putting up more of a fight as
     that could have been the best series of the playoffs,
     I think Boston will come out smoking in the next
     two games and that Buffalo will end the series in
     game six back in Buffalo, and say, how about those Islanders?
     they are up 2 - 1 on the Capitals and will probably
     win the series, only to be clobbered by the Penguins who
     should eliminate the Devils in the next game.
     I cannot see (i'm sad to say) anyone beating the 
     Penguins this year (again) and they will take cup # 3 
     I'm afraid.  well talk to ya later.


Steve




... To find out a girl's faults, praise her to her girl friends.
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
                                                                                    

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53992
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

In article <1r8tgh$lfi@hsdndev.harvard.edu> nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219) writes:
>
>Harry and his buttkisser Milbury will never admit that they screwed up
>in a major way when they brought in one of the dumbest people in the
>business,Brian Sutter. Sutter's playoff record as the head coach in St.Louis
>speaks for itself. The Blues really have a chance to advance to the
>second round this year...
>

Grant Fuhr has done this to a lot better coaches than Brian Sutter...

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53993
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Hockey guest spots...

In article <22APR93.25499311.0068@VM1.MCGILL.CA> JBE5 <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA> writes:
>Manon Rheaume was on with Letterman in Sept. 1992.  Her English was
>so terrible that Letterman took cheap shots at her.  Although the shots
>were funny, they were uncalled for.
>

Well, on the contrary, I thought Dave was rather taken with her and her
accent..."(H)ockey is my passion"... 

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53994
From: smorris@venus.lerc.nasa.gov (Ron Morris )
Subject: Re: WJR in Boston

John Girash writes...
>For all those Red Wings fans in Boston, I thought I'd letcha know that (being
>desperate for news on the game) I tried to get WJR (AM 760) on my Walkman --
>and SUCCEEDED!  It was at night (about 10pm) & reception got better as it got

You can get WJR a LONG way away.  The problem is that, because of those
well known and beloved "contractual obligations", WJR will be doing
Tiger baseball instead of the Wings playoff games for probably half
the games the Wings could play.  For this series, I know tonight's
game and I believe games 5 and 6 (if necessay) will be bumped.

Ron

**********
"And one of my major goals is to leave the next president a new set
of things to worry about.  I'm getting bored reading the same problems
in the paper, decade after decade.  I want people to have to deal
with new problems."
                    ... President Bill Clinton   2-4-93

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53995
From: vallille@emr1.emr.ca (Roy Vallillee)
Subject: Sabre fans 

Yes, Yes, I can see it now >>>> all those Sabre fans FINALLY taking
their Sabre sweaters out of the moth balls and proudly wearing them.
After 9 years of playoff frustration and being up 3 games to nil
I guess it is a pretty good bet.    BUT there has not been a team
that has come back from an 0-3 deficit since 1975 - could this be
the year.   (Don't throw out the moth balls yet)

ROY

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53996
From: smorris@venus.lerc.nasa.gov (Ron Morris )
Subject: Re: Wings News and Playoff Thoughts

I wrote:
>>
>>I feel the jury is still out on Tim Cheveldae as a playoff goalie.
>>He was average in his first playoffs.  Last year, he had a horrible
>>start, but played great the last ten games after he was benched.
>>His GAA, even with the horrible start, was 2.5 last year.  This year,
>>I think he's going to play very well (he has to if Detroit is going
>>to win the cup).  He wasn't sharp in game 1, but he didn't have to be.
>>I thought he looked pretty good yesterday.
>>
Charles Hubbert writes...
>Great write up of the Wings/Toronto series thus far.  I agree with just
>about everything that you said, but Chevy shouldn't have let the shot from
>the right point in.  First goal, Mikorov, I think.  Other than that, the
>Wings are looking good, and Chevy is holding his own.  Not great, but maybe

Chevy has let in 2 or 3 soft goals so far, but they all didn't matter.
However, his recent history has been inconsistant play but comes up
big when it counts.  The score was 4-0 I think when the goal you mentioned
was scored.  In the third period when it looked like Toronto was coming
back, Chevy was exceptional.  I can see him as a Barraso style playoff
goalie:  inconsistant when there's nothing on the line,
but comes up big when really needed.  I guess we'll both find out.

Ron

**********
"And one of my major goals is to leave the next president a new set
of things to worry about.  I'm getting bored reading the same problems
in the paper, decade after decade.  I want people to have to deal
with new problems."
                    ... President Bill Clinton   2-4-93

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53997
From: colling@ann-arbor.applicon.slb.com (Michael Collingridge)
Subject: Re: Hockey guest spots...

In article 27867 of rec.sport.hockey sclark@epas.utoronto.ca 
(Susan Clark) asks:
>Hi guys....
>        I'm looking to answe a bit of trivia.  What hockeplayers have
>appeared on major talk shows on TV (i.e., Letterman, Carson/Leno,
>Arsenio, etc.....i.e. shows of a national nature--include Canadian equivalents
>if you can think of any)?  This can include NHL, Olympic, and World Champion-
>ship players.  I'm pretty sure I've seen Gretzky and Lemieux, but I was
>wondering if there were any others.....
>

I am not so sure about the celebrated players of the game, but Tod Hartje,
who played for Harvard in college and then went on to play in the AHL
(initially for Moncton and currently for Providence-- thanks to Daryl 
Turner for the update!) appeared on David Letterman's show about two
years ago now.

Tod has the distinction of being the first American born player to go 
and play in the former Soviet Union. This was arranged by Jets GM Mike 
Smith while Tod was playing in Moncton at about the time all those 
European players were coming over to North America to play in the NHL.

Tod spent a year playing in Russia and played with or against some of
the Russian players who have just entered the NHL in the last two years.
He wrote a book on his experiences called "Behind the Red Line" (check it
out!) and appeared on the Letterman show to talk about them.

-- Mike 

Note: I hope I have my facts straight. It has been a year since I
read Tod's book. I wanted to dig the book out to double check, but 
realized I lent it to a friend, and he hasn't returned the book yet! 
(Just wait 'til I get a hold of him...)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53998
From: pavalin@bnr.ca (Paul Valin)
Subject: Re: Montreal versue Quebec

In article <1r8p64$kj6@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu>, vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu
(David Vergolini) wrote:
> 
>Did anyone see the Montreal - Quebec game yesterday?  It was tight right down
>to the last second of the third period.  In the overtime Roy and Hextall played
>like they were gods.
>Ok, so Montreal won!  They deserved it after getting their first goal in
>overtime waved off because the puck was hit in with a high stick.  Their second
>goal in overtime was also replayed, but I could not tell if it was the Montreal
>player who kicked it in.  The puck definitely was not directed in by a stick.
>Anyways, Montreal is back into the series.
> 

The overhead replay pretty clearly showed that it was the Quebec 
defender who deflected the puck.  The re-play officials did not 
take nearly as much time to make this call as they did for the first 
non-goal, so it seemed pretty non-controversial.

I agree that it was a great game; good to see Roy and Damphousse back
into form.  Hopefully the sign of good things to come...
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Paul Valin                                     Tel: + 1 613 763 7394
Bell-Northern Research Ltd.                    Email: pavalin@bnr.ca
P.O. Box 3511, Station C
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada K1Y 4H7               'only my opinions...'

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 53999
From: "Matthew T. Keating" <mk55+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Bowman needs credit

During the first three games of the Pens-Devils series, I have been
impressed time and time again by the pure talent of the Pens.  Jagr,
MacEachern and Barrasso have been especially fun to watch.  But, one
element of this team which goes unnoticed seems to be Scotty Bowman.

Despite Brooks' lunatic comments, and despite the Devils' line changing
adantage in last night's game, Bowman has been able to keep his cool and
keep the Devils in the dark.  Granted, the hell-dwellers had the Pens
bottled up for a while last night, but Bowman was eventually able to
configure his line-up to get the job done.  His ability to throw out new
looks and strategies at a moments notice is incredible.

Bowman seems to have a terrific ability of reading his players on an
individual basis.  Last night, for instance, he realized that the speed
of Jagr, Straka, and MacEachern was throwing the Devils off balance.  As
a result, Straka received many more shifts than average; Jagr played
almost the entire game (he was always on the puck), and MacEachern
scored a goal, while complementing Jagr many times throughout the night.
His ability to commit to one player in crucial situations is
commendable, especially when a coach of such a talented team might
simply rely on the overall talent to dominate, and to bring about
success.

While no one can replace the genius and optimism of Badger Bob Johnson,
Bowman, in his own way, has made himself a permanent, though not clearly
seen, mark in  Pittsburgh. 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54000
From: duncan@ (Nicholas Duncan)
Subject: Where's Roger?

I really feel the need for a knowledgable hockey observer to explain this year's playoffs to me. I mean, the obviously superior Toronto team with the best center and the best goalie in the league keeps losing. What gives?

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
         
I stand by all the misstatements that I've made.
		-- Vice President Dan Quayle to Sam Donaldson, 8/17/89

Me Too -- Nick Duncan <duncan@mprgate.mpr.ca>

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54001
From: bks2@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (bryan.k.strouse)
Subject: NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4-22-93



NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR 4/22/93.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                  CONFERENCE SEMI-FINALS        BEST OF SEVEN
      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE
 
 NJ                  BUF   (leads 3-0)   STL   (leads 2-0)   WIN               
 PIT   (leads 3-0)   BOS                 CHI                 VAN   (leads 2-0)

 NYI   (leads 2-1)   MON                 TOR                 LA    (tied  1-1) 
 WAS                 QUE   (leads 2-1)   DET   (leads 2-0)   CAL              

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quebec Nordiques    (leads series 2-1)    1   0   0   0   -   1
Montreal Canadiens                        0   1   0   1   -   2

1st period: QUE, Sundin 1 - (Gusarov) 1:17
	 
2nd period: MON, Muller 1 - (Damphousse, Bellows) (pp) 1:30

3rd period: NONE

1 Overtime: MON, Damphousse 1 - (Bellows, Desjardins) (pp) 10:30

Powerplay Opportunities-Nordiques 0 of 4
			Canadiens 2 of 6

Shots on Goal-	Nordiques  12   4  14   5  -  35
		Canadiens  11  14  13  12  -  50

Quebec Nordiques--Hextall (2-1) (50 shots - 48 saves)
Montreal Canadiens--Roy (1-2) (35 shots - 34 saves)

ATT-17,679

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Pittsburgh Penguins  (leads series 3-0)   1   0   3   -   4
New Jersey Devils                         1   1   1   -   3

1st period: NJD, Guerin 1 - 1:03
	    PIT, McEachern 3 - (Straka) 9:36
	   
2nd period: NJD, Holik 1 - (S.Stevens) 16:32

3rd period: PIT, M.Lemieux 4 - (Murphy, Ramsey) 1:07
	    PIT, Taglianetti 1 - (Loney, Tippett) 7:05
	    PIT, Murphy 1 - (Francis, Tocchet) (pp) 9:31
	    NJD, Semak 1 - (Zelepukin) 9:44

Powerplay Opportunities-Penguins 1 of 4
			Devils   0 of 5

Shots on Goal-	Penguins   7  16  12  -  35
		Devils    16  11   5  -  32

Pittsburgh Penguins--Barrasso (3-0) (32 shots - 29 saves)
New Jersey Devils--Billington (0-1) (35 shots - 31 saves)

ATT-14,974

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Boston Bruins                        1   0   2   0   -   3
Buffalo Sabres  (leads series 3-0)   2   0   1   1   -   4

1st period: BUF, Mogilny 4 - (LaFontaine, Hawerchuk) (pp) 1:33
	    BUF, Khmylev 1 - (Smehlik, Hannan) 4:42
	    BOS, Bourque 1 - (Oates, Donato) (pp) 17;33

2nd period: NONE

3rd period: BOS, Smolinski 1 - (Oates) 13:28
	    BUF, B.Sweeney 2 - (Khmylev, Carney) 14:56
	    BOS, Neely 3 - (Oates, Shaw) 15:57

1 Overtime: BUF, Khmylev 2 - (Hawerchuk, LaFontaine) (pp) 1:05

Powerplay Opportunities-Bruins 1 of 5
			Sabres 2 of 7

Shots on Goal-	Bruins  11   8  15   0  -  34
		Sabres  12  11   8   3  -  34

Boston Bruins--Blue (0-1) (34 shots - 30 saves)
Buffalo Sabres--Fuhr (3-0) (34 shots - 31 saves)

ATT-16,325

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Washington Capitals                       1   1   1   0   -   3
New York Islanders   (leads series 2-1)   1   0   2   1   -   4

1st period: NYI, Thomas 1 - 16:37
	    WAS, Burridge 1 - (May, Cavallini) 18:58

2nd period: WAS, Carpenter 1 - (Ridley, Bondra) 6:18

3rd period: WAS, Elynuik 1 - (Carpenter, Ridley) 6:15
	    NYI, Thomas 2 - (Turgeon, King) 11:11
	    NYI, Turgeon 3 - (Thomas, Hogue) 19:17

1 Overtime: NYI, Ferraro 3 - (Hogue, Flatley) 4:46

Powerplay Opportunities-Capitals  0 of 2
			Islanders 0 of 4

Shots on Goal-	Capitals   10   8   6   1  -  25
		Islanders  10   6   8   6  -  30

Washington Capitals--Tabaracci (1-2) (25 shots - 21 saves)
New York Islanders--Healy (2-1) (30 shots - 27 saves)

ATT-14,180

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


\|||||/
-SPIKE-




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54002
From: leunggm@odin.control.utoronto.ca (Gary Leung)
Subject: Re: POTVIN and HIS STICK

In article <2346575PS380.9.0@sscl.uwo.ca> 2346575PS380@sscl.uwo.ca writes:
>Dino getting shots in front of the net, he should expect it.  This is playoff
>hockey where anything goes. You lose one game in the regular season, and it's
>not so bad. You lose a game in the playoffs and it's a difficult thing to
>overcome.  I've watched hockey (and played it too) for a number of years and
>I haven't seen one post-season game where the forward in front of the net 
>has not finished without any bruises on the back of his leg.  The Leafs are 
>not doing a good job in clearing the net and Potvin has been forced to take
>matters into his own hands.  I remember when Cicarelli used to play for the
>London Knights (OHL), he always was a nuisance in front of the net and the 
>goalies took exception to this.  He also complained (in this morning's paper)
>about what happened last night, but to me, it's a lot of bellyaching. His 
>team is up 2-0 and he complains about being whacked...I wonder what would
>happen if he tried to do the same thing in front of Billy Smith or a younger
>Ron Hextall? Seems Dino would need two artifical legs.  Dino should take it 
>as part of the game and thank his lucky stars that he's in the playoffs and
>has a good chance to go the finals.


Well, I agree that if you're going to stand in front of the net,
that you should expect to get hit and hacked at. In general, you
should expect to finish the game with some bruises. However,
there is a fine line between hacking at a guy (causing some pain
and discomfort) and blatantly attempting to injure another
player. Felix Potvin, IMO, crossed that line on Wednesday. That
two hander on Ciccarelli was way out of line. I lost a lot of
respect for Potvin because of that. It showed an immaturity. He
did not slash at Ciccarelli to simply try to remove him from the
slot area (a legal position for Dino to be in). Instead, he
slashed in an attempt to injure. It was out of shear frustration. As a
Leaf supporter (just a supporter, I'm not a Leaf fan really), I
was very disappointed.

You're right in mentioning Billy Smith and Ron Hextall (at least
in his Philly days). They both crossed that same line at times and
for that reason, many fans (and players) disliked them (that's
why their names always comes up as examples when we talk about
these issues). Let's hope that Felix doesn't do that again. I'd
hate to see anyone (even Dino --- although I admit I don't like
him very much) get seriously hurt from such careless (but
intentional) use of the stick.

Gary



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54003
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

In article <C5y0t6.Bqn@acsu.buffalo.edu> v120qldp@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (A REAL KNEEBITER) writes:
>In article <1993Apr23.102811.623@sei.cmu.edu>, caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz) writes...
>> 
>>While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash" that
>>Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had his
>>jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not positive.
>>Does anyone remember/know his name?  What has happened to him since?  What
>>about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?  Has this ever
>>happened before in a hockey game?   
>
>It was Clint Malarchuk's neck cut by Uwe Krupp's skate.  I know it happened in
>Buffalo, but I can't tell you against whom.
>
>Krupp was defending an opposing attacker charging the net.

It was NOT Krupp's skate.  Krupp was defending against Steve Tuttle,
of the Blues.  They both sort of tripped and fell toward Malarchuk,
and Tuttle's skate came perilously close to cutting (but actually just
missed) the jugular.  Malarchuk immediately fell to the ice, hands at
his neck, blood on the ice.
>
>Malarchuk became the fourth goalie (behind Hasek, Puppa and Draper) after
>suffering from Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder.  He's been playing in San Diego
>for former Sabre coach Rick Dudley.

He'd been suffering from it for over a decade.  He just wasn't
diagnosed for it until he didn't sleep for ten days and decided to
have some alcohol to help him sleep.  Unfortunately, he'd just been
put on ulcer medicine a few days earlier.  It's amazing he lasted as
long as he did.  OCD sufferers stop distinguishing the line between
reality and imagination, or fail to accept that something they've
checked is OK now.  For example, an OCD sufferrer can wash his hands
over and over and still think they're dirty.  He might check the oven
ten times to be sure it's turned off.  He might see a movie about
something and automatically assume the situation is the same for his
own life.  Malarchuk has dramatically decreased the medicine he takes,
but still needs it.  He went off it this past winter and had a bad OCD
episode and I think was in the hospital for a couple days.  (He felt
it slowed his reflexes, so he tried to go without).  In any event, he
is alive and well and living in San Diego, while playing with the
Gulls (IHL).  

>
>Krupp is now playing for the Islanders after the LaFontaine/Turgeon trade.

And Tuttle is no longer with the Blues, but I don't know where he is.
Possibly in the IHL, but you'd best ask a Blues fan.

-- 
Valerie Hammerl 	       John Sr. would lift Pat over the boards, grab 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu       his hand, and start running around the outside,
V085PWPZ@UBVMS.CC.BUFFALO.EDU  faster and faster.  "I wanted to learn how to 
get that feeling, and the only way was to learn how to skate."  P. LaFontaine

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54004
From: yadalle@cs.UAlberta.CA (Yadallee Dave S)
Subject: Oilers for sale??

Here's one from the mill.  The Oilers MIGHT move to Hamilton
where Porklington can get a free deal.

Given what Labour relations and Puck has been like, it WOULD be a sigh of relief.

This WAY w4e can can BOTH elements!!
--
Dave Shariff Yadallee (B. Sc.(Econ/Math) (U of Alberta 1990) )
( yadalle@amisk.cs.ualberta.ca) God Save the Queen, God Bless us All!Remember!
Jesus saves lives from eternal damnation!
Newfoundland, keep good old Clyde, VOTE LIBERAL!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54005
From: boudreau@athena.mit.edu (Carol V. Boudreau)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

In article <1993Apr23.102811.623@sei.cmu.edu>, caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz) writes:
|> 
|> While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash" that
|> Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had his
|> jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not positive.
|> Does anyone remember/know his name?  What has happened to him since?  What
|> about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?  Has this ever
|> happened before in a hockey game?   
|> 
|> Thanks,
|> 
|> Carol
|> Go Pens!

That would be Clint Malarchuck.  It was speculated at the time, that
the injury was so serious that had he been playing at the other end
of the rink at the time (he was playing in the same end as the
ambulence is parked), he never would have survived.  Ditto, if he
were playing anything other than a league with an ambulance on 
standby.

If you've seen video tape of the incident, it is amazing how much blood
there was.  It was literally spurting out all over the ice, as Clint
grabbed his neck and watched the puddle in horror.  

Amazingly enough, he made a full recovery, and played again in the
NHL.  He was getting on in years at the time of the incident anyway,
and didn't play for too long afterward.  Some people speculated that
he just couldn't get himself back together after the incident, and I
think he had a bunch of other personal problems dogging him afterward.
He did eventually get back to form, and played another year or so after
that, and then I believe he retired.

Anyone else?

-- 


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Carol Boudreau            #44                         a.k.a. The X-Terminator
boudreau@athena.mit.edu                           Go Flames!  Rock the Kings!
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54006
From: scialdone@nssdca.gsfc.nasa.gov (John Scialdone)
Subject: WAY-TO-GO-FERRARO!!!!

The Isles picked one hell-of-a-time to get their first win all year after being
down after 2 periods. The Caps seemed to have the game in hand playing steady
defense and getting great goaltending from Tabaracci. The Isles power play
philosophy continues to be dump-and-chase which, except for boardaholics like
Flatley, doesn't work against the Caps. I hope Al realizes this!! They have too
many talented finesse players, so why not carry the puck in and set-up??? If
last night's game is any omen, the Isles could be on their way to that ole
championship form; COMING from behind late in a game. My advice to the Caps is
to pounce on those Healy Rebounds. Flatley showed alot of heart by playing the
last period and overtime despite an almost swollen-shut left eye injury
suffered at the hands of Dale Hunter. Ray Ferraro has arrived just in time for
the playoffs showing the fiesty hustle that us Islander fans remember from an 
Italian from the past; JOHN TONELLI!!! It was Tonelli who won a similar game
against the PENS in game 5 on the 82 playoffs. The Isles scored two late third
period goals to send the game into OT tied at 3. In OT, Tonelli scored the game
winner to send the Isles to the next round. The Isles have lacked this tenacity
for years, but perhaps its BACK! It was good to see the Coliseum packed just
like the ole days!!! Good luck to the Isles the rest of the way!!!!!

John Scialdone
SCIALDONE@NSSDCA.GSFC.NASA.GOV

"""And the Home of the Brave"""  Jerry Garcia, Bob Weir, Vince Welnick
April 12, 1993: Opening Day, Candlestick Park



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54007
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: Wings will win


In article 735571987@vela.acs.oakland.edu, ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:

>gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:

Lots of debate about the virtues of Bryan Murray vs Pat Quinn as a GM
deleted.  Randy Graca seems to think Murray is the best GM in the league.
I think Quinn is one of several who are better.

>>Plus his team (Quinn's) has improved a much greater amount than Detroit since
>>he took over with them.
>
>How do you figure?  Both Vancouver and Detroit did the same thing last year:
>They both won their division, they had close to the same number of points,
>they both went down 3-1 in the first round of the playoffs before finally
>escaping in 7 games, and they both got knocked out in the second round by
>teams they should have been able to beat, with less talent.  (Specifically,
>if I remember correctly, third place teams).  How does this make Vancouver
>more improved?  Further, if I'm not mistaken, the Wings had more points than
>Vancouver at the end of this season (albeit not many). 

When Quinn took over Vancouver- several years ago, NOT LAST YEAR, they 
regularily missed the playoffs.  I can't recall if they missed the playoffs
the year before his hiring but they probably did.  Quinn has improved the
team from non-playoff calibre to a serious contender.

When Murray took over in Detroit, the were about a .500 team that was a
contender to win the Norris division and possibly even a Stanley Cup
contender.

So Quinn has improved his team more than Murray has since taking over as a GM.
Quinn is one example of a better GM than Murray.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54008
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: HABS WIN, HABS WIN!!!!!!!

In article <22APR93.25012157.0068@VM1.MCGILL.CA> JBE5 <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA> writes:
>Yahooooooooooooooooooooo!
>
>What a game, we finally beat those diques...and in O.T.!
>The Habs dominated this game and especially in O.T..

They _finally_ started going to the net!  See what happens when you 
create some traffic?  Muller deserves full marks (what a player!),
and Damphousse finally started skating.  Roy (thankyouthankyouthankyou)
was excellent.  Did you see that third period save on Young?  And the 
defense was taking out Quebec players in the zone.

Anybody else wonder if Hextall will feel like a dweeb when he finds 
out that the winning goal went in off his own D-man's skate?  Whatta
suck.  Although he _is_ playing really well.

>Life doesn't get better than this!!!!!!!!!

Sure it does.  On Sunday when the B's are golfing and the Habs are tied
2-2 you'll see what I mean! :-) :-)

>Nick

--
dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54009
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Bowman needs credit

In article <0fq1Vru00WBNA3L3pI@andrew.cmu.edu> "Matthew T. Keating" <mk55+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>During the first three games of the Pens-Devils series, I have been
>impressed time and time again by the pure talent of the Pens.  Jagr,
>MacEachern and Barrasso have been especially fun to watch.  But, one
>element of this team which goes unnoticed seems to be Scotty Bowman.
>

Bowman is in the Hockey Hall of Fame as a coach already...and unlike
Gil Stein...he didn't get their by stacking the Board of Directors! -)

>
>While no one can replace the genius and optimism of Badger Bob Johnson,
>Bowman, in his own way, has made himself a permanent, though not clearly
>seen, mark in  Pittsburgh. 

Bowman is the genius...Johnson isn't.  Bowman is a great coach...Johnson,
a very good one.  However, Bowman is really not a modern coach, and
Patrick's solution of having him only run the team on game days, and
delegate most of the day-to-day responsibity to the assistants is
a shrewd managerial decision on Patrick's part.  

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54010
From: dan@vicorp.com (Dan Gauthier)
Subject: Re: Where are all the Bruins fans???

In article <93113.010900RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu (Robbie Po) writes:
>I'm just wondering where all the Bruins fans are???  I mean they woofed it
>up with about 1,000,000 posts during the regular season saying that their
>fave team was going to kick everyone's @#$ in the playoffs and win the Stanley
Oh really?  I seem to remember this year's woofers consisting mainly of
yourself and Roger.  Boston fans were relatively quiet.

>Cup.  While I see nothing wrong with a little ranting and raving, I'm just
>curious why all the Boston faithful have stopped posting.  I mean I haven't
>even see just one little Boston fan post, 'cept for the Bruins fans that
>aren't cocky. ...

I guess the concept of a fan who is not cocky is something you couldn't
possible understand, eh?

>but I don't know, I'd sure like to see where all those Bruins fans are at :-)
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>** Robbie Po **          1993's STREAKERS   "We do what comes naturally!
>Patrick Division Semi's  -- PGH PENGUINS -- You see now, wait for the
>PENGUINS 4, Devils 3     1991, 1992 STANLEY possibility, don't you see a
>Penguins lead, 3-0       CUP CHAMPIONS :-)  strong resemblance..."-DG '89

Nah.  I doubt you really would.  You're just being a PROVOCATIVE SOB
as usual with a large stick up your but.  Of course, I mean that in the
nicest way.  :-)  

And just how much bragging did YOU do, "wobbie," on r.s.b.c after 
UMASS!!! beat your Quakers?

BTW.  Congratulations should go to the Sabres.  They are playing more
diciplined, and with more will to win.  They deserve it.

Dan,        dan@vicorp.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54011
From: horton@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Death before success)
Subject: Re: Leafs Crushed Again; Blues Win; Flames Back.

jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:

>In article <vzhivov.735454735@cunews> vzhivov@alfred.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov) writes:
>>
>>Joseph, shut-out the Hawks 2-0. The Blues are playing like they did in
>>'86 - clutch 'n grab, shoot the puck out. It's incredibly boring to
>>watch, but if it works...
>>

>road. I agree, it's very boring if you're not a Blues fan, but the Blues
>played two perfect road games.


Not boring is right!!! It is more likely to cause me to have a stroke!!
I had to listen to game two on the Blackhawk station and I don't think I
could take another call of "And JOSEPH makes a SPEcTACular saaaaaave".
Now I'm a Blues fan, but I don't want them to play "like" they played
in game two. Sure the result was fine, but the Blues match up very well
with the Hawks so they really don't need to treat them like the 86 Flames.
We don't need a "Monday Night Miracle" to have a chance to beat Chicago.
The Blues can do it on talent. At least over the hawks.

Rich h.--- Go BLUES!!

>  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
>  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
>  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
>  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
>  %     \    ________/                                                   *
>  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
>  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
>  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
>  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
>  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54012
From: mac18@po.CWRU.Edu (Michael A. Cornell)
Subject: Re: ESPN2 - Tell us about it


In a previous article, huot@cray.com (Tom Huot) says:

>Geoff Filinuk (filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu) wrote:
>
>: 	This comes indirectly from Al Morgani who works in the studio
>: for ESPN hockey.
>[Some text deleted]
>: 	ESPN is under contractual obligation to show baseball and COULD NOT
>: broadcast the OT of the hockey game.  Next year, ESPN2 will be introduced so 
>: baseball fans can watch baseball and hockey fans can watch hockey.
>
>I hadn't heard about this new ESPN2. When is this new network
>supposed to start? Sounds great to me! (as long as my cable co.
>offers it)

The USA Today says "late this year".  The question is, will hockey be moved to
ESPN2 permenantly, or will it be where they have a game of the week on
ESPN, and have a bunch of other games on ESPN2?


-- 
Mike Cornell     | "There are a great many people in the country today who,
mac18@po.cwru.edu|  through no fault of their own, are sane." -Monty Python
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Let's Go Flyers!  Stanley Cup in '94!  "OH! My brain hurts!"- Mr D. P. Gumby

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54013
From: gomer+@pitt.edu (Richard J Coyle)
Subject: Re: Pens fans reactions

In article <1993Apr22.102420.2694@sei.cmu.edu> sad@sei.cmu.edu (Susan Dart) writes:
>Amongst Penguins' fans there seems to be an inner calm that I've never
>experienced before this year with the Pens. The players and the fans have so
>much confidence in the team this year. We're savoring every game and saving
>our energy for the Stanley Cup.

That's not inner calm.  It's boredom, and it's being spoiled.  The Arena's
been as quiet as a church on many nights this year; too many of us just
take winning for granted.  It's been seemingly forever since the team
lost, and we've forgotten what it's like to feel real excitement and
surprise at victory.

While I'm glad to have the Pens doing so well, in some ways it was a better
high back when the Pens beat the Bruins two years ago, and the Rangers last
year. Too much of a good thing is not always good for you.

rick


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54014
From: gomer+@pitt.edu (Richard J Coyle)
Subject: Re: Lemieux's Getting the Hart... Jeez I hope not!

In article <22APR93.02956996.0062@UNBVM1.CSD.UNB.CA> F1HH@UNB.CA (Patrick Walker) writes:

(much mindless drivel deleted)

>Sorry to ramble.  As you can see I hate Mario.
>Pat Walker
>UNB

Question to you Canadian folk:  is this University of New Brunswick a
branch campus of the Western Business School?  Seems like the same sort
of rectal appendage belongs to both of them.

rick



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54015
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Oilers for sale??

In article <yadalle.735582909@cab117> yadalle@cs.UAlberta.CA (Yadallee Dave S) writes:
>Here's one from the mill.  The Oilers MIGHT move to Hamilton
>where Porklington can get a free deal.
>

The probability is that the Oilers are not going anywhere.

Pocklington has chosen this moment to make his "last" stand is
because he is at the moment of maximum advantage...the provincial
government is months away from a provincial election...it is
the moment when he has maximum power to convince Northlands
to give him a better arena deal or a better purchase price...
and it is before the NHL's new collective agreement with
the players which might involve some enhanced revenue-sharing.

Pocklington is many things...stupid is not one of them.

He can dictate terms...because other cities will pay his
price if Edmonton doesn't.

Edmonton has already fucked up its international airport, and
surrendered supremacy to Calgary, and over the next few years
Edmonton is going to take a hard hit from government cutbacks.
It will screw itself beyond recogniton if it manages to find
a way to lose its hockey team too...because Northlands wants
to continue to use the Oilers to subsidize horse racing.

However, in this case, about the long-term financial
viability of the Oilers, the fact is that Pocklington is basically 
right, regardless of who owns the team, and it is right to provoke
the crisis now, before the team accumulates millions of dollars
in losses, or becomes habitually uncompetitive because of lack
of money.

Sather has done his job...the Oilers are poised to be competitive
again very soon (Al Strachan, one of the most knowledgeble hockey
writers in Canada in a post-mortem of the Oilers season in
the Globe and Mail recently agrees with me.)

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54016
From: colling@ann-arbor.applicon.slb.com (Michael Collingridge)
Subject: Re: NHL ALLTIME SCORING LEADERS

>All time NHL leading goal scorers (* denotes active player):
>
>  1.  Gordie Howe          Det-Hfd                            801
>  2. *Wayne Gretzky        Edm-LA                             765
>  .
>  .
>  .
I wonder how many more years it will take Gretz to beat this one? ;-)

- Mike

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54017
From: sad@sei.cmu.edu (Susan Dart)
Subject: Re: ESPN


If ESPN pisses you off, call them - they do respond to calls. Last night I
called when they said they were cutting to baseball and we couldn't see the
sudden-death overtime for the BUffalo game. Apparently they received enough
calls so they waited for the overtime to finish before cutting away.

Their phone number is 203-585-2000

Susan Dart

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54018
Subject: Re: Wings News and Playoff Thoughts
From: kwolfer@eagle.wesleyan.edu

In article <1r8u6v$prv@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu>, twork@egr.msu.edu (Michael Twork) writes:
>>roots in Detroit.  He would be a valuable asset to the Wings and Perhaps the
>>Rangers could get a Zombo in return?
> 
>   
>  
> Wake up and smell the Norris!!  Rick Zombo was traded to the Blues for Vince
> Riendo (sp?) last season.  
> 
> - Mike
> 
Sorry Mike! What defensemen would the Wings be willing to give up for Beezer?
 
> 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54019
From: msanfrat@cs.ucsd.edu (Mike Sanfratello)
Subject: Re: Sabres-Bruins

In article <lte5tcINN7vr@appserv.Eng.Sun.COM> mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler) writes:
> [ ... ]
>
>I'm not a Buffalo fan, but I could get on their bandwagon if they
>win #3.
>-- 

Welcome aboard!  And, since I haven't seen this yet this year (but all
preceding years), let me say:

T H I S  C O U L D  'B'  T H E  Y E A R !                 (NOT!)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54020
From: gwittt@alleg.edu (Tom Gwitt)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

In article <1993Apr23.102811.623@sei.cmu.edu> caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol  
Jarosz) writes:
> 
> While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash"  
that
> Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had  
his
> jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not  
positive.
> Does anyone remember/know his name?

	Clint Malarchuk


  What has happened to him since?

	Assigned to San Diego Gulls at the being of the season I believe

  What
> about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?

It was Uwe Krupp and a Blues player, though Uwe's skate I beleive cut  
Clint.  He has since be traded to the Isles in the LaFontaine deal.

  Has this ever
> happened before in a hockey game? 

This is the only time I know of.  
> 

--
Tom Gwitt     gwittt@alleg.edu		GO SABRES!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54021
From: ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca)
Subject: Re: Wings will win

gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:


>In article 735571987@vela.acs.oakland.edu, ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:

>>gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:

[stuff deleted]

>When Quinn took over Vancouver- several years ago, NOT LAST YEAR, they 
>regularily missed the playoffs.  I can't recall if they missed the playoffs
>the year before his hiring but they probably did.  Quinn has improved the
>team from non-playoff calibre to a serious contender.

>When Murray took over in Detroit, the were about a .500 team that was a
>contender to win the Norris division and possibly even a Stanley Cup
>contender.

The last year before Bryan Murray took over, the Wings did not make the
playoffs.  While they had been considered a possible contender when Jacques
Demers first arrived, in his last two years they were, respectively,
embarrassed in the first round by Chicago, and then failed to make the 
playoffs (at a time, a might add, when there were only five teams in the
Norris).

It's true that Vancouver did not make the playoffs for many a year before 
Quinn came, but in those years the Smythe Division was a lot--I mean *a lot*--
tougher division than the Norris, also known as the "Snorris", division.
Vancouver had to play Edmonton and Calgary, both very legitimate Stanley
Cup contenders, eight times a year, while Detroit got to play such 
powerhouses as Toronto and Minnesota.  Now, Edmonton is hardly even a force
in the league, and the Smythe even has the mighty San Jose sharks, while
over this same period of time in which Vancouver was improving, so was 
everybody in the Norris (except St. Louis).  Detroit had to improve just
to keep up with the competition in their division.  They had to improve *a
lot* to get better than their competition in the Norris.

Bryan Murray inherited a team with very little talent.  For really good
players, they had Yzerman, Burr, and Probert, and that was about it.  (And
no doubt some will dispute whether Burr and Probert were that good). The
rest were either very green rookies or washed up veterans.  The only reason
they got as far as they did in the years before Murray came was due to the
coaching of Demers, who, at least at first, got every last ounce of effort
possible out of his team.  Then, even his coaching began to degrade.

>So Quinn has improved his team more than Murray has since taking over as a GM.
>Quinn is one example of a better GM than Murray.

There are a number of reasons why Detroit wasn't in as bad a shape standings
wise when Murray took over as Vanc. was when Quinn took over, some of which
I outlined above, but Murray did not have any better personnel to work with
at the outset than did Quinn, with the exception of Yzerman.  And one player
cannot alone make a team into a Stanley Cup contender, as I'm sure everyone
reading this will agree.  

We'll be able to see better which team is really the most improved when they
face each other in the conference final (assuming they don't get knocked out,
like last year).

>Gregmeister

--Randy


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54022
From: slutsky@tesla.njit.edu
Subject: Sports broadcasting on FM

I am curious to known if there are any professional sports teams whose
games are regularly broadcast on an FM station.  The only one I am
aware of is WYSP in Philadelphia who carries the Eagles' games.

If you respond to me I will summarize for the list.

Bruce Slutsky
slutsky@tesla.njit.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54023
From: sjg3@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (STEVEN JAY GIBBLE)
Subject: TV Coverage - NHL to blame!


    The tv coverage of the playoffs is fucking ridicules.  Overtime time games
    that are not shown?  What the hell kind of shit is this?  If that would
    have happened to the Flyers(if they were in the damn playoffs to begin
    with) while I was watching, I would have gone throught the roof!

    However, everybody is getting pissed off at ESPN, but they are not the
    ones to blame.  They have prior contracts that they just can't simply break
    whenever they want to.  The N.H.L. is to blame.  When they signed the
    deal with ESPN, they had to know of this.  They had to know shit like this
    would happen since they wouldn't have complete priority.  The N.H.L.
    should be feeling the heat that is being thrown at ESPN.  How can the
    N.H.L. do this to its fans? How dare they.  We are the ones that make the
    damn league exist and they can't even televise complete playoff games for us to
    watch!  They more I write about this, the more pissed off I get.  We must
    let the N.H.L. know that  we expect a little better than this.  If anybody
    out there knows how to go about doing this, let me and everybody else know.

    Well I had to get that off my chest and while I'm at it....

    Mario is the Michael Jordan of hockey.  All that fucker has to do is fall
    on the ice and the closet guy to him gets at least 2.  Last night in the
    3rd game between NJ and Pitt, he was being pushed while skating across the
    front of the goal while trying to get a shot off.  The guy on him was
    doing a good job, so he got off a weak shot, but then he decided to fall
    to the ice. Then the fucking ref(Van Helloamend?) called the guy for
    holding.  They replayed the play, and my roomate(who is clueless about
    hockey) wanted to know what the NJ guy did to get a call, because it was so fucking obvious the NJ player
    had both hands on his stick, and no, he did not trip him.  It is simple,
    Mario gets touched, he falls to the ice, automatic 2.  But the thing that
    really pissed me off is, Pitt scored the 3rd or 4th goal, I don't remember,
    on the resulting PP and
    eventually won 4-3.  His diving/calls makes a HUGE difference in the
    outcome of a game.

    They gotta stop the damn holding and interference that is so fucking
    obvious. That is not hockey.  It allows inferior players to bring down the
level of the better players, and allows inferior teams to beat better ones.
This has pissed me off for many years now, and it has improved somewhat.
However, during the playoffs and 3rd periods, the damn refs must misplace
their balls, because they sure don't make any calls that show that they got
any.

    All agreeing or disagreeing replies are welcomed.

    Steve

    

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54024
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: div. and conf. names

In article <1993Apr20.152107.19114@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:

>There are several problems with the way the game is being presented to the
>fans.  I feel that geographical names would enhance regional loyalties
>more than names honouring personages.

I think a compromise would work; namely honouring personages in 
Conference names, and using geographical references in the divisional 
names.  Although I still do not think the move will draw fans to the
game; IMO it's a cosmetic change that Bettman and the owners _hope_ 
will have an effect.  And it doesn't say much for the mentality of 
anybody it works on, either.  

>Another thing that bothers me is the points system.  Percentages, as used in
>the other major sports are clearly more informative.  When I look at the
>NHL standings the first thing I have to do is make a quick calculation to
>account for games in hand (which is almost always the case).  Some will
>object to percentages, claiming perhaps, that it is an "Americanization"
>of the sport

Surprise, I agree totally.  The points system is fine, if everybody at all
times has played the same number of games.  Since this is almost never the
case, winning percentage is the way to go.  I don't particularly care if it 
is an "American" thing either, if it works.  


--
dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54025
From: mosscropm@woods.ulowell.edu
Subject: Bleep! Bruins lose 4-3 in O.T.

Bleep! Bleep! Bleep!  The Bruins lost AGAIN in O.T.  I can't stand it!

Aside from frustrated ravings, I must give Buffalo credit: they are making good 
on most of their scoring opportunities, and are playing great defense.  Boston
players can't seem to get control of the puck anywhere near the Buffalo net
except for on rare occasions.  The Buffalo defense is also doing an excellent
job clearing away rebounds.  Fuhr is playing great when the big save is needed
but he's also getting plenty of help.
Boston has been playing rather well (better than would be indicated by the 
series score of 3-0) but is lacking that extra drive in the earlier part of the 
game.  As a result, Boston keeps leaving the ice at the end of the 1st period
2 goals down.  This MUST stop if Boston is to have any hope of winning a single
game (the outlook for the Bruin's advancement to the second round are quite
bleak).  IMHO, the Bruins NEED to score first.  If they can do that, they have
an excellent chance of winning, since they have outplayed the Sabres in the 
2nd and 3rd periods.

(The scary thing is that I'll be going to grad school in Buffalo next year.
   I'll never cheer for the Sabres... You can't convert me... ^:)


MTM3

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mike Mosscrop  --  Die hard Bruins fan
Dept. of Chemistry
UMass-Lowell
mosscropm@woods.ulowell.edu


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54026
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: Oilers for sale??

In article <yadalle.735582909@cab117> yadalle@cs.UAlberta.CA (Yadallee Dave S) writes:
>Here's one from the mill.  The Oilers MIGHT move to Hamilton
>where Porklington can get a free deal.
>
>Given what Labour relations and Puck has been like, it WOULD be a sigh of relief.
>



I heard yesterday that Pocklington was talking with folks at Copps
that afternoon (yesterday).  


-- 
Valerie Hammerl 	       John Sr. would lift Pat over the boards, grab 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu       his hand, and start running around the outside,
V085PWPZ@UBVMS.CC.BUFFALO.EDU  faster and faster.  "I wanted to learn how to 
get that feeling, and the only way was to learn how to skate."  P. LaFontaine

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54027
From: archer@elysium.esd.sgi.com (Archer (Bad Cop) Surly)
Subject: Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!

In <1993Apr22.212219.23130@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com> spiegel@sgi501.msd.lmsc.lockheed.com (Mark Spiegel) writes:

*In article <1993Apr21.234022.2880@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
*>
*>McGill/Hammond -> Johan Garpenlov.  Would you really rather have those two
*>instead of Johan?
*
*	By your logic then you enjoy having Falloon and Ozolinsh on 
*	injured reserve?
*

Falloon was hurt on a clean check.  He just fell poorly.  Same with Wilson.
I don't know about Ozolinsh.  A judo coach would do more for the Sharks 
injury situation than Bob Probert.

Actually, a judo/ju-jitsu coach could help add a really interesting 
wrinkle to anyone's game....

-- archer


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54028
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

In article <1r8tgh$lfi@hsdndev.harvard.edu>, nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark
Shneyder 432-4219) says:
>The Fat Lady is about to hit the first note...Okay,how about 3-0 deficits?
>The B's chances for a comeback are now less 1%(That's based on 7-game
>playoff format)...

Actually, that's based on the NHL's history of 7 games.  The statstical
odds of winning one straight game -- 50/50.  Two straight games -- 25%.  Three
straight games -- 12.5%, 4 straight games = 6.25%.  The odds of the Penguins
winning 14 straight games in the playoffs was 0.0061%.  Of course, this doesn't
include weighted average, but the Pens beating the Devils 3 straight (a weaker
team) along with beating the Rangers 3 straight (a much stronger team) has made
the act balanced out.  That's about right.  For Boston the odds of winning are
probably closer to 10% (with weighted average) since Buffalo's record isn't as
good and Boston has a stronger team.  Enough about my QBA probabilities though!
It's just goes to prove ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE, if you integrate that to Debbie
Gibson :-)

>>   Who do you think gets the start in game three? I hope it is going
>>to be Blue. If the team can rally around him, maybe Moog can too.

Moog gets about ***'s out of 5 for his performance from me.  I give Blue 4
starts.  Fuhr has been too tough.  Buffalo caught a hot goaltender just in
time...I mean, after all, Buffalo is 3 wins, 7 losses in their last 10.

>Harry Sinden's appearance outside of B's dressing room after Game 3
>was a pathetic site. He said something really retarded to cover Sutter's
>behind,"This game is not about winning or losing..". Harry,check the

It's very frustrating to lose, and you've gotta say something.  Actually
it's not about winning or losing, it is how you play the game.  But when the
competition is magnified to this level, 99.9% of the people only care about
who wins or loses :-)

>schedule! Your team is in the playoffs and about to go on a long summer
>vacation on Sunday morning!

I think Buffalo will win in 6 -- it's not like Boston is getting blown away.
They lost 2 OT games -- with a different bounce, they could easily be up 2-1.

>Harry and his buttkisser Milbury will never admit that they screwed up
>in a major way when they brought in one of the dumbest people in the
>business,Brian Sutter. Sutter's playoff record as the head coach in St.Louis
>speaks for itself. The Blues really have a chance to advance to the
>second round this year...

Good point here.  Chicago's in deep trouble tonight.  The 'Hawks have a bad
past history of winning the division and losing early.  When they don't finish
1st, they do okay.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          1993's STREAKERS   "We do what comes naturally!
Patrick Division Semi's  -- PGH PENGUINS -- You see now, wait for the
PENGUINS 4, Devils 3     1991, 1992 STANLEY possibility, don't you see a
Penguins lead, 3-0       CUP CHAMPIONS :-)  strong resemblance..."-DG '89

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54029
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: Where are all the Bruins fans???

In article <1993Apr23.171510.20581@vicorp.com>, dan@vicorp.com (Dan Gauthier)
says:
>>even see just one little Boston fan post, 'cept for the Bruins fans that
>>aren't cocky. ...

>I guess the concept of a fan who is not cocky is something you couldn't
>possible understand, eh?

My sig has nothing to do with cockiness.  What you put in your sig has nothing
to do with your article, as I learned back in the fall, the hard way.

>Nah.  I doubt you really would.  You're just being a PROVOCATIVE SOB
>as usual with a large stick up your but.  Of course, I mean that in the

You mean 'butt' don't you?  Not but :-)

>nicest way.  :-)

Sure you do -- what??????????

>And just how much bragging did YOU do, "wobbie," on r.s.b.c after
>UMASS!!! beat your Quakers?

Two points, one what does r.s.b.c. have to do with hockey?  Secondly, UMASS
beat my Quakers???  Hello!!!  Earth here, are you responding???  We're not in
the Atlantic 10 (or 8 whatever you wanna call it), we're in the Big 10 now!!!
The A-10 was too weak for my Lady Lions -- they had to go to a more challenging
conference.  It didn't pay off as the Big East showed them a thing or too, but
I still posted on a regular basis and tracked all the women's scores with
reviews throughout the tournament.  It wasn't a reason to stop posting. :-)

>BTW.  Congratulations should go to the Sabres.  They are playing more

It's not over yet -- if anyone has a chance to come back in 4 games, I think
Boston can do it, but I still see Buffalo winning in 6.

>diciplined, and with more will to win.  They deserve it.

Agreed -- they're playing tremendous hockey right now.  Congatualtions on three
straight Buffalo.  It could very easily be 2-1 Boston, but Buffalo has come up
tough and a little luck.  (You never see a penalty in OT that doesn't have both
sides involved in a playoff game.  Never never never!)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          1993's STREAKERS   "We do what comes naturally!
Patrick Division Semi's  -- PGH PENGUINS -- You see now, wait for the
PENGUINS 4, Devils 3     1991, 1992 STANLEY possibility, don't you see a
Penguins lead, 3-0       CUP CHAMPIONS :-)  strong resemblance..."-DG '89

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54030
From: cobra@chopin.udel.edu (KING COBRA)
Subject: Re: ESPN

In article <1993Apr23.134038.17094@sei.cmu.edu> sad@sei.cmu.edu (Susan Dart) writes:
>
>If ESPN pisses you off, call them - they do respond to calls. Last night I
>called when they said they were cutting to baseball and we couldn't see the
>sudden-death overtime for the BUffalo game. Apparently they received enough
>calls so they waited for the overtime to finish before cutting away.
>
>Their phone number is 203-585-2000
>
>Susan Dart


  Well I think whenever ESPN covers the game they do a wonderful job. But
   what I don't understand is that they cut the OT just show some stupid
   baseball news which is not important at all. Then I waited for the scores
   to comeon Sportscenter, but they talk about Baseball, basketball and 
   football. Then they showed Penguine highlight and went back to stupid
   basketball. Finally they showed a highlight of the OT goal but that
   was like 30 sec. I think they should give more attention to NHl during
   the playoffs then talking about boring basketball games..

   I guess it is NHL's fault too for leaving ESPN. Hope things improve
   by next season...

   COBRA


-- 


*******************************************************************************
**   ___  ____  ____  ____  ____  **                                         **

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54031
From: mckee@cs.Buffalo.EDU (Douglas McKee)
Subject: Ghost from Sweeney's past


Wow, this guy seems to be out to prove something to his old team, Boston.
Which Sweeney you ask...well, of course Bob Sweeney, the one that Boston
let Buffalo get a hold of (they still have 2 Sweeneys which makes things
slightly confusing).  Game winner in OT in game 1, and another
BIG goal (seconds after Fuhr made 3 point blank saves -> this is why
Grant has 5 rings!!!) to put Buffalo ahead in the 3rd.  Yes, Neely countered
a minute later, but hadn't this course of Buffalo going ahead after being
tied and shutting down another few great scoring opportunities, I
think Boston would have notched their first win of the series.

Well, the Sabres haven't made it to the end of this series yet, but
I certainly feel they've got Boston right were they want them...actually,
they've got them in a position that neither Buffalo nor Boston felt
that would come about.  One more astronomical game by Fuhr, a few more
heroics by the rest of the team (this is a team sport afterall) and I
think Borque, Neely, Jouneau (sp?), and Company are gonna be swinging
a new stick (Weather is perfect for golf season) real soon.  I'm not
gonna waiger anything on this, because I've seen some really strange
things happen in both pro and college hockey.

Talking about golf...was that a hockey swing, golf swing or baseball
swing that Hawerchuck used in the last shot of the game that Khmylev
deflected in for the BIG ONE?  The whole OT (all 1 minute of it!) was a
tesiment to Buffalo's ability to really be persistent and grind it out
in the end (something they weren't necessarily in the regular season).  The
Sabres pushed hard and forced Borque to blatently take down Bodger in
the opening seconds.  I don't normally like penalties being called in
such ultra-critical points, but this was BLATENT.  Finally, the Sabres
won a faceoff (they weren't that hot in this dept the rest of the game)
when LaFontaine scooped at the puck 3 times.  When Hawerchuck took his
shot (quite a boomer, but Blue stopped this one) he took a few steps
over to get his own rebound and slapped at it again, without setting
it up.  I didn't realize it went in until the announcer started screaming,
"They score, THEY SCORE!!!".  The best was seeing LaFontaine jumping
up and down, skating a little bit, jumping some more, and then skating
over to Brad May who he jumped on.

Doug McKee
mckee@cs.buffalo.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54032
From: gjp@sei.cmu.edu (George Pandelios)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry-New Pens Annoucer?


In article <C5wIuy.D88.1@cs.cmu.edu>, lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico) writes:
|> Don Cherry announcing Penguins games.  Yeah, and (to quote Pgh's
|> goofy mayor) I'm the Queen of Sheba.

Well, Your Majesty, ;^), couldn't you just picture it?  Cherry starts doing
his first post-game interview with Barrasso;  Tommy gives him that little look
(like somebody crapped on his shoe) and then proceeds to give Don a
tonsilectomy with his Sher-Wood.  Now that you could put on pay-per-view!

Hope you had a good laugh!

George
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
  George J. Pandelios				Internet:  gjp@sei.cmu.edu
  Software Engineering Institute		usenet:	   sei!gjp
  4500 Fifth Avenue				Voice:	   (412) 268-7186
  Pittsburgh, PA 15213				FAX:	   (412) 268-5758
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Disclaimer:  These opinions are my own and do not reflect those of the
	     Software Engineering Institute, its sponsors, customers, 
	     clients, affiliates, or Carnegie Mellon University.  In fact,
	     any resemblence of these opinions to any individual, living
	     or dead, fictional or real, is purely coincidental.  So there.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54033
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Goalie masks

In article <C5sqz3.EG8@acsu.buffalo.edu> hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl) writes:

>>[...] and I'll give Fuhr's new one an honourable mention, although I haven't
>>seen it closely yet (it looked good from a distance!).  

>This is the new Buffalo one, the second since he's been with the
>Sabres?  I recall a price tag of over $700 just for the paint job on
>that mask, and a total price of almost $1500.  Ouch.  

Yeah, it's the second one.  And I believe that price too.  I've been trying
to get a good look at it on the Bruin-Sabre telecasts, and wow! does it ever
look good.  Whoever did that paint job knew what they were doing.  And given
Fuhr's play since he got it, I bet the Bruins are wishing he didn't have it:)

--

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54034
From: wscott@physics.ubc.ca (Bill Scott)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz) writes:


>While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash" that
>Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had his
>jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not positive.
>Does anyone remember/know his name?  What has happened to him since?  What
>about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?  Has this ever
>happened before in a hockey game?   

>Thanks,

>Carol
>Go Pens!
    
    I remember reading an article in Reader's digest many moons ago
 about a similar incident. During a minor leaque game a player neck was
 cut when the opponent he was back-checking tripped and his skakes
 flew up. In this case the victim's mask proved a hinderance since
 his face was protected and so he didn't bother with the
 usually instinctive reaction to protect his face/neck. A quick        
 thinking coach saved his life by applying direct pressure and using
 snow to contract the blood vessels (from what I can remember).
     
     Bill Scott (wscott@physics.ubc.ca)
     Go Jets Go.....down but not out.  


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54035
From: John Michael Santore <jsbh+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Hockey guest spots...

>Hi guys....
>        I'm looking to answe a bit of trivia.  What hockeplayers have
>appeared on major talk shows on TV (i.e., Letterman, Carson/Leno,
>Arsenio, etc.....i.e. shows of a national nature--include Canadian equivalents
>if you can think of any)?  This can include NHL, Olympic, and World Champion-
>ship players.  I'm pretty sure I've seen Gretzky and Lemieux, but I was
>wondering if there were any others...

I saw Messier and Leetch shooting at a camera on Letterman(?).  I
could have been any show though, since I watch NONE of those late
night shows very regularly.
					-John Santore

Philadelphia Flyers in '93-'94! 

=============================================================================
 ____________________                                
/                    \                   "We break the surface tension 
\_________     ____   \                   with our wild kinetic dreams"
/             /    \   \                        -Rush, Grand Designs
\_______     /  (*) )   )
/           / /\___/   /                 Go Philadelphia Flyers!
\_____     / /        /
/         /  \_______/                   John Santore (jsbh@andrew.cmu.edu)
\________/   
          
Rush-Yes-King Crimson-Emerson, Lake and Palmer-Marillion-Genesis (w/ Gabriel)
=============================================================================

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54036
From: franjion@spot.Colorado.EDU (John Franjione)
Subject: Re: Where's Roger?

duncan@ (Nicholas Duncan) writes:

>I really feel the need for a knowledgable hockey observer to explain
>this year's playoffs to me. I mean, the obviously superior Toronto team
>with the best center and the best goalie in the league keeps losing.
>What gives?

Unfortunately, Roger is now over at r.s.baseball spewing his expertise
(i.e. being a dickhead).  I guess he is afraid of posting anything
here, because he knows what to expect.
-- 
John Franjione
Department of Chemical Engineering
University of Colorado, Boulder
franjion@spot.colorado.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54037
From: htilney@vax.clarku.edu
Subject: RE: Don Cherry - Color Man for Pens Next year?

Isn't he the guy who took shots at Jagr and Ulf in a recent Sports
Illustrated? I'm not familiar with Cherry's work, and maybe he's known
for sarcasm, but I'd have to wonder about him doing commentary for the Pens.

Bart

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54038
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

In article <C5y3xD.Dox@acsu.buffalo.edu> hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl) writes:
>
>And Tuttle is no longer with the Blues, but I don't know where he is.
>Possibly in the IHL, but you'd best ask a Blues fan.
>
  Steve Tuttle was traded from the Blues to TB in the before the start of this
season along with Pat Jablonski, for future considerations. He played for
Milwaukee of the IHL, then got traded from TB to QUE along with Michel Mongeau.
He's currently playing with Halifax of the AHL.

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54039
From: clare@ssd.kodak.com (Bill Clare 726-9419)
Subject: Ulf crushes Valeri Zelepukin

That more or less says it.  I flicked the Penguins game on briefly and saw
Ulf cross-check Valeri in the face.  I am wondering if Don Cherry is going to
go off on this at all in coach's corner.

billc
-- 
Bill Clare, Eastman Kodak Company	Internet: clare@bissun.kodak.com
m/c 35416 --  901 Elmgrove Road		Phone:    (716) 726-9419
Rochester, New York 14653-5416
Any opinions expressed herein belong to me and not to my employer.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54040
From: pkester@hooville.mitre.org (Peter Kester)
Subject: Re: ESPN's (lack of) coverage

In article <1993Apr20.174439.7627@philabs.philips.com> jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio) writes:
>The worst thing is that this is exactly what I did last year.  I had the Rangers
>on MSG, and the two different games on SCNY and SCA on at the same time.  Yes,
>I'd rather have SC cover it, just for the amount of coverage.
>
So this year you had a game on SCNY, a game on SCA, a game on ESPN,
and if the Rangers hadn't crashed and burned, you would have had a
game on MSG.  What are you complaining about?

I seem to recall last year everyone complaining about SC coverage.  I
even remember Orioles' games being shown in the DC area instead of
hockey.  And what about when SC failed to show the conclusion of other
games because its feature game was over?  Sound familiar?

This year I'm getting twice the coverage.  I can see all the Caps
games *plus* the games ESPN shows.  I think it's great that hockey is
back on ESPN.  IMHO, they're doing a great job especially considering
the baseball contract they have to work around.

--

Peter Kester
pkester@mitre.org

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54041
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: POTVIN and HIS STICK

In article <2346575PS380.9.0@sscl.uwo.ca> 2346575PS380@sscl.uwo.ca writes:
>In article <1r68fs$fhc@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> hallg@yangtze.egr.msu.edu (The Terminator) writes:
>>From: hallg@yangtze.egr.msu.edu (The Terminator)
>>Felix Potvin deserves to have the sh&$ kicked out of him.  If there is anyone
>>that he should be hitting with his stick, its his pussy defensemen who can't
>>seem to move big Dino Ciccerelli (5'10" 180 lbs) out from in front of the net.
>>
>>Obviously Toronto has realized that they are overmatched by the Wings and must
>>rely on trying to antagonize the superior Red Wings with cheap shots.  I prefer
>>to watch hockey than seeing shots of Felix Potvin slashing and spearing Dino
>>Ciccerelli standing in front of the net.  HE HAS EVERY RIGHT TO STAND IN
>>FRONT OF THE NET, JUST NOT IN THE CREASE!

Yes, he does.  BUT, the goalie sure as hell doesn't want him there!  When
I played roller hockey (boy do I miss those days) as a goalie, I would
scream at my defense to clear guys out of the slot.  I don't care if he's
in the crease or not, get him the hell away from me so I can see the ball!
(Yes, roller hockey, remember)  And if there was nobody around to clear
the slot, then I'd do it myself by pushing the offending player--*hard*. 
I *hate* people in my way when I'm the goalie, and I am sure Felix does
too.  I should say that I didn't see the incident, so if Potvin really
swung the stick big time, then that's not right, but he can move people
out of the way.  He's a player on the ice too, you know.  :-)

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!
     In this corner				LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
     Weighing in at almost every weight imaginable . . . 
     Life, and all that surrounds it.		     -- Blues Traveler, 1993

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54042
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Where's the knowledgeable observer?

In <franjion.735590256@spot.Colorado.EDU> franjion@spot.Colorado.EDU (John Franjione) writes:

>duncan@ (Nicholas Duncan) writes:

>>I really feel the need for a knowledgable hockey observer to explain
>>this year's playoffs to me. I mean, the obviously superior Toronto team
>>with the best center and the best goalie in the league keeps losing.
>>What gives?

>Unfortunately, Roger is now over at r.s.baseball spewing his expertise
>(i.e. being a dickhead).  I guess he is afraid of posting anything
>here, because he knows what to expect.

It is indeed nice to have fans that are concerned about the dearth of
disputatious dissertation linked to my hiatus.  Have simply been too
damned busy lately to keep you lads and lassies entertained.  You can
be sure, however, that I will somehow manage to find time to woof if 
the Leafs give just cause. 

And let's all try to keep people's names (especially mine) out of the
subject headers.  I, for one, neither seek nor enjoy such a cheap form
of notoriety.

One thing you can be assured of, however, is this: the Leafs are the
best of all the teams in the league that have allowed 12 goals in 2 
games.


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54043
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: Pens fans reactions

Richard J Coyle (gomer+@pitt.edu) wrote:

: That's not inner calm.  It's boredom, and it's being spoiled.  The Arena's
: been as quiet as a church on many nights this year; too many of us just
: take winning for granted.  It's been seemingly forever since the team
: lost, and we've forgotten what it's like to feel real excitement and
: surprise at victory.

At least last night there was some excitement. The Pens 
didn't have it wrapped up before the game was half over like 
the previous two games. I'm not sure if NJ just rose up and 
played better or if the Penguins just started to play down 
somewhat. Probably it was somewhere in between. New Jersey 
seemed much more aggressive last night in the Pens end. They 
did much more swarming around, which at least kept an 
element of suspense in the game. No question that Billington 
helped make it more interesting also. Claude Lemieux didn't 
help the cause any though, with his ejection early in the 
game. So, who's going to start in the Devils goal for the 
"final" game Sunday? ;-) Sorry. I couldn't help myself.

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54044
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: Bowman needs credit

Gerald Olchowy (golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca) wrote:

: Bowman is the genius...Johnson isn't.  Bowman is a great coach...Johnson,
: a very good one.  However, Bowman is really not a modern coach, and
: Patrick's solution of having him only run the team on game days, and
: delegate most of the day-to-day responsibity to the assistants is
: a shrewd managerial decision on Patrick's part.  

IMHO Bowman is the perfect coach for this group of players at 
this time. Johnson was the perfect coach two years ago for his 
group of players. I would say we have been very lucky here in 
Pittsburgh that the order these coaches came in was this one. 
(Excluding the unfortunate circumstances which brought about the 
change.) With the immense talent on the Penguins roster this 
year, a tougher Bowman keeps the egos in check. Johnson on the 
other hand, was able to inspire the younger, inexperienced players 
to new heights. Both coaches have / had different strengths. Both 
of which came at exactly the right time. 

Another person also mentioned that Bowman is the perfect coach 
for this time since nobody can argue with his decisions. How can 
you argue with the coach with the best record in hockey anyway? 
Playing for a great coach like that demands respect which also 
keeps the egos in check. 

Just a couple of ideas.

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54045
From: aubin@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Jean Paul Aubin)
Subject: Stats

Hello,

Could someone tell me if and where i could find faceoff stats for the
91/92 season and later on the 92/93 (i think its to early to get it now).

Thanks a lot

JP

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54046
From: brifre1@ac.dal.ca
Subject: Re: Trivia question

In article <1993Apr23.102811.623@sei.cmu.edu>, caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz) writes:
> 
> While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash" that
> Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had his
> jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not positive.
> Does anyone remember/know his name?  What has happened to him since?  What
> about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?  Has this ever
> happened before in a hockey game?   
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Carol
> Go Pens!

It was Clint Malarchuk

Whatever happened to him, anyway?

Barfly
Go *sigh* Leafs *cry*

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54047
From: John Michael Santore <jsbh+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Goalie mask poll update 4/22/93

> Now here this:  Anyone voting for John Blue for best goalie mask poll will be
> shot on site, no questions asked ;-)

> But c'mon.. it's a black mask, with yellow paint along the opening..  how
> totally plain vanilla!  eeuu..

Heh, someone mentioned Tommy Soderstrom (Flyers) for the besk mask poll
too (in the mentioned below part).  All he has is a plain white helmet
with a big cage.
I found this pretty amusing.

					-John Santore

Philadelphia Flyers in '93-'94!

=============================================================================
 ____________________                                
/                    \                   "We break the surface tension 
\_________     ____   \                   with our wild kinetic dreams"
/             /    \   \                        -Rush, Grand Designs
\_______     /  (*) )   )
/           / /\___/   /                 Go Philadelphia Flyers!
\_____     / /        /
/         /  \_______/                   John Santore (jsbh@andrew.cmu.edu)
\________/   
          
Rush-Yes-King Crimson-Emerson, Lake and Palmer-Marillion-Genesis (w/ Gabriel)
=============================================================================

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54048
From: tmenner@sei.cmu.edu (Thomas Menner)
Subject: Hockey Equip. Recommendations?

Hey man! -

Having spent the past season learning to skate and having played a
couple of sessions of mock hockey, I'm ready to invest in hockey
equipment (particularly since I will be taking summer 'hockey
lessons').  However, I am completely and profoundly ignorant when it
comes to hockey equipment.  I've checked out local stores and looked
at catalogs, but I was hoping to solicit opinions/suggestions before
actually plunking down any money.  Having played football in high
school and college I at least have that equipment as a basis for
comparison.  But for example what are the advantages/disadvantages to
different kinds of shoulder pads and pants/girdles?  Are there any
notoriously bad or unsafe brands or styles?  etc.  So any suggestions
or comments would be greatly appreciated.


Tom Menner    	   	     	  I    When you're swimming in the creek
Software Engineering Institute	  I    And an eel bites your cheek,
Carnegie Mellon University   	  I    That's a moray!
Pittsburgh, PA	   	     	  I    	    - Fabulous Furry Freak Bros.




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54049
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: ESPN's (lack of) coverage

pkester@hooville.mitre.org (Peter Kester) writes:
>jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio) writes:
>>The worst thing is that this is exactly what I did last year.
>>Yes, I'd rather have SC cover it, just for the amount of coverage.
>>
>So this year you had a game on SCNY, a game on SCA, a game on ESPN,
>and if the Rangers hadn't crashed and burned, you would have had a
>game on MSG.  What are you complaining about?

The problem is that (by no fault of ESPN) ongoing games are not
covered 'til the final horn sounds.  With two channels, SCNY and SCA,
late-finishing games (up to Pacific time) and overtimes elsewhere will
kick in at the end of local coverage.  If SCNY is blocked by the Mets,
there is still some hockey on SCA (SCNY Plus).

With an ESPN 2, the current situation would be alleviated.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54050
From: spiegel@sgi501.msd.lmsc.lockheed.com (Mark Spiegel)
Subject: Re: SHARKS:  Kingston Fired!!!

In article <1993Apr23.063205.26192@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>In article <1993Apr22.212219.23130@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com> spiegel@sgi501.msd.lmsc.lockheed.com (Mark Spiegel) writes:
>>In article <1993Apr21.234022.2880@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>
>>	I said Gund will have to open his *CHECKBOOK*, I didn't say give up
>>	any draft picks or promising talent.  If we could have gotten
>>	Murphy for the $2M great, but I agree the Sharks shouldn't give
>>	up young talent or early round draft picks.  I listed Chelios et al
>>	only to indicate the *TYPE* of player I think the Sharks need to pick 
>>	up.  The rules on signing free agents less than 30 years old puts
>>	a big restriction on what the Sharks can pick up.  However, I do
>>	believer they need to pick up some players who will add toughness
>>	to the team.
>
>But you have to remember that you're unlikely to get any real quality free
>agents who do not require compensation.  The Sharks tried, with Makarov, who
>was probably the top of the class among non-compensation free agents, but even
>he probably wouldn't have helped too much.
>
	Don't expect to get top quality, just some toughness.  I don't
	view Makarov as a player who would add toughness.

>>>Size hopefully won't be much of a worry next year.  Alexander Cherbayev and
>>>Michal Sykora have agreed to multi-year contracts, and it appears that Mike
>>>Rathje will also sign soon.  All three are pretty big.
>>
>>	Size alone isn't enough.  We all know how much fear Kolstad (6-6)
>>	struck in the eyes of opponents NOT!
>
>Well, Rathje and Sykora are both highly touted prospects, unlike Kolstad...
>And Cherbayev was initially supposed to play for the Russian WC Team.  (Anybody
>know what happened there?)  That means that he's likely to be good enough.
>

	Nelson, you're confusing skill and toughness.


>>>McGill/Hammond -> Johan Garpenlov.  Would you really rather have those two
>>>instead of Johan?
>>
>>	By your logic then you enjoy having Falloon and Ozolinsh on 
>>	injured reserve?
>
>By your logic then you think that if the Sharks had kept McGill and Hammond
>that you can guarantee that Falloon and Ozolinsh wouldn't have gotten hurt?
>(Think again; there was a chance that McGill would have caused Ozolinsh to get
>stuck at KC, and as you know, Hammond is worthless, and McGill is almost
>worthless.)
>
>>>Well, Wilson, maybe, but I don't think Falloon and Ozolinsh were really
>>>injured on cheapshots.
>>
>>	who said they were?   
>
>If they weren't then, I don't see any justification that having McGill and
>Hammond around would prevent their injuries.  If the injuries of Falloon and
>Ozolinsh were purely accidental, then what could McGill and Hammond have done
>to prevent them?
>
	Hey, get off the McGill/Hammond thing.  I'm no fan of either. My
	point is that last year the Sharks had toughness that was missing
	this year.  This year we had more skill, I'm all for that, but
	if your skill players keep getting beat up and injured they
	can't do you much good.  Whether it's a cheap shot or not you
	can't let the other teams push you around.  The 1992-93 Sharks
	simply got pushed around to much.  Other teams knew this.
	They knew they could aggressively check the Sharks and not
	pay for it.   Adding some players in the off season who will
	add some toughness to the team will help insure that next
	season other teams will be more hesistant to vigorously 
	check our skill players, or to take cheap shots.  It doesn't
	guarantee no injuries (nothing does), but it's something the
	Sharks can do to reduce the number of injuries.  

	mark

 just say

 #####  #     #    #    ######  #    #   #####           ____                  
#     # #     #   # #   #     # #   #   #     #            -_ --__             
#       #     #  #   #  #     # #  #    #                    \    --_          
 #####  ####### #     # ######  ###      #####                \      -_        
      # #     # ####### #   #   #  #          #                |       \       
#     # #     # #     # #    #  #   #   #     #    __________ /         \_____ 
 #####  #     # #     # #     # #    #   #####  ___________ /            \_____
______________________________________________________________________________
Mark Spiegel  spiegel@lmsc.lockheed.com   Cow Palace:108/K/8  Epicenter: ?



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54051
Subject: Re: Hockey guest spots...
From: Paul H. Pimentel <PP3903A@auvm.american.edu>

Two years ago Mark Messier appeared on David Letterman the summer he signed wit
h the Rangers.  I remember he and Mike Gartner taking slapshots at the camera,
 one finally was a bullseye and the screen went blank.  It was funny if you saw
 it, I guess.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54052
From: joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm)
Subject: Re: Lemieux's Getting the Hart... Jeez I hope not!

In article <22APR93.02956996.0062@UNBVM1.CSD.UNB.CA> F1HH@UNB.CA (Patrick Walker) writes:
>Who should get the Hart?
...
>Mario.  Jesus NO!  It's bad enough for me just to utter the word
> without being extremely sick and pissed off.  They guy's a luber
...
>ten minutes now... Give me a f--king break with this Mario is the
>best player ever.  What!  Did Gretzky die?  I wish Bobby Clarke
...
>Not that I condone violence, but I'll make an exception for Mario.
>But if Mario is going to complain about being hit, someone should
>give him and Scotty something REAL to complain about.
>Sorry to ramble.  As you can see I hate Mario.
>Pat Walker
>UNB

	"Why don't you kill him Beav"

	"Well...I dunnow Eddie...I might get in trouble"

	"Here's a gun Beav, shoot him, Beav"

	"Well...ok Eddie"

BLAM BLAM

	Wally: "You're in trouble now Beave"






Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54053
From: joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm)
Subject: Re: Ranger Fans?????

In article <1993Apr22.101356.1@eagle.wesleyan.edu> kwolfer@eagle.wesleyan.edu writes:
...
>
>As far as the Stanley Cup goes I think there's only one team that can test
>Pittsburgh and that's Detroit.  This would be the most entertaining and hard
>fought series.  Mario is amazing!
>
>Kurt

That is if Mario makes it.

Pat Walker sounds like the type that would bring an AK-47 to a game
and take pot shots at Mario. ("stand STILL...dam sunavbich...HMFF")


Joseph Stiehm

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54054
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: ESPN

In article <0fq0VIC00WB8RQ019D@andrew.cmu.edu> ch3g+@andrew.cmu.edu (Chad Nicholas Hunter) writes:
>I live in Pittsburgh (yes i'm a pens fan) where hockey gets a lot
>of coverage.  i can only imagine how a caps fan residing in Texas
>must feel.

	Or a Caps fan residing in Atlanta, where they DONT EVEN TELL
THE F&@(*@CKING PLAYOFF SCORES ON THE NEWS!!!!!

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54055
From: cal2d@csissun11.ee.Virginia.EDU (Craig Allen Lorie)
Subject: Re: Devils and Islanders tiebreaker????

According to the hockey gurus over at ESPN, should the Islanders win tonite
the two teams will have the same record, but the Devils will be playing the
Penguins.  This is because the Islanders have won the season series against
the Devils.  I think the rules for deciding a tie breaker include:

1.  season series
2.  goals against
3.  goals for

in this order (correct me if I'm wrong).  Anyone have anything to add?

Craig

Go Islanders!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54056
From: mjr4u@Virginia.EDU ("Matthew J. Rush")
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

d_jaracz@oz.plymouth.edu  writes:
> In article <93106.092246DLMQC@CUNYVM.BITNET> Harold Zazula <DLMQC@CUNYVM.BITNET> writes:
> >I was watching the Detroit-Minnesota game last night and thought I saw an
> >octopus on the ice after Ysebaert scored to tie the game at two. What gives?
> 
> No no no!!!  It's a squid!  Keep the tradition alive!  (Kinda like the
> fish at UNH games....)
> 
Actually, the way I understand it, it is an octapus.
Apparently, a number of years ago, a fan threw an octapus on
the ice and the announcer said "Octapi will not occupy the ice"
or something like that, and it's happened ever since.  The fans
cheer those who pick up the dead octapus with their hands, and
boo those who use a shovel.

Matt at UVA

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54057
From: v128r82w@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Ralph L d'Ambrosio)
Subject: Re: Devils and Islanders tiebreaker????

In article <C5LDI2.77u@odin.corp.sgi.com>, enolan@sharkbite.esd.sgi.com (Ed Nolan) writes...
>If the Islanders beat the Devils tonight, they would finish with
>identical records.  Who's the lucky team that gets to face the Penguins
>in the opening round?   Also, can somebody list the rules for breaking
>ties.
I am not sure about the tie breaker rules. However, I think if the Islanders win
(Oh God, Please, Please let them win), the Islanders win the series against 
NJ and advances to third.

********************************************************************************
Of course no one asked me, I always interject my opinions on maters I have no
concern over.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Go Islanders!!!!! (I mean come on, the Jets were bad enough
Go Jets for '93

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54058
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat


In article 1qmtd1INNr1l@iskut.ucs.ubc.ca, gibson@nukta.geop.ubc.ca (Brad Gibson) writes:

<In response to a debate about who has has a better season- Jagr of Francis>

I think Jagr did he probably had a better point per minute ice time- stats
don't exist to properly analyze this and he had a substancially better +/-.


>  Actually, what I think has become more evident, is that you are determined to
>  flaunt your ignorance at all cost.  Jagr did not have a better season than
>  Francis ... to suggest otherwise is an insult to those with a modicum of
>  hockey knowledge.  Save your almost maniacal devotion to the almighty
>  plus/minus ... it is the most misleading hockey stat available.
>
>  Until the NHL publishes a more useful quantifiable statistic including ice
>  time per game and some measure of its "quality" (i.e., is the player put out
>  in key situations like protecting a lead late in the game; is he matched up
>  against the other team's top one or two lines; short-handed, etc), I would
>  much rather see the +/- disappear altogether instead of having its dubious
>  merits trumpeted by those with little understanding of its implications.

+/- is a useful statistic.  If a player is on the ice when his team scores a
lot of goals and only allows a few goals, he must be doing something right.
It is especially useful to compare between teammates- as they play for the
same team and should have roughly similar +/- ratings if they are equally
good players.  It can be adjusted- with varying degrees of success to compare
between players on different teams.

I agree it would be nice for the NHL to keep more statistics- but how useful
are the ones that you suggest??  Total ice time would be very useful- it is
a missing stat in Jagr vs Francis arguments from before.  Somehow measuring
the quality of ice time as you suggest would be useless.  It would be a
better stat for evaluating coaching- ie are the players given quality ice
time actually their talented ones?  A very good player could be given low
amounts of quality ice time because of team depth or a stupid coach who
doesn't recognize his talent and a very bad player could be given lots of
quality ice time because of a lack of team depth or a stupid coach that
thinks he is an effective player.  This stat would be much more flawed than
+/- and almost no conclusions could be drawn regarding player talent.

+/- is a useful stat.  It is quite useful in evaluating player talent.
You are the one displaying ignorance because of your unwillingness to see
that being on the ice when goals are scored but not when they are allowed
is a very positive thing- and should be evaluated as such.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54059
From: klaty@procyon.engin.umich.edu (Brad Alan Klaty)
Subject: Re: POTVIN and HIS STICK


So if Potvin can pound on Dino, what happens when Dino pounds 
on him?  If Dino gets his legs slashed, can he slash Potvin
in return?  This year at a UM-LSSU hockey game, a UM player
was called for a slash when he hit the goalie's glove with
his stick.  Is that slashing, while hitting someone's ankles
isn't?  How do the refs know what to call?  Do the goalies
get more liberties than other players?


				Brad

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54060
From: joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm)
Subject: Re: Hockey guest spots...

sclark@epas.utoronto.ca (Susan Clark) writes:
> I'm looking to answer a bit of trivia.  What hockeplayers have
> appeared on major talk shows on TV [...examples deleted...]
> I'm pretty sure I've seen Gretzky and Lemieux, but I was
> wondering if there were any others...

Michael J. Fox was on Letterman about a year ago (or two) during the 
playoffs as a celebrity hockey player for the Bruins.  While he's not
exactly a NHLer he did mention that the Bruins wanted to break Ulfie's
legs (or something like that) in response to the Neely incident.  It
was quite amusing, as one of the few Letterman viewers who actually knew
what he was talking about.  Anybody know who the Pens celebrity hockey
player is?  Michael Douglas (aka Michael Keaton)?

Joseph Stiehm

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54061
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

What sadist brought up this vein about Malarchuk?  When I saw what
happened I wanted to throw up, and at the same time I was devastated,
since I thought that Malarchuk wouldn't survive.  BTW, I believe he picked
up an alcohol problem after (before?) the incident.

To radically change the subject, the Caps must be having nightmares about
the Isles in overtime in the playoffs.  Have they *ever* beaten the
Islanders in a playoff OT game?  This is lunacy.  The Caps are such a
sorry team in the playoffs, they consistently choke against opponents who
they should be beating.  Losing two OT games in a row is not coincidence,
it's evidence of the choke factor.

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!
     In this corner				LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
     Weighing in at almost every weight imaginable . . . 
     Life, and all that surrounds it.		     -- Blues Traveler, 1993

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54062
From: LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall)
Subject: Re: Where's Roger?

In article <franjion.735590256@spot.Colorado.EDU>
franjion@spot.Colorado.EDU (John Franjione) writes:
 
>Unfortunately, Roger is now over at r.s.baseball spewing his expertise
>(i.e. being a dickhead).  I guess he is afraid of posting anything
>here, because he knows what to expect.
>--
>John Franjione
>Department of Chemical Engineering
>University of Colorado, Boulder
>franjion@spot.colorado.edu
 
 
 
 Hey, we could start a new game on the net.  It's called 'Where's Roger?'
It's similiar to 'Where's Waldo?' but instead of finding Waldo in a picture
of people, we try to find Roger in a newsgroup on the net.
 I predict that he'll be in r.s.basketball.pro next.
 
 
 
Laurie Marshall
Wayne State University
Detroit, Michigan
Go Wings!!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54063
From: joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm)
Subject: Re: TV Coverage - NHL to blame!

In article <1993Apr23.164919.43442@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu> sjg3@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (STEVEN JAY GIBBLE) writes:
...
>    Mario is the Michael Jordan of hockey.  All that fucker has to do is fall
>    on the ice and the closet guy to him gets at least 2.  Last night in the
>    3rd game between NJ and Pitt, he was being pushed while skating across the
>    front of the goal while trying to get a shot off.  The guy on him was
>    doing a good job, so he got off a weak shot, but then he decided to fall
>    to the ice. Then the fucking ref(Van Helloamend?) called the guy for
>    holding.  They replayed the play, and my roomate(who is clueless about
>    hockey) wanted to know what the NJ guy did to get a call, because it was so fucking obvious the NJ player
>    had both hands on his stick, and no, he did not trip him.  It is simple,
>    Mario gets touched, he falls to the ice, automatic 2.  But the thing that
>    really pissed me off is, Pitt scored the 3rd or 4th goal, I don't remember,
>    on the resulting PP and
>    eventually won 4-3.  His diving/calls makes a HUGE difference in the
>    outcome of a game.
...
>    All agreeing or disagreeing replies are welcomed.
>
>    Steve





We must have been watching two different games.   The Devil had one hand on
Mario's elbow and pulling the elbow caused Mario to fall so the call was
appropriate.

Using clueless people to substantiate your claims doesn't give me a lot of
confidence in your call either.  Next time consider getting a second opinion
from a clueful observer.  Or maybe all those available disagreed.







Joseph Stiehm







Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54064
From: mblumens@itsmail1.hamilton.edu (Mary Blumenstock)
Subject: Re: Ranger Fans?????

>In article <1993Apr22.101356.1@eagle.wesleyan.edu> kwolfer@eagle.wesleyan.edu writes:
>I for one am happy about the Ranger's hiring of Keenan.  It's too bad that they
>

I agree that Keenan is an excellent choice.  Did you see Mike
Lupica's column in Sunday's news?  My sentiments exactly.  I
think he just may be the one to instill some hunger and fire
into their hearts next season.  Either that or he's going to 
be kicking alot of butt!

>Reading through most of these hockey news I don't see many Ranger fans writing.   

I'm here, but am new to this group and have been keeping fairly
quiet (you know, doing the "lurking" thing).  I don't have a
sense how many Rangers fans there are on the list either.  I 
am a die-hard Ranger fan (I guess I have to be - I sat in the
Garden throughout the Penguins' - led by Mario's 5 goals - decimation 
of them on 4/9), but am sick at the abundance of talent that has
been totally untapped, and the lack of heart displayed this
season.

>
>I have some final questions about the way the team was handled in that last
>dreadful stretch.
>
>1. Knowing they needed offensive help from the blueline, why didn't we see Mike
>Hurlbut, who played pretty well when he was called up when Leetch first went
>down?
>

Hurlbut was injured for quite a while.  I'm not sure, but I
think he may have recovered in time for the playoff run, and
if so, like you, question why he wasn't used.

>
>>2. Why????!!!!! is Joe Kocur playing every night?  He is not Bob Probert who is
>>tough but also can play.
>>

I believe Kocur was used, in many instances, for his intimidation 
factor.  Granted, he seemed to get an awful lot of ice time for 
that reason alone, but you have to realize that when a team is
not doing any REAL physical intimidation (I'd like to have a nickel 
for every time J.D. said 'They've got to take the body more'), 
you've got to at least have some illusions ;-(

>3. How come Paul Broten is relegated to street clothes for the end of the
>season.  At least he plays with some heart and character, draws penalties and
>plays 110% when he's on the ice.  Was he in the doghouse for some reason?

I agree and I don't know.

>4. Joe Cirella?????!!!!  Enough said!
>

Sorry, I don't agree with you here.  I think Joey C. did a good
job filling in when he was asked to.  I can't imagine that it's
easy going from near 0 ice time to being a full timer.  I don't
seem to remember him turning the puck over at the blue line too
much, or failing to clear the zone.  He worked hard, and at
least didn't make any rookie mistakes.  As he said himself in an
interview, he can only give what he has.  and he did.  

>
>Ranger fans may be suffering but we're some of the most loyal, unlike Islander
>fans who only show up when the team wins.
>

Absolutely.  I think attendance at the Garden was better on the
last day of the season, than any average night for the
Islanders.

> 
>>fought series.  Mario is amazing!
>

The man is awesome.  In a way, I'm enjoying the playoffs more,
now that the Rangers aren't in them.  I can really appreciate
all the glory Mario is getting without 'hating' him because he's
on the opposing team.  He deserves it all, as far as I'm
concerned.

		- Mary

===============================================================
Mary Blumenstock               mblumens@itsmail1.hamilton.edu
Hamilton College 
Clinton, N.Y.                    GO RANGERS!! (next year...)



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54065
From: jennifer@netcom.com (Jennifer!)
Subject: Re: TV Coverage - NHL to blame!

sjg3@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (STEVEN JAY GIBBLE) writes:


>    The tv coverage of the playoffs is fucking ridicules.  Overtime time games
>    that are not shown?  What the hell kind of shit is this?  If that would
>    have happened to the Flyers(if they were in the damn playoffs to begin
>    with) while I was watching, I would have gone throught the roof!

For those of you who read TV Guide, there's an article in next week's
SPORTSVIEW concerning the NHL and major network broadcasting. Pretty
interesting.

- Jennifer


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54066
From: jbarrett@aludra.usc.edu (Jonathan Barrett)
Subject: Re: Where's the knowledgeable observer?

maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:

>One thing you can be assured of, however, is this: the Leafs are the
>best of all the teams in the league that have allowed 12 goals in 2 
>games.


>-- 

>cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
>                                           "So many morons...
>rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Roger, you should check your facts before posting! The Kings have 
conceded 12 goals in 2 games. 

Jon



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54067
From: allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan)
Subject: Re: Ulf and all...

drozinst@db.erau.edu (Drozinski Tim) writes:

>As if an aluminum stick being taken to Ulf's head is gonna solve the problem
>with violence in the sport of hockey.  How the hell can you say the guy is
>a goon and justify it, with your back-assward mentality?  Saying that hurting
>a player will solve anyone's problems is asinine.  New rules and a new 
>referee system need to be instituted.  Right now, too many of the real goons
>get away with too much, because the ref is watching the play (or supposed to be:I've seen Koharski and Van Hellemond, to name a few, with their heads up their  asses on a few calls) rather than keeping an eye on the goofballs behind the 
>play.  Even if the linesmen were able to call all penalties, it would be an
>improvement.

Unfortunately, that is the way the league is heading... You can't fight,
so the only way to retaliate against someone is with a cheap shot when
the ref isn't looking. Ulf has brought this to a high level... Players
stuck in the past (like Neely) who prefer fights to cheap shots
are at a disadvantage in the new system.

Lets face it, A cheap shot (like high sticking) is a very effective
method... It is easier to hide from the refs, has a better chance of
causing injury, and you can draw people into fights that way. I don't
like it, but that's the way the league is going.

By the way, there was a rather good hit by Ulf in the last Penguin-Devil
game. Managed to hit the NJ player in the face with a stick. (Must have been a
legal hit... After all, Ulf is a clean player and is allowed to do
things like that.)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54068
From: allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan)
Subject: Oiler's rumour - Team moving? Press conference next week


I heard a story on the local sports news broadcast in Edmonton.
Oiler owner Peter Pocklington will be holding a press conference
next week. While the exact details are not known, it is believed
to concern the Oiler's future.

Rumour has it that Pocklington signed a tentative lease arrangement
with Copps Collesium in Hamilton. During the press conference,
Pocklington may announce the deal. It is quite possible that
the deal may simply be a way to force Edmonton Northlands to
renegotiate the Oiler lease on the stadium.

Northlands has offered to buy the Oilers for $65 million earlier,
but the offer was rejected immediately by Pocklington.

As for me, my opinion is divided... Edmonton has been fairly
supportive of the Oilers. Even though they're a small market
team, they had many sellouts in the 80s. Even with the problems
that the team had this year, they still brought in more fans
than many teams in larger cities did. On the other hand, if
the team does move, there is no place more deserving than
Hamilton. Of course, how would that affect the grand
realignment scheme of Bettman? 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54069
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Tue, April 20, 1993

NY Islanders                     1 1 2 0 1--5
Washington                       0 2 2 0 0--4
First period
     1, NY Islanders, Turgeon 1 (King, Thomas) 13:14.
Second period
     2, Washington, Hunter 3 (Johansson, Miller) 6:33.
     3, NY Islanders, Turgeon 2 (Thomas, Vaske) 12:36.
     4, Washington, Hunter 4 (Johansson, Carpenter) pp, 16:51.
Third period
     5, NY Islanders, Hogue 1 (unassisted) 3:31.
     6, Washington, Khristich 2 (Cavallini, Bondra) 7:16.
     7, NY Islanders, Ferraro 2 (Flatley, Hogue) 14:50.
     8, Washington, Hunter 5 (Johansson, Khristich) pp, 19:57.
First overtime
     No scoring.
Second overtime
     9, NY Islanders, Mullen 1 (Ferraro, Flatley) 14:50.

NY Islanders: 5    Power play: 5-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Ferraro            1    1    2
Flatley            0    2    2
Hogue              1    1    2
King               0    1    1
Mullen             1    0    1
Thomas             0    2    2
Turgeon            2    0    2
Vaske              0    1    1

Washington: 4    Power play: 5-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bondra             0    1    1
Carpenter          0    1    1
Cavallini          0    1    1
Hunter             3    0    3
Johansson          0    3    3
Khristich          1    1    2
Miller             0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Montreal                         0 0 1--1
Quebec                           3 0 1--4
First period
     1, Quebec, Leschyshyn 1 (Kamensky, Sakic) pp, 4:19.
     2, Quebec, Young 2 (Lapointe) 11:41.
     3, Quebec, Young 3 (Lapointe, Duchesne) 13:56.
Second period
     No scoring.
Third period
     4, Montreal, Bellows 2 (Odelein) 11:05.
     5, Quebec, Lapointe 1 (Ricci) en, 19:23.

Quebec: 4    Power play: 2-1   Special goals:  pp: 1  en: 1  Total: 2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Duchesne           0    1    1
Kamensky           0    1    1
Lapointe           1    2    3
Leschyshyn         1    0    1
Ricci              0    1    1
Sakic              0    1    1
Young              2    0    2

Montreal: 1    Power play: 1-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bellows            1    0    1
Odelein            0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
New Jersey                       0 0 0--0
Pittsburgh                       2 4 1--7
First period
     1, Pittsburgh, McEachern 1 (Francis, Taglianetti) 15:09.
     2, Pittsburgh, Lemieux 3 (Samuelsson, Barrasso) sh, 17:41.
Second period
     3, Pittsburgh, Tocchet 2 (Stevens, Samuelsson) 3:48.
     4, Pittsburgh, Jagr 2 (Francis, Ramsey) 12:39.
     5, Pittsburgh, Stevens 1 (Francis, Murphy) pp, 15:43.
     6, Pittsburgh, McEachern 2 (Daniels, Mullen) 16:56.
Third period
     7, Pittsburgh, Mullen 1 (Francis, Barrasso) 17:42.

Pittsburgh: 7    Power play: 4-1   Special goals:  pp: 1  sh: 1  Total: 2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Barrasso           0    2    2
Daniels            0    1    1
Francis            0    4    4
Jagr               1    0    1
Lemieux            1    0    1
McEachern          2    0    2
Mullen             1    1    2
Murphy             0    1    1
Ramsey             0    1    1
Samuelsson         0    2    2
Stevens            1    1    2
Taglianetti        0    1    1
Tocchet            1    0    1

New Jersey: 0    Power play: 5-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------
Buffalo                          2 1 1--4
Boston                           0 0 0--0
First period
     1, Buffalo, Presley 1 (unassisted) sh, 4:27.
     2, Buffalo, Wood 1 (Moller, Sweeney) pp, 8:07.
Second period
     3, Buffalo, Mogilny 3 (Lafontaine) 5:03.
Third period
     4, Buffalo, Hawerchuk 1 (Carney, Smehlik) pp, 14:48.

Buffalo: 4    Power play: 4-2   Special goals:  pp: 2  sh: 1  Total: 3
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Carney             0    1    1
Hawerchuk          1    0    1
Lafontaine         0    1    1
Mogilny            1    0    1
Moller             0    1    1
Presley            1    0    1
Smehlik            0    1    1
Sweeney            0    1    1
Wood               1    0    1

Boston: 0    Power play: 5-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54070
From: ee152fcs@sdcc15.ucsd.edu (Bjorn Karlsson)
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 20

In article <1993Apr21.073134.5117@ericsson.se> etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson) writes:
>
> 1993 World Championships in Germany:
> ====================================

Is there any games being shown here in the US from the WC???

Thanks

mc



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54071
From: Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: ABC coverage


Gerald Olchowy writes:

>Clement, although he has a pleasant personality (aggravatingly pleasant
>in my opinion), is a terrible
>analyst, because he is almost alway wrong...the prototypical example
>being New Jersey's first goal last Sunday.
> 
>I grew up with Dick Irvin doing color beside Danny Gallivan...I knew
>did Irvin, Dick Irvin was a friend of mine...Bill Clement you aren't
>any Dick Irvin.
> 
>As long as the teams involved do not include the US national team or
>the New York Rangers, I'd take John Davidson over Bill Clement any
day.

Personality means something to me.  That is exactly why I like Clement
(and Emrick).  On the other hand, JD is a pompous, bull-headed, arrogant
know-it-all.  He's a real turn-off (which is exactly what I do when he's
on).  One complaint I do have about Clement is that he sometimes talks
too much.  If I wanted that I'd listen to Tim McGarver doing a baseball
game.

Mom.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54072
From: mikkot@romulus.math.jyu.fi (Mikko Tarkiainen)
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 18

In article <1993Apr21.085435.6895@ericsson.se> etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson) writes:

OK, here is my try:

> The Czech Republic
> ------------------
>
> Goaltenders:	 1. Petr Briza		(Finland somewhere, right?)
				        Lukko, Finland
					(look at the colors of his mask)
					              
> Defense:	 3. Leo Gudas		?
				        ex-JyPHT, Finland, now in Germany
					Excellent defenseman

>		 5. Drahomir Kadlec	?
					HIFK, Finland

>		14. Jiri Kucera		?
				        Tappara, Finland

>		19. Tomas Kapusta	?
					HPK, Finland

>		20. Otakar Janecky	(Finland?)
					Jokerit, Finland
	
>		24. Radek Toupal	?
				        HPK, Finland

>		26. Jiri Dolezal	?
				        JyPHT, Finland, no new contract
					JyPHT owns his player rights

All of these Czechs (Kadlec, Dolezal not anymore) are very good hockey
players. It is a big surprise that Hlinka selected Dolezal. 
"Dole" had a bad season in JyPHT and that's why they didn't make
a new contract. The other Czech we had, Jiri Jonak, got fired also.

There are lots of Czechs playing in Finland. Darius Rusnak, Igor Liba,
Sejba, Svoboda, ...


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54073
From: golf@phoenix.oulu.fi (Jouko Kylmaoja)
Subject: German audience is lunatic??

I watched the game Germany-Czechs in WC today...and i was astonished about
the behaviour of the German audience!
The German team got a few penalties in the last period and the crowd went
grazy! They threw coins, extra pucks and other trash into the rink...is
that stupid or what?? I guess the Canadian referee (one of the
Isostar-bros ;) gave the German team a penalty for that, but it didn't help
much.
I guess the Germans just are proud over their Nazi-Kill-'em-All-Everyone-
But-Us-Germans-Sucks attitude...they just seem to have that kind of attitude
in every possible sport (remember the European champs in Stockholm in soccer)
It really pisses me off!
I do not mean that every single German has this attitude that sucks, but 
most of them seem to do...

	Jokke Kylmaoja
	golf@phoenix.oulu.fi


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54074
From: delarocq@eos.ncsu.edu (DERRELL EMERY LAROCQUE)
Subject: A few words of advice to the Stars Hater....






    I have some advice for you, and some thoughts about
your hatred of the Minnesota North Stars:

1. A real team like Toronto would not be moved, you are right,
   just eliminated from the playoffs first round!
2. Why stay in Minnesota when you can go to a college in
   Western Ontario and actually take classes on map-reading
   and the Artistry of BSing specifically set up for just you.
3. Why should anyone love the Stars, when hating the Leafs
   is so much better?
4. Oh, I'm sorry.. well, maybe you can't understand my
   big words.. next time I'll limit my vocabulary to words
   like "get real team now" and "do not waste our time"
5. Respond to this article. I love to laugh at your humor,
   even though it it unintentional. I got a BIG kick out of
   GO LEAFS GO.... go where? HOME, I think!! :)
-- 
delarocq@eos.ncsu.edu


      
---------------------------------------------------------------------------   
1988,1989,1990,1991 AFC East Division Champions
1991,1992, AND 1993 AFC Conference Champions!!!!!!!!  :)

Squished the Fish ............... Monday Night Football, November 16, 1992..
SQUISHED THE TRASH TALKING FISH.. AFC CHAMPIONSHIP, JANUARY 17, 1992..

If you are a Buffalo Bills fan, email me at delarocq@eos.ncsu.edu
so we can talk all about the games, insight, etc.
If you are a Packers fan, let me know. I am interested in any news
out of Green Bay...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54075
From: lmcmasc@noah.ericsson.se (Mauro Schena)
Subject: Bruins

Could anyone post the game summary for the Sabres-Bruins game.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54076
From: "William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: LET'S GO BUFFALO!


     You know, I never really appreciated them before!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54077
From: cobra@chopin.udel.edu (KING COBRA)
Subject: RE: ESPN UP YOURS .........



In article <1993Apr20.214505.6925@wkuvx1.bitnet> kozloce@wkuvx1.bitnet writes:
>Jesus Christ!!!
>
>The score is now 6-0. The Pens are beating the shit out of the Devils who
>gave up in the middle of the 2nd period. ESPN does something smart. The
>announcer states "well folks this game is getting out of hand. Lets go to
>the Islander/Capitals game." I celebrate as I was actually making progress in
>my CS homework because I was so bored by the scheduled game.  I tear down and
>throw on my jersey, Hunter scores I go ape shit 'cause this is the first
>caps game I've been able to watch all season. And what does ESPN do? they
>go back to the blowout that NJ hasn't a chance in hell of winning!
>     The period ends and the sportscaster (CAPITOLS JUST TIED IT UP!! YES!!
>oops excuse me =) goes into his penguin worship mode (Dont freak pens fans!
>They are worthy of this! I'm so glad we wont have to play them as much next
>year!) and here comes the 3rd period...what? its the blowout again. Oh they
>were just waiting for the Cap/Isles to get out of intermission. Good
>they've put a close game back on. Wait! WHATS THIS SHIT?!! THEY'RE SHOWING
>THE BLOWOUT AGAIN!
>
>
>AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG!
>
>(Oh guess what the score is now 7-0 penguins! Switch games you $%&*#@!!!)
>
>Holy shit they're changing games! ITS ABOUT GODDAMNED TIME!! Lets see if
>they'll stay.
>
>Later
>
>I think this proves by $#%&* point. The Caps game goes into overtime but
>"due to contractual obligations" they have to switch to the fucking baseball.
>(Sorry for my language but im PISSED!) What the hell were they going to do
>if their scheduled game went into overtime? ESPN get your head out of your
>ass.
>
>Now I know there are a lot 



 First of all I think when ESPN covers the game they do a wonderful job, but
 last night I felt the same way. I really hate watching Devils/Pens game. 
 Everyone knows that Devils are going to get their ass kicked, why even 
 bother showing them. I was so bored and these ESPN people don't seem to have
 any brain. After the Sundays and last night games, they are still going to 
 show Devils/Pens on THU and SUN. WHat the hell are they thinking about? I 
 think if they keep it up like this NHL will never get a major network contract.
 I'd rather see Caps/Isls game which is more exciting. 

 Now I just hope all baseball games are rained out on ESPN so atleast
 we can get diffrent hockey games. 

  



*******************************************************************************
**   ___  ____  ____  ____  ____  **                                         **
**  /    /   / /___/ /___/ /___/  **   Experience is what makes a person     **
** /___ /___/ /___/ / \_  /   /   **   make new mistakes instead of old      **
**                                **   one.                                  **
** E-mail: cobra@chopin.udel.edu  **                                         **
**                                **                                         **
*******************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54078
From: mse@cc.bellcore.com (25836-michael evenchick(F113))
Subject: Re: #77's?

In article <1r23on$4p6@bigboote.WPI.EDU>, ching@bigwpi.WPI.EDU ("The Logistician") writes:
|> 
|> I am in need of all of the players wearing #77 in the NHL.  I know now only
|> of one, Ray Borque for the Bruins.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.
|> 
|> Thanx.
|> 
|> -- 
|> ------------------------THE LOGISTICIAN REIGNS SUPREME!!!----------------------
|> |									      |
|> |   GO BLUE!!!   GO TIGERS!!!   GO PISTONS!!!   GO LIONS!!!   GO RED WINGS!!! |
|> -------------------------------ching@wpi.wpi.edu-------------------------------

Pierre Turgeon of the Islanders

Mike

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54079
From: Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Wirtz is a weenie

from Dean:
>>In other TV news, the Penguins announced yesterday that they will have 3
>>fewer broadcast TV games, and will have 22(!) games on some sort of
>>subscription / pay-per-view system. Yuck.
> 
>This is incorrect.  This year the Pens had 61 games on "free" TV and 6
>games on PPV.  Next year they will have 62 games on free TV and 22 on 
>a subscription basis.  
> 
>You actually get 1 more free game than last year, and there will be no
>more "radio-only" games.

Yes, you're right. After going home and reading the paper, I got the
full details. That's what I get for making a post based on WDUQ's news.
I should know by now they get just about every sports related item wrong.

Ralph


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54080
From: "William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Don Cherry - help me out, here


     As a person who has rarely even SEEN Don Cherry and doesn't know
anything about him, I don't know whether it is just this area
(Pittsburgh) of the USA that is "deprived" of his broadcasts or whether
he's a Canadian thing altogether.  Seriously, what is he all about?  I
know he was a coach at one time, and from the volume of posts about him,
SOMEONE surely is getting a steady diet of him somehow, but my question
is, what is the deal with him?  Secondly, are the comments of his that I
read about on the net merely flame bait, or do people actually take him
seriously?  I gotta tell you, from what I see, he really sounds like an
ass.  Let me know - maybe I'm missing something.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54081
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage

In article <116084@bu.edu> icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera) writes:
>
>	I loved the ABC coverage. The production was excellent. The appearance
Antonio,you weren't alone.

ABC ratings were very good. I was schocked to hear that ABC's telecast
was the fifth most watched sporting event over the weekend. National
rating came out to a very respectable 3.3. Top-29 Nielsen markets were
at 2.9. In Boston,the game scored lower at 2.4 but it had some competion
from local sports teams.
Quite frankly, I expected ABC's ratings to be under 2.0. But I'm happy
to be proven wrong!

Well,well...Sometimes it pays off clicking away on your cable-tv remote
control.:-) And if you happen to be a hockey fan,you could just stumble
upon a playoff hockey game...

ESPN picked up Detroit-Toronto game on Monday night because the only
night game in MLB was being rained out in Chicago. You have to give
ESPN credit for switching to Detroit's FOX-50 coverage and having Bill
Clement at a Pittsburgh's TV station(WATE?) for intermission analysis.
Maybe,ESPN people were giddy over perliminary over-night ABC ratings
for Sunday's telecast and thought it was a good idea to feature the
Norris division showdown rather than a monster truck competion.
Good move,ESPN!


-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54082
From: tmavor@earthview.cms.udel.edu (Tim "Gun for Hire" Mavor)
Subject: Re: ESPN UP YOURS .........

>
>[Various justifiable rantings on ESPN coverage by several deleted]
>

The only way to change ESPN's thinking, if it is even possible, is to complain
to them directly.  Anyone know there telephone # in Bristol, Ct?  

I do find it hard to believe that ESPN doesn't think viewers will simply
change the channel from a boring game....I know I did.  And then, when
they didn't show the NYI-Wash overtime(s), I was livid!  If I wanted
to watch baseball, I could have turned on the Phillies-Padres extra
inning game....instead, I went to bed angry......I boycotted ESPN's
morning Sportscenter today, I was still so incensed.

My wife says I shouldn't go to bed angry, but last nite.........GRRRRRRR!

 
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Tim Mavor		   |  "I am known by many names.......
College of Marine Studies  |   some call me.........Tim."
Univ. of Delaware	   |    
Newark, DE 19716	   |  "You know much that is hidden, O' Tim!"
tmavor@pandora.cms.udel.edu|  	Monty Python and the Holy Grail	---------------------------------------------------------------------


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54083
From: leventhal@cs.bgsu.edu (Laura Leventhal)
Subject: Info - world hockey championships

Does anyone have any information about the world hockey championships and
specifically about the US team?  Game summaries and/or stats would be
greatly appreciated!!  USA Today reported that the US beat the Czech
Republic, but that was the limit of the story.

Thanks
Laura

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54084
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage

In article <9491@blue.cis.pitt.edu> shah@pitt.edu (Ravindra S Shah) writes:
>
>Exactly.  That is my biggest complaint about the coverage so far.
>Follow that damn puck!
>

If ESPN/ABC is going to stick with one-sided Pens-Devils series(and it
looks like they will continue with it on Thursday night), I'd rather
watch pretty women in the stands than non-action on the ice where a
slow,aging NJ team being taken out to lunch by a dynamic Pens squad.

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54085
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: ESPN sucks: OT or Baseball?  Guess which.

In article <C5tC87.Aty@ccu.umanitoba.ca> umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner) writes:
>Showing a meaningless (relatively) baseball game over the overtime of
>game that was tied up with less than 3 seconds left on the clock?
>Gimme a break!  Where does ESPN get these BRILLIANT decisions from?
>

It's called 'contractual obligations' with Major League Baseball.
I would've liked to see the OT of the Isles-Caps game, but I understand
where ESPN is coming from. ESPN is committed to a single telecast a night
and everything after that is a bonus.

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54086
From: LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall)
Subject: Re: Trivia:  the Habs?

In article <C5tI1C.9sy@news.cso.uiuc.edu>
caine@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Lord Vader) writes:
 
>
>
>OK, I'm sure that this has been asked 100's of times before, but I
>have wondered since I heard it...  Where the hell did the nickname
>of the "Habs" come from for the Montreal Canadiens?
>
>Thanks in advance,
>Caine Schneider
 
 
 
 The answer is in the FAQ for this group.  nough said.
 
 
 
Laurie Marshall
Wayne State University
Detroit, Michigan
Go Wings!!!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54087
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: Schedule...

In article <lt8dl1INN2u2@appserv.Eng.Sun.COM> mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler) writes:
>But only in NY,NJ, Philadelphia, and Chicago. Everywhere else, the only
>reason SportsChannel was available was for local baseball broadcasts.
>And local baseball pre-empted the NHL playoffs. Thus far into this

Good point. Not only baseball but local NBA basketball games took
precedence over any SCA's NHL playoff coverage.

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54088
From: LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall)
Subject: Re: Red Wings Goespel...

In article <1993Apr21.040956.12823@wuecl.wustl.edu>
mvs1@cec2.wustl.edu (Michael Virata Sy) writes:
 
>
>        Don't forget Paul Ysebaert, ex-Devil.  He's a good team player.
 
      And Dino Ciccarelli and Ray Sheppard and so on and so on.....
 
    : )
 
Laurie Marshall
Wayne State University
Detroit, Michigan
Go Wings!!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54089
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Wings will win

In article <ragraca.735586800@vela.acs.oakland.edu> ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:
>
>It's true that Vancouver did not make the playoffs for many a year before 
>Quinn came, but in those years the Smythe Division was a lot--I mean *a lot*--
>tougher division than the Norris, also known as the "Snorris", division.
>Vancouver had to play Edmonton and Calgary, both very legitimate Stanley
>Cup contenders, eight times a year, while Detroit got to play such 
>powerhouses as Toronto and Minnesota.  Now, Edmonton is hardly even a force
>in the league, and the Smythe even has the mighty San Jose sharks, while

Them thar's fighting words...hardly a force...geez...miss the playoffs
once in 15 years, and even after making the final four 3 times in the
last five years, and everyone thinks its doomsville.

>over this same period of time in which Vancouver was improving, so was 
>everybody in the Norris (except St. Louis).  Detroit had to improve just
>to keep up with the competition in their division.  They had to improve *a
>lot* to get better than their competition in the Norris.
>
>Bryan Murray inherited a team with very little talent.  For really good
>players, they had Yzerman, Burr, and Probert, and that was about it.  (And
>no doubt some will dispute whether Burr and Probert were that good). The
>rest were either very green rookies or washed up veterans.  The only reason
>they got as far as they did in the years before Murray came was due to the
>coaching of Demers, who, at least at first, got every last ounce of effort
>possible out of his team.  Then, even his coaching began to degrade.
>

Fedorov, Primeau, Kozlov, Lidstrom, Sillinger, Konstantinov, Drake,
Kennedy, Racine, and Cheveldae were already in the pipeline due to
Devellano...Murray inherited these guys...in addition to Yzerman,
Probert, Carson, Chiasson, etc.

>There are a number of reasons why Detroit wasn't in as bad a shape standings
>wise when Murray took over as Vanc. was when Quinn took over, some of which
>I outlined above, but Murray did not have any better personnel to work with
>at the outset than did Quinn, with the exception of Yzerman.  And one player
>cannot alone make a team into a Stanley Cup contender, as I'm sure everyone
>reading this will agree.  
>

No...Quinn had far less...Murray took over Detroit at a time to 
take advantage of all of Devellano's good drafting...if Devellano
had not given in to Demers request to make the Oates trade, he might
still be GM.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54090
From: jack.petrilli@rose.com (jack petrilli)
Subject: Bruins

On April 23,  mckee@cs.Buffalo.EDU (Douglas McKee) wrote:

M(--> were doomed to 4'th in the division.  I'm still not convinced the
M(--> Sabres will win this series (I've lived in Buffalo all my life, and
M(--> these last 10 years have been playoff Hell), but I'm just sitting
M(--> back, crossing my fingers and hoping the offense can keep scoring

Have no fear, Doug, the Bruins are toast. Statistically, only 2 teams 
in **all** the Stanley Cup series ever played have come back to win. 
And it couldn't have happened to a nicer team, with all the crowing 
from Boston fans I've had to endure over the last month. 

Take heart, Bruins fans. At least you finished first in the Adams 
<sinister chuckle>.

- Jack

 * Laugh and the world thinks you're an idiot.
---
   RoseReader 2.10  P003814 Entered at [ROSE]
   RoseMail 2.10 : RoseNet<=>Usenet Gateway : Rose Media 416-733-2285

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54091
From: jack.petrilli@rose.com (jack petrilli)
Subject: Bruins

On April 23,  wuziyun%suned@cs.yale.edu (You wanna know?) wrote:

W --> 
W --> SEE! The Providence Bruins lost the first two games at home and came back to
W -->      tie the series on the road, there may be hope for the Bruins yet!

Toast. They're toast. (And I know how much you want me to eat these 
words, but it ain't gonna happen.) Are the golf courses in the Boston 
area in playable condition yet?

- Jack

 * Acid consumes 47 times its weight in life!
---
   RoseReader 2.10  P003814 Entered at [ROSE]
   RoseMail 2.10 : RoseNet<=>Usenet Gateway : Rose Media 416-733-2285

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54092
From: jack.petrilli@rose.com (jack petrilli)
Subject: HABS WIN, HABS WIN!!!

On April 23,  JBE5 <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA> wrote:

J<--> 
J<--> Yahooooooooooooooooooooo!
J<--> 
J<--> What a game, we finally beat those diques...and in O.T.!
J<--> The Habs dominated this game and especially in O.T..

You realize that we dominated game 1 also and should be ahead in this 
series 2 - 1?

J<--> Glorieux were plagued by bad luck; the puck wouldn't bounce their
J<--> way.  But in O.T. they got their lucky break, the winning goal
J<--> went off Gusarov's skate.  Thank you Lord!!!!!!

And it's about time! We hit 2 posts in this overtime and 1 post in 
game 1's overtime. Let's hope that **we** start getting some luck for 
a change.

He played well in this game but Roy's inconsistency still makes me 
nervous. Otherwise, I'd say we're going to win this series, no sweat. 
It's all up to Patrick Roy to provide **consistent** goaltending.

J<--> And those damn Bruins lost in O.T., their down 3-0.  Congratulations
J<--> Buffalo!!
J<--> 
J<--> Life doesn't get better than this!!!!!!!!!

Agreed. <g> 

- Jack

 * Tagline Bad or Missing  NO CARRIER
---
   RoseReader 2.10  P003814 Entered at [ROSE]
   RoseMail 2.10 : RoseNet<=>Usenet Gateway : Rose Media 416-733-2285

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54093
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: Hockeytipset 93 avgjort



	         Hockey-tipset, V}ren 1993:
	         ==========================

 *#*#*#*#* Vinnare av Hockey-tipset 1993... Per Bengtson!!! Grattis! *#*#*#*#*

 Slutst{llning:		1. Per Bengtson		15
			2. Lars Andersson	13
			3. Anders Engwall	11
			4. Staffan Axelsson	10
			   Patrik ]sander	10
			6. Hannu L A Hietanen	 9
			   Ingvar Khan		 9
			8. noran@cs.tut.fi	 8
			   Jan Stein		 8
			   Roger Wennstr|m	 8
			11.Lars Thore Aarhus	 7
			   Fredrik Nissen	 7
			   Marek Repinski	 7
			   Lars Wiklund		 7
			15.Lennart Hedenstr|m	 6

 Vinnare och lycklig {gare av en FBK-mugg {r allts} Per Bengtson,
 kometen som ledde hockeytipset 92 vid halvtid men som sedan fick
 ge vika f|r Anders Engwall i slutspurten.

 De tre f|rsta lyckades pricka in den viktiga fr}ga 1.4 SM-guld till Bryn{s.
 Kanske var det v{l sv}rt att tippa slutspelet ocks} men man ser att
 om den j{mna finalen mellan Lule} och Bryn{s ist{llet hade slutat till
 Lule}s f|rdel, s} hade det varit samma vinnare i alla fall.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 H{r f|ljer de korrekta svaren. Siffran inom parentes anger hur m}nga
 som hade tippat detta. * anger Per Bengtsons vinnande rad.


	1. Elitserien

	1.1 Tippa den slutgiltiga tabellen.

	 1. V{ster}s            (7)
	 2. Bryn{s              (2)	*
	 3. Malm|               (4)
	 4. F{rjestad           (5)
	 5. MoDo                (6)
	 6. Lule}               (6)	*
	 7. Leksand             (2)	*
	 8. Djurg}rden          (2)	*

        - - - - - - - - - -
	 9. HV 71              (11)	*
	10. R|gle              (12)	*

	
	1.2 Vilka 4 av de 8 kvartsfinalisterna g}r vidare till semifinal?

	    Djurg}rden          (4)
	    Lule}               (9)
	    Bryn{s              (6)	*
	    Malm|              (13)	*

	1.3 Vilka 2 lag m|ts i final?

	    Lule}               (5)
	    Bryn{s              (4)	*

	1.4 Vilka blir Svenska M{stare 92/93?   (3p)

	    Bryn{s              (4)	*

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

	2. Allsvenskan

	   1. V{stra Fr|lunda  (11)	*
	   2. Huddinge          (3)	*
				
	  - - - - - - - - - - -

	   3. Bj|rkl|ven        (5)
	   4. AIK               (5)	*

	  - - - - - - - - - - -

	   9. Team G{vle        (1)
	  10. Boden             (0)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54094
From: <JOLD@vma.cc.nd.edu>
Subject: New Div. 1 NCAA teams

It was great to hear that UMass is bringing back hockey!  It reminded me that a
couple of years ago there was talk that both Bimidgi (sp?) and Mankato State
trying to upgrade their programs to Div. 1 status.  I also seem to remember
that they had some trouble with new NCAA rule about just who was allowed to
compete at the Div. 1 level.  Was that ever resolved?  Also, I was just
wondering if there is ANY college hockey east of Colorado (Alaska excepted).
With the new popularity of hockey on the west coast, I would expect there to
be some interest building at the collegiate levels too. Anyone heard anything?
                      James Old, e-mail JOLD@vma.cc.nd.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54095
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

In article <1993Apr21.063836.4412@ncsu.edu> delarocq@eos.ncsu.edu (DERRELL EMERY LAROCQUE) writes:
>
>   Tonight in Boston, the Buffalo Sabres blanked the Boston
>Bruins 4-0 tonight in Boston. Looks like Boston can hang
>this season up, because Buffalo's home record is awesome!!!!
>This is great.. Buffalo fans might get to see revenge for
>last year!!!!! :)

I'm glad Grant Fuhr will never be as over-confident after two wins
as you are...it takes four wins to defeat an opponent...each tougher
to obtain than the previous one.  Buffalo is off to a good start...
Fuhr is proving the Fuhr-bashers wrong, but Boston is an awfully
good team.

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54096
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Bruins

In article <1993Apr21.124053.29722@exu.ericsson.se> lmcmasc@noah.ericsson.se writes:
>Could anyone post the game summary for the Sabres-Bruins game.

Grant Fuhr rules! -).

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54097
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Subject: Re: SHARKS: Jack Feirerra (was Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!)

In article <1993Apr23.063737.26286@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>In article <lte43kINN7ul@appserv.Eng.Sun.COM> mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler) writes:
>I don't think trading Kisio was intrinsically a mistake; however, trading him
>for a 3rd round pick would be; he should have been worth a lot more than a
>3rd round pick for a playoff team.  In fact, I would intimate that the offers
>the Sharks got this year for Kisio were way greater than just a 3rd round pick.

Hindsight's 20-20. Nobody expected Kisio to have his 2nd best career year.

>>Besides, without Kisio, the Sharks would have tanked even earlier in
>>the season, and Gund might have gotten a little more serious
>>about getting Joe Murphy, a guy who definitely would be around
>>3 - 5 years from now when the Sharks do make the playoffs.
>
>What else could be done?  The Gunds offered $2 million for Murphy, but the
>Oilers wanted prospect(s), which the Sharks declined to give, which I think is
>correct.

I didn't mean to imply that Gund's offer wasn't enough.  Gund's offer
was the right $, but too late in the season.  $2M offered in November
lets Sather buy a replacement for Murphy *this* season and make the
playoffs *this* year. $2M in March doesn't help Sather with his
immediate objectives, doesn't help with long term objectives (only a
prospect or draft pick does, and no way should the Sharks do that).
However, getting back to what-if games, had Kisio been traded to
Chicago last year, then the Sharks go 0 for October, and maybe Gund
panicks sooner in November. And here's another what-if twist: Chicago
would have had Kisio this season; they *never* go after Murphy in the
first place because Kelly is having his *best* season (bigger guys in
Chicago). So Gund has no competition. So Ferriera, Sather, and Keenan
all look like geniuses.

A broken fax machine, and Ferriera, Keenan, and maybe Kingston
(and maybe even Green) lose their jobs. Kind of makes you
shiver doesn't it. :-)

Bottomline, for every black scenario any of you can concoct for
Kisio leaving, I can concoct an equally bright one.

>>If the Kisio-fiasco was the cause of Ferierra's down fall, I hope
>>it wasn't because he tried to trade Kisio, but because he screwed it
>>up. Nonetheless, I'm sorry Ferierra and Kingston are gone, and I wish Gund
>>would follow.
>
>And what have the Gunds done exactly that caused you to wish that they were
>gone? ...

Are you serious?
	- Let Ferierra go,
	- fire Kingston (these last two basically mean that
		Sharks are starting over again in terms of the
		timetable to capture the Cup. As I've stated
		frequently: 5 out 6 expansion teams had the same GM
		from inception through Cup season)

	- broadcast more home games than away games
	- broadcast very few road Pacific and Mountain time games
	- jack up my ticket prices from $27 to $38 in two years (not that I'm
		going to pay 120 bucks for 3 seats. I'll probably next to the
		virtual 107 folks)

	- not tell me my priority #
	- not let me sell my priority #
	- in order for me to get the free jacket, force me to order my tickets
		for next season before I get to select my section

	- not let me park at the new arena after paying for their
		privileged parking lot (which was sometimes full when
		I got there) for 2 straight years.

I've been a loyal ticket holder, since day 1 (literally) in spring of
'90 when the team was announced.  and I'm not getting that loyalty
returned. Wirtz treats his fans far better by comparison. And
Pocklington with his cheap tix is the best owner of all.

>GO EDMONTON OILERS!  Go for playoffs next year!  Stay in Edmonton!

I know one isn't suppose to make negative comments on signatures, but
what did us Oiler fans do to you to deserve the "Stay in Edmonton"
part? I'd never wish the Kings to leave metro-LA; it's too much fun
watching the Shark's beat them.
-- 
Mike Eisler, mre@Eng.Sun.Com  ``Not only are they [Leafs] the best team, but
 their fans are even more intelligent and insightful than Pittsburgh's.  Their
 players are mighty bright, too.  I mean, he really *was* going to get his
 wallet back, right?'' Jan Brittenson 3/93, on Leaf/Pen woofers in
 rec.sport.hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54098
From: LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here

In article <MfpIRbO00WBLI1ispC@andrew.cmu.edu>
"William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
 
>
>
>     As a person who has rarely even SEEN Don Cherry and doesn't know
>anything about him, I don't know whether it is just this area
>(Pittsburgh) of the USA that is "deprived" of his broadcasts or whether
>he's a Canadian thing altogether.  Seriously, what is he all about?  I
>know he was a coach at one time, and from the volume of posts about him,
>SOMEONE surely is getting a steady diet of him somehow, but my question
>is, what is the deal with him?  Secondly, are the comments of his that I
>read about on the net merely flame bait, or do people actually take him
>seriously?  I gotta tell you, from what I see, he really sounds like an
>ass.  Let me know - maybe I'm missing something.
>
 
 Well, here in Detroit we get to see and hear Don Cherry quite regularly.
The Detroit area picks up Hockey Night in Canada from CBC (ch 9) in
Windsor where we see Don Cherry's Coaches Corner between periods. We
also get to see Don Cherry's Grapevine just before the game. The
Grapevine is a hockey talk show where Don talks to a player or coach
about what else: Hockey.  It's actually a pretty good show and Don
isn't as annoying as he is on Coaches Corner.  I think this is were
Don got his nickname 'Grapes' but I'm not sure.  Don use to coach the
Boston Bruins.  I don't know exactly when that was.  Could someone fill
me in on this info?
  A local radio station here in Detroit (WLLZ) talks to Don every Tuesday
morning.  Personally, I've had my fill of Donny!  He really pisses me off
sometimes.  During the Detroit-Toronto game Monday night on CBC, Don gave
high praise to Doug Gilmour, saying he was a two-way player and not
just a designated goal scorer and that he is probably the best player
in the game because of that.  That's fine and I agree that Gilmour
is a good two-way player BUT he said the EXACT same thing about Yzerman
about a month ago on a local radio talk show.  What gives?
  It seems like he just has a set speech that he changes when he goes from
city to city.
  Don Cherry:  'I think <insert star player name for city that he is in>
              is the best two-way player in the league today.'
 
  There have been other times (can't remember exactly what he said) that he
basically changed his opinions to match the audience he was talking to.
  Someone here on the net said something about how Don criticized Mario
Lemieux but when the time comes for Don to broadcast the Cup playoffs
from the Civic Center (Yes, I think the Pens will make it out of the
Wales Conference) Don will apologize left and right for his remarks about
Lemieux.  In my opinion, he is an ass.  And I won't change my opinion
if I'm in a different city.
  Sorry, if this didn't answer your question better but I just had to get
this off my chest.
 
Laurie Marshall
Wayne State University
Detroit, Michigan
Go Wings!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54099
From: bart@splunge.uucp (Barton Oleksy)
Subject: Re: Oilers for sale??

yadalle@cs.UAlberta.CA (Yadallee Dave S) writes:

>Here's one from the mill.  The Oilers MIGHT move to Hamilton
>where Porklington can get a free deal.

>Given what Labour relations and Puck has been like, it WOULD be a sigh of 
>relief.

>This WAY w4e can can BOTH elements!!

Well, Dave, I would have to disagree with you there.  Satan himself could
own the team, and I'd be happy as long as the Oilers stayed in Edmonton.
Selfish, but true.  I don't want to see the Oilers move, no matter who
their owner is.

Bart, bart@splunge.uucp  or  barto@nait.ab.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54100
From: Mamatha Devineni Ratnam <mr47+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Atlanta's ABC affiliate SUCKS!!!!!


I knew, despite the lack of a full game telecast last week, it was still
too much hockey for Atlanta. Atlanta's ABC has declined to pick up any
playoff games till May9. And even when they show the games on MAy9 and May16,
they will continue to skip the first half hour of the telecast. I know this
is still a better situation compared to rest of Georgia, Alabama, etc., but
it is still pretty annoying. At least in PIttsburgh, we had a network preemptionchannel which showed all netwoork shows prempted by the local affiliate.


I asked them what their problem was. I told them that a local 1.9 rating was
not that bad considering it was the first NHL game shown after a long time
without much promotion. Besides, their syndicated programming in the afternoon
is usually low rated. So what did they have to lose by showing NHL playoffs.
She told me that they had contractual obligations. I asked her if golf
was shown oin ABC, would contractual obligations come in the way. And how come
contractual obligations didn't come in the way of last week's telecast? She
then couldn't give me a coherent answer.


Also, I added that Atlanta had one of the highest neutral site game
attendances and that the demographics were good. I think ABC and other networks
should begin to tie their high rated programs like Roseanne in with
 thier sports programming.
I hope that everyone in Atlanta who reads this bboard calls WSB 2 and complain
bitterlyt about this. Tell them you will stop watching their news telecasts
since they seem to be very unprofessional in handling this situation.

The lady did not seem to settle on a single reason. Sometimes, the reason
is low ratings. Then another time, she says contractual obligations.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54101
From: bpenrose@morgan.ucs.mun.ca (Brian Penrose)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

In article <1993Apr23.102811.623@sei.cmu.edu> caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz) writes:
>
>While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash" that
>Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had his
>jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not positive.
>Does anyone remember/know his name?  What has happened to him since?  What
>about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?  Has this ever
>happened before in a hockey game?   
>
>Thanks,
>
>Carol
>Go Pens!

His name is Clint Malarchuk.  I'm not sure what he does now but I've heard
he's an extra in slasher films.

--Brian


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54102
From: Mamatha Devineni Ratnam <mr47+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Atlanta sportsbars



OK. I know I look pretty desperate on this bboard. I think I have posted
3 or 4 messages already on the issue of NHL telecats over the last few weeks.
But, hey. I am pretty desperate. What I am interested is not just a
sportsbar with multiple screens so thast I can watch the game on one
of those silent screens. Are there any hockey oriented bars in this area.
Or does some Patrick division or Adams division fan have a satellite dish?
I don't mind paying an admission fee, if necessary.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54103
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here

In article <MfpIRbO00WBLI1ispC@andrew.cmu.edu> "William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>
>     As a person who has rarely even SEEN Don Cherry and doesn't know
>anything about him, I don't know whether it is just this area
>(Pittsburgh) of the USA that is "deprived" of his broadcasts or whether
>he's a Canadian thing altogether.  Seriously, what is he all about?  I
>know he was a coach at one time, and from the volume of posts about him,
>SOMEONE surely is getting a steady diet of him somehow, but my question
>is, what is the deal with him?  Secondly, are the comments of his that I
>read about on the net merely flame bait, or do people actually take him
>seriously?  I gotta tell you, from what I see, he really sounds like an
>ass.  Let me know - maybe I'm missing something.
>

For those of you who complain about Don Cherry, and wonder why he is
popular...

the reply is Dick Vitale and John Madden and Bobby Knight and
Joe Garagiola and Howard Cosell.

John Madden picks Gary Clark of the Redskins for his All-Madden team
a lot, over much better receivers...for much the same reasons Cherry
sings the praises of Doug Gilmour...a little guy with heart...yet one
doesn't see a string of American posts saying that John Madden has
lost his marbles.

Dick Vitale is always promoting this kid from this high school or
that college with outrageous statements.

Why should Americans expect that Canada would not have such characters
in relation to our greatest passion...which is hockey?   Canadians
are very similar to Americans...culturally our sports are just hockey
and curling, whereas with Americans it is football/basketball/baseball
and bowling.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54104
From: jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM (Jason Cockroft)
Subject: Re: Bowman needs credit

>However, Bowman is really not a modern coach, and
>Patrick's solution of having him only run the team on game days, and
>delegate most of the day-to-day responsibity to the assistants is
>a shrewd managerial decision on Patrick's part.  

I would argue Gerald, that Bowman is the first "modern" coach.
Bowman's Canadiens were the first NHL team to have a weight-room
in the 70s.  He is the first coach I have seen, that manipulates
the press into spreading false game plan rumours.  (During important games
listen to the pre-game interview will Bowman and compare that to
what is on the ice!)  I agree Bowman is a master of the lineups. 
Remember last year in the SC when he benched Jagr only to set him free 
in OT.  When Jagr banged in the winning goal I thought this was
trademark Bowman and also a sign of a modern coach!

I am left asking "What is a modern coach if not Bowman?"

-jake.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54105
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Nords 3 - Habs 2 in O.T. We was robbed!!

In article <1993Apr20.163027.28425@jarvis.csri.toronto.edu> yaska@eecg.toronto.edu (Yaska Sankar) writes:

>>>Paul Stewart is the worst and most biased ref. presently in the NHL.
>>>WE WAS ROBBED!!!!

>>No.  Patrick Roy is the reason the game was lost, and Ron Hextall is the
>>reason Quebec won. 

>I don't buy this at all. Roy was the reason the game was tied... and that
>would *not* have been the case had Dionne kept his cool. 
>Roy stood on his 
>head for the first 15 minutes of the game when the Nords were rushing from 
>end-to-end. Kamensky's mini-break after the tying goal and the first shot by 
>Young in OT were both excellent chances stopped by Roy. Roy outplayed 
>Hextall for most of the game, but Roy becomes the villain and Hextall 
>the hero because Roy's team didn't make full use of their opportunities.

Whoa.  What you are effectively doing is implying that if a player plays
really well, he 'stores up' mistakes that can be used at a later time.  Ths
is not so.  Roy is the 'villain', as you so succinctly put it, because he
allowed a very cheap goal.  If you think Roy outplayed Hextall, perhaps you
should get a tape of the game and watch the first 7-8 minutes of the third
period.  NHL goaltenders _make_ some great saves.  If they did not, they
would not be in the NHL in the first place.  I do not expect any particular
goalie to be able to make the great saves all of the time, even though they
are occasionally required.  However, when it comes to a routine shot like
Sakic's, especially at such a crucial time in a game, I don't think there 
are any legitimate excuses. 

>Hextall, on the other hand, had a lot of lucky bounces 
>[description of lucky bounces.....]
>Hextall wasn't particularly brilliant on those plays ... 

I am not arguing that Hextall was brilliant.  I am arguing is that a
relatively weak wrist shot from the outside of the circle shold not result 
in a goal. 

> ... but it was just the 1 goal. The timing stank, but against
>an explosive team like Quebec, they gave them 1 opportunity too many with
>a powerplay that was totally unnecessary.

In a one-goal game with less than a minute to go there is no such thing as
'just the 1 goal'.  I have not defended Dionne for taking the penalty
either...in fact I think it was a boneheaded move.  But it led to _one_ goal
only, and Montreal had a _two_ goal lead.  My main concern is the second 
goal.

>This most certainly was a team loss... Leclair missed his opportunities,
>as did Bellows and Brunet. Dionne took a bad penalty. Damphousse and Lebeau
>were *silent*. Carbonneau and Savard were a step behind all night. Roy gave
>up the bad goal. Roy, by no means, can be singled out for this loss.

What you say about the skaters is absolutely true.  But realize that the 
game was effectively *won*.  You could watch any hockey game (in fact, you
could watch any sporting event period) and spend hours discussing the 'what
if's' w.r.t. missed opportunities.  They are not important when the final
result is decided.  If I get the time soon, I'll watch the game again and
email you a list of lucky Montreal bounces and a list of Quebec offensive
screwups.  Montreal was _leading_ with a minute to go.  The goalie
is the last line of defence, and I will grant that extra attention is
focussed on him, sometimes without justification.  But Roy gave up a *lousy*
goal, and a team cannot afford such a goal.

>>Roy looked like a player in an industrial league on Sakic's shot.

>And Hextall didn't on Dionne's goal? Please. 

WHO CARES?  Of what value is it to justify one lousy play with a totally
unrelated lousy play?  I could do a Hextall critique if you'd like.  But if
you're going to assess his performance, keep in mind that he made the key
saves at the key times.

>Roy is paid big money because
>that is his value compared to other goalies ... and he still is in the top 5

For the record, I did not say that Roy was not one of the top goaltenders in
the league.  In fact, I agree that he is.

>The Montreal media is the quickest to heap praise and then hurl derogatory
>comments against the Habs. They are no better than uninformed fans.
                            
I assume you are referring to me.  However, I have pointed out that I think
the loss can be blamed on Roy.  I have not said he sucks, nor do I think I've
made any other 'derogatory comments'.  If you regard objective
(and informed, FYI) observations as derogatory, I really can't help you. 

--
dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54106
From: wang@mte.ncsu.edu (Cheng Wang)
Subject: Re: Buffalo Sabres

In article <1r8pc7$sa5@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu (David
Vergolini) writes:
>  Ok, Buffalo fans.  I am a Red Wings fan, but am amazed at how the Sabres are
>beating up on the Bruins.  Is there any reason for this?  Is it Grant Fuhr or
>Mogilny and Lafontaine?  I would like to hear from you since I do not know
much
>about the Sabres.
>
>
>
>
>
>                                                Dave Vergolini
>                                                Michigan State University
>                                                vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu
>
Pure and Simple, Grant Fuhr is money.  He has been awesome in the playoffs,
especially last night.  But Mogilny has been scoring well, and his russian
friend Kymlev (sp?) has also done well.  But Fuhr is the biggest reason they
are winning, and the difference between this year's team and previous years.

Bill Perry


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54107
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: Ulf and all...

Allan Sullivan (allan@cs.UAlberta.CA) wrote:

: Unfortunately, that is the way the league is heading... You can't fight,
: so the only way to retaliate against someone is with a cheap shot when
: the ref isn't looking. Ulf has brought this to a high level... Players
: stuck in the past (like Neely) who prefer fights to cheap shots
: are at a disadvantage in the new system.

: Lets face it, A cheap shot (like high sticking) is a very effective
: method... It is easier to hide from the refs, has a better chance of
: causing injury, and you can draw people into fights that way. I don't
: like it, but that's the way the league is going.

: By the way, there was a rather good hit by Ulf in the last Penguin-Devil
: game. Managed to hit the NJ player in the face with a stick. (Must have been a
: legal hit... After all, Ulf is a clean player and is allowed to do
: things like that.)

Are there any ex NHL hockey players out there who might care to
comment on this and end this ridiculously long discussion?

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54108
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: Ulf crushes Valeri Zelepukin

Bill Clare 726-9419 (clare@ssd.kodak.com) wrote:
: That more or less says it.  I flicked the Penguins game on briefly and saw
: Ulf cross-check Valeri in the face.  I am wondering if Don Cherry is going to
: go off on this at all in coach's corner.

And that was the ONLY infraction of this type in the game. 
Come on! Wake up! Geez He's not the only player who does this
sort of thing. I think we were kind of lucky. The game was not
really all that "chippy" considering the state NJ is in about
now.

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54109
From: dvb@ick (David Van Beveren)
Subject: Re: TV Coverage - NHL to blame!

sjg3@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (STEVEN JAY GIBBLE) writes:
: 

[ a whole lot of completely ignorant stuff about Pitt. ]

Give this guy a drug test, and some Ridalin whale you are at it.

dvb

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54110
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Subject: Re: Wash/Isl OT game

In article <1993Apr23.091337@staff.dccs.upenn.edu> filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu (Geoff Filinuk) writes:
>	GET OFF ESPN'S BACK AND STOP POSTING ARTICLES ON THIS SUBJECT!!!
>There have been to many f****n complainers about this game that it's making me
>sick.

Generally I agree with you. However, (1) last night ESPN cut away to Baseball
Tonite, which looks like SportsCenter tailored to baseball, and they cut
away at 7:40 pacific. That's quite a contract they have there. (2) if
ESPN couldn't deliver, they should have had a transistion plan to
let SportsChannel pick up the slack.

Nonetheless, it is ultimately the fault of the US-American public that regular
season baseball has precedence over playoff hockey in the U.S.
Support your team; support your game.

Somebody in r.s.h. had an excellent idea that we should write Chrysler
to thank them for supporting hockey with their ads and that we would
consider their products. Here's an equally excellent idea, watch
baseball for 10 minutes (I know I'm asking a lot, but that's what spew
bags are for), write down who is advertising, and write them letters
complaining that they are supporting baseball to your displeasure and
that you won't consider buying their products because of it.
-- 
Mike Eisler, mre@Eng.Sun.Com  ``Not only are they [Leafs] the best team, but
 their fans are even more intelligent and insightful than Pittsburgh's.  Their
 players are mighty bright, too.  I mean, he really *was* going to get his
 wallet back, right?'' Jan Brittenson 3/93, on Leaf/Pen woofers in
 rec.sport.hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54111
From: gjd4n@Virginia.EDU ("Gregory J. Demme")
Subject: Re: Trivia question

  The goalie to whom you refer is Clint Malarchuk.  He was at
that time playing with the Sabres.  His team immediately prior
to that was the Washington Capitals.  While he did recover and
continue to play, I do not know his present whereabouts.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54112
From: mjr4u@Virginia.EDU ("Matthew J. Rush")
Subject: Bernie Nicholls - What a man!

Just some thoughts:

I don't usually like to post simply to make fun of a player,
but this time I couldn't resist.  During the Pens-Devils game
last night, second period, I think Kevin Stevens was in the
penalty box, Nicholls punched Kjell Samuellson in the face,
then raised his stick like a two handed sword to defend
himself!  All Kjell could do, at 8'7" and 355 pounds, was laugh!

And speaking of Swedish Penguins defensemen, Ulf is getting a
little out of hand lately.  His cheap shots are getting more
frequent and more violent.  As everybody in the Meadowlands
except for the officials could see last night, he rammed the
butt of his stick down one of the Devil's throat.  I've always
supported the argument "he does his job by being irritating,"
but he's starting to push it over the edge IMHO.  Of course,
Holik's chop to Barrasso's neck wasn't too sportsmanlike either.
It seems that he was following the "The only way to beat the
Penguins is to injure them" philosophy.

As my Modern Drama professor pointed out to me the other day,
Jagr was stoned pretty well Tuesday night, and last night as
well, although the 30 seconds he danced around the Devils end
was pretty exciting.

Matt at UVA

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54113
From: popovich@cs.columbia.edu (Steve Popovich)
Subject: Re: Truly a sad day for hockey

"Mom" writes:
>I fear that within the next decade or so the only professional sports team
>left in Pittsburgh will be the Steelers.

Perish the thought...but you know, you may be right, at least as far
as MAJOR LEAGUE professional sports teams go.  They all seem to be
becoming BIG MONEY games, much more so than at any previous time.  To
think that if I am ever able to move back home several years from now,
all that may be there is an AHL team, at best...SIGH.

The interesting thing is that the NHL is also expanding, at the same
time as it is dramatically increasing the amount of money needed to
operate a team.  This would seem to indicate that there's a BIG
shake-out about to occur in the next few years, unless player salaries
can somehow be brought under control.  Frankly, I don't see how the
NHL's current drive for expansion is supportable under its current
operating conditions.  If revenue sharing AND a salary cap don't come
into the NHL soon, look out.
	-Steve

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54114
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Subject: Re: ESPN2 - Tell us about it

In article <1993Apr23.094308.6503@walter.cray.com> huot@cray.com (Tom Huot) writes:
>I hadn't heard about this new ESPN2. When is this new network
>supposed to start? Sounds great to me! (as long as my cable co.
					^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>offers it)
^^^^^^^^^^^

Hopefully EPSN will use the lesson given by the master: Ted Turner.
The season Ted introduced TNT, many cable co.'s refused to put it on,
saying that, gee we get enough old movies, miniseries, etc. on TBS,
USA, AMC, WGN, WOR, why do we need another one? This was in the fall.
Come spring, Ted fixed their little red wagons good. The previous
spring, NBA playoffs wore on TBS, now they were on TNT (and still are).
And everyone gets TNT now.

So, ESPN should put NFL football and baseball on ESPN2, and leave
hockey on ESPN. And if cable co.'s play games and drop ESPN
in favor of ESPN2, ESPN should alternate baseball and football between
channels every week.

But, do the ESPN guys collectively have the gonads of the Turner guy?
-- 
Mike Eisler, mre@Eng.Sun.Com  ``Not only are they [Leafs] the best team, but
 their fans are even more intelligent and insightful than Pittsburgh's.  Their
 players are mighty bright, too.  I mean, he really *was* going to get his
 wallet back, right?'' Jan Brittenson 3/93, on Leaf/Pen woofers in
 rec.sport.hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54115
From: ingo@sunee.uwaterloo.ca (Electroholic)
Subject: Re: LIST OF TEE TIMES AT METROPOLITAN TORONTO GOLF COURSES FOR MONDAY

In article <1993Apr20.194441.23595@julian.uwo.ca> lee139@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (Steve Lee) writes:
>
>In article <C5spEC.EuC@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber) writes:
>
>>Kevin L. Stamber
>>Purdue University
>>...and Phil Kirzyc (The Kielbasa Kid) will roam the Arena for interviews.
>
>
>Woops!  This is rec.sport.hockey! Not rec.sport.golf!  Hope you check the
>newsgroup header next time before posting!
>
>Steve

	If the Leaf's play like they did in game one they're going to need
these!  Watching that game _really_ hurt!



					Cheers!
						i.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|  ingo@sunee.uwaterloo.ca                   | The more violent the body     |
|  iwweigel@descartes.uwaterloo.ca           | contact of the sports you     | 
|  ingo@electrical.watstar.uwaterloo.ca      | watch, the lower your class.  |
|  iwweigele@electrical.watstar.uwaterloo.ca |         -- Paul Fussell       |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If the University of Waterloo had on opinion, this probably wouldn't be it...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54116
From: jbrown@vax.cns.muskingum.edu
Subject: ESPN cares less about hockey

ESPN is pathetic, I have been watching everybody complain about ESPN's coverage
and I agree with all of you.  Might I suggest that we are getting all worked up
over nothing.  We ALL knew that ESPN's coverage was going to suck.  I mean have
you ever watched during the regular season Sportscenter coverage of hockey? It
sucks, I mean really sucks!!!  ESPN does not know hockey if it shot them in the
ass.  I was really pissed of about last night, coverage.  I go to school in Ohio
I *know* the Indians suck, so why show them?  If I were Bill Clement I would
shoot myself.

Anyway after I calmed down after I realized that they were not going to show
overtime of the Caps Isles game I thought to myself I knew that this was going
to happen, in fact I remerbed myself praying that at least they would keep even
the boring Devils game.

Overall I think ESPN does not care if they show hockey or not and I firmly
belive that they have know respect for the fans. ie *because of contract       
obligations*, screw you ESPN.

Praise be to all hockey fans who put up with this shit!

GO HAWKS!!!

JB

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54117
From: rick@emma.tfbbs.wimsey.bc.ca (Rick Younie)
Subject: stats for hockey pool

I'm the keeper of the stats for a family hockey pool and I'm looking
for daily/weekly email servers for playoff stats.  I've connected with
the servers at J.Militzok@skidmore.EDU and wilson@cs.ucf.edu.  I'm
still sorting these two out.

Are there others?  Email please as my site doesn't get this group.

Thanks.

Rick
--
 rick@emma.panam.wimsey.bc.ca
 rick@emma.tfbbs.wimsey.bc.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54118
From: steven.kipling@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Steven Kipling) 
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

 -=> Quoting Cire Y. Trehguad to All <=-
CYT> : Michael Collingridge writes:
 : >And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
 : >resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
 : >team captain trivia would be appreciated.
 CYT> ;
 CYT> : Wasn't Ron Francis captain of the Whalers when he was traded to
 CYT> : Pittsburgh?

 CYT> And Rick Tochett was the captain of the Flyers when traded to the Pens
 CYT> recently...

 CYT> Caleb

 CYT> And let us not forget that the New Jersey Devils traded
 CYT> captain Kirk Muller for Stephen Richer and Chorske

 CYT> Man I hated that trade!


        Well as for team captains being traded
        in there first year in the NHL the
        Edmonton Oilers traded their captain
        Ron Chiperfield to the Quebec Nordique
        right at the trading deadline for 
        Goaltender Ron Lowe
        In their second year of existence
        The Edmonton Oilers again right at the trade 
        deadline traded their captain, this time 
        B.J. McDonald to the Vancouver Canucks
        along with the rights to winger Ken 
        Berry for Garry Lariviere and the rights 
        to Lars Gunner Petterson 
        
        as for more captain trivia, the next Edmonton
        captain was Lee Fogilin who was later traded to
        the Buffalo Sabres, after him was Wayne Gretzky
        who was traded to L A, then came Kevin Low who
        only this year was traded to the N Y Rangers
        so that every captain the Edmonton Oilers have had
        has been traded.

        The present captain is Craig McTavish and we'll
        just have to wait and see.


        well talk to you later

        Steve


... Answers: $1, Short: $5, Correct: $25, dumb looks are still free.
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
                                                                                                                  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54119
From: malinich@bucknell.edu (Tom Malinich)
Subject: Montreal Canadiens

Are there any Montreal Canadiens fans out there who can let me the radio
station(s) which are playing the playoff series (including short wave radio
frequencies)?  Lewisburg, PA (home of Bucknell University) is definitely
not a hockey town! 

Please send responses to malinich@bucknell.edu

Thanks!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54120
From: icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera)
Subject: Re:WJR in Boston


	In the Boston area, you can hear the Rangers on WFAN and the Devils
on WABC, the Whalers on WTIC and the Red Wings on WJR. This of course is in
addition to the Bruins who are currently on WEEI but may move to WHDH because
the fools at WEEI are owned by the Celtics and thus will show them over the
Bruins every time there is a conflict. You can also get WBAL Baltimore but
I don't think they have hockey. BTW, I once got a station from Indiana that
had Fort Wayne Comets games.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54121
From: ccohen@pitt.edu (Caleb N Cohen)
Subject: Re: ESPN sucks: OT or Baseball?  Guess which.

In article <C5tC87.Aty@ccu.umanitoba.ca> umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca writes:
: >Showing a meaningless (relatively) baseball game over the overtime of
: >game that was tied up with less than 3 seconds left on the clock?

What actually happened.  After the Pens game, i turned to ESPN and the game
was nearly at the end of regular, then the phone rang.  I turened off the 
TV - later when i turned it back on, the Indians were on...  Then a
little later, the hockey games was on again, then the baseball game...
what was actually on - not that it matters any more, but some hockey was
in deed on...



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54122
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: Goodbye, good riddance, get lost 'Stars

In article <DT642B1w165w@sms.business.uwo.ca> s4lawren@sms.business.uwo.ca (Stephen Lawrence) writes:
>        Goodbye Minnesota,...you never earned the right to have an NHL 
>franchise in the first place!
>Whatta weird town!!!!!

	Whatta ass!!!!!


-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54123
From: Young-Soo Che <yc25+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: NHLPA poll (partial stats/results)

All these people who send in their polls should take a closer look at
NJD, they are a very deep team, with two very capable goalies, and
excellent forwards and defensemen.  Shooter in Richer, an all around do
it all in Todd, chef Stasny-master of a thousand dishes, power play
captain-Stevens.  Take a look at the numbers, or play with them and see
for yourselves.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54124
From: lange@reg.triumf.ca (THREADING THE CANADIAN TAPESTRY)
Subject: Detroit Playoff Tradition

Way back in the early years (~50's) it took 8 wins to garner the Stanley Cup. 
Soooooo, a couple of local fish mongers (local to the Joe Louis Arena, that is)
started the tradition of throwing an octopi onto the ice with every win.  After
each victory, one leg would be severed before the octopus found its way to the
ice.  (They are dead by the way.)  It was a brilliant marketing strategy to
shore up the demand for one of their least popular products.

Hope this helps.

J. Lange


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54125
From: d_jaracz@oz.plymouth.edu (David R. Jaracz)
Subject: Re: Peter Forsberg

In article <19930423112743.cvincent@poolman.ucs.mun.ca> cvincent@morgan.ucs.mun.ca  (Carl Vincent) writes:
>In Article <1993Apr23.020006.583@spang.Camosun.BC.CA> "ua256@freenet.Victoria.BC.CA (Tom Moffat)" says:
>> 
>> Can some on e give me some stats on Forsrg in the World Championships
>> 
>> If sao mail to ua256@freenet.victoria.bc.ca
>> 
>> -- 
>> Tom Moffat
>> Victoria B.C.
>> Canada
>> 
>Here are the top point getters in the World Jr Hockey Championships:	
>   
>                  G   A  P  
>Forsberg,SWE      7  24 31 <<I am SOOO glad I have both these guys on my
>Naslund,SWE      13  11 24 <<rotisserrie team.  But then again, w/ Mario,
>Vyborny,CZE-SLO   6   9 15   Bure, Gretzky, Neely, P. Turgeon, Damphousse,
>Sundstrom,SWE    10   4 14   Lebeau and Juneau, dunno how much time
>Lehtinen,FIN      6   8 14   they'll get.. :) :) :)
> 



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54126
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

Valerie S. Hammerl (hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu) wrote:
: In article <1993Apr17.062622.25380@news.clarkson.edu> farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy) writes:

: >In fact, the tradition has been passed down to their affiliate
: >in Adirondack. In Gm 6 of last yr's finals, an 8 legged creature was
: >hurled onto the frozen pond and landed right at the feet of ref
: >Lance Roberts.

: It may have been passed to Toronto, but I've even seen an octopus at
: the Aud -- last year's Bruins-Sabres game.  I knew all about the
: Detroit version, but seeing at the Aud was a bit puzzling.  :-)

I don't think it's puzzling a bit. It's called "unoriginality".

(no, i'm not bitter :)

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54127
From: bks2@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (bryan.k.strouse)
Subject: NHL PLAYOFFS RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4-20-93



NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR 4/20/93.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                  CONFERENCE SEMI-FINALS        BEST OF SEVEN
      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE
 
 NJ                  BUF   (leads 2-0)   STL   (leads 1-0)   WIN               
 PIT   (leads 2-0)   BOS                 CHI                 VAN   (leads 1-0)

 NYI   (tied  1-1)   MON                 TOR                 LA    (leads 1-0) 
 WAS                 QUE   (leads 2-0)   DET   (leads 1-0)   CAL              

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

New Jersey Devils                         0   0   0   -   0
Pittsburgh Penguins  (leads series 2-0)   2   4   1   -   7

1st period: PIT, McEachern 1 - (Francis, Taglianetti) 15:09
	    PIT, M.Lemieux 3 - (U.Samuelsson, Barrasso) (sh) 17:41

2nd period: PIT, Tocchet 2 - (K.Stevens, U.Samuelsson) 3:48
	    PIT, Jagr 2 - (Francis, Ramsey) 12:39
	    PIT, K.Stevens 1 - (Francis, Murphy) (pp) 15:43 
	    PIT, McEachern 2 - (Daniels, Mullen) 16:46

3rd period: PIT, Mullen 1 - (Francis, Barrasso) 17:42

Powerplay Opportunities-Devils   0 of 5
			Penguins 1 of 4

Shots on Goal-	Devils    12  11  13  -  36
		Penguins  13  10   4  -  27

New Jersey Devils--Terreri (0-2) (23 shots - 17 saves)  Billington (0:00 third)
	     	   (4 shots - 3 saves)
Pittsburgh Penguins--Barrasso (2-0) (36 shots - 36 saves)

ATT-16,164

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

New York Islanders   (series tied 1-1)   1   1   2   0   1   -   5
Washington Capitals                      0   2   2   0   0   -   4

1st period: NYI, Turgeon 1 - (King, Thomas) 13:14

2nd period: WAS, Hunter 3 - (Johansson, Miller) 6:33
	    NYI, Turgeon 2 - (Thomas, Vaske) 12:36
	    WAS, Hunter 4 - (Johansson, Carpenter) (pp) 16:51

3rd period: NYI, Hogue 1 - 3:31
	    WAS, Khristich 2 - (Cavallini, Bondra) 7:16
	    NYI, Ferraro 2 - (Flatley, Hogue) 14:50
	    WAS, Hunter 5 - (Johansson, Khristich) (pp) 19:57

1 Overtime: NONE

2 Overtime: NYI, Mullen 1 - (Ferraro, Flatley) 14:15

Powerplay Opportunities-Islanders 0 of 5
			Capitals  2 of 5

Shots on Goal-	Islanders  14  17   8  13   9  -  61
		Capitals    6   9  11  14   5  -  45

New York Islanders--Healy (1-1) (45 shots - 41 saves)
Washington Capitals--Tabaracci (1-1) (61 shots - 56 saves)

ATT-15,421

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Montreal Canadiens                       0   0   1   -   1
Quebec Nordiques    (leads series 2-0)   3   0   1   -   4

1st period: QUE, Leschyshyn 1 - (Kamensky, Sakic) (pp) 4:19
	    QUE, Young 2 - (Lapointe) 11:41
	    QUE, Young 3 - (Lapointe, Duchesne) 13:56

2nd period: NONE

3rd period: MON, Bellows 2 - (Odelein) 11:05
	    QUE, Lapointe 1 - (Ricci) (en) 19:23

Powerplay Opportunities-Canadiens 0 of 1
			Nordiques 1 of 2

Shots on Goal-	Canadiens   8  10  15  -  33
		Nordiques  18  14   6  -  38

Montreal Canadiens--Roy (0-2) (37 shots - 34 saves)
Quebec Nordiques--Hextall (2-0) (33 shots - 32 saves)

ATT-15,399

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Buffalo Sabres  (leads series 2-0)   2   1   1   -   4
Boston Bruins                        0   0   0   -   0

1st period: BUF, Presley 1 - (sh) 4:27
	    BUF, Wood 1 - (Houlder, B.Sweeney) (pp) 8:07

2nd period: BUF, Mogilny 3 - (LaFontaine) 5:03
	   
3rd period: BUF, Hawerchuk 1 - (Carney, Smehlik) (pp) 14:48

Powerplay Opportunities-Sabres 2 of 4
			Bruins 0 of 5

Shots on Goal-	Sabres   9   8   8  -  25
		Bruins  14  12   8  -  34

Buffalo Sabres--Fuhr (2-0) (34 shots - 34 saves)
Boston Bruins--Moog (0-2) (10 shots - 7 saves)  Blue (5:03 second) (15 shots -
	       14 saves)

ATT-14,448

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


\|||||/
-SPIKE-




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54128
From: loh@fraser.sfu.ca (Keith Meng-Wei Loh)
Subject: Re: ESPN cares less about hockey

jbrown@vax.cns.muskingum.edu writes:

>ESPN is pathetic, I have been watching everybody complain about ESPN's coverage
>and I agree with all of you.  Might I suggest that we are getting all worked up
>over nothing.  We ALL knew that ESPN's coverage was going to suck.  I mean have
>you ever watched during the regular season Sportscenter coverage of hockey? It
>sucks, I mean really sucks!!!  ESPN does not know hockey if it shot them in the
>ass.  I was really pissed of about last night, coverage.  I go to school in Ohio
>I *know* the Indians suck, so why show them?  If I were Bill Clement I would
>shoot myself.

I hope this makes you feel better, but the overtime between the Isles and
the Caps was GREAT!!! 


Hang in there. :) 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54129
From: chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Subject: Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!

nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:

>And Cherbayev was initially supposed to play for the Russian WC Team.  (Anybody
>know what happened there?)

Yeah, they finally came to agreement on a contract. As soon as the ink was
dry, he suddenly decided Kansas City was a neat place to be. (ergo, the
"want to play for the national team" was a bargaining chip).

-- 
 Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= chuq@apple.com
   Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms =+=  GEnie: MAC.BIGOT =+= ALink:CHUQ 
  Minor League fans: minors-request@medraut.apple.com (San Jose Giants: A/1/9)
  San Francisco Giants fans: giants-request@medraut.apple.com (The Stick?NOT!)
   San Jose Sharks fans: sharks-request@medraut.apple.com (New seat: 127/TBD)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54130
From: kfrank@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Kevin D Frank)
Subject: Re: Area-code for Edmonton, Alberta, CANADA...

Believe it or not, we DO have phone books, but the current information does
not include an area code for Edmonton Alberta.

I would not be so hostile towards others for asking simple questions...

"I would rather appear stupid than open my moutha nd remove all doubt."
							-Mark Twain

-- 
	"If you assult someone you get 5 years--In hockey, 5 minutes.
			Is this a great sport or what?!"

Kevin D. Frank					kfrank@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54131
From: Bhullar@BLDG_HSC_CAMPUS (Raj BHULLAR)
Subject: Buffalo Sabres

Can the Sabres win two more games against the Bruins?

I think game three in Buffalo will be the most important of the
series.  If the Sabres lose that game, the party will be over.  It will 
be hello next year.

The key for the remaining games in the series will be whether Fuhr can
keep up his brillliant goaltending and if Mogilny can continue skate by 
the Bruins.  He has shown demonstrated excellent speed.

Finally, the Sabres appear to have shown up for the post season.






Sabres/Bills Fan      

   

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54132
From: Mark D. Whitten <347NFET@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: If You Were Pat Burns ...

If I were Pat Burns I'd throw in the towel. The wings dominated every
aspect of the game.  Trying to mix up the lines is a dead end.  Murray
has too many combinations to counter with. My prediction is wings in 5.

Mark
Let's Go Wings!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54133
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: Grant Fuhr leads Sabres

  Buffalo is up 2-0 is the series with Boston, and the reason....Grant Fuhr ?
  Fuhr is playoff hungry, and he's proving once again why they call him
  money goaltender. Fuhr might not be one of the best goaltenders in the
  league anymore (Statistically at least), but he's proving that he can
  make the big save at the right time.
  
  The Leafs should have kept Fuhr, and probably would have had a chance 
  against powerhouse Detroit. But again.......where was Andreychoke in game 1 ?

  I can see the huge smile on Gerald's face after Fuhr's performance.
 
  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54134
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Roger Maynard

Does anyone recieve annoying email from Roger Maynard whenever they post an
article telling them to leave him alon and stop posting to the group??
These emails are filled with insults- more than are usual in Roger's posts
and have little if any hockey info.
I have recieved two in the last 2 days.
I am just wondering if I am special or Roger trys to bully everyone who
disagrees with him.

Gregmeister

Obligatory hockey comment:

It is highly unlikely that the Maple Leafs will even get out of their
division.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54135
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: Goodbye, good riddance, get lost 'Stars

In article <1993Apr21.070706.21059@julian.uwo.ca> kirk@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (ANDREW KIRK) writes:
>Back to hockey,
>the North Stars should be moved because for the past few years they have
>just been SHIT. A real team like Toronto would never be moved!!!

	Well, if SHIT means going to the Stanley Cup finals a couple years
ago, I'd rather be shit than a leaf fan.

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54136
From: kerryy@bnr.ca (Kerry Yackoboski)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here

In article <MfpIRbO00WBLI1ispC@andrew.cmu.edu>, "William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
|> 
|>      As a person who has rarely even SEEN Don Cherry and doesn't know
|> anything about him, I don't know whether it is just this area
|> (Pittsburgh) of the USA that is "deprived" of his broadcasts or whether
|> he's a Canadian thing altogether.  Seriously, what is he all about?  I
|> know he was a coach at one time, and from the volume of posts about him,
|> SOMEONE surely is getting a steady diet of him somehow, but my question
|> is, what is the deal with him?  Secondly, are the comments of his that I
|> read about on the net merely flame bait, or do people actually take him
|> seriously?  I gotta tell you, from what I see, he really sounds like an
|> ass.  Let me know - maybe I'm missing something.

I asked him, and Don Cherry denies being Roger Maynard and he denies
any knowledge of Usenet. :-)

He did concede that Roger is the best two way poster on the net today.
His defense is as good as his offence.... :-)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54137
From: 35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca
Subject: Re: Area-code for Edmonton, Alberta, CANADA...

In article <1993Apr22.232317.6924@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>, kfrank@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Kevin D Frank) writes:
> I'm trying to get ahold of the directory assistance operator in Edmonton, but
> I need the area code to do so.  If you know it, please e-mail me directly as
> I have little time to scan through all the posts.
> 
> Much appreciated!!!

Geez, I didn't realize things were so bad at Ohio State that they can't
afford phone books, or even operators.

This is probably Clinton's fault, isn't it...8^)

403.

Paul Badertscher
35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54138
From: 35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca
Subject: CBC: Canadian for ESPN.

Hooray, I hear on TSN that the Jets have won a game, Selanne
getting a hat-trick!

Of course, here in GOD'S COUNTRY (read Ontario!) I couldn't
see that game, nor any other in the VAN-WPG series so far,
because our beloved CBC figures no one out here cares about
this series (which has looked pretty competitve so far...

On Monday and Wednesday nights, CBC could have shown the Toronto-
Detroit game, done the news, then picked up Winnipeg-Vancouver.
They didn't.  Tonight?  You guessed it, Toronto-Detroit, the
news (not the end of the Jets game), then Calgary-LA.

SO, if it's "Hockey Night in Canada", why can't this Ontarian see
one of the two series with two Canadian teams?  Is this too much to
ask?

Paul Badertscher
35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54139
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: Jets/Canucks - Jets hold on, win 5-4

Teemu Selanne had 3 goals, Keith Tkachuk had one, and Luciano Borsato
scored a rare Jets shorthanded goal as the Jets held on to beat the
Canucks 5-4, and close the series to 2-1.  Trevor Linden and Pavel
Bure had two goals each for the Canucks in a losing cause.

Selanne came out of a two game goal scoring slump, scoring two powerplay
goals, and one on a nice breakaway pass from Darrin Shannon.

Hard work paid off tonight for the Jets, and if the Jets continue to
exhibit this strong work effort, they can make a series of it. (I woofed
last year when we were up 3-1...I ain't going to do THAT again.  I'll
have to be quietly happy with a solid performance.  ;)

Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54158
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Devils and Islanders tiebreaker????

In article <C5LFA4.E10@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> cal2d@csissun11.ee.Virginia.EDU (Craig Allen Lorie) writes:
>According to the hockey gurus over at ESPN, should the Islanders win tonite
>the two teams will have the same record, but the Devils will be playing the
>Penguins.  This is because the Islanders have won the season series against
>the Devils.  I think the rules for deciding a tie breaker include:
>
>1.  season series
>2.  goals against
>3.  goals for
>
>in this order (correct me if I'm wrong).  Anyone have anything to add?
>

I thought it was 1) wins 2) goals for.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54159
From: fgiraffe@well.sf.ca.us (Frank Giraffe)
Subject: Re: SHARKS: Jack Feirerra (was Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!)


>        - broadcast more home games than away games
>        - broadcast very few road Pacific and Mountain time games
>        - jack up my ticket prices from $27 to $38 in two years (not that
I'm
>                going to pay 120 bucks for 3 seats. I'll probably next to
the
>                virtual 107 folks)
>        - not tell me my priority #
>        - not let me sell my priority #
>        - in order for me to get the free jacket, force me to order my
tickets
>                for next season before I get to select my section
>        - not let me park at the new arena after paying for their

Grrrr, let's start a whole 'nother topic on show bad the sharks are doing on
these things. I swear that ALL of my partial plan games were televised (I
know, I'm exaggerating, but...).
In order:
-the new ticket prices suck
-wait 'till people try to park at games next year. Public transit? Yeah
right, I'd love to take caltrain for 3 hours to see a 3 hour game.

Shelling out hundreds of dollars for partial season plans for two years
doesnt mean anything to the sharks, as I get to pick my seats after the dead
rise from their graves to claim their seats! :-)
-Frank
-- 
>Frank Giraffe- fgiraffe@well.sf.ca.us - {apple,pacbell,ucbvax}!well!fgiraffe
>As the noose of narco-militarism tightens 'round our necks, we worry about
>  burning flags and pee in jars at work to keep our jobs.  -- Jello Biafra

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54160
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here

In article <MfpIRbO00WBLI1ispC@andrew.cmu.edu> "William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>     As a person who has rarely even SEEN Don Cherry and doesn't know
>anything about him, I don't know whether it is just this area
>(Pittsburgh) of the USA that is "deprived" of his broadcasts or whether
>he's a Canadian thing altogether.  Seriously, what is he all about?  I

He's a Canadian "thing". Former coach of the Boston Bruins and Colorado
Rockies. From the summaries that get posted I gather that his ongoing beef
this year has been the conventional wisdom that Canadian hockey is doomed
to be second or third rate behind the perceived emergence of the U.S.
and European programs.

>know he was a coach at one time, and from the volume of posts about him,
>SOMEONE surely is getting a steady diet of him somehow, but my question
>is, what is the deal with him?  Secondly, are the comments of his that I

After he left the Rockies, he got a job with CBC's Hockey Night in Canada
and hasn't looked back since. Actually, he did work for CBC at least
on playoff season after the Rockies were eliminated.

>read about on the net merely flame bait, or do people actually take him
>seriously?  I gotta tell you, from what I see, he really sounds like an

I'd say it's a combination of flame bait and serious journalism. The closest
thing you'll find to Cherry in the U.S. is Stan Fischler, a self-described
hockey maven. The similarities are that they both say things that get
people upset. The difference is that Cherry knows the game and Fischler
doesn't.

>ass.  Let me know - maybe I'm missing something.

Don's a character. If he were completely rational and noncontroversial
he wouldn't have a job. By some definitions, he could be called an ass.
But then some people feel the same about Mike Lang, another character that
I wish would get wider exposure (only one national telecast last year).
-- 
Mike Eisler, mre@Eng.Sun.Com  ``Not only are they [Leafs] the best team, but
 their fans are even more intelligent and insightful than Pittsburgh's.  Their
 players are mighty bright, too.  I mean, he really *was* going to get his
 wallet back, right?'' Jan Brittenson 3/93, on Leaf/Pen woofers in
 rec.sport.hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54161
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Goalie mask poll update 4/21/93

Current votes for favorite goalie masks (3pts - 1st, 2pts - 2nd, 1pt - 3rd)

Player                    Team                 Pts       Votes
--------------------------------------------------------------
1. Ed Belfour             Chicago              31         14
2. Andy Moog              Boston               30         13
3. Curtis Joseph          St. Louis            26         11 
   Brian Hayward          San Jose             26         10 
5. Ron Hextall            Quebec               16          8
6. Gerry Cheevers         Boston (retired)     11          6 
7. John Vanbeisbrouck     NY Rangers           10          4
   Grant Fuhr             Buffalo              10          4 
9. Mike Richter           NY Rangers            6          3
10. Manon Rheaume         Atlanta (IHL)         5          2
11. Don Beaupre           Washington            4          2
    Ken Dryden            Montreal (retired)    4          2
--------------------------------------------------------------
Others receiving less than 4pts: Mike Vernon (Cal), Clint
 Malarchuk (Buf/SD,IHL), Tommy Soderstrom (Phil), Ray LeBlanc (USA),
 Artus Irbe (SJ), Tim Cheveldae (Det), Sean Burke (NJ),
 Rick Wamsley (Tor,ret), Jon Casey (Minn), Bob Essensa (Win),
 Glenn Healy (NYI), Toy Espo (???), Gilles Gratton (???),
 Rod Stauber (LA), Gump Worsley (???), Pat Jablonski (TB),
 Grant Fuhr (Tor), Felix Potvin (Tor), Stephane Beauregard (Win),
 Mark Fitzpatrick (NYI), Chico Resch (NYI)


Can someone please tell me which teams the (???) play(ed) for? Thanks.

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54162
From: slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains 

ST>         as for more captain trivia, the next Edmonton
ST>         catain was Lee Fogilin who was later traded to
ST>         the Buffalo Sabres, after him was Wayne Gretzky
ST>         who w   traded to L A, then came Kevin Low who
ST>         nly this year was traded to the N Y Rangers
 
Wasn't Mark Messier Captain of the oilers before Kevin Lowe?
But, of course, he was traded as well -- so your point of every
Oilers captain being traded is still true.
 
Stephen Legge
SLEGGE@kean.ucs.mun.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54163
From: cdash@moet.cs.colorado.edu (Charles Shub)
Subject: ESPN really sucks big time


so all us hockey/automobile racing fans all know exactly where we stand
	ESPN delays the martinsville race by a day for the NFL draft
	ESPN shows baseball instead of the overtime of a NHL playoff game

	gimme a break, guys

=>  >>Does anyone know why this race is tape delay? Especially until Monday???
=>  >Is this the weekend for the NFL draft?
=>  >If so, postponing the race for a day is
=>  >a real slap in the face for racing fans.
=>  I'm afraid you're right (as usual). As I recall they've been doing this
=>  ever since they started covering the draft live. I wish they could work
=>  out some kind of a deal with somebody else such as TNN to get the race
=>  on live, but I guess ESPN isn't much into sharing. It also clarifies
=>  where auto racing stands on their priority list (as if we didn't already
=>  know ;-)
-- 

charlie shub  cdash@cs.Colorado.EDU       -or-         (719) 593-3492     
on leave at the University of Iowa  cdash@cs.uiowa.edu (319) 335-0739

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54164
From: tvartiai@vipunen.hut.fi (Tommi Vartiainen)
Subject: Re: Finland/Sweden vs.NHL teams (WAS:Helsinki/Stockholm & NHL expansion)

In <1993Apr16.195754.5476@ousrvr.oulu.fi> mep@phoenix.oulu.fi (Marko Poutiainen) writes:

>: FINLAND:  
>: 
>: D-Jyrki Lumme.......20
>: D-Teppo Numminen....20
>: D-Peter Ahola.......13
>: 
>Well well, they don't like our defenders (mainly Lumme and Numminen)...

About 25 is correct for Numminen and Lumme.


>: R-Teemu Selanne.....27
>: 
>Compared to Kurri, Selanne's points are too high, lets make it 25 or 26.

No, Kurri's points are too low. 27 for Kurri and 28 for Sel{nne.

>: well in the Canada Cup and World Championships largely due to the efforts of
>: Markus Ketterer (the goalie), 3-4 or the players listed above and luck. There's
>: presumably a lot of decent players in Finland that wouldn't be superstars at
>: the highest level but still valuable role players, however. My guess would be
>: that the Finnish Canada Cup team would be a .500 team in the NHL.

>Wow, now, it looks like you don't like our players? What about guys like:
>Nieminen, Jutila, Riihijarvi, Varvio, Laukkanen, Makela, Keskinen and (even
>if he is aging) Ruotsalainen? The main difference between finnish and North-
>American players is, that our players tend to be better in the larger rink.
>The Canadian defenders are usually slower that defenders in Europe. 
>And I think that there was more in our success than Ketterer and luck (though
>they helped). I think that the main reason was, that the team worked well
>together.


That's true. Game is so different here in Europe compared to NHL. North-ame-
ricans are better in small rinks and europeans in large rinks. An average
european player from Sweden, Finland, Russian or Tsech/Slovakia is a better 
skater and  puckhandler than his NHL colleague. Especially defenders in NHL
are mainly slow and clumsy. Sel{nne has also said that in the Finnish Sm-league
game is more based on skill than in NHL. In Finland he couldn't get so many 
breakaways because defenders here are an average much better skaters than in
NHL. Also Alpo Suhonen said that in NHL Sel{nne's speed accentuates because
of clumsy defensemen.

I have to admit that the best players come from Canada, but those regulars
aren't as skilful as regulars in the best european leagues. Also top europeans
are in the same level as the best north-americans.(except Lemieux is in the
class of his own). 

Tommi

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54165
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: RUMOUR - Keenan signs with Rangers?

In article <1993Apr16.185823.6310@news.columbia.edu> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>
>Interestingly, Keenan's co-coach (or is it his "Number One"?) on Team
>Canada at the World Championships is Roger Neilsen.  
>

But ultimately their hockey philosophies are like night and day...
Keenan believes in pressuring the opposition and taking the
initiative (within the limits of his system)...while Roger
has a reactive hockey philosophy...which is why Messier will
be able to and has played for Keenan, but thought Roger's way
was a sure loser.

>It'd be interesting if the Rangers call in the balance of Neilsen's
>contract to be Keenan's assistant ...  Roger did do a very good job
>with the mediocre players, just as he handled the Cinderella Canucks
>of 10 years ago ... but his mistake was playing the Rangers like those
>Canucks last May ...
>

Roger is a great assistant coach...but considering what must be bad
blood between Nielson and Messier, it would be a mistake to bring
him back even in that role.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54166
From: gomer+@pitt.edu (Richard J Coyle)
Subject: Re: Goodbye, good riddance, get lost 'Stars

In article <1993Apr21.070706.21059@julian.uwo.ca> kirk@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (ANDREW KIRK) writes:
>Losers like us? You are the fucking moron who has never heard of the Western
>Business School, or the University of Western Ontario for that matter. Why 
>don't you pull your head out of your asshole and smell something other than
>shit for once so you can look on a map to see where UWO is! Back to hockey,
>the North Stars should be moved because for the past few years they have
>just been SHIT. A real team like Toronto would never be moved!!!

Not only have I not heard of the Western Business School, or the University
of Western Ontario, I've never even wondered if there WAS a western
Ontario.  And judging by the quality of the posts coming from there, I'm
still not sure that the place exists.

Perhaps I should be impressed, though, since it appears that grade school
children in that area have access to the Internet.

rick

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54167
From: mckinzie@schaefer.math.wisc.edu (Mark McKinzie)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here

"William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:


>     As a person who has rarely even SEEN Don Cherry and doesn't know
>anything about him, I don't know whether it is just this area
>(Pittsburgh) of the USA that is "deprived" of his broadcasts or whether
>he's a Canadian thing altogether.  Seriously, what is he all about?  I
>know he was a coach at one time, and from the volume of posts about him,
>SOMEONE surely is getting a steady diet of him somehow, but my question
>is, what is the deal with him?  Secondly, are the comments of his that I
>read about on the net merely flame bait, or do people actually take him
>seriously?  I gotta tell you, from what I see, he really sounds like an
>ass.  Let me know - maybe I'm missing something.

From his Topps "rookie" year (as coach) card (74-75):
"For the past couple of seasons, Don has been the highly-successful
 coach of the Rochester Americans of the AHL, but he is getting his
 first shot at an NHL job with the Bruins.  Named Coach of the Year
 in the AHL the last two years, and he aims to make the Bruins a
 rough team again, as they were a couple of years back.  Although
 he played 16 seasons of professional hockey, Don never played a
 regular-season NHL game.  He did appear in one playoff game for
 Boston in 1956-57.  Don's brother, Dick, played two seasons in the
 NHL with Boston and Philadelphia."



-- 
Mark McKinzie          |    Listen, if they're going to buy lunch boxes,
mckinzie@math.wisc.edu | they might as well buy David Cassidy lunch boxes.
UW Dept. of Mathematics|
Madison, WI 53706      |                  -David Cassidy-

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54168
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Hockey Draft Final Standings

Here are the final stadings for the USENET Hockey Draft.  Congratulations
to this year's winner, Dave Wessels of Victoria, B.C., who parlayed his
initial 1000 points into 1575.9 points!

Thanks to all 262 teams for entering the biggest USENET Hockey Draft ever!
I hope to hear from you all again this September, for the 7th Annual draft.

It has been my pleasure running the draft, and I hope you all had fun.

	- Andrew

USENET Hockey Draft Standings
Week 28

Posn	Team				Total	Pts	Cash	Last Posn

1.	Dave Wessels                    1575.9	1574	1.9	(1)
2.	Gilles Carmel                   1539.0	1538	1.0	(3)
	Bob Hill                        1539.0	1515	24.0	(2)
4.	Seppo Kemppainen                1515.2	1468	47.2	(4)
5.	The Awesome Oilers              1513.0	1458	68.6	(5)
6.	Hillside Raiders                1503.0	1496	7.0	(6)
7.	Mak "The Knife" Paranjape       1500.0	1469	31.0	(7)
8.	Jan Stein                       1492.3	1457	35.3	(8)
9.	this years model                1488.6	1471	17.6	(9)
10.	Tapio Repo                      1486.6	1467	19.6	(10)
11.	Rangers Of Destiny              1486.0	1444	42.0	(10)
12.	The Underachievers              1459.1	1449	10.1	(13)
13.	FRANK'S BIG FISH                1457.0	1435	22.0	(12)
14.	Go Flames                       1448.3	1408	40.3	(15)
15.	On Thin Ice                     1444.3	1412	32.3	(14)
16.	Mopar Muscle Men                1441.7	1438	3.7	(17)
17.	littlest giants                 1439.6	1404	35.6	(16)
18.	Lindros Losers                  1427.7	1426	1.7	(18)
19.	DIE Penguin Bandwaggoners       1412.2	1392	20.2	(19)
20.	Samuel Lau (Calgary, Alberta)   1401.9	1397	4.9	(20)
21.	Boomer's Boys                   1374.2	1374	0.2	(21)
22.	Delaware Wombats                1372.3	1371	1.3	(23)
23.	General Accounting Office       1365.9	1345	20.9	(22)
24.	Migods Menschen                 1365.6	1334	31.6	(24)
25.	Wellsy's Buttheads DEC NH       1363.6	1311	52.6	(25)
26.	Fife Flyers                     1356.4	1325	31.4	(27)
27.	Rocky Mountain High             1352.8	1351	1.8	(26)
28.	Dave Snell                      1346.0	1321	25.0	(29)
29.	Fluide Glacial                  1341.0	1323	18.0	(30)
30.	Gerald Olchowy                  1337.7	1304	33.7	(28)
31.	Gaoler                          1317.2	1306	11.2	(31)
32.	SmegHeads                       1316.3	1316	0.3	(32)
33.	Neural Netters                  1309.3	1298	11.3	(35)
34.	The Young And The Skateless     1307.9	1265	42.9	(33)
35.	Sam & His Dogs                  1297.6	1286	11.6	(34)
36.	Artic Storm                     1293.3	1254	39.3	(37)
37.	Youngbucs                       1293.0	1238	101.7	(36)
38.	Soft Swedes                     1284.9	1238	46.9	(38)
39.	Simmonac                        1280.8	1260	20.8	(46)
40.	Milton Keynes Kings             1271.8	1269	2.8	(40)
41.	Jeff Horvath                    1266.6	1261	5.6	(39)
42.	Legion of Hoth                  1265.8	1250	15.8	(45)
43.	Le Fleur de Lys                 1264.3	1239	25.3	(43)
44.	Yan The Man Loke                1263.7	1263	0.7	(44)
45.	Kuehn Crushers                  1258.1	1213	45.1	(41)
46.	Hamster from Hoboken            1254.7	1246	8.7	(41)
47.	Streaks                         1249.8	1195	54.8	(49)
48.	Brian Bergman                   1249.3	1226	23.3	(50)
49.	The Finnish Force               1248.5	1226	22.5	(47)
50.	Grant Marven                    1239.9	1237	2.9	(53)
51.	ice legion                      1239.8	1211	28.8	(48)
52.	Goaldingers                     1237.0	1215	22.0	(51)
53.	T C OverAchievers               1231.9	1229	2.9	(52)
54.	Randy Coulman                   1226.2	1221	5.2	(62)
55.	Bozrah Bruins                   1225.2	1180	45.2	(54)
56.	Skriko Wolves                   1223.4	1218	5.4	(57)
57.	buffalo soldiers                1223.0	1168	62.1	(59)
58.	Houdini's Magicians             1221.3	1203	18.3	(56)
59.	Steven And Mark Dream Team      1219.1	1216	3.1	(64)
60.	Real Bad Toe Jam                1216.9	1168	48.9	(55)
61.	rec.sport.hockey choices        1216.3	1215	1.3	(58)
62.	bemybaby                        1216.2	1162	54.2	(60)
63.	LAMP LIGHTERS                   1213.9	1208	5.9	(63)
64.	LIPPE                           1212.9	1199	13.9	(61)
65.	Phil and Kev's Karma Dudes      1205.8	1205	0.8	(69)
66.	Doug Bowles                     1203.0	1183	20.0	(72)
67.	Bloom County All Stars          1202.3	1198	4.3	(67)
68.	Tom                             1202.1	1189	13.1	(66)
69.	Indianapolis Bennies            1197.8	1177	20.8	(65)
70.	Bruins                          1196.1	1196	0.1	(68)
71.	smithw                          1195.0	1174	21.0	(70)
72.	AIK Exiles                      1188.5	1154	34.5	(77)
73.	Iowa Hockeyes                   1188.3	1172	16.3	(71)
74.	Frank Worthless                 1186.3	1180	6.3	(76)
75.	The Great Pumpkin               1183.4	1129	54.4	(73)
76.	NON!                            1182.4	1166	16.4	(74)
77.	shooting seamen                 1180.1	1180	0.1	(75)
78.	Invisible Inc                   1178.1	1177	1.1	(78)
79.	Brad Gibson                     1174.2	1147	27.2	(79)
80.	Cougarmania                     1170.8	1146	24.8	(80)
81.	John Zupancic                   1170.1	1143	27.1	(84)
82.	David Wong                      1166.0	1111	66.1	(83)
83.	garryola                        1165.7	1156	9.7	(85)
84.	Gary Bergman Fan Club           1163.1	1158	5.1	(86)
	Staffan Axelsson                1163.1	1148	15.1	(87)
86.	Kortelaisen Kovat               1158.0	1103	164.1	(81)
87.	Chocolate Rockets               1154.5	1152	2.5	(90)
88.	PLP Fools                       1153.1	1153	0.1	(82)
89.	The Kamucks                     1152.0	1097	76.1	(97)
90.	Chubby Checkers                 1150.3	1134	16.3	(88)
	KODIAKS                         1150.3	1149	1.3	(93)
92.	Derrill's Dastardly Dozen       1150.1	1128	22.1	(89)
93.	Ken DeCruyenaere                1147.0	1142	5.0	(91)
94.	Fisher Dirtbags                 1146.7	1146	0.7	(92)
95.	Neil Younger                    1145.2	1131	14.2	(106)
96.	BSC Oranienburg                 1144.1	1137	7.1	(96)
97.	No Namers                       1138.0	1083	58.2	(94)
98.	Arsenal Maple Leafs             1137.8	1134	3.8	(98)
99.	The Campi Machine               1137.0	1082	65.3	(95)
100.	Mombasa Mosquitos               1131.1	1125	6.1	(100)
101.	Bjoern Leaguen                  1130.0	1127	3.0	(103)
102.	Ellis Islanders                 1123.6	1116	7.6	(99)
103.	Zachmans Wingers                1122.8	1073	49.8	(101)
104.	King Suke                       1120.1	1120	0.1	(108)
105.	Larry                           1116.8	1105	11.8	(109)
106.	VoteNoOct26                     1115.8	1084	31.8	(111)
107.	Bloodgamers                     1115.1	1073	42.1	(112)
	Het Schot Is Hard               1115.1	1097	18.1	(110)
109.	Hurricane Andrew                1114.6	1107	7.6	(107)
110.	Dirty White Socks               1114.4	1071	43.4	(104)
111.	Wormtown Woosbags               1114.0	1059	72.6	(105)
112.	Bruce's Rented Mules            1111.9	1100	11.9	(112)
113.	Oklahoma Stormchasers           1111.3	1083	28.3	(116)
114.	Teem Kanada                     1111.0	1095	16.0	(114)
115.	Edelweiss                       1110.9	1108	2.9	(102)
116.	Frank's Follies                 1110.2	1086	24.2	(115)
117.	Pond Slime                      1109.7	1109	0.7	(118)
118.	SPUDS                           1108.6	1096	12.6	(117)
119.	PSV Dartmouth                   1097.1	1090	7.1	(119)
120.	Kokudo Keikaku Bunnies          1096.3	1056	40.3	(124)
121.	Blue Talon                      1095.3	1082	13.3	(121)
122.	Stanford Ice Hawks              1094.2	1066	28.2	(122)
123.	Timo Ojala                      1088.3	1088	0.3	(125)
124.	Mark Sanders                    1088.1	1077	11.1	(120)
125.	Aye Carumba!!!                  1087.9	1084	3.9	(123)
126.	Dirty Rotten Puckers            1087.2	1086	1.2	(128)
127.	garys team                      1087.1	1070	17.1	(133)
128.	Cluster Buster                  1084.6	1077	7.6	(127)
129.	Haral                           1083.3	1076	7.3	(126)
130.	Apricot Fuzzfaces               1081.3	1058	23.3	(129)
131.	Gary Bill Pens Dynasty          1078.6	1059	19.6	(132)
132.	Seattle PFTB                    1077.9	1055	22.9	(135)
133.	Nesbitt                         1077.1	1076	1.1	(131)
134.	The Lost Poots                  1076.7	1070	6.7	(130)
135.	Le Groupe MI                    1076.2	1046	30.2	(137)
136.	Arctic Circles                  1075.6	1038	37.6	(134)
137.	Late Night with David Letterman 1074.0	1074	0.0	(136)
138.	Wembley LostWeekenders          1071.3	1071	0.3	(145)
139.	Wild Hearted Sons               1068.9	1064	4.9	(143)
140.	Dree Hobbs                      1066.4	1053	13.4	(149)
141.	Closet Boy's Boys               1066.0	1018	48.0	(142)
142.	Scott Glenn                     1065.2	1055	10.2	(139)
143.	GO BRUINS                       1064.2	1058	6.2	(138)
144.	Andy Y F WONG                   1063.5	1042	21.5	(145)
	Book 'em Danno's Bushbabies     1063.5	1053	10.5	(148)
146.	McKees Rocks Rockers            1062.1	1057	5.1	(147)
147.	boutch 92-93                    1062.0	1042	20.0	(144)
148.	team gold                       1060.7	1044	16.7	(141)
149.	Goddess Of Fermentation         1056.2	1026	30.2	(151)
150.	convex stars                    1055.6	1050	5.6	(153)
151.	Flying Kiwis                    1055.1	1046	9.1	(140)
152.	Einstein's Rock Band            1054.0	1054	0.0	(154)
153.	Dr Joel Fleishman               1053.7	1050	3.7	(165)
154.	Tim Rogers                      1053.1	1045	8.1	(152)
155.	MY TEAM                         1053.0	998	174.8	(159)
156.	Tap                             1052.5	1052	0.5	(156)
157.	Sundogs                         1052.4	1052	0.4	(166)
158.	Buttered Waffles                1052.0	1006	46.0	(157)
159.	GO HABS GO                      1051.0	1043	8.0	(150)
160.	Princeton Canucks               1050.0	995	124.2	(155)
161.	Hubert's Hockey Homeboys        1049.6	1049	0.6	(157)
162.	Satan's Choice                  1047.5	1033	14.5	(164)
163.	Bob's Blues                     1046.8	1000	46.8	(160)
164.	Les Nordiques                   1045.0	990	60.4	(162)
165.	Pierre Mailhot                  1044.6	1042	2.6	(167)
166.	furleys furies                  1041.6	1038	3.6	(161)
167.	Slap Shot Marco                 1039.8	988	51.8	(168)
168.	HUNTERS & COLLECTORS            1038.4	996	42.4	(162)
169.	The Dreamers                    1038.0	983	63.7	(173)
170.	San Jose Mahi Mahi              1036.8	1005	31.8	(169)
171.	Jeff Nimeroff                   1034.8	986	48.8	(171)
172.	East City Jokers                1034.0	979	69.1	(174)
173.	The Leafs Rule!!!!              1033.8	1008	25.8	(170)
174.	Darse Billings                  1033.7	999	34.7	(178)
175.	Flowers                         1033.0	978	113.6	(177)
176.	Daryl Turner                    1030.4	1028	2.4	(175)
177.	LANA Inc                        1030.3	1003	27.3	(180)
178.	riding the pine                 1028.7	1008	20.7	(176)
179.	Spinal Tap                      1027.4	986	41.4	(181)
180.	Stimpy ADG Zeta                 1027.0	1006	21.0	(172)
181.	Chappel's Chumps                1024.0	1000	24.0	(179)
182.	Big Bad Bruins                  1023.5	1005	18.5	(184)
183.	Enforcers                       1022.1	994	28.1	(183)
184.	Mike Mac Cormack Sydney NS CAN  1022.0	967	107.2	(186)
	JimParker                       1022.0	967	179.0	(182)
186.	Bulldogs                        1020.4	997	23.4	(187)
187.	Yellow Plague                   1019.2	1005	14.2	(195)
188.	Jeff Bachovchin                 1018.7	972	46.7	(184)
189.	Absolut Lehigh                  1017.9	1009	8.9	(189)
190.	voyageurs                       1015.7	1013	2.7	(188)
191.	Republican Dirty Tricksters     1010.0	955	66.0	(190)
192.	Ninja Turtles                   1009.3	1008	1.3	(196)
193.	Dr.D And The S.O.D.             1009.1	992	17.1	(192)
194.	Henry's Bar B Q                 1008.7	1008	0.7	(191)
195.	Bunch of Misfits                1007.8	984	23.8	(193)
196.	Robyns Team                     1007.0	977	30.0	(194)
197.	Cobra's Killers                 1006.7	975	31.7	(202)
198.	Cherry Bombers                  1005.2	1004	1.2	(203)
199.	Kuta Papercuts                  1003.5	985	18.5	(200)
200.	Great Expectations              998.3	996	2.3	(201)
	Acadien                         998.3	980	18.3	(198)
202.	DARMAN'S Dragons                994.3	966	28.3	(199)
203.	Team Melville                   993.9	947	46.9	(197)
204.	Killer Apes                     990.3	966	24.3	(205)
205.	Kaufbeuren Icebreakers          988.6	951	37.6	(206)
206.	Jayson's Kinky Pucks            987.9	961	26.9	(204)
207.	Roger Smith                     987.6	948	39.6	(208)
208.	Firebirds                       980.9	977	3.9	(209)
209.	IKEA Wholesale                  980.7	979	1.7	(211)
210.	Umpire 4 life                   980.1	969	11.1	(207)
211.	Those 1st few weeks hurt!       980.0	925	55.9	(210)
212.	Outlaws                         975.0	920	164.9	(212)
213.	400 Hurricane                   973.1	941	32.1	(223)
214.	Frack Attack                    972.3	945	27.3	(219)
215.	Believe it or dont              970.1	949	21.1	(215)
216.	Todd's Turkeys                  967.9	966	1.9	(219)
217.	Thundering Herd                 966.0	911	163.6	(214)
218.	Knee Injuries                   965.4	955	10.4	(217)
219.	The 200 Club                    962.8	956	6.8	(213)
220.	fred mckim                      962.0	907	93.0	(222)
221.	Crazy Euros                     961.9	944	17.9	(218)
222.	Creeping Death                  959.3	938	21.3	(216)
223.	Ryan's Renegades                956.9	906	50.9	(221)
224.	pig vomit                       953.3	952	1.3	(224)
225.	Ice Strykers                    952.0	897	105.4	(225)
	dayton bomber                   952.0	952	0.0	(228)
227.	CDN Stuck in Alabama            951.3	941	10.3	(227)
228.	Fighting Geordies               950.0	895	141.6	(226)
229.	Cafall and Crew                 947.3	909	38.3	(229)
230.	Ship's Way                      942.7	934	8.7	(235)
231.	Zipper Heads                    941.9	908	33.9	(232)
232.	Chris of Death                  941.0	886	83.6	(230)
233.	Banko's Beer Rangers            940.2	936	4.2	(232)
234.	Swillbellies                    939.7	921	18.7	(231)
235.	Oz                              934.0	899	35.0	(237)
236.	Laubsters II                    931.0	876	201.6	(236)
237.	Ninja Bunnies                   928.9	884	44.9	(239)
238.	Great Scott                     928.0	873	73.3	(240)
239.	Joliet Inmates                  927.8	882	45.8	(238)
240.	NY Flames                       923.8	916	7.8	(234)
241.	SANDY'S SABRES                  917.7	913	4.7	(243)
242.	Widefield White Wolves          910.9	874	36.9	(241)
243.	Florida Tech Burgh Team         909.3	860	49.3	(246)
244.	The Ice Holes                   908.7	906	2.7	(242)
245.	South Carolina Tiger Paws       903.0	848	78.4	(245)
	Daves Team                      903.0	871	32.0	(244)
247.	Mudville Kings                  900.6	873	27.6	(250)
248.	Redliners                       898.9	883	15.9	(252)
249.	roadrunners                     898.5	880	18.5	(249)
250.	For xtc                         898.2	890	8.2	(248)
251.	Leos Blue Chips                 894.4	884	10.4	(247)
252.	New Jersey Rob                  891.7	891	0.7	(251)
253.	Pat Phillips                    891.1	881	10.1	(253)
254.	Stewart Clamen                  869.6	868	1.6	(254)
255.	Demon Spawn                     868.0	843	25.0	(255)
256.	Sunnyvale Storm                 815.2	815	0.2	(256)
257.	Allez les Blues                 803.0	748	476.9	(257)
258.	Up For Sale Hockey Club         785.0	762	23.0	(258)
259.	Petes Picks                     783.0	728	168.5	(259)
260.	RINACO                          780.0	725	114.0	(260)
261.	Brenz Revenge                   705.0	701	4.0	(261)
262.	Dinamo Riga                     658.0	603	571.6	(262)
-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54169
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Hockey Draft final point totals

Here are the final point totals for players chosen in the USENET Hockey Draft.
Note that only 114 players scored more than 55 points (the minimum cost)
although 254 different players were chosen.

	- Andrew

Points	Team	Player
160	PIT	Mario_Lemieux
148	BUF	Pat_LaFontaine
142	BOS	Adam_Oates
137	DET	Steve_Yzerman
132	WPG	Teemu_Selanne
132	NYI	Pierre_Turgeon
127	BUF	Alexander_Mogilny
127	TOR	Doug_Gilmour
125	LA	Luc_Robitaille
123	PHI	Mark_Recchi
114	QUE	Mats_Sundin
111	PIT	Kevin_Stevens
110	VAN	Pavel_Bure
109	PIT	Rick_Tocchet
107	CHI	Jeremy_Roenick
106	STL	Craig_Janney
105	QUE	Joe_Sakic
102	BOS	Joe_Juneau
101	STL	Brett_Hull
100	CGY	Theoren_Fleury
100	PIT	Ron_Francis
99	TOR	Dave_Andreychuk
97	MTL	Vincent_Damphousse
97	DET	Dino_Ciccarelli
97	WPG	Phil_Housley
96	BUF	Dale_Hawerchuk
94	STL	Brendan_Shanahan
94	MTL	Kirk_Muller
94	PIT	Jaromir_Jagr
93	MIN	Mike_Modano
91	NYR	Mark_Messier
89	HFD	Geoff_Sanderson
88	MTL	Brian_Bellows
88	CGY	Robert_Reichel
87	LA	Jari_Kurri
87	NYI	Steve_Thomas
87	DET	Sergei_Fedorov
87	DET	Paul_Coffey
86	TB	Brian_Bradley
86	PHI	Rod_Brind'Amour
85	WSH	Peter_Bondra
85	PIT	Larry_Murphy
85	HFD	Andrew_Cassels
85	VAN	Cliff_Ronning
82	WSH	Mike_Ridley
82	LA	Tony_Granato
82	QUE	Steve_Duchesne
82	HFD	Pat_Verbeek
82	BOS	Ray_Bourque
81	CGY	Gary_Suter
81	NJ	Claude_Lemieux
80	MTL	Stephan_Lebeau
79	NJ	Alexander_Semak
79	WSH	Kevin_Hatcher
79	MIN	Russ_Courtnall
79	WSH	Dale_Hunter
78	QUE	Mike_Ricci
78	SJ	Kelly_Kisio
78	STL	Jeff_Brown
77	QUE	Owen_Nolan
77	VAN	Murray_Craven
77	VAN	Geoff_Courtnall
76	NYR	Tony_Amonte
76	NYI	Derek_King
76	MIN	Dave_Gagner
75	PHI	Eric_Lindros
75	CGY	Joe_Nieuwendyk
75	NYI	Benoit_Hogue
74	TOR	Nikolai_Borschevsky
74	WSH	Michal_Pivonka
74	MIN	Ulf_Dahlen
73	LA	Jimmy_Carson
73	NJ	Stephane_Richer
73	CHI	Chris_Chelios
73	STL	Nelson_Emerson
72	WPG	Alexei_Zhamnov
72	BOS	Dmitri_Kvartalnov
72	VAN	Trevor_Linden
72	WPG	Thomas_Steen
71	VAN	Petr_Nedved
70	PIT	Joe_Mullen
70	CHI	Steve_Larmer
69	LA	Mike_Donnelly
68	QUE	Andrei_Kovalenko
68	NYR	Mike_Gartner
67	WSH	Dmitri_Khristich
66	WSH	Al_Iafrate
66	DET	Ray_Sheppard
66	SJ	Johan_Garpenlov
65	TOR	Glenn_Anderson
65	HFD	Zarley_Zalapski
65	LA	Wayne_Gretzky
65	NYR	Adam_Graves
64	NJ	Valeri_Zelepukin
63	OTT	Norm_Maciver
63	PHI	Kevin_Dineen
62	DET	Steve_Chiasson
62	DET	Paul_Ysebaert
62	PHI	Garry_Galley
61	PIT	Shawn_McEachern
60	MTL	Mike_Keane
60	WPG	Darrin_Shannon
60	NYI	Pat_Flatley
60	NJ	Bernie_Nicholls
60	QUE	Scott_Young
59	LA	Rob_Blake
59	PHI	Brent_Fedyk
57	CHI	Steve_Smith
57	WSH	Pat_Elynuik
57	NJ	Scott_Stevens
57	CGY	Sergei_Makarov
57	WPG	Fredrik_Olausson
56	VAN	Greg_Adams
56	TB	John_Tucker
54	CHI	Christian_Ruuttu
54	CHI	Brent_Sutter
54	CGY	Al_MacInnis
54	NYR	Sergei_Nemchinov
53	HFD	Terry_Yake
53	NYR	Darren_Turcotte
52	NYI	Vladimir_Malakhov
52	VAN	Dixon_Ward
52	LA	Tomas_Sandstrom
51	BOS	Stephen_Leach
51	HFD	Patrick_Poulin
51	WPG	Keith_Tkachuk
50	NYI	Jeff_Norton
50	MTL	Denis_Savard
50	TOR	John_Cullen
50	WSH	Sylvain_Cote
49	NYR	Ed_Olczyk
49	STL	Kevin_Miller
49	BOS	Dave_Poulin
49	VAN	Anatoli_Semenov
49	PHI	Pelle_Eklund
49	WPG	Evgeny_Davydov
48	MTL	Gilbert_Dionne
48	NJ	John_MacLean
48	QUE	Martin_Rucinsky
48	LA	Alexei_Zhitnik
48	EDM	Petr_Klima
48	EDM	Doug_Weight
47	EDM	Shayne_Corson
46	EDM	Craig_Simpson
45	WSH	Kelly_Miller
45	EDM	Dave_Manson
44	CHI	Michel_Goulet
44	MTL	Mathieu_Schneider
43	DET	Bob_Probert
43	CGY	Paul_Ranheim
43	OTT	Sylvain_Turgeon
42	MIN	Mark_Tinordi
41	OTT	Bob_Kudelski
41	DET	Niklas_Lidstrom
41	OTT	Brad_Shaw
41	EDM	Todd_Elik
41	BOS	Vladimir_Ruzicka
40	MIN	Mike_McPhee
40	NYR	Esa_Tikkanen
40	TOR	Dave_Ellett
40	NJ	Peter_Stastny
39	LA	Corey_Millen
39	NJ	Bobby_Holik
39	BUF	Yuri_Khmylev
39	TB	Adam_Creighton
39	TOR	Wendel_Clark
38	VAN	Sergio_Momesso
38	NYR	Alexei_Kovalev
37	TOR	Rob_Pearson
37	QUE	Valery_Kamensky
37	CHI	Dirk_Graham
36	NYR	Brian_Leetch
36	EDM	Zdeno_Ciger
35	TOR	Peter_Zezel
35	BOS	Ted_Donato
33	MIN	Neal_Broten
33	HFD	Mikael_Nylander
33	PHI	Josef_Beranek
33	CHI	Stephane_Matteau
32	EDM	Scott_Mellanby
32	DET	Keith_Primeau
32	BUF	Wayne_Presley
32	NYI	Brian_Mullen
32	PHI	Dmitri_Yushkevich
32	MTL	Gary_Leeman
31	BUF	Richard_Smehlik
31	BOS	Steve_Heinze
31	TOR	Dmitri_Mironov
30	CHI	Brian_Noonan
28	WSH	Bob_Carpenter
28	SJ	Pat_Falloon
27	STL	Igor_Korolev
27	TB	Mikael_Andersson
27	NYI	Ray_Ferraro
26	BUF	Petr_Svoboda
26	OTT	Mark_Lamb
26	NYR	James_Patrick
25	MTL	Benoit_Brunet
24	NYI	Scott_LaChance
24	TOR	Bill_Berg
23	EDM	Martin_Gelinas
23	WPG	Sergei_Bautin
23	EDM	Kevin_Todd
21	NYI	David_Volek
21	NYI	Darius_Kasparaitis
21	TB	Roman_Hamrlik
21	MIN	Brent_Gilchrist
20	NYR	Phil_Bourque
20	DET	Jim_Hiller
20	PHI	Andrei_Lomakin
20	HFD	Yvon_Corriveau
19	BUF	Donald_Audette
18	BOS	Cam_Neely
17	CHI	Joe_Murphy
17	SJ	Mark_Pederson
16	PIT	Martin_Straka
15	NYR	Peter_Andersson
13	NJ	Janne_Ojanen
13	OTT	Tomas_Jelinek
12	MIN	Bobby_Smith
11	TB	Steve_Kasper
10	SJ	Ray_Whitney
9	HFD	Robert_Petrovicky
9	BUF	Viktor_Gordijuk
8	TOR	Joe_Sacco
8	QUE	Mikhail_Tatarinov
8	SJ	Peter_Ahola
7	CHI	Rob_Brown
7	BOS	Glen_Murray
6	MIN	Brian_Propp
6	HFD	Tim_Kerr
5	WSH	Reggie_Savage
5	LA	Robert_Lang
5	STL	Vitali_Prokhorov
5	DET	Viacheslav_Kozlov
5	EDM	Shaun_Van_Allen
4	BOS	Jozef_Stumpel
4	MIN	Dan_Quinn
4	PIT	Bryan_Fogarty
3	MTL	Olav_Petrov
3	TB	Stan_Drulia
2	NJ	Claude_Vilgrain
2	WSH	Jason_Woolley
0	QUE	Peter_Forsberg
0	WSH	Brian_Sakic
0	WSH	Randy_Burridge
0	MTL	Patrick_Kjellberg
0	OTT	Alexei_Yashin
0	EDM	Dean_McAmmond
0	CGY	Cory_Stillman
0	TB	Brent_Gretzky
0	BUF	Jason_Dawe
0	VAN	Igor_Larionov
0	CHI	Sergei_Krivokrasov
-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54170
From: kirchner@Informatik.TU-Muenchen.DE (Robert Kirchner)
Subject: Re: German audience is lunatic??



In article <1993Apr21.114335.7071@ousrvr.oulu.fi>, golf@phoenix.oulu.fi (Jouko Kylmaoja) writes:
|> I watched the game Germany-Czechs in WC today...and i was astonished about
|> the behaviour of the German audience!
|> The German team got a few penalties in the last period and the crowd went

It was not just those penalties. Most of all it was the penalty the referee didn't
call on the Czechs right before their first goal.

|> grazy! They threw coins, extra pucks and other trash into the rink...is
|> that stupid or what?? I guess the Canadian referee (one of the
|> Isostar-bros ;) gave the German team a penalty for that, but it didn't help
|> much.
|> I guess the Germans just are proud over their Nazi-Kill-'em-All-Everyone-

Don't you think it's quite silly to call it a Nazi attitude, when some people 
throw coins on the ice? Hey, I don't approve the behavior of these guys,
especially not in a WC game, but I can't see any reason for using the word 'Nazi'
in this connection. 
  
|> But-Us-Germans-Sucks attitude...they just seem to have that kind of attitude
|> in every possible sport (remember the European champs in Stockholm in soccer)

Soccer hooligans are not just a German problem (remember the world cup in Italy).
Again: there's a big difference between throwing coins and smashing shop-windows
or fighting with other so-called 'fans', who come to a WC just to see if the
Dutch or the English or the Germans are the best bruisers.
Which other sports are you talking about? I don't think soccer is 'every possible
sport'.

|> It really pisses me off!
|> I do not mean that every single German has this attitude that sucks, but 
|> most of them seem to do...

How many Germans do you know? Do you think 200 out of 10000 is 'most of them'? 
If you hear about some white policemen beating a black man in the US, what do you
think about the Americans? 'Most of them' like beating blacks?

|> 
|> 	Jokke Kylmaoja
|> 	golf@phoenix.oulu.fi
|> 



Robert

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54171
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

In article <C5uE6G.J83@acsu.buffalo.edu> v003nnc3@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (MR. BUNGLE) writes:

>[...] I'd like to see some playoff games since I'm stuck in Buffalo at UB, but
>I think Boston isn't giving up so easy.
>
No, Boston probably won't go down easy, but if the Sabres hadn't won
game one Buffalo would have been out in four.

And what problem are you having with playoff games here in
Buffalo???!!!??? There's the Sabres-Bruins, Quebec-Montreal, and
whatever ESPN and ABC show, and on opposite nights there's
Toronto-Detroit and whatever ESPN(/ABC) shows.  More hockey than a
good chunk of North America, either side of the border.  It's
wonderful, and there are thousands of folks who'd kill to be in your
shoes, coverage-wise.




-- 
Valerie Hammerl 	       John Sr. would lift Pat over the boards, grab 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu       his hand, and start running around the outside,
V085PWPZ@UBVMS.CC.BUFFALO.EDU  faster and faster.  "I wanted to learn how to 
get that feeling, and the only way was to learn how to skate."  P. LaFontaine

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54172
From: neath@brazil.psych.purdue.edu (Ian Neath)
Subject: Re: Final Regular Season Individual Goalie Stats

What about including points?  Probably no goals (at least against
opponents) but there have been several assists given.

--
      Ian Neath        | There are four kinds of people in this world:
neath@psych.purdue.edu | cretins, fools, morons and lunatics - U. Eco

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54173
From: mashumka@fish.Princeton.EDU (Mark Andrew Shumka)
Subject: Canucks score

HELP!  I'm stuck here at a computer in New Jersey and have no access to
a radio or TV.  Could someone kindly post the score of the Canucks-Jets
game?  Thanks in advance.

Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54174
Subject: Camera work on televised games
From: yecx@vax5.cit.cornell.edu

Is it just me or is the camera work on some of these games really sad??  I
can't remember how many times during the Penguins-Devils game they showed some
guy (without the puck) being checked in the corner while the puck was being
fired on goal.  In fact, I think they even missed one goal completely because
they were showing two guys holding each other in the corner.

Now the last time I watched a football game, they didn't show the lineman going
at it while the running back turned the corner for a touchdown . . . . 

Is it just me??	

Greg


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54175
From: paul@fugu.Data-IO.COM (Paul Brownlow)
Subject: Re: SHARKS REVIEW Part 5: Left Wings

In article <1r2e9d$1nd@apple.com>, chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach) writes:
|> nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
|> >#45	DODY WOOD		Season: 1st
|> >Acquired:	3rd round pick in 1991 entry draft
|> >Grade:		I (D+/D, although perhaps I shouldn't give a grade at all)
|> 
|> >I have been accused of knocking on Wood too much.
|> 
|> You? Nah... 
|> 
|> He was seriously unimpressive, even as a tough guy (his rep). However, as
|> few games as he had in a season that was at that point meaningless, I hate
|> to judge the talent too quickly. Butn in Dody's case, I"m tempted to make an
|> exception.
|> 
|> But I won't.

Wood played most of his junior career in Seattle.  He was one
of the leading scorers on a mediocre team when he was traded away in
1992.  He rarely lost a fight and was one of the toughest players in
the WHL.

However, I was extremely surprised when he was drafted, especially in
the third round.  He certainly didn't look like NHL material...
-- 
Paul Brownlow				|         Visualize 
Data I/O Corp.  Redmond, WA		|	   Whirled
paul@data-io.com			|	    Peas
					|

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54176
From: paul@fugu.Data-IO.COM (Paul Brownlow)
Subject: Re: 1993 NHL Draft

In article <1993Apr20.184627.4585@newshub.ariel.yorku.ca>, cs902043@ariel.yorku.ca (SHAWN LUDDINGTON) writes:
|> Tampa Bay will either go for a russian Kozlov (I think that's it) or a 
|>     defenseman Rob Niedemeyer (probably spelt the last name wrong)

Rob Niedermayer is a forward (center, I think) with the WHL Medicine Hat
Tigers.  His brother, Scott, is a defenseman (now with the NJ Devils).
-- 
Paul Brownlow				|         Visualize 
Data I/O Corp.  Redmond, WA		|	   Whirled
paul@data-io.com			|	    Peas
					|

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54177
From: matthew@wavefront.wti.com (Matt Coohill)
Subject: ESPN f*ck up


	Okay... here's some gripe"ing" (?griping?... whatever).

	(I live in Santa Barbara... for reference... I think)

	Okay, ABC showed the Kings/Flames... fine... YAWN.

	ESPN (through a fortunate rainout of a baseball game) showed the
  Red Wings/Toronto game... cool.

	But I SWEAR that the advertisements all week long had said that
  ESPN would show Pitt/NJ on Tuesday and Bos/Buff on Thursday.

	I raced home from work early (4:30 Pacific) to catch the game, but
  ALAS, it was the Boston/Buffalo game and then they promised that they would
  show the Pitt/NJ game on Thursday.  OVERNIGHT they changed their mind.

	I didn't mind THAT MUCH.  I watched the game (hockey is MUCH better
  than NO hockey).  During the game their were no video highlights from the
  Patrick division.  What the hell was going on?  At least they should show
  video highlights of the other games (especially the NYI/Caps game that was
  so close).  My father (lives in Bowling Green, Kentucky [Bumbf*ck, Egypt])
  got to watch the Pens game on ESPN.  I just don't get it.

	The biggest problem is that Buffalo or Boston fans who didn't want
  to see the Pittsburgh/New Jersey game 2, will turn on their TVs on Thursday
  and see the Pittsburgh/New Jersey game 3 instead of the Buffalo/Boston game
  3.  At least, in my case, I just had to wait 2 more days to see my game.

	If I were a big Boston or Buffalo fan and I missed the game on
  Tuesday due to false advertising on the part of ESPN, I'd be mad as
  hell.

	Oh well... hopefully we'll get better coverage next year OR
  SOMETHING.

Matt Coohill

P.S.  The announcers for the Buffalo/Boston were the worst that I have
	ever heard (as far emotion goes).  They had the enthusiasm of
	"Droopy Dog".  I hope for better on Thursday.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54180
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

It is meaningless to compare one player's plus/minus statistic with
another players' out of the context of the role and the playing time
of the players involved.    

To compare Jagr's and Francis's plus/minus is ridiculous and absurd...

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54181
From: nichols@spss.com (David Nichols)
Subject: Re: Detroit Playoff Tradition

In article <16APR199314443969@reg.triumf.ca> lange@reg.triumf.ca (THREADING THE CANADIAN TAPESTRY) writes:
>Way back in the early years (~50's) it took 8 wins to garner the Stanley Cup. 
>Soooooo, a couple of local fish mongers (local to the Joe Louis Arena, that is)
>started the tradition of throwing an octopi onto the ice with every win.  After
>each victory, one leg would be severed before the octopus found its way to the
>ice.  (They are dead by the way.)  It was a brilliant marketing strategy to
>shore up the demand for one of their least popular products.
>
>Hope this helps.
>
>J. Lange
>

Local to the Joe Louis Arena? You mean local to Olympia Stadium, where
Red Wings games were played until fairly recently (early 80s comes to
mind). As far as I know, the rest of the post is basically correct. If
what you meant by local was simply Detroit and I'm being incredibly
picky, okay, sorry about that.

--
 David Nichols        Senior Statistical Support Specialist         SPSS, Inc.
 Phone: (312) 329-3684     Internet:  nichols@spss.com     Fax: (312) 329-3657
*******************************************************************************
 Any correlation between my views and those of SPSS is strictly due to chance.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54182
From: atkinsj@reis59.alleg.edu (Joshua Atkins)
Subject: Re: Goalie Mask Update

In article <C5L3EC.F2v@acsu.buffalo.edu> hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie  
S. Hammerl) writes:
> In article <93289@hydra.gatech.EDU> gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)  
writes:
> >
> >	Here are the results after three days of voting. Remember 3pts for 
> >1st, 2 for 2nd, and 1 for 3rd. Also, you can still turn in votes! And..  
if
> >the guy isn't a regular goalie or he is retired, please include the  
team! 
> >Thanks for your time, and keep on sending in those votes!
> 
> > Glenn Healy (NYI), Tommy Soderstron (???), Ray LeBlanc (USA).
>                      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> 
> Soderstrom plays with Philly, but he doesn't have a moulded mask.
> He's got the helmet and cage variety, in white.  Or at least that's
> what he wore thirteen hours ago.
> 
Yeah but Soderstrom's mask has always appeared to be a lot bigger than the  
average helmet-and-cage variety.  It has a certain appeal on its own

josh


> -- 
> Valerie Hammerl			"Some days I have to remind him  
he's not 
> hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu	Mario Lemieux."  Herb Brooks on Claude
> acscvjh@ubms.cc.buffalo.edu	Lemieux, top scorer for the Devils, but 
> v085pwwpz@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu  known for taking dumb penalties.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54183
From: lee139@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (Steve Lee)
Subject: STOP MAYNARD BASHING!!!! (was Re: Roger Maynard)

In article <1993Apr16.213024.8698@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@hudson.UVic.CA writes:
>Does anyone recieve annoying email from Roger Maynard whenever they post an
>article telling them to leave him alon and stop posting to the group??
>These emails are filled with insults- more than are usual in Roger's posts
>and have little if any hockey info.
>I have recieved two in the last 2 days.
>I am just wondering if I am special or Roger trys to bully everyone who
>disagrees with him.
>
>Gregmeister
>

You can't be serious!  I and many of my colleagues have not received any
bad e-mails from Roger, in fact, Roger happens to have answered most if not
all of my hockey questions and curiosities, so before you start flaming
at me or Roger, better re-consider your nasty attitude towards Roger and the
like!


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Lee      *      University of Western Ontario      *      London, Canada 
                      lee139@obelix.gaul.csd.uwo.ca          
_______________________________________________________________________________


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54184
From: rhirji@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca (Rahim Hirji)
Subject: Re: Flames Question

In article <C5HtrB.ICE@ccu.umanitoba.ca> clhawth@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Timothy Chesley) writes:
>I heard a little while back that Gary Roberts would be returning to play
>in Calgary's last regular season game.  Can anybody confirm this??
>He'll be a big help to the Flames in the playoffs and may change my
>playoff pool strategy.


Roberts played in last night game against the Sharks and got a goal (38th)
and an assist.

This definitely bolsters Calgary's chances in the playoffs.


							Rahim Hirji


 
-- 
				     |  Rahim Hirji
 Life is what happens while you are  |  Actuarial Science
 making other plans		     |  rhirji@descartes.uwaterloo.ca
				     |  University of Waterloo

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54185
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: TV Schedule for Next Week

jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio) writes:
>mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger) writes:
>
>|> United States TV Schedule:
>|> April 18   Devils/Islanders at Pittsburgh   1 EST  ABC
>|> April 18   St. Louis at Chicago             12 CDT ABC
>|> April 18   Los Angeles at Calgary           12 PDT ABC

Okay, here's the down side of the ESPN deal: no additional coverage.
With a split contract, SCA could have at least gotten at leftovers
like Canucks-Jets, Caps-whoever and Red Wings-Leafs (or whoever else
is playing).

>|> April 20   Devils/Islanders at Pittsburgh   7:30   ESPN
>|> April 22   TBA                              7:30   ESPN
>|> April 24   TBA                              7:30   ESPN
>
>Does anyone know if there will be alternate games in cities where
>local broadcast rights are being protected?

For our area (Islanders-Devils), it's likely to be the Bruins, since
the other Adams series is Montreal-Quebec.  I'd prefer the latter
myself ...

I'm under the impression that the ABC deal overrides the local deals,
but if St. Louis at Chicago pops up we'll know ...

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54192
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: Bruins-Pens: the Ulf-Neeley fight

Oh, excuse me for wasting the bandwidth, but I was referring to 
the original incident, not the recent skirmish which occurred
this past month. 

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54193
From: scialdone@nssdca.gsfc.nasa.gov (John Scialdone)
Subject: CUT Vukota and Pilon!!!

I have been to all 3 Isles/Caps tilts at the Crap Centre this year, all Isles
wins and there is no justification for Vukota and Pilon to play for the Isles.
Vukota is absolutely the worst puck handler in the world!! He couldn't hit a
bull in the ass with a banjo!! Al must remember a few years back when Mick 
scored 3 goals in one period against the Caps in a 5-3 Isles win. I was there
and was astonished as was the rest of the crowd. Wake-up Al!!! Years later he's
gotten worse. He's a cheap shot artist and always ends up getting
stupid/senseless penalties. I think he would make a good police officier!!!

As for Pilon, he can't carry the puck out to center ice by himself. He either
makes a bad pass resulting in a turnover, or he attempts to bring the puck 
towards the neutral zone and skates right into an opposing skater. He can't
stay on his skates with most forwards or centers. He either falls down or 
committs a penalty. Call up somebody from Capital District AL!!!!!

As far as the playoffs, the Isles are as difficult to figure out as the Caps.
Two good teams with talent but so inconsistent. They should meet in the first
round. The Isles seem to play up to the level of their competition so they
should play well against Jersey tonite. It'll probably be another tight 1-goal
game as the last 20 games hve been for the Isles. I wish when the get a lead
they could continue to pour it on instead of settling back into a defensive
shell and letting the opposition get back in the game. Al MUST understand he
can't do with this team what he did with the 80-83 Isles. maybe Al should got
to. Where is Bobby Nystrom?? Clark Gilles?? John Tonelli?? These are the kind
of young minds we need behing the bench!!    FIRE AL!!!!

John Scialdone
SCIALDONE@NSSDCA.GSFC.NASA.GOV

**********When your ship comes in, first man takes the Sail********************



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54194
From: rbeskost@adam.East.Sun.COM (Richard Beskosty - Sun BOS Systems Product Assurance)
Subject: Re: Goalie mask poll

In article 93158@hydra.gatech.EDU, gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak) writes:
> 
> 	Here is an update on the Goalie mask poll...
> 	First, since so many people gave me their 3 best, I decided to
> give 3 pts for their favorite, 2 pts for 2nd, 1 for 3rd. If you e-mailed
> a response with only one, I gave it 3 pts. Please feel free to send me
> your 2 other favorites, if you only sent one before. 
> 	Also, votes are still welcome! Any mask you like will do, as I 
> have received votes for players not in the NHL. Please mention what team
> they play for, though.
> 	So here are the up-to-date results so far:
> 
> 


My vote goes to Andy Moog 1st, Belfour 2nd, Vanbiesbrouck 3rd

The Bruin's are hot at just the right time !!!!!


rich beskosty

rbeskost@east.sun.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54195
From: richard@amc.com (Richard Wernick)
Subject: Re: Ulf and all...

You should be ashamed to call yourself an Ulf Samuelson fan. Anybody who plays
the way he does, does not belong in the NHL. There have been cheap shot artists
through the history of the game, but a lot of them have been talanted players.
Bobby Clarke, Kenny Linsemen, Pie McKenzie, Chris Chelios etc.. but nobody has been
out right as dirty a cheapshot coward as Ulf. Violence in hockey has got to be curbed
and players like (Should have been a Women) Samuelson don't belong. When players
like Ulf, who's main purpose is to injure the better players in the league is allowed
to continue, and the league won't stop it, the players should. A Christian Pro 1000
aluminum stick directed at his ugly head should do the trick nicely. If the Bruins get
a chance to meet Pittsburgh in the near future, you can bet Neely will have his day.
The sight of watching Ulf turtle up like the coward he is, is worth almost as much as a
Stanely Cup. This wimp of a player almost ruined the career of one the best right wingers
in the game. If you are to remove Ulf Samuelson from the lineup, the Penguins would not
even notice he's gone. He's an eyesore on the game of hockey.


Rich




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54196
From: williac@govonca.gov.on.ca (Chris Williams)
Subject: Re: STOP MAYNARD BASHING!!!! (was Re: Roger Maynard)

In <1993Apr16.225806.10680@julian.uwo.ca> lee139@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (Steve Lee) writes:

>In article <1993Apr16.213024.8698@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@hudson.UVic.CA writes:
>>Does anyone recieve annoying email from Roger Maynard whenever they post an
>>article telling them to leave him alon and stop posting to the group??
>>These emails are filled with insults- more than are usual in Roger's posts
>>and have little if any hockey info.
>>I have recieved two in the last 2 days.
>>I am just wondering if I am special or Roger trys to bully everyone who
>>disagrees with him.
>>
>>Gregmeister
>>

>You can't be serious!  I and many of my colleagues have not received any
>bad e-mails from Roger, in fact, Roger happens to have answered most if not
>all of my hockey questions and curiosities, so before you start flaming
>at me or Roger, better re-consider your nasty attitude towards Roger and the
>like!


>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Steve Lee      *      University of Western Ontario      *      London, Canada 
>                      lee139@obelix.gaul.csd.uwo.ca          
>_______________________________________________________________________________

Speaking of Roger, where is his comments from last nights game. You have
to admit he can make a nothing game sound like it was game 7 of the
Stanley Cup finals.
Roger pushes the Leafs so much it even bothers me, a long time supporter
but he does have a good overall idea of the game.
Wow I just gave R.M a compliment, guess I better stop it with the Rye +
Water before I give him another..



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54197
From: daniell@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Daniel Lyddy)
Subject: Re: Bruins vs Canadiens:

In article <1993Apr16.213513.7683@rose.com> jack.petrilli@rose.com (jack petrilli) writes:
>So I don't know what you mean by parity; Boston never was, is not now, 
>and never will be as good an organization as the Montreal Canadiens.
>

Never was?  Probably.  Is not now?  Debatable.  What other valid test can
you think of besides the final standings or divisional playoff winner?  What
do you propose, a worthless vote like they do in college football?  What a
joke!

>You Boston fans make me laugh: you're going crazy based on a very 
>recent Boston domination over Montreal in the playoffs. I mean how 
>many cups has Boston won compared to Montreal's 23? And who do you 
>think is going to win the **next** cup between the 2 teams? Montreal 
>or Boston? You know Sinden's going to find some way of screwing up 
>even this good Boston team. He'll fire Suter or trade away a vital 
>star. (Admittedly, his last few trades have been good ones but how 
>long before his luck runs out and he starts making Esposito-for-
>Ratelle type trades again?) 
>

If I remember right, Brad Park was also involved in that trade.  He wasn't
all that bad a hockey player.

But let's look at some of Sinden's trades over the years:

??? for Rick Middleton (Rangers).  I don't know who Sinden gave up for Middle-
ton, so I'll call this one a +.

Barry Pederson for Cam Neely (Canucks).  +++.  Any questions?

Greg Hawgood for Vladimir Ruzicka (Oilers). ++.  Didja see that one Rosie
roofed against Roy in last year's playoffs?

Courtnall/Ranford for Andy Moog (Oilers).  A wash.  Moog is a good goaltender,
Ranford burned Boston in the Finals in his first year, and Courtnall always
seems to get his points.  Anyone in Vancouver care to comment on Courtnall
as a defensive liability?

Ken Linseman for Dave Poulin (Flyers) ++.  Any more questions?

Janney/Quintal for Adam Oates (Blues).  ++.  Janney is an enormous talent and
a personable guy, the the Bruins play in Adam's Division.  Enough said?

So,even if you count the Esposito/Vadnais/Ratelle/Park/I don't remember who 
else (Joe Zanussi?) trade as a double minus, Harry the Horse trader comes
out on top.  I submit that the Bruins are always good because of Harry, not
in spite of him.

BTW, do you really think the Habs will bounce back next season.  I'll bet 
they finish fourth or fifth in the Conference, behind any of the following:
Pittsburgh, Quebec, Boston, Washington, Islanders.  Someone correct me if
these five teams will not be in Montreal's conference.

In summary, things look bleak for the Habs, at least in the near future.  I
suspect that the next team from La Belle Province to win the Cup will be
that team that Lindros didn't want to play for.

>I admit that I've been suffering lately with the Boston gets hot while 
>Montreal swans in the playoffs type years. But I **do** have the sure 
>knowledge that the Montreal braintrust will keep plugging away until 
>they hit the right formula for yet another cup. Whereas if I were a 
>Boston fan, I'd have this kind of despair that as long as Harry Sinden 
>is running the show, the Bruins will always be good but **never** 
>good enough.
>
>- Jack

-- 
Dan Lyddy    daniell@cory.berkeley.edu    University of California at Berkeley

My Two Favorite Hockey Teams:  1) The Boston Bruins
                               2) Whoever's playing Pittsburgh

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54198
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

Brad Gibson (gibson@nukta.geop.ubc.ca) wrote:

[Much text deleted]

:   plus/minus ... it is the most misleading hockey stat available.

Not necessarily the most misleading, but you are right, it definitely
needs to be taken in the proper perspective. A shining example is
if you look at the Penguins individual +/-, you will find very few minuses.
That only makes common sense, since they didn't lose many games.

:   Until the NHL publishes a more useful quantifiable statistic including ice
:   time per game and some measure of its "quality" (i.e., is the player put out
:   in key situations like protecting a lead late in the game; is he matched up
:   against the other team's top one or two lines; short-handed, etc), I would
:   much rather see the +/- disappear altogether instead of having its dubious
:   merits trumpeted by those with little understanding of its implications.

Unfortunately, you will need to keep a ridiculous number of stats to
really come up with a statistic which really shows a player's value.
Let's just enjoy the game and not overanalyze it. (like I'm doing now,
excuse me!)

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54199
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

Gerald Olchowy (golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca) wrote:
: It is meaningless to compare one player's plus/minus statistic with
: another players' out of the context of the role and the playing time
: of the players involved.    

: To compare Jagr's and Francis's plus/minus is ridiculous and absurd...

: Gerald

Thank you for putting this in perspective!

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54200
From: boora@kits.sfu.ca (The GodFather)
Subject: RANGERS ARE AN EMBARRASSMENT

	I can't believe that the NY Rangers would force its 
players to go to Binghamtom to play in the AHL playoffs instead
of letting them represent their countries in the World Championships.

Anderrson and Zubov are waiting for the NHL to make a decision to this,
while Kovalev has given in and gone down to the minors.

The Rangers are a disgrace.

ps. it has been reported that Neil Smith was very much against
the hiring of Mike Keenan. How long will Smith be in NY for?

		the GodFather.
`

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54201
From: yadalle@cs.UAlberta.CA (Yadallee Dave S)
Subject: Re: Oilers for sale??

bart@splunge.uucp (Barton Oleksy) writes:

>yadalle@cs.UAlberta.CA (Yadallee Dave S) writes:

>>Here's one from the mill.  The Oilers MIGHT move to Hamilton
>>where Porklington can get a free deal.

>>Given what Labour relations and Puck has been like, it WOULD be a sigh of 
>>relief.

>>This WAY w4e can can BOTH elements!!

>Well, Dave, I would have to disagree with you there.  Satan himself could
>own the team, and I'd be happy as long as the Oilers stayed in Edmonton.
>Selfish, but true.  I don't want to see the Oilers move, no matter who
>their owner is.

>Bart, bart@splunge.uucp  or  barto@nait.ab.ca

I too am of the same  sentiment Bart, but realistically, this town DOESN'T WANT TO pay for 
quality player and hence we are loosing these people left, right and center.
Labour is also responsible for their boycott Pocklington movement.
I would like the Oilers to stay, but realistically, given this situation, it's 
bye-bye Oilers.
--
Dave Shariff Yadallee (B. Sc.(Econ/Math) (U of Alberta 1990) )
( yadalle@amisk.cs.ualberta.ca) God Save the Queen, God Bless us All!Remember!
Jesus saves lives from eternal damnation!
Newfoundland, keep good old Clyde, VOTE LIBERAL!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54202
From: v057p7nk@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Andrew W Korbut)
Subject: Re: Ulf crushes Valeri Zelepukin

In article <C5xx27.G32@newsserver.pixel.kodak.com>, clare@ssd.kodak.com (Bill Clare 726-9419) writes...
>That more or less says it.  I flicked the Penguins game on briefly and saw
>Ulf cross-check Valeri in the face.  I am wondering if Don Cherry is going to
>go off on this at all in coach's corner.

Nah, Cherry will only spew if Ulf was nailing "a good Canadian boy".

What an idiot... if this is the heart and soul of Canadian patriotism, 
then someone needs a new hobby...

 Dr.D [The Devils Advocate]        "Drinkin' & women & guns don't mix..."
 v057p7nk@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu
 awkorbut@acsu.buffalo.edu                      - Mark Arm

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54203
From: jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio)
Subject: NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 23 APRIL 1993




NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 23 APRIL 1993:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                  CONFERENCE SEMI-FINALS        BEST OF SEVEN
      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE
  
 NJ                  BUF   (leads 3-0)   STL   (leads 3-0)   WIN               
 PIT   (leads 3-0)   BOS                 CHI                 VAN   (leads 2-1)

 NYI   (leads 2-1)   MON                 TOR                 LA    
 WAS                 QUE   (leads 2-1)   DET   (leads 2-1)   CAL   (tied  2-1)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Detroit Red Wings (lead series 2-1)    0   1   1   -   2
Toronto Maple Leafs                    2   0   2   -   4

Dave Andreychuk scored his first two playoff goals for Toronto and Felix
Potvin stopped 34 of 36 Red Wing shots as the Maple Leafs won their first
win in the series.

First period-- 1, Toronto, Andreychuk 1 (Foligno,Gilmour), 4:21.  2, Toronto,
  Andreychuk 2 (Gilmour), 7:37.

Second period-- 3, Detroit, Fedorov 2 (Coffey,Sheppard), 1:20 (pp).

Third period-- 4, Toronto, Clark 1 (Gilmour,Mironov), 4:44 (pp).  5, Toronto,
  Pearson 1 (Clark,Cullen), 9:32.  6, Detroit, Chiasson 2 (Konstantinov,
  Fedorov), 14:14.

Shots on goal-- Detroit 9-19-8--36.  Toronto  13-8-12--33.  Power-play
  opportunities-- Detroit 1 of 5; Toronto 1 of 8.  Goalies-- Detroit,
  Cheveldae, 2-1 (33 shots-29 saves).  Toronto, Potvin, 1-2 (36-34).
  A--15,720.

Referee-- Mark Faucette.  Linesmen-- Kevin Collins, Brian Murphy.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Chicago Blackhawks                   0   0   0   -   0
St. Louis Blues (lead series 3-0)    1   1   1   -   3

Curtis Joseph blanked the Blackhawks for the second straight game and Brett
Hull scored a goal and added an assist to lead the Blues to a 3-0 series lead.
Chicago hasn't scored in 131:09 of play since Brian Noonan's hat-trick goal in
game 1.

First period-- 1, St. Louis, Janney 1 (Hull,Brown), 16:53 (pp).

Second period-- 2, St. Louis, Hull 3 (Miller), 12:31.

Third period-- 3, St. Louis, Emerson 1 (Felsner,Shanahan), 16:44.

Shots on goal-- Chicago 9-12-13--34.  St. Louis 7-13-4--24.  Power-play
  opportunities-- Chicago 0 of 4; St. Louis 1 of 7.  Goalies-- Chicago,
  Belfour, 0-3 (24 shots-21 saves).  St. Louis, Joseph, 3-0 (34-34).
  A--17,985.

Referee-- Dan Marouelli.  Linesmen-- Randy Mitton, Shane Heyer.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Vancouver Canucks (lead series 2-1)    1   2   1   -   4
Winnipeg Jets                          3   0   2   -   5

Teemu Selanne broke out of his mini-slump with a hat trick, including the
game-winner, to lead the Jets to a 5-4 victory.  Trevor Linden and Pavel Bure
each scored twice for the losing Canucks.

First period-- 1, Winnipeg, Tkachuk 1 (Housley), 3:52.  2, Winnipeg, Selanne 1
  (Housley,Shannon), 7:01 (pp).  3, Vancouver, Bure 2, 18:29.  4, Winnipeg,
  Selanne 2 (Shannon,Housley), 19:57 (pp).

Second period-- 5, Vancouver, Linden 2 (Ronning,Lumme), :14.  6, Vancouver,
  Linden 3 (Adams,Slegr), :59 (pp).

Third period-- 7, Winnipeg, Borsato 1 (Steen), 2:53 (sh).  8, Winnipeg,
  Selanne 3 (Shannon), 9:35.  9, Vancouver, Bure 3 (Babych,Lidster), 15:52.

Shots on goal-- Vancouver 18-9-10--37.  Winnipeg 13-8-8--29.  Power-play
  opportunities-- Vancouver 1 of 8; Winnipeg 2 of 6.  Goalies-- Vancouver,
  McLean, 2-1 (29 shots-24 saves).  Winnipeg, Essensa, 1-2 (37-33).
  A--15,569.

Referee-- Kerry Fraser.  Linesmen-- Gord Broseker, Dan Schachte.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Calgary Flames (lead series 2-1)    2   1   2   -   5
Los Angeles Kings                   0   1   1   -   2

(Boxscore tomorrow)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Saturday, 24 April 1993:

     Washington at NY Islanders (NY Islanders lead series 2-1), 7:40pm EST
     Boston at Buffalo (Buffalo leads series 3-0), 7:40pm EST
     Quebec at Montreal (Quebec leads series 2-1), 8:10pm EST

Sunday, 25 April 1993:

     Pittsburgh at New Jersey (Pittsburgh leads series 3-0), 1:10pm EST
     Chicago at St. Louis (St. Louis leads series 3-0), 1:10pm EST
     Calgary at Los Angeles (Calgary leads series 2-1), 3:10pm EST
     Detroit at Toronto (Detroit leads series 2-1), 7:10pm EST
     Vancouver at Winnipeg (Vancouver leads series 2-1), 9:10pm EST


-JPC


-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John P. Curcio 		          Go Bruins!		   Philips Laboratories
jpc@philabs.philips.com 			           345 Scarborough Road
(914) 945-6442               	 		     Briarcliff Manor, NY 10510 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54204
From: Ryan J. Thieme <33CWDTR@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN


In article <1993Apr20.032017.5783@wuecl.wustl.edu>, jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph
Charles Achkar) says:
>
> It was nice to see ESPN show game 1 between the Wings and Leafs since
>the Cubs and Astros got rained out. Instead of showing another baseball
>game, they decided on the Stanley Cup Playoffs. A classy move by ESPN.
>
>
It was a classy move.  But it looks like ESPN is going to devote most of
the coverage to the Pens.  On Tuesday night, they continued to broadcast
the Pen-Devil game even though Pittsburgh had the game well in control.
Granted they did show some "bonus" coverage of the Caps and Isles but
they cut away from the close game, which went into double ot, to update
us on the fifth goal of the rout.
Thursday was a good game even if it was the second straight game between
the pens and devils.  IMHO they should program some variety into the
telecasts.(Yes I know the game shown on saturday is between the B's and
Sabres, probably throwing a bone to us Bruin fans.)
And what about the Cambell conference?  I'd like to see a game in the
Norris or Smythe.  Why not have back to back nights of National
Hockey Night?

Just a thought.

Ryan
>  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
>  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    %
>  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    *
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54205
From: e8l6@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (Rocket)
Subject: NHL Playoff leaders with +/- & Penalty mins as of April 22, 1993



    Player       Team   GP  G   A  Pts +/- PIM

    M.Lemieux    PIT     3   4   2   6   2   0
    Francis      PIT     3   1   5   6   5   4
    Oates        BOS     3   0   6   6   1   2
    Yzerman      DET     2   3   2   5   3   0
    Coffey       DET     2   0   5   5   1   0
    D.Hunter     WAS     3   5   0   5  -4  10
    Mogilny      BUF     3   4   1   5   3   4
    Thomas       NYI     3   2   3   5   6   0
    Lapointe     QUE     3   1   4   5   2   2
    Johansson    WAS     3   0   5   5  -1   4
    Carson       LA      2   4   0   4   0   2
    Brown        STL     2   1   3   4   1   2
    Fleury       CAL     2   1   3   4   0  19
    G.Courtnall  VAN     2   1   3   4   3   2
    Flatley      NYI     2   0   4   4   3   2
    MacInnis     CAL     2   0   4   4  -1   4
    Ferraro      NYI     3   3   1   4   2   2
    McEachern    PIT     3   3   1   4   4   8
    Neely        BOS     3   3   1   4   1   4
    Turgeon      NYI     3   3   1   4   5   0
    Bellows      MON     3   2   2   4   0   0
    Jagr         PIT     3   2   2   4   3   0
    Khmylev      BUF     3   2   2   4   3   0
    Khristich    WAS     3   2   2   4   0   2
    Hawerchuk    BUF     3   1   3   4   0   2
    Hogue        NYI     3   1   3   4   3   2
    Juneau       BOS     3   1   3   4   0   6
    K.Stevens    PIT     3   1   3   4   1   6
    L.Murphy     PIT     3   1   3   4   2   0
    LaFontaine   BUF     3   1   3   4   2   0
    Ramsey       PIT     3   0   4   4   3   4
    Smehlik      BUF     3   0   4   4   4   2
    Noonan       CHI     2   3   0   3   0   0
    Gilmour      TOR     2   2   1   3  -1  12
    Hull         STL     2   2   1   3   0   0
    Otto         CAL     2   2   1   3   2   2
    Reichel      CAL     2   2   1   3   0   0
    Bure         VAN     2   1   2   3   2   0
    Drake        DET     2   1   2   3   2   0
    Linden       VAN     2   1   2   3   4   2
    Nieuwendyk   CAL     2   1   2   3  -1   2
    Roberts      CAL     2   0   3   3  -2   4
    Young        QUE     3   3   0   3   3   0
    B.Sweeney    BUF     3   2   1   3   2   4
    S.Stevens    NJ      3   2   1   3  -2   4
    Tocchet      PIT     3   2   1   3   0   2
    Carpenter    WAS     3   1   2   3   0   6
    J.Mullen     PIT     3   1   2   3   2   2
    Ronning      VAN     2   2   0   2   4   0
    Suter        CAL     2   2   0   2   0   4
    Yawney       CAL     2   2   0   2   3   4
    Adams        VAN     2   1   1   2   2   0
    Chiasson     DET     2   1   1   2  -1   4
    Craven       VAN     2   1   1   2   2   2
    Cullen       TOR     2   1   1   2  -1   0
    Dahlquist    CAL     2   1   1   2   2   4
    King         WIN     2   1   1   2   2   2
    Racine       DET     2   1   1   2   6  14
    Rychel       LA      2   1   1   2   1  19
    Shanahan     STL     2   1   1   2   0   4
    Sheppard     DET     2   1   1   2   2   0
    Sydor        LA      2   1   1   2   0   4
    Barnes       WIN     2   0   2   2   1   2
    Emerson      STL     2   0   2   2   0   0
    Gill         TOR     2   0   2   2  -2   0
    Granato      LA      2   0   2   2   1   4
    Gretzky      LA      2   0   2   2  -3   0
    Housley      WIN     2   0   2   2  -2   0
    Janney       STL     2   0   2   2   0   0
    King         NYI     2   0   2   2   4   6
    Kozlov       DET     2   0   2   2   1   2
    Sandstrom    LA      2   0   2   2  -4   4
    Shuchuk      LA      2   0   2   2  -1   2
    Vaske        NYI     2   0   2   2   1   0
    Damphousse   MON     3   1   1   2   0   0
    Elynuik      WAS     3   1   1   2  -1   0
    Guerin       NJ      3   1   1   2   0   4
    Hannan       BUF     3   1   1   2   2   8
    Holik        NJ      3   1   1   2   1   4
    Muller       MON     3   1   1   2   0   0
    Sakic        QUE     3   1   1   2   0   0
    Semak        NJ      3   1   1   2  -2   0
    Sundin       QUE     3   1   1   2   1   2
    Taglianetti  PIT     3   1   1   2   3   6
    Tipett       PIT     3   1   1   2  -1   6
    Barasso      PIT     3   0   2   2   0   2
    Bondra       WAS     3   0   2   2   1   0
    Carney       BUF     3   0   2   2   3   4
    Cavallini    WAS     3   0   2   2   0   2
    Desjardins   MON     3   0   2   2   0   0
    Duchesne     QUE     3   0   2   2   1   2
    Niedermayer  NJ      3   0   2   2  -1   2
    Ricci        QUE     3   0   2   2   3   2
    Ridley       WAS     3   0   2   2  -1   0
    U.Samuelsson PIT     3   0   2   2   4   6
    Blake        LA      1   0   1   1   2   0
    Borschevsky  TOR     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Zelepukin    NJ      1   0   1   1  -2   0
    B.Mullen     NYI     2   1   0   1  -2   0
    Burr         DET     2   1   0   1  -1   2
    Domi         WIN     2   1   0   1   2   4
    Fedorov      DET     2   1   0   1   2   2
    Felsner      STL     2   1   0   1   1   0
    Howe         DET     2   1   0   1   4   2
    Huddy        LA      2   1   0   1   1   0
    Kurri        LA      2   1   0   1  -2   2
    Lefebvre     TOR     2   1   0   1   0  12
    Lidstrom     DET     2   1   0   1  -1   0
    Lowry        STL     2   1   0   1   1   2
    McSorley     LA      2   1   0   1  -3  12
    Millen       LA      2   1   0   1   2   4
    Mironov      TOR     2   1   0   1  -1   2
    Numminen     WIN     2   1   0   1  -2   0
    Paslawski    CAL     2   1   0   1  -1   0
    Steen        WIN     2   1   0   1  -4   0
    Ysebaert     DET     2   1   0   1   0   0
    Anderson     TOR     2   0   1   1  -2   2
    Berube       CAL     2   0   1   1   1  15
    Chelios      CHI     2   0   1   1  -1   2
    Ciccarelli   DET     2   0   1   1   1  14
    Clark        TOR     2   0   1   1   0   6
    Dahl         CAL     2   0   1   1   2   6
    Dipietro     MON     2   0   1   1   0   0
    Donnelly     LA      2   0   1   1   1   2
    Ellett       TOR     2   0   1   1  -3   0
    Gallant      DET     2   0   1   1   1   4
    K.Brown      CHI     2   0   1   1   1   0
    Kennedy      DET     2   0   1   1   1   0
    Larmer       CHI     2   0   1   1   0   0
    Matteau      CHI     2   0   1   1  -1   2
    McLean       VAN     2   0   1   1   0   0
    McRae        STL     2   0   1   1   1   2
    Murzyn       VAN     2   0   1   1   2   0
    Musil        CAL     2   0   1   1   0   5
    Pearson      TOR     2   0   1   1  -1  21
    Primeau      DET     2   0   1   1   1  20
    Probert      DET     2   0   1   1   0   6
    Ranheim      CAL     2   0   1   1   2   0
    Robitaille   LA      2   0   1   1  -4   2
    Roenick      CHI     2   0   1   1  -1   0
    Selanne      WIN     2   0   1   1  -2   0
    Shannon      WIN     2   0   1   1   4   0
    Skrudland    CAL     2   0   1   1   2  10
    Sutter       CHI     2   0   1   1  -1   0
    Taylor       LA      2   0   1   1   1   0
    Zhitnik      LA      2   0   1   1  -2   2
    Barr         NJ      3   1   0   1   0   6
    Bourque      BOS     3   1   0   1  -2   2
    Burridge     WAS     3   1   0   1  -2   0
    Dionne       MON     3   1   0   1   0   0
    Heinze       BOS     3   1   0   1   0   0
    Leschyshyn   QUE     3   1   0   1   1   4
    Presley      BUF     3   1   0   1   0   0
    Rucinsky     QUE     3   1   0   1   1   2
    Smolinski    BOS     3   1   0   1  -1   2
    Wood         BUF     3   1   0   1  -1   4
    Brunet       MON     3   0   1   1   0   0
    Daniels      PIT     3   0   1   1   1   0
    Donato       BOS     3   0   1   1  -5   0
    Driver       NJ      3   0   1   1  -3   4
    Gusarov      QUE     3   0   1   1   2   0
    Houlder      BUF     3   0   1   1   0   0
    K.Samuelsson PIT     3   0   1   1   2   0
    Kamensky     QUE     3   0   1   1   1   4
    Krygier      WAS     3   0   1   1   0   4
    Loney        PIT     3   0   1   1   2   0
    May          WAS     3   0   1   1   1   2
    Miller       WAS     3   0   1   1  -3   0
    Odelein      MON     3   0   1   1   0   0
    Pivonka      WAS     3   0   1   1  -1   0
    Shaw         BOS     3   0   1   1  -2   4
    Straka       PIT     3   0   1   1   0   0
    Belanger     MON     1   0   0   0   0   0
    Chorske      NJ      1   0   0   0   0   0
    Druce        WIN     1   0   0   0   0   0
    Eagles       WIN     1   0   0   0   0   0
    Errey        BUF     1   0   0   0   0   4
    Ewen         MON     1   0   0   0   0   0
    Foligno      TOR     1   0   0   0   0  16
    Goulet       CHI     1   0   0   0   0   0
    Grimson      CHI     1   0   0   0   0   2
    Hughes       BOS     1   0   0   0   0   2
    Kovalenko    QUE     1   0   0   0   0   2
    Leeman       MON     1   0   0   0   0   0
    McLlwain     TOR     1   0   0   0  -2   0
    Osbourne     TOR     1   0   0   0  -1   2
    Richer       NJ      1   0   0   0  -4   0
    Roberge      MON     1   0   0   0   0   0
    Schneider    MON     1   0   0   0   0   0
    Watters      LA      1   0   0   0   1   4
    Weimer       BOS     1   0   0   0  -1   4
    Andreychuk   TOR     2   0   0   0  -2   2
    Ashton       CAL     2   0   0   0  -1   2
    Babych       VAN     2   0   0   0   2   2
    Baron        STL     2   0   0   0   0   6
    Bassen       STL     2   0   0   0   0   4
    Baumgartner  TOR     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Bautin       WIN     2   0   0   0  -2   2
    Belfour      CHI     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Berg         TOR     2   0   0   0  -1   4
    Billington   NJ      2   0   0   0   0   0
    Blue         BOS     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Borsato      WIN     2   0   0   0  -2   0
    Bozon        STL     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Butcher      STL     2   0   0   0   2   0
    Cheveldae    DET     2   0   0   0   0   2
    Conacher     LA      2   0   0   0   2   0
    Corkum       BUF     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Diduck       VAN     2   0   0   0   2   2
    Dirk         VAN     2   0   0   0   0   2
    Erickson     WIN     2   0   0   0  -1   0
    Essensa      WIN     2   0   0   0   0   2
    Gilbert      CHI     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Graham       CHI     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Hardy        LA      2   0   0   0  -1  10
    Hedican      STL     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Hrudey       LA      2   0   0   0   0   0
    J.Lemieux    CHI     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Johansson    CAL     2   0   0   0  -1   0
    Joseph       STL     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Kasatonov    NJ      2   0   0   0  -2   0
    Kennedy      WIN     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Konstantinov DET     2   0   0   0   1   4
    Krushelnyski TOR     2   0   0   0  -2   0
    Lidster      VAN     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Lumme        VAN     2   0   0   0   2   4
    Macoun       TOR     2   0   0   0  -1   6
    Marchment    CHI     2   0   0   0   1   6
    Miller       STL     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Momesso      VAN     2   0   0   0  -1   2
    Moog         BOS     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Muni         CHI     2   0   0   0  -1   0
    Murphy       CHI     2   0   0   0  -1   4
    Murray       CHI     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Nedved       VAN     2   0   0   0  -2   2
    Olausson     WIN     2   0   0   0  -1   2
    Pearson      QUE     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Potvin       TOR     2   0   0   0   0   6
    Quintal      STL     2   0   0   0  -1   0
    Ramage       MON     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Ri.Sutter    STL     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Rouse        TOR     2   0   0   0  -2   0
    Russell      CHI     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Ruuttu       CHI     2   0   0   0   1   0
    S.Richer     BOS     2   0   0   0  -1   0
    S.Smith      CHI     2   0   0   0  -2   4
    Sandlak      VAN     2   0   0   0  -2   0
    Semenov      VAN     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Stern        CAL     2   0   0   0  -1  26
    T.Hunter     VAN     2   0   0   0   0   2
    T.Sweeney    BOS     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Terreri      NJ      2   0   0   0   0   0
    Tkachuk      WIN     2   0   0   0  -3  10
    Ulanov       WIN     2   0   0   0  -1   4
    Valk         VAN     2   0   0   0   0   2
    Vernon       CAL     2   0   0   0   0   2
    Wilson       STL     2   0   0   0   0   4
    Zezel        TOR     2   0   0   0  -2   2
    Zhamnov      WIN     2   0   0   0  -1   0
    Zombo        STL     2   0   0   0  -1   4
    Albelin      NJ      3   0   0   0  -1   0
    Anderson     WAS     3   0   0   0  -1   0
    Audette      BUF     3   0   0   0  -1   4
    Bodger       BUF     3   0   0   0   3   0
    Brisebois    MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    C.Lemieux    NJ      3   0   0   0  -4  17
    Carbonneau   MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Cavallini    QUE     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Cote         WAS     3   0   0   0  -3   0
    D.Sweeney    BOS     3   0   0   0  -2   4
    Daigneault   MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Dalgarno     NYI     3   0   0   0  -3   0
    Daneyko      NJ      3   0   0   0  -1   2
    Douris       BOS     3   0   0   0  -3   0
    Fetisov      NJ      3   0   0   0  -5   0
    Finn         QUE     3   0   0   0  -1   0
    Fitzgerald   NYI     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Foote        QUE     3   0   0   0   1   0
    Fuhr         BUF     3   0   0   0   0   2
    G.Roberts    BOS     3   0   0   0  -1   4
    Haller       MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Hatcher      WAS     3   0   0   0  -1   2
    Healy        NYI     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Hextall      QUE     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Hough        QUE     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Iafrate      WAS     3   0   0   0  -2   0
    Jennings     PIT     3   0   0   0   0   4
    Jones        WAS     3   0   0   0  -2   5
    Kasparaitis  NYI     3   0   0   0   0   4
    Keane        MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Kimble       BOS     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Krupp        NYI     3   0   0   0   2   2
    Kvartalnov   BOS     3   0   0   0   0   2
    LeClair      MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Leach        BOS     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Lebeau       MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Ledyard      BUF     3   0   0   0  -3   4
    Loiselle     NYI     3   0   0   0  -1   2
    MacLean      NJ      3   0   0   0  -4   4
    Malakov      NYI     3   0   0   0   1   2
    May          BUF     3   0   0   0   0   4
    McKay        NJ      3   0   0   0   0  16
    Nicholls     NJ      3   0   0   0  -4   4
    Nolan        QUE     3   0   0   0   1   2
    Norton       NYI     3   0   0   0   3   0
    Patterson    BUF     3   0   0   0  -1   2
    Pilon        NYI     3   0   0   0   1  22
    Poulin       BOS     3   0   0   0  -4   0
    Roy          MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Savard       MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Simon        QUE     3   0   0   0  -1   2
    Stapleton    PIT     3   0   0   0   1   0
    Stastny      NJ      3   0   0   0  -1   2
    Sutton       BUF     3   0   0   0   2   0
    T.Green      NYI     3   0   0   0  -3   0
    Tabaracci    WAS     3   0   0   0   0   4
    Vukota       NYI     3   0   0   0  -1   2
    Wesley       BOS     3   0   0   0   1   0
    Wolanin      QUE     3   0   0   0   1   4
-- 

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-                                                                           -
-    Maurice Richard                                                        -

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54206
From: chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Subject: Re: SHARKS: Jack Feirerra (was Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!)

mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler) writes:

>I've been a loyal ticket holder, since day 1 (literally) in spring of
>'90 when the team was announced.  and I'm not getting that loyalty
>returned.

Well, so are we, and we see it completely different than you. Guess it's a
matter of perspective.

-- 
 Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= chuq@apple.com
   Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms =+=  GEnie: MAC.BIGOT =+= ALink:CHUQ 
  Minor League fans: minors-request@medraut.apple.com (San Jose Giants: A/1/9)
  San Francisco Giants fans: giants-request@medraut.apple.com (The Stick?NOT!)
   San Jose Sharks fans: sharks-request@medraut.apple.com (New seat: 127/TBD)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54207
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: Blues shutout Hawks again, lead series 3-0

4/23/93    BLUES SHUTOUT HAWKS AGAIN, LEAD SERIES 3-0
-----------------------------------------------------
It was a great atmosphere last night at the St. Louis Arena as Joseph and
the Blues shutout the Hawks for the second consecutive game. People were
cheering the Blues long before face-off time, and they kept going for the
entire game. My friends and I went out celebrating until the early morning
hours with some of the players. Here's a game summary from the St. Louis
Post-Disptach. Enjoy...

By Dave Luecking
Of The Post-Dispatch Staff:

At 10:24 p.m. Friday night, The Arena crowd of 17,965 paid homage to Blues
goalie Curtis Joseph. The fans began bowing, their arms extended, taking the
the lead from a fan who held a sign that read ``Only God Saves More Than
Joseph."  It was a fitting tribute to Joseph, who has brought the Blues to
the verge of a surprising sweep.

Joseph recorded his second successive shutout Friday, blanking the Blackhawks
3-0 in Game 3 of the Norris Division semifinals and giving the Blues a 3-0
lead in the best-of-seven series.

The Blackhawks haven't scored against Joseph since the 8:51 mark of the second
period of Game 1. Joseph has shut out the Blackhawks for 151 minutes 9 seconds,
a Blues record. Jacques Plante held the previous record of 146:28, set in the
first round of the 1969 playoffs against the Philadelphia Flyers, one of only
two series the Blues have sweeped in their history.

The Blues can wrap up their first sweep since 1969 with a victory in Game 4,
a nationally televised game that begins at noon Sunday. The Blues have had
only two sweeps in franchise history, both in 1969, when they swept
Philadelphia and Los Angeles en route to the Stanley Cup finals.

The shutout Friday was easier than on Wednesday in Game 2 when Joseph had to
make 47 saves. This time, the Blues held the shots down to 34, and the
Blackhawks couldn't touch Joseph.

Well, they touched Joseph, numerous times, shoving him and pushing him at 
every opportunity to try to get him off his game. But Joseph and the Blues
were unfazed, dishing out their own punishment along the way.

The Blues' grinders -- Bob Bassen, Rich Sutter, Kevin Miller and Dave Lowry --
wore down the Blackhawks, taking the visitors from Chicago off their game.
The grinders set the stage for the glamour boys, the gifted playmakers and
scorers, who made the most of their opportunities.

Craig Janney, Brett Hull and Nelson Emerson scored, getting one goal in each
period. Hull assisted on Janney's first-period power play goal after two unwise
Chicago penalties. Checker Miller set up Hull's goal in the second period, and
rookie Denny Felsner assisted for Emerson, who scored at 16:44 of the final 
period.

Blues fans jumped to their feet in celebration of that goal and began yelling
``Sweep. Sweep. Sweep." They also taunted Chicago goalie Ed Belfour 
``Bell-Four. Bell-Four." They also chanted ``Na, na-na-na, hey-hey good bye."

Such talk is a tad premature. There's still one game left, but the Blues are
on a roll. They have the Blackhawks on their heels.

The Blues set the tone early on Friday with two crunching hits in the first
minute of play. Rich Sutter leveled Bryan Marchment, and Brendan Shanahan
dumped Steve Smith at center ice.

Chicago tried to retaliate, but Troy Murray's decision to run into Joseph
backfired. Referee Dan Marouelli gave him a roughing penalty.

The Blues didn't get a shot on goal on the power play, and they survived a
scare after Chicago killed the penalty when Rick Zombo gave the puck away to
Steve Larmer. Joseph stopped Larmer's shot and everything else Chicago threw
at him in the first period. The 'Hawks ignored the scouting report on Joseph
about shooting high and continued to shoot low, where Joseph's butterfly
style is deadly.

Rookie Bret Hedican picked up three consecutive penalties midway through the
period -- two for hooking and one for holding -- but Chicago got only two
shots on goal, as many as Miller. The Blues' penalty killer twice stole the
puck and just missed on good scoring chances against Belfour.
 
Marouelli began calling penalties on the Blackhawks to even things up.
He caught Brent Sutter hooking Shanahan four seconds after Hedican's third
penalty. He called Marchment for elbowing Janney along the boards at 14:58,
and gave the Blues a two-man advantage 1:07 later when Christian Ruuttu
slashed Shanahan.

The Blues worked around the puck on the ensuing power play, and Hull got it
where he likes it -- in the high slot. Hull's shot hit Belfour's right
shoulder, and the puck bounced precariously close to the goal line. Belfour
dived back to cover, but the puck squirted loose to Janney, who poked it into
the net at 16:53 for his first goal of the playoffs.

The Blues continued their relentless hitting as the period ended, and the
Blackhawks lost their composure. Joe Murphy tripped Ron Wilson with two seconds
remaining in the period, and after time had expired Smith upset the Blues by
shooting the puck into the Blues' bench.

Chris Chelios made a move toward Joseph as the teams left the ice, and
Marouelli slapped him with a 10-minute misconduct. Chicago survived the Blues'
power play, but the loss of Chelios hurt. He didn't return until the midway
point of the period, and within three minutes of his return, Hull had increased
the Blues' lead to 2-0, deflecting in Miller's crisp pass.

Try as they might, the Blackhawks couldn't get to Joseph, who stopped
everything they could throw at him. He stopped 12 shots in the second period
and 13 more in the third. Chicago also hit the goalpost twice.

Emerson's goal put the game away. He went hard to the net and redirected
Felsner's pass.

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54208
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: ESPN2 - Tell us about it

In article <1r997l$3fc@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> mac18@po.CWRU.Edu (Michael A. Cornell) writes:
>
>The USA Today says "late this year".  The question is, will hockey be moved to
>ESPN2 permenantly, or will it be where they have a game of the week on
>ESPN, and have a bunch of other games on ESPN2?
>

Yes and No. ESPN2 will be launched as early in September. Cap Cities
are currently working with cable companies to ensure a good start-up
base needed for a launch for any brand new cable service.

The problem ESPN2 faces is the TCI-Cablevision connection in the
merger of their Prime and SportsChannel networks. Prime SportsChannel
will try to wrestle away NHL from ESPN in the off-season. Also,TCI
and Cablevision have control a large number of cable systems around the
country with a total of 15 million subscribers. TCI-Cablevision will
do their best that ESPN2 never gets off the ground successfully. And the
NHL's value will suddenly skyrocket in this cable war between Prime SC
and ESPN. NHL is more vital to the survival of a regionalized Prime
SportsChannel since they virtually have no national major league sports
contracts and only cover local NHL/NBA/MLB sports teams.

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54218
From: seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr)
Subject: FLYERS notes 4/16


The FLYERS blew a 3-0 lead over the Buffalo Sabres in the second period, but
Kevin Dineen's 7th career hat trick powered them to their 7th consecutive win,
7-4 over the Sabres who have now lost 7 in a row. Alexander Mogilny led the
comeback scoring his 75th and 76th goals of the season which tied the game at
3 in the 2nd period and 4 in the 3rd. Tommy Soderstrom stopped 41 of 45 shots
on goal to improve his own record to 20-17-6 as he was tested by Mogilny and
LaFontaine all night.

Roster move:

Andre Faust was once again recalled from Hershey, Shawn Cronin was a healthy
scratch.

Lines:

Eklund-Lindros-Recchi
Beranek-Brind'Amour-Dineen
Lomakin-Butsayev-Conroy
Faust-Acton-Brown

Galley-Bowen
Yushkevich-Hawgood
Carkner-McGill

Tommy Soderstrom

Game Summary:

Say, if anybody from Buffalo is reading this, where did you people get that
woman who sang the anthems? We had to turn down the volume!

The FLYERS defense started out the game showing everybody why the FLYERS have
been shutting teams out lately by holding the Sabres to only 8 shots in the
first period. They then showed everybody why they will be playing golf Sunday
when they gave up 37 shots in the last two periods. Maybe Tommy told them that
he was getting bored back there...

Mark Recchi opened the scoring so fast that if you blinked you missed it. After
Buffalo won the faceoff and dumped, Tommy wrapped the puck around the boards
to Eric 1/2 way up on his left. Eric dropped it to Galley, and he sent it ahead
to Recchi steaming out of the zone. Mark skated into the center circle, passed
the puck to himself through the legs of Richard Smehlik, skated around him and
in on Fuhr. Smehlik was pulling at him all the way through the zone with his
stick, Recchi drifted right, drifted back left, and slid the puck back to the
right past Fuhr for a 1-0 FLYERS lead at 0:18. It was so beautiful Eric and
Garry should turn down their assists :-).

The FLYERS kept the pressure on Fuhr for a while after that, but he was strong
and kept the FLYERS from doing further damage. The game then became a defensive
struggle for a while. The Sabres got the first chance on the power play when
Terry Carkner took a boarding minor at 10:26 for crunching Dale Hawerchuk into
the boards in the FLYERS zone. LaFontaine got the only scoring chance, and not
a terribly good one, as the FLYERS smothered the Sabres power play. Mogilny got
a post after it was over. The 25th consecutive penalty kill for the FLYERS.

Keith Carney took a holding penalty at 13:31 for taking down Mark Recchi to
give the FLYERS a power play. The best penalty killing team in the league
didn't allow the FLYERS a shot on goal, although the FLYERS did create a
good scoring chance for Lindros who partially fanned on his shot. Towards
the end of the period the play started going end to end, but everybody kept
missing the net. Greg Hawgood took an interference penalty at 18:19 to give
the Sabres another power play, but they couldn't get anything going and the
fans expressed their displeasure, particularly when they iced the puck. Shots
were 8-6 Buffalo after the FLYERS had led 6-2 at one point.

Mike Emrick interviewed FLYERS president Jay Snider between periods. Jay was
disappointed to not make the playoffs, but not discouraged. This was considered
a rebuilding year after *The Trade* and he seemed very happy with the way the
season went. When asked if he agonized over *The Trade* he said that it was
Russ Farwell's trade and not his, that it only was an issue for him and Ed
Snider as far as the money. But yes, there was some agonizing, and they'd do
it all over again. When asked how the coaching situation would be handled for
next year he said that it's Russ' call, and Russ will evaluate things at the
end of the season. He feels that they're 3 years away from a shot at the Cup.
He expects to get into the playoffs next year, have a shot at a division title
the following year, and a shot at the finals the year after that. This based
on the current level of play and anticipated improvements over the summer.

He's very happy with the re-alignment (he called it "outstanding"). Happy with
the current expansion, feels that the talent pool is big enough with the unflux
of Europeans, but feels that they must make sure existing franchises are stable.
Seemed to like the idea of playing in the Olympics (booo) but said that there
was a definite split among owners and that this certainly would only happen in
four years if there was a consensus.

The Sabres gave the FLYERS their second power play of the game when Brad May
took a tripping penalty at 0:51 of the second. The FLYERS had a little trouble
getting started, but eventually did. Hawgood took a pass as he was moving
throug the neutral zone and handed the puck to Eklund just outside the Sabres
blue line along the right boards. Eklund carried into the zone nad passed
across to Dineen who tried a one timer from between the blue line and the
top of the left circle. He half fanned on it, and sent the puck trickling
through the slot. Fuhr didn't know where it was, though, and Hawgood won the
race to it and flipped it into essentially an open net at 2:15.

Then Mogilny on a breakaway. He slipped through two FLYERS at the blue line
and went in on Soderstrom. He went with the backhander, but Soderstrom was
all over it.

The FLYERS then took some bad discipline type penalties that really hurt them.
Viacheslav Butsayev took a double minor for roughing and high sticking when
Barnaby got under his skin and drew one minor, then according to Gary Dornhoefer
took a dive to get the other (there was no video) at 4:22. The Sabres coudln't
get started. Ryan McGill poked at the puck just after a Sabre carried into the
FLYERS zone, and after a bunch of people poked at it Dineen emerged with it and
headed the other way. It started out a 1 on 1, but Brind'Amour hustled ahead to
make it a 2 on 1 and back off the defenseman. Dineen let it rip from the top
of the right circle to make it 3-0 FLYERS at 5:40. That was all for Fuhr, John
Muckler sent in Dominik Hasek to take over.

But the Sabres still had lots of power play time. Again they took some time to
just get into the FLYERS zone, and when they finally did the FLYERS were all
over them. Boos began to ring through the building. But they finally got through
Soderstrom on an ugly goal. Smehlik took a shot from the top of the zone that
missed and kicked out to Hawerchuk in the slot. Hawerchuk tried a backhander as
he skated towards the goal line to the right as Galley dove down to block it.
Mistake #1, he should have let Soderstrom handle the backhander and worried
about A) the rebound or B) Barnaby who was camped behind the goal line right
next to the net. Well, the rebound dropped right next to Soderstrom, and
mistake #2, Galley just laid there and watched Barnaby get THREE hacks at the
puck before he finally pushed it through the goalie. He didn't even swing his
stick out to try and knock the puck away. With the goal, at 7:48, two streaks
end for the FLYERS. 150:28 of shutout hockey, and 27 straight penalty kills.

Lindros put them right back on the power play at 8:36 with a high sticking
minor, I think it was Barnaby again. This time the Sabres were able to get
set up quickly, but couldn't get too much quality on goal. The Sabres continued
to keep the puck in the FLYERS end for a while after the power play ended.
Things evetually settled down, but then the other very bad penalty. McGill
allowed Barnaby to get under his skin and slashed his stick just before a
faceoff. The gloves were dropped, and McGill started pounding the crap out of
him. But during the fight, he gave Barnaby a head butt with his helmet, and
that meant a match penalty. 2 for slashing, 5 fighting and 5 for the major,
7 minutes of power play time for the Sabres at 14:15, Barnaby only got 5.

The FLYERS were keeping them at bay for a while, but there was only so long
they could do that. After a couple of good Sabre chances, Audette handed to
Ledyard at the point, and Ledyard sent a drive that was knocked down by
Soderstrom. LaFontaine whacked at the bouncing puck from the left side of
the net, and knocked it over to Randy Wood at the right. Soderstrom had
moved over to play LaFontaine, and since Yushkevich and Carkner were waving
at the puck instead of picking up men, Wood just slid it into the empty net
at 17:34 to close the FLYERS lead to 3-2. LaFontaine was actually trying to
put it on net, but half fanned on it and got a break.

The FLYERS then got some shorthanded pressure in the Sabres zone, but Hasek
was strong. Finally it was Keith Carney passing ahead to Hawerchuk into the
neutral zone, and Hawerchuk sent a good backhand pass to Mogilny at the FLYERS
blue line. Another mini-breakaway for Mogilny, he elected to shoot from the
left circle, and he threaded the needle to get it just inside the far post at
18:56 for his 75th of the season. Ironically, the youth hockey tip between
the 1st and second period was Tommy Soderstrom talking about cutting off
angles...

That was all in the 2nd, shots were 19-7 Sabres.

Into the 3rd period, and Pelle EKlund blew a golden opportunity to get the
FLYERS the lead back. A 2 on 1, Acton with the puck, he dropped to Eklund in
the slot, and Eklund held the puck as he slid through the left circle until
he had almost no angle at all to shoot from. When he finally did shoot, he
hit the far post. That was still during the carryover power play time.

Than an incredible almost goal. Randy Wood skated around Recchi and Hawgood
untouched into Soderstrom. Soderstrom goes down, Wood pokes the puck under
Soderstrom, and a black object hits the back of the net. Red light comes on,
horn sounds, crowd cheers. But up to the video replay booth, for some strange
reason, and in the meantime Emrick and Dornhoefer try to figure out what they
could be reviewing. Well, it turns out that it was the taped up stick blade
that went into the net, not the puck. Emrick mentions that one of the criteria
for scoring a goal is that the puck must go into the net...

Dave Hannan then took out Recchi and got a holding minor at 2:35. The FLYERS
could not get anything going at all. They finally got set up 1/2 way through,
but were kept on the perimeter. As time ran out, Beranek stripped the puck
from a Sabre in the offensive zone along the right boards and passed it across
to Eklund at the top of the left circle. Eklund saw Dineen heading at the net
just inside the right circle and passed through to him. Dineen fumbled the pass,
but twice directed it at Hasek, and Eklund swooped in and chipped the bouncing
puck over the goalie for his 11th at 4:42. 4-3 FLYERS.

But the Sabres came right back. LaFontaine picked up the puck in his offensive
left corner and slid it to Bob Erry behind the FLYERS net. Erry started to skate
out, but then just dropped the puck back to nobody behind the net. Mogilny flew
in, skated around, and stuffed it through Soderstrom's 5 hole for his 76th at
5:24 to tie the game at 4.

Then Hawerchuk took a retaliatory roughing penalty at 5:55. The FLYERS set up
in the Sabres zone, and stayed there. Off a faceoff high in the Sabres zone in
the middle. While Brind'Amour wrestled for the puck, Dineen snuck through the
line and wristed a perfect shot low to Hasek's glove side at 6:44.

Play started to go back and forth until Hawgood took a roughing penalty at 8:19.
The FLYERS dumped the puck into the Sabres zone. Brind'Amour and Ledyard went
after it, and Rod got the puck. He backed away from the right boards, skated
to the right faceoff dot, and passed between his legs to Dineen crashing
through the slot all by himself. Dineen waited patiently and lifted it over
the blocker of Hasek for a 6-4 FLYERS lead at 8:39. 3rd hat trick of the season
for Dineen, 7th of his career, 2nd shorthanded goal of the game for him 35th
of the season.

Then Carney took a tripping penalty at 9:02 to kill the rest of the Sabres
power play. Not much action on the 4 on 4, and the Sabres got most of the
chances on the FLYERS resulting power play.

Play went end to end for quite a while after that and both goalies had to
make some big saves. The Sabres weren't able to pull Hasek as time was running 
out as the FLYERS wouldn't allow any consistant possession for the Sabres.
Finally as time was running out Ken Sutton misplayed the puck in his own left
corner and Brind'Amour stripped it away from him. He pulled away and found
Dineen on the other side of the left circle, and Dineen found Acton at the
right of Hasek. He slid the puck between two Sabres defenders, and Acton
chipped it back to the far side of Hasek for his 8th of the season at 19:48
on his 35th birthday. That was all the scoring, shots were 18-13 Buffalo,
and the ice was showered with plastic drinking mugs handed out before the
game.

So another strong game from Tommy Soderstrom who hadn't been tested much
in his last couple of starts. Kevin Dineen has a career high 6 point night
(unless he had a better night earlier in the season, but I don't think so).
The FLYERS longest winning streak in 3 years, 30 goals for only 11 against
with three shutouts. Eric Lindros is 8th in league with 33 even strength goals
despite missing 23 games with injury. 4 points out of 4th, clinched 5th place
since the Rangers lose the tie breaker.

A couple misc notes:

Forget the Mike Keenan rumors, there will be a press conference tommorrow to
announce that he will be head coach of the New York Rangers next year.

In the last notes I mentioned that Garry Galley won the Barry Ashbee Award,
but I failed to mention that the award is for the best defenseman.

The Times of Trenton has reported that "a preeminent specialist from Oklahoma"
has looked over Tommy Soderstrom's medical record and determined that no
further tests are necessary in the near future.

Same paper had a blurb about Bill Dineen being asked about whether or not he
expected to be back next year. His response was that he wants to come back,
he feels he did a good job this year, but that he would cheerfully accept a
role scouting if Farwell didn't want him back.

FLYERS team record watch:

Eric Lindros:

41 goals, 33 assists, 74 points

(rookie records)
club record goals:			club record points:
Eric Lindros	40 1992-93		Dave Poulin	76 1983-84
Brian Propp	34 1979-80		Brian Propp	75 1979-80
Ron Flockhart	33 1981-82		Eric Lindros	74 1992-93
Dave Poulin	31 1983-84		Ron Flockhart	72 1981-82
Bill Barber	30 1972-73		Pelle Eklund	66 1985-86

Mark Recchi:

52 goals, 69 assists, 121 points.

club record goals:			club record points:
Reggie Leach	61 1975-76		Mark Recchi	121 1992-93*
Tim Kerr	58 1985-86,86-87	Bobby Clarke	119 1975-76
Tim Kerr	54 1983-84,84-85	Bobby Clarke	116 1974-75
Mark Recchi	52 1992-93		Bill Barber	112 1975-76
Rick Macliesh	50 1972-73		Bobby Clarke	104 1972-73
Bill Barber	50 1975-76		Rick Macliesh	100 1972-73
Reggie Leach	50 1979-80

*More than 80 games.

FLYERS career years:

Player		Points	Best Prior Season
Mark Recchi	121	113 (90-91 Penguins)
Rod Brind'Amour	84	77 (91-92 FLYERS)
Garry Galley	62	38 (84-85 Kings)
Brent Fedyk	59	35 (90-91 Red Wings)

That's all for now...

pete clark jr - rsh FLYERS contact and mailing list owner


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54219
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: Ulf and all...

Richard Wernick (richard@amc.com) wrote:
: You should be ashamed to call yourself an Ulf Samuelson fan. Anybody who plays
: the way he does, does not belong in the NHL. There have been cheap shot artists
: through the history of the game, but a lot of them have been talanted players.
: Bobby Clarke, Kenny Linsemen, Pie McKenzie, Chris Chelios etc.. but nobody has been
: out right as dirty a cheapshot coward as Ulf. Violence in hockey has got to be curbed
: and players like (Should have been a Women) Samuelson don't belong. When players
: like Ulf, who's main purpose is to injure the better players in the league is allowed
: to continue, and the league won't stop it, the players should. A Christian Pro 1000
: aluminum stick directed at his ugly head should do the trick nicely. If the Bruins get
: a chance to meet Pittsburgh in the near future, you can bet Neely will have his day.
: The sight of watching Ulf turtle up like the coward he is, is worth almost as much as a
: Stanely Cup. This wimp of a player almost ruined the career of one the best right wingers
: in the game. If you are to remove Ulf Samuelson from the lineup, the Penguins would not
: even notice he's gone. He's an eyesore on the game of hockey.


: Rich


Thank you for your extremely lucid and well thought out observation.
Now when you get back on your medication, please let us know how you
are feeling. 
Thank you,
--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54220
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: Goodbye, good riddance, get lost 'Stars

Stephen Lawrence (s4lawren@sms.business.uwo.ca) wrote:
:         Goodbye Minnesota,...you never earned the right to have an NHL 
: franchise in the first place!
:         Hope you enjoy your Twin city wide mania for HIGH SCHOOL HOCKEY
: (hey, by the way my old pee wee team is having a reunion in Regina, care 
: to come up and film the event?)
:         Yee haa Golden Gophers
: Whatta weird town!!!!!

: s4lawren@sms.business.uwo.ca (Stephen Lawrence)
: Western Business School  --  London, Ontario

This is the second posting of this kind from an idiot at a business 
school in Canada. What is your problem up there anyway? Is this what 
they teach you in business school in Canada?
--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54221
From: jfp001@acad.drake.edu
Subject: Re: Goalie Mask Update

In article <93289@hydra.gatech.EDU>, gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak) writes:
> 
> 	Here are the results after three days of voting. Remember 3pts for 
> 1st, 2 for 2nd, and 1 for 3rd. Also, you can still turn in votes! And.. if
> the guy isn't a regular goalie or he is retired, please include the team! 
> Thanks for your time, and keep on sending in those votes!
> 
> Player                  Team                  Pts     Votes
> -----------------------------------------------------------
> 1. Brian Hayward        San Jose              15        6
>    Andy Moog            Boston                15        6
> 3. Curtis Joseph        St. Louis             11        5
> 4. Ed Belfour           Chicago               10        5
> 5. Gerry Cheevers       Boston (retired)       5        3 
>    Manon Rheaume        Atlanta (IHL)          5        2
>    Ron Hextall          Quebec                 5        2
> 8. Don Beaupre          Washington             4        2
> -----------------------------------------------------------
> Others receiving 1 vote: Artus Irbe (SJ), Tim Cheveldae (Det),
>  Clint Malarchuck (Buf/SD,IHL), Grant Fuhr (Buf), Rick Wamsley 
>  (Tor,ret), Jon Casey (Minn), John Vanbiesbrouck (NYR),
>  Ken Dryden (Mon,ret), Bob Essensa (Win), Mike Vernon (Cal),
>  Glenn Healy (NYI), Tommy Soderstron (???), Ray LeBlanc (USA).
> 

C'mon, Tommy Soderstrom is having a fine rookie (I think he's a rookie)
season with the Flyers. I'm sure most of you knew that already, but just
in case. 

John P.
jfp001@acad.drake.edu
A longtime, but realistic Ranger fan who's willing to admit that the Rangers
sucked big-time this year. They don't even deserve the luxury of a nice
golf course with a warm breeze. God, talk about underachievers!
Mike Keenan - we're waiting for you!
> 
> -- 
> GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
> GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
> GO HORNETS!  ||
> GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54222
From: nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: SHARKS REVIEW Part 3: Defensemen (21-45)

#21	PETER AHOLA		Season: 2nd
Acquired:	'92-93, trade with Pittsburgh for future considerations
Grade:		I (B)

It is way too early to tell about Ahola, who was acquired probably because the
Penguins figured that they would lose him in the expansion draft.  Ahola had
only played 50 games this season (I think it's actually less; the San Jose
Mercury News may be in err here), 20 of them with the Sharks.  In the games he
has played, he appeared quite solid defensively, although he hasn't been
spectacular, and his offense isn't anything to write home about (8 points);
it's even possible that the trade may be for future considerations which turn
out to be ... Peter Ahola.

#24	DOUG WILSON		Season: 16th
Acquired:	'91-92, trade with Chicago for RW Kerry Toporowski and
		2nd round pick in '92 entry draft
Grade:		I (B)

I have often been accused of overly down on Wilson; I may have had too high
expectations for him, but his legs, knees, et al., are giving out.
Nevertheless, when he was playing, he exhibited a strong shooting and
playmaking abilities, even if he has lost a step on defense, which,
unfortunately, he demonstrated this year as well, as at times he was slow to
catch the opponent forwards, and his offensive output was only good enough for
2nd place on the team (20 points in 42 games).  But next year, which may be
Wilson's last, if he can stay healthy, he can still be a contributor.

#29	DEAN KOLSTAD		Season:	2nd
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		I (C-/D+)

It's probably somewhat unfair for me to judge Kolstad on just a handful of
games (forgetting exact number, but no more than 15), but at age 25 he's
quickly running out of time if he wants to make it to the NHL.  In those games,
he did not impress anyone; after generating 7 shots in the first period of
the first game he played, he scored just 2 points in his tenure up here with
the Sharks, and was even less impressive defensively, as he appeared awkward
with his movement and was prone to giveaways.  He needs to make a leap in
his level of performance to have any chance of making the team.

#38	PAT MACLEOD		Season: 2nd
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		I (?)

MacLeod was on the roster a lot longer than Kolstad, but it appears to my
memory that he played less than Kolstad, because the Sharks were reluctant to
use him, but were even more reluctant to send him to the minors, figuring that
he wouldn't clear waivers; in fact, he has played the past 4-5 weeks with
Kansas City, but is still technically there on a rehabilitation assignment,
a "rehab assignment" that will include him playing in the Turner Cup playoffs.
Since he has played so little, I can't even give a tentative grade on him, but
he demonstrated last year excellent offensive skills but terrible defensive
skills.

#41	TOM PEDERSON		Season: 1st
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		I (B+)

Called up in the middle of the season when the defensive corps was decimated
by injuries, Pederson impressed many Sharks fan here on net, including yours
truly.  He demonstrated very good offensive skills, scoring 20 points in
43 games.  However, his size (5' 9", 165 lbs.) is of concern, and soon after
he began to shine offensive did teams begin to push him around physically,
on both sides of the ice, although he had appeared fearless in his approach.
But to be successful, he probably needs to bulk up to have a fighting chance
on surviving against some of the bigger players in the league.

#45	CLAUDIO SCREMIN		Season: 1st
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		I (D+/D)

He played all of ~5 games in the league this year, but was thoroughly
umimpressive, just as he was at the end of last season; again, it may be a
small sample, but just as in the case of Kolstad, Scremin, at age 25, is
quickly running out of time.  He was not a contributor on either offense or
defense in the games he played with the Sharks.  The only notable thing that
will go down in Scremin's entry of league stats is probably the fact that he
was once traded for now Capitals goaltender Don Beaupre.

===============================================================================
GO CALGARY FLAMES!  Al MacInnis for Norris!  Gary Roberts for Hart and Smythe!
GO EDMONTON OILERS!  Go for playoffs next year!  Stay in Edmonton!
===============================================================================
Nelson Lu (claudius@leland.stanford.edu)
rec.sport.hockey contact for the San Jose Sharks

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54223
From: e8l6@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (Rocket)
Subject: Dear Montana@pinetree.org  Re: Hockey Pool



   Hi there, I can't seem to get mail to you. Can you tell me your entire
adress, or even your dotted decimal address?

   (ie. 131.202.3.10)

   Thanks,
           rocket@calvin.cs.unb.ca 

-- 

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-                                                                           -
-    Maurice Richard                                                        -

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54224
From: schock@flip.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (Craig-Richard Schock)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

In article <1993Apr22.121035.3394@mtroyal.ab.ca>  writes:
> >And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
> >resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
> >team captain trivia would be appreciated.
> 
> Brad McCrimmon was the captain of the Flames when he was traded to Detroit
> following the 1989-90 season. This was during the off-season though.
> 
> There's countless examples of captains being traded, I'm sure.

Yeah... I think that the Flames and the Flyers traded Captains once... Mel  
Bridgeman for Brad Marsh.

Craig

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54225
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: ESPN2 - Tell us about it

nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219) writes:
>
>The problem ESPN2 faces is the TCI-Cablevision connection in the
>merger of their Prime and SportsChannel networks. Prime SportsChannel
>will try to wrestle away NHL from ESPN in the off-season. Also, TCI
>and Cablevision have control a large number of cable systems around the
>country with a total of 15 million subscribers. TCI-Cablevision will
>do their best that ESPN2 never gets off the ground successfully. And the
>NHL's value will suddenly skyrocket in this cable war between Prime SC
>and ESPN. NHL is more vital to the survival of a regionalized Prime
>SportsChannel since they virtually have no national major league sports
>contracts and only cover local NHL/NBA/MLB sports teams.

Note that this ominous prospect is fueled by the fact that various SC
and Prime outlets are wholly or partly owned by local NHL owners.
When/If Cablevision VP Chuck Dolan's purchase of the Islanders goes
through, the Islanders will be back solidly in the SCNY fold (their
original owners were, and they've remained due to a lucrative TV
contract).  The Flyer Snyders own the Philadelphia SC as well as the
Prism pay channel.  There are six teams affiliated with regional SC's,
another half dozen affiliated with Prime outlets, and other locals
like HTS and NESN who have barter arrangements.  With all this
cross-ownership, I was surprised that ESPN got the deal this 
season!!

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54226
From: rzuback@alumni.Lakeheadu.Ca
Subject: Leafs Revenge!

Tonight will see the Toronto Maple Leafs, as some have guessed, come out 
hitting!  The "Buds" will grind Detroit into the ground and walk away with 
home ice advantage for the remainder of the series... which given a shift to 
Toronto, will not last long.  (Keep in mind this is only a predicition).  
Wendall will have to get into the game however otherwise Probert will 
dominate on the physical front.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54227
From: jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio)
Subject: Re: NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 23 APRIL 1993

In article <1993Apr24.131127.17461@philabs.philips.com> jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio) writes:

>NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 23 APRIL 1993:
>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>                  CONFERENCE SEMI-FINALS        BEST OF SEVEN
>      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE

> NYI   (leads 2-1)   MON                 TOR                 LA    
> WAS                 QUE   (leads 2-1)   DET   (leads 2-1)   CAL   (tied  2-1)
                                                                     ^^^^^^^^^^

O.K. people, so it's not tied.  I meant leads 2-1........  Shoot me if you
must.

-JPC

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John P. Curcio 		          Go Bruins!		   Philips Laboratories
jpc@philabs.philips.com 			           345 Scarborough Road
(914) 945-6442               	 		     Briarcliff Manor, NY 10510 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54228
From: farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: College hockey all-star game roster

Someone asked about the rosters for the college hockey senior all-star
shrine game held in Orono, Maine earlier this month: 

WEST
Derek Plante		MINN-DULUTH	(west MVP of the game)
Greg Johnson		N DAKOTA		
Bryan Smolinski		MICH ST
Fred Knipscheer		ST CLOUD STATE
Chris Campbell		WISCONSIN-SUPERIOR
Glenn Lang		UW-SUPERIOR
Chris Bergeron		MIAMI
Joe Cook		MIAMI
Jamie Erb		BEMIDIJI
Brett Harkins		BOWLING GREEN
David Roberts		MICHIGAN
Todd Trettier		UW-STEVENS POINT
John Young		MICH TECH
Brett Hauer		MINN-DULUTH
Pat Neaton		MICHIGAN
Barry Richter		WISCONSIN
Mike Smith		LSSU
Chris Valicevic		ST MARY'S
Shaun Gravistin		AK-ANCHORAGE	(goalie)
Tom Newman		MINNESOTA	   "
Bryan Schoen		DENVER		   "
Ron Mason		MICH ST		(coach)
Steve Nelson		UW-SUPERIOR	  "
Jim Knapp		MINN-DULUTH	  "

EAST
Jack Duffy		YALE
Chris Foy		N'EASTERN
Scott Meehan		MASS-LOWELL
Aaron Miller		VERMONT
Kevin O'SUllivan	BU
Chris Potter		CONNECTICUT
Ray Alcindor		MIDDLEBURY
Greg Carvel		ST LAWRENCE
Bob Cowan		PROVIDENCE
Steve Dubinksy		CLARKSON
Dan Gravelle		MERRIMACK
Ryan Hughes		CORNELL
Mark Kauffman		YALE
Matt Mallgrave		HARVARD
Chris McGee		BABSON
Scott McNair		RIT
Jim Montgomery		MAINE
David Sacco		BU
Chris Rogles		CLARKSON	(goalie)   (East's MVP of the game)
Garth Snow		MAINE		   "
Grant Wood		HAMILTON	   "
Brian Durocher		BROWN		(coach)
Shawn Walsh		MAINE   	   "
Bruce Marshalll		CONNECTICUT	   "


These are the original rosters. There may have been a few changes
for the actual game (guys not being able to participate or whatever).

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54229
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL Playoff results, Thurs/Fri

AHL PLAYOFF SCORES-- FIRST ROUND	(home team in CAPS)
================================

GAMES PLAYED ON THURS, 4/22
-------------------------
Rochester 4	UTICA 3		(OT)
		
GAMES PLAYED ON FRI, 4/23
--------------------------
Binghamton 8	BALTIMORE 3
MONCTON 5	St John's 4	(OT)
Springfield 4	PROVIDENCE 2

===================================================================
SERIES STATI (plural of status? :)
----------------------------------
Adirondack defeated CDI, 4-0
Springfield leads Providence, 3-2
Binghamton leads Baltimore, 2-1
Rochester leads Utica, 3-1
St John's leads Moncton, 3-1
Cape Breton leads Fredericton, 3-1
			
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54230
From: yadallee@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Dave Shariff Yadallee)
Subject: Re: Oiler's rumour - Team moving? Press conference next week

allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan) writes:

-
- I heard a story on the local sports news broadcast in Edmonton.
- Oiler owner Peter Pocklington will be holding a press conference
- next week. While the exact details are not known, it is believed
- to concern the Oiler's future.
-
- Rumour has it that Pocklington signed a tentative lease arrangement
- with Copps Collesium in Hamilton. During the press conference,
- Pocklington may announce the deal. It is quite possible that
- the deal may simply be a way to force Edmonton Northlands to
- renegotiate the Oiler lease on the stadium.
-
- Northlands has offered to buy the Oilers for $65 million earlier,
- but the offer was rejected immediately by Pocklington.
-
- As for me, my opinion is divided... Edmonton has been fairly
- supportive of the Oilers. Even though they're a small market
- team, they had many sellouts in the 80s. Even with the problems
- that the team had this year, they still brought in more fans
- than many teams in larger cities did. On the other hand, if
- the team does move, there is no place more deserving than
- Hamilton. Of course, how would that affect the grand
- realignment scheme of Bettman?
-

  Following up on this, the provincial government has been asked by the
Opposition to block any deal that Pocklington is offering to Hamilton.  The
government said that Pock is going nowhere!

  Why don't I believe the government?  Wasn't it Pocklington who wanted to be
Tory leader 9 years ago?

Dave Shariff Yadallee (B. Sc.(Econ/Math) (U of Alberta 1990) )
(yadallee@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca) God Save the Queen, God Bless us All!Remember!
Jesus saves lives from eternal damnation!
Newfoundland, keep good old Clyde, VOTE LIBERAL!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54231
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: Calder Cup schedule

FULL 1993 CALDER CUP PLAYOFF SCHEDULE AND RESULTS	
home team in CAPS		*=if necesary

FIRST ROUND					
Springfield Indians vs Providence Bruins
Gm 1:	Springfield 3	PROVIDENCE 2	
Gm 2:	Springfield 5	PROVIDENCE 4
Gm 3:	Providence 3	SPRINGFIELD 2
Gm 4:	Providence 9	SPRINGFIELD 0		
Gm 5:	Springfield 4	PROVIDENCE 2
Gm 6:	4/24	Providence at Springfield	
Gm 7:	4/27	Springfield at Providence	*

CD Islanders vs Adirondack Red Wings
Gm 1:	ADIRONDACK 6	CDI 2
Gm 2:	ADIRONDACK 5	CDI 3
Gm 3:	Adirondack 3	CDI 0
Gm 4:	Adirondack 3	CDI 1
(ADIRONDACK WINS SERIES, 4-0)

Baltimore Skipjacks at Binghamton Rangers
Gm 1:	Baltimore 4	BINGHAMTON 3	
Gm 2:	BINGHAMTON 6	Baltimore 2
Gm 3:	Binghamton 8	BALTIMORE 3
Gm 4:	4/24	Binghamton at Baltimore
Gm 5:	4/26	Baltimore at Binghamton	
Gm 6:	4/28	Binghmaton at Baltimore	*
Gm 7:	4/30	Baltimore at Binghamton	*
		
Utica Devils vs Rochester Americans
Gm 1:	Utica 3		ROCHESTER 2	(OT)
Gm 2:	ROCHESTER 9	Utica 3
Gm 3:	Rochester 6	UTICA 4
Gm 4:	Rochester 4	UTICA 3		(OT)
Gm 5:	4/24	Utica at Rochester	
Gm 6:	4/26	Rochester at Utica	*
Gm 7:	4/28	Utica at Rochester	*

Moncton Hawks vs St John's Maple Leafs
Gm 1:	St JOHN'S 4	Moncton 2	(at Halifax)
Gm 2:	ST JOHN'S 3	Moncton 2	(at Halifax)
Gm 3:	St John's 6	MONCTON 5
Gm 4:	MONCTON 5	St John's 4	(OT)
Gm 5:	4/26	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax	
Gm 6:	4/28	St John's at Moncton		*
Gm 7:	4/30	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax	*

Cape Breton Oilers vs Fredericton Canadiens
Gm 1:	FREDERICTON 4	Cape Breton 3	(2OT)
Gm 2:	Cape Breton 5	FREDERICTON 2
Gm 3:	CAPE BRETON 3	Fredericton 0	
Gm 4:	CAPE BRETON 6	Fredericton 5 	(OT)
Gm 5:	4/24	Cape Breton at Fredericton	
Gm 6:	4/26	Fredericton at Cape Breton	*
Gm 7:	4/28	Cape Breton at Fredericton	*
(note about this series: the AP reports that CB has won this
 series 4-1, but in the original schedule, Game 5 wasn't supposed
 to be until tonight and I only have the Oilers as being up 3-1)

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54232
From: brifre1@ac.dal.ca
Subject: Re: POTVIN and HIS STICK

In article <122521@netnews.upenn.edu>, kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller) writes:
>>>>I prefer
>>>to watch hockey than seeing shots of Felix Potvin slashing and spearing Dino
>>>Ciccerelli standing in front of the net.  HE HAS EVERY RIGHT TO STAND IN
>>>FRONT OF THE NET, JUST NOT IN THE CREASE!
> 
> Yes, he does.  BUT, the goalie sure as hell doesn't want him there!  When
> I played roller hockey (boy do I miss those days) as a goalie, I would
> scream at my defense to clear guys out of the slot.  I don't care if he's
> in the crease or not, get him the hell away from me so I can see the ball!
> (Yes, roller hockey, remember)  And if there was nobody around to clear
> the slot, then I'd do it myself by pushing the offending player--*hard*. 
> I *hate* people in my way when I'm the goalie, and I am sure Felix does
> too.  I should say that I didn't see the incident, so if Potvin really
> swung the stick big time, then that's not right, but he can move people
> out of the way.  He's a player on the ice too, you know.  :-)
> 
> --
>     Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
> 	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!
>      In this corner				LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
>      Weighing in at almost every weight imaginable . . . 
>      Life, and all that surrounds it.		     -- Blues Traveler, 1993
I have to agree wholeheartedly with this view.  I don't like to see stickwork,
but you have to clear players away from in front.  My personal favorite move
(I'm a goalie too) is to give the offeding player a good whack on the back
of their skates when the ref isn't looking.  Makes 'em go down like a ton of
bricks, but doesn't cause injuries unless they don't know how to fall (I'm 
talking about hitting the blades here, not the foot).  It also makes the 
player you hit and anyone who sees really mad and apt to take a stupid
retaliation penalty.  Unfortunately, it also leaves your blocker out of 
position for a short time...I don't do this if a shot is likely on the short
side.  Hmm....maybe I should mail Potvin this method (in French and with
helpful diagrams, of course).  It sure would be nice to see Ciccerelli (who
I have a great deal of respect for, BTW, he's not a big guy, but he plays
huge!) fall on his back a few times!  :-)

Barfly

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54233
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: They're real and they're spectacular

"They're real and they're spectacular", the Blues shutout the Blackhawks in
consecutive playoff games. 

If the Blues sweep the Hawks on Sunday, I will launch a broom onto the ice
in the last seconds of the game. "Not that there's anything wrong with that."

Curtis Joseph has been the "master of his own domain", and the Hawks have
been shooting the puck like a bunch of "chuckers". Not even "Superman" could
play any better in goal. Joseph must have been eating his "cereal."

"It's like a sauna in here" said a spectator about the hot atmosphere and
the wild crowd at the Arena.

It was "very refreshing" to see the Blues "double-dip" the Hawks.

The Hawks goons tried to "pick" on Hull, Janney, and Joseph but the Blues
checking line "nipped" those Hawks real well.

The fat "Yoyoma" will sing on Sunday, and the Hawks will head to the "beach".
The Hawks' trip back to Chicago will feel like a long "journey from Milan
to Minsk"

Enjoy Sunday's game with some Junior Mints and wash them down with a Snapple.

Just a little fun.

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54239
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Stan Fischler, 4/22

In article <1993Apr24.181145.17567@news.columbia.edu> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>
>* Roger Neilson is not property ... among other rumours, he's now
>the #1 candidate to coach the Flyers, and will bring along Colin
>Campbell as his assistant.
>

This would be dumb move of the nineties...Lindros is big and strong...
but why give him a ball and chain on one leg and an anchor on the
other to drag along.

>* Compuware is actively scouting Phoenix for a new team in 94-95 [hey,
>Nick and Jimmy ... buy the Devils and fix them here, please! --- gld].
>

Not if Pocklington gets there first! (-...actually, if Pocklington
doesn't get a better deal, he would probably go to Hamilton...taking
the team out of Canada would get the whole country mad at him...
taking the team to Hamilton wouldn't get anybody mad at him that 
isn't mad at him already...and would make him a lot of friends
in Southern Ontario...so many that the whining of the stupid politicians in
Edmonton and the fickle spoiled fans wouldn't be noticed at all.
Edmonton would wallow in anonymnity.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54240
From: allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan)
Subject: Don's nickname "grapes" (was Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here)

georgeh@gjhsun (George H) writes:

>LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall) writes:

>>Don got his nickname 'Grapes' but I'm not sure.  Don use to coach the
>>Boston Bruins.  I don't know exactly when that was.  Could someone fill
>>me in on this info?

>I think that the name 'grapes' came because as coach (for the Bruins ?
>or in the minors ?) he used to chew on grapes to keep from getting 
>dehydrated during the games.  His dog Blue may have been named 
>'cause he liked Labatts beer ... anyone know about that ?

According to "Quotations from Chairman Cherry", Don was playing in
Springfield. He and another player had to pay some fines; the other
player had his paid off, but not Don didn't want to.

Don called the other player a "teacher's Pet", and the other player
replied "Ah, that's just sour grapes".

Don't know how accurate that is, but that's what's printed.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54241
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Stan Fischler, 4/16 (Keenan stuff!)


* The Keenan hiring is precipitated by the loss of an anticipated $5M
in playoff revenue and fears of losing season ticket-holders (!), plus
Paramount chief Stan Jaffe's chip against the Flyers over l'Affaire
Lindros last autumn.  Add to this that Neilsen might return as an
assistant coach [Gerald, what'd I say earlier today??], and Roger
conferred with Jaffe on the hiring.  This hiring by Jaffe went over
the head of MSG, Inc. (Par. subsidiary) head Bob Gutkowski and over
the head and the protests of Pres./GM Neil Smith.

* MSG is making the announcement on Saturday to get back at the
Islanders for making the playoffs (i.e., steal the press).

* Flyers owner Ed Snyder is livid and beside himself over this.

* Keenan will make up to $900,000/yr.

* Gary Bettman has appointed an independent consul to look at
Gil Stein's admission into the Hall of Fame.

* New crease colours, rather than blue?

* The Oilers will charge to eat in the Press Room next year.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54242
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Playoff pool rule revision

Well, I will have to change the scoring on my playoff pool.  Unfortunately
I don't have time right now, but I will certainly post the new scoring
rules by tomorrow.  Does it matter?  No, you'll enter anyway!!!  Good!

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54243
From: brifre1@ac.dal.ca
Subject: Leafs win! (thank you Potvin)

It's about time the boys got it together!!
They were outworked and outplayed by the Wings in the first two games.
But Burns must have kicked their behinds cause they sure came out in full
gear (or is that high gear?) in game 3.  Except for a 10-15 minute stretch
in the 2nd period, they outskated and outworked the Wings.  Please don't
flame this statement 'cos you know it's true!  I have to admit that 
goaltending was the key.  Potvin kept the Leafs ahead during the sleepy
stretch the Leafs went through in the 2nd.  He also kept the rebounds to a
minimum, something that cost Cheveldae 2 goals.  Clark even looked like
he had stopped moping (first star!), although I still don't know why he
was so flat in games 1 and 2.

If the Leafs play the same style and can keep the pace they had in game
3, they may actually have a chance of winning this series (a slim chance, 
but a chance....I'm no RM.....where is he anyways? haha).

Barfly

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54244
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL Leafs Back Home?

Apparently, the public workers' strike in St John's, Newfoundland is over.
The strike has, since mid-January, forced the St John's Maple Leafs hockey
team to play their home games in other cities such as Toronto, Cornwall
and Charlottetown. They have been playing their playoff home games
in Halifax, Nova Scotia. Leafs' management said that they COULD
return to St John's for the second round.

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54245
From: ua256@freenet.Victoria.BC.CA (Tom Moffat)
Subject: Interview guests


Have you ever noticed that after a hockey player has been interviewed
in between periods on a tv game. That they usually get a goal or
an assist. can you explain this or is it that they usually talk 
to stars more than regular players which explains the hight 
percentage of results after.

Just wondering how everybody else thinks about this or if they dont 
care about this trivial nonsense.
ttyl  Tom
-- 
Tom Moffat
Victoria B.C.
Canada

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54246
From: randolin@polisci.umn.edu (Robert Andolina)
Subject: Sabres-Bruins

Buffalo fans:

Some people in the discussion group, as well as "commentator Al" on ESPN, 
believe that game 3 is critical for the Sabres.  HELLOOOO!!!!! The Sabres 
are AHEAD 2 games to 0, not behind.  As a life-long Sabres fan, I am well 
aware of their ability to choke, but let's not exaggerate that.  As long as 
the Sabres win one of the next 2 games (be it game 3 OR game 4), they are 
still in good shape (ahead 3 games to 1), with game 6 to be played at 
Buffalo.  If they lose games three AND four, then start worrying.  Game 3 is 
critical for Boston, not Buffalo.



Rob Andolina
randolin@polisci.umn.edu




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54247
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

In article <1993Apr21.142357.14164@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>Fuhr is proving the Fuhr-bashers wrong, but Boston is an awfully
>good team.
>

Yeh,but :

1.Biran Sutter's playoff record as the head coach in St.L wasn't very
impressive. His Blues teams were eliminated very early in the playoffs.
It doesn't look like this trend will change with the Bruins.

2. Bruins have never come back to win after falling behind 2-0 in their
entire 68-year history. It doesn't look like Buffalo will just lose
their next two games at the Aud with the way Fuhr has been standing on
his head.

Basically,the Bruins will be on the golf course by next weekend.
Also,it seems like the whole Boston area has gone baseball crazy after
an incredibly great start by the Red Sox(best record in their major
leagues as of now). I would say that 70% of the callers to the Bruins'
flagship station(SportsRadio 590) are talking about the Red Sox,about
15% are yapping about the Patriots' upcoming draft,10% are on the Celtics
and about 5% are on the Bruins.
Somehow,no one around here is really schocked the way Bruins are folding
early.

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54248
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Upcoming TV schedule

Hey,guess what's coming to ESPN for a change? A playoff which doesn't
involve the Pens. Not that there is anything wrong with that...

ESPN games :

Thursday  Game3 Pens at Devils at 7:30(Gary Thorne and Bill Clement)
Saturday  Game4 Caps at NY Isles at 7:30(Tom Mees and John Davidson)

ABC game :

Sunday    Game4 Pens at Devils at 1:00 (Gary Thorne and Bill Clement)

ESPN named its #2 broadcast team on Tuesday. It paired Tom Mees(play by
play) with John Davidson(analyst).

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54249
From: ac291@Freenet.carleton.ca (W. Jon Shaib)
Subject: Some Play-offs Thoughts


Well, we're almost halfway through the first round, and so far things are
good in general:

  1. The 2 teams that I hate most: Chicago and "Basten" are down 3 zip.
     (even though there is a possibility either can still win their
      series, yet this ego-thrashing and arrogance-smashing by the
      underdogs (St. Louis and Buffalo) is so rewarding).
  2. Montreal is at this stage in a team's life where they are not good
     enough to go all the way, yet too good to be able to get some
     (really) good draft picks... :-(
  3. Is it just me, or does anyone out there also think that this year
     the cup final should be played between 2 teams from the WALES?
  4. Is it just because they're playing Montreal that I find the diques
     arrogant ***'s, or are they really?
  5. Smythe-what???? I'm really getting sick of seeing Douggie and Wendel
     night in and night out... We should see some Canucks/Jets/Flames
     action...!
  6. Don Cherry is an ******* alright, but hey... so are our politicians...
  
ObLeafsJoke:  Q. what do you get when you cross a maple leaf and a 
                groundhog?
              A. Six more weeks of crummy hockey!
------------------------------------------------------------------
L8R, dudes...
GO HABS GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jon Shaib  ac291@carleton.freenet.ca
---------------------------------------------------------------------------


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54250
From: spiegel@sgi413.msd.lmsc.lockheed.com (Mark Spiegel)
Subject: Re: 1993 NHL Draft

In article <1993Apr20.184627.4585@newshub.ariel.yorku.ca> cs902043@ariel.yorku.ca (SHAWN LUDDINGTON) writes:
>In article <93109.134719IO91748@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> Jon Carr <IO91748@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> writes:
>>When is the draft this year?  And will there be any coverage?
>>I know the upcomming NFL draft is on ESPN.
>>
>>Anyone got the details?
>>
>>Paul Kariya 1993 #1 Pick! (No. 2 perhaps?  He won't last long!) :-)
>>
>I don't know the exact coverage in the states.  In Canada it is covered
>by TSN, so maybe ESPN will grab their coverage!  I don't know!
>
>As for the picks
>Ottawa picks #1 which means it is almost 100% that Alexander Daigle will 
>go #1. He'll either stay or be traded in Montreal or Quebec.  IMO I would
>take Kariya.  He should alot of leadership in the NCAA and so far in
>the World Championships.  Daigle didn't show this for his junior team.
>
>San Jose will then get Kariya.
>
>Tampa Bay will either go for a russian Kozlov (I think that's it) or a 
>    defenseman Rob Niedemeyer (probably spelt the last name wrong)
>
	The Sharks appear to be leaning toward picking Rob
	Niedermayer, a center (his brother Scott (?) is a defenseman
	picked by NJ a couple years ago).  They brought him in for a
	physical/tryout a week or so ago. From what I have read
	Niedermayer is the best skater in the draft, plays BOTH
	offense and defense, and isn't afraid of physical play.
	Defensively the Sharks are looking pretty good in terms of
	defense prospects (Rathje, Sykora, Ragnarsson), and our
	centers (Kisio et al) are getting old.

	With all of the small players the Sharks have I justs CAN't
	see them picking yet another small player like Kariya, he'd
	just get bashed by the oppposition and get a separated 
	shoulder.

	mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54251
From: hallg@lead.egr.msu.edu (The Terminator)
Subject: Re: ESPN

In article <randolin.3.735424986@polisci.umn.edu>, randolin@polisci.umn.edu (Robert Andolina) writes:
|> The thing that confuses me most about ESPN is that they decided to show the 
|> Penguins and Devils again on Thursday night.  Being that both of the first 
|> two games were dominated by Pitt., you would think that they would show a 
|> different game.  This is in addition to the fact that they should show other 
|> games just for the sake of fair exposure.

ESPN must have some very poor marketing people.  They are only concerned with
featuring players (i.e. Mario) than featuring good competitive hockey.

|> Also, some of you should know that (as far as I can tell) ESPN is not going 
|> to show Campbell conference games regularly in the first two rounds.  I 
|> believe that they are only going to show Campbell games in the first two 
|> rounds as those series wear on (games 6 & 7, or perhaps games 5, 6, 7). 

I've heard that this is because most of their market is East Coast and hence
would prefer the Wales stuff.  Also, don't expect Canadian teams on ESPN.

In summary, if you want to see a network that provides good hockey coverage, 
watch CBC from Canada.  They may be biased toward Canadian teams, but they
don't treat the viewers like idiots, they provide nice updates, and Don Cherry
will always provide a few laughs.



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54252
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Keenan signs with the Rangers!!

In article <1993Apr16.175300.98134@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu> cpc4@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (CONNIN PATRICK COLGAIN) writes:
>Just heard on the news that Mike Keenan formerly of the Blackhawks, Flyers,
>and General of a Siberian Prison has just signed to coach the Rangers.  The
>Rangers, who won the President's Cup last year have slipped just a bit at the
>end of the season and are destined to finish last behind the lowly Flyers.
>The Flyers' fans are going to be disappointed on Keenans decision, because
>they were very interested in him.  Oh well.

At least we got somebody the Flyers wanted ;-)

Is this really true?  I have not been keeping up with any news.  If it is,
what's the deal with Neil Smith?  Is he gone, too?

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54253
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Devils and Islanders tiebreaker????

In article <C5LFA4.E10@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> cal2d@csissun11.ee.Virginia.EDU (Craig Allen Lorie) writes:
>According to the hockey gurus over at ESPN, should the Islanders win tonite
>the two teams will have the same record, but the Devils will be playing the
>Penguins.  This is because the Islanders have won the season series against
>the Devils.  I think the rules for deciding a tie breaker include:
>
>1.  season series
>2.  goals against
>3.  goals for
>
>in this order (correct me if I'm wrong).  Anyone have anything to add?

I think that they go to divisional records before goals, but I could be
wrong, too.

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54254
From: formeza@panix.com (The Owl)
Subject: Re: Hockey Cards For Sale

In <C5H92x.Dtw@panix.com> formeza@panix.com (The Owl) writes:

In case anyone missed it, I'm reposting this and I'm also selling some other
stuff.

>I would like to sell a few of my Hockey Cards sets:

>1990-91 Upperdeck Hockey Low #'s Sets $45

>This is the first Upperdeck Hockey Set made. Important rookie cards in it are:
>Mogilny, Roenick, Belfour, Recchi, Stevens, Jagr, Nolan, Nedved, Ricci, 
>Sundin, Modano, Richter and others! The Beckett price is $42, but I'm
>Charging $45 to cover the Shipping and Packaging.

I've sold one, but I still have 2 left for sale. I also realize that $45 is
alot of money, especially if you don't normally collect cards. So if enough
people are interested, I'll break up the set into team sets. I'm not sure
how much for each. It would be nice to just sell them for $3 each, but then
the people who get the Whalers and Devils (Note, I'm not bagging on these teams
its just that they don't have alot of good rookie cards in this set) would
be subsidizing the people who want Chicago or Pittsburgh. So I'll have to make
it varialble pricing. But most of them should be about $2 or $3 dollars.


>1991-92 Score Pinnacle (Candian) Sets $45

>This is a very nice set, premium quality cards. Has second year cards of the
>players above, plus Bure, Potvin, Falloon, and Lindros ($15 value) second year
>cards,and the following rookie cards: Lidstrom Kamensky, Zelepukin, Roussel,
>Konstantinov. Beckett Price is $50, but I have alot of these.

>1991-92 Upperdeck Czechoslovakian Set $60

>This is a 100 card set of the 92 World Junior Tournament. Meant for sale in
>Czechoslovakia, but didn't sell well there, and some of it filtere back in
>to the US. The cards are Bilingual. Has Lachance, Kovalev, and Straka Rookies.
>If your interested, please e-mail me. Thanks

Ok someone asked for this one, but he's from Canada, if he can get me the
money in US funds then its his, if not, the first person who writes in will
be the alternate.

Also I would like to sell 2 Upperdeck Pavel Bure rookie cards (note these
are not in the UD low #'s set mentioned above). $16 each. They are $15 in
the book, but the $1 goes for postage, packaging and insurance.

And if there is something you want that you don't see, e-mail me, I may have
it or may be able to get  it for you.

Thanks,
>The Owl
>Ted Formeza
>formeza@sun.panix.com



































Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54255
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: ESPN cares less about hockey

In article <1993Apr21.111312.5054@vax.cns.muskingum.edu> jbrown@vax.cns.muskingum.edu writes:
>ESPN is pathetic, I have been watching everybody complain about ESPN's coverage
>and I agree with all of you.  Might I suggest that we are getting all worked up
>over nothing.  We ALL knew that ESPN's coverage was going to suck.  I mean have
>you ever watched during the regular season Sportscenter coverage of hockey? It
>sucks, I mean really sucks!!!  ESPN does not know hockey if it shot them in the
>ass.  I was really pissed of about last night, coverage.  I go to school in Ohio
>I *know* the Indians suck, so why show them?  If I were Bill Clement I would
>shoot myself.
>
>Anyway after I calmed down after I realized that they were not going to show
>overtime of the Caps Isles game I thought to myself I knew that this was going
>to happen, in fact I remerbed myself praying that at least they would keep even
>the boring Devils game.
>
>Overall I think ESPN does not care if they show hockey or not and I firmly
>belive that they have know respect for the fans. ie *because of contract       
>obligations*, screw you ESPN.
>
>Praise be to all hockey fans who put up with this shit!
>
>GO HAWKS!!!
>

This is the price hockey fans have to pay for the mistake of leaving
ESPN 5 or 6 years ago...it will take time to correct for that mistake.

But returning to ESPN was the correct decision last year...by next
time, we may have the potential for Sportschannel and ESPN to really
compete to offer better coverage and be forced to deliver on it.
 
Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54256
From: ferguson@cs.rochester.edu (George Ferguson)
Subject: What's up in Rochester???


Here we are with the Sabres up 2-0 to the Bruins and the Sabres' farm
team, the Rochester Amerks, on their way to the Calder Cup (urp!) and
what kind of hockey coverage are we getting? The same Penguins/Devils
every other day crap that everyone else gets. What's worse, the
SportsChannel coverage of the Islanders appears to be blocked out,
since we got CBA basketball last night, if you can believe it.  I
assume the Sabres are demanding the SC blackout, not ESPN, since we
are, unbelievably, usually considered part of the Islanders territory
(MSG coverage of the Rangers is blacked out here). This despite being
a solid seven hours plus from Long Island.

Does anyone know what GRC is doing, besides putting their satellite
dish up their ass and screwing my reception of channels 8, 10, and 13?
Did Empire demand a fortune for the games? What about the games on
Fox37 (or whatever number it is there in Buffalo)? Has anyone phoned
to complain (besides me)?

George

-- 
George Ferguson                 ARPA: ferguson@cs.rochester.edu
Dept. of Computer Science       UUCP: rutgers!rochester!ferguson
University of Rochester         VOX:  (716) 275-2527
Rochester  NY  14627-0226       FAX:  (716) 461-2018

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54257
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Grant Fuhr leads Sabres

In article <1993Apr21.161633.25624@wuecl.wustl.edu> jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:
>  Buffalo is up 2-0 is the series with Boston, and the reason....Grant Fuhr ?
>  Fuhr is playoff hungry, and he's proving once again why they call him
>  money goaltender. Fuhr might not be one of the best goaltenders in the
>  league anymore (Statistically at least), but he's proving that he can
>  make the big save at the right time.
>  The Leafs should have kept Fuhr, and probably would have had a chance 
>  against powerhouse Detroit. But again.......where was Andreychoke in game 1?

I applauded the Sabres for making the deal to get Fuhr, specifically because I
thought it would help them win at least one playoff series.  However, I don't
think the Leafs can be faulted either...there is nothing to say that Felix
won't be winning playoff series by himself in years to come.  

Anyway, does anybody else find it ironic that Fuhr is up against Moog? (or at
least he was until a guy named Alex showed up....:-) )


--

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54258
From: ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca)
Subject: Re: Radio stations

co398@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Theodore G. Benjamin) writes:


>In messge 51890 on Mon Apr 19 15:46:40 1993, greanias@texas.mitre.org (Steve Greanias) wrote:

>>        I do not have cable and on the nights the Caps don't 
>>play, I would like to tune in other games.  Does anyone have a 
>>list of the radio stations which broadcast the games for the NHL
>>teams?

>Here are the ones I can remember offhand:

>     KDKA    1020 AM   Pittsburgh Penguins

Lori, the regular Penguins poster here on rec.sport.hockey, indicated to me
via e-mail that on the nights that Pirates baseball and Penguins playoff 
games coincide, the Pens will be covered on WDVE FM (102.5).

>     WABC     770 AM   New Jersey Devils
>     WBBM     780 AM   Chicago Blackhawks
>     WJM (?)  720 AM   Detroit Redwings
      ^^^^     ^^^^
This is WJR in Detroit and it's 760 AM. However, as I neglected to mention in
my earlier response to this thread,  on the nights when the Tigers baseball
games coincide with the Wings' playoff games, the Wings will be carried on
WLLZ FM (98.7).

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54259
From: msanfrat@cs.ucsd.edu (Mike Sanfratello)
Subject: Re: ESPN Thumbs Up your $%#@*!!

In article <1993Apr20.214505.6925@wkuvx1.bitnet> kozloce@wkuvx1.bitnet writes:
>AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG!
>
>(Oh guess what the score is now 7-0 penguins! Switch games you $%&*#@!!!)
> [...]

and guess which game ESPN is showing in my area on Thursday - yep,
Pens-Devils.  There are so many other interesting series, who cares
about Mario???

mike

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54260
From: sclark@epas.utoronto.ca (Susan Clark)
Subject: Re: If You Were Pat Burns ...

	Borchevsky is 5'9" and Gilmour is 5'11"...I think Gilmour slightly
outweighs Borchevsky.  Andreychuk is also about 5'11", I think.

Susan
teeheehee...oops!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54261
From: cobra@chopin.udel.edu (KING COBRA)
Subject: Re: ESPN f*ck up

In article <1428@wavefront.wti.com> matthew@wavefront.wti.com (Matt Coohill) writes:
>
>	ESPN (through a fortunate rainout of a baseball game) showed the
>  Red Wings/Toronto game... cool.
>
>	But I SWEAR that the advertisements all week long had said that
>  ESPN would show Pitt/NJ on Tuesday and Bos/Buff on Thursday.
>
>	I raced home from work early (4:30 Pacific) to catch the game, but
>  ALAS, it was the Boston/Buffalo game and then they promised that they would
>  show the Pitt/NJ game on Thursday.  OVERNIGHT they changed their mind.
>

  What the hell are U talking about? ESPN showed Pens/Devils game as advertised.
  BUt the morons at ESPN should know that Pens will kick Devils ass and the
  game will be boring. I'd rather see Boston/Buffalo game which seems to be
  an exciting series since noone had expected Buffalo to get past the first
  round. 

  Well let's hope they change their mind on THU's game and show some other
  game. The Pens series is really getting boring. I want to see some 
  exciting game no matter who wins. If NHL wants a major network contract
  then they better put some brains in ESPN people.

  



*******************************************************************************
**   ___  ____  ____  ____  ____  **                                         **
**  /    /   / /___/ /___/ /___/  **   Experience is what makes a person     **
** /___ /___/ /___/ / \_  /   /   **   make new mistakes instead of old      **
**                                **   one.                                  **
** E-mail: cobra@chopin.udel.edu  **                                         **
**                                **                                         **
*******************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54262
From: allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan)
Subject: Don Cherry - Coach's Corner summary - April 21, 1993




Here's a summary of Don Cherry's Coach's Corner from April 21, 1993.
The game being broadcast in my region was LA and Calgary, although
I think it was filmed during the Toronto-Detroit game that night.

(Warning... Anti-fighting people may want to skip this post.)

Topics
------

Don's Tie, Grant Fuhr, Penalties, Wings vs Leafs, Fighting, Dale Hunter.

Episode Summary
---------------

This episode began with the camera zoomed in on Don's tie. Don was
pointing out the characters on the tie... Bugs Bunny, Foghorn Leghorn,
and Yosemite Sam (who Don called Lanny Macdonald.)

Ron Maclean began by mentioning that Don was almost evicted from a
hotel where he was watching the previous night's games, because of
all the yelling and cheering he was doing over the play of Hunter
and Fuhr.

Don began to praise Fuhr, calling him the "greatest goalie", and
said that he's winning the series against Boston all by himself.
He then showed clips from earlier episodes (Nov. 14, Jan. 16) when
Fuhr was still with the Leafs, and Don advised "Don't Trade Fuhr!"

Don went on to predict that if Buffalo gets by Boston, it would
be Fuhr who wins the series. Muckler took a lot of heat for the
trade, but Don feels Muckler's been vindicated.

The next topic involved how playoff games are being ruined by
too many penalty calls. He showed a clip from a Winnipeg-Vancouver
game, where Domi hit a Vancouver player, and was given a 2 min. penalty.
Ron said that it was called a penalty because his stick was involved,
but Don stuck with the opinion that it was a good hit, with Domi
hitting the Vancouver player with his shoulder. Don: "Its sad what
they're doing for hockey... a 5 minute penalty for a nosebleed."

Next, they went to the playoff series between Detroit and Toronto.
People in Detroit were calling Wendel Clarke "Wendy" for not fighting.
However, Don pointed out that Probert was not fighting either.

This lead Don into a tirad about fighting and stickwork, and how
banning fighting leads to more high sticking: "It's like college
hockey... The little wee guy with the visor is brave as anybody.
That's why you're seeing so much stickwork. Because they know you
won't drop your gloves and give them a shot. The rules are made
by people who don't know what's going on in hockey".

The final topic Don discussed was Dale Hunter. Don pointed out
that he was leading the league in goals, and showed a clip
of Hunter from a previous game. When he was younger, Hunter was
taught to "play to win", which differs from today's idea of
just letting kids have fun.

At then end of the episode, they showed a clip from a coach's
corner, with the tape on fast forward, so that Don sounded like
one of the chipmunks.

Rating
------
Typical anti-fighting posturing, not too much humour, but some
good quotes.

I'd give it a 7.0 out of 10.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   \  \                   |Allan Sullivan (allan@cs.ualberta.ca)
    \  \                  |Department of Computing Science,
     \  \_______          |University of Alberta, Edmonton, Alberta, Canada.
      \    ###  \     _   |---------------------------------------------------
       \___###___\   (_)  |My opinions are mine and mine alone.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It is amazing how much can be accomplished if no one cares who gets the
 credit..."          - U. of A. Golden Bears Hockey Motto (C. Drake)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
        

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54263
From: allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan)
Subject: Don Cherry - Coach's Corner summary - April 23, 1993




Here's a summary of Don Cherry's Coach's Corner from April 23, 1993.
It was taken from a tape delay of a Vancouver-Winnipeg game, but
it was filmed during the Toronto-Detroit game that night. I think
it was also shown during the Calgary-LA game. 

(Warning... Anti-fighting people may want to skip this post.)

Topics
------

Don's Tie, Doug Gilmour, Wings/Leafs, Quebec/Montreal, Boston/Buffalo,
Wendel Clark, Fighting and Stickwork.

Episode Summary
---------------

Once again, the episode started with a shot of Don's tie... This
was a different tie than last time. Don pointed out some of the
characters on the tie, but gave them different names... Felix the
Cat (Sylverster), Maclean (Daffy Duck), etc.

Ron Maclean asked Don what he thought of the current Wings-Leafs
game. Don thought it was good. Burns told the Leaf players "They
won in their building, we're going to win in ours".

Don then began to praise Gilmour again. Don pointed out that Gilmour
has never got less than 2 points or a goal in any game since he
got 5 points in a game against St. Louis.  (Don also claims that
he gave a lot of encouragement to Gilmour, which was partly responsible
for his good play.) Several clips were then shown of Gilmour
from the series... A hit on Constantinov, and a pass to Andrewchuk
resulting in a goal.

On the game itself, the Wings were taking a lot of penalties in
the first period. The Wings have enough talent to score short handed
however, and when the Leafs get a power play, Coach Burns tells
the Leaf players "Don't let them score on you".

Ron brought up the previous Quebec-Montreal game. [Note: Montreal
won that game in overtime, despite having a possible game winner
disqualified because it was batted in with a high stick.] Don
thought the high stick was obvious, even without the use of
instant replay.

On the Buffalo-Boston series [Note: Buffalo is currently winning
the series 3-0], Don gave full credit to Goaltender Grant Fuhr.
Fuhr should be getting 1/2 the team's playoff checks for his
play.

Wendel Clarke has recently been criticized for his performance
during the Detroit-Toronto series. Don defended him, by saying
that he can't play the way he should, because of the league's
new rules. "This used to be a rough and tough league... Now its
all hack and slash." Don lays the blame on Gil Stien for the
problems.

Don's opinions on fighting and stickwork are shared by Wings
GM and coach Bryan Murray. A clip from a news conference by Murray
was shown, in which Murray made statements claiming the elimination
of fighting increases stickwork. Don also read a newspaper article
in which Murray makes the following statements: "Players don't fight
because they're afraid of getting thrown out of the game as instigator.
Instead, they settle grudges by getting their sticks and slicing
each other. Is this what the fans want to see? I guarantee there
wouldn't be as many slashes if fighting were kept in the game."

Don warned league commisioner Gary Bettman to "smarten up" with
fighting in hockey. He went on to say that before, there used
to be one guy cut with a high stick in a series. Now, with no fights,
someone gets cut every period.

Rating
------
Typical anti-fighting posturing, but here Don's opinion is supported
by Murray.

I'd give it a 7.0 out of 10.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54264
From: cobra@chopin.udel.edu (KING COBRA)
Subject: Re: ESPN

In article <randolin.3.735424986@polisci.umn.edu> randolin@polisci.umn.edu (Robert Andolina) writes:
>The thing that confuses me most about ESPN is that they decided to show the 
>Penguins and Devils again on Thursday night.  Being that both of the first 
>two games were dominated by Pitt., you would think that they would show a 
>different game.  This is in addition to the fact that they should show other 
>games just for the sake of fair exposure.
>
>Also, some of you should know that (as far as I can tell) ESPN is not going 
>to show Campbell conference games regularly in the first two rounds.  I 
>believe that they are only going to show Campbell games in the first two 
>rounds as those series wear on (games 6 & 7, or perhaps games 5, 6, 7). 
>
>Also, does anyone have info on ABC coverage for this Sunday (4/25)?
>
>

  ESPN had an advertise for Pens/Devils game 4. I don't know what the hell
  they are trying to do, especially against NFL draft. Well I guess there goes
  the NHL ratings for Sundays game.

>
>Robert Andolina
>randolin@polisci.umn.edu
>



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54272
From: chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Subject: Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!

snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols) writes:

>In article <1r1v5n$klh@morrow.stanford.edu> steve@sep.Stanford.EDU (Steve Cole) writes:
>>I think the three-headed GM's guiding principle was to keep veterans
>>in favor of youngsters only if they offered a "significant" advantage.

>Doesn't sound like a bad strategy to me.

No, and in fact, that was Ferreira's original strategy, which the troika
proceeded to simply continue to implement. There wasn't exactly a radical
shift in policy when he was ousted (something people seem to forget). The
only real question is whether they did it as well as Ferreira could have if
he stayed, or whether the basic strategy was flawed (since Ferreira has been
quoated as saying he's going to do something different in Anaheim with the
Ducks, my guess is that it wasn't as good in practice as it was on paper,
and he's tweaking it a bit second time around). One also has to wonder
whether the strategy would have been a lot better if we hadn't had those
injuries, and whether we're complaining about the weather because an
earthquake collapsed the root cellar.

>Of course, Ferreira had also traded a number of veterans with marginal
>contributions before he was fired, so it's not clear that this would have
>been different.  Besides, they *were* marginal contributors.

Let's also NOT FORGET that Ferreira came *THIS* close to trading Kelly
Kisio, which, if the rumors I've heard are true, was over the strong
objections of other aspects of Shark management and probably had a lot to do
with both his ouster and the three-headed, consensus oriented GM.

Imagine, for a second, where the Sharks would be today if that fax machine
hadn't jammed.

>With or without Mullen, they weren't going to be a playoff team; what good
>does it do them to hang onto a player who'd rather be elsewhere?  

Especially an unhappy player that isn't playing as well because of it. Not
that I'd accuse Mullen of tanking, but his motivation simply wasn't there,
and that kind of thing can affect the team.

>>An example from this season, Skriko was brought in on a trial basis
>>but not kept, because of his age. I thought he was a decent
>>contributor worth keeping around.

>>The youth movement has its advantages; look at Gaudreau who
>>might still be in KC if more veterans had been kept around. But
>>you have to find the right balance.

>Right balance for what?  That's the issue.  

Exactly. At the time they let Skriko go, we hadn't yet had the major injury
bugs that killed us later. I'd much rather have Skriko around than someone
like Dean Kolstad, but at that point, that wasn't the choice. And since the
choice was more one of Skriko vs. someone like John Carter, I think the
right choice was made for that time period.

-- 
 Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= chuq@apple.com
   Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms =+=  GEnie: MAC.BIGOT =+= ALink:CHUQ 
  Minor League fans: minors-request@medraut.apple.com (San Jose Giants: A/1/9)
  San Francisco Giants fans: giants-request@medraut.apple.com (The Stick?NOT!)
   San Jose Sharks fans: sharks-request@medraut.apple.com (New seat: 127/TBD)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54273
From: anthonyp@sco.COM (Anthony Picilaidis)
Subject: NHL Draft


 
I believe the NHL Draft is on or the June 18th weekend.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54274
From: machnik@ctron.com (Michael C. Machnik)
Subject: goalie stats

In article <1r3smf$67m@access.usask.ca>, coulman@cs.Usask.CA (Randy
Coulman) writes:
Path:
ctron-news.ctron.com!noc.near.net!uunet!utcsri!newsflash.concordia.ca!mi
izar.cc.umanitoba.ca!access.usask.ca!cs.Usask.CA!coulman
From: coulman@cs.Usask.CA (Randy Coulman)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Final Regular Season Individual Goalie Stats
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 93 12:27:59 EDT
Organization: University of Saskatchewan
Lines: 103
Sender: coulman@skorpio (Randy Coulman)
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <1r3smf$67m@access.usask.ca>
Reply-To: coulman@cs.Usask.CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: skorpio.usask.ca

I would appreciate it if someone could volunteer to verify the shots on goal
and save percentage numbers for me, so I can put these stats on the archive
site.  Contact me by mail if you want to volunteer.

Here are the individual goalie stats as of: Wed Apr 21 09:09:38 CST 1993

These stats include games up to and including the Sunday previous to the date
listed above.  They have been verified against what is printed in my newspaper
every Tuesday.  They don't print shots and save percentage numbers, so those
are not verified.  These stats are available by mail every weekday and
sometimes on weekends, if I'm in town and I can get late game results.  Just
send me a note if you would like to receive these stats by mail.

If you have any questions, comments or suggestions, let me know.

Randy

-------
MP = Minutes Played, GA = Goals against,
SO = Shutouts, GAA = Goals against average
W = Wins, L = Losses, T = Ties
SOG = Shots on Goal, SV = Save Percentage

 MP   GA SO   GAA  W  L  T  SOG   SV  TM Player
=======================================================
   1   0  0  0.00  0  0  0    0 1.000 WAS Byron Dafoe
  11   0  0  0.00  0  0  0    3 1.000 HAR Corrie D'Alessio
  40   1  0  1.50  0  0  0   19 0.947 MTL Frederick Chabot
  25   1  0  2.40  0  0  0   10 0.900 BOS Mike Bales
2781 116  2  2.50 25 15  7 1287 0.910 TOR Felix Potvin
4106 177  7  2.59 41 18 11 1879 0.906 CHI Ed Belfour
1322  64  1  2.90  9  8  4  596 0.893 BOS John Blue
 996  49  2  2.95  6  7  1  414 0.882 CHI Jim Waite
3702 186  4  3.01 43 14  5 1889 0.902 PIT Tom Barrasso
3890 196  1  3.02 29 28  9 2194 0.911 STL Curtis Joseph
1817  94  1  3.10 18  8  4  858 0.890 VAN Kay Whitmore
1429  75  0  3.15 11 10  4  716 0.895 BUF Dominik Hasek
3194 168  3  3.16 37 14  3 1354 0.876 BOS Andy Moog
1311  70  1  3.20 14  4  1  629 0.889 CAL Jeff Reese
3595 192  2  3.20 31 25  5 1813 0.894 MTL Patrick Roy
 168   9  0  3.21  1  1  1   87 0.897 HAR Mike Lenarduzzi
1193  64  0  3.22 13  4  2  522 0.877 DET Vincent Riendeau
1785  96  2  3.23 17  7  4  938 0.898 TOR Daren Puppa
3880 210  4  3.25 34 24  7 1898 0.889 DET Tim Cheveldae
3732 203  2  3.26 29 26  9 1805 0.888 CAL Mike Vernon
2655 146  1  3.30 22 20  2 1314 0.889 NYI Glenn Healy
3359 185  1  3.30 24 24  6 1726 0.893 BUF Grant Fuhr
2757 152  4  3.31 20 18  7 1519 0.900 NYR John Vanbiesbrouck
3282 181  1  3.31 27 23  5 1531 0.882 WAS Don Beaupre
3476 193  3  3.33 26 26  5 1683 0.885 MIN Jon Casey
3261 184  3  3.39 28 21  5 1620 0.886 VAN Kirk McLean
2672 151  2  3.39 19 21  3 1322 0.886 NJ  Chris Terreri
1433  81  1  3.39 17  5  1  686 0.882 MTL Andre Racicot
1939 110  0  3.40 18  9  4  947 0.884 QUE Stephane Fiset
2512 143  5  3.42 20 17  6 1329 0.892 PHI Tommy Soderstrom
1368  78  0  3.42 13  7  2  691 0.887 PIT Ken Wregget
 542  31  0  3.43  5  4  0  225 0.862 BOS Reggie Lemelin
2988 172  0  3.45 29 16  5 1525 0.887 QUE Ron Hextall
2253 130  0  3.46 17 15  5 1067 0.878 NYI Mark Fitzpatrick
3855 227  2  3.53 33 26  6 2119 0.893 WIN Bob Essensa
1601  96  0  3.60 15 10  2  777 0.876 WIN Jim Hrivnak
1596  97  1  3.65 10 12  5  803 0.879 MIN Darcy Wakaluk
1591  97  0  3.66  7 19  2  757 0.872 TB  Wendell Young
1163  71  0  3.66  8 10  1  573 0.876 TB  JC Bergeron
2389 146  2  3.67 21 16  4 1180 0.876 NJ  Craig Billington
1210  74  1  3.67  8  8  2  628 0.882 STL Guy Hebert
1302  80  2  3.69  8 12  0  664 0.880 WAS Rick Tabaracci
 664  41  0  3.70  5  6  0  344 0.881 BUF Tom Draper
 224  14  0  3.75  1  2  1  116 0.879 NYR Corey Hirsch
1769 111  1  3.76 13 11  5  932 0.881 PHI Dominic Roussel
2105 134  1  3.82 13 19  3 1184 0.887 NYR Mike Richter
 157  10  0  3.82  1  2  0   78 0.872 NYI Danny Lorenz
3753 240  1  3.84 17 38  6 2069 0.884 EDM Bill Ranford
1735 111  0  3.84 15  8  4  987 0.888 LA  Robb Stauber
2718 175  2  3.86 18 21  6 1545 0.887 LA  Kelly Hrudey
 154  10  0  3.90  0  2  1   66 0.848 QUE Jacques Cloutier
 867  57  0  3.94  5  9  1  499 0.886 HAR Mario Gosselin
 532  35  0  3.95  6  4  0  294 0.881 LA  Rick Knickle
2268 150  1  3.97  8 24  4 1197 0.875 TB  Pat Jablonski
2074 142  1  4.11  7 26  0 1250 0.886 SJ  Arturs Irbe
2656 184  0  4.16 16 27  3 1470 0.875 HAR Sean Burke
1338  93  0  4.17  9 12  2  763 0.878 EDM Ron Tugnutt
1326  95  0  4.30  2 17  1  743 0.872 OTT Daniel Berthiaume
 802  59  0  4.41  3  9  0  405 0.854 PHI Stephane Beauregard
3388 250  0  4.43  8 46  3 1711 0.854 OTT Peter Sidorkiewicz
  65   5  0  4.62  0  0  1   39 0.872 CAL Andrei Trefilov
1373 111  0  4.85  4 15  1  784 0.858 HAR Frank Pietrangelo
  73   6  0  4.93  0  0  1   34 0.824 WIN Mike O'Neill
  60   5  0  5.00  0  1  0   46 0.891 SJ  Wade Flaherty
2000 176  0  5.28  2 30  1 1220 0.856 SJ  Jeff Hackett
 930  86  0  5.55  2 14  1  559 0.846 SJ  Brian Hayward
 160  15  0  5.63  0  3  0   91 0.835 TOR Rick Wamsley
  20   2  0  6.00  0  0  0    7 0.714 WAS Olaf Kolzig
  90  10  0  6.67  0  2  0   44 0.773 OTT Darrin Madeley
 249  30  0  7.23  0  5  0  146 0.795 OTT Steve Weeks
  98  13  0  7.96  0  2  0   51 0.745 LA  David Goverde
  45   7  0  9.33  0  1  0   21 0.667 TB  David Littman

-- 
Randy A. Coulman, M.Sc.         |       ARIES Laboratory
Research Assistant              |       Department of Computational Science
                                |       University of Saskatchewan
coulman@cs.Usask.ca             |       Saskatoon, SK   S7N 0W0             

--
Mike Machnik           machnik@blue.ctron.com    nin15b34@merrimack.edu
Cabletron Systems, Inc.                                  *HMN* 11/13/93

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54275
From: atwoodc@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (Charles Atwood)
Subject: ESPN bashing!

I agree thouroughly!!  Screw the damn contractual agreements!
Show the exciting hockey game.  They will lose
fans of ESPN (of which I have been one for quite a while) quickly 
with decisions like this.
Just my $.02

Chuck "ESPN f***ed up this time" Atwood
atwoodc@csugrad.cs.vt.edu
Virginia Tech Computer Science Department


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54283
From: cuorg@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Orazio Guagliano)
Subject: Re: Schedule...

In article <1993Apr20.233724.26553@news.columbia.edu> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler) writes:
>>gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>>>I can't believe that ESPN is making SportsChannel America look good.
>>
>>But only in NY,NJ, Philadelphia, and Chicago. Everywhere else, the only
>>reason SportsChannel was available was for local baseball broadcasts.
>
>Yes, a point well-taken ... however, even in areas that finally got
>some games, there's something nagging in the back of your skull when
>the network that has the national rights in its pocket says on its
>sports news, "There's an awesome overtime going on in Quebec City,
>and we'll *try* to get you an update through the show ..." when you
>know that it's on a satellite's feedhorn somewhere up there ...


  Listen guys you can talk about this the whole playoffs.  I'm here in a
small town in southern Illinois at school.  I'm from Canada and I know
that cbc and tsn have games on every night,  all you have to do is go to
a bar with a satellite.  I have watched both games between Mon Que and
toronto and detroit,  not to mention Van vs Winn and with cbc.  They
show all goals from every game that evening so I haven't missed a goal
all playoffs.  Well have to go boy leafs are on Ciao.

Roger Guagliano
Eastern Illinois University


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54284
From: drozinst@db.erau.edu (Drozinski Tim)
Subject: Re: Ulf and all...

jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio) writes:

>In article <1qmpfa$qna@alpha.db.erau.edu> drozinst@db.erau.edu (Drozinski Tim) writes:

>>I AM an Ulf (and Pgh) fan, and what pisses me off about the whole Adam Graves/
>>Ulf Samuesson debate is that Ulf plays hard-hitting hockey (nothing wrong with 
>>that) while Graves does what he does when the only way to win a game is to 
>>intentionally hurt someone (which bites!).

>Jeesus... I never thought I'd see the day when I defended a Ranger....

>You obviously don't watch much hockey if you think that Graves is a
>goon.  He is one of the hardest working Rangers (check that-- THE
>hardest working Ranger).  He had 36 goals this year (not bad for a
>checking type of player), and showed up for every single game this
>season (unlike that stiff Messier).  He is fearless, and throws CLEAN
>checks.  He will also stand up to someone after he hits them, not like
>that pussy Oaf.

Exactly my point.  If you'd watch games more closely, you'd see a lot 
of goons going after him.  Ulf is one of the main reasons why less physical 
players for Pgh are left alone.  Ulf plays rough hockey, but only when 
other players are putting the rush on Mario or Jagr.  If you want to say anyone
on the Penguins is a cheap shot or a goon, say it's Jennings or Caufield.  Don'tslander a good defenseman because your favorite players can't beat the Pens
even when they take dives (like Gartner) to try for the cheap penalties.

>As for his slash of Lemieux, fine.  It was a cheap shot.  It is the
>exception, not the rule.  I bet you think Mike Gartner is a goon
>because of the time that he slashed the hell out of Oaf's arm last
>year, right?  After all, he did get a suspension for it...

Hey, that's fine!  If a player does something stupid, he should be penalized
including Ulf.  Or Mario (you're not likely to see that happen) or anyone else for that matter.  It's pointless to say any one person is a cheap-shot goon,     because you'll see EVERYONE take a cheap shot now and then, especially if you'resomeone who is shadowed as much as Ulf is.

>-JPC

>-- 
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>John P. Curcio 		          Go Bruins!		   Philips Laboratories
>jpc@philabs.philips.com 			           345 Scarborough Road
>(914) 945-6442               	 		     Briarcliff Manor, NY 10510 



********************************************************************************Tim Drozinski
drozinst@db.erau.edu
"Chew electric death, snarling cur!"   Spaceman Spiff


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54285
From: drozinst@db.erau.edu (Drozinski Tim)
Subject: Re: Ulf and all...

"William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:

>Richard Wernick writes:

><stuff deleted> ... If the Bruins get to meet Pittsburgh in the near
>future, you can bet Neely will have his day.  The sight of watching Ulf
>turtle up like the coward he is, is worth almost as much as a Stanley
>Cup. ... <stuff deleted>

How much do you watch and follow hockey?  The Pens and Bruins will be in the
same division next season, which will give Neeley plenty of opportunity
to whine about Ulf.
>     All I can say is, I'm glad that you are satisfied with seeing Ulf
>"turtle up" as a substitute for the Stanley Cup, because that's as close
>as the Bruins are going to come to the Stanley Cup for a while. 

********************************************************************************Tim Drozinski
drozinst@db.erau.edu
"Chew electric death, snarling cur!"    Spaceman Spiff


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54286
From: farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: Re: Selfish hockey fans..

: In article <1993Apr21.131501@staff.dccs.upenn.edu> filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu (Geoff Filinuk) writes:
: >
: >	On Tuesday, when it was raining in Chicago, ESPN provided 
: >bonus hockey coverage.  Now it seems as though some fans are ticked off
: >that the NY-Wash OT was replaced with the Angels-?? game.  People must
: >realize that there are more baseball fans instead of hockey fans in the U.S  
: >The baseball game was scheduled to air and advertisers money was paid so
: >they can't skip the baseball game.  Why don't you people CHILL OUT
: >and enjoy whatever coverage you can get.

Well, partly because I, as an ardent fan of both sports, would rather
see Game 3 of the NHL playoffs than Game 3 of 162 of the MLB
season (even if the bb game involves the Red Sox).	

ESPN may have had contractual obligations. I understand that part.
But it's a bit inaccurate to call us "selfish" just because we want
to watch the watch the game we love. Am I, as a baseball fan, "selfish"
when I get pissed a CBS for showing approximately one game per month?
I don't think so.

While, ESPN may have contractual obligations, we, as their consumers,
have a right to voice our displeasure with how they are serving us.
There's certainly nothing wrong with that.

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


		

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54287
From: drozinst@db.erau.edu (Drozinski Tim)
Subject: Re: Ulf and all...

joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm) writes:



>>the way he does, does not belong in the NHL. There have been cheap shot artists
>>through the history of the game, but a lot of them have been talanted players.
>>Bobby Clarke, Kenny Linsemen, Pie McKenzie, Chris Chelios etc.. but nobody has been
>>out right as dirty a cheapshot coward as Ulf. Violence in hockey has got to be curbed
>>and players like (Should have been a Women) Samuelson don't belong. When players
>>like Ulf, who's main purpose is to injure the better players in the league is allowed
>>to continue, and the league won't stop it, the players should. A Christian Pro 1000
>>aluminum stick directed at his ugly head should do the trick nicely. If the Bruins get
>>a chance to meet Pittsburgh in the near future, you can bet Neely will have his day.
>>The sight of watching Ulf turtle up like the coward he is, is worth almost as much as a
>>Stanely Cup. This wimp of a player almost ruined the career of one the best right wingers
>>in the game. If you are to remove Ulf Samuelson from the lineup, the Penguins would not
>>even notice he's gone. He's an eyesore on the game of hockey.
>>
>>
>>Rich



>Rich, pull your head out of your ass.

>Joseph Stiehm


As if an aluminum stick being taken to Ulf's head is gonna solve the problem
with violence in the sport of hockey.  How the hell can you say the guy is
a goon and justify it, with your back-assward mentality?  Saying that hurting
a player will solve anyone's problems is asinine.  New rules and a new 
referee system need to be instituted.  Right now, too many of the real goons
get away with too much, because the ref is watching the play (or supposed to be:I've seen Koharski and Van Hellemond, to name a few, with their heads up their  asses on a few calls) rather than keeping an eye on the goofballs behind the 
play.  Even if the linesmen were able to call all penalties, it would be an
improvement.

********************************************************************************Tim Drozinski
drozinst@db.erau.edu
"Chew electric death, snarling cur!"    Spaceman Spiff









Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54288
From: jae2001@andy.bgsu.edu (Jason Ehas)
Subject: Re: ESPN Thumbs Up your $%#@*!!

In article <1993Apr20.214505.6925@wkuvx1.bitnet>, kozloce@wkuvx1.bitnet
wrote:
> I think this proves by $#%&* point. The Caps game goes into overtime but
> "due to contractual obligations" they have to switch to the fucking baseball.
> (Sorry for my language but im PISSED!) What the hell were they going to do
> if their scheduled game went into overtime? ESPN get your head out of your
> ass.
> 
> Now I know there are a lot 

Hey American Hockey fans,

As a hockey fan I can sympathize with thefrustration that you feel.  The
problem is that other Americans don't give a shit about hockey.  They view
it as a bunch of Canadians with bad accents and missing teeth beating the
shit out of each other on a patch of ice when it is too warm now in
two-thirds of the US to see the stuff naturally.  On the other hand
BASEBALL is the *gasp**swoon**sigh* "NATIONAL PASTTIME".  BASEBALL is so
romanticized in the US that you are supposed to forget that other sport
exist after April 1 and before November 1.  I feel that since ESPN shows 5+
BASEBALL games a week they should be able to show an OT hockey game instead
of the opening innings of a BASEBALL game.  Hell, the game is going to last
2hrs 45mins, so what if you miss the first 1 1/2 hrs?  And I am an Indians
fan!  Show the end of what you started, then switch!  But then, I'm a
hockey fan, what do I know?  BASEBALL is the all mighty sport.

Jason
jae2001@andy.bgsu.edu
GO Whalers!  Pick well!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54289
From: gibson@nukta.geop.ubc.ca (Brad Gibson)
Subject: Re: USENET Hockey Draft Final Standings

In article <C5un02.Gq5@idacom.hp.com> andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott) writes:
>Here are the final stadings for the USENET Hockey Draft.  Congratulations
>to this year's winner, Dave Wessels of Victoria, B.C., who parlayed his
>initial 1000 points into 1575.9 points!
>
>Thanks to all 262 teams for entering the biggest USENET Hockey Draft ever!
>I hope to hear from you all again this September, for the 7th Annual draft.
>
>
>USENET Hockey Draft Standings
>Week 28
>
>Posn	Team				Total	Pts	Cash	Last Posn
>
>1.	Dave Wessels                    1575.9	1574	1.9	(1)
>79.	Brad Gibson                     1174.2	1147	27.2	(79)
>262.	Dinamo Riga                     658.0	603	571.6	(262)

  An interesting note ... I have absolutely no recollection who was on my team.
  I picked all my players about 2 weeks before the start of the season, and
  then never touched the roster again.  I got wrapped up in my own "money" pool
  and decided not to get involved at all with the USENET pool (sorry Andrew
  btw).  The only thing I remember about my team is that I had Joe Sacco and
  maybe John MacLean.  Maybe Francis and Kevin Stevens as well.  Out of
  curiousity I checked the final standings today on r.s.h., only to find to my
  amazement that with absolutely no input, the initial team still managed to
  finsh 79th!  I'm not sure what that implies for those who finished below me
  :)

  Ciao.
  Brad Gibson

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Brad K. Gibson                           INTERNET: gibson@geop.ubc.ca
  Dept. of Geophysics & Astronomy         
  #129-2219 Main Mall                      PHONE: (604)822-6722
  University of British Columbia           FAX:   (604)822-6047
  Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
  V6T 1Z4
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54290
From: Andy <2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
Subject: Re: ? Octopus


In article <16BB6EA2A.LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu>, LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu
(Laurie Marshall) says:
>
>In article <C5ssL4.EBs@spk.hp.com>
>filipows@spk.hp.com (Dennis Filipowski) writes:
>
>>
>
>  Door attendants at the Joe Louis Arena have been checking fans for
>octopuses (sp?), as they are NOT allow in the Arena.  I want to know
>where these people are hiding these octopuses.  Everytime I've been to
>the Joe they checked my purse and that's the only place I can think of
>putting one.  Any other Wings fans out there know of ways to sneak
>these octopuses into the Joe?

You mean they don't strip-search you and do cavity  checks!? THE FOOLS!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54291
From: scialdone@nssdca.gsfc.nasa.gov (John Scialdone)
Subject: Pilon BITES!!!!

Do the Isles have another defenseman to insert into the line-up besides
Pilon??? Once again, last night's STUPID penalty put the Isles in a hole for the
remainder of regulation and 2 minutes into overtime!!! Even though the Isles
nearly survived Pilon's blunder in regulation, it was the most inopportune time
for a 5-minute major penalty. Instead of confronting Cote as he came across the
blueline, Pilon backed up and swiped at Cote's nose with his stick. Al Arbour
can't be serious to think Pilon is the guy to have out there with the game on
the line??? I heard Scott LaChance is out till later in the series, but there
must be someone else!!! Bring back the BAMMER, Dave Langevin!!!!

*******************************LETS GO ISLANDERS********************************

John Scialdone
SCIALDONE@NSSDCA.GSFC.NASA.GOV

"""I've been gambling hereabouts, for 10 good solid years""" JG/RH



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54292
From: mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger)
Subject: TEAM POOL STANDINGS

O.K., only one series is done.  But I need to post something.

By the way, the Islanders just scored.


Rank Team Name                  Points   Final 4
  1. roland_behunin                  5   CAL-6 QUE-7 QUE-7 
  2. Milton_Keynes_Kings             0   DET-6 PIT-5 PIT-5 
     Barfly                          0   TOR-6 BOS-7 TOR-6 
     Dean's                          0   DET-5 PIT-5 PIT-7 
     Oz                              0   LAK-6 BOS-6 LAK-6 
     Garry                           0   TOR-6 BOS-6 BOS-4 
     Brian_Bergman                   0   DET-6 PIT-6 DET-6 
     Mopar_Muscle_Men                0   CHI-5 PIT-6 PIT-5 
     BH's_Last_Place_Picks           0   CHI-5 PIT-6 PIT-5 
     Dave_Wessels                    0   VAN-7 PIT-6 PIT-5 
     Sam_&_His_Dogs                  0   DET-6 PIT-5 PIT-5 
     Ye_Ding                         0   DET-6 PIT-5 PIT-6 
     Tampere_Stars                   0   CHI-6 PIT-6 PIT-6 
     The_Mighty_Hedgehogs_Of_Myllyp  0   CHI-6 BOS-6 BOS-6 
     Homesick_Hawaiian               0   VAN-7 PIT-6 PIT-5 
     Killer_Kings                    0   CHI-6 WAS-6 CHI-6 
     Puggy_Greybeards                0   DET-5 PIT-5 PIT-5 
     Ottawa_Bearcats                 0   TOR-5 PIT-6 TOR-6 
     Andrew_Kirk                     0   TOR-6 PIT-6 PIT-5 
     Muller_n_Walker                 0   DET-6 PIT-6 PIT-6 
     Excalibur                       0   DET-6 PIT-4 PIT-6 
     Rednecks_from_Hockey_Hell       0   DET-7 BOS-5 BOS-5 
     The_@$%@#$%_Rangers_of_1940     0   CHI-6 PIT-7 PIT-6 
     Jeff_Phelps                     0   DET-6 PIT-6 PIT-5 
     Arctic_Circles                  0   DET-6 PIT-6 PIT-4 
     Sludge                          0   DET-6 PIT-6 DET-6 
     The_Logistician                 0   DET-6 PIT-6 DET-7 
     Hillside_Raiders                0   CHI-6 BOS-6 BOS-7
     Danielle                        0   CHI-5 QUE-7 QUE-7
     Stanias_Stars                   0   CHI-6 BOS-7 BOS-6
     BloodHook                       0   DET-5 PIT-5 PIT-5
     Gilles_Carmel                   0   CHI-6 PIT-7 PIT-7
     Pasi_Fr{nti                     0   LAK-7 PIT-5 PIT-6
     Evan_Pritchard                  0   VAN-6 PIT-6 PIT-5
     Skriko_Wolves                   0   DET-7 PIT-5 PIT-5
     Rangers_Blow                    0   CAL-7 PIT-6 PIT-4
     Sean                            0   DET-5 PIT-5 PIT-6
     Schott_Shooters                 0   CHI-6 PIT-5 PIT-5
     Gary_Shiff                      0   TOR-4 PIT-6 PIT-4
     Mike_Burger                     0   DET-7 PIT-6 DET-7
     Darse                           0   DET-6 PIT-6 PIT-6



*******************************************************************************
*  Mike Burger                    *  My Canada includes, Quebec, Ontario,     *
*  mmb@lamar.colostate.edu        *  the Maritimes, the Prairies, and Florida *
*  A Beginning Computing TA Stud  *  four months a year.                      *
*  over 500 students served       *    --Royal Canadian Air Farce             *
*******************************************************************************
*      University of Michigan - 1990  --  Colorado State University - 199?    *
*******************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54293
From: BGK2 <BGK2@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA>
Subject: HABS TIE SERIES AT 2 !!!!!!!

YAHOOOOOOOOO!

The Habs tied this sucker at 2 and the teams now head for Quebec
City to play game 5.  BTW, final score was Habs 3-Nords 2.

The score might be a bit misleading.  The Habs dominated the game
from the 5:00 mark of the first and then on.  The score should have
been 8-2 if it weren't for some miraculous save from a Ron Hextall
(bastard!).  He's the reason the score was as close.  Habs winning
goal was scored by Benoit Brunet at 1:07 of the 3rd.

Roy had an OK game.  He made the first save (one way or another)
and the defense was there to clear any rebounds.

This just in, ESPN radio reports that the Bruins lost 6-5 in OT.
YAHOOOOOOOOOOO!!!  Those suckers got what they deserved.

Life is just great!!!! Now if my finals would go just as well!

Nick (I'll take off my town crier hat now)

---
 The Czar of Mainframe Computing
 <BGK2@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA>
 McGill University


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54294
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: Re: Jets/Canucks - Jets hold on, win 5-4

In article <C6067p.Lsp@news.cso.uiuc.edu> epritcha@s.psych.uiuc.edu ( Evan Pritchard) writes:
>
>	I will also be happy will a good performance.  We played OK in
>Vancouver, but much better last night, as the 'big' guys were going
>for the Jets.  

Yep, though my reasons for being relatively quiet are simple...last year
I woofed when we went up 3-1 on the Canucks...and look where it got me.  :)
>
>	By the way, did Domi play last night?  I didn't notice him
>on the ice.  

Domi got tossed in the 2nd with a high-sticking major.  He had been
playing with Kris King and Stu Barnes...and it was this line that was
arguably the best in the first two games.

>
>	I am very glad to have found some places in Champaign,
>Illinois that have satillite dishes to pick up the CBC Vancouver feed.
>And I'm also glad to have found some other hockey fans, some Jets and
>some Canucks fans, to watch the game with.  
>
Definitely a good thing...every little cheer helps, Evan.  :)
Good thing the net doesn't need a voice to operate...I won't have one
Sunday night when I get home, I hope.  White noise here we come!  ;)

>
One thing, I WILL say though...Vancouver can KEEP Steve Armitage and
John Garrett as a broadcast team...those two are BAD, especially when
you are spoiled by Don Wittman.  (At least four or five times, Steve called
Barnes Selanne.  Whoops! :)

Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54295
From: vzhivov@superior.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov)
Subject: Sabres!!! Sweep.

It's over - the Sabres came back to beat the Bruins in OT 6-5 tonight
to sweep the series. A beautiful goal by Brad May (Lafontaine set him
up while lying down on the ice) ended it. Fuhr left the game game with
an injured shoulder and Lafontaine was banged up as well; however, the
Sabres will get a week's rest so injuries should not be a problem.

Montreal edged Quebec 3-2 to square their series, which seems to be
headed for Game 7. The Habs dominated the first two periods and were
unlucky to only have a 2-2 tie after 40 minutes. However, an early
goal by Brunet in the 3rd won it.

The Islanders won their 3rd OT game of the series on a goal by Ray
Ferraro 4-3; the Caps simply collapsed after taking a 3-0 lead in the
2nd. The Isles' all-time playoff OT record is now 28-7.

- Vlad the Impaler

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54296
From: RRHAMMER@vm.cmp.ilstu.edu
Subject: And you think ESPN shafted you?

Like many others I too was watching the Caps/Isles game when the went
to the baseball game.  I too was pissed.  How could they interupt such
an important game.  I understand about contracts, but you would think they
would have a clause in the contract concerning important games!
Anyway,  us BLUES (and Hawks) fans got shafted worse!  While everyone
in the U.S. and watched the game on ABC.  However those of us who live in
the central Illinois area were subjected to watching the Arthritus(?)
Telethon.  The area that was most affected by the telecast did not get
to see the game except through HAWK VISION.  This game, had it been
televised, would have been the first home Hawks game shown in the area
since 1980.  This television BULL*&%$ has got to stop.  We are not only
being deprived of seeing games, due to skyrocketing ticket prices, but
we are also being deprived of watching them on TV.
 PEACE,
 HAMMER
 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54297
From: RRHAMMER@vm.cmp.ilstu.edu
Subject: Pierre Turgeon a stud!

Being a a BLUES fan I don't get to see much else from around the league
with the exception of Hockey Night on ESPN.  I can't get the BLUES games
where I go to school, thus I don't get to see a whole lot of other teams
play except for the Hawks.  But last night I got to catch a glimpse of
the Caps/Isles game.  It occurred to me that Turgeon is a stud on skates.
His moves are quick and brilliant.  You NY fans should be proud.
P.S. Who won the game (Caps/Isles)?
 
Peace,
Hammer
 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54298
From: lzuo@byron.u.washington.edu (Joseph)
Subject: Great comeback for Sabres, despit changing goalie !

Bufflo Sabres has just finished their great four wins over Boston. All
Sabres players contribute to those great wins but those talent players
including Mogily, Fuhr, Kemhlev and Lafontin impressed me most. Their 
skills showed the art of sport, not like the garbage speech from the
coach's corner.

Go ! Make hocky popular, make hocky more exciting but less violent ! 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54299
From: jwodzia@fadel.uucp (john wodziak)
Subject: Re: Ranger Fans?????

kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller) writes:
>kwolfer@eagle.wesleyan.edu writes:

>>Reading through most of these hockey news I don't see many Ranger fans writing.   
>
>We're here, talking about hockey.  We don't go away like some team's fans
>when the Rangers bite the big one.

Yeah I think we're used to it by now. (even if some of us do change our
.sigs to root for our second favorite teams :-)

>
>>I'm new to this system and a big hockey fan and a long suffering(1940)
>Ranger > fan.  But remember suffering builds character!!
>
>I don't care!  I want my f*cking Stanley Cup!!!!!  Before I die!  AARGH!!!

I'll be happy if they win it before I get out of school. (the way it's going
I may be here saying Piled Higher and Deeper before long)

>
>
>>Ranger fans may be suffering but we're some of the most loyal, unlike Islander
>>fans who only show up when the team wins.
>This has been observed many times.  It's true, definitely.

I have a feeling that alot of people out there may not like this statement
but......
by far the worst "band  wagon" fans are the PIT fans (at least at the present).
Case in Point -- I know a guy who just came to Hockey Hell(TM) from Pitt U.
Him - "How 'bout the Pens? The're F-ing awesome"
Me - "Yeah but beating up on the Devils doesn't mean alot. Wait until
	they meet Boston and/or Detroit in the Playoffs start."
Him - "When do the Playoffs start?"
Me - "Uhhhh. They started a week ago."

I'm not saying that this is true of all the Waddlers fans but there seems to 
be alot of them floating around who really know nothing about hockey except
that they're newly beloved Waddlers are the best team in the game right now
and when they're not the best team those fans will disappear into the woodwork.

John
Flames >> dev/null
Serious comments welcomed.
"Eat the Rich"

> 
>>As far as the Stanley Cup goes I think there's only one team that can test
>>Pittsburgh and that's Detroit.  This would be the most entertaining and hard
>>fought series.  Mario is amazing!
>
>--
>    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
>						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
>	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!
>
>	   "A cow is not a vegetarian dish."  -- Keith Keller, 1993


In Hockey Hell...............jwodzia@eng.clemson.edu............John R. Wodziak
The _REAL_ Black and Gold   |In Memorium: #7 Alan Kulwicki 1954-1993   | Space
Will Triumph over those who |A Polish Yankee Mechanical Engineer,      | for 
are Pretenders to the Crown.|1992 Winston Cup Champion & a great Person| Rent!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54300
From: jwodzia@fadel.uucp (john wodziak)
Subject: Re: Where are all the Bruins fans???

Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>I'm just wondering where all the Bruins fans are???  I mean they woofed it
>up with about 1,000,000 posts during the regular season saying that their
>fave team was going to kick everyone's @#$ in the playoffs and win the Stanley
>Cup.  While I see nothing wrong with a little ranting and raving, I'm just
>curious why all the Boston faithful have stopped posting.  I mean I haven't
>even see just one little Boston fan post, 'cept for the Bruins fans that
>aren't cocky.  Well, maybe they're all out on the golf course or something,
>but I don't know, I'd sure like to see where all those Bruins fans are at :-)

Still here. Just doing a little sobbing in our beer so we're to busy to
post :-)

Seriously I think I caught a .sig curse from Nelson :-)
First the $%@#$%$ Rangers and $50 now the B's......
Hmmm....How bout dem Whalers? (No offense to steveg or others)




In Hockey Hell...............jwodzia@eng.clemson.edu............John R. Wodziak
The _REAL_ Black and Gold   |In Memorium: #7 Alan Kulwicki 1954-1993   | Space
Will Triumph over those who |A Polish Yankee Mechanical Engineer,      | for 
are Pretenders to the Crown.|1992 Winston Cup Champion & a great Person| Rent!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54301
From: njs@mrtoad.lahabra.chevron.com (n.j.spera)
Subject: Re: ESPN UP YOURS .........

In article <1993Apr21.174430.24039@Virginia.EDU>, mjr4u@Virginia.EDU ("Matthew J. Rush") writes:
|> Actually, I was angry when they went away from the Pens game.
|> Being a Pens fan in central Virginia is kinda tough.  I only
|> get to see them on ESPN, and when they play the Caps, cause
|> we're close enough to DC to get all the Caps games, so when
|> ESPN switched to the Caps, . . . AAAGGGHHH!
|> 
|> Matt

Not nearly as angry as I was to have set the VCR yesterday only to get
home to find the Bruins VS Buffalo - that's what I get for reading the
TV section and not the sports section for what game will be aired.

-- 
 Nancy J. Spera, IMT Division           # "If I didn't know for a fact that   P
 Chevron Petroleum Technology Co.       G  Elvis was working in a donut shop  E
 P.O. Box 446, La Habra, CA 90633-0446  O  in Beaver Falls, I'd swear he was  N
 Tel: (310) 694-7761  njs@chevron.com   # driving this truck." Scotty Baldwin S

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54302
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: Radio stations


Add Boston's WEEI-590AM as the Bruins' flagship station. You probably won't
pick it up anywhere outside of Boston since it's only a 5,000 watt
station. The Bruins also have network stations in all 6 New England
states.

This could be the Bruins' last year on 'EEI which also happens to be an
all-sports radio station. The problem is that the Bruins are not too happy
being moved over to a different station(WMEX 1150AM) whenever there
is a the same-night conflict with the NBA's Boston Celtics. This happened
28 times during the course of the regular season.(The Celtics own financially
troubled WEEI). The Bruins might resurface on WHDH 850 next year. Stay
tuned.

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54303
From: steven.kipling@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Steven Kipling) 
Subject: Re: #77's?

 -=> Quoting The Logistician to All <=-

 

 TL> I am in need of all of the players wearing #77 in the NHL.  I know now
 TL> only of one, Ray Borque for the Bruins.  Any help would be greatly
 TL> appreciated. 
 TL> Thanx.



      Hi there Logistician, is not Paul Coffey wearing
      # 77 for the Detroit Red Wings?
      That is the only other one (besides Borque) that I can think of
      hope it helps.


      Steve






... WARNING!  Removal of this tagline prohibited by law!
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54304
From: steven.kipling@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Steven Kipling) 
Subject: Re: ESPN broadcastsssss

 -=> Quoting Cire Y. Trehguad to All <=-


 CYT> Hey I am in Iowa and I do not mind ESPN showing the PITT/NJD games.
 CYT> At least I get to see the DEVILS...even if they are gettin there ass
 CYT> kicked Perhaps they will score and even win a game or two

 CYT> GO DEVILS


I am sorry to tell you this, but
I don't think the devils will win
a game against Pittsburg, the 
Penguins have so many scoring threats
that you shut down one and another
will kill you
It's too bad but I must conclude that the Penguins will
win their third stanley cup in a row.
I hope someone will beat them, but I just cannot see it
happening.


S t e v e





... Backup not found: (A)bort (R)etry (P)anic
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
                                                            

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54305
From: steven.kipling@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Steven Kipling) 
Subject: Re: Hey, What about teh C

 -=> Quoting Greg Rogers to All <=-
 GR> Hi all,
 GR> Due to living in the Bay Area, I as unable to see Vancouver's victory
 GR> over the Jets last night.  I know the score, but that rarely describes
 GR> the game. Could someone please post a brief sonapsis (sp?) of waht
 GR> happened.  How well did each team play?  Were the cannucks deserving of
 GR> the victory? 
 GR> Also, could some kind soul please email me the end of season,
 GR> individual player stats?

 GR> Greg

 GR> -- Vancouver for the cup (in a virtual reality)--



            I am sorry to tell you this Greg, but in all
            reality, we cannot see Vancouver winning the
            cup.  They have a rrally good chance to come
            out of the Smythe Division, and a chance to make 
            it to the finals, but no one is capable this year
            of beating the Penguins, they have too many
            scoring threats. I would love to be proven wrong, but
            I must conclude that the Pens will win cup 3 this year.


            Steve




... Mondays are a rotten way to spend a 7th of your life.
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
                          

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54306
From: steven.kipling@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Steven Kipling) 
Subject: Re: Test...Please ignore

 -=> Quoting Ohandley@betsy.gsfc.nasa. to All <=-

 Oh> From: ohandley@betsy.gsfc.nasa.gov
 Oh> Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
 Oh> Subject: Test...Please ignore
 Oh> Message-ID: <1993Apr21.180741@betsy.gsfc.nasa.gov>
 Oh> Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1993 22:07:41 GMT
 Oh> Reply-To: ohandley@betsy.gsfc.nasa.gov

 Oh> This is a test.....Please ignore.


 Oh> =======================================================================
 Oh> ========
 Oh> =======================================================================
 Oh> ========


      OK I will ignore this message
      since it is only a test.
      wow, Montreal just scored to go up
      1 - 0 in game 4 of their series, oh sorry
      I was supposed to ignore this message wasn't I


      bye for now.


      Steve




... DONT YOU DARE READ THIS TAGLINE!!!!!!!
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
                                                      

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54307
From: b859zah@utarlg.uta.edu (George M. Smiley)
Subject: Re: ESPN really sucks big time

cdash@moet.cs.colorado.edu (Charles Shub) writes...
> 
>so all us hockey/automobile racing fans all know exactly where we stand
>	ESPN delays the martinsville race by a day for the NFL draft
>	ESPN shows baseball instead of the overtime of a NHL playoff game
> 
>	gimme a break, guys
>

What really irritated me was that they kept switching back and forth
between baseball and hockey after they stated that they couldn't show
the overtime period. I turned back to ESPN around 11 and it was hockey.
Great, I pulled up a chair and watched, then the first overtime period 
ended and they went back to baseball before coming back to hockey
something like 30 minutes later. Are they trying to alienate both
hockey and baseball viewers at the same time. As for Martinsville,
I wonder why they even bothered to sign up for it when they it was
no secret that it coincided with the draft. Why not let TNN broadcast
it ?


George

>charlie shub  cdash@cs.Colorado.EDU     

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54308
From: chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Subject: Re: SHARKS REVIEW Part 5: Left Wings

paul@fugu.Data-IO.COM (Paul Brownlow) writes:

>Wood played most of his junior career in Seattle.  He was one
>of the leading scorers on a mediocre team when he was traded away in
>1992.  He rarely lost a fight and was one of the toughest players in
>the WHL.

Wood is fairly small for an enforcer-type. I mean, Fleury does a pretty good
job and isn't that large, but Dody is no Fleury. 

Having been witness to three or four of his fights closeup, he simply isn't
ready to fight at an NHL level (assuming that it's his role, which is ALL he
really showed us in his few games up from K.C. -- if he can pass, shoot or
skate, I never saw much of it). All he has is a right fist, which isn't bad,
but at the NHL level, the other players are smart enough to grab the thing
before he can land anything significant. Once you control that hand, he's a
fish flopping on the beach and the other player can do just about anything
he wants to him. His entire strategy seemed to be keep the hand out of reach
until he found an opening -- and I never once saw him find an opening worth
talking about. He got neutralized quickly, and stomped on a couple of times.

Unless he shows some new tricks in camp, he'll be on my "career minor
leaguer" list. Since this was his first taste of the NHL, I expect the
Sharks gave it to him so he'd KNOW what he'd have to work on off-season. He
needs to get stronger, he needs to get more speed and he needs to show some
versatility as something else than a simply goond, because he wasn't
particularly good as a goon.

-- 
 Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= chuq@apple.com
   Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms =+=  GEnie: MAC.BIGOT =+= ALink:CHUQ 
  Minor League fans: minors-request@medraut.apple.com (San Jose Giants: A/1/9)
  San Francisco Giants fans: giants-request@medraut.apple.com (The Stick?NOT!)
   San Jose Sharks fans: sharks-request@medraut.apple.com (New seat: 127/TBD)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54309
From: jsmilla@emory.edu (Joshua S. Millard)
Subject: Islanders win Third in OT

Don't know who scored, but the Isles (28-7 franchise record in
playoff OT games) took game four by a score of 4-3 for their
third consecutive OT win over the Capitals tonight at Uniondale.
If you know, please post who scored for a Isles fan living in
Atlanta:Hockey Hell.

Lord Stan's a Uniondale Man!  GO ISLES!

JSM.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54358
From: ketolain@messi.uku.fi (Jarkko Ketolainen)
Subject: WC/Finland

Disaster! Finland was beaten by Czech 1-3 (0-0,1-1,0-2).
Finland will be 4th of pool B and will most certainly meet Canada in the
quarter final on wednesday 28th. Lack of scoring skills has
been the major problem of team Finland throughout the tournament.
Briza (goalie)  was the MVP of  the Czech team and Tikkanen was the 
MVP of the Finnish team. 

Jarkko #14

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54359
From: wihervaa@messi.uku.fi (Mikko Wihervaara)
Subject: Re: WC/Finland

ketolain@messi.uku.fi (Jarkko Ketolainen) writes:

>Disaster! Finland was beaten by Czech 1-3 (0-0,1-1,0-2).
>Finland will be 4th of pool B and will most certainly meet Canada in the
>quarter final on wednesday 28th. Lack of scoring skills has
>been the major problem of team Finland throughout the tournament.
>Briza (goalie)  was the MVP of  the Czech team and Tikkanen was the 
       ^^^^^^^^ 
>MVP of the Finnish team. 

In four of the five games Finns have played, the goalie has been chosen
the best player of the opposing team. (In the fifth, the finnish goalie, 
Ketterer was elected the best Finn) Has this to do with the goalies 
having good days in these games, or are the finnish players just lousy
scorers???

Anyway, quite few goals have been scored in these games in generally
(the exception of course being Canada vs. Italy).  It looks like the
goalies are getting too good.  Is this due to their equipment getting
bigger, so they cover more (their gloves, e.g. seem to be much bigger
now than they were some years ago).

Anybody know if the rules on goalie equipment has changed this way????


Mikko Wihervaara  
 
>Jarkko #14
-- 
T{m{ on nyt t{mm|nen testi
sigun kai piti olla muutamarivinen
nyt viel{ pari 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54360
From: willis@oracle.SCG.HAC.COM (Stan Willis)
Subject: Kings regular season schedule/results

1992-93 Los Angeles Kings Schedule/Results

TV:
---
2 preseason games, 82 of 84 regular season and all playoffs on TV.

 (PT)= Prime Ticket, (5) = KTLA Channel 5, (7) = ABC Channel 7 - playoffs

Radio:
------
All regular and preseason games broadcast on the Kings radio network.

 Southern California 	XTRA -  690am (flagship)
 Simi Valley		KWNK -  670am 
 Ankorage, Alaska	KBYR -  700am
 El Centro		KAMP - 1430am
 Fairbanks, Alaska	KIAK -  970am
 Hemet/Temecula		KHSJ - 1320am
 Lancaster/Palmdale	KAVL -  610am
 Palm Desert		KNWZ - 1270am
 Paso Robles		KPRL - 1230am
 Reno, Nevada		KPLY - 1270am
 Sacramento		KSAC - 1240am
 San Luis Obispo	KKAL - 1280am
 Santa Clarita		KBET - 1220am
 Las Vegas, Nevada 	KENO - 1460am

Preseason:
----------
September/October:
18 LA  3 vs VAN 3 @ Vancouver   - 12,357 (0-0-1,  1 pt)
20 LA  5 vs PIT 2 @ Portland    -  6,124 (1-0-1,  3 pts) (PT)
23 LA  3 vs PIT 3 @ Tacoma      -  ?     (1-0-2,  4 pts)
24 LA  2 vs NYR 7 @ San Diego   -  8,099 (1-1-2,  4 pts) (PT)
26 LA  2 vs NYR 6 @ Phoenix     -  8,977 (1-2-2,  4 pts)
27 LA  4 vs SJ  2 @ Sacramento  -  7,950 (2-2-2,  6 pts)
30 LA  2 vs VAN 5 @ The Forum   - 10,250 (2-3-2,  6 pts)
03 LA  8 vs SJ  8 @ The Forum   - 12,005 (3-3-2,  8 pts)
      --       --
Total 29       36

Regular Season:
---------------
October:
06 LA  5 @  Calgary      4 (OT) - 19,461 ( 1- 0- 0,   2 pts) (PT)
08 LA  3 vs Detroit      5      - 16,005 ( 1- 1- 0,   2 pts) (PT)
10 LA  6 vs Winnipeg     3      - 14,509 ( 2- 1- 0,   4 pts) (PT)
13 LA  2 vs San Jose     1      - 14,320 ( 3- 1- 0,   6 pts) (PT)
15 LA  4 vs Calgary      0      - 15,133 ( 4- 1- 0,   8 pts) (PT)
17 LA  8 vs Boston       6      - 16,005 ( 5- 1- 0,  10 pts) (PT)
20 LA  2  @ Calgary      6      - 19,169 ( 5- 2- 0,  10 pts)  (5)
23 LA  2  @ Winnipeg     4      - 12,924 ( 5- 3- 0,  10 pts) (PT)
24 LA  5  @ Minnesota    5      - 15,174 ( 5- 3- 1,  11 pts)  (5)
27 LA  4  @ NY Islanders 3      - 10,259 ( 6- 3- 1,  13 pts) (PT)
29 LA  3  @ Boston       8      - 14,448 ( 6- 4- 1,  13 pts) (PT)
31 LA  7  @ Hartford     1      -  9,244 ( 7- 4- 1,  15 pts)  (5)
      --                --                -----------------
Oct.  51                46                 7- 4- 1,  15 pts

November:
05 LA  5 vs New Jersey   2      - 14,592 ( 8- 4- 1,  17 pts) (PT)
07 LA  5 vs Buffalo      2      - 16,005 ( 9- 4- 1,  19 pts) (PT)
08 LA 11  @ San Jose     4      - 11,089 (10- 4- 1,  21 pts) (no tv)
10 LA  4  @ Winnipeg     4      - 12,831 (10- 4- 2,  22 pts) (PT)
12 LA  7 vs Vancouver    4      - 15,486 (11- 4- 2,  24 pts) (PT)
14 LA  6 vs Edmonton     2      - 16,005 (12- 4- 2,  26 pts) (PT)
16 LA  3  @ Vancouver    6      - 15,896 (12- 5- 2,  26 pts) (PT)
17 LA  0  @ San Jose     6      - 11,089 (12- 6- 2,  26 pts) (PT)
19 LA  4 vs Chicago      1      - 16,005 (13- 6- 2,  28 pts) (PT)
21 LA  6 vs Toronto      4      - 16,005 (14- 6- 2,  30 pts) (PT)
25 LA  3  @ Edmonton     1      - 13,636 (15- 6- 2,  32 pts) (no tv)
27 LA  5  @ Detroit      3      - 19,875 (16- 6- 2,  34 pts) (PT)
28 LA  2  @ Toronto      3      - 15,720 (16- 7- 2,  34 pts) (PT)
      --                --                -----------------
Nov.  61                42                 9- 3- 1,  19 pts
Year 112                88

December:
01 LA  6  @ Chicago      3      - 16,292 (17- 7- 2,  36 pts) at Milwaukee (PT)
03 LA  5 vs Pittsburgh   3      - 16,005 (18- 7- 2,  38 pts) (PT)
05 LA  7 vs Hartford     3      - 16,005 (19- 7- 2,  40 pts) (PT)
08 LA  5 vs Montreal     5      - 12,276 (19- 7- 3,  41 pts) at Phoenix (PT)
10 LA  4 vs Quebec       5      - 15,221 (19- 8- 3,  41 pts) (PT)
12 LA  6 vs St Louis     3      - 16,005 (20- 8- 3,  43 pts) (PT)
15 LA  2 vs Tampa Bay    3      - 15,753 (20- 9- 3,  43 pts) (PT)
18 LA  5  @ Edmonton     5      - 15,257 (20- 9- 4,  44 pts)  (5)
19 LA  3  @ Calgary      5      - 20,214 (20-10- 4,  44 pts) (PT)
22 LA  2 vs Vancouver    6      - 16,005 (20-11- 4,  44 pts) (PT)
26 LA  2  @ San Jose     7      - 11,089 (20-12- 4,  44 pts)  (5)
29 LA  2 vs Philadelphia 10     - 16,005 (20-13- 4,  44 pts) (PT)
31 LA  0  @ Vancouver    4      - 16,150 (20-14- 4,  44 pts) (PT)
      --                --                -----------------
Dec.  49                62                 4- 7- 2,  10 pts
Year 161               150

January:
02 LA  5 vs Montreal     5      - 16,005 (20-14- 5,  45 pts) (PT)
06 LA  3 vs Tampa Bay    6      - 16,005 (20-15- 5,  45 pts) (PT)
08 LA  3  @ Winnipeg     6      - 14,036 (20-16- 5,  45 pts)  (5)
10 LA  5  @ Chicago      4      - 17,705 (21-16- 5,  47 pts)  (5)
12 LA  3  @ Ottawa       2      - 10,500 (22-16- 5,  49 pts) (PT)
14 LA  1  @ New Jersey   7      - 13,586 (22-17- 5,  49 pts) (PT)
16 LA  2 vs Winnipeg     5      - 16,005 (22-18- 5,  49 pts) (PT)
19 LA  5  @ Edmonton     4      - 16,686 (23-18- 5,  51 pts) (PT)
21 LA  4 vs Vancouver    5      - 16,005 (23-19- 5,  51 pts) (PT)
23 LA  3 vs NY Rangers   8      - 16,005 (23-20- 5,  51 pts) (PT)
26 LA  7 vs San Jose     1      - 16,005 (24-20- 5,  53 pts) (PT)
28 LA  1 vs Calgary      2      - 16,005 (24-21- 5,  53 pts) (PT)
30 LA  2 vs Chicago      2      - 16,005 (24-21- 6,  54 pts) (PT)
      --                --                -----------------
Jan.  44                57                 4- 7- 2,  10 pts
Year 205               207

February:
02 LA  2  @ Quebec       3      - 14,843 (24-22- 6,  54 pts) (PT)
03 LA  2  @ Montreal     7      - 17,164 (24-23- 6,  54 pts) (PT)
09 LA  3 vs Edmonton     6      - 16,005 (24-24- 6,  54 pts) (PT)
11 LA  6 vs Detroit      6      - 16,005 (24-24- 7,  55 pts) (PT)
13 LA  3 vs Washington  10      - 16,005 (24-25- 7,  55 pts) (PT)
15 LA  3 vs Vancouver    0      - 16,005 (25-25- 7,  57 pts) (PT)
17 LA 10  @ Minnesota    5      - 14,911 (26-25- 7,  59 pts) (PT)
18 LA  2  @ Chicago      7      - 17,597 (26-26- 7,  59 pts) (PT)
20 LA  3  @ Washington   7      - 17,812 (26-27- 7,  59 pts) (PT)
22 LA  5  @ Tampa Bay    2      - 10,425 (27-27- 7,  61 pts) (PT)
25 LA  0  @ St Louis     3      - 13,473 (27-28- 7,  61 pts) (PT)
27 LA  2 vs Toronto      5      - 16,005 (27-29- 7,  61 pts) (PT)
      --                --                -----------------
Feb.  41                61                 3- 8- 1,   7 pts
Year 246               268

March:
02 LA  6 vs Calgary      2      - 16,005 (28-29- 7,  63 pts) (PT)
04 LA  8 vs Ottawa       6      - 16,005 (29-29- 7,  65 pts) (PT)
06 LA  6 vs Edmonton     1      - 16,005 (30-29- 7,  67 pts) (PT)
09 LA  3  @ NY Rangers   4      - 18,200 (30-30- 7,  67 pts) (PT)
11 LA  3  @ Pittsburgh   4      - 16,164 (30-31- 7,  67 pts) (PT)
13 @ Philadelphia - Postponed after 1 period (1-1) due to weather. Resch for 4/1
14 @ Buffalo      - Postponed due to weather.  Rescheduled for 3/15.
15 LA  4  @ Buffalo      2      - 13,799 (31-31- 7,  69 pts) (PT)
16 LA  8 vs Winnipeg     4      - 16,005 (32-31- 7,  71 pts) (PT)
18 LA  7 vs NY Islanders 4      - 16,005 (33-31- 7,  73 pts) (PT)
20 LA  3 vs St Louis     2      - 16,005 (34-31- 7,  75 pts) (PT)
24 LA  2  @ Vancouver    6      - 16,150 (34-32- 7,  75 pts)  (5)
26 LA  4  @ Edmonton     1      - 17,503 (35-32- 7,  77 pts)  (5)
28 LA  3  @ Winnipeg     3      - 15,566 (35-32- 8,  78 pts) (PT)
29 LA  9  @ Detroit      3      - 19,875 (36-32- 8,  80 pts)  (5)
31 LA  5  @ Toronto      5      - 15,720 (36-32- 9,  81 pts) (PT)
      --                --                -----------------
Mar.  71                47                 9- 3- 2,  20 pts
Year 317               315

April:
01 LA  3  @ Philadelphia 1      - 17,380 (37-32- 9,  83 pts) (PT) rescheduled
03 LA  0 vs Minnesota    3      - 16,005 (37-33- 9,  83 pts) (PT)
06 LA  3 vs Calgary      3      - 16,005 (37-33-10,  84 pts) (PT)
08 LA  2 vs San Jose     1      - 16,005 (38-33-10,  86 pts) (PT)
10 LA  3  @ San Jose     2 (OT) - 11,089 (39-33-10,  88 pts) (PT)
13 LA  4  @ Vancouver    7      - 16,150 (39-34-10,  88 pts) (PT)
15 LA  6 vs Vancouver    8      - 16,005 (39-35-10,  88 pts) (PT)
      --                --                -----------------
Apr.  21                25                 3- 3- 1,   7 pts
Year 338               340                39-35-10,  88 pts -  3rd Smythe, 
                                                              11th overall

Playoffs:
---------
April:
18   @ Calgary - 12:00 noon (7)
21   @ Calgary -  6:30 pm (PT)
23  vs Calgary -  7:30 pm (PT)
25  vs Calgary - 12:00 noon (7)**
*27  @ Calgary -  6:30 pm (PT)
*29 vs Calgary -  7:30 pm (PT)

May:
*01  @ Calgary -  6:30 pm (PT)

all times listed are Pacific Time.
*if necessary.
** may be shown on ABC, if televised by Prime Ticket, time is 7:30 pm.
===============================================================================
Stan Willis (willis@empire.dnet.hac.com)
net contact: L.A. Kings

 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
      talk with the L.A. Kings Mailing List ...... kings@cs.stanford.edu
      to subscribe or unsubscribe: ....... kings-request@cs.stanford.edu
 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
===============================================================================

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54361
From: nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: Possible Canadian WC Team?

This is an all-point team for the Canadian NHLers who are not playoff bound...

GOALIES
Bill Ranford, Edmonton
Sean Burke, Hartford
Peter Sidorkiewicz, Ottawa

DEFENSEMEN
Zarley Zalapski, Hartford
Norm MacIver, Ottawa
Garry Galley, Philadelphia
Greg Hawgood, Philadelphia
Dave Manson, Edmonton
Mark Tinordi, Minnesota

CENTERS
Mark Messier, N. Y. Rangers
Geoff Sanderson, Hartford
Brian Bradley, Tampa Bay
Rod Brind'Amour, Philadelphia

LEFT WINGS
Adam Graves, N. Y. Rangers
Chris Kontos, Tampa Bay
Patrick Poulin, Hartford
Shayne Corson, Edmonton

RIGHT WINGS
Pat Verbeek, Hartford
Russ Courtnall, Minnesota
Mike Gartner, N. Y. Rangers
Kevin Dineen, Philadelphia

===============================================================================
GO CALGARY FLAMES!  Al MacInnis for Norris!  Gary Roberts for Hart and Smythe!
GO EDMONTON OILERS!  Go for playoffs next year!  Stay in Edmonton!
===============================================================================
Nelson Lu (claudius@leland.stanford.edu)
rec.sport.hockey contact for the San Jose Sharks

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54364
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Stan Fischler, 4/24

In <1993Apr25.170303.19486@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:

>Wayne made his own bed...choosing McNall over Sather and hockey
>destiny...he should sleep in it instead of whining.  Ego got

Absolute nonsense.  The decision that was made was Pocklington's.  He chose 
20 mill over Gretzky.  If Gretzky wasn't upset about not being able to win
a cup in LA then I submit that he wasn't worth the 20 mill.

>the best of him...he thought the supporting cast in Edmonton
>didn't matter...that he was the show himself.

How do you know what he thinks (or thought)?  The only "thought" that I
can see that you have revealed is your own.  You don't like Gretzky.
Big deal.

>Now, my only complaint about Lemieux is that he dives too much...
>but last year Patrick convinced him twice to accept Bowman and hockey
>destiny, rather than his ego.

The real purpose of diving is not merely an attempt to draw a penalty.  What
the player is trying to do is make the checkers keep their distance so the
ref won't be fooled.  I can't imagine why anyone would expect someone like
Lemieux to change his game.  Why don't you pick on 1 dimensional over-rated
type like Hull and Salami. 


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54365
From: farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL Playoff results

AHL PLAYOFF SCORES-- FIRST ROUND	(home team in CAPS)
================================

GAMES PLAYED ON TUES, 4/20
-------------------------
Rochester 6	UTICA 4
Fredericton at Cape Breton

SERIES STATI (plural of status? :)
----------------------------------
Adirondack leads CDI, 3-0
Providence tied w/Springfield, 2-2
Binghamton tied w/Baltimore, 1-1
Rochester leads Utica, 2-1
St John's leads Moncton, 2-0
Cape Breton tied w/Fredericton, 1-1

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54366
From: fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu (FRANK MICHAE SALVATORE)
Subject: NC Caps/Isles Fans


Caps/Isles Fans,

Anyone interested in catching the games from Nassau
Coliseum (hopefully there will be another) can catch
the game at North Carolina's Original Sports Bar in
Chapel Hill.  I'm pretty sure they carry HTS as well.
They had all three games on at the same
time last night.  This is the only place I know to
catch all of the Stanley Cup action.

Frank Salvatore
fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54367
From: Mamatha Devineni Ratnam <mr47+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Pens fans reactions



I am sure some bashers of Pens fans are pretty confused about the lack
of any kind of posts about the recent Pens massacre of the Devils. Actually,
I am  bit puzzled too and a bit relieved. However, I am going to put an end
to non-PIttsburghers' relief with a bit of praise for the Pens. Man, they
are killing those Devils worse than I thought. Jagr just showed you why
he is much better than his regular season stats. He is also a lot
fo fun to watch in the playoffs. Bowman should let JAgr have a lot of
fun in the next couple of games since the Pens are going to beat the pulp out of Jersey anyway. I was very disappointed not to see the Islanders lose the final
regular season game.          PENS RULE!!!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54478
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Playoff Pool game 2 standings

Here are the standings after game 2 of each of the divisional semi-final
series.

	- Andrew

USENET Hockey Playoff Draft Standings

Posn	Team				Pts	Rem	Last Posn

1.	Sneddon Scorers                 77	25	(1)
2.	Arctic Circles                  75	25	(75)
	Northern Lights                 75	25	(33)
	Threepeat                       75	25	(19)
5.	fighting amish                  74	25	(161)
	Team Elvis                      74	25	(11)
7.	chris roney                     73	25	(33)
	Myers Marauders                 73	25	(--)
	the dead ducks                  73	25	(11)
10.	Les Poteux                      72	25	(--)
	Sludge                          72	25	(75)
	Paige Faults                    72	25	(33)
	Sam & His Dogs                  72	25	(33)
	The Borg                        72	25	(2)
	Hurricane Andrew                72	25	(4)
	Lewey's Lakers                  72	25	(102)
	Einstien's Punk Band            72	25	(9)
18.	Homesick Hawaiian               71	25	(4)
	Test Department                 71	25	(11)
	Samuel Lau (Calgary, Alberta)   71	25	(127)
	Mopar Muscle Men                71	25	(33)
	Jerky Boys                      71	24	(4)
	GB Flyers                       71	25	(19)
24.	Neural Netters                  70	25	(102)
	give you money monday           70	25	(9)
	Bill McGreer                    70	25	(--)
	Fugazi                          70	25	(33)
	Detroit Homeboy                 70	25	(11)
	Bloom County All-Stars          70	25	(54)
	DehraDun Maawalis               70	25	(75)
31.	Great Expectations              69	25	(4)
	PURDUE RICKS PENS               69	25	(19)
33.	frank's little wankers          68	25	(33)
	Jan Stein                       68	25	(33)
	Allez les Blues                 68	25	(--)
	Goaldingers                     68	25	(75)
	suds                            68	25	(19)
	weenies                         68	25	(33)
	A.P. BURY                       68	25	(19)
	Bruce's Rented Mules            68	25	(4)
41.	Mind Sweepers                   67	25	(33)
	Mike Burger                     67	25	(11)
	Go Flames                       67	25	(--)
	garryola                        67	25	(33)
	The Mulberry Maulers            67	25	(75)
	LIPPE                           67	25	(102)
	Flamming Senators               67	25	(19)
	Big Bay Bombers                 67	25	(102)
	Milton Keynes Kings             67	25	(33)
50.	Seppo Kemppainen                66	25	(19)
	Freddy Beach Rockets            66	25	(--)
	The Campi Machine               66	25	(19)
	j's rock'em sock'ems            66	25	(75)
	Sean Forbes                     66	25	(19)
	Tapio Repo                      66	25	(11)
	zachmans wingers                66	25	(19)
	Zipper Heads                    66	25	(11)
	Canadian Gladiators             66	25	(75)
59.	Teem Kanada                     65	25	(33)
	New Zealand Leafs               65	25	(54)
	Tiger Chung Lees                65	25	(54)
	Rangers Of Destiny              65	25	(33)
	make beliefs                    65	25	(54)
	Dave Wessels                    65	25	(2)
	Norway Killerwhales             65	25	(54)
66.	Force 25                        64	25	(75)
	trevor's triumph                64	25	(75)
	Commitments                     64	25	(141)
	Skate or Die                    64	25	(19)
	Dog's Hog's                     64	25	(33)
	Delaware Destroyers             64	25	(33)
	Craig team                      64	25	(11)
	Rangers Blow                    64	25	(54)
	Debbie Bowles                   64	25	(19)
	Mak Paranjape                   64	25	(141)
	Comfortably Numb                64	25	(127)
	Loaded Weapons                  64	25	(54)
	Rob Del Mundo                   64	25	(54)
	Robarts Research Rebels         64	25	(54)
	Fuzzfaces Galore                64	25	(19)
	Houdini's Magicians             64	25	(54)
	La Coupe Stainless              64	25	(141)
83.	Cluster Buster                  63	25	(33)
	Lets Go Pandas                  63	25	(102)
	Tequila Shooters                63	25	(141)
	Steves Superstars               63	25	(102)
	Reksa fans of Oulu              63	25	(127)
	Habs Playing Golf               63	25	(75)
	Chris Stevens                   63	25	(--)
	On Thin Ice                     63	25	(102)
	Oakville Brothers               63	25	(33)
	Jason team                      63	25	(102)
	smithw                          63	25	(102)
94.	Anson Mak                       62	25	(173)
	Skriko Wolves                   62	25	(102)
	all the kane's men              62	25	(75)
	Danielle Leblanc                62	25	(127)
	Team Awesome                    62	25	(19)
	weasels                         62	25	(141)
	Alf's All-Stars                 62	25	(75)
	Zippety Doodah                  62	25	(75)
	Kramer George and Jerry         62	25	(75)
	Rev's Rebels                    62	25	(75)
	Yan Loke                        62	25	(75)
	Lamp Lighters                   62	25	(102)
	littlest giants                 62	25	(75)
	Mr Creosote                     62	25	(75)
108.	oceanweavers                    61	25	(161)
	Great Scott                     61	25	(141)
	Bobby Schmautz Fan Club         61	25	(127)
	IceMachine                      61	25	(102)
	Hat Trick Mike                  61	25	(--)
	The promise land                61	25	(33)
	Daves knee jerk picks           61	25	(102)
	Doug Bowles                     61	25	(102)
	Holsteins SFB                   61	25	(54)
	Lemon Pepper Grizzly Bears      61	25	(54)
	Flying pigs                     61	25	(127)
	Les Raisins                     61	25	(102)
	RENEB                           61	25	(102)
	Gilles Carmel                   61	25	(102)
122.	Boops Bets                      60	25	(127)
	Timo Ojala                      60	25	(127)
	Rednecks from Hockey Hell       60	25	(33)
	gee man                         60	25	(127)
	FRACK ATTACK                    60	25	(54)
	triple X                        60	25	(127)
	Ulfie's 16 brothers             60	25	(--)
	buffalo soldiers                60	25	(54)
	Shigella                        60	25	(102)
	Ottawa Bearcats                 60	25	(127)
	Whiters                         60	25	(141)
	Monica Loke                     60	25	(102)
	Lance Hill The Boston Bruins Fa 60	25	(33)
135.	Mann Mariners                   59	24	(141)
	New Jersey Rob                  59	25	(102)
	Frasses Faceplants              59	25	(141)
	Doug Mraz                       59	25	(102)
	Muller n Walker                 59	25	(54)
	High Stickers                   59	25	(141)
	Legzryx                         59	25	(161)
	Beer Makes Me An Expert         59	25	(75)
	Gail Hiebert                    59	25	(127)
	Dean Martin                     59	25	(161)
145.	marcs maulers                   58	25	(127)
	brians bloodletters             58	25	(75)
	Van Isle Colonists              58	25	(141)
	Charlie Cook                    58	25	(--)
	Bjorkloven                      58	25	(54)
	Schott Shooters                 58	25	(102)
	Bjoern Leaguen                  58	25	(75)
	The Eradicators                 58	25	(141)
	Lord Stanley's Favourites       58	25	(141)
	But Wait Theres more            58	25	(127)
	Stacey Ross                     58	25	(141)
156.	Heikki Salmi                    57	25	(54)
	The Ice Kickers                 57	25	(75)
	Chapman Chaps                   57	25	(161)
	The ^&#@$#$% Rangers of 1940    57	25	(54)
	The Underwriters                57	25	(54)
	beam team                       57	25	(176)
	Dave Hiebert                    57	25	(75)
	Canuck Force                    57	25	(176)
	Evan Pritchard                  57	25	(161)
	Controversy Warriors            57	25	(54)
	JFZ Dream Team                  57	25	(141)
167.	San Jose Mahi Mahi              56	25	(141)
	go go gagit                     56	25	(161)
	goddess of fermentation         56	25	(54)
	bure's blur                     56	25	(141)
	Louisiana Psycho Killers        56	25	(141)
	East City Jokers                56	25	(102)
	Tampere Salami                  56	25	(176)
	JOE'S A CRAK HEAD               56	25	(102)
	Grant Marven                    56	25	(75)
	Mark And Steve Dreaming Again   56	25	(75)
	Pens Dynasty                    56	25	(161)
178.	Chip n Dale                     55	25	(189)
179.	Cherry Bombers                  54	25	(161)
	Brian Bergman                   54	25	(189)
	The Goobmeister                 54	25	(75)
	Oz                              54	25	(141)
	Arm & Hammer                    54	25	(161)
	gax goons                       54	25	(176)
	Daryl Turner                    54	25	(102)
186.	E.I.S                           53	25	(141)
	BOSSE                           53	25	(75)
	Myllypuro Hedgehogs             53	25	(161)
	Chapman Sticks                  53	25	(176)
	Hillside Raiders                53	25	(185)
	Knights on a Power Play         53	25	(173)
192.	Eldoret Elephants               52	25	(185)
	Sparky's Select                 52	25	(176)
	Sluggo's Hosers                 52	25	(173)
	butt ends                       52	25	(176)
196.	lisa's luggers                  51	25	(197)
	Stanias Stars                   51	25	(161)
198.	Ken De Cruyenaere               49	25	(176)
199.	Gary Shiff                      48	25	(--)
200.	JUKURIT                         47	25	(176)
201.	Montys Nords                    45	25	(192)
	Jane's World                    45	25	(185)
	Rolaids Required                45	25	(189)
	Martin's Gag                    45	25	(194)
205.	Equipe Du Jour                  44	25	(196)
206.	Arsenal Maple Leafs             41	18	(194)
	the ALarmers                    41	25	(185)
208.	Killer Kings                    38	25	(192)
-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54479
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Goalie mask poll update 4/22/93


	Curtis Joseph and Ray LeBlanc have made some big moves in the
poll recently. Hextall has shown some strong movement as well. Kirk
McLean and Tom Barrasso (I can't see why) have been added to the list
recently. Keep sending in those votes.

Current votes for favorite goalie masks (3pts - 1st, 2pts - 2nd, 1pt - 3rd)

Player                    Team                 Pts       Votes
--------------------------------------------------------------
1. Ed Belfour             Chicago              32         15
   Curtis Joseph          St. Louis            32         13 
3. Andy Moog              Boston               30         13
4. Brian Hayward          San Jose             26         10 
5. Ron Hextall            Quebec               16          8
6. Grant Fuhr             Buffalo              12          5 
7. Gerry Cheevers         Boston (retired)     11          6 
8. John Vanbeisbrouck     NY Rangers           10          4
9. Ray LeBlanc            USA Olympic           7          3
10. Mike Richter          NY Rangers            6          3
11. Manon Rheaume         Atlanta (IHL)         5          2
12. Don Beaupre           Washington            4          2
    Ken Dryden            Montreal (retired)    4          2
--------------------------------------------------------------
Others receiving less than 4pts: Mike Vernon (Cal), Clint
 Malarchuk (Buf/SD,IHL), Tommy Soderstrom (Phil), Tom Barrasso (Pit),
 Artus Irbe (SJ), Tim Cheveldae (Det), Sean Burke (NJ),
 Rick Wamsley (Tor,ret), Jon Casey (Minn), Bob Essensa (Win),
 Glenn Healy (NYI), Tony Espo (Chi), Gilles Gratton (Bos),
 Rod Stauber (LA), Gump Worsley (Mtl/NYR), Pat Jablonski (TB),
 Grant Fuhr (Tor), Felix Potvin (Tor), Stephane Beauregard (Win),
 Mark Fitzpatrick (NYI), Chico Resch (NYI), Kirk McLean (Van)

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54507
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: WC 93: Scores and standings, April 25


 1993 World Championships in Germany:
 ====================================

  Group A standings (Munich)            Group B standings (Dortmund)
  --------------------------            ----------------------------

             GP  W T L  GF-GA +/-  P                  GP  W T L  GF-GA +/-  P

  Canada      5  5 0 0  31- 4 +27 10    Czech republic 5  4 1 0  17- 4 +13  9
  Sweden      5  3 0 2  17-14  +3  6    Germany        5  4 0 1  20-12  +8  8
  Russia      5  2 1 2  15-12  +3  5    USA            5  2 2 1  14-10  +4  6
  Switzerland 5  2 0 3  11-14  -3  4    Finland        5  2 1 2   7- 7   0  5
  ----------------------------------    -------------------------------------
  Italy       4  1 1 2   7-19 -12  3    Norway         4  0 0 4   1-13 -12  0
  Austria     4  0 0 4   3-21 -18  0    France         4  0 0 4   6-19 -13  0

 
 April 18:  Italy - Russia        2-2       Norway - Germany          0-6
            Sweden - Austria      1-0       USA - Czech republic      1-1

 April 19:  Canada - Switzerland  2-0
            Russia - Austria      4-2       Finland - France          2-0

 April 20:  Sweden - Canada       1-4       Czech republic - Germany  5-0
            Switzerland - Italy   0-1       Finland - USA             1-1

 April 21:                                  Germany - France          5-3
            Italy - Sweden        2-6       Czech republic - Norway   2-0

 April 22:  Switzerland - Russia  0-6       USA - France              6-1
            Austria - Canada      0-11      Norway - Finland          0-2

 April 23:  Switzerland - Austria 5-1       Germany - Finland         3-1

 April 24:  Russia - Sweden       2-5       Czech republic - France   6-2
            Canada - Italy       11-2       USA - Norway              3-1

 April 25:  Sweden - Switzerland  4-6       Finland- Czech republic   1-3
            Russia - Canada       1-3       Germany - USA             6-3

 April 26:  Austria - Italy                 France - Norway		20:00

 
 PLAYOFFS:
 =========

 April 27:	Quarterfinals
		Sweden - USA						15:30
		Russia - Germany					20:00

 April 28:	Quarterfinals
		Canada - Finland					15:30
		Italy/Switzerland - Czech republic			20:00

 April 29:	Relegation
		A #5 - B #6						15:30
		A #6 - B #5						20:00

 April 30:	Semifinals
		A #1/B #4 - A #3/B #2					15:30
		A #4/B #1 - A #2/B #3					20:00

 May 1:		Relegation						14:30
		Bronze medal game 					19:00

 May 2:		FINAL							15:00

--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54508
From: ritt1@ac.dal.ca
Subject: Re: Lemieux's Getting the Hart... Jeez I hope not!

In article <22APR93.02956996.0062@UNBVM1.CSD.UNB.CA>, Patrick Walker <F1HH@UNB.CA> writes:
 
> By the way, I am Canadian, play a little, and watched
> Hockey night In Canada, (Never Missed a Show!)

Well that's really great Pat.  I guess since you've played a little you thereby 
qualify as an expert.  Especially since you watch all the games on t.v.  All 
that qualifies you as is a armchair quarterback or a coach potato

> Not that I condone violence, but I'll make an exception for Mario.
Pat Walker

Again just further evidence as to what kind of an expert you are.  Truly a 
stupid statement.  Mario is definately one of the best players to play the game.
I'm not saying he is the best to ever play the game, but he should come to
mind when that question is asked.  Let's face it, he just returns from 
radiation therapy with around a dozen games left, overtakes Lafontaine for the
scoring lead and then buries him!!!!  No, I guess he just got lucky.
Speaking of Lafontaine, now there's a guy who should be considered for the
Hart trophy as well, certainly one of the better players in the league this
year. 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54509
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: PLAYOFFS STATS through Sunday 4/25

Stanley Cup Playoff stats through games played Sunday, April 25 1993
--------------------------------------------------------------------

Top 20 Point Scorers
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  1    9  0   9  0  0  0  0   4 CAN BOS  C 12  Adam Oates
  2    8  5   3  4  0  2  0   0 USA STL RW 16  Brett Hull
  3    7  6   1  2  0  0  0   6 RUS BUF RW 89  Alexander Mogilny
  3    7  4   3  1  1  0  0   4 CAN PIT  C 66  Mario Lemieux
  3    7  3   4  2  1  0  0  19 CAN CAL RW 14  Theoren Fleury
  3    7  2   5  1  0  0  0  12 CAN TOR  C 93  Doug Gilmour
  3    7  1   6  0  0  0  0   0 CAN DET  D 77  Paul Coffey
  3    7  1   6  0  0  0  0   0 USA BUF  C 16  Pat LaFontaine
  9    6  4   2  0  0  2  0   4 CAN NYI  C 20  Ray Ferraro
  9    6  3   3  0  0  1  0   2 RUS VAN RW 10  Pavel Bure
  9    6  3   3  1  0  1  0   0 RUS BUF LW 13  Yuri Khmylev
  9    6  3   3  1  0  1  0   6 CAN VAN RW 16  Trevor Linden
  9    6  2   4  1  0  0  0   2 CAN BUF  C 10  Dale Hawerchuk
  9    6  2   4  1  0  2  0   0 USA STL  C 15  Craig Janney
  9    6  2   4  2  0  0  0   6 CAN BOS  C 49 *Joe Juneau
  9    6  2   4  0  0  0  1   6 CAN CAL  C 25  Joe Nieuwendyk
  9    6  1   5  0  0  0  0   4 CAN STL  D 21  Jeff Brown
  9    6  1   5  0  0  1  0   4 CAN PIT  C 10  Ron Francis

Top 10 Goal Scorers
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  1    7  6   1  2  0  0  0   6 RUS BUF RW 89  Alexander Mogilny
  2    8  5   3  4  0  2  0   0 USA STL RW 16  Brett Hull
  2    5  5   0  3  0  1  0  14 CAN WAS  C 32  Dale Hunter
  4    7  4   3  1  1  0  0   4 CAN PIT  C 66  Mario Lemieux
  4    6  4   2  0  0  2  0   4 CAN NYI  C 20  Ray Ferraro
  4    5  4   1  0  0  1  0   6 CAN TOR LW 14  Dave Andreychuk
  4    5  4   1  1  0  0  0   4 CAN BOS RW  8  Cam Neely
  4    4  4   0  2  0  0  0   2 USA LA   C 12  Jimmy Carson
  4    4  4   0  0  0  2  0   0 USA QUE RW 48  Scott Young

Top 10 Assist Scorers
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  1    9  0   9  0  0  0  0   4 CAN BOS  C 12  Adam Oates
  2    7  1   6  0  0  0  0   0 CAN DET  D 77  Paul Coffey
  2    7  1   6  0  0  0  0   0 USA BUF  C 16  Pat LaFontaine
  4    7  2   5  1  0  0  0  12 CAN TOR  C 93  Doug Gilmour
  4    6  1   5  0  0  0  0   4 CAN STL  D 21  Jeff Brown
  4    6  1   5  0  0  1  0   4 CAN PIT  C 10  Ron Francis
  4    5  0   5  0  0  0  0   0 USA WIN  D  6  Phil Housley
  4    5  0   5  0  0  0  0   4 SWE WAS  D  6  Calle Johansson
  4    5  0   5  0  0  0  0   8 CAN CAL  D  2  Al MacInnis

Top 10 Power-play Goal Scorers
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  1    8  5   3  4  0  2  0   0 USA STL RW 16  Brett Hull
  2    5  5   0  3  0  1  0  14 CAN WAS  C 32  Dale Hunter
  3    7  3   4  2  1  0  0  19 CAN CAL RW 14  Theoren Fleury
  3    7  6   1  2  0  0  0   6 RUS BUF RW 89  Alexander Mogilny
  3    6  2   4  2  0  0  0   6 CAN BOS  C 49 *Joe Juneau
  3    5  2   3  2  0  0  0   6 CAN STL LW 19  Brendan Shanahan
  3    4  4   0  2  0  0  0   2 USA LA   C 12  Jimmy Carson
  3    4  2   2  2  0  0  0   2 TCH CAL  C 26  Robert Reichel
  3    4  3   1  2  0  1  0   2 FIN WIN RW 13 *Teemu Selanne
  3    3  2   1  2  0  1  0   6 CAN MON LW 25  Vincent Damphousse

All the Short-handed Goal Scorers
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  1    7  3   4  2  1  0  0  19 CAN CAL RW 14  Theoren Fleury
  1    7  4   3  1  1  0  0   4 CAN PIT  C 66  Mario Lemieux
  1    4  3   1  0  1  1  0   4 USA CAL  C 29  Joel Otto
  1    4  2   2  0  1  0  0   6 USA CAL  D 20  Gary Suter
  1    3  2   1  1  1  0  0  23 RUS DET  C 91  Sergei Fedorov
  1    2  1   1  0  1  0  0  10 CAN BOS  C 19  Dave Poulin
  1    1  1   0  0  1  0  0   4 CAN WIN  C 38  Luciano Borsato
  1    1  1   0  0  1  0  0   2 CAN DET LW 11  Shawn Burr
  1    1  1   0  0  1  0  0   2 CAN STL LW 10  Dave Lowry
  1    1  1   0  0  1  1  0   0 USA BUF RW 18  Wayne Presley

Top 10 Game-winning Goal Scorers
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  1    8  5   3  4  0  2  0   0 USA STL RW 16  Brett Hull
  1    6  4   2  0  0  2  0   4 CAN NYI  C 20  Ray Ferraro
  1    6  2   4  1  0  2  0   0 USA STL  C 15  Craig Janney
  1    4  4   0  0  0  2  0   0 USA QUE RW 48  Scott Young
  5    6  3   3  0  0  1  0   2 RUS VAN RW 10  Pavel Bure
  5    6  1   5  0  0  1  0   4 CAN PIT  C 10  Ron Francis
  5    6  3   3  1  0  1  0   0 RUS BUF LW 13  Yuri Khmylev
  5    6  3   3  1  0  1  0   6 CAN VAN RW 16  Trevor Linden
  5    5  4   1  0  0  1  0   6 CAN TOR LW 14  Dave Andreychuk
  5    5  5   0  3  0  1  0  14 CAN WAS  C 32  Dale Hunter

Top 5 Point Scoring Defensemen
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  3    7  1   6  0  0  0  0   0 CAN DET  D 77  Paul Coffey
  9    6  1   5  0  0  0  0   4 CAN STL  D 21  Jeff Brown
 19    5  0   5  0  0  0  0   0 USA WIN  D  6  Phil Housley
 19    5  0   5  0  0  0  0   4 SWE WAS  D  6  Calle Johansson
 19    5  0   5  0  0  0  0   8 CAN CAL  D  2  Al MacInnis

Top 4 Rookie Point Scorers
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  9    6  2   4  2  0  0  0   6 CAN BOS  C 49 *Joe Juneau
 33    4  3   1  0  0  1  0   8 USA PIT  C 15 *Shawn McEachern
 33    4  3   1  2  0  1  0   2 FIN WIN RW 13 *Teemu Selanne
 33    4  0   4  0  0  0  0   2 TCH BUF  D 42 *Richard Smehlik

Top 5 Penalty Minute Leaders
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  1    1  0   1  0  0  0  0  26 CAN DET LW 55  Keith Primeau
  2    3  2   1  1  1  0  0  23 RUS DET  C 91  Sergei Fedorov
  3    0  0   0  0  0  0  0  22 CAN NYI  D 47  Richard Pilon
  4    2  1   1  0  0  0  0  21 CAN TOR RW 12  Rob Pearson
  4    1  1   0  0  0  0  0  21 CAN WIN RW 20  Tie Domi

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54510
From: hunter@nsslsun.nssl.uoknor.edu (Steve Hunter)
Subject: Minnesota Shame?

I'm a hockey fan from way back, and maintain an interest as best I can
here in the hockey hinterlands (Oklahoma).  I'm hoping I can get a
reading from some of you about the move of the North Stars to Dallas.

I've been under the impression that Minnesota was one of, or possibly,
THE hockey state in the U.S.  So why is the team moving to a city in
Texas?  Is it that the owner is a greedy, self-serving profiteer, or
were the Stars really not making a profit?  Or was the city or whoever
owned the arena doing some price gouging?

As much as I'd like to see the NHL only a 3 hour drive from me, I
can't help but feel for the people in Minnesota, unless they truly
didn't support the team.  

Opinions, please.

Steve Hunter
National Weather Service
NEXRAD radar group
Norman, OK



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54511
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: BLUES: Playoff stats through first round

BLUES PLAYOFF SCORING THROUGH END OF NORRIS SEMIFINALS 
------------------------------------------------------

PS #   NAME                GP   G   A  Pts.   +/-  PIM  PP  SH  GW  EN
-- --  ----                --  --  --  ----   ---  ---  --  --  --  --
RW 16  Brett Hull           4   5   3    8    +2    0   4   0   2   0
 C 15  Craig Janney         4   2   4    6    +1    0   1   0   2   0
 D 21  Jeff Brown           4   1   5    6    +1    4   0   0   0   0
LW 19  Brendan Shanahan     4   2   3    5     0    6   2   0   0   0 
 C  7  Nelson Emerson       4   1   2    3    +1    2   0   0   0   0
RW  9 *Denny Felsner        4   1   1    2    +2    2   0   0   0   0 
LW 10  Dave Lowry           4   1   0    1    +2    2   0   1   0   0
LW 17  Basil McRae          4   0   1    1    +1    2   0   0   0   0
LW 14  Kevin Miller         4   0   1    1    -1    2   0   0   0   0
RW 23  Rich Sutter          4   0   0    0     0    2   0   0   0   0
 C 28  Bob Bassen           4   0   0    0    -1    6   0   0   0   0
LW 36 *Philippe Bozon       4   0   0    0     0    0   0   0   0   0
 C 18  Ron Wilson           4   0   0    0    -2    4   0   0   0   0
 D  5  Garth Butcher        4   0   0    0    +1    2   0   0   0   0
 D 33  Stephane Quintal     4   0   0    0    +1    0   0   0   0   0
 D 44 *Bret Hedican         4   0   0    0     0    8   0   0   0   0
 D 34  Murray Baron         4   0   0    0    -1    8   0   0   0   0
 D  4  Rick Zombo           4   0   0    0    -1    10  0   0   0   0
 G 31  Curtis Joseph        4   0   0    0     0    0   0   0   0   0
 D  6  Doug Crossman        0   0   0    0     0    0   0   0   0   0
 C 22  Ron Sutter           0   0   0    0     0    0   0   0   0   0
RW 38 *Igor Korolev         0   0   0    0     0    0   0   0   0   0
RW 39  Kelly Chase          0   0   0    0     0    0   0   0   0   0
 D  2  Curt Giles           0   0   0    0     0    0   0   0   0   0
 G 29 *Guy Hebert           0   0   0    0     0    0   0   0   0   0

*  Rookie

GOALTENDING
-----------
                   GP  Min.   GA    Avg.   W   L   EN  SO  SA  SAVE%
31  Curtis Joseph   4  251     6    1.43   4   0    0  2   140 .957 
29 *Guy Hebert      0   00     0    0.00   0   0    0  0   00   --- 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Team Totals        4  251     6    1.43   4   0    0  2   140 .957 

SO -- Shutouts ; SA -- Shots Against.

Goals                 13        6 
1st Period            4         1 
2nd Period            3         4 
3rd Period            5         1 
Overtime              1         0 
Power-play goals      7/29      1/24 
Short-handed goals    1         0 
Empty-net goals       0         0 
Shots                 97        140 

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54512
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: WC 93: Results, April 25


 1993 World Championships in Germany:
 ====================================

 Group A results:

 SWEDEN - SWITZERLAND  4-6 (0-3,3-1,1-2)

 1st: SWI 0-1 Manuele Celio 1                                         3:21
      SWI 0-2 Patrick Howald 1                                       11:37
      SWI 0-3 Patrick Howald 2   (Sven Leuenberger)                  16:00
 2nd: SWE 1-3 Peter Andersson 1  (Michael Nylander)                   2:47 (pp)
      SWI 1-4 Roman Waeger 1     (Martin Rauch,Sven Leuenberger)      8:53 (pp)
      SWE 2-4 Jonas Bergqvist 3  (Markus Naslund)                     9:08
      SWE 3-4 Jan Larsson 1      (Patrik Juhlin)                     18:50
 3rd: SWE 4-4 Mikael Renberg 2   (Thomas Rundqvist,Peter Andersson)   7:49
      SWI 4-5 Roman Waeger 2                                          9:07
      SWI 4-6 Felix Hollenstein 1 (Sven Leuenberger,Thomas Vrabec)   11:29

              Shots on goal:   Penalties:   Attendance:   Referee:
 Sweden        5 20 18 - 43    4*2min       6,000         Rob Hearn, USA
 Switzerland  10  6  7 - 23    5*2min

 Switzerland beat Sweden in a WC for the first time since 1950, and the Swiss
 now have a small chance of reaching the quarterfinals (if Austria beats
 Italy tonight).

 The Swiss took the lead after Hakan Ahlund made an incredibly stupid drop
 pass at his own blue line, and Celio came in alone with Soderstrom and beat
 Tommy to the stick side. The Swedes continued to make mistakes as Howald
 was allowed to skate in between the Swedish D and put the puck past Tommy
 to make it 0-2. 0-3 was a nice one, Howald entered the Swedish zone, slammed
 on the breaks, and his shot went in by Tommy's far post. One of the lousiest
 periods I've seen Sweden play this year.
 Second period saw a new Swedish team, and the Swiss had to ice the puck many
 times. On a pp, Nylander skated in from the boards, Pavoni made the initial
 save, but Peter Andersson scored on the rebound.  Then a power play goal
 from the Swiss, a slap shot from the blue line hit two players on the way
 to the goal and past Soderstrom also. Jonas Bergqvist made it 2-4 after a
 nice pass from Naslund behind the goal. Jan Larsson reduced the lead to 3-4
 just before the end of 2nd period, on a pp skated in unattacked in front of
 the goal, and put the puck through Pavoni's 5-hole. 
 Third period, Sweden equalized on a slap shot from Renberg that trickled
 through Pavoni's 5-hole. Then, another defensive mistake by the Swedes,
 Waeger was allowed to skate around the Swedish goal unattacked and from close
 range could make it 4-5. Hollenstein then scored 4-6 on a 2-on-1 break away,
 and put it top shelf with no chance for Soderstrom.

 Switzerland:

 Goaltender:  20 Reto Pavoni  (28 Renatio Tosio)
 Defense:     26 Rick Tschumi, 2 Martin Steinegger
              16 Sven Leuenberger, 5 Martin Rauch
               7 Sandro Bertaggia, 17 Patrick Sutter
              31 Samuel Balmer
 Forwards:    22 Alfred Luthi, 11 Felix Hollenstein, 25 Roman Waeger
              23 Gil Montandon, 12 Roberto Triulzi, 10 Patrick Howald
              35 Christian Weber, 18 Andreas Ton, 24 Joerg Eberle
              15 Bruno Erni, 13 Thomas Vrabec, 29 Manuele Celio
 
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

 RUSSIA - CANADA  1-3 (0-2,1-1,0-0)

 1st: CAN 0-1 Kevin Dineen 1     (Garry Galley)                       4:28
      CAN 0-2 Paul Kariya 2      (Eric Lindros)                      12:20 (pp)
 2nd: CAN 0-3 Eric Lindros 10    (Paul Kariya,Shayne Corson)          9:40
      RUS 1-3 Valeri Karpov 2    (?)                                 16:24
 3rd:

 Penalties: RUS 2*2min 1*5min, CAN 5*2min
 Referee: Anton Danko, Czech republic
 Attendance: 8,600

 Russia probably made their best game of the tourney, but yet there wasn't
 enough to win against the effective Canadians.

 Galley took a slap shot that found Dineen by the far post, and Dineen just
 deflected the puck past Trefilov in the Russian goal. Then a power play
 goal, after a couple of deflections Eric Lindros found Kariya alone by the
 far post, and Kariya put the puck high over a sliding Trefilov.
 Russia won the shots in the first period 12-5, and they had the most of
 the scoring opportunities, but they just couldn't score.
 Second period saw Lindros scoring his 10th (!!) goal of the WC. Kariya
 entered the Russian zone, slammed on the break to get past his defenseman,
 then made a nice pass to Corson who just got the stick on the puck to
 deflect it to Lindros who one-timed the puck.
 The Russians then finally got their goal, Karpov broke in from the side
 and made a slap shot in Tugnutt's top right hand corner.
 
 Player of the game in Canada was voted Paul Kariya, and for Russia Valeri
 Karpov. I agree, the difference in this game was Lindros and Kariya, and
 in part also Tugnutt. Kariya had a far better game now than vs the Swedes,
 and he was very impressive. Kariya got the place in the line with Lindros
 after Mike Gartner went out with a rib-injury early in the first period.

 Lindros, BTW, lead the point scoring with 14 pts (9+5) before this game,
 7 pts ahead of the next player! i.e. double as much as the next player
 (among those Kariya with 1+6). Amazing!

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Group B results:

 FINLAND - CZECH REPUBLIC  1-3 (0-0,1-1,0-2)

 1st:
 2nd: CZE 0-1  Petr Hrbek 2           11:04
      FIN 1-1  Mika Alatalo 1         17:51
 3rd: CZE 1-2  Jiri Dolezal 3          5:04
      CZE 1-3  Martin Hostak 2        19:45 (en)

 Penalties: FIN 8*2min, CZE 9*2min
 Referee: Vincent Moreno, Switzerland
 Attendance: 4,300

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

 GERMANY - USA  6-3 (5-0,0-0,1-3)

 1st: GER 1-0  Raimond Hilger 2        7:12
      GER 2-0  Gerd Truntschka 3      11:16
      GER 3-0  Ernst Kopf 3           11:55
      GER 4-0  Michael Rumrich 3      16:06
      GER 5-0  Benoit Doucet 1        18:45
 2nd:
 3rd: USA 5-1  Derek Plante 1          4:06
      GER 6-1  Dieter Hegen 5          6:57
      USA 6-2  Craig Johnson 1         7:30
      USA 6-3  Rob Gaudreau 3         13:07

 Penalties: GER 7*2min, USA 10*2min
 Referee: Valeri Bokarev, Russia
 Attendance: 11,000

--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54513
From: bks2@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (bryan.k.strouse)
Subject: NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4-21-93



NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR 4/21/93.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                  CONFERENCE SEMI-FINALS        BEST OF SEVEN
      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE
 
 NJ                  BUF   (leads 2-0)   STL   (leads 2-0)   WIN               
 PIT   (leads 2-0)   BOS                 CHI                 VAN   (leads 2-0)

 NYI   (tied  1-1)   MON                 TOR                 LA    (tied  1-1) 
 WAS                 QUE   (leads 2-0)   DET   (leads 2-0)   CAL              

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Toronto Maple Leafs                       0   1   1   -   2
Detroit Red Wings    (leads series 2-0)   1   3   2   -   6

1st period: DET, Lidstrom 1 - (Yzerman, Coffey) (pp) 4:06

2nd period: DET, Fedorov 1 - (sh) 0:43
	    DET, Yzerman 2 - (Coffey, Chiasson) (pp) 8:06
	    DET, Yzerman 3 - (Coffey, Sheppard) 17:40
	    TOR, Mironov 1 - (Gill, Gilmour) 19:10

3rd period: TOR, Gilmour 2 - (Anderson) 4:32
	    DET, Ysebaert 1 - (Kozlov) 5:51
	    DET, Drake 1 - (Kozlov, Kennedy) 18:33

Powerplay Opportunities-Maple Leafs 1 of 8
			Red Wings   2 of 7

Shots on Goal-	Maple Leafs  10   7  13  -  30
		Red Wings    16  11   3  -  30

Toronto Maple Leafs--Potvin (0-2) (30 shots - 24 saves)
Detroit Red Wings--Cheveldae (2-0) (30 shots - 28 saves)

ATT-19,875

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

St. Louis Blues     (leads series 2-0)   2   0   0   -   2
Chicago BlackHawks                       0   0   0   -   0

1st period: STL, Hull 2 - (Brown, Janney) (pp) 7:38
	    STL, Lowry 1 - (sh) 13:53

2nd period: NONE

3rd period: NONE

Powerplay Opportunities-Blues      1 of 5
			BlackHawks 0 of 6

Shots on Goal-	Blues        9   3   5  -  17
		BlackHawks  16  19  12  -  47

St. Louis Blues--Joseph (2-0) (47 shots - 45 saves)
Chicago BlackHawks--Belfour (0-2) (17 shots - 15 saves)

ATT-17,339

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Los Angeles Kings  (series tied 1-1)   1   0   3   -   4
Calgary Flames                         0   5   4   -   9

1st period: LAK, Carson 3 - 1:11

2nd period: CAL, Otto 1 - (Roberts, MacInnis) 5:02
	    CAL, Yawney 2 - (Dahlquist, Ranheim) 8:02
	    CAL, Reichel 1 - (Fleury) (pp) 10:52
	    CAL, Nieuwendyk 1 - (Roberts, Musil) 13:47
	    CAL, Otto 2 - (Dahl) (sh) 19:37

3rd period: LAK, Carson 4 - (Granato, Shuchuk) 5:34
	    CAL, Reichel 2 - (Fleury, MacInnis) (pp) 7:23
	    CAL, Paslawski 1 - (Roberts, Nieuwendyk) 8:14
	    CAL, Fleury 1 - (MacInnis, Nieuwendyk) (pp) 10:37
	    LAK, Rychel 1 - (Blake) 11:56
	    LAK, Kurri 1 - (Gretzky, Zhitnik) (pp) 15:22
	    CAL, Suter 2 - (Skrudland, Berube) 19:15

Powerplay Opportunities-Kings  1 of 7
			Flames 3 of 6

SHots on Goal-	Kings   14   8   9  -  31
		Flames   9  16  15  -  40

Los Angeles Kings--Hrudey (1-1) (40 shots - 31 saves)
Calgary Flames--Vernon (1-1) (31 shots - 27 saves)

ATT-19,477

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Winnipeg Jets                           0   1   1   -   2
Vancouver Canucks  (leads series 2-0)   1   1   1   -   3

1st period: VAN, Ronning 2 - (Courtnall, Linden) 11:37

2nd period: VAN, Courtnall 1 -  6:05
	    WIN, Domi 1 - (King, Barnes) 6:48

3rd period: WIN, Numminen 1 - (Housley, Selanne) (pp) 0:30
	    VAN, Bure 1 - (Adams, Craven) 4:01

Powerplay Opportunities-Jets    1 of 4
			Canucks 0 of 3

Shots on Goal-	Jets      6  10   6  -  22
		Canucks  14   9   9  -  32

Winnipeg Jets--Essensa (0-2) (32 shots - 29 saves)
Vancouver Canucks--McLean (2-0) (22 shots - 20 saves)

ATT-15,729

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


\|||||/
-SPIKE-




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54514
From: ketolain@messi.uku.fi (Jarkko Ketolainen)
Subject: question/goalie's equipment

Have the rules for goalies' equipment changed? It seems that e.g. glove
has become bigger and bigger all the time (and pads too), and the goalies are
wearing "over size" jerseys. Am I dreaming? If you watch old photos or
films let say about ten years back, I think the difference is quite obvious.
Who is an expert on this, please let me know. (Or have the goalies become
bigger?)

Jarkko #14 (trouble in scoring?)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54515
From: stompkin@tuba.calpoly.edu (The Edge)
Subject: Re: KINGS EVEN SERIES AT 2. STAUER SHINES!!

In article <1rfbldINN1qe@abyss.West.Sun.COM> dvb@ick (David Van Beveren) writes:
>
>vzhivov@superior.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov) writes:
>[Game 3 report deleted]
>:it (bad ref'ing) won't affect this
>: series, which should only go two more games, all things being equal.
>
>Wrong.
>
>The Kings just put on an exibition of hustle, team play and consistent 
>pounding and took it back to Calgary with the series tied at 2 games each.
>The final score was 3-1, with the third goal an empty-netter at 19:54 of
>the third (Conacher).
>
>This is not an official game report, just my observations from the stands.
>
>1. Melrose made a wise decision and put Stauber back in goal. Robb had
>   something to prove, and he did in stopping 28 of 29 while facing a 
>   fierce Calgary attack. There were numerous 'highlight film' saves.
>
>2. Kings third and fourth lines rose to the occasion, playing rough while
>   avoiding bad penalties. Warren Rychel scored the game-winner early in the
>   second period. (Rookie defenseman Alexi Zhitnik scored the first from the 
>   blue line late in the first.)
>
>
>3. Dave Taylor is awesome. He suffered a broken nose partway through the
>   second pariod, checked from behind into the boards by Roberts, who got
>   5 and a game. He came back late in the third, and was on the ice when
>   Conacher scored the empty netter. 

Actually it was in the third period, his return did bring a spark to the
crowd, and to the players, who played awesome defense in the third.

>
>4. The Kings go-to guys still are not producing. No goals from Kurri, Granato,
>   Sandstrom or Robitaille, who have a total of 10 points between them. 

You forgot about Gretzky.  If any of these guys start scoring, the Kings
will be unstoppable, if they continue the great defensive work as well.

>
>5. McCreary sucks. He called McSorely for high sticking someone who was already
>   on the ice, and Sandstrom for high sticking when he himself was already on
>   the ice. He missed many flagrant stick penalties, including one from Flame
>   goalie Jeff Reese who followed Granato out to almost the blue line where he
>   cross-checked him. He called the game very inconsistently, with a series of
>   ticky-tack penalties in the first and almost none in the third. Can't the
>   NHL supply decent officiating?
>
>6. I was sitting directly across the ice from Ron and Nancy Reagan. When the
>   empty netter was scored, Nancy leapt out of her seat with both fists high
>   in the air. Way to go Nancy!
>
>
>This series is still too close to call. Tuesday's game may be the deciding
>one. I expect King might put Vernon back in, even though Reese had two good
>games in LA. Reese has historically been good in LA. This was only the second
>time he lost there. This move would be good for the Kings, since Vernon is 
>such a sieve. I am sure that Stauber will get the call for the Kings.

Stauber will be in net on Tuesday.  Hopefully he will provide another
stellar performance and earn the name Robb "Stopper" Stauber.

>
>The firswt two lines of the Kings have to wake up. While it is great to see,
>you cannot depend on Pat Conacher and Warren Rychel for all of your offense.
>I expect Sandstrom, Granato and Gretzky might be put back together on a line
>like they were early in the season. This would leave Kurri, Carson and Luc
>as the second. On paper, these two lines look powerful. Let's see if they
>can make it real.

I believe this is how they are...I know it is Gretzky and Sandstrom, but he
has been putting a number of people on left.  Also the Carson, Robataille
Kurri line once ignited, will light the fire of the other lines.
(Hopefully!)
>
>GO KINGS!
>
>dvb
>
>
>

It is evident that the scoring drought is getting to Luc, after his slight
breakaway in the third (I think) he was steamed on the bench, this emotion
might help him break his streak.  Also, I have noticed Blake has had a few
really good chances to score, but has fanned, or shot wide.  Is the injury
still affecting him?  


The E
    D
    G
    E

stompkin@tuba.calpoly.edu


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54516
From: etxmarr@eos.ericsson.se (Marek Repinski)
Subject: Re: Ettans nya indelning

In article <1993Apr22.134632.23686@eua.ericsson.se>, euaaen@eua.ericsson.se (Anders Engwall) writes:
(...)
|> Om jag f|rst}tt saken r{tt f}r vi:
|> 
|> NORRA - Kiruna, Boden, Pite}, Skellefte}, CRIF, V{nn{s,
|>         Husum, \stersund, Antj{rn, Sundsvall/Timr}
|> V[STRA - Mora, G{vle, Avesta, Uppsala, K|ping, Arvika,
|>          Grums, \rebro + tv} lag fr}n v{stra kvalserien (vilka?)
|> \STRA - Arlanda, V{sby, Vallentuna, \ster}ker, Danderyd/T{by,
|>         AIK, Hammarby, S|dert{lje, T{lje, Huddinge,
|>         Nyk|ping, Roma
|> S\DRA - Vita H{sten, M|lndal, Bor}s, V{stervik, Hanhals,
|>         Troja/Ljungby, M|rrum, Pantern + tv} lag fr}n
|>         s|dra kvalserien 
(...)
|> F|r det f|rsta {r det principiellt fel att man har {ndrat
|> premisserna f|r uppflyttning i efterhand. F|r det andra kan
|> man ju undra varf|r just \stersund och V{stervik skall f} en fri-
|> sl{ng. Ja, i fallet \stersund {r det solklart en fix f|r
|> ovan n{mnda problem med norrgruppen, men V{stervik? [r det
|> m}nne f|r att Nyk|ping skall slippa spela i s|der, vilket
|> de klagat |ver? Vad tror ni man s{ger i exempelvis Tierp, som
|> kom 3:a i |stra kvalet?
|> 
|> Kommentarer?

Att man skulle bli tvyngen att {ndra premisserna kunde man inte lista
ut p} f|rhand. Huvudsak att man inte flyttar *ner* fel lag.
\stersund var en solklar fix som sagt, men V{stervik!! Att det beror p}
Nyk|ping tror jag inte p}, man kunde ju lika g{rna "flytta ner" Roma
till s|dra (iaf om man g}r efter bredgraderna). Mest r{ttvist vore att
l}ta Tierp och V{stervik g|ra upp, men d} skulle Roma/Nyk|pinks vara
eller inte vara i |stra ocks} avg|ras. Vad skulle de s{ga om det?
Det st|rsta felet med }rets indelning {r *exakt* samma som f|rra }ret,
fast v{rre. DET [R INTE R[TVIST INDELAT, sportligt sett. Vallentuna var
en match fr}n att g} upp till Allsvenskan f|rra }ret ist{llet gick 
G{vle upp. Tror ni n}n av dem lyckas lika bra i }r?
AIK, HIF, SSK och HIK ska sl}ss om tv} platser!! Om man hadde placerat
dessa i var sin division skulle de vara sj{lvklara favoriter till en
plats i Allsvenskan, men nu m}ste tv} ge vika. Var finns r{ttvisan i det?
:-( Jag har h|rt att HIK har l{mnat in en protest till f|rbundet ang{ende
indelningen i |stra.
Mitt f|rslag vore att l}ta 3:orna i varje division kvalspela om tv}
platser i Allsvenskan och efter jul skulle man kunna sl} ihop de fyra
divisionerna till tv}, en s|der och en norr. P} s} s{tt bestraffas inte
ett lag som kommer fr}n en trakt d}r det finns m{nga bra lag.

En kul grej som jag |nskar att man inf|rde {r att l}ta vinnaren i
Allsvenskan f} spela i SM-slutspelet. Det skulle bli en extra krydda till
division ett ishockeyn om lagen k{nde att de var "inom r{ckh}ll" till
SM-bucklan. Det skulle kanske p} sikt ocks} kunna minska skillnaderna
mellan lag i elitserien och division ett. Vad s{js?

|> -- 
|> Anders Engwall				Email: Anders.Engwall@eua.ericsson.se
|> ELLEMTEL Utvecklings AB			Voice: +46 8 727 3893
|> lvsj, Sweden				Fax: +46 8 727 42 20
|> "Hll dom, som brygger puns ock ger pyanlektionor." -- C.A. Tolln, 1899

-- 


/Marek


-------------------------------------------------------------------
Marek.Repinski@eos.ericsson.se | "Man skall inte anv{nda fr{mmande      
     Ericsson Telecom AB       |  ord om man har en adekvat inhemsk
   System Design Division      |  vokabul{r disponibel"
        - Sweden -             |    Gunnar Emanuel Str{ng (1906-92)

Gur pbbxvr jnf va Fjrqvfu, vg jbag uryc jvgu EBG-13

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54517
From: catcher@netcom.com (Paul W. Francisco)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER (***QUITE LONG***)

In article <1993Apr26.002033.22710@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>In <1993Apr25.224654.23092@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> phoenix@startide.ctr.columbia.edu (Ali Lemer) writes:
>>I'm not even going to bother to reply to your ranting post; the letter is 
>>addressed to Gary Bettman, not you. He can reply as he wishes.
>
>Not so.  Your post is addressed to all.  I quote:

As she said, the letter is addressed to Bettman.  The post (which, though
having pretty much the same content, is an entirely different entity) was
addressed to all.  When she puts the letter in the mail I doubt it will
say "To: All".  I figure she wanted to let people here see what was in it
since it is a topic that interests a lot of folks here.  That's an entirely 
different purpose than sending the letter to Bettman.

Unfortunately...

>And I guess I let you know didn't I?

>You do NOT represent a *large* body of hockey fans by any standard you care
>to use to define "large".  65 people constitutes nothing more than a tiny 
>group of fanatics and is in no way representative of "a large body of hockey
>fans on the Internet" let alone of "one of the largest computer networks in 
>the world." 

The "largest computer networks in the world" phrase is a definition of 
the Internet, not a group as a whole that she claims to represent.  As
for the business of whether or not it is large, it is large compared
to say, the number of folks on r.s.h. who are sending a letter to thank
him for changing the names, at least to this point.  And just for my
own curiosity I thought I'd look up the "official" definition of large
in the dictionary.  It reads:

large - 1.  having more than usual power, capacity, or scope.    
        2.  exceeding most other things of like kind in quantity or size.

Now I have no idea how many letters Bettman may have gotten on the issue
or how many people may have signed them.  65 people may be up there, 
thereby validating definition 2.  I would also wager that the geographical
range of signatures is quite large, which would give it a large scope.

>He might be impressed by the size of the list of names.

Why would he be impressed with this unless it were "large"? 

I am of course assuming that you actually agree with what you are writing
and are not simply trying to be a pain about the whole issue to hear
yourself speak.  

I personally don't know whether or not I agree with the letter.  I have
very mixed emotions about it.  I like the names as they are, and don't
think they make it that difficult to learn the game, but there might be
a shred of validity to the change.  

-- 
Paul W. Francisco        	    In the shadow an angel cries...
catcher@netcom.com                      - Front Line Assembly

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54518
From: catcher@netcom.com (Paul W. Francisco)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER & Roger's Response

Again I assume this is not just flame bait by Roger, but actually a
truly held opinion.  

In article <1993Apr26.004705.24794@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>I would say that the letter clearly implies representation of the views of
>a group that I belong to.  And I don't share those views.  And I don't
>believe that the majority of posters on r.s.hockey share those views. 
>And so I have no intention of allowing them to simply "go ahead" without
>making my feelings on the subject clear.

Thanks.  For speaking for all those who didn't feel it was important
enough to say something themselves.  

I wouldn't say that the letter clearly implies representation of the
views of a group that you belong to.  It represents a subset (that you
don't belong to) of a larger group (which you do, if only because this
isn't a moderated group).

Look, there are several ways to state an opposing viewpoint.  Three
that come to mind are as follows:

1) Say it subtly.  Result: it may not be clear.
2) Say it directly yet politely.  Result: probably it will spark some 
   interesting conversation.
3) Say it directly and obnoxiously.  Result: validity goes right out
   the window.

>I would agree that unwarranted use of said term is entirely immature.

You realize that anything you say can, and most certainly will, be
used against you.

-- 
Paul W. Francisco        	    In the shadow an angel cries...
catcher@netcom.com                      - Front Line Assembly

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54519
From: bbeagan@cmsa.gmr.com (Brian D. Beagan)
Subject: Re: Wings; Ogrodnick


In article QfpfQaK00Vot4BpEdD@andrew.cmu.edu, Mike Molloy <mmaq+@andrew.cmu.edu> () writes:
>I haven't seen any mention of Ogrodnick yet in the box scores.
>
>Does anyone know if he's playing?
>
>Mike


He's been out, but he isn't injured.  He played well when he was put into the lineup at the end of the season - Murray has to sit somebody out, though.  If the Red Wings hadn't played as well as they did in the first game, he may have been in the second.  Why should Murray juggle players when the Wings are dominating Toronto like they are?

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54520
Subject: Re: SHARKS REVIEW Part 5: Left Wings
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <1r4jsk$24v@apple.com>, chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach) writes:
> paul@fugu.Data-IO.COM (Paul Brownlow) writes:
> 
>>Wood played most of his junior career in Seattle.  He was one
>>of the leading scorers on a mediocre team when he was traded away in
>>1992.  He rarely lost a fight and was one of the toughest players in
>>the WHL.
> 
> Wood is fairly small for an enforcer-type. I mean, Fleury does a pretty good
> job and isn't that large, but Dody is no Fleury. 

And Fleury is no enforcer. An agitator for sure, but Fleury never has and never
will have a fight, which seems to be what you're saying Wood is. 

The closest Fleury ever came to fighting was a game two years ago against
Los Angeles. There was a scrum and McSorley pinched Fleury's head under his
arm. Fleury dropped his gloves and gave McSorley a weak shot to the side of the
head. McSorely, knowing a good thing when he saw one, popped Fleury one right
between the eyes. End of fight. Fleury got ten stitches for his trouble.

The only player I can ever see Theo fighting is Cliff Ronning, and even then
he'd be giving up two inches and 10-15 pounds. :-)

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54521
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <1993Apr21.213100.17414@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca>, golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
> In article <1993Apr21.160212.9413@adobe.com> snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols) writes:
>>In article <1993Apr21.144033.15925@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>>>John Madden picks Gary Clark of the Redskins for his All-Madden team
>>>a lot, over much better receivers...for much the same reasons Cherry
>>>sings the praises of Doug Gilmour...a little guy with heart...yet one
>>>doesn't see a string of American posts saying that John Madden has
>>>lost his marbles.
>>
>>Maybe because John Madden doesn't pretend that his All-Madden team is the
>>team of the best players.  Maybe because John Madden doesn't feel the need
>>to denigrate players he doesn't choose for his All-Madden team.  Maybe
>>because Madden actually demonstrates some knowledge about football when he
>>broadcasts a game.
>>
> 
> Don Cherry doesn't denigrate players except those who dive, showboat,
> wield their sticks as weapons while hiding behind visors, or
> deliberating attempt to injure or aggravate the injuries of others.

Not always true. In fact, in the case of Doug Gilmour, he actually praises them.

Europeans that do those things are scum in Cherry's opinion. Canadian kids
that do them are "tough, just like a real Canadian". 

Ulf Samuelsson cheap shots Mark Messier's ribs and Don wants Ulf's head. Doug
Gilmour breaks Tomas Sandstrom's arm and Don says Sandstrom had it coming. 
Methinks Don is either very confused or just a bigot. Most likely the latter.

I used to like Don Cherry. I thought he was great. But I'm starting to see
his true colors (redneck) and the more I see of them, the more I think he's
just an asshole.

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54522
Subject: Makarov
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <1993Apr21.234022.2880@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU>, nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>  
> I *don't* think the Sharks should dig into the free agent market.  Most of
> the "good" free agents will require quite a bit of compensation, and set the
> Sharks back as far as player development goes; remember, the Sharks were
> unwilling to give up player(s) in addition to the $2 million they offered for
> Joe Murphy, and I think that's a good approach.  They tried to sign Sergei
> Makarov before this season because Makarov wouldn't have required compensation.

Matching the Makarov offer was the only real mistake Dave King has made this
year. I have to wonder about the intelligence of signing a 33-year old who
is obviously on the downside of his career to a 4-year $2 million contract. 
Risebrough matched the offer on King's request and Makarov has spent the last
quarter of the season in the press box because his work ethic just plain
stinks. Not to mention that he's lost a step and can no longer get himself
into position to make the nifty passes. 

I think Makarov will be available for free this offseason to anybody who agrees
to pay his contract. He's ineffective in Calgary, but he might be able to help
a team like San Jose, with their shortage of talent. If there's no takers, and
Makarov doesn't show improvement in training camp, I think the Flames will just
bite the bullet and buy out Makarov's contract and release him. With his
current attitude, he is a detriment to the team.

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54523
Subject: More Hart trophy stuff....
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <1r4bkvINN5nm@abyss.West.Sun.COM>, dvb@ick (David Van Beveren) writes:
>  
> When you think of the NHL, who comes to mind? Gilmour? Gretzky? Mario?
> .. ah... did I mention Mario? If you said Gretzky, you haven't really
> been following along, have you. If you said Gilmour, you are a true
> Maynard. 
> 
> I don't even think the selection of the HArt deserves serious discussion on
> this group. It is a no-brainer.

While I agree that Lemieux deserves the Hart, it is far from a "no-brainer". 
The Hart trophy goes to the player most valuable to his team, not to the best
player in the league. So your above arguement is really worthless. 

The Pens without Mario are still a damn good hockey team. The Leafs without 
Gilmour would have been fighting Tampa Bay for the 3rd pick. 

Like I said, Mario deserves it, IMHO. But it is a very close race and a 
Gilmour victory would not surprise me. I dislike Doug Gilmour with a passion, 
but I must concede that he is extremely valuable to the Leafs.

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54524
From: ballb@reis56.alleg.edu (Brett Ball)
Subject: Re: Ranger Fans?????

In article <1993Apr22.101356.1@eagle.wesleyan.edu>  writes:
> I for one am happy about the Ranger's hiring of Keenan.  It's too bad  
that they
> didn't hire him when Smith fired Nielsen, maybe he could of staightened  
out the
> babies on this team and made the playoffs.  What this team needs is a  
little
> fire under their butts!!
> 
> Reading through most of these hockey news I don't see many Ranger fans  
writing.   
> I'm new to this system and a big hockey fan and a long suffering(1940)  
Ranger
> fan.  But remember suffering builds character!!
> 
> I have some final questions about the way the team was handled in that  
last
> dreadful stretch.
> 
> 1. Knowing they needed offensive help from the blueline, why didn't we  
see Mike
> Hurlbut, who played pretty well when he was called up when Leetch first  
went
> down?
> 
> 2. Why????!!!!! is Joe Kocur playing every night?  He is not Bob Probert  
who is
> tough but also can play.
> 
> 3. How come Paul Broten is relegated to street clothes for the end of  
the
> season.  At least he plays with some heart and character, draws  
penalties and
> plays 110% when he's on the ice.  Was he in the doghouse for some  
reason?
> 
> 4. Joe Cirella?????!!!!  Enough said!
> 
> Ranger fans may be suffering but we're some of the most loyal, unlike  
Islander
> fans who only show up when the team wins.
> 
> As far as the Stanley Cup goes I think there's only one team that can  
test
> Pittsburgh and that's Detroit.  This would be the most entertaining and  
hard
> fought series.  Mario is amazing!
> 
> Kurt

I think Joe Kocus should play every night.   He is a big physical guy, and  
he gets the fans into the game with some big hits.  (both checks and  
fists)  Its a big advantage to get the crowd going.  Plus, he helps  
protect the other players.  Notice there are very few fights when Kocur is  
on the ice unless he is it.  I have seen people start to go after essa  
Tikkanen, only to go slinking away when Kocur steps in.  I think he is big  
asset, but should be third line, and special situation only play.
> 
> 
> 
> 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54525
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: Re: SHARKS REVIEW Part 7: the Trades

nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>
>Acquired:	C Marcus Thuresson, from N. Y. Islanders
>For:		RW Brian Mullen
>Grade:		I (B-/C+)
>
>It is not known yet what the impact, overall, of this trade would be, as
>Thuresson is not yet under contract to the Sharks, and does not appear to be
>ready to become so anytime soon.  Mullen, meanwhile, has had a productive
>(somewhat) season with the Islanders.  Thuresson, however, does not appear to
>be a big scorer at all; if my memory is right, he had just 2 points in just
>11 games in the Swedish elite league in '91-92.  This season, I didn't notice
>his name frequently at all in Staffan's reports, and he didn't make the
>national team either; it does not appear to be a good sign.

 Marcus Thuresson had 6 goals, 10 assists, 16 points and 22 PIM in 31 games
 this season for Leksand in the Swedish elite league. This was only 10th
 in point scoring for Leksand.

 Marcus (born May 31 1971, Ht 185 cm, Wt 85 kg) is relatively young so he
 might still start producing, but I think the Sharks may have done a bad
 trade here.

 Staffan

--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54526
From: galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin)
Subject: Re: And you think ESPN shafted you?

In article <16BB7BF12.RRHAMMER@vm.cmp.ilstu.edu> RRHAMMER@vm.cmp.ilstu.edu writes:
>Like many others I too was watching the Caps/Isles game when the went
>to the baseball game.  I too was pissed.  How could they interupt such
>an important game.  I understand about contracts, but you would think they
>would have a clause in the contract concerning important games!
>Anyway,  us BLUES (and Hawks) fans got shafted worse!  While everyone
>in the U.S. and watched the game on ABC.  However those of us who live in
>the central Illinois area were subjected to watching the Arthritus(?)
>Telethon.  The area that was most affected by the telecast did not get
>to see the game except through HAWK VISION.  This game, had it been
>televised, would have been the first home Hawks game shown in the area
>since 1980.  This television BULL*&%$ has got to stop.  We are not only
>being deprived of seeing games, due to skyrocketing ticket prices, but
>we are also being deprived of watching them on TV.
> PEACE,
> HAMMER
> 

I'm familiar with the telethon situation (an individual on CompuServe
was also victimized and was equally pissed).  That was a local
television station contract which could not be broken.  For that item,
I strongly suggest you call that affiliate and vent your anger on
them.  (Supposedly one station had told my friend that they have
received hundreds of angry calls which will translate into far less
incentive to pre-empt hockey telecasts in future.  The contract was
written when the pathetic WLAF was in that time slot.)

-Tom Galvin         galvint@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54527
From: galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin)
Subject: Re: ESPN f*ck up

In article <1428@wavefront.wti.com> matthew@wavefront.wti.com (Matt Coohill) writes:
>
>	Okay... here's some gripe"ing" (?griping?... whatever).
>
>	(I live in Santa Barbara... for reference... I think)
>
>	Okay, ABC showed the Kings/Flames... fine... YAWN.
>
>	ESPN (through a fortunate rainout of a baseball game) showed the
>  Red Wings/Toronto game... cool.
>
>	But I SWEAR that the advertisements all week long had said that
>  ESPN would show Pitt/NJ on Tuesday and Bos/Buff on Thursday.
>
>	I raced home from work early (4:30 Pacific) to catch the game, but
>  ALAS, it was the Boston/Buffalo game and then they promised that they would
>  show the Pitt/NJ game on Thursday.  OVERNIGHT they changed their mind.
>
>[rest deleted]

    ESPN never committed (and I never saw advertised) to a particular
Thursday game.  They had originally scheduled Bos-Buf, and that was
somehow leaked on this net, but to my knowledge ESPN never publicly
released a schedule until Monday when they announced Pitt-NJ Thursday
and Boston-Buffalo Saturday.

-Tom Galvin         galvint@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54528
From: galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin)
Subject: Re: ESPN

In article <randolin.3.735424986@polisci.umn.edu> randolin@polisci.umn.edu (Robert Andolina) writes:
>The thing that confuses me most about ESPN is that they decided to show the 
>Penguins and Devils again on Thursday night.  Being that both of the first 
>two games were dominated by Pitt., you would think that they would show a 
>different game.  This is in addition to the fact that they should show other 
>games just for the sake of fair exposure.

NESN owns the rights to Bruin telecasts.  I suspect that NESN was only
going to sell one telecast to ESPN (remember, ESPN only owns exclusive
rights to the FINALS, not the entire playoffs).  Since ESPN bought the
SCA contract, there are less wrangles to untie with showing the Devils
and Penguins.

>
>Also, some of you should know that (as far as I can tell) ESPN is not going 
>to show Campbell conference games regularly in the first two rounds.  I 
>believe that they are only going to show Campbell games in the first two 
>rounds as those series wear on (games 6 & 7, or perhaps games 5, 6, 7). 
>

I think the same broadcast rights factor comes into it.  Plus they
have no way of fitting western game times into their current schedule
unless the NHL was willing to make a western club move up their game.
I think the NHL got as much as it could when it shuffled the deck for ABC.

>Also, does anyone have info on ABC coverage for this Sunday (4/25)?
>
>

Same exact coverage as last week:  Pit-NJ game 4 in the east, Chi-StL
in the central, LA-Cgy in the mountains and west.

>
>Robert Andolina
>randolin@polisci.umn.edu
>

-Tom Galvin      galvint@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54529
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Subject: Re: Habs Late

In article <1993Apr21.165801.10243@newshub.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:
>Vincent Damphousse has decided to take a vacation, apparently.  I have

My respect for the power of the hockey gods is preventing me from
commenting on the above, and for commenting on whether the guy
Damphousse was traded for is on vacation or not. Perhaps Roger
(demonstrably in contempt of the hockey gods and paying for it) dares a
comment or two?
-- 
Mike Eisler, mre@Eng.Sun.Com  ``Not only are they [Leafs] the best team, but
 their fans are even more intelligent and insightful than Pittsburgh's.  Their
 players are mighty bright, too.  I mean, he really *was* going to get his
 wallet back, right?'' Jan Brittenson 3/93, on Leaf/Pen woofers in
 rec.sport.hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54530
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Subject: Re: LET'S GO BUFFALO!

In article <93111.205214RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>In article <AfpIKNm00WBLI1isJ1@andrew.cmu.edu>, "William K. Willis"
><ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> says:
>>
>>     You know, I never really appreciated them before!
>
>Looks like Bob Errey's ring really sparkles in that locker room, and everyone
>else wants one, too! :-)  Correct me if I'm wrong though, (just through

No, Fuhr's 5 rings out sparkle Errey's. And doesn't Bob have 2 rings?
-- 
Mike Eisler, mre@Eng.Sun.Com  ``Not only are they [Leafs] the best team, but
 their fans are even more intelligent and insightful than Pittsburgh's.  Their
 players are mighty bright, too.  I mean, he really *was* going to get his
 wallet back, right?'' Jan Brittenson 3/93, on Leaf/Pen woofers in
 rec.sport.hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54531
From: bson@gnu.ai.mit.edu (Jan Brittenson)
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

In article <1r49s8$q8b@hsdndev.harvard.edu> nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219) writes:

 > Bruins have never come back to win after falling behind 2-0 in
 > their entire 68-year history.

   Which doesn't mean much since the statistics are mostly based on
the 5-game playoff format. But, yes, it looks dark for the B's. What a
disappointment.

   Still, I think the problem is mental. They needed the saves Blue
came up with, perhaps he can offer something to mentally rally around.

   Who do you think gets the start in game three? I hope it is going
to be Blue. If the team can rally around him, maybe Moog can too.

--
						-- Jan Brittenson
						   bson@gnu.ai.mit.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54532
From: jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM (Jason Cockroft)
Subject: Re: Pens fans reactions


>I'm really impressed with Bowman's coaching tactics - he's had an answer for
>every move that Brooks has thrown at the Pens.
>
>Susan Dart

Such as?

-jake. 


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54533
From: jbarrett@aludra.usc.edu (Jonathan Barrett)
Subject: Re: Flames Final: Kings Destroyed

vzhivov@superior.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov) writes:

>Flames final score:

>Calgary 9 - L.A. 4

>Things are back to where they belong. Gretzky didn't play. Kelly
>Hrudey is his old self again. Let's hope the Flames put the old-timers
>away ASAP.

>- Vlad the Impaler

Yes, these last couple of months the Kinngs have failed to show up in about
one game in five. Presumably last night was that one game in five. 

Jon

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54534
From: gak@wrs.com (Richard Stueven)
Subject: SHARKS: Jack Feirerra (was Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!)

In article jgl@apple.com, chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach) writes:
>snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols) writes:
>
>>Of course, Ferreira had also traded a number of veterans with marginal
>>contributions before he was fired, so it's not clear that this would have
>>been different.  Besides, they *were* marginal contributors.
>
>Let's also NOT FORGET that Ferreira came *THIS* close to trading Kelly
>Kisio, which, if the rumors I've heard are true, was over the strong
>objections of other aspects of Shark management and probably had a lot to do
>with both his ouster and the three-headed, consensus oriented GM.
>
>Imagine, for a second, where the Sharks would be today if that fax machine
>hadn't jammed.

On the other hand, I'm hard pressed to think of any other real mistakes
Fereirra made.  Imagine indeed, but then again we have the benefit of
hindsight.

Let's say that in the view of the Sharks' upper management, the attempt
to trade Kisio was a major factor in the decision to fire Feirerra.
I'm inclined to take exactly the opposite view:  they should have kept
him...he's obviously the luckiest man in hockey!  (Wonder what
sacrifice he made to the Muse of Fax?  (His job, I guess.))

have fun
gak

---
Richard Stueven       AHA# 22584 |----------| He has erected a multitude of new
Internet:            gak@wrs.com |----GO----| offices, and sent hither swarms
ATTMAIL: ...!attmail!gakhaus!gak |---SHARX--| of officers to harass our people,
Cow Palace:            107/H/3-4 |----------| and eat out their substance.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54535
From: gp2011@andy.bgsu.edu (George Pavlic)
Subject: Re: Lemieux's Getting the Hart... Jeez I hope not!

In article <22APR93.02956996.0062@UNBVM1.CSD.UNB.CA>, Patrick Walker
<F1HH@UNB.CA> wrote:
> 
> Who should get the Hart?
> Gretzky, not in a million years.  At least not this year.
>   He hasn't played all year.
> Yzerman, though it would be nice, I don't think he'll get it, he's
>  consistent, but not well known.  (Thought he should be!)
> Mario.  Jesus NO!  It's bad enough for me just to utter the word
>  without being extremely sick and pissed off.  They guy's a luber
> I think he should become a stuntman after he retires.  Jeez, he ha
> s enough expericene falling down.  Oope!  Stick didn't come anywhe
> re near me, gotta fall, got to get a penalty against the other
> team!  It's the annual "whine-a-thon" with today's host, Jerry
> Lewis  By the way, I am Canadian, play a little, and watched
> Hockey night In Canada, (Never Missed a Show!), not one of these,
> Well, a, my home team is in the finals, and I was a hockey fan for
> ten minutes now... Give me a f--king break with this Mario is the
> best player ever.  What!  Did Gretzky die?  I wish Bobby Clarke
> and the Broadstreet Bullies were still around, they'd know what
> to do with a whouse like Mario!
> They'd bounce him around like the puck.
> Not that I condone violence, but I'll make an exception for Mario.
> But if Mario is going to complain about being hit, someone should
> give him and Scotty something REAL to complain about.
> Sorry to ramble.  As you can see I hate Mario.
> Pat Walker
> UNB

You, along with Mario Lemieux, must be from another planet.  The only
difference is that Lemieux comes from the one with Geo. Washington, Abe
Lincoln (and many other great men and women of this world) whereas you come
from the one with David Koresh.  Yeah, Mario is good at drawing penalties,
but wouldn't you try do something (you do claim to play) to give your team
an advantage?  I don't remember Lemieux getting any diving penalties this
year, whereas many others did.  Finally, Mario has NEVER complained about
being hit.  He knows it's part of the game; he gets back by dishing out an
even bigger hit to the same guy or just scoring a few goals (or setting
them up.)  Don't you have any compassion for a man who has gone through so
much in his life?

George

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54536
From: ummak027@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Anson Sen Sau Mak)
Subject: Re: #77's?

In article <1r23on$4p6@bigboote.WPI.EDU> ching@bigwpi.WPI.EDU ("The Logistician") writes:
>
>I am in need of all of the players wearing #77 in the NHL.  I know now only
>of one, Ray Borque for the Bruins.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.
>
>Thanx.
>
>-- 
>------------------------THE LOGISTICIAN REIGNS SUPREME!!!----------------------
>|									      |
>|   GO BLUE!!!   GO TIGERS!!!   GO PISTONS!!!   GO LIONS!!!   GO RED WINGS!!! |
>-------------------------------ching@wpi.wpi.edu-------------------------------

Pierre Turgeon of NYI, and Paul Coffey of Detorit are both #77. 

Hope this help.

Anson

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54537
From: Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Pens fans reactions


Terence Rokop writes:

>Richard J Coyle writes:
> 
>>That's not inner calm.  It's boredom, and it's being spoiled.  The Arena's
>>been as quiet as a church on many nights this year; too many of us just
>>take winning for granted.  It's been seemingly forever since the team
>>lost, and we've forgotten what it's like to feel real excitement and
>>surprise at victory.

>I don't really agree with this.  But it is an entirely different "high,"
>at any rate.  The first Cup the Pens won, I didn't think about anything
>else; I just watched Mario and all skate the thing around the ice.  Now
>it seems to be more of a question whether or not, thirty years from now,
>young hockey fans (may there be millions!) will still ask us what it was
>like to watch this team.  That's what they are playing for now.  But I
>was still as nervous as ever when the Devils were blasting shots at
>Barrasso in the final seconds of game three, so the fun is far from over
yet.

I'm not bored either.  Most people I know say that winning the second Cup
was better than the first but to me nothing will ever top that first one.
But I'm every bit as excited this year and I am experiencing that inner calm
to which Susan originally referred.  Inner calm is not boredom.

As far as the arena in general being boring, well Richard's got that right.
It's been that way all season.  I attribute it to a lot of new fans who
just don't have the same spirit and knowledge as long-time fans.  At
last Tuesday's game, I overheard a man express surprise that a
goaltender can get an
assist.

Anyone who follows sports with regularity knows that anything can happen
at any time.  I'm confident in the Pens but I'm also not stupid enough to
think for one minute that it's impossible for New Jersey to blow them out
of this series.  I doubt that will happen but it's possible.  Bored?  Uh-uh.
Spoiled?  Not in the least.  Forgot what excitement is like?  Living through
that amazing streak wasn't exciting?!  I don't take a darned thing for
granted.  God, look at Chicago...

And I see no problem with quietly savoring all of this anyway.  It isn't gonna
last forever and I intend to enjoy it while I can.  

Mom.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54538
From: gritter@cs.purdue.edu (Carl Gritter)
Subject: NHL ALLTIME SCORING LEADERS


Here are the NHL's alltime leaders in goals and points at the end of
the 1992-3 season. Again, much thanks to Joseph Achkar.

Carl

Notes: An active player is a player that has scored at least one
point the past season.  The points leaders follow the goal leaders.
If you find any mistakes, please send me email.
-------------------------------------------------------------------

All time NHL leading goal scorers (* denotes active player):

  1.  Gordie Howe          Det-Hfd                            801
  2. *Wayne Gretzky        Edm-LA                             765
  3.  Marcel Dionne        Det-LA-NYR                         731
  4.  Phil Esposito        Chi-Bos-NYR                        717
  5.  Bobby Hull           Chi-Wpg-Hfd                        610
  6. *Mike Gartner         Wsh-Min-NYR                        583
  7.  Mike Bossy           NYI                                573
  8.  Guy Lafleur          Mtl-NYR-Que                        560
  9.  Johnny Bucyk         Det-Bos                            556
 10.  Maurice Richard      Mtl                                544
 11.  Stan Mikita          Chi                                541
 12.  Frank Mahovlich      Tor-Det-Mtl                        533
 13. *Michel Goulet        Que-Chi                            532
 14. *Jari Kurri           Edm-LA                             524
 15.  Bryan Trottier       NYI-Pit                            520
 16.  Gilbert Perreault    Buf                                512
 17.  Jean Beliveau        Mtl                                507
 18.  Lanny McDonald       Tor-Col-Cgy                        500
 19.  Jean Ratelle         NYR-Bos                            491
 20.  Norm Ullman          Det-Tor                            490
 21. *Dino Ciccarelli      Min-Wsh-Det                        485
 22.  Darryl Sittler       Tor-Phi-Det                        484
 23. *Mario Lemieux        Pit                                477
 24. *Glenn Anderson       Edm-Tor                            459
 25.  Alex Delvecchio      Det                                456
 26. *Mark Messier         Edm-NYR                            452
 27. *Dale Hawerchuk       Wpg-Buf                            449
 28.  Rick Middleton       NYR-Bos                            448
 29. *Steve Yzerman        Det                                445
 30. *Peter Stastny        Que-NJ                             444
 31.  Rick Vaive           Van-Tor-Chi-Buf                    441
 32. *Joe Mullen           StL-Cgy-Pit                        433
 33.  Yvan Cournoyer       Mtl                                428
 34. *Dave Taylor          LA                                 427
 35.  Steve Shutt          Mtl-LA                             424
 36. *Denis Savard         Chi-Mtl                            423
 37.  Bill Barber          Phi                                420
 38. *Brian Propp          Phi-Bos-Min                        413
 39.  Gary Unger           Tor-Det-StL-Atl-LA-Edm             413
 40.  Rod Gilbert          NYR                                406
 41. *Steve Larmer         Chi                                406
 42. *John Ogrodnick       Det-Que-NYR                        402
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Other active players:
     *Bernie Nicholls      LA-NYR-Edm-NJ                      397
     *Pat LaFontaine       NYI-Buf                            386
     *Brian Bellows        Min-Mtl                            382
     *Dave Andreychuk      Buf-Tor                            373
     *Tim Kerr             Phi-NYR-Hfd                        370
     *Bobby Smith          Min-Mtl                            357
     *Brett Hull           Cgy-StL                            356
     *Luc Robitaille       LA                                 353
     *Mike Foligno         Det-Buf-Tor                        351
     *Dave Christian       Wpg-Wsh-Bos-StL-Chi                340
     *Paul Coffey          Edm-Pit-LA-Det                     330
     *Brent Sutter         NYI-Chi                            325
     *Pat Verbeek          NJ-Hfd                             318
     *Ron Francis          Hfd-Pit                            311
     *Cam Neely            Van-Bos                            292
     *Ray Bourque          Bos                                291
     *Bob Carpenter        Wsh-NYR-LA-Bos-Tor                 285
     *Brent Ashton         Van-Col-NJ-Min-Que-Det-Wpg-Bos-Cgy 284
     *Doug Gilmour         Stl-Cgy-Tor                        277
     *Rick Tocchet         Phi-Pit                            277
     *Kevin Dineen         Hfd-Phi                            275
     *Tomas Sandstrom      NYR-LA                             273
     *Dale Hunter          Que-Wsh                            269
     *Ryan Walter          Wsh-Mtl-Van                        264
     *Brian Mullen         Wpg-NYR-SJ-NYI                     260
     *Ed Olczyk            Chi-Tor-Wpg-NYR                    260
     *Kirk Muller          NJ-Mtl                             258
     *Joe Nieuwendyk       Cgy                                257
     *Jimmy Carson         LA-Edm-Det                         254

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

All time NHL scoring leaders (* denotes active player):

  1. *Wayne Gretzky        Edm-LA                             765 1563 2328
  2.  Gordie Howe          Det-Hfd                            801 1049 1850
  3.  Marcel Dionne        Det-LA-NYR                         731 1040 1771
  4.  Phil Esposito        Chi-Bos-NYR                        717  873 1590
  5.  Stan Mikita          Chi                                541  926 1467
  6.  Bryan Trottier       NYI-Pit                            520  890 1410
  7.  Johnny Bucyk         Det-Bos                            556  813 1369
  8.  Guy Lafleur          Mtl-NYR-Que                        560  793 1353
  9.  Gilbert Perreault    Buf                                512  814 1326
 10.  Alex Delvecchio      Det                                456  825 1281
 11.  Jean Ratelle         NYR-Bos                            491  776 1267
 12. *Mark Messier         Edm-NYR                            452  780 1232
 13.  Norm Ullman          Det-Tor                            490  739 1229
 14. *Peter Stastny        Que-NJ                             444  777 1221
 15.  Jean Beliveau        Mtl                                507  712 1219
 16. *Dale Hawerchuk       Wpg-Buf                            449  763 1212
 17.  Bobby Clarke         Phi                                358  852 1210
 18. *Paul Coffey          Edm-Pit-LA-Det                     330  871 1201
 19. *Denis Savard         Chi-Mtl                            423  769 1192
 20. *Jari Kurri           Edm-LA                             524  666 1190
 21. *Mario Lemieux        Pit                                477  697 1174
 22.  Bobby Hull           Chi-Wpg-Hfd                        610  560 1170
 23.  Bernie Federko       StL                                369  761 1130
 24.  Mike Bossy           NYI                                573  553 1126
 25. *Michel Goulet        Que-Chi                            532  590 1122
 26.  Darryl Sittler       Tor-Phi-Det                        484  637 1121
 27. *Mike Gartner         Wsh-Min-NYR                        583  524 1107
 28.  Frank Mahovlich      Tor-Det-Mtl                        533  570 1103
 29. *Ray Bourque          Bos                                291  806 1099
 30. *Dave Taylor          LA                                 427  635 1062
 31.  Denis Potvin         NYI                                310  742 1052
 32.  Henri Richard        Mtl                                358  688 1046
 33. *Steve Yzerman        Det                                445  595 1040
 34. *Bobby Smith          Min-Mtl                            357  679 1036
 35.  Rod Gilbert          NYR                                406  615 1021
 36. *Glenn Anderson       Edm-Tor                            459  559 1018
 37.  Lanny McDonald       Tor-Col-Cgy                        500  506 1006
 38.  Rick Middleton       NYR-Bos                            448  540  988
 39.  Dave Keon            Tor-Hfd                            396  590  986
 40. *Ron Francis          Hfd-Pit                            311  675  986
 41. *Bernie Nicholls      LA-NYR-Edm-NJ                      397  580  977
 42. *Brian Propp          Phi-Bos-Min                        413  561  974
 43.  Andy Bathgate        NYR-Tor-Det-Pit                    349  624  973
 44.  Maurice Richard      Mtl                                544  421  965
 45.  Larry Robinson       Mtl-LA                             208  750  958
 46. *Dino Ciccarelli      Min-Wsh-Det                        485  472  957
 47. *Steve Larmer         Chi                                406  517  923
 48. *Joe Mullen           StL-Cgy-Pit                        433  486  919
 49.  Bobby Orr            Bos-Chi                            270  645  915
 50.  Brad Park            NYR-Bos-Det                        213  683  896
 51.  Butch Goring         LA-NYI-Bos                         375  513  888
 52.  Bill Barber          Phi                                420  463  883
 53.  Dennis Maruk         Cal-Cle-Wsh-Min                    356  521  877
 54.  Ivan Boldirev        Bos-Cal-Chi-Atl-Van-Det            361  505  866
 55.  Yvan Cournoyer       Mtl                                428  435  863
 56.  Dean Prentice        NYR-Bos-Det-Pit-Min                391  469  860
 57.  Ted Lindsay          Det-Chi                            379  472  851
 58.  Tom Lysiak           Atl-Chi                            292  551  843
 59. *Dale Hunter          Que-Wsh                            269  570  839
 60.  John Tonelli         NYI-Cgy-LA-Chi-Que                 325  511  836
 61.  Jacques Lemaire      Mtl                                366  469  835
 62. *Larry Murphy         LA-Wsh-Min-Pit                     203  631  834
 63. *John Ogrodnick       Det-Que-NYR                        402  425  827
 64. *Doug Wilson          Chi-SJ                             237  590  827
 65. *Doug Gilmour         Stl-Cgy-Tor                        277  548  825
 66.  Red Kelly            Det-Tor                            281  542  823
 67.  Pierre Larouche      Pit-Mtl-Hfd-NYR                    395  427  822
 68.  Bernie Geoffrion     Mtl-NYR                            393  429  822
 69.  Steve Shutt          Mtl-LA                             424  393  817
 70. *Phil Housley         Buf-Wpg                            242  575  817
 71.  Wilf Paiment         KC-Col-Tor-Que-NYR-Buf-Pit         356  458  814
 72.  Peter McNab          Buf-Bos-Van-NJ                     363  450  813
 73. *Brian Bellows        Min-Mtl                            382  428  810
 74. *Dave Andreychuk      Buf-Tor                            373  436  809
 75.  Pit Martin           Det-Bos-Chi-Van                    324  485  809
 76. *Pat LaFontaine       NYI-Buf                            386  421  807
 77.  Ken Linesman         Phi-Edm-Bos                        256  551  807
 78.  Gary Unger           Tor-Det-StL-Atl-LA-Edm             413  391  804
 79.  Ken Hodge,Sr         Chi-Bos-NYR                        328  472  800
 80. *Neal Broten          Min                                249  547  796
 81.  Wayne Cashman        Bos                                277  516  793
 82.  Rick Vaive           Van-Tor-Chi-Buf                    441  347  788
 83.  Borje Salming        Tor-Det                            150  637  787
 84.  Jean Pronovost       Pit-Atl-Wsh                        391  383  774
 85.  Peter Mahovlich      Det-Mtl-Pit                        288  485  773
 86. *Dave Christian       Wpg-Wsh-Bos-StL-Chi                340  430  770
 87.  Rick Kehoe           Tor-Pit                            371  396  767
 88.  Rick MacLeish        Phi-Hfd-Pit-Det                    349  410  759
 89. *Thomas Steen         Wpg                                240  511  751
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Other active players:
     *Al MacInnis          Cgy                                185  555  740
     *Luc Robitaille       LA                                 353  371  724
     *Mike Foligno         Det-Buf-Tor                        351  367  718
     *Brent Sutter         NYI-Chi                            325  389  714
     *Mark Howe            Hfd-Phi-Det                        192  520  712
     *Kirk Muller          NJ-Mtl                             258  433  691
     *Tim Kerr             Phi-NYR-Hfd                        370  304  674
     *Adam Oates           Det-StL-Bos                        167  490  657
     *Randy Carlyle        Tor-Pit-Wpg                        148  499  647
     *Ryan Walter          Wsh-Mtl-Van                        264  382  646
     *Pat Verbeek          NJ-Hfd                             318  313  631
     *Brent Ashton         Van-Col-NJ-Min-Que-Det-Wpg-Bos-Cgy 284  345  629
     *Bob Carpenter        Wsh-NYR-LA-Bos-Tor                 285  337  622
     *Brian Mullen         Wpg-NYR-SJ-NYI                     260  362  622
     *Ed Olczyk            Chi-Tor-Wpg-NYR                    260  358  618
     *Kelly Kisio          Det-NYR-SJ                         215  402  617
     *Brett Hull           Cgy-StL                            356  247  603
     *Rick Tocchet         Phi-Pit                            277  324  601
     *Dan Quinn            Cgy-Pit-Van-StL-Phi-Min            232  367  599
     *Scott Stevens        Wsh-StL-NJ                         132  462  594
     *Tomas Sandstrom      NYR-LA                             273  320  593
     *Tom Fergus           Bos-Tor-Van                        235  346  581
     *Dave Babych          Wpg-Hfd-Van                        120  460  580
     *Mike Ridley          NYR-Wsh                            230  348  578
     *Laurie Boschman      Tor-Edm-Wpg-NJ-Ott                 225  350  575
     *Keith Acton          Mtl-Min-Edm-Phi                    224  350  574
     *Murray Craven        Det-Phi-Hfd                        205  365  570
     *Kevin Dineen         Hfd-Phi                            275  290  565
     *Rob Ramage           Col-StL-Cgy-Tor-Min-TB             139  423  562
     *Mike Krushelnyski    Bos-Edm-LA-Tor                     234  319  553
     *Gary Suter           Cgy                                124  428  552
     *Pierre Turgeon       Buf-NYI                            218  324  542
     *Troy Murray          Chi-Wpg                            217  324  541
     *Cam Neely            Van-Bos                            292  241  533
     *Geoff Courtnall      Bos-Edm-Wsh-StL-Van                246  274  520
     *Vincent Damphousse   Tor-Edm-Mtl                        195  320  515
     *Jimmy Carson         LA-Edm-Det                         254  259  513
     *Peter Zezel          Phi-StL-Wsh-Tor                    182  328  510
     *Guy Carbonneau       Mtl                                207  302  509
     *Mark Osborne         Det-NYR-Tor-Wpg                    202  301  503
     *Chris Chelios        Mtl-Chi                            108  394  502
     *Dave Poulin          Phi-Bos                            195  301  496
     *Ray Ferraro          Hfd-NYI                            230  263  493
     *Russ Courtnall       Tor-Mtl-Min                        208  284  492
     *Joe Nieuwendyk       Cgy                                257  234  491
     *John MacLean         NJ                                 241  248  489
-- 





Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54539
From: au021@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Roland Behunin)
Subject: Now if ESPN wanted to show a good game...


They could put on a Quebec-Montreal game.

Talk a bout areivalry!
opps rivalry..

roland
-- 
Roland

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54540
From: chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Subject: Re: 1993 NHL Draft

cs902043@ariel.yorku.ca (SHAWN LUDDINGTON) writes:

>As for the picks
>Ottawa picks #1 which means it is almost 100% that Alexander Daigle will 
>go #1. He'll either stay or be traded in Montreal or Quebec.

I dunno about hat. I have friends up there on GEnie who are now saying that
Ottawa's gone soft on Daigle and is thinking hard about Pronger. Daigle has
shown an Attitude the latter part of this season many folks havne't liked,
and after coming back from his (second) multi-game suspension for being
stupid, he's really tanked in his performance. His stock is dropping like a
rock. 

Also remember that a lot of teh "draft 1st" stuff comes from the assumption
he'll be traded to Quebec for lots of prospects. It's not clear that 
Quebec would really be willing to pay a lot for him given his current
status. He's still first round, but I don't consider him a first pick lock
by any means at this point.

It's also possible that the Senators are posturing to try to bring down his
signing price, since Daigle has been taking some Lindros lessons during thos
suspensions.

>IMO I would
>take Kariya.  He should alot of leadership in the NCAA and so far in
>the World Championships.  Daigle didn't show this for his junior team.

>San Jose will then get Kariya.

No. Kariya won't go in the first three, for a very simple reason: he's not
leaving college, and I don't believe ANY of the expansion teams are going to
use a first for someone who won't be around for another year or two, not
when there is equally good (or almost as good) stuff available that can make
an immediate impact. San jose seems to be leaning heavily towards
Niedermayer for that reason. Kariya could go 6th or 7th, unless a team can
convince him to leave school early (which I doubt).


My cut on things as they stand today:

>Draft Order
>-----------
>1) Ottawa (60% Daigle, if not, 40% Pronger)
>2) San Jose 80% Niedermayer, unless Ottawa skips Daigle. Then it's open.
	(it depends on if the Sharks can get a deal for him. I don't
	believe they draft him to keep him).
>3) Tampa Bay (whoever Ottawa doesn't take, or maybe Koslov)

-- 
 Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= chuq@apple.com
   Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms =+=  GEnie: MAC.BIGOT =+= ALink:CHUQ 
  Minor League fans: minors-request@medraut.apple.com (San Jose Giants: A/1/9)
  San Francisco Giants fans: giants-request@medraut.apple.com (The Stick?NOT!)
   San Jose Sharks fans: sharks-request@medraut.apple.com (New seat: 127/TBD)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54541
From: chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Subject: Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!

spiegel@sgi413.msd.lmsc.lockheed.com (Mark Spiegel) writes:

>  Gaetz may or may not be back next
>	year, but in either event the Sharks have to pick up others.

Gaetz won't be back. There's been rumors he was officially released right at
the end of the season when his contract expired, but I haven't seen
confirmation. It was clear from my talks with the Sharks doctors that he
wasn't going to make it for a while, and the Sharks would have to sign him
to a contract, which given his problems competing at the IHL level this
spring, doesn't make sense. 

-- 
 Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= chuq@apple.com
   Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms =+=  GEnie: MAC.BIGOT =+= ALink:CHUQ 
  Minor League fans: minors-request@medraut.apple.com (San Jose Giants: A/1/9)
  San Francisco Giants fans: giants-request@medraut.apple.com (The Stick?NOT!)
   San Jose Sharks fans: sharks-request@medraut.apple.com (New seat: 127/TBD)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54542
From: sesrock@andy.bgsu.edu (Stuart Esrock)
Subject: Re: Bruins

joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm) writes:
> 
> Come on Boston, where the hell are you? Seven wins in a row and what, choke?

Ah well, another Brian Sutter team is ground into the dirt with intensity
during the regular season and then is burned out by playoff time.
Yah Fuhr has been awesome so far, but really you'd think Sutter would have
learned his lesson about pushing his team too far during the regular season.

Stuart Esrock   Bowling Green State U.   "How bout them Blues!!!"

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54543
From: galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin)
Subject: Re: Camera work on televised games

In article <1993Apr22.105352.18235@vax5.cit.cornell.edu> yecx@vax5.cit.cornell.edu writes:
>Is it just me or is the camera work on some of these games really sad??  I
>can't remember how many times during the Penguins-Devils game they showed some
>guy (without the puck) being checked in the corner while the puck was being
>fired on goal.  In fact, I think they even missed one goal completely because
>they were showing two guys holding each other in the corner.
>
>Now the last time I watched a football game, they didn't show the lineman going
>at it while the running back turned the corner for a touchdown . . . . 
>
>Is it just me??	
>
>Greg
>

ESPN has been trying various things to get away from the
follow-the-puck concept of televising hockey games.  One of the main
problems with hockey is that it is very difficult to show everything
that is going on -- more happens away from the puck than in any other
sport except maybe football and they can do iso's on football players
to be shown between plays.

The problem of course is that sometimes you get something worthwhile,
other times you get burned.

-Tom Galvin        galvint@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54544
From: sesrock@andy.bgsu.edu (Stuart Esrock)
Subject: Re: Joseph and Blues Shut down WartHAwks Blues up 2-0

cr292@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Jim Schenk) writes:
> 
> One last point, Darryl Sutter is getting badly out coached by Bob Berry.  The
> madder Darryl gets the more he reminds me of Brian.  The Hawks are
> quickly loosing thier focus, I don't think the Blues will win in 4 but you
> never know

Not to Sutter bash or anything since I idolized them as players....
you sure would think the Sutters would learn something about burning out their
teams in the regular season.....just too much intensity during the regular 
season.  I earlier posted a note about Brian and got to thinking after I read
this item.....gee both Sutters won their divisions and now both have lost 
home ice advantage and are getting smoked in their opening series in the
playoffs.  Kind of makes you wonder.......

Bottom line....man it is great to be smoking the WartHawks!!!!!
Agreed Jim.....this has been damn sweet, so far.  About the only thing
that comes close to this is shutting up all the Maple Laugh fans....Detroit
has completely kicked their asses so far.  But, I will stick with the
Blues for providing the best playoff tonic so far.

Stuart Esrock  Bowling Green State U.  "Go you Blues!!!"

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54545
From: <MWEINTR@auvm.american.edu>
Subject: Playoff consecutive loss record?

With the recent demise of the Chicago Blawkhawks (much to my delight) I
noticed their 8 (?) game playoff losing streak (4 to the Pens last year, and
now 4 to the Blues) and I am wondering what the NHL record for consecutive
losses is, if there even is one...

I'm pretty sure that the Hawks have at least a 9 game losing  streak, since
they've had to have lost a series since their last championship (whenever that
was)

Basically, I need something else to rag on my Hawks-fan friend with :)

Mike, the insomniaced
---
***Yes-Rush-Marillion-Emerson, Lake and Palmer-Genesis-Dream Theater***
* Mike Weintraub, aka Jvi on IRC   ________.sig Quote du Jour________ *
* mweintr@american.edu            |"Life is like a scissors-paper-   |*
* jedi@wave.cerf.net              | stone game, none of the answers  |*
* The American University         | is always right, but sometimes   |*
* Washington, DC                  |_each one is"__Neil Peart, Rush___|*
***Go Philadelphia Phillies and Vancouver Canucks (3 down, 13 to go)***

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54546
From: maszakj@pell1l5.alleg.edu (Jonathan Maszak)
Subject: Re: Lemieux's Getting the Hart... Jeez I hope not!

In article <22APR93.02956996.0062@UNBVM1.CSD.UNB.CA> Patrick Walker  
<F1HH@UNB.CA> writes:
> Who should get the Hart?
> Gretzky, not in a million years.  At least not this year.
>   He hasn't played all year.
> Yzerman, though it would be nice, I don't think he'll get it, he's
>  consistent, but not well known.  (Thought he should be!)
> Mario.  Jesus NO!  It's bad enough for me just to utter the word
>  without being extremely sick and pissed off.  They guy's a luber
>  to ramble.  As you can see I hate Mario.
> Pat Walker
> UNB	

i'm not going to bother reprinting your pathetic excuse for a post. Mario  
fan, or not you have to respect what he can do with a blade. as for the  
hart trophy, i guess winning the scoring title after being out twenty-four  
days with CANCER, then leading his team to the presidents trophy and  
breaking the win streak record in the process shouldn't even qualify him  
for the award. maybe next year he'll tend a few games when barrasso needs  
a rest. be realistic, mario has earned every one of his accolades and  
deserves all the attention that he gets. lose the jealous attitude and you  
may start enjoying hockey at its finest
				-maze

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54547
From: ncjlog@atmos.washington.edu (Neal Johnson)
Subject: Belfour and Roenick, playoff Houdinis?


 Have Belfour and Roenick done another disappearing act at chips are 
 down time?  When I saw them it looked like the Blackhawks' defense
 might carry them along way in the playoffs.  

 Well they held St. Louis to 17 shots in game 2 and lost.

 Looks like maybe Keenan had (has) some insight to me.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54548
Subject: Re: Ranger Fans?????
From: kwolfer@eagle.wesleyan.edu


In article <1993Apr22.171734.9534@alleg.edu>, ballb@reis56.alleg.edu (Brett Ball) writes:
> In article <1993Apr22.101356.1@eagle.wesleyan.edu>  writes:
>> I for one am happy about the Ranger's hiring of Keenan.  It's too bad  
> that they
>> didn't hire him when Smith fired Nielsen, maybe he could of staightened  
> out the
>> babies on this team and made the playoffs.  What this team needs is a  
> little
>> fire under their butts!!
>> 
>> Reading through most of these hockey news I don't see many Ranger fans  
> writing.   
>> I'm new to this system and a big hockey fan and a long suffering(1940)  
> Ranger
>> fan.  But remember suffering builds character!!
>> 
>> I have some final questions about the way the team was handled in that  
> last
>> dreadful stretch.
>> 
>> 1. Knowing they needed offensive help from the blueline, why didn't we  
> see Mike
>> Hurlbut, who played pretty well when he was called up when Leetch first  
> went
>> down?
>> 
>> 2. Why????!!!!! is Joe Kocur playing every night?  He is not Bob Probert  
> who is
>> tough but also can play.
>> 
>> 3. How come Paul Broten is relegated to street clothes for the end of  
> the
>> season.  At least he plays with some heart and character, draws  
> penalties and
>> plays 110% when he's on the ice.  Was he in the doghouse for some  
> reason?
>> 
>> 4. Joe Cirella?????!!!!  Enough said!
>> 
>> Ranger fans may be suffering but we're some of the most loyal, unlike  
> Islander
>> fans who only show up when the team wins.
>> 
>> As far as the Stanley Cup goes I think there's only one team that can  
> test
>> Pittsburgh and that's Detroit.  This would be the most entertaining and  
> hard
>> fought series.  Mario is amazing!
>> 
>> Kurt
> 
> I think Joe Kocus should play every night.   He is a big physical guy, and  
> he gets the fans into the game with some big hits.  (both checks and  
> fists)  Its a big advantage to get the crowd going.  Plus, he helps  
> protect the other players.  Notice there are very few fights when Kocur is  
> on the ice unless he is it.  I have seen people start to go after essa  
> Tikkanen, only to go slinking away when Kocur steps in.  I think he is big  
> asset, but should be third line, and special situation only play.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>This is fast becoming a game without the goons.  I admit Kocur may get the
fans into the game but surely they would rather see Broten taking a pass from
Kovalev and scoring a breakaway goal to put the Rangers up 3 (magic #) goals in
the third period, rather than seeing Kocur take another stupid penalty and the
Rangers giving up another powerplay goal! 

The Rangers need another top flight center who can take the pressure off
Messier and the first line.  Nemchinov is a perfect third line center.

So who goes Beezer or Richter?

Kurt
 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54549
Subject: Binghampton Rangers Playoff Games
From: kwolfer@eagle.wesleyan.edu

Does anyone know if MSG will televise any of the Binghampton Rangers playoff
games.  Even taped replays would be nice?




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54550
From: stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber)
Subject: Re: Pens Broadcasters

In article <Mfqk2O200awN0sskQm@andrew.cmu.edu>, Nathan Robert Peters <np22+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
> 	Rumor has it here in Pittsburgh that there is going to be a Penguins
> broadcasting change before next season.  According to the rumor, the KBL
> leadership (the company the broadcasts the Pen's games) wants to limit
> loved broadcaster Mike Lange to radio only and hire Don Cherry as his
> broadcast partner.  This would mean Paul Stiegerwald would be fired
> (good riddance).   
> 
> 	Does anyone know anything about this?  Lange is a fun broadcaster to
> listen to, and Pens games wouldn't be the same without him.  Also I hear
> Cherry doesn't have high opinions of Lemieux, Ulf Sammuelsson, or
> Jaromir Jagr.  How is he supposed to broadcast their games?
> 
     I believe that the large number of digits on his paycheck (and
it would not be binary) would help Don to be a fan of Ulf!, Jaro, and
Mario.
> 
> Nate Peters - Lifetime Penguins fan (even from before they were the best)

Kevin L. Stamber
Purdue University
Top 10 reasons the Pittsburgh Penguins won the Patrick Division:
3. A strong desire to get THE CUP back to your neighborhood
   Eat 'n' Park -- where there's always something special cooking!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54551
From: The Always Fanatical: Patrick Ellis <IO11330@MAINE.MAINE.EDU>
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

I'm personally expecting Moog.  Blue played fairly decent (alright
spectacular at times) in his 1/2 a game but Moog has the experience.
What Did Blue have going for him, nothing, What would happen in a Tie
game, the prssure is then on the Goal tender to insure that you keep the
puck out (at the very least until your team scores)  Blue didn't face that
kind of pressure on Tuesday.  The Bruins will come out storming that
is for sure.  I really think that this series is up to Buffalo, Boston
(except for two bad passes in game one) really hasn't played that bad
,  As a believer is statistics, you know that your going to get the
puck by fuhr sooner or later, just keep shooting.  There game plan is
sound but they need to take the lead first, and control the tempo.....

               IMHO
                      Pat Ellis

P.S.  GO BRUINS    GO UMAINE BLACK BEARS    42-1-2       NUMBER 1......

                   HOCKEY EAST REGULARS SEASON CHAMPIONS.....
                   HOCKEY EAST TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONS>......
                   PAUL KARIYA, HOBEY BAKER AWARD WINNER.......
         NCAA DIV. 1 HOCKEY TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


                    M-A-I-N-E      GGGGOOOOOOO    BBBLLLUUEEEE!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54552
From: yadalle@cs.UAlberta.CA (Yadallee Dave S)
Subject: Re: Oilers for sale??

golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:

>The probability is that the Oilers are not going anywhere.

  Gerald, look at what happened to the Stars; they are off to Dallas.


>Pocklington has chosen this moment to make his "last" stand is
>because he is at the moment of maximum advantage...the provincial
>government is months away from a provincial election...it is
>the moment when he has maximum power to convince Northlands
>to give him a better arena deal or a better purchase price...
>and it is before the NHL's new collective agreement with
>the players which might involve some enhanced revenue-sharing.

Gerald, the Alberta election is slated fou 7 June, unless something RE?ALLY goes 
wrong this time!!  Pocklington could end up being THE embarassment of Klein
if he goes ahead with his 'ultimatum'.


>Pocklington is many things...stupid is not one of them.

Gerald,  people still have an axe to grind with this guy.  I CANNOT see him staying for long.

>He can dictate terms...because other cities will pay his
>price if Edmonton doesn't.

But the people in Edmonton won't budge, trust me on this one.

>Edmonton has already ****** up its international airport, and
>surrendered supremacy to Calgary, and over the next few years
>Edmonton is going to take a hard hit from government cutbacks.
>It will screw itself beyond recogniton if it manages to find
>a way to lose its hockey team too...because Northlands wants
>to continue to use the Oilers to subsidize horse racing.

Northlands won't budge ccording to one of the board members, Bruce Campbell.

>However, in this case, about the long-term financial
>viability of the Oilers, the fact is that Pocklington is basically 
>right, regardless of who owns the team, and it is right to provoke
>the crisis now, before the team accumulates millions of dollars
>in losses, or becomes habitually uncompetitive because of lack
>of money.

I haven't heard anything, BUT attendance at the Coliseum was the lowest this 
year.  HINT!!HINT!!  Remeber what I said about a personal vendetta?

>Sather has done his job...the Oilers are poised to be competitive
>again very soon (Al Strachan, one of the most knowledgeble hockey
>writers in Canada in a post-mortem of the Oilers season in
>the Globe and Mail recently agrees with me.)

Gerald, don't blame Sather.  This battle between the peole and Pocklington
started in 1986 and got WORST when Pocklington sold Gretzky.  

There were days when you can shake the hand of Pocklington when he was
respectalbe( I use to do so in 1982 - 1983 season) , but those days are GOE!!

>Gerald

BTW, when following up, please delete name of posting writer.
--
Dave Shariff Yadallee (B. Sc.(Econ/Math) (U of Alberta 1990) )
( yadalle@amisk.cs.ualberta.ca) God Save the Queen, God Bless us All!Remember!
Jesus saves lives from eternal damnation!
Newfoundland, keep good old Clyde, VOTE LIBERAL!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54553
From: v128r82w@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Ralph L d'Ambrosio)
Subject: Re: Leafs now favoured

In article <1993Apr26.020100.29640@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca>, maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes...
>Once again the Leafs overcame the Red Wings in what was possibly the
>most exciting game played yet in this playoff year.  Potvin was solid
>and Wendel completely dominated Probert.  Gilmour, as usual, was the
>best player on the ice.  And to those who claim that Andreychuk fades
>in the playoffs, please take note:  Andreychuk is averaging a goal a
>game. 
> 
>3 stars
> 
>Andreychuk - 2 goals
>Wendel     - all over Probert
>Probert    - all over everyone else
> 
>Todd Gill also played an excellent game.
> 
>We can't say enough about Doug Gilmour.  When he is right, all is well.
>Gilmour brings to mind Davey Keon from the previous Leaf dynasty.
> 
>Predictions so far on track:
> 
>NYI over Buffalo and Leafs over LA Kings.
> 
>Leafs over NYI in the final.

I can't let this pass.
*If* the Islanders get past Pitts. (Assuming the Isles beat the Caps, God 
Willing), them I'm sorry, the Isles will crush the Leafs.
Flame shields up.

********************************************************************************
Of course no one asked me I always interject my opinions on matters I have no 
concern over 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Go Islanders!!!!!! (3 down, 1 to go)
Go Jets for '93
********************************************************************************


> 
> 
>-- 
> 
>cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
>                                           "So many morons...
>rm                                                 ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54554
From: mikkot@romulus.math.jyu.fi (Mikko Tarkiainen)
Subject: Re: Pens Info needed

In article <1993Apr16.171319.13467@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>In article <1993Apr16.074054.3124@jyu.fi> mikkot@romulus.math.jyu.fi (Mikko Tarkiainen) writes:
>
>>Coaching news: 
>>	       Vasili Tichonov (ex-Assat) to San Jose Sharks 
>Wow.  So that's probably the reason why current assistant coach Drew Ramenda
>hinted that he won't be back.  Thanks for the news, Mikko; can you (or any
>of our Finnish netters) comment on Tichonov?

The first time I heard this piece of news was on the post game radio
interview here in Jyvaskyla. That was the bronze medal game in the 
SM-liiga which Tichonov's team Porin Assat (the Aces of town Pori:)
lost.  Vasili, the son of Victor Tichonov (the famous Soviet coach),
said that for a long time the Sharks have been persuading him to
take the assistant coach post. But he wants to be the head coach where
ever he goes. He definitely won't be coaching Assat anymore (after
three? seasons). I don't know why.

Vasili is a good coach I believe. Assat was a good team, produced many
players to our national team. Assat wasn't a skilled team (IMHO) but
they had the fighting spirit. After all, they butchered Jokerit in the
playoffs and gave hard time to TPS, the champs. But Assat wasn't
consistent, only when they were in the right mood they could beat any
team in the SM-liiga.

I am not 100% sure about the deal with the Sharks. As I said, he wants
to be the head coach. But he and the Sharks are going to negotiate and
decide during the WC. I doubt that he will be the head coach but
maybe they'll do some compromise.

Could somebody post more information about Vasili? I know he was coaching
in the former Soviet league; teams, results? His character as a coach?


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54555
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: Devils and Islanders tiebreaker????

In article <C5LDI2.77u@odin.corp.sgi.com>, enolan@sharkbite.esd.sgi.com (Ed
Nolan) says:
>If the Islanders beat the Devils tonight, they would finish with
>identical records.  Who's the lucky team that gets to face the Penguins
>in the opening round?   Also, can somebody list the rules for breaking
>ties.
      As I recall, the Penguins and Devils tied for third place last year
with identical records, as well.  Poor Devils -- they always get screwed.
Yet, they should put a scare into Pittsburgh.  They always do!  Pens in 7.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          PGH PENGUINS!!!    "It won't be easy, but it
Contact for the '93-'94  '91 STANLEY CUP    will have greater rewards.
Penn State Lady Lions    '92 CHAMPIONS      Mountains and Valleys are
rap115@psuvm.psu.edu     11 STRAIGHT WINS!  better than nothing at all!"

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54556
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: Goodbye, good riddance, get lost 'Stars

In article <DT642B1w165w@sms.business.uwo.ca>, s4lawren@sms.business.uwo.ca
(Stephen Lawrence) says:
>        Goodbye Minnesota,...you never earned the right to have an NHL
>franchise in the first place!
>        Hope you enjoy your Twin city wide mania for HIGH SCHOOL HOCKEY
>(hey, by the way my old pee wee team is having a reunion in Regina, care
>to come up and film the event?)
>        Yee haa Golden Gophers
>Whatta weird town!!!!!
   --Minnesota definitely deserves an NHL franchise!!!  You'll see the
Minnesota Whalers pretty soon, so fear not Minnesota fans.  No Norm Green,
'cept for the team color (sorry, bad pun!)

   --What a difference two years makes!  Minnesota finished 29-37-14 in 1992
and made the finals.  They finish with a better record at  38-38-10 thi year
and move to Dallas.  Every team in the playoffs has a winning record!!!
Finally!!!  It's about time, NHL!!!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          PGH PENGUINS!!!    "It won't be easy, but it
Contact for the '93-'94  '91 STANLEY CUP    will have greater rewards.
Penn State Lady Lions    '92 CHAMPIONS      Mountains and Valleys are
rap115@psuvm.psu.edu     11 STRAIGHT WINS!  better than nothing at all!"

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54557
From: Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Bernie Nicholls - What a man!

from Matthew Rush:
>but he's starting to push it over the edge IMHO.  Of course,
>Holik's chop to Barrasso's neck wasn't too sportsmanlike either.
>It seems that he was following the "The only way to beat the
>Penguins is to injure them" philosophy.

It's pretty obvious that Holik's hitting Barrasso was an accident. He
was even apologizing for it immediately before the Penguins all jumped
on him.

Ralph


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54562
From: howarth@sbctri.sbc.com (David Howarth)
Subject: Re: Hawks

In article <122779@netnews.upenn.edu>, ldecock@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Luke
DeCock) wrote:
> 
> The only player the Hawks have lost because they screwed up is Peluso. The
> hapless Blues lost Stevens and gave away Oates. Okay, so the Blues won this

You must be kidding, right? In losing Stevens the Blues got Shanahan and
kept
Joseph. Then they traded Oates for Janney. As a Hawks fan you have got to
respect those "hapless" names. 8^) Lets see, who scored the game winning
overtime goal in the 4th game???


> Luke DeCock
> ldecock@mail.sas.upenn.eu

     /\   David Howarth                              howarth@sbctri.sbc.com
    ///\   Southwestern Bell Technology Resources Inc.
   ///  \   Advanced Technology Laboratory
  ///    \   1010 Pine, Rm 635  St. Louis,  MO.  63101 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54563
From: leunggm@odin.control.utoronto.ca (Gary Leung)
Subject: Fuhr Deserves Credit (Was: Sabres sweep (Fuhr's role))

In article <1revcrINNeij@shelley.u.washington.edu> lzuo@byron.u.washington.edu (Joseph) writes:
>In article <randolin.6.735770247@polisci.umn.edu> randolin@polisci.umn.edu (Robert Andolina) writes:
>>Many people have suggested that Fuhr's play is the only reason that the 
>>Sabres beat the Bruins.  While Fuhr was a critical factor, I would not 
>>overlook the fact that the Sabres finally got some scoring from people other 
>>than Mogilny and LaFontaine (Khmylev, Sweeney, Hawerchuck, etc.).  Indeed, 
>>LaFontaine played hurt and didn't score many goals.  Also, the team played 
>>better defense (although not great) than in the regular season.  Fuhr 
>>deserves a lot of credit, but not all of it.
>>
>>Robert A.
>
>I agree with this. I also think Fuhr's contribution for Sabres's win is just
>the same as many palyers in the team. Mogilny had six goals in four games
>including two goals for the great comeback in the final win after Fuhr had
>left. The key for Sabres's win over Boston is whole team's strong commitment
>as an underdog and all their talent players including Mogilny and Fuhr.
>

I think that Grant Fuhr deserves more credit than that!
While it's true that the entire Sabres team played very well, I
still believe that if it wasn't for Grant Fuhr, the series would
now be tied 2-2. He virtually stole games 1 and 3 for the Sabres.
In both of these games, Fuhr stood on his head to give the Sabres
the chance to win. Especially in game 3, Fuhr made a series of
huge stops in the third period when the score was tied 2-2. 
Even in game 2 when the Sabres won 4-0, the score seemed to
indicate that the Sabres dominated. However, if it hadn't been
for Fuhr, the Sabres wouldn't have been up (2-0 I think it was)
through the 2nd period and the Bruins wouldn't have had to open
up the game (thereby allowing Mogilny to score the third goal on
a breakaway to salt away the game).  There
is no doubt in my mind that Fuhr was the critical factor in the
victory. 

In my opinion, Neely, Oates and Juneau played as well as
LaFontaine, Mogilny and Hawerchuk. The Sabres did get
extraordinary efforts from Hannan, Sweeney, Wood, and Khmylev
(compared to that of the Bruins checkers). However, the Bruins defense
, IMO, played better than the Sabres defense (the Sabres have Ken Sutton
playing a regular shift afterall ;-)
The difference in the series was Fuhr, who outplayed Andy Moog. 

Gary

Go Sabres!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54564
From: phoenix@startide.ctr.columbia.edu (Ali Lemer)
Subject: Re: Minnesota Shame?

In article <C62xpu.MD3@constellation.ecn.uoknor.edu> hunter@nsslsun.nssl.uoknor.edu (Steve Hunter) writes:
>I'm a hockey fan from way back, and maintain an interest as best I can
>here in the hockey hinterlands (Oklahoma).  I'm hoping I can get a
>reading from some of you about the move of the North Stars to Dallas.
>
>I've been under the impression that Minnesota was one of, or possibly,
>THE hockey state in the U.S.  So why is the team moving to a city in
>Texas?  Is it that the owner is a greedy, self-serving profiteer, or
>were the Stars really not making a profit?  Or was the city or whoever
>owned the arena doing some price gouging?
>
>Opinions, please.


Well, as a hockey fan, I think it's terrible. It's one thing to say, "Hey, 
let's give a hockey team to cities that don't have one!" -- that's fine. It's
entirely another to say, "Okay, let's take a team from a thriving hockey town
and move it!" 

Of course, none of us will ever know the real inside story, but
from what I know, a group of Minneapolis businessmen told Green repeatedly that
they would purchase the remaining 3600 (?) season tickets to get to the 10,000
level that Green wanted, yet he refused every time. It's pretty obvious that he
was determined to get out of Minneapolis at any cost and use the season tickets
thing as an excuse. 

I was fortunate enough to get to the penultimate game, and
the fans were great! People were tailgating and playing roller hockey in the
parking lot before the game, the attendance was so full as to have SRO, and the
whole atmosphere in the Centre was terrific. Minnesota IS Hockey, USA. How the
NHL can so blithely let the major league team from there move away is beyond 
me. I only hope they get a new team soon.

Just my $0.02.


-- Ali.

-- 
Ali "Procrastination" Lemer || "I gave [NHL Commissioner Gary Bettman] a puck
Columbia University (NYC)   || once. He spent the rest of the day trying to 
phoenix@ctr.columbia.edu    || open it." -- Pat Williams, GM, Orlando Magic
***************** BE KIND TO ANIMALS...HUG A HOCKEY PLAYER! *******************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54704
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER (***QUITE LONG***)

In article <1993Apr26.054446.29764@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> phoenix@startide.ctr.columbia.edu (Ali Lemer) writes:
>
>Hey, everyone, didja hear that? We're "fanatics" now! Cool! Can we get our
>own 1400-acre compound, replete with weapon and ammo caches? Who wants a
>barbeque?
>
>
>-- Ali.

I can't believe sh*t like this gets any attention in this group during
the playoffs.

Ali,you're a blabbering moron. At least you could've waited 'till
the end of the playoffs to start your dumb letter campaign.

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54705
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL playoff results (concrete)

Well, I got the scores for Sat's games...

AHL PLAYOFF SCORES-- FIRST ROUND	(home team in CAPS)
================================
		
GAMES PLAYED ON SAT, 4/24
-------------------------
BALTIMORE 3	Binghamton 1
ROCHESTER 3	Utica 2
SPRINGFIELD 4	Providence 3
		
===================================================================
SERIES STATI (plural of status? :)
----------------------------------
Adirondack defeated CDI, 4-0
Springfield defeated Providence, 4-2
Binghamton tied w/Baltimore, 2-2
Rochester defeated Utica, 4-1
St John's leads Moncton, 3-1
Cape Breton defeated Fredericton, 4-1
			
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54706
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: Calder Cup Playoff schedule

FULL 1993 CALDER CUP PLAYOFF SCHEDULE AND RESULTS	
home team in CAPS		*=if necesary

FIRST ROUND					
Springfield Indians vs Providence Bruins
Gm 1:	Springfield 3	PROVIDENCE 2	
Gm 2:	Springfield 5	PROVIDENCE 4
Gm 3:	Providence 3	SPRINGFIELD 2
Gm 4:	Providence 9	SPRINGFIELD 0		
Gm 5:	Springfield 4	PROVIDENCE 2
Gm 6:	SPRINGFIELD 4	Providence 3
(SPRINGFIELD WINS SERIES, 4-2)

CD Islanders vs Adirondack Red Wings
Gm 1:	ADIRONDACK 6	CDI 2
Gm 2:	ADIRONDACK 5	CDI 3
Gm 3:	Adirondack 3	CDI 0
Gm 4:	Adirondack 3	CDI 1
(ADIRONDACK WINS SERIES, 4-0)

Baltimore Skipjacks at Binghamton Rangers
Gm 1:	Baltimore 4	BINGHAMTON 3	
Gm 2:	BINGHAMTON 6	Baltimore 2
Gm 3:	Binghamton 8	BALTIMORE 3
Gm 4:	BALTIMORE 3	Binghamton 1	
Gm 5:	4/26	Baltimore at Binghamton	
Gm 6:	4/28	Binghmaton at Baltimore	
Gm 7:	4/30	Baltimore at Binghamton	*
		
Utica Devils vs Rochester Americans
Gm 1:	Utica 3		ROCHESTER 2	(OT)
Gm 2:	ROCHESTER 9	Utica 3
Gm 3:	Rochester 6	UTICA 4
Gm 4:	Rochester 4	UTICA 3		(OT)
Gm 5:	ROCHESTER 3	Utica 2
(ROCHESTER WINS SERIES, 4-1)

Moncton Hawks vs St John's Maple Leafs
Gm 1:	St JOHN'S 4	Moncton 2	(at Halifax)
Gm 2:	ST JOHN'S 3	Moncton 2	(at Halifax)
Gm 3:	St John's 6	MONCTON 5
Gm 4:	MONCTON 5	St John's 4	(OT)
Gm 5:	4/26	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax	
Gm 6:	4/28	St John's at Moncton		*
Gm 7:	4/30	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax	*

Cape Breton Oilers vs Fredericton Canadiens
Gm 1:	FREDERICTON 4	Cape Breton 3	(2OT)
Gm 2:	Cape Breton 5	FREDERICTON 2
Gm 3:	CAPE BRETON 3	Fredericton 0	
Gm 4:	CAPE BRETON 6	Fredericton 5 	(OT)
Gm 5:	Cape Breton won

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54707
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: WC 93: Scores and standings, April 22


 1993 World Championships in Germany:
 ====================================

  Group A standings (Munich)            Group B standings (Dortmund)
  --------------------------            ----------------------------

             GP  W T L  GF-GA +/-  P                  GP  W T L  GF-GA +/-  P

  Canada      3  3 0 0  17- 1 +16  6    Czech republic 3  2 1 0   8- 1  +7  5
  Russia      3  2 1 0  12- 4  +8  5    Finland        3  2 1 0   5- 1  +4  5
  Sweden      3  2 0 1   8- 6  +2  4    USA            3  1 2 0   8- 3  +5  4
  Italy       3  1 1 1   5- 8  -3  3    Germany        3  2 0 1  11- 8  +3  4
  ----------------------------------    -------------------------------------
  Switzerland 3  0 0 3   0- 9  -9  0    France         3  0 0 3   4-13  -9  0
  Austria     3  0 0 3   2-16 -14  0    Norway         3  0 0 3   0-10 -10  0

 
 April 18:  Italy - Russia        2-2       Norway - Germany          0-6
            Sweden - Austria      1-0       USA - Czech republic      1-1

 April 19:  Canada - Switzerland  2-0
            Russia - Austria      4-2       Finland - France          2-0

 April 20:  Sweden - Canada       1-4       Czech republic - Germany  5-0
            Switzerland - Italy   0-1       Finland - USA             1-1

 April 21:                                  Germany - France          5-3
            Italy - Sweden        2-6       Czech republic - Norway   2-0

 April 22:  Switzerland - Russia  0-6       USA - France              6-1
            Austria - Canada      0-11      Norway - Finland          0-2

 April 23:  Switzerland - Austria           Germany - Finland		20:00

 April 24:  Russia - Sweden                 Czech republic - France	15:30
            Canada - Italy                  USA - Norway		20:00

 April 25:  Sweden - Switzerland            Finland- Czech republic  	15:30
            Russia - Canada                 Germany - USA		20:00

 April 26:  Austria - Italy                 France - Norway		20:00

 
 PLAYOFFS:
 =========

 April 27:	Quarterfinals
		A #2 - B #3						15:30
		A #3 - B #2						20:00

 April 28:	Quarterfinals
		A #1 - B #4						15:30
		A #4 - B #1						20:00

 April 29:	Relegation
		A #5 - B #6						15:30
		A #6 - B #5						20:00

 April 30:	Semifinals
		A #1/B #4 - A #3/B #2					15:30
		A #4/B #1 - A #2/B #3					20:00

 May 1:		Relegation						14:30
		Bronze medal game 					19:00

 May 2:		FINAL							15:00

--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54708
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: WC 93: Results, April 22


 1993 World Championships in Germany:
 ====================================

 Group A results:

 RUSSIA - SWITZERLAND  6-0 (2-0,1-0,3-0)

 1st: RUS 1-0  Alexei Yashin 1          5:23
      RUS 2-0  Alexei Yashin 2         16:45
 2nd: RUS 3-0  Ilia Biakin 1            7:13
 3rd: RUS 4-0  Andrei Khomutov 3        3:47
      RUS 5-0  Ilia Biakin 2            4:13
      RUS 6-0  Sergei Sorokin 1        13:50

 Penalties: RUS 7*2min 1*5min game penalty, SWI 9*2min
 Referee: Rob Hearn, USA
 Attendance: 3,500

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

 CANADA - AUSTRIA  11-0 (6-0,2-0,3-0)

 1st: CAN  1-0  Shayne Corson 1         9:51
      CAN  2-0  Rod Brind'Amour 2      10:24
      CAN  3-0  Paul Kariya 1          12:42
      CAN  4-0  Gerry Galley 1         18:23
      CAN  5-0  Eric Lindros 2         19:11
      CAN  6-0  Rod Brind'Amour 3      19:46
 2nd: CAN  7-0  Eric Lindros 3          0:31
      CAN  8-0  Eric Lindros 4          8:50
 3rd: CAN  9-0  Brian Savage 1         13:37
      CAN 10-0  Brian Benning 1        16:26
      CAN 11-0  Geoff Sanderson 3      17:55

 Penalties: CAN 2*2min, AUT 2*2min
 Attendance: 7,500

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 USA - FRANCE  6-1 (3-1,1-0,2-0)

 1st: FRA 0-1  Antoine Richer 1         5:02
      USA 1-1  Adam Burt 1              8:32
      USA 2-1  Rob Gaudreau 1          18:15
      USA 3-1  Jeff Lazaro 1           18:29
 2nd: USA 4-1  Adam Burt 2             10:54
 3rd: USA 5-1  Shjon Podein 1           8:03
      USA 6-1  Rob Gaudreau 2          16:25

 Penalties: USA 3*2min, FRA 2*2min
 Referee: Darren Loraas, Canada
 Attendance: 1,511

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

 FINLAND - NORWAY  2-0 (0-0,0-0,2-0)

 1st:
 2nd:
 3rd: FIN 1-0  Juha Riihijarvi 1        4:16
      FIN 2-0  Kari Harila 1           12:37

 Penalties: FIN 5*2min, NOR 7*2min
 Referee: Sven-Erik Sold, Sweden
 Attendance: 3,600

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 The best goal scorers:

 Eric Lindros		CAN	4
 Rod Brind'Amour	CAN	3
 Dieter Hegen		GER	3
 Andrei Khomutov	RUS	3
 Geoff Sanderson	CAN	3
 Ilia Biakin		RUS	2
 Adam Burt		USA	2
 Viacheslav Bykov	RUS	2
 Jiri Dolezal		CZE	2
 Mike Gartner		CAN	2
 Rob Gaudreau		USA	2
 Patrik Juhlin		SWE	2
 Frank Pajonkowski	FRA	2
 Bernd Truntschka	GER	2
 Jarkko Varvio		FIN	2
 Alexei Yashin		RUS	2

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Some WC stats:

 *  Fastest goal in a WC game after first face-off:

    10 seconds:	    Steve Larmer, Canada  1991 in a game vs Sweden (ended 3-3)
                    Boris Michailov, USSR   1978

 *  Most consecutive WC games without a loss:

    47:   USSR    1978-85
    38:   USSR    1963-68
    37:   Canada  1937-49
    35:   USSR    1985-90
    27:   Canada  1950-54

--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54709
From: b_hart@odin.dev.macsch.com (Bill Hart)
Subject: Re: If Oilers go to Hamilton


In article <1993Apr26.023650.16749@spang.Camosun.BC.CA>, ua256@freenet.Victoria.BC.CA (Tom Moffat) writes:
|>
|>
|>If the Oilers move to Hamilton what division will they play in .
|>-- 
|>Tom Moffat
|>Victoria B.C.
|>Canada
|>
As a guess, Hamilton would be put into the Midwest, with either
Winnipeg or Dallas moving to the Pacific.

Bill
b_hart@macsch.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54710
From: Karim Edvard Ahmed <ka0k+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Minnesota Shame?

>I've been under the impression that Minnesota was one of, or possibly,
>THE hockey state in the U.S.  So why is the team moving to a city in
>Texas?  Is it that the owner is a greedy, self-serving profiteer, or
>were the Stars really not making a profit?  Or was the city or whoever
>owned the arena doing some price gouging?


Norman Green claims that he has lost money over the last three years
that he has owned the team.  When he bought the team, it seemed kind of
obvious that he was going to have to deal with a few years in the red,
before the team started making a profit again.  He gave the impression
that he was willing to do so.  He claimed two years ago that the team
needed to average only 8000+ fans per game in order to pull a profit,
but this season the team averaged 12000+ fans, despite increasd ticket
prices.  I think the team's attendence and play was clearly in an upward
trend, which leaves me dumbfounded as to how he could ignore that in
deciding to move.  He was even offered the many concessions he rudely
demanded, such as guaranteed season ticket sales, cheap rent at the
other two arenas in town, etc.

Oh well, I guess the bottom line is $$$.  Green wanted immediate huge
returns in Dallas, and wasn't willing to wait another year or so in MN. 
Dallas gave Green a pretty stellar deal to play there (although I feel
Minnesota's was quite reasonable), and he also has some cronies down
there as well.  All this means, is that Minnesota is without an NHL team
for a year or two.  Too bad for the NHL.

KEA 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54711
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: Re: Winnipeg vs. Vancouver

In article <C63p9q.205@unixhub.SLAC.Stanford.EDU> grogers@ravel.SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Greg Rogers) writes:
>>> MKR@stud.hsn.no (MORTEN KRISTIANSEN) writes:
>>>
>>>Read this all you Canucks fan out there!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>>>Winnipeg are going to kick Vancouvers butts so badly they are not going to
>>>be able to sit down for weeks.
>>>And no this is NOT a joke.
>>>A prediction before the fourth game in Winnipeg:
>>>
>>>Winnipeg 6 Vancouver 2  (2-0,1-2,3-0)
>>>Selanne, Steen score a couple of goals each!!!
>>>
>>>Winnipeg to win Stanley cup playoffs.>>
>>
>>
>>To all you Jets Fanatics...Ha ha ha.
>>To normal Jets Fans...It was a pretty good fourth game. More physical
>>play than I've seen in the first three games.>
>>
>>These moronic posts that have continued throughout the year about how
>>the Jets will cremeate the Canucks and Selanne will smash Bure into the
>>boards is so full of *%it. Why don't you take a cue fromm Daryl and just
>>wait 'till its over before you make more of a fool of yourself???>
>>
>>I'm not going to predict anything about the Canucks. They are up 3-1 and
>>are coming back home, but I'm not going swing any *%it around until the
>>series is wrapped up.
>>
>>Tony
>
>Bravo Tony,
>
>I too am sick of all the mindless, fanatical, blind faith Jets fans who could 
>prpbably predict the end of the world more accurately than the coutcome of a
>playoff series.
>
>Now I will admit that I am a mindless, fanatica, blind faith Canucks fan.
>But unlike those from Winterpeg, I do not need to vent my spleen upon the 
>world as to how great my team is.  I know, I have confidence in them, and
>that's enough.
>
>Granted, the Jets finished the season hot, and the Canucks were having trouble,
>but Vancouver has built themselves a reputation for being a playoff team.  
>Just ask any Flames fan.  They may not win every series, but they alway fight
>to the end.  I'll admit that last year was not great, but if they combine
>the work ethic of the past with the new tallent of the present, they will
>be tough to beat (note: I did not say they would pummel every team they meet 
>and destroy the greatest player playing today).
>
>Now, like any Canucks fan, I would love to see them take the cup.  I feel
>they have a good chance to make it out of the Smythe, and a 50-50 shot at
>Detroit (I can't see them losing to St. Louis).  If Pittsburgh makes it to
>the cup, I'd have to put my money on them (Yes even if they're facing the
>Canucks).  If Buffalo, Montreal, or Quebec beat Pittsburgh, I'd choose the
>winner of Vancuover and Detroit to take the cup.
>
>Oh, and one parting note for the Jets fans: Just how many times has 
>Winnepeg made it to the finals? 8')
>
>Go Canucks
>
>Greg
>
Devorski unfortunately helped to taint an otherwise brilliant display
by MacLean.  The Canucks tied up the Jets so tightly that I thought that
they were mailing them.

BTW, Greg...next time, don't fall asleep in geography class, it's pretty
sad when a fellow in Norway can spell Winnipeg properly and a guy in
North America can't.

One more thing...how LONG has Vancouver been in the NHL?  How many
championships do they have?  

Oh yeah...and I CAN go to the Arena and see not one, not two, but
*six* championship banners hanging from the rafters.  3 Stanley Cup
banners, and 3 Avco Cup banners.  My NHL guide says that Vancouver has
won the Cup once (as many times as the rockin' town of Kenora has won it!)

Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54712
From: admiral@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Steve C Liu)
Subject: Caps postseason fortunes

Okay, the Caps AGAIN are about to break out the golf clubs but before they
do, does anyone have the history of the Washington Capitals' futility
record in the playoffs? I remember that Terry's first year was the first
year that the Caps finally made it to the third round but before under
Brian, I noticed that every other year the Caps got to the second round
and the years in between they didn't make it past the first round. Is this
trend continuning? 
The Admiral, a hopeless Caps fan.
P.S. We still remember that 3 OT loss to the Islanders! Aurggghhhhhhhhh!
____________________________________________________________________________
|Admiral Steve C. Liu          Internet Address: admiral@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu|
|1993 World Champions  - Baltimore Orioles - Why Not? - Series in the Yards|
|         1992-1993 Stanley Cup Champions -  Washington Capitals           |
|*****The Bangles are the greatest female rock band that ever existed!*****|
|   This sig has been brought to you by... Frungy! The Sport of Kings!     |
|"My God man, drilling holes through his head is not the answer!" Dr. McCoy|
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54714
From: mblumens@itsmail1.hamilton.edu (Mary Blumenstock)
Subject: FAQ for this group

Could someone please tell me how I can access the FAQ for this
group?  I'm relatively new, and would like to read it, but
although I've seen it mentioned, I've yet to see it posted.  Is
it archived somewhere or does someone post it to the group on a
regular basis?  or, is it distributed on-demand?  I'd appreciate
any help anyone can give me.  

Thanks in advance.

			- Mary

p.s.  Please respond via email as the articles expire within 24
hours on my mail system, and I don't always get a chance to read
everything.  Thanks.


===============================================================
Mary Blumenstock               mblumens@itsmail1.hamilton.edu

                  GO RANGERS!!!!  
                     (...next year, of course ;-()


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54715
From: chuck@mks.com (Chuck Lownie)
Subject: Re: Leafs vs Wings

In article <94233@hydra.gatech.EDU> gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak) writes:
>In article <1993Apr22.133739.11317@mks.com> chuck@mks.com (Chuck Lownie) writes:
>>Potvin by the way has played very well.  He kept Toronto in the game
>>last night during those 5 penalties in the first period by making great
>>saves, but they did end up getting to him in the second.
>
>	The guy has a GAA of 6.00 in the playoffs, and he's "played very
>well"??? Hahahahahaa. What a joke.
>

Did you watch the games????


-- 





Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54716
From: chuck@mks.com (Chuck Lownie)
Subject: Re: Leafs vs Wings

In article <16BB89B12.LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu> LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall) writes:
>In article <1993Apr22.133739.11317@mks.com>
>chuck@mks.com (Chuck Lownie) writes:
>>In last nights game Toronto received FIVE penalties, Detroit none.  If
>>--
>>
> 
> Which game were you watching?  Didn't you see the third period when
>the Wings had 2 penalties called on them and then a delayed penalty?
>The Leafs had a 2 man advantage for about a minute and a 1 man advantage
>for another minute or two and the Leafs still couldn't score.
>  And I wonder how the Leafs scored a powerplay goal if, according
>to you, they never had a powerplay.
>  In the Detroit paper today, it said there were 40 penalties called in
>last night's game. And you're saying Detroit had none of those penalties?
>I'm guessing you only watched the first period. I have to admitt the Leafs
>did get alot of penalties in that period where as the Wings didn't get
>many if any at all (Haven't looked at the box scores yet).  But, the
>ref more than made up for it in the third period.
> 
>Laurie Marshall
>Wayne State University
>Detroit, Michigan
>Go Wings!!!

My apologies for the typo - I meant the Wings had 5 power plays in the
first period and the Leafs none.  

As well, my point isn't that the refs were biased, just that they were
calling a lot of penalties, which works to the benefit of the Wings.

Having the ref call a whole bunch of penalties against one team then
calling a bunch against the other to "make up for it" takes a lot away
from what could have been a great game.



-- 





Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54717
From: hechel@vms.huji.ac.il
Subject: switzerland at WC93

what did happen to the swiss team ? last year they reached the semi-final
and now after 3 matches no points and even no goals !!
after the 0:1 against Italy it seems they lost any hope and were
overrun 0:6 by the russian team.
now it seems that they have to work hard not to be relegated to the
B-level. does anybody know if this WC is the qualification tournement for
the olympic games '94 in Lillehammer or are some teams already
qualified for them.

hopp schwiiz
           daniel

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54718
From: reiniger@ug.cs.dal.ca (Darren Reiniger)
Subject: Re: CBC: Canadian for ESPN.

In article <1993Apr24.011729.1@uwovax.uwo.ca> 35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca writes:
>Hooray, I hear on TSN that the Jets have won a game, Selanne
>getting a hat-trick!
>
>Of course, here in GOD'S COUNTRY (read Ontario!) I couldn't
>see that game, nor any other in the VAN-WPG series so far,
>because our beloved CBC figures no one out here cares about
>this series (which has looked pretty competitve so far...
>
>On Monday and Wednesday nights, CBC could have shown the Toronto-
>Detroit game, done the news, then picked up Winnipeg-Vancouver.
>They didn't.  Tonight?  You guessed it, Toronto-Detroit, the
>news (not the end of the Jets game), then Calgary-LA.
>
>SO, if it's "Hockey Night in Canada", why can't this Ontarian see
>one of the two series with two Canadian teams?  Is this too much to
>ask?
>
>Paul Badertscher
>35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca

 I'd like to echo these sentiments.  This is the worst coverage I can 
 ever remember seeing on CBC.  As soon as the game ends, I can count to 30,
 and by that time, they've signed off the air.  No post game interviews,
 no updating of late scores, nothin'.  TSN is really putting CBC to 
 shame.  I only hope the later round coverage improves, I mean, who
 really wants to see CBC PrimeTime News instead of hockey.

 My $.02,
  Darren

-- 
 Darren Reiniger                   reiniger@ug.cs.dal.ca || arishem@ac.dal.ca
 Centre For Marine Geology, Dalhousie University, Halifax, N.S., Canada
| People who wonder where this generation is going should remind themselves   |
| where it came from in the first place.                                      |

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54719
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Stewart homered the Wings!!

In article <andy.bgsu.edu-250493225109@m248-100.bgsu.edu> andy.bgsu.edu (Ryan ) writes:

(Roger Maynard) wrote:
 
>> Once again the Leafs overcame the Red Wings in what was possibly the
>> most exciting game played yet in this playoff year.

Perhaps it was the most exciting game played yet that YOU have seen.  For
most of us who watch teams around the league with interest and objectivity, 
it was *nowhere* *near* the most exciting game...

>Paul Stewart called *the* single worst game I've seen this year.  
>Federov's major was obvious, and I don't dispute it.  However, Chaisson's 
>penalty shouldn't even have been a penalty, let alone a major and a
>game misconduct.  The 5-minute+ game misc. call is for high sticking only. 
>There is no "blood" penalty.  Just because  Chaisson barely touched the 
>poor sap, and he hit the dasher and bled profusely doesn't mean it is a 
>penalty. 

Unfortunately, the instant replay is not used on hits.  At first, I
immediately thought "5 and a game" because the hit _looked_ much more severe
from an intent-to-injure perspective than it was.  After seeing the replay,
I'd say it deserved 2-4 minutes for boarding (it was careless any way you 
slice it).  If Stewart had replay, I do not think Chaisson would have gotten
5 and the game.

>In the second period, behind Potvin, Probert had the puck, and was
>going to get out front, and was _tackled!_  I couldn't believe the no-call.

This no-call was bullshit, I agree. I admire Stewart for letting them go, but
Probert *looked* *up* saying where the hell is the penalty?  I've never
seen Probert whine either (he doesn't need to).  Now, if Probie
decides to put Wendel through the boards, he's probably gone, right?

>I don't remember who (on the Leafs) touched the puck 
>on Racine's shot towards the end of the game (43.2 seconds left), but Stewart
>called it out of play, last touched by Detroit.  Everybody in the Garden,
>including the Linesmen knew it.  Yzerman protested, but Stewart just 
>laughed, and really "homered" the Wings.

This was also bullshit.  But once again, no replay.  It was Rouse, btw. I'm
really pissed that the linesmen didn't correct the call either....it's b.s.
when the officials refuse to admit they made a mistake.  

>But, when it all comes down to it, [Wings played like shit.....]

Yes.  The calls you describe should not have the difference in a Detroit
loss.  I picked the Leafs to win Game 3 on emotion and adrenalin, but the
Wings have no excuses for Game 4.  They should be the superior team.

The call that pissed me off the most was Anderson getting 4 for putting his
stick in somebody's eye.  That was _the_ most dangerous stick infraction I
have seen in a long time, and everybody in the damn league _knows_ he's an
asshole when it comes to stickwork.  Four lousy minutes.  Bullshit call. 
Murray should send the tape in.  Or a Wing should hammer the living shit out
of him.

--
dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54720
From: white@venus.cc.hollandc.pe.ca (Take me Baby!)
Subject: Canada 5-0 after preliminary round at World Champioships


	Team Canada defeated Russia 3-1 to finish the priliminary 
round unbeaten at 5-0. Scoring for the Canadians were Kevin Dineen of 
the Flyers, Eric Lindros also of the Flyers and Paul Cariya of the 
Maine Black Bears. Cariya has put on quite a show at the Worlds. He is 
sure to be drafted in the top 3 this summer at the NHL entry draft.

	Canada defeated Italy 11-2 and Austria 11-0 before meeting the 
Russians on Sunday. The Canadians now face Finland in the Quarter -
finals on Tuesday.


Kevin White
white@cc.hollandc.pe.ca
Holland College
Ch'town PEI Canada


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54721
From: jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM (Jason Cockroft)
Subject: Leafs: What happened?

How did the Leafs turn it around??? 


I couldn't get the Leaf games on the weekend in CA.

Did the Leaf defense wise up overnight?
Did the Leafs get in the slot or 
was it just "fluke" goals in a goalie duel? 
Did the Wings turn off the jets or muscle?  
What gives here?

I caught game 1 on satellite.  I figured my Leafs were washed.
This is a _major_ turnaround.   Very few predicted this. 
How, how, how did it happen?   

Wing and Leaf perspectives welcomed!


-jake.



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54722
From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
Subject: Re: Caps moving ?????

In <berger.735512230@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu> berger@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu writes:

> I've heard rumors recently from reliable sources that Abe Polin, the
> moron who owns the Washington Capitals is looking to move the team
> after this season or next.  Milwaukee was mentioned as the team's
> potential destination.  The person who told me this is strongly
> affiliated with the NHL and has been extremely accurate in the past
> with news of this sort.  Does anyone know if this is so or has
> heard anything of the sort?  With Baltimore's AHL team gone, that would
> leave the area with only an ECHL franchise in Baltimore- not good.
> Thanks
> 
>    David

WHY!!! DC/Baltimore is one of the top media markets (=the only thing the NHL
seems to care about these days), they've been doing far better than the NBA
Bullets at the gate for the last five years. The team has been a perennial
contender and fan support has been good to excellent . . . Why should Pollin
move to city that's five times smaller but has as many teams in other pro
sports. I don't get it...  
 
> -- 
> 
> 					David

MARCU$

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54723
From: mmilitzo@scott.skidmore.edu (matthew militzok)
Subject: 1992 - 1993 FINAL NHL PLAYER STATS

If you are interested in receiving the final player stats for
the 1992-1993 NHL Season as well as playoff box scores, stats and
scores/updates...
then e-mail my stat server

mmilitzo@skidmore.edu

the subject of the message must be:	STATS

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54724
From: golf@phoenix.oulu.fi (Jouko Kylmaoja)
Subject: Finland-Norway in WC

	Finns had to do their best last night when they played against Norway
in world champs. After two periods the score was still 0-0. This game was 
quite much similar to the first game Finland played  (against France).
The norwegian goalie was very good and a bit lucky, too. In the third period
Juha Riihij{rvi scored 1-0 from a rebound, the time was around 5 mins or so.
The second goal was scored by Kari Harila, who shot straight from a faceoff
behind the Nowwegian goalie. Saku Koivu, the 18-year-old center got his first
point of this tournament. Saku Koivu played very well througout the game and he
was awarded the best player of the game- prize. Despite the fact that he is
quite small in size he handles the puck very well and is a fast skater. 
I think that we will hear from this guy in the future.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54725
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER (***QUITE LONG***)

In <catcherC630J6.87F@netcom.com> catcher@netcom.com (Paul W. Francisco) writes:

>As she said, the letter is addressed to Bettman.  The post (which, though
>having pretty much the same content, is an entirely different entity) was
>addressed to all.  When she puts the letter in the mail I doubt it will
>say "To: All".  I figure she wanted to let people here see what was in it
>since it is a topic that interests a lot of folks here.  That's an entirely 
>different purpose than sending the letter to Bettman.

And it is a damn good thing that she did post it since she claims to represent
people in rec.sport.hockey.

>Unfortunately...

>The "largest computer networks in the world" phrase is a definition of 
>the Internet, not a group as a whole that she claims to represent.  As

Her sole purpose in mentioning the net, as Steve Gallichio has already 
pointed out, is to lend weight to her points through association with the
internet.  There is no other reason to mention the internet.  This is 
misrepresentation and if the internet was a private corporation Alison
would be leaving herself wide open to all kinds of civil suits.

>for the business of whether or not it is large, it is large compared
>to say, the number of folks on r.s.h. who are sending a letter to thank
>him for changing the names, at least to this point.  And just for my

This is not a letter.  It is a petition claiming to represent a large
proportion of rec.sport.hockey users, and by implication, a significant
number of internet users.  65 names can in no way be considered a 
"large" proportion of rec.sport.hockey which, while we have no way of
counting actual readership, is accessible to hundreds of thousands of
people.  65 persons is no more than a fly's fart in a windstorm.
 
>own curiosity I thought I'd look up the "official" definition of large
>in the dictionary.  It reads:

>large - 1.  having more than usual power, capacity, or scope.    
>        2.  exceeding most other things of like kind in quantity or size.

Gee.  You looked up "large" in the dictionary?  What next?  Two syllable 
words?

>Now I have no idea how many letters Bettman may have gotten on the issue
>or how many people may have signed them.  65 people may be up there, 
>thereby validating definition 2.  I would also wager that the geographical
>range of signatures is quite large, which would give it a large scope.

Let me suggest that the only place you are likely to envy the magnitude of 
65 is when you are looking for ways to beef up your IQ scores.

>>He might be impressed by the size of the list of names.

>Why would he be impressed with this unless it were "large"? 

As I said, he *might* be impressed by the size of the list of names.  But 
it would have to be considerably larger.  But even this definition does
not account for the original context from which you lifted this sentence.

>I personally don't know whether or not I agree with the letter.  I have
>very mixed emotions about it.  I like the names as they are, and don't
>think they make it that difficult to learn the game, but there might be
>a shred of validity to the change.  

Well then what the hell is your point?  You don't really know if you have
an opinion about the hockey issue but you do know that you don't like me.  
Is that it?


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                 ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54726
From: Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Pens fans reactions


Susan Dart writes:

>Amongst Penguins' fans there seems to be an inner calm that I've never
>experienced before this year with the Pens. The players and the fans have so
>much confidence in the team this year. We're savoring every game and saving
>our energy for the Stanley Cup.

That's a good way to put it.  It's a quiet confidence.  I don't feel like
I have to defend this team anymore. 

The Devils are a puzzle to me.  They have long been one of the few teams
I always dreaded playing.  Their D isn't quite what it used to be but they
still usually play us pretty tough.  I just can't figure it out.  At least
last night they mounted an attack.

>	2. Watching some of the Devils players being interviewed, I could
>	   see in their faces and eyes, that they really don't have any
>	   confidence. They are left speechless when asked what more they
>	   can to do to beat the Pens. They act as though they know it's
>	   a hopeless task.

Bernie Nichols was interviewed after Game 2 on the late news.  He was
shaking his head in disbelief over Barrasso, saying that Tommy is like
another defenseman out there and how difficult it is playing against him.
Then he got this far-away look on his face, his voice started trailing
off and he said, "It just isn't right...it just isn't fair..." and he
tried to muster a smile.

>I'm really impressed with Bowman's coaching tactics - he's had an answer for
>every move that Brooks has thrown at the Pens.

As far as coaching goes, a Pens/Islanders match-up should be pretty good.

One guy I feel sorry for in all of this so far is Chris Terreri.  I'm sure
Tom Barrasso knows how he feels.  For so long Tommy would look up and not
have a teammate in sight.  Terreri's teammates really left him out in the
cold in the first two games.

Mom.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54727
Subject: Flames Final Stats and Playoff News
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

News:
=====
For the first time all season, the Flames are now injury-free. The only player
remaining on the limp is center Carey Wilson who, even when healthy, is not 
a major part of the team. 

Trent Yawney did not score a goal all season until the last regular season
game against San Jose. He potted his first of the year in that game, and has
also scored goals in both Game 1 and Game 2 against Los Angeles. 

Thoughts on Game 1:
==================

The Flames played horribly in dropping the first game of their series with
Los Angeles 6-3 on Sunday afternoon. They seemed more interested in throwing
big hits than in scoring goals. They physically dominated the Kings, but that
was the only area they dominated in. The game plan was to rush the net and 
try and take advantage of a young, inexperienced L.A. defence and the shaky
Kings goaltending, but those plans fell by the wayside while the Flames
conducted a steady march to the penalty box. Particularily stupid was Theoren
Fleury taking a five minute major and a game misconduct for slamming Warren
Rychel's face into the dasher while Rychel was on his knees. 

Goaltender Mike Vernon played well and could not really be faulted for the
loss, despite his well-publicized poor record in afternoon games. He got
very little support from his defence in clearing the front of the net and 
sweeping away rebounds. In fact, Marty McSorley's goal actually went in off
Chris Dahlquist's skate in front of the net. 

Thoughts on Game 2:
==================

The Flames came back strong in the second game, evidently aware of the
potentially fatal consequences of losing both the first two games on home ice.
The first period was fairly even, with the edge going to the Kings. But Calgary
came out strong in the second period and simply dominated the Kings, scoring
five goals to take a lead they never relinquished en route to a 9-4 win. 

The deciding factors in this game were faceoffs and special teams. Calgary
dominated on faceoffs as they did in Game 1, but they were able to make better
use of the won faceoffs in this game than they did in the first one. Calgary
also went 3-for-5 on the powerplay while L.A. only went 1-for-8 and gave up
a shorthanded goal to Joel Otto. L.A.'s powerplay goal also came late in the
game with the outcome already decided. The Kings' powerplay failed them when
they needed it most, in the 1st and 2nd periods. 

The Flames lost RW Greg Paslawski with a suspected shoulder injury when he
was leveled by Alexei Zhitnik right after scoring Calgary's 7th goal. Charlie
Huddy left the game for the Kings with a groin injury. 

The game was marred by stupidity in the last minute. First, Craig Berube of
Calgary took a five-minute major for fighting plus a game misconduct for
instigating when he went after Tony Granato for no apparent reason. Granato
drew a minor for some strange reason. (Turtling perhaps). This was followed
30 seconds later by Warren Rychel drawing a major, minor, and game misconduct
for hitting Frank Musil in the face with his stick and then instigating a
fight. Musil got a fighting major for some similarily strange reason. Hardy and
Yawney went toe-to-toe and both got double minors. (Gregson thought that Musil 
turtling amounted to fighting, but that Yawney and Hardy throwing punches at 
each other was just roughing? Where's this guy from.....)
 
Upcoming games:
==============
Friday April 23, at L.A.
Sunday April 25, at L.A.
Tuesday April 27, home to L.A. 
Thursday April 29, at L.A. (if necessary)
Saturday May 1, home to L.A. (if necessary)

Injuries:
========
C  Carey Wilson, indefinite with recurring knee injuries (Dec 10)

1992-93 Calgary Flames final regular season statistics.
========================================================

#   Pos.  Name                  GP     G      A     Pts     +/-    PIM
===============================================================================
14  RW    Theoren Fleury        83     34     66    100     +14     88
26  C     Robert Reichel        80     40     48     88     +25     54
20  D     Gary Suter            81     23     58     81     -1     112
10  LW    Gary Roberts          58     38     41     79     +32    172
25  C     Joe Nieuwendyk        79     38     37     75     +9      52
42  RW    Sergei Makarov        71     18     39     57      0      40
 2  D     Al MacInnis           50     11     43     54     +15     61
29  C     Joel Otto             75     19     33     54     +2     150
28  LW    Paul Ranheim          83     21     22     43     -4      26
23  RW    Greg Paslawski        73     18     24     42     +3      12
22  RW    Ron Stern             70     10     15     25     +4     207
15  LW    Brent Ashton          58     10     13     23     +11     52
11  LW    Chris Lindberg        62      9     12     21     -3      18
34  D     Roger Johansson       77      4     16     20     +13     62
18  D     Trent Yawney          63      1     16     17     +9      67
 3  D     Frank Musil           80      6     10     16     +28    131
39  C     Brian Skrudland       39      7      7     14     +4      65
16  LW    Craig Berube          77      4      8     12     -6     209
 7  D     Michel Petit          35      3      9     12     -5      54
 4  D     Kevin Dahl            61      2      9     11     +9      56
33  C     Carey Wilson (I)      22      4      7     11     +10      8
 5  D     Chris Dahlquist       74      3      7     10      0      66
21  D     Alexander Godynyuk    27      3      4      7     +6      19
19  RW    Todd Harkins          15      2      3      5     -4      22
12  LW    Paul Kruse            27      2      3      5     +2      41
35  G     Jeff Reese            26      0      4      4      0       4
 6  D     Greg Smyth            35      1      2      3     +2      95
30  G     Mike Vernon           64      0      2      2      0      42
27  RW    Thomas Forslund        6      0      2      2      0       0
??  C     Shawn Heaphy           1      0      0      0      0       2
??  LW    Patrick Lebeau         1      0      0      0      0       0
 1  G     Andrei Trefilov        1      0      0      0      0       2

#   Name             GP   Min.   GAA   W  L  T   EN  SO GA   SA    Save% 
============================================================================
30  Mike Vernon      64   3732   3.27  29 26 9   4   2  203  1799   .888
35  Jeff Reese       26   1311   3.26  14  4 1   0   1   71   631   .889
 1  Andrei Trefilov   1     65   4.62   0  0 1   0   0    5    39   .872
===========================================================================
    Team Totals      84   5119   3.30  43 30 11  4   3  283  2469   .886

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54728
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Oiler's rumour - Team moving? Press conference next week

In <1993Apr26.143902.24502@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:

>So what's stopping Pocklington from going to a bank and borrowing $41
>million dollars to pay off his Treasury Branch loans...I was reading

According to the recent TSN report Peter Puck is not paying any interest
on the Treasury Branch loans.  That's a lot of green.

>somewhere than Pocklington business have gross revenues of about
>$500 million per year...I don't think he would have much problem
>"borrowing from his VISA to pay off his Mastercard" if he wanted to.

Again, according to TSN, virtually everything that Peter Puck has already 
has liens against it.  Of course we can't really be sure of this. 

>Pocklington is at the point of maximum advantage right now...and
>he is basically right in that Northlands (which is a creature of the
>City of Edmonton) must give him a better deal in the era of escalating
>salaries.  Northlands and the city benefitted as much as he did during
>the eighties from the Oilers...and wealth generated by the Oilers
>success was shared...but the finanical viability of small market teams
>has radically changed in the space of a couple of years, and for
>the Oilers to remain viable and competitive, they need much more of
>the revenue stream from concessions, parking, and building advertising
>as most every other professional sports franchise in North America
>has.  What was once a fair agreement that shared the wealth is now
>Northlands sucking the blood out of the Oilers franchise.

The Oiler rationale regarding the renegotiation of player contracts is
that a deal is a deal.  Sather has spouted this repeatedly.  Pocklinton
has a contract with Northlands until 1999.  A deal is a deal.  Perhaps
if he included the income he has received from his sale of assets (players
such as Gretzky) and the income he has received in expansion fees with
his revenues he wouldn't be losing money.  He has admitted pulling this
money out of the Oiler franchise to put into his other businesses. 

>The Oilers have paid several times over what the Coliseum cost to
>build, and bring Edmonton prestige and recognition throughout the
>world that is essentially priceless...to nickel-and-dime the Oilers
>just so Northlands can use revenue sucked out of the Oilers to 
>subsidize their horse-racing operations is insanity.

I think that Pocklington has received ample provincial subsidization.  
I can't really blame him for going after municipal subsidization but 
he is certainly not entitled to it.  Pocklington has "sucked" revenue
out of the Oilers in order to prop up his failing business interests.
Pocklington is not to be trusted.  I doubt very much that any Oiler
team will ever again make the playoffs under Pocklington's stewardship.
As soon as a player shows himself to be a competent NHL'er and expects
to be paid accordingly he is shipped off for younger players and or
draft picks.


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                 ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54729
Subject: Another travesty at the Joe Louis
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

(Detroit, April 21)

Most knowledgable observers once again watched in shock as the Detroit Red
Wings again beat the best goaltender in the world six times en route to 
another easy victory over the best team in the NHL. 

For the best goaltender in the world, Felix Potvin, six was a bad number as
he surrendered six goals and collected six minutes in penalties in reponse
to the goon tactics employed by the inferior Red Wings team. 

								Alan

P.S. We told you this would happen, Roger. Didn't we? I love it.....

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54730
Subject: Re: Nords 3 - Habs 2 in O.T. We was robbed!!
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

 In article <18APR93.25909598.0086@VM1.MCGILL.CA> JBE5 <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA> writes:
>Aargh!
>
>Paul Stewart is the worst and most biased ref. presently in the NHL.
>He called a total of 4 penalties on the Habs and one on the Nordiques.
>The Nords' penalty came in O.T.  Stewart, being an ex-Nordique himself,
>was looking to call penalties on the Habs while letting the Nords
>get away with murder...WE WAS ROBBED!!!!

If my powerplay was as bad as Montreal's, I'd be thanking Stewart for calling
as few penalties as possible. Quebec's powerplay is lethal and it is to their
advantage to have a penalty-filled game where they can clean up with their
superior powerplay. 

Montreal really lost that game (and game 2) because Patrick Roy is well on
his way to having another one of his trademark awful playoffs. The man is
truly overrated. Quebec has scored six goals on Roy and four, perhaps five, 
were quite stoppable. 

								Alan


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54731
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 18
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <1r1439$c9t@access.digex.net>, steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio) writes:
> What is the policy regarding players and the minor league playoffs versus WC?
> I know that the Rangers are holding back Kovalev, Zubov, and Andersson for
> Binghamton, but I also know that the Whalers wanted Michael Nylander to play
> for Springfield, while Nylander wanted to play for Sweden. The Whalers allowed
> the NHL to decide, and the NHL chose the WCs. How does this differ from the
> Rangers and Oilers? Did the Whalers have to go through the league, or could
> they have forced Nylander to play in Springfield?

As long as a player is under contract to an organization, he is obligated to
play only where that organization tells him to play or gives him permission
to play. The Rangers are certainly within their rights to force Zubov and
Andersson to report to Binghampton. 

It certainly does reflect a lack of class on the part of the Ranger 
organization, however. Is having Binghampton win the Calder Cup really more
important to them than keeping their players happy? 

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54732
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

>And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
>resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
>team captain trivia would be appreciated.

Brad McCrimmon was the captain of the Flames when he was traded to Detroit
following the 1989-90 season. This was during the off-season though.

There's countless examples of captains being traded, I'm sure.

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54733
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER & Roger's Response

In <1993Apr26.054703.29827@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> phoenix@startide.ctr.columbia.edu (Ali Lemer) writes:

>Gee, what a coincidence. He doesn't share my views. Perhaps that's why his
>name is not on the list to accompany the letter! Maybe I should write a 
>disclaimer at the end: "Mr. Bettman, nota bene: Roger Maynard does NOT
>agree with this letter!" I know he'd be so worried, otherwise!

You wouldn't have to put my name at the bottom if you simply appended a 
standard disclaimer that the opinions expressed in your petition in no
way claim to represent the views of either rec.sport.hockey or the internet
as a whole.  You have surely seen these disclaimers appended to the postings
of many who work for companies and post on the net.  The disclaimers, clever
though some of them may be, are there for a reason.

 
-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                 ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54734
From: rskirsky@athena.qualcomm.com (Ray Skirsky)
Subject: Re: Where's Roger?

Speaking of Roger and ilk, whatever happened to good ol' gln?  I had him in
my kill file since last year's playoffs and now that I've moved to a new
news reader which doesn't have kill files, I find that he's gone.  I must
admit, however, that unlike gln, Roger seems to know something about the game
as long as the subject doesn't touch on the Leafs.

Ray Skirsky 
rskirsky@qualcomm.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54735
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER & Roger's Response

In <catcherC6317q.8LB@netcom.com> catcher@netcom.com (Paul W. Francisco) writes:

>I wouldn't say that the letter clearly implies representation of the
>views of a group that you belong to.  It represents a subset (that you
>don't belong to) of a larger group (which you do, if only because this
>isn't a moderated group).

And you can bet that I wouldn't be the only one not belonging to the
moderated group if it was moderated by an anally-retentive little
dullard like yourself. 

>Look, there are several ways to state an opposing viewpoint.  Three
>that come to mind are as follows:

I hardly need you to presume to lecture me on how to communicate my points
of view.  This "posting" that you have made is the second on the subject of
the NHL letter and you have yet to communicate your opinion on the matter.
Instead you content yourself with flaming me.

>3) Say it directly and obnoxiously.  Result:

Result:
Moronic little busy bodies like yourself take advantage of a perceived
opportunity to post rules for others to live by. 

>You realize that anything you say can, and most certainly will, be
>used against you.

Well if using it "against" me means you are going to post something of
significance then by all means go ahead.  I insist.  Otherwise why don't
you just go back to sleep or do whatever it is that you do when you are 
all by yourself...

-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                 ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54736
From: neath@brazil.psych.purdue.edu (Ian Neath)
Subject: Re: Why Blues Pulverized Chicago WeenieHawks

sesrock@andy.bgsu.edu (Stuart Esrock) writes:

2) Hitting....Hawks tried to outmuscle Blues but could not do it.
Instead, Blues matched Hawks hit for hit and crunched the shit out of
them in game #4.....Scud line, Shanahan, Butcher, and Zombo particularly
took turns bashing favorite targets like Chelios.

3) Skating.....when the Hawks tried to outskate Blues, they could not do
that either.  Nelson Emerson finally showed up and skated circles around
flat footed Chicago defense.....Hedican, Felsner, Ron Wilson and others
also proved that with old cement skaters like Goulet and Keith Brown,
Blues could lap Chicago in a 400 M relay race.


     I agree with #2 but you are wrong about #3.  In fact, the only
     point where the Hawks in any way matched the Blues was when
     they quit trying to outmuscle and instead tried to outskate
     the Blues.  They scored and took the lead.  Too bad it was
     Game 4 and they then took some stupid penalties.  When the
     Hawks skated, they outskated the Blues and took control.


--
      Ian Neath        | There are four kinds of people in this world:
neath@psych.purdue.edu | cretins, fools, morons and lunatics - U. Eco

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54737
From: lor@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (edward.lor)
Subject: Re: Caps postseason fortunes

In article <1rhddoINN4l9@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu> admiral@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Steve C Liu) writes:
>Okay, the Caps AGAIN are about to break out the golf clubs but before they
>do, does anyone have the history of the Washington Capitals' futility
>record in the playoffs? I remember that Terry's first year was the first
>year that the Caps finally made it to the third round but before under
>Brian, I noticed that every other year the Caps got to the second round
>and the years in between they didn't make it past the first round. Is this
>trend continuning? 
This is not a trend. The Caps were done. Goneso in five games, and it saves
us Caps fans a lot of pain.

I mean, it would be more painful if the Caps were up 3-1, watching them 
tumbled when they need ONE MORE WIN to clinch the series. How many times
have they done that in their history?

1985 up 2-0 in a five game series against the Isles, lost 3 straight
1987 up 3-1 against the Isles, lost 3 straight
1992 up 3-1 against the Pens, lost 3 straight

In other words, when they were about to clinch with 3 games to go, they 
were a pitiful 2-9, the lone wins being 

1) a sweep of Philly in 1984
2) the 1990 win against the Rangers in the Patrick finals, the ONLY TIME 
they managed to get out of the division.

Actually, Saturday's blown lead wasn't anything new. We all know the Caps
are famous lead blowers in crucial playoff games. Examples:

1) game 4 against the Isles, 1985, led 4-2 after two, lead series 2-1,
gave up 4 goals in the 3rd period, including the game winning goal in the
last minute. After that goal, Bobby Carpenter botched a penalty shot.
Series tied 2-2, lost game 5 a few days later.

2) game 4 against the Rangers, 1986, led series 2-1, led by 2 in the 3rd 
period, blew it. Lost game in OT and three consecutive games.

3) game 6 against Pittsurgh, 1992, led series 3-2, led by 2 in 2nd period.
Blew it and the series.

4) game 3 against Isles, 1993, series tied 1-1, led by 2 after 2. Blew it.

5) game 4 against Isles, 1993, trailed series 2-1, led by 3 in 2nd period.
Blew it again.

When they were leading by 3 in game 4, I said to myself: "if they blew this
lead, the series is OVER". They have lost all the momemtum. The Islanders
believe they can come back no matter what the score is.

I am still waiting for a Cap goalie who can carry the team, who can 
completely shut down the opposition when they are hanging on their dear 
lives in a crucial game.

>The Admiral, a hopeless Caps fan.
>P.S. We still remember that 3 OT loss to the Islanders! Aurggghhhhhhhhh!
Well, some teams such have it and some teams just don't. When the Caps
were frustrated year in year out by the Islanders, I was thinking "wait
until Potvin/Bossy/Trottier/Smith retire". Well, they retired (even though
Trottier was still able to haunt the Caps on a Pens uniform), yet another
generation of Islanders were still doing the same thing. Well, I guess 
it has nothing to do with the players.

-- 
                                          Edward Lor
                                          lor@cbnewsk.att.com
                                          

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54738
From: howarth@sbctri.sbc.com (David Howarth)
Subject: Re: Winnipeg vs. Vancouver

In article <C63p9q.205@unixhub.SLAC.Stanford.EDU>,
grogers@ravel.SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Greg Rogers) wrote:
> 
> I feel
> they have a good chance to make it out of the Smythe, and a 50-50 shot at
> Detroit (I can't see them losing to St. Louis).  

Gee, they lost to St. Louis twice this year. Maybe you should have your
eyes checked. 8^)

> Go Canucks
> 
> Greg

Go Blues....the Rodney Dangerfield team....They get no respect....except
in Chicago mabee...

     /\   David Howarth                              howarth@sbctri.sbc.com
    ///\   Southwestern Bell Technology Resources Inc.
   ///  \   Advanced Technology Laboratory
  ///    \   1010 Pine, Rm 635  St. Louis,  MO.  63101 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54739
From: howarth@sbctri.sbc.com (David Howarth)
Subject: Re: Maybe next year Hawks

In article <1993Apr26.125444.5073@vax.cns.muskingum.edu>,
jbrown@vax.cns.muskingum.edu wrote:
> 
> Belfour played well, but I hardly saw any offense from any hawk.  What I want
> to know is where was Roenick.  

As far as I can tell, he was right next to Bassen!

Don't you guys love it when people like me come out of the woodwork...8^)

     /\   David Howarth                              howarth@sbctri.sbc.com
    ///\   Southwestern Bell Technology Resources Inc.
   ///  \   Advanced Technology Laboratory
  ///    \   1010 Pine, Rm 635  St. Louis,  MO.  63101 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54740
From: dpapp@muskwa.ucs.ualberta.ca (Papp Denis)
Subject: Regular season 93/94 pool

1993-1994 NHL Hockey Pool
By
Denis Papp and Chris Stoochnoff
 
Rules:
 
- Pick 17 players (3 LW, 3 C, 3 RW, 3 LD, 3 RD, 2 Goalies)
  You may pick ANY 17 players from any team.
 
- Points for players are as follows:
        - 1 point per goal
        - 1 point per assist
        - 1 point per 10 PIM
 
- Points for goalies are as follows:
        - 2 points per win
        - 1 point per tie
        - 1 point per assist
        - 1 point per 5 PIM
        - 2 points per shutout
        - 100 points per goal
 
Entries:
 
-Entries can be sent (by mail or ascii text file) to Chris Stoochnoff or Denis
Papp on Hard Wired BBS (434-7996). 
-Due date for entries is the first day of regular season play. After that,
no more entries will be accepted (unless it is just slightly late. If that is
the case, there will be a small penalty applied to the team).
-internet users can send email to dpapp@muskwa.ucs.ualberta.ca
 
Prizes:
 
Prizes have not yet been considered. They could range from nothing to free
time on Hard Wired BBS or even something else (if you have any suggestions...
please feel free to put your two cents worth in).
 One idea is to get whoever is willing to to submit an equal amount of
money, and that will go to be the prize money.  The prize money will
go to the top team who has submitted to the prize pool.  A list
of all people who submit money will be posted, as well as those who
didnt - if it is done this way. 
Cost:
 
The cost... ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!!! There is absolutely no fee for this pool.
 
Note:
 
-If you have any questions, please feel free to send them to Denis Papp or
myself (Chris Stoochnoff). The players positions (ie. Brett Hull is Right
Wing) will be decided by the year book I will be using. So, if you do not
know a certain players position, or you are not completely sure what position
he plays, then ask me and I'll tell you.
 
-And for a great time, call the Hard Wired BBS at (403)-434-7996 (this will be
the location where the pool standings will be displayed).
 
Internet Users:
 
-To contact Denis Papp, just email (dpapp@muskwa.ucs.ualberta.ca). Standings
will be distributed by email as well.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54741
From: sclark@epas.utoronto.ca (Susan Clark)
Subject: Re: Leafs: What happened?

Hi guys....

What happened?
	1.  Potvin didn't let six goals by.
	2.  Wendel and Andreychuk woke up.
	3.  Home ice and LOTS of yelling in the Gardens gave the Leafs
		the emotional edge.
	4.  Refs calls (especially last night) tended to favour Leafs.

	A couple of comments:

	1.  On Gilmour:  Just because the guy isn't one of the three
	stars doesn't mean he was not leading the team.  Someone posted
	the playoff point total and he's in something like fifth or sixth
	place....plus, he walked away with the Molson cup (given for
	accumulating points from the three star selection) during the
	regular season.

	2.  On the officiating:  I've heard gripes from both ends on this
	one.  Emotions are very high in this series;  the rivalry is
	one of the stronger ones I know of.  I do have to agree that the
	officiating last night was pro-Leaf in general (except for whoever
	missed that slash on Gilmour's hand).

	3.  In general:  I STILL think Detroit has one of the better
	chances vs. Pittsburgh (though I think the Leafs would do better
	against the Blues....but not as well if they made it out of the
	division). Problem is, I like both these teams, though I'm
	supporting the Leafs on the underdog principle.  D

	By the way...Gilmour tiring out is a lot like Bob Probert not
		playing aggressive hockey....
	By the way....I'm not any sort of expert, nor do I claim to be.
		I just like watching a good matchup.


	tee hee hee...ooops!
	Susan



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54742
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: More Hart trophy stuff....

In <1993Apr26.162805.1534@adobe.com> snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols) writes:

>In article <1993Apr24.010132.3405@mtroyal.ab.ca> caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca writes:
>>The Hart trophy goes to the player most valuable to his team, not to the best
>>player in the league. So your above arguement is really worthless. 

>Personally, I always thought that "most valuable to his team" was silly.
>Why should the best player in the league be penalized because he plays on a
>team with other good players?  Why should a lesser player be picked solely
>because he's the best player on a weak team?   Wouldn't the weaker team be
>helped even more by the best player in the league?  Doesn't the presence of
>the best player in the league make the other players on the team look
>better, too?

The Hart Trophy was orginally awarded in a time where people did not think
in terms of who was the "best" player, rather in terms of who was the most
valuable to the team.  And "valuable to his team" was not, and should not
be, considered synonymous with "best".  We are talking about a time when
honour and attitude, not measurable skills, were the most important assets
a player brought to his team, his league and his sport.  This was before
the onslaught of professionalism which has clearly denigrated what was 
formerly the foremost peacetime pursuit of glory.

The Hart Trophy is not a prize.  It is an honour.


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                 ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54743
From: jab55062@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (The World Reknown Jason Boskey)
Subject: Re: Blues sweep Hawks

While I will first congratulate the Blues for their victory, I think it must
be realized that the primary reason the Blues were able to win was Curtis   
Joseph.  When a goalkeeper gets hot, there is little an opposing team can do.
Joseph should be given the entire city of St. Louis, because otherwise there 
would probably be a game 6 scheduled.  

As for the game on Sunday.  The Blues caught a few breaks, without a doubt.
One was the Referee constantly watching the Blackhawks, looking for reasons to
give them penalties.  Second, The Blues first goal resulted because the puck
hit the linesman as the Blackhawks attempted to clear.  No linesman, no shot
for Brett(I can redirect anything)Hull to redirect.  On another of St. Louis'
goals, Belfour was tripped from behind as he went to make the save by someone
who didn't belong in the crease, which means it was a St. Louis player.
Finally, the overtime goal was caused because someone kept Belfour from getting back to the crease.  No goalie, no way to stop the shot.

I congratulate St. Louis for beating the Hawks.  It will be a shame to see
Bryan Murray finally advance to the Campbell Conference Finals because Joseph
won't be able to stop the powerful Red Wing attack.


____________________________________________________________________________
|The World Reknown Jason Boskey           | Mail: Bosk@uiuc.edu            |
|Known throughout the World as The Bosk   |"Christ, you know it ain't easy,|
|All Rights Reserved, All Lefts Enhanced  |You know how hard it can be,    |
|-----------------------------------------|The way things are goin'        |
|"Here they come spinning out of the turn"|They're gonna crucify me"       |
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54744
From: mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger)
Subject: TEAM POOL - Standings

Standings reflecting 2 completed series in Round 1:

    Participant                Points   Final 4
 1. roland_behunin                  5   CAL-6 QUE-7 QUE-7 
    Dave_Wessels                    5   VAN-7 PIT-6 PIT-5 
 3. Barfly                          0   TOR-6 BOS-7 TOR-6 
    Dean's                          0   DET-5 PIT-5 PIT-7 
    Oz                              0   LAK-6 BOS-6 LAK-6 
    Garry                           0   TOR-6 BOS-6 BOS-4 
    Brian_Bergman                   0   DET-6 PIT-6 DET-6 
    Mopar_Muscle_Men                0   CHI-5 PIT-6 PIT-5 
    BH's_Last_Place_Picks           0   CHI-5 PIT-6 PIT-5 
    Milton_Keynes_Kings             0   DET-6 PIT-5 PIT-5 
    Sam_&_His_Dogs                  0   DET-6 PIT-5 PIT-5 
    Ye_Ding                         0   DET-6 PIT-5 PIT-6 
    Tampere_Stars                   0   CHI-6 PIT-6 PIT-6 
    The_Mighty_Hedgehogs_Of_Myllyp  0   CHI-6 BOS-6 BOS-6 
    Homesick_Hawaiian               0   VAN-7 PIT-6 PIT-5 
    Killer_Kings                    0   CHI-6 WAS-6 CHI-6 
    Puggy_Greybeards                0   DET-5 PIT-5 PIT-5 
    Ottawa_Bearcats                 0   TOR-5 PIT-6 TOR-6 
    Andrew_Kirk                     0   TOR-6 PIT-6 PIT-5 
    Muller_n_Walker                 0   DET-6 PIT-6 PIT-6 
    Excalibur                       0   DET-6 PIT-4 PIT-6 
    Rednecks_from_Hockey_Hell       0   DET-7 BOS-5 BOS-5 
    The_@$%@#$%_Rangers_of_1940     0   CHI-6 PIT-7 PIT-6 
    Jeff_Phelps                     0   DET-6 PIT-6 PIT-5 
    Arctic_Circles                  0   DET-6 PIT-6 PIT-4 
    Sludge                          0   DET-6 PIT-6 DET-6 
    The_Logistician                 0   DET-6 PIT-6 DET-7 
    Hillside_Raiders                0   CHI-6 BOS-6 BOS-7 
    Danielle                        0   CHI-5 QUE-7 QUE-7 
    Stanias_Stars                   0   CHI-6 BOS-7 BOS-6 
    BloodHook                       0   DET-5 PIT-5 PIT-5 
    Gilles_Carmel                   0   CHI-6 PIT-7 PIT-7 
    Pasi_Fr{nti                     0   LAK-7 PIT-5 PIT-6 
    Evan_Pritchard                  0   VAN-6 PIT-6 PIT-5 
    Skriko_Wolves                   0   DET-7 PIT-5 PIT-5 
    Rangers_Blow                    0   CAL-7 PIT-6 PIT-4 
    Sean                            0   DET-5 PIT-5 PIT-6 
    Schott_Shooters                 0   CHI-6 PIT-5 PIT-5 
    Gary_Shiff                      0   TOR-4 PIT-6 PIT-4 
    Mike_Burger                     0   DET-7 PIT-6 DET-7 
    Darse                           0   DET-6 PIT-6 PIT-6


*******************************************************************************
*  Mike Burger                    *  My Canada includes, Quebec, Ontario,     *
*  mmb@lamar.colostate.edu        *  the Maritimes, the Prairies, and Florida *
*  A Beginning Computing TA Stud  *  four months a year.                      *
*  over 500 students served       *    --Royal Canadian Air Farce             *
*******************************************************************************
*      University of Michigan - 1990  --  Colorado State University - 199?    *
*******************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54745
From: pjotr@ludd.luth.se (Peter Sj|str|m)
Subject: Re: WC/Finland

In <1993Apr25.220033.7284@math.ucla.edu> dstein@oak.math.ucla.edu (David Stein) writes:

>Jarkko Ketolainen writes:

>>Disaster! Finland was beaten by Czech 1-3 (0-0,1-1,0-2).
>>Finland will be 4th of pool B and will most certainly meet Canada in the
>>quarter final on wednesday 28th.

>  Look at the situation positively... the Finns can now kick Canada out! :-)

	They did last world cup and eventually lost tp Sweden in the final!

		/Peter

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54746
Subject: Re: Wings News and Playoff Thoughts
From: kwolfer@eagle.wesleyan.edu

In article <1993Apr23.010100.28651@mtu.edu>, kcsmith@mtu.edu (Smith) writes:
>>
>>I don't think he's shown that he's good enough to carry Detroit to the Cup.
>>The team may be good enough to reach the finals, but Cheveldae is their 
>>Achilles Heel.  You *must* have goaltending in the playoffs, and 
>>Cheveldae looks like an overmatched 2nd or 3rd stringer (which he probably
> 
> I guess I don't know of too many 2nd or 3rd string goalies that could post
> over 30 wins in a season.  Chevy has done that the past two seasons playing 
> behind a defense that is not exactly the best in the league.  His 34 wins 
> this year were not all against Toronto and for those who look at Vincent Rien.
> stats and think he should be starting, take a look at the teams he played
> against (teams like San Jose, Ottawa, and TB) any NHL goalie could post a decent
> record playing teams like that night in and night out.
> 
>>is).  Look for Detroit management to remedy the situation in the offseason.
> 
> I really don't see this happening.  If they didn't think Cheveldae could do the
> job they would of traded for somebody this year, after all why wait until next
> year when there were goalies available this year.
> 
>>Hey, I may be wrong, but after watching him kick rebound after rebound into
>>the high slot, I don't think he can carry them in the tough games (i.e.
>>those not against Toronto).
> 
> Better to kick out rebounds than to let goals in.
>>
>>If St. Louis gets past Chicago, watch for Joseph to carry the Blues past
>>an otherwise vastly superior Red Wings club.
>>
> Joseph is hot, but so are the Wings.  They have scored six goals in both of
> their games so far with Toronto, supposively one of the leagues best defenses.
> I guess if they end up playing for the Norris title we'll see what happens.
> 
>>
> 
>> Dr.D [The Devils Advocate]        "Drinkin' & women & guns don't mix..."
>> v057p7nk@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu
>> awkorbut@acsu.buffalo.edu                      - Mark Arm
> 
> 
> kcs
> 
> Wings in '93, or hopefully by '94.


As far as Cheveldae is concerned, he is a decent goalie.  The most logical
trade in the offseason to me would be between Detroit and NY Rangers.  I'm sure
if Beezer would be traded he would enjoy the opportunity to go back to his
roots in Detroit.  He would be a valuable asset to the Wings and Perhaps the
Rangers could get a Zombo in return?  Beezer got a few good years in him and
the opportunity to get a fresh start would energize his play.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54747
From: jack.petrilli@rose.com (jack petrilli)
Subject: hawks lose (yawn)

On April 25,  maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) wrote:

M --> 
M --> Look for the Leafs, led by a healthy Doug Gilmour and a confidence-restored
M --> Felix Potvin to do the Blues in 6.  The Leafs will have 3 more games with the
M --> Wings and that should give Joseph a few extra days to pass those horshoes.
M --> 

HA! Roger the dodger is back! (on the bandwagon, that is.)

- Jack

 * Please Tell Me if you Don't Get This Message
---
   RoseReader 2.10  P003814 Entered at [ROSE]
   RoseMail 2.10 : RoseNet<=>Usenet Gateway : Rose Media 416-733-2285

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54748
From: vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu (David Vergolini)
Subject: Montreal versue Quebec

  Did anyone see the Montreal - Quebec game yesterday?  It was tight right down
to the last second of the third period.  In the overtime Roy and Hextall played
like they were gods.
  Ok, so Montreal won!  They deserved it after getting their first goal in
overtime waved off because the puck was hit in with a high stick.  Their second
goal in overtime was also replayed, but I could not tell if it was the Montreal
player who kicked it in.  The puck definitely was not directed in by a stick.
Anyways, Montreal is back into the series.







                                                Dave Vergolini
                                                Michigan State University
                                                vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54749
Subject: Re: Where are all the Bruins fans???
From: kwolfer@eagle.wesleyan.edu

In article <93113.010900RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>, Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
> I'm just wondering where all the Bruins fans are???  I mean they woofed it
> up with about 1,000,000 posts during the regular season saying that their
> fave team was going to kick everyone's @#$ in the playoffs and win the Stanley
> Cup.  While I see nothing wrong with a little ranting and raving, I'm just
> curious why all the Boston faithful have stopped posting.  I mean I haven't
> even see just one little Boston fan post, 'cept for the Bruins fans that
> aren't cocky.  Well, maybe they're all out on the golf course or something,
> but I don't know, I'd sure like to see where all those Bruins fans are at :-)
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ** Robbie Po **          1993's STREAKERS   "We do what comes naturally!
> Patrick Division Semi's  -- PGH PENGUINS -- You see now, wait for the
> PENGUINS 4, Devils 3     1991, 1992 STANLEY possibility, don't you see a
> Penguins lead, 3-0       CUP CHAMPIONS :-)  strong resemblance..."-DG '89


Here in the middle of Connecticut there are plenty of Bruin Fans, many who have
let me know in no uncertain terms that the Rangers choked down the stretch.  I
think the Bruins are doing the same exact thing the Rangers did, they're
playing too tight!!  Who's responsibility is it to check Mogilny?  He has
gotten off a number of quality shots on goal of which there are many rebounds
which are not being cleared by the B's defense.  It's too bad the B's might not
get the opportunity to play Pittsburgh again.  I would really enjoy seeing
Ulfie get beat up by Neely.  We all hate Ulfie, but would love him on are
team!!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54750
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Hockey Draft winning team (regular season)

I was asked to post the team log of this year's winning team in the regular
season draft.  Here 'tis:

%begin Dave_Wessels
...reading team 'Dave_Wessels' from database
%log all

Team log:

Name			Team	Points	Value	Bought	Week	Sold	Week
Trevor Linden           VAN	72	72.0	78.8	pre	70.4	10
Cliff Ronning           VAN	85	85.0	74.6	pre	97.8	6
Robert Reichel          CGY	88	88.0	58.9	pre	51.4	8
Pat Verbeek             HFD	82	82.0	63.0	pre	64.3	7
Pat Falloon             SJ	28	28.0	62.7	pre	46.8	7
John MacLean            NJ	48	48.0	55.0	pre	27.5	7
Eric Lindros            PHI	75	75.0	55.0	pre	105.0	6
Rick Tocchet            PIT	109	109.0	81.2	pre	106.9	9
Greg Adams              VAN	56	56.0	63.0	pre	93.8	8
Mike Ricci              QUE	78	78.0	60.3	pre	79.8	6
Joe Juneau              BOS	102	102.0	55.0	pre	110.9	6
Kevin Hatcher           WSH	79	79.0	57.4	pre	54.6	6
Teemu Selanne           WPG	132	132.0	55.0	pre	109.2	6
Pavel Bure              VAN	110	110.0	77.5	pre	108.9	8
Dixon Ward              VAN	52	52.0	55.0	pre	61.2	7
Russ Courtnall          MIN	79	79.0	60.7	6	84.6	14
Darren Turcotte         NYR	53	53.0	60.7	6	72.1	14
Christian Ruuttu        CHI	54	54.0	61.9	6	52.2	13
Petr Nedved             VAN	71	71.0	59.3	6	84.5	12
Petr Klima              EDM	48	48.0	65.3	6	--	--
Tony Granato            LA	82	82.0	56.0	6	75.6	12
Steve Duchesne          QUE	82	82.0	88.7	6	92.2	13
Alexander Mogilny       BUF	127	127.0	103.8	6	118.8	14
Ray Sheppard            DET	66	66.0	55.0	7	63.0	15
Steve Larmer            CHI	70	70.0	64.9	7	79.7	17
Vincent Damphousse      MTL	97	97.0	64.9	7	94.5	15
Tony Amonte             NYR	76	76.0	63.0	7	63.0	16
Brendan Shanahan        STL	94	94.0	55.0	8	--	--
Corey Millen            LA	39	39.0	55.0	8	48.9	16
Johan Garpenlov         SJ	66	66.0	55.0	8	55.9	15
Kelly Kisio             SJ	78	78.0	63.0	8	72.3	15
Pat Elynuik             WSH	57	57.0	57.0	9	56.7	16
Benoit Hogue            NYI	75	75.0	61.6	10	74.3	20
Pat Flatley             NYI	60	60.0	55.0	11	59.9	18
Rod Brind'Amour         PHI	86	86.0	74.1	12	81.0	19
Michal Pivonka          WSH	74	74.0	55.0	12	--	--
Joe Mullen              PIT	70	70.0	55.0	12	--	--
John Cullen             TOR	50	50.0	55.0	13	55.7	19
Stephane Richer         NJ	73	73.0	55.0	13	61.8	19
Jeff Norton             NYI	50	50.0	64.0	14	56.3	20
Glenn Anderson          TOR	65	65.0	55.0	14	--	--
Ray Bourque             BOS	82	82.0	65.6	14	--	--
Bernie Nicholls         NJ	60	60.0	72.8	14	67.8	20
Andrew Cassels          HFD	85	85.0	56.0	14	--	--
Dmitri Kvartalnov       BOS	72	72.0	82.1	15	--	--
Tomas Sandstrom         LA	52	52.0	59.7	15	43.6	22
Joe Sakic               QUE	105	105.0	109.6	15	--	--
Rob Blake               LA	59	59.0	59.5	16	--	--
Derek King              NYI	76	76.0	68.3	16	70.9	22
Michel Goulet           CHI	44	44.0	55.0	16	45.4	23
Mike Modano             MIN	93	93.0	90.5	17	--	--
Dmitri Khristich        WSH	67	67.0	55.0	18	--	--
Alexander Semak         NJ	79	79.0	62.6	19	--	--
Nikolai Borschevsky     TOR	74	74.0	69.3	19	--	--
Mike Donnelly           LA	69	69.0	70.5	19	--	--
Jeff Brown              STL	78	78.0	69.1	20	--	--
Thomas Steen            WPG	72	72.0	55.0	20	--	--
Kevin Dineen            PHI	63	63.0	55.5	20	--	--
Mario Lemieux           PIT	160	160.0	134.9	22	--	--
Wayne Gretzky           LA	65	65.0	55.0	23	--	--
You have 1.9 cash points.

As of week 28, your team is placed 1 (of 262 teams).
-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54751
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: BLUES SWEEP BLACKHAWKS!

In article <93115.191211RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>, Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
says:
>(Michael Virata Sy) says:
>>Michael Sy
>>mvs1@cec2.wustl.edu (DEVILS CONSULTANT)
>>And HOW 'BOUT THOSE DEVILS!  4-1 over the Penguins.  HAHAHAHAHAHAH!
>

>Attention all Penguins fans:  If The Pens  win game 5,  show some laughter
>in that e-mail box address listed above.  Thanks! :-)
>

Attention Penguins fans once again, apparently 99.999% of you understand that
this was just a joke (Hence the :-) next to it) but one idiot on here doesn't
as he got pissed at me and sent me two hate e-mails telling me that this is
wrong.  I have no intentions of sending e-mail to anyone should the Pens win
tonight, and I really do not expect/do not intend to lead any of you to send
this poster e-mail either.  It was NOT a serious request.  If you didn't know
that (which you probably did) then don't do it.  Thanks.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          1993's STREAKERS   "We do what comes naturally!
Patrick Division Semi's  -- PGH PENGUINS -- You see now, wait for the
Devils 4, PENGUINS 1     1991, 1992 STANLEY possibility, don't you see a
Penguins lead, 3-1       CUP CHAMPIONS :-)  strong resemblance..."-DG '89

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54752
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: Caps postseason fortunes

In article <1rhddoINN4l9@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu>, admiral@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Steve
C Liu) says:
>Okay, the Caps AGAIN are about to break out the golf clubs but before they
>do, does anyone have the history of the Washington Capitals' futility
>record in the playoffs? I remember that Terry's first year was the first

Don't give up so soon.  A lot of Burgh fans didn't give up at 3-1 last year.
You gotta believe!  (Hard as that may seem)  With the Caps with the #1 power
play in the playoffs and #1 penalty killing (according to Mike Lange) all
the Caps have to do is make sure it doesn't go OT...as that was Boston's and
Chicago's demise.  OT can be a curse.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54753
From: "William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Where are all the Bruins fans???

Good point - there haven't even been any recent posts about Ulf! 
Secretly, I'm convinced that he's responsible for the Bs being down 3-0
to Buffalo, somehow.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54754
From: vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu (David Vergolini)
Subject: Buffalo Sabres

  Ok, Buffalo fans.  I am a Red Wings fan, but am amazed at how the Sabres are
beating up on the Bruins.  Is there any reason for this?  Is it Grant Fuhr or
Mogilny and Lafontaine?  I would like to hear from you since I do not know much
about the Sabres.





                                                Dave Vergolini
                                                Michigan State University
                                                vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54755
From: Andy <2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
Subject: Re: CBC: Canadian for ESPN.

In article <C63tEF.63C@cs.dal.ca>, reiniger@ug.cs.dal.ca (Darren Reiniger) says:
>
> I'd like to echo these sentiments.  This is the worst coverage I can
> ever remember seeing on CBC.  As soon as the game ends, I can count to 30,
> and by that time, they've signed off the air.  No post game interviews,
> no updating of late scores, nothin'.  TSN is really putting CBC to
> shame.  I only hope the later round coverage improves, I mean, who
> really wants to see CBC PrimeTime News instead of hockey.
>
> My $.02,
>  Darren

This was a concession to Mansbridge and CBC News, they argued that if you're
going to play  havoc with the schedule, you should  at least make sure that
Prime Time is aired as soon as possible. News got a commitment that the
post-game show would be scrapped and that the network would go to PTN within
one minute or so of the game  ending.

As for the earlier comments about CBC being "Ontariocentric" frankly
the no doubleheader decison goes both ways, people in the West cant  see
the Leafs  and people in Central Canada can't see the Jets game. The
reason for the decision was CBC's feeling they couldn't sell advertising
for six hours of hockey in  one night.

 As for who wants to see news over hockey, a lot of people. CBC always gets
plenty of complaints about juggling the news schedule.



>
>--
> Darren Reiniger                   reiniger@ug.cs.dal.ca || arishem@ac.dal.ca
> Centre For Marine Geology, Dalhousie University, Halifax, N.S., Canada
>| People who wonder where this generation is going should remind themselves
>|
>| where it came from in the first place.
>|

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54756
From: Mamatha Devineni Ratnam <mr47+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Real FAns



There was a discussion about how real fans were ones who respect their teams
no matter ow bad they are. That's bullshit. Anyone who would follow the
Pens or the Pirates in parts of the early eighties on a devoted basis are
losers. It's OK to follow and be concerned about your home team. But
to  give them respect even when it is clear the management and the players suck
should not be required of a true fan.A  true fan would follow the team in
troubled times to the extent that they could discuss how to improve the team.

When I visit PIttsburgh, I'll refuse to go to a Pirates game since I think
the management has given PIttsburgh a team which could have been much better
even if they couldn't sign Barry Bonds. Lert's say the Pens start doing to
their own team what the Oilers have done this year and what the Whalers have
done in recent years, I would be hard pressed to show much enthusiasm for the
team. I'll still follow it and bitch about it. But I won't waste my
money on mediocre teams.

-P{ravin Ratnam

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54757
From: umward10@news.cc.umanitoba.ca (Derek Ward)
Subject: Re: Winnipeg vs. Vancouver

David Downie (dave@downie.commerce.ubc.ca) wrote:
: 
: Speaking of Paddock--what's he doing slagging Sandlak?  If Sandlak puts  
: his mind to it, he can be a physical presence and waking him up might be a  
: real mistake.

	Isn't Sandbag out with an injury now anyways?  Perhaps Paddock
meant to say that Momesso was the cheap short artist.  After all, that
would make more sense.

--
  ___   ___  ___   ___                     _  _  ___   ______
 / ./  /_   /__/  /_   /_./   | | Wpg   __// |_   |    \ 
/_/   /__  /  \  /__  /  \    | |      |__/  |_   |  __/     in '93!
umward10@ccu.umanitoba.ca <-> Computer Science <-> U of Manitoba 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54758
From: ballb@carr113.alleg.edu (Brett Ball)
Subject:  Re:NHL letter

If you wanted to send your own letter to the NHL where would you send it?
Brett E. Ball

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54759
From: gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: Winnipeg vs. Vancouver


In article G2o@ccu.umanitoba.ca, umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner) writes:

>Oh yeah...and I CAN go to the Arena and see not one, not two, but
>*six* championship banners hanging from the rafters.  3 Stanley Cup
>banners, and 3 Avco Cup banners.  My NHL guide says that Vancouver has
>won the Cup once (as many times as the rockin' town of Kenora has won it!)

Don't let this confuse anybody.  The Winnipeg Jets have never won the
Stanley Cup (or even come that close).  These Stanley Cup championships
go back a LONG way to about the turn of the century.  The Winnipeg
Victorias won one or more of these Cups- the Jets didn't win any of
them.

Can you think of anything more irrelevant to argue about a playoff
series going on today than who won more Stanley Cups around the turn
of the century??

Lets face facts.  The Canucks are leading the series 3-1.  The Canucks
dominated the Jets in their season series.  The Canucks did better in
the regular season than Winnipeg.  Who is the better team?  I think
that the facts show that Vancouver is better than Winnipeg.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54760
From: jgold@chopin.udel.edu (Jonathan Goldstein)
Subject: Re: The Amazin' Isles!!!!!!

WATCH OUT PITSBURGH HERE COME THE ISLES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



They said we wouldn't make the playoffs and we came in third
They said the Caps would beat us and they're not going to
They say that Pitsburgh has a 1:1 ratio of winning the cup but We'll prove them
wrong.


L E T S   G O    I S L A N D E R S!!!!!!!  Bring it back home





-- 
            //////////   /////////   //      //
                  //       //     //   // /   //
                 //        //     //   //  /  //
                //         //     //   /    / //

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54761
From: ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry-New Pens Annoucer?

lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico) writes:


>In an article published in this morning's Pittsburgh Post Gazette,
>KBL (the Pgh. cable sports channel) President Bill Craig has 
>confirmed that he has had preliminary talks with the Mouth of
>the North, Don Cherry.  Craig said he is interested in hiring Cherry
>as color commentator and for post game duties.

>Others being considered for the open broadcasting jobs are current
>Pens announcers Mike Lange and Paul Steigerwald (Craig spoke to
>both yesterday), KBL's Stan Savaran and Guy Junker, ESPN's Mike
>Emrick, MN broadcaster Doug McCloud, and TSN's Jim Hughson.

>KBL and the Penguins have just inked a new deal, giving KBL all 
>TV and radio rights to Pens games.  Plans are that KBL would like
>to have an entire night of hockey, starting with a 7:00 pre-game
>show and running to a post game show that would sign off about 11:00
>(depending upon length of the game).

>Don Cherry announcing Penguins games.  Yeah, and (to quote Pgh's
>goofy mayor) I'm the Queen of Sheba.

Considering how often and how badly he has slammed the Pens on Coach's 
Corner on Hockey Night in Canada, it would surprise me as well.  But then,
people will do anything for money, won't they?


>Lori
>Contact for the Penguins
>lli+@cs.cmu.edu

--Randy


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54762
From: ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca)
Subject: Re: Wings will win

gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:


>In article 116@orasis.vis.toronto.edu, bdown@vis.toronto.edu (Brian Down) writes:
>>
[stuff deleted]

>For example, look at Pat Quinn of the Canucks (I am not saying
>that he is the best GM - merely a better one than Murray - and
>one I am very familiar with).

>He traded:
>Garth Butcher (a good player) and Dan Quinn (not in the NHL anymore)
>to St Louis for Cliff Ronning, Geoff Courtnall, Sergio Mommesso and
>Robert Dirk   - too good to be true right

I think this goes along with a comment you made in an earlier post -
namely, Quinn taking advantage of a major league bonehead for a GM
in St. Louis.  This trade was an absolutely stupid trade for St. Louis,
and it was not the only stupid trade that this guy made.  We can give
Quinn credit for being an opportunist here.

[stuff about other trades deleted]

>Plus his team has improved a much greater amount than Detroit since
>he took over with them.

How do you figure?  Both Vancouver and Detroit did the same thing last year:
They both won their division, they had close to the same number of points,
they both went down 3-1 in the first round of the playoffs before finally
escaping in 7 games, and they both got knocked out in the second round by
teams they should have been able to beat, with less talent.  (Specifically,
if I remember correctly, third place teams).  How does this make Vancouver
more improved?  Further, if I'm not mistaken, the Wings had more points than
Vancouver at the end of this season (albeit not many). 

>Gregmeister

--Randy


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54763
From: Andy <2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
Subject: Re: If Oilers go to Hamilton

In article <1993Apr26.023650.16749@spang.Camosun.BC.CA>,
ua256@freenet.Victoria.BC.CA (Tom Moffat) says:
>
>If the Oilers move to Hamilton what division will they play in .

And won't they have to change their name to the "Steelers" or something.
The only significant deposits of oil around Hamilton are those caused by
the tire fire a  few years back.

Then again if the NBA can have the Utah Jazz or the L.A. Lakers (think about
it, what lakes are in L.A.) then I guess the NHL can have the Hamilton Oilers.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54764
From: Mike D'Amico <miked77@bnr.ca>
Subject: Senators sign top draft picks

Reports in Ottawa today say that the Senators have come to a verbal
agreement with last seasons first pick and 2nd overall choice Alexei
Yashin on a 5 year deal. As well the Senators have signed their second
round pick Chad Penney who is currently playing for the Sault Ste. Marie
Greyhounds in the Ontario Junior league playoffs.

Mike D'Amico
BNR
Ottawa, Ontario

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54765
From: yatrou@INRS-Telecom.Uquebec.CA (Paul Yatrou)
Subject: Re: Stewart homered the Wings!!

In <andy.bgsu.edu-250493225109@m248-100.bgsu.edu> andy.bgsu.edu (Ryan ) writes:

>  Paul Stewart called *the* single worst game I've seen this year.
> Federov's major was obvious, and I don't dispute it.  
>However, Chaisson's penalty shouldn't even have been a penalty, let alone
> a major and a game misconduct.
>

I don't "notice" refs and linesmen until the playoffs come around, and
yes I have to agree that Stewart called the *two* worst games I've seen
so far (Mtl-Quebec game 1, and last nights Toronto-Detroit game).

What's the scoop on this guy? Is he the latest incarnation of
KERRY FRASER??? Just because you are boneheadedly stubborn doesn't
make you a good ref!!! Making the right call does...

My votes for:
Best Ref: Van Hellemond
Most Improved: Koharski
Worst: Paul Stewart

(Oops, I don't really want to start a best/worst ref thread so don't
follow up ;-)

Paul Yatrou.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54766
From: "Carl D. Lovejoy" <cl3d+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Don Cherry-New Pens Annoucer?

>KBL and the Penguins have just inked a new deal, giving KBL all 
>TV and radio rights to Pens games.  Plans are that KBL would like
>to have an entire night of hockey, starting with a 7:00 pre-game
>show and running to a post game show that would sign off about 11:00
>(depending upon length of the game).
> 
>Don Cherry announcing Penguins games.  Yeah, and (to quote Pgh's
>goofy mayor) I'm the Queen of Sheba.
> 
>Lori
>Contact for the Penguins
>lli+@cs.cmu.edu

    Well I was watching Hockey Hotline last night and Stan said that the
station (KBL) had been recieving calls all day concerning this subject. 
And the verdict was that almost exclusively NOBODY wanted that load
mouth, know it all blow hard, former Bruin whiner, Ulf Hating, scum
sucking, Pr*ck of missery in Pittsburgh on a permanent basis.  That's
not exactly what Stan said;  I did do a bit of interpriting.


The CMU Kiddie

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54767
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER (***QUITE LONG***)

[obnoxious name-calling deleted]

	Ok, who wants rm off of here? I say we get his net privleges revoked.
	Any seconds?

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54768
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER (***QUITE LONG***)


	Roger,

	    SHUT UP.

 	Thank you.

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54769
From: Mark@tdkt.kksys.com (MARK STEIGER)
Subject: Minnesota Shame?

SH>I'm a hockey fan from way back, and maintain an interest as best I can
  >here in the hockey hinterlands (Oklahoma).  I'm hoping I can get a
  >reading from some of you about the move of the North Stars to Dallas.

SH>I've been under the impression that Minnesota was one of, or possibly,
  >THE hockey state in the U.S.  So why is the team moving to a city in
  >Texas?  Is it that the owner is a greedy, self-serving profiteer, or
  >were the Stars really not making a profit?  Or was the city or whoever
  >owned the arena doing some price gouging?

SH>As much as I'd like to see the NHL only a 3 hour drive from me, I
  >can't help but feel for the people in Minnesota, unless they truly
  >didn't support the team.

SH>Opinions, please.

I used to work for the Stars.  Minnesota supported the team to an
extent.  When I was there, we had quite afew sellouts (This was the
season after the cup run and during the finals).  Norm's main bitch was
that there wasn't enough luxury suites.  And, the ones he had were not
always full.  He wanted more boxes and wanted them full.  He was just
asking for too much from people that could go and see other hockey games
at High Schools for $5 or college for about $10 that would probably be
better.

Mark

  QMPro 1.01 41-6393  Radioactive cats are very, very HOT!

 * Origin: Origin Line Not Defined In GOEDIT (1:282/4018)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54770
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: Springfield Indians/AHL office

Here is something crossposted from the AHL mailing list:			

In a discussion between me and Chris Lerch, the subject of Springfield's 
1st round upset of the Providence Bruins
came up. Chris basically raised the possibility that the AHL 
hierarchy is biased in favor of the Indians. He noted that the offices
for the league are in Spring. and many ex-Indians are working for the AHL.
Furthermore, he also informed me that back a few years ago in the Cup 
finals between Roch and Spring, that the Amerks charged favoritism by the office
and that:

"...there were little questionable things liket he AHL president and
staff attending all games with the Springfield brass, including sitting
in their box for the game in Springfield and, according to the Rochester
media, openly cheering for Springfield."

Certainly this is something that is quite serious if any of this
is true. I don't know if this is anything more than whining on the
part of the Amerks (they have pulled this sort of crap against the
Wings before) but if true, this is somthing that seriously raises
questions about President Jack Butterfield's leadership.

BTW- This was posted with the permission of Chris

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54771
From: filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu (Geoff Filinuk)
Subject: Wash/Isl OT game


	This comes indirectly from Al Morgani who works in the studio
for ESPN hockey.

	The management of ESPN was reluctant to leave the Pitt-NJ game 
(even though the outcome was certain) because of fear of the Wash-Ny game 
going to overtime.  When the Caps scored with :02 left to tie the game, Al said
he heard many people say f**K .!#$%.  
	ESPN is under contractual obligation to show baseball and COULD NOT
broadcast the OT of the hockey game.  Next year, ESPN2 will be introduced so 
baseball fans can watch baseball and hockey fans can watch hockey.

	GET OFF ESPN'S BACK AND STOP POSTING ARTICLES ON THIS SUBJECT!!!
There have been to many f****n complainers about this game that it's making me
sick.

Geoff Filinuk

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54772
From: golf@phoenix.oulu.fi (Jouko Kylmaoja)
Subject: WC, pool A

210493
Italy-Sweden 2-6 (0-1,1-2,1-3)
                       W D L             
	Canada      2  2 0 0  6-1  4
	Sweden      3  2 0 1  8-6  4
	Russia      2  1 1 0  6-4  3
 	Italy	    3  1 1 1  5-8  3
	----------------------------
	Austria	    2  0 0 2  2-5  0
	Switzerland 2  0 0 2  0-3  0

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54773
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER (***QUITE LONG***)

In article <1993Apr26.054446.29764@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> phoenix@startide.ctr.columbia.edu (Ali Lemer) writes:
>Ali "Procrastination" Lemer || "I gave [NHL Commissioner Gary Bettman] a puck
>Columbia University (NYC)   || once. He spent the rest of the day trying to 
>phoenix@ctr.columbia.edu    || open it." -- Pat Williams, GM, Orlando Magic
>***************** BE KIND TO ANIMALS...HUG A HOCKEY PLAYER! *******************

	Nice sig. Like the change. 
	BTW: Could you post the names of the people who are going to be on the
letter? I (and I'm sure others) would like to know if we are included. If I'm
not I want to be! Roger is a fool!

	
-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54774
From: tervio@katk.Helsinki.FI (TERVI| MARKO J)
Subject: Re: switzerland at WC93

In article <1993Apr23.113132.690@vms.huji.ac.il> hechel@vms.huji.ac.il writes:


>  does anybody know if this WC is the qualification tournement for
>the olympic games '94 in Lillehammer or are some teams already
>qualified for them.

>hopp schwiiz
>           daniel

The top 11 teams of this tournament will play in the Olympics next year.
The last team of this tournament, top two of pool B (Great Britain and 
Poland) and the winner of pool C (Latvia) will play for the last Olympic 
spot next fall.
  However, if next year's hosts Norway were to finish 12th (which would be 
no surprise), then it's the 11th team of pool A that will have to play in 
the qualification tournament.  

    Marko Tervio

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54775
From: bm562@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Richard L. Trionfo)
Subject: Re: Caps moving ?????


   Why would Pollin want to move the Caps, because I think he
owns the Cap Centre.  I know they don't sell out all of their 
games, but they draw a lot more than the Bullets.  If you
had the situation that Abe had, would you move if you were
guaranteed that anyone who went to the games would have to 
park at the stadium, because there has been nothing within
a half mile, until the recent construction in
the area.
   Can they win a game in OT again.
       Rich
-- 
  "You've read the hat, now see the movie."
                   -Imus in the morning 
  "A blurb? You're a blurb!"
                   -Seinfeld

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54776
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

In article <BSON.93Apr22060320@nutrimat.gnu.ai.mit.edu> bson@gnu.ai.mit.edu (Jan Brittenson) writes:
>
>   Which doesn't mean much since the statistics are mostly based on
>the 5-game playoff format. But, yes, it looks dark for the B's. What a
>disappointment.

The Fat Lady is about to hit the first note...Okay,how about 3-0 deficits?
The B's chances for a comeback are now less 1%(That's based on 7-game
playoff format)...

>   Who do you think gets the start in game three? I hope it is going
>to be Blue. If the team can rally around him, maybe Moog can too.
 
He got the start but the headlines on all Boston local TV sportscats
said it all : "Sutter Blue It!". And he did.

Harry Sinden's appearance outside of B's dressing room after Game 3
was a pathetic site. He said something really retarded to cover Sutter's
behind,"This game is not about winning or losing..". Harry,check the
schedule! Your team is in the playoffs and about to go on a long summer
vacation on Sunday morning!

Harry and his buttkisser Milbury will never admit that they screwed up
in a major way when they brought in one of the dumbest people in the
business,Brian Sutter. Sutter's playoff record as the head coach in St.Louis
speaks for itself. The Blues really have a chance to advance to the
second round this year...

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54777
From: fswbl@aurora.alaska.edu
Subject: RE: Regular season 93/94 pool

THIS IS WHAT I CAME UP WITH USING THE FINAL REGULAR SEASON STATS FOR THE
92/93, WHICH YOU CAN FIND IN THE APRIL 22, 1993 EDITION OF THE USA TODAY!
TRY IT OUT AND SEE WHAT YOU COME UP WITH.....

 1. ADAM OATES           C    BRUINS     145 PTS
 2. TEEMU SELANNE       RW    JETS       136 PTS
 3. ALEXANDER MOGILNY   RW    SABRES     131 PTS
 4. PAVEL BURE          RW    CANUCKS    116 PTS
 5. VINCENT DAMPHOUSSE  LW    CANADIANS  106 PTS
 6. DAVE ANDREYCHUK     LW    MAPLELEAFS 104 PTS
 7. PHIL HOUSLEY        RD    JETS       103 PTS
 8. PAUL COFFEY         RD    REDWINGS    94 PTS
 9. SERGEI FEDOROV       C    REDWINGS    94 PTS
10. ANDY MOOG            G    BRUINS      86 PTS
11. AL INFRATE          RD    CAPITIALS   82 PTS
12. PATRICK ROY          G    CANADIANS   76 PTS
13. AL MACINNIS         LD    FLAMES      60 PTS
14. DENNIS SAVARD        C    CANADIANS   59 PTS
15. CALLE JOHANSSON     LD    CAPITALS    50 PTS
16. YURI KHMYLEV        LW    SABRES      41 PTS
17. RICHARD SMEHLIK     LD    SABRES      36 PTS
------------------------------------------------
    TOTAL POINTS                        1519 PTS

MOST VALUABLE PLAYER: ADAM OATES
ROOKIE OF THE YEAR: TEEMU SELANNE
MOST IMPROVED PLAYER: VINCENT DAMPHOUSSE
DEFENSEMAN OF THE YEAR: PHIL HOUSLEY
GOALIE OF THE YEAR: PATRICK ROY

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54778
From: LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall)
Subject: Re: Another travesty at the Joe Louis

In article <1993Apr22.114213.3391@mtroyal.ab.ca>
caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca writes:
 
>(Detroit, April 21)
>
>Most knowledgable observers once again watched in shock as the Detroit Red
>Wings again beat the best goaltender in the world six times en route to
>another easy victory over the best team in the NHL.
>
>For the best goaltender in the world, Felix Potvin, six was a bad number as
>he surrendered six goals and collected six minutes in penalties in reponse
>to the goon tactics employed by the inferior Red Wings team.
>
>                                                                Alan
>
>P.S. We told you this would happen, Roger. Didn't we? I love it.....
 
 
 
 
 
 Where is Roger anyway?  Haven't heard from him in awhile.  He must
be out on the golf course waiting for the Leafs to join him any day
now. : )
 
 
 
Laurie Marshall
Wayne State University
Detroit, Michigan
Go Wings!!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54779
From: twork@egr.msu.edu (Michael Twork)
Subject: Re: Wings News and Playoff Thoughts

>roots in Detroit.  He would be a valuable asset to the Wings and Perhaps the
>Rangers could get a Zombo in return?

  
 
Wake up and smell the Norris!!  Rick Zombo was traded to the Blues for Vince
Riendo (sp?) last season.  

- Mike




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54780
From: hallg@lead.egr.msu.edu (Gregory Hall)
Subject: Re: Wings News and Playoff Thoughts


|> As far as Cheveldae is concerned, he is a decent goalie.  The most logical
|> trade in the offseason to me would be between Detroit and NY Rangers.  I'm sure
|> if Beezer would be traded he would enjoy the opportunity to go back to his
|> roots in Detroit.  He would be a valuable asset to the Wings and Perhaps the
|> Rangers could get a Zombo in return?  Beezer got a few good years in him and
|> the opportunity to get a fresh start would energize his play.
|> 

Only problem is that Zombo was traded to St. Louis last year for goalie
Vincent Riendeau.

I think that while Chevy is not among the elite class of goalies, he is
adequate given the offensive firepower of the Wings.

Greg

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54896
From: roney@selkirk.sfu.ca (Chris J. Roney)
Subject: Re: Hey, What about teh Cannucks?

grogers@slacvx.slac.stanford.edu (Greg Rogers) writes:

>Hi all,

>Due to living in the Bay Area, I as unable to see Vancouver's victory over
>the Jets last night.  I know the score, but that rarely describes the game.
>Could someone please post a brief sonapsis (sp?) of waht happened.  How well
>did each team play?  Were the cannucks deserving of the victory?


    Well, in my opinion the Canucks played a really strong game. I was
especially pleased by a very strong game from Linden - I think he
could be a key to success for them this year.  Defensively, they
really had a strong game.  Hardly heard Selanne's name all night.
Craven also played one of his best games since coming over.  With a
few exceptions, they really didn't let the high-flying Jets do much
high-flying.  I thought the Jets defence looked overmatched by the
Canucks forwards - they will have to improve on that if they want to
make this a series.

    In short, it was a great start!

-- 
Chris Roney  (e-mail chris_roney@sfu.ca)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54897
From: loh@fraser.sfu.ca (Keith Meng-Wei Loh)
Subject: Canucks 3-2 over Winnipeg

	The Jets gave the Canucks another run for their money in an almost
identical game to the first of the series but once again came up short as
Vancouver outscored Winnipeg 3-2.
	The pattern of the first game was repeated tonight, with the Canucks
scoring quickly and then going to sleep in the second period, only to stave
off a Jet comeback with opportune goals from their greater talent. The Jets
looked more dangerous in this one but it didn't make a difference in the 
numbers that counted: goals.
	Vancouver's big line produced again, with centre Cliff Ronning and
left winger Geoff Courtnall scoring in the first and in the second to 
boost the Canucks to a 2-0 lead on giveaways by the suspect Jet defence of
Bautin and Ulanov. Mental lapses by the defence and goal-scoring talent
in opportune areas made the difference in all three Canuck goals.
	However, as in the first game, the Jets worked hard to take the
game to the Canucks in the second period. The Jets dominated the second,
checking hard and penetrating the Vancouver zone without being challenged
by a Canuck team that wanted to pack it in early. 
	The hard work paid off late in the second, when Tie Domi caught
Vancouver goalie Kirk McLean by surprise with a sharp angle shot to make
the score 2-1. 
	Domi's goal gave the Jets new life as they began to take the rush
to the Canuck's collapsing defence. The Canucks were unwilling to do 
anything but let McLean take shots and clear the rebounds. The Jets were
allowed to set up and make plays.
	Both goalies made standup saves as the play picked up considerably.
McLean made three great saves in the second off a dancing Teammu Selanne
while Essensa was rocked by a Pavel Bure drive. Selanne looked dangerous
on the rush as the Jets pressed a series of attacks into the Canuck
zone. The Canucks, on the other hand, looked like they were offering four
checking lines in an effort to preserve their slim lead.
	A series of minor penalties at the end of the second period
resulted in a one man advantage for the Jets in the early third. The
Jet's Tempo Numminen drove a puck from the point through McLean's
legs and into the net to tie the game at 2-2.
	The Canuck's discordant play picked up where it left off.
This was characterized by long lead passes that either never connected
or were picked off by the Jets and individual rushes into a tight
Winnipeg defence that were never supported.
	However, as in the first and second Canuck goals, a Jet defensive
lapse (re: bonehead play) stalled the Winnipeg comeback. With the faceoff
in the Winnipeg zone, Pavel Bure was left to stand in the crease with
no Jet defender anywhere near him. Bure, who had been invisible in the
game up to that point, took a rebound and managed to roof it with a 
backhand even though he was off balance. 
	By then it was too late for the Jets to come back. Essensa made it
to the bench with one minute to go but the extra attacker did nothing
for their attack. Canucks 3, Winnipeg 2.
	Next game is Friday at Winnipeg with the Jets in the hole by two games.
- 30 -



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 54900
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER (***QUITE LONG***)

In article <1993Apr25.222739.16828@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>In <1993Apr25.214053.21752@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> phoenix@startide.ctr.columbia.edu (Ali Lemer) writes:
>
>
>>Dear Mr. Bettman -
>
(Ali's letter deleted for brevity)

>[...] (Roger's acid-laced response removed)
>Maybe we should get together and establish some kind of mandatory maturity
>level to keep some of this stuff off of the air.

Roger,
Your responses might just exclude you from sharing your opinions,
then.  You see, the same rights Ali has to mail her letter to the NHL
are the same ones that let you post replies that mow her down like
wheat at harvest-time.  She never said she represented the entire
internet or the entire group rec.sport.hockey.  She has every right to
state her opinion along with those of the fifty or sixty or
hundred-odd folk who've agreed to allow her to list their names on the
bottom of it.  You may not agree with it.  Fine.  I really don't care
enough about the name change to care.  Your name isn't attached to it,
so why moan and complain?  If you felt her words were leading, well,
you're free to feel that way and take exception, but manners never
hurt.  I personally disagree and feel her generalizations were fine
(I have the right to think and say that, too).  Ali's under no
compunction to change a single word.  Now, while you're free to
disagree with every word she wrote, to tear apart her character is
uncalled for.  I'm posting this as a form of public reprimand.  If you
tear down Ali's integrity and character publicly, you'll get chastised
publicly in return.  Would it have been so hard to say, "Ali, please
be a bit more specific in your description, the way I've read it
indicates you're stating my view also, and that's simply not true.
I'd really like to see a disclaimer noting that you don't mean the
entire internet or the entire r.s.h. group attached to it, despite
your intent to list names at the bottom.  Thanks.  Cordially as
always," &c.  Calling her a moron and an asshole just reduces the
weight of your words and the opinions of their author in the eyes of
myself, and possibly others.  

Oh, and Ali, nice to see someone standing up for something, even if
it's not something I personally advocate.  :-)







-- 
Valerie Hammerl 	       John Sr. would lift Pat over the boards, grab 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu       his hand, and start running around the outside,
V085PWPZ@UBVMS.CC.BUFFALO.EDU  faster and faster.  "I wanted to learn how to 
get that feeling, and the only way was to learn how to skate."  P. LaFontaine

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
document_id: 55022
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: WC: Scores and standings, April 18


 1993 World Championships in Germany:
 ====================================

	Group A standings (Munich)	Group B	standings (Dortmund)
	--------------------------	----------------------------

	           GP  W T L GF-GA P	              GP  W T L GF-GA P

	Sweden      1  1 0 0  1-0  2	Germany        1  1 0 0  6-0  2
	Italy       1  0 1 0  2-2  1 	Czech republic 1  0 1 0  1-1  1
	Russia      1  0 1 0  2-2  1	USA            1  0 1 0  1-1  1
	Canada      0  0 0 0  0-0  0	Finland        0  0 0 0  0-0  0
	Switzerland 0  0 0 0  0-0  0	France         0  0 0 0  0-0  0
	Austria     1  0 0 1  0-1  0	Norway         1  0 0 1  0-6  0

 
 April 18:  Italy - Russia    2-2           Norway - Germany      0-6
            Sweden - Austria  1-0           USA - Czech republic  1-1

 April 19:  Canada - Switzerland					15:30
            Russia - Austria                Finland - France		20:00

 April 20:  Sweden - Canada                 Czech republic - Germany	15:30
            Switzerland - Italy             Finland - USA		20:00

 April 21:                                  Germany - France		15:30
            Italy - Sweden                  Czech republic - Norway	20:00

 April 22:  Switzerland - Russia            USA - France		15:30
            Austria - Canada                Norway - Finland		20:00

 April 23:  Switzerland - Austria           Germany - Finland		20:00

 April 24:  Russia - Sweden                 Czech republic - France	15:30
            Canada - Italy                  USA - Norway		20:00

 April 25:  Sweden - Switzerland            Finland- Czech republic  	15:30
            Russia - Canada                 Germany - USA		20:00

 April 26:  Austria - Italy                 France - Norway		20:00

 
 PLAYOFFS:
 =========

 April 27:	Quarterfinals
		A #2 - B #3						15:30
		A #3 - B #2						20:00

 April 28:	Quarterfinals
		A #1 - B #4						15:30
		A #4 - B #1						20:00

 April 29:	Relegation
		A #5 - B #6						15:30
		A #6 - B #5						20:00

 April 30:	Semifinals
		A #1/B #4 - A #3/B #2					15:30
		A #4/B #1 - A #2/B #3					20:00

 May 1:		Relegation						14:30
		Bronze medal game 					19:00

 May 2:		FINAL							15:00

--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52550
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Superstars and attendance (was Teemu Selanne, was +/- leaders)


Dean J. Falcione (posting from jrmst+8@pitt.edu) writes:
[I wrote:]

>>When the Pens got Mario, granted there was big publicity, etc, etc,
>>and interest was immediately generated.  Gretzky did the same thing for LA. 
>>However, imnsho, neither team would have seen a marked improvement in
>>attendance if the team record did not improve.  In the year before Lemieux
>>came, Pittsburgh finished with 38 points.  Following his arrival, the Pens
>>finished with 53, 76, 72, 81, 87, 72, 88, and 87 points, with a couple of
                          ^^
>>Stanley Cups thrown in.
      
>It was at this point the Pens attendance was near capacity (34 out of 40 
>sellouts) yet they hadn't made the playoffs since 1982.  How do you explain
>a 6th place team breaking attendance records when they haven't been to the
>playoffs in 7 years?  Mario Lemieux is the explanation, IMHO.  

>You could make a case that the *expectation* of an improving team that
>would make the playoffs is the reason. 

Funny you should mention it...this is exactly the case I was going to make.

>But I think the reason is Lemieux
>had a 168 point season and was the first non-Gretzky to win the Hart and
>Ross since 1980.  People turned out to watch him play. 

I will grant that a star like Mario will draw fans, even if the team sucks. 
But this is short term only; I still do not think the attendance increase 
will last, unless the team is a winning/competitive/improving/butt-kicking
one.  Pittsburgh was still getting better, so people continued to support
them.  If they suddenly dropped to, say, 50 points, you'd have knee surgery
for some of the people jumping off the bandwagon.  

>Also, the following year (88-89) the Pens had 89 points not 87. 

Ok.  My numbers came from the NHL Guide and Record Book. 

>They made the transaction to try and build a winner around Mario, that is 
>true.  But the improvement in attendance came before they started doing
>this (Coffey late in 1987) and before they even had a playoff bound team.
>A doubling of attendance occured in 1984-85 from the previous year.  An
>increase from 38 points to 53 points is not going to do that.  The arrival
>of Mario Lemieux is what did it. 

You can give the credit to Mario since he deserves it.  But my point is that
it wasn't Mario himself, but it was the *expectation* of things to come (i.e.
a winning team) that he created by being the next great hockey superstar. And
before anybody jumps in and says I'm nit-picking and mincing words, go back
and read from where this thread started...

It might help to think about what would go through a fan's mind who suddenly
found an interest in Mario and the Pens.  Was it "gee, Mario Lemieux is
amazing, I'll go watch him play", or was it "gee, now we've got a *kick*
*ass* guy on *our* side, I'll go watch him play".  I think it was the latter.

> Similar thing happened in L.A.   Before
>Gretzky's arrival, about 12000 per game.  After, constant sellouts.  They
>are STILL selling out every game despite showing little or no improvement
>since Gretzky's first year there.  How do you explain it?  People are going
>to see Gretzky.  they certainly aren't going to see a winner, they haven't
>GOT a winner.  They've had MUCH better teams in their past history than
>they currently have, yet they didn't draw as well then.

I don't think this is accurate.  The *tickets* sell, but people don't go to
the games.  I think this thread has already been discussed...season ticket
holders in LA don't always use their tickets.  So in effect, after the Kings
initial success following Gretzky's arrival (68 to 91 points, same source)
and corresponding attendance jump, there has been an effective drop in
attendance even though ticket sales may not have changed much.  

Whether or not the Kings are a 'winner' is debatable.  I claim that since
Gretzky's arrival they have at the very least been competitive...I also claim
that McNall has made a stupid move in trying to reassemble the Oiler
dynasty...but that's another story and included only because I don't like
McNall:-).  Anyway,  McNall did do some heavy marketing around Gretzky, and
that undoubtedly was also responsible for the attendance and merchandising
sales, etc.  But as I said, when the Kings have been in there little
tailspins over the past couple of years there have been empty seats at the
Forum even if the tickets were sold.

>I think in the case of a Lemieux or Gretzky, the player can transcend
>winning as the major drawing power.  

For the short term, IMO.  Although I think that it's inevitable that the team
will improve with a player such as Lemieux or Gretzky, simply because they
make people around them better.

>But winning sure as hell helps.  ;-)

Well, at least we are in full agreement here!

>This does not make Roger's point any more valid, but the Jets aren't

So are you saying Roger has ever had a valid point? <couldn't resist...>

>getting a HUGE jump in productivity, yet they ARE getting a huge
>jump in attendance.  This is due to the emergence of Teemu Selanne.
>They have the 17th best record in hockey, it sure as hell isn't because
>they are winning.

Yes, but they are doing no worse than last year.  I think the same type of
reasoning I applied to a new Pittsburgh fan applies to all the extra people
showing up at Winnipeg games.  It's difficult to predict, but do you think
that if the Jets miss the playoffs next season that in the year after they
will maintain their attendance levels?  I seriously doubt it, because in that
case the expectation of an improving team would be gone, with or without
Selanne.

I did provide the example of Rocket Ismail and the Toronto Argonauts of the 
CFL...did you leave it out because you don't know much about the CFL?  If 
that's the case then fair enough, but if it isn't the case then I'm curious
to hear your explanation.



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52551
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: NHL team leaders in +/-

In article <1993Mar29.190650.28940@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:

>The Jets use the "breakaway pass" scheme to create a scoring sensation
>in order to generate interest.  If teams score as many or more goals
>against Winnipeg when Selanne is on the ice as Winnipeg scores when
>he is on the ice then I can't see how his contribution can be described
>as impressive.  

Implicitly you are assuming that goals scored against Winnipeg with Selanne
on the ice can be blamed on him...Roger, he is a FORWARD.  Winnipeg has a
lousy defensive record anyway.  Let's put it another way.  John Cullen's +/-
is terrible.  What's your excuse for him?  That his powerplay points don't
count?  Neither do Selanne's... 

>The object of the game is not to feed Selanne - it is 
>to win.  And feeding Selanne does not contribute in any meaningful way
>to winning.

Knowledgeable hockey observers the world over would agree that
feeding Selanne so he can score does contribute in a meaningful way to
winning. 

>Pat Burns wouldn't have a goal suck like this on his team.

You're worried about Teemu when you have Glenn Anderson on your team?

>We DON'T KNOW what Selanne does best.  We do know what Jet's management
>wants.  And again, the object of the exercise is not to allow Selanne to
>do what he does best, it is to win hockey games.

What he does best is score...so I refer you to my comment above.

>As it is now, Selanne
>is a grandstanding goal suck.  Did you see the way he parades around
>with his arms outstretched after scoring a goal?  You would think the
>Messiah had returned...

Nope, didn't see it.  I was too busy watching Foligno jump up and down after
_his_ goal....




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52552
From: jbarrett@aludra.usc.edu (Jonathan Barrett)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

I can only comment on the Kings, but the most obvious candidate for pleasant
surprise is Alex Zhitnik. He came highly touted as a defensive defenseman, but
he's clearly much more than that. Great skater and hard shot (though wish he
were more accurate). In fact, he pretty much allowed the Kings to trade away
that huge defensive liability Paul Coffey. Kelly Hrudey is only the biggest
disappointment if you thought he was any good to begin with. But, at best, he's
only a mediocre goaltender. A better choice would be Tomas Sandstrom, though
not through any fault of his own, but because some thugs in Toronto decided 
to threaten his career in order to avoid conceding a goal. Other than that, the
award goes to Robert Lang, an uninspiring Czech. Robitaille could easily be
MVP, but I'd prefer to give it to Rob Blake who is quietly becoming one of the
league's premier defensemen, and if the Kings manage to hold onto him and the 
rest of our young defense, it could one day mean that we'll let in fewer
goals than Hartford. Honorable mentions to Majestic Marty and Warren Rychel.
Jon

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52553
From: assist@orion.oac.uci.edu (ASSIST Coordination Site)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <C4zCII.Ftn@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca> smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale) writes:
>                         MVP           Biggest       Biggest
>                                       Suprise       Disappointment

>Los Angeles Kings       Robitaille     Donnelly      Hrudey


I would have chosen Alex Zhitnik for biggest suprise.  They
did expect that he would become a great defenseman, but I don't
think anyone knew that he was going to be this impressive in his 
rookie year.  His speed, skating ability, and puck control is
exceptional -- he is the one to watch on the Kings.


Kris
kris@fs2.assist.uci.edu

GO KINGS!

--

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52554
From: ching@coyote.WPI.EDU (Jay Heminger)
Subject: Re: NCAA finals...Winner????


Maine beat LSSU 5-4.


-- 
------------------------THE LOGISTICIAN REIGNS SUPREME!!!----------------------
|									      |
|   GO BLUE!!!   GO TIGERS!!!   GO PISTONS!!!   GO LIONS!!!   GO RED WINGS!!! |
-------------------------------ching@wpi.wpi.edu-------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52555
From: ayim@leibniz.uwaterloo.ca (Alfred Yim)
Subject: And... THEY'RE OFF!!!!!

Well, I gotta tell ya,

last night's Leafs game vs the Devils was a nail-bitter LET ME TELL YOU!
It was a well played game by BOTH teams (I thought) but according to the
Don and Ron it was the an "off-night" for the Leafs and the Devils 
were outplaying Toronto. Well, I BEG to differ....

IMHO, Clark deserved to be a first star as much as Gilmour did. His
fast breaks towards the net and the good opportunites that he
created reminded me of the Clark of old. (But not to take any of the
credit away from Gilmour).

I think the Leafs are playing GREAT hockey. WHY? 
Well first look at their injury list which includes, Cullen, Ellet,
Zezel, Macoun. Of course my question is this....how will the Leafs
fare when they are once again "healthy" if they are playing this well
so far??

Second, just look at their standings, still second in defence,
moved from 11th overall to 6th over in the last month, haven't lost
at home in last 12 games, 8 game undefeated streak..etc.
(BTW, am I wrong or was this Potvin's first shut-out? I can't 
remember him having any as of yet.)

Well, as of April 3 we see that the race for first in the Norris
has truly begun and it will be a VERY CLOSE race between Chicago and
Toronto. And the best game of the season will probably be their last
against each other. (is anyone lucky enough to have tickets to
see this one?)

Coming to the stretch and still a ROAR'IN!!!!!
Go LEAFS Go!!!!
-- 
****************************************** 
*  Alfred (Yong-Jeh) Yim                 *   Toronto wins the  
*  4B Mathematics (Actuarial Science)    *     (   ?    )    CUP.
*  University of Waterloo, Canada.       *  i like "coca-cola" idea personally
*  E-mail: ayim@descartes.waterloo.edu   *  
*****************************************************************************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52556
From: jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM (Jason Cockroft)
Subject: Re: "Give Blood" Tee Shirts


>The shirts are believe or not from a Bob Probert line of clothes.
>The whole shirt says "Give Blood - Fight Probie".


Cool.  They sound like a cult classic.  Can someone post a address or
phone # of a store that sells these?

Thanks,

-jake.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52557
Subject: NCAA finals...Winner????
From: ktgeiss@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu

Lake State/Maine in finals...WHO WON?   Please post.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52558
From: MWEINTR@auvm.american.edu
Subject: Re: Trade rumor: Montreal/Ottawa/Phillie

Also sprach slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca ...

>TSN Sportsdesk just reported that the OTTAWA SUN has reported that
>Montreal will send 4 players + $15 million including Vin Damphousse
>and Brian Bellows to Phillidelphia, Phillie will send Eric Lindros
>to Ottawa, and Ottawa will give it's first round pick to Montreal.
>
>If this is true, it will most likely depend on whether or not Ottawa
>gets to choose 1st overall.  Can Ottawa afford Lindros' salary?
>
>Personally, I can't see Philli giving up Lindros -- for anything.
>They didn't give away that much to Quebec just to trade him away
>again.  Not to mention that Lindros seems to be a *huge* draw in
>Phillie -- and that he represents a successful future for the
>franchise.
>
>Ottawa may be better off taking the 4 players +$15 from Montreal
>for the pick.
>
>Stephen Legge
>SLEGGE@kean.ucs.munc.ca

Two things:

1. Didn't the trade deadline pass two weeks ago?

2. The FLYERS would never ever EVER give up Lindros, simple as that.

Go Flyers, Cup in '94...

Mike
---
***Yes-Rush-Marillion-ELP-Genesis-King Crimson-Dream Theater-Beatles***
* Mike Weintraub, aka Jvi on IRC              "Courageous convictions *
* mweintr@american.edu                         will drag the dream    *
* jedi@wave.cerf.net                           into existence"        *
* The American University, Washington DC        - Rush (NOT Limbaugh) *
***Go Philadelphia Flyers, Vancouver Canucks & Philadelphia Phillies***

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52559
From: galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin)
Subject: Re: Re-Alignnment, Expansion

In article <C4zHJ1.7xB@idacom.hp.com> andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott) writes:
>In article <1993Apr2.175946.7727@nntpd2.cxo.dec.com> nixdorf@etre (Eric Nixdorf) writes:
>>
>>     Looking at the way the divisions were re-aligned, there are six teams each
>>in the Central (Norris) and Pacific (Smyth) divisions, while there are seven
>>teams each in the Northeast (Adams) and Atlantic (Patrick) divisions.  The
>>thought occurs to me that inherent in the realignment is expansion of one team
>>in the Central division and one team in the Pacific division, although I've
>>seen nothing published that indicates that.
>
>Actually, when the NHL expansion committee was formed a couple of years back
>(before the Ottawa and Tampa Bay expansion), John Zeigler stated at the time
>that it was the NHL's expansion plan to grow to 28 teams (7 per division) by
>the turn of the century.
>
>-- 
>Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
>HP IDACOM Telecom Division      | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253
>
>During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Last night during a Sharks' broadcast, Commissioner Bettman was
interviewed during the first intermission.  He made no bones about it,
the expansion to 28 is on permanent hold until he is satisfied that
the current allotment of 26 are fully stable.  This means that cities
looking for a club in the foreseeable future will have to wait until
one team in some location fails or looks to relocate.

This is good, IMO.  There's no sense in expanding if it only means
more failing franchises are in the mold.

-Tom Galvin             galvint@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52560
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Sat, April 3, 1993
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)

Tampa Bay                        1 1 0--2
Philadelphia                     3 2 1--6
First period
     1, Philadelphia, Carkner 3 (unassisted) 1:24.
     2, Philadelphia, Hawgood 9 (Recchi, Lindros) pp, 5:56.
     3, Philadelphia, Lindros 37 (Recchi, Hawgood) pp, 9:52.
     4, Tampa Bay, Beers 12 (Zamuner, Chambers) pp, 15:06.
Second period
     5, Tampa Bay, Andersson 13 (Hamrlik, Lafreniere) pp, 1:58.
     6, Philadelphia, Conroy 3 (Butsayev, Faust) 12:10.
     7, Philadelphia, Beranek 13 (Galley, Hawgood) pp, 18:53.
Third period
     8, Philadelphia, Recchi 51 (Brind'Amour, Galley) pp, 17:56.

Philadelphia: 6    Power play: 5-4
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Beranek            1    0    1
Brind'Amour        0    1    1
Butsayev           0    1    1
Carkner            1    0    1
Conroy             1    0    1
Faust              0    1    1
Galley             0    2    2
Hawgood            1    2    3
Lindros            1    1    2
Recchi             1    2    3

Tampa Bay: 2    Power play: 7-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Andersson          1    0    1
Beers              1    0    1
Chambers           0    1    1
Hamrlik            0    1    1
Lafreniere         0    1    1
Zamuner            0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Vancouver                        1 0 0--1
Detroit                          2 2 1--5
First period
     1, Detroit, Kozlov 4 (Fedorov, Chiasson) 5:20.
     2, Detroit, Drake 17 (Ciccarelli, Coffey) pp, 7:48.
     3, Vancouver, Ronning 24 (Slegr, Bure) pp, 17:35.
Second period
     4, Detroit, Sheppard 30 (Drake, Hiller) 6:54.
     5, Detroit, Ciccarelli 38 (Chiasson, Drake) pp, 12:13.
Third period
     6, Detroit, Ysebaert 31 (Fedorov, Cheveldae) sh, 4:59.

Detroit: 5    Power play: 5-2   Special goals:  pp: 2  sh: 1  Total: 3
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Cheveldae          0    1    1
Chiasson           0    2    2
Ciccarelli         1    1    2
Coffey             0    1    1
Drake              1    2    3
Fedorov            0    2    2
Hiller             0    1    1
Kozlov             1    0    1
Sheppard           1    0    1
Ysebaert           1    0    1

Vancouver: 1    Power play: 6-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bure               0    1    1
Ronning            1    0    1
Slegr              0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Buffalo                          1 1 0--2
Boston                           1 1 1--3
First period
     1, Buffalo, Audette 12 (Corkum, Wood) 16:40.
     2, Boston, Juneau 30 (Neely, Oates) 18:39.
Second period
     3, Buffalo, Errey 9 (LaFontaine, Khmylev) 10:51.
     4, Boston, Douris 3 (D.Sweeney, Bourque) 17:57.
Third period
     5, Boston, Donato 12 (unassisted) 17:42.

Boston: 3    Power play: 4-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bourque            0    1    1
Donato             1    0    1
Douris             1    0    1
Juneau             1    0    1
Neely              0    1    1
Oates              0    1    1
Sweeney D          0    1    1

Buffalo: 2    Power play: 5-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Audette            1    0    1
Corkum             0    1    1
Errey              1    0    1
Khmylev            0    1    1
LaFontaine         0    1    1
Wood               0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Calgary                          1 1 0 1--3
San Jose                         0 2 0 0--2
First period
     1, Calgary, Suter 21 (Reichel, MacInnis) pp, 17:47.
Second period
     2, San Jose, Zmolek 5 (Odgers, Evason) 3:03.
     3, San Jose, Kisio 24 (Garpenlov, Gaudreau) pp, 7:23.
     4, Calgary, Lindberg 9 (MacInnis) pp, 12:43.
Third period
     No scoring.
Overtime
     5, Calgary, Fleury 31 (Otto, Yawney) 3:06.

Calgary: 3    Power play: 8-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Fleury             1    0    1
Lindberg           1    0    1
MacInnis           0    2    2
Otto               0    1    1
Reichel            0    1    1
Suter              1    0    1
Yawney             0    1    1

San Jose: 2    Power play: 9-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Evason             0    1    1
Garpenlov          0    1    1
Gaudreau           0    1    1
Kisio              1    0    1
Odgers             0    1    1
Zmolek             1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
Pittsburgh                       0 3 2--5
Quebec                           2 1 0--3
First period
     1, Quebec, Kamensky 15 (Huffman) 6:05.
     2, Quebec, Young 27 (Lapointe, Huffman) 16:52.
Second period
     3, Pittsburgh, Mullen 29 (Lemieux, Murphy) 3:54.
     4, Pittsburgh, Lemieux 60 (Tocchet, U.Samuelsson) 5:07.
     5, Pittsburgh, Lemieux 61 (Tocchet, Stevens) 8:12.
     6, Quebec, Young 28 (Sundin, Kovalenko) pp, 14:52.
Third period
     7, Pittsburgh, Tippett 4 (unassisted) sh, 3:52.
     8, Pittsburgh, Tippett 5 (McEachern, Mullen) 8:25.

Pittsburgh: 5    Power play: 1-0   Special goals:  sh: 1  Total: 1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Lemieux            2    1    3
McEachern          0    1    1
Mullen             1    1    2
Murphy             0    1    1
Samuelsson U       0    1    1
Stevens            0    1    1
Tippett            2    0    2
Tocchet            0    2    2

Quebec: 3    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Huffman            0    2    2
Kamensky           1    0    1
Kovalenko          0    1    1
Lapointe           0    1    1
Sundin             0    1    1
Young              2    0    2

-----------------------------------------
New Jersey                       0 0 0--0
Toronto                          0 0 1--1
First period
     No scoring.
Second period
     No scoring.
Third period
     1, Toronto, Gilmour 32 (Andreychuk, Anderson) 16:22.

Toronto: 1    Power play: 5-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Anderson           0    1    1
Andreychuk         0    1    1
Gilmour            1    0    1

New Jersey: 0    Power play: 3-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------
Ottawa                           1 0 2--3
Hartford                         5 1 1--7
First period
     1, Ottawa, Maciver 17 (Baker, Luongo) 4:22.
     2, Hartford, Kron 11 (Nylander, Gosselin) 5:13.
     3, Hartford, Burt 4 (Cassels, Verbeek) 7:59.
     4, Hartford, Cunneyworth 4 (Yake, Nylander) 9:59.
     5, Hartford, Sanderson 42 (Cassels, Houda) 11:11.
     6, Hartford, Verbeek 35 (Cassels, Zalapski) pp, 15:50.
Second period
     7, Hartford, Sanderson 43 (Cassels, Zalapski) pp, 18:38.
Third period
     8, Hartford, Kron 12 (Poulin, Burt) 4:57.
     9, Ottawa, Turgeon 23 (Lamb) 8:57.
     10, Ottawa, Baker 17 (Luongo, Maciver) pp, 16:17.

Hartford: 7    Power play: 3-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Burt               1    1    2
Cassels            0    4    4
Cunneyworth        1    0    1
Gosselin           0    1    1
Houda              0    1    1
Kron               2    0    2
Nylander           0    2    2
Poulin             0    1    1
Sanderson          2    0    2
Verbeek            1    1    2
Yake               0    1    1
Zalapski           0    2    2

Ottawa: 3    Power play: 7-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Baker              1    1    2
Lamb               0    1    1
Luongo             0    2    2
Maciver            1    1    2
Turgeon            1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
Winnipeg                         1 3 2--6
Edmonton                         1 0 3--4
First period
     1, Winnipeg, Tkachuk 27 (Housley, Zhamnov) pp, 14:38.
     2, Edmonton, Klima 31 (Ciger, Elik) 16:05.
Second period
     3, Winnipeg, King 8 (unassisted) 3:54.
     4, Winnipeg, Zhamnov 21 (Selanne) 10:25.
     5, Winnipeg, Domi 5 (Selanne, Housley) 18:44.
Third period
     6, Edmonton, Manson 15 (unassisted) 10:58.
     7, Winnipeg, Eagles 8 (Numminen, Bautin) pp, 14:13.
     8, Winnipeg, Zhamnov 22 (Ulanov, Selanne) 15:27.
     9, Edmonton, Gelinas 8 (Kravchuk, Ranford) 16:48.
     10, Edmonton, Kravchuk 10 (Buchberger) 18:42.

Winnipeg: 6    Power play: 5-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bautin             0    1    1
Domi               1    0    1
Eagles             1    0    1
Housley            0    2    2
King               1    0    1
Numminen           0    1    1
Selanne            0    3    3
Tkachuk            1    0    1
Ulanov             0    1    1
Zhamnov            2    1    3

Edmonton: 4    Power play: 3-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Buchberger         0    1    1
Ciger              0    1    1
Elik               0    1    1
Gelinas            1    0    1
Klima              1    0    1
Kravchuk           1    1    2
Manson             1    0    1
Ranford            0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Chicago                          0 3 0 0--3
St. Louis                        1 2 0 0--3
First period
     1, St. Louis, Shanahan 46 (Janney, Hull) pp, 4:09.
Second period
     2, Chicago, Murphy 4 (Chelios, Roenick) pp, 0:50.
     3, St. Louis, Shanahan 47 (Hedican, Janney) 1:18.
     4, Chicago, Noonan 16 (Murphy, Chelios) pp, 5:24.
     5, St. Louis, Bozon 6, ps, 12:13.
     6, Chicago, Roenick 43 (Sutter, Murphy) pp, 18:39.
Third period
     No scoring.
Overtime
     No scoring.

St. Louis: 3    Power play: 4-1   Special goals:  pp: 1  ps: 1  Total: 2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bozon              1    0    1
Chelios            0    1    1
Hedican            0    1    1
Hull               0    1    1
Janney             0    2    2
Murphy             0    1    1
Shanahan           2    0    2

Chicago: 3    Power play: 3-3
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Chelios            0    2    2
Murphy             1    2    3
Noonan             1    0    1
Roenick            1    1    2
Sutter             0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Montreal                         0 1 2--3
NY Islanders                     0 2 0--2
First period
     No scoring.
Second period
     1, Montreal, Brunet 10 (Carbonneau, Daigneault) 4:39.
     2, NY Islanders, Turgeon 51 (Thomas, Kurvers) pp, 9:14.
     3, NY Islanders, Mullen 16 (unassisted) 15:13.
Third period
     4, Montreal, Bellows 38 (Desjardins, Dipietro) 3:01.
     5, Montreal, Damphousse 38 (Desjardins, Bellows) pp, 10:11.

Montreal: 3    Power play: 5-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bellows            1    1    2
Brunet             1    0    1
Carbonneau         0    1    1
Daigneault         0    1    1
Damphousse         1    0    1
Desjardins         0    2    2
Dipietro           0    1    1

NY Islanders: 2    Power play: 5-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Kurvers            0    1    1
Mullen             1    0    1
Thomas             0    1    1
Turgeon            1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
Minnesota                        2 1 0--3
Los Angeles                      0 0 0--0
First period
     1, Minnesota, Dahlen 33 (unassisted) 2:34.
     2, Minnesota, Courtnall 33 (Dahlen, Modano) pp, 9:30.
Second period
     3, Minnesota, McPhee 14 (Sjodin, Hatcher) pp, 7:24.
Third period
     No scoring.

Minnesota: 3    Power play: 11-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Courtnall          1    0    1
Dahlen             1    1    2
Hatcher            0    1    1
McPhee             1    0    1
Modano             0    1    1
Sjodin             0    1    1

Los Angeles: 0    Power play: 5-0
No scoring

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52561
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Sun, April 4, 1993
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)

NY Rangers                       3 1 0--4
Washington                       0 0 0--0
First period
     1, NY Rangers, Graves 33 (Turcotte, Lowe) 9:13.
     2, NY Rangers, Gartner 44 (Messier) 11:21.
     3, NY Rangers, Olczyk 21 (Messier, Amonte) 14:57.
Second period
     4, NY Rangers, Beukeboom 2 (unassisted) 3:30.
Third period
     No scoring.

NY Rangers: 4    Power play: 4-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Amonte             0    1    1
Beukeboom          1    0    1
Gartner            1    0    1
Graves             1    0    1
Lowe               0    1    1
Messier            0    2    2
Olczyk             1    0    1
Turcotte           0    1    1

Washington: 0    Power play: 3-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------
Boston                           0 2 1--3
Buffalo                          0 0 0--0
First period
     No scoring.
Second period
     1, Boston, Leach 24 (Wesley, Oates) pp, 1:03.
     2, Boston, Oates 44 (Douris, Poulin) 9:00.
Third period
     3, Boston, Douris 4 (Bourque) sh, 0:55.

Boston: 3    Power play: 5-1   Special goals:  pp: 1  sh: 1  Total: 2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bourque            0    1    1
Douris             1    1    2
Leach              1    0    1
Oates              1    1    2
Poulin             0    1    1
Wesley             0    1    1

Buffalo: 0    Power play: 6-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------
Pittsburgh                       1 3 1--5
New Jersey                       0 1 1--2
First period
     1, Pittsburgh, Francis 23 (Lemieux, Tocchet) pp, 13:25.
Second period
     2, Pittsburgh, Murphy 21 (Francis, Mullen) sh, 0:38.
     3, Pittsburgh, Francis 24 (Tocchet, Lemieux) pp, 7:14.
     4, Pittsburgh, Jagr 33 (Tocchet, Francis) pp, 15:22.
     5, New Jersey, Zelepukin 17 (Driver, Lemieux) pp, 19:07.
Third period
     6, New Jersey, MacLean 23 (Nicholls, Stevens) 6:45.
     7, Pittsburgh, Lemieux 62 (Jagr) en, 19:51.

Pittsburgh: 5    Power play: 9-3   Special goals:  pp: 3  sh: 1  en: 1  Total: 5
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Francis            2    2    4
Jagr               1    1    2
Lemieux            1    2    3
Mullen             0    1    1
Murphy             1    0    1
Tocchet            0    3    3

New Jersey: 2    Power play: 9-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Driver             0    1    1
Lemieux            0    1    1
MacLean            1    0    1
Nicholls           0    1    1
Stevens            0    1    1
Zelepukin          1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
Toronto                          0 0 0--0
Philadelphia                     2 1 1--4
First period
     1, Philadelphia, Dineen 31 (Beranek, Hawgood) 8:10.
     2, Philadelphia, McGill 3 (Lindros, Recchi) 19:55.
Second period
     3, Philadelphia, Lindros 38 (Recchi, Galley) 7:55.
Third period
     4, Philadelphia, Dineen 32 (Hawgood, Galley) pp, 18:39.

Philadelphia: 4    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Beranek            0    1    1
Dineen             2    0    2
Galley             0    2    2
Hawgood            0    2    2
Lindros            1    1    2
McGill             1    0    1
Recchi             0    2    2

Toronto: 0    Power play: 6-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------
Vancouver                        0 2 1--3
Ottawa                           0 0 0--0
First period
     No scoring.
Second period
     1, Vancouver, Plavsic 6 (Craven) 13:05.
     2, Vancouver, Momesso 17 (Nedved, Plavsic) pp, 15:52.
Third period
     3, Vancouver, Bure 57 (unassisted) 13:27.

Vancouver: 3    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bure               1    0    1
Craven             0    1    1
Momesso            1    0    1
Nedved             0    1    1
Plavsic            1    1    2

Ottawa: 0    Power play: 5-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------
St. Louis                        2 0 2--4
Chicago                          4 0 1--5
First period
     1, Chicago, Sutter 18 (Murphy, Chelios) pp, 1:08.
     2, St. Louis, Janney 20 (Shanahan, J.Brown) pp, 6:49.
     3, Chicago, Roenick 44 (Chelios, Smith) pp, 8:20.
     4, Chicago, Roenick 45 (Sutter, Chelios) pp, 13:14.
     5, Chicago, Graham 19 (Gilbert, Ruuttu) 13:42.
     6, St. Louis, Janney 21 (Shanahan, Crossman) 19:38.
Second period
     No scoring.
Third period
     7, Chicago, Murphy 5 (Chelios, Belfour) 0:20.
     8, St. Louis, Miller 21 (Hull, Janney) pp, 7:04.
     9, St. Louis, Janney 22 (Miller, Shanahan) 19:32.

Chicago: 5    Power play: 8-3
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Belfour            0    1    1
Chelios            0    4    4
Gilbert            0    1    1
Graham             1    0    1
Murphy             1    1    2
Roenick            2    0    2
Ruuttu             0    1    1
Smith              0    1    1
Sutter             1    1    2

St. Louis: 4    Power play: 4-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Brown J            0    1    1
Crossman           0    1    1
Hull               0    1    1
Janney             3    1    4
Miller             1    1    2
Shanahan           0    3    3

-----------------------------------------
Calgary                          1 2 1--4
San Jose                         1 0 2--3
First period
     1, Calgary, Otto 19 (Yawney, Ashton) pp, 5:29.
     2, San Jose, Odgers 10 (Pederson, Wilkinson) 18:33.
Second period
     3, Calgary, Nieuwendyk 34 (Johansson, Reese) 2:03.
     4, Calgary, Reichel 35 (Skrudland, Berube) 12:22.
Third period
     5, Calgary, Ashton 7 (Otto, Fleury) 1:30.
     6, San Jose, Pederson 9 (Odgers, Evason) 2:24.
     7, San Jose, Odgers 11 (Gaudreau, Evason) pp, 19:30.

Calgary: 4    Power play: 5-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Ashton             1    1    2
Berube             0    1    1
Fleury             0    1    1
Johansson          0    1    1
Nieuwendyk         1    0    1
Otto               1    1    2
Reese              0    1    1
Reichel            1    0    1
Skrudland          0    1    1
Yawney             0    1    1

San Jose: 3    Power play: 5-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Evason             0    2    2
Gaudreau           0    1    1
Odgers             2    1    3
Pederson           1    1    2
Wilkinson          0    1    1

-----------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52562
From: "Justin R. Fortun" <jf4f+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Playoff Predictions

>B(--> Stanley Cup Champion: Vancouver Canucks
> 
>Sorry, Pittsburgh in a walk.
> 
>- Jack

First of all, the Penguins WILL win the cup again.  Who is going to stop them?
Definitely not the Canucks! 

My predictions:

Patrick Division winner:  Pittsburgh
Adams Division winner:  Quebec or Montreal
Norris Division winner:  Detroit
Smythe Division winner:  Winnipeg

Wales conference champ:  Pittsburgh
Campbell Conference champ:  Detroit

Stanley Cup Champions(again):  Pittsburgh

Canucks suck.  They'll lose in the first round, compliments of Winnipeg
and Teemu Selanne.  

The Pens are almost unstoppable with Mario Lemieux.  


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52563
From: U16028@uicvm.uic.edu
Subject: Re: Coloured puck (was: CHANGES NOT NOTED YET!)

In article <1993Apr5.171006.22196@bnr.ca>, dwarf@bcarh601.bnr.ca (W. Jim Jordan)
says:
>The precedent was set by the WHA in their first season.  They used a red
>puck for exhibition games and a blue one for the regular season.
>Thankfully, they abandoned it in favour of black before the next season
>began.
>
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
One reason that the WHA abandoned the blue puck was the fact that it
crumbled very quickly during play.  The blue dye that was used somehow
affected the vulcanized rubber of the puck, decreasing its cohesiveness.

Terry
U16028@uicvm.uic.edu
&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52564
From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
Subject: Re: WC Pool B : GB win the gold

In <1993Apr5.130317.8175@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca writes:

> In article <1porp4$1c0@zaphod.axion.bt.co.uk> nmcglynn@axion.bt.co.uk writes:
> >
> >GB has now risen from nowhere to Pool A in 5 seasons. They pulled out of the
> >World Championships in 1981, and did not re-enter until 1989 when we took part
> >in Pool D. In 1990, we hosted Pool D and won all our game to progress to
> >Pool C. In 1991 GB finished 5th in Pool C, and then last year we hosted
> >Pool C, again winning all our games. Now after Pool B, GB won all 7 games
> >and in now in Pool A. World Champions next year perhaps :-)
> >
> 
> Just goes to show you what using Canadians can do for a hockey team...
> France, Italy, and now Great Britain all use a significant number of
> Canadians on "their" hockey teams.

Yup. Then again, there are lots of foreign-born players on the Canadian
national soccer team so the Brits give something back to you in the end:-)
---
For the record, former NY Rangers coach Ted "Darth" Sator recently led
Lion Milan (Jari Kurri's former team, only the nickname's changed
[Devils->Lion]) to their second straight Italian championship. They made the
European Final Four last autumn after losing to Swedish champs Malmo in the
semis...and accomplished this feat using FIFTEEN Canadian-born players!! Mamma
mia!

MARCU$
 
> Gerald
> 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52565
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <C51CJB.L5z@ccu.umanitoba.ca> umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner) writes:
>They were, and even if Washington might consider Patty a bust, I'd rework
>that trade in a minute.  Druce has been a complete and utter bust here,
>only 5 goals.

	Well, Druce pretty much sucked when he was with the Caps. He had one
good **playoffs** (not season). oh well. The Caps are notorious for making
stupid trades anyway, as can be seen with the Cicarelli and Hrivnak trades.
Sigh.
	In another note... I'd have to say the Caps biggest surprise was 
Cote, as many Caps fans had been expecting a lot from Bondra already.
 


-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52566
Subject: canadian silver dollar-stanley cup centennial
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)


Hi.  According to my always questionable newspaper, there's a silver
dollar being minted in Canada, the back of which commemorates the
anniversary of the Stanley Cup.  Now, I know full well what coins are
used every day in Canada.  I can easily fish a few out of my pocket
change right now, in fact.  My question is, since the loon is the only
dollar coin that I know is legal tender, is this just a commemorative
coin with no monetary exchange value, or what?  Is it the sort of
thing that only hockey buffs and coin collectors might covet, with no
chance of it being circulated?  If it is an uncirculated coin, what's
the current cost and what's its potential value?  Just curious.  If no
one knows, I'll take this to soc.culture.canada and rec.collecting (or
whatever it is).  Thanks again

-- 
Valerie Hammerl			"Some days I have to remind him he's not 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu	Mario Lemieux."  Herb Brooks on Claude
acscvjh@ubms.cc.buffalo.edu	Lemieux, top scorer for the Devils, but 
v085pwwpz@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu  known for taking dumb penalties.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52567
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Superstars and attendance (was Teemu Selanne, was +/- leaders)

In <1993Apr5.182124.17415@ists.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:

>Dean J. Falcione (posting from jrmst+8@pitt.edu) writes:

>>But I think the reason is Lemieux
>>had a 168 point season and was the first non-Gretzky to win the Hart and
>>Ross since 1980.  People turned out to watch him play. 

>I will grant that a star like Mario will draw fans, even if the team sucks. 
>But this is short term only; I still do not think the attendance increase 
>will last, unless the team is a winning/competitive/improving/butt-kicking
>one.  Pittsburgh was still getting better, so people continued to support
>them.  If they suddenly dropped to, say, 50 points, you'd have knee surgery
>for some of the people jumping off the bandwagon.  

I disagree.  McNall has demonstrated with Gretzky that a star brings out the
crowds whether or not the team is expected to do well.  Very few fans real-
istically expect the Kings to do well this year (although I do) and yet they
still go out to see Gretzky.  This is the marketing strategy - selling the
game by selling the stars - that is employed by Baseball and, notably, the
NBA and this is the attitude that the new Bettman/McNall leadership is 
bringing to the league.  They have gone on record as stating that they are
trying to sell the game on its stars.  Timo Salami and Brett Hull are perfect 
examples of players that real fans know aren't worth a damn and yet, being
benificiaries of marketing-oriented coaching strategies, have goal totals
that would indicate to the casual observer, the very fans the NHL wants to
attract, that these players are indeed superstars.

>>They made the transaction to try and build a winner around Mario, that is 
>>true.  But the improvement in attendance came before they started doing
>>this (Coffey late in 1987) and before they even had a playoff bound team.
>>A doubling of attendance occured in 1984-85 from the previous year.  An
>>increase from 38 points to 53 points is not going to do that.  The arrival
>>of Mario Lemieux is what did it. 

>It might help to think about what would go through a fan's mind who suddenly
>found an interest in Mario and the Pens.  Was it "gee, Mario Lemieux is
>amazing, I'll go watch him play", or was it "gee, now we've got a *kick*
>*ass* guy on *our* side, I'll go watch him play".  I think it was the latter.

It ain't nearly so simple as this.  The casual fan doesn't think about much 
at all.  Can you actually find an adult with a 3 digit IQ who believes that
McDonalds makes good hamburgers?
 
>I did provide the example of Rocket Ismail and the Toronto Argonauts of the 
>CFL...did you leave it out because you don't know much about the CFL?  If 
>that's the case then fair enough, but if it isn't the case then I'm curious
>to hear your explanation.

Yes but apparently the Rocket has not lived up to his marketing responsi-
bilities has he?  He was hyped, initially, as a superstar, but outside of
one Grey Cup game he has done very little to maintain/enhance that assess-
ment of his talents.  Most Argo fans probably feel the team would be better
off without him. 

cordially, as always,

rm

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52568
From: r_turgeo@oz.plymouth.edu (Randy S. Turgeon)
Subject: Re: Ottawa/Montreal/Philly trade


  Here we go again. Is this the same idiot who posted the Gretzky
trade to Toronto????   Sheeeesh!  You should have waited until we got
over that one before this garbage, maybe we would have believed it for
half a second (NOT!).

   By the way, I just heard from Mother Goose that Mario Lemieux was
traded to Winnpeg for Tie Domi!!!!!


Randy
PSC (I know noone has heard of it, it's a tiny college in Hicksville
New Hampshire. Plymouth State College)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52569
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: NHL team leaders in +/-

In <1993Apr5.185633.17843@ists.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:

>Implicitly you are assuming that goals scored against Winnipeg with Selanne
>on the ice can be blamed on him...Roger, he is a FORWARD.  Winnipeg has a
>lousy defensive record anyway.  Let's put it another way.  John Cullen's +/-
>is terrible.  What's your excuse for him?  That his powerplay points don't
>count?  Neither do Selanne's... 

Are you comparing Cullen to Salami?  I would say that that is valid.  If
Winnipeg is such a lousy defensive team then why the hell does Salami
stand around the other team's blueline when the puck is in his own end?

>>The object of the game is not to feed Selanne - it is 
>>to win.  And feeding Selanne does not contribute in any meaningful way
>>to winning.

>Knowledgeable hockey observers the world over would agree that
>feeding Selanne so he can score does contribute in a meaningful way to
>winning. 

Excuse me?  Are the Jets playing .500 hockey?  Let me check...yes - but just
barely.  They have allowed more goals than they have scored.  Sounds an
awful lot like Salami's +/- to me.  Sounds like they would be just as well
off - or better - if he played the solid two-way game that our friends in
Finland claim he is capable of.  But if he did that he wouldn't be chal-
lenging for the league lead in goals would he?  The Bi-Planes might be
challenging for first however...

>You're worried about Teemu when you have Glenn Anderson on your team?

Now let's see...you have compared Timo to Anderson and Cullen.  Who's
next?  Mike Foligno?

>>We DON'T KNOW what Selanne does best.  We do know what Jet's management
>>wants.  And again, the object of the exercise is not to allow Selanne to
>>do what he does best, it is to win hockey games.

>What he does best is score...so I refer you to my comment above.

Some of our Finnish friends who have watched him play claim that he
can play a solid two-way game.  I would have to say that this style
of contribution would be more conducive to winning.  Or don't you 
think so?

>>As it is now, Selanne
>>is a grandstanding goal suck.  Did you see the way he parades around
>>with his arms outstretched after scoring a goal?  You would think the
>>Messiah had returned...

>Nope, didn't see it.  I was too busy watching Foligno jump up and down after
>_his_ goal....

I don't believe it!  You did compare him to Foligno!  (And I honestly hadn't
read this far).

It would help if you used a little discrimination in your thinking.  Your
contributions would be more highly valued if we could see that you weren't
trying to be merely argumentative.

cordially, as always,

rm

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52570
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: In memoriam: Dan Kelly and Danny Gallivan

In article <burke.1-290393150052@burkemac.oshag.nd.edu> burke.1@nd.edu (R. P. Burke) writes:
>When talking about hockey broadcasters, let's give a moment of silence to
>remember the St. Louis Blues' great, Dan Kelly. (Many of you may have heard
>him in the late 60s and early 70s on CBS.) He used to do Hockey Night In
>Canada intermissions, with another recently deceased great, Danny Gallivan
>of the Canadiens.

Agreed here...I'll never forget Dan Kelly calling the play-by-play in the '87
Canada Cup.  He was masterful!

And Danny Gallivan will _never_ be replaced; even now when I watch HNIC I
remember his voice...when I see an Al MacInnis or Al Iafrate (hey, what's with
these guys named Al who can shoot??) shot from the point I still think
"blistering blast"...THN had a tribute to Gallivan in the issue following his
death; in the story they included a quote from one of the games he did.  It
went: 

"It appears Risebrough has pugnaciously construed that check," he said, "and 
will undoubtedly make a visitation to the box of punition."

Classic, vintage Gallivan!  He's sorely missed.  So here's to two of the best
there was and best that ever will be.


dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52571
From: smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale)
Subject: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...


I was thinking about who on each of the teams were the MVPs, biggest
surprises, and biggest disappointments this year. Now, these are just
my observations and are admittedly lacking because I have not had an
opportunity to see all the teams the same amount. Anyway....
  
MVP = most valuable player to his team both in terms of points and
      in terms of leadership ("can't win without him")
  
Biggest surprise = the player who rose above expectation -- the player
      that may have raised the level of his game to a new height, even
      if that new level doesn't necessarily warrant an allstar berth
      (includes those players who at the outset of the season, may not
      even have been in the team's plans).
   
Biggest disappointment = the player from whom we expected more (e.g., I
      picked Denis Savard in Montreal because with the new emphasis on
      offence brought by Demers, shouldn't Savard have done better?)
   
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
  
                        Team           Biggest       Biggest
Team:                   MVP:          Surprise:    Disappointment:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Boston Bruins           Oates          D.Sweeney     Wesley
Buffalo Sabres          Lafontaine     Mogilny       Audette (jinx?)
Calgary Flames          Roberts        Reichel       Petit
Chicago Blackhawks      Roenick        Ruuttu        Goulet
Detroit Red Wings       Yzerman        Chaisson      Kozlov
Edmonton Oilers         Manson         Buchberger    Mellanby
Hartford Whalers        Sanderson      Cassells      Corriveau
Los Angeles Kings       Robitaille     Donnelly      Hrudey
Minnesota North Stars   Modano      Tinordi(not expected back)  Broten
Montreal Canadiens      Muller         Lebeau        Savard
New Jersey Devils       Stevens        Semak         MacLean
New York Islanders      Turgeon        King(finally) Marois
New York Rangers        Messier        Kovalev       Bourque
Ottawa Senators         MacIver        Baker         Jelinek
Philadelphia Flyers     Lindros/Recchi Fedyk/Galley  Eklund
Pittsburgh Penguins     Lemieux        Tocchet(even for him)  Jagr
Quebec Nordiques        Sakic/Ricci    Kovalenko     Pearson
San Jose Sharks         Kisio          Gaudreau      Maley
St Louis Blues          Shanahan       C.Joseph      Ron Sutter
Tampa Bay Lightening    Bradley        Bradley       Creighton/Kasper
Toronto Maple Leafs     Gilmour        Potvin        Ellett/Anderson
Vancouver Canucks       Bure           Nedved(finally)    Momesso
Washington Capitals     Hatcher        Bondra/Cote   Elynuik
Winnipeg Jets           Selanne        Selanne       Druce
----------------------------------------------------------------------
  
As I mentioned up top, these are my *impressions* from where I sit. I
would welcome any opinions from those fans nearer their teams (in other
words, *anywhere* away from a Toronto newspaper!)
   
Bryan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52572
From: dscy@eng.cam.ac.uk (D.S.C. Yap)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale) writes:

>                        Team           Biggest       Biggest
>Team:                   MVP:          Surprise:    Disappointment:
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Washington Capitals     Hatcher        Bondra/Cote   Elynuik
>Winnipeg Jets           Selanne        Selanne       Druce

                                                      ^^^^^^^^
                                                      weren't these two
                                                      traded for each
                                                      other?  Poetic justice.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52573
From: SHOE@PHYSICS.watstar.uwaterloo.ca (Mark Shoesmith)
Subject: Re: Let's talk sticks...

In article <C50pt4.6CM@odin.corp.sgi.com> dptom@endor.corp.sgi.com (Tom Arnold) writes:

>Okay you hockey playing fans/finatics out there. I'm looking over the wide 
>range of aluminum sticks for the first time. I've been playing with pieces
>of lumbar that seem to weigh alot and break after a few uses, so I'm 
>thinking of changing to an aluminum shaft so when I break the blade all I 
>have to do is change it. The problem is that there is such a wide reange of
>models and selections out there that I'm not certain which to consider. Can
>any of you post some of your suggestions and experiences with the aluminum 
>sticks? What is the difference between models? What do you like/dislike about
>them? And, which brands are best?
>
>

I've had, and still have a few aluminum sticks.  I got my first when I was 15
(a Christian), and broke the shaft halfway through the season, two years 
later.  I bought another (a Canadian) at the beginning of the next season, 
and I still have it.  I also have an Easton, that a friend was getting rid 
off, after giving up the game.  I find that Easton blades are easier to get, 
but all brands of blades are pretty well interchangeable.  Watch out for 
dried up bits of firewood, that some stores pass off as blades.  In my 
experiences, the blades of an aluminum break more often than regular sticks, 
but I've only ever broken one aluminum shaft.

I like aluminum sticks.  The blades are quickly changed, even on the bench 
if you have to.  On the downside, the shaft won't break if you decide to 
impale yourself on it :-)

Ciao,
Mark S.

"This is between me and the vegetable"   - Rick Moranis in
                                           Little Shop of Horrors
Mark Shoesmith
shoe@physics.watstar.uwaterloo.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52574
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <C4zCII.Ftn@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca> smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale) writes:
>
>I was thinking about who on each of the teams were the MVPs, biggest
>surprises, and biggest disappointments this year. Now, these are just
>my observations and are admittedly lacking because I have not had an
>opportunity to see all the teams the same amount. Anyway....
>  
>Team:                   MVP:          Surprise:    Disappointment:
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Edmonton Oilers         Manson         Buchberger    Mellanby

Well, since the Oilers didn't win a heck of a lot of games, I'm not sure
they deserve and MVP ("can't win without him").  However, I'd suggest Kelly
Buchberger instead of Dave Manson, who has had a brutal year, his pick for
the All-Star game notwithstanding.

As for biggest surprise, I'd say that Buchberger had higher expectations
this year due to his "breakthrough" year (for him) last year, so he didn't
really raise his game.  My suggestion would be Shjon Podein, one of the
callups from Cape Breton during the year.  He was quite far down on the
depth chart in the Oilers stable of prospects, but made a big impact on
the team.  He has 12 goals in his 33 games and is only -1.  Those are decent
numbers for a third-line player who was seemingly doomed to minor-league
oblivion.  The Oilers coaching staff likens his style to John Tonelli.
I think he'll be on the full-time roster next year.

As for biggest disappointment, you could name any of the players the Oilers
dumped for lousy production this year (Nicholls, Gilchrist, Tikkanen) or
even Shayne Corson, but Mellanby isn't far off.

-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Division      | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52575
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re:  Potvin's new goalie mask


Stephen Legge (SLEGGE@kean.ucs.munc.ca) writes:
>I was wtahcing RIGHT GUARD HOCKEY WEEK on TSN yesterday and they had
>a feature on this guy that does a lot (most?) of the masks for NHL
>goalies.  They talked about how they are made, what they are made of,
>and the designs that are put on them, etc.

Actually, this part was really interesting.  It turns out that the mask is
custom-fit to the goalie's face.  The goalie puts his/her face through a
piece of wood (or was it plastic?) with a hole in it that allows only the face
and forehead to show.  Hair is covered by a cap, eyes are covered by a plastic
wrap-type material, and vaseline is put on the goaltender's face.  Then, a
plaster is spread on their cheeks, forehead, and chin which takes about 12
minutes to dry sufficiently.  When it dries, it is effectively a mold of the
goalie's face.  This is used as the basis of the mask (the rest involves
padding the inside, hardening the exterior, fitting the cage, etc. etc.  
John Blue of the Bruins actually demonstrated the procedure on the show. 

>He exhibited a couple masks he is currently working on, namely, a
>new mask for Andy Moog which is a basic re-working of his current
>mask with the bear on it, and new mask for Bob Essensa which was 
>*really* cool -- the Jets logo was on the chin, and there were two
>fighter jets on either side on the forehead with an air-brushed
>back-ground.

Yeah, Essensa's mask looked really good.
 
>The best one of all was one he never talked about, he just held it up.
>It has the current Leafs crest on the chin and an awesome looking 
>black panther on the forehead -- it *has* to be a new mask for Felix
>Potvin, but he never said whose it was.

Actually, I thought I heard him say that it _was_ Potvin's for certain.  I
would bet money on it either way...and it did look awesome!


dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca
 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52576
From: mjr4u@Virginia.EDU ("Matthew J. Rush")
Subject: Re: NCAA finals...Winner????

ktgeiss@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu writes:
> Lake State/Maine in finals...WHO WON?   Please post.

Maine 5-4. 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52577
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <C4zCII.Ftn@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca> smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale) writes:
>
>                        Team           Biggest       Biggest
>Team:                   MVP:          Surprise:    Disappointment:
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Boston Bruins           Oates          D.Sweeney     Wesley
>Buffalo Sabres          Lafontaine     Mogilny       Audette (jinx?)
>Calgary Flames          Roberts        Reichel       Petit
>Chicago Blackhawks      Roenick        Ruuttu        Goulet

Chelios is by far the MVP on Chicago...

>Detroit Red Wings       Yzerman        Chaisson      Kozlov
>Edmonton Oilers         Manson         Buchberger    Mellanby

Manson, by his own admission, had a terrible year...the Oilers
don't really have a team MVP...by default, it should go to Craig
MacTavish.  Shjon Podein was the biggest surprise...Tikkanen the
biggest disappointment.

>Hartford Whalers        Sanderson      Cassells      Corriveau
>Los Angeles Kings       Robitaille     Donnelly      Hrudey
>Minnesota North Stars   Modano      Tinordi(not expected back)  Broten

Tinordi was back by mid-season last year...and when he plays he is the MVP.

>Montreal Canadiens      Muller         Lebeau        Savard
>New Jersey Devils       Stevens        Semak         MacLean
>New York Islanders      Turgeon        King(finally) Marois

King had a great year last year also.

>New York Rangers        Messier        Kovalev       Bourque

How can Kovalev be a surprise?

>Ottawa Senators         MacIver        Baker         Jelinek
>Philadelphia Flyers     Lindros/Recchi Fedyk/Galley  Eklund

Fence-sitting...look at Philly's record with Eric and without...
there is no doubt.  Soderstrom is probably the biggest surprise.

>Pittsburgh Penguins     Lemieux        Tocchet(even for him)  Jagr

Tocchet had a near 100 point season in Philly with Mike Bullard as
his center...why shouldn't he be able to do that with Mario?

>Quebec Nordiques        Sakic/Ricci    Kovalenko     Pearson
>San Jose Sharks         Kisio          Gaudreau      Maley
>St Louis Blues          Shanahan       C.Joseph      Ron Sutter

Really Joseph deserves the MVP nod.

>Tampa Bay Lightening    Bradley        Bradley       Creighton/Kasper
>Toronto Maple Leafs     Gilmour        Potvin        Ellett/Anderson
>Vancouver Canucks       Bure           Nedved(finally)    Momesso
>Washington Capitals     Hatcher        Bondra/Cote   Elynuik
>Winnipeg Jets           Selanne        Selanne       Druce

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52578
From: hse31913@vax1.utulsa.edu (hse31913@vax1.utulsa.edu(Scott H.), U of Tulsa)
Subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE DOUBTERS NOW?  HMM?

In article <1993Apr4.051942.27095@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca>,
 maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
 
> And after the Leafs make cream cheese of the Philadelphia side tomorrow
> night the Leafs will be without equal.
> 
> The Leafs are the best team in the Campbell Conference.
> 
> cordially, as always,
> 
> rm
>  
> -- 
> Roger Maynard 
> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

More like Philadelphia making dust out of dead Leafs.
Roger why do you continue to embarass yourself with your brash predictions?

They got whitewashed by a last place team.  Granted Philly is pretty decent
but the "best team in the Cambell Conference" would have beaten a last
place team.

-- 
Scott E. Humphrey,  Chemical Engineering, University of Tulsa
hse31913@vax1.utulsa.edu
Bruins for The Cup!!!
Opinions expressed are those of the individual, not of the U of Tulsa.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52579
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: re:  Don Cherry's Coach's Corner Summary - April 3, 1993


allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan) writes:

Before I begin lambasting Don Cherry, let me first say that I've been sort of
a Cherry fan for a while...admittedly stuff he says has to be taken lightly,
but he's more-or-less harmless.  On Saturday, however, he crossed the lines of
good taste:

>According to Don, the entire article wasn't perfect, and there
>were some 'shots' by Frank Musil and Alpo Suhonen. 
>Don noted that Musil wasn't much of a player (didn't
>score many goals last year). He also made fun of their names...
>One guy has a name like dog food, the other like a laxitive
>(meta-Musil).

This is the best he can do?!!  Gee Don, tremendous amounts of professionalism
here.  The CBC looks just as bad as he looks foolish letting him get away with
this nonsense...making fun of names??  It's bad enough that he makes asinine
blanket statements about European players, but he's now resorted to making fun
of their names too?  He sounded like an idiot, much like he did last week
when he said that Teemu would never make it to his 'Rock 'em, Sock 'em' video
until he dropped the gloves...

>On the subject of realignment, Don said that he liked the
>new division names.

Well, what he _said_ was that even though he's been around the league for quite
some time, he still doesn't know who's where w.r.t. conference and division
names.  HELLO??!! McFly??  The names have been around for a couple of decades
or so....he also invited the audience to "Name the teams in the Wales...quick,
quick!" Followed by "Ah, you don't know, I don't know...."  

Sorry Don.  Wrong on this one.

>Ron (to Don): "I don't know wy I like you on your show
>for 30 minutes... I can hardly stand you on this show for 5."

This was absolutely hilarious.

Don's argument about the basketball and baseball brawls was fairly
good...unfortunately he neglected to mention the fines that were levelled in
the NBA case.  Serious money...oh well, he's never been one for objectivity,
has he?

Don's question to Gretzky:

>Wouldn't it be better
>for you to change your friends so that they like the game, than for
>us to change the game for your friends?"

Now this I liked.



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52580
From: slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca
Subject: Trade rumor: Montreal/Ottawa/Phillie

TSN Sportsdesk just reported that the OTTAWA SUN has reported that
Montreal will send 4 players + $15 million including Vin Damphousse 
and Brian Bellows to Phillidelphia, Phillie will send Eric Lindros
to Ottawa, and Ottawa will give it's first round pick to Montreal.
 
If this is true, it will most likely depend on whether or not Ottawa
gets to choose 1st overall.  Can Ottawa afford Lindros' salary?
 
Personally, I can't see Philli giving up Lindros -- for anything.  
They didn't give away that much to Quebec just to trade him away 
again.  Not to mention that Lindros seems to be a *huge* draw in
Phillie -- and that he represents a successful future for the 
franchise.
 
Ottawa may be better off taking the 4 players +$15 from Montreal
for the pick.
 
Stephen Legge
SLEGGE@kean.ucs.munc.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52581
From: darling@cellar.org (Thomas Darling)
Subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE DOUBTERS NOW?  HMM?

jason@studsys.mscs.mu.edu (Jason Hanson) writes:

> In article <1993Apr4.051942.27095@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.
> >
> >And after the Leafs make cream cheese of the Philadelphia side tomorrow
> >night the Leafs will be without equal.
> 
> Then again, maybe not.

To put it mildly.  As I watched the Flyers demolish Toronto last night, 4-0,
I realized that no matter how good the Leafs' #1 line may be, they'll need
one or two more decent lines to go far in the playoffs.  And, of course, a
healthy Felix Potvin.

^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^\\\^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^
Thomas A. Darling \\\ The Cellar BBS & Public Access System: 215.539.3043
darling@cellar.org \\\ GEnie: T.DARLING \\ FactHQ "Truth Thru Technology"
v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~\\\~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52582
From: darling@cellar.org (Thomas Darling)
Subject: Re: Good for hockey/Bad for hockey

jmd@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (joseph.m.dakes) writes:

> In article <1ppdccINNbe1@dev-null.phys.psu.edu>, stimpy@dev-null.phys.psu.edu
> > In article <C4wxnF.Bx1@constellation.ecn.uoknor.edu> mfoster@alliant.backbo
> > >I prefer the Miami Colons myself.  Headline: FLAMES BLOW OUT COLONS, 9-1
> > 
> > Would Kevin Dineen play for the Miami Colons???
> 
> As a Flyers fan, I resent you making Kevin Dineen the butt of your
> jokes:-)!

Aw, just take a moment to digest it and I'm sure you'll see the humour...

^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^\\\^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^
Thomas A. Darling \\\ The Cellar BBS & Public Access System: 215.539.3043
darling@cellar.org \\\ GEnie: T.DARLING \\ FactHQ "Truth Thru Technology"
v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~\\\~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52583
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <1993Apr5.212018.25066@eng.cam.ac.uk> dscy@eng.cam.ac.uk (D.S.C. Yap) writes:
>smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale) writes:
>
>>                        Team           Biggest       Biggest
>>Team:                   MVP:          Surprise:    Disappointment:
>>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>Washington Capitals     Hatcher        Bondra/Cote   Elynuik
>>Winnipeg Jets           Selanne        Selanne       Druce
>
>                                                      ^^^^^^^^
>                                                      weren't these two
>                                                      traded for each
>                                                      other?  Poetic justice.

They were, and even if Washington might consider Patty a bust, I'd rework
that trade in a minute.  Druce has been a complete and utter bust here,
only 5 goals.

Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52584
From: mac18@po.CWRU.Edu (Michael A. Cornell)
Subject: Hey FLYERS Fans!


Did you ever notice how many people on the net have trouble in the
comparitively easy task of spelling the nick name of our fair city?  I
never knew that Philadelphia becomes Phillie or Philli when spoken of.  So
for all you who don't know yet here's a _little_ clue.

	IT IS SPELLED:       P H I L L Y

OK...thank you.

Oh yeah, about that drug-induced trade rumor....I don't think the Sniders
are that stupid...the rumor you should be looking into is Mike Keenan
coming back to coach the FLYERS.

later

Mike

-- 
Mike Cornell     | "There are a great many people in the country today who,
mac18@po.cwru.edu|  through no fault of their own, are sane." -Monty Python
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Let's Go Flyers!  Stanley Cup in '94!  "OH! My brain hurts!"- Mr D. P. Gumby

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52585
From: seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr)
Subject: Re: Adams Division Race

In article <1993Apr2.175052.22810@thunder.mcrcim.mcgill.edu>, breton@McRCIM.McGill.EDU (Pierre Breton) writes:
> 
> 
> The Adams division race is certainly interesting this year.  Here are
> important data to keep in mind in the eventuality of a tie for a given
> standing position.
> 
> In head to head games:
> Quebec wins over Montreal, 4-3-0;
> Boston leads against Quebec, 3-1-1 with two games remaining;
> Montreal and Boston are tied, 4-4-0 with one game remaining.
> 
>       (..)        Pierre Breton   (aka Fluide Glacial)

Pierre,
For purposes of the tie breaker, you only count the first three games in
each city. Therefore, Quebec cannot possibly be ahead of Montreal 4-3,
and there's probably only one game that counts remaining between Boston
and Quebec, which means Boston has probably already won.

pete clark - rsh FLYERS contact

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52586
From: pereira@CAM.ORG (Dean Pereira)
Subject: Canadiens - another Stanley Cup???


		With the kind of team Montreal has now,  they can take the
cup easily.  The only problem they have right now is that everyone is
trying to steal the show and play alone.  They need some massive teamwork.
	They are also in a little of a slump because long-time hockey
Montreal Canadiens announcer Claude Mouton died last tuesday and it was
rough on everybody because he has worked with the organization for 21
years.  But I know that is no excuse.  But if the Habs manage to get some
good teamwork and get into the spirit,  they should have no problem
winning in May.

						Dean

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52587
From: drbombay@netlink.cts.com (Walter Ladwig)
Subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE DOUBTERS NOW?  HMM?

The Blackhawks shall triumph.

Walter Ladwig             @ "This is the weather the cuckoo likes,
Net Link                  @  armored division submissive to 
DrBombay@Netlink.cts.com  @  vernacular the world into a gambling
                          @  birdhouse velocity."
                                                -The Cut-Ups

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52588
From: rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser)
Subject: Re: Canadiens - another Stanley Cup???

pereira@CAM.ORG (Dean Pereira) writes:


>		With the kind of team Montreal has now,  they can take the
>cup easily.  The only problem they have right now is that everyone is
>trying to steal the show and play alone.  They need some massive teamwork.
>	They are also in a little of a slump because long-time hockey
>Montreal Canadiens announcer Claude Mouton died last tuesday and it was
>rough on everybody because he has worked with the organization for 21
>years.  But I know that is no excuse.  But if the Habs manage to get some
>good teamwork and get into the spirit,  they should have no problem
>winning in May.

   I agree. I also think Roy needs a good kick sometimes...that horrible
4-0 loss to the Capitals last week...yeeeech!

   Here's to Cup #23...this year!

 
-- 
Richard J. Rauser        "You have no idea what you're doing."
rauser@sfu.ca            "Oh, don't worry about that. We're professional
WNI                          outlaws - we do this for a living."
-----------------
"Remember, no matter where you go, there you are." -Dr.Banzai

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52589
From: rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser)
Subject: Too Many Europeans in NHL



   Ten years ago, the number of Europeans in the NHL was roughly a quarter
of what it is now. Going into the 1992/93 season, the numbers of Euros on
NHL teams have escalated to the following stats:

Canadians: 400
Americans: 100
Europeans: 100

   Please note that these numbers are rounded off, and taken from the top
25 players on each of the 24 teams. My source is the Vancouver Sun.

   Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. I am sick
of watching a game between an American and a Canadian team (let's say, the
Red Wings and the Canucks) and seeing names like "Bure" "Konstantinov" and
"Borshevshky". Is this North America or isn't it? Toronto, Detriot, Quebec,
and Edmonton are particularly annoying, but the numbers of Euros on other
teams is getting worse as well. 

    I live in Vancouver and if I hear one more word about "Pavel Bure, the
Russian Rocket" I will completely throw up. As it is now, every time I see
the Canucks play I keep hoping someone will cross-check Bure into the plexiglassso hard they have to carry him out on a stretcher. (By the way, I'm not a
Canucks fan to begin with ;-). 

    Okay, the stretcher remark was a little carried away. But the point is that
I resent NHL owners drafting all these Europeans INSTEAD of Canadians (and
some Americans). It denies young Canadians the opportunity to play in THEIR
NORTH AMERICAN LEAGUE and instead gives it to Europeans, who aren't even
better hockey players. It's all hype. This "European mystique" is sickening,
but until NHL owners get over it, Canadian and American players will continue
to have to fight harder to get drafted into their own league.

    With the numbers of Euros in the NHL escalating, the problem is clearly
only getting worse.

    I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let the Bures
and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.

    I just don't want them on mine.


 
 
-- 
Richard J. Rauser        "You have no idea what you're doing."
rauser@sfu.ca            "Oh, don't worry about that. We're professional
WNI                          outlaws - we do this for a living."
-----------------
"Remember, no matter where you go, there you are." -Dr.Banzai

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52590
From: shadow@r-node.hub.org (Jay Chu)
Subject: Lindros will be traded!!!

True rumor.  Fact!  A big three way deal!

Eric Lindros going to Ottawa Senators.  And Senators get $15mill from
Montreal.

Montreal gets Alexander Daigle (the first round pick from Senators)

Philly gets Damphousse, Bellow, Patrick Roy and a draft pick.

-- 
        ______                shadow@r-node.gts.org
       | |__| |   If it's there and you can see it       - it's real
       |  ()  |   If it's there and you can't see it     - it's transparent
       |______|   If it's not there and you can't see it - you erased it!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52591
From: jslam@cbnewsl.cb.att.com (joseph.lam)
Subject: Re: Request for Islanders e-mail list

In article <1993Apr3.014237.20959@sifon.cc.mcgill.ca> bui@ee470.ee.mcgill.ca (BUI/DON/MR) writes:
>In article <16b5xvf@rpi.edu> wangr@rpi.edu writes:
>>>If anyone out there is keeping an Islanders e-mail list, could you
>>>please add me to it? Thanks in advance.
>>
>>>Ercu
>>	
>>	Can u add me onto the list too....Thanks...
>>
>>Rex
>
>Count me IN !!!!
>
>Go Isles!
>
>						-Don
>
>bui@ee470.ee.mcgill.ca
>

Please count me in also...

Just can't tell you how excited I was when the Islanders beat the Rangers
in overtime on last Friday!!!

Go Isles!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52592
From: mfoster@alliant.backbone.uoknor.edu (Marc Foster)
Subject: Re: Expansion

In article <PATRICK.93Apr2201529@blanco.owlnet.rice.edu> patrick@blanco.owlnet.rice.edu (Patrick L Humphrey) writes:
>On Fri, 2 Apr 1993 22:05:16 GMT, vamwendt@atlas.cs.upei.ca (Michael Wendt) said

>>16.   Albany (New York), Boise (Idaho)--A couple of cities with fair interest
>>but size and closeness to other teams is a question.

>Albany has their AHL franchise (though it goes by the Capital District label),
>but Boise?  Forget it.  The CHL made an attempt at that part of the country in
>1983-84, with a franchise in Great Falls -- and no one showed up.  Folks up in
>that part of the PNW just aren't interested in hockey.

Hey Patrick, the Montana Magic played in Billings, not Great Falls...

>--PLH, I know where I'd put the next two NHL expansion teams: Phoenix and
>Houston, assuming the Whalers don't pack up and move in the meantime...

Marc, Phoenix and Houston it is... 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
        _/_/    _/         _/_/   _/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/   _/_/     _/_/_/ 
     _/    _/  _/       _/    _/      _/  _/       _/    _/  _/
    _/    _/  _/       _/    _/     _/   _/       _/    _/  _/
   _/_/_/    _/       _/_/_/_/    _/    _/_/_/   _/_/_/      _/_/
  _/    _/  _/       _/    _/   _/     _/       _/    _/        _/
 _/    _/  _/       _/    _/  _/      _/       _/     _/       _/    _ _ _____
_/_/_/    _/_/_/_/ _/    _/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/      _/ _/_/_/     - - /____/
...............................................................................
Marc Foster, r.s.h contact for the Oklahoma City Blazers, 1993 Central Hockey
University of Oklahoma Geography Department               League Adams Cup
Internet: mfoster@geohub.gcn.uoknor.edu                   Champions
          mfoster@alliant.backbone.uoknor.edu 

To be placed on the CHL Mailing List, send email to either address above.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52593
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Trade rumor: Montreal/Ottawa/Phillie

In article <1993Apr5.203552.1@kean.ucs.mun.ca> slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca writes:
>TSN Sportsdesk just reported that the OTTAWA SUN has reported that
>Montreal will send 4 players + $15 million including Vin Damphousse 
>and Brian Bellows to Phillidelphia, Phillie will send Eric Lindros
>to Ottawa, and Ottawa will give it's first round pick to Montreal.
>

Obviously some reporter for the Ottawa Sun got taken by an April
Fools joke...probably started by someone with the Nordiques or the
Bruins.  

Like for example...who is going to reimburse the Flyers for the
$15 million they paid to the Nordiques...like the Senators are
going to get Lindros and $15 million.  The Flyers sent the
equivalent of 6 or 7 players (when you include the draft choices)
to Quebec, and they are going to get only four back.

Some reporter was had real badly and someone must be having a
real good laugh seeing as how the so much of the sports media
has chosen to publicize this utter nonsense.

>If this is true, it will most likely depend on whether or not Ottawa
>gets to choose 1st overall.  Can Ottawa afford Lindros' salary?
>

Can you think...it cannot possibly be true...no need for the "if"!

>Personally, I can't see Philli giving up Lindros -- for anything.  
>They didn't give away that much to Quebec just to trade him away 
>again.  Not to mention that Lindros seems to be a *huge* draw in
>Phillie -- and that he represents a successful future for the 
>franchise.
> 
>Ottawa may be better off taking the 4 players +$15 from Montreal
>for the pick.
> 

I can't believe that anyone would consider giving such crap even
the remotest consideration.

Gerald       


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52594
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In <rauser.734062608@sfu.ca> rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard "The Racist" Rauser) writes:

[all kinds of unacceptably racist drivel deleted]

And after that we find the man has absolutely nothing to say.

Richard J. Rauser, you are a dishonourable little man.

caustically, when necessary,

rm
    
-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52595
From: jbarrett@aludra.usc.edu (Jonathan Barrett)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:

>    Okay, the stretcher remark was a little carried away. But the point is that
>I resent NHL owners drafting all these Europeans INSTEAD of Canadians (and
>some Americans). It denies young Canadians the opportunity to play in THEIR
>NORTH AMERICAN LEAGUE and instead gives it to Europeans, who aren't even
>better hockey players. It's all hype. This "European mystique" is sickening,
>but until NHL owners get over it, Canadian and American players will continue
>to have to fight harder to get drafted into their own league.

According to what reasonable principle of justice does standing in intimate
geographical and psychological relations to a league give one some privileged
right to play in it?

A European

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52596
From: coulman@cs.Usask.CA (Randy Coulman)
Subject: Re: Playoff Predictions

In article <1993Apr04.223559.7129@rose.com>, jack.petrilli@rose.com (jack petrilli) writes:

[... stuff deleted ...]
>
>I don't understand why so many people are predicting an upset against 
>Pittsburgh. The team has won 12 in a row coming into the playoffs. 
>They've won practically every game that they've really wanted to win 
>all year (including critical victories against the Caps and one 
>against a hot Bruins team **at the Gaahden**). The team is probably at 
>its peak (stronger than the previous 2 Stanley Cup winners). I mean, I 
>know they can lose but it would be a **large** upset. I personally 
>think teams are going to be hard pressed to win 1 or 2 games in any 
>series against the Pens (and I'm **not** a Pittsburgh fan).
>

I have to agree here.  As I heard on TSN tonight, "You want to pick
someone else, but you just don't see how you can".  And I'm a Bruins
fan.  Maybe this year will be different, but it doesn't look good.
Time will tell, though.

[... lots more deleted ...]

Randy
-- 
Randy A. Coulman, M.Sc.         |       ARIES Laboratory
Research Assistant              |       Department of Computational Science
                                |       University of Saskatchewan
coulman@cs.Usask.ca             |       Saskatoon, SK   S7N 0W0             

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52597
From: kozloce@wkuvx1.bitnet
Subject: Re: Good for hockey/Bad for hockey

In article <Rs2J2B8w164w@cellar.org>, darling@cellar.org (Thomas Darling) writes:
> jmd@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (joseph.m.dakes) writes:
> 
>> In article <1ppdccINNbe1@dev-null.phys.psu.edu>, stimpy@dev-null.phys.psu.edu
>> > In article <C4wxnF.Bx1@constellation.ecn.uoknor.edu> mfoster@alliant.backbo
>> > >I prefer the Miami Colons myself.  Headline: FLAMES BLOW OUT COLONS, 9-1
>> > 
>> > Would Kevin Dineen play for the Miami Colons???
>> 
>> As a Flyers fan, I resent you making Kevin Dineen the butt of your
>> jokes:-)!
> 
> Aw, just take a moment to digest it and I'm sure you'll see the humour...
> 
> ^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^\\\^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^
> Thomas A. Darling \\\ The Cellar BBS & Public Access System: 215.539.3043
> darling@cellar.org \\\ GEnie: T.DARLING \\ FactHQ "Truth Thru Technology"
> v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~\\\~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v~v


If anybody is having problems following the thread be sure to ask the
origonal poster to rectify your misunderstanding.

KOZ
LETS GO CAPS!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52598
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Canadiens - another Stanley Cup???

In <rauser.734062534@sfu.ca> rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:

>pereira@CAM.ORG (Dean Pereira) writes:


>>		With the kind of team Montreal has now,  they can take the
>>cup easily.  The only problem they have right now is that everyone is
>>trying to steal the show and play alone.  They need some massive teamwork.

This is known as the Savard syndrome - and we are talking Denis, not Serge.
No team will ever win squat with the likes of Denis Savard in their lineup.

>>	They are also in a little of a slump because long-time hockey
>>Montreal Canadiens announcer Claude Mouton died last tuesday and it was
>>rough on everybody because he has worked with the organization for 21
>>years.  But I know that is no excuse.  But if the Habs manage to get some
>>good teamwork and get into the spirit,  they should have no problem
>>winning in May.

They could tell Savard to stay home and watch the games on TV.

>   I agree. I also think Roy needs a good kick sometimes...that horrible
>4-0 loss to the Capitals last week...yeeeech!

>   Here's to Cup #23...this year!

Sounds like #12 to me.

cordially, as always, 

rm

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52599
From: slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca
Subject: Re:Re: Trade rumor: Montreal/Ottawa/Phillie

>>TSN Sportsdesk just reported that the OTTAWA SUN has reported    
>>tht Montreal will send 4 players + $15 million including Vin 
>>Damphousse and Brian Bellows to Philldelphia, Phillie will send 
>>Eric Lindros to Ottawa, and Ottawa will give it's first round pick 
>>to Montreal.

>>Personally, I can't see Philli giving up Lindros -- for anything.    
  
> Here we go again. Is this the same idiot who posted the Gretzky     
> trade to Toronto????               ^^^^^?!!!

Listen, *ASSHOLE*, I'm just commenting on what I heard 
reported on the sports news!!

You'll notice my skeptical comment!  Sheesh... I thought this group 
wasfor conversation!  Guess I was wrong. }-<

Stephen Legge
SLEGGE@kean.ucs.munc.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52600
From: daniell@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Daniel Lyddy)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <rauser.734062608@sfu.ca> rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:
>
>
>   Ten years ago, the number of Europeans in the NHL was roughly a quarter
>of what it is now. Going into the 1992/93 season, the numbers of Euros on
>NHL teams have escalated to the following stats:
>
>Canadians: 400
>Americans: 100
>Europeans: 100
>
>
>   Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. I am sick

You know, you're absolutely right.  I think we should round up all those
players of European descent and ship 'em back to where they came from.  Let's
see, with whom should we start?  I dunno, Lemieux?  Hmmm...sounds like he
has *French* blood in him!!!  Hey!  France is part of Europe!  Send that
Euro-blooded boy back!!!

Sheesh.

>    I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let the Bures
>and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.
>
>    I just don't want them on mine.

I don't think it would be hard to find some Native Americans (or Native
Canadians, for that matter) who would dispute your claim to this great 
continent of *ours.*  Ya see, if you believe the anthropologists, we're *all*
immigrants of some sort.  If you really don't think that Mogilny, Bure,
Selanne, et al have improved the NHL, then I'm not sure you understand the
game.
-- 
******************************************************************************
Dan Lyddy    daniell@cory.berkeley.edu    University of California at Berkeley
"No, I don't play hockey.  Not too many brothers do."  -- Deion Sanders

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52601
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: Good for hockey/Bad for hockey

>>> > >I prefer the Miami Colons myself.  Headline: FLAMES BLOW OUT COLONS, 9-1
>>> > Would Kevin Dineen play for the Miami Colons???
>>> As a Flyers fan, I resent you making Kevin Dineen the butt of your
>>> jokes:-)!
>> Aw, just take a moment to digest it and I'm sure you'll see the humour...
>If anybody is having problems following the thread be sure to ask the
>origonal poster to rectify your misunderstanding.

	What about his rectum?






-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52602
From: slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca
Subject: Re: Too Many European in NHL

RA>    Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. 
R> I am sick of watching a game between an American and a Canadian 
RA> team (let's say, the Red Wings and the Canucks) and seeing names 
R> like "Bure" "Konstantinov" and "Borshevshky". Is this North America 
RA> isn't it?
 
I disagree.  I think the NHL should feature the best hockey talent in
the world -- regardless of nationality.  I have to admit that when I 
see players like Gretzky and Messier traded off to the US because the
Canadian teams can't afford them, I have been know to say (only half-
seriously) that we'd probably be better off if we had our own Canadian
hockey league for Canadian players! ;-)

RA> I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let 
RA> te Bures and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.    

RA> 
RA> I just don't want themon mine.   
 
Again, it doesn't matter to me -- Russian, Finnish, Mexican, Albertan,
New Yorker, black, white, korean, martian, plutoneon, ... it doesn't
matter.
 
Any of them can put a Leafs' jersey on if they can put the puck in! 
:-)

Stephen Legge
SLEGGE@kean.ucs.munc.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52603
From: stimpy@dev-null.phys.psu.edu (Gregory Nagy)
Subject: Re: Good for hockey/Bad for hockey

In article <91548@hydra.gatech.EDU> gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak) writes:
>>>> > >I prefer the Miami Colons myself.  Headline: FLAMES BLOW OUT COLONS, 9-1
>>>> > Would Kevin Dineen play for the Miami Colons???
>>>> As a Flyers fan, I resent you making Kevin Dineen the butt of your
>>>> jokes:-)!
>>> Aw, just take a moment to digest it and I'm sure you'll see the humour...
>>If anybody is having problems following the thread be sure to ask the
>>origonal poster to rectify your misunderstanding.
>
>	What about his rectum?

It's bad jokes like that which draws crohns, I mean groans from the crowd...
Don't bother looking it up in the appendix, it's useless anyway.
         
Just one more word of advice...

If you go to a Miami game, stay away from any foods made with "natural casings"

:)
--

      __-----__     _______________________
     / _______ \   /                       \
    |_// \/ \ \_| / Hockey! Hockey! Hockey! \
    /__|O||O|__U\ \   Joy!    Joy!    Joy!  /
   |/_ \_/\_/ _U | \_______________________/
   | | (____) | ||  //    Stimpson J Kat
   \/\___/\__/  // //     stimpy@dev-null.phys.psu.edu
   (_/  _5_  ~~~| //      nagy@physci.psu.edu           
    |   \*/     |\/       nagy@cs.psu.edu
     \___v_____/_/        nagy@crayola.cs.psu.edu
      \____/---//         nagy@love-shack.com
     __|| _-----               and oh yeah...              
    (____(____)           GGN100@psuvm.[psu.edu,bitnet]     
     ~~~~ ~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52604
From: "Terence M. Rokop" <tr2i+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: NCAA finals...Winner????

ktgeiss@miavx1.acs.muohi writes:

>Lake State/Maine in finals...WHO WON?   Please post.

Maine 5, LSSU 4.



                                                Terry

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52605
From: v124p7kk@ubvmsc.cc.buffalo.edu (Darryl S Brooks)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL (Euro-bashing?)

In article <rauser.734062608@sfu.ca>, rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes...
> 
> 
>   Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. I am sick
>of watching a game between an American and a Canadian team (let's say, the
>Red Wings and the Canucks) and seeing names like "Bure" "Konstantinov" and
>"Borshevshky". Is this North America or isn't it? Toronto, Detriot, Quebec,
>and Edmonton are particularly annoying, but the numbers of Euros on other
>teams is getting worse as well. 
> 
>    I live in Vancouver and if I hear one more word about "Pavel Bure, the
>Russian Rocket" I will completely throw up. As it is now, every time I see
>the Canucks play I keep hoping someone will cross-check Bure into the plexiglassso hard they have to carry him out on a stretcher. (By the way, I'm not a
>Canucks fan to begin with ;-). 
> 
>    Okay, the stretcher remark was a little carried away. But the point is that
>I resent NHL owners drafting all these Europeans INSTEAD of Canadians (and
>some Americans). It denies young Canadians the opportunity to play in THEIR
>NORTH AMERICAN LEAGUE and instead gives it to Europeans, who aren't even
>better hockey players. It's all hype. This "European mystique" is sickening,
>but until NHL owners get over it, Canadian and American players will continue
>to have to fight harder to get drafted into their own league.
> 
>    With the numbers of Euros in the NHL escalating, the problem is clearly
>only getting worse.
> 
>    I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let the Bures
>and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.
> 
>    I just don't want them on mine.
> 
> 
	Ah, so now we're into European player bashing?  What next?  
No more French Canadiens?  Yeah, there's an idea!  Let them French-
speaking Canadiens have their own hockey league!  We don't want them!
	Are you _CRAZY_?  The NHL is one of the true international
leagues, and yes, there _ARE_ many Europeans who deserve to play in
the NHL and are better than some North Americans, look at Teemu!!!
I, for one, am glad to see Europeans in the NHL and I hope the
NHL soon expands to Europe.  Its nice to see all these different
people come together to form the (soon to be) 26 hockey teams.
	
> 
> 
>-- 
>Richard J. Rauser        "You have no idea what you're doing."
>rauser@sfu.ca            "Oh, don't worry about that. We're professional
>WNI                          outlaws - we do this for a living."
>-----------------
>"Remember, no matter where you go, there you are." -Dr.Banzai

Darryl Brooks                    University at Buffalo
                __                 ______                        ///
       | |     /  \  \ \     / /  / _____          / /         ////
       | |    / /\ \  \ \___/ /  (  \          ---/-/---       ///
       | |   / /__\ \   \   /      \  \       ---/-/---       ///
| |____| |  /  ____  \   | |     ____\  )       / /          ///
 \______/  / /      \ \  | |     ______/                  ///////

                   Go Bills, Sabres, and Magic!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52606
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Stan Fischler, 4/4


At the Lester Patrick Awards lunch, Bill Torrey mentioned that one of his
options next season is to be president of the Miami team, with Bob Clarke
working for him.  At the same dinner, Clarke said that his worst mistake
in Philadelphia was letting Mike Keenan go -- in retrospect, almost all
players came realize that Keenan knew what it took to win.  Rumours are
now circulating that Keenan will be back with the Flyers.

Nick Polano is sick of being a scapegoat for the schedule made for the
Red Wings; After all, Bryan Murray approved it.

Gerry Meehan and John Muckler are worried over the Sabres' prospects;
Assistant Don Lever says that the Sabres have to get their share now,
because a Quebec dynasty is emerging ...

The Mighty Ducks have declared that they will not throw money around
loosely to buy a team.

Oilers coach Ted Green remarked that "There some guys around who can
fill Tie Domi's skates, but none who can fill his helmet."

Senators' Andrew McBain told off a security guard at Chicago Stadium
who warned him of the stairs leading down to the locker room; McBain
mouthed off at him, after all being a seasoned professional ... and
tumbled down the entire steep flight.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52607
From: "Patricia L. Bruno" <pb37+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Hockey Hell

> 
>In article <C4nq5G.EKB@noose.ecn.purdue.edu>,
>rgemeinh@separator.ecn.purdue.edu (Richard A Gemeinhart) wrote:
>> 
>> In article <1993Mar26.155933.9669@ncsu.edu> fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu
(FRANK MICH
>AE SALVATORE) writes:
>> >
>> >
>> >I am originally from New York State, and I go to school
>> >in North Carolina.  Yet, I don't constantly gripe about
>> >the lack of hockey.  Wouldn't some of you who chose to go
>> >to school in the South realize (most who gripe are Clemson students)
>> >that hockey isn't quite as popular in South Carolina
>> >when you chose a school?
>> >
>> >Why did you all (excuse me - y'all) choose schools in
>> >the South if hockey was this important to you?  
>> 
>> Not everyone has the luxury of deciding on a college by making sure the 
>> hockey coveraage is what you want it to be.  I am a Pittsburgh transplan
>> to S. C. when at home and the coveraage sucks.  Sports south didn't
even show
>> the final game of the Stanley Cup laast year while it was happening.  They
>> put it on ktape delay and cut the intermissions then went off the air.  
>> When you move you take the good with the bad and deal with it;  it doesn't
>> mean thaat you can't complain about it.
> 
>I was transplanted by my parents from the Greater Hartford area to the
>Greater Cleveland, Ohio area.  This was not an action of my choice.  The
>only hockey coverage I could get there regularly was Red Wings and Penguins
>(explaining, in part, why I follow these teams today).  In Cleveland you
>couldn't even find hockey scores on the 11 o'clock news because they
>figured that if they didn't have it, it wasn't a sport.
> 


At least your parents didn't move you Idaho.  The only things that get
any coverage there are football, basketball and baseball!

Patty


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52608
From: ddf@mips.com (Dee Dee France)
Subject: European/Russian Hockey team addresses?

Does anyone have the addresses to any of the following hockey teams
located in the Czech/Slovak Republics, Finland, Russia or Sweden?
Any information on how to find these addresses would also be appreciated.

Aik
Assat
Brynas
Budejovice
Chelabinsk
Djurgarden
Dynamo
Eskulap
Espoo
Farjestad
Frolunda
HPK
HV-71
Hifk
Ilves
JYP HT
Jihlava
Jokerit
Jokp
Kalpa
Khimik
Kladno
Kristall
Lada
Leksand
Litvinov
Lukko
Lulea
Malmo
Metallurg
Modo
Olomouc
Pardubice
Red Army
Rogle
Skoda
Slovan
Soviet Wings
Sparta
Spartak
TPS
Tappara
Trencin
Tuto
Vantaa
Vasteras
Yaroslavl
Zlin

-- 
Dee Dee France
ddf@sgi.com 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52609
From: adams@hunter.unr.edu (Brian Adams)
Subject: Re: In memoriam: Dan Kelly and Danny Gallivan

In article <1993Apr5.194440.18546@ists.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:
>In article <burke.1-290393150052@burkemac.oshag.nd.edu> burke.1@nd.edu (R. P. Burke) writes:
>>When talking about hockey broadcasters, let's give a moment of silence to
>>remember the St. Louis Blues' great, Dan Kelly. (Many of you may have heard
>>him in the late 60s and early 70s on CBS.) He used to do Hockey Night In
>>Canada intermissions, with another recently deceased great, Danny Gallivan
>>of the Canadiens.
>

I *loved* Dan Kelly!  He was on USA when I first got hooked on Hockey back
in 1980 or so.  No, he wasn't always spot on top of the play, and he
wasn't overly cute, but those pipes!  That lusty, barrel chested, voice!
No pipsqueak was he (unlike some fellas we know!)

I rode into hockey mania on the coattails of Gretzky and the Boys on the
Bus.  My first Finals saw the Islanders sweep them.  But I'll never
forget the night, a year later, when the Oilers closed it out at home in
the pandemonium, the smoke from a million sparklers, the long empty-net
goal near the end, and Dan Kelly letting the crowd's reaction tell the
story for a few long seconds, then that voice barking through the din
"Dave Lumley ... sews it up for Edmonton!"  It sounds stupid, but that
early (for me) hockey memory will always bring a thrill.  Since then
I've grown a lot more jaded about the game, but I was really saddened
by Dan Kelly's passing.  He was one of the good guys.

Brian Adams
Reno




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52610
From: mjacques@flute.calpoly.edu (Michael Jacques)
Subject: Re: Playoff Predictions

In article <1pn4qhINNsm1@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU> boudreau@athena.mit.edu (Carol V. Boudreau) writes:
>


>
>In the Smythe:
>This one is the toughest for me to call, because I have to put
>personal bias aside (Go Calgary).  I think a lot depends on who
>wins the division.  Winnipeg will move into third by the end of
>the season, and the first place winner will have a clear advantage.
>It will be a lot easier to build momentum against a team like the
>Kings.  Whoever plays the Kings in the first round will take the
>division.  Much as it hurts, I have to pick,
>Division Winner - Vancouver Canucks

I'll have to disagree with you on this one. I think Vancouver will go as
Bure goes, and if he continues on his goal scoring slump, then they
won't even make it out of the first round. I think the Kings will make
it out of the first round, regardless of who they play. They seem to be
doing pretty well, even with that bad game against Minnesota on
Saturday. I think it'll be either Calgary or Los Angeles to win the
Smythe (i.e. go on to the conference finals). 
>
>Wales Conference Trophy:
>Islanders and Bruins will fight to the end, but I think the
>Islanders have enough steam to overtake the Bruins in seven.
>
>Campbell Conference Trophy:
>a walk for Vancouver, maybe in 5 or 6 but definately not 7.
>
>Stanley Cup Final:
>Islanders and Vancouver.  Islanders will have nothing left by
>this point and will succumb fairly easily to the Canucks.
>
>Stanley Cup Champion: Vancouver Canucks

Still have to disagree with you here. I think it'll be Pittsburg to
get the hat trick in Stanley Cups. They just look
toooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo good. 
>
>I hope you have enjoyed my predictions.  I hope they are not
>all correct (Go Calgary).
>
Neither do I. Well, may the best team win it all (Pittsburg). That's
just my $.02 worth.
>
>-- 
>----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>message from the terminal of:
>Carol Boudreau  <boudreau@Athena.mit.edu>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52611
From: peterson@pms001.pms.ford.com (Doug Peterson)
Subject: NCAA Hockey Final

I haven't seen anyone post this so I will do the honors.

Maine beat LSSU 5-4 in Milwaukee on Saturday night.  It was quite a game.
Maine stormed to a 2-0 lead in the first and looked like they might run away
with it.  Maine's first goal came inside the first thirty seconds of the game.
LSSU came back at the end of the period to cut the lead to 2-1.

LSSU came out in the second dominating the play particularly along the boards.
The play went quickly with the refs running a no-holds-barred type of game.
LSSU scored three more unanswered goals to lead 4-2 at the end of the second.
Now it looked like LSSU might just walk away with the game.

Coach Walsh, of Maine, replaced the starting goalie Dunham with Snow, who won
the game against Michigan.  Snow proved to be a much more aggressive goalie.
The third period, like the second, belonged to the team behind.  Maine scored
three unanswered goals in a span of five minutes after the four minute mark.
They were all scored by Jim Montgomery, the tournament MVP, and all assisted by
Paul Kariya.

The last minute of the game bears highlighting.  The change to Snow also
proved the difference in the end.  With one minute to go and with the LSSU
goalie pulled, Snow dueled with a LSSU forward in a amazing set of moves by
both.  Snow won.  It was a great way to end the game.

This year's three championships games were sold out last year in about one
month.  The Bradley Center holds approximately 17,700.  

-- 
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
Douglas J. Peterson                   Have         _--____    ____
peterson@pms860.pms.ford.com            you        `   /  ----        / 
Safety Laboratories Department            driven     -/- __  ____ _  /
Ford Motor Company                           a    .  /  / \--/___/ \/
(313) 390-8089                                    \_/  ,\_/ /    \_/_   lately?

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52612
From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In <rauser.734062608@sfu.ca> rauser@fraser.sfu.ca writes:

> 
> 
>    Ten years ago, the number of Europeans in the NHL was roughly a quarter
> of what it is now. Going into the 1992/93 season, the numbers of Euros on
> NHL teams have escalated to the following stats:
> 
> Canadians: 400
> Americans: 100
> Europeans: 100
> 
>    Please note that these numbers are rounded off, and taken from the top
> 25 players on each of the 24 teams. My source is the Vancouver Sun.
> 
>    Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. I am sick
> of watching a game between an American and a Canadian team (let's say, the
> Red Wings and the Canucks) and seeing names like "Bure" "Konstantinov" and
> "Borshevshky". Is this North America or isn't it? Toronto, Detriot, Quebec,
> and Edmonton are particularly annoying, but the numbers of Euros on other
> teams is getting worse as well. 

That's why we have expansion - to create more jobs. NHL teams can't afford to
import role players from Europe, they pick the stars but will continue to build
their teams around local players.
> 
>     With the numbers of Euros in the NHL escalating, the problem is clearly
> only getting worse.
> 
>     I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let the Bures
> and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.

I'd *LOVE* to see a European NHL division but can't see it happen for some
time. There's simply not enough fan interest at the moment in several
"crucial" markets like Germany, Italy and France while Sweden and Finland
probably can't afford to shell out $20-$30 for tickets the way
American/Canadian fans do. Call it "the Minnesota North Stars" effect:
Scandinavians do love hockey but we prefer to watch local, inexpensive
hockey to the NHL. The National Hockey League should love the idea, though.
Pan-European TV channels such as Eurosport could bring in the millions the
American networks likely never will pay.
 
>     I just don't want them on mine.
> 
> 
>  
>  
> -- 
> Richard J. Rauser        "You have no idea what you're doing."
> rauser@sfu.ca            "Oh, don't worry about that. We're professional
> WNI                          outlaws - we do this for a living."
> -----------------
> "Remember, no matter where you go, there you are." -Dr.Banzai

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52613
From: seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <1993Apr5.221541.28537@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca>, golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
> In article <C4zCII.Ftn@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca> smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale) writes:
> >
> >                        Team           Biggest       Biggest
> >Team:                   MVP:          Surprise:    Disappointment:
> >-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >Philadelphia Flyers     Lindros/Recchi Fedyk/Galley  Eklund
> 
> Fence-sitting...look at Philly's record with Eric and without...
> there is no doubt.  Soderstrom is probably the biggest surprise.

Re Eric: True, but fortunately we didn't get to find out what they would be
like without Recchi for 30 games.

Soderstrom: Absolutely. 4 shutouts in 39 games for a rookie without a lot
of defense in front of him. Runnerups to Galley and Fedyk who are scoring
a ton over their career best. But Galley thinks he's Paul Coffey (puts scoring
ahead of defending) and Fedyk has tailed off big time.

Eklund: Was a big question mark this year and was coming off injuries. 42
points in 49 games is not bad at all, and recently he's been a huge factor
in the wins they've gotten. Eklund has never had a point a game season in
his career, his production is very typical for him. How does he qualify as
a disappointment? If anything he's a surprise.

My choice would be Roussel if I went strictly by what was expected of players,
but I never thought that he had what it takes to be a #1 goalie. My biggest
disappointment is Bill Dineen. I thought that he was going to be the perfect
coach for this young team, instead he's made too many bad moves and IMHO
has cost them enough games to keep them out of the playoffs this year. Any
coach that thinks putting Eric Lindros at the point on power plays is a
bright idea needs to go back to coaching school.

pete clark jr - rsh FLYERS contact and mailing list owner

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52614
From: seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr)
Subject: FLYERS notes 4/5



The FLYERS team that can beat any team on any night showed up at the Spectrum
Sunday night, and dominated the Maple Leafs thoroughly en route to a 4-0
shutout. Tommy Soderstrom will get credit for the shutout, but he barely broke
a sweat until the third period as the FLYERS defense kept the Leafs from
mounting any serious attack.

Injuries:

Pelle Eklund is day-to-day with a bruised thigh.

Roster Moves:

Jason Bowen was added to the lineup for his first NHL game. Jason was the FLYERS
second pick in the first round (15th overall) of the 1992 entry draft. 19 years
old, 6'4", 210 lbs. In 62 games with the tri-city Americans he had 10 goals,
12 assists and 219 PIM. He plays left wing and defense, he played defense in
this game although Bobby Taylor said that Bill Dineen was planning to use him
up front as well.

Andre Faust was returned to Hershey. He actually left after the second period
of the Kings game, flew to Albany, got the game tying goal in a Bears OT win,
and played again for Hershey Sunday night.

Lines:

Fedyk-Lindros-Recchi
Beranek-Brind'Amour-Dineen
Lomakin-Butsayev-Conroy
Acton-Brown

Galley-McGill
Yushkevich-Cronin
Carkner-Hawgood
Bowen

Tommy Soderstrom in goal.

Acton replaced Lomakin in the 3rd period.

Game Summary:

If the FLYERS played like this every night, they'd be in the playoffs this
year. The FLYERS hit everything that moved. They created scoring chance after
scoring chance. They snuffed out everything that the Leafs tried to do.

Jason Bowen made a good play on his first NHL shift that almost created a goal.
He had the puck in the top of the left offensive circle all alone, but instead
of taking the shot he found Brind'Amour crashing the net on the other side.
A perfect pass and a good shot across Daren Puppa's body should have been a
goal, but Puppa made a great save reading the play.

Garry Galley gave the Maple Leafs 7th ranked power play the first chance when
he hooked Doug Gilmour at 4:25. The FLYERS lowly 21st ranked penalty killing
unit was almost flawless the entire game, and set the tone on this kill. The
Maple Leafs got almost nothing but long unscreened shots, and the defense swept
away every rebound.

After the power play, the FLYERS got a goal on an ugly play. Rod Brind'Amour
gave the puck to Greg Hawgood at the right point, and he sent a drive at the
net. Puppa made the save and kicked the rebound right into the feet of Josef
Beranek and Bob Rouse, who were wrestling in the slot. Beranek was able to
get his stick on the puck and push it out to Dineen who was skating into
the slot from the right circle, and he lifted a backhander over Puppa for
a 1-0 FLYERS lead at 8:10.

The FLYERS kept the pressure on, and Puppa was the only Leaf keeping the FLYERS
from building on their lead for a while. Eventually things settled down and
defense prevailed. Each team got an occasional scoring chance, but the goalies
were strong. Bowen started giving some Lindros-like checks in his own corners.
Then Lindros, who was looking to avenge a hit Foligno gave him, thought he had
a chance to even the score. He had Foligno lined up at center ice, leaned into
him, and rode him into the center ice boards. The only problem was that Foligno
was a little far from the boards, and Mike "Mister" McGeough felt that it
warranted a boarding call at 15:38

The Leafs couldn't get anything going on the power play as the FLYERS were
very aggressive (for a change) on the kill.

With time running out in the period, Recchi carried through the neutral zone
and handed to Lindros as they approached the Leaf's blue line. They were in
a crowd with Wendell Clark and Jamie Macoun, Lindros tried a backhand pass
to Recchi through the feet of Macoun that connected to Recchi, but then Clark
checked Recchi off the puck. Macoun then tried to clear, but it was weak and
went right to McGill who had manned the point. He drove it from just inside
the blue line. Macoun got his stick on it and deflected it past his own
goalie at 19:55.1. Shots were 13-8 FLYERS in the period.

The FLYERS finally got their first chance on the power play when Dave Andreychuk
tripped up Rod Brind'Amour in his offensive zone. During the power play, the
FLYERS got cheated a little when the puck popped up into the air and Eric
gloved it down, but McGeough thought it hit his stick above his head. We
could see from our seats at the other end of the ice that it only hit his glove
and the replay confirmed, but the faceoff went to the other end. As time was
running out in the advantage, Lindros found Galley with a pass across the goal
mouth but Puppa made the save. The rebound kicked back to the right corner where
Recchi picked it up, passed it out to Eric crashing through the right circle,
and Eric one-timed past Puppa at 7:55. With the assist, Recchi moves past
Bobby Clarke's 74-75 season, the second best one season total for a FLYER at
117.  Eric moves up to 4th all time in FLYERS rookie scoring with 67 points.

Mike Eastwood took down Al Conroy at 8:30 to give the FLYERS another chance on
the power play. Not much pressure before Garry Galley ended the power play with
a slash at 9:19. Not much happened on the 4 on 4, although the Leafs had most
of the possession. The FLYERS smothered the Leafs short power play. Tempers
flared a little at 13:14. Bowen and Pearson got roughing minors, Keith Acton
got a bloody face. Dave McLlwain then took a dive and got Greg Hawgood a
hooking minor at 13:46 to set up a 4 on 3. The replay showed that Hawgood's
stick stopped making contact with McLlwain long before he spun around and fell.
Again the FLYERS smothered the Leafs power play, led by Dimitri Yushkevich.
Bowen made a thundering hit when he came out of the box on Pearson. Berehowski
tried to perplex everybody with his sloooowball. He had the puck at the point,
and just trickled a pass down the slot. He made all the FLYERS look silly as
nobody could get a stick on it, and it got to Gilmour at the side of the net,
but Soderstrom stoned him.

The FLYERS picked things up offensively after the kill was over, but didn't
get anything home. Shots were 13-10 FLYERS.

The FLYERS were content with the 3 goal lead in the third period, and they
decided that if Tommy wanted a shutout, he was going to have to work for it a
little.

The FLYERS got most of the scoring chances in the first 7 or so minutes of the
period, but couldn't get past Puppa. Then the Leafs got tired of Lindros making
road kill out of them, and tempers flared. 2 each for Doug Gilmour and Lindros 
(unsportsmanlike conduct) and 2 each for Glenn Anderson and McGill (roughing)
all at 7:02. Terry Carkner then took a kneeing penalty at 7:51 on Gilmour.

Again the FLYERS smothered the Leafs power play.

At about the 12 minute mark, Dave Andreychuk got a shot away from his left
circle that got through Soderstrom. The puck was rolling on it's side, and
as luck would have it it turned away from the net instead of turning towards
it (think of how a rolling quarter inevitably starts to lean one way or the
other). Seconds later Rod Brind'Amour tripped up Gilmour at 12:24 to give the
Leafs another chance on the power play. On the advantage, after Soderstrom
stoned Andreychuk while lying down, Andreychuk got the rebound through
Soderstrom, but from behind the net and it went straight through and was swept
away by one of his defensemen. They kept the pressure on, but Soderstrom was
equal and preserved the shutout.

Recchi cross checked Ken Baumgartner to get tempers hot and start a brawl
at 16:01. No punches thrown, Recchi got the initial minor, Krushelnyski
Baumgartner and Lindros each got roughing minors. At 17:02 Rouse and Beranek
expressed their mutual dislike for each other and got 2 each for slashing to
set up another 4 on 4. Mike Eastwood shoved down Ryan McGill in the FLYERS
zone as they were battling for the puck, and while McGill was down he ran
his stick across McGill's face. The FLYERS were not happy with that at all.
5-8 Al Conroy paired up with 6-1 Berehowski, and started throwing punches.
Upward. Well, Al held his own, much to the delight of the crowd. Each got
a couple punches in before going down in a head, and Al got a standing O!
Penalties: Eastwood 5 (cross check) + game, Clark, Carkner 10 each. Berehowski
and Conroy 5 each (fighting) at 17:49.

So a major penalty for the rest of the game for the FLYERS. The had no interest
in stting on the lead. Hawgood, Galley and Brind'Amour played catch until
Hawgood found Dineen all alone in the left circle, he controlled the puck and
blasted it past Puppa at 18:39.

That was all the fireworks, Tommy Soderstrom would not face another shot. Puppa
did, but kept the FLYERS off the board. 4-0 FLYERS, shots were 9-8 FLYERS in the
3rd. Probably the strongest game I've seen from the FLYERS since the All Star
break. Shutout number 4 for Soderstrom, all since 1/10. Tied for 2nd most in
the NHL, but he's played fewer games than Belfour (6) or the goalie I can't
remember that he's tied with.

Next up it's the Winnipeg Selannes Tuesday night in Winnipeg. The FLYERS cannot
be eliminated if they win, but a loss coupled with an Islander win that night
in Washington would be the official end.

FLYERS up to 71 points on the season in 78 games. Last year they had 75 points
in 80 games (5 under .500), so they need at least 8 points in their last 6
games to improve on that only by percentage points (5 under in 84 is better
than 5 under in 80).

Tragic number holds at 3 points with 6 games left. The tragic number for 5th
is 5 points, I watched the Rangers blow a 4-2 third period lead at home to
lose 5-4 before I finished this up. Why 5 points instead of 4? Well, the FLYERS
will win the tie-breaker if they catch them, whereas the Islanders win tie
breakers against the FLYERS and so need only a tie. The Rangers could crumble
down the stretch as they play the Devils, the Pens twice, the FLYERS, and
finish up with 2 games against the Caps. So I guess 5th place could be the
goal for the team to focus on.

FLYERS team record watch:

Eric Lindros:

38 goals, 29 assists, 67 points

(rookie records)
club record goals:			club record points:
Eric Lindros	38 1992-93		Dave Poulin	76 1983-84
Brian Propp	34 1979-80		Brian Propp	75 1979-80
Ron Flockhart	33 1981-82		Ron Flockhart	72 1981-82
Dave Poulin	31 1983-84		Eric Lindros	67 1992-93
Bill Barber	30 1972-73		Pelle Eklund	66 1985-86

Mark Recchi:

51 goals, 66 assists, 117 points.

club record goals:			club record points:
Reggie Leach	61 1975-76		Bobby Clarke	119 1975-76
Tim Kerr	58 1985-86,86-87	Mark Recchi	117 1992-93
Tim Kerr	54 1983-84,84-85	Bobby Clarke	116 1974-75
Mark Recchi	51 1992-93		Bill Barber	112 1975-76
Rick Macliesh	50 1972-73		Bobby Clarke	104 1972-73
Bill Barber	50 1975-76		Rick Macliesh	100 1972-73
Reggie Leach	50 1979-80

FLYERS career years:

Player		Points	Best Prior Season
Mark Recchi	117	113 (90-91 Penguins)
Rod Brind'Amour	79	77 (91-92 FLYERS)
Garry Galley	58	38 (84-85 Kings)
Brent Fedyk	58	35 (90-91 Red Wings)

That's all for now...

pete clark jr - rsh FLYERS contact and mailing list owner


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52615
From: hahietanen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi
Subject: Strange phenomens in NHL (was: Team leaders in +/-)

In article <1993Apr5.195705.29227@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca>, maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
> In <1993Apr5.185633.17843@ists.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:
> 
>>Implicitly you are assuming that goals scored against Winnipeg with Selanne
>>on the ice can be blamed on him...Roger, he is a FORWARD.  Winnipeg has a
>>lousy defensive record anyway.  Let's put it another way.  John Cullen's +/-
>>is terrible.  What's your excuse for him?  That his powerplay points don't
>>count?  Neither do Selanne's... 
> 
> Are you comparing Cullen to Salami?  I would say that that is valid.  If
> Winnipeg is such a lousy defensive team then why the hell does Salami
> stand around the other team's blueline when the puck is in his own end?

  I thought that he was comparing Cullen to TEEMU SEL[NNE. I always thought
  that salami is some sort of sausage, BUT IF YOU, dear Roger, ARE ABLE TO
  SEE SALAMI ON THE ICE PLAYING HOCKEY... I don't know what to do, but you
  surely should do something and very quickly!!!

  Maybe you think that if you keep on talking some rubbish, after some time
  everybody will consider it to be really true... You should take care of
  your LEAFS, they surely need it more.
  
> 
>>What he does best is score...so I refer you to my comment above.
> 
> Some of our Finnish friends who have watched him play claim that he
> can play a solid two-way game.  I would have to say that this style
> of contribution would be more conducive to winning.  Or don't you 
> think so?

  At least we have seen him playing... 
> 
>>>As it is now, Selanne
>>>is a grandstanding goal suck.  Did you see the way he parades around
>>>with his arms outstretched after scoring a goal?  You would think the
>>>Messiah had returned...

 During the latest Philly game the Leaf players didn't parade... Philly
 crunched them 4-0 !!!  Maybe you need some more two way players who can
 score, too !!???
> 
> 
> cordially, as always,
> 
> rm
> 
> -- 
> Roger Maynard 
> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

  just cordially,

  Hannu

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> GO  JETS  GO ! >>>>>>>> TEEMU ! >>>>>>> TEPPO ! >>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> TAPPARA >>>>>> CANADIENS >>>>>>> BLACKHAWKS >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
 


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52616
Subject: Re: Trade rumor: Montreal/Ottawa/Phillie
From: <JER108@psuvm.psu.edu>

In article <93095.210625MWEINTR@auvm.american.edu>, <MWEINTR@auvm.american.edu>
says:
>
>Also sprach slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca ...
>
>>TSN Sportsdesk just reported that the OTTAWA SUN has reported that
>>Montreal will send 4 players + $15 million including Vin Damphousse
>>and Brian Bellows to Phillidelphia, Phillie will send Eric Lindros
>>to Ottawa, and Ottawa will give it's first round pick to Montreal.
>>
>>If this is true, it will most likely depend on whether or not Ottawa
>>gets to choose 1st overall.  Can Ottawa afford Lindros' salary?
>>
>>Personally, I can't see Philli giving up Lindros -- for anything.
>>They didn't give away that much to Quebec just to trade him away
>>again.  Not to mention that Lindros seems to be a *huge* draw in
>>Phillie -- and that he represents a successful future for the
>>franchise.
>>
>>Ottawa may be better off taking the 4 players +$15 from Montreal
>>for the pick.
>>
>>Stephen Legge
>>SLEGGE@kean.ucs.munc.ca
>
>Two things:
>
>1. Didn't the trade deadline pass two weeks ago?
>
>2. The FLYERS would never ever EVER give up Lindros, simple as that.
>
3. With Soderstrom and Roussel, why the hell would the Flyers want to
   pick up an older and slumping Roy?

(BYW, I could come up with a group of players they'd trade for.... but
they wouldn't be from the same team.)

>Go Flyers, Cup in '94...
>
>Mike
>---
>***Yes-Rush-Marillion-ELP-Genesis-King Crimson-Dream Theater-Beatles***
>* Mike Weintraub, aka Jvi on IRC              "Courageous convictions *
>* mweintr@american.edu                         will drag the dream    *
>* jedi@wave.cerf.net                           into existence"        *
>* The American University, Washington DC        - Rush (NOT Limbaugh) *
>***Go Philadelphia Flyers, Vancouver Canucks & Philadelphia Phillies***

                                          John E. Runski
                                           <jer108@psuvm>

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52617
From: mtjensen@nbivax.nbi.dk
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <C4zCII.Ftn@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca>, smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale) writes:
> 
> I was thinking about who on each of the teams were the MVPs, biggest
> surprises, and biggest disappointments this year. Now, these are just
> my observations and are admittedly lacking because I have not had an
> opportunity to see all the teams the same amount. Anyway....
>   
> MVP = most valuable player to his team both in terms of points and
>       in terms of leadership ("can't win without him")
>   
> Biggest surprise = the player who rose above expectation -- the player
>       that may have raised the level of his game to a new height, even
>       if that new level doesn't necessarily warrant an allstar berth
>       (includes those players who at the outset of the season, may not
>       even have been in the team's plans).
>    
> Biggest disappointment = the player from whom we expected more (e.g., I
>       picked Denis Savard in Montreal because with the new emphasis on
>       offence brought by Demers, shouldn't Savard have done better?)
>    
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>   
>                         Team           Biggest       Biggest
> Team:                   MVP:          Surprise:    Disappointment:
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> Boston Bruins           Oates          D.Sweeney     Wesley
> Buffalo Sabres          Lafontaine     Mogilny       Audette (jinx?)
> Calgary Flames          Roberts        Reichel       Petit
> Chicago Blackhawks      Roenick        Ruuttu        Goulet
> Detroit Red Wings       Yzerman        Chaisson      Kozlov
> Edmonton Oilers         Manson         Buchberger    Mellanby
> Hartford Whalers        Sanderson      Cassells      Corriveau
> Los Angeles Kings       Robitaille     Donnelly      Hrudey
> Minnesota North Stars   Modano      Tinordi(not expected back)  Broten
> Montreal Canadiens      Muller         Lebeau        Savard
> New Jersey Devils       Stevens        Semak         MacLean
> New York Islanders      Turgeon        King(finally) Marois
> New York Rangers        Messier        Kovalev       Bourque
> Ottawa Senators         MacIver        Baker         Jelinek
> Philadelphia Flyers     Lindros/Recchi Fedyk/Galley  Eklund
> Pittsburgh Penguins     Lemieux        Tocchet(even for him)  Jagr
> Quebec Nordiques        Sakic/Ricci    Kovalenko     Pearson
> San Jose Sharks         Kisio          Gaudreau      Maley
> St Louis Blues          Shanahan       C.Joseph      Ron Sutter
> Tampa Bay Lightening    Bradley        Bradley       Creighton/Kasper
> Toronto Maple Leafs     Gilmour        Potvin        Ellett/Anderson
> Vancouver Canucks       Bure           Nedved(finally)    Momesso
> Washington Capitals     Hatcher        Bondra/Cote   Elynuik
> Winnipeg Jets           Selanne        Selanne       Druce
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>   
> As I mentioned up top, these are my *impressions* from where I sit. I
> would welcome any opinions from those fans nearer their teams (in other
> words, *anywhere* away from a Toronto newspaper!)
>    
> Bryan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52618
From: tervio@katk.Helsinki.FI (TERVI| MARKO J)
Subject: Realignment in 2000

   Well, here it is, NHL in the year 2000.
I got these from a very reliable source in a dream some years ago and 
although I initially thought I had just been taking too many too strong 
drugs now it seems the realization has really begun...  You can see the 
league has already started to move to this direction.

   *The Walt Disney Conference*
Anaheim Mighty Chipmunks    -Franchise name to be changed after each new 
LA Kings                      hockey movie         
LA Flames                   -We've seen some of that
San Jose Sharks
San Diego Bruins
Tijuana Red Wings   -Detroit's hockey team will follow its car industry...
Dallas Stars           
Houston Oilers
Texas Rangers
Seattle Canucks

   *The Norm Green Conference*
Alabama White Hawks
Biloxi Blues
Tampa Bay Lightning
Miami Blades
Helsinki Jets        -You've heard them starting getting used to the anthem
Montreal Quebecois (sp?)                 -There will be no 'Canada'
Atlanta Devils
Orlando Penquins
Key West Islanders
Hartford Whalers                        The Whalers will never move, huh?
Palm Beach Capitals

  Now that the Anahaim team is becomming real I'm really beginning to believe
the rest of the 'message'.  I'm sure the future will turn you into believers 
too.  After 2000 the NHL will abandond ice-rinks.  It's so expensive to cool 
down the rinks in the subtropics and the locals hardly know what ice is 
anyway.  NHL will become a roller skating hockey league.  That way it can 
create more public interest in the game when local supporteres can play the 
game in their back yards !

         I hope I'm just out of my mind.
        There won't REALLY be a Disney team in Anaheim, will there?
        The Stars aren't REALLY moving...
        

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52619
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: NHL Swedes: Stats, April 5


 Scoring stats for the Swedish NHL players, April 5:
 ===================================================

 Mats Sundin watch:

   Most points during a season:
 
    131  Kent Nilsson, Calgary Flames       1980-81  (49+82)
    110  Mats Naslund, Montreal Canadiens   1985-86  (43+67)
  * 109  Mats Sundin, Quebec Nordiques      1992-93  (43+66)
    106  Hakan Loob, Calgary Flames         1987-88  (50+56)
    104  Kent Nilsson, Calgary Flames       1982-83  (46+58)
     99  Kent Nilsson, Calgary Flames       1984-85  (37+62)

   Most goals during a season:

     50  Hakan Loob, Calgary Flames         1987-88
     49  Kent Nilsson, Calgary Flames       1980-81
     46  Kent Nilsson, Calgary Flames       1982-83
     45  Tomas Sandstrom, LA Kings          1990-91
     43  Mats Naslund, Montreal Canadiens   1985-86
  *  43  Mats Sundin, Quebec Nordiques      1992-93

   Most assists during a season:

     82  Kent Nilsson, Calgary Flames       1980-81
     67  Mats Naslund, Montreal Canadiens   1985-86
     66  Borje Salming, Toronto Maple Leafs 1976-77
  *  66  Mats Sundin, Quebec Nordiques      1992-93
     62  Kent Nilsson, Calgary Flames       1984-85
     61  Borje Salming, Toronto Maple Leafs 1977-78
     61  Thomas Steen, Winnipeg Jets        1988-89

 Ulf Samuelsson watch:

   Most penalty minutes during a season:

  *  243  Ulf Samuelsson, Pittsburgh Penguins   1992-93   (through 3/25)
     211  Ulf Samuelsson, Pittsburgh Penguins   1990-91
     206  Ulf Samuelsson, Pittsburgh Penguins   1991-92
     184  Kjell Samuelsson, Philadelphia Flyers 1988-89
     181  Ulf Samuelsson, Hartford Whalers      1988-89
     174  Ulf Samuelsson, Hartford Whalers      1985-86
     170  Borje Salming, Toronto Maple Leafs    1980-81
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RL Rk Name             Team J# Ps Ht   Wt  Born      G  A  Pts  PL  Comment
-- -- ---------------- ---- -- -- ---  --- --------  -- -- ---  --  -------
    1 Mats Sundin       QUE 13 C  6-2  189  2/13/71  43 66 109   7  
    2 Ulf Dahlen        MIN 22 RW 6-2  195  1/12/67  33 38  71   5    
    3 Thomas Steen      WIN 25 C  5-10 195  6/ 8/60  21 43  64   5
    4 Johan Garpenlov   SJS 10 LW 5-11 185  3/21/68  21 40  61   5 
    5 Fredrik Olausson  WIN  4 D  6-2  200 10/ 5/66  13 38  51   4
    6 Tomas Sandstrom   LAK  7 LW 6-2  207  9/ 4/64  22 24  46   2
    7 Per-Erik Eklund   PHI  9 LW 5-10 175  3/22/63   8 34  42      Injured
    8 Calle Johansson   WAS  6 D  5-11 205  2/14/67   6 35  41   1
    9 Nicklas Lidstrom  DET  5 D  6-2  180  4/28/70   7 33  40   2 
   10 Tommy Sjodin      MIN 33 D  5-11 190  8/13/65   7 29  36     
   11 Ulf Samuelsson    PIT  5 D  6-1  195  3/26/64   2 24  26   1 
   12 Mikael Andersson  TBL 34 LW 5-11 185  5/10/66  13 11  24   1 
   13 Michael Nylander  HFD 36 LW 5-11 176 10/ 3/72   5 16  21   2 
   14 Roger Johansson   CGY 34 D  6-1  185  4/ 7/67   4 15  19   1
   15 Jan Erixon        NYR 20 LW 6-0  196  7/ 8/62   5 10  15      
   16 Peter Andersson   NYR 25 D  6-0  187  8/29/65   4  7  11   1 
   17 Kjell Samuelsson  PIT 28 D  6-6  235 10/18/58   3  6   9   2 
   18 Tommy Albelin     NJD  6 D  6-1  190  5/21/64   1  5   6      
   19 Per Djoos         NYR 44 D  5-11 176  5/11/68   1  1   2      Binghampton?
   20 Niclas Andersson  QUE 46 LW 5-8  169  5/20/71   0  1   1      Halifax
   21 Thomas Forslund   CGY 27 LW 6-0  185 11/24/68   0  1   1      Salt Lake
   22 Patrik Carnback   MON 20 LW 6-0  189  2/ 1/68   0  0   0      Injured
   23 Patrik Kjellberg  MON 27 LW 6-2  196  6/17/69   0  0   0      Fredericton

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
RL=Rank Last week, Rk=Rank, J#=Jersey Number, Ps=Position, Born (mm/dd/yy)
G=Goals, A=Assists, Pts=Points, PL=Points scored since Last posted list
===============================================================================

 Goalie stats:

 Name             Team J# Ps Ht   Wt  Born     
 ---------------- ---- -- -- ---  --- --------
 Tommy Soderstrom  PHI 30 G  5-9  163  7/17/69

                                       / - - - - -  T  O  T  A  L  - - - - - \

 mm/dd   vs   res  r  w/l/t  sh - sv   GP   MP  GA  GAA    SOG   SV  SV%   SO A
 -----  ---- ----  -  -----  --   --   --   --  --  ---    ---  ---  ---   -- --
 12/17   PIT  4-5  L  0-1-0  27 - 22    1   62   5  4.84    27   22  0.815
 12/19   CHI  3-1  W  1-1-0  28 - 27    2  122   6  2.95    55   49  0.891
 12/20  @TBL  1-4  L  1-2-0  31 - 27    3  182  10  3.30    86   76  0.884
 12/23   PIT  0-4  L  1-3-0  26 - 22    4  242  14  3.47   112   98  0.875
 12/26  @WAS  5-5  T  1-3-1  41 - 36    5  307  19  3.71   153  134  0.876
 12/29  @LAK 10-2  W  2-3-1  43 - 41    6  367  21  3.43   196  175  0.893
 12/30  @SJS  6-2  W  3-3-1  35 - 33    7  427  23  3.23   231  208  0.900
  1/ 2  @CGY  3-7  L  3-4-1  32 - 26    8  486  29  3.58   263  234  0.890
  1/ 3  @EDM  2-2  T  3-4-2  33 - 31    9  551  31  3.38   296  265  0.895
  1/ 7   WAS  8-2  W  4-4-2  33 - 31   10  611  33  3.24   329  296  0.900
  1/ 9   NYR  4-3  W  5-4-2  26 - 23   11  671  36  3.22   355  319  0.899
  1/10   EDM  4-0  W  6-4-2  29 - 29   12  731  36  2.95   384  348  0.906  1
  1/14   CGY  4-4  T  6-4-3  27 - 23   13  796  40  3.02   411  371  0.903
  1/16  @BOS  5-4  W  7-4-3  37 - 33   14  856  44  3.08   448  404  0.902
  1/17   DET  4-7  L  7-5-3  36 - 29   15  916  51  3.34   484  433  0.895
  1/21   BOS  4-5  L  7-6-3  32 - 27   16  976  56  3.44   516  460  0.891
  1/23  @NYI  4-8  L  7-7-3  31 - 23   17 1036  64  3.71   547  483  0.883    1
  1/24   HFD  5-4  W  8-7-3  25 - 21   18 1098  68  3.72   572  504  0.881
  1/30  @PIT  2-4  L  8-8-3  35 - 32   19 1157  71  3.68   607  536  0.883
  2/ 3  @NYR  2-2  T  8-8-4  38 - 36   20 1222  73  3.58   645  572  0.887
  2/ 9   OTT  8-1  W  9-8-4  28 - 27   21 1282  74  3.46   673  599  0.890
  2/11   MTL  0-0  T  9-8-5  23 - 23   22 1347  74  3.30   696  622  0.894  2
  2/13  @NJD  4-6  L  9-9-5  32 - 26   23 1407  80  3.41   728  648  0.890
  2/14   NJD  2-5  L  9-10-5 26 - 21   24 1467  85  3.48   754  669  0.887
  2/16  @CGY  4-4  T  9-10-6 29 - 29   25 1512  85  3.37   783  698  0.891
  2/18  @VAN  3-2  W 10-10-6 30 - 28   26 1572  87  3.32   813  726  0.893
  2/20  @MIN  2-5  L 10-11-6 33 - 28   27 1632  92  3.38   846  754  0.891
  2/22   DET  5-5  - 10-11-6 15 - 12   28 1653  95  3.45   861  766  0.890
  3/ 2   PIT  5-4  W 11-11-6 22 - 21   29 1689  96  3.41   883  787  0.891
  3/ 5  @WAS  3-0  W 12-11-6 36 - 36   30 1749  96  3.29   919  823  0.896  3
  3/ 7  @NJD  4-7  L 12-12-6 41 - 35   31 1808 102  3.38   960  858  0.894
  3/ 9  @NYI  2-4  L 12-13-6 24 - 21   32 1867 105  3.37   984  879  0.893
  3/11   WAS  6-4  W 13-13-6 28 - 24   33 1927 109  3.39  1012  903  0.892
  3/16   MIN  4-3  W 14-13-6 34 - 31   34 1987 112  3.38  1046  934  0.893
  3/20  @PIT  3-9  L 14-14-6 27 - 20   35 2027 119  3.52  1073  954  0.889
  3/21   NJD  2-3  L 14-15-6 27 - 24   36 2086 122  3.51  1100  978  0.889
  3/24  @NYR  5-4  W 15-15-6 45 - 41   37 2146 126  3.52  1145 1019  0.890    2
  3/27  @QUE  3-8  L 15-16-6 25 - 19   38 2186 132  3.62  1170 1038  0.887
  4/ 1   LAK  1-3  L 15-17-6 26 - 23   39 2246 135  3.61  1196 1061  0.887
  4/ 4   TOR  4-0  W 16-17-6 26 - 26   40 2306 135  3.51  1222 1087  0.890  4
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
res=result, sh=shots, sv=saves
GP=Games Played, MP=Minutes Played, GA=Goals Against, GAA=Goals Against Average
SOG=Shots On Goal, SV=SaVes, SV%=SaVing Percentage, SO=ShutOuts, A=Assists
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Staffan
--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52620
From: wsa@poe.acc.Virginia.EDU (Warren S. Arbogast)
Subject: Re: Spelling Error on the Stanley Cup??

r_turgeo@oz.plymouth.edu  writes:
>   I was reading a newspaper tidbit that mentioned that there is a
> grammatical error on the Stanley Cup. This newspaper, "The 
> Union Leader"  (Manchester, New Hampshire), stated that one of the
> years that the New York Islanders won the cup, the printing on the
> actual cup stated "New York Ilanders". Can anyone verify this?? I
> forgot the exact year that this supposedly occured. Any die-hard
> Islander fans know about this?? The reason why I am asking is
> because the paper is not very reliable, we call it "The Union
> Mis-leader".
> 
> 
> Randy
> Plymouth State College
> r_turgeo@oz.plymouth.edu

Speaking of spelling errors on the Cup, I wonder if the "h" in
Pittsburgh made it to the Cup.  You know how funny people can
be about spelling Pittsburgh.
--
Warren Arbogast
Darden Visual Communications          "with 10 miles behind them           
University of Virginia                            and 10,000 more to go"
  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52621
From: euatno@eua.ericsson.se (Tomas Nopp)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:



>   Ten years ago, the number of Europeans in the NHL was roughly a quarter
>of what it is now. Going into the 1992/93 season, the numbers of Euros on
>NHL teams have escalated to the following stats:

>Canadians: 400
>Americans: 100
>Europeans: 100

>   Please note that these numbers are rounded off, and taken from the top
>25 players on each of the 24 teams. My source is the Vancouver Sun.

>   Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. I am sick
>of watching a game between an American and a Canadian team (let's say, the
>Red Wings and the Canucks) and seeing names like "Bure" "Konstantinov" and
>"Borshevshky". Is this North America or isn't it? Toronto, Detriot, Quebec,
>and Edmonton are particularly annoying, but the numbers of Euros on other
>teams is getting worse as well. 

Is the answer as simple as that you dislike russians???

>    I live in Vancouver and if I hear one more word about "Pavel Bure, the
>Russian Rocket" I will completely throw up. As it is now, every time I see
>the Canucks play I keep hoping someone will cross-check Bure into the 
>plexiglass so hard they have to carry him out on a stretcher. (By the way, 
>I'm not a Canucks fan to begin with ;-). 

>Okay, the stretcher remark was a little carried away. But the point is that
>I resent NHL owners drafting all these Europeans INSTEAD of Canadians (and
>some Americans). It denies young Canadians the opportunity to play in THEIR
>NORTH AMERICAN LEAGUE and instead gives it to Europeans, who aren't even
>better hockey players. It's all hype. This "European mystique" is sickening,
>but until NHL owners get over it, Canadian and American players will continue
>to have to fight harder to get drafted into their own league.

>    With the numbers of Euros in the NHL escalating, the problem is clearly
>only getting worse.

And where would canadian hockey be today without the europeans?? Dont say
that the european influence on the league has been all bad for the game.
I mean, look at the way you play these days. Less fights and more hockey.
Imho, canadian hockey has had a positive curve of development since the
70's when the game was more brute than beauty......

>    I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let the Bures
>and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.

Oh, look!! You don't like Finns either....

>    I just don't want them on mine.
Too bad almost all of you northamericans originates from europe.....

Hmmm... And what kind of a name is Rauser. Doesn't sound very "canadian" to
me. ;-)

PS. When analyzing teams like Italy, France and Great Britain you find that
a lot of their players are "Canadians" with double citizenship... DS
> 
> 
>-- 
>Richard J. Rauser        "You have no idea what you're doing."
>rauser@sfu.ca            "Oh, don't worry about that. We're professional
>WNI                          outlaws - we do this for a living."
>-----------------
>"Remember, no matter where you go, there you are." -Dr.Banzai
         _________________       __________
          /         _  ,     /l /
        _/__()_/))_(/_/)_  _/ L/_()_/)_/)_
                                   /  /
********************************************************************
* Tomas Nopp                    Tel   : +46 8 727 33 24            *
* Ellemtel Telecom Systems Labs Fax   : +46 8 647 80 59            *
* Box 1505                      Email : Tomas.Nopp@eua.ericsson.se *
* S-125 25 ALVSJO       <------ Snailmail                          *
********************************************************************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52622
From: westerhold@batgirl.rtp.dg.com ()
Subject: wanted: mail order hockey equipment


Could anyone recommend a mail order distributor for
hockey equipment.

				Thanks in Advance
				Wayne
--
 /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
<  Wayne E. Westerhold                    wester@dg-rtp.dg.com             >
<  Data General Corporation               Research Triangle Park, NC       >
 \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52623
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <rauser.734062608@sfu.ca> rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:
>   Ten years ago, the number of Europeans in the NHL was roughly a quarter
>of what it is now. Going into the 1992/93 season, the numbers of Euros on
>NHL teams have escalated to the following stats:
>
>Canadians: 400
>Americans: 100
>Europeans: 100
>
>   Please note that these numbers are rounded off, and taken from the top
>25 players on each of the 24 teams. My source is the Vancouver Sun.
>
>   Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. I am sick
>of watching a game between an American and a Canadian team (let's say, the
>Red Wings and the Canucks) and seeing names like "Bure" "Konstantinov" and
>"Borshevshky". Is this North America or isn't it? Toronto, Detriot, Quebec,
>and Edmonton are particularly annoying, but the numbers of Euros on other
>teams is getting worse as well. 
>

From where I come from in Canada, Borshevsky sounds more Canadian than
Smith! -)

Anyways, crawl back into the hole you crawled out of...the NBA doesn't
care where they get basketball players from, major league baseball
doesn't give a damn where they get baseball players from (except Cuba,
that is).

Canada is in no imminent danger of being overtaken as the primary 
supplier of players...Sweden, Finland, the Czech Republic, and Slovakia
are all relatively small countries, and cannot really produce players
at a greater rate than they are already producing them, and the
potential influx from the former Soviet Union is severely blunted
because the system has been raided and is starved for finances and
will take a decade or two, to recover and become a real threat, and
the US will just maintain its slow increase.  Canada should continue
to supply 60% plus of the top hockey players in the world for the
forseeable future.

Besides we need the European hockey market if hockey is to take
its rightful place besides soccer as the two predominant world
sports...and since soccer is essentially boring, unlike hockey.

>    I live in Vancouver and if I hear one more word about "Pavel Bure, the
>Russian Rocket" I will completely throw up. As it is now, every time I see
>the Canucks play I keep hoping someone will cross-check Bure into the plexiglassso hard they have to carry him out on a stretcher. (By the way, I'm not a
>Canucks fan to begin with ;-). 
>
>    Okay, the stretcher remark was a little carried away. But the point is that
>I resent NHL owners drafting all these Europeans INSTEAD of Canadians (and
>some Americans). It denies young Canadians the opportunity to play in THEIR
>NORTH AMERICAN LEAGUE and instead gives it to Europeans, who aren't even
>better hockey players. It's all hype. This "European mystique" is sickening,
>but until NHL owners get over it, Canadian and American players will continue
>to have to fight harder to get drafted into their own league.
>
>    With the numbers of Euros in the NHL escalating, the problem is clearly
>only getting worse.
>

Canadians are under no threat...the European numbers will soon saturate,
if they haven't already...and by the time Russia comes online again,
the NHL should be a world league, and there will be many more teams
to stock and many more jobs for Canadian hockey players.  In the near
team, the percentage of Canadians will mostly decline because of 
Americans, not because of Europeans.

>    I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let the Bures
>and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.
>
>    I just don't want them on mine.
>

Crawl into a hole and die...   


Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52624
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <1993Apr6.044323.22829@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> daniell@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Daniel Lyddy) writes:
>
>You know, you're absolutely right.  I think we should round up all those
>players of European descent and ship 'em back to where they came from.  Let's
>see, with whom should we start?  I dunno, Lemieux?  Hmmm...sounds like he
>has *French* blood in him!!!  Hey!  France is part of Europe!  Send that
>Euro-blooded boy back!!!
>

Don't you Americans study history...the French settled in North America
as early or before the British...Lemieux can probably trace back his
North American heritage back a lot further than most of us.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52625
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Lindros will be traded!!!

In article <1993Apr5.163209.576@r-node.hub.org> shadow@r-node.hub.org (Jay Chu) writes:
>True rumor.  Fact!  A big three way deal!
>
>Eric Lindros going to Ottawa Senators.  And Senators get $15mill from
>Montreal.
>
>Montreal gets Alexander Daigle (the first round pick from Senators)
>
>Philly gets Damphousse, Bellow, Patrick Roy and a draft pick.
>

Another person incapable of rational thought!

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52626
From: lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <rauser.734062608@sfu.ca> rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:
>
>
>   Ten years ago, the number of Europeans in the NHL was roughly a quarter
>of what it is now. Going into the 1992/93 season, the numbers of Euros on
>NHL teams have escalated to the following stats:
>
>Canadians: 400
>Americans: 100
>Europeans: 100

Xenophobic trash deleted.

>    I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let the Bures
>and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.
>
>    I just don't want them on mine.

If you're going to go to those extremes, I guess you'd better start 
packing.  Because unless you're a Native North American, this isn't
your continent either.  

Lori




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52627
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Mon, April 5, 1993

Hartford                         1 1 3--5
NY Rangers                       1 2 1--4
First period
     1, Hartford, Cunneyworth 5 (Janssens, Greig) 12:21.
     2, NY Rangers, Graves 34 (Turcotte, Zubov) 18:39.
Second period
     3, NY Rangers, Kovalev 19 (Turcotte, Graves) 2:12.
     4, Hartford, Sanderson 44 (Cassels) pp, 4:54.
     5, NY Rangers, Amonte 30 (Andersson, Vanbiesbrouck) pp, 19:13.
Third period
     6, NY Rangers, M.Messier 25 (Amonte, Andersson) 2:26.
     7, Hartford, Sanderson 45 (Cassels) sh, 5:23.
     8, Hartford, Nylander 6 (Ladouceur) 8:35.
     9, Hartford, Verbeek 36 (Zalapski) 17:43.

Hartford: 5    Power play: 4-1   Special goals:  pp: 1  sh: 1  Total: 2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Cassels            0    2    2
Cunneyworth        1    0    1
Greig              0    1    1
Janssens           0    1    1
Ladouceur          0    1    1
Nylander           1    0    1
Sanderson          2    0    2
Verbeek            1    0    1
Zalapski           0    1    1

NY Rangers: 4    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Amonte             1    1    2
Andersson          0    2    2
Graves             1    1    2
Kovalev            1    0    1
Messier M          1    0    1
Turcotte           0    2    2
Vanbiesbrouck      0    1    1
Zubov              0    1    1

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52628
From: damelio@progress.COM (Stephen D'Amelio)
Subject: Re: What was Ray doing?

daveb@thewho.East.Sun.COM (Dave Brewer) writes:

>In yesterday's fracus between Rob Ray and Brent Hughes, was it the camera angle or was
>Ray actually punching Hughes where it appeared he was punching him? (For those that didn't
>see the game - it was several inches below the belt and he punched him there quite a few
>times.) Dreadful.

>Also, why did Poulin get four minutes?


I've been watching & playing hockey for a good long time now, and
I've seen players with questionable tactics, but never have I seen
what Ray did on Sunday. This guy gets my all time loser award. It's
one thing to repeatedly cross check someone to the back of the neck
when they are down, it's another thing to have a fist fight with
someones balls. Ray should be thrown out of the league, what an
a**hole.

-Steve




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52629
From: bks2@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (bryan.k.strouse)
Subject: NHL RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4-05-93



NHL RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4/05/93.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                  STANDINGS
      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE
 TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT
 
xPIT  53 21  6 112  yMON  47 27  6 100  yDET  44 28  9  97  yVAN  42 28  9  93
 WAS  40 31  7  87  yBOS  46 26  7  99  yCHI  43 25 11  97  yCAL  40 29 10  90
 NJ   38 35  6  82  yQUE  44 25 10  98  yTOR  42 26 11  95  yLA   37 33  9  83
 NYI  37 34  6  80  yBUF  38 31 10  86   STL  35 34 10  80  yWIN  37 35  7  81
 NYR  34 33 11  79   HAR  24 49  5  53   MIN  34 35 10  78   EDM  26 45  8  60
 PHL  30 37 11  71   OTT   9 66  4  22   TB   22 51  5  49   SJ   10 68  2  22

x - Clinched Division Title
y - Clinched Playoff Berth

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hartford Whalers   (24-49-5)   1   1   3   -   5
New York Rangers  (34-33-11)   1   2   1   -   4

1st period: HAR, Cunneyworth 5 - (Janssens, Greig) 12:21
	    NYR, Graves 34 - (Turcotte, Zubov) 18:39

2nd period: NYR, Kovalev 19 - (Turcotte, Graves) 2:12
	    HAR, Sanderson 44 - (Cassels) (pp) 4:54
	    NYR, Amonte 30 - (Andersson, Vanbiesbrouck) (pp) 19:13

3rd period: NYR, M.Messier 25 - (Amonte, Andersson) 2:26
	    HAR, Sanderson 45 - (Cassels) (sh) 5:23
	    HAR, Nylanders 6 - (Ladouceur) 8:35
	    HAR, Verbeek 36 - (Zalapski) 17:43

Powerplay Opportunities-Whalers 1 of 4
			Rangers 1 of 4

Shots on Goal-	Whalers   7   8   8  -  23
		Rangers   9  10  12  -  31

Hartford Whalers--Gosselin (4-7-1) (31 shots - 27 saves)
New York Rangers--Vanbiesbrouck (20-18-7) (23 shots - 18 saves)

ATT-17,806

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


\|||||/
-SPIKE-




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52630
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Hockey Draft week 26 standings

Here are the standings after the April 6 update.  I'll be leaving for Japan
in 1.5 hours, and I won't be back until April 17.  Consequently, I will not
post  the week 27 results until April 18.  Email sent between April 13 and
April 18 will be processed using the numbers available April 18.

	- Andrew

USENET Hockey Draft Standings
Week 26

Posn	Team				Pts	Proj	Cash	Last Posn

1.	Dave Wessels                    1478	1575.3	1.9	(1)
2.	Gilles Carmel                   1389	1533.8	56.3	(5)
3.	Bob Hill                        1418	1530.8	24.0	(2)
4.	The Awesome Oilers              1366	1509.9	68.6	(3)
5.	Seppo Kemppainen                1372	1508.9	47.2	(6)
6.	Mak "The Knife" Paranjape       1376	1501.8	31.0	(4)
7.	Hillside Raiders                1397	1490.7	7.0	(7)
8.	Jan Stein                       1354	1478.8	35.3	(9)
9.	Rangers Of Destiny              1346	1472.5	42.0	(10)
10.	this years model                1368	1471.8	17.6	(8)
11.	Tapio Repo                      1354	1461.0	19.6	(12)
12.	FRANK'S BIG FISH                1341	1448.3	22.0	(14)
13.	The Underachievers              1309	1446.5	65.4	(16)
14.	On Thin Ice                     1333	1445.5	32.3	(11)
15.	Lindros Losers                  1349	1436.9	1.7	(13)
16.	littlest giants                 1319	1435.7	35.6	(15)
17.	Go Flames                       1290	1422.6	64.4	(17)
18.	Mopar Muscle Men                1328	1411.7	3.7	(19)
19.	DIE Penguin Bandwaggoners       1304	1409.7	20.2	(18)
20.	Samuel Lau (Calgary, Alberta)   1298	1383.2	4.9	(21)
21.	General Accounting Office       1272	1373.8	20.9	(22)
22.	Migods Menschen                 1259	1367.0	31.6	(20)
23.	Boomer's Boys                   1285	1366.1	0.2	(23)
24.	Delaware Wombats                1285	1356.2	1.3	(24)
25.	Wellsy's Buttheads DEC NH       1223	1354.4	52.6	(27)
26.	Rocky Mountain High             1270	1349.3	1.8	(29)
27.	Fife Flyers                     1232	1346.3	31.4	(26)
28.	Gerald Olchowy                  1231	1343.0	33.7	(25)
29.	Fluide Glacial                  1246	1338.5	18.0	(28)
30.	Gaoler                          1227	1318.3	11.2	(30)
31.	SmegHeads                       1238	1313.0	0.3	(32)
32.	The Young And The Skateless     1185	1299.7	42.9	(31)
33.	Artic Storm                     1179	1291.8	39.3	(43)
34.	Sam & His Dogs                  1206	1289.0	11.6	(33)
35.	Neural Netters                  1199	1287.9	11.3	(35)
36.	Youngbucs                       1157	1286.6	101.7	(34)
37.	Soft Swedes                     1154	1275.3	46.9	(58)
38.	Jeff Horvath                    1188	1262.7	5.6	(39)
39.	Yan The Man Loke                1180	1261.3	0.7	(40)
40.	Milton Keynes Kings             1180	1259.6	2.8	(42)
41.	Hamster from Hoboken            1178	1257.5	8.7	(36)
42.	Le Fleur de Lys                 1159	1257.3	25.3	(46)
43.	ice legion                      1157	1256.6	28.8	(37)
44.	Simmonac                        1133	1254.4	87.6	(44)
45.	Kuehn Crushers                  1137	1253.1	45.1	(72)
46.	The Finnish Force               1149	1249.4	22.5	(48)
47.	Streaks                         1117	1247.1	54.8	(38)
48.	Legion of Hoth                  1156	1246.3	15.8	(52)
49.	Goaldingers                     1146	1240.6	22.0	(45)
50.	Grant Marven                    1155	1236.0	2.9	(50)
51.	bemybaby                        1161	1235.2	7.3	(49)
52.	T C OverAchievers               1162	1232.8	2.9	(47)
53.	Skriko Wolves                   1151	1232.4	5.4	(53)
54.	Bozrah Bruins                   1117	1230.7	45.2	(41)
55.	Brian Bergman                   1132	1229.3	23.3	(51)
56.	LIPPE                           1132	1214.7	13.9	(65)
57.	Randy Coulman                   1140	1214.5	5.2	(56)
58.	LAMP LIGHTERS                   1138	1214.2	5.9	(66)
59.	Dave Snell                      1089	1212.5	182.5	(60)
60.	Steven And Mark Dream Team      1133	1210.6	3.1	(53)
61.	Houdini's Magicians             1126	1209.9	18.3	(59)
62.	Real Bad Toe Jam                1096	1208.6	48.9	(63)
63.	rec.sport.hockey choices        1137	1208.3	1.3	(63)
64.	Iowa Hockeyes                   1118	1205.7	16.3	(55)
65.	buffalo soldiers                1085	1204.6	62.1	(57)
66.	Indianapolis Bennies            1114	1200.6	20.8	(67)
67.	Bloom County All Stars          1121	1199.2	4.3	(61)
68.	Tom                             1109	1194.0	13.1	(68)
69.	Phil and Kev's Karma Dudes      1121	1192.6	0.8	(69)
70.	AIK Exiles                      1078	1188.1	34.5	(70)
71.	Doug Bowles                     1099	1186.4	20.0	(62)
72.	Bruins                          1117	1184.9	0.1	(75)
73.	smithw                          1095	1184.3	21.0	(71)
74.	The Great Pumpkin               1057	1178.6	54.4	(73)
75.	shooting seamen                 1111	1177.8	0.1	(77)
76.	Frank Worthless                 1099	1176.6	6.3	(82)
77.	NON!                            1089	1175.7	16.4	(74)
78.	Invisible Inc                   1104	1173.5	1.1	(79)
79.	Brad Gibson                     1075	1169.0	27.2	(89)
80.	Chubby Checkers                 1074	1165.6	16.3	(85)
81.	PLP Fools                       1092	1164.8	0.1	(76)
82.	John Zupancic                   1063	1164.2	27.1	(78)
83.	Staffan Axelsson                1082	1163.0	15.1	(80)
84.	David Wong                      1038	1162.5	66.1	(87)
85.	Kortelaisen Kovat               1041	1160.7	164.1	(92)
86.	Chocolate Rockets               1083	1158.9	2.5	(83)
87.	Ken DeCruyenaere                1078	1158.8	5.0	(94)
88.	Cougarmania                     1061	1154.7	24.8	(86)
89.	garryola                        1073	1152.9	9.7	(81)
90.	Derrill's Dastardly Dozen       1062	1149.6	22.1	(88)
91.	No Namers                       1033	1147.6	58.2	(91)
92.	The Campi Machine               1022	1145.8	65.3	(90)
93.	Gary Bergman Fan Club           1071	1145.1	5.1	(98)
94.	Fisher Dirtbags                 1073	1144.1	0.7	(93)
95.	KODIAKS                         1076	1141.0	1.3	(84)
96.	Arsenal Maple Leafs             1066	1136.0	3.8	(99)
97.	The Kamucks                     1020	1134.1	76.1	(105)
98.	BSC Oranienburg                 1067	1132.1	7.1	(102)
99.	Bloodgamers                     1018	1127.1	42.1	(97)
100.	Ellis Islanders                 1055	1125.5	7.6	(100)
101.	Mombasa Mosquitos               1053	1125.4	6.1	(95)
102.	Edelweiss                       1049	1122.8	2.9	(101)
103.	Zachmans Wingers                1006	1117.7	49.8	(103)
104.	Wormtown Woosbags               1001	1114.6	72.6	(96)
105.	Dirty White Socks               1008	1113.6	43.4	(106)
106.	Hurricane Andrew                1040	1113.5	7.6	(104)
107.	Larry                           1034	1113.2	11.8	(109)
108.	VoteNoOct26                     1010	1108.5	31.8	(108)
	Bruce's Rented Mules            1033	1108.5	11.9	(110)
110.	King Suke                       1042	1108.2	0.1	(112)
111.	Teem Kanada                     1030	1105.3	16.0	(115)
112.	Bjoern Leaguen                  987	1104.7	61.4	(123)
113.	Frank's Follies                 1020	1101.2	24.2	(117)
114.	Neil Younger                    985	1100.9	77.7	(120)
115.	Het Schot Is Hard               1027	1100.8	18.1	(121)
116.	PSV Dartmouth                   1033	1100.7	7.1	(107)
117.	Pond Slime                      1034	1096.8	0.7	(111)
118.	Stanford Ice Hawks              1008	1096.5	28.2	(114)
119.	SPUDS                           1019	1096.4	12.6	(113)
120.	Mark Sanders                    1020	1091.9	11.1	(116)
121.	Oklahoma Stormchasers           1004	1089.9	28.3	(137)
122.	Timo Ojala                      1015	1084.2	0.3	(130)
123.	Nesbitt                         1025	1083.0	1.1	(118)
124.	Aye Carumba!!!                  1016	1082.4	3.9	(124)
125.	Kokudo Keikaku Bunnies          976	1081.2	40.3	(119)
126.	Blue Talon                      1007	1080.0	13.3	(129)
127.	Apricot Fuzzfaces               1001	1078.3	23.3	(125)
128.	Haral                           1013	1077.8	7.3	(122)
129.	garys team                      995	1076.5	17.1	(126)
130.	Late Night with David Letterman 1013	1075.3	0.0	(133)
131.	Arctic Circles                  974	1075.2	37.6	(132)
132.	The Lost Poots                  1000	1072.9	6.7	(127)
	Seattle PFTB                    988	1072.9	22.9	(134)
134.	boutch 92-93                    987	1071.5	20.0	(135)
135.	Dirty Rotten Puckers            1001	1071.2	1.2	(147)
136.	Flying Kiwis                    998	1069.8	9.1	(130)
	Cluster Buster                  996	1069.8	7.6	(136)
138.	Scott Glenn                     999	1068.7	10.2	(142)
139.	Dree Hobbs                      988	1068.5	13.4	(146)
140.	GO BRUINS                       999	1066.6	6.2	(144)
141.	Le Groupe MI                    975	1065.4	30.2	(141)
142.	team gold                       992	1065.1	16.7	(128)
143.	Closet Boy's Boys               955	1063.4	48.0	(140)
144.	Gary Bill Pens Dynasty          982	1063.2	19.6	(151)
	McKees Rocks Rockers            998	1063.2	5.1	(151)
146.	Tim Rogers                      987	1061.9	8.1	(148)
147.	Andy Y F WONG                   982	1061.1	21.5	(143)
148.	Buttered Waffles                947	1059.6	46.0	(145)
149.	Bob's Blues                     951	1059.2	46.8	(139)
150.	Princeton Canucks               945	1058.9	124.2	(154)
151.	GO HABS GO                      989	1058.7	8.0	(149)
152.	Wembley LostWeekenders          998	1057.6	0.3	(157)
153.	Wild Hearted Sons               993	1057.5	4.9	(138)
154.	Einstein's Rock Band            994	1054.8	0.0	(160)
155.	Tap                             989	1053.0	0.5	(150)
156.	Goddess Of Fermentation         964	1051.0	30.2	(156)
157.	HUNTERS & COLLECTORS            945	1050.6	42.4	(163)
158.	Dr Joel Fleishman               985	1048.7	3.7	(159)
159.	furleys furies                  983	1048.6	3.6	(153)
160.	convex stars                    979	1047.9	5.6	(161)
161.	Les Nordiques                   939	1046.9	60.4	(155)
162.	MY TEAM                         932	1045.3	174.8	(167)
163.	Hubert's Hockey Homeboys        980	1043.9	0.6	(162)
	Book 'em Danno's Bushbabies     977	1043.9	10.5	(169)
165.	riding the pine                 956	1038.7	20.7	(158)
166.	Sundogs                         975	1037.1	0.4	(166)
167.	Jeff Nimeroff                   927	1037.0	48.8	(172)
168.	Slap Shot Marco                 930	1036.0	51.8	(164)
169.	Daryl Turner                    976	1035.8	2.4	(179)
170.	The Dreamers                    921	1033.1	63.7	(180)
171.	East City Jokers                919	1031.6	69.1	(173)
172.	Flowers                         921	1031.4	113.6	(168)
173.	Satan's Choice                  961	1030.1	14.5	(171)
174.	The Leafs Rule!!!!              943	1030.0	25.8	(165)
175.	Pierre Mailhot                  969	1029.9	2.6	(174)
176.	voyageurs                       968	1029.4	2.7	(170)
177.	Spinal Tap                      928	1029.1	41.4	(176)
178.	San Jose Mahi Mahi              939	1026.7	31.8	(185)
	Stimpy ADG Zeta                 949	1026.7	21.0	(182)
180.	Jeff Bachovchin                 916	1024.7	46.7	(175)
181.	Bulldogs                        941	1024.5	23.4	(184)
182.	LANA Inc                        940	1021.0	27.3	(177)
183.	Big Bad Bruins                  939	1020.6	18.5	(186)
184.	Mike Mac Cormack Sydney NS CAN  904	1019.1	107.2	(183)
185.	Darse Billings                  925	1017.8	34.7	(178)
186.	Chappel's Chumps                934	1017.6	24.0	(181)
187.	JimParker                       903	1014.5	179.0	(192)
188.	Republican Dirty Tricksters     894	1008.0	66.0	(189)
189.	Enforcers                       924	1007.8	28.1	(191)
190.	Absolut Lehigh                  937	1007.7	8.9	(190)
191.	Yellow Plague                   933	1005.0	14.2	(187)
192.	Dr.D And The S.O.D.             929	1003.8	17.1	(198)
193.	Bunch of Misfits                916	1003.3	23.8	(188)
194.	Ninja Turtles                   942	1000.8	1.3	(194)
195.	Great Expectations              934	999.3	2.3	(196)
196.	Cherry Bombers                  939	998.1	1.2	(200)
197.	Henry's Bar B Q                 941	998.0	0.7	(195)
198.	Robyns Team                     907	993.5	30.0	(198)
199.	Team Melville                   891	991.8	46.9	(202)
200.	Umpire 4 life                   919	990.9	11.1	(193)
201.	Acadien                         914	988.9	18.3	(197)
202.	Kaufbeuren Icebreakers          894	988.2	37.6	(207)
203.	Firebirds                       926	986.5	3.9	(201)
204.	Jayson's Kinky Pucks            904	986.1	26.9	(203)
205.	Cobra's Killers                 891	982.5	31.7	(208)
206.	Outlaws                         871	981.6	164.9	(206)
207.	Kuta Papercuts                  912	981.5	18.5	(204)
208.	Killer Apes                     902	979.9	24.3	(205)
209.	DARMAN'S Dragons                896	979.4	28.3	(211)
210.	Roger Smith                     882	978.2	39.6	(212)
211.	Those 1st few weeks hurt!       862	975.1	55.9	(210)
212.	Thundering Herd                 860	972.8	163.6	(218)
213.	IKEA Wholesale                  910	970.2	1.7	(214)
214.	Believe it or dont              895	968.7	21.1	(215)
215.	fred mckim                      861	966.8	93.0	(217)
216.	400 Hurricane                   880	966.4	32.1	(216)
217.	Creeping Death                  886	965.0	21.3	(220)
218.	Knee Injuries                   897	964.9	10.4	(213)
219.	The 200 Club                    902	964.7	6.8	(209)
220.	Crazy Euros                     888	962.1	17.9	(219)
221.	Frack Attack                    875	961.8	27.3	(226)
222.	Todd's Turkeys                  898	957.0	1.9	(229)
223.	Ryan's Renegades                858	956.4	50.9	(225)
224.	Cafall and Crew                 862	955.9	38.3	(222)
225.	pig vomit                       894	955.2	1.3	(227)
226.	Ice Strykers                    848	954.4	105.4	(221)
227.	Fighting Geordies               850	954.1	141.6	(223)
228.	CDN Stuck in Alabama            886	945.7	10.3	(231)
229.	Ship's Way                      884	943.4	8.7	(233)
230.	Swillbellies                    870	942.8	18.7	(228)
231.	Oz                              851	941.8	35.0	(235)
232.	Chris of Death                  835	939.3	83.6	(234)
233.	Banko's Beer Rangers            875	938.6	4.2	(230)
234.	NY Flames                       872	938.1	7.8	(232)
235.	Laubsters II                    828	937.4	201.6	(237)
236.	dayton bomber                   882	935.1	0.0	(241)
237.	Zipper Heads                    847	931.7	33.9	(224)
238.	Ninja Bunnies                   826	928.1	44.9	(236)
239.	Joliet Inmates                  832	926.0	45.8	(239)
240.	Widefield White Wolves          832	924.1	36.9	(242)
241.	Daves Team                      834	920.9	32.0	(238)
242.	Great Scott                     814	917.8	73.3	(240)
243.	South Carolina Tiger Paws       806	915.1	78.4	(243)
244.	SANDY'S SABRES                  854	910.8	4.7	(245)
245.	Florida Tech Burgh Team         809	904.6	49.3	(250)
246.	The Ice Holes                   850	903.9	2.7	(246)
247.	Leos Blue Chips                 845	902.9	10.4	(244)
248.	For xtc                         837	897.8	8.2	(248)
249.	roadrunners                     826	895.9	18.5	(249)
250.	Mudville Kings                  816	894.0	27.6	(251)
251.	Redliners                       820	890.8	15.9	(253)
252.	Pat Phillips                    827	889.1	10.1	(247)
253.	New Jersey Rob                  835	883.0	0.7	(252)
254.	Stewart Clamen                  821	869.4	1.6	(255)
255.	Demon Spawn                     782	860.1	25.0	(254)
256.	Sunnyvale Storm                 772	813.5	0.2	(256)
257.	Allez les Blues                 713	810.7	476.9	(257)
258.	Up For Sale Hockey Club         725	795.0	23.0	(260)
259.	Petes Picks                     689	788.1	168.5	(258)
260.	RINACO                          682	781.6	114.0	(259)
261.	Brenz Revenge                   669	718.5	4.0	(261)
262.	Dinamo Riga                     571	663.8	571.6	(262)
-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52631
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Hockey Draft week 26 price list

Here is the price list for the week April 6 to April 12.

	- Andrew

Buy	Sell	Pts	Team	Player
157.5	141.8	150	PIT	Mario_Lemieux
152.1	136.9	143	BUF	Pat_LaFontaine
139.3	125.4	131	BOS	Adam_Oates
133.8	120.4	129	DET	Steve_Yzerman
132.9	119.6	125	WPG	Teemu_Selanne
132.9	119.6	125	TOR	Doug_Gilmour
130.9	117.8	120	NYI	Pierre_Turgeon
129.7	116.7	122	BUF	Alexander_Mogilny
126.0	113.4	117	PHI	Mark_Recchi
120.2	108.2	113	LA	Luc_Robitaille
115.9	104.3	109	QUE	Mats_Sundin
111.3	100.2	106	PIT	Kevin_Stevens
108.5	97.7	102	STL	Craig_Janney
108.5	97.7	102	VAN	Pavel_Bure
106.3	95.7	100	CHI	Jeremy_Roenick
105.3	94.8	99	QUE	Joe_Sakic
104.0	93.6	99	PIT	Rick_Tocchet
103.1	92.8	97	STL	Brett_Hull
102.1	91.9	96	BOS	Joe_Juneau
102.1	91.9	96	TOR	Dave_Andreychuk
101.9	91.7	97	PIT	Ron_Francis
99.8	89.8	95	MTL	Vincent_Damphousse
98.9	89.0	93	MIN	Mike_Modano
98.9	89.0	93	WPG	Phil_Housley
98.9	89.0	93	CGY	Theoren_Fleury
97.8	88.0	92	BUF	Dale_Hawerchuk
97.7	87.9	93	MTL	Kirk_Muller
96.0	86.4	88	NYR	Mark_Messier
94.6	85.1	89	STL	Brendan_Shanahan
94.4	85.0	91	DET	Dino_Ciccarelli
91.4	82.3	86	LA	Jari_Kurri
91.4	82.3	87	PIT	Jaromir_Jagr
90.3	81.3	86	MTL	Brian_Bellows
88.3	79.5	82	WSH	Peter_Bondra
87.3	78.6	80	HFD	Geoff_Sanderson
87.2	78.5	82	CGY	Robert_Reichel
87.2	78.5	82	QUE	Steve_Duchesne
87.1	78.4	84	DET	Paul_Coffey
86.1	77.5	83	DET	Sergei_Fedorov
85.1	76.6	79	TB	Brian_Bradley
85.1	76.6	79	PHI	Rod_Brind'Amour
85.1	76.6	81	PIT	Larry_Murphy
84.0	75.6	77	HFD	Andrew_Cassels
84.0	75.6	77	HFD	Pat_Verbeek
84.0	75.6	79	LA	Tony_Granato
84.0	75.6	78	WSH	Mike_Ridley
84.0	75.6	77	NYI	Steve_Thomas
83.0	74.7	79	MTL	Stephan_Lebeau
81.8	73.6	76	WSH	Dale_Hunter
80.8	72.7	76	QUE	Mike_Ricci
80.8	72.7	76	BOS	Ray_Bourque
78.6	70.7	73	WSH	Kevin_Hatcher
77.7	69.9	74	SJ	Kelly_Kisio
77.6	69.8	73	VAN	Cliff_Ronning
77.6	69.8	73	STL	Jeff_Brown
77.6	69.8	73	TOR	Nikolai_Borschevsky
76.6	68.9	72	NJ	Claude_Lemieux
76.6	68.9	72	MIN	Dave_Gagner
76.6	68.9	72	MIN	Russ_Courtnall
76.4	68.8	70	NYR	Tony_Amonte
75.5	68.0	71	VAN	Murray_Craven
75.5	68.0	71	LA	Jimmy_Carson
75.5	68.0	71	CGY	Gary_Suter
75.5	68.0	71	MIN	Ulf_Dahlen
74.4	67.0	70	VAN	Geoff_Courtnall
74.4	67.0	70	BOS	Dmitri_Kvartalnov
74.3	66.9	69	WSH	Michal_Pivonka
74.2	66.8	68	NYI	Derek_King
74.2	66.8	68	NYI	Benoit_Hogue
73.4	66.1	69	QUE	Owen_Nolan
73.4	66.1	69	CHI	Steve_Larmer
73.4	66.1	69	NJ	Alexander_Semak
73.1	65.8	67	NYR	Mike_Gartner
72.3	65.1	68	STL	Nelson_Emerson
72.3	65.1	68	CHI	Chris_Chelios
72.2	65.0	67	PHI	Eric_Lindros
71.1	64.0	66	WSH	Al_Iafrate
70.2	63.2	66	VAN	Trevor_Linden
70.2	63.2	66	LA	Mike_Donnelly
70.0	63.0	65	WSH	Dmitri_Khristich
69.3	62.4	66	PIT	Joe_Mullen
69.1	62.2	65	CGY	Joe_Nieuwendyk
69.1	62.2	65	NJ	Stephane_Richer
68.1	61.3	64	WPG	Alexei_Zhamnov
68.1	61.3	64	WPG	Thomas_Steen
68.1	61.3	64	QUE	Andrei_Kovalenko
68.1	61.3	64	VAN	Petr_Nedved
66.5	59.9	61	NYR	Adam_Graves
66.5	59.9	61	HFD	Zarley_Zalapski
66.4	59.8	64	DET	Ray_Sheppard
64.9	58.4	61	TOR	Glenn_Anderson
64.1	57.7	61	SJ	Johan_Garpenlov
63.8	57.4	60	OTT	Norm_Maciver
63.0	56.7	60	MTL	Mike_Keane
63.0	56.7	60	PIT	Shawn_McEachern
62.7	56.4	59	LA	Rob_Blake
62.7	56.4	59	LA	Wayne_Gretzky
62.5	56.3	58	PHI	Garry_Galley
62.5	56.3	58	PHI	Brent_Fedyk
61.1	55.0	56	NYI	Pat_Flatley
60.6	54.5	57	CGY	Sergei_Makarov
60.6	54.5	57	NJ	Bernie_Nicholls
60.1	54.1	58	DET	Steve_Chiasson
59.5	53.6	56	CHI	Steve_Smith
59.5	53.6	56	QUE	Scott_Young
59.1	53.2	57	DET	Paul_Ysebaert
58.9	53.0	54	NYR	Sergei_Nemchinov
58.5	52.7	55	NJ	Valeri_Zelepukin
58.2	52.4	54	WSH	Pat_Elynuik
58.2	52.4	54	TB	John_Tucker
58.2	52.4	54	PHI	Kevin_Dineen
57.4	51.7	54	VAN	Greg_Adams
56.4	50.8	53	WPG	Darrin_Shannon
55.6	50.0	51	NYR	Darren_Turcotte
55.3	49.8	52	NJ	Scott_Stevens
55.0	48.8	51	CHI	Christian_Ruuttu
55.0	48.8	51	VAN	Dixon_Ward
55.0	48.8	51	WPG	Fredrik_Olausson
55.0	48.2	49	NYR	Ed_Olczyk
55.0	47.9	50	WPG	Keith_Tkachuk
55.0	47.2	48	NYI	Jeff_Norton
55.0	46.9	49	TOR	John_Cullen
55.0	46.9	49	VAN	Anatoli_Semenov
55.0	46.9	49	CGY	Al_MacInnis
55.0	46.9	49	BOS	Stephen_Leach
55.0	45.9	48	CHI	Brent_Sutter
55.0	45.4	48	MTL	Denis_Savard
55.0	45.2	46	HFD	Terry_Yake
55.0	45.0	47	NJ	John_MacLean
55.0	44.6	46	WSH	Sylvain_Cote
55.0	44.0	46	EDM	Petr_Klima
55.0	44.0	46	EDM	Shayne_Corson
55.0	44.0	46	LA	Tomas_Sandstrom
55.0	44.0	46	EDM	Craig_Simpson
55.0	43.5	46	MTL	Gilbert_Dionne
55.0	43.2	44	NYI	Vladimir_Malakhov
55.0	43.0	45	BOS	Dave_Poulin
55.0	43.0	45	STL	Kevin_Miller
55.0	43.0	45	LA	Alexei_Zhitnik
55.0	43.0	45	QUE	Martin_Rucinsky
55.0	43.0	45	WPG	Evgeny_Davydov
55.0	42.7	44	WSH	Kelly_Miller
55.0	42.1	44	EDM	Doug_Weight
55.0	42.1	44	EDM	Dave_Manson
55.0	41.2	42	HFD	Patrick_Poulin
55.0	41.1	43	CHI	Michel_Goulet
55.0	40.7	42	PHI	Pelle_Eklund
55.0	40.2	42	MIN	Mark_Tinordi
55.0	39.7	42	MTL	Mathieu_Schneider
55.0	39.2	41	CGY	Paul_Ranheim
55.0	39.2	41	EDM	Todd_Elik
55.0	39.2	41	BOS	Vladimir_Ruzicka
55.0	39.2	41	OTT	Sylvain_Turgeon
55.0	37.4	39	TOR	Dave_Ellett
55.0	37.4	40	DET	Niklas_Lidstrom
55.0	37.4	40	DET	Bob_Probert
55.0	36.4	38	NJ	Peter_Stastny
55.0	36.4	37	NYR	Esa_Tikkanen
55.0	36.4	38	OTT	Brad_Shaw
55.0	36.4	38	TOR	Wendel_Clark
55.0	36.4	38	BUF	Yuri_Khmylev
55.0	35.4	37	VAN	Sergio_Momesso
55.0	35.4	37	OTT	Bob_Kudelski
55.0	35.4	36	NYR	Brian_Leetch
55.0	35.4	37	NJ	Bobby_Holik
55.0	34.5	36	TOR	Rob_Pearson
55.0	34.5	36	MIN	Mike_McPhee
55.0	34.4	35	NYR	Alexei_Kovalev
55.0	33.9	35	TB	Adam_Creighton
55.0	33.5	35	EDM	Zdeno_Ciger
55.0	32.6	34	LA	Corey_Millen
55.0	32.6	34	CHI	Dirk_Graham
55.0	31.6	33	TOR	Peter_Zezel
55.0	30.6	32	BOS	Ted_Donato
55.0	30.6	32	QUE	Valery_Kamensky
55.0	30.2	32	MTL	Gary_Leeman
55.0	29.9	32	DET	Keith_Primeau
55.0	29.7	31	BUF	Wayne_Presley
55.0	29.7	31	MIN	Neal_Broten
55.0	29.7	31	BOS	Steve_Heinze
55.0	29.1	30	PHI	Josef_Beranek
55.0	28.7	30	CHI	Stephane_Matteau
55.0	28.7	30	BUF	Richard_Smehlik
55.0	28.7	30	TOR	Dmitri_Mironov
55.0	28.4	29	NYI	Brian_Mullen
55.0	27.2	28	PHI	Dmitri_Yushkevich
55.0	26.8	28	CHI	Brian_Noonan
55.0	26.8	28	EDM	Scott_Mellanby
55.0	26.5	28	SJ	Pat_Falloon
55.0	25.8	27	STL	Igor_Korolev
55.0	25.6	26	NYR	James_Patrick
55.0	24.8	26	BUF	Petr_Svoboda
55.0	23.9	25	OTT	Mark_Lamb
55.0	23.2	24	TB	Mikael_Andersson
55.0	22.6	23	NYI	Scott_LaChance
55.0	22.1	23	EDM	Kevin_Todd
55.0	21.3	22	WSH	Bob_Carpenter
55.0	21.1	22	TOR	Bill_Berg
55.0	21.1	22	WPG	Sergei_Bautin
55.0	20.8	22	MTL	Benoit_Brunet
55.0	20.6	21	NYI	David_Volek
55.0	20.6	21	HFD	Mikael_Nylander
55.0	20.1	21	MIN	Brent_Gilchrist
55.0	19.6	20	NYR	Phil_Bourque
55.0	19.6	20	NYI	Ray_Ferraro
55.0	18.6	19	HFD	Yvon_Corriveau
55.0	18.2	19	EDM	Martin_Gelinas
55.0	17.7	19	DET	Jim_Hiller
55.0	17.6	18	NYI	Darius_Kasparaitis
55.0	17.5	18	PHI	Andrei_Lomakin
55.0	17.2	18	BUF	Donald_Audette
55.0	15.5	16	TB	Roman_Hamrlik
55.0	15.1	16	SJ	Mark_Pederson
55.0	14.2	15	PIT	Martin_Straka
55.0	12.4	13	NJ	Janne_Ojanen
55.0	12.4	13	OTT	Tomas_Jelinek
55.0	11.5	12	CHI	Joe_Murphy
55.0	10.8	11	NYR	Peter_Andersson
55.0	10.6	11	TB	Steve_Kasper
55.0	10.5	11	BOS	Cam_Neely
55.0	9.5	10	MIN	Bobby_Smith
55.0	9.5	10	SJ	Ray_Whitney
55.0	8.8	9	HFD	Robert_Petrovicky
55.0	8.6	9	BUF	Viktor_Gordijuk
55.0	7.7	8	QUE	Mikhail_Tatarinov
55.0	7.7	8	TOR	Joe_Sacco
55.0	7.6	8	SJ	Peter_Ahola
55.0	6.7	7	CHI	Rob_Brown
55.0	6.7	7	BOS	Glen_Murray
55.0	5.9	6	HFD	Tim_Kerr
55.0	4.9	5	WSH	Reggie_Savage
55.0	4.8	5	STL	Vitali_Prokhorov
55.0	4.8	5	LA	Robert_Lang
55.0	4.8	5	EDM	Shaun_Van_Allen
55.0	3.9	4	BOS	Jozef_Stumpel
55.0	3.9	4	MIN	Dan_Quinn
55.0	3.8	4	PIT	Bryan_Fogarty
55.0	3.7	4	DET	Viacheslav_Kozlov
55.0	2.9	3	TB	Stan_Drulia
55.0	2.9	3	MIN	Brian_Propp
55.0	2.9	3	MTL	Olav_Petrov
55.0	2.0	2	WSH	Jason_Woolley
55.0	1.9	2	NJ	Claude_Vilgrain
55.0	0.0	0	VAN	Igor_Larionov
55.0	0.0	0	TB	Brent_Gretzky
55.0	0.0	0	OTT	Alexei_Yashin
55.0	0.0	0	QUE	Peter_Forsberg
55.0	0.0	0	EDM	Dean_McAmmond
55.0	0.0	0	WSH	Brian_Sakic
55.0	0.0	0	WSH	Randy_Burridge
55.0	0.0	0	MTL	Patrick_Kjellberg
55.0	0.0	0	CGY	Cory_Stillman
55.0	0.0	0	CHI	Sergei_Krivokrasov
55.0	0.0	0	BUF	Jason_Dawe
-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52632
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Playoff Pool

As I've mentioned in the rules posting, I will be out of town until the
day before the entry deadline, so I won't be able to respond to your
messages until April 18.

I would be grateful if someone could repost the rules and instructions for
the playoff pool sometime next week, for the benefit of those who missed the
first two postings.

Thanks.

-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52633
From: jyturunen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL 

In article <rauser.734062608@sfu.ca>, rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:
>
>    Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. I am sick
> of watching a game between an American and a Canadian team (let's say, the
> Red Wings and the Canucks) and seeing names like "Bure" "Konstantinov" and
> "Borshevshky". Is this North America or isn't it? Toronto, Detriot, Quebec,
> and Edmonton are particularly annoying, but the numbers of Euros on other
> teams is getting worse as well.

    I'm sick too watching all-american names like GRETZKY etc.

    Which names you accept ? Sitting bull and dances with wolves ?

    It is North America. What are you doing here ?


    Jyri


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52634
From: hahietanen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi
Subject: TPS will stay on the top...

MIGHTY ONES GET MIGHTIER:

TPS, the Finnish Champions 1992/3, are getting still stronger!

I just heard some news, according to which TPS has acquired
the next Finnish hockey superstar(??) Jere Lehtinen from Kiekko-Espoo!

There are also some rumours about Erik Kakko (Reipas) and Marko Jantunen
(KalPa) being traded to TPS. Both of this players are currently on the
Finnish olympic team. I think that Jantunen is drafted to the NHL, too.

BTW. Is Juha Yl|nen (centre, HPK) drafted by the Jets?? During last year
he has reached the top level among Finnish centres. He had very good
playoff games against TPS!

  Hannu

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> GO  JETS  GO ! >>>>>>>> TEEMU ! >>>>>>> TEPPO ! >>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> TAPPARA >>>>>> CANADIENS >>>>>>> BLACKHAWKS >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
 


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52635
From: patchman@lion.WPI.EDU (Peter Bruce Harper)
Subject: Personal to Ulf Samuellsson


Dear Ulf,

	Would you possibly consider helpiMontreal Canadiens fans everywhere
by throwing a knee-check in the direction of Denis Savard during your upcoming
game against Montreal? We just can't seem to win WITH him!

						Thanx alot,
						Pete H.


:-)


###############################################################################
!Pete Harper          ! Baby, baby don't you hesitate 'cause I just can't wait!
!patchman@wpi.wpi.edu ! Lady once you get me down on my knees,                !
!OR                   ! then you can do what you please . . .                 !
!U_HARPER@jake.wpi.edu! COME ON AND LOVE ME!                                  !
!                     !         -Skid Row, "Come On and Love Me"              !
*******************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52636
From: r_turgeo@oz.plymouth.edu (Randy S. Turgeon)
Subject: Division by zero error in JACK NICKALUS TOURNAMENT GOLF


    I was playing this golf game and something interesting happened.
On the 7th hole, I drove the ball down the fairway, when the ball was
in mid-flight, the game completely froze. A couple seconds later, the
screen went completely black, with an error message in large "Bubble"
letters that said DIVISION BY ZERO. I thought it was funny considering
I am a computer programmer, and I had never seen an error like this on
an actual video game system like Sega or Nintendo (or even Atari or
Intellevision years ago). Oh yeah, after the message, there was also
what must have been an address, in hexadecimal. I forget the exact hex
code that was given. HAS THIS HAPPENED TO ANYONE ELSE??? It must have,
my game shouldn't have been the only one to do this.

Thanks
Randy
PSC
r_turgeo@oz.plymouth.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52637
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Observations

On the Lindros "trade":  Like Ottawa would be stupid enough to get
Lindros.  Why do you think Quebec traded him?  Lindros would go on
personal strike again...maybe I should talk to Ottawa mgmt. about
arranging such a trade....  ;-)

On that xenophobe:  Thankfully nobody agreed with him publicly.  Maybe we
should look at baseball, the supposed "American" pasttime (sp?).  Look at
all the damn Latin Americans playing there!  They should all be deported! 
They aren't American!  (add sarcasm to taste)

To Roger:  Wow, for once we agree.  I hope this isn't a sign of things to
come.... I'll become a ranting lunatic who talks about nothing but the
Leafs being the best in the Campbell.  ;-)

On the Rangers:  I told someone that nothing that happened in the Patrick
would surprise me anymore.  I lied.  How the hell can a team go into
Washington, earn a shutout, then come back home and lose to pitiful
Hartford?  The absolute *pinnacle* of mediocrity.  I can't stand it.
From what I've read, the goalie is to blame this time, as Beezer played
pretty poorly.  Smith is talking about calling up Corey Hirsch from
Binghamton, everybody is pointing fingers... this is definitely not the
same team which wanted to prove itself in Washington.  *Now* nothing that
happens in the Patrick will surprise me.  (Yeah, right... ;-)



--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

"Next time you go over my head, I'll have yours on a platter."
						-- Cmdr. Benjamin Sisko, 1993

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52638
From: mjr4u@Virginia.EDU ("Matthew J. Rush")
Subject: Re: Sad day for hockey

dvb@ick  writes:
> 
> 1. Foul (Any illegal contact with the other player or his stick with your
>    body or stick). If you get 5 you are out for the game.

I've never seen a game where one player has committed 5
penalties.  Something like this would require more attention by
the referee.

> 
> 2. Unsportsmanlike contact. (An intentional foul). This inlcludes all the
>    current flavours of roughing, fighting and boarding. If you get two you
>    are thrown out of the game, and fined.
> 
> 3. Technical foul. Bad mouthing the ref, by player or coach. Penalty shot
>    is awarded. Two and you are thrown out of the game.
> 
> Besides the penalty shot for one technical, if the team gets 5 penalties
> in a period, the opposing team gets a penalty shot for every additional one,
> until the end of the period. The victim gets two shots if he/she was in
> the act of shooting when the foul ocured.
> 
> This works well for several reasons. First, penalty shots are the most
> exciting thing in hockey, right? So, it follows that the more the better.
> Next, when the player is setting up for a penalty shot, the network can
> take a commercial. Finally, with only three penalties, the network
> announcers (Don Meredith, Dick Vitale, John Madden, Pat Summerall, and
> Marv Levy, among others) will be able to tell the viewers what happened before
> the PA announcer says it.
> 

But you're creating a scoring opportunity where there might not
have been one before.  I can see the relationship between free
throws awarded after a certain number of fouls, but it's
obviously easier to score in basketball, there are more
opportunities.  If a basketball team scores 100 points, that's
at least fifty chances made.  The average number of shots taken
by each team in a hockey game (and this is a total guess) is
probably around 40, and a team is lucky to capitalize on maybe
5 of them.  You have some good ideas concerning the other
penalties, but I think that a player should be awarded a
penalty shot only when they had a chance to score and was
interfered with.

Also, later in the post, you talked about how boring the NBA
game you attended was, that play was stopped too often.
Wouldn't your penalty shot rule take up more time during a
hockey game?

Matt att UVA

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52639
From: ayari@judikael.loria.fr (Ayari Iskander)
Subject: Re: Lemieux, NHLPA'93, and other thoughts

I think that NHLPA' 93 is the best video game available now.
of course many things could be done better, but i really appreciate that
the names of players are the real ones, no matter if it lacks some logos...
I am still playing it since November leading different teams to the finals
and making scorers from the same team compete for the top scoring:
Yesterday I won the title using Toronto against Hartford (4 games to two),
I played the playoffs in a 7 games fashion (5 minutes for each period) and
the best scorer and shooter was Gilmour (116 shots if I remember well)
-- 
_____________________________________________________

  Iskander AYARI
 
  Email : Iskander.Ayari@loria.fr ou ayari@loria.fr
_____________________________________________________


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52640
From: joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <1993Apr6.170330.12314@is.morgan.com> scairns@fsg.com writes:
>
>			   MVP		  Surprise	  Disappointment
>			   ---------------------------------------------
>|> New York Rangers        Messier        Kovalev         Bourque
>		           Gartner	  Zubov		  Bourque
>
...
>Bourque - the Penguin's GM must laugh his head off every time he thinks
>of the Rangers and this loser.
>
>+------------------------------------------------------------------+
>| Scott Cairns           	|   email: scairns@fsg.com         |
>| Fusion Systems Group		|  usmail: 225 Broadway, 24th Fl   |
>| New York, New York, USA   	|          New York, NY  10007     |
>+------------------------------------------------------------------+
>| Standard disclaimers apply.   				   | 
>+------------------------------------------------------------------+
>| I hope in the future Americans are thought of as a warlike,      |
>| vicious people, because then I bet a lot of high schools would   |
>| pick 'Americans' as their mascot.				   |
>|    					- Jack Handey		   |
>+------------------------------------------------------------------+

Please.  Have a care with Phil.  We liked him a lot in Pittsburgh.  He
didn't score a lot if you look at his stats last year but he worked his
butt off.  It was his speed that created opportunities in the offensive
zone that allowed the Pens to utilize his potential.  I haven't been
paying attention to him this year so I can't say I know what you're 
objecting to.  He has been out with injuries though, hasn't he?  And
if the offense isn't there, there's not much his speed will do for you.
Like I said, he created opportunities but he didn't score much.  I thought
the money offered from the Rangers was a little high, and so did the Pens,
I guess.

Joseph Stiehm





















In article <1993Apr6.170330.12314@is.morgan.com> scairns@fsg.com writes:
>
>			   MVP		  Surprise	  Disappointment
>			   ---------------------------------------------
>|> New York Rangers        Messier        Kovalev         Bourque
>		           Gartner	  Zubov		  Bourque
>
...
>Bourque - the Penguin's GM must laugh his head off every time he thinks
>of the Rangers and this loser.
>
>+------------------------------------------------------------------+
>| Scott Cairns           	|   email: scairns@fsg.com         |
>| Fusion Systems Group		|  usmail: 225 Broadway, 24th Fl   |
>| New York, New York, USA   	|          New York, NY  10007     |
>+------------------------------------------------------------------+
>| Standard disclaimers apply.   				   | 
>+------------------------------------------------------------------+
>| I hope in the future Americans are thought of as a warlike,      |
>| vicious people, because then I bet a lot of high schools would   |
>| pick 'Americans' as their mascot.				   |
>|    					- Jack Handey		   |
>+------------------------------------------------------------------+

Please.  Have a care with Phil.  We liked him a lot in Pittsburgh.  He
didn't score a lot if you look at his stats last year but he worked his
butt off.  It was his speed that created opportunities in the offensive
zone that allowed the Pens to utilize his potential.  I haven't been
paying attention to him this year so I can't say I know what you're 
objecting to.  He has been out with injuries though, hasn't he?  And
if the offense isn't there, there's not much his speed will do for you.
Like I said, he created opportunities but he didn't score much.  I thought
the money offered from the Rangers was a little high, and so did the Pens,
I guess.

Joseph Stiehm

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52641
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <1993Apr6.155743.18798@adobe.com> snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols) writes:
>In article <1993Apr6.141557.8864@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>>Anyways, crawl back into the hole you crawled out of...the NBA doesn't
>>care where they get basketball players from, major league baseball
>>doesn't give a damn where they get baseball players from (except Cuba,
>>that is).
>
>MLB is perfectly willing to take players from Cuba.  They just have to
>defect first.  
>
>Sort of like the situation used to be with Russian/Czech/etc hockey
>players, until the political situation in those countries changed.
>

Major league baseball has told the Blue Jays and the Expos not to
sign Oscar Linares (I think that is his name)
...Canada does not have the restrictions against
Cubans that the US has and other major league teams have told the
Canadian teams that they would be very unhappy if the Expos or the
Blue Jays would do this.  Cubans players would not have to defect
to play in Canada and could play the 81 home games for the Expos
and Blue Jays without any trouble.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52642
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

In article <1993Apr6.170330.12314@is.morgan.com> scairns@fsg.com writes:
>Messier is a joke this year - bad back not withstanding.  His play is
>the reason the Rangers will be on the golf course in a couple of weeks.
>Gartner is my choice - the guy works his butt off every game.
>
>Kovalev - no surprise.  He's played adequately but as bad defensively

Kovalev is too talented a player to play for Roger Nielson...Roger needs
players who can't think for themselves and can only skate in straight
lines up and down the ice.  Dudley and Nielson are the only two coaches
bad enough in the league to take talents like Mogilny and Kovalev and
not know how to turn them into Bure and Selanne.

>as was predicted in preseason.  Perhaps he'll pull an Alex Mogilny in
>a couple of years and surprise us then.  Zubov wasn't expected to make
>it out of the minors this season and owing to the number of injuries,
>has proved to be a very pleasant surprise.
>

Get Muckler as coach, and Kovalev will look like Mogilny.

The trouble with the Rangers is that Neil Smith went out and got
players like Messier, Kovalev, and Graves who have been schooled in
taking the game to their opponent and attacking, while hiring coaches
who are interested in "rope-a-dope" strategies.  If you want the
Roger Nielsons of the world to be your coach you don't go out and
get a Mark Messier, who is an old dog who can't learn new tricks
from a known loser, and you don't waste your draft picks on players
like Kovalev.

Gerald

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52643
From: snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <1993Apr6.195022.6362@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>Major league baseball has told the Blue Jays and the Expos not to
>sign Oscar Linares (I think that is his name)

Linares has not defected; as I pointed out, MLB requires that the player
defect first.

>...Canada does not have the restrictions against
>Cubans that the US has and other major league teams have told the
>Canadian teams that they would be very unhappy if the Expos or the
>Blue Jays would do this.

What a surprise.  As long as the pool of talent is not accessible to all
teams, MLB won't let a few teams sign it.  Seems perfectly reasonable to
me.  

>  Cubans players would not have to defect
>to play in Canada and could play the 81 home games for the Expos
>and Blue Jays without any trouble.

Except that MLB won't allow it, which is all I ever said.

Sherri Nichols
snichols@adobe.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52644
From: J056600@LMSC5.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM
Subject: Re: Lindros will be traded!!!

In <1993Apr5.163209.576@r-node.hub.org>, Jay Chu writes:

>True rumor.  Fact!  A big three way deal!

>Eric Lindros going to Ottawa Senators.  And Senators get $15mill from
>Montreal.

>Montreal gets Alexander Daigle (the first round pick from Senators)

>Philly gets Damphousse, Bellow, Patrick Roy and a draft pick.

Sheesh.  The rumor mill strikes again.  But let's just assume this were true.
My question is this:

What would Montreal give San Jose if the Sharks got first pick and took Daigle?


Tim Irvin
*****************************************************************************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52645
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Sad day for hockey

In article <1pq50fINN15b@abyss.West.Sun.COM> dvb@ick (David Van Beveren) writes:
>NO NO NO! since all the penalties fall into three classes, there should
>only be three penalties:
>
>1. Foul (Any illegal contact with the other player or his stick with your
>   body or stick). If you get 5 you are out for the game.
>
>2. Unsportsmanlike contact. (An intentional foul). This inlcludes all the
>   current flavours of roughing, fighting and boarding. If you get two you
>   are thrown out of the game, and fined.
>
>3. Technical foul. Bad mouthing the ref, by player or coach. Penalty shot
>   is awarded. Two and you are thrown out of the game.
>
>Besides the penalty shot for one technical, if the team gets 5 penalties
>in a period, the opposing team gets a penalty shot for every additional one,
>until the end of the period. The victim gets two shots if he/she was in
>the act of shooting when the foul ocured.

These new rule changes are great!  However, I think that your rules are
MUCH too complicated.  How will the normal average fan be able to count
how many fouls a player has?  And then we would even have to remember the
names of the players, in order to determine who drew the foul!  And, of
course, there will have to be new "sub-positions", like the power center
who just sits in the slot until the (blue, of course) puck comes near him,
and the "shooting defenseman" and the "point defenseman".  Finally, we'll
be able to keep stats on the best and the worst penalty-shot takers. 
Since almost everyone on the ice will be getting fouled, we'll be able to
see Ulf Samuellson (sp?) and Tie Domi miss penalty shots like crazy.  

;-) ;-) ;-)

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

"Next time you go over my head, I'll have yours on a platter."
						-- Cmdr. Benjamin Sisko, 1993

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52646
From: dvb@ick (David Van Beveren)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...

assist@orion.oac.uci.edu (ASSIST Coordination Site) writes:
: In article <C4zCII.Ftn@watserv1.uwaterloo.ca> smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca (Bryan Smale) writes:
: >                         MVP           Biggest       Biggest
: >                                       Suprise       Disappointment
: 
: >Los Angeles Kings       Robitaille     Donnelly      Hrudey
: 
: 
: I would have chosen Alex Zhitnik for biggest suprise.  They
: did expect that he would become a great defenseman, but I don't
: think anyone knew that he was going to be this impressive in his 
: rookie year.  His speed, skating ability, and puck control is
: exceptional -- he is the one to watch on the Kings.
: 

I agree, with Marty McSorely and Warren Rychel running a close second and 
third. I am surprised more people have not noted Knickle as the biggest
surprise, even though I personally do not really rate him well. The biggest 
disappointment has to be Carson. Though this is really unfair, since too much 
was expected of him. The second biggest disappointment is Melrose, with his 
adolescent handling of the goaltending problems. Putting Hrudey on the bench 
for a month is just stupid. It did not contribute to the team coming out of 
its slump. MVP is surely Robitaille.

dvb

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52647
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: New Name for the Stanley Cup

In article <1993Apr2.202146.22837@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> phoenix@startide.ctr.columbia.edu (Ali Lemer) writes:
>
>Of course we need new position names for those unable to remember the 
>very complicated hockey terminology:
>
>Old Name	New Name
>--------	--------	
>
>Centre		The Guy in the Middle
>Left Wing	The Guy on the Left
>Right Wing	The Guy on the Right
>Defenceman	The Guy Back There
>Goaltender	The Guy in the Net (or "cage", as my mother calls it)
>Referee		The Guy with the Whistle
>Linesman	The Guy with the Arms
>Coach		The Guy in the Suit
>GM		The Head Guy
>Puck		The Black Thing
>Red Line	The Line in the Middle
>Blue Line	The Line on the Side
>Crease		The Place in front of the Guy in the Net
>Faceoff Circle	The Round Thing Where They Stand
>Slot or Point	Over There (must point to accompany term)
>Bench		The Place Where They Sit
>Penalty Box	The Place Where They Sit When They're Bad

Mr. Bettman	The Guy in the Wrong Sport
Mr. Stein	The Guy Who Should Be In Charge But Isn't

Of course, we also need new names for the individual awards, and other
stuff like the President's Cup.

President's Cup		The Trophy Given To the Best Regular-Season Team
Hart winner		The Most Valuable Player, chosen from the
				Guys in the Middle, the Guys on the
				Right, the Guys on the Left, the Guys
				Back There, and the Guy in the Net,
				though typically given only to the
				Guys in the Middle and the Guys on 
				the Left and on the Right
Norris winner		The Best Guy in the back; or, the Guy who was
				awarded for something even though he
				is not one of the Guys in the Middle
				or on the Left or the Right

...ad nauseum.

:-)

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

"Next time you go over my head, I'll have yours on a platter."
						-- Cmdr. Benjamin Sisko, 1993

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52648
Subject: Paul Kuryia and Canadian World Team
From: apland@mala.bc.ca

Heard last night that Paul Kuryia will be playing for the Canadian World
Hockey team this year.  He was on a local radio station when a friend of
the familty called to congratulate him on the invitation.  Meekly Paul told
the host that he didn't think they wanted it out yet.  This morning I heard
that he is destined to play on a line with Lindros and Recci{unsure of this
one}.  If he plays well in this arena, he could go #1 or 2 in the draft.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52649
Subject: Re: JETS FANS!  Hrivnak or Tabaracci??
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)

In article <1993Apr6.172313.29469@wam.umd.edu> giant@next14pg2.wam.umd.edu (Thundarr) writes:
>After seeing Hrivnak and Tabarraci play, who
>would you prefer to have?  And how about
>Tyler Larter?  What ever happened to him??

	You know what my answer will be: Hrivnak! The choice is obvious.



-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52650
From: fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu (FRANK MICHAE SALVATORE)
Subject: Re: JETS FANS!  Hrivnak or Tabaracci??



> >After seeing Hrivnak and Tabarraci play, who
> >would you prefer to have?  And how about
> >Tyler Larter?  What ever happened to him??
> 
> 	You know what my answer will be: Hrivnak! The choice is obvious.
> 
> 
> 

Ok, but have you seen Tabaracci play yet?  In his two starts and
his relief effort for Beaupre, he has looked mighty sharp - don't
forget the shutout.  I think he's let in just four goals over eight
periods of play.  I like Hrivnak, but we might actually have to give
some credit to David Poile for a change after this trade.

Hopefully if Tabaracci starts against the Isles tonight, I haven't
jinxed him.

Frank Salvatore
fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52651
From: steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio)
Subject: Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...



Bryan Smale (smale@healthy.uwaterloo.ca) writes:
> I was thinking about who on each of the teams were the MVPs, biggest
> surprises, and biggest disappointments this year.
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>                         Team           Biggest       Biggest
> Team:                   MVP:           Surprise:     Disappointment:
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> Hartford Whalers        Sanderson      Cassells      Corriveau

My votes (FWIW):

Team MVP: Pat Verbeek. He fans on 25% of goal mouth feeds, but he still has 
36 goals after a terrible start and has been an examplary (sp?) team captain
throughout a tough couple of seasons. Honorable mention: Nick Kypreos and
Mark Janssens. Probably more appropriate in the unsung heroes category than
MVP, but Kypreos (17 goals, 320+ PIM) has been the hardest working player on
the team and Janssens is underrated as a defensive center and checker. I guess
I place a greater emphasis on hard work than skill when determining value.

Biggest surprise: Geoff Sanderson. He had 13 goals and 31 points last season
as a center, then moved to left wing and has so far put up 45 goals and 80+
points. He now has a new Whaler record 21 power play goals, most all coming
from the right wing faceoff circle, his garden spot. Honorable mention: Andrew
Cassels and Terry Yake. The kiddie quartet of Sanderson, Poulin, Nylander, and
Petrovicky have been attracting the most attention, but Cassels is just 23
and will score close to 90 points this season. He has quite nicely assumed the
role of number one center on the team and works very well with Sanderson. Yake
bounced around the minors for a number of seasons but is still 24 and will put
up about 20 goals and 50 points this season. Yake, like Sanderson, started
performing better offensively once he was converted from center to wing, 
although lefty Sanderson went to the left wing and righty Yake went to the
right side.

Biggest disappointment: Hands down, John Cullen. Cullen had a disasterous 77
point season last year, his first full season after The Trade. Cullen started
the season off of summer back surgery, and fell flat on his face (appropriate,
since he spent all of his Whaler career flat on his ass, and whining about it).
Cullen scored just 9 point on 19 games, was a clubhouse malcontent, commanded
the powerplay to a 9% success percentage (>21% with Sanderson), and sulked his
way out of town. Worst of all, his 4 year, $4M contract had three years left
to run, so no one would give up any more than the 2nd round draft pick the 
Maple Leafs offered to Hartford. Honorable mention: Steve Konroyd, also subpar
after signing a 3 year, $2.1M contract; Eric Weinrich, who showed flashes of
competence, but overall has played poorly; Jim McKenzie, who was a much better
hockey player two seasons ago than he is now; and Frank Pietrangelo, who only
seemed to play well when Sean Burke was out for an extended period and he got
to make a number of starts in a row.

-SG (a real live Hartford Whalers season ticket holder)
-steveg@cadkey.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52652
From: Raj Ramnarace <ACPS6992@RyeVm.Ryerson.Ca>
Subject: Maple Leafs Update

For those Leaf fans who are concerned, the following players are slated for
return on Thursday's Winnipeg-Toronto game :
    Peter Zezel, John Cullen

  Mark Osborne and Dave Ellett are questionable to return on Thursday.

All regular players who were injured (including Dimitri Mironov) should be back
for Saturday's home game against the Flyers.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52653
From: J056600@LMSC5.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM
Subject: Does the FAQ crash YOUR newsreader?


   The r.s.h FAQ sheet never fails to crash my newsreader.  The only way I
can avoid crashing (and restarting the machine) is to look at the headers and
avoid reading the FAQ.  Does anyone else have problems reading the FAQ?


Tim Irvin
******************************************************************************
The season is near a merciful end...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52654
From: khettry@r1w2.pub.utk.edu (23064RFL)
Subject: Testing!!!



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52655
From: pavalin@bnr.ca (Paul Valin)
Subject: Re: Canadiens - another Stanley Cup???

In article <1993Apr6.044045.5215@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca>,
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) wrote:
> 
> In <rauser.734062534@sfu.ca> rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:
> 
>>pereira@CAM.ORG (Dean Pereira) writes:
> 
> 
>>>		With the kind of team Montreal has now,  they can take the
>>>cup easily.  The only problem they have right now is that everyone is
>>>trying to steal the show and play alone.  They need some massive teamwork.
> 
>This is known as the Savard syndrome - and we are talking Denis, not Serge.
>No team will ever win squat with the likes of Denis Savard in their lineup.
> 
> 
>They could tell Savard to stay home and watch the games on TV.

If life were so simple!  Savard has not played in three of the last 
four games and they are still playing like crap.  Montreal's problems
run deeper than Savard (and Mouton) unfortunately; I hope they can
get their act together before the playoffs.

The line-up in their game coming up against PittsburgH is said to be
the one they're likely to use for the playoffs.  Let's hope they can
forget about the nice weather we're having and play hockey.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Paul Valin                                     Tel: + 1 613 763 7394
Bell-Northern Research Ltd.                    Email: pavalin@bnr.ca
P.O. Box 3511, Station C
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada K1Y 4H7               'only my opinions...'

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52656
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <rauser.734062608@sfu.ca> rauser@fraser.sfu.ca (Richard John Rauser) writes:
>
>   Here's the point: there are far too many Europeans in the NHL. I am sick
>of watching a game between an American and a Canadian team (let's say, the
>Red Wings and the Canucks) and seeing names like "Bure" "Konstantinov" and
>"Borshevshky". Is this North America or isn't it? Toronto, Detriot, Quebec,
>and Edmonton are particularly annoying, but the numbers of Euros on other
>teams is getting worse as well. 

Gee, you'd think Winnipeg would be tops on that list, what with 8 regulars
being European.


>
>    I live in Vancouver and if I hear one more word about "Pavel Bure, the
>Russian Rocket" I will completely throw up. As it is now, every time I see
>the Canucks play I keep hoping someone will cross-check Bure into the plexiglassso hard they have to carry him out on a stretcher. (By the way, I'm not a
>Canucks fan to begin with ;-). 

Well, being a Jet fan, I sometimes wish that Bure would get knocked silly
too.  (Nothing serious, just enough to keep him out of a game. :)


>
>    Okay, the stretcher remark was a little carried away. But the point is that
>I resent NHL owners drafting all these Europeans INSTEAD of Canadians (and
>some Americans). It denies young Canadians the opportunity to play in THEIR
>NORTH AMERICAN LEAGUE and instead gives it to Europeans, who aren't even
>better hockey players. It's all hype. This "European mystique" is sickening,
>but until NHL owners get over it, Canadian and American players will continue
>to have to fight harder to get drafted into their own league.

In most cases, the owners have very little to do with it.  They give their
general managers one order when it comes to the draft...find me the best
players so that our team will win the Stanley Cup.  Whether that player is
in Kindersley, Saskatchewan or Chelyabinsk, Russia, if the GM believes him
to be the better player, the GM should be drafting him.

Where do you get off calling the NHL THEIR league, when referring to Canadian
players.  It doesn't belong to them, it belongs to the owners.  The owners
can do what they want.  While a 'Canadian content' rule might be enforcable
here in Canada, there is enough doubt that it would be enforcable in the US
that the CFL (sorry for the football reference) didn't even TRY to push their
import ratio rule on the Sacromento Goldminers.

Increasing the competition for the 'elite' positions, in most cases, would
make players better anyways.  (Oh yeah, and how many Europeans play at the
lower levels of professional hockey in North America?  While there are some
that play in the AHL, or the IHL where that's an NHL team's primary farm
club, you don't hear of many Europeans playing in the CHL, the ECHL, or on
the secondary farm teams in the IHL.  (ie. the Jets do have a few Russian
players in Moncton, but I don't believe there are any Europeans in Ft. Wayne.))
So with all those teams, there are plenty of positions for hockey players
in North America.

>
>    With the numbers of Euros in the NHL escalating, the problem is clearly
>only getting worse.
>
>    I'm all for the creation of a European Hockey League, and let the Bures
>and Selannes of the world play on their own continent.
>
>    I just don't want them on mine.

I'm in favour of the NHL being the league for the premier players in the
world.  I've grown up with Europeans playing on 'my' team, and some of those
players were the among the best in the world.  From Hedberg, Nilsson, and
Sjoberg, to Sel{nne, Zhamnov, and Olausson, and all those in between and to
come, I wouldn't have it any other way.

Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52657
From: macro@cup.hp.com (Patrick MacRoberts)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL


%>I dunno, Lemieux?  Hmmm...sounds like he
%>has *French* blood in him!!!  Hey!  France is part of Europe!  Send that
%>Euro-blooded boy back!!!
%
% Don't you Americans study history...the French settled in North America
% as early or before the British...Lemieux can probably trace back his
% North American heritage back a lot further than most of us.


<friendly-jibe mode on>

Don't you Canadians understand sarcasm?  Sometimes the reader must
decide that what he's reading is so ludicrous that it must mean
the opposite of what it said...

Kinda like the "Toronto's going to win the Cup" posts.  Yeah.  Right.
And cows can fly...

<friendly-jibe mode off>

Geez, Gerald.  Like anyone reading rec.flamefest.hockey.pens.are.great
didn't know that Le-Mow was from Quebec.

-Patrick

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52658
From: snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <1993Apr6.141557.8864@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>Anyways, crawl back into the hole you crawled out of...the NBA doesn't
>care where they get basketball players from, major league baseball
>doesn't give a damn where they get baseball players from (except Cuba,
>that is).

MLB is perfectly willing to take players from Cuba.  They just have to
defect first.  

Sort of like the situation used to be with Russian/Czech/etc hockey
players, until the political situation in those countries changed.

Sherri Nichols
snichols@adobe.com




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52659
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: Re: TPS will stay on the top...

In article <1993Apr6.171611.1@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi> hahietanen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi writes:
>MIGHTY ONES GET MIGHTIER:
>
>TPS, the Finnish Champions 1992/3, are getting still stronger!

Oh no!  Say it isn't so!

>
>BTW. Is Juha Yl|nen (centre, HPK) drafted by the Jets?? During last year
>he has reached the top level among Finnish centres. He had very good
>playoff games against TPS!

Yes, Yl|nen is a draft choice of the Jets.  (Assuming, of course, this
is the same Yl|nen that played for Kiekko-Espoo in 1990-91.)  He was a
5th round, 91st overall pick of the Jets in the 1991 entry draft.

I noticed in the summaries that Yl|nen had really begun to play well in
the playoffs.

Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52660
From: lsa@ll.mit.edu (lisa s anderson)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL

In article <1993Apr6.142037.9246@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca>, golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:

|>
|>In article <1993Apr6.044323.22829@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> daniell@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Daniel Lyddy) writes:
|>>
|>>You know, you're absolutely right.  I think we should round up all those
|>>players of European descent and ship 'em back to where they came from.  Let's
|>>see, with whom should we start?  I dunno, Lemieux?  Hmmm...sounds like he
|>>has *French* blood in him!!!  Hey!  France is part of Europe!  Send that
|>>Euro-blooded boy back!!!
|>>
|>
|>Don't you Americans study history...the French settled in North America
|>as early or before the British...Lemieux can probably trace back his
|>North American heritage back a lot further than most of us.
|>
|>Gerald
|>


Uh, Gerald, I think he was joking...


-lisa

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52661
From: ac942@Freenet.carleton.ca (Marc Gregoire)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL


Somebody wrote:
>I'd *LOVE* to see a European NHL division but can't see it happen for some
>time. There's simply not enough fan interest at the moment in several
>"crucial" markets like Germany, Italy and France while Sweden and Finland
>probably can't afford to shell out $20-$30 for tickets the way
>American/Canadian fans do. Call it "the Minnesota North Stars" effect:
>Scandinavians do love hockey but we prefer to watch local, inexpensive
>hockey to the NHL. The National Hockey League should love the idea, though.
>Pan-European TV channels such as Eurosport could bring in the millions the
>American networks likely never will pay.

This brings up a question I asked myself (no answer) when it was mentionned
that the NHL could expand in Europe.

Would most of the North-americans now playing in the NHL be willing
to play for a team in Europe?

I do not think that the majority of hockey players are necessarily
interested in expanding their cultural experience to that level.
(I know I would but I am not a pro hockey player)

When one recalls some players remarks in the last few years it makes
me wonder how a European expansion could be achieved.  Remember these:

- Lindros did not want to play in Quebec (for more than $ reasons)
- Nicholls ... in Edmonton.
- R. Courtnall wanted to be traded to LA only.
- C. Lemieux said he would refuse to go to Edmonton earlier this year.

I know there are many non-cultural reasons behind these but there is more:

- Some american players who played for the Expos complained about the french
  fact and that the city was not quite like the other US cities.  One
  players' wife trying to make her point went on to complain that she could
  not even find her favorite brand of nacho chips in Montreal.

Anybody knows what happened when all these US football players moved
to London, Spain, etc .. for the one year of that new football league
(2 years ago?)

I wonder what the players association thinks about going to Europe.

Myself I would like to see some European teams, but what would be 
the best way to do it? 

Marc

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52662
From: dvb@ick (David Van Beveren)
Subject: Sad day for hockey

ee0i+@andrew.cmu.edu ("Ethan Z. Evans") writes:
: 
: Of course, penalties will have to be changed:
: 
: Roughing:	Chauvanistic Males Being Aggressive
: Slashing:	Chauvanistic Males Venting Frustration
: Fighting:	Proof That Males Cannot Cope With Their Feelings
: 

NO NO NO! since all the penalties fall into three classes, there should
only be three penalties:

1. Foul (Any illegal contact with the other player or his stick with your
   body or stick). If you get 5 you are out for the game.

2. Unsportsmanlike contact. (An intentional foul). This inlcludes all the
   current flavours of roughing, fighting and boarding. If you get two you
   are thrown out of the game, and fined.

3. Technical foul. Bad mouthing the ref, by player or coach. Penalty shot
   is awarded. Two and you are thrown out of the game.

Besides the penalty shot for one technical, if the team gets 5 penalties
in a period, the opposing team gets a penalty shot for every additional one,
until the end of the period. The victim gets two shots if he/she was in
the act of shooting when the foul ocured.

This works well for several reasons. First, penalty shots are the most
exciting thing in hockey, right? So, it follows that the more the better.
Next, when the player is setting up for a penalty shot, the network can
take a commercial. Finally, with only three penalties, the network
announcers (Don Meredith, Dick Vitale, John Madden, Pat Summerall, and
Marv Levy, among others) will be able to tell the viewers what happened before
the PA announcer says it.

Oh, one other rule. When a goal is scored (10-20 times a period), the play
cannot resume until the PA announcer announces it. This way, the network
can sneak in a few more commercials. Then, once the PA announcer has told
them who scored, the TV announcer can tell you the viewer, and even have a 
chance of pronouncing his name right.

Seriously, though, I actually went to see a NBA basketball game last week,
for the first time in my life. I was amazed how boring it was. The play is
so slow they actually had fans come out for things like free-throw shooting
contests DURING THE PERIOD!. Of course the 'Laker Girls' get to do their 
routines at least 6-8 times during the game, and not just between periods
either. There is a whistle every 30 seconds on average, maybe less. The
game is 48 minutes, with 2 minutes between quarters 1-2 and 3-4 and a
10 minute halftime, and it still takes over 2 hours.

The reason for this has to be TV. There is plenty of room to throw in
commercials, and have the announcer jabber while nothing else is happening.
On TV, basketball is fairly entertaining, IMHO. But, it is better to watch
it on TV than to be there. If this is the road the NHL is following, then
it truly is a sad day.

Enough for now.

dvb

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52663
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL
From: riel@unixg.ubc.ca (William Riel)

How long has Don Cherry been a student at SFU? (or is that Arche Bunker?)

Please, keep this racist drivel off of the net.  You're an embarassment
to Canadians everywhere.

Bill 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52664
From: tvartiai@vipunen.hut.fi (Tommi Vartiainen)
Subject: Re: TPS will stay on the top...

In <1993Apr6.171611.1@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi> hahietanen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi writes:
>BTW. Is Juha Yl|nen (centre, HPK) drafted by the Jets?? During last year
>he has reached the top level among Finnish centres. He had very good
>playoff games against TPS!

I'm not sure about Juha, but another top center, Rauli Raitanen([ss{t)
is drafted by Jets. Raitanen had very good year and he has played in the
Finnish nationalteam. I believe that he'll be one of the best finns in
this year's WC, if Matikainen(Head coach) elects him to the team.

>  Hannu

   Tommi



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52665
From: pbarone@x102a.ess.harris.com (barone philip 00309)
Subject: USENET Playoff Pool

I saw a previous request for the Rules and Instructions for the USENET 
playoff pool but I haven't seen any responce. Does anybody have this info?
If so post away or you could mail it to me. Thanks in advance.


--
============================================================================
Phil Barone                  \       Internet:  pbarone@x102a.ess.harris.com
Harris Corporation GISD       \
Cape Canaveral A.F.S.          \
407-853-8169                    \
============================================================================




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52666
From: LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall)
Subject: Re: WHERE ARE THE DOUBTERS NOW?  HMM?

In article <1993Apr4.051942.27095@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca>
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
 
>
>For those of you who can only decide which team is best after you have
>seen the standings:
>
>TOR  42 25 11  95   .609
>CHI  42 25 11  95   .609
>DET  44 28  9  97   .599
>VAN  41 28  9  91   .583
>
>No team in the Campbell Conference has a better record than Toronto.
 
  That's true, but according to your stats, Chicago has just as good a
record as Toronto.  It's interesting that you should list Toronto ahead
of Chicago.
 
 Laurie Marshall
 Wayne State University
 Detroit, Michigan
 Go Wings!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52667
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: Miami's name?

In article <1993Apr6.160042.4953@vax.cns.muskingum.edu> da_tinker1@vax.cns.muskingum.edu writes:
>When will the new Miami franchise team announce it's name?
>Just curious.

	The South Florida Colons.

	:)

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52668
From: khettry@r1w2.pub.utk.edu (23064RFL)
Subject: Testing !!

	Just Testing !!!
	No flames please !

Bye



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 52669
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Too Many Europeans in NHL


You're right ... I'm sick of seeing all those white guys on skates
myself ... the Vancouver Canucks should be half women, and overall 
one-third Oriental.



(-; (-; (-; (-; (-; (-; 

And I'll gladly volunteer myself for the overage draft. (-;

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53468
From: hamlet@stein.u.washington.edu (Mitch McGowan)
Subject: rec.sport.hockey Frequently Asked Questions

Archive-name: hockey-faq

rec.sport.hockey answers to Frequently Asked Questions and other news:
 
Contents:

0. New Info.
1. NHL
2. NHL Minor Leagues
3. College Hockey (North America)
4. Other leagues (e.g. Europe, Canada Cup tournament)
5. E-mail files
6. USENET Hockey Pool
7. Up-coming Dates
8. Answers to some frequently asked questions
9. Miscellaneous
 
 Send comments, suggestions and criticisms regarding this FAQ list via e-
mail to hamlet@u.washington.edu.
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
 0. New Info.
 
 This section will describe additions since the last post so that you can 
decide if there is anything worth reading. Paragraphs containing new 
information will be preceded by two asterisks (**).

 1.: New Anaheim contact, Winnipeg to keep affiliate in Moncton.
 2.: New Milwaukee contact, IHL broadcaster of the year named, Rheaume to 
start against Cyclones, San Diego sets record.
 3.: Ticket info included for 1994 NCAA Division I Championships.
 4.: World Championship Pool B results listed, Sweden Hockey Games final 
standings listed, Swedish Elite League final standings listed, new Olypmic 
Hockey mailing list.
 5.: New Montreal mailing list address.
 6.: 
 7.: 
 8.: 
 9.: 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
  1. NHL - National Hockey League
 
 For detailed information concerning a team (particularly where to get 
tickets and merchandise, where to watch games in town....), send e-mail to 
the net contact(s) for the team.

                             First   # of   Last
 Team                   Div  Season  Cups   Cup    Net Contacts
 ---------------------  ---  ------  ----  ------ ----------------------
**
 Anaheim Mighty Ducks    -   93-94      -    -    Kris Myers
                                                  kris@fs2.assist.uci.edu
 Boston Bruins           A   24-25      5  71-72  
 Buffalo Sabres          A   70-71      0    -    Jeff Horvath
                                                  jhorvath@macc.wisc.edu
 Calgary Flames          S   80-81*     1  88-89  CALDWELL8102@mtroyal.ab.ca
 Chicago Blackhawks      N   26-27      3  60-61  John Scholvin
                                                  scholvin@casbah.acns.nwu.edu
 Detroit Red Wings       N   33-34*     7  54-55  SGLENN@cmsa.gmr.com
 Edmonton Oilers         S   79-80*     5  89-90  Andrew Scott
                                                  andrew@idacom.hp.com
 Hartford Whalers        A   79-80*     0    -    Matthew Olsen
                                                  dmolsen@athena.mit.edu
 Los Angeles Kings       S   67-68      0    -    Stan Willis
                                                  willis@empire.dnet.hac.com
 Minnesota North Stars   N   67-68*     0    -    Mitch McGowan
                                                  hamlet@u.washington.edu
 Montreal Canadiens      A   17-18     22  85-86  
 New Jersey Devils       P   82-83*     0    -    
 New York Islanders      P   72-73      4  82-83  Mark Anania
                                                  ananim@rpi.edu
 New York Rangers        P   26-27      3  39-40  Paul Romano
                                                  romano@monolith.bellcore.com
 Ottawa Senators         A   92-93      0    -    Scott Simpson
                                                  simpson@bnr.ca
 Philadelphia Flyers     P   67-68      2  74-75  Pete Clark
                                                  seth@hos1cad.att.com
 Pittsburgh Penguins     P   67-68      2  91-92  Lori Iannamico
                                                  lli+@cs.cmu.edu
                                                  Thomas Sullivan
                                                  tms@cs.cmu.edu
 Quebec Nordiques        A   79-80*     0    -
 St. Louis Blues         N   67-68      0    -    Joseph Achkar
                                                  jca2@cec1.wustl.edu
 San Jose Sharks         S   91-92      0    -    Nelson Lu
                                                  claudius@leland.stanford.edu
**
 South Florida           -   93-94      -    -    
 Tampa Bay Lightning     N   92-93      0    -    Tom Wilson
                                                  wilson@eola.cs.ucf.edu
 Toronto Maple Leafs     N   26-27*    11  66-67  Darryl Gamble
                                                  darryl@cs.yorku.ca
 Vancouver Canucks       S   70-71      0    -    Alan Chim
                                                  chim@sfu.ca
 Washington Capitals     P   74-75      0    -    David Lu
                                                  david@eng.umd.edu
 Winnipeg Jets           S   79-80*     0    -    umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca
 
 A=Adams N=Norris P=Patrick S=Smythe
 
 *Calgary: formerly Atlanta Flames (72/73-79/80)
  Detroit: formerly Detroit Cougars (26/27-29/30) -> Detroit Falcons 
(30/31-32/33)
  Edmonton: formerly Alberta Oilers (WHA) (72/73) -> Edmonton Oilers (WHA) 
(72/73-78/79)
  Hartford: formerly New England Whalers (WHA) (72/73-78/79)
  Minnesota: Cleveland Barons were merged with Minnesota for the 1978/79 
season.
  New Jersey: formerly Kansas City Scouts (74/75-75/76) -> Colorado 
Rockies (76/77-81/82)
  Quebec: formerly Quebec Nordiques (WHA) (72/73-78/79)
  Toronto: formerly Toronto Arenas (17/18-18/19) -> Toronto St. Patricks 
(19/20-25/26)
  Winnipeg: formerly Winnipeg Jets (WHA) (72/73-78/79)

 Teams with mailing lists, see section 5 for addresses: Boston, Buffalo, 
Los Angeles, Montreal, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, St. Louis, San Jose, 
Tampa Bay, Vancouver, Washington.

-----
 
- Schedule

 1992-1993 Schedule for the NHL

                                 April
    Sun       Mon       Tue       Wed       Thu       Fri       Sat
+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+
!         !         !         !         ! 1       ! 2       ! 3       !
!         !         !         !         !Min @ Cal!Mon @ Was!Buf @ Bos!
!         !         !         !         !Det @ Chi!NYI @ NYR!Cal @ SJ !
!         !         !         !         !Har @ Pit!         !Chi @ StL!
!         !         !         !         !Que @ Ott!         !Van @ Det!
!         !         !         !         !Tor @ Phi!         !Win @ Edm!
!         !         !         !         !Win @ SJ !         !Ott @ Har!
!         !         !         !         !Van @ TB !         !Min @ LA !
!         !         !         !         !         !         !Mon @ NYI!
!         !         !         !         !         !         !NJ  @ Tor!
!         !         !         !         !         !         !TB  @ Phi!
!         !         !         !         !         !         !Pit @ Que!
+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+
! 4       ! 5       ! 6       ! 7       ! 8       ! 9       !10       !
!Bos @ Buf!Har @ NYR!Bos @ Que!Edm @ Van!Que @ Bos!Van @ Cal!Bos @ Mon!
!Cal @ SJ !         !Buf @ Min!Har @ Ott!Chi @ NYI!Pit @ NYR!Buf @ Det!
!StL @ Chi!         !Cal @ LA !Mon @ Pit!Det @ TB !         !Chi @ TB !
!Pit @ NJ !         !Edm @ SJ !NYR @ NJ !SJ  @ LA !         !Har @ Que!
!NYR @ Was!         !NYI @ Was!         !Was @ Phi!         !LA  @ SJ !
!Van @ Ott!         !Phi @ Win!         !Tor @ Win!         !StL @ Min!
!         !         !StL @ TB !         !         !         !NJ  @ Was!
!         !         !         !         !         !         !Ott @ NYI!
!         !         !         !         !         !         !NYR @ Pit!
!         !         !         !         !         !         !Phi @ Tor!
+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+
!11       !12       !13       !14       !15       !16       !17       !
!Ott @ Bos!Was @ Mon!Mon @ Buf!Bos @ Ott!Phi @ Buf!         !         !
!Que @ Buf!NYR @ Phi!Cal @ Edm!NYI @ Har!SJ  @ Cal!         !         !
!Cal @ Van!         !Chi @ Min!Pit @ NJ !Tor @ Chi!         !         !
!TB  @ Chi!         !LA  @ Van!Was @ NYR!Min @ Det!         !         !
!Win @ Edm!         !Ott @ Que!         !Edm @ Win!         !         !
!Tor @ Har!         !StL @ Tor!         !Har @ NYI!         !         !
!Min @ StL!         !TB  @ Win!         !Van @ LA !         !         !
!NYI @ NJ !         !         !         !NJ  @ Pit!         !         !
!         !         !         !         !TB  @ StL!         !         !
+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+

 The season will begin on 10/6 and end on 4/15. Playoffs will begin on 
4/18 and end on or before 6/14. 24 NHL regular season games will be played 
in non-NHL cities during 92-93 season. Cities: Milwaukee (2), Sacramento 
(2), Cleveland (2), Indianapolis, Phoenix, Miami, Oklahoma City, Dallas, 
Atlanta, Cincinnati, Providence, Peoria, Hamilton (4), Saskatoon (4), 
Halifax.

 Here is a chart showing the number of games between the teams (84 games 
each):

      N N N P P W   B B H M O Q   C D M S T T   C E L S V W
      J Y Y h i a   o u a o t u   h e i t B o   a d A J a i
        I R i t s   s f r n t e   i t n L   r   l m     n n
      = = = = = =   = = = = = =   = = = = = =   = = = = = =
 NJ : - 7 7 7 9 7   4 4 4 3 4 4   2 2 2 2 2 2   2 2 2 2 2 2
 NYI: 7 - 7 9 7 7   4 3 4 4 3 3   2 2 2 3 2 2   2 3 2 2 2 2
 NYR: 7 7 - 7 7 9   3 4 3 4 3 4   2 2 2 2 3 2   2 2 2 3 2 2
 Phi: 7 9 7 - 7 7   4 3 3 4 3 4   2 3 2 2 2 2   3 2 2 2 2 2
 Pit: 9 7 7 7 - 7   5 4 3 3 4 3   2 2 2 2 2 2   2 3 2 2 2 2
 Was: 7 7 9 7 7 -   3 4 4 3 4 3   3 3 2 2 2 2   2 2 2 2 2 2

 Bos: 4 4 3 4 5 3   - 7 7 9 7 7   2 2 2 2 2 2   2 2 2 2 2 2
 Buf: 4 3 4 3 4 4   7 - 9 7 7 7   2 2 2 2 2 2   2 2 2 2 3 2
 Har: 4 4 3 3 3 4   7 9 - 7 7 7   2 2 2 3 2 2   2 2 2 2 2 3
 Mon: 3 4 4 4 3 3   9 7 7 - 7 7   2 2 2 2 2 2   2 2 3 3 2 2
 Ott: 4 3 3 3 4 4   7 7 7 7 - 9   2 2 2 2 2 3   2 2 2 2 2 3
 Que: 4 3 4 4 3 3   7 7 7 7 9 -   2 2 2 2 3 3   2 2 2 2 2 2

 Chi: 2 2 2 2 2 3   2 2 2 2 2 2   - 9 7 7 7 7   3 4 5 3 4 3
 Det: 2 2 2 3 2 3   2 2 2 2 2 2   9 - 7 7 7 7   4 3 4 4 3 3
 Min: 2 2 2 2 2 2   2 2 2 2 2 2   7 7 - 9 7 7   4 4 3 3 5 4
 StL: 2 3 2 2 2 2   2 2 3 2 2 2   7 7 9 - 7 7   4 3 3 3 4 4
 TB : 2 2 3 2 2 2   2 2 2 2 2 3   7 7 7 7 - 9   3 4 3 4 3 4
 Tor: 2 2 2 2 2 2   2 2 2 2 3 3   7 7 7 7 9 -   4 3 4 4 3 3

 Cal: 2 2 2 3 2 2   2 2 2 2 2 2   3 4 4 4 3 4   - 7 7 9 7 7
 Edm: 2 3 2 2 3 2   2 2 2 2 2 2   4 3 4 3 4 3   7 - 7 7 7 9
 LA : 2 2 2 2 2 2   2 2 2 3 2 2   5 4 3 3 3 4   7 7 - 7 9 7
 SJ : 2 2 3 2 2 2   2 2 2 3 2 2   3 4 3 3 4 4   9 7 7 - 7 7
 Van: 2 2 2 2 2 2   2 3 2 2 2 2   4 3 5 4 3 3   7 7 9 7 - 7
 Win: 2 2 2 2 2 2   2 2 3 2 3 2   3 3 4 4 4 3   7 9 7 7 7 -

 Valerie Hammerl <hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu> has posted this year's version 
of nhl.c, a schedule program for NHL games.  For example, users can find 
out the games played on a certain date or find out the next ten games 
played by team x. A copy can be obtained by e-mailing 
<hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu>

 Following is the neutral site schedule:

 Tue 10/13:  Calgary vs. Minnesota @ Saskatoon
 Tue 10/20:  Ottawa vs. Toronto @ Hamilton
 Tue 11/03:  Chicago vs. Washington @ Indianapolis
 Tue 11/17:  Toronto vs. Quebec @ Hamilton
 Wed 11/18:  Buffalo vs. New Jersey @ Hamilton
 Tue 12/01:  Los Angeles vs. Chicago @ Milwaukee
 Tue 12/08:  Montreal vs. Los Angeles @ Phoenix
 Wed 12/09:  Tampa Bay vs. New York Rangers @ Miami
 Sun 12/13:  Edmonton vs. New York Islanders @ Oklahoma City
 Tue 12/15:  New York Islanders vs. St. Louis @ Dallas
 Mon 01/04:  San Jose vs. Montreal @ Sacramento
 Mon 01/18:  Hartford vs. Winnipeg @ Saskatoon
 Mon 02/08:  Boston vs. Pittsburgh @ Atlanta
 Mon 02/08:  St. Louis vs. Hartford @ Peoria
 Tue 02/16:  Philadelphia vs. Calgary @ Cincinnati
 Sat 02/20:  Quebec vs. Tampa Bay @ Halifax
 Mon 02/22:  New York Rangers vs. San Jose @ Sacramento
 Mon 02/22:  Detroit vs. Philadelphia @ Cleveland
 Tue 02/23:  Winnipeg vs. Ottawa @ Saskatoon
 Mon 03/01:  Vancouver vs. Buffalo @ Hamilton
 Thu 03/11:  Minnesota vs. Vancouver @ Saskatoon
 Tue 03/16:  Washington vs. Detroit @ Milwaukee
 Tue 03/16:  New Jersey vs. Boston @ Providence  *
 Sun 03/21:  Pittsburgh vs. Edmonton @ Cleveland

 * Location subject to change

NHL Playoff Schedule:

Wales Conference Division Semifinals: April 18, 20, 22, 24, 26*, 28*, 30*
Campbell Conference Division Semifinals: April 19, 21, 23, 25, 27*, 29*, May 1*
Wales Conference Division Finals: May 2, 4, 6, 8, 10*, 12*, 14*
Campbell Conference Division Finals: May 3, 5, 7, 9, 11*, 13*, 15*
Wales Conference Final: May 16, 18, 20, 22, 24*, 26*, 28*
Campbell Conference Final: May 17, 19, 21, 23, 25*, 27*, 29*
Stanley Cup Final: June 1, 3, 5, 7, 9*, 11*, 14*

* - if neccessary

-----
 
- News & Scores
 
 SPIKE (bryan.k.strouse) <bks@cbnewsh.cb.att.com> posts weekday news and 
box scores (Sunday through Thursday). John P. Curcio 
<jpc@philabs.philips.com> posts weekend news and box scores. Both maintain 
e-mail lists for faster delivery.
 Net contacts post team news as they see/hear/read it.
 
-----
 
- Notable team news (transactions and announcements)
 
 Note that this information is culled from press releases and posts.  It 
is updated each month and only information currently under discussion or 
of continuing importance or interest will be listed for more than two 
postings.
 
 Boston Bruins
  Boston legislators and the developers proposing a new Boston Garden 
finally agreed to a deal that puts the 19,000-seat, $160 million project 
back on track to be finished in September 1995.
  Right wing Daniel Marois will be sidelined indefinitely following 
surgery to repair a herniated disc in his back.
**
  Sent defenseman Glen Murray to Providence of the American Hockey League.

 Buffalo Sabres
1-800-333-PUCK (1-800-333-7825)
  Acquired left winger Bob Errey from Pittsburgh for defenseman Mike 
Ramsey.
**
  Veteran Buffalo Sabres broadcaster Ted Darling will be inducted into the 
club's Hall of Fame Sunday, April 11.  Darling, who joined the expansion 
Sabres in 1970, was the team's play-by-play announcer on both television 
and radio until illness forced him out of the booth during last season.
**
  Recalled forwards Viktor Gordiouk and Doug MacDonald from Rochester of 
American Hockey League.

 Calgary Flames
  Acquired veteran right wing Greg Paslawski from Philadelphia for future 
considerations.
**
  Recalled center Todd Harkins and left winger Tomas Forslund from Salt 
Lake City of International Hockey League.

 Chicago Blackhawks
        The $175 million, privately financed United Center, scheduled to 
open in August 1994, will be home to the NBA's Chicago Bulls and NHL's 
Chicago Blackhawks. The stadium is owned by entities controlled by the two 
teams. The owners apparently still have not made a decision on whether the 
old Chicago Stadium will be razed for parking space once the new facility, 
located directly across the street, opens.
  Suspended defenseman Craig Muni indefinitely for failing to report 
following a trade with Edmonton.

 Detroit Red Wings
  Acquired defenseman Steve Konroyd from Hartford for a sixth-round draft 
pick.
  Annnounced the signing of right wing Joe Frederick, their 13th pick in 
the 1989 National Hockey League entry draft.
**
  Two contrite hockey fans have returned the stolen Michigan Sports Hall 
of Fame plaque honoring Detroit Red Wing great Gordie Howe. The bronze 
plaque was stolen more than four years ago from Cobo Hall in Detroit, site 
of the Michigan Hall of Fame.

 Edmonton Oilers
  Sent forward Esa Tikkanen to the New York Rangers for center Doug 
Weight.
  Traded defenseman Craig Muni to Chicago for forward Mike Hudson.
  NHL commissioner Gary Bettman said the Edmonton Oilers' lease with 
Northlands Coliseum must be improved if the team is to survive in the 
city. Edmonton Northlands is a non-profit agency set up by the city to 
administer exhibition facilities including the Coliseum.  Oilers owner 
Peter Pocklington calls his lease with Northlands horrendous and has 
threatened to move the team if he doesn't get a better deal. He makes no 
money from parking, concessions or building advertising. The 17,313-seat 
Coliseum also has few of the lucrative private boxes that produce 
significant revenues for other owners.
  Announced center Kevin Todd will not need surgery but will miss the 
remainder of the season with a separated shoulder.

 Hartford Whalers
  Sent defenseman Steve Konroyd to Detroit for a sixth-round draft pick.
  Acquired left winger Robert Kron and a third-round draft pick from 
Vancouver for left winger Murray Craven and a fifth-round draft pick.
**
  The state of Connecticut will begin negotiations to buy the Civic Center 
from the city in an effort to keep the financially struggling Hartford 
Whalers franchise in the city.

 Los Angeles Kings
  Sent center John McIntyre to the New York Rangers for defenseman Mark 
Hardy and Ottawa's fifth-round 1993 draft pick.

 Minnesota North Stars
1-800-800-0435 if calling from the U.S.
1-800-800-0458 if calling from Canada
  The Dallas City Council has approved an agreement with the Minnesota 
North Stars that will bring the NHL club to Reunion Arena next season.
  Defenseman Mark Tinordi, captain of the North Stars, will be sidelined 
the rest of the season, including any postseason games the North Stars 
might play, because of a broken collarbone.
  Acquired defenseman Mark Osiecki from Winnipeg for ninth- and 10th-round 
draft picks in 1993.
  Added defenseman Travis Richards from the University of Minnesota.
  A former employee filed a sexual harassment suit against Minnesota North 
Star owner Norman Green. Karen (Kari) Dziedzic, Green's former executive 
assistant, claims Green often instructed her to wear cosmetics, described 
her outfits as "very hot" and "very sexy," once slapped her hand as she 
was about to eat and humiliated her by grabbing her hand and rubbing it 
through a client's hair.
  The Minnesota North Stars, who will move to Dallas after this season, 
announced that nearly 11,000 season ticket reservations have been made for 
their new home at Reunion Arena, which has a capacity of 16,800.
  The Met Center commission has told the Minnesota North Stars that it 
wants the club out - with its keys returned - at midnight after the last 
home game.  The club is moving to Dallas for next season.  The club must 
pay unpaid interest of $4,492.80 on the team's late rent payment for 1992, 
which was made earlier this month, and has been instructed not to take 
property such as the scoreboard and Zamboni ice-surfacing machine.
**
  Derian Hatcher's game-misconduct penalty was rescinded by the NHL, 
allowing the Minnesota defenseman to play in the North Stars' last two 
regular-season games.  Hatcher was given the penalty during a fight at the 
end of a loss at St. Louis on Sunday, April 11.  But the league didn't 
rescind the game-misconduct penalty Shane Churla received.  The Stars 
recalled center Cal McGowan from their top minor league club in Kalamazoo, 
Mich., to replace Churla.

 Montreal Canadiens
  Acquired defenseman Rob Ramage from Tampa Bay for minor league 
defensemen Eric Charron and Alain Cote and future considerations.

 New Jersey Devils
**
  Bernie Nicholls publicly apologized for his criticism of referee Denis 
Morel after the Devils' 5-2 loss to the Buffalo Sabres.  Nicholls was 
ejected by Morel for being the third man in on a fight late in the second 
period of that game and afterward Nicholls called Morel "a homer" and "an 
embarrassment to the referee's association."

 New York Islanders
  Traded right wing Daniel Marois to Boston for a conditional draft 
choice.

 New York Rangers
  Obtained forward Esa Tikkanen from Edmonton for center Doug Weight.
  Acquired left winger Mike Hartman from Tampa Bay 
  Acquired center John McIntyre from Los Angeles for defenseman Mark Hardy 
and Ottawa's fifth-round 1993 draft pick.
  Defenseman Brian Leetch will undergo additional surgery on the right 
ankle he broke in a non-skating fall and is not expected to play again 
this season. Leetch suffered the broken ankle March 19 following a victory 
over San Jose. The team said he slipped on an icy patch of pavement as he 
was getting out of a taxi cab in front of his apartment.
**
  Announced that defenseman James Patrick will require surgery on a 
herniated disc in his back and will not play again this season.
**
  Returned goaltender Corey Hirsch to Binghamton of the American Hockey 
League.

 Ottawa Senators
        The Ottawa Senators received the go-ahead to build the 18,500-seat 
Palladium on the proposed location in nearby Kanata, Ont.  The projected 
cost is C$150 million. Construction will be postponed until the 1995-96 
season, one year behind schedule.
  The Ottawa Senators lost their 37th consecutive NHL road game to tie the 
1974-75 Washington Capitals for most road losses in a row.
**
  Assigned left wing Martin St. Amour to New Haven of the American Hockey 
League.

 Philadelphia Flyers
  The opening date of Spectrum II has been pushed back to fall 1995. 
Formal groundbreaking has been postponed indefinitely.
  Traded veteran right wing Greg Paslawski to the Calgary Flames for 
future considerations.

 Pittsburgh Penguins
  Traded left winger Bob Errey to Buffalo for defenseman Mike Ramsey.
  Reacquired defenseman Peter Taglianetti from Tampa Bay Lightning for a 
third-round 1993 draft choice.
**
  Revolutionary Comics of San Diego agreed to destroy all available copies 
of a Mario Lemieux comic book in a settlement with the Pittsburgh Penguins 
over a trademark infringement lawsuit.  The Penguins sued in February 
charging that the "Sport Stars Mario Lemieux" comic infringed on the 
team's logo and uniform, which are registered trademarks.

 Quebec Nordiques
1-800-463-3333

 St. Louis Blues
  St. Louis Blues center Ron Sutter will miss the rest of the season as a 
result of separating his right shoulder.

 San Jose Sharks
  The San Jose Sharks announced that ticket prices will increase by about 
30% for the 1993-94 season when they move from the Cow Palace into a new 
$155-million arena in San Jose.
**
  Recalled defenseman Tom Pederson from Kansas City of the International 
Hockey League.
**
  Reached agreement in principle with left wing Alexander Cherbayev.

 Tampa Bay Lightning
1-800-881-2639
        At least two investor groups are poised to build a sports arena in 
downtown Tampa if the delay-plagued company that holds a lease from the 
Tampa Bay Lightning bows out. Tampa Coliseum Inc. has a lease with the 
National Hockey League team to develop an entertainment and sports arena 
next to Tampa Stadium, but has been unable to raise enough money for the 
project.
  Sent left winger Mike Hartman to the New York Rangers for center Randy 
Gilhen.
  Sent defenseman Peter Taglianetti to Pittsburgh for a third-round 1993 
draft choice.
  Sent defenseman Rob Ramage to the Montreal Canadiens for minor league 
defensemen Eric Charron and Alain Cote and future considerations.
**
  Manon Rheaume's first starting appearance in goal for the Atlanta 
Knights was impressive enough for her coach to say she has a chance to be 
a backup goalie for another minor league team next season. Rheaume, the 
first female to play professional hockey, stopped 25 shots and gave up six 
goals against the Cincinnati Cyclones on Saturday night, April 10. After 
the game, her coach, Gene Ubriaco, said Rheaume performed well enough to 
compete for the No. 2 goalie spot with the Louisville IceHawks of the East 
Coast Hockey League next season. The Knights and the IceHawks are minor 
league clubs of the Tampa Bay Lightning.
**
  As their first season comes to a close, there are rumors swirling that 
the Tampa Bay Lightning just might become the Atlanta Lightning.  Or the 
Minnesota Lightning.  But they are just rumors, according to Lightning 
general manager Phil Esposito.  ESPN reported on Sunday, April 11, that 
the Lightning, who have been playing in 10,400-seat Expo Hall, are 
exploring opportunities to move to either Atlanta or Minneapolis.  But 
Esposito said there was no truth to the report.  "We were disappointed 
with ESPN's irresponsible comment," Esposito said.  "There is just no 
substance to the rumor." Rumors have been swirling for the past two years 
regarding a move by Tampa Bay, which is presently discussing plans to 
build a new arena.

 Toronto Maple Leafs
**
  Defenseman Matt Martin, who helped Maine win the 1993 NCAA hockey 
championship, gave up his final year of eligibility and signed a contract 
with the Toronto Maple Leafs.

 Vancouver Canucks
       The Vancouver Canucks have cleared the last hurdle in their effort 
to build a new stadium. Vancouver council has given the green light for 
the 100 million dollar complex. It will seat 20 thousand people and will 
have an adjoining office tower. It will be built between the viaducts near 
B.C. Place in Vancouver. Site preparation will begin this summer, with a 
completion date of Fall 1995.
  Traded left winger Robert Kron and a third-round draft pick to Hartford 
for left winger Murray Craven and a fifth-round draft pick.
  Obtained defenseman Dan Ratushny from Winnipeg for a ninth-round draft 
pick.
**
  Signed right wing Brian Loney to a multi-year contract and assigned him 
to Hamilton of American Hockey League (AHL).

 Washington Capitals
(301) 808-CAPS
  Traded goaltender Jim Hrivnak and future considerations to Winnipeg for 
goaltender Rick Tabaracci.

 Winnipeg Jets
        Winnipeg Jets have been allowed economic assistance in order to 
keep them in the Smythe division as a result of expansion.
  Sent defenseman Mark Osiecki to Minnesota for ninth- and 10th-round 
draft picks in 1993.
  Sent goaltender Rick Tabaracci to Washington for Jim Hrivnak and future 
considerations.
  Sent defenseman Dan Ratushny to Vancouver for a ninth-round draft pick.
  Winnipeg's Teemu Selanne broke the NHL's rookie points record. The Jets 
rookie tied the record of 109 points, set by Peter Stastny with Quebec 
(1980-81), with a goal, his 66th of the season, and moved ahead on an 
assist in a 5-4 loss to Toronto.
**
  The Fort Wayne Komets said they have been told by Winnipeg that the Jets 
will keep a minor league affiliation with Moncton of the American Hockey 
League. There have been reports the Jets would move players from Moncton 
to Fort Wayne next season.

-----

- Expansion news:

  The National Hockey League announced that the expansion Anaheim and 
South Florida franchises will join the league for the 1993- 1994 season.

        Disney and National Hockey League officials announced Monday, 
March 1, that the Mighty Ducks of Anaheim, Disney's expansion team, will 
take to the ice next fall. Michael Eisner, chairman and chief executive 
officer of the Walt Disney Co., said the Mighty Ducks will play at the 
Pond, the new Anaheim sports arena, near Disney's flagship theme park. The 
arena is under construction and will be completed in June. The Pond seats 
17,350. The team still must meet the league's requirement that it sell at 
least 10,000 season tickets for the final grant of NHL membership.

        Anaheim named Jack Ferreira general manager and Pierre Gauthier 
assistant general manager.
**
  Veteran NHL scout Al Godfrey has been hired as the Midwest regional 
scout for the Anaheim Mighty Ducks.

        Philadelphia Flyers' senior vice president Bobby Clarke was named 
Monday, March 1, to the post of general manager for Miami's NHL expansion 
team. Franchise owner H. Wayne Huizenga made the announcement at the Miami 
Arena, three months after being awarded a franchise. Huizenga said he 
plans to have a team on the ice in time for the beginning of the NHL 
season in October.

-----

- Realignment:

Eastern Conference

Atlantic Division

Washington Capitals, New Jersey Devils, New York Islanders, New York 
Rangers, Philadelphia Flyers, South Florida, Tampa Bay Lightning

Northeast Division

Boston Bruins, Buffalo Sabres, Hartford Whalers, Montreal Canadiens, 
Ottawa Senators, Pittsburgh Penguins, Quebec Nordiques

Western Conference

Central Division

Chicago Blackhawks, Dallas Stars, Detroit Red Wings, St. Louis Blues, 
Toronto Maple Leafs, Winnipeg Jets

Pacific Division

Anaheim Mighty Ducks, Calgary Flames, Edmonton Oilers, Los Angeles Kings, 
San Jose Sharks, Vancouver Canucks

  Schedule: Eastern Conference teams will play five games against each of 
six divisional opponents (30); four games against each of the seven teams 
in the conference's other division (28) and two games against each of the 
12 Western Conference members (24).

Western Conference teams will play six games against each of five 
divisional opponents (30); four games against each of the six teams in the 
conference's other division (24) and two games against each of the 14 
Eastern Conference clubs (28).

  Playoffs: The system will be conference-based, with the No. 1 team 
meeting the No. 8 team in the first round, No. 2 vs. No. 7, No. 3 vs. No. 
6 and No. 4 vs. No. 5. Matchups will be based on overall points with the 
four division champions being placed in the first- or second-place seeds 
in each conference and being assured of home-ice in the first two playoff 
rounds. All series will be best of seven (2-2-1-1-1 rotation) except 
matchups between Central and Pacific teams.  Those series will rotate 2-3-
2 to reduce travel.  In those cases, the team with the most regular-season 
points will choose whether to start the series at home or away.

-----

- Draft news:

        Under terms of the new expansion draft, which will be held in 
June, each of the 24 existing clubs will be allowed to protect one 
goaltender, five defensemen and nine forwards. The most recent expansion 
drafts allowed teams to protect two goalies and did not make a distinction 
between forwards and defensemen.
        First-year pros only will be exempt from the draft, which is down 
from the two-year exemption teams had last season. San Jose, Tampa Bay and 
Ottawa still will be allowed to exempt second-year pros.
        Each of the 24 teams will lose two players, with a maximum loss of 
one goaltender and a maximum loss of one defenseman. The one exception is 
that a team which loses a goaltender can then no longer lose a defenseman.
        At the end of the first phase of the draft, the two new franchises 
will have three goaltenders, eight defensemen and 13 forwards for a total 
of 24 players. A second phase then will be conducted where San Jose, Tampa 
Bay and Ottawa will select two players each from the rosters of the two 
new teams.
        Ottawa, Tampa Bay and San Jose will be guaranteed priority 
drafting selection in the 1993 draft as long as they have the three worst 
records. Anaheim and Miami will choose no lower than fourth and fifth. The 
expansion franchises will move up in the draft should either San Jose, 
Tampa Bay or Ottawa not finish in the bottom three positions.
        The two new teams will pick first and second in the 1994 Entry 
Draft, regardless of their finish in 1993-94. Should either of the two new 
teams not play next season they would have priority drafting position in 
1994.

        The owners announced the 1994 draft will be in Hartford and the 
1995 draft in Winnipeg. The 1994 draft was scheduled for Boston, but a 
delay in the construction of a new arena required the draft be moved.

-----
 
- League news:

Disputes:

  The NHL owners and players have resolved differences over salary 
arbitration procedures, clearing the way for about 40 hearings.  NHLPA 
executive director Bob Goodenow didn't disclose how the issues were 
resolved, but the prior sticking point had been the manner in which 
statistics were used in arbitration hearings.

Olympics:

  The NHL announced February 26, 1993, it will not make professional 
players available to compete in the 1994 Winter Olympics.

League Leadership:

        Los Angeles Kings owner Bruce McNall succeeded Blackhawks owner 
Bill Wirtz as chairman of the NHL's powerful Board of Governors. Appointed 
to join McNall on the Executive Committee were Ron Corey of the Montreal 
Canadiens, Mike Ilitch of the Detroit Red Wings, Peter Pocklington of the 
Edmonton Oilers and Ed Snider of the Philadelphia Flyers.

        Gary Bettman, vice president and general counsel of the National 
Basketball Association, was named commissioner of the National Hockey 
League, Friday, December 11, 1992.

Miscellaneous:

        Henri Richard, Bernie Parent and Billy Smith have been named 
special ambassadors for the Stanley Cup Centennial, a season-long 
celebration of the NHL championship trophy. The trio will appear at 
league-wide function such as the All-Star Game and Stanley Cup playoffs.

        The National Hockey League named John N. Turner, former Prime 
Minister of Canada, to serve on Board of Directors of Hockey Hall of Fame 
and Museum and nominated Scotty Morrison, David M. Taylor, Larry Bertuzzi, 
Robert G. Bundy, Walter Bush, Murray Costello, Jim Gregory, Leslie Kaplan, 
Lawrence G. Meyer and Alan Tonks to serve on Board, which takes office 
March 30.

  NHL President Gil Stein was one of four individuals elected to the 
Hockey Hall of Fame Builder's category. The others were Buffalo Sabres' 
Chairman of the Board and President Seymour Knox III, Vancouver Canucks' 
Chairman Frank Griffiths and veteran Canadian hockey executive Fred Page. 
Former NHL linesman John D'Amico was selected in the Hall of Fame's 
Referee-Linesman category.

-----
 
- NHL TV

 Games are carried on TSN and CBC in Canada, on ESPN in the U.S.  Check 
your local listings.

        The National Hockey League has struck a conditional five-year deal 
with ESPN to televise professional hockey through the 1996-97 season.
        The series of agreements grants ESPN exclusive national coverage 
of the NHL starting with the 1992-93 season, and the cable network has an 
option to extend the term of that domestic agreement for four more years. 
The deal also grants ESPN exclusive international television distribution, 
excluding Canada, for the next five years.
        The league's new TV contract calls for ESPN to televise up to 25 
regular-season games to its domestic audience this coming season and 37 
playoff games, including the entire Stanley Cup Final. The majority of 
ESPN's regular-season games will be televised on Friday nights.

        NHL Commissioner Gary Bettman announced Wednesday, March 3, that 
ABC Sports will televise five Stanley Cup playoff games starting next 
month. ABC will carry the playoff games on its network through an 
arrangement with ESPN, the U.S. rightsholder for NHL games. ESPN will 
provide the production of the games. ABC owns ESPN.
  April 18 - Wales Conference Game #1 Quarterfinals
  April 25 - Campbell Conference Game #4 Quarterfinals
  May 2 - Wales Conference Game #1 Semifinals
  May 9 - Campbell Conference Game #4 Semifinals
  May 16 - Wales Conference Game #1 Finals

-----
 
- Award winners, all-star teams, hall of fame inductees, and draft picks
 
 91-92 Award Winners:
 Hart Trophy (MVP): Mark Messier (NYR)
 Vezina Trophy (best goalie): Patrick Roy (Mon)
 Norris Trophy (best defenseman): Brian Leetch (NYR)
 Calder Trophy (best rookie): Pavel Bure (Van)
 Selke Trophy (best defensive forward): Guy Carbonneau (Mon)
 Lady Byng Trophy (sportsmanship): Wayne Gretzky (LA)
 Jack Adams Award (best coach): Pat Quinn (Van)
 Bill Masterton Memorial Trophy (perseverance): Mark Fitzpatrick (NYI)
 King Clancy Trophy (contribution to community): Ray Bourque (Bos)
 Jennings Trophy (lowest team GAA): Patrick Roy (Mon)
 Art Ross Trophy (most scoring points): Mario Lemieux (Pit)

        Hall of Famer players Frank Boucher and Red Dutton and executives 
Bruce McNall and Gil Stein Thursday were named the 1993 winners of the 
Lester Patrick Award for ``outstanding service to hockey in the United 
States''. The award is selected each year by a committee representing a 
wide cross-section of the hockey community.

 91-92 1st All-Star Team: Patrick Roy (G, Mon), Ray Bourque (D, Bos), 
Brian Leetch (D, NYR), Mark Messier (C, NYR), Brett Hull (RW, StL), Kevin 
Stevens (LW, Pit)

 92-93 All-Star Game Starters (as voted by fans):
Wales Conference: Mario Lemieux (C, Pittsburgh), Jaromir Jagr (W, 
Pittsburgh), Kevin Stevens (W, Pittsburgh), Ray Bourque (D, Boston), Brian 
Leetch (D, Rangers), Patrick Roy, (G, Montreal).
Campbell Conference: Steve Yzerman (C, Detroit), Brett Hull (W, St. 
Louis), Pavel Bure (W, Vancouver), Chris Chelios (D, Chicago), Paul Coffey 
(D, Los Angeles), Ed Belfour (G, Chicago)

 91-92 All-rookie team: Gilbert Dionne (LW, Mon), Tony Amonte (RW, NYR), 
Kevin Todd (C, NJ), Vladimir Konstantinov (D, Det), Nicklas Lidstrom (D, 
Det), Dominik Hasek (G, Chi).

 1992 Hall of Fame Inductees: Marcel Dionne, Bob Gainey, Lanny McDonald, 
and Woody Dumart.

 First round of the 1992 entry draft:
  # Player (pos, team)
  1 Roman Hamrlik (D, TB)
  2 Alexei Yashin (C, Ott)
  3 Mike Rathje (D, SJ)
  4 Todd Warriner (LW, Que)
  5 Darius Kasparaitis (D, NYI)
  6 Cory Stillman (C, Cal)
  7 Ryan Sittler (LW, Phi)
  8 Brandon Convery (C, Tor)
  9 Robert Petrovicky (C, Har)
 10 Andrei Nazarov (LW, SJ)
 11 David Cooper (D, Buf)
 12 Sergei Krivokrasov (LW, Chi)
 13 Joe Hulbig (LW, Edm)
 14 Sergei Gonchar (D, Was)
 15 Jason Bowen (LW, Phi)
 16 Dmitri Kvartalnov (LW, Bos)
 17 Sergei Bautin (D, Win)
 18 Jason Smith (D, NJ)
 19 Martin Straka (C, Pit)
 20 David Wilkie (D, Mon)
 21 Libor Polasek (C, Van)
 22 Curtis Bowen (LW, Det)
 23 Grant Marshall (RW, Tor)
 24 Peter Ferraro (C, NYR)

-----

- New NHL Rules

 Game ejection for instigating a fight.
 Helmets are optional.
 Grabbing an opponent's stick as a defensive move is a penalty.
 Diving to draw a penalty is a penalty.
 Coincidental minors when both teams are full-strength result in 4 vs. 4 
play.
 High sticking is from the waist up.

 - New CBA - ratified by NHLPA on 4/11/92
 
 Term: September 16, 1991 to September 15, 1993.
 
 Licensing and endorsements: Players own exclusive rights to their 
individual personality, including their likenesses.
 
 Salary arbitration: New rules negotiated; 8 salary arbitrators to be 
jointly agreed upon.
 
 Free agency: Compensation scale reduced for players age 30 and under. 
Group III free agent age reduced to 30 from 31. A player who has completed 
10 or more professional seasons (minor or NHL) and who in last year of 
contract didn't earn more than the average NHL salary, can elect once in 
his career to become an unrestricted free agent at the end of his 
contract.
 
 Salary and awards: Players' playoff fund increased to $7.5M in 1991-92 & 
$9M in 92-93. New minimum salary of $100,000.
 
 Insurance: $200,000 disability coverage. Dental & broad-based medical 
improvements. 100% increase in life insurance for players; coverage for 
wives.
 
 Pension: Improved pension contributions of $8000 to $12500 per player per 
year, depending on the player's number of NHL games. Agreement on language 
to guarantee continuation of Security Plan negotiated in 1986.
 
 Regular season: Increased from 80 to 84 games in 92-93. For 2 games 
played at neutral sites, all arrangements and revenues to be shared.
 
 Rosters: Kept at 18 skaters and 2 goaltenders for 92-93.
 
 Entry draft: Reduced to 11 rounds from 12.
 
 Supplemental draft: One selection for each non-playoff team.
 
 Joint study group: Examine financial state of NHL & issue report to 
assist in preparing for 1993 negotiations

-----
 
 NHL free agency categories (effective until 9/15/93)

 Group I:
  - players aged 24 and under
  - player's choice of player equalization or draft pick compensation
  - for compensation, old club has right to match offer from new club
  - for equalization, old club has no right to match offer
  - equalization, which can consist of players, draft picks, and/or cash,
    must be agreed upon between two clubs or submitted to arbitration

 Group II:
  - players aged 25 to 29
  - player's choice of player equalization or draft pick compensation
  - for equalization, old club has right to match offer only if it is
    at least $351,000
  - for compensation, schedule is:
    one first round pick if player signs for $350,000-$500,000/year
    two first round picks if player signs for $500,000-$1 million/year
    extra first round pick for each additional $1M over $1M/year

 Group III:
  - players aged 30 and over
  - old club gets no compensation, but has right to match offer
  - to receive right to match, old club must make qualifying offer of 15%
    over player's salary in prior season

 Group IV:
  - players considered defected free agents

 Group V:
  - player with 10 years of experience whose salary is below NHL average
    can choose to be a free agent without compensation once in his career.
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
2. NHL Minor Leagues

 The NHL minor leagues are the International Hockey League, the American 
Hockey League and the East Coast Hockey League.  Information on the 
Central Hockey League and the American Hockey Association can be found in 
section 4.

-----
 
 IHL
 
 contacts:
  IHL: Rob Springall <rgs7077@ultb.isc.rit.edu>
  Atlanta Knights: Scott Clarkson <gt3394c@prism.gatech.edu>
  Cincinnati Cyclones: Joseph Combs <jgcombs@uceng.UC.EDU>
  Cleveland Lumberjacks: Rob Gasser <CSRAG@uoft02.utoledo.edu>
  Ft. Wayne Komets: Rob Gasser <CSRAG@uoft02.utoledo.edu>
**
  Milwaukee Admirals: Jason Hanson <jason@studsys.mscs.mu.edu>
  Salt Lake Golden Eagles: Roland Behunin <behunin@logdis1.oo.aflc.af.mil>

  The International Hockey League has granted a franchise to a Las Vegas 
group headed by Henry Stickney for the 1993-1994 season.

**
        The International Hockey League named Bob Chase. voice of the Fort 
Wayne Komets, as the league's broadcaster of the year. The IHL also said 
the annual award, effective next year, will be named in Chase's honor.
        Also honored by the IHL were Jim Loria of the Kansas City Blades 
as marketing director of the year, Shelly Gartner of the Phoenix 
Roadrunners as merchandise manager of the year and Steve Doherty of the 
Kalamazoo Wings as public relations director of the year.

**
        The Atlanta Knights of the International Hockey League announced 
Thursday, April 8, that Manon Rheaume will be the starting goaltender in a 
home game Saturday night, April 10, against the Cincinnati Cyclones. 
Rheaume will become the first female to start in a regular season 
professional hockey game.

**
Fort Wayne -- Announced winger Scott Gruhl will retire at the end of the 
International Hockey League season. Gruhl will join the Muskegon Fury of 
the Colonial League.
**
  The Fort Wayne Komets said they have been told by Winnipeg that the Jets 
will keep a minor league affiliation with Moncton of the American Hockey 
League. There have been reports the Jets would move players from Moncton 
to Fort Wayne next season.

**
  The San Diego Gulls of the International Hockey League set a record with 
their 61st victory, 5-1, over the Salt Lake Golden Eagles. The Gulls (61-
11-8) became the first team in professional hockey to win that many games 
in a season. The 1976-77 Montreal Canadiens won 60 games.

  IHL's 1992 Turner Cup: The Kansas City Blades defeated Muskegon 
Lumberjacks 4 games to 0.

-----
 
 AHL

 contacts:
  AHL: Rob Springall <rgs7077@ultb.isc.rit.edu>
       Bri Farenell <farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu>
       Mark Anania <ananim@rpi.edu>

See Section 5 for newsletter information.

 Atlantic Division: Cape Breton, Fredericton, Halifax, Moncton, St. John's
 Northern Division: Adirondack, Capital District, Providence, New Haven, 
Springfield
 Southern Division: Baltimore, Binghamton, Hershey, Rochester, Utica, 
Hamilton

       The New Haven Senators have been sold by Peter Shipman to the 
Ottawa Senators NHL organization. They are the only Canadian NHL team with 
an American AHL affiliate, and have made it clear they intend to move the 
team to somewhere in the Canadian Atlantic Provinces. This sale and move 
has yet to be approved by the AHL head office, but is expected to pass 
easily at the general meeting in May.
  The Baltimore Skipjacks, the Washington Capitals' American Hockey League 
affliate, will skate next season as the Portland Pirates.
  The Calgary Flames will base their farm team in the AHL in St. John, New 
Brunswick next season.  The team will be called the St. John Blue Flames.
**
  The Fort Wayne Komets of the IHL said they have been told by Winnipeg of 
the NHL that the Jets will keep a minor league affiliation with Moncton of 
the American Hockey League. There have been reports the Jets would move 
players from Moncton to Fort Wayne next season.

  AHL's 1992 Calder Cup: The Adirondack Red Wings beat the St. John's 
Maple Leafs 4 games to 3. The home-ice curse held true as all games in the 
final were won by the visiting team. 
  John Anderson (New Haven) is 1992 winner of Les Cunningham Plaque as AHL 
MVP.
 
-----
 
 ECHL

contacts:
  ECHL, Toledo Storm: Rob Gasser <CSRAG@uoft02.utoledo.edu>

        The Toledo Storm hockey team is asking SeaGate Convention Center 
to consider becoming its host site beginning with the 1994-95 season. The 
Storm, which has played its last two seasons in the Toledo Sports Arena, 
said it asked for 55 dates in the downtown facility. The Storm also has 
been talking with backers of a proposed ice complex in suburban Sylvania 
to become a primary tenant.

 ECHL's 1992 Riley Cup: Hampton Roads beat Louisville 4 games to 0.

See Section 5 for newsletter information.

-----
 
 Minor League Affiliates for NHL teams:
 
 Bos: Providence Bruins (AHL), Johnstown Chiefs (ECHL)
 Buf: Rochester Americans (AHL), Erie Panthers (ECHL)
 Cal: Salt Lake Golden Eagles (IHL), Roanoke Valley Rebels (ECHL)
 Chi: Indianapolis Ice (IHL), Columbus Chill (ECHL), St. Thomas (Col. HL)
 Det: Adirondack Red Wings (AHL), Toledo Storm (ECHL)
 Edm: Cape Breton Oilers (AHL), Winston-Salem Thunderbirds (ECHL)
 Har: Springfield Indians (AHL), Louisville Icehawks (ECHL)
 LA : Phoenix Roadrunners (IHL), Raleigh Icecaps (ECHL)
 Min: Kalamazoo Wings (IHL), Dayton Bombers (ECHL)
 Mon: Fredericton Canadiens (AHL), Winston-Salem Thunderbirds (ECHL), 
Flint (Col. HL)
 NJ : Utica Devils (AHL), Birmingham Bulls (ECHL)
 NYI: Capital District Islanders (AHL), Richmond Renegades (ECHL)
 NYR: Binghamton Rangers (AHL)
 Ott: New Haven Senators (AHL), Thunder Bay (Col. HL)
 Phi: Hershey Bears (AHL)
 Pit: Cleveland Lumberjacks (IHL), Knoxville Cherokees (ECHL)
 Que: Halifax Citadels (AHL), Greensboro Monarchs (ECHL)
 SJ : Kansas City Blades (IHL), Nashville Knights (ECHL)
 StL: Peoria Rivermen (IHL), Dayton Bombers (ECHL), Flint (Col. HL)
 TB : Atlanta Knights (IHL)
 Tor: St. John's Maple Leafs (AHL), Raleigh Icecaps (ECHL), Brantford 
(Col. HL)
 Van: Columbus Chill (ECHL), Hamilton Canucks (AHL)
 Was: Baltimore Skipjacks (AHL), Hampton Roads Admirals (ECHL)
 Win: Moncton Hawks (AHL), Thunder Bay (Col. HL)
 
 Ind: Cincinnati Cyclones (IHL)
      Fort Wayne Komets (IHL)
      Michigan Falcons (Colonial HL)
      Milwaukee Admirals (IHL)
      San Diego Gulls (IHL)
      St. Thomas (Colonial HL)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
3. College Hockey
 
contacts:
  NCAA: Mike Machnik <nin15b34@merrimack.edu>
  Wisconsin Badgers: Jeff Horvath <horvath@cs.wisc.edu>
  CCHA, Bowling Green State: Keith Instone <instone@euclid.bgsu.edu>
  ECAC, Clarkson: Bri Farenell <farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu>

- e-mail lists:
 Wayne Smith <wts@maine.maine.edu> maintains 2 lists, one for discussions 
(HOCKEY-L) and one for news (HOCKEY-D):
 
 send e-mail to <listserv@maine.maine.edu> with body:
 SUBSCRIBE HOCKEY-L <name & favorite team>
 or
 SUBSCRIBE HOCKEY-D <name>
   (a read-only list containing news from HOCKEY-L)

Up-to-date Division I standings and scores can be obtained through the 
archives of the College Hockey Mailing List.  Send a message to the server 
at listserv@maine.maine.edu with the body containing ONLY the commands 
(either or both)

 - ftp site: andy.bgsu.edu
  The directory "pub/Hockey" contains CCHA press releases, scores, 
standings, and rosters. The sub-directory "Archives" has archives of the 
Division I college hockey mailing list since 1989. Also, archives from the 
Division III list since May 1992 are available.

  NCAA hockey championship:
Semi-finals:  Maine 4, Michigan 3 (OT)
              Lake Superior State 6, Boston University 1
Finals:  Maine 5, Lake Superior State 4

  Freshman Paul Kariya who was named winner of the 1992-93 Hobey Baker 
Award as college hockey's top player.

**
  The NCAA Division I Hockey Championships will be held at the St. Paul 
Civic Center in St. Paul, Minnesota, on March 31 and April 2, 1994.
  For priority seating call the University of Minnesota Ticket Office at 
(612) 624-8080, between 8:00 a.m. and 5:00 p.m., Monday through Friday or 
send a postcard to:

University of Minnesota Ticket Office
1994 NCAA Hockey Championships
516 15th Avenue SE
Minneapolis  MN  55455

- NCAA Division I Teams
 
 CCHA (Central Collegiate Hockey Association):
Bowling Green, Ferris State, Illinois-Chicago, Lake Superior, Miami, 
Michigan, Michigan State, Ohio State, Western Michigan, Notre Dame, Kent 
State, Alaska-Fairbanks (affiliate member )
 
        CCHA Playoff structure:  The top 6 will host the bottom 6 (1 vs 
12, 2 vs 11, etc) in a two-of-three weekend series The six winners will 
advance to Joe Louis Arena for single elimination the rest of the way. The 
top 2 remaining seeds get a bye while 3 plays 6 and 4 plays 5 on the first 
night. On the second night, the 4 remaining teams battle it out, leaving 
only two to play for the championship, on the third night. Alaska-
Fairbanks, as an affiliate member, will be seeded from #7 to #12 by the 
league office.

 ECAC (Eastern College Athletic Conference) (men's):
Brown, Clarkson, Colgate, Cornell, Dartmouth, Harvard, Princeton, RPI, St. 
Lawrence, Union, Vermont, Yale

 ECAC (Eastern College Athletic Conference) (women's):
Brown, Colby, Cornell, Dartmouth, Harvard, New Hampshire, Northeastern, 
Princeton, Providence, Rochester Institute of Technology, St. Lawrence, 
Yale

        The Eastern Collegiate Athletic Conference unveiled the nation's 
first intercollegiate women's ice hockey league and announced the 12 teams 
will begin play in the 1993-94 season. The top eight finishers in the ECAC 
Women's Ice Hockey League will qualify for a post-season tournament. The 
league replaces an informal 15-team conference of nine Division I and six 
Division III schools, which held their own respective division tournaments 
at the end of the regular season. The ECAC said it would discontinue its 
Division III women's tournament after the 1992-93 season.

 Hockey East:
Boston College, Boston University, UMass-Lowell, Maine, Merrimack, New 
Hampshire, Northeastern, Providence
 
 WCHA (Western Collegiate Hockey Association):
Colorado College, Denver, Michigan Tech, Minnesota, Minnesota-Duluth, 
North Dakota, Northern Michigan, St Cloud, Wisconsin
 
Alaska-Anchorage has joined the WCHA as a full-fledged member for 93-94
 
 Independents:
Air Force, Alabama-Huntsville, Alaska-Anchorage, Alaska-Fairbanks, Army

-----

 - Canadian Intercollegiate Athletic Union

 CIAU Championships:
 Finalists:
 Team:                                         Division:
 University of Alberta Golden Bears            West
 University of Guelph Gryphons                 Ontario West
 University of Toronto Varsity Blues           Ontario East
 University of Acadia Axemen                   East

 Semi-finals:  Acadia 9, Alberta 4
               Toronto 3, Guelph  2
 Finals:  Acadia 12, Toronto 1

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
4. Other Hockey Leagues
 
 - 1992 World Championships in Czechoslovakia
 
 Sweden defeated Finland 5-2 (gold medal match)
 Czechoslovakia defeated Switzerland 5-2 (bronze medal match)
 
 Final Standings (round robin):
 
 GROUP A   W T L  GF GA Pts   GROUP B  W T L  GF GA PTS
 Finland   5 0 0  32  8  10   Russia   4 1 0  23 10   9
 Germany   4 0 1  30 14   8   Czech    4 0 1  18  7   8
 USA       2 1 2  14 15   5   Switz    2 2 1  12 11   6
 Sweden    1 2 2  14 12   4   Canada   2 1 2  15 18   5
 Italy     1 1 3  10 18   3   Norway   1 0 4   8 16   2
 Poland    0 0 5   8 41   0   France   0 0 5   8 22   0
 
 Austria will replace Poland in Pool A of 1993 WC in Germany
 
  The 1993 World Championships (Pool A) is scheduled to run from Apr 18 to 
May 2 in Munich, Germany.

-----
**
 - 1993 World Championships (Pool B) in Eindhoven, the Netherlands

                    #g    w l t    pts      gf    ga
1. Great Britain     7    7 0 0    14       50    13
2. Poland            7    6 1 0    12       71    12
3. Netherlands       7    5 2 0    10       47    20
4. Denmark           7    4 3 0     8       38    24
5. Japan             7    3 4 0     6       34    31
6. Romania           7    2 5 0     4       20    44
7. China             7    1 6 0     2       12    79
8. Bulgaria          7    0 7 0     0        9    58

Great Britain advances to Pool A.  Bulgaria is relegated to Pool C.

-----
 
 - 1992 Olympic Games
**
- e-mail lists:
 Charlie Slavin <slavin@maine.maine.edu> maintains OlymPuck - The Olympic 
Hockey Discussion List:
 
 send e-mail to <listserv@maine.maine.edu> with body:
SUBSCRIBE   OlymPuck   your_name   favorite country(ies)

 CIS won the gold, Canada the silver, and Czechoslovakia the bronze 
(defeated USA).
 
 Yale hockey coach Tim Taylor was named coach for the '94 US Olympic Team.
 
 Dany Dube from the UQTR Patriotes (CIAU) and Tom Renney from the Kamloops 
Blazers (WHL) are co-coaches of Canada's national program.

     The 1998 Nagano Winter Olympic Organizing Committee said it has 
approved the addition of women's ice hockey and curling to the list of 
official medal events at the Games.  The decision, which came at the 
organizing committee meeting here, followed an accord reached in Nagano 
between the committee and the IOC Coordination Committee.  The decision 
will be formally ratified by an Executive Board meeting of the 
International Olympic Committee (IOC) and its Session.  As a result, the 
number of total events at Nagano will increase to 64 in seven sports.

-----
 
- 1991 Canada Cup
 
 Team Canada defeated Team USA 2 games to 0.
 
-----

 - 1992 Izvestia hockey tournament

 Final:  Russia II - Czechoslovakia  2-1
 Game for 3rd and 4th place:  Russia I - Sweden  4-1
 Game for 5th and 6th place:  Finland - Switzerland  3-1
 Game for 7th and 8th place:  Canada - Germany  6-1

 Final Standings for the 25th Izvestia Cup:
  1. Russia II (the Russian Olympic team)
  2. Czechoslovakia
  3. Russia I
  4. Sweden
  5. Finland
  6. Switzerland
  7. Canada
  8. Germany

-----

- 1992 Germany Cup

        Russia defeated Team Canada 6-3 to win the $170,000 four-team 
Germany Cup for the third time. The Russian team, coached for the first 
time by the legendary Boris Michailov, assured itself of the $67,000 
winner's check after a 3-1 win over Czechoslovakia. The former Soviet 
Union and Commonwealth of Independent States captured the tournament in 
1988 and 1991 under Viktor Tikhonov.

-----

- 1992 Spengler Cup

        Canada, with Fabian Joseph scoring his second goal of the game at 
3:47 of overtime, beat Farjestad (Sweden) 6-5 in the final of the Spengler 
Cup at Davos, Switzerland. The Canadians overcame a two-goal deficit in 
the final two minutes of regulation and went on to earn their second 
overtime victory within 15 hours.

 Final:

 Team Canada - Farjestad (Sweden)  6-5 (1-1,2-2,2-2,1-0)  OT

-----

- 1992 European cup finals

Duesseldorf, December 30, 1992

Bronze:  Jokerit Helsinki - Lions Milano 4-2.

Gold:  Malmoe IF - Dynamo Moscow 4-3 (Shootout)

  This was the third successive European championship for a Swedish team: 
in 1990 and 1991 the champion was Djurgaarden (Stockholm).

-----

- 1993 Sweden Hockey Games
**
 Final Standings:

                     GP  W T L  GF-GA      P
 1. Sweden            3  2 0 1  13- 8  +5  4
 2. Czech Republic    3  2 0 1  16-11  +5  4
 3. Russia            3  1 1 1   9-11  -2  3
 4. Canada            3  0 1 2  13-21  -8  1

 Sweden wins due to head-to-head result vs the Czech republic.

-----
 
- Junior Leagues
 
 contact:
  WHL: Randy Coulman <coulman@skdad.usask.ca>
       Mitch McGowan <hamlet@u.washington.edu>

        The site for the 75th Memorial Cup Tournament has yet to be 
chosen.  It will be staged in Ontario but the exact location won't be 
determined until next spring.
        In March of '93, the two regular-season division champions from 
the Ontario Hockey League will meet in a best-of-seven series at the start 
of the playoff season.  The winner of the series earns the right to host 
the Memorial Cup, traditionally held in May.
        The eventual OHL champion will also participate in the tourney. 
But if the league champs also happen to be the club hosting the Memorial 
Cup, then the league finalists will advance as well."

 Charles Poulin (Mon draft) of St-Hyacinthe (QMJHL) is '92 Canadian Hockey 
League Player of the Year.
 
 1992 Memorial Cup at Seattle
 
 Round-robin standings              W  L  GF  GA
 Sault Ste. Marie Greyhounds (OHL)  3  0  14   8
 Kamloops Blazers (WHL)             2  1  10   7
 Seattle Thunderbirds (WHL host)    1  2   9  10
 Verdun College Francais (QMJHL)    0  3   5  13 
 
 Semifinal   Kamloops 8  Seattle 3
 Final       Kamloops 5  Sault Ste. Marie 4
 
-----

 - Central Hockey League
 
 contact:
  Marc Foster <mfoster@metgem.gcn.uoknor.edu>
              <mfoster@alliant.backbone.uoknor.edu>
  Ted Wollnik <twollnik@rdxsun11.aud.alcatel.com>

See Section 5 for newsletter information.

 CHL:
Fort Worth Fire, Wichita Thunder, Dallas Freeze, Tulsa Oilers, Memphis 
River Kings, Oklahoma City Blazers

  Six non-affiliated teams play a 60 game schedule extending from early 
November to mid March. Each team is owned by the league, with local 
interests controlling day to day operations. Each team has a $100,000 
salary cap for 17 total players (16 dress up). Unlike the ECHL, players 
are not limited to three years in the league.
  A Western Division may be added to the Central Hockey League for the 93-
94 season if the plans of CHL president Ray Miron materialize.  Miron 
confirmed that El Paso, Amarillo, Tuscon, and Albuquerque are cities under 
consideration for the Western Division, which would play some interlocking 
games with the Eastern Division.  Meanwhile, San Antonio and Houston are 
close to being confirmed as the league's newest members.

-----

 - Major League Hockey
 
        A new hockey league with franchises throughout the United States 
and Canada will begin play in the fallof 1993, officials announced 
Wednesday, February 10.
        Major League Hockey was founded by Roy Boe, former president of 
the New York Islanders of the National Hockey League and the New York/New 
Jersey Nets of the American and National Basketball associations.
        According to Boe, the league will debut with six to eight teams 
playing a schedule of approximately 80 games. Franchise applications have 
been received from groups in Chicago, Cleveland, Dallas, Denver, Detroit, 
Houston, Minneapolis-St. Paul, Phoenix, San Francisco, Saskatoon, Toronto 
and Worcester, Mass., Boe said.
        Although the league will not raid existing leagues to stock its 
rosters, Boe said it will seek the ``world's finest hockey players.''
        Boe said league play will have an international flair and 
discussed implementing some rules which are reminiscent of those of the 
IIHF.
        ``We're removing the red line, moving the goal nets forward and 
eliminating all tie games,'' said Boe.
        The MLH office will operate out of Stamford, Conn.

-----
 
- British Premier Division:
 
 contacts:
  Neil A. McGlynn: <nmcglynn@axion.bt.co.uk> (from NA)
                   <nmcglynn@uk.co.bt.axion> (from Europe)
  Steve Salvini: <steve@cs.hw.ac.uk>
 
 Contact Steve for the GB USENET draft.

 e-mail list: send e-mail to <uk-hockey-request@cee.hw.ac.uk> to 
subscribe.

 Durham Wasps defeated Nottingham Panthers 7-6 in '92 British championship 
game.
 
-----
 
- Finnish Elite League (SM-LIIGA):

 contacts:
  Juha Koivisto & Kimmo Kauranen  <hockey@tac.fi>
  Vesa J Pyyluoma <veikko@vipunen.hut.fi>

Final standings 91-92:
  1) Jokerit, Helsinki 2) JyP HT, Jyvaskyla  3) HIFK, Helsinki
  4) Assat, Pori       5) TPS, Turku         6) Lukko, Rauma
  7) KalPa, Kuopio     8) HPK, Hameenlinna   9) Ilves, Tampere
  10) Reipas, Lahti   11) Tappara, Tampere  12) JoKP, Joensuu
  JoKP dropped and Kiekko-Espoo from Espoo qualified to the SM-LIIGA

Individual stats leaders 91-92:
  Points:  Makela Mikko, TPS      25+45=70   (+ playoffs:  2+3=5 )
  Scoring: Selanne Teemu, Jokerit 39+23=62   (+ playoffs: 10+7=17)

All Stars 91-92:
  Briza Petr (Lukko),  Virta Hannu (TPS),  Laurila Harri (JyP HT),
  Makela Mikko (TPS),  Janecky Otakar (Jokerit),  Selanne Teemu (Jokerit)

-----
 
- German Hockey League:
 
 contact:
  Andreas Stockmeier <stocki@cs.tu-berlin.de> or <stocki@tub.UUCP>
 
 Duesseldorfer Eishockey-Gemeinschaft defeated SB Rosenheim in '92 German 
final

-----

 - Swedish Elite League (Elitserien):

 contact:
  Staffan Axelsson <etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se>

**
 1992-93 regular season final standings:
 1. Vasteras      2. Brynas        3. Malmo         4. Farjestad
 5. MoDo          6. Lulea         7. Leksand       8. Djurgarden
 9. HV 71        10. Rogle        11. Frolunda     12. AIK

 Brynas defeated Lulea 3 games to 2 for the 1993 Swedish hockey 
championship.

-----
 
 - Swiss First Division:

 Kloten became the 1992-93 champions of the Swiss League Nationale A
by beating Fribourg-Gotteron 4-2 to sweep the final series 3-0.

-----
 
 - 1992 Women's World Championships at Finland
  1 Canada, 2 USA, 3 Finland, 4 Sweden, 5 China, 6 Norway, 7 Denmark, 
  8 Switzerland
 
-----

 1993 World Junior Hockey Championships at Sweden

 Final Standings:

                   GP  W T L  GF-GA  +/-   P
 1. Canada          7  6 0 1  37-17  +20  12
 2. Sweden          7  6 0 1  53-15  +38  12
 3. Czechoslovakia  7  4 1 2  38-27  +11   9
 4. USA             7  4 0 3  32-23  + 9   8
 5. Finland         7  3 1 3  31-20  +11   7
 6. Russia          7  2 2 3  26-20  + 6   6
 7. Germany         7  1 0 6  16-37  -21   2
 8. Japan           7  0 0 7   9-83  -74   0

 Canada wins gold due to head-to-head result vs Sweden.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
5. Info available via e-mail

  When requesting items via e-mail please include your preferred address 
in the body of the message.  Sometimes the reply-to address is not a good 
thing to go by.

 - ftp site: wuarchive.wustl.edu (128.252.135.4)
        In directory /doc/misc/sports/nhl there are some new hockey files.
        Get the README file for information and contents.

---

 - E-mail lists:
 
 List Topic (Freq.)                      To Subscribe
 Boston Bruins                           bruins-request@cs.Usask.CA
     List Address                        bruins@cs.Usask.CA
 Buffalo Sabres                          sabres-request@potter.csh.rit.edu
     List Address                        sabres@potter.csh.rit.edu
 Los Angeles Kings                       kings-request@cs.stanford.edu
     List Address                        kings@cs.stanford.edu
**
 Montreal Canadiens                      habs-request@janus.sdsu.edu
     List Address                        habs@janus.sdsu.edu
 Philadelphia Flyers                     seth@hos1cad.att.com
 Pittsburgh Penguins                     gp2f+@andrew.cmu.edu
     List Address                        gp2f@andrew.cmu.edu
 St. Louis Blues                         jca2@cec1.wustl.edu
 San Jose Sharks                         sharks-request@medraut.apple.com
     List Address                        sharks@medraut.apple.com
 Tampa Bay Lightning                     wilson@cs.ucf.edu
 Vancouver Canucks                       boey@sfu.ca
     List Address                        vancouver-canucks@sfu.ca
 Washington Capitals                     david@eng.umd.edu
     List Address                        caps@monster.umd.edu
 NHL Boxscores (M-F)                     bks@cbnewsh.cb.att.com
 NHL Boxscores (S-S)                     jpc@philabs.philips.com
 NHL Goalie Stats (d)                    coulman@cs.Usask.CA
 NHL Scores (n)                          wilson@cs.ucf.edu
 NHL Team Stats (w)                      wilson@cs.ucf.edu
 AHL Newsletter                          ahl-news-request@hamlet.cmu.edu
     List Address                        ahl-news@hamlet.cmu.edu
 ECHL Newsletter                         echl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu
     List Address                        echl-news@andrew.cmu.edu
 US College Hockey                       (see section 3)
 NCAA Division III Hockey                hockey3-request@hooville.mitre.org
     List Address                        hockey3@request.mitre.org
 CHL Newsletter                          mfoster@geohub.gcn.uoknor.edu
 British League                          uk-hockey-request@uk.ac.hw.cs
**
Olympic Hockey                           (see section 4)

 Freq: M-F=Monday-Friday, S-S=Saturday-Sunday, d=daily, n=nightly, 
w=weekly
 
 If you have something interesting, make it available. When requesting, 
use the keyword in the body or subject. Also, specify team, date, etc., 
where applicable.
 
 Available from Eric Rickin <ab870@cleveland.freenet.edu>:
 Keyword    Description
 AHLADDR    AHL team addresses
 CANJUNIORS Canada junior teams
 NHLTV      TV stations for each team
 NHLRADIO   Radio stations for each team
 USJUNIORS  US junior teams
 XXXXDRAFT  XXXX (for XXXX=1989-1992) NHL Entry Draft
 1991EXP    1991 NHL Expansion & Dispersal Draft
 
 Available from Rob Springall <rgs7077@ultb.isc.rit.edu>:
 Keyword    Description
 AHL        Up-to-date info on the AHL
 IHL        Up-to-date info on the IHL
 NHL.C      A C program that prints the 91-92 NHL schedule for a specified 
            day
 
 Available from Stan Willis <willis@empire.dnet.hac.com>:
 Keyword    Description
 ATTEND     91-92 NHL team home attendance report by quarters
 PSLOGOS    NHL team logos in PostScript
 
 Available from David Anthony Wyatt <wyatt@ccu.umanitoba.ca>:
 Keyword    Description
 ALLLIST    All-time List of Professional Hockey Franchises
 
 Available from Roland Behunin <behunin@logdis1.oo.aflc.af.mil>:
 Keyword    Description
 SATINFO    Satellite info for NHL teams
 
 Available from Mike Machnik <nin15b34@merrimack.edu>:
 Keyword    Description
 DIV1SCHED  92-93 NCAA Division I scores
 Mike can also provide a schedule for any of the 46 Division I teams to 
people who ask.  E-mail him for details.

 Available from Bill Clare <Clare@Kodak.COM>:
 Keyword    Description
 RETIRED    List of retired numbers for NHL players
 
 Available from Staffan Axelsson <etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se>:
 Keyword    Description
 WCMEDALS   World Championships Medalists 1920-1992
 WCSTAND    World Championships All-Time Standings, Pool A 1920-1992
 WCALSTAR   World Championships All-Star Teams 1961-1992
 WCROSTXX   World Championships Gold Winning Teams' Rosters 1958-1992 
            (Specify XX=58-92)
 WJHC       History of medals given at the World Junior Hockey 
            Championships
 WJHCSTAT   Team and player stats from the World Junior Hockey 
            Championships.

 Available from Paul Brownlow <paul@data-io.com>:
 Keyword    Description
 CHLPOY     Past Canadian Hockey League players of the year
 MEMCUP     Past Memorial Cup winners

 Available from <wilson@cs.ucf.edu>:
 To use the statsmailer, send e-mail to "wilson@cs.ucf.edu" with subject 
"statsmailer" and a body containing the word HELP to receive a list of 
allowable commands. Things available: NHL team/league schedules/calendars, 
a plethora of team statistics, scores of games, and some assorted hockey 
files. Seasons 1988-1992 available. New material was added on 1/19/93.

 Available from Mitch McGowan <hamlet@u.washington.edu>
 Keyword    Description
 ROSTERS    1993 NHL All-Star Game rosters
 NHLLEAD    1991-92 NHL Leaders (Scoring, Goals, Assists, Power-play 
            goals, Short-handed goals, Game-winning goals, Shots, Goals-
            against average, Victories, Save percentage, Shutouts)
 ZAMBONI    Alan Thicke's "Book of Zamboni" opening from the 1991 NHL  
            Awards broadcast

 Available from Matt Militzok <mmilitzo@skidmore.edu>
 Keyword    Description
 STATS      Up-to-date NHL statistics

 Available from Harry Peltz <hbpeltz@mailbox.syr.edu>
 Keyword    Description
 SCORES     Compilation of NHL scores for the current month (in compressed 
and uuencoded format)
Dates can also be specified for specific box scores, but try not to 
request too many at one time (Max 5 box scores or three days).

 Available from Richard Stueven <gak@wrs.com>
 Keyword    Description
 DIRECT     Current NHL directory file

 Available from Michael Burger <mmb@lamar.colostate.edu>
 Keyword    Description
 TVINFO     TV/Radio stations for all teams along with network 
            information.

Up-to-date Division I standings and scores can be obtained through the 
archives of the College Hockey Mailing List.  Send a message to the server 
at listserv@maine.maine.edu with the body containing ONLY the commands 
(either or both)

GET 9293CONF STAND (for all Division I conference standings)
GET 9293COMP SCHEDULE (for a full-season listing of Division I scores)

The schedule is about 1000 lines long and the standings file is about 50 
lines.  These files are updated more-or-less weekly around Monday.  
Contact Mike Machnik (nin15b34@merrimack.edu) with any questions.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
6. USENET Hockey Pool
 
 send e-mail to <andrew@idacom.hp.com>.
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
 7. Up-coming Dates

 Apr 18 - May 2: The 1993 World Championships (Pool A), Munich, Germany.
 Jun 26: NHL entry draft, Quebec City, Quebec.
 Feb 12 - Feb 27, 1994: XVII Olympic Winter Games, Lillehammer, Norway.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
 8. Answers to some frequently asked questions:
 
 Q: Why are the Montreal Canadiens called the Habs?
 A: Most of the team during the 40-50's was made up of people who lived in 
and around Montreal. Hence they were called "Les Habitants" (natives of 
Montreal). This was then shortened to the Habs.
 
 Q: Why is the Montreal Canadiens logo a large C with an H within it?
 A: In 1914-15, the Canadiens logo consisted of C with an A within it to 
signify Club Athletique Canadien (CAC). The next year, CAC no longer 
existed and it was changed to what it is now to signify Club de Hockey.

 Q: What is the most informative hockey publication?
 A: The Hockey News is preferred by most North American hockey fans. It is 
a weekly journal with up-to-date info.
Phone: 800-268-7793 (Canada and US)
Phone/fax: 0483 776141 (UK and rest of Europe)
 
 Q: How does a 5-minute power-play count in the penalty killing stats in 
the NHL?
 A: If X goals are scored, then the team gets credit for X goals in X+1 
chances.
 
 Q: How is +/- computed in the NHL?
 A: First, +/- only applies to skaters. Except for a power-play goal, when 
a goal is scored, each skater on the ice for the scoring team is given a 
+, and each skater on the ice for the other team is given a -. Short-
handed goals do count for +/-.
 
 Q: What is the five-hole?
 A: The space between a goalie's pads. There are five major scoring zones: 
(1) upper left corner of goal, (2) upper right, (3) lower left, (4) lower 
right, and (5) five-hole.
 
 Q: What is the meaning of throwing an octopus on the ice?
 A: This tradition began in Detroit in the 1950's when two best-of-seven 
series were required to win the Stanley Cup. Every time Detroit won a 
game, an octopus with one less arm was thrown on the ice.

 Q: Who was the first woman to play in an NHL game?
 A: Manon Rheaume, a 20-year-old goaltender, became the first woman ever 
to play in an NHL game on September 23, 1992 when she started in net for 
the expansion Tampa Bay Lightning in an exhibition against the St. Louis 
Blues. Rheaume played the first period before 8,223 at the 10,400-seat 
Expo Hall on the Florida State Fairgrounds and allowed two goals on nine 
shots. She left with the score tied 2-2, although the Lightning ultimately 
lost the game, 6-4.

 Q: What is the richest contract in NHL history?
 A: Mario Lemieux, the superstar center of the Pittsburgh Penguins, signed 
the richest contract in NHL history, a seven-year deal believed to be 
worth about $42 million. Lemieux will earn between $6 million and $7 
million a year, nearly twice as much as any other player in the league.

 Q: Who is the new commissioner of the NHL?
 A: Gary Bettman, vice president and general counsel of the National 
Basketball Association, was named commissioner of the National Hockey 
League, Friday, December 11, 1992. Bettman joined the NBA in 1981 as 
assistant general counsel. He became the league's chief legal officer in 
September of 1984. A New York resident, Bettman graduated from Cornell 
University in 1974 and from New York University School of Law in 1977.

 Q: How many professional hockey leagues are there in North America?
 A: Six:  National, American, International, East Coast, Central and 
Colonial Hockey Leagues.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
9. Miscellaneous:
 
 For field hockey discussions, go to the newsgroup rec.sport.hockey.field.
 For skating discussions, go to the newsgroup rec.skate.
 
 Some sites get another hockey group, called clari.sports.hockey. c.s.h 
consists of the UPI feed for all UPI news articles that are related to 
hockey, including game results, summaries, scores, standings, etc.  Much 
of the information in the NHL team news section comes from this newsgroup.
 
  The rec.sport.hockey Frequently Asked Questions posting is posted semi-
monthly, usually on the 1st and 15th of each month, during the hockey 
season.  This file was originally created by Tom Wilson, who posted it 
during the 1991-92 season.  It was taken over by Mitch McGowan for the 
1992-93 season.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
  Please make corrections via e-mail, indicating "r.s.h FAQ" as the 
subject line. Feel free to start a discussion on any previously mentioned 
topic (but use an appropriate subject line).
 
Mitch McGowan <hamlet@u.washington.edu>

1



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53521
From: Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Barasso - the cheap shot master?

After watching the Pengiuns all year (and as many other teams as
possible), I've really noticed an increase in Tom Barasso's cheap shots
this year (and not noticed a corrsponding increase with other
goaltenders). I've also noticed that he usually gets away with it. Just
as examples last night, I noticed him elbowing Scott Stevens in the
head, which basically started the whole shoving match that got Stevens
(Scott) and Tocchet 2 minute minors. He also KICKED John McLean. Of
course he wasn't called for that. Isn't kicking an automatic match
penalty and 10 game suspension? I think Glenn Anderson got one a few
years ago for kicking Gaetan Duchesne in the chest. There's no doubt in
my mind that Barasso is the dirtiest golatender since Hextall. He's also
very good.

How about that Tocchet head-butt? Is there an automatic susppension that
goes along with a (non-kicking) match penalty? I can't remember anymore.

Oh, the playoffs should be fun,
Ralph


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53522
From: Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: How to beat Pittsburgh!

from Anna Matyas:
>>Now if we could just clone Chelios's personality and transplant it
>>into all of the defensemen on the Islanders, Capitals, and Devils...
>> 
>>Gerald
> 
>In other words, you want to turn them all into assholes so they
>will spend lots of time in the penalty box and get lots of
>misconducts?
> 
>And this comes from a Chelios fan...

Yeah, and also be second in the team in scoring and play about 35
minutes a game and play on the power play and kill penalties and be the
best defenseman in the league. I'd take a whole team of Chelioses if I
could. (That way, when one got a penalty the others could kill it!)

Ralph


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53523
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: Re: Bruins-Pens: the Ulf-Neeley fight

mattb@hawk.samsung.com (Matt Brown) writes:
[more about the Messier-Samuelsson incident]
>While this is true, strictly speaking, it was the Rocksteady replicant who
>initially used his stick illegally to measure Messier's ribcage. There is no
>question in my mind, from seeing the replay in slo-mo, that Ulf-2000 was
>coming at Messier with intent-to-"hasta la vista" in mind, and should have
>been gone for that. 
>
 I agree with Rick that Ulf's cross check wasn't illegal. It was the kind
 of check you see a dozen times during a game without being called. Slo-mos
 sometimes have a tendency to make things look worse than they really are.
 Besides, if Messier can't take the heat, he should stay out of the kitchen.

>So Staffan, how is Mattias Timmander doing this year? And any impression
>on Markus Czeriew??? (lost my roster list) on Hammerby? Does it look like
>they will make it to the Eliteserien for next year? And then get stomped
>if Markus goes to Boston?
>
 Well Matt, Mattias Timmander hasn't been playing with the MoDo elite league
 team yet (just the MoDo junior team), so I predict he needs a few more years
 here before he can join the B's. I saw him play in the Swedish championship
 game for junior players this year, and he played very well, a physical game,
 but not the kind of rough stuff that Ulfie does (I suspect you would like to
 have a Ulf type-of-player on the B's team too? :)
 As for Mariusz Czerkawski, he has had a *great* season for Hammarby in
 division 1. He scored -if I remember correctly- 93 points this season,
 and then we have to keep in mind that a 50+ point season in Sweden is
 considered *very good* due to the limited number of games. Mariusz is
 Djurgarden property (he was just on loan to Hammarby), so he will play
 in Elitserien next season, unless the B's can get him of course.
 I would say that Mariusz has to be one of the most exciting player to
 watch in Swedish hockey this season.

 Staffan
--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53524
From: accgsg@vaxa.hofstra.edu (Gary Graffagnino)
Subject: Isles / Hockey Ramblings


	Well, the Patrick Division got a little more interesting last night. 
The Islanders lost in OT and the Devils tied the Pens.  That means if the Isles
beat the Devils on Friday, the will meet the Caps in the playoffs.

	However, I have some more comments on the Islanders and hockey in
general that I need to get off my chest :).  First of all, with the Islanders 
back-to-back lackluster performances against the Whalers, one may think that 
the Islanders are out of shape.  These guys always suck wind in the 2nd period,
come on a little in the 3rd and run out of gas too soon.  It is unbelieveable
how many one goal games these guys have lost.  Anyway, the games was pretty 
wide open.  The Isles still have tons of trouble scoring.  The Whalers played 
a golie in is 1st NHL start, I think his name was Lenarduzzi (sp?).  (His NHL 
debut was the Tuesday tie against the Isles).  Like I mentioned before, this 
guy looked like the best golie on the planet for a while (until he misplayed a 
Mahlakov slap shot to go to OT).  I say it's because the Isles don't shoot 
correctly.  Has anyone else noticed this?

	Also, I think it is really a shame for hockey when I guy like Mick
Vukota gets as much ice time as he does.  This guy has about as much hockey
talent as Jiggs MacDonald (who did play hockey, I think).  Anytime he gets the
puck it gets stolen, and he always starts fights and gets needless penalties. 
Richard Pilon is another guy who is on the ice to stir up crap.  And he's a
defenseman.  He's got to be approaching negative infinity for his plus/minus. 
This guy gets beaten all the time.  Why the need for such "enforcers"?  Not
only do fights slow the game down ALOT, but it takes away from the guys who are
really trying to play the game.  I'll be one of the few to admit, I do enjoy a 
good fight once in a while, but only when it's "called for".  You know, when a
guy checks the goalie too hard.  In other words, a violation of "hockey ethics"
might cause you to get puched.  But there is no need to start crap when you are
losing or becuase you can get away with it!! Does anyone agree that referees
need to be a little less lenient in the 3rd and OT?  I mean COME ON already. 
I'm sick of seeing teams pulling guys down, holding guys etc. just becuase the
referee doesn't call it.  OT and late in the 3rd should be a time for strategy,
not physical prowess.  Trying to set up a goal should be first and foremost. 
If you are so afraid that the other team is going to score that you have to
pull a guy down to prevent it, you don't deserve to win in the first place.

Just My Honest Opinion,

Gary at Hofstra
ACCGSG@VAXB.HOFSTRA.EDU
ACCGSG@HOFSTRA.BITNET

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53525
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: Re: Pens Info needed


Kevin L. Stamber writes:
>If there's anyone who can help me on these items, please
>let me know.
>
>*  Markus Naslund -- I saw that MoDo lost early in the National
>                     tournament and that he was playing for the national
>                     team at the World Championships.  Any stats
>                     available?  Any word on how he's playing?  When
>                     is he expected to join the club?  
>

 Markus had a good season in MoDo in the Swedish elite league, scoring
 22 goals, 17 assists, 39 points and 67 PIM in 39 games.

 As Daryl points out, Markus won't be joining the Pens for this year's
 playoffs, since the World Championships starts April 18th.

 But there is a good chance that Markus will join the Pens before next
 season. MoDo, though, naturally wants to keep their superstars Forsberg
 and Naslund, so the latest news on this is that MoDo is looking for
 personal sponsors for Forsberg and Naslund in order to match the kind
 of money they would receive in NHL.

Daryl Turner writes:
>By 'the club', I would assume you mean the Pens.  Don't hold your breath,
>you aren't going to see Naslund this year.  The World Championship
>Tournament doesn't start until 18 April.  So NHL teams won't see any
>influx of Europeans, and no team playing in the WC will see a sudden
>influx of 'eliminated' NHLers.  The earliest a player on a playoff bound
>team could join a WC-team is the last game of the round robin, and I
>doubt any coach is going to want to play short one player for that long.

 Actually, Swedish coach Curt Lundmark is thinking about leaving two
 spots open for additions from eliminated NHLers. It is Mats Sundin and
 Calle Johansson that Curt hopes can join the team, although in a late
 stage of the tournament. Technically, I seem to recall that you can leave
 spots open until 24 hrs before the WC final.

 Staffan
--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53526
From: pkortela@snakemail.hut.fi (Petteri Kortelainen)
Subject: expanding to Europe:Dusseldorf

In article <1993Apr13.091859.29570@abo.fi> MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF) writes:
>I didn't say every team MUST have a number of local players. Rather, the
>European teams should get the CHANCE to sign their top players before the rest
>of the league comes in. I agree that birthplace isn't that important,
>Dusseldorfer EG of the German league average close to 10,000 fans and they
>don't have a single German-born forward! Lion Milan made the European Final
>Four with fifteen Canadian-born players... But nationality is going to be an
>issue in Sweden and Finland, I think. We really need an issue preventing
>Lindros and Mario from ending up being drafted by a European team and vice
>versa. Player trades are a different matter - any player can end up anywhere
>after being drafted.

DEG has many german-born forwards in the team. In fact the majority of players
are german-born. 1992-93 DEG had 11150 average in 11800 spectator arena.

My Possible-NHL(European league)-site list:
Switzerland  : Berne, Zurich (Lugano and 1-2 others)
Germany      : Dusseldorf, Cologne, Berlin, Munich (Mannheim, Rosenheim)
Sweden       : Stockholm, Gothenburg (Malmo, Gavle)
Finland      : Helsinki (Turku, Tampere)
Italy        : Milan
France       : Paris (Chamonix, Ruoen?)
Norway       : (Oslo)
Austria      : (Vienna, Villach)
Chech        : (Prag)
Slovakia     : (Bratislava)
Russia       : (Moscow, St. Petersburg)
Great Britain: ?
Netherlands  : ? 

Petteri Kortelainen

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53527
From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
Subject: Re: Sweden-Finland, April 14

In <1993Apr15.063253.17375@ericsson.se> etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se writes:

> 
>  Played in Stockholm Globe arena, April 14 1993:
>  ===============================================
> 
>  SWEDEN - FINLAND  4-3 (2-0,0-2,2-1)
> 
>  1st: SWE 1-0 Jan Larsson        (Stefan Nilsson,Patrik Juhlin)       3:15
>       SWE 2-0 Peter Popovic      (Mikael Renberg,Thomas Rundqvist)   16:20
>  2nd: FIN 2-1 Mika Nieminen      (Ville Siren,Mikko Haapakoski)       0:40
>       FIN 2-2 Timo Saarikoski    (Vesa Viitakoski,Harri Laurila)     17:48 (sh)
>  3rd: SWE 3-2 Fredrik Stillman   (Stefan Nilsson,Patrik Juhlin)       7:35 (pp)
>       SWE 4-2 Mikael Renberg                                          8:40
>       FIN 4-3 Saku Koivu         (Mika Alatalo)                      13:17
> 
>              Shots on goal:      Penalties:     Attendance:    Referee:
>  Sweden      14 12 15 - 41       4*2min         12,470         Borje Johansson
>  Finland     12  9  9 - 30       9*2min                        (Sweden)
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well, if things were different and I had my way, the headline would be: "NHL,
European Division regular season game: Stockholm Storm vs. Helsinki Tornado
4-3..." Two games against every North American-based team (46 in all), and this
might have been the ninth and final regular season encounter between Helsinki
and Stockholm. The remaining 27 games would involve Paris, Dortmund, Milan...
A nice dream.

MARCU$

> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> --
>  ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
>   \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
> \\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53528
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Leaf slump over


On March 21, 1993 Roger Maynard wrote (in reply to an article by Graham
Hudson):

>> will still have the Jennings Trophy at the end of the year.  Potvin is very
>> good, and I do believe that he will be a star, but I want to see him
>> perform in the playoffs under pressure.

>You don't think he is performing "under pressure" now?  The major
>differences  between playoff hockey and normal hockey is 1. play-
>ing every other night which is physically exhausting and 2.   You
>play  the  same  team  in a consecutive string of games.  Is this
>what you mean by pressure?  Have you even thought about what  you
>mean  by pressure, or are your thoughts, like most of the rest of
>this drivel, simply half-baked?

This was <1993Mar21.223936.6192@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca>, for anybody who
would like to check.

He went on (in another article) to say [paraphrased]

>"Playoff hockey" is just an expression used by announcers to convince
>simple-minded folks like yourself that what you are seeing is a better
>product than a regular-season game.

*NOW*, however, in article <1993Apr12.013939.23016@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> 
(Roger Maynard) writes:

>With a 4-2 win over a tough Whaler squad the Leafs showed all doubters
>what playoff hockey is all about.  
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

So, Roger, what exactly *is* playoff hockey all about?  Or is it a convenient
phrase to use in certain circumstances only?

You see, when you spout off with flame bait too many times, sooner or later
it catches up with you....



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53529
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Mogilny must be benched.

In article <C5C68r.5sq@acsu.buffalo.edu> v057p7nk@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu 
(Andrew W Korbut) writes:

>Anyway, this game continued a trend that has sadly been taking shape for
>a couple of weeks now.  I had hoped it was fatigue, or an aberration, but
>I can't snow myself any longer.  Alex Mogilny must be benched as a
>disciplinary action, and soon.

>His explanation for Ysebaert jumping between him and LaFontaine to score the
>winning goal yesterday?  "Wasn't my guy, ask Patty about it."

Actually this stuff from Mogilny doesn't surprise me all that much.  About 4
or 5 weeks ago I read in the Toronto Sun a quote from Alex; it went something
like [sarcastically]:

"Yep, Patty's the man.  He's responsible for the team's success...I'm a 
nobody around here."

I was going to post it at the time...I must have forgot since nobody else 
was talking about him being a problem.

>If I heard that in the locker room, I'd beat the shit out of him on the spot.
>Patty took responsibility in the press, taking the heat off of Alex.  That's
>because LaFontaine is the epitome of class, and a consummate team player.

Yep, I'd beat the shit out of him too.  LaFontaine really must be a team
player...makes you wonder what the Islander management was thinking.
My question is what the hell is Muckler doing?  Whether he wishes to admit it
or not, the team is his to coach, and if he can't do the job then maybe the
job should be given to somebody who can.  

Gee, kinda like Alex's spot on the team, isn't it?

> Dr.D [The Devils Advocate]        



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53530
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Canadians - another Stanley Cup

In article <93097.094815MECE7187@RyeVm.Ryerson.Ca> <MECE7187@RyeVm.Ryerson.Ca>
writes:

>Im sorry to tell you this, but unless they pull off another 1986 miracle, there
> is no way the HABS will win this year.   Ever since they traded for
>Ramage, and since Savard came off injury, they have been playing shinny.  And
>you cant blame Roy for the 4-0 loss to Washington, when 20 players could not
>score one goal.  I know, you think
>I am a Boston fan, but all of my years have been dedicated to Les HABS.

>David Degan

Well, it seems that the Habs have been much talked-about of late, so here's my
$0.02.  These guys have absolutely no concept of how to play in front of the
damn net!!!  Watch them in the offensive zone, especially on the powerplay. 
Damphousse or Lebeau will skate all over the bloody zone, maybe pass to the
point, get it back, skate some more, pass it around....BUT WHERE'S THE SHOT??!
Answer: the shot is totally useless because they lack a forward who stands
in front of the net a la` Neely, Shanahan, Tocchet, etc etc.  Too bad 
Demers won't put Dipietro or LeClair on the powerplay more often.  Dammit,
even Ewen would at least cause some disruptions.  Montreal desperately needs
a power forward with some talent, IMO.

Then watch them in their own zone. Patrick Roy is screened on everything. Say
what you want about his performance; IMNSHO he cannot stop what he cannot see. 
And Montreal's defence does a miserable job of clearing the front of the net. 
Last night against Washington Roy played a *great* game.  The first goal came
on the most ridiculous goalmouth scramble I've seen in a long time, and he
didn't have a hope in hell of stopping the shot.  The second goal came on a
deflection of a shot he only partially saw anyway.  Pathetic defence.  The
third goal was EN.

No wonder he gets pissed off at his defencemen.


dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53531
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Vlad's Playoff Picks

In article <vzhivov.734637613@cunews> vzhivov@alfred.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov) writes:

Wales Conference, Adams Division, Semifinal
>Boston vs. Buffalo:
>The Bruins are playing some excellent hockey, and with Cam Neely back
>and Moog his old self again this should be a cake-walk.  BRUINS IN 5.

I'm hoping for a Fuhr miracle, but I agree that Boston will likely win the
series.  Goaltending is about equal, top offensive players are about equal
(Mogilny-LaFontaine vs. Oates-Juneau), but Buffalo has no answer to Neely
(not to imply that Neely is not a top offensive player btw, in fact he's one
of my favourites even though he's a damn Bruin :) ).  And the rest of the
matchup wrt lineup favours Boston anyway.  But I think it will go six.

>Quebec vs. Montreal:
>This one is very tough to call. Montreal certainly has the experience
>factor, but Quebec is more talented IMHO. It'll come down to the
>goalies.  I'll go with experience and Roy. CANADIENS IN 7.

Agreed here...but Montreal will be pushed to the limit.  Is it just me, or
does everything Montreal does in the playoffs come down to Roy?  Go Habs!!

Final
>Boston vs. Montreal:
>Will Bruin domination continue in this rivalry? Yes. Moog has
>consistently outperformed Roy in the playoffs (after 1986)..[other stuff]
> Bruins in five.

I can't predict a Montreal victory because I've been watching them play for
6 weeks and IMO they severly need some tougher players, especially to play
in the Garden.  Last time they beat the B's 5-2 but Boston had a clear
territorial advantage; the victory was Roy's.  At the same time, I can't
bring myself to predict the possibility of a loss, so I'll just say I will
not be putting money on this series. :-)

>Patrick Division, semifinal

>Pittsburgh vs. NY Islanders:
>What can I say? The Pens are flying high and have the most talent in
>the league. 

Agreed.  NY doesn't have the goaltending to stop the onslaught, independent
of the trouble they have given Pittsburgh this year.  Pens in five, which is
credit to NY.

>Washington vs. New Jersey:
>CAPITALS IN 5.

Agreed here too, but I think it will go at least six.  Jersey has a decent
team, and Washington has done poorly against the division this year.

>Pittsburgh vs. Washington:
>If the Caps had Bill Ranford I might see an upset, but Don Beaupre
>just doesn't inspire my hopes.  PENGUINS IN 6.

I think they will use Tabaracci more after Beaupre gets shelled.  I don't
think it will go six either...*maybe* five.

>CONFERENCE FINAL:
>Pittsburgh vs. Boston:
>A replay of last year. The Penguins are just as good as 12 months ago,
>and the Bruins are much improved. But... PENGUINS IN 6.

If Pittsburgh plays Boston, IMO they win in likely five, possibly six.  They
own the Bruins.  If they play Montreal, I think it will go to seven, and once
again I won't be putting money on the seventh game.  I say seven because the
Habs have played Pittsburgh very tough this season.

>Campbell Conference, Norris Division, semifinal

>Chicago vs. St. Louis (or Minnesota):
> BLACKHAWKS IN 5.

Chicago will win, but I think in at least six.  Chicago is not that good,
IMO.  And remember that they take ridiculous numbers of penalties.

>Detroit vs. Toronto:
>The Leafs have had an excellent season, but they've been playing
>playoff hockey all year - the Habs under Burns were the same way and
>always wilted in the playoffs.  RED WINGS IN 5.

Very true.  The Leafs have much to be proud of, but they will soon find out
why Montreal did so lousy in the playoffs.  Toronto might win two or three 
at MLG though.  Wings in six, maybe even seven.

>FINAL:
>Chicago vs. Detroit:
> This will be a war. Fedorov will win it in OT. RED WINGS IN 7.

It _will_ be a war...possibly the most intense playoff series of them all. 
And yes, I think Detroit will win.  Probert will have to come up big though.

>Smythe Division SEMI-FINALS:

>Vancouver vs. Winnipeg:
> CANUCKS IN 7.

Our first disagreement.  Canucks are playing like shit.  They don't use their
size *at* *all*, which may explain why they get hammered 8-1 by a team
chasing them (Calgary)....Winnipeg in six.

>Calgary vs. Los Angeles:
>This would have been tough to call, except for three things. 1/ The
>Kings don't have a goalie; 2/ Gary Roberts will be back; 3/ the Kings
>shot themselves in the foot by trading a proven winner (Paul Coffey)
>for a proven loser (Jimmy Carson). Gretzky is just too weary to carry
>this group. FLAMES IN 5.

This is also tough for me to call, because I haven't seen the Smythe enough. 
I don't think Roberts will be well enough to figure in, Coffey is a
non-issue, who cares what Carson has done before, and *never* underestimate
Gretzky.  LA in six.

>FINAL:
>Vancouver vs. Calgary:
> FLAMES IN 6.

If it is these two, Calgary will not need six games.  But I think it will be
LA-Winnipeg anyway, and LA in seven, because of home ice.

>COFERENCE FINAL:
>Detroit vs. Calgary:
> RED WINGS IN 7.

Wow, must've been tough to go against your team.  But let's see, I picked
LA-Detroit.  Detroit will win, probably in six.

>STANLEY CUP FINAL:
>Pittsburgh vs. Detroit:
>Three in a row and official 'dynasty' status for the Pens? Or can the
>Wings complete a dream season? Well, the Wings are better in goal (not
>sufficiently so though IMHO) and have better D-men. However, Mario and
>the boys can sure score. Look for Jagr to shine in the playoffs,
>though I sure would love to see Probert beat some sense into him. The
>Pens are just too much, especially since Detroit will have a tougher
>battle to get here. PENGUINS IN 5.

If Pittsburgh plays Detroit, it will go longer than five, and I wouldn't bet
against the Wings.  They are very strong, IMO, and nobody knows *how* strong
because they've been underachieving most of the year.  If forced to choose,
though, I'd have to take the Penguins.

A side note.  Vlad, last week you said that Selanne was a better player than
Gilmour.  NO WAY.  He is a more talented pure goal scorer...but aside from
the age difference, there is no way I would take him over Gilmour on my team.
I'm not asking for flames, either, btw....I've spent more than enough time
arguing on behalf of Selanne and I still say he's a great player.  But while
he and Gilmour are both dangerous offensively (give Teemu an edge),
Gilmour *does* *it* *all*.  I know a lot of Gilmour-bashing goes on, esp.
from Flame fans.  But IMO you guys are letting your dislike of Gilmour cloud
your judgement when it comes to his skill.  He is easily one of the best
all-round players in the NHL.



dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53532
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Wed, April 14, 1993

Boston                           2 2 0--4
Ottawa                           0 1 1--2
First period
     1, Boston, Roberts 5 (Juneau) 7:19.
     2, Boston, Wiemer 1(Juneau, Oates) 17:47.
Second period
     3, Boston, Neely 11 (Juneau, Murphy) 6:10.
     4, Boston, Hughes 5 (Richer, Kimble) 7:55.
     5, Ottawa, Archibald 9 (Rumble, Lamb) 11:37.
Third period
     6, Ottawa, Boschman 9 (Kudelski) 5:10.

Boston: 4    Power play: 2-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Hughes             1    0    1
Juneau             0    3    3
Kimble             0    1    1
Murphy             0    1    1
Neely              1    0    1
Oates              0    1    1
Richer             0    1    1
Roberts            1    0    1
Wiemer             1    0    1

Ottawa: 2    Power play: 4-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Archibald          1    0    1
Boschman           1    0    1
Kudelski           0    1    1
Lamb               0    1    1
Rumble             0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Washington                       0 0 2--2
NY Rangers                       0 0 0--0
First period
     No scoring.
Second period
     No scoring.
Third period
     1, Washington, Bondra 36 (Pivonka, Cavallini) 6:54.
     2, Washington, Bondra 37 (Cote, Pivonka) 10:10.

Washington: 2    Power play: 2-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bondra             2    0    2
Cavallini          0    1    1
Cote               0    1    1
Pivonka            0    2    2

NY Rangers: 0    Power play: 1-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------
NY Islanders                     2 1 1 0--4
Hartford                         2 1 1 1--5
First period
     1, NY Islanders, Ferraro 13 (Malakhov, King) 1:29.
     2, NY Islanders, Hogue 32 (Thomas, Turgeon) 1:57.
     3, Hartford, Yake 21(Poulin) 4:15.
     4, Hartford, Yake 22 (Nylander, Poulin) 16:44.
Second period
     5, Hartford, Verbeek 39 (Cassels, Weinrich) pp, 2:43.
     6, NY Islanders, Thomas 35 (King, Ferraro) 7:58.
Third period
     7, Hartford, Burt 5 (Sanderson, Cassels) 13:41.
     8, NY Islanders, Malakhov 14 (Hogue) 17:45.
Overtime
     9, Hartford, Janssens 12 (Poulin) 1:08.

Hartford: 5    Power play: 3-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Burt               1    0    1
Cassels            0    2    2
Janssens           1    0    1
Nylander           0    1    1
Poulin             0    3    3
Sanderson          0    1    1
Verbeek            1    0    1
Weinrich           0    1    1
Yake               2    0    2

NY Islanders: 4    Power play: 3-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Ferraro            1    1    2
Hogue              1    1    2
King               0    2    2
Malakhov           1    1    2
Thomas             1    1    2
Turgeon            0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Pittsburgh                       2 3 1 0--6
New Jersey                       2 4 0 0--6
First period
     1, Pittsburgh, Daniels 5 (Needham, Tippett) 4:14.
     2, New Jersey, Lemieux 29 (Semak, Driver) 10:19.
     3, Pittsburgh, Stevens 55(Tocchet, Murphy) pp, 12:40.
     4, New Jersey, Zelepukin 22 (Driver, Niedermayer) 17:26.
Second period
     5, Pittsburgh, Lemieux 68 (Stevens, Tocchet) 1:42.
     6, New Jersey, Semak 36 (Lemieux, Zelepukin) 2:27.
     7, Pittsburgh, McEachern 28 (Jagr, Barrasso) 4:24.
     8, New Jersey, Stevens 12 (Guerin, Pellerin) 5:45.
     9, Pittsburgh, Lemieux 69 (unassisted) sh, 12:40.
     10, New Jersey, Richer 37 (Nicholls) 15:53.
     11, New Jersey, Lemieux 30 (Semak, Zelepukin) 17:40.
Third period
     12, Pittsburgh, Mullen 33 (Jagr, Lemieux) 18:54.
Overtime
     No scoring.

Pittsburgh: 6    Power play: 5-1   Special goals:  pp: 1  sh: 1  Total: 2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Barrasso           0    1    1
Daniels            1    0    1
Jagr               0    2    2
Lemieux            2    1    3
McEachern          1    0    1
Mullen             1    0    1
Murphy             0    1    1
Needham            0    1    1
Stevens            1    1    2
Tippett            0    1    1
Tocchet            0    2    2

New Jersey: 6    Power play: 3-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Driver             0    2    2
Guerin             0    1    1
Lemieux            2    1    3
Nicholls           0    1    1
Niedermayer        0    1    1
Pellerin           0    1    1
Richer             1    0    1
Semak              1    2    3
Stevens            1    0    1
Zelepukin          1    2    3

-----------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53533
Subject: Re: Rheaume start
From: S960121@UMSLVMA.UMSL.EDU

Just a quick note about Manon's immediate future: Rumor has it(USA Today's spor
ts page) that she will be playing with Tampa Bay's affiliate in the ECHL(I Thin
k. It's been a couple of days. :)) She will supposedly be competing for the num
ber 2 goaltender spot.  I think, after her performance, which was damn good for
 someone who hasn't played squat all year, that we'll be seeing a lot more of h
er in Atlanta in the years to come.
 
 
Ward
 
-Go Blades!! Bring home the Turner Cup, again!!
 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53534
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: What's so bad about the new playoff format?

In article <115330@bu.edu> icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera) writes:
>
>   What's so bad about the new playoff format? Do you really believe teams
>that finish fourth in their div. deserve to be in the playoffs? 
>With the new format, you have more of a chance to see more teams. Do you
>really want to see the Bruins against the Sabres umpteen times or would
>you rather see the Bruins and the Capitals in the secound round of playoffs?

There is really nothing inherently wrong with it but they tried it just
a little over a decade ago, and noone showed up for the early rounds in
the playoffs...whereas soon after they went to the divisional set-up
arenas were mostly filled in the early rounds.  

The empirical evidence of the last two decades is that more people will
show up to see the Bruins play the Sabre umpteen times than see the
Bruins play the Captials in the first round.

Maybe hockey has increased in popularity sufficiently that this will
no longer be the case.  The experiment is worthwhile with the uneven
distribution of the expansion teams, but I prefer the divisional 
playoff.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53535
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: For sale; Edmonton Oilers.

In article <mcm12B2w165w@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca> mbevan@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Mark Bevan) writes:
>
>He was already offered $65 million for them from Northlands Coliseum
>but refused the offer.... I don't think he is going to sale. I think he
>may decide to move the team to the States though where he can draw
>more revenue from the team.
>

Pocklington just wanted to wake up the powers that be holding political
office, in Northlands, and in the business community that the Oilers
with their current lease arrangement are in a state where on a yearly
basis they will likely have an operating loss based on "normal" hockey
revenues and expenses.  That he did this was a good thing...it is better
he complain early, and make the city aware of a potential looming crisis
before he begins to lose millions and millions of dollars...which would
truly jeopardize the franchise.

Pocklington's first option is not to sell or to move, but to sell
a minority share of the team (to realize some of the appreciated value
of the team) and to get a better arena deal, either in Northlands, or
via a new building.  Pocklington probably isn't going to get exactly
what he wants...but ultimately he will probably get enough, or will
sell to someone who will probably get enough.

There are a lot of risks in moving a team also...

...one has to remember "Peter Puck's principle"...it is better to
spend other people's money than one's own if at all possible.

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53536
From: saross01@starbase.spd.louisville.edu (Stacey A. Ross)
Subject: Re: Hockey and the Hispanic community

In <C5I2s2.3Bt@odin.corp.sgi.com> rickc@wrigley.corp.sgi.com (Richard Casares) writes:
>You'll have a hard time selling any sport to a community that
>can't play it on account of availability or financial reasons.
>Hockey is pretty much a sport for the white and well off.

What?! White, yes. Well off, definitely not. Hockey season ticket owners have
the lowest average income of any of the four major North American sports.

And think of where the majority of hockey players come from. From a farm out
in Boondock, Saskatchewan or Weedville, Alberta.

>When was the last time you saw a hockey league in the inner city.
>The insurance alone is a big enough barrier.

The inner city isn't the only place that is poor.
I think the biggest barrier to hockey in the inner city is... no ICE to play on.

						  Stace


>-- 
>+===================================================================+
>| Rick Casares			            Silicon Graphics        |	
>| cubfan@wrigley.corp.sgi.com		    2011 N. Shoreline Blvd  |
>| "Just wait till next year."               Mountain View, CA 94039 |
>+===================================================================+

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53537
From: <AJS147@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: Winning Streaks

   You might want to clarify the 11 game winning streak.  That Pens streak
is a PLAYOFF streak (tied by the Chicago Blackhawks, who had won 11 in a row
until they met the Pens in the finals last year)  The 18 game unbeaten, so far,
is a regular season unbeaten streak.  But hey, don't take it personally.  I'm a
Flyers fan and two in a row is a stretch.  But with a healthy Lindros, Recchi,
Brind'amour and Tommy Soderstrom, they'll be there next year!
By the way, since the Flyers need defenseman, what kind of trade would
anybody suggest from the existing Flyers roster since the scuttlebutt is that

Terry Carkner won't be there next year and apart from him a piece of notebook
paper would be better defense.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Matt Weaver (properly found at AJS147@psuvm.psu.edu).  Hey, at least we're not
                                                       the Whalers!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53538
From: galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin)
Subject: Re: Washington To Beat Pitt

In article <93105.052120RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>In article <1993Apr14.015415.10176@mprgate.mpr.ca>, tasallot@galaxy.mpr.ca
>(Mathew Tasalloti) says:
>>chances this year), but it seems to me like Washington is the ONLY
>>team that can stop the Penguins from winning their next Stanley Cup.
>
>  Really? I think both the Islanders and Devils would have a better chance
>at the Penguins than the Capitals, IMO.
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>** Robbie Po **          PGH PENGUINS!!!    "It won't be easy, but it
>Contact for the '93-'94  '91 STANLEY CUP    will have greater rewards.
>Penn State Lady Lions    '92 CHAMPIONS      Mountains and Valleys are
>rap115@psuvm.psu.edu     11 STRAIGHT WINS!  better than nothing at all!"

Really?  What makes you think the Islanders have a better shot?  They
couldn't even beat the Whalers in two games!

(Well, since you're a Pens fans the whole question is moot.  I think
the teams most likely to beat the Pens are the Bruins, Nordiques, and
Blackhawks but I don't think they can really do it.  :-))

-Tom Galvin       galvint@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53539
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Bruins vs Canadiens: Talentwise

In article <1993Apr14.235849.15397@amc.com> richard@amc.com (Richard Wernick) writes:
>The bottom line is the Bruins are the better team this year.
>Montreal fans have been screaming for years that their beloved Canadiens deserve
>another cup. Since the removal of the French Canadien rule, they have been screaming
>foul. Welcome to league parity, something the rest of the league has had for years.
>Even if the Habs do beat Boston in the playoffs, they won't get by the Pens.
>I do agree with you, Boston is the more taleneted team.
>

The French Canadian rule was an extremely short term feature when the
universal draft was instituted in the sixties and only lasted for a
few years...and really didn't have any substantial effect during that
period.  The Canadiens Stanley Cup achievements were earned on a
level playing field.

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53540
From: smithw@col.hp.com (Walter Smith)
Subject: Re: Playoff predictions

OK, I'll join in the fun and give my playoff predictions: 

1st round: 
----------

PITT vs NYI:  PITT in 4.  
WASH vs NJD:  WASH in 6. 

BOS  vs BUF:  BOS  in 5. 
QUE  vs MON:  MON  in 7. 

CHI  vs STL:  CHI in 4. 
DET  vs TOR:  DET in 6. 

VAN  vs WIN:  WIN in 6. 
CAL  vs  LA:  CAL in 5. 

2nd round: 
----------

PITT vs WASH: PITT in 4. 
BOS  vs MON:  BOS  in 6. 

CHI  vs DET:  CHI  in 7. 
WIN  vs CAL:  CAL  in 5. 

3rd round: 
----------

PITT vs BOS:  PITT in 5. 
CHI  vs CAL:  CHI  in 5. 

Finals:
------

PITT vs CHI: PITT in 5. 


=============================================
Walter


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53541
From: lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico)
Subject: Re: Giveaways 

In article <1993Apr14.173826.29856@philabs.philips.com> jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio) writes:
>

>That's probably because they couldn't find anyone to sponser it... Maybe USS
>could sponser the Pittsburgh Penguins/US Steel Steel Rod Night-- close enough?

Maybe in the 60's, but not now.  Steel is a dead industry in Pgh. 

No, a giveaway night in the 90's for Pgh would be "Baboon Liver Night"
sponored by The Pittsburgh Zoo...

Lori


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53542
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Goalie masks


	I'm starting an informal poll on goalie masks. I'd like to know
who's mask you think looks the best. I've always like Curtis Joseph's
of the Blues the best. Anyway, send your nominations to me, or post your
vote here on r.s.h. My e-mail adress is: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

	Thanks for your time.

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53543
From: ayari@judikael.loria.fr (Ayari Iskander)
Subject: NHLPA poll (Stats/2nd uptade)

2nd uptade:

Here are the standings for the poll after 29 votes: 5 points for 1st, 4 for 2nd,... 1 point for 5th: 

EA/ NHLPA game

1. DET 78
2. CHI 67 
3. VAN 60
4. NY  59
5. MTL 54
6. PIT 23
7. WAS 20
8. BOS 17
9..QUE  9 
10.CAL  8
11.ASW  7
12.LA   5
   TOR  5
14.ASE  4
   WIN  4
16.BUF  3
   PHI  3
18.SJ   2
19.MIN  1
   OTW  1
   Atlanta to win Turner Cup 1 (not in the game, but 1 person vote)


Continue to send your votes in this format (until April 20th, approximately)
------------------------------------------------
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
------------------------------------------------


__

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53544
From: bdown@vis.toronto.edu (Brian Down)
Subject: Re: Barasso - the cheap shot master?

Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:

>After watching the Pengiuns all year (and as many other teams as
>possible), I've really noticed an increase in Tom Barasso's cheap shots
>this year (and not noticed a corrsponding increase with other
>goaltenders).

Have a look at Ed Belfour.

>He also KICKED John McLean. Of
>course he wasn't called for that. 

Belfour kicked Gerrard Gallant when the Wings played the 'Hawks
a couple of weeks ago. No penalty. No review. No suspension.
This was after he attacked Bob Probert in the previous period.
He was penalized for that.

>There's no doubt in
>my mind that Barasso is the dirtiest golatender since Hextall.
>He's also very good.

Likewise Belfour. Too bad he goes down so much! :-)

>Ralph

Brian Down (bdown@vis.toronto.edu)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53545
From: franti@polaris.utu.fi (Pasi Fr{nti)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

lor@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (edward.lor) writes:

>>	Player:		Points:		+/-	Subtraction:
>>	-------		-------		----	------------
>>	Lemieux		  157		 53	  -104
>>	LaFontaine 	  145		 13	  -132
>>	Oates 		  141		 12	  -129
>>	Yzerman		  138		 33	  -105
>>	Selanne		  137		  8	  -129

>This is wrong. Among Lemieux's 157 points, we do NOT know how many
>are power play points. We may be able to find out how many PP goal he
>scored, but not how many PP assist he accumulated. We also don't know
>the # times he was on the ice but not credited on the goals the Pens 
>scored.

That is what my point really was. There is not straight dependency between
the +/- and scored points. Apparently most of the netters have realized
it by themselves.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53546
From: cubrj@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Brian Johnson)
Subject: the hawks WILL return to the finals!!!!!

Well now that the hawks have won the division the road is a little
easier for the playoffs. Let toronto and detroit beat the hell out of
each other while Chicago sweeps st.louis. That just makes it easier in
the second round with all the rest they will get and tor/det getting
none. For the conf. champ they will have a hard time versus the division
but that div. will be pretty battered also so the advantage goes to the
Hawks again. Then bring pitt. and sure the Hawks will probably lose but
its better to get that far and lose than to not go.

brian


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53547
From: gjp@sei.cmu.edu (George Pandelios)
Subject: Re: Washington To Beat Pitt


In article <1993Apr14.185059.27513@ncsu.edu>, fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu (FRANK MICHAE SALVATORE) writes:
|> 
|>  
|> 
|> > 
|> > What makes you think so?  I'd like to understand your reasoning.
|> > From my seat, the Caps don't really appear to believe that they can 
|> > defeat Pittsburgh.  Therefore, they don't.  I think their spirit was 
|> > broken in last year's playoffs and hasn't really recovered.  I don't know 
|> > what the season series numbers were, but I believe that the Pens won it.
|> > I think that either the Devils or the Islanders will cause more problems for
|> 
|> 
|> What is this spirit crap?  I'm a Caps fan and hope they win
|> if they end up facing Pittsburgh,
|> but I don't think the Caps lose to Pitt because of lack
|> of spirit.  Yes, the Penguins won the season series against the
|> Caps.  They've won eighteen games in a row for God's sake.
|> Did you ever think the Penguins might be good, and that's
|> why they win?

I re-read what I wrote and it didn't say exactly what I thought.  

Sure the Pens are a better team.  They've got size and the best skill players
in the league.  They've also got the best clutch goaltending.  They're the 
best team in the league.

But, my point was the Caps have not played to their ability level vs the
Pens since last year's choke.  And that's the mental problem (the one they've
had for a number of years) I tried to point out.  Spirit, mental preparedness,
will to win, whatever you want to call it, it's missing when the Caps play the
Pens.  Actually, you're right - it won't make any difference.

George

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53548
From: wong@fraser.sfu.ca (Sam S. Wong)
Subject: Re: Mogilny must be benched.

dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:

>Actually this stuff from Mogilny doesn't surprise me all that much.  About 4

>or 5 weeks ago I read in the Toronto Sun a quote from Alex; it went something
>like [sarcastically]:

>"Yep, Patty's the man.  He's responsible for the team's success...I'm a 
>nobody around here."

>I was going to post it at the time...I must have forgot since nobody else 
>Gee, kinda like Alex's spot on the team, isn't it?



How can you assume it was a sarcastic remark?

For someone whose first language is not English, I would interpret
that comment to mean that he believes Pat is the MVP on the team and that
he is just one of the other normal players.  Quite modest I might say.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53549
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Leaf slump over

In <1993Apr13.190225.29001@newshub.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:


>On March 21, 1993 Roger Maynard wrote (in reply to an article by Graham
>Hudson):

>>You don't think he is performing "under pressure" now?  The major
>>differences  between playoff hockey and normal hockey is 1. play-
>>ing every other night which is physically exhausting and 2.   You
>>play  the  same  team  in a consecutive string of games.  Is this
>>what you mean by pressure?  Have you even thought about what  you
>>mean  by pressure, or are your thoughts, like most of the rest of
>>this drivel, simply half-baked?

>This was <1993Mar21.223936.6192@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca>, for anybody who
>would like to check.

>He went on (in another article) to say [paraphrased]

>>"Playoff hockey" is just an expression used by announcers to convince
>>simple-minded folks like yourself that what you are seeing is a better
>>product than a regular-season game.

>*NOW*, however, in article <1993Apr12.013939.23016@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> 
>(Roger Maynard) writes:

>>With a 4-2 win over a tough Whaler squad the Leafs showed all doubters
>>what playoff hockey is all about.  
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

>So, Roger, what exactly *is* playoff hockey all about?  Or is it a convenient
>phrase to use in certain circumstances only?

>You see, when you spout off with flame bait too many times, sooner or later
>it catches up with you....

Nice try Deepak, but "tough Whaler squad" should have clued you in to the
fact that my Leaf woofing was tongue-in-cheek.

If playoff hockey is any more intense than the regular season variety then
it is because the teams are facing each other at least 4 consecutive times
in 7 days and hockey being the contact sport that it is, some things will
be carried over that might dissipate during the regular season.  But that is
only for some of the players.  Many of the rest, who have been playing with
injuries, who miss their families, or who, like Grant Fuhr, would really
rather be playing golf, don't really give a damn.  Of course I can't say this
for sure, but I believe that this is fairly typical of human nature and I
don't think that hockey players are above having what I consider typically
human attitudes.  

With the recent salary escalations the key players are actually losing 
money by participating in the playoffs.  The ones who regard the playoff
"take" as some kind of a bonanza are fringe players who are unlikely
to consistently be a force in the playoffs.  Now I know some of you are
going to come back with "winning spirit" and all of that crap but these
players are professionals after all.  While they may love to play the 
game that love is entirely incidental to their purpose, which is, to make
a decent living. 

Of course, the coach is a professional as well, and part of what he is 
being paid to do is motivate the players.  So, if the coach does his
job well enough the players may respond with a winning effort.

The second season, is after all, merely an exhibition.  The true Champions
of the league are the division winners, the teams that come out on top 
after the long struggle of the season.  The Stanley cup playoffs merely
accord victory to the team that has remained healthy and "hot".  The 
emphasis on the playoffs, with their "sudden death" appeal has been promoted
by the media and the owners with profit purely in mind.  Even if Pittsburgh
loses the playoffs, we all know that they were really the best team in the
league over the year.  They proved it.

cordially, as always,

rm

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53550
From: s4lawren@sms.business.uwo.ca (Stephen Lawrence)
Subject: Re: Playoff predictions

smithw@col.hp.com (Walter Smith) writes:

> OK, I'll join in the fun and give my playoff predictions: 
> 
> 1st round: 
> ----------
> 
> PITT vs NYI:  PITT in 4.  
> WASH vs NJD:  WASH in 6. 
> 
> BOS  vs BUF:  BOS  in 5. 
> QUE  vs MON:  MON  in 7. 
> 
> CHI  vs STL:  CHI in 4. 
> DET  vs TOR:  DET in 6. 
> 
> VAN  vs WIN:  WIN in 6. 
> CAL  vs  LA:  CAL in 5. 
> 
> 2nd round: 
> ----------
> 
> PITT vs WASH: PITT in 4. 
> BOS  vs MON:  BOS  in 6. 
> 
> CHI  vs DET:  CHI  in 7. 
> WIN  vs CAL:  CAL  in 5. 
> 
> 3rd round: 
> ----------
> 
> PITT vs BOS:  PITT in 5. 
> CHI  vs CAL:  CHI  in 5. 
> 
> Finals:
> ------
> 
> PITT vs CHI: PITT in 5. 
> 
> 
> =============================================
> Walter
> 

        Not bad, you only got 2 wrong,...
        Cal over Chi in 5
        and Cal over Pit in 6 (or 7) to take the SC

s4lawren@sms.business.uwo.ca (Stephen Lawrence)
Western Business School  --  London, Ontario

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53551
From: gjp@sei.cmu.edu (George Pandelios)
Subject: Re: Patrick Playoffs Look Like This


In article <BSON.93Apr14154548@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu>, bson@gnu.ai.mit.edu (Jan Brittenson) writes:
|> In article <1993Apr13.132133.16224@sei.cmu.edu> gjp@sei.cmu.edu (George Pandelios) writes:
|> 
|>  > The Pens won't be playing Montreal, because Boston will win Adams
|>  > divisional play.  Buffalo and Quebec will make decent showings.
|>  > Boston, out of sheer determination, will win a game against the Pens,
|>  > but no more.  They have heart, but the Pens have too many big guns and
|>  > too many ways to win.
|> 
|>    If Boston does indeed win the Adams (nothing is certain), and
|> indeed gets to play the Pens, then I think you'll find a very
|> different Boston team this year. Boston will use every trick in the
|> book to shut down the Pens offense -- something they didn't even try
|> last year. The Pens' weak spot is defense and goaltending -- if Boston

First, I enjoyed reading your post.  Second, I disagree with the Pen's weak
spot being defense and goaltending - for a couple of reasons.  Barrasso has
had a spectacular year - no slow start, consistently sharp, GAA < 3.0, and 
leads the league in wins.  Tommy deserves the Vezina.  Given the lack of 
respect he commands, though, I doubt he will win it.  The other reason 
concerns the Pens' team defense.  They are hovering around 3rd or 4th in the
fewest goals allowed.  That is a big improvement for them, and it indicates
that they are playing better team defense.

|> can shut down the Pens' offense and get an early goal, then you have a
|> real game. If the Pens score first, then it's practically over. I
|> don't think the Pens have the discipline to stick to the team game if
|> they're held scoreless 5 minutes into the second.
|> 
|>    Boston doesn't have the guns of the Pens, but the Pens doesn't have
|> the defense, goaltending, and discipline of Boston. Still, Boston can
|> put the puck in the net. Remember that Boston is not a "run-and-gun"
|> Patrick-style team, although they played run-and-gun hockey for the
|> better part of the regular season (who doesn't). Even Neely backchecks
|> all the way in behind his own net if necessary.
|> 
|>    Penalty-killing will be a big factor. Boston are, I believe +2 over
|> the last 40-something short-handed situations, meaning they have
|> scored 4 SHG while giving up 2 PPG (one in a lackluster game against
|> Ottawa).
|> 
|>    I'd say the series will go to 5 or 6. But I'm much less certain
|> whether it will be in favor of the Pens or the B's. Their styles going
|> into the playoffs are too different to make it predictable. Still, I'd
|> place my bets on the Pens I think. My prediction is that if the B's
|> can get the first goal in four of the games, they'll take the series.
|> Otherwise the Pens will.
|> 
|>    But I'd rather wait and see whether the B's will actually get out
|> of the Adams to begin with... Buffalo, Quebec, and Montreal aren't
|> exactly planning to call it a game and go home!
|> 
|> --
|> 						-- Jan Brittenson
|> 						   bson@gnu.ai.mit.edu

We'll see.  It'll be fun.

George
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  Software Engineering Institute		usenet:	   sei!gjp
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=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
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	     Software Engineering Institute, its sponsors, customers, 
	     clients, affiliates, or Carnegie Mellon University.  In fact,
	     any resemblence of these opinions to any individual, living
	     or dead, fictional or real, is purely coincidental.  So there.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53552
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: Playoff telecasts in Atlanta

In article <1q9noa$d90@hsdndev.harvard.edu> nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219) writes:
>In article <IflYr6y00WB4A6F60A@andrew.cmu.edu> Mamatha Devineni Ratnam <mr47+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>>
>>Does anyone know if all the Patrick division games are going to be televised
>>on ESPN and ABC? If some games are going to be left out(Or blanked out by
>>dumb southern ABC affiliates), I was wondering if anyone out there knows
>>of any sports bars in Atlanta which are frequented by hockey fans. I don't
>>want to miss out on any of the Pens games. I am sure that there are some
>>Islander fans(now that the rangers are dead) who would want to watch every
>>Pens-Islanders game in Atlanta.
>
>
>Circle Tuesday,April 20th on your TV calendar. ESPN will carry Game#2
>from Pittsburgh's Civic Arena or as they are advetising it : Pittsburgh vs.
>4th place Partick Div. finisher. Personally, Bruins-Buffalo or Montreal-
>Quebec City is a much better matchup but ESPN is hoping for a spoiler
>in the Pens series which it's not likely to get the way Mario has been
>playing for the past month or so.

I'd personally prefer Buffalo-Boston, as a birthday gift from ESPN,
but I don't think the folks at ESPN will accomodate that for me ;-)
ESPN has this inexplicable affinity for the Patrick division, it
seems.  

-- 
Valerie Hammerl			"Some days I have to remind him he's not 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu	Mario Lemieux."  Herb Brooks on Claude
acscvjh@ubms.cc.buffalo.edu	Lemieux, top scorer for the Devils, but 
v085pwwpz@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu  known for taking dumb penalties.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53553
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: David Polie's future

In article <92821@hydra.gatech.EDU> gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak) writes:
>In article <gfmoD2e00iV1892owC@andrew.cmu.edu> gp2f+@andrew.cmu.edu (Gary James Patalsky) writes:
>>Bad news for the Patrick division next year.  Caps GM David Polie is
>>reportedly trying to get a front office job with the NHL.  I can't
>>believe Polie has not been fired despite 10 years of mediocrity.
>
>	YES! YES! THE IDIOT'S GONE! THE IDIOT'S GONE!!!!!!! I wish
>this happened before he traded Hrivnak. Anyway, THE IDIOT'S GONE!!!
>

He's not gone yet.  The position opening is down to Polie and the
Sabres' GM Gerry Meehan.  I think I'd like to see Meehan gone...

-- 
Valerie Hammerl			"Some days I have to remind him he's not 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu	Mario Lemieux."  Herb Brooks on Claude
acscvjh@ubms.cc.buffalo.edu	Lemieux, top scorer for the Devils, but 
v085pwwpz@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu  known for taking dumb penalties.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53554
From: jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM (Jason Cockroft)
Subject: Re: Playoff predictions

1st round: 
----------

PITT vs NYI:  PITT in 4. 

It looks like a safe bet.  NYI has been bagging it of late.
NYI and NJD have a showdown Friday night for the honour
of Pittsburg anyway.  Pigsburg in 4.

WASH vs NJD:  WASH in 6. 
I think that NJD have a solid team and will compete with
WASH.  I agree though with WASH in 6.

BOS  vs BUF:  BOS  in 5. 
The B's have been playing awesome hockey in the last
two weeks.  The only question is how long will it last?
Fuhr is a dud.  BOS in 4.

QUE  vs MON:  MON  in 7.
It seems to me that MON is much like the VAN - no chemistry.
The Habs seem to be not in stride. QUE in 5.  

CHI  vs STL:  CHI in 4. 
STL should not be in the playoffs. CHI in 4.

DET  vs TOR:  DET in 6.
I am a diehard Leaf fan but ... It seems that the Leafs
offense is shutting down in the last week.  Can they
turn it around against Detroit.  As I recall, the last
couple of time these two teams met, the Leafs were pummelled.
I don't know if Bobbie is allowed in Canada yet.  If he is,
DET in 5.  If not, DET in 6.

VAN  vs WIN:  WIN in 6.

Upset in the making here.  Another team with bad chemistry.
There is something gone foul among Linden, Momesso and Bure.
WIN in 6.

CAL  vs  LA:  CAL in 5.
Anybody that says that LA could possibly beet CAL does
not watch the Smythe a whole lot.  LA is a bunch of Geritols.
CAL in 4.


2nd round: 
----------

PITT vs WASH: PITT in 4. 
It seems to me that Pigsburg has some egos on their team.  Their
saving grace though is Bowman.  He can put anybody in their place.
However, if PIGS have a quick first round, they may be a little
too high.  WASH could be there for a surprise.  Having said that,
I will say PITT in 6.

BOS  vs MON:  BOS  in 6.
MON will not be there.  BOS is surprising me of late. Cam is great.
The couple of wins against QUE last week have sold me with the
B's.  B's in 6.


CHI  vs DET:  CHI  in 7.
Yikes.  This will not be pretty.  But DET is running like a machine
of late.  They've had a non-busy end of the season in which they played
like killers.  DET in 6.

WIN  vs CAL:  CAL  in 5.
CAL has a solid team, a little weak in the nets.  CAL will out
muscle WIN.  CAL in 5.

3rd round: 
----------

PITT vs BOS:  PITT in 5. 

I hate PITT.  My logic eludes me.  The dark side will take over
and give BOS the extra push it needs to dump PITT.  There may
be something to this - if you think of the rivalry.  BOS in 7.
CHI  vs CAL:  CHI  in 5. 

Finals:
------

PITT vs CHI: PITT in 5. 

NO, no, no.  We have BOS vs DET.  I don't know what to say
here.  Both teams will be flying and overdue.  I will go
with goaltending and muscle and say DET in 7.


-jake.





Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53555
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat


In article 6143@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca, maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>In <1993Apr14.201910.13370@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:

>>1. You have completely missed the point with the Selke trophy.  It goes
>>to the best defensive forward.  This is the forward who forgoes points
>>to help his team out defensively.  It is an unsung hero of sorts.  Yes,
>>Lemieux and Gilmour are good defensive players, but they play a more
>>offensively oriented style than a true defensive forward.  This year,
>
>You mean guys that check but can't score?  The guys who can both check
>and score shouldn't be candidates?  Is that right?

The Selke candidate forwards main purpose on a shift is to prevent goals
from being scored- not to score them.  When Lemieux or Gilmour play their
number one purpose is to score- defence is secondary- especially considering
the line that plays against them is probably a defensive one.  That is
why they are not Selke candidates.

>>2. When Tarasov called Bob Gainey the best player in the world, it was
>>assumed that he meaned the best _technical_ player- the one who knew
>>every intricacy about playing hockey and never made a technical error.
>
>And who was it that made this assumption?  All of your friends maybe?
>Sorry Greg, but 2 people aren't enough...you can "assume" all that you
>want to, but if you think Tarasov was serious then you are an idiot.

Someone posted something about this assumption being lost in translation
(it was a few months ago).  Whoever this was please repost it.

>>I agree with this assessment.  Bob Gainey may have been the best technical
>>player ever.
>
>Right Greg.  Did you see this in the Sun or something?  What did you think
>of Claude Provost?  Gainey was nothing more than a journeyman player who's
>outstanding abilities were entirely political.  He might have had a col-
>lection of defensive skills but he had absolutely no offensive skills at
>all.  None.  But perhaps you think that the abilities to pass the puck, shoot
>the puck and deke a goalie or defenseman are not technical skills?  

Gainey is the best defensive forward ever.  I stand by that assessment.
He was a very good player who belongs in the hall of fame.  Did you
ever watch him play? He never made a technical error.

<Babbling deleted>

>Gee Greg, the pundits were calling Gilmour the best two-way player in the
>league way back when he was with St. Louis.  I would have expected you to
>have picked up on that. 

Who are these pundits??  Gilmour was good with St Louis- but he was not the
best two-way player in the game when he was with them.  You have overhyped
Gilmour on this net for months.  He is a very good forward- but hardly the
best in the NHL.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53556
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat


In article 1@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi, hahietanen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi () writes:
>In article <1993Apr14.174139.6604@sol.UVic.CA>, gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:
>> 
>> 
>> +/- is a good stat because it is the only stat that I am aware of that
>> takes into account defensive play.  It isn't a measure of defensive
>> play- it takes into account offense and defence- all aspects of play.
>                                                   
>  If we are interested of real all-round players, the power play stats
>  should be considered, too. Because the power play is also one aspect 
>  of play! There is still something to be done with these player evaluation
>  tools!!

IMO any good player should score on power plays because of the man
advantage.  Very good power play scorers tend to become overrated
because their point totals are inflated by power play points.
+/- tends to expose these overrated players such as Brett Hull,
John Cullen and Dave Andreychuck.

Given the opportunity to play power play consistently, any player can
inflate his totals.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53557
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat


In article 1676@mala.bc.ca, apland@mala.bc.ca (Ron Apland) writes:
>In article <1993Apr14.174139.6604@sol.UVic.CA>, gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:
>> 
>> To adjust +/-:
>> 
>> 1. First calculate a teams +/-.  (Goals Scored - PP Goals Scored) -
>> (Goals allowed - PP Goals Allowed (when they were penalty killing)).
>> 
>> 2.  Divide this number by 5 to take into account of the fact that there
>> are 5 players on the ice and each is 1/5 responsible for the team +/-.
>> 
>> 3.  A players adjusted +/- is (His raw +/-) - (Team Adjustment).
>> 
>> BTW  If anyone could calculate and post adjusted +/- ratings it would be
>> greatly appreciated.  I might find the time to do so- but don't count on
>> it.
>
>I have a database filter set up for the player stats.  When it is posted for
>the end of season I'll repost the team averages.  You don't need to go through
>the complicated team adjustment you are using - all you need is the team
>average by summing all the individual players' +\- and divide by the total
>number of players on the team.  This will be a little distorted because the
>players who have been traded recently will have come with +\- scores based
>on their original teams.  This shouldn't distort it too bad though.  If you
>want to look at individual players from this perspective then go ahead -
>you'll require the original player stats though.

Question:
If a team uses 40 players in a season do you merely divide the total +/-
by 40?  If so, a player who plays in only 1 game is considered equally
valuable as a player who plays in all of them.

>Another way of looking at the same thing is to compare the deviation from
>the mean for the team of the player to the standard deviation for the team.
>I'll post both.

Since the standard deviation for each team is different, I am unsure how 
"transferable" between teams that these stats are.  Shouldn't the average
standard deviation in the league be used?

I am interested in seeing each method.
But I still think that mine is the best. If for no other reason than familiarity.

Gregmeister






Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53558
From: hamlet@stein.u.washington.edu (Mitch McGowan)
Subject: Minnesota recalls McGowan (HELP!!!)

  Derian Hatcher's game-misconduct penalty was rescinded by the NHL, 
allowing the Minnesota defenseman to play in the North Stars' last two 
regular-season games.  Hatcher was given the penalty during a fight at 
the end of a loss at St. Louis on Sunday, April 11.  But the league 
didn't rescind the game-misconduct penalty Shane Churla received.  The 
Stars recalled center Cal McGowan from their top minor league club in 
Kalamazoo, Mich., to replace Churla.

The above is courtesy of The Washington Times on-line service.

Now, here's where I need help.  If anyone out there has a tape of Tuesday's
Chicago-Minnesota game, please contact me.  Terms will be favorable.

Also, if anyone can tape tonight's Minnesota-Detroit game, please contact
me.  This could be quite important.  Once again, I will make it worth
your trouble.

Thanks to all.

--
rec.sport.hockey contact for Minnesota North Stars
and maintainer of the r.s.h FAQ file
Mitch McGowan a.k.a.    | KALAMAZOO WINGS  | MINNESOTA NORTH STARS |
hamlet@u.washington.edu | ST. KILDA SAINTS | TORONTO BLUE JAYS     |

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53559
From: franti@polaris.utu.fi (Pasi Fr{nti)
Subject: Re: Helsinki/Stockholm & NHL expansion?

MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF) writes:

>Not too low perhaps, but surely not as high as that of an European NHL
>division. The Finnish team, for example, would contain all players currently on
>the national team plus a top-class foreigner or two. They would be in an
>entirely different league than TPS or Jokerit, both of whom have perhaps a
>dozen players of international class - if even that. Why settle for a minor
>league when you could have the best?

It is no matter what you call the teams, Jokerit and TPS, or Helsinki Tornado
and Turku Typhoon, the best palyers in Finland would eventually end up in
those teams anyway, if they were in the "big" league. 


>I'd rather spend 150 Marks to watch the Helsinki Tornado play Montreal, the NY
>Rangers or Los Angeles than 50 Marks(?) for the privilege to see Jokerit vs.
>JypHT or even Djurgardens IF. There's nothing like the NHL, period.

Unrealistic for now. Maybe we should first just expand Finnish league to
allow teams from Baltic countries to entry!  Then others will get interested
in the idea, that maybe one should settle something bigger. The ultimate 
goal, as you want it, would be European Division in NHL. Btw. does that 
make a final with an Europan team against Norht American?

 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53560
From: rrmadiso@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca (*** CHUCK ***)
Subject: Re: Playoff predictions


Everybody.  Please send me your predictions for the Stanley Cup Playoffs!
I want to see who people think will win.!!!!!!!

Please Send them in this format, or something comparable:

1. Winner of Buffalo-Boston
2. Winner of Montreal-Quebec
3. Winner of Pittsburgh-New York
4. Winner of New Jersey-Washington
5. Winner of Chicago-(Minnesota/St.Louis)
6. Winner of Toronto-Detroit
7. Winner of Vancouver-Winnipeg
8. Winner of Calgary-Los Angeles

9. Winner of Adams Division (1-2 above)
10. Winner of Patrick Division (3-4 above)
11. Winner of Norris Division (5-6 above)
12. Winner of Smythe Division (7-8 above)

13. Winner of Wales Conference (9-10 above)
14. Winner of Campbell Conference (11-12 above)

15. Winner of Stanley Cup (13-14 above)

I will summarize the predictions, and see who is the biggest
INTERNET GURU PREDICTING GUY/GAL.

Send entries to Richard Madison
rrmadiso@napier.uwaterloo.ca

PS:  I will send my entries to one of you folks so you know when I say
I won, that I won!!!!!

:)




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53561
From: cr292@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Jim Schenk)
Subject: Re: the hawks WILL return to the finals!!!!!


The Hawks won the Norris div, and sealed their fate.  It's bad luck
to win the Norris.  The Hawks will sweep the Blues in their dreams but will
lose in 6 in reality.  I predict that in the 6 game with the Blues Belfour
will go down on his knees 7000 time s and will spend the rest of the time 
looking behind him self.  Butcher will pound Roenick and The warthawks have
no one tough enough to prevent it

Bye Bye Wart HAwks

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53562
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: My predictions

Smythe Division
---------------

Vancouver vs. Winnipeg - Jets in 7
The Jets have played the Canucks tough the last three games.  Everyone is
healthy for the Jets.  I'm biased.  :)

Calgary vs. Los Angeles - Flames in 6
From what I have seen, the Kings have looked flat lately.  I just can't see
them getting by the Flames.

Final- Jets in 6.
The Jets haven't lost to the Flames in '93.  They will, but it will be a
close series that will come down to how well Roberts has recovered.  I
don't think he'll be 100%, and while it will help, it won't be enough.

Norris Division
---------------

Chicago vs. St. Louis/Minnesota
Chicago in 6 against the Blues, 7 against the Stars.  

Detroit vs. Toronto - Wings in 6.
The Wings should be able to shutdown Gilmour and Andreychuk.  Chelvadae is
more experienced than Potvin.

Final - Hawks in 7.  Brutal series.  Probert and Chelios will go at it.
Belfour is better than Chelvadae, IMHO.

Conference Final - Hawks in 6.  It hurts, but the Hawks are more experienced,
and that will carry them through to the final.

Prince of Wales Conference
--------------------------

Adams Division
--------------

Boston vs. Buffalo - Bruins in 6.
B's can check, Juneau is darn good, and Neely.  The Sabres rely too much
on Lafontaine and Mogilny.

Quebec vs. Montreal - Montreal in 7.
Classic battle, the inexperience will hurt the Nords, this year.

Final - Bruins in 5.  Habs will be hurting from their series with the Nords,
and Boston has been able to control the scorers on the Habs.

Patrick Division
----------------

Pittsburgh vs Islanders/Devils - Pens in 5.
One word.  Mario.

Washington vs. Devils/Islanders - Caps in 6 / Devils in 7.
I think the Caps can beat the Isles, but not the Devils.  Tabaracci has been
strong in goal, and if he plays like last year, he could carry the team.
It doesn't matter, though.

Final - Pens in 5.  Two more words.  Stevens.  Jagr.

Cup Final - Pens in 6.  Three last words.  Tocchet.  Murphy.  Barrasso.

The only thing I don't like about this is that the Pens woofers are going to
be out in full force again.  (I don't mean the regular Penguin fans...it's
just like the bunch around here that if these predictions are true will post
like nuts while the Jets are winning, but we won't hear from again when they
lose.)

(Oh yeah...next year's Cup prediction...Jets in 7 over the Nords.)



Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53563
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

In <1993Apr15.160450.27799@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:

>The Selke candidate forwards main purpose on a shift is to prevent goals
>from being scored- not to score them.  When Lemieux or Gilmour play their
>number one purpose is to score- defence is secondary- especially considering
>the line that plays against them is probably a defensive one.  That is
>why they are not Selke candidates.
>Gainey is the best defensive forward ever.  I stand by that assessment.
>He was a very good player who belongs in the hall of fame.  Did you
>ever watch him play? He never made a technical error.

I watched him over his entire career.  I have NEVER seen a player, and that
includes Russell Courtnall and Davie Keon, screw up as many breakaways as
Bob Gainey.  And I will never forget the time Denis Potvin caught Gainey
with his head down.  You have been sold a bill of goods on Bob Gainey.

Gainey was a plugger.  And when the press runs out of things to say about 
the stars on dynasties they start to hype the pluggers.  Grant Fuhr, Essa
Tikkannen, Butch Goring, Bob Nystrom, Bob Gainey, Doug Jarvis, Derek
Sanderson, Wayne Cashman, Bob Baun, Bob Pulford, Ralph Backstrom, Henri
Richard, Dick Duff...and so on...

cordially, as always,

rm

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53564
From: JBE5 <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA>
Subject: WFAN (STEVE & CHIEF ON 48 HOURS)

Greetings!

Steve Summers and the Chief were on 48 Hours last night shmoozing
sports.  I unfortunately missed it.  Those of you who saw it, can
you please provide a synopsis.

Thanx.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Czar of Mainframe Computing <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA>
McGill University

---> I'M TOO SEXY FOR COBOL.

---> Habs...it doesn't look good!

---> Let's Go Expos!
                ======================================
                | Peter Peter Pumkin Eater,          |
                | Knew a chick but couldn't meet her.|
                | Saw her brother one fine day,      |
                | Sucked his cock now he's gay!      |
                |           --Andrew Dice Clay       |
                ======================================

 DISCLAIMER:
************************************************************************
*   Needless to say that the opinions expressed by THE CZAR represent  *
*   those of the faculty, staff, and students of McGill University.    *
************************************************************************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53565
From: lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico)
Subject: Pens box score 4/14

Pens-6 NJ Devils-6

FIRST PERIOD: SCORING: 1, Pittsburgh, Daniels(Needham, Tippett)4:14.
2, NJ Devils, C. Lemieux(Semak, Driver)10:19.  3, Pittsburgh, Stevens
(Tocchet, Murphy)12:40ppg.  4, NJ Devils, Zelepukin(Driver, Niedermayer)
17:26.  PENALTIES: PGH, Stevens(roughing)1:30.  NJD, Pellerin-double
minor(cross-checking)1:30.  NJD, Zelepukin(tripping)7:21.  NJD,
Stasny(holding)11:15.  PGH, Taglianetti(roughing)13:51.  NJD, Lemieux
(roughing)13:51.  PGH, Jagr(tripping)15:23.

SECOND PERIOD: SCORING: 5, Pittsburgh, Lemieux(Murphy, Tocchet)1:42.
6, NJ Devils, Semak(Lemieux, Zelepukin)2:27.  7, Pittsburgh, McEachern
(Jagr, Barrasso)4:24.  8, NJD, Stevens(Guerin, Pellerin)5:45.  9,
Pittsburgh, Lemieux(unassisted)12:40shg.  10, NJ Devils, Richer
(Nicholls)15:53.  11, NJ Devils, Lemieux(Zelepukin)17:40.  PENALTIES:
PGH, Stevens(roughing)3:06.  NJD, McKay(roughing)3:06.  PGH, Mullen
(hooking)10:42.  PGH, Tocchet(roughing)12:06.  NJD, Stevens(slashing)
12:06.  NJD, Lemieux(unsportsmanlike conduct)12:40.  PGH, U.
Samuelsson(cross checking)20:00.  PGH, Barrasso-double minor(spearing)
served by McEachern, 20:00.  NJD, Holik(cross checking)20:00.  NJD,
Lemieux(roughing)20:00.

THIRD PERIOD: SCORING: 12, Pittsburgh, Mullen(Jagr, Lemieux)18:54.
PENALTIES: NJD, Daneyko(interference)3:37.  PGH, Stevens(roughing)
9:18.  NJD, Holik(roughing)9:18.  PGH, match penalty-game misconduct,9:50.
NJD, Zelepukin(tripping)12:01.  PGH, Stevens(roughing)18:41.  NJD,
Daneyko(roughing)18:41.

OVERTIME: SCORING: No scoring.  PENALTIES: No penalties.

SHOTS ON GOAL:
Pittsburgh: 9-11-8-2=30
NJ Devils: 12-15-9-3=39

GOALIES:
Barrasso(39 shots, 33 saves. 43-14-5)
Billington(30 shots, 24 saves)

REF: Devorski  Linesmen: Gauthier, Vines

Lori
Contact for the Penguins
lli+@cs.cmu.edu


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53566
From: jae2001@andy.bgsu.edu (Jason Ehas)
Subject: Re: Giveaways

In article <1qi44l$kqr@access.digex.net>, steveg@cadkey.com (Steve
Gallichio) wrote:
> 
> 
> John P. Curcio (jpc@philabs.philips.com) responded to my drivel:
> 
> >steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio) writes:
> > 
> >>I still am surprised that no one has tried giving away the goodies at the end
> >>of the game. The two problems with that, of course, are that you would want
> >>to make sure the first people in the building would be assured of getting
> >>them (probably redeemable vouchers), and that the building managers want to
> >>avoid at all costs delaying people as they leave the building, if, for
> >>instance, the goodies are given to people as they exit.
> >
> >I went to the New Jersey Devils/Carvel Ice Cream Puck Night (tm) last year to
> >see the beloved Bruins play.  The pucks were given out at the end of the game.
> >I could just imagine what would have happened late in the third if the Bruins
> >were winning....
> 
> It figures, after I posted the first article, I found out that the Whalers are
> going to be using coupons for the the giveaway on Friday Night. I believe that
> is is the "Some Big Corporation (Probably a Bank) Flying Disk Night." I think
> that we could all see the potential for danger here...
> 
> >|> All in all, I have seen a whole bunch of giveaways land on the ice, and it
> >|> never ceases to amuse me. I'm just thankful for the players that no one has
> >|> yet to sponsor 'Lead Pipe Night' at any arenas...
> >
> >That's probably because they couldn't find anyone to sponser it... Maybe USS
> >could sponser the Pittsburgh Penguins/US Steel Steel Rod Night-- close enough?
> 
> Naah, it'd probably bounce off of Jay Caufield.
> 
> -SG

I was at a Cincinnati Cyclones game a year ago when the local country
station sponsored a kazoo giveaway.  After a particularly bad call by the
underexperienced ECHL ref, it was Kazoostorm time down on the ice.  I
thought this was a pathetic display by the fans, but they were rightfully
unhappy.

Jason

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53567
From: ad215@Freenet.carleton.ca (Rachel Holme)
Subject: Re: Canucks clinch, Bure to score 20 playoff goals


In a previous article, steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio) says:
>
>Ron Apland (apland@mala.bc.ca) writes:
>> Quinn will resign as head coach (this is no secret) and HOPEFULLY they will 
>> BRING IN someone who looks at the game spatially and institutes some team 
>> disciplined play.  How about Keenan?  Give him what he wants, GM and Coach,
>> and have Quinn upstairs as president.
>
>I was under the impression that Rick Ley was in line for the Canucks job
>should Quinn step off the bench. Ley coached in the Canucks' organization

BRING BACK HARRY!  (NEALE)  At least he was witty...

-- 
ad215@freenet.carleton.ca (Rachel Holme)]

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53568
From: loh@fraser.sfu.ca (Keith Meng-Wei Loh)
Subject: Re: Hockey and the Hispanic community

rickc@wrigley.corp.sgi.com (Richard Casares) writes:

>In article <115331@bu.edu>, icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera) writes:
>|> 
>|> 	The presence of the new team in Miami(I can't say South Florida;
>|> it's too long) makes me think of an interesting question. Can you sell
>|> the Hispanic community on Hockey? Miami is 60-70% Hispanic. This
>|> community
>|> has no experience and no previous exposure to Hockey that I know of.
>|> The
>|> teams in NY and LA which also have big Hispanic groups do not seem to
>|> try
>|> to woo this group. What will Miami do? Could they get Spanish-language
>|> tv and radio coverage?
>|> 

>You'll have a hard time selling any sport to a community that
>can't play it on account of availability or financial reasons.
>Hockey is pretty much a sport for the white and well off.

Well, suffice to say that it is a sport for those able to make the
substantial investment in equipment, etc. But here's something, do 
you think that the availability of in-line skates and road hockey
could contribute to a rise in awareness of ice hockey? I would
argue this is having an effect here. Kids play ice hockey in the
winter and road hockey in the summer with in-line skates. 


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53569
From: tvartiai@vipunen.hut.fi (Tommi Vartiainen)
Subject: Re: Suhonen will NOT go to Jokerit

In <tvartiai.734823058@vipunen.hut.fi> tvartiai@vipunen.hut.fi (Tommi Vartiainen) writes:

>According to the inside information, Alpo Suhonen won't be the next headcoach
>of Jokerit. It's pretty sure that Boris Majorov will continue, although owner
>of the team previously said that he will chance the coach.

>Tommi
Wrong information. They just announced that Suhonen has made a deal with 
Jokerit.
 

Tommi

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53570
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Mogilny must be benched.

In article <wong.734890713@sfu.ca> wong@fraser.sfu.ca (Sam S. Wong) writes:
>> About 4 or 5 weeks ago I read in the Toronto Sun a quote from Alex; it
>> went something like [sarcastically]:
>> "Yep, Patty's the man.  He's responsible for the team's success...I'm a 
>> nobody around here."

>How can you assume it was a sarcastic remark?
>For someone whose first language is not English, I would interpret
>that comment to mean that he believes Pat is the MVP on the team and that
>he is just one of the other normal players.  Quite modest I might say.

Well, I don't recall assuming anything, except perhaps that the columnist 
who reported the incident was telling the truth i.e. the sarcastic impression
came from _him_ (Steve Simmons?).  Besides, to my knowledge Alex has a pretty
fair grasp of the English language...and his recent comment after the Detroit
game would indicate that this remark _is_ what I think it to be.  Very low.


dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53571
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat


In article 20009@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca, maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>In <1993Apr15.160450.27799@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:

>>Gainey is the best defensive forward ever.  I stand by that assessment.
>>He was a very good player who belongs in the hall of fame.  Did you
>>ever watch him play? He never made a technical error.
>
>I watched him over his entire career.  I have NEVER seen a player, and that
>includes Russell Courtnall and Davie Keon, screw up as many breakaways as
>Bob Gainey.  And I will never forget the time Denis Potvin caught Gainey
>with his head down.  You have been sold a bill of goods on Bob Gainey.
>
>Gainey was a plugger.  And when the press runs out of things to say about 
>the stars on dynasties they start to hype the pluggers.  Grant Fuhr, Essa
>Tikkannen, Butch Goring, Bob Nystrom, Bob Gainey, Doug Jarvis, Derek
>Sanderson, Wayne Cashman, Bob Baun, Bob Pulford, Ralph Backstrom, Henri
>Richard, Dick Duff...and so on...

These players all are pretty good players.  They are the depth that the
dynasties had to win Stanley Cups.  They tend to be the very good second
line guys- who would be first liners on most weaker clubs in the NHL.
They were all important to their clubs.  Probably, several of these
Stanley Cup winning teams would not have won the cups they did if it
were not for the depth provided by these players.

They compare to Rick Tocchet and Ron Francis of the Penguins.  Very good
players who can lead lesser teams (Francis-Hartford, Tocchet-Philly) who
provide the depth to the team that is currently best in the NHL.

As a defensive forward, there have been none better than Bob Gainey.  That
doesn't mean he was the best player (or even the best forward) the Canadians
had at that time, but he was excellent at what he did.  Gainey could
dominate games with his defence.  He didn't need to get goals to dominate.
He shut down the opposition and was thus valuable.  There has never been
anyone any better at doing this.  Not ever.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53572
From: horse@dead.duc.auburn.edu (John Horstman)
Subject: Re: Washington To Beat Pitt

In article KKq@acsu.buffalo.edu, v128r82w@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Ralph L d'Ambrosio) writes:
>In article <1993Apr14.015415.10176@mprgate.mpr.ca>, tasallot@galaxy.mpr.ca (Mathew Tasalloti) writes...
>> 
>>If the Penguins get out of the Patrick, they will win the
>>cup.  However, their hardest task is to get out of that division.
>>I'm sure that Washington will most definitly throw a rench into the
>>Penguin plans.  I'm a Canucks fan (not that I think much of their
>>chances this year), but it seems to me like Washington is the ONLY
>>team that can stop the Penguins from winning their next Stanley Cup.
>
>I was under the impression that the Penguins has had the Caps number for 
>most of the season.
>
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>=============================================******>>
>> 
>>  Mathew Tasalloti
>>  MPR Teltech Ltd.
>>  Vancouver, BC, Canada    
>> 
>>              <<******==================================================
>********************************************************************************
>Of course no one asked me, I always interject my opinions on matters I have no
>concern over.
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Go Islanders, Playoffs here we come
>Go Jets for '93
>********************************************************************************


And last year the Capitals had the Pens number up until about game 3 of the playoffs.




John Horstmann

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53573
From: grogers@slacvx.slac.stanford.edu (Greg Rogers)
Subject: Hockey on TV in the Bay area, NOT!

Hi all,

I don't get the sport's channel and I'm desparate for some playoff action
(especially the Cannucks).  Does anyone know of a sports bar on the Bay
Peninsula that will be showing hockey games.  I'm looking for something 
between redwood City and Mountain View.

Thanks a lot,
Greg

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53574
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Goalie mask poll


	Here is an update on the Goalie mask poll...
	First, since so many people gave me their 3 best, I decided to
give 3 pts for their favorite, 2 pts for 2nd, 1 for 3rd. If you e-mailed
a response with only one, I gave it 3 pts. Please feel free to send me
your 2 other favorites, if you only sent one before. 
	Also, votes are still welcome! Any mask you like will do, as I 
have received votes for players not in the NHL. Please mention what team
they play for, though.
	So here are the up-to-date results so far:

Player                 Team              Pts     Votes
-------------------------------------------------------
1. Ed Belfour          Chicago            8        4
   Andy Moog           Boston             8        3
3. Curtis Joseph       St. Louis          5        2
4. Brian Hayward       San Jose           4        2
5. Grant Fuhr          Buffalo            3        1
   Ron Hextall         Quebec             3        1
7. Clint Malarchuk     Buffalo            2        1
   Manon Rheaume       Atlanta (IHL)      2        1
9. John Casey          Minnesota          1        1
   Rick Wamsley        Toronto (retired)  1        1

	Thanks to all that voted, and keep 'em coming!

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53575
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Washington To Beat Pitt

In article <C5J59C.GED@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil> galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin) writes:
>In article <93105.052120RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>>In article <1993Apr14.015415.10176@mprgate.mpr.ca>, tasallot@galaxy.mpr.ca
>>(Mathew Tasalloti) says:
>>>chances this year), but it seems to me like Washington is the ONLY
>>>team that can stop the Penguins from winning their next Stanley Cup.
>>
>>  Really? I think both the Islanders and Devils would have a better chance
>>at the Penguins than the Capitals, IMO.
>
>Really?  What makes you think the Islanders have a better shot?  They
>couldn't even beat the Whalers in two games!

Yes, but as has been mentioned many times before, the Islanders play at
the talent level of their opponent.  Since Hartford is pitiful, the
Islanders played pitiful.  Since Pittsburgh is great, the Isles will most
likely play great.  This is most likely due to inexperience and very poor
shooting.  To Greg: yes, I have noticed that the Islanders couldn't hit
the broad side of a barn with the puck if they were two feet in front of
it.  Does anyone have shooting percentages?  I don't know if that would
help, since they often miss the net completely, but it might shed some
light on the subject.

And, my playoff pool is running!!!  Exact rules to be posted tomorrow, but
don't hesitate to send in picks!!!

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53576
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Goalie masks

My vote goes to John Vanbiesbrouck.  His mask has a skyline of New York
City, and on the sides there are a bunch of bees (Beezer).  It looks
really sharp.

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53577
From: cbn7g@Virginia.EDU (Christopher Bass Nystrom)
Subject: Re: ESPN Tonight

swartzjh@RoseVC.Rose-Hulman.Edu writes:
> Has anyone heard what game ESPN is showing tonight.  They said they will
> show whatever game means the most playoff-wise. I would assume this would
> be the Blues-Tampa game or the Minnesota-Red Wings game...  Anyone heard for
> sure???
> 
> 
> 		Jeff Swartz


It's going to be the Stars - Wings game

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53578
From: sclark@epas.utoronto.ca (Susan Clark)
Subject: Who picks first?

	According to THE FAN here in T.O., Ottawa has won the Daigle e
sweepstakes.  They didn't mention why, but San Jose had more goals
than the Sen-sens, so I have a hunch this is why Ottawa would pick
first.....

Susan


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53579
From: 35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca
Subject: Re: Stop predicting

In article <1993Apr16.060010.10012@ncsu.edu>, cdkaupan@eos.ncsu.edu (CARL DAVID KAUPANG) writes:
> 
> It is really annoying to see all of these
> predictions on the Net.  Who really cares
> who you think will win?  Please stop with
> the predictions, we all know the Caps are
> going to win the Cup, so let it go at that.
> 
> 
In the words of Doktor Kultur, in the Ottawa Citizen,
"Remember to unhook the Nitrous Oxide before you leave
the Dentist Chair!"  8^)

GO JETS (for once, in the playoffs, please, I beg of you...)
Paul Badertscher
35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53580
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Stan Fischler, 4/16 (Keenan stuff!)

In article <1993Apr17.015225.29031@news.columbia.edu> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>
>* The Oilers will charge to eat in the Press Room next year.
>

There was an article in one of the Toronto papers about this a few
months ago...probably the Globe and Mail...

...any ethical "journalist", even a sports journalist should not
accept free meals from a team in any case, which was the one of
the points the article was making.

Admittdly, most sports reporting is mostly with any ethical
standards...

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53581
From: apland@mala.bc.ca (Ron Apland)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

In article <1993Apr16.222846.17764@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca>, golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
> It is meaningless to compare one player's plus/minus statistic with
> another players' out of the context of the role and the playing time
> of the players involved.    

It's just as meaningless to compare goals, assists, PIM and any other stat I
can think of.  Each player is asked to take a unique role for his team.  The
contexts will never be the same from one player to another playing on the
same team or different teams.  And yet ... awards are given and promotions
received based in part on these meaningless stats.  The operative words are
"in part" - stats must be interpreted, tempered with other information one
has about the player.  


> To compare Jagr's and Francis's plus/minus is ridiculous and absurd...

And comparing Jagr's and Francis's points is just as ridiculous and absurd...
but not more ridiculous and absurd as comparing goals, assists, points, +\-
for Selanne, Lindros, Juneau, Potvin, and the other rookies in the league...
and yet...

How about looking at them for what they are and enjoy the game.

Ron

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53582
From: "James J. Murawski" <jjm+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: This Year's vs. Next Year's Playoffs


Well, since someone probably wanted to know, here's this year's playoff
matchups on the left, and what the matchups would be next year under the
new alignment and playoff-matchup rules.  The same 16 teams make the playoffs
under next year's rules, and three of the first round matchups are the same
(QUE-MTL, CHI-STL, VAN-WIN).

PIT --+                      +-- CHI | PIT --+                      +-- CHI
      +---+              +---+       |       +---+              +---+
NJ  --+   |              |   +-- STL | BUF --+   |              |   +-- STL
          +---+      +---+           |           +---+      +---+
WAS --+   |   |      |   |   +-- DET | QUE --+   |   |      |   |   +-- TOR
      +---+   |      |   +---+       |       +---+   |      |   +---+
NYI --+       |      |       +-- TOR | MTL --+       |      |       +-- CAL
              +------+               |               +------+
BOS --+       |      |       +-- VAN | WAS --+       |      |       +-- VAN
      +---+   |      |   +---+       |       +---+   |      |   +---+
BUF --+   |   |      |   |   +-- WIN | NJ  --+   |   |      |   |   +-- WIN
          +---+      +---+           |           +---+      +---+
QUE --+   |              |   +-- CAL | BOS --+   |              |   +-- DET
      +---+              +---+       |       +---+              +---+
MTL --+                      +-- LA  | NYI --+                      +-- LA


====================================================================
    Jim Murawski
    Sr. Software Engineer               (412) 268-2650  [office]
    Administrative Computing and        (412) 268-6868  [fax]
         Information Services           jjm+@andrew.cmu.edu
    Carnegie Mellon University          Office: UCC 155
    4910 Forbes Avenue
    Pittsburgh, PA 15213-3890

    "Le Mieux!  Le Magnifique!  Soixante Six!  Claude...NON!"

There are 1374 days until Clinton (Clinocchio) leaves office (1373 too many).


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53583
From: seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr)
Subject: FLYERS notes 4/17



The FLYERS closed out the season last night with their 8th straight victory,
a 5-4 OT winner over the Hartford Whalers. The OT game winner came from Dimitri
Yushkevich, just his 5th of the season and his first game winner. The FLYERS
never led up until that point in the game. For the Whalers, the loss marked an
NHL record 9th OT loss this season.

Roster move:

Gord Hynes was called to to play in place of Ryan McGill

Injuries:

Ryan McGill injured his hand in a fight 4/15 and was scratched.

Lines:

Eklund-Lindros-Recchi
Beranek-Brind'Amour-Dineen
Lomakin-Butsayev-Conroy
Faust-Acton-Brown

Galley-Bowen
Yushkevich-Hawgood
Carkner-Hynes

Dominic Roussel

Game Summary:

I didn't get TV coverage of the game, and since it was stormy in these parts
I didn't have the best radio coverage either. Here's the box score followed by
a few things I did pick up:

First Period:
	Hartford, Nylander 10, 8:51
	Philadelphia, Recchi 53 (Lindros, Brind'Amour), 19:59.8 (pp)
Penalties - Verbeek, Har (holding), :55; Carkner, Phi (roughing), 13:53; Houda,
Har (interference) 18:43

Second Period:
	Hartford, Burt 6 (Cunneyworth, Kron), 2:00
	Philadelphia, Bowen 1 (Eklund, Recchi), 7:09
	Hartford, Nylander 11 (Zalapski, Sanderson), 9:38
Penalties - Galley, Phi, major-game misconduct (spearing) :58; Verbeek, Har
major-game misconduct (spearing), :58; Brown, Phi (tripping), 3:22; Zalapski,
Har (tripping), 15:51; Brind'Amour, Phi (slashing), 19:50

Third Period:
	Hartford, Kron 14 (Sanderson, Cassels), 1:24 (pp)
	Philadelphia, Beranek 15 (Lomakin, Yushkevich), 3:11
	Philadelphia, Faust 2 (Brind'Amour, Roussel), 3:38
Penalties - Houda, Har (tripping), 4:20; Hawgood, Phi (holding), 5:30

Overtime:
	Philadelphia, Yushkevich 5 (Faust), 1:15.
Penalties - None

Power Play:
	Philadelphia 1 of 4, Hartford 1 of 4

Goalies:
	Philadelphia, Roussel 14-11-5 (30 shots - 26 saves)
	Hartford, Lenarduzzi, 1-1-1 (38 - 33)

On the first Hartford goal, Gord Hynes misplayed the puck at the FLYERS blue
line and Nylander stripped him and took off.

The Recchi goal was a 2 on 1 with Lindros.

The Bowen goal was just a puck he threw at the net, got a good carom and it
ended up behind the goalie.

On the second Nylander goal he got three whacks at the puck before it went in.
This is the most frustrating part of the FLYERS defense. Take the body, and if
they get one shot and beat you fine. Don't give them another chance. Carkner,
Galley and McGill are all terrible about this, I'll bet money at least one of
them was the closest FLYER to the play.

That's all I have, my radio got bad after that and I was lucky to know who it
was that scored, much less how.

From what I heard, Roussel had a very strong game. After the game, Gene Hart
asked Bobby Taylor to pick the three stars of the season rather than of the
game. It was Garry Galley #3 for his career high point total (I'm surprised
that a former goalie wouldn't look closer at his defensive play), Tommy 
Soderstrom #2 for his team record tying 5 shutouts in only about 1/2 a season
and, Mark Recchi #1 for his all time high team single season scoring mark.
But here's the odd part. He couldn't decide between Lindros and Recchi for
number 1. If he picks Recchi as #1 after he had a hard time choosing between
him and Lindros, doesn't that make Lindros #2????

What? You wanna know my three stars of the season? Well, since you asked...

#1 Eric Lindros. Eric dominates a game simply by stepping out onto the ice.
The difference between the team's record with him and without him is no
accident. I believe that the team could have been almost as successful without
Recchi. There is no question that this team is significantly better with Eric
Lindros on it, and I think that he will deservedly wear the 'C' on his jersey
next season.

#2 Tommy Soderstrom. 5 shutouts was second in the league to only Ed Belfour,
and Tommy didn't have a Chris Chelios (booo) in front of him. He also didn't
play a complete season due to heart problems (sentimental edge here, my family
has a history of heart problems). There's no question in my mind that Tommy
Soderstrom is this teams goalie of the future, and if Roussel complains again
about being number 2 look for him to be traded within 2 years.

#3 Mark Recchi. Again, you can't argue with an all-time team high single season
scoring mark. There are an awful lot of teams that didn't have a single player
get as many points. Plus, Mark is the only FLYER to play the entire season.
Not a tough choice.

Honorable mentions: Rod Brind'Amour topped his single season high point total
which he set last year. The difference was that he wasn't on the top line
this year and didn't get as much playing time. Then again, he didn't get the
defensive attention that he got last year from the other team either.

Dimtri Yushkevich was the teams most consistent defenseman. Yes, he made rookie
mistakes, but he was usually fast enough to make up for them. I have a feeling
that with his shot he'll score a few more points next year without giving up
anything in his own zone, and I suspect that he'll be the teams top defenseman
in years to come.

Garry Galley was the team's point leader from defensemen. Again, there are some
things you just can't argue with. And he battled with chronic fatigue syndrome,
he certainly deserves kudos for only missing one game, and that was against his
wishes under doctors orders. But his defensive play often negates his offensive
contribution. A little more caution, and a little bit smarter in his own end
will make him a much more important part of the team next year.

Brent Fedyk was the leagues biggest improvement over last years point total.
But consistency became a problem for him.

A couple misc notes mostly for mailing list members:

Tom Misnik, a member of the mailing list, would like to exchange E-mail
addresses with any list members who want to keep in touch over the summer.
If you're interested, you can send him mail at:

att!ACR.ORG!TMISNIK

The FLYERS end the season 1 game below .500 in 5th place, their best winning
percentage since going .500 in 1988-89. 14-20-3 within the division (4th in
Patrick), 23-14-5 at home. They finished 17th overall, will draft 10th in
next years entry draft (Quebec had the 1st rounder, though). They scored as
many goals as they allowed, 319.

The 8 straight wins is the most since they won 13 in a row in 1985.

I will be sending out final stats as soon as I get the issue of the Hockey
News that contains them, since there are no more games for me to go to I have
no other way of getting them.

I hope you've all enjoyed this years hockey season as much as I have. Knowing
the future that we have coming to us made missing the playoffs one more time
almost bearable.

FLYERS team record watch:

Eric Lindros:

41 goals, 34 assists, 75 points

(rookie records)
club record goals:			club record points:
Eric Lindros	40 1992-93		Dave Poulin	76 1983-84
Brian Propp	34 1979-80		Brian Propp	75 1979-80
Ron Flockhart	33 1981-82		Eric Lindros	75 1992-93
Dave Poulin	31 1983-84		Ron Flockhart	72 1981-82
Bill Barber	30 1972-73		Pelle Eklund	66 1985-86

Mark Recchi:

53 goals, 70 assists, 123 points.

club record goals:			club record points:
Reggie Leach	61 1975-76		Mark Recchi	123 1992-93*
Tim Kerr	58 1985-86,86-87	Bobby Clarke	119 1975-76
Tim Kerr	54 1983-84,84-85	Bobby Clarke	116 1974-75
Mark Recchi	53 1992-93*		Bill Barber	112 1975-76
Rick Macliesh	50 1972-73		Bobby Clarke	104 1972-73
Bill Barber	50 1975-76		Rick Macliesh	100 1972-73
Reggie Leach	50 1979-80

*More than 80 games.

FLYERS career years:

Player		Points	Best Prior Season
Mark Recchi	123	113 (90-91 Penguins)
Rod Brind'Amour	86	77 (91-92 FLYERS)
Garry Galley	62	38 (84-85 Kings)
Brent Fedyk	59	35 (90-91 Red Wings)

That's all for now...

pete clark jr - rsh FLYERS contact and mailing list owner


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53584
From: 06paul@ac.dal.ca
Subject: My Predictions of a classic playoff year!

Here is yet another prediction for them great playoffs!
(you may laugh at your convenience!) :)

	Adams Division (I hate the NE (name) divisoin!!!)

BOS vs BUF   BOS in 5  (the B's are hot lately!)

MON vs QUE   MON in 7  (This will be the series to watch in the first round!)


BOS vs MON   MON in 7  (this may be a bit biased but I feel the Canadiens will
		       (smarten up and start playing they played two months ago
			( i.e. bench Savard !!!)
	Patrick Division 

PIT vs NJD   PIT in 6  (It wont be a complete cake walk... there be a few lumps
			(in the cake batter!)

WAS vs NYI   WAS in 6  	(This will not be an exciting series..IMO)


PITT vs WAS  PIT in 4   (Washington will be tired after the NYI)

	Norris Division

CHI vs StL    CHI in 5   (StL will get a lucky game in)

TOR vs DET    TOR in 7   (THis , like MON vs QUE, will be another intense 
			 (series to watch!)

CHI vs TOR    TOR in 7   (Potvin will be settling in nicely by this point.)

	Smythe Division

VAN vs WIN     VAN in 5  (Teemu is great, but Vancouver better as a team!)

CAL vs LAK     CAL in 6  (Gretzky is great, but Calgary has been on fire lately)
				...sorry for the pun... um, no I am not! :)

VAN vs CAL     VAN in 6  (This will be a great series! but VAN has proven they
			 (Will not lie down and get beat!)

	Wales Conference finals

Pittsburgh vs Montreal    	Montreal in 6 (Montreal IMHO is the only team
					      (that has a chance against 
						Pittsburgh.)

	Campbell Conference finals

Vancouver vs Toronto		Toronto in 6  (Potvin will be series MVP)


	STANLEY CUP FINALS  

Toronto Maple Leafs    vs    Montreal Canadiens    
	(The Classic Stanley Cup Final matchup!!) <---also a dream come true!

	Montreal wins the Stanley cup in the 7th game 1 - 0 in double overtime.
Roy and Potvin are spectacular throughout the series and share series MVP (if 
that is possible) Vincent Damphouse nets game winner from a brilliant pass by
Brian Bellows! Canadiens star(?) Denis Savard watched his buddies play from the
owners box nursing that splinter on his thumb which has left him on the 
disabled list since the first game of the playoffs (awww shucks). 

***************************************YEE HAA!!*******************************
*poof* And I wake up :)
Well that is my predictions...I hope and dream they come true. and you can stop
laughing anytime :)

							Paul
						Die hard Habs Fan living with
						3 Die hard Leafs fans!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53585
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL playoff results, 4/16

AHL CALDER CUP PLAYOFF GAME(S) PLAYED ON 4/16
Providence 3	SPRINGFIELD 2	(OT)	
Baltimore 4	BINGHAMTON 3		
Utica 3		ROCHESTER 2	(OT)	
Cape Breton 5	FREDERICTON 2		

GAME(S) SCHEDULED FOR 4/17
Capital District at Adirondack		
Providence at Springfield
Baltimore at Binghamton
Utica at Rochester			
Moncton vs St John's at Halifax		
					
SERIES STATI (plural of status? :)
Adirondack leads CDI, 1-0
Springfield leads Providence, 2-1
Baltimore leads Binghamton 1-0
Utica leads Rochester, 1-0
St John's leads Moncton, 1-0
Cape Breton tied w/Fredericton, 1-1
	
=================================================
=================================================
FULL 1993 CALDER CUP PLAYOFF SCHEDULE AND RESULTS	
home team in CAPS		*=if necesary

FIRST ROUND					
Springfield Indians vs Providence Bruins
Gm 1:	Springfield 3	PROVIDENCE 2	
Gm 2:	Springfield 5	PROVIDENCE 4
Gm 3:	Providence 3	SPRINGFIELD 2
Gm 4:	4/17	Providence at Springfield
Gm 5:	4/22	Springfield at Providence	
Gm 6:	4/24	Providence at Springfield	*
Gm 7:	4/27	Springfield at Providence	*

CD Islanders vs Adirondack Red Wings
Gm 1:	ADIRONDACK 6	CDI 2
Gm 2:	4/17	CDI at Adirondack
Gm 3:	4/18	Adirondack at CDI
Gm 4:	4/21	Adirondack at CDI
Gm 5:	4/23	CDI at Adirondack	*
Gm 6:	4/24	Adirondack at CDI	*
Gm 7:	4/26	CDI at Adirondack	*

Baltimore Skipjacks at Binghamton Rangers
Gm 1:	Baltimore 4	BINGHAMTON 3	
Gm 2:	4/17	Baltimore at Binghamton
Gm 3:	4/23	Binghamton at Baltimore
Gm 4:	4/24	Binghamton at Baltimore
Gm 5:	4/26	Baltimore at Binghamton	*
Gm 6:	4/28	Binghmaton at Baltimore	*
Gm 7:	4/30	Baltimore at Binghamton	*
		
Utica Devils vs Rochester Americans
Gm 1:	Utica 3		Rochester 2	(OT)
Gm 2:	4/17	Utica at Rochester
Gm 3:	4/20	Rochester at Utica
Gm 4:	4/22	Rochester at Utica
Gm 5:	4/24	Utica at Rochester	*
Gm 6:	4/26	Rochester at Utica	*
Gm 7:	4/28	Utica at Rochester	*

Moncton Hawks vs St John's Maple Leafs
Gm 1:	St John's 4	Moncton 2
Gm 2:	4/17	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax
Gm 3:	4/21	St John's at Moncton
Gm 4:	4/23	St John's at Moncton
Gm 5:	4/26	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax	*
Gm 6:	4/28	St John's at Moncton		*
Gm 7:	4/30	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax	*

Cape Breton Oilers vs Fredericton Canadiens
Gm 1:	FREDERICTON 4	Cape Breton 3	(2OT)
Gm 2:	Cape Breton 5	FREDERICTON 2
Gm 3:	4/20	Fredericton at Cape Breton
Gm 4:	4/22	Fredericton at Cape Breton
Gm 5:	4/24	Cape Breton at Fredericton	
Gm 6:	4/26	Fredericton at Cape Breton	*
Gm 7:	4/28	Cape Breton at Fredericton	*

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL and ECAC contact for rec.sport.hockey		Go USA Hockey!	   +	
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    + CONGRATS TO THE BOSTON BRUINS, 1992-93 ADAMS DIVISION CHAMPIONS      +
    + PHOENIX SUNS, 1992-93 PACIFIC DIVISION CHAMPIONS			   +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++






Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53586
From: downec@crockett1a.its.rpi.edu (Christopher Stevan Downey)
Subject: Re: This Year's vs. Next Year's Playoffs

Let's fill in some winners here:

|> 
|> Well, since someone probably wanted to know, here's this year's playoff
|> matchups on the left, and what the matchups would be next year under the
|> new alignment and playoff-matchup rules.  The same 16 teams make the playoffs
|> under next year's rules, and three of the first round matchups are the same
|> (QUE-MTL, CHI-STL, VAN-WIN).
|> 
|> PIT --+                      +-- CHI | PIT --+                      +-- CHI
|>       +PIT+              +CHI+       |       +---+              +---+
|> NJ  --+   |              |   +-- STL | BUF --+   |              |   +-- STL
|>           +NYI+      +DET+           |           +---+      +---+
|> WAS --+   |   |      |   |   +-- DET | QUE --+   |   |      |   |   +-- TOR
|>       +NYI+   |      |   +DET+       |       +---+   |      |   +---+
|> NYI --+       | *BOS*|       +-- TOR | MTL --+       |      |       +-- CAL
|>               +------+               |               +------+
|> BOS --+       |  DET |       +-- VAN | WAS --+       |      |       +-- VAN
|>       +BOS+   |      |   +VAN+       |       +---+   |      |   +---+
|> BUF --+   |   |      |   |   +-- WIN | NJ  --+   |   |      |   |   +-- WIN
|>           +BOS+      +VAN+           |           +---+      +---+
|> QUE --+   |              |   +-- CAL | BOS --+   |              |   +-- DET
|>       +QUE+              +CAL+       |       +---+              +---+
|> MTL --+                      +-- LA  | NYI --+                      +-- LA
|> 

Just my thoughts,
Chris
downec@rpi.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53587
From: downec@crockett1a.its.rpi.edu (Christopher Stevan Downey)
Subject: Re: My Predictions of a classic playoff year!

In article <1993Apr17.152611.12934@ac.dal.ca>, 06paul@ac.dal.ca writes:
|> Here is yet another prediction for them great playoffs!
|> (you may laugh at your convenience!) :)
|> 
|> 	Adams Division (I hate the NE (name) divisoin!!!)
|> 
|> BOS vs BUF   BOS in 5  (the B's are hot lately!)
|> 
|> MON vs QUE   MON in 7  (This will be the series to watch in the first round!)
|> 
|> 
|> BOS vs MON   MON in 7  (this may be a bit biased but I feel the Canadiens will
|> 		       (smarten up and start playing they played two months ago
|> 			( i.e. bench Savard !!!)
|> 	Patrick Division 
|> 
|> PIT vs NJD   PIT in 6  (It wont be a complete cake walk... there be a few lumps
|> 			(in the cake batter!)
|> 
|> WAS vs NYI   WAS in 6  	(This will not be an exciting series..IMO)
|> 
|> 
|> PITT vs WAS  PIT in 4   (Washington will be tired after the NYI)
|> 
|> 	Norris Division
|> 
|> CHI vs StL    CHI in 5   (StL will get a lucky game in)
|> 
|> TOR vs DET    TOR in 7   (THis , like MON vs QUE, will be another intense 
|> 			 (series to watch!)
|> 
|> CHI vs TOR    TOR in 7   (Potvin will be settling in nicely by this point.)
|> 
|> 	Smythe Division
|> 
|> VAN vs WIN     VAN in 5  (Teemu is great, but Vancouver better as a team!)
|> 
|> CAL vs LAK     CAL in 6  (Gretzky is great, but Calgary has been on fire lately)
|> 				...sorry for the pun... um, no I am not! :)
|> 
|> VAN vs CAL     VAN in 6  (This will be a great series! but VAN has proven they
|> 			 (Will not lie down and get beat!)
|> 
|> 	Wales Conference finals
|> 
|> Pittsburgh vs Montreal    	Montreal in 6 (Montreal IMHO is the only team
|> 					      (that has a chance against 
|> 						Pittsburgh.)
|> 
|> 	Campbell Conference finals
|> 
|> Vancouver vs Toronto		Toronto in 6  (Potvin will be series MVP)
|> 
|> 
|> 	STANLEY CUP FINALS  
|> 
|> Toronto Maple Leafs    vs    Montreal Canadiens    
|> 	(The Classic Stanley Cup Final matchup!!) <---also a dream come true!
|> 
|> 	Montreal wins the Stanley cup in the 7th game 1 - 0 in double overtime.
|> Roy and Potvin are spectacular throughout the series and share series MVP (if 
|> that is possible) Vincent Damphouse nets game winner from a brilliant pass by
|> Brian Bellows! Canadiens star(?) Denis Savard watched his buddies play from the
|> owners box nursing that splinter on his thumb which has left him on the 
|> disabled list since the first game of the playoffs (awww shucks). 
|> 
|> ***************************************YEE HAA!!*******************************
|> *poof* And I wake up :)
|> Well that is my predictions...I hope and dream they come true. and you can stop
|> laughing anytime :)
|> 
|> 							Paul
|> 						Die hard Habs Fan living with
|> 						3 Die hard Leafs fans!

I only have one comment on this:  You call this a *classic* playoff year
and yet you don't include a Chicago-Detroit series.  C'mon, I'm a Boston
fan and I even realize that Chicago-Detroit games are THE most exciting
games to watch.

Chris
downec@rpi.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53588
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Who picks first?

Ottawa picks first, because they had fewer wins during the season, the
first tiebreaker.

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53589
From: jason@studsys.mscs.mu.edu (Jason Hanson)
Subject: Re: NHL team in Milwaukee

Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Re: NHL team in Milwaukee
Summary: 
Expires: 
References: <1qhsfe$80v@access.digex.net> <1993Apr15.093354.14844@abo.fi> <1993Apr16.131843.24012@walter.cray.com>
Sender: 
Followup-To: 
Distribution: 
Organization: Marquette University - Department MSCS
Keywords: 

In article <1993Apr16.131843.24012@walter.cray.com> cbetz@radioman.cray.com (Charles Betz  {x66442 CF/ENG}) writes:
>
>Bradley Center in Milwaukee is home to the Milwaukee Admirals minor leauge
>hockey team.  The owner of the Admirals (sorry, I can't remember his name)
>either owns or at least shelled out the majority of the funds to build the
>Bradley Center.

Lloyd Pettit married into Allen-Bradley Corp. (ab.com) family and owns the
Admirals.  He donated the Bradley Center and the new Pettit National Ice
Center.

>Supposedly he was approached by the NHL about an expansion franchise, but 
>turned it down because he thought the franchise fee of $50 million was too
>high.

This is not the way I have heard it.  See, Lloyd (as he is affectionately
referred to by Milwaukeeans and Bob Uecker) bought the Bradley Center *TO* get
the NHL to come here.

>Like I said, I don't know whether this story is true or just a rumor, but if
>it's true, don't look for an NHL team in Milwaukee anytime soon.  The Admirals
>aren't going to be forced out of the building and you won't see an NHL club
>and a minor league club in the same building, especially since the NBA's
>Milwaukee Bucks play there as well.

Yeah, the Bucks, the Milwaukee Wave (soccer), the Admirals, the Marquette
Warriors, concerts and a bunch of other things...
-- 
Jason Hanson         |  915 W. Wisconsin Ave #1010  |  (414) 288-2179
Marquette University |   Milwaukee, WI 53233-2373   |  Ham Radio: N9LEA/AE
--  jason@studsys.mscs.mu.edu    ==+==    n9lea@n0ary.#nocal.ca.usa.na  --

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53590
From: mep@phoenix.oulu.fi (Marko Poutiainen)
Subject: Re: Finland/Sweden vs.NHL teams (WAS:Helsinki/Stockholm & NH

: you mention could cut it as stars in the NHL! Even "Rexi" in his prime was more
: of a good regular in New York/Edmonton than a superstar in his own right,
: although some blamed that on lack of effort on his behalf.
:
I think that the NY management made a mistake, and remember how Edmonton 
called Reksa in the middle of the season to win the cup ? Why did they call
him?
 
: Yeah, we've had a tendency to beat ourselves in the past. I almost knifed my
: brother in anger when Sweden scored two in the final minute of the WC 
: semifinals back in 1986:-) Or what about the three goals Antero Kivela let in
: with five minutes to go against the Russkies in Lake Placid'80? Ugh . . . 

O.K., that was BAD luck. If Penguins have the same kind of luck this year in
the playoffs, they'll never win the cup. They are still the best team.

--
***********************************************************************
* 'Howl howl gargle howl gargle howl howl howl gargle howl gargle howl* 
*  howl gargle gargle howl gargle gargle gargle howl slurrp uuuurgh'  *
*                                       -Prostetnic Vogon Jeltz       *
***********************************************************************
	-Marko Poutiainen
	 mep@phoenix.oulu.fi

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53591
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Playoff pool

Well, I looked at the scoring plan I had, and have decided to modify it. 
Here is the new, finalized scoring:

Pick 1st round winner, way off on games:	2
"     "    "     "     pick within one game:	3
"     "    "     "     pick exact games:	4

Pick 2nd round winner, way off on games:	4
"     "    "     "     pick within one game:	5
"     "    "     "     pick exact games:	7

Pick conference champ, way off on games:	7
"	"	"      pick within one game:	10
"	"	"      pick exact games:	13

Pick Stanley Cup winner, way off on games:	13
"	"    "	   "	pick within one game:	17
"	"    "	   "	pick exact games:	20
Pick loser in 7, series goes 7:			2
Pick loser in 7, game 7 decided in OT:		4

These are now final.  Anyone needing a copy of the entry sheet, email me
at the address below. 

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53592
From: cobra@ravel.udel.edu (KING COBRA)
Subject: Re: NHLPA poll (partial stats/results)

In article <ofnmaO_00iV1A6kYd2@andrew.cmu.edu> Young-Soo Che <yc25+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>All these people who send in their polls should take a closer look at
>NJD, they are a very deep team, with two very capable goalies, and
>excellent forwards and defensemen.  Shooter in Richer, an all around do
>it all in Todd, chef Stasny-master of a thousand dishes, power play
>captain-Stevens.  Take a look at the numbers, or play with them and see
>for yourselves.

  Yup. I agree with ya. I think Devils can beat Red Wings easily. SO I think
  all those who send in their votes should try all these diffrent teams
  before voting. I think Islanders and Quebec are much better then I had
  expected.

  COBRA



*******************************************************************************
**   ___  ____  ____  ____  ____  **                                         **
**  /    /   / /___/ /___/ /___/  **   Sex is not the answer, sex is the     **
** /___ /___/ /___/ / \_  /   /   **   question. Yes is the answer.          **
**                                **                                         **
** E-mail: cobra@chopin.udel.edu  **                                         **
**                                **                                         **
*******************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53593
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Finland/Sweden vs.NHL teams (WAS:Helsinki/Stockholm & NH

In article <1993Apr17.170255.23800@abo.fi> MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF) writes:
>
>Jutila was a failure, I think, while Makela (and Ari Haanpaa) had an
>on-again/off-again career with the Islanders. Both players had to play in the
>minors. Of course I "like" our players, I just don't think the names
>you mention could cut it as stars in the NHL! Even "Rexi" in his prime was more
>of a good regular in New York/Edmonton than a superstar in his own right,
>although some blamed that on lack of effort on his behalf.
>

Ruotsaleinen was a more than competent NHL'er...his choice of where
to play when did not bear on his hockey playing ability.

He was crucial to the Oilers Stanley Cup victory in 1990, the one
without Gretzky, because he made an Oiler power play which was
lethargic that year until he arrived slide into overdrive.  The
Oilers missed him more the following year than Kurri, and I think
the Oilers would have make the finals if Ruotsaleinen has stayed
around the following season, and would have beaten Pittsburgh
with Ruotsaleinen and a healthy Messier...and delayed Pittsburgh's
dynasty by a season.  

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53594
From: kerney@ecn.purdue.edu (John Kerney)
Subject: Re: FLYERS notes 4/17



Could someone post the Flyers record with and without Eric Lindros in
the lineup


I have a guy that is trying to compare the Quebec/Flyers trade to the 

Dallas/Minnesota trade in the NFL(Hershel Walker)

I just need the stat to back up my point that Eric will be one of the next

great players

thanks

john

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53595
From: Derek_Juntunen@abcd.houghton.mi.us (Derek Juntunen)
Subject: Who will be #1 pick in NHL draft?

I recently bought a pack of prospect hockey cards which had various
players that were coming into the NHL. I got this particular card of
a Russian named Viktor Kozlov. It says "many scouts believe he will
be the #1 pick in 1993". Another guy is quoted as saying "He's as 
good as Mario Lemieux". Anyone know who this guy is?????

-- Via DLG Pro v0.995


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53596
From: j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
Subject: Plus minus stat

>Post: 51246 of 51422
>Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
>From: j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
>Subject: Plus minus stat
>Organization: University of Western Ontario
>Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1993 04:42:11 GMT
>Nntp-Posting-Host: sms.business.uwo.ca
>Lines: 165
 
>I'm not defending Bob Gainey...frankly, I don't care for him all
>that much.  But your dismissal of him as something less than an
>effective hockey player is tiresome...it has no basis in
>anything.  How many Calders did he win? I think it was four (go
                     ^^^^^^^
Ooops...that should read Selke...forgive me for my insolence.
 
congenially, as always,
 
jd
 
-- 
James David 
j3david@student.business.uwo.ca

j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
Western Business School  --  London, Ontario

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53597
From: mdell+@pitt.edu (Michael G Dellinger)
Subject: Re: Stop predicting

In article <1993Apr16.233148.9711@rose.com> jack.petrilli@rose.com (jack petrilli) writes:
>On April 16,  cdkaupan@eos.ncsu.edu (CARL DAVID KAUPANG) wrote:
>
>C(--> It is really annoying to see all of these
>C(--> predictions on the Net.  Who really cares
>C(--> who you think will win?  Please stop with
>C(--> the predictions, we all know the Caps are
>C(--> going to win the Cup, so let it go at that.
>C(--> 
>
>Haa!!! That's one of the things I find **most** interesting in this 
>newsgroup. It's a good way of cluing into the "collective wisdom" of 
>the average hockey fans. That doesn't mean they're always right, 
>however. For example, the Habs are going to come out of the Adams and 
>hardly anyone believes that right now.
>
>- Jack
>
> * It's hard to be humble when you're perfect.

Well, as long as we're being unduly cocky here, It's obvious that the Pens
will cone out of the Patrick Division *not* the Caps, and also that
they will win thier third Stanley Cup. "Collective Wisdom" is a very polite
way of putting it, I don't know if I'd be so gracious.
And, for what it's worth (Probably not much) I think the Habs will come out of
the Adams too.
                       Not new, Long absent,
                                       Mikey D.
__
*****************************************************************************
Mike Dellinger
Computer Lab Consultant
Sutherland Hall Computer Lab and Grill
University of Pittsburgh
****************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53598
From: icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera)
Subject: Hockey & Hispanic market


In article <saross01.734885336@starbase.spd.louisville.edu>, saross01@starbase.spd.louisville.edu (Stacey A. Ross) writes:
|> In <C5I2s2.3Bt@odin.corp.sgi.com> rickc@wrigley.corp.sgi.com (Richard Casares) writes:
|> >You'll have a hard time selling any sport to a community that
|> >can't play it on account of availability or financial reasons.
|> >Hockey is pretty much a sport for the white and well off.

What is this crap? I'm only interested in intelligent discussion. If you 
can't answer my question, just say so. Can anyone else answer the ques.?


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53599
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: hawks vs leafs lastnight

In article <93106.082502ACPS6992@RyeVm.Ryerson.Ca> Raj Ramnarace <ACPS6992@RyeVm.Ryerson.Ca> writes:
>did anyone else see this game last night ? just like a playoff game!!
>lots of hitting...but I was disappointed by the video goal judge...
>on all replays, joe murphy's goal shouldn't have counted ! it didn't go in net
>!! and according to the tsn broadcasters, the video goal judge said that he
>saw the water bottle on top of the cage move so he assumed the puck went in!
>this is terrible...hope crap like this doesn't occur in the playoffs!
>the game would have ended in 2-2 tie !

I thought the red light went on...thus, in the review, the presumption
would be to find conclusive evidence that the puck did not go in the
net...from the replays I say, even from the rear, the evidence wasn't
conclusive that the puck was in or out...in my opinion...

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53600
From: ndallen@r-node.hub.org (Nigel Allen)
Subject: Brown University Ordered To Restore Two Women's Varsity Teams

I found this press release from Trial Lawyers for Public Justice on
another system, and thought it would be of interest on campuses 
where the administration or the athletics department wants to 
eliminate the women's ice hockey team.

 Women Athletes, TLP Win Sex Discrimination Ruling: Brown University
Ordered to Restore Two Women's Varsity Teams
To: National Desk, Sports Writer
 Contact: Lynette Labinger, 401-421-9794, home 401-274-7507, or
          Ray Marcaccio, 401-831-8900, both of Trial Lawyers For
          Public Justice

   WASHINGTON, April 16 -- The U.S. Court of Appeals
for the First Circuit in Boston has upheld a U.S. District Court
order requiring Brown University to immediately reinstate its women's
gymnastics and volleyball teams to full varsity status. The ruling in
Cohen et al. v. Brown University is the first appeals court decision
in the nation applying Title IX to intercollegiate athletics.  Trial
Lawyers for Public Justice (TLPJ), is the national public interest
law firm representing the women athletes.
   "This ruling makes clear what we have said all along -- if a
school wants to eliminate teams before women have their fair share of
opportunities to participate, they can only eliminiate men's teams,"
said TLPJ Executive Director Arthur Bryant, co-counsel in the case.
   The class action, filed April, 1992, charged Brown with violating
Title IX of the Education Amendments of 1972, the federal law that
prohibits sex discrimination by all educational institutions
receiving federal funds.  Brown terminated the two women's teams as
university-funded sports in May 1991, allowing them to continue to
compete against varsity teams if they could raise their own funds for
uniforms, travel, coaches, and all other expenses.  They had also
been denied admission preferences for use in recruiting new members.
   "This is a major victory for women and the cause of equal rights,"
said TLPJ lead counsel Lynette Labinger of Providence's Roney &
Labinger.  "Universities across America need to reevaluate their
programs quickly. Title IX is the law and it's going to be enforced."
   Three similar Title IX appeals await decision.  Colorado State
University, Indiana University of Pennsylvania (IUP), and Colgate
University are asking federal appeals courts to overturn court orders
requiring them to reinstate or establish specific women's varsity
teams.  Continuing its cutting-edge Title IX activities, TLPJ is
representing women athletes at IUP.
   In addition to Labinger and Bryant, TLPJ's legal team included:
Ray Marcaccio of Blish & Cavanagh and Amato DeLuca of Mandell, DeLuca
& Schwartz in Providence; and Sandra Duggan of Philadelphia.  The
National Women's Law Center, Women's Sports Foundation, and National
Association for Girls and Women in Sports filed an amicus brief in
support of TLPJ's appeal.
 -30-

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53601
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: hawks vs leafs lastnight

In <1993Apr18.153820.10118@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:

>In article <93106.082502ACPS6992@RyeVm.Ryerson.Ca> Raj Ramnarace <ACPS6992@RyeVm.Ryerson.Ca> writes:
>>did anyone else see this game last night ? just like a playoff game!!
>>lots of hitting...but I was disappointed by the video goal judge...
>>on all replays, joe murphy's goal shouldn't have counted ! it didn't go in net
>>!! and according to the tsn broadcasters, the video goal judge said that he
>>saw the water bottle on top of the cage move so he assumed the puck went in!
>>this is terrible...hope crap like this doesn't occur in the playoffs!
>>the game would have ended in 2-2 tie !

>I thought the red light went on...thus, in the review, the presumption
>would be to find conclusive evidence that the puck did not go in the
>net...from the replays I say, even from the rear, the evidence wasn't
>conclusive that the puck was in or out...in my opinion...

It seemed pretty conclusive to me.  The puck clearly hit the crossbar
and then came down on the line.  And the announcers, admittedly homers,
kept harping about how they "must have had a different view upstairs"
because it was obvious to them, and, I would have thought, to anyone who
saw the replay, that the puck didn't go in.  The referee originally 
signalled no goal but the video replay "judges" initiated contact with
the referee to claim that a goal was in fact scored.  This, to me, is
unheard of.  Seeing stuff like this happen gives me a bad feeling about
the Leaf chances this year.

cordially, as always,

rm

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53602
From: e8l6@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (Rocket)
Subject: NHL Final point standings


    Individual leaders by total points (Final standings)
    NOTE: Games played and points per games not accurate !!

    Player       Team   GP  G   A  Pts ppg  Prj PIM +/-

    M.Lemieux    PIT    59  69  91 160 2.71 160  38  53
    LaFontaine   BUF    82  53  95 148 1.80 148  63  13
    Oates        BOS    83  45  97 142 1.71 142  32  12
    Yzerman      DET    83  58  79 137 1.65 137  44  33
    Turgeon      NYI    80  58  74 132 1.65 132  26  -2
    Selanne      WIN    82  76  56 132 1.61 132  45   6
    Mogilny      BUF    75  76  51 127 1.69 127  40   9
    Gilmour      TOR    81  32  95 127 1.57 127  96  32
    Robitaille   LA     82  63  62 125 1.52 127 100  16
    Recchi       PHI    81  53  70 123 1.52 123  95  -2
    Sundin       QUE    79  47  67 114 1.44 114  96  19
    Stevens      PIT    71  55  57 112 1.58 112 169  16
    Bure         VAN    82  60  50 110 1.34 110  67  37
    Tocchet      PIT    79  48  61 109 1.38 109 240  28
    Roenick      CHI    82  50  57 107 1.30 107  82  15
    Janney       STL    82  24  82 106 1.29 106  12   1
    Sakic        QUE    77  48  57 105 1.36 105  40  -4
    Juneau       BOS    83  32  70 102 1.23 102  33  21
    Hull         STL    78  54  47 101 1.29 101  41 -21
    Andreychuk   TOR    81  55  45 100 1.23 100  56   4
    Fleury       CAL    82  34  66 100 1.22 100  88  15
    Francis      PIT    83  24  76 100 1.20 100  68   6
    Housley      WIN    78  18  79  97 1.24  97  52 -13
    Ciccarelli   DET    81  41  56  97 1.20  97  81  12
    Damphousse   MON    82  39  58  97 1.18  97  96   5
    Hawerchuk    BUF    79  16  80  96 1.22  96  48 -14
    Shanahan     STL    69  51  43  94 1.36  94 168   9
    Muller       MON    79  37  57  94 1.19  94  75   9
    Jagr         PIT    80  34  60  94 1.18  94  69  31
    Modano       MIN    80  33  60  93 1.16  93  81  -6
    Messier      NYR    72  25  66  91 1.26  91  70  -3
    Sanderson    HAR    79  46  43  89 1.13  89  28 -24
    Reichel      CAL    78  40  48  88 1.13  88  54  23
    Bellows      MON    80  40  48  88 1.10  88  42   4
    Fedorov      DET    72  34  53  87 1.21  87  72  33
    Thomas       NYI    76  37  50  87 1.14  87 109   0
    Coffey       DET    79  12  75  87 1.10  87  77  16
    Kurri        LA     81  27  60  87 1.07  88  38  20
    Bradley      TB     78  42  44  86 1.10  86  90 -22
    Brind'Amour  PHI    78  37  49  86 1.10  86  87  -9
    Ronning      VAN    77  29  56  85 1.10  85  30  16
    Bondra       WAS    80  37  48  85 1.06  85  70   3
    Cassels      HAR    81  21  64  85 1.05  85  57 -15
    Murphy       PIT    82  22  62  84 1.02  84  73  42
    Bourque      BOS    78  19  63  82 1.05  82  40  38
    Granato      LA     79  37  45  82 1.04  83 165   3
    Verbeek      HAR    81  39  43  82 1.01  82 180 -11
    Ridley       WAS    81  26  56  82 1.01  82  38   4
    Duchesne     QUE    81  20  62  82 1.01  82  57  15
    C.Lemieux    NJ     75  30  51  81 1.08  81 149   0
    Suter        CAL    80  23  58  81 1.01  81 112  -1
    Lebeau       MON    69  31  49  80 1.16  80  20  23
    Roberts      CAL    57  38  41  79 1.39  79 172  31
    Semak        NJ     80  37  42  79 0.99  79  70  22
    Hatcher      WAS    80  34  45  79 0.99  79 110 -12
    D.Hunter     WAS    81  20  59  79 0.98  79 194   2
    Courtnall    MIN    82  36  43  79 0.96  79  49  -2
    Brown        STL    69  25  53  78 1.13  78  56  -4
    Ricci        QUE    76  27  51  78 1.03  78 121   9
    Kisio        SJ     77  26  52  78 1.01  78  90 -15
    Craven       VAN    76  25  52  77 1.01  77  30   0
    G.Courtnall  VAN    82  31  46  77 0.94  77 167  23
    Nolan        QUE    72  36  40  76 1.06  76 185  -6
    King         NYI    74  38  38  76 1.03  76  45  -1
    Amonte       NYR    80  33  43  76 0.95  76  47   0
    Gagner       MIN    82  33  43  76 0.93  76 141 -15
    Lindros      PHI    58  41  34  75 1.29  75 143  25
    Hogue        NYI    67  33  42  75 1.12  75 106   6
    Nieuwendyk   CAL    77  38  37  75 0.97  75  52   8
    Pivonka      WAS    66  21  53  74 1.12  74  51  12
    Borschevsky  TOR    76  34  40  74 0.97  74  26  32
    Dahlen       MIN    81  35  39  74 0.91  74   6 -18
    Richer       NJ     76  38  35  73 0.96  73  44   0
    Emerson      STL    80  22  51  73 0.91  73  60  -1
    Nedved       VAN    82  38  35  73 0.89  73  94  18
    Chelios      CHI    82  15  58  73 0.89  73 282  13
    Carson       LA     84  37  36  73 0.87  74  30   2
    Zhamnov      WIN    66  25  47  72 1.09  72  58   5
    Kvartalnov   BOS    72  30  42  72 1.00  72  14   9
    Steen        WIN    78  22  50  72 0.92  72  75  -8
    Linden       VAN    82  33  39  72 0.88  72  60  15
    Mullen       PIT    71  33  37  70 0.99  70  12  21
    Larmer       CHI    82  35  35  70 0.85  70  48  22
    Donnelly     LA     82  29  40  69 0.84  70  45  18
    Kovalenko    QUE    80  27  41  68 0.85  68  57  10
    Gartner      NYR    81  45  23  68 0.84  68  55  -2
    Khristich    WAS    61  31  36  67 1.10  67  26  26
    Sheppard     DET    70  32  34  66 0.94  66  29   7
    Garpenlov    SJ     78  22  44  66 0.85  66  56 -25
    Iafrate      WAS    81  25  41  66 0.81  66 169  15
    Gretzky      LA     43  16  49  65 1.51  67   6   6
    Zalapski     HAR    80  14  51  65 0.81  65  86 -32
    Graves       NYR    81  36  29  65 0.80  65 148  -4
    Anderson     TOR    74  21  43  64 0.86  64 117  19
    Zelepukin    NJ     76  23  41  64 0.84  64  66  16
    MacIver      OTT    78  17  46  63 0.81  63  80 -42
    Dineen       PHI    80  35  28  63 0.79  63 199  11
    Chiasson     DET    78  12  50  62 0.79  62 151  15
    Ysebaert     DET    79  34  28  62 0.78  62  42  19
    Galley       PHI    80  13  49  62 0.78  62  98  14
    McEachern    PIT    83  28  33  61 0.73  61  46  21
    Nicholls     NJ     67  13  47  60 0.90  60  80 -13
    Keane        MON    75  15  45  60 0.80  60  93  28
    Flatley      NYI    77  13  47  60 0.78  60  61   3
    S.Young      QUE    81  30  30  60 0.74  60  20   4
    Shannon      WIN    82  20  40  60 0.73  60  91  -4
    Fedyk        PHI    74  21  38  59 0.80  59  48  14
    Blake        LA     76  16  43  59 0.78  60 152  18
    Olausson     WIN    66  16  41  57 0.86  57  22  -5
    Makarov      CAL    70  18  39  57 0.81  57  40   0
    Smith        CHI    76  10  47  57 0.75  57 212  13
    Elynuik      WAS    77  22  35  57 0.74  57  66   2
    Stevens      NJ     79  12  45  57 0.72  57 116  16
    Adams        VAN    51  25  31  56 1.10  56  14  33
    Tucker       TB     76  17  39  56 0.74  56  69 -10
    MacInnis     CAL    48  11  43  54 1.13  54  59  15
    Sutter       CHI    63  20  34  54 0.86  54  65   9
    Bodger       BUF    80   9  45  54 0.68  54  87  14
    Nemchinov    NYR    81  23  31  54 0.67  54  34  15
    Driver       NJ     81  14  40  54 0.67  54  64  -9
    Ruuttu       CHI    82  17  37  54 0.66  54 134  14
    Yake         HAR    63  22  31  53 0.84  53  44   5
    Turcotte     NYR    68  25  28  53 0.78  53  40  -2
    Sandstrom    LA     37  25  27  52 1.41  53  51  11
    Malakhov     NYI    61  14  38  52 0.85  52  59  14
    Ward         VAN    68  22  30  52 0.76  52  82  32
    Otto         CAL    74  19  33  52 0.70  52 150   2
    Kontos       TB     66  27  24  51 0.77  51  12  -7
    Leach        BOS    78  26  25  51 0.65  51 126  -6
    Poulin       HAR    78  20  31  51 0.65  51  37 -19
    Tkachuk      WIN    81  28  23  51 0.63  51 199 -14
    Savard       MON    62  16  34  50 0.81  50  90   2
    Norton       NYI    63  12  38  50 0.79  50  45  -6
    Cullen       TOR    64  18  32  50 0.78  50 109 -23
    Cote         WAS    74  21  29  50 0.68  50  34  28
    Eklund       PHI    52  11  38  49 0.94  49  16   8
    Olczyk       NYR    68  21  28  49 0.72  49  52  -1
    Semenov      VAN    74  12  37  49 0.66  49  32  16
    Davydov      WIN    77  28  21  49 0.64  49  64  -2
    Miller       STL    80  24  25  49 0.61  49  96   0
    Poulin       BOS    83  16  33  49 0.59  49  62  30
    Klima        EDM    66  32  16  48 0.73  48  98 -15
    Dionne       MON    73  20  28  48 0.66  48  55   6
    Baker        OTT    74  19  29  48 0.65  48  52 -21
    Rucinsky     QUE    76  18  30  48 0.63  48  51  14
    Weight       EDM    76  17  31  48 0.63  48  65   5
    Zhitnik      LA     76  12  36  48 0.63  49  78  -2
    MacLean      NJ     78  24  24  48 0.62  48 100  -7
    Corson       EDM    78  16  31  47 0.60  47 207 -16
    Sweeney      BUF    79  21  26  47 0.59  47 118   4
    Simpson      EDM    60  24  22  46 0.77  46  36 -14
    Hawgood      PHI    66  11  35  46 0.70  46  68  -9
    Johansson    WAS    74   7  38  45 0.61  45  54   0
    Miller       WAS    81  18  27  45 0.56  45  32  -1
    Manson       EDM    81  15  30  45 0.56  45 210 -26
    Desjardins   MON    81  13  32  45 0.56  45  98  19
    Schneider    MON    58  13  31  44 0.76  44  89   9
    Goulet       CHI    63  23  21  44 0.70  44  41  10
    Leclair      MON    70  19  25  44 0.63  44  33  11
    Drake        DET    71  18  26  44 0.62  44  91  14
    Lumme        VAN    73   8  36  44 0.60  44  55  29
    Gaudreau     SJ     58  23  20  43 0.74  43  18 -17
    Gill         TOR    68  11  32  43 0.63  43  64   4
    Turgeon      OTT    70  25  18  43 0.61  43 104 -26
    Probert      DET    79  14  29  43 0.54  43 292  -9
    Wood         BUF    80  18  25  43 0.54  43  77   7
    Ranheim      CAL    82  21  22  43 0.52  43  26  -4
    Zamuner      TB     82  15  28  43 0.52  43  72 -25
    Tinordi      MIN    69  15  27  42 0.61  42 157  -1
    Paslawski    CAL    71  18  24  42 0.59  42  12   0
    Ruzicka      BOS    60  19  22  41 0.68  41  38  -6
    Elik         EDM    60  14  27  41 0.68  41  56  -4
    Kudelski     OTT    61  24  17  41 0.67  41  28 -25
    McSorley     LA     79  15  26  41 0.52  42 393   0
    Shaw         OTT    79   7  34  41 0.52  41  34 -47
    Lidstrom     DET    83   7  34  41 0.49  41  28   7
    Stastny      NJ     60  17  23  40 0.67  40  20  -3
    Ellett       TOR    68   6  34  40 0.59  40  46  17
    Tikkanen     NYR    78  16  24  40 0.51  40  94 -22
    Niedermayer  NJ     78  11  29  40 0.51  40  47   8
    Racine       DET    79   9  31  40 0.51  40  80   8
    McPhee       MIN    82  18  22  40 0.49  40  44  -4
    Millen       LA     40  23  16  39 0.98  40  42  15
    Chambers     TB     53  10  29  39 0.74  39  34 -23
    Holik        NJ     59  20  19  39 0.66  39  72  -2
    Clark        TOR    65  17  22  39 0.60  39 187   3
    Khmylev      BUF    66  20  19  39 0.59  39  26   6
    Creighton    TB     81  19  20  39 0.48  39 110 -21
    Krushelnyski TOR    82  19  20  39 0.48  39  60   3
    Kurvers      NYI    49   8  30  38 0.78  38  38   8
    Crossman     STL    57  10  28  38 0.67  38  28  -6
    Kovalev      NYR    63  20  18  38 0.60  38  79  -8
    Craig        MIN    68  15  23  38 0.56  38 106 -10
    Krupp        NYI    79   9  29  38 0.48  38  67   8
    Momesso      VAN    82  18  20  38 0.46  38 193  11
    Kamensky     QUE    31  15  22  37 1.19  37  14  13
    Numminen     WIN    65   7  30  37 0.57  37  33   4
    Pearson      TOR    76  23  14  37 0.49  37 196  -2
    Graham       CHI    82  20  17  37 0.45  37 141   1
    Leetch       NYR    36   6  30  36 1.00  36  26   2
    Ciger        EDM    62  13  23  36 0.58  36   8 -14
    Beers        TB     62  12  24  36 0.58  36  70 -24
    Reid         BOS    65  20  16  36 0.55  36  10  12
    Lapointe     QUE    73  10  26  36 0.49  36  98   4
    Sjodin       MIN    75   7  29  36 0.48  36  30 -25
    Weinrich     HAR    76   7  29  36 0.47  36  76 -10
    Borsato      WIN    65  15  20  35 0.54  35  38  -1
    Zezel        TOR    68  12  23  35 0.51  35  24  -1
    Burr         DET    79  10  25  35 0.44  35  74  18
    Donato       BOS    81  15  20  35 0.43  35  61   2
    Benning      EDM    55  10  24  34 0.62  34 152  -1
    Howe         DET    59   3  31  34 0.58  34  22  20
    Guerin       NJ     63  14  20  34 0.54  34  63  16
    Hull         OTT    67  13  21  34 0.51  34  14 -21
    D.Sweeney    BOS    83   7  27  34 0.41  34  66  34
    Nylander     HAR    56  11  22  33 0.59  33  36  -5
    Beranek      PHI    63  15  18  33 0.52  33  78  -6
    Wesley       BOS    64   8  25  33 0.52  33  47  -2
    Matteau      CHI    77  15  18  33 0.43  33  96   6
    Broten       MIN    80  12  21  33 0.41  33  22   7
    Leeman       MON    50  15  17  32 0.64  32  24  14
    Dalgarno     NYI    55  15  17  32 0.58  32  60  16
    Mellanby     EDM    67  15  17  32 0.48  32 147  -4
    Primeau      DET    73  15  17  32 0.44  32 152  -6
    Gilbert      CHI    75  13  19  32 0.43  32  57   5
    Mullen       NYI    78  18  14  32 0.41  32  28   7
    Presley      BUF    78  15  17  32 0.41  32  92   5
    Leschyshyn   QUE    81   9  23  32 0.40  32  55  22
    Zubov        NYR    46   8  23  31 0.67  31   4   1
    Mironov      TOR    57   7  24  31 0.54  31  38  -2
    Bureau       TB     63  10  21  31 0.49  31 111 -12
    Brisebois    MON    68  10  21  31 0.46  31  77   8
    Heinze       BOS    72  18  13  31 0.43  31  24  21
    Smehlik      BUF    78   4  27  31 0.40  31  59  10
    Lemieux      CHI    79  10  21  31 0.39  31 109   4
    Yushkevich   PHI    79   5  26  31 0.39  31  71  10
    Evason       SJ     83  12  19  31 0.37  31 132 -33
    McInnis      NYI    56  10  20  30 0.54  30  24   7
    Noonan       CHI    61  16  14  30 0.49  30  82   1
    Gallant      DET    66  10  20  30 0.45  30 186  20
    Kennedy      DET    67  19  11  30 0.45  30  46  -1
    Hough        QUE    77   8  22  30 0.39  30  69 -11
    Gusarov      QUE    78   8  22  30 0.38  30  57  16
    MacTavish    EDM    80  10  20  30 0.38  30 110 -15
    Buchberger   EDM    81  12  18  30 0.37  30 133 -24
    Janssens     HAR    73  12  17  29 0.40  29 233 -12
    U.Samuelson  PIT    76   3  26  29 0.38  29 247  37
    Sydor        LA     78   6  23  29 0.37  29  59   0
    Duchesne     MIN    82  16  13  29 0.35  29  30   6
    Falloon      SJ     41  14  14  28 0.68  28  12 -25
    Sandlak      VAN    59  10  18  28 0.47  28 122   2
    Carpenter    WAS    65  11  17  28 0.43  28  63 -16
    Kron         HAR    42  14  13  27 0.64  27  18   7
    Ferraro      NYI    43  14  13  27 0.63  27  38  -5
    Kravchuk     EDM    55  10  17  27 0.49  27  32   3
    Plavsic      VAN    56   6  21  27 0.48  27  51  27
    Ron Sutter   STL    59  12  15  27 0.46  27  99 -11
    Cole         TB     65  12  15  27 0.42  27  21  -4
    Odgers       SJ     65  12  15  27 0.42  27 251 -25
    Fitzgerald   NYI    74   9  18  27 0.36  27  32  -1
    Fetisov      NJ     74   4  23  27 0.36  27 158   7
    Korolev      STL    74   4  23  27 0.36  27  20  -1
    Kypreos      HAR    75  17  10  27 0.36  27 325  -5
    Andersson    TB     75  16  11  27 0.36  27  14 -14
    Huddy        LA     80   2  25  27 0.34  27  62  20
    Rich Sutter  STL    82  13  14  27 0.33  27 100  -6
    Slegr        VAN    40   4  22  26 0.65  26 109  16
    Svoboda      BUF    40   2  24  26 0.65  26  59   3
    Patrick      NYR    60   5  21  26 0.43  26  61   1
    Jones        WAS    68  12  14  26 0.38  26 124  16
    Lamb         OTT    69   7  19  26 0.38  26  62 -40
    Osborne      TOR    75  12  14  26 0.35  26  87  -7
    May          BUF    80  13  13  26 0.33  26 238   3
    Eagles       WIN    82   8  18  26 0.32  26 131  -1
    Brunet       MON    45  10  15  25 0.56  25  19  13
    T.Green      NYI    58   7  18  25 0.43  25  43   6
    Stern        CAL    69  10  15  25 0.36  25 207   2
    Lidster      VAN    71   6  19  25 0.35  25  36   9
    Haller       MON    72  11  14  25 0.35  25 117   8
    Tippett      PIT    73   6  19  25 0.34  25  56   7
    Peluso       OTT    79  15  10  25 0.32  25 318 -32
    DiMaio       TB     54   9  15  24 0.44  24  62   0
    Brady        OTT    55   7  17  24 0.44  24  57 -25
    Freer        OTT    61  10  14  24 0.39  24  39 -32
    Cavallini    QUE    66   9  15  24 0.36  24  34  10
    Lachance     NYI    74   7  17  24 0.32  24  67  -2
    Shaw         BOS    76  10  14  24 0.32  24 108   9
    Berg         TOR    78  13  11  24 0.31  24 103   2
    Ozolinsh     SJ     37   7  16  23 0.62  23  40  -9
    Klatt        MIN    45   4  19  23 0.51  23  38   6
    Loach        LA     53  10  13  23 0.43  23  27   3
    Todd         EDM    55   9  14  23 0.42  23  26  -9
    Ashton       CAL    56  10  13  23 0.41  23  52   8
    McBain       OTT    57   7  16  23 0.40  23  43 -35
    Gelinas      EDM    63  11  12  23 0.37  23  30   2
    Bautin       WIN    69   5  18  23 0.33  23  92  -2
    Krygier      WAS    74  11  12  23 0.31  23  60 -14
    Johnson      MIN    79   3  20  23 0.29  23 105   9
    Acton        PHI    80   8  15  23 0.29  23  51 -11
    Barnes       WIN    37  12  10  22 0.59  22  10  -3
    Huffman      QUE    52   4  18  22 0.42  22  54   0
    Sutton       BUF    61   8  14  22 0.36  22  30   0
    McKay        NJ     71  11  11  22 0.31  22 199   1
    Konstantinov DET    81   5  17  22 0.27  22 135  23
    Pellerin     NJ     44  10  11  21 0.48  21  37  -1
    Sillinger    DET    51   4  17  21 0.41  21  16   0
    Volek        NYI    56   8  13  21 0.38  21  34  -1
    Lindberg     CAL    61   9  12  21 0.34  21  18  -4
    Evans        PHI    65   8  13  21 0.32  21  70  -9
    Hamrlik      TB     65   6  15  21 0.32  21  65 -20
    Gilchrist    MIN    68  10  11  21 0.31  21  49 -12
    Churla       MIN    73   5  16  21 0.29  21 286  -8
    Kasparaitis  NYI    77   4  17  21 0.27  21 166  14
    Loney        PIT    81   5  16  21 0.26  21  99   3
    Courtenay    SJ     38   7  13  20 0.53  20  10 -15
    Wilson       SJ     42   3  17  20 0.48  20  40 -28
    T.Pederson   SJ     43   7  13  20 0.47  20  31 -14
    Lomakin      PHI    48   8  12  20 0.42  20  34  14
    Druce        WIN    48   6  14  20 0.42  20  37  -5
    Hannan       BUF    53   5  15  20 0.38  20  41  10
    Corriveau    HAR    54   8  12  20 0.37  20  12 -20
    Bourque      NYR    54   6  14  20 0.37  20  39  -9
    Hiller       DET    60   8  12  20 0.33  20 109   6
    Maltais      TB     61   7  13  20 0.33  20  35 -19
    Burt         HAR    62   6  14  20 0.32  20 116 -14
    Johansson    CAL    75   4  16  20 0.27  20  60  11
    Marchment    CHI    76   5  15  20 0.26  20 309  13
    Diduck       VAN    78   6  14  20 0.26  20 163  29
    Podein       EDM    38  13   6  19 0.50  19  25  -1
    Berehowsky   TOR    40   4  15  19 0.48  19  61   1
    Babych       VAN    41   3  16  19 0.46  19  42   4
    Audette      BUF    42  12   7  19 0.45  19  51  -5
    Chorske      NJ     50   7  12  19 0.38  19  25  -1
    Bassen       STL    51   9  10  19 0.37  19  59  -4
    Hatcher      MIN    65   4  15  19 0.29  19 176 -26
    Kucera       CHI    70   5  14  19 0.27  19  59   7
    Wilson       STL    76   8  11  19 0.25  19  44  -7
    Macoun       TOR    76   4  15  19 0.25  19  55   3
    King         WIN    77   8  11  19 0.25  19 203   4
    Beukeboom    NYR    79   2  17  19 0.24  19 153  10
    Carkner      PHI    80   3  16  19 0.24  19 146  16
    Neely        BOS    12  11   7  18 1.50  18  25   4
    Foligno      TOR    54  13   5  18 0.33  18  84   1
    Christian    CHI    60   4  14  18 0.30  18  12   6
    Errey        BUF    61   9   9  18 0.30  18  80   1
    Gavin        MIN    63  10   8  18 0.29  18  59  -4
    McLlwain     TOR    65  14   4  18 0.28  18  30 -17
    Daigneault   MON    65   8  10  18 0.28  18  57  24
    Ramage       MON    74   5  13  18 0.24  18 146 -24
    Smith        EDM    76   4  14  18 0.24  18  30 -11
    Paek         PIT    76   3  15  18 0.24  18  64  15
    Murphy       CHI    17   7  10  17 1.00  17  18  -4
    DiPietro     MON    27   4  13  17 0.63  17  14  10
    M.Pederson   SJ     40  10   7  17 0.43  17  24 -20
    Nattress     PHI    44   7  10  17 0.39  17  29   1
    Carbonneau   MON    59   4  13  17 0.29  17  20  -8
    Yawney       CAL    61   1  16  17 0.28  17  65   5
    Kasatonov    NJ     63   3  14  17 0.27  17  55   7
    Roberts      BOS    64   5  12  17 0.27  17 103  22
    MacDermid    WAS    72   9   8  17 0.24  17  80 -13
    Odjick       VAN    74   4  13  17 0.23  17 360   4
    Conacher     LA     79   9   8  17 0.22  17  20 -15
    Cavallini    WAS    79   6  11  17 0.22  17  56   4
    Erickson     WIN    39   4  12  16 0.41  16  12   2
    Straka       PIT    41   3  13  16 0.39  16  29   3
    Erixon       NYR    42   5  11  16 0.38  16  10  13
    Murphy       BOS    48   5  11  16 0.33  16  60 -14
    Ledyard      BUF    48   2  14  16 0.33  16  43   0
    Butsayev     PHI    49   2  14  16 0.33  16  57   2
    Ulanov       WIN    54   2  14  16 0.30  16 122   6
    Carter       SJ     55   7   9  16 0.29  16  81 -25
    Glynn        EDM    62   4  12  16 0.26  16  58 -12
    Boschman     OTT    68   9   7  16 0.24  16  95 -27
    Rumble       OTT    68   3  13  16 0.24  16  61 -26
    Stanton      PIT    76   4  12  16 0.21  16  97   8
    Murzyn       VAN    77   5  11  16 0.21  16 179  36
    Musil        CAL    78   6  10  16 0.21  16 129  26
    May          WAS    80   6  10  16 0.20  16 266   0
    Foote        QUE    80   4  12  16 0.20  16 168   3
    Odelein      MON    81   2  14  16 0.20  16 201  35
    Andersson    NYR    29   4  11  15 0.52  15  16   7
    Archibald    OTT    42   9   6  15 0.36  15  32 -15
    Taylor       LA     46   6   9  15 0.33  15  49   2
    Lowe         NYR    47   3  12  15 0.32  15  58  -1
    Domi         WIN    59   5  10  15 0.25  15 340   1
    McCrimmon    DET    60   1  14  15 0.25  15  71  21
    Konroyd      DET    65   3  12  15 0.23  15  67 -15
    Zombo        STL    69   0  15  15 0.22  15  78  -4
    Butcher      STL    82   5  10  15 0.18  15 209   0
    Zmolek       SJ     83   5  10  15 0.18  15 229 -51
    Fergus       VAN    36   5   9  14 0.39  14  20   1
    Skrudland    CAL    38   7   7  14 0.37  14  65   4
    Pantaleyev   BOS    39   8   6  14 0.36  14  12  -6
    Pearson      QUE    41  13   1  14 0.34  14  95   3
    C.J.Young    BOS    43   7   7  14 0.33  14  32  -6
    Smail        OTT    51   4  10  14 0.27  14  51 -34
    Hardy        LA     53   1  13  14 0.26  14  89  -1
    Broten       NYR    58   5   9  14 0.24  14  48  -6
    Barr         NJ     60   6   8  14 0.23  14  44   3
    Taglianetti  PIT    71   2  12  14 0.20  14 182  15
    Ewen         MON    74   5   9  14 0.19  14 191   7
    Bergevin     TB     76   2  12  14 0.18  14  66 -16
    Finn         QUE    79   5   9  14 0.18  14 160  -4
    Lefebvre     TOR    79   2  12  14 0.18  14  90   6
    M.Sullivan   SJ     81   6   8  14 0.17  14  30 -42
    Ojanen       NJ     31   4   9  13 0.42  13  14  -2
    Reekie       TB     42   2  11  13 0.31  13  69   2
    Lindsay      QUE    44   4   9  13 0.30  13  16   0
    Ramsey       PIT    44   3  10  13 0.30  13  28  16
    Valk         VAN    46   6   7  13 0.28  13  73   5
    Jelinek      OTT    49   7   6  13 0.27  13  52 -21
    Needham      PIT    55   8   5  13 0.24  13  24  -2
    Lowry        STL    56   5   8  13 0.23  13 101 -18
    Rychel       LA     68   6   7  13 0.19  13 293 -14
    McGill       PHI    70   3  10  13 0.19  13 221   7
    Stapleton    PIT    78   4   9  13 0.17  13  10  -8
    Richardson   EDM    80   3  10  13 0.16  13 140 -18
    Rouse        TOR    80   3  10  13 0.16  13 128   8
    Daneyko      NJ     82   2  11  13 0.16  13 222   4
    Ogrodnick    DET    18   6   6  12 0.67  12   2  -3
    S. King      NYR    24   7   5  12 0.50  12  16   4
    Joseph       EDM    31   2  10  12 0.39  12  46  -6
    Petit        CAL    34   3   9  12 0.35  12  50  -6
    Williams     SJ     39   1  11  12 0.31  12  49 -25
    B.Smith      MIN    43   5   7  12 0.28  12   8  -6
    Bozon        STL    52   6   6  12 0.23  12  55  -1
    Ronan        MON    53   5   7  12 0.23  12  20   6
    Dirk         VAN    67   4   8  12 0.18  12 146  22
    Hunter       VAN    72   5   7  12 0.17  12 182  -5
    Luongo       OTT    74   3   9  12 0.16  12  68 -42
    Berube       CAL    75   4   8  12 0.16  12 209  -6
    Wilson       CAL    22   4   7  11 0.50  11   8  10
    Vujtek       EDM    28   1  10  11 0.39  11   8  -1
    Konowalchuk  WAS    36   4   7  11 0.31  11  16   4
    Snuggerud    PHI    39   4   7  11 0.28  11  14  -3
    Murray       CHI    49   4   7  11 0.22  11  57 -14
    Donnelly     BUF    58   3   8  11 0.19  11 219   6
    Dahl         CAL    59   2   9  11 0.19  11  52   9
    Kasper       TB     66   4   7  11 0.17  11  20 -16
    More         SJ     73   5   6  11 0.15  11 179 -35
    Quintal      STL    73   1  10  11 0.15  11 100  -6
    Ludwig       MIN    76   1  10  11 0.14  11 149   0
    Muni         CHI    79   0  11  11 0.14  11  73 -15
    Lazaro       OTT    26   6   4  10 0.38  10  16  -8
    Norwood      STL    32   3   7  10 0.31  10  63  -5
    Featherstone BOS    34   5   5  10 0.29  10 102   6
    Murphy       OTT    42   3   7  10 0.24  10  28 -18
    DeBrusk      EDM    49   8   2  10 0.20  10 199 -14
    Wells        NYR    50   1   9  10 0.20  10 105  -2
    Kimble       BOS    54   7   3  10 0.19  10 177   4
    Corkum       BUF    67   6   4  10 0.15  10  38  -2
    Dahlquist    CAL    73   3   7  10 0.14  10  66  -2
    Gordijuk     BUF    16   3   6   9 0.56   9   0   4
    Hurlbut      NYR    23   1   8   9 0.39   9  16   4
    Boivin       PHI    30   5   4   9 0.30   9  76  -5
    Moller       BUF    35   2   7   9 0.26   9  83   6
    Cunneyworth  HAR    36   5   4   9 0.25   9  61  -1
    Petrovicky   HAR    42   3   6   9 0.21   9  45 -10
    McRae        STL    45   3   6   9 0.20   9 167 -13
    Cirella      NYR    52   3   6   9 0.17   9  83   4
    Maley        SJ     55   2   7   9 0.16   9 143 -27
    Daniels      PIT    57   5   4   9 0.16   9  14  -6
    Hughes       BOS    61   5   4   9 0.15   9 191  -5
    Lalor        WIN    62   1   8   9 0.15   9  74 -13
    K.Samuelson  PIT    63   3   6   9 0.14   9 106  25
    McKenzie     HAR    63   3   6   9 0.14   9 202  -9
    Kocur        NYR    64   3   6   9 0.14   9 129  -9
    Loewen       OTT    77   4   5   9 0.12   9 145 -25
    Houlder      BUF    13   3   5   8 0.62   8   6   7
    T.Sweeney    BOS    14   1   7   8 0.57   8   6   1
    Douris       BOS    18   4   4   8 0.44   8   4   5
    Keczmer      HAR    21   4   4   8 0.38   8  28  -2
    Greig        HAR    22   1   7   8 0.36   8  27 -11
    Day          HAR    24   1   7   8 0.33   8  47  -8
    Werenka      EDM    27   5   3   8 0.30   8  24   1
    Tatarinov    QUE    28   2   6   8 0.29   8  28   6
    McDonough    SJ     30   6   2   8 0.27   8   6 -21
    Hill         MON    30   2   6   8 0.27   8  47  -5
    K.Brown      CHI    31   2   6   8 0.26   8  37   4
    Loiselle     NYI    38   5   3   8 0.21   8  84  -4
    Hudson       EDM    39   1   7   8 0.21   8  44  -8
    Hedican      STL    40   0   8   8 0.20   8  30  -4
    Roberge      MON    48   4   4   8 0.17   8 140   3
    Ahola        SJ     49   3   5   8 0.16   8  36 -11
    McIntyre     NYR    57   3   5   8 0.14   8  82 -14
    Anderson     WAS    57   2   6   8 0.14   8  18  -1
    Houda        HAR    57   2   6   8 0.14   8 163 -21
    Hartman      TB     58   4   4   8 0.14   8 154  -7
    Wilkinson    SJ     58   1   7   8 0.14   8  96 -48
    Hammond      OTT    61   4   4   8 0.13   8 104 -40
    Barrasso     PIT    62   0   8   8 0.13   8  20   0
    Kennedy      WIN    77   1   7   8 0.10   8 105  -4
    Eastwood     TOR    12   1   6   7 0.58   7  21  -2
    Quintin      SJ     14   2   5   7 0.50   7   4  -4
    R.Brown      CHI    15   1   6   7 0.47  33  33   6
    Godynyuk     CAL    26   3   4   7 0.27   7  17   7
    Rice         EDM    26   2   5   7 0.27   7  13  -5
    Murray       BOS    27   3   4   7 0.26   7   8  -6
    Wiemer       BOS    27   1   6   7 0.26   7  48  -1
    Berezan      SJ     28   3   4   7 0.25   7  28 -18
    Marois       NYI    28   2   5   7 0.25   7  35  -3
    Mallette     NJ     34   4   3   7 0.21   7  56   3
    Hynes        PHI    36   3   4   7 0.19   7  16  -3
    Gilhen       TB     42   3   4   7 0.17   7  12 -13
    Chase        STL    49   2   5   7 0.14   7 204  -9
    Vukota       NYI    71   2   5   7 0.10   7 199   4
    Zettler      SJ     79   0   7   7 0.09   7 150 -48
    Lafreniere   TB      9   3   3   6 0.67   6   4  -5
    Propp        MIN    15   3   3   6 0.40   6   0  -8
    Belanger     MON    18   4   2   6 0.33   6   4   1
    Kerr         HAR    22   0   6   6 0.27   6   7 -11
    Shuchuk      LA     23   2   4   6 0.26   6  14   4
    Bergland     TB     25   3   3   6 0.24   6  11  -9
    Vaske        NYI    25   1   5   6 0.24   6  30   6
    Carney       BUF    29   2   4   6 0.21   6  51   2
    Dinnen       OTT    31   2   4   6 0.19   6  30 -19
    Albelin      NJ     34   1   5   6 0.18   6  14  -1
    Patterson    BUF    35   4   2   6 0.17   6  18  -2
    Ladouceur    HAR    59   2   4   6 0.10   6 107 -17
    Russell      CHI    66   2   4   6 0.09   6 151   5
    Lang         LA     11   0   5   5 0.45   5   2  -3
    Lipuma       TB     13   0   5   5 0.38   5  32   1
    Brown        NJ     15   0   5   5 0.33   5   2   3
    Kozlov       DET    16   4   1   5 0.31   5  14  -1
    Savage       WAS    16   2   3   5 0.31   5  12  -4
    Bruce        SJ     17   2   3   5 0.29   5  33 -14
    Byers        SJ     18   4   1   5 0.28   5 122  -2
    Conroy       PHI    18   3   2   5 0.28   5  17   0
    Van Allen    EDM    21   1   4   5 0.24   5   6  -2
    Richer       BOS    23   1   4   5 0.22   5  18  -9
    Wolanin      QUE    23   1   4   5 0.22   5  49   8
    Leach        HAR    24   3   2   5 0.21   5   4  -7
    Prokhorov    STL    26   4   1   5 0.19   5  15  -4
    Kruse        CAL    26   2   3   5 0.19   5  41   3
    Richter      NYR    35   0   5   5 0.14   5   2   0
    Bawa         SJ     41   5   0   5 0.12   5  47 -24
    Osiecki      MIN    42   1   4   5 0.12   5  19 -20
    Matvichuk    MIN    51   2   3   5 0.10   5  26  -7
    Pedersen     HAR    58   1   4   5 0.09   5  60   2
    Jennings     PIT    58   0   5   5 0.09   5  65   7
    Essensa      WIN    66   0   5   5 0.08   5   2   0
    Ray          BUF    68   3   2   5 0.07   5 211  -3
    McKim        BOS     7   1   3   4 0.57   4   0   2
    Faust        PHI     8   2   2   4 0.50   4   4   3
    Smolinski    BOS     8   1   3   4 0.50   4   0   3
    Fogarty      PIT    12   0   4   4 0.33   4   4  -3
    Hervey       TB     15   0   4   4 0.27   4  36  -4
    Picard       SJ     25   4   0   4 0.16   4  24 -17
    Reese        CAL    25   0   4   4 0.16   4   4   0
    Romaniuk     WIN    28   3   1   4 0.14   4  22   0
    Thompson     LA     28   0   4   4 0.14   4  79  -3
    Pilon        NYI    41   1   3   4 0.10   4 146  -3
    Giles        STL    48   0   4   4 0.08   4  40  -2
    Baron        STL    53   2   2   4 0.08   4  59  -5
    Cheveldae    DET    66   0   4   4 0.06   4   4   0
    Hankinson    NJ      4   2   1   3 0.75   3   9   2
    McDougall    EDM     4   2   1   3 0.75   3   4   2
    Felsner      STL     4   0   3   3 0.75   3   0   0
    Ruff         TB      8   2   1   3 0.38   3   8  -1
    Petrov       MON     9   2   1   3 0.33   3  10   2
    Black        MIN    10   2   1   3 0.30   3   4   0
    Morris       SJ     14   0   3   3 0.21   3   6 -11
    Walter       VAN    23   3   0   3 0.13   3   8  -2
    Hrivnak      WIN    29   0   3   3 0.10   3   0   0
    Wakaluk      MIN    29   0   3   3 0.10   3  20   0
    Dufresne     MON    30   1   2   3 0.10   3  30   0
    Cronin       PHI    34   2   1   3 0.09   3  37   0
    Smyth        CAL    34   1   2   3 0.09   3  95   3
    Hrudey       LA     48   0   3   3 0.06   3   8   0
    Marsh        OTT    57   0   3   3 0.05   3  30 -25
    Casey        MIN    58   0   3   3 0.05   3  28   0
    Berry        MIN    61   0   3   3 0.05   3 107   4
    Ranford      EDM    66   0   3   3 0.05   3  10   0
    Belfour      CHI    69   0   3   3 0.04   3  28   0
    Rivers       TB      4   0   2   2 0.50   2   2  -2
    Forslund     CAL     5   0   2   2 0.40   2   0   0
    Capuano      TB      6   1   1   2 0.33   2   2  -4
    Djoos        NYR     6   1   1   2 0.33   2   2   0
    Cummins      DET     7   1   1   2 0.29   2  58   0
    Otevrel      SJ      7   0   2   2 0.29   2   0  -6
    Kolstad      SJ     10   0   2   2 0.20   2  12  -9
    Osborne      TB     11   1   1   2 0.18   2   8  -1
    Wood         SJ     12   1   1   2 0.17   2  71  -5
    Brickley     WIN    12   0   2   2 0.17   2   2   0
    Eakins       WIN    14   0   2   2 0.14   2  38   2
    Simon        QUE    15   1   1   2 0.13   2  67  -2
    Bennett      CHI    16   0   2   2 0.13   2   8  -2
    Gillis       HAR    18   1   1   2 0.11   2  38   0
    Carlyle      WIN    22   1   1   2 0.09   2  14  -6
    Nylund       NYI    22   1   1   2 0.09   2  43  -2
    Blue         BOS    22   0   2   2 0.09   2   6   0
    Watters      LA     22   0   2   2 0.09   2  18  -3
    Woolley      WAS    23   0   2   2 0.09   2  10   0
    Whitmore     VAN    29   0   2   2 0.07   2   2   0
    Stauber      LA     30   0   2   2 0.07   2   2   0
    W.Young      TB     31   0   2   2 0.06   2   2   0
    Roussel      PHI    32   0   2   2 0.06   2  11   0
    Twist        QUE    34   0   2   2 0.06   2  64   0
    Fiset        QUE    37   0   2   2 0.05   2   2   0
    Jablonski    TB     42   0   2   2 0.05   2   7   0
    Soderstrom   PHI    43   0   2   2 0.05   2   4   0
    Healy        NYI    46   0   2   2 0.04   2   2   0
    Burke        HAR    50   0   2   2 0.04   2  25   0
    Hextall      QUE    53   0   2   2 0.04   2  56   0
    Roy          MON    61   0   2   2 0.03   2  16   0
    Vernon       CAL    63   0   2   2 0.03   2  42   0
    Joseph       STL    66   0   2   2 0.03   2   8   0
    Brown        PHI    67   0   2   2 0.03   2  76  -5
    Grimson      CHI    76   1   1   2 0.03   2 186   2
    Barnaby      BUF     1   1   0   1 1.00   1   0   0
    Ratushny     VAN     1   0   1   1 1.00   1   0   0
    Zholtok      BOS     1   0   1   1 1.00   1   0   1
    Sullivan     NJ      2   0   1   1 0.50   1   0  -1
    Duncanson    NYR     3   0   1   1 0.33   1   0   0
    Beaufait     SJ      4   1   0   1 0.25   1   0  -1
    Bowen        PHI     4   1   0   1 0.25   1   2   0
    MacDonald    BUF     4   1   0   1 0.25   1   2   0
    Esau         QUE     4   0   1   1 0.25   1   2   1
    D.Smith      MIN     9   0   1   1 0.11   1   2  -2
    Vial         DET     9   0   1   1 0.11   1  20   1
    Brown        BUF    10   0   1   1 0.10   1   6  -5
    Draper       BUF    11   0   1   1 0.09   1   2   0
    Karpa        QUE    11   0   1   1 0.09   1  13  -6
    Tichy        CHI    13   0   1   1 0.08   1  30   7
    Gosselin     HAR    15   0   1   1 0.07   1   2   0
    Fortier      LA     16   0   1   1 0.06   1  11  -9
    Hayward      SJ     18   0   1   1 0.06   1   2   0
    McGill       TOR    19   1   0   1 0.05   1  34   5
    Bergeron     TB     19   0   1   1 0.05   1   0   0
    Potvin       LA     19   0   1   1 0.05   1  52  -9
    Berthiaume   OTT    23   0   1   1 0.04   1   2   0
    Racicot      MON    25   0   1   1 0.04   1   6   0
    Wregget      PIT    25   0   1   1 0.04   1   6   0
    Ciccone      MIN    29   0   1   1 0.03   1 106   3
    Puppa        TOR    32   0   1   1 0.03   1   0   0
    Hackett      SJ     36   0   1   1 0.03   1   4   0
    Fitzpatrick  NYI    37   0   1   1 0.03   1   2   0
    Billington   NJ     40   0   1   1 0.03   1   8   0
    Potvin       TOR    46   0   1   1 0.02   1   4   0
    Vanbiesbrouk NYR    48   0   1   1 0.02   1  18   0
    McLean       VAN    54   0   1   1 0.02   1  16   0
    Moog         BOS    54   0   1   1 0.02   1  14   0
    Beaupre      WAS    57   0   1   1 0.02   1  20   0
    Baumgartner  TOR    61   1   0   1 0.02   1 155 -11
    Bales        BOS     1   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Burridge     WAS     1   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Chabot       MON     1   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    D'Alessio    HAR     1   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Littman      TB      1   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Parks        NYI     1   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Semchuk      LA      1   0   0   0 0.00   0   2   0
    St. Amour    OTT     1   0   0   0 0.00   0   2   0
    Cimellaro    OTT     2   0   0   0 0.00   0   0  -2
    Cote         TB      2   0   0   0 0.00   0   0  -1
    Marcinyshyn  NYR     2   0   0   0 0.00   0   2  -1
    O'Neill      WIN     2   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Raglan       TB      2   0   0   0 0.00   0   2   0
    Williams     LA      2   0   0   0 0.00   0  10   0
    Charron      MON     3   0   0   0 0.00   0   2   0
    Ciavaglia    BUF     3   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Cloutier     QUE     3   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Hamr         OTT     3   0   0   0 0.00   0   0  -3
    Wamsley      TOR     3   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Hirsch       NYR     4   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    O'Connor     NJ      7   0   0   0 0.00   0   9  -4
    J.Messier    NYR     9   0   0   0 0.00   0   6   0
    Knickle      LA     10   0   0   0 0.00   0   2   0
    Chapdelaine  LA     13   0   0   0 0.00   0  12  -6
    Shannon      TOR    15   0   0   0 0.00   0  11  -2
    Agnew        HAR    16   0   0   0 0.00   0  68   3
    Waite        CHI    20   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Langway      WAS    21   0   0   0 0.00   0  20 -13
    Riendeau     DET    22   0   0   0 0.00   0   2   0
    Hebert       STL    23   0   0   0 0.00   0   2   0
    Tabaracci    WAS    23   0   0   0 0.00   0  12   0
    Tugnutt      EDM    25   0   0   0 0.00   0   2   0
    Caufield     PIT    26   0   0   0 0.00   0  60  -1
    Hasek        BUF    27   0   0   0 0.00   0   0   0
    Pietrangelo  HAR    30   0   0   0 0.00   0   4   0
    Irbe         SJ     35   0   0   0 0.00   0  10   0
    Terreri      NJ     47   0   0   0 0.00   0   6   0
    Fuhr         BUF    56   0   0   0 0.00   0  10   0
    Sidorkiewicz OTT    63   0   0   0 0.00   0   8   0
-- 

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-                                                                           -
-    Maurice Richard                                                        -

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53603
From: The Always Fanatical: Patrick Ellis <IO11330@MAINE.MAINE.EDU>
Subject: Re: Bruins vs Canadiens:

un, you better add at least another plus to the Pederson
for Neely trade, the Bruins also received a number 1 round
draft pick, didn't play great this year but Wesley's still a
decent defenseman....  And the Bruins got Pederson back eventually
anyway.....

             Pat Ellis


P.S.  GO BRUINS    GO UMAINE BLACK BEARS    42-1-2       NUMBER 1......

                   HOCKEY EAST REGULARS SEASON CHAMPIONS.....
                   HOCKEY EAST TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONS>......
                   PAUL KARIYA, HOBEY BAKER AWARD WINNER.......
         NCAA DIV. 1 HOCKEY TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


                    M-A-I-N-E      GGGGOOOOOOO    BBBLLLUUEEEE!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53604
From: The Always Fanatical: Patrick Ellis <IO11330@MAINE.MAINE.EDU>
Subject: Keenan signs, Plus WALSH????????


Well I just read in the Boston Globe that while not confirming
(or denying) anything, Walsh may end up with the Rangers organizations
as an (assistant Coach?).  Keenan has talked with Walsh in the past
(he came up to see Kariya as he will be coaching him in the worlds,
funny I guess he got to watch the Ferraro brothers as well.....) I'm
not sure if walsh will go, but if Keenan is getting 700,000 and walsh
even gets 100,000 that's a 30% pay raise for walsh (not to mention
a nice career move....) Anyone from New York Hear anything about
this????????

               Pat Ellis




P.S.  GO BRUINS    GO UMAINE BLACK BEARS    42-1-2       NUMBER 1......

                   HOCKEY EAST REGULARS SEASON CHAMPIONS.....
                   HOCKEY EAST TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONS>......
                   PAUL KARIYA, HOBEY BAKER AWARD WINNER.......
         NCAA DIV. 1 HOCKEY TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


                    M-A-I-N-E      GGGGOOOOOOO    BBBLLLUUEEEE!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53605
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: div. and conf. names

In <1993Apr18.073540.6871@hubcap.clemson.edu> jwodzia@dlite.uucp (john wodziak) writes:

>Sorry Roger but Mr Basketbal should what he really means here. IE he should
>have said that he hopes "fans in the _American_ Southeast can follow the
>names of the divisions." The odds that these people other than those who
>are displaced "Notherners" (who are probably already fans) is on the order
>of the proverbial snowball's in hell.

I am not at all clear about what you are trying to say here.   If  you
asked  somone,  who  had never heard of hockey before, if LA played in
the Smythe division what do you think  that  the  response  would  be?
What  if you asked this person if LA played in the West division?  The
naming of  divisions  after  long-dead  entrepreneurs  is  unnecessary
obfuscation.

>>I am glad that the names are being changed for another reason.  The names
>>Patrick, Smythe, Norris, Adams and Campbell are all the names of so-called
>>"builders" of the game.  This is the same type of thinking that put Stein
>>in the Hall of Fame.  This is absolute nonsense.  The real builders of the
>>game are Richard, Morenz, Howe, Conacher, Orr, etc.  If you are going to
>>name the divisions after people at least name the divisions after people
>>who deserve it.

>Yes these people deserve recognigtion as hockey greats but the old division
>names took into account Messers Patrick, Norris, Smythe and the Prince who 
>had alot more to do with the ORIGINS of the league than people who came into
>an already established situation. It is much easier to be an element of change

Hardly.  The "established" situation existed prior to Smythe,  et  al.
The  Stanley  Cup was a challenge trophy up for grabs to whatever team
could successfully mount the challenge.  What our  dear  founders  did
was formalize the challenge.  They created a closed league, an oligop-
olistic professional system, in the interests of making money.  Wheth-
er  or  not  that system has contributed to better hockey is certainly
debatable.  We are, however, stuck with their invention and  that  de-
bate  is  academic.   The  point  to  be made, however, is that people
played hockey and people enjoyed watching hockey  long  before  Smythe
and his pals showed up.

>or a standout in an existing situation than it is to be someone who creates
>a new situation.  If you want to honor players like Bobby Orr than I'm sure
>you can find a reason to name a torphy after him such as best offensive 
>defenseman.

What's wrong with best defenceman, period?  Was there  ever  a  better
defenceman?   Was  there  ever a better player?  And if you think that
Bruce Norris' contribution was somehow  more  significant  than  Bobby
Orr's  then,  in the interests of education, why don't you take a poll
and find out how many people know who Norris was?  But you don't  have
to, do you?

>No I can't for the reasons I gave above. I'm in the same boat as Jason and I
>grew up with the current divisonal names and learned them when I was about 
>10 years old and who played in what division. If a 10 year old _American_
>can learn this why would it be hard for an "Occasional Fan" to pick up 
>on who plays in what division?

So you don't feel that you should have to make the effort to  remember
that  Vancouver  plays in the West division?  (Or Pacific, or whatever
other intuitively understandable moniker is chosen.)

>>Oh.  Now I see your point.  Your intention has been to alert us to the erosion
>>of purity.  I'll bet you like hockey because it's, for the most part, played
>>by whites of European extraction. 

>Probably not. In my case I'm sure of this. What you said would be like me
>saying that All Maple Leafs fans are as biased, closed minded, ignorant,

And of course you neatly deleted Jason's  jingoistic  rant  about  the
game  losing  its  "Canadianization".   Quoting me out of context does
more to erode your credibility than it  does  mine.   My  position  is
clearly  progressive  and  is anything but "biased, closed minded, ig-
norant".  Arrogant, I will grant you.

>arrogant, and moronic as you.  Just because someone A) doesn't like what
>Mr Basketball is doing, B) voices their opinion. and C) Likes the senerio of
>you going to Antartica does not mean that you have the right to insult them.

Nice try John.  But for a flame to be truly effective you have to
display  at  least  enough  intelligence  to  earn  your target's
respect.

cordially, as always,

rm 

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53606
From: mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger)
Subject: TEAM POOL - Tabulations

Thanks for the 41 people who have entered this year's TEAM POOL.

Here is a summary of what was picked:

1st Round:
Pittsburgh 41, New Jersey 0
Chicago 40, St. Louis 1
Boston 40, Buffalo 1
Vancouver 30, Winnipeg 11
Calgary 27, Los Angeles 14
Detroit 26, Toronto 15
Washington 24, New York Islanders 15 (2 people picked New Jersey)
Quebec 23, Montreal 18

2nd Round:
Pittsburgh 38, Washington 2, New York Islanders 1
Boston 31, Quebec 6, Montreal 4
Detroit 21, Chicago 15, Toronto 5
Calgary 18, Vancouver 14, Los Angeles 8, Winnipeg 1

3rd Round:
Pittsburgh 31, Boston 7, Quebec 2, Washington 1
Detroit 18, Chicago 11, Toronto 5, Vancouver 3, Calgary 2, Los Angeles 2

Finals:
Pittsburgh 26, Boston 5, Detroit 4, Toronto 2, Quebec 2, Los Angeles 1, Chicago
1

Good luck to all!


*******************************************************************************
*  Mike Burger                    *  My Canada includes, Quebec, Ontario,     *
*  mmb@lamar.colostate.edu        *  the Maritimes, the Prairies, and Florida *
*  A Beginning Computing TA Stud  *  four months a year.                      *
*  over 500 students served       *    --Royal Canadian Air Farce             *
*******************************************************************************
*      University of Michigan - 1990  --  Colorado State University - 199?    *
*******************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53607
From: nittmo@camelot.bradley.edu (Christopher Taylor)
Subject: Anyone Have Official Shorthanded Goal Totals?

Does anyone out there have the shorthanded goal totals of the NHL players
for this season?  We're trying to finish our rotisserie stats and need SHG
to make it complete.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53608
From: holland@geop.ubc.ca (Stephen Holland)
Subject: Re: My Predictions of a classic playoff year!

In article 12934@ac.dal.ca, 06paul@ac.dal.ca () writes:
>
>	STANLEY CUP FINALS
>Toronto Maple Leafs    vs    Montreal Canadiens    
>	(The Classic Stanley Cup Final matchup!!) <---also a dream come true!
>	Montreal wins the Stanley cup in the 7th game 1 - 0 in double overtime.

You know... after I finished laughing I thought:  This would be a great
final.  Two Canadian teams with lots of tradition and all that Don Cherry
nonsense behind them and a nail-biter finish.

Of course, I would prefer a Vancouver--Montreal final with Vancouver
scoring the final goal....

Pity neither will happen.

steve holland




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53609
From: Karim Edvard Ahmed <ka0k+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Truly a sad day for hockey

>A fine 26 year history came to a close tonight, as the Minnesota North Stars, 
>or Norm's Stars (whichever you prefer) lost to the Red Wings by a score of
>5-3.  The Stars goals were scored by Mike McPhee and Ulf Dahlen, who netted
>two including the final one in franchise history, with less than a minute to
>play.


Yes, it's a shame that the NHL lost a fine team in one of the best
hockey markets in the country.  Being a North Stars fan, it is sad to
see all of the tradition of the last 26 years get thrown into oblivion
at the hands of a truly crappy owner.

Hopefully the NHL will install an expansion franchise in the Twin Cities
within the next five years.  Even if this is the case, a lot has been
lost in the North Stars move...

KEA

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53610
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Possible Canadian WC Team?

nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>
>CENTERS
>Mark Messier, N. Y. Rangers

Messier was not invited due to his nagging injuries.  While the press
made an issue of it, and attempted to link it to the Rangers' internal
political woes, Mike Keenan repeated that to Messier personally during
the MSG press conference.  It makes sense ... Messier would probably
have not declined the invitation if it were made for publicity ...

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53611
From: dmoney@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Dean R Money)
Subject: How difficult is it to get Penguin tickets?

The subject line says it all.  Is it terribly difficult to get tickets
to Penguins games, especially now that they are in the playoffs?  Would
it be easy to find scalpers outside of the Igloo selling tickets?

Dean Money
dmoney@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53612
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Hockey Draft week 27 standings

Well, I'm back from Tokyo, so here are the standings after the April 13 update.

	- Andrew

USENET Hockey Draft Standings
Week 27

Posn	Team				Pts	Proj	Cash	Last Posn

1.	Dave Wessels                    1536	1572.8	1.9	(1)
2.	Bob Hill                        1481	1538.1	24.0	(3)
3.	Gilles Carmel                   1492	1529.9	1.0	(2)
4.	Seppo Kemppainen                1430	1514.0	47.2	(5)
5.	The Awesome Oilers              1412	1504.4	68.6	(4)
6.	Hillside Raiders                1456	1495.2	7.0	(7)
7.	Mak "The Knife" Paranjape       1424	1491.7	31.0	(6)
8.	Jan Stein                       1412	1483.2	35.3	(8)
9.	this years model                1428	1479.3	17.6	(10)
10.	Rangers Of Destiny              1401	1475.9	42.0	(9)
	Tapio Repo                      1422	1475.9	19.6	(11)
12.	FRANK'S BIG FISH                1398	1453.9	22.0	(12)
13.	The Underachievers              1409	1452.9	10.1	(13)
14.	On Thin Ice                     1380	1440.9	32.3	(14)
15.	Go Flames                       1367	1438.1	40.3	(17)
16.	littlest giants                 1370	1437.7	35.6	(16)
17.	Mopar Muscle Men                1400	1431.4	3.7	(18)
18.	Lindros Losers                  1396	1431.2	1.7	(15)
19.	DIE Penguin Bandwaggoners       1357	1411.0	20.2	(19)
20.	Samuel Lau (Calgary, Alberta)   1360	1396.3	4.9	(20)
21.	Boomer's Boys                   1341	1371.6	0.2	(23)
22.	General Accounting Office       1316	1369.4	20.9	(21)
23.	Delaware Wombats                1341	1367.5	1.3	(24)
24.	Migods Menschen                 1307	1366.8	31.6	(22)
25.	Wellsy's Buttheads DEC NH       1280	1362.3	52.6	(25)
26.	Rocky Mountain High             1325	1357.2	1.8	(26)
27.	Fife Flyers                     1283	1348.4	31.4	(27)
28.	Gerald Olchowy                  1275	1340.2	33.7	(28)
29.	Dave Snell                      1281	1335.7	25.0	(59)
30.	Fluide Glacial                  1291	1333.7	18.0	(29)
31.	Gaoler                          1279	1321.5	11.2	(30)
32.	SmegHeads                       1289	1315.8	0.3	(31)
33.	The Young And The Skateless     1235	1305.6	42.9	(32)
34.	Sam & His Dogs                  1262	1297.3	11.6	(34)
35.	Neural Netters                  1251	1294.2	11.3	(35)
36.	Youngbucs                       1206	1288.1	101.7	(36)
37.	Artic Storm                     1220	1287.7	39.3	(33)
38.	Soft Swedes                     1205	1281.5	46.9	(37)
39.	Jeff Horvath                    1239	1268.6	5.6	(38)
40.	Milton Keynes Kings             1229	1262.5	2.8	(40)
41.	Hamster from Hoboken            1223	1257.0	8.7	(41)
	Kuehn Crushers                  1185	1257.0	45.1	(45)
43.	Le Fleur de Lys                 1202	1256.9	25.3	(42)
44.	Yan The Man Loke                1225	1255.5	0.7	(39)
45.	Legion of Hoth                  1208	1251.1	15.8	(48)
46.	Simmonac                        1169	1249.4	87.6	(44)
47.	The Finnish Force               1192	1245.1	22.5	(46)
48.	ice legion                      1193	1244.8	28.8	(43)
49.	Streaks                         1161	1242.8	54.8	(47)
50.	Brian Bergman                   1190	1241.0	23.3	(55)
51.	Goaldingers                     1190	1239.3	22.0	(49)
52.	T C OverAchievers               1209	1237.0	2.9	(52)
53.	Grant Marven                    1196	1231.2	2.9	(50)
54.	Bozrah Bruins                   1155	1223.9	45.2	(54)
55.	Real Bad Toe Jam                1150	1223.4	48.9	(62)
56.	Houdini's Magicians             1181	1222.4	18.3	(61)
57.	Skriko Wolves                   1186	1221.5	5.4	(53)
58.	rec.sport.hockey choices        1196	1221.1	1.3	(63)
59.	buffalo soldiers                1142	1220.3	62.1	(65)
60.	bemybaby                        1140	1219.9	54.2	(51)
61.	LIPPE                           1179	1215.2	13.9	(56)
62.	Randy Coulman                   1185	1214.8	5.2	(57)
63.	LAMP LIGHTERS                   1180	1211.6	5.9	(58)
64.	Steven And Mark Dream Team      1174	1206.2	3.1	(60)
65.	Indianapolis Bennies            1160	1205.4	20.8	(66)
66.	Tom                             1160	1202.8	13.1	(68)
67.	Bloom County All Stars          1164	1198.8	4.3	(67)
68.	Bruins                          1174	1198.5	0.1	(72)
69.	Phil and Kev's Karma Dudes      1172	1198.0	0.8	(69)
70.	smithw                          1146	1194.5	21.0	(73)
71.	Iowa Hockeyes                   1149	1193.8	16.3	(64)
72.	Doug Bowles                     1146	1190.6	20.0	(71)
73.	The Great Pumpkin               1108	1187.3	54.4	(74)
74.	NON!                            1145	1186.4	16.4	(77)
75.	shooting seamen                 1161	1183.3	0.1	(75)
76.	Frank Worthless                 1149	1182.7	6.3	(76)
77.	AIK Exiles                      1116	1179.8	34.5	(70)
78.	Invisible Inc                   1156	1177.4	1.1	(78)
79.	Brad Gibson                     1126	1176.9	27.2	(79)
80.	Cougarmania                     1114	1165.7	24.8	(88)
81.	Kortelaisen Kovat               1086	1165.2	164.1	(85)
82.	PLP Fools                       1135	1163.1	0.1	(81)
83.	David Wong                      1082	1161.6	66.1	(84)
84.	John Zupancic                   1102	1160.7	27.1	(82)
85.	garryola                        1121	1159.4	9.7	(89)
86.	Gary Bergman Fan Club           1128	1157.6	5.1	(93)
87.	Staffan Axelsson                1120	1157.1	15.1	(83)
88.	Chubby Checkers                 1110	1156.2	16.3	(80)
89.	Derrill's Dastardly Dozen       1109	1155.0	22.1	(90)
90.	Chocolate Rockets               1121	1150.7	2.5	(86)
91.	Ken DeCruyenaere                1113	1147.9	5.0	(87)
92.	Fisher Dirtbags                 1119	1147.4	0.7	(94)
93.	KODIAKS                         1122	1146.0	1.3	(95)
94.	No Namers                       1067	1145.8	58.2	(91)
95.	The Campi Machine               1061	1145.2	65.3	(92)
96.	BSC Oranienburg                 1115	1142.4	7.1	(98)
97.	The Kamucks                     1064	1141.5	76.1	(97)
98.	Arsenal Maple Leafs             1108	1138.4	3.8	(96)
99.	Ellis Islanders                 1096	1128.0	7.6	(100)
100.	Mombasa Mosquitos               1090	1122.4	6.1	(101)
101.	Zachmans Wingers                1051	1122.1	49.8	(103)
102.	Edelweiss                       1091	1121.0	2.9	(102)
103.	Bjoern Leaguen                  1039	1118.5	61.4	(112)
104.	Dirty White Socks               1050	1116.5	43.4	(105)
105.	Wormtown Woosbags               1039	1116.1	72.6	(104)
106.	Neil Younger                    1036	1115.0	77.7	(114)
107.	Hurricane Andrew                1082	1114.8	7.6	(106)
108.	King Suke                       1089	1114.5	0.1	(110)
109.	Larry                           1078	1114.3	11.8	(107)
110.	Het Schot Is Hard               1076	1113.6	18.1	(115)
111.	VoteNoOct26                     1056	1112.6	31.8	(108)
112.	Bloodgamers                     1046	1111.6	42.1	(99)
	Bruce's Rented Mules            1077	1111.6	11.9	(108)
114.	Teem Kanada                     1075	1110.6	16.0	(111)
115.	Frank's Follies                 1063	1106.5	24.2	(113)
116.	Oklahoma Stormchasers           1053	1103.6	28.3	(121)
117.	SPUDS                           1068	1103.4	12.6	(119)
118.	Pond Slime                      1081	1102.3	0.7	(117)
119.	PSV Dartmouth                   1071	1101.4	7.1	(116)
120.	Mark Sanders                    1065	1099.2	11.1	(120)
121.	Blue Talon                      1062	1096.5	13.3	(126)
122.	Stanford Ice Hawks              1043	1094.7	28.2	(118)
123.	Aye Carumba!!!                  1063	1089.6	3.9	(124)
124.	Kokudo Keikaku Bunnies          1021	1088.0	40.3	(125)
125.	Timo Ojala                      1059	1085.7	0.3	(122)
126.	Haral                           1057	1085.3	7.3	(128)
127.	Cluster Buster                  1048	1083.4	7.6	(136)
128.	Dirty Rotten Puckers            1054	1082.7	1.2	(135)
129.	Apricot Fuzzfaces               1037	1081.1	23.3	(127)
130.	The Lost Poots                  1048	1080.5	6.7	(132)
131.	Nesbitt                         1058	1078.6	1.1	(123)
132.	Gary Bill Pens Dynasty          1035	1077.8	19.6	(144)
133.	garys team                      1035	1076.2	17.1	(129)
134.	Arctic Circles                  1012	1074.1	37.6	(131)
135.	Seattle PFTB                    1028	1074.0	22.9	(132)
136.	Late Night with David Letterman 1049	1073.7	0.0	(130)
137.	Le Groupe MI                    1020	1073.2	30.2	(141)
138.	GO BRUINS                       1046	1072.7	6.2	(140)
139.	Scott Glenn                     1038	1069.7	10.2	(138)
140.	Flying Kiwis                    1035	1068.7	9.1	(136)
141.	team gold                       1029	1067.4	16.7	(142)
142.	Closet Boy's Boys               995	1064.6	48.0	(143)
143.	Wild Hearted Sons               1036	1064.4	4.9	(153)
144.	boutch 92-93                    1023	1063.2	20.0	(134)
145.	Andy Y F WONG                   1019	1062.6	21.5	(147)
	Wembley LostWeekenders          1040	1062.6	0.3	(152)
147.	McKees Rocks Rockers            1036	1062.4	5.1	(144)
148.	Book 'em Danno's Bushbabies     1032	1062.1	10.5	(163)
149.	Dree Hobbs                      1020	1060.2	13.4	(139)
150.	GO HABS GO                      1027	1058.1	8.0	(151)
151.	Goddess Of Fermentation         1005	1057.8	30.2	(156)
152.	Tim Rogers                      1024	1056.8	8.1	(146)
153.	convex stars                    1026	1055.9	5.6	(160)
154.	Einstein's Rock Band            1033	1055.7	0.0	(154)
155.	Princeton Canucks               979	1055.5	124.2	(150)
156.	Tap                             1028	1055.2	0.5	(155)
157.	Hubert's Hockey Homeboys        1030	1053.9	0.6	(163)
	Buttered Waffles                981	1053.9	46.0	(148)
159.	MY TEAM                         977	1052.0	174.8	(162)
160.	Bob's Blues                     980	1050.9	46.8	(149)
161.	furleys furies                  1021	1046.6	3.6	(159)
162.	HUNTERS & COLLECTORS            982	1045.9	42.4	(157)
	Les Nordiques                   974	1045.9	60.4	(161)
164.	Satan's Choice                  1012	1045.3	14.5	(173)
165.	Dr Joel Fleishman               1020	1043.9	3.7	(158)
166.	Sundogs                         1017	1040.9	0.4	(166)
167.	Pierre Mailhot                  1017	1039.9	2.6	(175)
168.	Slap Shot Marco                 966	1037.8	51.8	(168)
169.	San Jose Mahi Mahi              989	1037.6	31.8	(178)
170.	The Leafs Rule!!!!              990	1037.3	25.8	(174)
171.	Jeff Nimeroff                   963	1036.5	48.8	(167)
172.	Stimpy ADG Zeta                 996	1035.2	21.0	(178)
173.	The Dreamers                    958	1034.6	63.7	(170)
174.	East City Jokers                956	1033.7	69.1	(171)
175.	Daryl Turner                    1008	1033.1	2.4	(169)
176.	riding the pine                 988	1031.8	20.7	(165)
177.	Flowers                         957	1030.4	113.6	(172)
178.	Darse Billings                  975	1029.3	34.7	(185)
179.	Chappel's Chumps                984	1027.9	24.0	(186)
180.	LANA Inc                        982	1027.2	27.3	(182)
181.	Spinal Tap                      963	1026.6	41.4	(177)
182.	JimParker                       949	1025.9	179.0	(187)
183.	Enforcers                       980	1023.9	28.1	(189)
184.	Jeff Bachovchin                 949	1020.7	46.7	(180)
	Big Bad Bruins                  981	1020.7	18.5	(183)
186.	Mike Mac Cormack Sydney NS CAN  944	1020.6	107.2	(184)
187.	Bulldogs                        973	1019.7	23.4	(181)
188.	voyageurs                       996	1017.2	2.7	(176)
189.	Absolut Lehigh                  984	1015.4	8.9	(190)
190.	Republican Dirty Tricksters     930	1010.4	66.0	(188)
191.	Henry's Bar B Q                 990	1007.7	0.7	(197)
192.	Dr.D And The S.O.D.             968	1007.3	17.1	(192)
193.	Bunch of Misfits                957	1006.9	23.8	(193)
194.	Robyns Team                     955	1005.5	30.0	(198)
195.	Yellow Plague                   969	1003.4	14.2	(191)
196.	Ninja Turtles                   982	1003.0	1.3	(194)
197.	Team Melville                   930	999.1	46.9	(199)
198.	Acadien                         962	998.6	18.3	(201)
199.	DARMAN'S Dragons                950	998.4	28.3	(209)
200.	Kuta Papercuts                  961	998.2	18.5	(207)
201.	Great Expectations              972	998.0	2.3	(195)
202.	Cobra's Killers                 942	996.4	31.7	(205)
203.	Cherry Bombers                  971	995.6	1.2	(196)
204.	Jayson's Kinky Pucks            943	989.9	26.9	(204)
205.	Killer Apes                     947	989.7	24.3	(208)
206.	Kaufbeuren Icebreakers          929	989.1	37.6	(202)
207.	Umpire 4 life                   950	987.8	11.1	(200)
208.	Roger Smith                     927	987.0	39.6	(210)
209.	Firebirds                       960	983.8	3.9	(203)
210.	Those 1st few weeks hurt!       905	982.9	55.9	(211)
211.	IKEA Wholesale                  958	982.0	1.7	(213)
212.	Outlaws                         903	975.6	164.9	(206)
213.	The 200 Club                    944	969.4	6.8	(219)
214.	Thundering Herd                 887	966.7	163.6	(212)
215.	Believe it or dont              926	966.6	21.1	(214)
216.	Creeping Death                  924	965.7	21.3	(217)
217.	Knee Injuries                   932	965.6	10.4	(218)
218.	Crazy Euros                     927	965.3	17.9	(220)
219.	Frack Attack                    918	965.0	27.3	(221)
	Todd's Turkeys                  942	965.0	1.9	(222)
221.	Ryan's Renegades                893	961.7	50.9	(223)
222.	fred mckim                      889	961.5	93.0	(215)
223.	400 Hurricane                   909	960.4	32.1	(216)
224.	pig vomit                       936	958.3	1.3	(225)
225.	Ice Strykers                    882	955.4	105.4	(226)
226.	Fighting Geordies               882	953.7	141.6	(227)
227.	CDN Stuck in Alabama            925	951.6	10.3	(228)
228.	dayton bomber                   932	951.5	0.0	(236)
229.	Cafall and Crew                 892	948.2	38.3	(224)
230.	Chris of Death                  872	945.0	83.6	(232)
231.	Swillbellies                    902	941.9	18.7	(230)
232.	Banko's Beer Rangers            913	940.4	4.2	(233)
	Zipper Heads                    892	940.4	33.9	(237)
234.	NY Flames                       907	938.8	7.8	(234)
235.	Ship's Way                      913	938.7	8.7	(229)
236.	Laubsters II                    861	937.6	201.6	(235)
237.	Oz                              878	934.1	35.0	(231)
238.	Joliet Inmates                  872	933.5	45.8	(239)
239.	Ninja Bunnies                   858	925.9	44.9	(238)
240.	Great Scott                     853	924.6	73.3	(242)
241.	Widefield White Wolves          861	919.7	36.9	(240)
242.	The Ice Holes                   890	912.7	2.7	(246)
243.	SANDY'S SABRES                  886	910.8	4.7	(244)
244.	Daves Team                      858	910.7	32.0	(241)
245.	South Carolina Tiger Paws       835	909.0	78.4	(243)
246.	Florida Tech Burgh Team         844	908.9	49.3	(245)
247.	Leos Blue Chips                 874	902.5	10.4	(247)
248.	For xtc                         874	900.0	8.2	(248)
249.	roadrunners                     861	899.7	18.5	(249)
250.	Mudville Kings                  851	897.8	27.6	(250)
251.	New Jersey Rob                  876	894.2	0.7	(253)
252.	Redliners                       856	893.3	15.9	(251)
253.	Pat Phillips                    859	887.6	10.1	(252)
254.	Stewart Clamen                  851	869.6	1.6	(254)
255.	Demon Spawn                     820	866.1	25.0	(255)
256.	Sunnyvale Storm                 804	818.4	0.2	(256)
257.	Allez les Blues                 738	809.1	476.9	(257)
258.	Up For Sale Hockey Club         749	789.4	23.0	(258)
259.	Petes Picks                     721	788.0	168.5	(259)
260.	RINACO                          709	781.8	114.0	(260)
261.	Brenz Revenge                   691	713.3	4.0	(261)
262.	Dinamo Riga                     595	663.9	571.6	(262)
-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53613
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Hockey Draft week 27 price list

Here is the price list for the week April 13 to April 19.

	- Andrew

Buy	Sell	Pts	Team	Player
158.9	143.0	157	PIT	Mario_Lemieux
148.5	133.7	145	BUF	Pat_LaFontaine
142.7	128.4	141	BOS	Adam_Oates
137.6	123.8	136	DET	Steve_Yzerman
132.1	118.9	129	WPG	Teemu_Selanne
131.7	118.5	127	NYI	Pierre_Turgeon
130.1	117.1	127	TOR	Doug_Gilmour
126.0	113.4	123	BUF	Alexander_Mogilny
123.4	111.1	119	PHI	Mark_Recchi
121.9	109.7	119	LA	Luc_Robitaille
113.3	102.0	112	QUE	Mats_Sundin
111.3	100.2	110	PIT	Kevin_Stevens
110.6	99.5	108	VAN	Pavel_Bure
108.6	97.7	106	STL	Craig_Janney
108.3	97.5	107	PIT	Rick_Tocchet
107.6	96.8	105	CHI	Jeremy_Roenick
105.3	94.8	104	QUE	Joe_Sakic
103.5	93.2	101	STL	Brett_Hull
102.4	92.2	100	CGY	Theoren_Fleury
101.2	91.1	100	PIT	Ron_Francis
100.4	90.4	98	TOR	Dave_Andreychuk
100.2	90.2	99	BOS	Joe_Juneau
98.3	88.5	96	WPG	Phil_Housley
98.3	88.5	96	MTL	Vincent_Damphousse
96.3	86.7	94	MTL	Kirk_Muller
96.1	86.5	95	DET	Dino_Ciccarelli
95.3	85.8	93	BUF	Dale_Hawerchuk
95.3	85.8	93	MIN	Mike_Modano
94.4	85.0	91	NYR	Mark_Messier
93.2	83.9	91	STL	Brendan_Shanahan
93.1	83.8	92	PIT	Jaromir_Jagr
88.1	79.3	86	MTL	Brian_Bellows
88.1	79.3	86	LA	Jari_Kurri
88.0	79.2	87	DET	Sergei_Fedorov
87.1	78.4	85	CGY	Robert_Reichel
87.0	78.3	86	DET	Paul_Coffey
86.1	77.5	83	WSH	Peter_Bondra
86.1	77.5	83	HFD	Geoff_Sanderson
86.0	77.4	84	TB	Brian_Bradley
85.0	76.5	82	NYI	Steve_Thomas
84.0	75.6	83	PIT	Larry_Murphy
84.0	75.6	81	PHI	Rod_Brind'Amour
83.0	74.7	82	BOS	Ray_Bourque
83.0	74.7	82	QUE	Steve_Duchesne
83.0	74.7	80	HFD	Andrew_Cassels
82.0	73.8	80	LA	Tony_Granato
81.9	73.7	79	WSH	Dale_Hunter
81.9	73.7	79	WSH	Mike_Ridley
80.9	72.8	78	HFD	Pat_Verbeek
80.9	72.8	79	MTL	Stephan_Lebeau
80.9	72.8	79	CGY	Gary_Suter
78.9	71.0	77	VAN	Cliff_Ronning
78.9	71.0	77	NJ	Claude_Lemieux
78.9	71.0	78	QUE	Mike_Ricci
77.9	70.1	76	VAN	Murray_Craven
77.9	70.1	76	STL	Jeff_Brown
77.8	70.0	75	WSH	Kevin_Hatcher
77.8	70.0	75	NYR	Tony_Amonte
76.9	69.2	76	SJ	Kelly_Kisio
76.8	69.1	75	NJ	Alexander_Semak
76.8	69.1	75	MIN	Russ_Courtnall
75.8	68.2	74	MIN	Dave_Gagner
75.8	68.2	74	TOR	Nikolai_Borschevsky
75.7	68.1	73	PHI	Eric_Lindros
74.8	67.3	73	LA	Jimmy_Carson
73.8	66.4	72	CGY	Joe_Nieuwendyk
73.8	66.4	72	VAN	Geoff_Courtnall
73.8	66.4	72	MIN	Ulf_Dahlen
73.6	66.2	71	NYI	Derek_King
73.6	66.2	71	WSH	Michal_Pivonka
72.9	65.6	72	QUE	Owen_Nolan
72.9	65.6	72	BOS	Dmitri_Kvartalnov
72.7	65.4	71	STL	Nelson_Emerson
72.7	65.4	71	CHI	Chris_Chelios
72.6	65.3	70	NYI	Benoit_Hogue
71.7	64.5	70	NJ	Stephane_Richer
71.7	64.5	70	WPG	Thomas_Steen
71.7	64.5	70	WPG	Alexei_Zhamnov
71.7	64.5	70	CHI	Steve_Larmer
69.8	62.8	69	PIT	Joe_Mullen
69.5	62.6	67	NYR	Mike_Gartner
68.6	61.7	67	VAN	Petr_Nedved
68.6	61.7	67	VAN	Trevor_Linden
68.6	61.7	67	LA	Mike_Donnelly
68.4	61.6	66	WSH	Dmitri_Khristich
68.4	61.6	66	WSH	Al_Iafrate
66.8	60.1	66	DET	Ray_Sheppard
66.8	60.1	66	QUE	Andrei_Kovalenko
66.4	59.8	64	HFD	Zarley_Zalapski
66.4	59.8	64	NYR	Adam_Graves
65.8	59.2	65	SJ	Johan_Garpenlov
64.5	58.1	63	TOR	Glenn_Anderson
63.5	57.2	62	LA	Wayne_Gretzky
63.5	57.2	62	OTT	Norm_Maciver
62.2	56.0	60	PHI	Garry_Galley
61.7	55.5	61	DET	Steve_Chiasson
61.7	55.5	61	DET	Paul_Ysebaert
61.5	55.4	60	NJ	Valeri_Zelepukin
61.5	55.4	60	MTL	Mike_Keane
61.2	55.1	59	PHI	Brent_Fedyk
60.7	54.6	60	PIT	Shawn_McEachern
60.4	54.4	59	LA	Rob_Blake
60.1	54.1	58	NYI	Pat_Flatley
59.7	53.7	59	QUE	Scott_Young
59.4	53.5	58	WPG	Darrin_Shannon
59.1	53.2	57	PHI	Kevin_Dineen
58.4	52.6	57	NJ	Bernie_Nicholls
58.4	52.6	57	CGY	Sergei_Makarov
58.4	52.6	57	CHI	Steve_Smith
58.1	52.3	56	WSH	Pat_Elynuik
57.4	51.7	56	VAN	Greg_Adams
57.4	51.7	56	NJ	Scott_Stevens
57.4	51.7	56	TB	John_Tucker
56.3	50.7	55	WPG	Fredrik_Olausson
56.0	50.4	54	NYR	Sergei_Nemchinov
55.0	49.5	53	NYR	Darren_Turcotte
55.0	48.9	53	CGY	Al_MacInnis
55.0	48.9	53	CHI	Christian_Ruuttu
55.0	48.0	52	CHI	Brent_Sutter
55.0	47.6	51	HFD	Terry_Yake
55.0	47.0	51	VAN	Dixon_Ward
55.0	47.0	51	WPG	Keith_Tkachuk
55.0	46.4	51	BOS	Stephen_Leach
55.0	46.1	50	TOR	John_Cullen
55.0	46.1	50	MTL	Denis_Savard
55.0	45.7	49	NYR	Ed_Olczyk
55.0	45.2	49	VAN	Anatoli_Semenov
55.0	44.8	48	WSH	Sylvain_Cote
55.0	44.8	48	NYI	Vladimir_Malakhov
55.0	44.8	48	NYI	Jeff_Norton
55.0	44.8	48	HFD	Patrick_Poulin
55.0	44.6	49	BOS	Dave_Poulin
55.0	44.3	48	LA	Tomas_Sandstrom
55.0	44.3	48	EDM	Petr_Klima
55.0	44.3	48	NJ	John_MacLean
55.0	44.3	48	EDM	Doug_Weight
55.0	43.3	47	MTL	Gilbert_Dionne
55.0	43.3	47	LA	Alexei_Zhitnik
55.0	43.3	47	EDM	Shayne_Corson
55.0	42.8	47	QUE	Martin_Rucinsky
55.0	42.4	46	WPG	Evgeny_Davydov
55.0	42.4	46	STL	Kevin_Miller
55.0	42.4	46	EDM	Craig_Simpson
55.0	42.0	45	WSH	Kelly_Miller
55.0	42.0	45	PHI	Pelle_Eklund
55.0	40.6	44	CHI	Michel_Goulet
55.0	40.6	44	EDM	Dave_Manson
55.0	39.6	43	OTT	Sylvain_Turgeon
55.0	38.7	42	CGY	Paul_Ranheim
55.0	38.7	42	MTL	Mathieu_Schneider
55.0	38.7	42	MIN	Mark_Tinordi
55.0	38.3	42	DET	Bob_Probert
55.0	37.8	41	EDM	Todd_Elik
55.0	37.4	40	NYR	Esa_Tikkanen
55.0	37.4	41	BOS	Vladimir_Ruzicka
55.0	36.9	40	OTT	Bob_Kudelski
55.0	36.9	40	NJ	Peter_Stastny
55.0	36.9	40	TOR	Dave_Ellett
55.0	36.9	40	OTT	Brad_Shaw
55.0	36.5	40	DET	Niklas_Lidstrom
55.0	36.0	39	NJ	Bobby_Holik
55.0	36.0	39	TOR	Wendel_Clark
55.0	35.5	38	NYR	Alexei_Kovalev
55.0	35.0	38	BUF	Yuri_Khmylev
55.0	35.0	38	MIN	Mike_McPhee
55.0	34.1	37	TOR	Rob_Pearson
55.0	34.1	37	VAN	Sergio_Momesso
55.0	33.6	36	NYR	Brian_Leetch
55.0	33.2	36	CHI	Dirk_Graham
55.0	33.2	36	TB	Adam_Creighton
55.0	32.8	36	QUE	Valery_Kamensky
55.0	32.3	35	EDM	Zdeno_Ciger
55.0	32.3	35	LA	Corey_Millen
55.0	31.9	35	BOS	Ted_Donato
55.0	31.3	34	TOR	Peter_Zezel
55.0	30.4	33	MIN	Neal_Broten
55.0	29.5	32	MTL	Gary_Leeman
55.0	29.5	32	EDM	Scott_Mellanby
55.0	29.5	32	BUF	Wayne_Presley
55.0	29.2	32	DET	Keith_Primeau
55.0	28.9	31	NYI	Brian_Mullen
55.0	28.9	31	PHI	Josef_Beranek
55.0	28.6	31	CHI	Stephane_Matteau
55.0	28.3	31	BOS	Steve_Heinze
55.0	28.0	30	PHI	Dmitri_Yushkevich
55.0	28.0	30	HFD	Mikael_Nylander
55.0	27.6	30	BUF	Richard_Smehlik
55.0	27.6	30	TOR	Dmitri_Mironov
55.0	25.8	28	CHI	Brian_Noonan
55.0	25.5	28	SJ	Pat_Falloon
55.0	24.9	27	STL	Igor_Korolev
55.0	24.3	26	WSH	Bob_Carpenter
55.0	24.3	26	NYR	James_Patrick
55.0	23.9	26	BUF	Petr_Svoboda
55.0	23.0	25	OTT	Mark_Lamb
55.0	22.4	24	NYI	Scott_LaChance
55.0	22.1	24	MTL	Benoit_Brunet
55.0	22.1	24	TB	Mikael_Andersson
55.0	21.2	23	EDM	Martin_Gelinas
55.0	21.2	23	WPG	Sergei_Bautin
55.0	21.2	23	TOR	Bill_Berg
55.0	21.2	23	EDM	Kevin_Todd
55.0	19.6	21	NYI	David_Volek
55.0	19.6	21	NYI	Ray_Ferraro
55.0	19.4	21	MIN	Brent_Gilchrist
55.0	18.6	20	HFD	Yvon_Corriveau
55.0	18.6	20	NYR	Phil_Bourque
55.0	18.6	20	NYI	Darius_Kasparaitis
55.0	18.2	20	DET	Jim_Hiller
55.0	17.7	19	PHI	Andrei_Lomakin
55.0	17.6	19	BUF	Donald_Audette
55.0	16.6	18	TB	Roman_Hamrlik
55.0	15.5	17	BOS	Cam_Neely
55.0	15.5	17	SJ	Mark_Pederson
55.0	14.6	16	PIT	Martin_Straka
55.0	13.9	15	CHI	Joe_Murphy
55.0	12.2	13	NYR	Peter_Andersson
55.0	12.0	13	OTT	Tomas_Jelinek
55.0	12.0	13	NJ	Janne_Ojanen
55.0	10.2	11	TB	Steve_Kasper
55.0	10.2	11	MIN	Bobby_Smith
55.0	9.1	10	SJ	Ray_Whitney
55.0	8.4	9	HFD	Robert_Petrovicky
55.0	8.3	9	BUF	Viktor_Gordijuk
55.0	7.4	8	TOR	Joe_Sacco
55.0	7.3	8	QUE	Mikhail_Tatarinov
55.0	7.3	8	SJ	Peter_Ahola
55.0	6.5	7	CHI	Rob_Brown
55.0	6.4	7	BOS	Glen_Murray
55.0	5.6	6	HFD	Tim_Kerr
55.0	5.5	6	MIN	Brian_Propp
55.0	4.7	5	WSH	Reggie_Savage
55.0	4.6	5	STL	Vitali_Prokhorov
55.0	4.6	5	LA	Robert_Lang
55.0	4.6	5	EDM	Shaun_Van_Allen
55.0	3.7	4	MIN	Dan_Quinn
55.0	3.6	4	DET	Viacheslav_Kozlov
55.0	3.6	4	BOS	Jozef_Stumpel
55.0	3.6	4	PIT	Bryan_Fogarty
55.0	2.8	3	MTL	Olav_Petrov
55.0	2.8	3	TB	Stan_Drulia
55.0	1.9	2	WSH	Jason_Woolley
55.0	1.8	2	NJ	Claude_Vilgrain
55.0	0.0	0	MTL	Patrick_Kjellberg
55.0	0.0	0	OTT	Alexei_Yashin
55.0	0.0	0	WSH	Randy_Burridge
55.0	0.0	0	EDM	Dean_McAmmond
55.0	0.0	0	CGY	Cory_Stillman
55.0	0.0	0	TB	Brent_Gretzky
55.0	0.0	0	BUF	Jason_Dawe
55.0	0.0	0	WSH	Brian_Sakic
55.0	0.0	0	VAN	Igor_Larionov
55.0	0.0	0	CHI	Sergei_Krivokrasov
55.0	0.0	0	QUE	Peter_Forsberg
-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53614
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Aargh!  Great Hockey Coverage!! (Devils)


Locked away, waiting for the tape-delay to start ...

It's nice that the Devils are starting out their playoffs on network
television ... too bad that their playoff game has been preempted on
WABC-AM for an early-season Yankees baseball game!

It's a 12-2 win by the Texas Rangers ... and they're delaying the
tape-delay by another half-hour for the ballgame "highlights"!!!

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53615
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Fri, April 16, 1993

Philadelphia                     1 1 2 1--5
Hartford                         1 2 1 0--4
First period
     1, Hartford, Nylander 10 (unassisted) 8:51.
     2, Philadelphia, Recchi 53 (Lindros, Brind'Amour) pp, 19:59.
Second period
     3, Hartford, Burt 6 (Cunneyworth, Kron) 2:00.
     4, Philadelphia, Bowen 1 (Eklund, Recchi) 7:09.
     5, Hartford, Nylander 11 (Zalapski, Sanderson) 9:38.
Third period
     6, Hartford, Kron 14 (Sanderson, Cassels) pp, 1:24.
     7, Philadelphia, Beranek 15 (Lomakin, Yushkevich) 3:11.
     8, Philadelphia, Faust 2 (Brind'Amour, Roussel) 3:38.
Overtime
     9, Philadelphia, Yushkevich 5 (Faust) 1:15.

Philadelphia: 5    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Beranek            1    0    1
Bowen              1    0    1
Brind'Amour        0    2    2
Eklund             0    1    1
Faust              1    1    2
Lindros            0    1    1
Lomakin            0    1    1
Recchi             1    1    2
Roussel            0    1    1
Yushkevich         1    1    2

Hartford: 4    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Burt               1    0    1
Cassels            0    1    1
Cunneyworth        0    1    1
Kron               1    1    2
Nylander           2    0    2
Sanderson          0    2    2
Zalapski           0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
New Jersey                       0 3 1--4
NY Islanders                     3 3 2--8
First period
     1, NY Islanders, Turgeon 56 (unassisted) 4:11.
     2, NY Islanders, Thomas 36 (Malakhov, King) pp, 5:58.
     3, NY Islanders, Ferraro 14 (Dalgarno, Malakhov) 18:16.
Second period
     4, New Jersey, Niedermayer 11 (Richer, Nicholls) 0:41.
     5, NY Islanders, Mullen 18 (Vaske, Dalgarno) 1:15.
     6, NY Islanders, Thomas 37 (Hogue, Norton) 2:12.
     7, New Jersey, Zelepukin 23 (unassisted) 17:11.
     8, New Jersey, Richer 38 (Nicholls, Daneyko) 17:23.
     9, NY Islanders, Hogue 33 (Flatley, Ferraro) 18:42.
Third period
     10, NY Islanders, Turgeon 57 (unassisted) 3:45.
     11, New Jersey, Semak 37 (Lemieux, Driver) 9:06.
     12, NY Islanders, Turgeon 58 (King, Pilon) 10:21.

NY Islanders: 8    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Dalgarno           0    2    2
Ferraro            1    1    2
Flatley            0    1    1
Hogue              1    1    2
King               0    2    2
Malakhov           0    2    2
Mullen             1    0    1
Norton             0    1    1
Pilon              0    1    1
Thomas             2    0    2
Turgeon            3    0    3
Vaske              0    1    1

New Jersey: 4    Power play: 2-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Daneyko            0    1    1
Driver             0    1    1
Lemieux            0    1    1
Nicholls           0    2    2
Niedermayer        1    0    1
Richer             1    1    2
Semak              1    0    1
Zelepukin          1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
NY Rangers                       1 0 1--2
Washington                       1 1 2--4
First period
     1, NY Rangers, Graves 36 (Zubov, Andersson) 6:17.
     2, Washington, Ridley 26 (unassisted) 18:33.
Second period
     3, Washington, Hatcher 34 (Johansson) 12:19.
Third period
     4, Washington, Jones 12 (May) 2:49.
     5, Washington, Cote 21 (Khristich, Pivonka) pp, 18:55.
     6, NY Rangers, Gartner 45 (Amonte, Andersson) pp, 19:50.

Washington: 4    Power play: 7-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Cote               1    0    1
Hatcher            1    0    1
Johansson          0    1    1
Jones              1    0    1
Khristich          0    1    1
May                0    1    1
Pivonka            0    1    1
Ridley             1    0    1

NY Rangers: 2    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Amonte             0    1    1
Andersson          0    2    2
Gartner            1    0    1
Graves             1    0    1
Zubov              0    1    1

-----------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53616
From: stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber)
Subject: Re: How difficult is it to get Penguin tickets?

In article <1993Apr18.201811.28965@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>, dmoney@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Dean R Money) writes:
> The subject line says it all.  Is it terribly difficult to get tickets
> to Penguins games, especially now that they are in the playoffs?  Would
> it be easy to find scalpers outside of the Igloo selling tickets?
> 
> Dean Money
> dmoney@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu

     Here is my traditional experience with tickets, playoffs and otherwise,
at the Civic Arena.

     Scalping is illegal but nonetheless present outside the Arena.  Best 
strategy, given that you don't mind missing the Anthem (which is OK if B.E.
Taylor decides to come back ever again :) ) is to wait until 7:40 or 7:45,
when the game is rolling; the scalpers are at this point desperate to sell
and will reduce to near or at face value to get rid of their tickets.

     Playoffs are a little different in that good seats will go early on; 
what's left at 7:45 may be nosebleed material (D, E sections).

Others can add on their opinions as well.

Kevin L. Stamber
Purdue University
PENGUINS 6 DEVILS 3 -- Pens lead series 1 game to none



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53617
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Did The Blues Pull It Out?

When I left, it was 4-3, Blues with 2:00 to go!  As I predicted in
"@#$%! I was right in the first place!!!"  Blues in 6!  YES!!!

Of course it's only one game -- that could be the 'Hawks stab in the face to
wake them up -- that's what playoffs are about, on any given day... :-)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          PGH PENGUINS!!!    "We do what comes naturally!
Patrick Division Semi's  '91 STANLEY CUP    You see now, wait for the
PENGUINS 6, Devils 3     '92 CHAMPIONS      possibility, don't you see a
Penguins lead, 1-0       12 STRAIGHT WINS!  strong resemblance..."-DG '89

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53618
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Playoff pool entry form

Well, thanks to everyone who has entered so far.  There are at least 40
entries, and hopefully more people will enter before the deadline, which
is 7:30 pm Today, Sunday, April 18, 1993!  In the interest of fairness,
since I will win anyway, I feel it is only right to actually tell everyone
my picks, so that you all won't cry "rigged" after I declare myself the
winner.  Here they are:


	Series			Your Pick		Games

   Division Semifinals

Pittsburgh-New Jersey		Pittsburgh		5
Washington-NY Islanders	NY Islanders		6

Boston-Buffalo			Boston			5
Quebec-Montreal			Quebec			7

Chicago-St. Louis		Chicago			4
Detroit-Toronto			Detroit			6

Vancouver-Winnipeg		Winnipeg		7
Calgary-Los Angeles		Calgary			7

   Division Finals

Patrick				Pittsburgh		6
Adams				Quebec			7
Norris				Chicago			7
Smythe				Calgary

   Conference Finals

Wales				Pittsburgh		5
Campbell			Chicago			4


Stanley Cup winner		Pittsburgh		6

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53619
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Playoff Pool (IMPORTANT)

I got back from my trip to discover that my email spool file got blown
away.  I am missing all the playoff pool entries sent between April 5
and April 17.  It looks like about 200 entries got lost.  *Sigh*.

Therefore, I would like to ask each person that sent me a team to resend
it ASAP.  I am relying on your honesty to not make changes after the
deadline today.

Thanks in advance, and I apologize for the problem.

-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53620
From: gp2011@andy.bgsu.edu (George Pavlic)
Subject: Re: Aargh!  Great Hockey Coverage!! (Devils)

In article <1993Apr18.203823.28597@news.columbia.edu>,
gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) wrote:
> 
> 
> Locked away, waiting for the tape-delay to start ...
> 
> It's nice that the Devils are starting out their playoffs on network
> television ... too bad that their playoff game has been preempted on
> WABC-AM for an early-season Yankees baseball game!
> 
> It's a 12-2 win by the Texas Rangers ... and they're delaying the
> tape-delay by another half-hour for the ballgame "highlights"!!!
> 
You think that's bad?  I'm in Bowling Green, OH, and we get ABC from
Toledo.  Well, the cable co. decided to totally pre-empt the game (no tape
delay, no nothing) for a stupid telethon!  Hockey is very big around here,
too.  I had to listen to "my" Penguins win on my car radio out in the
parking lot.  I can just be thankful for a strong radio because being 230
miles from Pittsburgh, the reception usually isn't good at all.  I can't
believe I picked it up during the middle of the day.

George

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53621
From: wangr@vccsouth22.its.rpi.edu ( Rex Wang )
Subject:  Tie Breaker....(Isles and Devils)

	Are people here stupid or what??? It is a tie breaker, of cause they
have to have the same record. How can people be sooooo stuppid to put win as
first in the list for tie breaker??? If it is a tie breaker, how can there be
different record???? Man, I thought people in this net are good with hockey.
I might not be great in Math, but tell me how can two teams ahve the same points
with different record??? Man...retard!!!!!! Can't believe people actually put
win as first in a tie breaker......



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53622
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: Blues steal game 1 from Hawks


  The Blues scored two power-play goals in 17 seconds in the third period
and the beat the Chicago Blackhawks 4-3 Sunday afternoon at Chicago Stadium.
Brendan Shanahan tied the game 3-3 and Brett Hull scored the game winner 17
seconds later. Jeff Brown and Denny Felsner scored the other Blues goals.
Brian Noonan had the hat trick for the Hawks, who also had some very good
goaltending from Ed Belfour. Blues goalie Curtis Joseph was solid down the
stretch to preserve the Blues lead.

The Hawks came out strong in the first period, outshooting the Blues 6-1 and
taking a 1-0 lead on Noonan's first goal. Right after an interference penalty
on Rick Zombo had expired, Keith Brown intercepted a clearing attempt at the
blue line and passed the puck to Steve Larmer in the right circle. Larmer fired
a long slap shot, and Noonan deflected the puck between Joseph's pads. After
the goal, the Blues picked up the intensity and went on to outshoot the Hawks
10-9 in the first period.

Jeff Brown tied the game 1-1 at 3:12 of the second. Nelson Emerson broke in on
the left side, got by Craig Muni and pushed the puck across the slot. Belfour
came out to play the pass and shoveled it to the right boards, where Brown
collected it and slapped it in before Belfour could get back to the goal.

Two minutes later on a Hawks power play, Belfour stopped Rich Sutter on a
short-handed break-in. Chris Chelios picked up the puck and passed it to Jeremy
Roenick who carried it on right wing and found an open Noonan with a nice pass
across the slot. Noonan fired it past Joseph at 5:30 for the 2-1 lead.

Noonan completed his hat trick 3:11 later to increase the Hawks' lead to 3-1.
Stephane Matteau made a nice pass from the right boards to Noonan who beat
Stephane Quintal by driving to the net. Joseph had no chance as Noonan
deflected the puck in the net.

Denny Felsner reduced the Blues deficit to 3-1 at 12:49 after picking up the
rebound of Basil McRae's slap shot from the slot. Janney set up McRae for
the shot, and the puck sailed wide of the net and bounced off the end boards
to Felsner. Felsner sticked the rebound into the partially open net. The Blues
outshot the Hawks 10-5 in the second period.

With the Blackhawks leading 3-2 at 9:56 of the third, Stephane Matteau picked
up a high sticking penalty. Just 53 seconds into the power play, Steve Smith
was called for slashing, giving the Blues a 5-on-3 advantage for 1:07.

The Blues didn't waste time as Brendan Shanahan scored just 23 seconds into
the two-man advantage to tie the game 3-3. Janney found Hull in the slot,
and Hull fired a rocket at Belfour. Jeff Brown collected the rebound and
passed it to Shanahan in the left circle. Shanahan beat Belfour from a sharp
angle.

Just 17 seconds later, Hull scored the game winner for the Blues. Nelson
Emerson broke in on right wing, carried the puck behind the net along with
two Hawks defensemen. Emerson made a nice pass to an unchecked Hull in the
slot, and Hull beat Belfour to put the Blues up 4-3.

The Hawks had several chances to tie the game in the final minutes, but Joseph
made some brilliant saves to prevent the Hawks from scoring. He stopped Troy
Murray point blank from just right of the crease with 2:30 left in the game.
The Blues killed off a late Hawks power play, with Rich Sutter clearing the
puck with his hand as it was trickling along the goal line. The Blues held
on to win the game. The Hawks oushot the Blues 13-7 in the third period,
totaling 27 shots on goal for each team. The Blues special teams were excellent
in the game. The Blues killed 6 of 7 Hawks power plays, and scored twice on
on four power play chances. The Blues ranked among the best special teams in
the league. They rank 2nd in penalty killing and 3rd on the power play.
 
The game was carried live on ABC, the first time an NHL game other than an
All-Star game has been shown on network television since May 24, 1980, when
CBS carried Game 6 of the Stanley Cup finals.

The best-of-seven series continues Wednesday in Chicago and Friday and Sunday
in St. Louis.

Box score
---------
Blues 4, Blackhawks 3

BLUES       0    2    2   --   4
CHICAGO     1    2    0   --   3

FIRST PERIOD

   CHI -- Noonan 1 (Larmer, K.Brown), 8:17.

   Penalties -- Shanahan, StL (holding), 2:28; Zombo, StL (interference), 6:00;
Murphy, Chi (high-sticking), 11:30; Grimson, Chi (boarding), 14:39; Zombo, StL
(holding), 18:46.

SECOND PERIOD

   STL -- Brown 1 (Shanahan, Emerson), 3:12.
   CHI -- (PPG) Noonan 2 (Roenick, Chelios), 5:40.
   CHI -- Noonan 3 (Matteau, Sutter), 8:51.
   STL -- Felsner 1 (McRae, Janney), 12:49.

   Penalties -- Baron, StL (interference), 4:33; Wilson, StL (tripping), 9:31.

THIRD PERIOD

   STL -- (PPG) Shanahan 1 (J.Brown, Hull), 11:12.
   STL -- (PPG) Hull 1 (Emerson, J.Brown), 11:29.

   Penalties -- Shanahan, StL (roughing), 1:54; Matteau, Chi (high-sticking),
9:56; Smith, Chi (slashing), 10:49; Baron, StL (roughing), 14:23.

SHOTS ON GOAL

BLUES       10    10     7   --   27
CHICAGO      9     5    13   --   27

Power-play Opportunities -- St. Louis 2 of 4; Chicago 1 of 7.

Goaltenders -- St. Louis, Joseph, 1-0-0 (27 shots-24 saves).
               Chicago, Belfour, 0-1-0 (27-23).

Referee -- Kerry Fraser. Linesmen -- Kevin Collins, Brian Murphy. A -- 16,199.

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53623
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Tie Breaker....(Isles and Devils)

In <lrw509f@rpi.edu> wangr@vccsouth22.its.rpi.edu ( Rex Wang ) writes:

>I might not be great in Math, but tell me how can two teams ahve the same points
>with different record??? Man...retard!!!!!! Can't believe people actually put
>win as first in a tie breaker......

Well I don't see any smileys here.  I am trying to figure out if the poster
is a dog or a wordprocessor.  Couldn't be neither.  Both are smarter than
this.

"I might not be great in Math"


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53624
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: Aargh! Great Hockey Coverage!! (Devils)

In article <1993Apr18.203823.28597@news.columbia.edu>,
gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) says:
>Locked away, waiting for the tape-delay to start ...

I think this guy is going to be just a little bit disappointed.  Lemieux
two, Tocchet, Mullen, Tippett, and Jagr.  I buzzed my friend because I forgot
who had scored Mullen's goal.  I said, "Who scored?  Lemieux two, Tocchet,
Tippett, Jagr."  The funny part was I said the "Jagr" part non-chalantly as
he was in the process of scoring while I was asking this question!!! :-)

All in all ABC's coverage wasn't bad.  On a scale of 1-10, I give it about
an 8.  How were the games in the Chi/St. Louis/LA area???

>It's nice that the Devils are starting out their playoffs on network
>television ... too bad that their playoff game has been preempted on
>WABC-AM for an early-season Yankees baseball game!

That's stupid!!!  I'd complain to the television network!  If I were to even
see a Pirates game on instead of a Penguins game at this time of the year, I
and many other Pittsburghers would surely raise hell!!!

>It's a 12-2 win by the Texas Rangers ... and they're delaying the
>tape-delay by another half-hour for the ballgame "highlights"!!!

Texas is off to a good start, they may pull it out this year.  Whoops!  That
belongs in rec.sport.baseball!!!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          PGH PENGUINS!!!    "We do what comes naturally!
Patrick Division Semi's  '91 STANLEY CUP    You see now, wait for the
PENGUINS 6, Devils 3     '92 CHAMPIONS      possibility, don't you see a
Penguins lead, 1-0       12 STRAIGHT WINS!  strong resemblance..."-DG '89

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53625
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: @#$%! I was right in the first place!!!

In article <vzhivov.735059801@cunews>, vzhivov@superior.carleton.ca (Vladimir
Zhivov) says:
>
>In <93107.091503RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>
>>2-Red Wings vs. 3-Maple Leafs               Maple Leafs in 6
>
>>  Comment : It's kind of tough to rely on Yzerman as the team's main weapon.
>>            He's a great palyer, but Dino knows all about choking, which
>>            puts the burden on Steve even more.  Potvin's had a hell of a
>>            season and goaltending is what you need in the playoffs.
>
>For a great prognosticator:), you seem to remember very little playoff
>history. Dino always shows up in the playoffs, which is why he is a
>great "sleeper" pick in pools. Don't forget about Fedorov, one of the
>top players in the NHL, IMHO, and Coffey who has the most Stanley Cup
>rings of any active players (correct me if I'm wrong). Wings in a
>cakewalk.

Oh yeah, how come Dino could never take the Caps out of the Patrick
Division?  He choked up 3 games to 1 last year and got swept away in
the second round two years ago.  He rarely, if ever, makes it out of the
division.

>>1-Canucks vs. 4-Jets                        Canucks in 5
>
>>  Comment : It's more like Vancouver vs. Selanne.  King and Domi (for
>>            enforcing) help Winnipeg out a little, maybe a game.  Canucks
>>            have their number.
>
>Except that the Canuck are playing like shit. Winnipeg can win this
>one, though I think Vancouver will manage to slip by.

So are the Islanders, but they can still pull it out.  Vancouver has Winnipeg's
 number, so it really doesn't matter.

>>2-Flames vs. 3-Kings                        Flames in 7
>
>>  Comment : 7 games looks good as the Kings always seem to battle it out.
>>            Flames are back in running and won't know memories of last year's
>>            season.  Gretzky is on a tear, but there are too many ?????
>>            surrounding the Kings.

>Kings "always seem to battle it out"? When? Where?

 Kings always seem to go at least 6 or 7, they never play a four or five
game serious.  There's a difference between battling it out and pulling it
out, as I take Calgary to pull it out in 7.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          PGH PENGUINS!!!    "We do what comes naturally!
Patrick Division Semi's  '91 STANLEY CUP    You see now, wait for the
PENGUINS 6, Devils 3     '92 CHAMPIONS      possibility, don't you see a
Penguins lead, 1-0       12 STRAIGHT WINS!  strong resemblance..."-DG '89

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53626
From: ddlin@athena.mit.edu (David D Lin)
Subject: Daigle/Kariya

I hear Daigle will eb the first pick next year. What is the word on Kariya???
Anybody ever seen him play on TV???? Is he also entering the draft???

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53627
From: doyle@cs.umass.edu (Jim Doyle)
Subject: UMass Big East hockey underway



The mission to revive hockey at UMass is now underway. At the  4 PM Saturday
afternoon press conference held at the new Mullins Center Arena - former
Boston College Asst. Coach Joe Mallen was awarded the 4 year, $85,000/year
contract as Head Coach for the UMass Minutemen. 

Mallen was the third viable pick for the position, right behind Jeff Jackson
(Lake Superior) and second behind Shawn Walsh (UMaine). Previous offers for 
the position were rumored to have been offered to the asst. coaches of
Brown, RPI and the head coach of the AHL Springfield Indians.

UMass hockey was disbanded in 1979 due to financial constraints that had
undermined the team's position over a period of years. In late November
of last year, the $52 million Mullins Sports Center was opened following
its one year construction deadline. 

The Minutemen are slated to play an independent Div II/Div III schedule this
upcoming winter before officially entering Hockey East for the Winter 1994
season. Mallen has yet to comment on player recruitment strategies or
potential team candidates for the Minutemen - it is expected that he will
leverage off his inside contacts within New England, the Bay State and
Europe to draw on competitive, top ice players for the University.

UMass has slated 18 hockey scholarships for the upcoming Fall semester ; 
expect to hear more from me as I hear more from my sources.

.... J.D.


+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
Jim Doyle 	Univ. of Massachusetts - Dept. of Computer Science

Staff Programmer	PUMA/DCC/CNET	 email:	doyle@gaia.cs.umass.edu

office:		Lederle GRC Room A203	 Tel.  413-545-3179
home  :		91 Blackberry Ln         Tel.  413-549-1409
		Amherst,MA 01002-1516	
							

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53628
From: gomer+@pitt.edu (Richard J Coyle)
Subject: Re: How difficult is it to get Penguin tickets?

In article <1993Apr18.201811.28965@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> dmoney@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Dean R Money) writes:
>The subject line says it all.  Is it terribly difficult to get tickets
>to Penguins games, especially now that they are in the playoffs?  Would
>it be easy to find scalpers outside of the Igloo selling tickets?

There are ALWAYS scalpers with tickets outside the Arena.  You might have
to pay a few bucks extra, but you can always find them.  Look on the
street under the message board, or out on the street in front of the Hyatt,
or even around Gate 1.  The later you buy them, the less money you'll pay,
and during the regular season you could usually find some for near face
value or below if you wait until game time.  Might be better to pick them
up earlier now, though.

rick

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53629
From: umfu0009@ccu.umanitoba.ca (J. M. K. Fu)
Subject: Re: Tie Breaker....(Isles and Devils)

In <lrw509f@rpi.edu> wangr@vccsouth22.its.rpi.edu ( Rex Wang ) writes:

>	Are people here stupid or what??? It is a tie breaker, of cause they
>have to have the same record. How can people be sooooo stuppid to put win as
>first in the list for tie breaker??? If it is a tie breaker, how can there be
>different record???? Man, I thought people in this net are good with hockey.
>I might not be great in Math, but tell me how can two teams ahve the same points
>with different record??? Man...retard!!!!!! Can't believe people actually put
>win as first in a tie breaker......

Why not? I believe both the Devils and Islanders got 87 points.
Say for example, another team had this record : 20-37-47;
they had 20*2+47*1+37*0=87 which is the same as their points total.
(The Islanders' and Devils' records are both 40-37-7.

It is simple arithmetics and involve no Calculus.


John.
(a computer science graduate who pretends to be a mathematican)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53630
From: rjtapp@neumann.uwaterloo.ca (Riston Tapp)
Subject: Re: Bruins vs Canadiens:

In article <1993Apr16.213513.7683@rose.com> jack.petrilli@rose.com (jack petrilli) writes:
>On April 14,  richard@amc.com (Richard Wernick) wrote:
>
>or Boston? You know Sinden's going to find some way of screwing up 
>even this good Boston team. He'll fire Suter or trade away a vital 
>star. (Admittedly, his last few trades have been good ones but how 
>long before his luck runs out and he starts making Esposito-for-
>Ratelle type trades again?) 
>

How was this trade bad? I seem to recall Ratelle and Middleton making a pretty
good centre - right wing combination, and the Bruins also got Brad Park in the
deal (and they also lost Vadnais and somebody else). After the trade, the 
Bruins were in two finals and one semi-final, all of which, of course, they 
lost to Montreal (which should please you to no end). I doubt, however, keeping
Esposito would have made a difference in those series, as he did not for
the Rangers in '79 (or any of his years in Boston, for that matter).

Riston
-- 
Riston
------
            _  ___  _
	   //^/o o\^\\

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53631
From: Martin D. Hill <32GFKKH@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: NHL team in Milwaukee

Well put, Jason.  I am not from Wisconsin, but I have close relatives who
live in Port Washington (about 30 minutes north of Milwaukee), I visit the
city regularly, and I have been in the Bradley four times to see the Admirals
play  and the NCAA Hockey Championships.  It is a beautiful building.  The
Pettits and the city like to promote it as the best facility for hockey in
North America.
As to what will happen with the Admirals if Milwaukee does acquire a
franchise, word is the team will move to Green Bay and play in the Brown
County Arena.
Once again, the Admirals are an independent franchise, and the people of
Milwaukee have been supporting them well.  The games I have been to have seen
crowds anywhere from 10,000 to 13,000, which are numbers some NHL teams (i.e.
the Islanders, Hartford, New Jersey) would be envious of having on some nights.
Plus the fact that the city is able to support a minor league franchise without
the glamour of having an NHL club affiliated to it is testimony to the amount
of hockey interest exists in the city.

Sincerely,

Martin Hill, Rt. 2, Box 155B, Sault Ste. Marie, MI (Home of LSSU:  Go Lakers!)

P.S.  Anybody know what the attendance figures are for the IHL and how
Milwaukee stacks up against other IHL cities such as Atlanta, Phoenix, San
Diego, Cleveland, and Cincinnati?  If so, please reply.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53632
From: epritcha@s.psych.uiuc.edu ( Evan Pritchard)
Subject: Re: div. and conf. names

maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>In <115873@bu.edu> Jason Gibson writes:

>>I can live with the other changes that have been made (e.g. the playoff format
>>change), but the change to the division and conference names really annoys me.
>>"Batman" was on TSN last night saying that changing the names would make the
>>game easier for the "occasional fan to follow".  He should have said what he
>>meant: that changing the names will make the game easier for _Americans_ in 
>>non-hockey cities to follow.  I don't know of too many of my friends who had 
>>a hard time following which teams were in each division. Even a minimal amount
>>of exposure to the game allows a person to quickly pick up on this.

>There is nothing wrong with making the game easier for "_Americans_" to
>follow.  The more fans the merrier and even if you dislike the "occasional"
>fan there is always the chance that these fans will become fanatics.

>I am glad that the names are being changed for another reason.  The names
>Patrick, Smythe, Norris, Adams and Campbell are all the names of so-called
>"builders" of the game.  This is the same type of thinking that put Stein
>in the Hall of Fame.  This is absolute nonsense.  The real builders of the
>game are Richard, Morenz, Howe, Conacher, Orr, etc.  If you are going to
>name the divisions after people at least name the divisions after people
>who deserve it.

	I think that you are incorrect, Roger.  Patrick,
Smythe and Adams all played or coached in the league before becoming
front office types.  Hence, they did help build the league, although
they were not great players themselves.  

	I agree that a name is a name is a name, and if some people
have trouble with names that are not easily processed by the fans,
then changing them to names that are more easily processed seems like
a reasonable idea.  If we can get people in the (arena) door by being
uncomplicated, then let's do so.  Once we have them, they will realize
what a great game hockey is, and we can then teach them something
abotu the history of the game.  
 
>The history of the names can be put rather succinctly.  All of the aforemen-
>tioned used the game of hockey to make money.  Can you imagine a Pocklington
>division?  A Ballard division?  Or how about a Green division?

	No, I would not want to see a Ballard division.  But to say
that these owners are assholes, hence all NHL management people are
assholes would be fallacious.  Conn Smythe, for example, was a classy
individual (from what I have heard). 

	Also, isn't the point of "professional" hockey to make money
for all those involved, which would include the players.  What I think
you might be saying is that the players have not made as much money as
should have been their due, and it is the players that are what make
the game great not the people who put them on the ice, so naming
division after management people rather than players is adding insult
(in the form of lesser recognition) to injury (less money than was
deserved).   

_______________________
Evan Pritchard --------  Number 1 or 9 depending on the hockey pool 
=======================
epritcha@psych.uiuc.edu  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53633
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Aargh! Great Hockey Coverage!! (Devils)

Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) says:
>>Locked away, waiting for the tape-delay to start ...
>
>I think this guy is going to be just a little bit disappointed.

Why?  I'm calling this Penguins ... in 6.  Only that with the way 
things stand, the only radio game at that hour is from the Devils
on WABC, 770 AM.  It'd be nice to have a Sony Watchman, but ...

No need to be paranoid, Robbie.  Don't judge me by my geographic
coordinates ...

Jets over Nordiques in the final ... 7.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53634
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: div. and conf. names

In <C5pDGI.LJL@news.cso.uiuc.edu> epritcha@s.psych.uiuc.edu ( Evan Pritchard) writes:

>	I think that you are incorrect, Roger.  Patrick,
>Smythe and Adams all played or coached in the league before becoming
>front office types.  Hence, they did help build the league, although
>they were not great players themselves.  

Punch Imlach's contributions as a coach and GM were far greater than
those of the above combined.  Should we name a division or trophy after
him?  Smythe and Norris and the bunch were honoured purely because they
were powerful owners.  As owners they certainly did help to build the
league but whether they developed the game is another question altogether.
Are we going to honour those who contributed to the league's evolution
or are we going to honour those who contributed to the glory of the 
sport itself?   

>	I agree that a name is a name is a name, and if some people
>have trouble with names that are not easily processed by the fans,
>then changing them to names that are more easily processed seems like
>a reasonable idea.  If we can get people in the (arena) door by being
>uncomplicated, then let's do so.  Once we have them, they will realize
>what a great game hockey is, and we can then teach them something
>abotu the history of the game.  

I can't disagree with you here.

>>The history of the names can be put rather succinctly.  All of the aforemen-
>>tioned used the game of hockey to make money.  Can you imagine a Pocklington
>>division?  A Ballard division?  Or how about a Green division?

>	No, I would not want to see a Ballard division.  But to say
>that these owners are assholes, hence all NHL management people are
>assholes would be fallacious.  Conn Smythe, for example, was a classy
>individual (from what I have heard). 

What have you heard?  The Major was the *definitive* little asshole!  He
originated the phrase "if you can't beat 'em in the alley you can't beat
'em on the ice."  That was his idea of hockey.  Do you think, by chance,
that Don Cherry is a classy individual?

>	Also, isn't the point of "professional" hockey to make money
>for all those involved, which would include the players.  What I think
>you might be saying is that the players have not made as much money as
>should have been their due, and it is the players that are what make
>the game great not the people who put them on the ice, so naming
>division after management people rather than players is adding insult
>(in the form of lesser recognition) to injury (less money than was
>deserved).   

The money issue is irrelevant to the point that we would agree on, and
that is: "it is the players that are what make the game great and not the
people who put them on the ice"

Exactly true.  Naming divisions and trophies after Smythe and the bunch
is the same kind of nepotism that put Stein in the hall of fame.  I have
always thought that this was nonsense.


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53635
From: roney@selkirk.sfu.ca (Chris J. Roney)
Subject: Re: div. and conf. names

epritcha@s.psych.uiuc.edu ( Evan Pritchard) writes:


>	No, I would not want to see a Ballard division.  But to say
>that these owners are assholes, hence all NHL management people are
>assholes would be fallacious.  Conn Smythe, for example, was a classy
>individual (from what I have heard). 

     Depends on what you mean by classy. From what I've heard about
him, he was about as classy as Harold Ballard.  Only difference was
that back then almost all the owners were like that, so he seemed okay
by comparison.  Read the book "Net Worth" for one view of what Smythe
(and Norris and Adams and Campbell) were like. 

>	Also, isn't the point of "professional" hockey to make money
>for all those involved, which would include the players.  What I think
>you might be saying is that the players have not made as much money as
>should have been their due, and it is the players that are what make
>the game great not the people who put them on the ice, so naming
>division after management people rather than players is adding insult
>(in the form of lesser recognition) to injury (less money than was
>deserved).   


     Even more specifically, I think what Roger was saying (and I said
it previously too) is that these are NOT the people who made the
league great, so why should divisions, conferences etc. be named after
them instead of Morenz, Vezina, Howe, Orr etc., the people who DID
make it great.  Instead, the NHL has chosen to immortalize the men who
got rich off of the men who made the game great.  

-- 
Chris Roney  (e-mail chris_roney@sfu.ca)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53636
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: Re: Numerical Nothingness

In article <1993Apr18.140401.18439@freenet.carleton.ca> ad684@Freenet.carleton.ca (Bob Wilson) writes:
>
>Mario averaged 2.66666666666666666666666666666666666666666666
>points per game ... the Antigretz

Gretzky averaged 2.69 pts/game

>Mario projected over 80 games.
>213 points (beats Wayne's record by 1)

Check your information before posting, Gretzky's record is 215 pts in 80 games.


>Over 84 games 97 g + 127 a = 224 points.
>
Over 84 games, Gretzky's total projected 226 points.

>Pitt's winning percentage with Mario (45-10-5) over 84 games
>-> 133 points.   Would this have been a record?
>I know Mtl had 132 one year.

The 76-77 Canadiens had .825 percentage, 132 pts in 80 games. (60-8-12).
The 29-30 Bruins had a .875 winning percentage.
Also the 77-78 Canadiens had a .806 percentage with a 59-10-11 record.

>Bob Wilson
>ad684@freenet.carleton.ca

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53637
From: mmilitzo@scott.skidmore.edu (matthew militzok)
Subject: NHL Playoff Stats & Scores

For updated playoff updates (scores, stats, summaries)
e-mail me. (mmilitzo@skidmore.edu) with the subject STATS.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53638
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Rangers name Keenan coach

clarinews@clarinet.com (UPI) writes in clari.sports.hockey:

>	NEW YORK (UPI) -- Mike Keenan, whose NHL coaching history
>has been to wear out his welcome despite an impressive penchant for 
>winning, has come to the city that embraces victors above all else.

Well, I could become a fan ... (-;

Seriously, this news coming since Thursday has effectively robbed the
Islanders and the Devils of any airtime on sports talk shows almost
everywhere that I've sampled ... in fact, the playoffs almost don't
exist now. )-; Ranger fans calling in to WFAN or to New York One's
midnight sports talk were in a mix of fury over this season and near-
orgasm over Keenan's hiring.  (Summarizing: Keenan is a winner and
will give the Broadway Bums 'da business' in pursuing the next Cup
chase ...)

>	The Chicago Blackhawks cut their last tie with Keenan when
>he was forced out as general manager in November. He had given up
>Chicago's coaching duties a year ago and his thirst for the power
>of a GM now increases the pressure on beleaguered Rangers GM Neil
>Smith.

This will be an interesting combination to watch ... Keenan has been
paid enough money to put up and shut up and just be a coach, but his
advice on any player moves will be listened to closely.  A lot of big
player moves will happen --- remember that Keenan got rid of Denis
Savard.  The country club days are over ...

>	``When Keenan left Chicago I couldn't help but think about 
>him as our coach,'' Smith said. ``There was an indication he would 
>be taken off the market. I feared that and couldn't let that happen.''

If Paramount had given Smith an earlier sign of support and offered
Keenan the big money to put-up-and-shut-up back in January, the
Rangers might not be heading for golf now ...

>	Keenan, 43, takes on a demoralized team that offers him a
>chance to fashion yet another of his reclamation projects -- at the
>highest salary ever commanded by an NHL coach. The Rangers -- owned
>by Gulf & Western -- have bestowed upon Keenan an unprecedented $3
>million, four-year deal,

>	``I've known Mike a long time,'' Messier said. ``We've won two
>Canada Cups together. He's been to the finals three times. Maybe we
>miss just one more element to win the Stanley Cup. I don't think he's
>the same person he was 10 years ago or even five years ago. I think he
>has changed and bettered himself with experience.''

One of Keenan's first statements was a reaffirmation that Mark Messier
will be the team's captain.

>	The timing of the move gives the Rangers' new coach 2 1-2
>months to prepare for the NHL draft (June 26), and Neil Smith may 
>not back off the their trade-happy pattern.

By then, Smith might have some bargains on Keenan's advice ... like
maybe unloading Phil Bourque for Tie Domi ... (-;

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53639
From: boora@kits.sfu.ca (The GodFather)
Subject: LA ON ABC IN CANADA

	Was the ABC coverage of the Kings/Flames game supposed to be the
way it was shown in BC with CBC overriding the ABC coverage?  When I flipped
to ABC, it was the same commentators, same commercials even.  My question
is:  Was this the real ABC coverage or did CBC just "black out" the 
ABC coverage for its own?


	comment:

	CBC had a great chance for some double headers:  Toronto/Detroit
and Vancouver/Winnipeg, but today they said that the East gets the Leafs
and the West get the Vancouver game.  I thought that they would show them
both.

		The GodfAther


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53640
From: Martin D. Hill <32GFKKH@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Subject:    college hockey all-star game

Does anybody know the details of the Shriners All-Star game that featured the
best seniors in college hockey in a game in Orono, Maine?  If you do, please
reply.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53641
From: rrmadiso@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca (*** CHUCK ***)
Subject: CORRECTIONS --- Re: Playoff predictions


Everyone... Read this.  If you have already sent your predictions, please
correct the Patrick division if you would like.  You have until midnight
on monday (my time.)

You may need to correct these games...


3 - Pittsburgh vs. New Jersey
4 - New York Islanders vs. Washington

10 - Patrick Division Winner

13 - Wales Conference Winner

15 - Stanley Cup Winner

Please forward all corrections to

Richard Madison
rrmadiso@napier.uwaterloo.ca



>1st rd:	Pens over Isles in 4.
>	Devils over Caps in 6.
>2nd:	Pens over Devils in 7.



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53642
From: andy.bgsu.edu (Ryan )
Subject: What are you smoking? (wasRe: My Predictions of a classic playoff year!)


> 	Norris Division
> 

> 
> TOR vs DET    TOR in 7   (THis , like MON vs QUE, will be another intense 
> 			 (series to watch!)
> 
> CHI vs TOR    TOR in 7   (Potvin will be settling in nicely by this point.)
> 

> 
> Vancouver vs Toronto		Toronto in 6  (Potvin will be series MVP)
> 
 *This is what kills me:
> 	STANLEY CUP FINALS  
> 
> Toronto Maple Leafs    vs    Montreal Canadiens    
> 	(The Classic Stanley Cup Final matchup!!) <---also a dream come true!
> 
> 	Montreal wins the Stanley cup in the 7th game 1 - 0 in double overtime.
> Roy and Potvin are spectacular throughout the series and share series MVP (if 
> that is possible) Vincent Damphouse nets game winner from a brilliant pass by
> Brian Bellows! Canadiens star(?) Denis Savard watched his buddies play from the
> owners box nursing that splinter on his thumb which has left him on the 
> disabled list since the first game of the playoffs (awww shucks). 

> 							Paul
> 						Die hard Habs Fan living with
> 						3 Die hard Leafs fans!
*******************************************************************************
Speaking of "die hard", that's what I did when I read this, died hard
laughing!

Toronto, to the Cup finals???

First of all, has anyone on the planet heard of the team from Detroit?  Al
Morgani (or however you spell the idiot's name) must be from Chicago,
because on ESPN, he said "it's not even close--Chicago will definatly win
the Norris Division in the Playoffs, no other team is close."  Everyone is
picking Chicago!  I don't get it, he says it's an "easy choice"?
God, Chicago was 1-4-1 against the Wings, and they won the division by a
point or two, followed closely by Toronto, who is also a good team!
As for the Leafs beating Detroit--doubt it, but even if they do, they
aren't going to get by Chicago.  If (even more amazingly) they get past the
Hawks, they would probably face Vancouver, and lose.
As for The Habs reaching the Finals, forget it.  Even I, as a devoted Wings
fan, will watch the Penguins easily three-peat as Cup winners.  Lemieux,
Jagr, Tocchet, Stevens, and Barrasso, its a done deal.  Sorry Detroit, wait
til next year.
But hey, these were Paul's picks, and everyone has a right to their own
opinnions, but the Leafs to the Finals??? Yeah. If they make it there, I'll
walk to Toronto to get some tickets, and that's a 700 mile walk!  

--Ryan--

Detroit Red Wings--the forgotten team!  Go Wings!!  Let's hope the Penguins
go out
early!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53643
From: colling@ann-arbor.applicon.slb.com (Michael Collingridge)
Subject: NHL Team Captains

In the mist of the Rangers soap box (i.e. Captain neMesis-ier/ex-coach 
Roger Nebula bad blood bath) and with high hopes turned to new coach 
Mr. Klean (Commissar Keenan)... I would like to know what procedures 
hockey teams use to select their captains (including A's). Are they 
selected by the coaching staff, do the players vote for a captain, or 
are they appointed by management?

And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
team captain trivia would be appreciated.

-- Mike

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53644
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

In <1993Apr19.022113.12134@ann-arbor.applicon.slb.com> colling@ann-arbor.applicon.slb.com (Michael Collingridge) writes:

>And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
>resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 

The Leafs have always been kind of comical.  During the second  Imlach
era, when Darryl Sittler was called a "cancer on the team", he tore the
C off his sweater and for a while the Leafs didn't have a Captain.

Sittler eventually ended up in Philly and he was promised  the  Philly
captaincy  by  new  GM  (and Sittler's friend) Bobby Clarke.  Instead,
Sittler got traded to Detroit.

Rick Vaive was the Leaf Captain for awhile but he slept in one day and
they took the captaincy away from him.  Then he was traded to Chicago.

During Doug Carpenter's tenure as Leaf coach, in an  attempt  to  kiss
the  ass of a sulking Gary Leeman, the Leafs took the A away from Brad
Marsh to give to Leeman.  Leeman wouldn't take it and when they  tried
to give it back to Marsh, he wouldn't take it neither.

The best story I remember about a captain concerned Mel Bridgman, late
of the Senators.  While he was in Philadelphia, Bobby Clarke, arguably
one of the great captains of all time, was bumped up to the status  of
playing coach and so he had to relinquish the captaincy.  Bridgman be-
came the new captain.  A reporter asked a Flyer what Bridgman did as a
captain  since  Clarke  was  still  the  undisputed leader amongst the
players.  The reporter was told that Bridgman was in charge of  making
sure that the soap dispensers in the showers were always full.


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53645
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Tie Breaker....(Isles and Devils)

In article <lrw509f@rpi.edu> wangr@rpi.edu writes:
>
>	Are people here stupid or what??? It is a tie breaker, of cause they
>have to have the same record. How can people be sooooo stuppid to put win as
>first in the list for tie breaker??? If it is a tie breaker, how can there be
>different record???? Man, I thought people in this net are good with hockey.
>I might not be great in Math, but tell me how can two teams ahve the same points
>with different record??? Man...retard!!!!!! Can't believe people actually put
>win as first in a tie breaker......

Golly, I love stupid people. :-)
Listen, Rex, this is hockey.  The NHL, to be precise.  And in the NHL,
there exist these things called "ties".  A tie occurs when a game ends
with the score for each team equal.  Each team gets one point for a tie. 
There also exits these things called "wins".  A win is when one team has a
higher score than the opponent.  (Oh yeah, only two teams play each other
at a time, so I can say "the opponent".)  A team gets two points for a
win.  So, let's say that a team has a record of 38 wins, 36 losses, and 10
ties.  Another team has a record of 40 wins, 38 losses and 6 ties.  The
first team has (38*2)+10 = 86 points.  The second team has (40*2)+6 = 86
points.  WOW!  They *both* have the same number of points, but the number
of wins is different!  How did they do that??!?!?!?!  That's amazing.  So,
Rex, when people talk about wins being the first tiebreaker, well, then
that's what it means.  In our example, the second team would win the
tiebreaker and therefore have the "better" record, even though both teams
had the same number of points.  If you didn't understand this post, Rex,
maybe you should go back and read it again, very slowly.
:-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-)

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53646
From: Mamatha Devineni Ratnam <mr47+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Atlanta Hockey Hell!!


Well, it's not that bad. But I am still pretty pissed of at the
local ABC coverage. They cut off the first half hour of coverage by playing
David Brinkley at 12:30 instead of an earlier time slot. I don't
even understand their problem. If they didnt think enough people would

not watch the game why would they decide to show most of the game? And
if they showed the remaining 2.5 hours of the game, would it hurt to play
David Brinkley at its regular time? They dont have any decent programming
before noon anyway. I called the sports dept and blasted them on their
machine. I called gain and someone picked it up. When I asked him why they
premepted the first half hour of the Stanley Cup playoffs, he seemed a bit
confused. When I explained a bit more in detail, he then said that's upto
to our programming dept. call back on  Monday. weel, I understand that the
sports dept is not responsible for this preemption. BUt I can't understand
how someone in the sports dept. can't even recognise the name of playoffs
shown on the very same station he works for.

Anyway, I am going to call them tomorrow and blast them on the phone again.
I urge all Atlanta hockey fans to call WSB 2 and ask them not to do the
same thing for the next 4 weeks.

-Pravin Ratnam(Oh by the way, Pens rule!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53647
From: sclark@epas.utoronto.ca (Susan Clark)
Subject: OOOPS!

Picture if you will, the Habs going into the last couple minutes of the
game, leading 2-0.  The Nords get a power play, pull Hextall, and get
a goal.  Bout a minute later, they get another one.  Then they win in
overtime......

A bad dream?.......

How's that Red Hot Chili Peppers song go...
"Give it away,give it away, give it away now...."

Oh well.  Suppose I can always watch the Leafs win tomorrow night....
   (smilies.....)

Am I the only female hockey fan in the world?

Susan Carroll-Clark
sclark@epas.utoronto.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53648
From: JBE5 <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA>
Subject: Nords 3 - Habs 2 in O.T. We was robbed!!

Aargh!

Paul Stewart is the worst and most biased ref. presently in the NHL.
He called a total of 4 penalties on the Habs and one on the Nordiques.
The Nords' penalty came in O.T.  Stewart, being an ex-Nordique himself,
was looking to call penalties on the Habs while letting the Nords
get away with murder...WE WAS ROBBED!!!!

It was an excellent game with plenty of end-to-end rushes and tremendous
goalkeeping.  The Nords tied it with over 1 minute to go while Lebeau
was serving a penalty.  I don't mind Stewart calling a penalty in the
last 5 min. of the game, but AT LEAST BE FAIR ABOUT IT.  The Nords were
caught with their hand in the cookie jar more than once.  Stewart turned
the other cheek...BASTARD!

Patrick Roy collapsed after letting in the tieing goal. He was shaky and
on his knees for the rest of the night.  The winning goal shouldn't have
gone in.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not blaming the loss on Stewart.  The Habs had
plenty of chances to capitalize, Muller, LeClair, Haller, etc. but
failed to put the puck in the net.  That's what did them in.  But
Mr. Stewart didn't help matters at all.

Oh well, at least the Bruins lost in O.T. also Ha, Ha!!--)

                               ,,,
                              (0-0)
============================oOO(_)OOo===================================
The Czar of Mainframe Computing <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA>
McGill University

 --> I'M TOO SEXY FOR COBOL.

---> Habs...will beat the Nords in 7!!!!

---> Let's Go Expos!
             ===========================================
             | Hickory, dickory doc,                   |
             | She took a good look at your cock.      |
             | It's really scary all rinkled and hairy,|
             | It smells like a 10 year old sock!      |
             |           --Andrew Dice Clay            |
             ===========================================

 DISCLAIMER:
************************************************************************
*   Needless to say that the opinions expressed by THE CZAR represent  *
*   those of the faculty, staff, and students of McGill University.    *
************************************************************************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53649
From: colling@ann-arbor.applicon.slb.com (Michael Collingridge)
Subject: Re: Truly a sad day for hockey

In article 27089, alvstad@mari.acc-admin.stolaf.edu (Mad Dog) reports:

>A fine 26 year history came to a close tonight, as the Minnesota North Stars, 
>or Norm's Stars (whichever you prefer) lost to the Red Wings by a score of
>5-3.  The Stars goals were scored by Mike McPhee and Ulf Dahlen, who netted
>two including the final one in franchise history, with less than a minute to
>play.

Are there any further stories to report on the eve' of Norm's farewell 
from the twin cities? In an earlier post, it was announced that Norm 
Green was given until midnight of the last home-game of the North Stars
to cleanup his belongings and turn in the keys to the arena. 
Did this happen? Was Norm run-out-of-town?

Rumor has it that while he was attempting to remove the score board, 
the score-board fell to the ice and flattened Mr. Greedy to a large
piece of green paper. Arena management had to use the Zamboni (which 
they confiscated from Norm's truck) to clean-up the useless remains. 

-- Mike

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53650
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Atlanta Hockey Hell!!

Mamatha Devineni Ratnam <mr47+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>
>I can't understand how someone in the sports dept. can't even recognise
>the name of playoffs shown on the very same station he works for.

You think that's bad ... one year, we had all three New York teams in
the playoffs and the cableco operator (SCNY once shared a channel with
BET but someone forgot to throw the switch at 6PM) didn't know what I
was talking about ...

While it's nice that the NHL is back on American network TV, it faces
the same problems as it did with the All Star game.  Local preemptions
and zero promotion (okay, I don't watch that much TV so I'm just foaming
all right?).  The league should have made sure that it was solid on cable
before going to the networks.  In year one of the new ESPN contract, the
saturation coverage of SCA (all other games shown to completion, like
the Quebec-Montreal and Sabres-Bruins overtimes) is missed around here.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53651
From: vzhivov@superior.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov)
Subject: Flames Truly Brutal in Loss

As the subject suggests the Flames were not impressive this afternoon,
dropping a 6-3 decision to the LA Kings. Most of the Flames neglected
to show up, especially in their own zone, as the Kings hit at least
five posts! The Flames best line was probably
Skrudland-Paslawski-Berube (which tells how bad the Flames were). Gary
Suter scored a great goal (in fact all three Flame goals were scored
by D-men - Yawney and Dahlquist getting the others), but also made
some bonehead plays. For the Kings, Pat Conacher was especially
impressive. 

The games was VERY chippy, as Dan Mirouelli lost control early and
never recovered it; there were high-sticks, cross-checks, punches,
hits from behind. Fleury got a game misconduct for rubbing out Warren
Rychel from behind. Flames dominated the game physically, but failed
to take advantage due to horrendous defensive lapses (I don't think
Vernon can be blamed for any of the goals). Calgary went with 7 D-men,
as Roger Johansson played LW; he looked lost IMHO - I hope King
inserts Chris Lindbergh, Paul Kruse, or Sergei Makarov for Wednesday's
game. Gretzky left the game in the 2nd period with a charley-horse; no
idea how serious - he didn't return.

I still think the Flames should win this series, but they better
buckle down.

- Vlad the Impaler


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53652
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Playoff pool update

Well, I have compiled some statistics on the entries of my pool.  There
are unofficially 52 entrants.  Here are the stats on what teams were
picked to win it all:

Pittsburgh:	34 (1 sweep, 14 in 5, 15 in 6, 4 in 7)
Boston:		6  (1 in 5, 5 in 6)
Detroit:	4  (3 in 6, 1 in 7)
Montreal:	2  (1 in 5, 1 in 7)
Toronto:	2  (1 in 6, 1 in 7)
   (no, this wasn't Roger)
Calgary:	1  (in 6)
Quebec:		1  (in 6)
Vancouver:	1  (in 7)
Washington:	1  (in 6)

Why the hell hasn't anybody picked Chicago???  NOBODY!  Quebec got a pick,
Detroit got 4, but absolutely no Chicago!  How odd.

Here are the "losers":

Detroit:	20
Chicago:	16	(so there they are!)
Pittsburgh:	6
Vancouver:	4
Boston:		2
Calgary:	2
Los Angeles:	1	what?!?
Toronto:	1

LOS ANGELES???????  Are you out of your mind?!?!?  Good luck to you,
you'll need it!

So Pittsburgh is the consensus winner of the Stanley Cup.  They'll
statistically beat Detroit in 6 games.  HAHA  that's happening!  NOT!  As
I said, every one of my picks will come true, and I picked Chicago to lose
to Pittsburgh in the finals, so tough luck to all you who picket Detroit.  
Well, tough luck to all of ya!  I am a genius!!!  ;-)

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

	   "A cow is not a vegetarian dish."  -- Keith Keller, 1993

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53653
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Flames Truly Brutal in Loss


This game would have been great as part of a double-header on ABC or
ESPN; the league would have been able to push back-to-back wins by
Le Magnifique and The Great One.  Unfortunately, the only network
that would have done that was SCA, seen in few areas and hard to
justify as a pay channel. )-;

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53654
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Possible Canadian WC Team?

In article <1993Apr18.194657.26319@news.columbia.edu> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>>
>>CENTERS
>>Mark Messier, N. Y. Rangers
>
>Messier was not invited due to his nagging injuries.  While the press
>made an issue of it, and attempted to link it to the Rangers' internal
>political woes, Mike Keenan repeated that to Messier personally during
>the MSG press conference.  It makes sense ... Messier would probably
>have not declined the invitation if it were made for publicity ...
>

Actually, Messier was invited, but declined due to nagging injuries...
Keenan and Messier have always gotten along...Keenan dumped Steve
Yzerman from the last Canada Cup team, even though Yzerman had
endured the training camp, when Messier who had missed essentially the
entire camp recovering from injuries became available at the
last moment.

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53655
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Daigle/Kariya

In article <1qsmhtINNt5l@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU> ddlin@athena.mit.edu (David D Lin) writes:
>I hear Daigle will eb the first pick next year. What is the word on Kariya???
>Anybody ever seen him play on TV???? Is he also entering the draft???

People are seeming to be less concerned about Kariya's size as he leads
teams to championships (World Junior and US College) and collects
awards...everyone is watching with interest as to how he will perform
on left wing with Eric Lindros and Mark Recchi at the world
championships.

4 months of go...chances were not very good that he would go in the
top five...now it has become probable...a great world championship
could put him in the top 3 with Daigle and Pronger.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53656
From: <JOLD@vma.cc.nd.edu>
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

In Detroit, the octopus is a symbol from the old days of the league. In
the era of the Original 6, four teams made the playoffs.  To win the Cup,
a team had to win two seven-game series - in other words it took 8
playoff wins to win the Cup.  The octopus (8 legs) has become a common
Detroit symbol.  Every year around playoff time people start sneaking
octopus (octopi?) into the Joe Louis Arena and throwing them onto the ice.

                                J. Old
                                e-mail: JOLD@vma.cc.nd.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53657
From: allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan)
Subject: Don Cherry - Coach's Corner summary - April 18, 1993



Here is a summary of Don Cherry's coach's corner from April 18, 1993.
It took place in the first intermission of game 1 of the Montreal-Quebec
series. 

Pre-game comments
-----------------
Don's pregame comments were mostly aimed at the goalies... The goalie
who gets back his all-star form (Roy or Hextall) can win the series
for his team.

Eposode Summary
---------------
This episode took place rinkside. Don was holding a hot dog that
he bought from the concession stand.

Ron Maclean started out by showing a cartoon which appeared in the
Toronto Sun. It featured a picture of Don, who just saw his shadow
and proclaimed "Will you look at dat, eh? Means another 6 weeks
of me. Beauty."

Next, Don talked about the hot dog he was holding. According to
him, the hot dogs at the Quebec stadium are the best food in all
the arenas in the NHL.

From there, Don commented on the Quebec-Montreal game. The game
had great flow, because Referee Paul Stewart calls the best game
in the NHL. In contrast, the Calgary-LA game was terrible... All
stop-and-go, over 50 minutes of penalties called against Calgary
by Dan Marouelli. Its getting so that the ref who calls the most
penalties gets to ref in the finals.

Next, Ron showed an old picture of Don, when he was playing for
the Rochester Americans of the AHL. Don recalled some of the
wins that he had in the Quebec arena... during the Memorial cup
and the AHL championships.

Finally, Don and Ron discussed Keenan becoming coach of the
Rangers. The rangers were a talented team who underachieved.
Don feels sorry for temporary coach Ron Smith, who had
several key injuries (to Leetch and Patrick) and goalies who
went cold.

Don had some criticism for the Rangers team... The party's over,
Adolf (Keenan) is there. The Rangers organization will no longer
be a 'country club'.... "NY should be achamed of themselves... If
they go in the tank with Adolf there, they'll be hanging from the
yardarm by their thumbs."


Rating
------
Nothing too special in this episode.

I'll give it a 5.5 out of 10.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   \  \                   |Allan Sullivan (allan@cs.ualberta.ca)
    \  \                  |Department of Computing Science,
     \  \_______          |University of Alberta, Edmonton, Alberta, Canada.
      \    ###  \     _   |---------------------------------------------------
       \___###___\   (_)  |My opinions are mine and mine alone.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It is amazing how much can be accomplished if no one cares who gets the
 credit..."          - U. of A. Golden Bears Hockey Motto (C. Drake)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
        

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53658
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Flames Truly Brutal in Loss

In article <vzhivov.735193129@cunews> vzhivov@superior.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov) writes:
>As the subject suggests the Flames were not impressive this afternoon,
>dropping a 6-3 decision to the LA Kings. Most of the Flames neglected
>to show up, especially in their own zone, as the Kings hit at least
>five posts! The Flames best line was probably

Mike Vernon is now 3 wins 11 losses plus that All-Star game debacle in
afternoon games during his career...with another afternoon game with
Los Angeles next Sunday...has the ABC deal doomed the Flames?

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53659
From: Karim Edvard Ahmed <ka0k+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Goodbye, good riddance, get lost 'Stars

>        Goodbye Minnesota,...you never earned the right to have an NHL 
>franchise in the first place!
>        Hope you enjoy your Twin city wide mania for HIGH SCHOOL HOCKEY
>(hey, by the way my old pee wee team is having a reunion in Regina, care 
>to come up and film the event?)
>        Yee haa Golden Gophers
>Whatta weird town!!!!!

What's with you stupid dorks from the "Western Business School"???!!! 
First there was that Cary asshole, and now you.  Don't you have anything
better to do instead of being obnoxious, antagonistic little shits over
the network???  Why don't you just take a hike, and stop embarrasing
yourself, your school, and Canada!

-KEA

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53660
From: Ryan J. Thieme <33CWDTR@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: How to beat Pittsburgh!

How do you beat the Penguins?


Crash the team plane.


Ryan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53661
From: epp@mala.bc.ca (Lorne Epp)
Subject: Re: LA ON ABC IN CANADA

In article <boora.735182771@sfu.ca>, boora@kits.sfu.ca (The GodFather) writes:
> 	Was the ABC coverage of the Kings/Flames game supposed to be the
> way it was shown in BC with CBC overriding the ABC coverage?  When I flipped
> to ABC, it was the same commentators, same commercials even.  My question
> is:  Was this the real ABC coverage or did CBC just "black out" the 
> ABC coverage for its own?
> 
> 

Here in Nanaimo (on Vancouver Island, for you furriners out there) we
got the ABC coverage on KOMO.  It probably depends on your cable company.

I started off switching between the CBC and ABC broadcasts, but finally
settled on ABC.  I can't stand Don Whitman, and Al Michaels was doing a
decent job.  He followed the play pretty well, knew all the players'
names, and only made a couple of "rookie" mistakes that I noticed.
One thing that surprised me is that they never once attempted to explain
the offside rule.

Am-I-paranoid-or-is-this-really-happening department:
There were no fights in the game, but there were a couple of occasions
where it looked like a fight was about to start.  Both times ABC cut
away to show a closeup of a coach or McNall or something.  Has ABC
decided to adopt the "Spicer policy?"

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lorne Epp                                               epp@mala.bc.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53662
From: ayim@laplace.uwaterloo.ca (Alfred Yim)
Subject: Re: Blackhawks win!!! 

In article <1993Apr16.140953.5025@vax.cns.muskingum.edu>, jbrown@vax.cns.muskingum.edu writes:
> The Hawks win!!  Jermey Roenick scored his 50 th goal and the Hawks put the
> Leafs in their place, the losers column.  If the Leafs can not even beat the
> Hawks in a match that had little or no meaning I will hate to see them against
> the Wings.  
> 
> Oh btw I laugh at rm, that jerky!!!
> 
> GO HAWKS!!!
> 
> JB

But I gotta tell ya,

If the Hawks can't beat the Blues in a game that
IS significant I can't wait to see how the Blues
might do against Toronto ;)

BTW, if you think that the Hawks deserved to win that game
I think you were not watching the same one everyone else
was.

ROAR'IN LEAF FAN
-- 
****************************************** 
*  Alfred (Yong-Jeh) Yim                 *   
*  4B Mathematics (Actuarial Science)    * 
*  University of Waterloo, Canada.       *   
*  E-mail: ayim@descartes.waterloo.edu   *   
*****************************************************************************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53663
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: Wings will win


In article 735249453@vela.acs.oakland.edu, ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:

>I also think that they will have a hard time with Pittsburgh if they
>face them in the finals (which is what all the Detroit sportswriters 
>are predicting).  Although I think Bryan Murray is probably the best GM
>I have ever seen in hockey

How do you figure that??  When Bryan Murray took over the Wings they were
a pretty good team that was contending for the Stanley Cup but looked
unlikely to win it.  Now they are a pretty good team that is contending for
the Stanley Cup but looks unlikely to win it.  A truly great GM would
have been able to make the moves to push the team to the upper echelon
of the NHL and maybe win the Stanley Cup.  A good GM (like Murray) can
maintain the team's success but can't push them to the next level.

In the history of hockey there have been several better GM's than Murray-
way too many to name.  Murray isn't even the best GM in the league today.
He fails in comparison to Sinden, Sather, Savard, Caron, Fletcher and
Quinn in my estimation.

I can't imagine how Bryan Murray can be the best GM anyone has ever seen
in hockey- unless they have seen VERY few GM's.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53664
From: neath@brazil.psych.purdue.edu (Ian Neath)
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN

jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:
> It was nice to see ESPN show game 1 between the Wings and Leafs since
> the Cubs and Astros got rained out. Instead of showing another baseball
> game, they decided on the Stanley Cup Playoffs. A classy move by ESPN.

Not in Indiana:  they showed a tape-delay of Chicago v Boston, because
WGN had the rainout of the cubs.  So WGN showed reruns of Hitchcock.
No hockey (at least in this part of the state).

Go Aeros!
--
      Ian Neath        | There are four kinds of people in this world:
neath@psych.purdue.edu | cretins, fools, morons and lunatics - U. Eco

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53665
From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
Subject: Re: expanding to Europe:Dusseldorf

In <PKORTELA.93Apr15164732@lk-hp-17.hut.fi> pkortela@snakemail.hut.fi writes:

> 
> DEG has many german-born forwards in the team. In fact the majority of players
> are german-born. 1992-93 DEG had 11150 average in 11800 spectator arena.

Interesting! One of our German friends here (Robert?) told me their forwards
were all Canadian-Germans. Perhaps somebody can sort this out for us?
 
> My Possible-NHL(European league)-site list:
> Switzerland  : Berne, Zurich (Lugano and 1-2 others)

OK, "this ain't North America" and so on, but I still doubt that _any_ city
having a pop. of 500,000 and below could support an NHL team. Of course,
Switzerland probably should be judged as one large city because of small
distances between cities but still. 

> Germany      : Dusseldorf, Cologne, Berlin, Munich (Mannheim, Rosenheim)

Dusseldorf? YES, although the arena is an anachronism (an OPEN wall behind one
of the goals - essentially an outdoor arena!). Cologne's arena only seats about
7,000-8,000, Berlin is about 6,000 and no new facility will be built
unless their Olympic bid is successful. Munich does have an arena. 

> Sweden       : Stockholm, Gothenburg (Malmo, Gavle)

Malmo is big enough, but they also need a new arena...the current one has 
5,000 seats I think.

> Finland      : Helsinki (Turku, Tampere)

If we're talking about the NHL, even Helsinki would struggle to make it work.
Turku (despite an excellent arena) and Tampere are nowhere near big enough for
major league hockey.

> Italy        : Milan

...Rome and the south are out of the question; this could as well be Africa
to hockey fans. Romans were given the chance to host some WC'94 games but
showed no interest whatsoever. All teams in the Italian league come from Milan
and the smaller cities in the north.

> France       : Paris (Chamonix, Ruoen?)

Paris had their own "Volans Francais"(sp) pro team a couple of years ago.
I believe they even made it to the European Club Championship finals 
tournament one year, but eventually folded due to lower-than-hoped-for 
attendances. The remaining cities seem to be too small to support a minor 
sport like hockey.

> Norway       : (Oslo)
> Austria      : (Vienna, Villach)
> Chech        : (Prag)
> Slovakia     : (Bratislava)
> Russia       : (Moscow, St. Petersburg)

The easter cities lack the money and infrastructure to support pro hockey.

> Great Britain: ?

Perhaps . . . Most European teams will have to be like the Tampa Bay Lightning
anyway; playing in a small 10,000 seat arena, backed by Japanese money, run by 
enthusiasts (Phil Esposito), heavy
marketing, fans that have difficulty telling what "icing" means... London has
been mentioned, Sheffield and Birmingham also have large arenas and a new
mega-facility (16,000 seats!) might be built in Bristol in a couple of years.

> Netherlands  : ?

No facilities to speak of; their biggest arena (in Eindhoven) seats 2,500 
fans for hockey. 
> 
> Petteri Kortelainen

MARCU$

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53666
From: j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
Subject: Plus minus stat...

Roger Maynard shares his views, with the masses, on Bob Gainey
and life in general:
 
>In <1993Apr15.160450.27799@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@hudson.UVic.CA
>(Greg  Ballentine) writes:
 
>>The Selke candidate forwards main purpose on a shift is to
>>prevent goals from being scored- not to score them.  When
>>Lemieux or Gilmour play their number one purpose is to score-
>>defence is secondary- especially considering the line that
>>plays against them is probably a defensive one.  That is why
>>they are not Selke candidates.
>>Gainey is the best defensive forward ever.  I stand by that
>>assessment. He was a very good player who belongs in the hall
>>of fame.  Did you ever watch him play? He never made a
>>technical error.
 
>I watched him over his entire career.  I have NEVER seen a
>player, and that includes Russell Courtnall and Davie Keon,
>screw up as many breakaways as Bob Gainey.  And I will never
>forget the time Denis Potvin caught Gainey with his head down. 
>You have been sold a bill of goods on Bob Gainey.
 
It was Bryan Trottier, not Denis Potvin.  It was a vicious
'boarding' from behind...Trottier was given a major.
 
But Roger, what the hell does this have to do with Gainey's skill
as a hockey player?  If Probert smashes Gilmour's head into the
boards next week, will that diminish your assessment of Gilmour's
skills?
 
>Gainey was a plugger.  And when the press runs out of things to
>say about  the stars on dynasties they start to hype the
>pluggers.  Grant Fuhr, Essa Tikkannen, Butch Goring, Bob
>Nystrom, Bob Gainey, Doug Jarvis, Derek Sanderson, Wayne
>Cashman, Bob Baun, Bob Pulford, Ralph Backstrom, Henri Richard,
>Dick Duff...and so on...
 
I would take Fuhr and Sanderson off of the latter.
 
I think Gainey would be honoured to know that you've included him
on this list.  I also think you have a relatively naive view
about what wins a hockey game...pluggers are an integral part of
any team.  The Selke is designed to acknowledge their
contribution...I think that most people understand that it's not
the Nobel Prize...so settle down.
 
>cordially, as always,
 
>rm
 
>-- 
>Roger Maynard 
>maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
 
congenially, as always,
 
jd
 
--
James David
david@student.business.uwo.ca

j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
Western Business School  --  London, Ontario

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53667
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Rangers give NHL another blackeye...

News reports in Toronto say that the Rangers are insisting that
Kovalev, Zubov, and Andersson play for Binghampton in the Calder
Cup playoffs, rather than return to play for their "home" countries
in the World Championships.

...shame on the Rangers.

Another black eye for the NHL in Europe.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53668
From: rrmadiso@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca (*** CHUCK ***)
Subject: Re: Playoff predictions

Here are my predictions (try not to laugh hysterically)
Somebody save this so I can laugh when I win my own pool.
I don't have prizes, but we all love BRAGGING RIGHTS, so winner takes them.

Also.  If somebody has some sort of scoring system let me know.
I was thinking 1 for 1st round victories, 2 for second, 3 for 3rd, 4 for 4th
But we may get alot of ties.  Any ideas?



1. BUFFALO
2. MONTREAL
3. PITTSBURGH
4. WASHINGTON
5. CHICAGO
6. TORONTO
7. WINNIPEG
8. LOS ANGELES

9. MONTREAL
10.PITTSBURGH
11.CHICAGO
12.WINNIPEG

13.MONTREAL
14.CHICAGO

15. MONTREAL

Richard Madison
rrmadiso@napier.uwaterloo.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53669
From: farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: Re: AHL Calder Cup Playoff preview

Daryl Turner (umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca) wrote:
: In article <1993Apr14.193524.25755@news.clarkson.edu> farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy) writes:
: >
: >ATLANTIC DIVISION
: >	
: >	ST JOHN'S MAPLE LEAFS VS MONCTON HAWKS
: >	MONCTON HAWKS
: >See CD Islanders. Moncton is a very similar team to CDI. Low scoring,
: >defensive, good goaltending. John Leblanc and Stu Barnes are the only
: >noticable guns on the team. But the defense is top notch and 
: >Mike O'Neill is the most underrated goalie in the league.
: >

: Bri, as I have tried to tell you since 2 February, Michael O'Neill
: might be the most underrated goalie in the AHL, but he ISN'T in the
: AHL.  He's on the Winnipeg Jets' injury list, as he has been since
: his first NHL start against the Ottawa Senators.  He's out until
: next year after surgery to repair a shoulder separation.

: Stu Barnes might be an AHL gun for the Hawks, but he's now the third
: line center with the Jets, and has been since mid January or so.

Sorry, my memory is gone. I thought that O'Neill got sent back
down in February but I must have been given incorrect info. I guess
this says it all about Moncton because Barnes is still one of
their top 3 or so scorers even though he's been out since January.

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL and ECAC contact for rec.sport.hockey		Go USA Hockey!	   +	
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    + CONGRATS TO THE BOSTON BRUINS, 1992-93 ADAMS DIVISION CHAMPIONS      +
    + PHOENIX SUNS, 1992-93 PACIFIC DIVISION CHAMPIONS			   +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53670
From: dwk@cci632.cci.com (Dave Kehrer)
Subject: Individual Winners (WAS: Re: WHERE ARE THE DOUBTERS NOW? HMM?)

Well, since you mentioned it...

In article <1993Apr12.142028.6300@jarvis.csri.toronto.edu>, migod@turing.toronto.edu (Mike Godfrey) writes:
  
> Lemieux is clearly the MVP

No question here.  Chip in the Masterson as well...

> Selanne wins the Calder

Yep. 

> Chelios the Norris,

If you asked me 30 days ago, I'd agree with you.  I now give the nod to
Raymond Bourque; his play took off the same time the B's did.  Chelios
gets a close second...

> dunno who wins the Vezina, but I suspect not Potvin.  
  
Barrasso finally gets his due, in a close one over Eddie the Eagle...

> Coach of the year is tricky:  Burns did the most with the least raw talent,
> King did a good job but the Flames clearly underachieved last year, Brian
> Sutter has done exceptionally well in his first year with a new team, ditto
> Demers, Page has been blessed by the ripening and acquisition of young
> talent, Darryl Sutter is having a good year for a rookie coach, Berry made
> the best of a bad situation, Terry Crisp worked minor miracles, and Bowman
> was Bowman.  I'd pick Burns, but I'm mildly biased.

In *your* case, that bias is acceptable :-)... Mine shows with the Norris pick,
so we're even...

I'm impressed with what all the coaches you mentioned did, but my pick would be 
Al Arbour.  Not too many folks thought the Isles would be in the playoffs, let 
alone contend for 3rd in their division... Granted that they *did* have a little
help from their cousins on Broadway... :-)

And I like the Islanders about as much as I like mowing my lawn...

> Mike Godfrey
--------
David Kehrer (dwk@sunsrvr2.cci.com)-Northern Telecom NAS-Rochester, New York 
"It's nothing for me to eat six or seven pieces of pizza, then go out to
dinner with my wife and not remember I had the pizza." - Jacques Demers

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53671
From: desperate fan
Subject: HELP! WC coverage in Europe

Vielen dank
Desperate Fan

PS. Sweden vs Finland finished 6-6 in Gothenburg 15th Apr.



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53672
From: swartzjh@RoseVC.Rose-Hulman.Edu
Subject: ESPN Tonight

Has anyone heard what game ESPN is showing tonight.  They said they will
show whatever game means the most playoff-wise. I would assume this would
be the Blues-Tampa game or the Minnesota-Red Wings game...  Anyone heard for
sure???


		Jeff Swartz

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53673
From: fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu (FRANK MICHAE SALVATORE)
Subject: Re: Patrick Division Correction!


In article <93105.013653RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>, Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
> 
> Well, I was a little off in those predictions!  One, I didn't count on the
> Devils scoring 6 goals tonight in a 6-6 tie, hence, there goes the streak!
> 
> Secondly, I didn't count on the Islanders getting just 1 point out of 4
> against the Whalers in two games.  So, no more Isles/Capitals.
> 
> New predicitons :
> 
> 1-PENGUINS VS 4-ISLANDERS                  Penguins in 6 or 7
 
> 
> 2-CAPITALS VS 3-DEVILS                     Devils in 7
> 
Why should we pay your predictions any heed, considering
you couldn't even predict the proper matchups?  Maybe
you should try forecasting the weather instead.

Frank Salvatore
fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53674
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Plus minus stat...

In <4LD32B2w165w@sms.business.uwo.ca> j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David) writes:

>It was Bryan Trottier, not Denis Potvin.  It was a vicious
>'boarding' from behind...Trottier was given a major.

Perhaps it was Trottier.  It happened behind the Habs goal if I recall.
Gainey simply didn't have his head up as he was picking up the puck.

>But Roger, what the hell does this have to do with Gainey's skill
>as a hockey player?  If Probert smashes Gilmour's head into the
>boards next week, will that diminish your assessment of Gilmour's
>skills?

If Gilmour was taken completely by surprise, as Gainey was, then yeah,
I would have to say that Doug wasn't playing "technically" smart 
hockey.  In any case, to claim as Greg did, that Gainey *never* made 
a technical mistake is absolutely ludicrous.

>>Gainey was a plugger.  And when the press runs out of things to
>>say about  the stars on dynasties they start to hype the
>>pluggers.  Grant Fuhr, Essa Tikkannen, Butch Goring, Bob
>>Nystrom, Bob Gainey, Doug Jarvis, Derek Sanderson, Wayne
>>Cashman, Bob Baun, Bob Pulford, Ralph Backstrom, Henri Richard,
>>Dick Duff...and so on...
> 
>I would take Fuhr and Sanderson off of the latter.

Good for you.  You'd only be displaying your ignorance of course, but to 
each his own...

>I think Gainey would be honoured to know that you've included him

I think Gainey should feel honoured to know that he is remembered at 
all.

>on this list.  I also think you have a relatively naive view
>about what wins a hockey game...pluggers are an integral part of

Certainly pluggers are an integral part of any team.  And that is
simply because there are not enough solid two-way players to go 
around.  Who would you rather have as your "checking" centre?  Doug
Gilmour or Doug Jarvis?  For that matter I would take either Gretzky
or Mario as my "checking" centres.  Do you think Gretzky could cover
Bob Gainey? 

>any team.  The Selke is designed to acknowledge their
>contribution...I think that most people understand that it's not
>the Nobel Prize...so settle down.

You're wrong again.  The Selke is awarded to the forward that does the
best job defensively and this may or may not be the best plugger.  If 
Gilmour does the best defensive job in the league I don't see why he 
should be out of the running simply because he also contributes offen-
sively.

Settle down?  If you think that I have likened the Selke to the Nobel
prize then I suggest that you had best "settle down".  And if you are
going to try to put words in my mouth, let me suggest that you "settle 
down" before you bother following up on my postings. 

>congenially, as always,
> 
>jd
> 
>--
>James David
>david@student.business.uwo.ca

You might consider developing your own style.  After all, imitation is 
the sincerest form of flattery and I am quite sure that flattery is not 
your intention.

cordially, as always,

rm

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53675
From: brifre1@ac.dal.ca
Subject: European expansion and our f*cked system

Everyone keeps talking about European expansion by 2010 thinking
wishful thoughts, but being totally off the ball.

The league format we use here is incompatible with that in Europe.
(for those that don't know, the best teams from lower divisions get
promoted and the worst get demoted).

Would European fans put up with our "if you've paid, you can play" 
attitude??

How long would they support teams that are run on Ranger-based 
corporate thinking (I use the term lightly).  (We don't need a good
product because these duffuses in NYC would fill the arena for Ottawa's
record every year......1940!! haha (sorry, had ta say it)).

If hockey (and other pro sports) had a similar system to Europe, maybe
teams like the Rangers would be forced to compete (or get demoted the fourth 
division).  We'd have many more teams...centres that aren't as big (like
Halifax or Adirondack....ok, so Halifax isn't a good example) would 
eventually get promoted, and every team would be somewhat competetive within
its own division (unlike Ottawa, SJ, Edmonton, etc.). Fans would eventually
get rewarded for their loyalty (or penalized for their neglect), and the
league would be more interesting and dynamic every year because of the influx
of newly promoted teams (and the Halifax Citadels win the Stanley Cup...I can
dream, can't I??)

Look at British (or any European) soccer as an example (they never have fan
problems).

Just someone who thinks our system really sucks

Barfly

(feel free to flame me, my account ends today...hahahaha)

1940!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53676
From: formeza@panix.com (The Owl)
Subject: Re: Rangers Top Ten

In <120365@netnews.upenn.edu> kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller) writes:

>> 
>>7.   Carol Alt, Head Coach In 93-94?

>I wish!  She can be *my* head coach any time!!!!  (Sorry Ali!  Back to
>real hockey.)

Hmmmmmm. I think I'll let everyone make there own comment on this one.


>>THE BAD
>> 
>>Alexei Kovalev.
>>What did the Rangers think when they signed him? Did they think he
>>was another Domi?  Just let him play! And not on a 4th line.  Better
>>that he stays in the minors and gets ice-time ALL the time.

>Whose "bad"?  It has been Neilson and Smith's decision to play him there,
>if that's what you mean, then that's bad.  But Kovalev himself is a very
>good player.  You're right, if he weren't stranded on the fourth line
>maybe he'd produce.  Sound familiar?  Darren Turcotte?

Neilson and Smith are bad. Kovalev is magical.


Lets Go Pens!
The Owl

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53677
From: igor@pravda.tse.su
Subject: Who will broadcast the WC

Which GERMAN satellite channels will show the World Championship action
from Dusseldorf & Munich?
Someone please tell me (must be able to root for the Red Machine)!

Thank you
 
***Russians for the world title, Nordiques for the Cup!!!***



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53678
From: seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr)
Subject: Re: Flyers [Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...]

In article <1993Apr14.165617.3215@cbnewsm.cb.att.com>, jmd@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (joseph.m.dakes) writes:
> In article <1993Apr13.144030.28994@cbnewsh.cb.att.com>, seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr) writes:
> 
> >So Roussel was giving up almost another goal a game while facing a proportional
> >number of shots for the number of minutes he played, and while I have't
> >actually checked I believe that he faced a lower quality of opponent.
> 
> Make that less than half a goal a game.  The lower quality of opponet
> argument is immaterial as neither Roussel nor Soderstrom had any say in
> the matter.  That was Dineen's decision.

So in other words, if Roussel shuts out the Sharks and Soderstrom shuts out
the Penguins, that's immaterial because it was the coaches decision? Come on,
Joe, think about what you're saying! Who they played is VERY significant.
Why they played them is what's irrelevent. A low GAA against good teams
is better than a low GAA against bad teams in the context of comparing two
goaltenders. A low GAA is better then a higher GAA. A low GAA against good
teams is much, much better than a higher GAA against bad teams in the context
of comparing two goaltenders.

> > The fact of the matter is that, despite last nights shutout, he doesn't
> > have what it takes. Last night was due to an inept Ranger team much more
> > than Roussel's skill. A 3 on 1 and they don't get a shot away? A 2 on none
> > and one guy just passes and stops, the other guy shoots into Roussel's pad?
> 
> C'mon, Pete?  So the Rangers were inept.  A shutout is a shutout.  During
> both of Soderstrom's masterpieces against Toronto, Mike Emerich was quoted
> as saying he didn't think the Leafs had much offensive firepower past their
> first line.  Does that make Soderstrom's shutouts less impressive because of
> Toronto's lack of offense?

YES IT DOES! Absolutely. **In the context of comparing two goaltenders**.
Of course, at the end of the season 2 points is 2 points no matter how you
get them. And on the score sheets shutouts are shutouts. But if you're a
coach deciding between two goalies, or a GM looking to make a trade, you
have got to look deeper than the stat sheets. I didn't see the second Toronto
game, but the first one was a defensive masterpiece. There was nothing in
that game to judge Tommy Soderstrom on because he wasn't tested. The same
for Roussel in the Ranger game. Two real scoring chances, one he made a
great play, the other he was saved by a mistake from the other player. If
you were judging Roussel on that game alone, you have very little to go by.

But if you were to look at the 0-0 tie against the Habs, you saw a goalie
stand on his head to get that shutout. THAT was a #1 goalie in action. Roussel
doesn't have a game like that in him.

> Well if you look back to November when Roussel was the #1 goalie (Soderstrom
> was being treated for his heart ailment).  The Flyers finished November at
> 6-3-1 and were 9-10-4 overall.  And there's no way of knowing where the Flyers
> would have finished if Soderstom wasn't wearing the oragne 'n black.  I'm glad
> we don't have to find out anytime soon either because he is one hell of a
> player.  I would take him over Roussel right now, but I still think Dom has
> what it takes to be the #1 guy.  He outperformed Hextall enough during the
> '91-92 season to make Flyers management think that way too.

Don't be so sure of that. FLYERS management never says bad thing about
Roussel, but they don't say too much on the good side either. I've seen
at least two interviews where every time Farwell was asked how happy he was
to have two good goaltenders, it was Tommy this, Tommy that, and oh, yeah,
Dom has played well too.

> By the way, what was the final card on Monday night?  Team picture by any
> chance?

FLYERS in the NHL Hall of Fame. Kinda dull, really. They handed out a
team picture to everybody who walked in from Pizza Hut, but it was the
same picture they sold in the programs in mid-season. Had names like Benning,
Kasper...

> And how did the Flyers choose the fans who received "the shirts off our
> backs?"  Winning Recchi's jersey after breaking the club's single season
> point record would have been nice.  But knowing your luck you would have
> won Roussel's:-)!

Mostly random seat locations, some were given out by having certain
autographs on the team photos. I don't like that method since I've seen
guards help out people get things like Lindros pictures, surely if they
got their hands on an autographed picture they'd hold 'em for their buddies.

pete clark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53679
From: brifre1@ac.dal.ca
Subject: Re: Goalie masks

In article <93102@hydra.gatech.EDU>, gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak) writes:
> 
> 	I'm starting an informal poll on goalie masks. I'd like to know
> who's mask you think looks the best. I've always like Curtis Joseph's
> of the Blues the best. Anyway, send your nominations to me, or post your
> vote here on r.s.h. My e-mail adress is: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu
> 
> 	Thanks for your time.

I saw a mask once that had drawings of band-aids, presumably for every puck
that goalie stopped with his face/head.  I can't remember who it was or even
if it was NHL (I see quite a few AHL games here).

This is by far the funniest mask I've seen, and for me funny=cool

> 
> -- 
> GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
> GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
> GO HORNETS!  ||
> GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu
Barfly

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53680
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: Plus minus stat...


In article 1443@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca, maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:

>Certainly pluggers are an integral part of any team.  And that is
>simply because there are not enough solid two-way players to go 
>around.  Who would you rather have as your "checking" centre?  Doug
>Gilmour or Doug Jarvis?  For that matter I would take either Gretzky
>or Mario as my "checking" centres.  Do you think Gretzky could cover
>Bob Gainey? 

Gretzky, Lemieux, Gilmour etc do not play the role of checking centreman.
They play an offensive role as opposed to a defensive one.  If they
were used as defensive centres it would be a waste of their offensive
abilities. 

When you compare Gretzky et al to Jarvis, Gainey etc you are comparing 
apples and oranges.  It is like me telling you that Felix Potvin isn't 
very good because a team would be better if the had Lemieux instead of
him.  Sure Lemieux is a better player, but he is a different type of
player.  For a team to be successful, they need to have all types of
players- this includes defensive forwards.

When compared with other defensive forwards, Bob Gainey is the greatest
defensive forward ever.  He is the player who's talents best suited being
a defensive forward- who completely dominated the game when he played.

Maybe if a more talented player such as Gretzky had decided to waste his
offensive talents and play defensively, he could have been a better
defensive forward, but he wasn't.

Bob Gainey is the best defensive forward that has ever played hockey.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53681
From: filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu (Geoff Filinuk)
Subject: Get Real.  Caps have no chance


	Anyone who really believes that the Caps can beat
the Pens are kidding themselves.  The Pens may not loose
one game in the playoffs.

Geoff Filinuk
Flyers Fan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53682
From: vzhivov@superior.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov)
Subject: Re: Individual Winners (WAS: Re: WHERE ARE THE DOUBTERS NOW? HMM?)

In <1993Apr15.170226.11074@cci632.cci.com> dwk@cci632.cci.com (Dave Kehrer) writes:

>Well, since you mentioned it...

>In article <1993Apr12.142028.6300@jarvis.csri.toronto.edu>, migod@turing.toronto.edu (Mike Godfrey) writes:
>  
>> Chelios the Norris,

>If you asked me 30 days ago, I'd agree with you.  I now give the nod to
>Raymond Bourque; his play took off the same time the B's did.  Chelios
>gets a close second...

How about Kevin Hatcher? Scored roughly 35 goals, plays 30 minutes a game.

>> dunno who wins the Vezina, but I suspect not Potvin.  
>  
>Barrasso finally gets his due, in a close one over Eddie the Eagle...

That's really sad when two second-rate goalies (Barasso and Belfour)
are the main contenders for the Vezina. Call me crazy, but how about
Tommy Soderstrom - five shutouts for a 6th place team that doesn't
really play defense. It's really unfortunate that the better goalies
in the league (McLean, Essensa, Vernon) had unspectacular years. BTW,
if you are going to award the Norris on the basis of the last 30 days,
why not give the Vezina to Moog? He has been the best goalie over the
past month.

>> Coach of the year is tricky:  Burns did the most with the least raw talent,
>> King did a good job but the Flames clearly underachieved last year, Brian
>> Sutter has done exceptionally well in his first year with a new team, ditto
>> Demers, Page has been blessed by the ripening and acquisition of young
>> talent, Darryl Sutter is having a good year for a rookie coach, Berry made
>> the best of a bad situation, Terry Crisp worked minor miracles, and Bowman
>> was Bowman.  I'd pick Burns, but I'm mildly biased.

>In *your* case, that bias is acceptable :-)... Mine shows with the Norris pick,
>so we're even...

>I'm impressed with what all the coaches you mentioned did, but my pick would be 
>Al Arbour.  Not too many folks thought the Isles would be in the playoffs, let 
>alone contend for 3rd in their division... Granted that they *did* have a little
>help from their cousins on Broadway... :-)

>And I like the Islanders about as much as I like mowing my lawn...

Arbour or King. Burns will probably win, since playoffs aren't taken
into consideration - he's OK in the regular season, but I'm not sure
if he's beaten anyone other than Hartford in the playoffs.

- Vlad the Impaler

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53683
From: tva1@gmuvax.gmu.edu
Subject: Re: David Polie's future

In article <1993Apr14.010305.1737@ncsu.edu>, fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu
(FRANK MICHAE SALVATORE) writes:
> 
>> Bad news for the Patrick division next year.  Caps GM David Polie is
>> reportedly trying to get a front office job with the NHL.  I can't
>> believe Polie has not been fired despite 10 years of mediocrity.
>> 

	You know what Frank? It's not David Poile's fault that the Caps
have mired in mediocrity for so long. Blame it on the owner, Abe Polin!
This guy owns both the NBA's Bullets and the NHL's Capitals. How dumb
and selfish could this guy be? He's unwilling to spend the bucks in 
order to get a big star to Landover...no wonder both teams STINK!

	I've heard that the Capitals had a chance to get Detroit's
Steve Yzerman last summer but they pulled out at the last minute. Why?
Because our good man, Abe, is afraid to spend the cash!

	Nevertheless, I'm still faithful and hoping that one day
this devilish dictator will be replaced.

>> Frank Salvatore
>> fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu

 Tuan A. Van
 "Does it matter where you buy your underwear ?!" --> Tom Cruise, RAIN MAN
 =========================================================================
 |  T. A. Van -- a.k.a. ARCHMAGE   |  Q: What's orange, black, and ugly  |
 |   George Mason University       |     and dwells in the basement ?    |
 |  Electrical Engineering '93     |  A: da Philadelphia FLYERS!         |
 |     TVA1@gmuvax.gmu.edu	   |     			         |
 |     TVA1@mason1.gmu.edu	   | 	 ** Let's go CAP-I-TALS! **      |
 =========================================================================

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53684
From: rvpst2+@pitt.edu (Richard V Polinski)
Subject: Re: Winning Streaks

In article <93105.053748RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu (Robbie Po) writes:
 
>
>      The Penguins 18 game unbeaten streak carries over to next season.
>Meaning, if they start the season with another 18 game unbeaten streak, they
>will have eclipsed the Flyers record.  Right now, the Penguins are on an 11
>game winning streak, as streaks carry over from one year to another.

Hmmmm, I'm not sure this is true.  According to Mike Lang and good old
Stagie, along with the rest of the TV crews in pittsburgh, they 
winning streak could have stopped because it is a regular season mark.
I would think this would also hold with an unbeaten streak for regular
season games.

However, you are right that the playoff streak does carry over from
last year.  And with 1 more win, I believe they tie an Edmonton record
(but don't quote me on that one).
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>** Robbie Po **          PGH PENGUINS!!!    "It won't be easy, but it
>Contact for the '93-'94  '91 STANLEY CUP    will have greater rewards.
>Penn State Lady Lions    '92 CHAMPIONS      Mountains and Valleys are
>rap115@psuvm.psu.edu     11 STRAIGHT WINS!  better than nothing at all!"



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53685
From: apland@mala.bc.ca (Ron Apland)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

In article <1993Apr15.161737.28377@sol.UVic.CA>, gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:
> 
> In article 1@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi, hahietanen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi () writes:
>>In article <1993Apr14.174139.6604@sol.UVic.CA>, gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> +/- is a good stat because it is the only stat that I am aware of that
>>> takes into account defensive play.  It isn't a measure of defensive
>>> play- it takes into account offense and defence- all aspects of play.
>>                                                   
>>  If we are interested of real all-round players, the power play stats
>>  should be considered, too. Because the power play is also one aspect 
>>  of play! There is still something to be done with these player evaluation
>>  tools!!
> 
> IMO any good player should score on power plays because of the man
> advantage.  Very good power play scorers tend to become overrated
> because their point totals are inflated by power play points.
> +/- tends to expose these overrated players such as Brett Hull,
> John Cullen and Dave Andreychuck.
> 
> Given the opportunity to play power play consistently, any player can
> inflate his totals.
> 
> Gregmeister

Except for Vancouver, of course.  Bure has a hard time scoring on that
power play.  He's got 7 shorthanded goals and 13 pp goals I think!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53686
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Playoff pool, rules, entry form

Well, the tentative rules, anyway.  And, of course, since the season is
not entirely over, tentative entry form.  But who cares?  The real hockey
season is starting!!!!!

Here's the deal:  You email (preferably) or post your predictions, AND the
number of games you think each series will go.  Each round will be
weighted, so that the Stanley Cup finals will be very important, but the
early rounds will still be important.  Here is the scoring:

Pick 1st round winner, way off on games:  2 points
Pick 1st round winner, within one game:   3 points
Pick 1st round winner, pick # of games:   5 points

Pick 2nd round winner, way off on games:  3 points
Pick 2nd round winner, within one game:   4 points
Pick 2nd round winner, pick # of games:   6 points

Pick conference champ, way off on games:  5 points
Pick conference champ, within one game:   6 points
Pick conference champ, pick # of games:   9 points

Pick Stanley Cup champ, way off on games: 8 points
Pick Stanley Cup champ, within one game:  10 points
Pick Stanley Cup champ, pick # of games:  14 points
Pick loser in 7, series goes 7:           2 points
Pick loser in 7, series decided in Game 7, OT: 4 points
(these last two are sympathy points, probably won't happen anyway)

Obviously, picking the Stanley Cup champion is important.  I will do some
tests to see if the format is fair, but probably I will be too lazy to
modify it, so the scoring will probably be like this.  As for entry forms,
well, this post is getting too long, so see next post. 

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53687
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Entry form for playoff pool

Okay, here's the entry sheet.  Keep in mind that not all spots are
decided, so it may change.

     Series  			Your Pick		Games

  Division Semis

NY Islanders-Pittsburgh
New Jersey-Washington

Buffalo-Boston
Montreal-Quebec

St. Louis-Chicago
Toronto-Detroit

Winnipeg-Vancouver
Los Angeles-Calgary

  Division Finals

Patrick
Adams
Norris
Smythe

  Conference Finals

Wales
Campbell


Stanley Cup winner


See previous post for scoring.  Good luck!

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53688
From: slacelle@gandalf.ca (Stephane Lacelle)
Subject: Bridgman is out

The Ottwawa Senators fired Mel Bridgman at 1:00 PM today.
Randy Sexton is gonna replace him.

-- 
=====================================================================
Stephane Lacelle				
S/W engineer                    Insert .sig here				
Gandalf Data Ltd                                                    

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53689
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: Playoff telecasts in Atlanta

In article <C5JABD.812@acsu.buffalo.edu> hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl) writes:
>
>I'd personally prefer Buffalo-Boston, as a birthday gift from ESPN,
>but I don't think the folks at ESPN will accomodate that for me ;-)
>ESPN has this inexplicable affinity for the Patrick division, it
>seems.  
>

First,Happy Birthday,Val. Second, ESPN's affinity with Patrick has probably
more to do with the travel/production costs for a once a week NHN(National Hockey
Night) affair.(ESPN-ABC owner,Capital Cities, is a company known for being
quite thrifty with minimal overhead costs. It's quite possible that Jim
Schoenfeld may be working for doughnuts :-).

Gary Thorne and Bill Clement are both NJ-based and the rest of ESPN crew
resides in the suburban CT with a very close proximity to tri-state area.
Plus,it makes sense in terms of solid hockey following in the NorthEast
corridor(PA-NY-NJ-DC/Maryland). Whereas,in the Adams you have only
3-American based teams, out of which 2(Buffalo and Hartford) are not
in Top-20  US TV-markets.

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53690
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL Season in review (off ice stuff)

Here is a review of some of the off-ice things that have
affected the AHL this year.


ST JOHN'S MAPLE LEAFS PROBLEMS
The St John's Maple Leafs sophomore season has been plagued by
problems. On-ice, the Leafs won the Atlantic Division title but
off ice was less happy. A strike by public workers has forced the
leafs out of the Newfoundland city for much of the last half of
the seaosn (since mid-Jan). They have played "home" games in places
like Montreal, Cornwall and Charlottetown. Their playoff "home"
games will be played in the Metro Center in Halifax, NS. One
demostration got violent. Workers attacked a Leafs' bus and
rocked it and broke windows in the St John's Memorial Stadium.
Despite the problems, Toronto officials insist that the Leafs
will return to St John's once the strike ends.
===================================================
SENATORS SOLD
The New Haven Senators have been sold by Peter Shipman to
the Ottawa Senators NHL organization. They are the only Canadian
NHL team with an American AHL affiliate, and have made it clear
they intend to move the team to somewhere in the Canadian Atlantic
Provinces. This sale and move has yet to be approved by the AHL
head office, but is expected to pass easily at the general meeting
in May. The quote in the story from Jack Butterfield made it 
clear the league was more interested in the stability of the 
AHL franchise accompanied by NHL ownership, rather than maintaining
the 56-year history of the AHL in New Haven. 

The Senators are currently in serious negotiations with Charlottetown
New Brunswick and are expected to move there.
==================================================
DALLAS HELPS HAWKS STAY IN MONCTON
After announcing that they would pull their affiliation out
of Moncton, the Winnipeg Jets changed their mind. 

The Jets announced the move when they said that they would be slashing
their minor league roster from 20-something to around a dozen; and they
wanted to share with an existing AHL or IHL franchise.

Enter the Dallas Lone Stars. Dallas agreed to supply the remaining
6 or 8 players to the Moncton franchise. Thus keeping the Hawks
in the New Brunswick city.

The deal is for one year and will be extended to three years if
the season ticket base increases to over 3000. The Hawks only sold
1400 for this year.
============================================================
SAINT JOHN FLAMES OFFICIAL
The Calgary Flames have officially signed a deal with the city of
Saint John, NB. The Saint John Blue Flames will play in the 6200
Exhibition Center. The Flames still have to apply for an expansion
frnachise from the AHL but are expected to have no trouble.
=========================================================
CAPS FOLLOW JACKS TO MAINE
Despite rumors to the contrary, the Capitals will follow the Baltimore
Skipjacks to Maine. The Caps' current farm team, the Baltimore Skipjacks,
announced that they would move to Maine and become the Portland Pirates.
There was much doubt as to if the Caps would follow but they announced
a limited deal with Portland. They would supply a dozen or so players
including 2 goalies. They become the third team to announce a limited
farm team along with Moncton and the Capital District Islanders.
======================================================
AHL GAME OF THE WEEK
In early January, the AHL started a game of the week. The game, produced
by, I believe, Pyman Productions, was televised across the Canadian
Maritimes and northeastern US. The first few weeks saw two games of
the week, one in Canada and another in the US but since then, there
has been only one. Sunday afternoon and night games were covered and
shown on Sportschannel NY and NE in the US and, I believe, Atlantic
Sports Network in Canada (but I'm not sure about that). I am not
sure if playoff games will be covered.
=====================================================
UTICA GONE? SYRACUSE ADDED?
There were heavy rumors that the Utica Devils will not be around next
season. There were rumors that they might be headed to a midwestern
city and that the city of Syracuse is trying to lure them.
=====================================================
WHAT THE AHL MIGHT LOOK LIKE NEXT YEAR

ONE OPTION				ANOTHER OPTION
			
Northern Division			Southern Division
ADIRONDACK RED WINGS			ADIRONDACK
SPRINGFIELD INDIANS			SPRINGFIELD
PROVIDENCE BRUINS			PROVIDENCE
CD ISLANDERS				CDI
PORTLAND PIRATES			HERSHEY
					BINGHAMTON
Southern Division			ROCHESTER
HERSHEY BEARS				HAMILTON
BINGHAMTON RANGERS			UTICA
ROCHESTER AMERICANS
HAMILTON CANUCKS			Atlantic Division
UTICA (?) DEVILS			PORTLAND 
					ST JOHN'S
Atlantic Division			SAINT JOHN
ST JOHN'S MAPLE LEAFS			MONCTON
MONCTON HAWKS				HALIFAX
HALIFAX CITADELS			FREDERICTON
CAPE BRETON OILERS			CAPE BRETON
FREDERICTON CANADIENS			CHARLOTTETOWN
SAINT JOHN BLUE FLAMES
CHARLOTTETOWN SENATORS (move is unofficial as yet)

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu +
    + AHL and ECAC contact for rec.sport.hockey		Go USA Hockey!	 +	
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	 +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champ: '66  '91  '93		 +
    + Glens Falls High School, Division II NY State Champs: '90  '91 	 +
    + Join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu    	 +
    + CONGRATS TO CLARKSON GOLDEN KNIGHTS HOCKEY: 1993 ECAC CHAMPIONS!!! +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53691
From: farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL News

DALLAS HELPS HAWKS STAY IN MONCTON
After announcing that they would pull their affiliation out
of Moncton, the Winnipeg Jets changed their mind. 

The Jets announced the move when they said that they would be slashing
their minor league roster from 20-something to around a dozen; and they
wanted to share with an existing AHL or IHL franchise.

Enter the Dallas Lone Stars. Dallas agreed to supply the remaining
6 or 8 players to the Moncton franchise. Thus keeping the Hawks
in the New Brunswick city.

The deal is for one year and will be extended to three years if
the season ticket base increases to over 3000. The Hawks only sold
1400 for this year.

SAINT JOHN FLAMES OFFICIAL
The Calgary Flames have officially signed a deal with the city of
Saint John, NB. The Saint John Blue Flames will play in the 6200
Exhibition Center. The Flames still have to apply for an expansion
frnachise from the AHL but are expected to have no trouble.

CAPS FOLLOW JACKS TO MAINE
Despite rumors to the contrary, the Capitals will follow the Baltimore
Skipjacks to Maine. The Caps' current farm team, the Baltimore Skipjacks,
announced that they would move to Maine and become the Portland Pirates.
There was much doubt as to if the Caps would follow but they announced
a limited deal with Portland. They would supply a dozen or so players
including 2 goalies. They become the third team to announce a limited
farm team along with Moncton and the Capital District Islanders.

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL and ECAC contact for rec.sport.hockey		Go USA Hockey!	   +	
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    + CONGRATS TO THE BOSTON BRUINS, 1992-93 ADAMS DIVISION CHAMPIONS      +
    + PHOENIX SUNS, 1992-93 PACIFIC DIVISION CHAMPIONS			   +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

					

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53692
From: j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
Subject: Plus minus stat

>Post: 51213 of 51227
>Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
>From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
>Subject: Re: Plus minus stat...
>Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, Laurentian University,
>Sudbury, ON Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1993 21:41:29 GMT
 
>In <4LD32B2w165w@sms.business.uwo.ca>
>j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David) writes:
 
>>It was Bryan Trottier, not Denis Potvin.  It was a vicious
>>'boarding' from behind...Trottier was given a major.
 
>Perhaps it was Trottier.  It happened behind the Habs goal if
>I recall. Gainey simply didn't have his head up as he was
>picking up the puck.
 
>But Roger, what the hell does this have to do with Gainey's
>skill as a hockey player?  If Probert smashes Gilmour's head
>into the boards next week, will that diminish your assessment
>of Gilmour's skills?
 
>If Gilmour was taken completely by surprise, as Gainey was, then
>yeah, I would have to say that Doug wasn't playing
>"technically" smart  hockey.  In any case, to claim as Greg did,
>that Gainey *never* made  a technical mistake is absolutely
>ludicrous.
 
Later on, in your posting, you make reference to "putting words
into other people's mouths"...I would suggest that your last
paragraph can only be interpreted in one way...namely, that I,
along with Greg, claim that Gainey never made a technical
mistake.  If you actually read what I've written, you will find
that I make no such claim...soooo, if logic serves me well,
you're contradicting yourself.
 
>>>Gainey was a plugger.  And when the press runs out of things
>>>to say about  the stars on dynasties they start to hype the
>>>pluggers.  Grant Fuhr, Essa Tikkannen, Butch Goring, Bob
>>>Nystrom, Bob Gainey, Doug Jarvis, Derek Sanderson, Wayne
>>>Cashman, Bob Baun, Bob Pulford, Ralph Backstrom, Henri
>>>Richard, Dick Duff...and so on...
 
>>I would take Fuhr and Sanderson off of the latter.
 
>Good for you.  You'd only be displaying your ignorance of
>course, but to each his own...
 
Roger, I'm not sure here, but I think "ignorance" is really a
function of "a lack of knowledge" and not "formulating an
opinion"...but hey, if you need to take a cheap shot, then by all
means go ahead...that's if it makes you feel better.
 
>>I think Gainey would be honoured to know that you've included
>>him
 
>I think Gainey should feel honoured to know that he is
>remembered at  all.
 
 
My word, such vehemence against poor ol' Bob Gainey.  Why does
he bother you so much...he was an effective player for his style
of play.
 
>>on this list.  I also think you have a relatively naive view
>>about what wins a hockey game...pluggers are an integral part
>>of
 
>Certainly pluggers are an integral part of any team.  And that
>is simply because there are not enough solid two-way players to
>go  around.  Who would you rather have as your "checking"
>centre?  Doug Gilmour or Doug Jarvis?  For that matter I would
>take either Gretzky or Mario as my "checking" centres.  Do you
>think Gretzky could cover Bob Gainey? 
 
I'm really sorry Roger, but you have lost me completely here. 
Why don't you ask me if I would rather have Jesus Christ,
himself, in nets?
 
Now, if you were to compare, say for example, Bob Gainey with Guy
Carbonneau, you would have a balanced comparison.
 
>>any team.  The Selke is designed to acknowledge their
>>contribution...I think that most people understand that it's
>>not the Nobel Prize...so settle down.
 
>You're wrong again.  The Selke is awarded to the forward that
>does the best job defensively and this may or may not be the
>best plugger.  If  Gilmour does the best defensive job in the
>league I don't see why he  should be out of the running simply
>because he also contributes offen-sively.
 
I'm wrong AGAIN...hmmm, let's see...where was I wrong in the
first place?  I'm only guessing here, Rog, but I have a feeling
that you've setup a "You're wrong again" macro key on your
machine.
 
I agree that my use of the word plugger is simplistic...but I
think you know what I'm getting at.  I would also like to point
out that Gilmour's potential as a Selke-winner was never part of
the debate...are you asking me for an opinion?  If so, I think
there are far too many other deserving players to include Gilmour
among the candidates.
 
>>Settle down?  If you think that I have likened the Selke to the
>>Nobel prize then I suggest that you had best "settle down". 
>>And if you are going to try to put words in my mouth, let me
>>suggest that you "settle  down" before you bother following up
>>on my postings. 
 
I would suggest that your comment: "And when the press runs out
of things to say about  the stars on dynasties they start to hype
the pluggers.  Grant Fuhr, Essa Tikkannen, Butch Goring, Bob
Nystrom, Bob Gainey, Doug Jarvis, Derek Sanderson, Wayne Cashman,
Bob Baun, Bob Pulford, Ralph Backstrom, Henri Richard, Dick
Duff...and so on..." demonstrates a blanket disregard for these
individuals as contributors to the game...so yes, settle
down...nobody has claimed that they are hockey gods.
 
>>congenially, as always,
>> 
>>jd
>> 
>>--
>>James David
>>david@student.business.uwo.ca
 
>You might consider developing your own style.  After all,
>imitation is  the sincerest form of flattery and I am quite sure
>that flattery is not  your intention.
 
C'mon...it has a nice ring to it...and admit it, you had a good
laugh.
 
congenially, as always,
 
jd
 
--
James David
david@student.business.uwo.ca

j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
Western Business School  --  London, Ontario

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53693
From: maX <maX@maxim.rinaco.msk.su>
Subject: Only test message

It's only test message.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53694
From: kfrank@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Kevin D Frank)
Subject: NHL Team Items...

I live in the desolate MidWest (as far as hockey is concerned) and our "sports"
stores around here carry VERY LITTLE hockey stuff, except for San Jose, Tampa
Bay, L.A., Pittsburgh, and if you're lucky Chicago.

I would like to know if anyone knows of any m,ail order, phone order stores that
I might be able to get in contact with.  I am dying for some real hockey stuff
(hats, shirts, key chains, etc.) for some other teams (Edmonton, Montreal, etc.)
so if you have any information, PLEASE e-mail me DIRECTLY.  Most appreciated!

Good luck to your teams in the Stanley Cup playoffs!

GO EDMONTON (likely...NOT!!)  Maybe next year...
-- 
	"If you assult someone you get 5 years--In hockey, 5 minutes.
			Is this a great sport or what?!"

Kevin D. Frank					kfrank@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53695
From: brifre1@ac.dal.ca
Subject: Yet more crazy predictions


Well here it goes...my crazy predictions (which never come true, but hey..)

Adams
	Bos vs. Buf - Bos in 5 (cakewalk for the hot Bruins)
	Que vs. Mon - Que in 6 (best series of the first round)

Patrick
	Pit vs. NYI - Pit in 5 (NYI wins fourth game)
	Was vs. NJD - NJD in 7 (a grueling upset, possibly OT in game 7)

Norris
	Chi vs. StL - Chi in 5 (StL is no match for Keenan's Krew)
	Det vs. Tor - Tor in 6 (Clark steps it up in playoffs this year)

Smythe (who cares?)
	Van vs. Win - Win in 7 (so I'm caught up in Teemu-mania, sue me!)
	Cal vs. LAK - Cal in 5 (LA sucks!!!!!!!!! IMO)

Division finals
	Bos vs. Que - Bos in 7 (killer games, watch for Cam to shine)
	Pit vs. NJD - Pit in 6 (NJD go insane, kill all on ice, but Pit wins)
	Chi vs. Tor - Tor in 7 (Tor defense finally get it together)
	Cal vs. Win - Cal in 6 (Win too tired after 1st series)

Conference finals
	Pit vs. Bos - Bos in 6 (Pit too beat up by NJD to play (I hope))
	Cal vs. Tor - Tor in 6 (Vernon turns into a sieve)

Stanley Cup
	Bos vs. Tor - Tor in 7 (Two totally different teams, who knows? Dreams
				can come true, pig might one day evolve wings)

Feel free to laugh at my predictions, I always do!

Barfly

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53696
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Plus minus stat

In <VFq32B2w165w@sms.business.uwo.ca> j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David) writes:

>>If Gilmour was taken completely by surprise, as Gainey was, then
>>yeah, I would have to say that Doug wasn't playing
>>"technically" smart  hockey.  In any case, to claim as Greg did,
>>that Gainey *never* made  a technical mistake is absolutely
>>ludicrous.
> 
>Later on, in your posting, you make reference to "putting words
>into other people's mouths"...I would suggest that your last
>paragraph can only be interpreted in one way...namely, that I,
>along with Greg, claim that Gainey never made a technical
>mistake.  If you actually read what I've written, you will find
>that I make no such claim...soooo, if logic serves me well,
>you're contradicting yourself.

Nonsense.  I quite clearly state that it was Greg that made the claim
that Gainey never made an error.  And he made the claim. Read below.

From rec.sport.hockey Thu Apr 15 21:22:49 1993
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Message-ID: <1993Apr15.160450.27799@sol.UVic.CA>

[nonsense deleted]

Gainey is the best defensive forward ever.  I stand by that assessment.
He was a very good player who belongs in the hall of fame.  Did you
ever watch him play? He never made a technical error.

[more nonsense deleted]

>>Good for you.  You'd only be displaying your ignorance of
>>course, but to each his own...
> 
>Roger, I'm not sure here, but I think "ignorance" is really a
>function of "a lack of knowledge" and not "formulating an
>opinion"...but hey, if you need to take a cheap shot, then by all
>means go ahead...that's if it makes you feel better.

To knowledgeable observers of the game my meaning is obvious.  Your
hockey education is not my responsibility.
 
>My word, such vehemence against poor ol' Bob Gainey.  Why does
>he bother you so much...he was an effective player for his style
>of play.

He was just another player.  To laud him as anything more I find
bothersome.  I hated the Habs.  I hated Lafleur until I realized
that he was likely the most aesthetically pleasing player to ever 
skate in my lifetime.  Why would anyone talk about Gainey?
  
>>go  around.  Who would you rather have as your "checking"
>>centre?  Doug Gilmour or Doug Jarvis?  For that matter I would
>>take either Gretzky or Mario as my "checking" centres.  Do you
>>think Gretzky could cover Bob Gainey?

>I'm really sorry Roger, but you have lost me completely here. 
>Why don't you ask me if I would rather have Jesus Christ,
>himself, in nets?

Did he play hockey at a high level?  Was he any good?  If not, why
would you bother to bring JC up?  I am talking about hockey players
here.  If you can't follow the conversation don't follow up.  As I
said previously, it is not my responsibility to educate you.

>Now, if you were to compare, say for example, Bob Gainey with Guy
>Carbonneau, you would have a balanced comparison.

Sure.  Two journeymen.  Big deal.  Neither one of them is worth
discussing.

>I'm wrong AGAIN...hmmm, let's see...where was I wrong in the

>>>I would take Fuhr and Sanderson off of the latter.

>first place?  I'm only guessing here, Rog, but I have a feeling
>that you've setup a "You're wrong again" macro key on your
>machine.

That is an excellent idea and if I decide to waste any more time
responding to any of your, or Greg's, postings then I will be sure
to implement that very macro.
 
>I would suggest that your comment: "And when the press runs out
>of things to say about  the stars on dynasties they start to hype
>the pluggers.  Grant Fuhr, Essa Tikkannen, Butch Goring, Bob
>Nystrom, Bob Gainey, Doug Jarvis, Derek Sanderson, Wayne Cashman,
>Bob Baun, Bob Pulford, Ralph Backstrom, Henri Richard, Dick
>Duff...and so on..." demonstrates a blanket disregard for these
>individuals as contributors to the game...so yes, settle
>down...nobody has claimed that they are hockey gods.

Tarasov claimed that Gainey was a "hockey god."  And Greg ate it up.
And that is what this thread is all about.  If you didn't know 
that then why are you responding?

And as for "blanket disregard for these individuals", I can remember 
Leaf teams, purely populated by such "individuals", winning four 
Stanley Cups.  Teams.  No one ran around telling us that George
Armstrong was the best hockey player in the world.

>>>congenially, as always,
>>> 
>>>jd
>>> 
>>>--
>>>James David
>>>david@student.business.uwo.ca
> 
>>You might consider developing your own style.  After all,
>>imitation is  the sincerest form of flattery and I am quite sure
>>that flattery is not  your intention.
> 
>C'mon...it has a nice ring to it...and admit it, you had a good
>laugh.

Right.  I had to get to the end of your posting before I realized you were 
a complete joke.

In the future, if you are going to respond to my postings I would appreciate
it if you could present a cogent argument supported by facts gleaned from a
version of reality that most of the rest of us would recognize.

cordially, as always, 

rm

-- 
Roger Maynard 
maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53697
From: apanjabi@guvax.acc.georgetown.edu
Subject: Re: How to beat Pittsburgh!

In article <AfnKOVK00UhB01RDtJ@andrew.cmu.edu>, Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
> 	<kfnJYea00Uh_I1VmUs@andrew.cmu.edu>
> NNTP-Posting-Host: po5.andrew.cmu.edu
> In-Reply-To: <kfnJYea00Uh_I1VmUs@andrew.cmu.edu>
> 
> from Anna Matyas:
>>>Now if we could just clone Chelios's personality and transplant it
>>>into all of the defensemen on the Islanders, Capitals, and Devils...
>>> 
>>>Gerald
>> 
>>In other words, you want to turn them all into assholes so they
>>will spend lots of time in the penalty box and get lots of
>>misconducts?
>> 
>>And this comes from a Chelios fan...
> 
> Yeah, and also be second in the team in scoring and play about 35
> minutes a game and play on the power play and kill penalties and be the
> best defenseman in the league. I'd take a whole team of Chelioses if I
> could. (That way, when one got a penalty the others could kill it!)
> 
> Ralph

>HOW TO BEAT PITTSBURGH???

	I.Mario Lemieux
		A.Death
			1.Too much Kimo
			2.Slash to skull
			3.Ask the Rangers (Slashing his wrist????)
	II.Jaromir Jagr
		A.Deportation
			1.Send him back to whatever Commie country 
			  he's from
			2.Tell him that Bill Clinton is going too
	III.Kevin Stevens
		A.Fighting
			1.Call Bob Probert
			2.Call Tie Domi
			3.Call my grandmother (She'd kick his ass)
 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53698
From: dale@odie.cs.mun.ca (Dale Fraser)
Subject: Re: AHL News: St John's news, part XXXVIII

brifre1@ac.dal.ca writes:

>In article <1993Apr13.132906.1827@news.clarkson.edu>, farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy) writes:
>> Pete Raymond emailed me this piece of info. Not sure if Game 7 was
>> intentionally or unintentionally omitted (ie date not set).	
>> 
>> BRI
>> ================================================================
>> [begin quoted material]
>> 
>> Because of the Moncton win Friday night Halifax was eliminated thus St.
>> John's will make Halifax home. The first round of play-offs wil take place
>> on these dates.
>> 
>> 	April 14 - Halifax Metro Center (Leafs Home Game)
>>         April 17 - Halifax Metro Center
>>      
>> 	April 21 - Moncton
>> 	April 23 - Moncton
>> 
>> 	April 26 - Halifax Metro Center
>> 
>> 	April 30 - Moncton
>> 
>This is a Halifax (or at least this Halifax) resident's dream come true!!
>The leafs are my favorite NHL team (and no, I don't know why)!!!!!!!!!
>I'd say that this is even better than the Citadels making the playoffs (a
>Quebec farm team; who cares??).

>By the way, for any NFLD fans....I'm sure ASN will carry some of the games
>(they'd be stupid not to....but then this is ASN)
I haven't heard any news about ASN carrying any games but the local
cable station here in St. John's (Cable 9) is carrying the games live!

Hey, it's better than nothing!

GO LEAFS GO!!!

Dale

|-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-|
|   "Why sex is so popular    |    Dale Fraser  dale@odie.cs.mun.ca   |
|       Is easy to see:       | Memorial University of Newfoundland   |
|    It contains no sodium    |     CS Undergrad  -  Class of '92     |
| And it's cholesterol free!" |-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-| 
|       Shelby Friedman       | BLUE JAYS 1992 WORLD SERIES CHAMPS!!  |
|-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-|
| *OPINIONS EXPRESSED ABOVE DO NOT BELONG TO ME OR THIS INSTITUTION!* |
|-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-|

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53699
From: dale@odie.cs.mun.ca (Dale Fraser)
Subject: Re: Hockey and the Hispanic community

icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera) writes:


>	The presence of the new team in Miami(I can't say South Florida;
>it's too long) makes me think of an interesting question. Can you sell
>the Hispanic community on Hockey? Miami is 60-70% Hispanic. This community
>has no experience and no previous exposure to Hockey that I know of. The
>teams in NY and LA which also have big Hispanic groups do not seem to try
>to woo this group. What will Miami do? Could they get Spanish-language
>tv and radio coverage?
I think, as do the owners, that hockey will do well in Miami since there
is a lot of people from the Northeast that spend their winters in
Florida every year. As for the coverage, someone will have to come up
with some money for that since broadcast rights can be expensive!

Just my $0.02!

Dale

|-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-|
|   "Why sex is so popular    |    Dale Fraser  dale@odie.cs.mun.ca   |
|       Is easy to see:       | Memorial University of Newfoundland   |
|    It contains no sodium    |     CS Undergrad  -  Class of '92     |
| And it's cholesterol free!" |-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-| 
|       Shelby Friedman       | BLUE JAYS 1992 WORLD SERIES CHAMPS!!  |
|-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-|
| *OPINIONS EXPRESSED ABOVE DO NOT BELONG TO ME OR THIS INSTITUTION!* |
|-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-|

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53700
From: monack@helium.gas.uug.arizona.edu (david n monack)
Subject: Re: ESPN Tonight

In <1qkj1kINN3g1@master.cs.rose-hulman.edu> swartzjh@RoseVC.Rose-Hulman.Edu writes:

>Has anyone heard what game ESPN is showing tonight.  They said they will
>show whatever game means the most playoff-wise. I would assume this would
>be the Blues-Tampa game or the Minnesota-Red Wings game...  Anyone heard for
>sure???

>		Jeff Swartz

I heard it will be the Minnesota-Detroit game. Don't know the time
though.

Dave

--
David Monack        e-mail: monack@gas.uug.arizona.edu
"Love is the delusion that one woman differs from another." H.L. Mencken

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53701
From: richard@amc.com (Richard Wernick)
Subject: Bruins in the Playoffs

Well Bruins fans it's playoff time again.
It looks like the B's have peaked at the right time.
Getting out of the Adams is going to be a cat fight to the end.
After what they did to Montreal and Quebec, these teams will be out for
revenge. If Neely can stay healthy, and both Bourque and Moog stay sharp,
we should get to see Neely finally take out two years of frustration 
on Ulf (I don't fight) Samuelson. I don't agree with fighting in the NHL,
but if there is one guy who deserves to be taken out good, it's him.

This is going to be a good series, Go Bruins!!!!


Rchard
richard@amc.com


 



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53702
From: j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
Subject: Plus minus stat

>Post: 51240 of 51243
>Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
>From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
>Subject: Re: Plus minus stat
>Organization: Dept. of Computer Science, Laurentian University,
>Sudbury, ON Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1993 01:59:36 GMT
 
<discussion deleted>
 
>>>Good for you.  You'd only be displaying your ignorance of
>>>course, but to each his own...
>> 
>>Roger, I'm not sure here, but I think "ignorance" is really a
>>function of "a lack of knowledge" and not "formulating an
>>opinion"...but hey, if you need to take a cheap shot, then by
>>all means go ahead...that's if it makes you feel better.
 
>To knowledgeable observers of the game my meaning is obvious. 
>Your hockey education is not my responsibility.
 
MY HOCKEY EDUCATION?  What the f--- are you talking about?  I'm
not even going to try to refute this absolutely insane statement. 
 
>>My word, such vehemence against poor ol' Bob Gainey.  Why does
>>he bother you so much...he was an effective player for his
>>style of play.
 
>He was just another player.  To laud him as anything more I find
>bothersome.  I hated the Habs.  I hated Lafleur until I realized
>that he was likely the most aesthetically pleasing player to
>ever  skate in my lifetime.  Why would anyone talk about Gainey?
 
"I hate the Habs" ?...you sound like a 10-year old.  This
statement is just further exemplifies your total inability to
argue objectively about hockey.  Don't give me this crap about
"cogent arguments"...I've yet to read something of yours that is
cogent.  You consistently argue with: (1) emotion; (2) huge,
sweeping statements
 
Frankly, you have a very unconvincing style.
 
I'm not defending Bob Gainey...frankly, I don't care for him all
that much.  But your dismissal of him as something less than an
effective hockey player is tiresome...it has no basis in
anything.  How many Calders did he win? I think it was four (go
ahead and refresh my memory).  What about the Conn Smythe?  Was
that a fluke?  Yeah, not the makings of a hockey superstar, I
know, but try to have a reason, any reason, to shoot him down.
 
>>>go  around.  Who would you rather have as your "checking"
>>>centre?  Doug Gilmour or Doug Jarvis?  For that matter I would
>>>take either Gretzky or Mario as my "checking" centres.  Do you
>>>think Gretzky could cover Bob Gainey?
 
>>I'm really sorry Roger, but you have lost me completely here. 
>>Why don't you ask me if I would rather have Jesus Christ,
>>himself, in nets?
 
>Did he play hockey at a high level?  Was he any good?  If not,
>why would you bother to bring JC up?  I am talking about hockey
>players here.  If you can't follow the conversation don't follow
>up.  As I said previously, it is not my responsibility to
>educate you.
 
Hey cowboy!  You're the "expert" who introduced the idiotic
comparison of Gainey with Gretzky and Lemieux...you figure it
out.
 
>>Now, if you were to compare, say for example, Bob Gainey with
>>Guy Carbonneau, you would have a balanced comparison.
 
>Sure.  Two journeymen.  Big deal.  Neither one of them is worth
>discussing.
 
How many individual awards between them? Eight...I don't remember
(once again, please feel free to refresh my memory...and try to
be as sarcastic as possible about my "hockey education").
 
>I'm wrong AGAIN...hmmm, let's see...where was I wrong in the
 
>>>I would take Fuhr and Sanderson off of the latter.
 
OH MY GOD!!!  Did I say that?  Roger...what's your point?  Fuhr
is a goaltender, goaltender's don't "plug"...in his prime, he was
one of the best.  Sanderson was a scrapper...if you stick him on
you may as well include half the Flyers team of the same era.
 
>>first place?  I'm only guessing here, Rog, but I have a feeling
>>that you've setup a "You're wrong again" macro key on your
>>machine.
 
>That is an excellent idea and if I decide to waste any more time
>responding to any of your, or Greg's, postings then I will be
>sure to implement that very macro.
 
Oh Roger, you shouldn't...really.  I don't deserve this...you are
far too accomodating already.
 
>>I would suggest that your comment: "And when the press runs out
>>of things to say about  the stars on dynasties they start to
>>hype the pluggers.  Grant Fuhr, Essa Tikkannen, Butch Goring,
>>Bob Nystrom, Bob Gainey, Doug Jarvis, Derek Sanderson, Wayne
>>Cashman, Bob Baun, Bob Pulford, Ralph Backstrom, Henri Richard,
>>Dick Duff...and so on..." demonstrates a blanket disregard for
>>these individuals as contributors to the game...so yes, settle
>>down...nobody has claimed that they are hockey gods.
 
>Tarasov claimed that Gainey was a "hockey god."  And Greg ate
>it up. And that is what this thread is all about.  If you didn't
>know  that then why are you responding?
 
You seem to have allowed all of these other players fall into
your sweeping, vacuous statement...that's why.  If you want to
debate Gainey, go ahead...but why bring up everybody else?  How
does it support your argument?  Do you have an argument, or do
you just like to throw around a few names hoping to impress us?
 
 
>And as for "blanket disregard for these individuals", I can
>remember  Leaf teams, purely populated by such "individuals",
>winning four Stanley Cups.  Teams.  No one ran around telling
>us that George Armstrong was the best hockey player in the
>world.
 
Great.  I couldn't agree more.  The Flyers won two cups for the
same reasons...deservedly so.  So what?  I don't get it.  Are you
angry that the Leafs didn't get more recognition?  
 
You seem to think these pluggers are "hyped"...I don't
agree...plain and simple.  If you're last statement is some sort
of compromise, fair enough.
 
>>>You might consider developing your own style.  After all,
>>>imitation is  the sincerest form of flattery and I am quite
>>>sure that flattery is not  your intention.
>> 
>>C'mon...it has a nice ring to it...and admit it, you had a good
>>laugh.
 
>Right.  I had to get to the end of your posting before I
>realized you were  a complete joke.
 
Not a pleasant bone in your body, eh Rog?  Why are you so
unhappy?  Not getting invited to enough parties?  What?
 
>In the future, if you are going to respond to my postings I
>would appreciate it if you could present a cogent argument
>supported by facts gleaned from a version of reality that most
>of the rest of us would recognize.
 
Roger, why are you under the impression that responding to your
posts is some great honour?  You really should stop...it sounds
a little bit pathetic.  Frankly, it's about as honourable as a
good fart.
 
congenially, as always, 
 
jd
 
-- 
James David 
j3david@student.business.uwo.ca/s

j3david@sms.business.uwo.ca (James David)
Western Business School  --  London, Ontario

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53703
From: farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: Re: Playoff predictions

PATRICK
1st rd:	Pens over Isles in 4.
	Devils over Caps in 6.
2nd:	Pens over Devils in 7.

ADAMS
1st rd: B's over Sabres in 5.
	Nords over Habs in 5.
2nd:	B's over Nords in 6.

NORRIS
1st:	Hawks over Stars/Blues in 5.
	Wings over Leafs in 7.
2nd:	Hawks over Wings in 5.

SMYTHE
1st:	Jets over Canucks in 7.	(call it a hunch)
	Flames over Kings in 5.
2nd:	Jets over Flames in 6.

WALES
Pens over B's in 7.	

CAMPBELL
Hawks over Jets in 5.

STANLEY
Pens over Hawks in 5.

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL and ECAC contact for rec.sport.hockey		Go USA Hockey!	   +	
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    + CONGRATS TO THE BOSTON BRUINS, 1992-93 ADAMS DIVISION CHAMPIONS      +
    + PHOENIX SUNS, 1992-93 PACIFIC DIVISION CHAMPIONS			   +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53704
From: mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger)
Subject: TV Schedule for Next Week

United States TV Schedule:
April 18   Devils/Islanders at Pittsburgh   1 EST  ABC  (to Eastern time zone)
April 18   St. Louis at Chicago             12 CDT ABC  (to Cent/Mou time zones)
April 18   Los Angeles at Calgary           12 PDT ABC  (to Pacific time zone)
April 20   Devils/Islanders at Pittsburgh   7:30   ESPN
April 22   TBA                              7:30   ESPN
April 24   TBA                              7:30   ESPN

If somebody would send me the CBC/TSN schedule I'll post that as well.


*******************************************************************************
*  Mike Burger                    *  My Canada includes, Quebec, Ontario,     *
*  mmb@lamar.colostate.edu        *  the Maritimes, the Prairies, and Florida *
*  A Beginning Computing TA Stud  *  four months a year.                      *
*  over 500 students served       *    --Royal Canadian Air Farce             *
*******************************************************************************
*      University of Michigan - 1990  --  Colorado State University - 199?    *
*******************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53705
From: "Steve Hayman" <sahayman@cs.indiana.edu>
Subject: Re: Hockey and the Hispanic community

In article <C5I2s2.3Bt@odin.corp.sgi.com> rickc@wrigley.corp.sgi.com (Richard Casares) writes:
>When was the last time you saw a hockey league in the inner city.

Well, actually now that you mention it, a few weeks ago the CBC ran a
documentary on "Ice Hockey in Harlem".  the Canadian Club of New York
(something like that) sponsors a league for kids in Harlem and based on
the TV report they all seemed to be having a lot of fun.  All playing
with regular equipment, jerseys, etc etc, on a proper outdoor rink.  It
looked just like kids playing hockey anywhere else.

Some of the kids were even fortunate to get a trip to a hockey camp in Alberta.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53706
From: jrmst8+@pitt.edu (Joseph R Mcdonald)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

In article <1993Apr15.000256.24403@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA writes:
>What it comes down to is that Jagr, despite being an arrogant asshole, is a
>very good hockey player who has had a better season this year than Ron Francis.
>Jagr has more points and a better +/-.

Jagr has a higher +/-, but Francis has had more points.  And take it from
an informed observer, Ronnie Francis has had a *much* better season than
Jaromir Jagr.  This is not to take anything away from Jaro, who had a 
decent year (although it didn't live up to the expectations of some).
 
>Gregmeister

Dean
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dean J. Falcione                                      "Badges? What badges? We 
(using jrmst8 by permission                            Don't need no stinkin'
 of the owner, Joe McDonald)                           badges!"

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53707
From: gsu0033@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Eric Molas)
Subject: Re: Playoff predictions


>1st round: 
>----------

>PITT vs NYI:  PITT in 4.  
>WASH vs NJD:  WASH in 6. 

>BOS  vs BUF:  BOS  in 5. 
>QUE  vs MON:  MON  in 7. 
I'd have to take Quebec in 6.

>CHI  vs STL:  CHI in 4. 

Hawks will win, but it will take 5.
>DET  vs TOR:  DET in 6. 

>VAN  vs WIN:  WIN in 6. 
>CAL  vs  LA:  CAL in 5. 
Cal in 7.
>2nd round: 
>----------

>PITT vs WASH: PITT in 4. 
>BOS  vs MON:  BOS  in 6. 
Boston will beat Quebec in 6.
>CHI  vs DET:  CHI  in 7. 
>WIN  vs CAL:  CAL  in 5. 

>3rd round: 
>----------

>PITT vs BOS:  PITT in 5. 
Pitt in 6. The Bruins arent a pushover.
>CHI  vs CAL:  CHI  in 5. 
The hawks havent had problems with them  all year. Yep, I agree.
>Finals:
>------

>PITT vs CHI: PITT in 5. 
Unless the Hawks can somehow change fate, you're right.  

Who knows, though.  Maybe some intensive forechecking aka normal Hawks
style will nullify a seemingly unbeatable team.  Maybe the Pens are due
for a let-down.  Hell, how could they _possibly_ extend their record
making play all the way through the playoffs.? 

>=============================================
>Walter

-- 
//Damien Endemyr the Unpure Knight of Doom                          //
//"So I've acquired a taste for blood and have adopted a nocturnal  //
//lifestyle.  That Doesnt mean I'm a vampire....."                  //

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53708
From: fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu (FRANK MICHAE SALVATORE)
Subject: Re: Get Real.  Caps have no chance


In article <1993Apr15.162719@staff.dccs.upenn.edu>, filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu (Geoff Filinuk) writes:
] 	Anyone who really believes that the Caps can beat
> the Pens are kidding themselves.  The Pens may not loose
> one game in the playoffs.


Let's be honest.  The Pens may not 'loose' one game as you
put it, but they will definitely lose one game.  Remember,
the regular season doesn't mean much when it comes to 
playoff time.  The Caps have a shot at least - the Flyers
sure don't

Frank Salvatore
fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53709
From:  (Proust)
Subject: Re: Individual Winners (WAS: Re: WHERE ARE THE DOUBTERS NOW? HMM?)

In article <1993Apr15.170226.11074@cci632.cci.com>, dwk@cci632.cci.com
(Dave Kehrer) wrote:
> 
> Well, since you mentioned it...
> 
> In article <1993Apr12.142028.6300@jarvis.csri.toronto.edu>, migod@turing.toronto.edu (Mike Godfrey) writes:
>   
> > Lemieux is clearly the MVP
> 
> No question here.  Chip in the Masterson as well...


Lemieux for the Masterson? No doubt he had an awe inspiring season,
but what personal records did he set this year? Lemieux should have
Hart locked up...but how about Mike Gartner for the Masterson?

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53710
From: jwodzia@fadel.uucp (john wodziak)
Subject: Re: Goalie masks

In article <120666@netnews.upenn.edu> kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller) writes:
>My vote goes to John Vanbiesbrouck.  His mask has a skyline of New York
>City, and on the sides there are a bunch of bees (Beezer).  It looks
>really sharp.

Doesn't it also have the Statue of Liberty on it or is that Richter's Mask?

The back actually has a Bee followed by a Z to represent the Beezer. It 
also has something that looks like the three interconnecting circles from
the Led Zepplin 4 album cover. Is that what it is supposed to be? and if
it is does anybody know why he would put it there? Ali?

>    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
>            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

John
"The official Language of Golf is Profanity"




In Hockey Hell...............jwodzia@eng.clemson.edu............John R. Wodziak
The REAL Black and Gold     |In Memorium: #7 Alan Kulwicki 1954-1993   | Bean
Will Triumph over those who |A Polish Yankee Mechanical Engineer,      | Town
are Pretenders to the Crown.|1992 Winston Cup Champion & a great Person| ROCKS!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53711
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: Re: Pens Info needed

In article <1993Apr15.140541.28465@ericsson.se> etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson) writes:
>
> Actually, Swedish coach Curt Lundmark is thinking about leaving two
> spots open for additions from eliminated NHLers. It is Mats Sundin and
> Calle Johansson that Curt hopes can join the team, although in a late
> stage of the tournament. Technically, I seem to recall that you can leave
> spots open until 24 hrs before the WC final.
>
Hmmm...I also heard through the grapevine that Team Finland might try and
leave a spot open for at least one NHLer. (Some guy named Sel{nne, ever
hear of him? :)  They might have to be content with Kurri, though, I hope. :)


Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53712
From: DMJEWLAL@CHEMICAL.watstar.uwaterloo.ca (Derrick M. Jewlal)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

In article <1993Apr14.174828.13445@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
>Subject: Re: plus minus stat
>Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1993 17:48:28 GMT
>In <DREIER.93Apr14092901@jacobi.berkeley.edu> dreier@jacobi.berkeley.edu (Roland Dreier) writes:
>
>>Selanne's +7 leads the Jets; Teppo Numminen is +4.  Who do you think
>>is better defensively?  Ron Francis of the Penguins is +5, although he
>>has 97 points, while Jaromir Jagr has only 87 points but is +30.  Is
>>Jagr really better on defense than Francis?  And how exactly should we
>>interpret the fact that Mario Lemieux has by far the highest +/- in
>>the league?  Does he get the Selke as well as the Ross?
>
>The plus/minus does not measure defense alone.  It attempts to measure
>a  player's  total contribution to the team effort.  And certainly, it
>is far from perfect and my posting never implied otherwise.  All  that
>my  posting  suggested  was  that  the +/- was a better indicator of a
>player's effectiveness, when examined in the context of that  player's
>team's  performance, than mere scoring totals alone.  And as for Mario
>getting the Selke - why not?  After Doug Gilmour, I would rather  have
>Lemieux  on the ice in any situation (other than as an enforcer, obvi-
>ously) than any player in the game.  I used to call the Selke the "Bob
>Gainey  Award".   It  came  about as a result of the statement made by
>Anatoli Tarasov: "Bob Gainey is the best hockey player in the  world."
>I am sure that Tarasov was either misquoted, originally, or had a tiny
>bit too much Vodka and was toying with a reporter.  In any event,  the
>NHL  decided  to honour one dimensional checkers along with one dimen-
>sional scorers.  Maybe the league should start awarding the "Doug Gil-
>mour Award" anually  to the league's most effective, all-round player.
>
>cordially, as always,
>
>rm
>
>-- 
>Roger Maynard 
>maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 

	Hey, what about the "Roger Maynard Award" for the most
	annoying fan....?
======================================================== 
Derrick M. Jewlal 
34 Laurel St. , Apt. #1 
Waterloo 
747 4804 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53713
From: nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: SHARKS REVIEW Part 1: Goaltenders

As the Sharks' season came to a close tonight, I will start a series of posts,
trying to revisit the players, the trades, the moves, etc., that went through
for the Sharks for the past season.  If you are uninterested, since I will
have the words SHARKS REVIEW in the subject heading in these postings, you can
kill them.

I will first try to evaluate how the players did.  These ratings, of course,
are subject to my own biases, but I hope that I can try to be as objective as
possible.  I will evalute players who finished the season with the Sharks
and/or did not play for another NHL team this season.

Thus, then, let's go to the goaltenders...

#1	BRIAN HAYWARD		Season:	11th
Acquired:	'91-92 from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		P (D)

It is sad that his career has to come to this dim an end, a career that
featured sharing three Jennings Trophies (with Patrick Roy, in '87, '88, and
'89).  It would indeed be unfair for me to do anything but give him a passing
grade (and skip the letter grading), but he had simply been awful on ice this
year, save for a bright spot or two, and even if he had been healthy, he would
not be any more than the 3rd-string goalie.

But Hayward was a classy individual, who also figured in on the Sharks' first
ever victory, the 3rd game of the season last year against the Calgary Flames.
As he retires, the fans will remember what a good guy he was.

#30	JEFF HACKETT		Season: 3rd
Acquired:	'91-92, from N. Y. Islanders in expansion draft
Grade:		C

Hackett, after (deservedly) winning the team MVP honors last season, simply
wasted the year.  Other than a few good spots (57 saves against Los Angeles,
almost-shutout against Tampa Bay, etc.), Hackett, finishing with 85.6% save
percentage and a 5.28 GAA, watched his status go from the team's #1 goalie to
bench decoration at the end of the season.  He was expected, early, to carry
the team along; instead, he apparently became frustrated, but the an early
injury that forced him to miss 12 games may have been a contributing factor,
but upon return, he simply wasn't up to the task.  He may not return next
year.

#31	WADE FLAHERTY		Season: 1st (still eligible as rookie)
Acquired:	'91-92, signed as undrafted free agent
Grade:		I (A-)

It is pretty hard to evaluate a goaltender on just one game alone, thus the
incomplete grade, but yet in the one start that he did get (against the Calgary
Flames), Flaherty was nothing but sharp for at least two periods.  He started
the season poorly in Kansas City, but finished strong, prompting the Blades'
owner Ron Parker to comment that he should be a candidate for the IHL MVP
honors.  The upcoming IHL playoffs would be a major challenge for him as he
tries to make it into the NHL; last year, he was a capable backup for Arturs
Irbe in the throughout the season and in the Turner Cup playoffs, picking up
all-star honors along with Irbe; now it's time for him to show that he can
share the job with Irbe next year, because with prospects Dan Ryder, Trevor
Robins, and Scott Cashman coming along, if he doesn't make it next year, he
may not ever.

#32	ARTURS IRBE		Season:	1st
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		B+

I may yet be overly critical of Irbe in a year that he clearly established that
he's a bona fide NHL goaltender, perhaps a bona fide #1 goaltender.  He has
provided most of the little highlight footage that the Sharks team had, getting
the team's first ever shut-out against the Los Angeles Kings on December 26.
He has been fearless in and out of the net, aggressively playing the puck and
making passes, reminding people of a young Ron Hextall (except, of course, the
goonism).  Yet he still needs to develop more consistency, which is hard to do
with such a bad defense in front of him, but if the Sharks are to challenge for
a playoff spot next season, Irbe's the key, as he demonstrated in being named
as a star of the game 13 times in 32 starts.

===============================================================================
GO CALGARY FLAMES!  Al MacInnis for Norris!  Gary Roberts for Hart and Smythe!
GO EDMONTON OILERS!  Go for playoffs next year!  Stay in Edmonton!
===============================================================================
Nelson Lu (claudius@leland.stanford.edu)
rec.sport.hockey contact for the San Jose Sharks

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53714
From: nmcglynn@buffalo.axion.bt.co.uk (Neil A. McGlynn)
Subject: British Championship Playoffs (16 Apr 93)

Group A					Group B
~~~~~~~					~~~~~~~

Cardiff Devils  7-3  Bracknell Bees	Nottingham Panthers  8-3  Billingham
Humberside      7-7  Whitley Warriors	Murrayfield Racers  11-2  Fife Flyers
Whitley Bay     6-9  Cardiff Devils     Billingham Bombers   6-8  Murrayfield
Humberside      8-5  Bracknell Bees	Nottingham Panthers 11-5  Fife Flyers
Cardiff Devils 10-4  Humberside		Murrayfield Racers   6-4  Nottingham
Bracknell Bees  4-9  Whitley Bay	Fife Flyers          2-5  Billingham
Bracknell Bees  3-8  Cardiff Devils	Billingham Bombers   2-8  Nottingham
Whitley Bay     5-7  Humberside		Fife Flyers          3-12 Murrayfield

		P W D L  F  A  P			     P W D L  F  A  P
Cardiff Devils  4 4 0 0 34 16  8*	Murrayfield Racers   4 4 0 0 37 15  8*
Humberside      4 2 1 1 26 27  5	Nottingham Panthers  4 3 0 1 31 16  6*
Whitley Bay     4 1 1 2 27 27  3	Billingham Bombers   4 1 0 3 16 26  2
Bracknell Bees  4 0 0 4 15 32  0	Fife Flyers	     4 0 0 4 12 39  0

* indicates qualified for Championship Finals

Relegation/Promotion A			Relegation/Promotion B
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~			~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Basingstoke    10-4  Swindon Wildcats   Sheffield Steelers  12-8  Peterborough
Durham Wasps   13-5  Romford Raiders	Slough Jets          1-9  MK Kings
Basingstoke     6-0  Durham Wasps	Sheffield Steelers   9-4  Milton Keynes
Swindon         8-5  Romford Raiders    Milton Keynes Kings  4-6  Peterborough
Durham Wasps   17-2  Swindon Wildcats	Slough Jets          2-12 Sheffield
Romford         4-10 Basingstoke 	Peterborough        10-2  Slough Jets
Romford        *8-3* Durham Wasps	Peterborough	     8-5  Sheffield
Swindon         7-11 Basingstoke        Milton Keynes Kings 10-4  Slough Jets

		P W D L  F  A  P			     P W D L  F  A  P
Basingstoke     4 4 0 0 37 15  8	Sheffield Steelers   4 3 0 0 38 22  6
Durham Wasps    4 2 0 2 33 21  4	Peterborough         4 3 0 1 32 23  6
Swindon         4 1 0 3 21 43  2	Milton Keynes Kings  4 2 0 2 27 20  4
Romford Raiders 4 1 0 3 22 34  2	Slough Jets	     4 0 0 4  9 41  0


  /-- / /-- /--   /-- / \ / /-- /-/ --- o Neil A. McGlynn   +44 473 645659
 /-- / /__ /--   /-- /   / /-- /_/ /__  o nmcglynn@axion.bt.co.uk
/   / /   /--   /   /__ / /-- /\  ___/  o British Telecom Laboratories, 
---------------------------------------	  Martlesham Heath, Ipswich, UK



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53715
From: cdkaupan@eos.ncsu.edu (CARL DAVID KAUPANG)
Subject: Stop predicting


It is really annoying to see all of these
predictions on the Net.  Who really cares
who you think will win?  Please stop with
the predictions, we all know the Caps are
going to win the Cup, so let it go at that.


David Kaupang
cdkaupan@eos.ncsu.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53716
From: mikkot@romulus.math.jyu.fi (Mikko Tarkiainen)
Subject: Re: Pens Info needed

In article <C5K9E8.M3@ccu.umanitoba.ca> umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner) writes:

>Hmmm...I also heard through the grapevine that Team Finland might try and
>leave a spot open for at least one NHLer. (Some guy named Sel{nne, ever
>hear of him? :)  They might have to be content with Kurri, though, I hope. :)

True, coach Matikainen is ready to keep a spot for Teemu all the way
until the medal games. He wants Teppo Numminen, too. And Kurri, but for
them the spots cannot be left open for too long. Esa Tikkanen we have
already. 

Even without these players I think we have pretty good team. Young,
hungry, talented guys, no old players that have got everything (except
the gold). Yesterday's practise game, SWE-FIN 6-6, shows that the two
world's best hockey teams ;) are in prime shape.  The Finn line
Riihijarvi(slightly injured)-Saarikoski-Viitakoski shined. I bet these
two teams are the best in the NHL, too. Roger, Roger?

What do you people think about Team Canada with Lindros, Brind'Amour,
Burke, Ranford, Recchi, Dineen...? Can they beat the Finns:?

Coaching news: 

	       Alpo Suhonen (ex-Jets) to Jokerit (now verified), 
               Boris Majorov (ex-Jokerit) to Tappara,
	       Vasili Tichonov (ex-Assat) to San Jose Sharks 
                                             (assistant coach),
	       Sakari Pietila to Lulea (silver team in Elite-serien)

FW Mikko Makela (ex-TPS) to Malmo IF.
G Markus Ketterer (Jokerit) still has no contract.
FW Timo Saarikoski to Jokerit, watch out for him in next week.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53717
From: voecking@Informatik.TU-Muenchen.DE (Volker Voecking)
Subject: Re: expanding to Europe:Dusseldorf


In article <1993Apr15.192231.27574@abo.fi>, MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF) writes:
|> In <PKORTELA.93Apr15164732@lk-hp-17.hut.fi> pkortela@snakemail.hut.fi writes:
|> 
|> > 
|> > DEG has many german-born forwards in the team. In fact the majority of players
|> > are german-born. 1992-93 DEG had 11150 average in 11800 spectator arena.
|> 
|> Interesting! One of our German friends here (Robert?) told me their forwards
|> were all Canadian-Germans. Perhaps somebody can sort this out for us?

As far as I know Dusseldorf has only one Canadian-German forward (i.e. a  player
who was born in Canada but now has a German passport). 
Benoit Doucet became german by marriing a german and he is going to play 
for Germany in the WC.

The other Canada-born forwards are:
	Peter-John Lee (has British passport)
	Chris Valentine
	Dale Dercatch
	Steve Gootas
 	Earl Spry (?)

At the moment there are only three German-born forwards coming into my mind:
	Bernd Trunschka, Andreas Brockmann, Ernst Koepf


Volker


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53718
From: sforsblo@vipunen.hut.fi (Svante Forsblom)
Subject: Re: Suhonen will NOT go to Jokerit


>In <tvartiai.734823058@vipunen.hut.fi> tvartiai@vipunen.hut.fi (Tommi Vartiainen) writes:

>>According to the inside information, Alpo Suhonen won't be the next headcoach
>>of Jokerit. It's pretty sure that Boris Majorov will continue, although owner
>>of the team previously said that he will chance the coach.

>>Tommi
>Wrong information. They just announced that Suhonen has made a deal with 
>Jokerit.
> 

>Tommi

And Boris Majorov has made a 1+1 year deal with Tappara.

Svante

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53719
From: montana@pinetree.org (David Wong)
Subject: hockey playoff pool: LAST CHANCE!

This will be my last post ( promotion ) of the hockey pool.. I will 
update the pool ( or try to ) every wednesday
 
Subject: Please join my hockey playoff pool. 
Deadline for pool: Midnight Saturday
Rules: Read on
Cost: NONE
PRIZES: NONE
Send replies to : Montana@pinetree.org
 
Note: if your entries is send by midnight saturday it will be accepted
      please include your name
 
               Rules to the ACME hockey playoff pool 
 
Critierias
 Pick 9 forwards  ( as long as they are forwards LW=RW=C is okay)
 Pick 6 defensemen
 ( arrange them in a lines, 3 forwards and two defense = 1 line 
 ( and arranged them in line order , which of your players would       
 ( play in the first line and which plays in the second line 
 Pick 1 designated playmaker   
      ( can be any positions...try a defensemen )
 Pick 1 designated scorer ( can be any positions )
 Pick 1 goal-tender
 Pick a team   ( the one you think may win the cup )           
                 
 *note: players can only be chosen once !
 ie Cannot have Sakic as forward and again as designated passer
 -----------------------------------------------------------------        
                 
 Calculation of points: 
  ( except for designated scorer and playmaker)
   1 assist  = 1 pt   IXI  1 goal = 1 pt  II 
   ( for players in line 1, their pt totals will be *2 )
          line 1 = pts * 2
          line 2 = pts * 1.5
          line 3 = pts * 1
   1 win     = 2 pt  ( for goalies)
   
   The team that wins the Cup = 10 pts
   
For the designated playmaker         Designated
Calculation will be as follows       Scorer:Goal    = 3 pts
Every goal scored = 0.5 points             Assists = 0.5 pts
Every assists     = 2 points
   
  In the event of a tie, the tie will be broken by unmodified 
  Goal totals and then by game winning goals
  ----SAMPLE-------------------------------------
   eg designated scorer = Jeremy Roenick
      Actual: G=12, A=10, Pts=22  Modified G=(12*3) + A=(10*0.5) = 41
   .    
       designated playmaker = Steve Smith
      Actual: G=1,  A=11, Pts=12  Modified G=(1*0.5)  + A=(11*2) = 22.5
   .
   line 1 = J Murphy(24)- G Courtnall(14)- M Messier(14)
                   Dave Manson(12)-  Iafrate(7)
       Total points = 142 points for that line!


--
  Internet: montana@pinetree.org (David Wong)
  UUCP: pinetree!montana
  Gordon's Pinetree -- Ottawa, ON, Canada -- +1 613 526 0702 -- v.32bis/v.42bis


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53720
From: juvirtan@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Jukka A Virtanen)
Subject: Re: Plus minus stat

In <1993Apr16.015936.11303@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:

>>>Good for you.  You'd only be displaying your ignorance of
>>>course, but to each his own...
>> 
>>Roger, I'm not sure here, but I think "ignorance" is really a
>>function of "a lack of knowledge" and not "formulating an
>>opinion"...but hey, if you need to take a cheap shot, then by all
>>means go ahead...that's if it makes you feel better.

>To knowledgeable observers of the game my meaning is obvious.  Your
>hockey education is not my responsibility.
 
Just curious, Roger, but since you have such a vast knowledge of the
game and the league, how come you haven't made a living out of it?
There must be a lot of demand for expertise in the field. I'm sure
you'd be of great help to, say, the Leafs as an assistant coach or
a scout. Or maybe try a career as a reporter or tv commentator...
 
I might be wrong, of course, and you already have.
-- 
Jukka A Virtanen
                                                    juvirtan@cc.helsinki.fi
                       University of Helsinki

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53721
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: Sweden-Finland, April 15


 Played in Scandinavium, Gothenburg, April 15 1993:
 ==================================================

 SWEDEN - FINLAND  6-6 (1-2,3-1,2-3)

 1st: SWE 1-0 Peter Popovic      (Markus Naslund)                     6:10
      FIN 1-1 Ville Siren        (Keijo Sailynoja)                    8:44 (pp)
      FIN 1-2 Juha Riihijarvi    (Timo Saarikoski,Vesa Viitakoski)   13:12 (pp)
 2nd: FIN 1-3 Jari Korpisalo     (Kari Harila,Rauli Raitanen)         6:48
      SWE 2-3 Jan Larsson        (Mikael Renberg,Stefan Nilsson)      7:25
      SWE 3-3 Hakan Ahlund       (Thomas Rundqvist)                   8:56
      SWE 4-3 Roger Akerstrom    (Roger Hansson)                      9:13
 3rd: SWE 5-3 Stefan Nilsson     (Patrik Juhlin,Charles Berglund)     2:20
      FIN 5-4 Keijo Sailynoja                                         9:23
      FIN 5-5 Keijo Sailynoja                                         9:44 (ps)
      SWE 6-5 Mikael Renberg     (Hakan Ahlund,Thomas Rundqvist)     17:16
      FIN 6-6 Jari Korpisalo                                         17:44

             Shots on goal:      Penalties:     Attendance:    Referee:
 Sweden       8 10 10 - 28       5*2min         6,799          Peter Andersson
 Finland     12 10 11 - 33       6*2min,1*10min                (Sweden)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Sweden opened the scoring as Markus Naslund made a drop pass at the Finnish
 blue line, Popovic picked it up and advanced towards the Finnish goal and
 shot a nice hard wrist shot in Ketterer's top corner. Ville Siren's slap
 shot from the blue line on power play made it 1-1, and Juha Riihijarvi
 scored a nice goal in another power play when he close in front of goal
 put the puck high over Aslin, 1-2 after the first period.
 The Finns started the second period with really good pressure. Korpisalo
 made it 1-3 with another goal from close range high over Aslin. Then,
 during the Finnish pressure, Sweden turned the game around in 1:47.
 Mikael Renberg worked hard behind the Finnish goal, and passed the puck to
 Jan Larsson in front, who backhanded the puck low, 2-3. Rundqvist entered
 the Finnish zone and passed to Ahlund, and the Finnish defense let Ahlund 
 skate in and take a shot that Ketterer dropped into the goal, 3-3.
 Next, Roger Hansson -behind the goal- sent the puck back to the blue line
 where Roger Akerstrom took a slap shot and Ketterer didn't see the puck since
 there was traffic in front, 4-3.
 Third period started with a nice goal by Stefan "the Shadow" Nilsson. Stefan
 and Patrik Juhlin entered the Finnish zone, Patrik passed the puck back to
 Stefan who alone with Ketterer made no mistake, 5-3.
 Then, Keijo Sailynoja show started. He reduce and equalized the lead in only
 21 seconds! First he scored the 5-4 goal, and after that he came in alone 
 with Aslin but was tripped by Aslin to get a penalty shot. Sailynoja
 made a nice penalty shot, showed forehand and put in with a low backhand shot.
 The Swedes seemed to head for a win when Mikael Renberg scored the 6-5 goal
 late in the game on a nice power play combination. Renberg waited in the slot,
 showed that he wanted the puck on the backhand side, Ahlund passed the puck
 and Renberg took a turnaround shot low in Ketterer's goal's far side.
 But Jari Korpisalo had other plans as he only 28 seconds later scored the
 game's final goal to make it 6-6. Korpisalo took a slap shot from a narrow
 angle that -maybe- Aslin should have saved.

 All in all, a decent game where the defense wasn't the best.
 Both teams juggled around the lines a bit in the second and third period
 to try no combinations.

 Renberg and Rundqvist plays well together in the Swedish team. Larsson-
 Nilsson-Juhlin best line overall again, it seems to be a working WC line.
 Stillman good on defense.
 Some players aren't good enough for the WC though. Hakan Ahlund (faell ner
 hjaelmen och jobba!), Roger Hansson, Challe Berglund, Kenny Jonsson
 will likely have to leave for NHL pros.

 Two-goal scorers Jari Korpisalo and Keijo Sailynoja played well in the
 Finnish team. Markus Ketterer didn't have a very good game, we've seen him
 a lot better, so Lindfors is probably Finland's starting goalie in the WC.
 I heard that Esa Tikkanen will join the Finnish team. It would be inter-
 resting to know which other pros coach Matikainen counts on for the WC.
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Starting lines:

 	SWEDEN					FINLAND

  35. Peter Aslin			30. Markus Ketterer

   8. Kenneth Kennholt			 2. Mikko Haapakoski
  14. Fredrik Stillman			 3. Ville Siren

  10. Hakan Ahlund			28. Jarkko Varvio
   9. Thomas Rundqvist			40. Mika Nieminen
  29. Mikael Renberg  			18. Keijo Sailynoja

  27. Roger Akerstrom			 4. Erik Hamalainen
   7. Arto Blomsten			 8. Kari Harila

  20. Jan Larsson 	 		25. Rauli Raitanen
   4. Stefan Nilsson 			26. Petri Varis
   5. Patrik Juhlin			14. Jari Korpisalo

   3. Peter Popovic			 5. Timo Jutila
  32. Stefan Larsson			44. Harri Laurila

  11. Roger Hansson			24. Juha Riihijarvi
  33. Fredrik Nilsson			22. Timo Saarikoski
  24. Peter Ottosson			11. Vesa Viitakoski

					 6. Pasi Sormunen
					12. Janne Laukkanen

  19. Markus Naslund			29. Juha Ylonen
  21. Peter Forsberg			27. Timo Peltomaa
  18. Jonas Bergqvist			17. Marko Palo

 Played parts of the game:
  22. Charles Berglund			15. Mika Alatalo
   6. Kenny Jonsson			16. Saku Koivu
					20. Marko Palo

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53722
From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
Subject: Finland/Sweden vs.NHL teams (WAS:Helsinki/Stockholm & NHL expansion)

In <tervio.40@katk.Helsinki.FI> tervio@katk.Helsinki.FI writes:

>    Now what if the two teams were merged (this has been proposed in Tampere 
> with Ilves ( =Lynx) and Tappara ( =Axe).  The fans wouldn't take it !
> They rather see their teams out of the playoffs most of the time or even 
> relegated than merged.  It's not that difficult to understand, it's just 
> like here in Helsinki.  You *grow up* being either a Jokerit- or HIFK -fan.
> The other team is the last team in the world you would support.  I'm not 
> talking about 'hate' but about extremely deeply rooted rivalry.

"Deeply rooted rivalry?" Ahem, Jokerit have been around since 1967 and joined
the top flight only in the early '70s. Helsingfors IFK have been around since
1897 but fans only started taking hockey seriously in the 1960s so I think
you're exagerating here.

>    However, it's been proved that both fan groups can cheer the same team
> - that's "the Finnish national team".  Maybe that's how you could set up a 
> huge franchise in Finland.  No one has ever said that the team must be 
> called after one city or play all its games on one arena.  Just one Team 
> Finland and Team Sweden in the NHL just wouldn't make any sense - we have 
> way more talent than 1/24th of the total of North American talent.  After a 
> couple of seasons you would never see the cup going anywhere outside the 
> Nordic  (presuming that our teams would have the advantage in  drafting 
> local talent, as prooposed).

That's a rather bold claim, in the light of how successful the Canadian &
American Olympic teams have been . . . and they've had to play according to our
set of rules and on international ice. The 1992 Olympic teams contained about
as much talent as your average expansion team. Canada had Eric Lindros, Sean
Burke, Joe Juneau and Chris Kontos. Another four or five have been deep subs in
the NHL. As for the Yanks, Keith Tkachuk, Scott Lachance, Bret Hedican, Shawn 
McEachern, Steve Heintze, Ted Donato, Joe Sacco and Bill Guerin have been 
3rd/4th line players in the NHL, while Robb Stauber has done well for the 
Kings in goal. Nothing more. In fact, I'm sure that an All-Star team assembled
from the best Finnish League teams would do no better in the NHL than Hartford 
or Tampa Bay currently are doing.
---
But what happens if _all_ top-class Finnish & Swedish players gradually end up
with Helsinki & Stockholm as the North American-based ones gradually retire and
no Canadian/American team is allowed to draft new players from Scandinavia? 
Here is what THE HOCKEY NEWS scouts think of our NHL-based players:

(28-30=superstar)
(23-27=star)
(18-22=NHL regular+)
(13-17=NHL regular)
( 8-12=role player)

FINLAND:  

D-Jyrki Lumme.......20
D-Teppo Numminen....20
D-Peter Ahola.......13

C-Jari Kurri........25
C-Christian Ruuttu..16

R-Teemu Selanne.....27

L-Esa Tikkanen......20
(Obviously, Selanne's ratings would be higher today than they were in January)

SWEDEN:
D-Ulf Samuelsson....21
D-Fredrik Olausson..20
D-Niklas Lidstrom...18
D-Calle Johansson...18
D-Kjell Samuelsson..17
D-Tommy Sjodin......13
D-Tommy Albelin......7

C-Mats Sundin.......26
C-Thomas Steen......18

R-Thomas Sandstrom..22
R-Ulf Dahlen........18
R-Michael Nylander..13

L-Per-Erik Eklund...18
L-Johan Garpenlov...16
L-Mikael Andersson..15
L-Jan Erixon........14

This would be interesting. Clearly, Finland's top five players (Winnipeg's
Selanne & Numminen, Vancouver's Lumme, Los Angeles' Jari Kurri and New York's
Tikkanen) are right up there with any five-man unit Pittsburgh & co. have. But
I have my doubts about the home-based Finnish players - the national team did
well in the Canada Cup and World Championships largely due to the efforts of
Markus Ketterer (the goalie), 3-4 or the players listed above and luck. There's
presumably a lot of decent players in Finland that wouldn't be superstars at
the highest level but still valuable role players, however. My guess would be
that the Finnish Canada Cup team would be a .500 team in the NHL.
---
Sweden is easier to judge because they have more players in North America.
Their points total (16 players) is 274 - seven more than Ottawa's 22 top
players combined! If we estimate there are six more NHL regulars back home in 
Sweden, an all-Swedish team would assemble about 350-360 skill points.
Deducting some points from Pittsburgh, NY Rangers and other teams that rely on
Swedish players, the Swedish team would finish in sixth place - about as high
as Boston, Vancouver, Calgary and Montreal on paper! So, the "dynasty" talk
isn't completely unfounded here. An all-Finnish/all-Swedish team might have an
advantage because the players would be playing at home half of the time,
won't have to adapt to a foreign country and a foreign language, and presumably
play the wide-open European variant of hockey rather than have to learn the
North American checking game. However, if free agency becomes a factor the top 
Scandinavian players still might end up playing for large-market teams after a 
couple of years the same way Edmonton's "dynasty" crumbled in the late '80s. 
Some fringe players likely will be drafted by other NHL teams as having an 
exclusive talent pool might be a bit unfair after all. I'd settle for a 
compromise, prohibit all European teams from signing a North American during 
the first two rounds but allow them to keep their top two players. After this, 
the amateur draft should be open to anyone. 

> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>  J O O   J O O   J O K E R I T  !  !  !    Finland over Czech in the Final
>    B R U I N P O W E R ! ! !               Bruins over Blackhawks in 6 
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

MARCU$
     

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53724
From: ayari@judikael.loria.fr (Ayari Iskander)
Subject: NHLPA poll (Stats/3rd uptade)

3rd uptade:

Here are the standings for the poll after 39 votes: 5 points for 1st, 4 for 2nd,... 1 point for 5th: 

EA/ NHLPA game

1. DET 102
2. CHI  97 
3. NY   74
4. VAN  73
5. MTL  69
6. PIT  33
7. WSH  29
8. BOS  21
9..ASW  16 
10.CGY  10
11.QUE   9
12.ASE   8
13.WPG   7
14.LA    5
   OTW   5
   STL   5
   TOR   5
18.BUF   3
   PHI   3
   TBY   3
21.SJ    2
22.MIN   1
   Atlanta to win Turner Cup 1 (not in the game, but 1 person vote)
24.EDM   0
   HTF   0
   LI    0
   NJ    0

4 teams have no point
Continue to send your votes in this format (until April 20th, approximately)
------------------------------------------------
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
------------------------------------------------


Keywords: 


-- 
_____________________________________________________

  Email : Iskander.Ayari@loria.fr ou ayari@loria.fr
_____________________________________________________


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53725
From: alvstad@mari.acc-admin.stolaf.edu (Mad Dog)
Subject: Truly a sad day for hockey


A fine 26 year history came to a close tonight, as the Minnesota North Stars, 
or Norm's Stars (whichever you prefer) lost to the Red Wings by a score of
5-3.  The Stars goals were scored by Mike McPhee and Ulf Dahlen, who netted
two including the final one in franchise history, with less than a minute to
play.

Tonight, on the air on the Stars TV telecast, announcer Al Shaver, the voice
of the North Stars, stated basically that he will not follow the team to 
Dallas.  Shaver, when asked by his son (who was doing the broadcast with him),
"What will you do now?" responded, "First I'm going to get me a new pair of
slippers.  Then I'm going to sit in my easy chair and watch the world go by."

Thank you North Stars, and thank you Al Shaver, for 26 years of Minnesota
memories.

Joel Alvstad



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53726
From: pkortela@snakemail.hut.fi (Petteri Kortelainen)
Subject: Re: New Finnish Star is born?

In article <1993Apr15.114041.1@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi> hahietanen@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi writes:

>I saw yesterday on TV a game between Team Sweden and Team Finland.
>Most of us might know that it was played in Stockholm and the result
>was 4:3 for the home team. That's nothing very special... But I was
>very surprised of Saku Koivu. I must admit that he surprised me 
>already in the Finnish playoffs. And now on team Finland!

>Saku Koivu is a light weight player, if we consider his size: According
>to my stats he is only 172cm and 68kgs! And he is only 18! (23.11.74).
>But he is a real two-way player! Skates well, can score, gives nice
>passes, does even bodycheckings!!? He is really something to watch
>in the WC. 

>The size isn't always everything. Maybe we remember Harlamov...
>And they say that Saku is still growing up (3cm during last year)...

Saku isn't that small any longer I guess I heard he is 177cm tall at the
moment and will still grow 6-8cm.

Petteri Kortelainen


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53727
From: pkortela@snakemail.hut.fi (Petteri Kortelainen)
Subject: Re: Helsinki/Stockholm & NHL expansion?

In article <1993Apr15.095653.17514@abo.fi> MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF) writes:

>In <C5H9wr.6J3@polaris.utu.fi> franti@polaris.utu.fi writes:


>Not too low perhaps, but surely not as high as that of an European NHL
>division. The Finnish team, for example, would contain all players currently 
 on
>the national team plus a top-class foreigner or two. They would be in an
>entirely different league than TPS or Jokerit, both of whom have perhaps a
>dozen players of international class - if even that. Why settle for a minor
>league when you could have the best?

How many players of international class an average NHL team has. 6-10?
Top players just play more in smaller rinks. Is the quality of European hockey
really poor, then recent years only few north-american (usually good farm 
players) players have got place in Finnish league or Elitserien, while most 
have been shipped back. 

Petteri Kortelainen

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53728
From: stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber)
Subject: Re: Radio stations

In article <ragraca.735252641@vela.acs.oakland.edu>, ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:
> greanias@texas.mitre.org (Steve Greanias) writes:
> 
> 
> 
> >	I do not have cable and on the nights the Caps don't play, I
> >would like to tune in other games.  Does anyone have a list of
> >the radio stations which broadcast the games for the NHL teams?
> 
> 
> >			Thanks in advance
> 
> I can give you a couple.  In Detroit, WJR (760) will be broadcasting
> at least the first couple of games of the Wings-Toronto series, and 
> since they broadcast at 50000 Watts, you may be able to pick it up
> after dark where you are at.  The Pittsburgh Penguins games used to be
> broadcast on KDKA 1020, but I don't know whether they will be pre-empted
> by baseball (and moved to another station) or not.  You can try those
> if the local baseball teams aren't playing at the same time, anyway.
> 
> --Randy
> 

KDKA has first rights to Pirates games, and will split probably 50-50
in conflicts; for Penguins games which are preempted, check out 
102.5 WDVE FM (that's right, DVE).  It is also 50,000 watts.

Kevin L. Stamber
Purdue University
no funny .sig today


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53729
From: jimg@cybernet.cse.fau.edu (Jim Gorycki)
Subject: New Franchise name

The new name is Florida Panthers.  
The panther is an endangered species, mostly located in the Everglades.
A couple of years ago, there were license plates made with Panthers on
them (part of the revenue were to go to some protection fund).

The name of the new President of the Panthers should be announced today.

As of yesterday's paper, Huizenga's new hockey team will take the ice at
the Miami Arena this fall.  The team has a guaranteed two-year lease with
the arena, with four one-year options that could run through 1999.

"It's not our choice", James Blosser, a lawyer and Huizenga Aid said
about ruling out the arena as a long term option.  "The NHL told us we 
can't stay there.  It's not economically feasible."

One reason is because the Miami Heat basketball team controls skybox
and advertising revenue at the arena, reducing the hockey team's profit
potential.

The hockey team is attracting arena site proposals from Broward, Dade, 
and Palm Beach counties.

A leading site is vacant land near Joe Robbie Stadium, where residents
10 days ago agreed to drop their opposition to a hockey arena, ending
an eight-year battle of wills.

Compliments of the News/Sun-Sentinel.

Jim G.

"Fitz...Sanchez...Castranova..."

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53730
From: jimg@cybernet.cse.fau.edu (Jim Gorycki)
Subject: Panther's President

As I promised, I would give you the name of the Panther's president.
After Huizenga announced the team name, he announced that Bill
Torrey is named the first president of the Panthers.

A little Bio from _Sun-Sentinel_
Torrey, the architect of four consecutive Stanley Cup champions as 
persident and general manager of the New York Islanders.
Throughout his 27 years in the NHL, Bill Torrey's bow ties have become
as much of a signature as Andre Agassi's hair.

The Panthers will introduce a uniform, insignia, and ticket-price 
information in early next month.  In the meantime, Huizenga leaves the
day-to-day operation in the hands of Torrey and Bob Clarke, the VP and
GM.

The Florida Panthers was chosen as the name of South Florida's NHL team
to focus attention on an endangered species.  There are 30 to 50 Florida
Panthers in the Everglades National Park, the Big Cypress National 
Preserve and other parts of southwestern Florida.

"The Panther is the quickest-striking of all cats," Torrey said.  
"Hopefully that's the way we'll play on ice."

More BIO:
In Torrey, Huizenga has the first man hired by the expansion Islanders
in 1972 and the one most responsible for guiding the Islanders to four
consecutive Stanley Cup championships (their first after only eight
seasons) and 14 consecutive winning seasons.  As executive vice president
of the California Golden Seals, Torrey watched the Seals go to the play-
offs in 1968, only their second NHL season.

"I guess this completes my own personal hat trick", said Torrey, 58, a
native of Montreal but a resident of Bear Lakes Country Club in Palm
Beach.

Jim G.
other accounts:
gorycki@sol.cse.fau.edu
jimg@cybernet.cse.fau.edu

--------------------------------------------------------------------
"I repeat myself when under stress. I repeat myself when under stress.
I repeat myself when under stress. I repeat myself when under stress.
I repeat..."  Adrian Belew, "Indicipline"
---------------------------------------------------------------------


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53731
From: lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico)
Subject: Pens playoff radio coverage (was:Re: Radio stations)

In article <ragraca.735252641@vela.acs.oakland.edu> ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:
>greanias@texas.mitre.org (Steve Greanias) writes:
>
>I can give you a couple.  In Detroit, WJR (760) will be broadcasting
>at least the first couple of games of the Wings-Toronto series, and 
>since they broadcast at 50000 Watts, you may be able to pick it up
>after dark where you are at.  The Pittsburgh Penguins games used to be
>broadcast on KDKA 1020, but I don't know whether they will be pre-empted
>by baseball (and moved to another station) or not.  You can try those
>if the local baseball teams aren't playing at the same time, anyway.

According to this morning's Post-Gazette:

The Pens will be carried by KDKA-Radio(1020 am), unless the Pirates
are playing.  When the Pirates play, the games will be carried by 
WDVE(102.5 fm).  WDVE will carry 12 games, starting with tonight's
game.

In fact, after this season, KDKA will no longer be the flagship
station for the Pens.  The Penguins and KBL have struck a new 
deal regarding the TV and radio rights to the games.  It seems
more than likely that WDVE will be the flagship radio station next 
season.  KBL will carry 62 games on tv,  with 17 of the games to be 
simulcast on KDKA-TV.  The remaining 22 games, as well as some of the 
early round playoff games, will be available by "subscription tv" only.
To receive the games, you'll have to pay a one time hook up fee, and
then a monthly fee of $11-12 dollars.

Also, under the new deal, there will no longer be radio/tv 
simulcasts.  There will be a TV broadcast team, and a radio
broadcast team.  

No word on who the announcers will be.  Mike Lange and Paul Steigerwald
are both under contract with KDKA, but their contracts expire at the
end of this season.  KBL President Bill Craig said he'd like to hire
Lange and Steigerwald.

Lori
Contact for the Penguins
lli+@cs.cmu.edu



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53732
From: Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Wirtz is a weenie

So what's the deal with Bill Wirtz? Apparently, the Blackhawks - St.
Louis game was a standing room only sell out as usual, but the Hawks
reported the attendace as 16,199. Gee, I wonder if Wirtz is planning to
use this as justification for continuing to keep home games off of TV?
What a schmuck.

In other TV news, the Penguins announced yesterday that they will have 3
fewer broadcast TV games, and will have 22(!) games on some sort of
subscription / pay-per-view system. Yuck.

Ralph


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53733
From: jwh@sei.cmu.edu (John Huber)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains


In article <1993Apr19.213015@IASTATE.EDU>, njdevils@IASTATE.EDU (Cire Y. Trehguad) writes:
|> Anna Matyas (am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu) wrote:
|> : Michael Collingridge writes:
|> : >And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
|> : >resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
|> : >team captain trivia would be appreciated.
|> ;
|> : Wasn't Ron Francis captain of the Whalers when he was traded to
|> : Pittsburgh?
|> 
|>   And Rick Tochett was the captain of the Flyers when traded to the Pens
|> recently...
|> 

And of course, Mike Ramsey was (at one time) the captain in Buffalo prior to
being traded to Pittsburgh.  Currently, the Penguins have 3 former captains
and 1 real captain (Lemieux) playing for them.  They rotate the A's during the
season (and even the C while Mario was out).  Even Troy Loney has worn the C
for the Pens.

-Jay


John W. Huber, Jr. - aka Jay   | Penguins - 1991,1992 Stanley Cup Champions
Software Engineering Institute | Pirates - 1990,1991,1992 NL East Champions
SEI 3409        (412) 268-3550 | MasterCraft - The ONLY boat for skiing

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53734
From: seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr)
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN

In article <1993Apr20.032017.5783@wuecl.wustl.edu>, jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:
> 
>  It was nice to see ESPN show game 1 between the Wings and Leafs since
> the Cubs and Astros got rained out. Instead of showing another baseball
> game, they decided on the Stanley Cup Playoffs. A classy move by ESPN.

What, did you leave the room each of the 100 or so times they said that
there WERE NO OTHER NIGHT BASEBALL GAMES? Every break they took back at
the studio mentioned it, followed by 'so...we're gonna show you hockey
instead.' My wife and I are hoping for rain at every baseball game they
have a feed for tommorrow night...

Point is, be glad they showed hockey, but if baseball was available
anywhere else you can bet you would've watched baseball last night.

pete clark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53735
Subject: Travesty at the Joe Louis
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

(Detroit, April 19)

In a development that shocked most knowledgable observers, the Detroit Redwings
scored no less than six goals against the best goaltender in the world en
route to a 6-3 win over the best team in the NHL, the Toronto Maple Leafs. 

The Leafs could not be faulted, as they completely dominated the inferior
Detroit squad and clearly deserved to win. Only the biased officiating of
Andy Van Hellemond and the idiots that insisted upon throwing an octopus on
the ice at every stoppage in an obvious attempt to distract the superior 
visiting side prevented an all-out massacre of the Wings by the league's best 
team. 

       							    Alan

P.S. This is sweet, Roger. So sweet. I look forward to the next installment on
Wednesday night. I trust you do, too. 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53736
Subject: Re: Who picks first?
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <1993Apr17.181421.14349@epas.toronto.edu>, sclark@epas.utoronto.ca (Susan Clark) writes:
> 	According to THE FAN here in T.O., Ottawa has won the Daigle e
> sweepstakes.  They didn't mention why, but San Jose had more goals
> than the Sen-sens, so I have a hunch this is why Ottawa would pick
> first.....

If I'm not mistaken, San Jose had more wins than Ottawa. First tiebreaker in
the NHL is always most wins.

								Alan


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53737
From: ccohen@pitt.edu (Caleb N Cohen)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage

Anna Matyas (am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu) wrote:

: Antonio Pera writes:

: >	I loved the ABC coverage. The production was excellent. The appearance
: >was excellent. It had a sleek modern look. This was the first time I heard
: >Thorne & Clement & I thought they were great. My only request is to leave
: >Al Micheals out of this. He annoys me. 
:
: I was skeptical before the game but was pleasantly surprised at the
: coverage.  I was particularly impressed by the close range camera coverage
: of work in the corners and behind the play without losing a beat getting
: back to the puck.

   Boy - everyone has been ripping on ESPN's hockey coverage (or is it just
Pittsburgher's who are thrilled with Lange & Steigy?)  For all of you
who are unaware -> ESPN bought the air time from ABC and did all the 
production, advertising sales, commentating, etc -> and even 
reaped any $ made...

Enjoy,
Caleb

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53738
From: arsenaul@ERE.UMontreal.CA (Arsenault Michel)
Subject: Looking for boxscores


I am looking for all the 84 boxscores of any NHL team for 
some personal research.  Can someone help me ?

Michel Arsenault

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53739
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: div. and conf. names

In <1993Apr19.191126.27651@newshub.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:

>However, that aside, the real question is whether you like the idea of
>changing the names based on the reasons given for it (making it easier for
>the 'casual fan'), or whether you like the idea of unique divisional names
>based on individuals who do deserve the honour.  IMO, the latter is a nice
>and unique touch that differs from other sports.  In addition, I do not
>think that changing divisional names will have an effect on the number of
>people that are interested in hockey, so it's a pointless exercise anyway.

There are several problems with the way the game is being presented to the
fans.  I feel that geographical names would enhance regional loyalties
more than names honouring personages.  And of course, they would not appear
nearly as confusing to one approaching the sport for the first time.  
Another thing that bothers me is the points system.  Percentages, as used in
the other major sports are clearly more informative.  When I look at the
NHL standings the first thing I have to do is make a quick calculation to
account for games in hand (which is almost always the case).  Some will
object to percentages, claiming perhaps, that it is an "Americanization"
of the sport but I feel that using percentages is more informative and
whether it is "American" or not is irrelevant.
 
>If the current names are inappropriate, then that is a separate issue, not 
>central to the original article.  Something to consider additionally is
>whether or not players like Orr who 'contributed to the glory of the sport'
>would have been able to do so _without_ an organized professional league to
>play in.  In this case, honouring builders of the _league_ as opposed to
>builders of the _sport_ becomes a chicken-and-egg type question. (although
>it was the chicken.....)

Even if Orr couldn't have contributed without the likes of Norris, you would
have to agree that Norris couldn't have contributed without the likes of Orr.
And taking a poll of most fans would quickly tell you who the fans feel made
the more meaningful contribution.

>>Exactly true.  Naming divisions and trophies after Smythe and the bunch
>>is the same kind of nepotism that put Stein in the hall of fame.  I have
>>always thought that this was nonsense.

>Dunno if the Stein comparison is justifiable, since it doesn't look as though
>his 'unanimous acceptance' to the Hall will hold up.

It doesn't look as if the division names are going to hold up either does it?


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53740
From: Scott.Marks@launchpad.unc.edu (Scott Marks)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

>And of course, Mike Ramsey was (at one time) the captain in Buffalo prior to
>being traded to Pittsburgh.  Currently, the Penguins have 3 former captains
>and 1 real captain (Lemieux) playing for them.  They rotate the A's during the
>season (and even the C while Mario was out).  Even Troy Loney has worn the C
>for the Pens.

I had heard(perhaps incorrectly) that while Lemieux was out, noone wore a
C on their jersey.  The As took turns doing captain duties(whatever they
are).

Scott...
scott.marks@launchpad.unc.edu
scott.marks@launchpad.unc.edu
--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  laUNChpad.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53741
From: steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains



Anna Matyas (am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu) wrote:
> Wasn't Ron Francis captain of the Whalers when he was traded to
> Pittsburgh?

No.

In what still, IMHO, ranks as the all-time greatest PR blunder (not to
mention on-ice blunder) the Whalers ever committed, GM Eddie Johnston and
Coach Rick Ley 'decided' that Francis was incapable as a leader and stripped
him of the Captain's "C" in December of 1990. The whole organization (read:
EJ and Ley, and by default owner Richard Gordon because he was too much of
a dupe to know how much he was being blind-sided by EJ) dumped on Francis all
season, starting with refusing to sign him to a new contract, publicly 
humiliating him, stripping him of the "C", and then trading him that Spring
to the Penguins. Classy guy, that EJ.

The loss of Francis (and too a lesser extent, Ulf), was one of a series of
decimating player moves by EJ which stripped the personality and fan-awareness
from the team that has put them in the precarious position they are in today.

[Gratuitous good EJ note...he did preside over the organization when it
acquired Verbeek, Cassels, Sanderson, Poulin, Nylander, etc. He stripped the
roster but he DID lay a foundation.]

-SG (a real live Hartford Whalers season ticket holder)
-steveg@cadkey.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53742
From: steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio)
Subject: The Most Average Player in the NHL


And now, I interrupt your regularly scheduled news reading to bring you 
another message sponsored by the Department of Really Mundane Statistics:

I passed the final individual player stats posted here the other day through
a filter to average out games, goals, assists, points, and penalty minutes
for the mythical average NHL pro who played in the league this season. (Why?
Because it's Monday and I didn't feel like writing any REAL code...)

Anyway, after I wiped out the 60-odd goalies in the list, I came up with:

NHL average:		55 GP      11 G      19 A      30 Pts      69 PIM

Then I passed the list through a second time to come up with the players who
had the smallest percentage difference in each of the categories.

Marty McInnis (NYI)	56 GP (1%) 10 G (9%) 20 A (5%) 30 Pts (0%) 24 PIM (65%)
Igor Kravchuk (EDM)	55 GP (0%) 10 G (9%) 17 A (10%) 27 Pts (9%) 27 PIM (53%)

These two are close in games, goals, assists, and points, but are too far off
in PIM. This leaves, as the most average player in the NHL:

Bobby Carpenter (WAS)	65 GP (18%) 11 G (0%) 17 A (10%) 28 Pts (6%) 63 PIM (8%)

What an honor.

I also passed the list through with the goalies still included. Kravchuk and
Carpenter were still in the top three, but Rob DiMaio came flying up from 
behind to take the title:

NHL average:		53 GP      10 G      17 A      27 Pts      64 PIM
Igor Kravchuk (EDM)     55 GP (3%) 10 G (0%) 17 A (0%) 27 Pts (0%) 27 PIM (50%)
Bobby Carpenter (WAS)   65 GP (22%) 11 G (10%) 17 A (0%) 28 Pts (3%) 63 PIM (1%)
Rob DiMaio (TB)		54 GP (1%) 9 G (9%) 15 A (11%) 24 Pts (11%) 62 PIM (3%)


It's all really kind of underwhelming when you think about it.

-SG

	    And now, back to our regularly scheduled programming...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53743
From: steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio)
Subject: Re: NHL team in Milwaukee




Charlie Betz (cbetz@romulus.cray.com) writes:
> After reading some of the reports of possible NHL moves to Milwaukee or that
> Milwaukee should have an NHL team, I thought I'd pass along a story I heard
> recently.  This is second hand, so I don't know how true it is, but I have
> no reason to doubt it either.
> 
> Bradley Center in Milwaukee is home to the Milwaukee Admirals minor leauge
> hockey team.  The owner of the Admirals (sorry, I can't remember his name)
> either owns or at least shelled out the majority of the funds to build the
> Bradley Center.

Lloyd Pettit.

> 
> Supposedly he was approached by the NHL about an expansion franchise, but 
> turned it down because he thought the franchise fee of $50 million was too
> high.
> 
> Like I said, I don't know whether this story is true or just a rumor, but if
> it's true, don't look for an NHL team in Milwaukee anytime soon.  The Admirals
> aren't going to be forced out of the building and you won't see an NHL club
> and a minor league club in the same building, especially since the NBA's
> Milwaukee Bucks play there as well.

Yes, it is true that he refused to buy a franchise from the NHL for $50M; but
at the time the reason was that the established market for teams was much 
less than that. He felt that no one would pay $50M for an expansion team, and
that he would simply wait to buy an existing franchise for less than that. But
the market fooled him, and 5 teams have been created for $50M apiece in the
last three years, and even the existing teams can't be moved for less than 
$50M and I doubt that he could get one for that little.

Pettit gambled and lost. Now he'll have to pay more.

-SG

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53744
From: steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio)
Subject: Re: Possible Canadian WC Team?



> This is an all-point team for the Canadian NHLers who are not playoff bound...

CENTERS
[...]
> Geoff Sanderson, Hartford
[...]

Sanderson will be on Team Canada, but he'd be out of position as a center.
Although he was drafted as a center and played there as a rookie, Sanderson
scored 46 goals this season as a left wing.

-SG

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53745
From: steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio)
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 18



Gerald Olchowy (golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca) writes:
> Podein is an interesting case...because he was eligible to
> play in Cape Breton in the AHL playoffs like Kovalev, Zubov,
> and Andersson...obviously Sather and Pocklington are not
> the total scrooges everyone makes them out to be...certainly
> in this case they've massively outclassed Paramount and the
> New York Rangers.

What is the policy regarding players and the minor league playoffs versus WC?
I know that the Rangers are holding back Kovalev, Zubov, and Andersson for
Binghamton, but I also know that the Whalers wanted Michael Nylander to play
for Springfield, while Nylander wanted to play for Sweden. The Whalers allowed
the NHL to decide, and the NHL chose the WCs. How does this differ from the
Rangers and Oilers? Did the Whalers have to go through the league, or could
they have forced Nylander to play in Springfield?

-SG

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53746
From: steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio)
Subject: Re: Tie Breaker....(Isles and Devils)



Rex Wang (wangr@vccsouth22.its.rpi.edu) spews forth stupidly:
> 	Are people here stupid or what??? It is a tie breaker, of cause they
> have to have the same record. How can people be sooooo stuppid to put win as
> first in the list for tie breaker??? If it is a tie breaker, how can there be
> different record???? Man, I thought people in this net are good with hockey.
> I might not be great in Math, but tell me how can two teams ahve the same
> points with different record??? Man...retard!!!!!! Can't believe people
> actually put win as first in a tie breaker......

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE tell me that you don't actually ATTEND Rensselaer, and
that you just work for ITS. Or that this was tounge-in-cheek.

Does this mean that I should be cutting off my alumni contributions, or 
increasing them?

-SG

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53747
From: leunggm@odin.control.utoronto.ca (Gary Leung)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

In article <1993Apr20.151818.4319@samba.oit.unc.edu> Scott.Marks@launchpad.unc.edu (Scott Marks) writes:
>>And of course, Mike Ramsey was (at one time) the captain in Buffalo prior to
>>being traded to Pittsburgh.  Currently, the Penguins have 3 former captains
>>and 1 real captain (Lemieux) playing for them.  They rotate the A's during the
>>season (and even the C while Mario was out).  Even Troy Loney has worn the C
>>for the Pens.
>

I think that Mike Foligno was the captain of the Sabres when he
got traded to the Leafs. Also, wasn't Rick Vaive the captain of
the Leafs when he got traded to Chicago (with Steve Thomas for
Ed Olcyzk and someone). Speaking of the Leafs, I believe that
Darryl Sittler was their captain (he'd torn the "C" off his
jersey but I think he re-claimed the captaincy later on) when he
was traded to the Flyers.

Oh yeah, of course, Gretzky was the captain of the Oilers before
he was traded wasn't he? 

Gary

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53748
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Mon, April 19, 1993

Toronto                          1 1 1--3
Detroit                          1 4 1--6
First period
     1, Detroit, Yzerman 1 (Gallant, Ciccarelli) 4:48.
     2, Toronto, Cullen 1 (Clark, Gill) 10:44.
Second period
     3, Detroit, Sheppard 1 (Probert, Coffey) pp, 5:04.
     4, Detroit, Burr 1 (Racine) sh, 6:42.
     5, Detroit, Chiasson 1 (Coffey) pp,11:00.
     6, Detroit, Howe 1 (Yzerman, Drake) 14:46.
     7, Toronto, Gilmour 1 (Borschevsky, Ellett) pp, 19:59.
Third period
     8, Detroit, Racine 1 (Primeau, Drake) 5:10.
     9, Toronto, Lefebvre 1 (Cullen, Pearson) 7:45.

Detroit: 6    Power play: 6-2   Special goals:  pp: 2  sh: 1  Total: 3
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Burr               1    0    1
Chiasson           1    0    1
Ciccarelli         0    1    1
Coffey             0    2    2
Drake              0    2    2
Gallant            0    1    1
Howe               1    0    1
Primeau            0    1    1
Probert            0    1    1
Racine             1    1    2
Sheppard           1    0    1
Yzerman            1    1    2

Toronto: 3    Power play: 5-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Borschevsky        0    1    1
Clark              0    1    1
Cullen             1    1    2
Ellett             0    1    1
Gill               0    1    1
Gilmour            1    0    1
Lefebvre           1    0    1
Pearson            0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Winnipeg                         1 0 1--2
Vancouver                        2 0 2--4
First period
     1, Vancouver, Adams 1 (Linden, Bure) pp, 1:23.
     2, Vancouver, Craven 1 (Bure, Murzyn) 9:56.
     3, Winnipeg, Steen 1 (Shannon, Housley) pp, 17:53.
Second period
     No scoring.
Third period
     4, Winnipeg, King 1 (Barnes) 3:43.
     5, Vancouver, Linden 1(Courtnall, McLean) 12:16.
     6, Vancouver, Ronning 1 (Courtnall) 18:31.

Vancouver: 4    Power play: 6-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Adams              1    0    1
Bure               0    2    2
Courtnall          0    2    2
Craven             1    0    1
Linden             1    1    2
McLean             0    1    1
Murzyn             0    1    1
Ronning            1    0    1

Winnipeg: 2    Power play: 3-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Barnes             0    1    1
Housley            0    1    1
King               1    0    1
Shannon            0    1    1
Steen              1    0    1

-----------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53749
From: riel@unixg.ubc.ca (William Riel)
Subject: Re: Travesty at the Joe Louis

In article <1993Apr20.005512.3382@mtroyal.ab.ca> caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca writes:
>(Detroit, April 19)
>
>In a development that shocked most knowledgable observers, the Detroit Redwings
>scored no less than six goals against the best goaltender in the world en
>route to a 6-3 win over the best team in the NHL, the Toronto Maple Leafs. 

Not only that, but if I'm not mistaken Detroit scored 4 goals on their first
five shots on net...looks like Toronto's cream cheese run continues (or is
that swiss cheese? after watching Potvin I'm leaning towards the latter)

Bill   

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53750
From: chuck@mks.com (Chuck Lownie)
Subject: Re: Tie Breaker....(Isles and Devils)

In article <lrw509f@rpi.edu> wangr@rpi.edu writes:
>	Are people here stupid or what??? It is a tie breaker, of cause they
>have to have the same record. How can people be sooooo stuppid to put win as
>first in the list for tie breaker??? If it is a tie breaker, how can there be
>different record???? Man, I thought people in this net are good with hockey.
>I might not be great in Math, but tell me how can two teams ahve the same points
>with different record??? Man...retard!!!!!! Can't believe people actually put
>win as first in a tie breaker......
>
>


I didn't see any smilies in this message so.......

                W     T    L    PTs
   Team A      50    30    4    104
   Team B      52    32    0    104


There you go.  Two teams that tie in points without identical records.


-- 





Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53751
From: wdsst3@cislabs.pitt.edu (William D Sands)
Subject: request for video in Pittsburgh area


	There was apparently a 30 minute special here on the Penguins' 
season on ABC (WTAE - channel 4), immediately preceding the opening 
game against the Devils on Sunday.  I only turned it on in time to 
watch the credits.  If anyone taped it and is willing to let me borrow 
it to dub it, I would appreciate it.  I would be willing to come pick 
it up, and I'll return it the next day and buy you a beer.  Please 
respond via e-mail.  Thanks a lot.
	Oh yeah.  Was it any good?
						-Billy


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53752
From: galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin)
Subject: Re: Bay area media (Wings-Leafs coverage)

In article <DREIER.93Apr19195132@durban.berkeley.edu> dreier@durban.berkeley.edu (Roland Dreier) writes:
>The San Francisco Bay area media is reporting tonight that the Detroit
>Red Wings beat the Toronto Maple Leafs 6-3.  Can someone who is not
>part of the media conspiracy against the Leafs tell me how the game
>really went (I am expecting a 4-0 win for the Leafs, shutout for
>Potvin, hat trick for Andreychuk and a goal and 3 assists for
>Gilmour).  If the Leafs really lost, how many penalties did whichever
>biased ref was at the game have to call against the Leafs to let the
>Red Wings win?
>
>Thank you very much.
>--
>Roland Dreier                                        dreier@math.berkeley.edu


Sorry to disappoint you but the Red Wings earned the victory...easily.

I watched most of the game on ESPN (as soon as I realized that they
were televising the game which was at the beginning of the second).
The Maple Leafs were flat.  Very flat.  Meanwhile, the Red Wings were
skating very freely and dictating the pace of the game.  I didn't
detect any bad penalty calls (Van Hellemond did his usual good job).
Toronto looked like how I expected them to for their first playoff
game in a few years -- nervous.

For the Leafs sake, I hope they can rid themselves of the butterflies
for game 2.  If game 1 is indicative of the series, it's gonna go
quick.

-Tom Galvin       galvint@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53753
From: galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin)
Subject: Re: Schedule...

In article <121411@netnews.upenn.edu> kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller) writes:
>In article <1qup1lINNotb@master.cs.rose-hulman.edu> swartzjh@RoseVC.Rose-Hulman.Edu writes:
>>Does anyone have the games ESPN will be airing this week???  Hopefully the
>>Detroit/Toronto game tongiht.  I though ABC did a decent job by getting some
>
>F**king *NO* hockey games televised nationally tonight!  What the hell is
>this???  Why the hell is ESPN showing some stupid baseball game, when
>baseball is not even three weeks into the season and hockey is in the
>playoffs???  No, wait, I know the answer: $$$$$$  But still!  It really
>pisses me off to no end.  They better start putting some more f*cking
>games on, or they will never make any money off of the deal that brought
>hockey back to ESPN.  AARGH!!!!  (not that I'd watch anyway, but hockey
>needs all the publicity it can get)
>
>--
>    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
>						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
>	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!
>
>	   "A cow is not a vegetarian dish."  -- Keith Keller, 1993

You obviously don't understand how TV scheduling works.  ESPN had
prior contracts to baseball to show Monday night games and had
contracted all the other bs shows well in advance.  The NHL TV deal
was very late in the scheduling process (you normally have to do this
one-plus year out.  The NHL package was finished two weeks before the
season started).  ESPN has shown tremendous commitment to the NHL by
squeezing in extra telecasts when it could (like the last Minnesota
game) and putting Stanley Cup games as backup to their baseball
telecasts (which by favorable circumstances they could pull off last
night).

But the bottom line is that ESPN cannot break contracts at will.  They
must honor the previous deals they made.  $$$$ _does_ have something
to do with it, especially if you risk a $$$$$$$$ lawsuit for breach of
contract with baseball.

So relax.  I'm happy.  (I don't get SportsChannel anyway).

-Tom Galvin              galvint@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53754
From: aa711@Freenet.carleton.ca (Ken Darcovich)
Subject: west coast NHL playoff games


Us easterners who have newspapers with editors
unsympathetic to playoff pools, often don't get
summaries from west coast games since they
finish too late at night for the morning edition.

I (and I'm sure others too) would greatly appreciate
it if scoring summaries of west coast playoff games
could be posted to this group right away.
basically, all we need are goal scorers and assists,
don't bother with times, penalties, shots etc...

this would make a lot of pool-obsessed people very
happy.

I guess with the Senators out golfing now, the 
local papers have lost interest.  ;-)

thanks.

kd.

-- 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53755
From: bks2@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (bryan.k.strouse)
Subject: NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4-19-93



NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR 4/19/93.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                  CONFERENCE SEMI-FINALS        BEST OF SEVEN
      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE
 
 NJ                  BUF   (leads 1-0)   STL   (leads 1-0)   WIN               
 PIT   (leads 1-0)   BOS                 CHI                 VAN   (leads 1-0)

 NYI                 MON                 TOR                 LA    (leads 1-0) 
 WAS   (leads 1-0)   QUE   (leads 1-0)   DET   (leads 1-0)   CAL              

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Toronto Maple Leafs                       1   1   1   -   3
Detroit Red Wings    (leads series 1-0)   1   4   1   -   6

1st period: DET, Yzerman 1 - (Gallant, Ciccarelli) 4:48
	    TOR, Cullen 1 - (Clark, Gill) 10:44

2nd period: DET, Sheppard 1 - (Probert, Coffey) (pp) 5:04
	    DET, Burr 1 - (Racine) (sh) 6;42
	    DET, Chiasson 1 - (Coffey) (pp) 11:00
	    DET, Howe 1 - (Yzerman, Drake) 14;46
	    TOR, Gilmour 1 - (Borschevsky, Ellett) (pp) 19:59

3rd period: DET, Racine 1 - (Primeau, Drake) 5:10
	    TOR, Lefebvre 1 - (Cullen, Pearson) 7:45

Powerplay Opportunities-Maple Leafs 1 of 5
			Red Wings   2 of 6

Shots on Goal-	Maple Leafs   5   9   9  -  23
		Red Wings    13   8  12  -  33

Toronto Maple Leafs--Potvin (0-1) (33 shots - 27 saves)
Detroit Red Wings--Cheveldae (1-0) (23 shots - 20 saves)

ATT-19,875

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Winnipeg Jets                           1   0   1   -   2
Vancouver Canucks  (leads series 1-0)   2   0   2   -   4

1st period: VAN, Adams 1 - (Linden, Bure) (pp) 1:23
	    VAN, Craven 1 - (Bure, Murzyn) 9:56
	    WIN, Steen 1 - (Shannon, Housley) (pp) 17:53

2nd period: NONE

3rd period: WIN, King 1 - (Barnes) 3:43
	    VAN, Linden 1 - (Courtnall, McLean) 12:16
	    VAN, Ronning 1 - (Courtnall) 18:31

Powerplay Opportunities-Jets    1 of 3
			Canucks 1 of 6

Shots on Goal-	Jets      7   5  10  -  22
		Canucks   9  12  12  -  33

Winnipeg Jets--Essensa (0-1) (33 shots - 29 saves)
Vancouver Canucks--McLean (1-0) (22 shots - 20 saves)

ATT-15,918

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


\|||||/
-SPIKE-




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53756
From: willis@oracle.SCG.HAC.COM (Stan Willis)
Subject: Series 1, game 1; Kings 6 @ Flames 3

1992-93 Los Angeles Kings notes and game reports.
-------------------------------------------------
Kings 6 @ Calgary Flames 3 - 04/18/93

The third place Kings opened the 1993 Stanley Cup Playoffs in Calgary, against
the second place Flames and came out with an impressive 6-3 victory in front of
a non-sellout crowd of 18,605 at the Saddledome in Calgary.

Symthe Division playoff hockey this was.  Both teams seemed a bit tense in the
opening period though the Kings scored off the opening face-off.  The Kings got
into the flow of the game much earlier than the Flames as they played out-
standing team defense.  It took the Flames 9:45 of the first period to record
their first shot on goal.  The Kings, ranked 16th of the 16 playoff teams on
penalty killing, shut down the Flames.  The Flames went 0-8 on the power play 
and could record only 8 shot on goal in those 8 opportunities.  The Kings had
their problems on the power play, yet they did manager to score 2 goals in 10
tries.

The Kings forwards back-checked while the defense stood the Flames up at the
blue line, allowing the Kings to take took the home ice advantage away from the 
Flames.  Rob Blake missed the game due to the lower back contusion but is ex-
pected to be in the lineup on Wednesday. Wayne Gretzky suffered a charlie horse
in his right leg.  He took a few shifts in the second period before retiring to 
the dressing room for the rest of the game.  Interviewed on the radio this 
morning, he stated that he was fine and would be in the lineup on Wednesday.

1st period: 
1-0. The Kings got things started right off the opening face-off.  Gretzky won
the draw with the puck going to Sydor.  He crossed center ice and slapped the
puck into the Flames zone and behind the net.  The puck carried around to the
far side where Robitaille wacked at it and the rebound bounced to Sandstrom. He
put the puck behind the Flames net where Gretzky picked it up.  Gretzky set up
in 'his office', moved to the near side and passed into the near circle where
Sydor had moved in.  Sydor, who got the puck between the face-off dot and the 
hash mark, shot off the pass, beating Vernon low and between the legs.

Millen and Fleury went off at 4:57.  Skrudland went off at 12:25 but the Kings
failed to convert.  Carson went off at 14:53 and the Flames failed to convert.
Dahlquist went off at 18:34 and Dahl went off at 19:30, giving the Kings a 30
second 5on3 which they failed to convert.  The Kings recorded 2 goal posts in
the period.

2nd period: 
The Kings opened with a 5on3 carried over from the 1st period which they failed
to convert on.  With 6 seconds left in the 5on4, Vernon put a bouncing puck into
the stands and received a delay of game.

1-1. Calgary evened the score on the ensuing Kings power play.  Kurri, with the
puck in the neutral zone, tried to put the puck into the Flames zone but it hit 
the stick of Fleury and bounced to Suter at the Flames blue line.  Suter skated 
down the near wing and into the Kings zone.  He faked a shot at the circle and
skated around Kurri. As he cut thorugh the crease, he got Hrudey to go with him 
and he put the puck behind Hrudey, on his stick side for a short hander.

2-1. The Kings reclaimed the lead 25 seconds later on the same power play.
Shuchuk, in the far circle passed to Sydor at the top of the slot and headed
for the net.  Sydors shot hit Shuchuk in the back and dropped into the low slot 
where 2 Kings (Shuchuk and Granato) were being checked by 3 Flames.  Carson
came from the far corner, picked up the loose puck and snapped a wrist shot
between the legs of Vernon from 5 feet above the crease.

3-1. The Kings widened their lead just 24 seconds later.  Rychel was checked off
the puck at the Flames blue line.  Taylor picked up the puck and sent a pass
cross the slot to Huddy.  Huddy shot off the pass, from the near face-off dot,
beating a diving Vernon on the glove side.

4-1. 2:59 later, the Kings had a 3 goal lead.  McSorley took a shot form the
near point that hit a Flame and deflected towards the boards.  Marty got his
own rebound, skated to the bottom of the circle and sent a pass into the low
slot that hit Dahlquist on the leg and deflected past the stick of Vernon.

Skrudland went off at 10:53 but the Kings could not convert.  Sydor went off at
12:35 and Watters went off at 14:40, giving the Flames a 5 second 5-3 but they
failed to convert.  McSorley went off at 17:19 and the Flames had 3 consecutive
power plays but the Flames killed it themselves when Suter went off for high
sticking at 17:31.  Sandstrom went off at 18:03 to close out the period.  The
Kings hit 3 goal post in the period.

3rd period:
The Kings used the phrase "Initiate, not retaliate" and it was very evident here
in the 3rd period as the Kings continued to pound the body and the Flames 
continued to take bad penalties to take themselves out of the game.

5-1. The Kings extended their lead to 4 goals at the 1:06 mark.  The Kings shot
the puck into the near corner of the Flames zone.  Vernon went behind the net to
cut off the puck but he could not control it.  Donnelly, who was behind him,
wacked at the puck, sending it into the low slot.  As Vernon slid back in to the
crease, Granato got a shot that hit a Flame and bounced to the left of the net
where Millen fired the rebound behind Vernon.

Sydor went off at 1:24; Nieuwendyk went off at 3:22 as the teams skated 4 on 4.

5-2. Otto, skating down the far side, stepped around McSorley, cut to the net
and passed to Dahlquist in the low slot.  Dahlquist cut through the top of the 
crease and put the puck in under a diving Hrudey.

Carson and Rychel came in on a 2-1.  When Carson passed across to Rychel, Fleury
tripped Rychel with no call.  The puck got shoveled into the far corner where 
Fleury knocked Rychel down and checked him from behind into the boards, drawing 
a 5-minute major and a game misconduct at the 6:08 mark.  Unfortunately, the 
Kings squandered the 5 minute power play when Granato (at 6:44) and Watters (at 
8:19) took penalties.  

5-3. The Flames closed to within 2 at the 8:47 mark.  MacInnis, at the near 
point, passed to Yawney at the far point.  He took a few strides towards the
net, wound up and drove a shot off the near post and in over the glove of
Hrudey.  The play started on another faceoff that the Kings lost.  Timeout - LA.

6-3. MacInnis took a penalty at 9:56 and the Kings converted on the power play
to seal the victory.  Sandstrom, skating down the far wing in the Flames zone 
cut towards the back of the net.  Just as he crossed the goal line, he passed 
the puck into the low slot, on the far side, to Carson who shot off the pass, 
beating Vernon on the ice, stick side.

At the 16:17 mark, Skrudland went off for slashing and Stern went crazy as he
went after Shuchuk.  Stern wound up with a double minor for roughing, a single
minor for cross checking and a 10 minute misconduct, and he took the Flames
right out of the game.

On the plus side:  The Kings, for the most part, played very disciplined hockey
as they let Calgary retaliate.  The Kings played good team defense and excellent
penalty killing.

On the minus side:  The Kings lost almost every face-off.  This must improve or
the Flames will surely get that power play back on track.

Notes:
------
The Kings recalled Guy Leveque, Brandy Semchuk and Jim Thomson from Phoenix.

Wayne Gretzkys 1st period assist was his 307th career playoff point.

The Kings entered the game 24th in the league in shots per game against, giving
the opposing team an average of 34.4 shots per game.

Flames goaltender Mike Vernon entered the game with a 3-9-1 record in afternoon 
games.  The Flames entered the game with a 34% success rate on the power play
over their last 9 games.

The teams were 3-3-1 against each other in the regular season.

Playoffs:
Campbell Conference:
Smythe Division:
LA  6  @ CAL 3 		LA leads 1-0
WIN    @ VAN

Norris Division:
STL 4  @ CHI 3		STL leads 1-0
TOR    @ DET

Wales Conference:
Adams Division:
BUF 5  @ BOS 4 (OT)	BUF leads 1-0
MON 2  @ QUE 3 (OT)	QUE leads 1-0

Patrick Division:
NJ  3  @ PIT 6		PIT leads 1-0
NYI 1  @ WAS 3		WAS leads 1-0

Records:
--------
vs	Smythe	 Norris	 Patrck	Adams	Overall
================================================
Home:    0- 0-0  0-0-0   0-0-0  0-0-0    0- 0-0 
Road:    1- 0-0  0-0-0   0-0-0  0-0-0    1- 0-0
==============================================================
Total:   1- 0-0  0-0-0   0-0-0	0-0-0	 1- 0-0  

Box Score:
=========================
Calgary      0 1 2 - 3
Los Angeles  1 3 2 - 6
=========================

1st period: 
LA  Sydor 1 (Gretzky, Sandstrom), 0:16
    LA  Millen - high sticking, 4:57
    CAL Fleury - high sticking, 4:57
    CAL Skrudland - interference, 12:25
    LA  Carson - tripping 14:53
    CAL Dahlquist - holding stick, 18:34
    CAL Dahl - roughing 19:30

2nd period: 
    CAL Verson - delay of game (served by Ashton), 1:34
CAL Suter 1 (Fleury), 2:48 (sh)
LA  Carson 1 (Shuchuk, Sydor), 3:13 (pp)
LA  Huddy 1 (Taylor, Rychel), 3:37
LA  McSorley 1 (unassisted), 6:36
    CAL Skrudland - elbowing, 10:53
    LA  Sydor - tripping, 12:35
    LA  Watters- hooking, 14:40
    LA  McSorley - holding, 17:19
    CAL Suter - high sticking, 17:31
    LA  Sandstrom - hooking, 18:03

3rd period:
LA  Millen 1 (Granato, Donnelly), 1:06
    LA Sydor - hooking, 1:24
    CAL Nieuwendyk - tripping, 3:22
CAL Dahlquist 1 (Otto), 4:23
    CAL Fleury - major (boarding), game misconduct, 6:08
    LA  Granato - tripping, 6:44
    LA  Watters - interference, 8:19
CAL Yawney 1 (MacInnis, Reichel), 8:47
    CAL MacInnis - roughing, 9:56
LA  Carson 2 (Sandstrom, Robitaille), 10:32 (pp)
    LA  Hardy - holding, 11:38
    CAL Skrudland - slashing, 16:17
    CAL Stern - double roughing, cross-checking, 10 min. misconduct, 16:17

Overtime: none

Shots:
------
Los Angeles   8  9 14 - 31
Calgary       5  8 11 - 24

Power play conversions:
-----------------------
For:      2 of 10; for the year:  2 of  10,  20.00%
Against:  0 of  8; for the year:  8 of   8, 100.00%

Goalies:
--------
Los Angeles - Hrudey (1-0-0)
Calgary - Vernon (0-1-0)

Attendance: 18,605

Scratches:
----------
Rob Blake - back contusion
Guy Leveque - numbers
Lonnie Loach - numbers
Marc Potvin - numbers
Brandy Semchuk - numbers
Robb Stauber - numbers
Brent Thompson - numbers
Jim Thomson - numbers

Lines - Forwards:
----------------
*Robitaille - Gretzky - Sandstrom 
Donnelly - Millen - Kurri
Rychel - Conacher - Taylor
Granato - Carson - Shuchuk

Lines - Defense:
----------------
*Huddy - Sydor
Watters - Zhitnik
Hardy - McSorley

* denotes starting lineup

Next game:
----------
Wednesday, April 21 @ Calgary Flames; 6:30pm Pacific Time on Prime Ticket
===============================================================================
Stan Willis (willis@empire.dnet.hac.com)
net contact: L.A. Kings

 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
      talk with the L.A. Kings Mailing List ...... kings@cs.stanford.edu
      to subscribe or unsubscribe: ....... kings-request@cs.stanford.edu
 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
================================================================================

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53757
From: smorris@venus.lerc.nasa.gov (Ron Morris )
Subject: Murray as GM  (was: Wings will win

In article <1993Apr19.204348.8254@sol.UVic.CA>, gballent@hudson.UVic.CA writes...
> 
>In article 735249453@vela.acs.oakland.edu, ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:
> 
>>are predicting).  Although I think Bryan Murray is probably the best GM
>>I have ever seen in hockey
> 
>How do you figure that??  When Bryan Murray took over the Wings they were
>a pretty good team that was contending for the Stanley Cup but looked
>unlikely to win it.  Now they are a pretty good team that is contending for
>the Stanley Cup but looks unlikely to win it.  A truly great GM would
>have been able to make the moves to push the team to the upper echelon
>of the NHL and maybe win the Stanley Cup.  A good GM (like Murray) can

I think Murray has done a great job.  He's picked up Ciccarelli,
Sheppard, Ysebaert, Howe, Coffey, and Riendeau (plus some depth players) 
without giving up anything the Wings needed or any of his top prospects.
All of this in three years.  Has anyone done better?

The year before he took over, the Wings didn't even make the playoffs.
There was about a year and a half during Demers' stint that the Wings
did OK, but that was due to Demers' motavational skills and clutch
and grab style.  They didn't have much talent.

Gerald, Murray wasn't responsible for Primeau (although I'm not
ready to admit that's a horrible pick).  They hired him after the
draft (which has never made sense to me).  His first pick was
Lapointe.

Ron 

**********
"And one of my major goals is to leave the next president a new set
of things to worry about.  I'm getting bored reading the same problems
in the paper, decade after decade.  I want people to have to deal
with new problems."
                    ... President Bill Clinton   2-4-93

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53758
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Wings will win

In article <ragraca.735249453@vela.acs.oakland.edu> ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:
>
>I also think that they will have a hard time with Pittsburgh if they
>face them in the finals (which is what all the Detroit sportswriters 
>are predicting).  Although I think Bryan Murray is probably the best GM
>I have ever seen in hockey, I'm not as impressed with his abilities as
>a bench coach or in general as a motivator.  With the amount of talent he
>has on this team, he should have blown away everyone in the Norris.  There
>is not another team in the Norris, maybe even in the Campbell conference,
>that can hold a candle to Detroit on paper in terms of pure talent.  But,
>some guys have not been pulling their weight at times this year.  Scotty
>Bowman, on the other hand, who has won (I think, correct me if I'm wrong)
>nine (9) stanley cups, is an outstanding coach, and I think he could
>outcoach Murray if they faced each other.  
>

Bryan Murray has done very little as GM...Yzerman, Fedorov, Cheveldae,
Chaisson, the whole Russian strategy was a product of the previous
GM...Murray has made a couple of decent trades...that's about it...
that would hardly rank him as the best GM.

Wasn't Primeau, Murray's first decision as GM...

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53759
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 18

In article <1993Apr19.211406.22528@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com> spiegel@sgi413.msd.lmsc.lockheed.com (Mark Spiegel) writes:
>	According to the SJ Murky News the Team USA roster is (names and
>	teams played for in 1992-93 listed):
>
>		Goalies
>		-------
........
>		Forwards
>		--------
>	Tony Amonte	New York Rangers
>	Ted Drury	Harvard Univ
>	Rob Gaudreau	San Jose' Sharks
>	Craig Johnson	Univ of Minnesota
>	Jeff Lazaro	Ottawa Senators
>	Mike Modano	Minnesota North Stars
>	Ed Olczyk	New York Rangers
>	Derek Plante	Univ of Minnesota-Duluth
>	Shion Podein	Edmonton Oilers
>	David Sacco	Boston University
>	Darren Turcotte New York Rangers
>	Doug Weight	Edmonton Oilers
>

It looks like the Edmonton Oilers just decided to take a European
vacation this spring...

Ranford, Tugnutt, Benning, Manson, Smith, Buchberger, and Corson
are playing for Canada.

Podein and Weight are playing for the US.

Is Kravchuk playing for the Russians...I know he had nagging
injuries late in the season.

Podein is an interesting case...because he was eligible to
play in Cape Breton in the AHL playoffs like Kovalev, Zubov,
and Andersson...obviously Sather and Pocklington are not
the total scrooges everyone makes them out to be...certainly
in this case they've massively outclassed Paramount and the
New York Rangers.

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53760
From: John Michael Santore <jsbh+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

>Michael Collingridge writes:
> 
>>And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
>>resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
>>team captain trivia would be appreciated.
> 
>Wasn't Ron Francis captain of the Whalers when he was traded to
>Pittsburgh?
>
>Mom.

Rick Tocchet was captain of the Flyers for several years before he was
traded to the Pens...

                                    -John Santore


=============================================================================
 ____________________                                
/                    \                   "We break the surface tension 
\_________     ____   \                   with our wild kinetic dreams"
/             /    \   \                        -Rush, Grand Designs
\_______     /  (*) )   )
/           / /\___/   /                 Go Philadelphia Flyers!
\_____     / /        /
/         /  \_______/                   John Santore (jsbh@andrew.cmu.edu)
\________/   
          
Rush-Yes-King Crimson-Emerson, Lake and Palmer-Marillion-Genesis (w/ Gabriel)
=============================================================================


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53761
From: snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols)
Subject: Re: SHARKS:  Kingston Fired!!!

In article <1993Apr20.085337.27224@leland.Stanford.EDU> terry@garfield.Stanford.EDU (Terry Wong) writes:
>I think that Jack Ferreira's firing eventually led to Kingston's
>firing.  You mention consistency of vision.  I think the
>Sharks lost that with the loss of Ferreira.  There has never
>been a 3 headed G.M. that has ever worked.  You need one
>person making the personnel decisions at the top, not
>management by committee.  The conventional wisdom
>from around the league is that Ferreira would have
>made the moves that would have fielded a better product
>on the ice.

How exactly would Ferreira accomplished this?  The three-headed GM-ship has
taken a lot of heat, but nobody's explained how things would have been any
different had Ferreira still been there.  Would Ferreira have made more
trades?  Who would have he had traded?  Would he have made fewer trades?
Who should not have been traded?

Sherri Nichols
snichols@adobe.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53762
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: Wings will win


In article 735307970@vela.acs.oakland.edu, ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:

>gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:
>
>>In article 735249453@vela.acs.oakland.edu, ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:
>
>>>I also think that they will have a hard time with Pittsburgh if they
>>>face them in the finals (which is what all the Detroit sportswriters 
>>>are predicting).  Although I think Bryan Murray is probably the best GM
>>>I have ever seen in hockey
>
>>How do you figure that??  When Bryan Murray took over the Wings they were
>>a pretty good team that was contending for the Stanley Cup but looked
>>unlikely to win it.  Now they are a pretty good team that is contending for
>>the Stanley Cup but looks unlikely to win it.  A truly great GM would
>>have been able to make the moves to push the team to the upper echelon
>>of the NHL and maybe win the Stanley Cup.  A good GM (like Murray) can
>>maintain the team's success but can't push them to the next level.
>
>When Jacques Demers brought the Wings to the conference finals twice a
>few years back, he had everyone on the team giving 100 percent, but he 
>had very little talent.  He had Yzerman, Bob Probert (who had drinking
>problems at the time), and a couple of decent goaltenders in Hanlon and
>Stefan who got hot.  That's about it.  Can you name one player on those
>earlier teams who even deserved to be in the all-star game, much less 
>actually got there, other than Yzerman and Probert?  Like, Petr Klima?
>Give me a break!  When they faced Edmonton in both of those conference
>finals, as hard as they played, it was clear they faced a team that simply
>had superior talent to the Wings.  That's why they could not get to the
>finals.  Also, at that time the Norris division was still the weakest 
>division in hockey, and getting past Chicago, and Toronto was not as
>impressive as it is today.
>
>Murray has brought scoring talent to the Wings that they did not have a
>few years ago when Devellano was GM and Demers was coach.  To name a few,
>Ysebaert, Kozlov, and Paul Coffey (who has made a definite positive impact on
>the power play especially).  

>Murray has built one of the most talented teams in hockey at the present, with
>the possible exception of the Pittsburgh Penguins.  The Wings have at least
>five 30 goal scorers that I can think of, and a couple of defenseman with over
>100 games worth of playoff experience.  Murray's one failing is that unlike
>the other GM's you mentioned (who are definitely also good, don't get me
>wrong), he has not found for himself a strong coach to motivate the team to
>go out and give 100 percent for the full 60 minutes every night like they 
>did the last time they made a cup run.  When a team wins or loses, it's a
>reflection of the GM *and* the coach, which was the point of my original 
>post.  If the team outmatches their opponent in terms of talent but loses
>anyway (which has been the case this year when the Wings have struggled),
>that indicates that the GM has done his job in building up the team but the
>coach has failed to motivate them.  If, as in the case of the last run the
>Wings made in the playoffs before Murray came, they gave opponents a hard
>time who should have beaten them easily, that indicates good coaching making
>up for a lack of talent.

All of this is fine.  I never said that Murray was a bad GM.  I merely said
that he isn't the best GM in hockey- or even a contender for that honor.
If Murray is as great as you claim- the Wings would have won the Stanley Cup
by now- probably more than once.  If he was as great a GM as you claim
and he was as poor a coach as you claim- he would have been intelligent
enough to hire the coach to push the team to the next level of success.
But Murray is an average (unspectacular) NHL coach and a pretty good GM
so none of this is true anyway.

Gregmeister


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53763
From: Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Ron Francis


Matthew Rush writes:

>Is there an award for "best back-up behind a hockey great"?
>Underneath all the hype about Lemieux, Stevens, Jagr, Ulf,
>etc., Ron Francis has quietly put together a 100 point season
>(24 goals and 76 assists in 84 games).  That was probably the
>best acquisition the Penguins have made since getting Lemieux
>(apologies to Rick Tocchet, who has had a hell of a year
>himself).  The Pens got just the right person at just the right
>time when they got Francis before the playoffs two years ago to
>back-up Mario.  Who was the second-line center before they got
>Francis?  I remember Randy Gilhen (who really plays tough, an
>ace in the face-off circle), but nobody with all the skills
>Francis has: scoring, passing, winning face-offs, and putting
>100% into every game, every night.  Just wanted to glow a
little.

I know what you mean!  I glow everytime Ronnie's out on the ice.
In fact, one of the neatest things about seeing the Pens in person
is that I can key in on him instead of watching what I'd probably
be seeing on tv.  He does so many subtle things behind the play.

He said in an interview recently that when he was a kid his dad
stressed the importance of playing two-way hockey; that you have to
learn how to play defense as well as offense and he obviously took
that advice to heart.  He was a breath of fresh air when he arrived
in Pittsburgh to the team whose forwards, for the most part, couldn't
and wouldn't play a lick of defense.

It's really difficult to assess what the key trades were that brought
all of this success to the Pens.  You mention Rick Tocchet and he has
certainly helped, and even ol' Kjell has been steady.  But looking at
this team you could almost take any one of them out of the line-up
permanently and replace them with an extremely mediocre player and it
wouldn't matter.

If I had to pick the top three acquisitions in recent years they would
be 1) Tom Barrasso; 2) Ron Francis; 3) Larry Murphy.  (I'd love to put
Francis first but I do think the only thing that could really damage
the Pens right now would be to lose Barrasso.)

Mom.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53764
From: "James J. Murawski" <jjm+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - Coach's Corner summary - April 19, 1993


On 20-Apr-93 in Don Cherry - Coach's Corner..
user Allan Sullivan@cs.UAlber writes:
>Next, a clip was shown from an earlier episode, in which Don was
>proclaiming Doug Gilmour to be the best player, not only in
>the NHL, but in the world. What about players like Lemieux?
>Don said that Gilmour was the best PLAYER, not "Designated point getter".
>Its not like baseball, where you have a "designatted hitter" who
>can score runs but can't play defense. Gilmour is a good two way player.

This clip was shown on local news in Pittsburgh last night (KDKA), complete
with animated sarcasm by the sportscaster.  It's the second time Cherry
has been shown on local Pittsburgh news in the last couple of weeks.  Both
times he was blasting Lemieux.


====================================================================
    Jim Murawski
    Sr. Software Engineer               (412) 268-2650  [office]
    Administrative Computing and        (412) 268-6868  [fax]
         Information Services           jjm+@andrew.cmu.edu
    Carnegie Mellon University          Office: UCC 155
    4910 Forbes Avenue
    Pittsburgh, PA 15213-3890

    "Le Mieux!  Le Magnifique!  Soixante Six!  Claude...NON!"

There are 1371 days until Clinton (Clinocchio) leaves office (1370 too many).


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53765
From: snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - Coach's Corner summary - April 19, 1993

In article <allan.735284991@swanlake> allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan) writes:
>Next, a clip was shown from an earlier episode, in which Don was
>proclaiming Doug Gilmour to be the best player, not only in
>the NHL, but in the world. What about players like Lemieux?
>Don said that Gilmour was the best PLAYER, not "Designated point getter".
>Its not like baseball, where you have a "designatted hitter" who
>can score runs but can't play defense. Gilmour is a good two way player.

What can you expect from a buffoon who said that the Pens should have
drafted Kirk Muller instead of Mario Lemieux?  

Perhaps once upon a time Don Cherry had some insight into the game of
hockey, but he's really degenerated into a parody of himself.

Sherri Nichols
snichols@adobe.com



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53766
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Nords 3 - Habs 2 in O.T. We was robbed!!

In article <18APR93.25909598.0086@VM1.MCGILL.CA> JBE5 <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA> writes:
>Aargh!
>
>Paul Stewart is the worst and most biased ref. presently in the NHL.
>He called a total of 4 penalties on the Habs and one on the Nordiques.
>The Nords' penalty came in O.T.  Stewart, being an ex-Nordique himself,
>was looking to call penalties on the Habs while letting the Nords
>get away with murder...WE WAS ROBBED!!!!

No.  Patrick Roy is the reason the game was lost, and Ron Hextall is the
reason Quebec won.  Everybody said it would come down to goaltending, that
goaltending was the key, etc etc.  Well, the key doesn't quite fit if you're
Montreal.  The Dionne penalty was kind of a cheesy call, but let's face it;
he literally left his feet to throw an elbow.  Blaming Stewart is just an
excuse to avoid facing the fact that Roy allowed what was one of the worst
goals he could possibly allow.  He even saw the whole shot, dammit.  Besides,
Stewart evened things up a bit by calling a Quebec penalty in OT.

Montreal played a solid game (although they still don't know how to clear
traffic in front of the net; the loss of Schneider will hurt even more). 
Normally I would say that any team that blows a 2-goal lead with less than 
five, let alone two, minutes to go in regulation time IN A PLAYOFF GAME 
ESPECIALLY needs to be smacked upside their collective heads.  But I don't
think this was a team loss (although Keane should have been able to clear 
the zone just prior to the first Quebec goal).  Roy is paid big money to 
play.  He looked like a player in an industrial league on Sakic's shot.

Demers should start Racicot in the next game.  If not that, he should let
the damn team read the papers for the next day or two....and maybe this
article, if possible.

>Patrick Roy collapsed after letting in the tieing goal. He was shaky and
>on his knees for the rest of the night.  The winning goal shouldn't have
>gone in.

I didn't think the wrap-around was as bad as the second goal.  I also didn't
think Scott Young should have gotten around the defender (can't remember who)
in the first place.  But you are correct, it shouldn't have gone in
regardless.

>Oh well, at least the Bruins lost in O.T. also Ha, Ha!!--)

Yep.  Moog looked bad on Mogilny's goal with five seconds left in the second,
IMO.  How about Neely though?   Holy shit, what a player.

Speaking of great players, man-oh-man can Quebec skate.  I haven't seen a
team so potent on the rush in a long time.  Watching them break out of their
zone, especially Sundin, is a treat to watch.  They remind me of the Red 
Army.  

But I still hate the team.

On the rest of the games:  Didn't St. Louis' winning goal come on a
powerplay?  Penalties will cost Chicago dearly, especially against Detroit. 
Same goes for Calgary; very, very undisciplined.  When Marty McSorely is
waving guys to the bench to *avoid* fights, you know something's up.  New
Jersey was overmatched, Terreri's heroics notwithstanding.  Mario is
unbelievable, and Jagr for some reason shows up in the playoffs.  But I 
hate that team anyway.



dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (pissed-off Habs fan)




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53767
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Atlanta Hockey Hell!!

In article <0foVj7i00WB4MIUmht@andrew.cmu.edu> Mamatha Devineni Ratnam <mr47+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>
>Well, it's not that bad. But I am still pretty pissed of at the
>local ABC coverage. They cut off the first half hour of coverage by playing

[stuff deleted]

Ok, here's the solution to your problem.  Move to Canada.  Yesterday I was able
to watch FOUR games...the NJ-PITT at 1:00 on ABC, LA-CAL at 3:00 (CBC), 
BUFF-BOS at 7:00 (TSN and FOX), and MON-QUE at 7:30 (CBC).  I think that if
each series goes its max I could be watching hockey playoffs for 40-some odd
consecutive nights (I haven't counted so that's a pure guess).

I have two tv's in my house, and I set them up side-by-side to watch MON-QUE
and keep an eye on BOS-BUFF at the same time.  I did the same for the two
afternoon games.

Btw, those ABC commentaters were great!  I was quite impressed; they seemed
to know that their audience wasn't likely to be well-schooled in hockey lore
and they did an excellent job.  They were quite impartial also, IMO.



dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (not suffering from a shortage of hockey here)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53768
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: div. and conf. names

In article <1993Apr19.003221.11964@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
[Evan Pritchard writes:]

>>	I think that you are incorrect, Roger.  Patrick,
>>Smythe and Adams all played or coached in the league before becoming
>>front office types.  Hence, they did help build the league, although
>>they were not great players themselves.  
>
>Punch Imlach's contributions as a coach and GM were far greater than
>those of the above combined.  Should we name a division or trophy after
>him?  [owner vs. player contributions deleted...]
>Are we going to honour those who contributed to the league's evolution
>or are we going to honour those who contributed to the glory of the 
>sport itself? 

[stuff deleted...]

>The money issue is irrelevant to the point that we would agree on, and
>that is: "it is the players that are what make the game great and not the
>people who put them on the ice"
  
As I recall, the author of the _original_ article that started the thread
claimed that he disliked the changing of the names for a variety of reasons. 
Roger, on one front you flamed him rather severely on the grounds that his
was a "jingoistic rant", but you also supported the name-changing on the
grounds that the current names are inappropriate because of the individuals
they represent. FWIW, I do not think the flaming was warranted, nor do I 
think you enhanced what credibility you have with it at all.  Just an 
observation...

However, that aside, the real question is whether you like the idea of
changing the names based on the reasons given for it (making it easier for
the 'casual fan'), or whether you like the idea of unique divisional names
based on individuals who do deserve the honour.  IMO, the latter is a nice
and unique touch that differs from other sports.  In addition, I do not
think that changing divisional names will have an effect on the number of
people that are interested in hockey, so it's a pointless exercise anyway.

If the current names are inappropriate, then that is a separate issue, not 
central to the original article.  Something to consider additionally is
whether or not players like Orr who 'contributed to the glory of the sport'
would have been able to do so _without_ an organized professional league to
play in.  In this case, honouring builders of the _league_ as opposed to
builders of the _sport_ becomes a chicken-and-egg type question. (although
it was the chicken.....)

>Exactly true.  Naming divisions and trophies after Smythe and the bunch
>is the same kind of nepotism that put Stein in the hall of fame.  I have
>always thought that this was nonsense.

Dunno if the Stein comparison is justifiable, since it doesn't look as though
his 'unanimous acceptance' to the Hall will hold up.


--
dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53769
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: hawks vs leafs lastnight

In article <1993Apr18.153820.10118@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:

>>on all replays, joe murphy's goal shouldn't have counted ! 
>>the game would have ended in 2-2 tie !

>I thought the red light went on...thus, in the review, the presumption
>would be to find conclusive evidence that the puck did not go in the
>net...from the replays I say, even from the rear, the evidence wasn't
>conclusive that the puck was in or out...in my opinion...

I was under the impression that the objective is to find conclusive
evidence that the puck _did_ cross the line.  And, the replays I saw showed 
fairly conclusively that the puck did _not_ cross the goal line at any
time anyway.  Somebody screwed up.  


dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53770
From: e2s@icf.hrb.com (Eric M. Sebastian)
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN

In article <1993Apr20.032017.5783@wuecl.wustl.edu>, jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:
> 
>  It was nice to see ESPN show game 1 between the Wings and Leafs since
> the Cubs and Astros got rained out. Instead of showing another baseball
> game, they decided on the Stanley Cup Playoffs. A classy move by ESPN.
> 
   It was good to see the Wings play, but lets not give ESPN too much credit.
There weren't any other late baseball games on so they didn't have another
option.

Eric Sebastian
Go Pens...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53771
From: smorris@venus.lerc.nasa.gov (Ron Morris )
Subject: Re: Wings take game one

In  <1qvos8$r78@cl.msu.>, vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu (David Vergolini) writes...
>  The Detroit Red Wings put a lot of doubter on ice tonight with a 6 - 3
>washing of the Toronto Maple Leafs.  All you Toronto fans have now seen the
>power of the mighty Red Wing offense.  Toronto's defense in no match for the
>Wing offense.  As for the defense, Probert, Kennedey and Primeau came out
>hitting hard.  Toronto players were being thrown left and right.  Not even
>Wendell Clark was tough enough for the Wings tough guys.  The Wings only gave
>up three goals, a low total for what they say is a mediocre defense.
>  All you Leaf fans better speak up now.  You team will probable have its
>season ended soon.  Wings fans, keep up the support.

There's quite a few Wings fans lurking about here, they just tend
to be low key and thoughtful rather than woofers.  I suppose every
family must have a Roger Clinton, though.  But remember (to paraphrase
one of my favorite Star Trek lines), "if we adopt the ways of the Leaf
fans, we are as bad as the Leaf fans".

Ron

**********
"And one of my major goals is to leave the next president a new set
of things to worry about.  I'm getting bored reading the same problems
in the paper, decade after decade.  I want people to have to deal
with new problems."
                    ... President Bill Clinton   2-4-93

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53772
From: ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca)
Subject: Re: Wings will win

golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:

>Bryan Murray has done very little as GM...Yzerman, Fedorov, Cheveldae,
>Chaisson, the whole Russian strategy was a product of the previous
>GM...Murray has made a couple of decent trades...that's about it...
>that would hardly rank him as the best GM.

>Wasn't Primeau, Murray's first decision as GM...

>Gerald

There are many teams in the NHL who have taken a liking to Russian players.
The "whole Russian strategy" is not specific to Detroit or to Devellano,
who was GM before Murray.  What the previous GM also did was to trade 
away several players who have gone on to do well with other teams, most
notably (in my memory) Murray Craven, who had a few very good years with
Philly after leaving here.  Also, it's not the volume of trades that will 
necessarily improve a team, but the quality of them.  Trading Adam Oates
for Bernie Federko was just plain stupid, even if Federko used to be a 
great player at one time.  Most of Murray's trades have worked significantly
to the Wings' advantage, with those that didn't being soured mainly by 
injury to the players involved (such as Troy Crowder, who suffered back
problems from which he never really recovered).

Put Scotty Bowman, Pat Burns, or any of the other better coaches in the 
league behind the bench of this Detroit team, and they could beat anybody.

--Randy
 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53773
From: ferguson@cs.rochester.edu (George Ferguson)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage


In article <cfoy0MW00Uh_41JndV@andrew.cmu.edu> Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>Thorne is good and I've always been a fan of Clement (but I miss
>Mike Emrick!).  My boyfriend, who is not a hockey fan, even looked up
>at one point and said, "These guys are pretty good announcers."  (This
>is the same guy who said that Rick Tocchet looks like Charles Bronson...:)

Did your boyfriend comment on the fact that Clement looks like a
walking ad for Brillo pad hair replacement therapy? The guy's just a
stuffed shirt who thinks he's the greatest hockey analyst since Howie
Meeker (for gosh sakes). I'll take Schoenie any day.

George

-- 
George Ferguson                 ARPA: ferguson@cs.rochester.edu
Dept. of Computer Science       UUCP: rutgers!rochester!ferguson
University of Rochester         VOX:  (716) 275-2527
Rochester  NY  14627-0226       FAX:  (716) 461-2018

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53774
From: ferguson@cs.rochester.edu (George Ferguson)
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN


In article <1993Apr20.032017.5783@wuecl.wustl.edu> jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:
> It was nice to see ESPN show game 1 between the Wings and Leafs since
>the Cubs and Astros got rained out. Instead of showing another baseball
>game, they decided on the Stanley Cup Playoffs. A classy move by ESPN.

They tried their best not to show it, believe me. I'm surprised they
couldn't find a sprint car race (mini cars through pigpens, indeed!)
on short notice.

George
-- 
George Ferguson                 ARPA: ferguson@cs.rochester.edu
Dept. of Computer Science       UUCP: rutgers!rochester!ferguson
University of Rochester         VOX:  (716) 275-2527
Rochester  NY  14627-0226       FAX:  (716) 461-2018

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53775
From: ferguson@cs.rochester.edu (George Ferguson)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage


In article <9454@blue.cis.pitt.edu> ccohen@pitt.edu (Caleb N Cohen) writes:
>   Boy - everyone has been ripping on ESPN's hockey coverage (or is it just
>Pittsburgher's who are thrilled with Lange & Steigy?)  For all of you
>who are unaware -> ESPN bought the air time from ABC and did all the 
>production, advertising sales, commentating, etc -> and even 
>reaped any $ made...

In the interests of saving badnwidth during this "heated" time of the
year (viz. the early flurry of "retard" comments coming from a certain
state whose name starts with P and ends with A), why don't you tell us
something we don't already know?

George
-- 
George Ferguson                 ARPA: ferguson@cs.rochester.edu
Dept. of Computer Science       UUCP: rutgers!rochester!ferguson
University of Rochester         VOX:  (716) 275-2527
Rochester  NY  14627-0226       FAX:  (716) 461-2018

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53776
From: r_turgeo@oz.plymouth.edu (Randy S. Turgeon)
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN

In article <1993Apr20.032017.5783@wuecl.wustl.edu> jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:
>
> It was nice to see ESPN show game 1 between the Wings and Leafs since
>the Cubs and Astros got rained out. Instead of showing another baseball
>game, they decided on the Stanley Cup Playoffs. A classy move by ESPN.
>


The only reason ESPN showed that hockey came was because there was no
other baseball game scheduled for the evening.

Randy
r_turgeo@oz.plymouth.edu



>
>  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
>  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
>  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
>  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
>  %     \    ________/                                                   *
>  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
>  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
>  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
>  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
>  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53777
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage

ccohen@pitt.edu (Caleb N Cohen) writes:
>
>   Boy - everyone has been ripping on ESPN's hockey coverage (or is it
>just Pittsburgher's who are thrilled with Lange & Steigy?)  For all of 
>you who are unaware -> ESPN bought the air time from ABC and did all 
>the production, advertising sales, commentating, etc -> and even 
>reaped any $ made...

No, Caleb, it's not the quality of ESPN that I have a problem with;
it is superb, whereas it did not evolve beyond the point where ESPN
left off when hockey went to SC (this is excepting SC's use of feeds
from CBC (-;).  It's the amount of hockey they're showing, or lack
of it, that we're complaining about.  They had rights to two OT's
that could've been shown on Sunday night after baseball ... and
they had pickup trucks racing through oversized pigpens followed
by Super-8 home movies of old car races (yes, I was checking in
desperation for Canucks-Jets) last night after SportsCenter.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53778
From: dvb@ick (David Van Beveren)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

colling@ann-arbor.applicon.slb.com (Michael Collingridge) writes:
: 
: And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
: resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
: team captain trivia would be appreciated.
: 

Luc Robitaille was captain of the Kings the first third of the season,
until The Great One came back from his disc injury. It was kind of
awkward, but Melrose appointed (anointed?) TGO as captain immediately upon
his return, after which he did not score a goal for something like 10
games.

I think Luc should have remained Captain all season.

dvb

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53779
From: joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage

In article <cfoy0MW00Uh_41JndV@andrew.cmu.edu> am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu (Anna Matyas) writes:
>
>I was skeptical before the game but was pleasantly surprised at the
>coverage.  I was particularly impressed by the close range camera coverage
>of work in the corners and behind the play without losing a beat getting
>back to the puck.
>
>Thorne is good and I've always been a fan of Clement (but I miss
>Mike Emrick!).  My boyfriend, who is not a hockey fan, even looked up
>at one point and said, "These guys are pretty good announcers."  (This
>is the same guy who said that Rick Tocchet looks like Charles Bronson...:)
>
>Mom.



I have one complaint for the cameramen doing the Jersey-Pitt series:  Show
the shots, not the hits.  On more than one occassion the camera zoomed in
on a check along the boards while the puck was in the slot.  They panned
back to show the rebound.  Maybe Mom's camera people were a little more 
experienced.



Joseph Stiehm






Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53780
From: gp2011@andy.bgsu.edu (George Pavlic)
Subject: Re: Ron Francis

Not to mention, Mr. Francis is an incredibly nice person.  Over Christmas
break, a friend of mine had a little Xmas gathering.  The two of us drove
to Ron's house.  While I stayed in the car out of shyness, my friend went
to the door and rang the bell.  Ron answered and my friend introduced
himself.  He then proceeded to invite Francis to the party.  Ron declined
because he "had to watch his daughter."  He then reached out and shook my
friend's hand!  I know this isn't r.s.b., but I don't think Barry Bonds
would be this polite in this situation.

George

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53781
From: nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: SHARKS REVIEW Part 5: Left Wings

Apparently, Part 2 (defensemen numbered 2 through 19) was lost when I posted
it; to make things worse, I lost my own copy.  I have asked on the Sharks
mailing list, on which it did get out, to see if someone can mail me a copy
back.  If someone responds, I will repost it when I get it; otherwise, I will
re-write it in a day or two and post it.  Sorry about that.

#8	LARRY DEPALMA		Season:	3rd
Acquired:	'91-92, free agent from Minnesota
Grade:		I (C-/D+)

No netter/fan watching the Sharks, including me, knows where DePalma was at
the end of the season; the Sharks appeared to still have his rights, but he
wasn't in San Jose, he wasn't in Kansas City, and his name hasn't appeared on
the waiver wire.  And that kind of invisibility was prevalent for the most part
for DePalma.  After being called up October 30 against the Tampa Bay Lightning,
DePalma had an excellent week, scoring 5 points in 3 games while playing good
defense.  Unfortunately, the 27-year-old DePalma then disappeared the rest of
the way, getting just 3 more points in 15 more games, and generally looked
lethargic and uninterested on both ends of the ice.  He then was sent down to
Kansas City, walked out from there, and was suspended and later reinstated
when it was revealed that he was injured; he then promptly disappeared from
the watching eyes of Shark Bytes (as the mailing list is now known to Sharks
officials) faithful, and neither the Sharks nor we miss him.

#10	JOHAN GARPENLOV		Season: 3rd
Acquired:	'91-92, trade with Detroit for D Bob McGill and 8th round
		pick in '92 entry draft from Vancouver
Grade:		A/A-

After an early slump, Garpenlov was nothing short of inspirational the rest
of the way, finishing with 66 points in 79 games, second highest total on the
team, as he clicked well with team MVP Kelly Kisio and right wing Rob
Gaudreau.  Kisio got most of the credit, but Garpenlov, finishing second in
the MVP voting, clearly demonstrated his playmaking and scoring skills, as he
was seen making excellent centering passes as well as finishing passes to him
by putting the puck past opposing goaltenders, getting a club-high 14 power-
play goals.  Contrary to his previous rep, Garpenlov also showed that despite
his small size (5' 11", 183 lbs.), he was willing to throw himself around
when necessary, albeit not very successful yet.  He also still needs to work
on his defense, although he improved tremendously throughout the season, and
was actually quite a good penalty killer by the end of the season.  He will
be a major key to the offense next year.

#15	DAVID BRUCE		Season: 5th
Acquired:	'91-92, from St. Louis in expansion draft
Grade:		I (?)

After a banner '91-92, when he led the team in power-play goals (10) and
was third in total scoring (38 points in 60 games), Bruce was bothered
virtually all of this season with a groin injury, which kept him out of the
lineup for all by 17 games this season.  Of course, it is difficult to
speculate how well he would have done this season had he not been affected by
the injury, but the 28-year-old Bruce was effective with a man up or a man
short in the Sharks' first season, and was expected to be a strong offensive
leader this season as well.  The injury appears serious, which is a shame,
because otherwise he may have a much brighter future for now; instead, his
future with the Sharks next season appears clouded.

#18	MARK PEDERSON		Season:	3rd
Acquired:	'92-93, trade with Philadelphia for C/LW Dave Snuggerud
Grade:		I (B)

It is difficult for me to understand the Flyers' decision to unload Pederson,
after a very good offensive season last season (40 points in 58 games), but
after riding the pine early in the season, Pederson was summarily sent to the
Sharks in exchange of the defensive-minded Snuggerud, and he finished with
41 games combined with the Flyers and the Sharks.  He was also limited by
injuries this season, and this limited his production (17 points).  But when
healthy, Pederson appears impressive, with a good scoring touch, good size
(and the willingness to throw it around, although he's not considered a
physical forward), and good speed.  He also does not appear to be a liability
on defense, but the Sharks probably have to wait until next season to see how
much, exactly, Pederson can do.

#20	JOHN CARTER		Season: 4th
Acquired:	'91-92, free agent from Boston
Grade:		I (B+/B)

Carter was definitely one of the hardest workers on the team, and the hard
work worked wonders, as at times he looked great on ice.  However, although he
did look great at times, the fact that he received just 16 points (in 55
games) for his efforts is a sign that there is only so much his hard work can
do, and the Sharks confirmed that by sending him to Kansas City with about
20 games left in the season.  Carter, who will turn 30 on May 6, always
hussled, but as a result, was sometimes trapped too deep within the offensive
zone while forechecking, but he was generally a credit on the defensive end,
but he is probably of limited utility in that capacity, and he did not impress
offensively, although he was one of the best Sharks at drawing penalties.  He
is very unlikely to be back next season.

#28	JEAN-FRANCOIS QUINTIN	Season: 1st
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		I (B+/B)

I don't understand why the Sharks didn't let Quintin play any more than the
14 games he played this season.  He was generally hard-working and creating
opportunities offensively, and appeared, at age 23, ready for regular NHL
duty, at least for a team like the Sharks, finishing with 7 points in those
14 games while not being a defensive liability.  Shoulder injury in training
camp before the '91-92 season limited Quintin, the team's leading scorer in
exhibition games despite sitting out the final two, to just 29 games with the
Sharks and the Blades that season, but he looked impressive.  He should be a
solid contender for regular duty next season.

#41	MARK BEAUFAIT		Season: 1st
Acquired:	2nd round pick in 1991 supplemental draft
Grade:		I (?)

After a all-star season at Kansas City, Beaufait got a cup of coffey with the
Sharks late in the season when the Blades knocked down a playoff spot and the
Sharks decimated with injuries, playing 5 games and scoring a goal for his only
NHL point thus far.  Despite small size (5' 9", 165 lbs.), Beaufait was not shy
to throw himself around when necessary, and looked pretty good at times,
although it's too early to judge him based on 5 NHL games, in which he played
mostly left wing, away from his center position at Northern Michigan and
Kansas City.

#42	JAROSLAV OTEVREL	Season: 1st
Acquired:	8th round pick in 1991 entry draft
Grade:		I (?)

Like Beaufait, Otevrel also played away from his normal position when he was
up for his cup of tea (7 games) midway through the season.  He was generally
very much of a defensive liability, and did not show much offensively either,
although that may be more indicative of the lack of ice time he got in those
7 games.  He may need another season to work on his defense, but once his
defense is acceptable, he should be ready.

#44	MICHEL PICARD		Season: 1st
Acquired:	'92-93, trade with Hartford for LW Yvon Corriveau
Grade:		I (B-/C+)

The 23-year-old Picard, although he perennially tore up the minors, seems to
be close to being out of chances, for some reason, after being acquired by the
Sharks but failing to impress the management in 25 games, scoring 4 goals for
his only points, and he spent most of the rest of the way in Kansas City.
He was not particularly strong defensively, and despite his offensive
brilliance in the minors, he has failed thus far to score in the NHL, although
he has been given limited opportunities.  He may be the Sharks' bait in the
expansion draft.

#45	DODY WOOD		Season: 1st
Acquired:	3rd round pick in 1991 entry draft
Grade:		I (D+/D, although perhaps I shouldn't give a grade at all)

I have been accused of knocking on Wood too much. :-)  Then, it is probably
no surprise to you that I am thoroughly unimpressed by Wood thus far, although
13 games is a small example.  He was generally a nonfactor on offense, was
not particularly good defensively, and took too many silly penalties, losing
many fights in the process and gathering 69 penalty minutes in those 13 games,
projecting to to 446(!) in an 84-game season.  He's not ready, and needs at
least another season at KC, where he can work on his fighting skills, if
nothing else.  His relatively small size (5' 11", 181 lbs.) does not give much
possibility that he can survive, at this stage, as an enforcer.

===============================================================================
GO CALGARY FLAMES!  Al MacInnis for Norris!  Gary Roberts for Hart and Smythe!
GO EDMONTON OILERS!  Go for playoffs next year!  Stay in Edmonton!
===============================================================================
Nelson Lu (claudius@leland.stanford.edu)
rec.sport.hockey contact for the San Jose Sharks

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53782
From: nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: SHARKS REVIEW Part 2: Defensemen (2-19)

I finally got it back, with great thanks to Mark Spiegel for saving and sending
it.



#2	ROB ZETTLER		Season:	4th
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		C/C-

Zettler gave the Sharks every bit he's got this year; unfortunately, this still
wasn't enough to make him any more than a marginal NHLer, if that.  He works
hard, for sure, but is no better than average on defense, and is prone to
costly penalties and defensive lapses at times, while being basically an
offensive zero (0 goal and 7 assists in 79 games).  He would be hardpressed
to make the team next year.

#3	DAVID WILLIAMS		Season: 2nd
Acquired:	'91-92, free agent from New Jersey
Grade:		C/C-

IMO, Williams was the most valuable defenseman for the Sharks in '91-92,
playing a combination of good offense (3 goals and 25 assists in 56 games) and
good defense.  But he, playing the first part of this season in Kansas City,
was good neither offensively nor defensively this year; it, then, appears that
'91-92 was a fluke.  Although he improved towards the end of the season, he
was prone to being out of position defensively, and did not demonstrate the
playmaking skills that made him the team's leading scorer among defensemen last
year.  He would also be hardpressed to make the team next year.

#4	JAYSON MORE		Season: 2nd
Acquired:	'91-92, from Montreal in expansion draft
Grade:		B+

After being touted as the team's top defensive prospects in training camp
before '91-92, More had a rather disappointing '91-92, as he was not
particularly good defensively, and had just 17 points in 46 games.  He, then,
proceeded to improve his game massively this season, becoming the team's most
reliable defenseman, whom the team can count on night in and night out to play
steady defense and providing occasional (but only occasional) offensive flash.
Offensively, he was even more disappointing than last year (11 points in 73
games), but his defense improved tremendously.  He is probably best as the
defensive part of a defense combination with an offensive defenseman.

#5	NEIL WILKINSON		Season: 4th
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		B-

Wilkinson was probably the team's top defensive defenseman in '91-92.  However,
partially because of injuries, he was not the same this year, as he missed 25
games total due to nagging knee and back injuries, and seemed to be slowed
even when playing.  He, then, had often to be saved by his defensive partners;
that is, if they are there at all.  But he also had some solid games, and if
he can be complete healthy, he can still be a force.

#6	SANDIS OZOLINSH		Season: 1st
Acquired:	'91-92, 2nd round pick in entry draft
Grade:		I (A)

At the time of his injury (December 30, against the Philadelphia Flyers),
Ozolinsh was well on track to be, IMO, the team's MVP.  A serious knee injury
in that game, though, forced him to miss the rest of the season (47 games),
but he still finished as the team's top scorer among defensemen (23 points),
which, of course, tells more about the lack of offense the Sharks had from
their defensemen, but it also tells of Ozolinsh's abilities.  At the time, he
was playing very good defense along with excellent offense; he was still
susceptible to so-called "rookie mistakes," but was probably the defenseman who
made the least of them on the team, rookie or veteran.  If he can come back
from his injuries, he is ready to be a star.

#19	DOUG ZMOLEK		Season: 1st
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		B

Zmolek had basically a solid and durable year, being one of the only two Sharks
to play in all 84 games of the season.  He was solid on defense, but
after being billed as an offensive defenseman, he didn't show it (15 points).
He was also prone to penalties, and his 229 penalty minutes was second on the
team; however, that was also an indication that he was fearly when facing tough
physical opponents, and he was at his best when playing physically.  But to
become a fixture in this league, he needs to improve both offensively and
defensively, and cut down on the number of power-plays he gives to opponents.

===============================================================================
GO CALGARY FLAMES!  Al MacInnis for Norris!  Gary Roberts for Hart and Smythe!
GO EDMONTON OILERS!  Go for playoffs next year!  Stay in Edmonton!
===============================================================================
Nelson Lu (claudius@leland.stanford.edu)
rec.sport.hockey contact for the San Jose Sharks





Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53783
From: adavis@mcl.bdm.com (Arthur Davis)
Subject: Re: Ron Francis

In article <1993Apr19.171223.11311@Virginia.EDU> mjr4u@Virginia.EDU ("Matthew J. Rush") writes:
> I forgot to ask: Is this the highest points total Francis has
>had in a season?  Has he ever had a 100 point season before,
>either with the Pens or the Whalers?
>

Francis got 101 in 89-90, his last full season with Hartford.

In agreement with your previous post, I think Francis is a tremendous and
generally underrated complete player.  I would LOVE to have him here in a
Capitals uniform where he would certainly be the #1 center (even though
Pivonka is also a very good complete player who is generally underrated).
Francis impresses me in many ways as an "ethical Dale Hunter".  Tons of
heart and can-do attitude with a lot of different skills, but none of
the cheap shots and few penalty minutes.  Not to mention nearly always
coming through when it's important.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53784
From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
Subject: Re: expanding to Europe:Dusseldorf

In <1993Apr16.073716.16514@Informatik.TU-Muenchen.DE> voecking@Informatik.TU-Muenchen.DE writes:

> 
> In article <1993Apr15.192231.27574@abo.fi>, MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF) writes:
> |> In <PKORTELA.93Apr15164732@lk-hp-17.hut.fi> pkortela@snakemail.hut.fi writes:
> |> 
> |> > 
> |> > DEG has many german-born forwards in the team. In fact the majority of players
> |> > are german-born. 1992-93 DEG had 11150 average in 11800 spectator arena.
> |> 
> |> Interesting! One of our German friends here (Robert?) told me their forwards
> |> were all Canadian-Germans. Perhaps somebody can sort this out for us?
> 
> As far as I know Dusseldorf has only one Canadian-German forward (i.e. a  player
> who was born in Canada but now has a German passport). 
> Benoit Doucet became german by marriing a german and he is going to play 
> for Germany in the WC.
> 
> The other Canada-born forwards are:
> 	Peter-John Lee (has British passport)
> 	Chris Valentine
> 	Dale Dercatch
> 	Steve Gootas
>  	Earl Spry (?)
> 
> At the moment there are only three German-born forwards coming into my mind:
> 	Bernd Trunschka, Andreas Brockmann, Ernst Koepf
 
Hm, do you think Dusseldorf fans would like it if their team joined the NHL?
Or do we have to include Koln as well (Cologne to you Anglophiles) to make 
them happy?:-)
 
> Volker

MARCU$
> 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53785
From: kerryy@bnr.ca (Kerry Yackoboski)
Subject: Re: Goalie masks

In article <1993Apr15.184750.12889@ac.dal.ca>, brifre1@ac.dal.ca writes:
|> I saw a mask once that had drawings of band-aids, presumably for every puck
|> that goalie stopped with his face/head.  I can't remember who it was or even
|> if it was NHL (I see quite a few AHL games here).

Gerry Cheevers used to have a mask that had stitches painted all over
it.

Ken Dryden's mask is a classic - an archetype of our time.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53786
From: wangr@rs6410.ecs.rpi.edu ( Isles' Fan!! )
Subject: Islanders sux!!!!

	Need I say more???????


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53787
From: lmcdapi@noah.ericsson.se (Daniel Piche)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

In article K00WBM850Z5v@andrew.cmu.edu, am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu (Anna Matyas) writes:
>
>Michael Collingridge writes:
>
>>And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
>>resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
>>team captain trivia would be appreciated.
>
>Wasn't Ron Francis captain of the Whalers when he was traded to
>Pittsburgh?
>
>Mom.

Chris Chelios was Montreal's co-captain with Guy Carbonneau when he was traded to Chicago for Denis Savard, and Peter Stastny was captain of the Quebec Nordiques when he was traded to New-Jersey. Also Mark Messier was captain of the Edmonton Oilers when he was traded to New-York. How about Dale Hawerchuk with Winnipeg when he was traded to Buffalo, was he captain too ? I think so. I should not forget Wayne (you know who) when he was traded to L.A. he was captain. Didn't they strip Wendel Clark of his capta



incy in Toronto ?

Just some updates and thoughts.

Cheer...

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Daniel Piche (LMC/U/DET - Design)
Ericsson Communications Inc.
8400 Decarie Blvd, 1rd floor
Town of Mont Royal, Quebec. H4P 2N2
(514)-738-8300 ext. 2178. 
E-mail: LMCDAPI@LMC.ERICSSON.SE
MEMOid: LMC.LMCDAPI

CHEERS.....
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53788
From: au021@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Roland Behunin)
Subject: Does anybody have the schedule for games Sunday 25 Apr 93


Hello Hockey fans.
Bonjour tout le monde!

Well, in Salt Lake City this past Sunday, the local ABC station decided not
to televise the hockey games.  La directrous de programme est la tete de merde!
Anyway, I have a satellite dish, and a few of my friends from hockey have invited themselves over to watch the games this coming Sunday (25 Apr), and I can
not find correct game times.  For the Calgary at LA game I have times showing
everything from 11:00 AM MDT, to 5:00 PM MDT.

I am not even sure what games are going to be played this coming Sunday, now
that ABC has mucked up the schedule.  I think I should be able to
pull in
three games (11:00 am, 2:00 pm, and 5:30 pm MDT) off the dish, but I am
not sure.

IF anybody has a schedule, pleas emial it to me.  As you can see, I have to
telent to get rec.sport.hockey, and it is sometimes difficult to get a link.

Thanks in advance
Merci d'avance

P.S.  Anglais ou francais d'accord.


Roland Behunin

behunin@oodis01.af.mil
behunin@oodis01.hill.af.mil
-- 
Roland

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53789
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Wings take game one

In article <1993Apr20.032350.18885@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>In <1qvos8$r78@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu (David Vergolini) writes:
>
>>  The Detroit Red Wings put a lot of doubter on ice tonight with a 6 - 3
>>washing of the Toronto Maple Leafs.  All you Toronto fans have now seen the
>>power of the mighty Red Wing offense.  Toronto's defense in no match for the
>>Wing offense.  As for the defense, Probert, Kennedey and Primeau came out
>
>Did they move Probert back to defense?  Why did I see him parking his ass
>in front of Potvin all night?  Somebody is going to have to discipline
>Probert if the Leafs want to win the series.  Perhaps a fresh Clark should
>hit the ice at the end of a long Probert shift and straigten him out for
>a while...
>

During the regular season, when the intensity is down, not many teams
have forwards who will continually go and park themselves in front of
the opposing teams net...and the inadequacy of the Leafs defense in
this regard thus didn't matter...however, the playoffs are a different
story...every good team is going to have players who are going to
become potted plants in front of Potvin...and the Leafs relatively
unphysical defensive core will finally be exposed as weak an inept.

Hard work will go a long way during the regular season...almost
to 100 points...and the Leafs deserve credit for that...but in the 
playoffs talent matters, because everyone begins working hard.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53790
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - Coach's Corner summary - April 19, 1993

In article <Yfoz1lm00WBOQ13hYq@andrew.cmu.edu> "James J. Murawski" <jjm+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>
>On 20-Apr-93 in Don Cherry - Coach's Corner..
>user Allan Sullivan@cs.UAlber writes:
>>Next, a clip was shown from an earlier episode, in which Don was
>>proclaiming Doug Gilmour to be the best player, not only in
>>the NHL, but in the world. What about players like Lemieux?
>>Don said that Gilmour was the best PLAYER, not "Designated point getter".
>>Its not like baseball, where you have a "designatted hitter" who
>>can score runs but can't play defense. Gilmour is a good two way player.
>
>This clip was shown on local news in Pittsburgh last night (KDKA), complete
>with animated sarcasm by the sportscaster.  It's the second time Cherry
>has been shown on local Pittsburgh news in the last couple of weeks.  Both
>times he was blasting Lemieux.
>

His designated point-getter remarks were not only meant for Lemieux,
but for Gretzky, Bure, etc. etc. .... and he made those particular
remarks last December before Lemieux was diagnosed with Hodgkin's,
and as the Leafs started their second half roll, and before
Gilmour's great season was being recognized by many people.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53791
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage

In article <cfoy0MW00Uh_41JndV@andrew.cmu.edu> Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>
>Thorne is good and I've always been a fan of Clement (but I miss
>Mike Emrick!).  My boyfriend, who is not a hockey fan, even looked up
>at one point and said, "These guys are pretty good announcers."  (This
>is the same guy who said that Rick Tocchet looks like Charles Bronson...:)
>

IMHO...

Clement, although he has a pleasant personality (aggravatingly pleasant
in my opinion), is a terrible
analyst, because he is almost alway wrong...the prototypical example
being New Jersey's first goal last Sunday.

I grew up with Dick Irvin doing color beside Danny Gallivan...I knew
did Irvin, Dick Irvin was a friend of mine...Bill Clement you aren't
any Dick Irvin.

As long as the teams involved do not include the US national team or
the New York Rangers, I'd take John Davidson over Bill Clement any
day.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53792
From: gp2011@andy.bgsu.edu (George Pavlic)
Subject: Re: Pens playoff radio coverage (was:Re: Radio stations)

In article <C5sFJv.FA1.1@cs.cmu.edu>, lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico)
wrote:

> According to this morning's Post-Gazette:
> 
> The Pens will be carried by KDKA-Radio(1020 am), unless the Pirates
> are playing.  When the Pirates play, the games will be carried by 
> WDVE(102.5 fm).  WDVE will carry 12 games, starting with tonight's
> game.
> 
> In fact, after this season, KDKA will no longer be the flagship
> station for the Pens.  The Penguins and KBL have struck a new 
> deal regarding the TV and radio rights to the games.  It seems
> more than likely that WDVE will be the flagship radio station next 
> season.  KBL will carry 62 games on tv,  with 17 of the games to be 
> simulcast on KDKA-TV.  The remaining 22 games, as well as some of the 
> early round playoff games, will be available by "subscription tv" only.
> To receive the games, you'll have to pay a one time hook up fee, and
> then a monthly fee of $11-12 dollars.
> 
> Also, under the new deal, there will no longer be radio/tv 
> simulcasts.  There will be a TV broadcast team, and a radio
> broadcast team.  
> 
> No word on who the announcers will be.  Mike Lange and Paul Steigerwald
> are both under contract with KDKA, but their contracts expire at the
> end of this season.  KBL President Bill Craig said he'd like to hire
> Lange and Steigerwald.
> 
> Lori
> Contact for the Penguins
> lli+@cs.cmu.edu

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!  Who's the mindscheme(?) behind this one -- Ted
Simmons?  As the saying goes, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."  I'm 230
miles from home (during the school year) and will never be able to pick up
DVE.  At least now I can sort of make out what Mike and Steigy say through
all the static on KDKA.  This just may be enough reason for me to transfer
to Duquesne and live at home.  Who's going to announce on DVE anyway? 
Paulson and Krenn?  (Just kidding.)

George

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53793
From: jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM (Jason Cockroft)
Subject: If You Were Pat Burns ...



What are the Leafs to do?  I am a Leaf supporter and
I say the Leafs are going down in four unless there
is nothing short of a miracle or a stroke of genenius hits
Pat Burns.

If you were Pat Burns what would you do?

Living in the Bay area, I do not get enough Leaf coverage
to pull something out of the bag,  (I would appreciate comments
on the Leaf/Detroit 3rd line match-ups)  but here is the basic
idea...

Andreychuck and Borchevsky have no business playing against 
the Wings.  They are too small.  The key to any Leafs success
will have to be Clark.  He is the only centre who can have
any presence within 3-stick lengths of the slot.  Where the
hell is Anderson?  Anderson can (in days past) get under peoples
skin.  Put a little more bluntly, Anderson has to be an asshole.
He used to be good at it.  We need him now.  

Perhaps, perhaps the Leafs can shut down Detroit's second line.
I was dissappointed to see Shepard and Yserbeart flying last night.
These guys are the "swing" players for the Wings.  Last year they
did a major choke in the playoffs and were to blame for the quick
exit of the Wings.  **THis has to happen again**.   Clark-Anderson-Gilmour
should be able to out hustle this line.  Anderson should do a
nasty on Yserbeart.  Clark should bang the hell out of Sheppard.  
Score Gilmour score!

Suggestions:  Clarke-Anderson-Gilmour vs. Sheppard-Yserbeart-??
	      Andreychuck-Borchevsy-??  vs. Detroit checking line
	      Toronto's checking line  vs. Yzerman-Fedorov-Probert (pray lots)

* as suggested - i would bench Andreychuck and Borchevsky to stir things up
		 and through a monkey wrench into Detroits game plan.  However,
		if the Detroit coaching would be dumb enough to play their
		checking line against these "finesse" players - well then
		let them play.

** Potvin can not be faulted on 5 of the goals - keep him in.
** Van Hellamond can not be faulted for the Leafs demise either.
** The Wings defense shut down the Leafs (especially in the slot).

I hope Pat Burns realizes that his team was out-hit, out-skated, and
out-coached on Monday night.  This was not a loss because of poor goaltending
or officiating.  This calls for drastic measures ... or tee off is next Monday.


-jake.


GO LEAFS !!!




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53794
From: caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz)
Subject: Re: Radio stations


In article <ragraca.735252641@vela.acs.oakland.edu>,
ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes: 

|>  The Pittsburgh Penguins games used to be
|> broadcast on KDKA 1020, but I don't know whether they will be pre-empted
|> by baseball (and moved to another station) or not.  You can try those
|> if the local baseball teams aren't playing at the same time, anyway.
|> 
|> --Randy
|> 

The Pens are now being broadcast on 102.5 WDVE.  

Carol

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53795
From: Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Bowman whining already

I should have guessed. It's time for the annual Pittsburgh Penguins
whine-a-thon. Bowman was complaning about cheap shots by the Devils in
Game 1. I'm sorry, Mr. Bowman, you're a great coach, but those "cheap
shots" were nothing compared to what's going to come. Also, I guess you
were only able to notice the cheap shots made by the guys not in white.
It's amazing what those black and gold colored glasses will do. 

PS - Nice dive on that high stick Mario. Everyone knew it was a high
stick, you could have stayed on your feet and saved your diving talent
for later.

just stirring it up a bit,
Ralph


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53796
From: ad215@Freenet.carleton.ca (Rachel Holme)
Subject: Re: CBC Game Choices (was LA ON CBC...)


In a previous article, 35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca () says:

>In article <boora.735182771@sfu.ca>, boora@kits.sfu.ca (The GodFather) writes:
>> 
>> 	CBC had a great chance for some double headers:  Toronto/Detroit
>> and Vancouver/Winnipeg, but today they said that the East gets the Leafs
>> and the West get the Vancouver game.  I thought that they would show them
>> both.

I'm totally p*-o'd, too!  Vancouver-Winnipeg is great west-coast hockey -
fast-paced and loads of talent.  What I've seen so far is hardly
entertaining, with the exception of the odd shift every now & then (of
course I missed Calgary-LA & Pitts-Jersey...)

>No, because the PINHEADS at CBC figure everyone here in Ontario cares
>for the Leafs, the Maple Leafs, and nothing but the Leafs.  Half of
>Southern Ontario is people who moved from out west, but the good folks
>in Toronto couldn't care less.  They should show the doubleheader
>(heck the second game would have two Canadian teams!), and let those
>desperate for news watch The National on Newsworld, but they don't.
>Why? Because Canada ends at Windsor, don'cha know!   Grrrrr.

Amen...

>Now I have to get updates every 30 mins. on CNN Headline News, for
>crying out loud...

That's cheaper than what I do - PHONE CALLS.  (There must be a better
system - one ring, Adams to Linden, he SCORES; two rings Bure rushes up
the ice, he SCORES, etc etc :-))

-- 
ad215@freenet.carleton.ca (Rachel Holme)]

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53797
From: gp2011@andy.bgsu.edu (George Pavlic)
Subject: Matt Militzok please read!


Sorry to everyone for wasting space.  Matt, the other day you posted that
you were doing a mailing list of playoff stats.  I lost your address. 
Please put me on that list.  Thanks.

George 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53798
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Wings will win

In article <ragraca.735309624@vela.acs.oakland.edu> ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:
>golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>
>>Bryan Murray has done very little as GM...Yzerman, Fedorov, Cheveldae,
>>Chaisson, the whole Russian strategy was a product of the previous
>>GM...Murray has made a couple of decent trades...that's about it...
>>that would hardly rank him as the best GM.
>
>There are many teams in the NHL who have taken a liking to Russian players.
>The "whole Russian strategy" is not specific to Detroit or to Devellano,
>who was GM before Murray.  What the previous GM also did was to trade 
>away several players who have gone on to do well with other teams, most
>notably (in my memory) Murray Craven, who had a few very good years with
>Philly after leaving here.  Also, it's not the volume of trades that will 
>necessarily improve a team, but the quality of them.  Trading Adam Oates
>for Bernie Federko was just plain stupid, even if Federko used to be a 
>great player at one time.  Most of Murray's trades have worked significantly
>to the Wings' advantage, with those that didn't being soured mainly by 
>injury to the players involved (such as Troy Crowder, who suffered back
>problems from which he never really recovered).
>

Devallano went earlier and more extensively to the Russian strategy
than anyone else...and was the first GM to "waste" high draft choices
on young Russians...Devallano would still be GM but he succombed to
Demers pleading to make the Oates-Federko et al trade...which is the
deal that sealed his fate.

Murray has made some decent trades...no doubt...but these are more
due to the stupidity or cheapness of other teams than brilliance on
his part...Washington was too cheap to pay Ciccarelli so they
essentially gave him away...and Carson was really a big anchor to
the team, and he was able to sucker a rookie GM to give him Paul
Coffey for deadweight.

If Detroit still fails this year because he was one defenseman short...
then he will have wasted an opportunity because Manson was available,
and he was unable to pull the trigger.  It is his judgement that he
has enough with what he's got...Yzerman doesn't have that many more
years in his prime.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53799
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Murray as GM  (was: Wings will win

In article <20APR199312512640@venus.lerc.nasa.gov> smorris@venus.lerc.nasa.gov (Ron Morris ) writes:
>
>Gerald, Murray wasn't responsible for Primeau (although I'm not
>ready to admit that's a horrible pick).  They hired him after the
>draft (which has never made sense to me).  His first pick was
>Lapointe.
>

I don't think Primeau is necessarily a bad pick...I'm was just trying
to locate the beginning of Murray's decisions...he slowness in trading
Carson has delayed Primeau's development...and you have to wait longer
for big players often...and Primeau can be a very good player without
being a point-a-game-player, especially on a team that has Yzerman and
Fedorov...if Primeau becomes Joel Otto, and gets 20 goals a season,
and plays mean...it will have been an extremely good pick.

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53800
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Panther's President

In article <0P6a3B1w165w@cybernet.cse.fau.edu> jimg@cybernet.cse.fau.edu (Jim Gorycki) writes:
>
>A little Bio from _Sun-Sentinel_
>Torrey, the architect of four consecutive Stanley Cup champions as 
>persident and general manager of the New York Islanders.
>Throughout his 27 years in the NHL, Bill Torrey's bow ties have become
>as much of a signature as Andre Agassi's hair.
>
>The Panthers will introduce a uniform, insignia, and ticket-price 
>information in early next month.  In the meantime, Huizenga leaves the
>day-to-day operation in the hands of Torrey and Bob Clarke, the VP and
>GM.
>

The San Jose Sharks and Ottawa Senators are each on their second GM
already...I'd be willing to wager that both the Sharks and Senators
will probably see their 3rd GM's and perhaps their 4th, before we
see the Panthers second.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53801
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 18

In article <1r1439$c9t@access.digex.net> steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio) writes:
>
>Gerald Olchowy (golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca) writes:
>> Podein is an interesting case...because he was eligible to
>> play in Cape Breton in the AHL playoffs like Kovalev, Zubov,
>> and Andersson...obviously Sather and Pocklington are not
>> the total scrooges everyone makes them out to be...certainly
>> in this case they've massively outclassed Paramount and the
>> New York Rangers.
>
>What is the policy regarding players and the minor league playoffs versus WC?
>I know that the Rangers are holding back Kovalev, Zubov, and Andersson for
>Binghamton, but I also know that the Whalers wanted Michael Nylander to play
>for Springfield, while Nylander wanted to play for Sweden. The Whalers allowed
>the NHL to decide, and the NHL chose the WCs. How does this differ from the
>Rangers and Oilers? Did the Whalers have to go through the league, or could
>they have forced Nylander to play in Springfield?
>

Obviously, it is ultimately the teams choice...the NHL would obviously
prefer not to annoy the European hockey federations, but the NHL right
now cannot force NHL teams to free their players...the Whalers probably
did it this way so as to not annoy their farm team affiliate.

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53802
From: shah@pitt.edu (Ravindra S Shah)
Subject: Re: Nords 3 - Habs 2 in O.T. We was robbed!!

Deepak Chhabra (dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca) wrote:

: Speaking of great players, man-oh-man can Quebec skate.  I haven't seen a
: team so potent on the rush in a long time.  Watching them break out of their
: zone, especially Sundin, is a treat to watch.  They remind me of the Red 
: Army.  

: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (pissed-off Habs fan)

Yeah, the Nords look like they're going to be good...but (excuse the
bias) have you ever watched the Pens on a rush?...Don't answer: everyone
has seen this footage.  Near the end of the season when the Pens played
the Nords it was like watching a (younger) double of the Pens.  ...The
Nords looked good right up to the point when they lost. 
--
Ravi Shah
shah+@pitt.edu

"La mu'sica ideas portara'  	approx. translation: "Music will bring ideas
y siempre continuara'				     and will continue forever
sonido electro'nico				     electronic sound
decibel sinte'tico"	-Musique non stop-	     synthetic decibel"
                           -Kraftwerk

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53803
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN

In article <C5sCLK.8B5@cbnewsh.cb.att.com> seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr) writes:
>
>What, did you leave the room each of the 100 or so times they said that
>there WERE NO OTHER NIGHT BASEBALL GAMES? Every break they took back at
>the studio mentioned it, followed by 'so...we're gonna show you hockey
>instead.' My wife and I are hoping for rain at every baseball game they
>have a feed for tommorrow night...
>
>Point is, be glad they showed hockey, but if baseball was available
>anywhere else you can bet you would've watched baseball last night.
>
>pete clark

 I know that there wasn't other games on the schedule, but ESPN sometimes
shows classic games from previous season to fill in the time slot.

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53804
From: cal2d@csissun11.ee.Virginia.EDU (Craig Allen Lorie)
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN

With everyone bitching about the hockey coverage by ESPN its almost like the 
Detroit-Toronto game was not televised last nite.  I was just thankful to see
hockey on a night that it wasn't supposed to be carried.  Thanks to ESPN, no
matter why they televised the game

Craig


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53805
Subject: Remarks by President Clinton to NCAA Division I Champion Hockey Team
From: "nigel allen" <nigel.allen@canrem.com>


Here is a press release from the White House.

 Remarks by President Clinton to NCAA Division I Champion Hockey Team
April 19; Q&A Following
 To: National Desk
 Contact: White House Office of the Press Secretary, 202-456-2100

   WASHINGTON, April 19 -- Following is a transcript
of remarks by President Clinton to the University of Maine "Black
Bears" NCAA Division I hockey champions:

                           The Rose Garden

 9:58 A.M. EDT

     THE PRESIDENT:  Good morning ladies and gentlemen.  It's
an honor for me to welcome the University of Maine Black Bears, the
winner of the NCAA Division I hockey national championship to the
Rose Garden and the White House.  I understand from Senator Mitchell
that this is the first team from the University of Maine every to win
a national championship.  And we're glad to have them here.

     I'm inspired not only by how the team pulled together to
win the championship, but how the entire state pulled together to
cheer them onto victory.

     Coming from a state that is also relatively small in
size, but also filled with pride and tradition and community, I can
understand how the people of Maine must feel about the Black Bears.
In our state people are still talking about the time we won the
Orange Bowl over the number one ranked football team, and that was
back in 1978.  I'm sure that 15 years from now, the people of Maine
will as proud of this team as they are today.

     You know, in my state football is a slightly more
popular sport than hockey.  We don't have a lot of ice.  (Laughter.)
But after spending three months getting banged around in this town, I
can understand a little more about hockey than I did before I came
here.  Hockey is a tough game.  It's a hard-hitting sport.  It does
have one virtue though, there's a penalty for delay of game.  I wish
we had that rule in the Senate.  (Laughter.)

     In government as in hockey, leadership is important.  In
the United States Senate, our team has a great captain, the Majority
Leader and the senior Senator from Maine, George Mitchell; junior
Senator -- Cohen looks so young, I can't imagine.  (Laughter.)  I'm
actually bitter about Senator Cohen because he looks so much younger
than me.

     On your hockey team, the captain Jim Montgomery has done
a great job.  He scored the winning goal late in the championship
game, leading you to a come-from-behind victory -- something else I
know a little bit about.

     Sport brings out the best in individuals and in teams
and in communities.  I share the pride that Senator Mitchell and
Senator Cohen and Congressman Andrews and all the people of Maine
must feel for the Black Bears who have shown us all how to play as a
team, how to bring out the best in one another, and how to come from
behind.

     I think it's important, as I ask young people from
around America who have achieved outstanding things in working
together, to come here to the White House to be recognized and
appreciated by their country, to remember that those kinds of values
and those kinds of virtues need to be ingrained in all of us for all
of our lives.

     We now have another role model, and I'm glad to have
them here today.  (Applause.)

     (The President is presented with team jersey.)
(Applause.)

     THE PRESIDENT:  That's great.  I love it.  It's beautiful.
(Applause.)

     (The President is presented with an autographed stick.)

     THE PRESIDENT:  Thank you.  That's great.  (Applause.)

                             * * * * * *

     Q  Mr. President, did you authorize the move on Waco
this morning, sir?

     THE PRESIDENT:  I was aware of it.  I think the Attorney
General made the decision.  And I think I should refer all questions
to her and to the FBI.

     Q  Did you have any instructions for her as to how it
should be executed?

     THE PRESIDENT:  No, they made the tactical decisions.
That was their judgment, the FBI.

     Q  Is this a raid?

     THE PRESIDENT:  And I will -- I want to refer you to --
talk to the Attorney General and the FBI.  I knew it was going to be
done, but the decisions were entirely theirs, all the tactical
decisions.

     Q  What did you and Senator Mitchell talk about this
morning?

     Q  Any chance for that stimulus package?

     THE PRESIDENT:  Senator Mitchell ought to pay my
quarter.  (Laughter.)  I was in there -- (laughter).

     SENATOR MITCHELL:  You have to pay that quarter.

     THE PRESIDENT:  I was ready.  (Laughter.)  Senator
Mitchell, he's worth a quarter any day.

     Q  Any chance for your bill, sir?

     THE PRESIDENT:  We talked about what was going to happen
this week in the Senate and about what other meetings we're going to
have for the rest of the week.  We only had about five minutes to
talk.  And we agreed we'd get back together later, around noon, and
talk some more.

     Q  Senator Dole said over the weekend that your
compromise is no compromise.

     THE PRESIDENT:  Well, I know he did, but, look, Senator
Dole and a lot of the other Republicans now in the Senate voted for
the same kind of thing for Ronald Reagan in 1983; and our research
indicates that a majority of them over time voted for a total of 28
emergency spending measures totalling over $100 billion when Reagan
and Bush were President, in those administrations.  And many of those
purposes were not nearly as worthy as putting the American people
back to work.  I don't want to go back and revisit every one, but you


can do it.  You can look at the research there.  So this position
they're taking is not credible.  We have a very tough five-year
deficit reduction plan.  All these costs are covered during that time
and then some.  And the very people that are saying this has all got
to be paid for don't have much of a history on which to base their
position.  They've got 12 years of vote for stimulus measures of this
kind that had very little to with putting the American people back to
work.  So I think we've got a chance to work it out, and I'm hopeful.
We'll see what happens today and tomorrow.  I'm feeling pretty good
about it.

     THE PRESS:  Thank you

                                 END       10:10 A.M. EDT

 -30-

--
Canada Remote Systems - Toronto, Ontario
416-629-7000/629-7044

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53806
From: jrmst8+@pitt.edu (Joseph R Mcdonald)
Subject: Re: Wirtz is a weenie

In article <wfozwMi00Uh_E1kyE=@andrew.cmu.edu> rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu (Robert Angelo Pleshar) writes:
>In other TV news, the Penguins announced yesterday that they will have 3
>fewer broadcast TV games, and will have 22(!) games on some sort of
>subscription / pay-per-view system. Yuck.

This is incorrect.  This year the Pens had 61 games on "free" TV and 6
games on PPV.  Next year they will have 62 games on free TV and 22 on 
a subscription basis.  

You actually get 1 more free game than last year, and there will be no
more "radio-only" games.

Its a good deal.  Last year, everybody bitched about Baldwin "breaking
up the team".  Now, he goes out of his way to keep the nucleus of this
team together and that takes money.  He comes up with a creative way
to generate more revenue so he can afford this team, and people bitch
some more.

Everybody wants something for nothing.

Dean

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dean J. Falcione                                      "Badges? What badges? We 
(using jrmst8 by permission                            Don't need no stinkin'
 of the owner, Joe McDonald)                           badges!"

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53807
From: shah@pitt.edu (Ravindra S Shah)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage

Joseph B Stiehm (joe13+@pitt.edu) wrote:


: I have one complaint for the cameramen doing the Jersey-Pitt series:  Show
: the shots, not the hits.  On more than one occassion the camera zoomed in
: on a check along the boards while the puck was in the slot.  They panned
: back to show the rebound.  Maybe Mom's camera people were a little more 
: experienced.



: Joseph Stiehm

Exactly.  That is my biggest complaint about the coverage so far.
Follow that damn puck!




--
Ravi Shah
shah+@pitt.edu

"La mu'sica ideas portara'  	approx. translation: "Music will bring ideas
y siempre continuara'				     and will continue forever
sonido electro'nico				     electronic sound
decibel sinte'tico"	-Musique non stop-	     synthetic decibel"
                           -Kraftwerk

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53808
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: If You Were Pat Burns ...

In article <1r1chb$5l2@jethro.Corp.Sun.COM> jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM writes:
>
>
>What are the Leafs to do?  I am a Leaf supporter and
>I say the Leafs are going down in four unless there
>is nothing short of a miracle or a stroke of genenius hits
>Pat Burns.
>
>If you were Pat Burns what would you do?
>

Pray for the Wings to become lazy and overconfident...the Wings
can only lose the series...Toronto cannot win it.  Take away
Doug Gilmour and the Leafs are an old Tampa Bay.

The Leafs deserve a lot of credit for their diligent effort
during the regular season...but if Detroit puts in a reasonable
effort, this is not a contest.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53809
From: LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall)
Subject: Re: If You Were Pat Burns ...

In article <1r1chb$5l2@jethro.Corp.Sun.COM>
jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM (Jason Cockroft) writes:
 
>Suggestions:  Clarke-Anderson-Gilmour vs. Sheppard-Yserbeart-??
>              Andreychuck-Borchevsy-??  vs. Detroit checking line
>              Toronto's checking line  vs. Yzerman-Fedorov-Probert (pray lots)
>
 
 Well, I'm a Wings fan and I think the FIRST thing that you should do is to
get the opponent's line combinations correct before you try to match up anyone
with them.  There is no Yzerman-Fedorov-Probert line, except for maybe on a
powerplay.  These three players usually play on three different lines.
Which would mean that Toronto's checking line would have to pull a triple
shift.
The Wings' lines usually look like this:
 
                      Gallant-Yzerman-Ciccarelli
 
                      Kozlov-Fedorov-Drake
 
                      Kennedy-Burr-Probert
 
                      Ysebaert-Primeau-Sheppard
 
Oh by the way:  Start praying! : )
 
Laurie Marshall
Wayne State University
Detroit, Michigan
Go Wings!!!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53810
From: franjion@spot.Colorado.EDU (John Franjione)
Subject: Re: Bay area media (Wings-Leafs coverage)

maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:

>In <DREIER.93Apr19195132@durban.berkeley.edu> dreier@durban.berkeley.edu (Roland Dreier) writes:

>>The San Francisco Bay area media is reporting tonight that the Detroit
>>Red Wings beat the Toronto Maple Leafs 6-3.  Can someone who is not
>>part of the media conspiracy against the Leafs tell me how the game
>>really went (I am expecting a 4-0 win for the Leafs, shutout for
>>Potvin, hat trick for Andreychuk and a goal and 3 assists for
>>Gilmour).  If the Leafs really lost, how many penalties did whichever
>>biased ref was at the game have to call against the Leafs to let the
>>Red Wings win?

>Ah yes.  California.  Did the San Francisco Bay area media report that
>Joe Montana is rumoured to be the leading candidate to replace fired
>San Jose Sharks coach George Kingston?  Apparently Montana is not only
>coveted for his winning attitude, but as a playing coach he will be
>expected to quarterback the powerplay.

Good comeback, Rog.  Your quick wit and intelligence continues to
amaze everyone.

-- 
John Franjione
Department of Chemical Engineering
University of Colorado, Boulder
franjion@spot.colorado.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53811
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: If You Were Pat Burns ...

In <1993Apr20.181549.11414@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:

>Pray for the Wings to become lazy and overconfident...the Wings
>can only lose the series...Toronto cannot win it.  Take away
>Doug Gilmour and the Leafs are an old Tampa Bay.

Right Gerald.  And take away Bob Probert and the Wings are dead Octopuses.

>The Leafs deserve a lot of credit for their diligent effort
>during the regular season...but if Detroit puts in a reasonable
>effort, this is not a contest.

Let's wait for the body to get cold before we start in with the eulogies
hm?  They have only lost ONE game.  The game was in Detroit after all and
Potvin did not have his best evening.  Nobody that I saw thought that the
Leafs would sweep the Wings.  It looks like it might go six.  The Leafs
will take the Wings home advantage away in the next game.


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53812
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: Goalie masks

In article <1993Apr16.164811.21637@newshub.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:


>[...] and I'll give Fuhr's new one an honourable mention, although I haven't
>seen it closely yet (it looked good from a distance!).  

This is the new Buffalo one, the second since he's been with the
Sabres?  I recall a price tag of over $700 just for the paint job on
that mask, and a total price of almost $1500.  Ouch.  




-- 
Valerie Hammerl			Birtday -(n)- An event when friends get 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu	together, set your dessert on fire, then
acscvjh@ubms.cc.buffalo.edu	laugh and sing while you frantically try 
v085pwwpz@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu  to blow it out.  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53813
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

In article <1993Apr17.062622.25380@news.clarkson.edu> farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy) writes:

>In fact, the tradition has been passed down to their affiliate
>in Adirondack. In Gm 6 of last yr's finals, an 8 legged creature was
>hurled onto the frozen pond and landed right at the feet of ref
>Lance Roberts.

It may have been passed to Toronto, but I've even seen an octopus at
the Aud -- last year's Bruins-Sabres game.  I knew all about the
Detroit version, but seeing at the Aud was a bit puzzling.  :-)

-- 
Valerie Hammerl			Birtday -(n)- An event when friends get 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu	together, set your dessert on fire, then
acscvjh@ubms.cc.buffalo.edu	laugh and sing while you frantically try 
v085pwwpz@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu  to blow it out.  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53814
From: stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber)
Subject: Re: Pens playoff radio coverage (was:Re: Radio stations)

In article <gp2011-200493131949@m248-68.bgsu.edu>, gp2011@andy.bgsu.edu (George Pavlic) writes:
> 
> NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!  Who's the mindscheme(?) behind this one -- Ted
> Simmons?  As the saying goes, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."  I'm 230
> miles from home (during the school year) and will never be able to pick up
> DVE.  At least now I can sort of make out what Mike and Steigy say through
> all the static on KDKA.  This just may be enough reason for me to transfer
> to Duquesne and live at home.  Who's going to announce on DVE anyway? 
> Paulson and Krenn?  (Just kidding.)
> 
> George

Don't kid around... They just might listen.

Kevin L. Stamber
Purdue University
waiting to hear 'Free Bird' as the new Penguins theme


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53815
From: stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber)
Subject: LIST OF TEE TIMES AT METROPOLITAN TORONTO GOLF COURSES FOR MONDAY

;^)

Kevin L. Stamber
Purdue University
...and Phil Kirzyc (The Kielbasa Kid) will roam the Arena for interviews.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53816
From: jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio)
Subject: ABC's announcers, ESPN's (lack of) coverage (WAS: Re: Atlanta ...)


In article <1993Apr19.160356.19160@newshub.ists.ca>, dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:
 
|> Ok, here's the solution to your problem.  Move to Canada.  Yesterday I was able
|> to watch FOUR games...the NJ-PITT at 1:00 on ABC, LA-CAL at 3:00 (CBC), 
|> BUFF-BOS at 7:00 (TSN and FOX), and MON-QUE at 7:30 (CBC).  I think that if
|> each series goes its max I could be watching hockey playoffs for 40-some odd
|> consecutive nights (I haven't counted so that's a pure guess).

The worst thing is that this is exactly what I did last year.  I had the Rangers
on MSG, and the two different games on SCNY and SCA on at the same time.  Yes,
I'd rather have SC cover it, just for the amount of coverage.

 
|> Btw, those ABC commentaters were great!  I was quite impressed; they seemed
|> to know that their audience wasn't likely to be well-schooled in hockey lore
|> and they did an excellent job.  They were quite impartial also, IMO.

I think Thorne earns his money.  The best part is that he is the same way when 
he is earning his $$ from SportsChannel as the Devils announcer (i.e.,
unbiased).  He goes orgasmic for goals, despite which team scores, and even more 
excited (if possible) for great saves.  He did a good job of explaining certain 
things to non-hockey types without offending those of us who follow the sport
(unlike NBC's clowns for the ASG).

-JPC

(Ob. Playoff-time flame-bait)

      Don't any of you Pittsburgh fans tell me how Mike Lang(e) is better. 
      Maybe if he were a little spontaneous, rather than reading rehearsed
      lines of B.S having nothing to do with hockey he would be better.

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John P. Curcio 		          Go Bruins!		   Philips Laboratories
jpc@philabs.philips.com 			           345 Scarborough Road
(914) 945-6442               	 		     Briarcliff Manor, NY 10510 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53817
From: lee139@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (Steve Lee)
Subject: Re: LIST OF TEE TIMES AT METROPOLITAN TORONTO GOLF COURSES FOR MONDAY


In article <C5spEC.EuC@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber) writes:

>Kevin L. Stamber
>Purdue University
>...and Phil Kirzyc (The Kielbasa Kid) will roam the Arena for interviews.


Woops!  This is rec.sport.hockey! Not rec.sport.golf!  Hope you check the
newsgroup header next time before posting!

Steve

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Lee      *      University of Western Ontario      *      London, Canada 
                      lee139@obelix.gaul.csd.uwo.ca          
_______________________________________________________________________________


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53818
From: ingo@sunee.uwaterloo.ca (Electroholic)
Subject: Re: Hockey & Hispanic market

In article <115868@bu.edu> icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera) writes:
>
>In article <saross01.734885336@starbase.spd.louisville.edu>, saross01@starbase.spd.louisville.edu (Stacey A. Ross) writes:
>|> In <C5I2s2.3Bt@odin.corp.sgi.com> rickc@wrigley.corp.sgi.com (Richard Casares) writes:
>|> >You'll have a hard time selling any sport to a community that
>|> >can't play it on account of availability or financial reasons.
>|> >Hockey is pretty much a sport for the white and well off.
>
>What is this crap? I'm only interested in intelligent discussion. If you 
>can't answer my question, just say so. Can anyone else answer the ques.?
>

	It's not really crap you know... only half crap ;-)   From what i 
understand it's very expensive to play hockey south of the border... 
(actually it's not that cheap up hear either... though once you have all the
equipement it's not more than $300 a year... actually i haven' played in
about 8 years so i could be off a bit... )  In the states, where ice time
is considerably more expensive it can cost over a thousand a year... compare 
this to baseball and you'll see that hockey is a sport for the well-to-do...
And this brings up the fact that the well-to-do in the US are majority white...

BTW: what was the original question... i think it has to do with the Hispanic
communtiy and playing hockey.... 


					Cheers!
						i.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|  ingo@sunee.uwaterloo.ca                   | The more violent the body     |
|  iwweigel@descartes.uwaterloo.ca           | contact of the sports you     | 
|  ingo@electrical.watstar.uwaterloo.ca      | watch, the lower your class.  |
|  iwweigele@electrical.watstar.uwaterloo.ca |         -- Paul Fussell       |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If the University of Waterloo had on opinion, this probably wouldn't be it...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53819
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

In article <1993Apr20.130822.603@exu.ericsson.se> lmcdapi@noah.ericsson.se writes:
>In article K00WBM850Z5v@andrew.cmu.edu, am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu (Anna Matyas) writes:
>>
>>Michael Collingridge writes:
>>
>>>And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
>>>resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
>>>team captain trivia would be appreciated.
>>
>>Wasn't Ron Francis captain of the Whalers when he was traded to
>>Pittsburgh?
>>
>>Mom.
>
>Chris Chelios was Montreal's co-captain with Guy Carbonneau when he
>was traded to Chicago for Denis Savard, and Peter Stastny was captain 
>of the Quebec Nordiques when he was traded to New-Jersey. Also Mark 
>Messier was captain of the Edmonton Oilers when he was traded to New
>York. How about Dale Hawerchuk with Winnipeg when he was traded to
>Buffalo, was he captain too ? I think so. I should not forget Wayne 
>(you know who) when he was traded to L.A. he was captain. Didn't they 
>strip Wendel Clark of his captaincy in Toronto ?
>

Buffalo seems to have started a tradition of trading its captains.

Pat LaFontaine was awarded the Captaincy when Mike Ramsey was forced
to give it up (Ramsey's now a Penguin).  Ramsey inherited it from Mike
Foligno (who's now a leaf).  He in turn had inherited it from Lindy
Ruff, who went I forget where.  Ruff had it from Perreault, who
retired, so I guess that's where the streak started.  Or did it?
After all, Danny Gare was captain before him, and he went to Detroit.
Jim Scoenfeld, Gerry Meehan, and Floyd Smith are the others, in
reverse order, last to first.  I was a bit young at the time, so I'm
not sure of the fate of Schoenfeld, but he ultimately went to Detroit
and Boston.  Meehan went to Vancouver, Atlanta and Washington.  Smith
seems to have hung up his skates after Buffalo, but I don't know if
the captaincy was removed before or after that, or how many games he
played for Buffalo.  This is actually getting fascinating.  :-)

Captaincy in Buffalo is a sure sign you're to be traded, almost,
unless you're a franchise player.

-- 
Valerie Hammerl			Birtday -(n)- An event when friends get 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu	together, set your dessert on fire, then
acscvjh@ubms.cc.buffalo.edu	laugh and sing while you frantically try 
v085pwwpz@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu  to blow it out.  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53820
From: spiegel@sgi413.msd.lmsc.lockheed.com (Mark Spiegel)
Subject: Re: Bay area media (Wings-Leafs coverage)

In article <1993Apr20.031840.18636@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>In <DREIER.93Apr19195132@durban.berkeley.edu> dreier@durban.berkeley.edu (Roland Dreier) writes:
>
>>The San Francisco Bay area media is reporting tonight that the Detroit
>>Red Wings beat the Toronto Maple Leafs 6-3.  Can someone who is not
>>part of the media conspiracy against the Leafs tell me how the game
>>really went (I am expecting a 4-0 win for the Leafs, shutout for
>>Potvin, hat trick for Andreychuk and a goal and 3 assists for
>>Gilmour).  If the Leafs really lost, how many penalties did whichever
>>biased ref was at the game have to call against the Leafs to let the
>>Red Wings win?
>
>Ah yes.  California.  Did the San Francisco Bay area media report that
>Joe Montana is rumoured to be the leading candidate to replace fired
>San Jose Sharks coach George Kingston?  Apparently Montana is not only
>coveted for his winning attitude, but as a playing coach he will be
>expected to quarterback the powerplay.

	Close Roger, but no banana, er avocado or is it artichoke ?!?

	Geracie in the Murky News said Kingston will be the new 49ers
	quarterback.  I'm still trying to determine if he is kidding
	or not :).  If I happen to pound down enuff pints sometime 
	this week I'll go back and check what stooper idiot Purdy
	said in his column.  That ought to be worth a few Leafs, I
	mean Laughs.   If I'm really depressed I'll read the SF Comicle.

	mark

 just say

 #####  #     #    #    ######  #    #   #####           ____                  
#     # #     #   # #   #     # #   #   #     #            -_ --__             
#       #     #  #   #  #     # #  #    #                    \    --_          
 #####  ####### #     # ######  ###      #####                \      -_        
      # #     # ####### #   #   #  #          #                |       \       
#     # #     # #     # #    #  #   #   #     #    __________ /         \_____ 
 #####  #     # #     # #     # #    #   #####  ___________ /            \_____
______________________________________________________________________________
Mark Spiegel  spiegel@lmsc.lockheed.com   Cow Palace:108/K/8  Epicenter: ?


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53821
From: slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

NJ> : >And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been 
traded,  
NJ> : >resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any 
other 
NJ> : >team captain trivia would be appreciated.    
 
Mike Foligno was captain of the Buffalo Sabres when he was traded to
Toronto.
 
Stephen Legge
SLEGGE@kean.ucs.mun.ca
\

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53822
From: e8l6@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (Rocket)
Subject: NHL Playoff leaders as of April 19, 1993

    Playoff leaders as of April 19, 1993

    Player       Team   GP  G   A  Pts +/- PIM

    M.Lemieux    PIT     1   2   2   4   0   0
    Juneau       BOS     1   1   3   4   0   0
    Noonan       CHI     1   3   0   3   0   0
    Mogilny      BUF     1   2   1   3   0   0
    Neely        BOS     1   2   1   3   0   0
    Brown        STL     1   1   2   3   0   0
    Jagr         PIT     1   1   2   3   0   0
    Oates        BOS     1   0   3   3   0   0
    Carson       LA      1   2   0   2   0   0
    Hunter       WAS     1   2   0   2   0   0
    Stevens      NJ      1   2   0   2   0   0
    Cullen       TOR     1   1   1   2   0   0
    Hull         STL     1   1   1   2   0   0
    Khristich    WAS     1   1   1   2   0   0
    Linden       VAN     1   1   1   2   0   0
    Racine       DET     1   1   1   2   0   0
    Shanahan     STL     1   1   1   2   0   0
    Sydor        LA      1   1   1   2   0   0
    Yzerman      DET     1   1   1   2   0   0
    Bure         VAN     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Coffey       DET     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Drake        DET     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Emerson      STL     1   0   2   2   0   0
    G.Courtnall  VAN     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Johansson    WAS     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Lapointe     QUE     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Niedermayer  NJ      1   0   2   2   0   0
    Ramsey       PIT     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Sandstrom    LA      1   0   2   2   0   0
    Smehlik      BUF     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Stevens      PIT     1   0   2   2   0   0
    Adams        VAN     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Barr         NJ      1   1   0   1   0   0
    Bellows      MON     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Burr         DET     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Chiasson     DET     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Craven       VAN     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Dahlquist    CAL     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Dionne       MON     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Felsner      STL     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Ferraro      NYI     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Francis      PIT     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Gilmour      TOR     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Hannan       BUF     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Heinze       BOS     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Howe         DET     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Huddy        LA      1   1   0   1   0   0
    King         WIN     1   1   0   1   0   0
    LaFontaine   BUF     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Lefebvre     TOR     1   1   0   1   0   0
    McSorley     LA      1   1   0   1   0   0
    Millen       LA      1   1   0   1   0   0
    Ronning      VAN     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Rucinsky     QUE     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Sakic        QUE     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Sheppard     DET     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Steen        WIN     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Suter        CAL     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Sweeney      BUF     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Tipett       PIT     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Yawney       CAL     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Young        QUE     1   1   0   1   0   0
    Barnes       WIN     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Borschevsky  TOR     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Brunet       MON     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Chelios      CHI     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Ciccarelli   DET     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Clark        TOR     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Desjardins   MON     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Dipietro     MON     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Donnelly     LA      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Driver       NJ      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Duchesne     QUE     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Ellett       TOR     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Elynuik      WAS     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Flatley      NYI     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Fleury       CAL     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Gallant      DET     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Gill         TOR     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Granato      LA      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Gretzky      LA      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Guerin       NJ      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Hawerchuk    BUF     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Holik        NJ      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Housley      WIN     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Janney       STL     1   0   1   1   0   0
    K.Brown      CHI     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Khmylev      BUF     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Krygier      WAS     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Larmer       CHI     1   0   1   1   0   0
    MacInnis     CAL     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Matteau      CHI     1   0   1   1   0   0
    McEachern    PIT     1   0   1   1   0   0
    McLean       VAN     1   0   1   1   0   0
    McRae        STL     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Mullen       PIT     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Muller       MON     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Murphy       PIT     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Murzyn       VAN     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Otto         CAL     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Pearson      TOR     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Pivonka      WAS     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Primeau      DET     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Probert      DET     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Reichel      CAL     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Ricci        QUE     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Robitaille   LA      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Roenick      CHI     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Samuelsson   PIT     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Semak        NJ      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Shannon      WIN     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Shuchuk      LA      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Sundin       QUE     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Sutter       CHI     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Taylor       LA      1   0   1   1   0   0
    Tocchet      PIT     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Vaske        NYI     1   0   1   1   0   0
-- 

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-                                                                           -
-    Maurice Richard                                                        -

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53823
From: slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca
Subject: Leafs versus Wings

How long can the Leafs play short-handed and still be expected to
score?  They did some fine penely-killing in the first (2 men down
for a couple of minutes at one point) but they just couldn't keep it 
up.  They spent virtually the entire game either short-handed or
just coming off a penelty -- as soon as they'd get re-grouped, they're
penalized again!
 
Sheesh -- like Gilmour said after the 1st -- you can't go calling 
every little push an shove in a game like that.  And if you're going
to, you have to do it for both teams.
 
Pearson (one of my four favorite Leafs) played like a bonehead -- I
saw him personally screw up at least 2 good scoring opportunities, and
then he got that *bonehead* 5-minute major high-sticking penalty.
 
Cullen has gotten stronger since his return from injury a hand-full of
games ago and he played a good game.  If the other players on his line
can smarten up, that line should do okay.  Clark's got to get tough --
he's got to intimidate and go for the net.  Send Clark up the left 
wing over the blue line a couple times... his patented wrist shot will
put some numbers on the board... and Pearson... heck, maybe he should
be benched.
 
I hate to repeat Grapes, but where the heck was Foligno?  Zezel can't
do all the checking himself -- and get MacLlwain on the move... we 
need some speed out there!  Keep Potvin in net, he did okay 
considering... although (like I said a couple weeks ago) Potvin 
messed up in a couple games in the AHL playoffs last year -- he can 
easily do it again.
 
My prediction last week was Toronto in 7 -- that the games DET wins 
will be blow-outs and the game TOR wins will be close -- I still stand
by that.
 
Don't fret, Leafs fans, in order to win in 7, the other team has to
win 3! :-)
 
Burns is going to make some magic -- he'll mix up some lines.  Match
the Wings line-per-line.  He'll have his team checking hard, and he'll
never let them get out-numbered in their own end.  The Leafs will win
Wednesday night... and will take 1 or their home games (probably the
first one).
 
Stephen LEAF Legge
SLEGGE@kean.ucs.mun.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53824
From: filipows@spk.hp.com (Dennis Filipowski)
Subject: ? Octopus

   During the Detroit game Mon night there were octopus thrown on
   the ice what is the meaning or symbolism here?  They used to
   throw fish on the ice here in Spokane afew years ago. I never 
   knew where this came from.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53825
Subject: Re: NHLPA poll (partial stats/results)
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <ofnmaO_00iV1A6kYd2@andrew.cmu.edu> Young-Soo Che <yc25+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>All these people who send in their polls should take a closer look at
>NJD, they are a very deep team, with two very capable goalies, and
>excellent forwards and defensemen.  Shooter in Richer, an all around do
>it all in Todd, chef Stasny-master of a thousand dishes, power play

Kevin Todd is an Oiler and has been one for months. How closely do you follow
the Devils, anyway? Jeez....

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53826
Subject: Re: Tie Breaker....(Isles and Devils)
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <lrw509f@rpi.edu>, wangr@vccsouth22.its.rpi.edu ( Rex Wang ) writes:
> 	Are people here stupid or what??? It is a tie breaker, of cause they
> have to have the same record. How can people be sooooo stuppid to put win as
> first in the list for tie breaker??? If it is a tie breaker, how can there be
> different record???? Man, I thought people in this net are good with hockey.
> I might not be great in Math, but tell me how can two teams ahve the same points
> with different record??? Man...retard!!!!!! Can't believe people actually put
> win as first in a tie breaker......

Then allow me to enlighten you, Rex. You see, there's a thing called a tie. 
A tie is worth one point (I know, I know. You're not good at math. But bear
with me). A win is worth two points. So, getting two ties is the same as 
getting one win. If your team played two games, won one and lost one, you'd
have two points. If my team played two games and tied them both, we'd also
have two points. We'd be tied in the standings even though our records are
different.

Perhaps you should learn something about hockey before posting again. (I am
starting to sound like Roger or what?)

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53827
From: ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca)
Subject: Re: Wings will win

gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:

>All of this is fine.  I never said that Murray was a bad GM.  I merely said
>that he isn't the best GM in hockey- or even a contender for that honor.
>If Murray is as great as you claim- the Wings would have won the Stanley Cup
>by now- probably more than once.  If he was as great a GM as you claim

I think you missed one of my points there.  It takes *more* than a great
GM to win a stanley cup, even once.  Some of the guys on the list you
gave earlier never won one.  I agree that you and I could probably argue
back and forth for days to no avail about who is the best GM in hockey-
that is a matter of opinion, and who is to say my opinion is any better 
than yours or yours than mine?  But the point of my *original* original
post (if not well stated) was that Murray has the GM abilities but not
the coaching abilities.  Which leads to below:

>and he was as poor a coach as you claim- he would have been intelligent
>enough to hire the coach to push the team to the next level of success.

I think at this point there's a personal, emotional element involved here
which transcends Murray's logical thought.  As outsiders, it's fine for 
us to say, "He should hire a different coach."  In fact, he has talked about
doing so in the past.  But, the press (here in Detroit, at least) has so
built up this business about Murray never getting past the second round of
the playoffs as a coach, that I think he has taken it upon himself to 
prove to the world that he *is* capable of coaching a team past the second
round.  He needs to, as the papers say, "get that monkey off his back."
So it becomes a matter not of intelligence, but of pride.  Is it foolish
to let pride stand in the way of sound logic?  Perhaps, but we're all
a little that way from time to time.  I think eventually he'll step down
from behind the bench and concentrate on his GM duties, and the team will
improve as a result.

I think his coaching duties take away time he might have otherwise spent
on GM work.  In that sense, once he steps down as coach, we'll see how
good of a GM he really is.

>But Murray is an average (unspectacular) NHL coach and a pretty good GM
>so none of this is true anyway.

I may not agree with everything you've said, but it's been fun discussing
it with you.

>Gregmeister

--Randy


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53828
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Subject: Re: Schedule...

In article <1993Apr20.052907.1625@news.columbia.edu> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>I can't believe that ESPN is making SportsChannel America look good.

But only in NY,NJ, Philadelphia, and Chicago. Everywhere else, the only
reason SportsChannel was available was for local baseball broadcasts.
And local baseball pre-empted the NHL playoffs. Thus far into this
playoff season, ESPN/ABC has given me more hockey in 2 days (1 game)
than SportsChannel did (0 games).

If people want hockey on TV, they should watch hockey on TV. I bet the
ratings for hockey on Sunday on ABC went into the toilet. Next week, there
will be far fewer ABC affiliates with hockey.

Someone in this thread said that he wouldn't watch the games even if
they were on TV, and this is a r.s.h. regular contributor!

Xenophobes north of border needn't fear the US-Americanization of "our"
game, because US-Americans will never figure out how to market hockey
here. Support your team; support your game.
-- 
 Mike Eisler, mre@Eng.Sun.Com  ``Not only are they [Leafs] the best team, but
 their fans are even more intelligent and insightful than Pittsburgh's.  Their
 players are mighty bright, too.  I mean, he really *was* going to get his
 wallet back, right?'' Jan Brittenson 3/93, on Leaf/Pen woofers in
 rec.sport.hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53829
From: yaska@eecg.toronto.edu (Yaska Sankar)
Subject: Re: Nords 3 - Habs 2 in O.T. We was robbed!!

In article <1993Apr19.141842.18456@newshub.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:
>In article <18APR93.25909598.0086@VM1.MCGILL.CA> JBE5 <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA> writes:
>>Aargh!
>>
>>Paul Stewart is the worst and most biased ref. presently in the NHL.
>>He called a total of 4 penalties on the Habs and one on the Nordiques.
>>The Nords' penalty came in O.T.  Stewart, being an ex-Nordique himself,
>>was looking to call penalties on the Habs while letting the Nords
>>get away with murder...WE WAS ROBBED!!!!
>
>No.  Patrick Roy is the reason the game was lost, and Ron Hextall is the
>reason Quebec won.  Everybody said it would come down to goaltending, that
>goaltending was the key, etc etc.  Well, the key doesn't quite fit if you're
>Montreal.  

I don't buy this at all. Roy was the reason the game was tied... and that
would *not* have been the case had Dionne kept his cool. 
Hextall gave up 2 very questionable goals himself ...
Both Dionne's and Bellows' shots were misplayed by Hextall, but just because
his gaffes were early in the game, no one seems to care. Roy stood on his head 
for the first 15 minutes of the game when the Nords were rushing from 
end-to-end. Kamensky's mini-break after the tying goal and the first shot by 
Young in OT were both excellent chances stopped by Roy. Roy outplayed Hextall 
for most of the game, but Roy becomes the villain and Hextall the hero 
because Roy's team didn't make full use of their opportunities.

Hextall, on the other hand, had a lot of lucky bounces ... he played very 
well, but the Haller shot off the post in OT, the rebound bouncing over 
Bellows' stick, the Brunet breakaway, the 3 chances for LeClair ... all 
those opportunities were *not* finished off by Montreal, and it cost them.
Hextall wasn't particularly brilliant on those plays ... 

>Blaming Stewart is just an
>excuse to avoid facing the fact that Roy allowed what was one of the worst
>goals he could possibly allow.  He even saw the whole shot, dammit.

Sure, no excuse ... but it was just the 1 goal. The timing stank, but against
an explosive team like Quebec, they gave them 1 opportunity too many with
a powerplay that was totally unnecessary.

>Montreal played a solid game (although they still don't know how to clear
>traffic in front of the net; the loss of Schneider will hurt even more). 

I disagree. Roy played well because he wasn't screened the whole night. 
The defense, for the 1st time this season, played remarkably, keeping Sakic,
Nolan, and Sundin  out of the slot most of the night.

>Normally I would say that any team that blows a 2-goal lead with less than 
>five, let alone two, minutes to go in regulation time IN A PLAYOFF GAME 
>ESPECIALLY needs to be smacked upside their collective heads. But I don't
>think this was a team loss (although Keane should have been able to clear 
>the zone just prior to the first Quebec goal).  

This most certainly was a team loss... Leclair missed his opportunities,
as did Bellows and Brunet. Dionne took a bad penalty. Damphousse and Lebeau
were *silent*. Carbonneau and Savard were a step behind all night. Roy gave
up the bad goal. Roy, by no means, can be singled out for this loss.

>Roy is paid big money to 
>play.  He looked like a player in an industrial league on Sakic's shot.

And Hextall didn't on Dionne's goal? Please. Roy is paid big money because
that is his value compared to other goalies ... and he still is in the top 5,
when you consider the defense, or lack of one, that played in front of him
for most of the season.

>Demers should start Racicot in the next game.  If not that, he should let
>the damn team read the papers for the next day or two....and maybe this
>article, if possible.

The Montreal media is the quickest to heap praise and then hurl derogatory
comments against the Habs. They are no better than uninformed fans. Why should
they read the papers? They played 58 minutes of "Burnsian" hockey to shut
down Quebec. All they need tonight, and for the rest of the series is the 
extra 2.

Red Light to face Quebec...rubbish. That's a guaranteed way to end the
series 4-0. Who would be taught a lesson by this ?
The fans, the media, and Racicot, perhaps. Certainly not the rest of the team.

>I didn't think the wrap-around was as bad as the second goal.  I also didn't
>think Scott Young should have gotten around the defender (can't remember who)
>in the first place.  But you are correct, it shouldn't have gone in
>regardless.

If you mean the goal should never have gone in, because there should never
have been an OT, then I agree. But the goal itself was a great piece of work
by Young. Roy had both the near and far posts covered, but Young flipped the
puck up under Roy's arm as he wrapped-around the net ... not a bad goal at all.

Yaska  ! yaska@eecg.toronto.edu ! Dept. of Electrical & Computer Engineering
Sankar !                        ! University of Toronto, Toronto, Canada

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53830
From: gp2011@andy.bgsu.edu (George Pavlic)
Subject: Re: Matt Militzok please read!

In article <gp2011-200493132808@m248-68.bgsu.edu>, gp2011@andy.bgsu.edu
(George Pavlic) wrote:
> 
> 
> Sorry to everyone for wasting space.  Matt, the other day you posted that
> you were doing a mailing list of playoff stats.  I lost your address. 
> Please put me on that list.  Thanks.
> 
> George 

Sorry again.  I guess you need my address.

gp2011@mailserver.bgsu.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53831
From: 900073s@dragon.acadiau.ca (Donald Smith)
Subject: Re: LIST OF TEE TIMES AT METROPOLITAN TORONTO GOLF COURSES FOR MONDAY

lee139@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (Steve Lee) writes:


>In article <C5spEC.EuC@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber) writes:

>Woops!  This is rec.sport.hockey! Not rec.sport.golf!  Hope you check the
>newsgroup header next time before posting!

>Steve Lee      *      University of Western Ontario      *      London, Canada 
>                      lee139@obelix.gaul.csd.uwo.ca          

  Actually Steve, I think he was refering to the Leafs, and when they can
be expected to hit the greens...

-- 
  ACADIA AXEMEN! CIAU CHAMPIONS, 1993! 
  Donald.Smith@dragon.acadiau.ca 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53832
From: sclark@epas.utoronto.ca (Susan Clark)
Subject: Re: Bay area media (Wings-Leafs coverage)

	Yeah, the news is true...the Leafs lost to the Wings 6-3.
Wish I could say I'd seen the whole game but my husband wanted
to watch "Young Guns II" on another channel. Sometime between
the first time I tuned in and d saw the Leafs tie and the next time
I tuned in and heard the score was 5-1, something happened.
	Please no woofing from Red Wings fans.  They're my third
favourite team, and if they make it past the Leafs I'll wish them
luck.  As for Potvin...well, it WAS his fist playoff game.

Susan Carroll-Clark
Who likes ANYONE Doug Gilmour plays for

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53833
From: steve@sep.Stanford.EDU (Steve Cole)
Subject: Re: SHARKS:  Kingston Fired!!!

In article <1993Apr20.165132.9777@adobe.com>, snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols) writes:
|> In article <1993Apr20.085337.27224@leland.Stanford.EDU> terry@garfield.Stanford.EDU (Terry Wong) writes:
|> >I think that Jack Ferreira's firing eventually led to Kingston's
|> >firing.  You mention consistency of vision.  I think the
|> >Sharks lost that with the loss of Ferreira.  There has never
|> >been a 3 headed G.M. that has ever worked.  You need one
|> >person making the personnel decisions at the top, not
|> >management by committee.  The conventional wisdom
|> >from around the league is that Ferreira would have
|> >made the moves that would have fielded a better product
|> >on the ice.
|> 
|> How exactly would Ferreira accomplished this?  The three-headed GM-ship has
|> taken a lot of heat, but nobody's explained how things would have been any
|> different had Ferreira still been there.  Would Ferreira have made more
|> trades?  Who would have he had traded?  Would he have made fewer trades?
|> Who should not have been traded?

I think the three-headed GM's guiding principle was to keep veterans
in favor of youngsters only if they offered a "significant" advantage.
At the end of last season, the contracts of several veterans with somewhat
maginal contributions (Fenton, Bozek, Anderson, and a couple others I
can't remember) were bought out. The idea was that youngsters could
play almost as well, and had the potential to improve where these
older guys did not. 
And they traded Mullen, because he wanted to go, not because he
wasn't good enough, but I think they were a bit too optimistic
in thinking they could make up for his contributions.
An example from this season, Skriko was brought in on a trial basis
but not kept, because of his age. I thought he was a decent
contributor worth keeping around.

The youth movement has its advantages; look at Gaudreau who
might still be in KC if more veterans had been kept around. But
you have to find the right balance.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Cole  (steve@sep.stanford.edu, apple!sep!steve)
Department of Geophysics, Stanford University, Stanford, CA 94305

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53834
From: kozloce@wkuvx1.bitnet
Subject: Re: Tie Breaker....(Isles and Devils)DIR

In article <1993Apr18.222115.6525@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca>, maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
> In <lrw509f@rpi.edu> wangr@vccsouth22.its.rpi.edu ( Rex Wang ) writes:
> 
>>I might not be great in Math, but tell me how can two teams ahve the same points
>>with different record??? Man...retard!!!!!! Can't believe people actually put
>>win as first in a tie breaker......
> 
> Well I don't see any smileys here.  I am trying to figure out if the poster
> is a dog or a wordprocessor.  Couldn't be neither.  Both are smarter than
> this.
> 
> "I might not be great in Math"
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
>                                            "So many morons...
> rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Roger? Lecture someone on not using smileys? What sweet hipocracy...

KOZ

LETS GO CAPS!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53835
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Playoff Hockey Pool: Game 1 standings

Here are the standings after game 1 of each of the divisional semi-finals.
(Hey, look who's #4!)  I'll try to post the standings after "each game"
(i.e. every two days).

I managed to recover the email lost up to Saturday night, so all I'm missing
is mail that arrived between early Saturday morning and Sunday afternoon.
Many people re-sent their teams, so you may have received two replies back
from me.  If your team name is not on this list, please resend your team
to me and I'll see what I can do.  Any kind of "proof" you sent it on the
weekend will help your case.  :-)  Seriously, this is only a fun pool and
I trust each person to be honest.

Again, sorry for any inconvenience, and I hope the pool is still fun for you.

	- Andrew


USENET Hockey Playoff Draft Standings

Posn	Team				Pts	Rem	Last Posn

1.	Sneddon Scorers                 43	25	(--)
2.	The Borg                        42	25	(--)
	Dave Wessels                    42	25	(--)
4.	Bruce's Rented Mules            41	25	(--)
	Great Expectations              41	25	(--)
	Hurricane Andrew                41	25	(--)
	Jerky Boys                      41	24	(--)
	Homesick Hawaiian               41	25	(--)
9.	give you money monday           40	25	(--)
	Einstien's Punk Band            40	25	(--)
11.	Zipper Heads                    39	25	(--)
	Tapio Repo                      39	25	(--)
	Detroit Homeboy                 39	25	(--)
	the dead ducks                  39	25	(--)
	Mike Burger                     39	25	(--)
	Test Department                 39	25	(--)
	Team Elvis                      39	25	(--)
	Craig team                      39	25	(--)
19.	Skate or Die                    38	25	(--)
	Debbie Bowles                   38	25	(--)
	Fuzzfaces Galore                38	25	(--)
	suds                            38	25	(--)
	The Campi Machine               38	25	(--)
	zachmans wingers                38	25	(--)
	Sean Forbes                     38	25	(--)
	Threepeat                       38	25	(--)
	Flamming Senators               38	25	(--)
	Team Awesome                    38	25	(--)
	A.P. BURY                       38	25	(--)
	PURDUE RICKS PENS               38	25	(--)
	GB Flyers                       38	25	(--)
	Seppo Kemppainen                38	25	(--)
33.	Paige Faults                    37	25	(--)
	weenies                         37	25	(--)
	chris roney                     37	25	(--)
	Rednecks from Hockey Hell       37	25	(--)
	Dog's Hog's                     37	25	(--)
	Mind Sweepers                   37	25	(--)
	Teem Kanada                     37	25	(--)
	Northern Lights                 37	25	(--)
	Fugazi                          37	25	(--)
	Delaware Destroyers             37	25	(--)
	Mopar Muscle Men                37	25	(--)
	Lance Hill The Boston Bruins Fa 37	25	(--)
	garryola                        37	25	(--)
	Oakville Brothers               37	25	(--)
	Sam & His Dogs                  37	25	(--)
	Cluster Buster                  37	24	(--)
	Jan Stein                       37	25	(--)
	frank's little wankers          37	25	(--)
	Milton Keynes Kings             37	25	(--)
	The promise land                37	25	(--)
	Rangers Of Destiny              37	25	(--)
54.	New Zealand Leafs               36	25	(--)
	Loaded Weapons                  36	25	(--)
	Bloom County All-Stars          36	25	(--)
	Robarts Research Rebels         36	25	(--)
	Tiger Chung Lees                36	25	(--)
	goddess of fermentation         36	25	(--)
	make beliefs                    36	25	(--)
	Rob Del Mundo                   36	25	(--)
	Heikki Salmi                    36	25	(--)
	The Underwriters                36	25	(--)
	Muller n Walker                 36	25	(--)
	Controversy Warriors            36	25	(--)
	Bjorkloven                      36	25	(--)
	Norway Killerwhales             36	25	(--)
	Holsteins SFB                   36	25	(--)
	buffalo soldiers                36	25	(--)
	Lemon Pepper Grizzly Bears      36	25	(--)
	FRACK ATTACK                    36	25	(--)
	Houdini's Magicians             36	25	(--)
	The ^&#@$#$% Rangers of 1940    36	24	(--)
	Rangers Blow                    36	25	(--)
75.	Dave Hiebert                    35	25	(--)
	Yan Loke                        35	25	(--)
	Canadian Gladiators             35	25	(--)
	littlest giants                 35	25	(--)
	Alf's All-Stars                 35	25	(--)
	The Ice Kickers                 35	25	(--)
	Beer Makes Me An Expert         35	25	(--)
	Force 25                        35	25	(--)
	Mr Creosote                     35	25	(--)
	The Goobmeister                 35	25	(--)
	The Mulberry Maulers            35	25	(--)
	Rev's Rebels                    35	25	(--)
	BOSSE                           35	25	(--)
	Zippety Doodah                  35	25	(--)
	Kramer George and Jerry         35	25	(--)
	DehraDun Maawalis               35	25	(--)
	Sludge                          35	25	(--)
	j's rock'em sock'ems            35	25	(--)
	brians bloodletters             35	25	(--)
	Grant Marven                    35	25	(--)
	Arctic Circles                  35	25	(--)
	all the kane's men              35	25	(--)
	trevor's triumph                35	25	(--)
	Mark And Steve Dreaming Again   35	25	(--)
	Goaldingers                     35	25	(--)
	Bjoern Leaguen                  35	25	(--)
	Habs Playing Golf               35	25	(--)
102.	Shigella                        34	25	(--)
	New Jersey Rob                  34	25	(--)
	Steves Superstars               34	25	(--)
	Big Bay Bombers                 34	25	(--)
	Doug Bowles                     34	25	(--)
	Neural Netters                  34	25	(--)
	LIPPE                           34	25	(--)
	Lets Go Pandas                  34	25	(--)
	Les Raisins                     34	25	(--)
	Daves knee jerk picks           34	25	(--)
	Monica Loke                     34	25	(--)
	Jason team                      34	25	(--)
	RENEB                           34	25	(--)
	Schott Shooters                 34	25	(--)
	Gilles Carmel                   34	25	(--)
	Lewey's Lakers                  34	25	(--)
	smithw                          34	25	(--)
	East City Jokers                34	25	(--)
	Daryl Turner                    34	25	(--)
	Doug Mraz                       34	25	(--)
	Skriko Wolves                   34	25	(--)
	IceMachine                      34	25	(--)
	Lamp Lighters                   34	25	(--)
	On Thin Ice                     34	25	(--)
	JOE'S A CRAK HEAD               34	25	(--)
127.	Samuel Lau (Calgary, Alberta)   33	25	(--)
	Comfortably Numb                33	25	(--)
	Reksa fans of Oulu              33	25	(--)
	Gail Hiebert                    33	25	(--)
	gee man                         33	25	(--)
	But Wait Theres more            33	25	(--)
	marcs maulers                   33	25	(--)
	Danielle Leblanc                33	25	(--)
	Bobby Schmautz Fan Club         33	25	(--)
	Ottawa Bearcats                 33	25	(--)
	Boops Bets                      33	25	(--)
	triple X                        33	25	(--)
	Timo Ojala                      33	25	(--)
	Flying pigs                     33	25	(--)
141.	The Eradicators                 32	25	(--)
	Van Isle Colonists              32	25	(--)
	Commitments                     32	25	(--)
	bure's blur                     32	25	(--)
	Great Scott                     32	25	(--)
	weasels                         32	25	(--)
	Tequila Shooters                32	25	(--)
	Whiters                         32	25	(--)
	Frasses Faceplants              32	25	(--)
	High Stickers                   32	25	(--)
	Mak Paranjape                   32	25	(--)
	Lord Stanley's Favourites       32	25	(--)
	San Jose Mahi Mahi              32	25	(--)
	Oz                              32	25	(--)
	E.I.S                           32	25	(--)
	Mann Mariners                   32	24	(--)
	JFZ Dream Team                  32	25	(--)
	Stacey Ross                     32	25	(--)
	Louisiana Psycho Killers        32	25	(--)
	La Coupe Stainless              32	25	(--)
161.	fighting amish                  31	25	(--)
	Evan Pritchard                  31	25	(--)
	Stanias Stars                   31	25	(--)
	Pens Dynasty                    31	25	(--)
	oceanweavers                    31	25	(--)
	go go gagit                     31	25	(--)
	Myllypuro Hedgehogs             31	25	(--)
	Arm & Hammer                    31	25	(--)
	Legzryx                         31	25	(--)
	Chapman Chaps                   31	25	(--)
	Dean Martin                     31	25	(--)
	Cherry Bombers                  31	25	(--)
173.	Sluggo's Hosers                 30	25	(--)
	Anson Mak                       30	25	(--)
	Knights on a Power Play         30	25	(--)
176.	Canuck Force                    29	25	(--)
	butt ends                       29	25	(--)
	beam team                       29	25	(--)
	JUKURIT                         29	25	(--)
	Chapman Sticks                  29	25	(--)
	Ken De Cruyenaere               29	25	(--)
	gax goons                       29	25	(--)
	Tampere Salami                  29	25	(--)
	Sparky's Select                 29	25	(--)
185.	Hillside Raiders                28	25	(--)
	Eldoret Elephants               28	25	(--)
	Jane's World                    28	25	(--)
	the ALarmers                    28	25	(--)
189.	Rolaids Required                27	25	(--)
	Chip n Dale                     27	25	(--)
	Brian Bergman                   27	25	(--)
192.	Killer Kings                    26	25	(--)
	Montys Nords                    26	25	(--)
194.	Arsenal Maple Leafs             25	18	(--)
	Martin's Gag                    25	25	(--)
196.	Equipe Du Jour                  24	25	(--)
197.	lisa's luggers                  23	25	(--)

-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53836
From: plarsen@sanjuan (P Allen Larsen)
Subject: Re: Canada 3 Sweden 1 at the World Champioships

In article <20APR199319243244@venus.cc.hollandc.pe.ca> white@venus.cc.hollandc.pe.ca (Take me Baby!) writes:
>
>	Today at the World Championships in Munich, Canada scored an 
>impressive 3-1 victory over the defending World Champs, Sweden. 

I believe that was 4-1.  Rod Brind-Amour scored at 19.59 of the third.

>
>Kevin White
>white@venus.cc.hollandc.pe.ca 


--
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
P. Allen Larsen                                           University of Victoria
plarsen@sanjuan.uvic.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53837
From: randolin@polisci.umn.edu (Robert Andolina)
Subject: minnesota scene

  To those who are wondering what is happening in Minnesota:

  From what I have seen in the local news (TV and newspaper), various people 
in the area are trying to get a new hockey team.  A columnist for the St. 
Paul "Pioneer Press" wrote an article giving the "inside scoop" on the 
issue.  There are three local sites competing for a team and three possible 
candiates to move to the Twin Cities.  First the sites: Target Center, Civic 
Center (St. Paul), and yes, even the Met Center.  The columnist was pretty 
confident that Minnesota will get a team, and that the Target Center will 
ultimately win out.  He argued, however, that the competition from the other 
two sites will delay the process considerably.  Without the 
inter-site competition, the columnist (sorry, I can't remember his name) 
believes that Minnesota would have a team by the 1994-95 season.  Also, 
because of the situation with the Timberwolves, things will be delayed 
until (unless) the city of Minneapolis takes over the Target Center.  
However, they are unlikely to do so until the Met Center is destroyed, 
because the city will lose money if there is competition from the Met for 
conventions and short-term events (even with hockey at Target).  To add to 
this mess, a STUDY (6 to 12 months) is going to be conducted on the future 
viability of the Met Center, which obviously delays the process even 
further.  I hope that the study is cancelled, which will have the effect of 
knocking the Met Center out of the running and perhaps encouraging 
Minneapolis to take over the Target Center sooner. The city would be
be even more encourged if the wrecking ball is taken to the Met, 
which may happen.
	Regarding possible candidates, the three teams are 
Hartford, Tampa Bay, and New Jersey.  I would prefer the Devils (Minnesota "
Ice Demons?") although the Lightning may have potential.  Although it hasn't 
been announced yet, it looks like 6 neutral site games will be played at the 
Target Center next year.  Apparently the Devils are interested in playing in 
as many of those six games as possible, and I wouldn't be surprised to see 
Hartford and Tampa show up there either.	So, Minnesota may end up 
getting another team, but it may take a few years.

	
	Go Sabres!
	
	Robert Andolina (former Buffalonian living in Minneapolis)
	randolin@polisci.umn.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53838
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Aargh! Great Hockey Coverage!! (Devils)

Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) says:
>>>
>>>I mean that the original poster was looking for a Devils victory
>>>on the tape delay, and it didn't happen in game 1.
>>
>>I was the original poster, and it was just a complaint about the
>>coverage (meaningless Yankee game before playoff Devils game).
>
>Oh!  I apologize then...I misinterpreted you!

No problem, no offence taken ...

>Of all the teams in the Patrick, I least dislike the Devils.

It is sad, just as a lover of the sport, that this team can be in
the metro New York area for over a decade and still exist as just
a non-entity ...

>How is ESPN's coverage anyways??? I think it starts tonight.

We're getting the Sabres-Bruins as the replacement game (and probably
so are you) while the Devils-Penguins game is played on SCNY and the
Islanders-Caps are the overflow game on the SCA (SCNY Plus).  If the
Sabres-Bruins ends early then we'll go to the Devils-Penguins game
(assuming that ESPN follows their previous patterns; we got the last
minute of the Islanders-Rangers and all of the overtime two weeks
ago).  ESPN's coverage started last night, by accident, but as one
or more other writers have pointed out, they could've gone to wild
hog wrestling for the evening instead ...

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53839
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Schedule...

mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler) writes:
>gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>>I can't believe that ESPN is making SportsChannel America look good.
>
>But only in NY,NJ, Philadelphia, and Chicago. Everywhere else, the only
>reason SportsChannel was available was for local baseball broadcasts.

Yes, a point well-taken ... however, even in areas that finally got
some games, there's something nagging in the back of your skull when
the network that has the national rights in its pocket says on its
sports news, "There's an awesome overtime going on in Quebec City,
and we'll *try* to get you an update through the show ..." when you
know that it's on a satellite's feedhorn somewhere up there ...

>If people want hockey on TV, they should watch hockey on TV. I bet 
>the ratings for hockey on Sunday on ABC went into the toilet. 

From today's Times, ABC got great ratings in Chicago and St. Louis (a
4.2), and the Kings-Flames got a 2.9 on the West Coast, but only a 2.2
in metro New York (i.e., the Devils squandered their newfound support
from a year ago when they played the Rangers )-;).  In comparison,
Seniors Golf did better ...

>Next week, there will be far fewer ABC affiliates with hockey.

I fear that the overall national numbers will not be so great ...
I can't tell if ABC did any advance marketing or not, 'cos I don't
watch much TV ... the NHL should have made sure that it was solid
on cable before going on the air.  Even ESPN could've sold second
rights to third party systems (i.e., non-SportsChannel) since they
are not making any extra money by sitting on the games ... hockey
fans will not necessarily be watching pre-season beach volleyball
if playoffs games aren't being shown somewhere ...

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53840
From: ching@bigwpi.WPI.EDU ("The Logistician")
Subject: #77's?


I am in need of all of the players wearing #77 in the NHL.  I know now only
of one, Ray Borque for the Bruins.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanx.

-- 
------------------------THE LOGISTICIAN REIGNS SUPREME!!!----------------------
|									      |
|   GO BLUE!!!   GO TIGERS!!!   GO PISTONS!!!   GO LIONS!!!   GO RED WINGS!!! |
-------------------------------ching@wpi.wpi.edu-------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53841
From: kozloce@wkuvx1.bitnet
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN

I agree. It was great for the ESPN people to show the Detroit game. (My
roommate just about sh*t when they threw the octopus on the ice. (Thanks
for explaining the significance of that BTW)) The only problem I had was
when they blotted out the local commentators with the baseball ads and
music. Especially when the wings player hit the rut and went into the
boards injuring his shoulder and they blotted out the injury report. Other
then that, hats off to ESPN. Now if they'll only make a habit of this. Yeah
right! Baseball seasons started (Zzzzzz.....) =)

KOZ 

LETS GO CAPS!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53842
From: kozloce@wkuvx1.bitnet
Subject: Re: Atlanta Hockey Hell!!DIR

> Someone give SportChannel a call (or maybe Ted Turner).
> Wasn't USA network covering the playoffs years ago?
> 
> Jim G.

Oh to be back in the good old days when I lived in Florida (Florida for
Petes sake!!) and could watch hockey every night as ESPN and USA alternated
coverage nights. Oh well I guess it would be too simple for the home office
to look back into their past to solve a problem in the present...

Of course I shouldn't complain. At least I'm getting to watch the playoffs
for a change. (Hooray!!) Now if the ESPN schedulers will realise there are
other teams except Pittsberg in the Patrick. (Sounds like a Dr Suess Book
=)

KOZ

LETS GO CAPS!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53843
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: If You Were Pat Burns ...

In article <C5suH3.3q0@tsegw.tse.com> mhembruc@tsegw.tse.com (Mattias Hembruch) writes:
>>hell is Anderson?  Anderson can (in days past) get under peoples
>>skin.  Put a little more bluntly, Anderson has to be an asshole.
>>He used to be good at it.  We need him now.  
>
>Agreed. Anderson was nowhere last night.
>

Well what do you expect...Burns was playing him with Krushelnyski
and Baumgartner...Anderson is a finisher...unless you play him with
someone to can get him the puck in a finishing position...he ain't
going to do much scoring!

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53844
From: c115110@cs.UAlberta.CA (Keith Scott Alan)
Subject: Hockey coverage

This is a general question for US readers:

How extensive is the playoff coverage down there?  In Canada, it is almost
impossible not to watch a series on TV (ie the only two series I have not had
an opportunity to watch this year are Wash-NYI and Chi-Stl, the latter because
I'm in the wrong time zone!).  We (in Canada) are basically swamped with 
coverage, and I wonder how many series/games are televised nationally or even
locally in the US and how much precedence they take over, say, local news if
the games go into double-OT.

Email me so as not to waste bandwidth, please.  My news feed is kind of slow
anyways.

l8tr


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53845
From: vergolin@haydn.lbs.msu.edu (David Vergolini)
Subject: Probert and Wendall

  Game two of the Detroit - Toronto series will be a rougher game.  I believe
that Clark will be coming out hitting on all cylindars.  I believe that Probert
will take exception to this and a fight between Clark and Probert will result.
  I know this sounds kind of ridiculous, but I know game two Toronto will come
out hitting.
  Any takers on this issue?

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53846
From: grogers@slacvx.slac.stanford.edu (Greg Rogers)
Subject: Hey, What about teh Cannucks?

Hi all,

Due to living in the Bay Area, I as unable to see Vancouver's victory over
the Jets last night.  I know the score, but that rarely describes the game.
Could someone please post a brief sonapsis (sp?) of waht happened.  How well
did each team play?  Were the cannucks deserving of the victory?

Also, could some kind soul please email me the end of season, individual
player stats?

Greg

-- Vancouver for the cup (in a virtual reality)--

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53847
From: dvb@ssd.kodak.com (Dave Blaszyk)
Subject: Re: If You Were Pat Burns ...

Jason Cockroft (jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM) wrote:

: What are the Leafs to do?  I am a Leaf supporter and
: I say the Leafs are going down in four unless there
: is nothing short of a miracle or a stroke of genenius hits

Root for another team. ;-)

: Andreychuck and Borchevsky have no business playing against 
: the Wings.  They are too small.  The key to any Leafs success
: will have to be Clark.  He is the only centre who can have
..
Andreychuk, is NOT small, slow and sloth-like, maybe, but he is
about 6'4" and that is not what I would consider as small.

As an aside, The big AndreyCHUNK as I call him has been known to
disappear come playoff time.  This was one of his main problems when
playing for Buffalo.

: GO LEAFS !!!
GO SABRES !!!




--
      /-//   \\-\Dave Blaszyk	e-mail	: dvb@snowmass.ssd.kodak.com
     /-//\   /\\-\(716) 253-7953  mail	: Eastman Kodak
  ///d// \\v// \\b\\\   		  C Plant, Bldg. 10 MC 39011
  \\\//   \//   \\///			  Rochester, New York 14620

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53848
From: un026300@wvnvms.wvnet.edu
Subject: Re: How to beat the Pens


	You can't.  But good luck trying.

	Jim



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53849
From: ayari@judikael.loria.fr (Ayari Iskander)
Subject: Re: How to beat Pittsburgh!

In article <1993Apr15.214902.3372@guvax.acc.georgetown.edu>, apanjabi@guvax.acc.georgetown.edu writes:
|> In article <AfnKOVK00UhB01RDtJ@andrew.cmu.edu>, Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
|> > 	<kfnJYea00Uh_I1VmUs@andrew.cmu.edu>
|> > NNTP-Posting-Host: po5.andrew.cmu.edu
|> > In-Reply-To: <kfnJYea00Uh_I1VmUs@andrew.cmu.edu>
|> > 
|> > from Anna Matyas:
|> >>>Now if we could just clone Chelios's personality and transplant it
|> >>>into all of the defensemen on the Islanders, Capitals, and Devils...
|> >>> 
|> >>>Gerald
|> >> 
|> >>In other words, you want to turn them all into assholes so they
|> >>will spend lots of time in the penalty box and get lots of
|> >>misconducts?
|> >> 
|> >>And this comes from a Chelios fan...
|> > 
|> > Yeah, and also be second in the team in scoring and play about 35
|> > minutes a game and play on the power play and kill penalties and be the
|> > best defenseman in the league. I'd take a whole team of Chelioses if I
|> > could. (That way, when one got a penalty the others could kill it!)
|> > 
|> > Ralph
|> 
|> >HOW TO BEAT PITTSBURGH???
|> 
|> 	I.Mario Lemieux
|> 		A.Death
|> 			1.Too much Kimo
|> 			2.Slash to skull
|> 			3.Ask the Rangers (Slashing his wrist????)
|> 	II.Jaromir Jagr
|> 		A.Deportation
|> 			1.Send him back to whatever Commie country 
|> 			  he's from
|> 			2.Tell him that Bill Clinton is going too
|> 	III.Kevin Stevens
|> 		A.Fighting
|> 			1.Call Bob Probert
|> 			2.Call Tie Domi
|> 			3.Call my grandmother (She'd kick his ass)
|>  

Since everybody wants to see Pittsburgh players not playing, the
Stanley cup would be devaluated.

-- 
_____________________________________________________

  Iskander AYARI

  Email : Iskander.Ayari@loria.fr ou ayari@loria.fr
_____________________________________________________


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53850
Subject: Re: Smiths birthday goal was LEAFS GO ALL THE WAY !!!
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <C4wty9.40u@mcs.anl.gov>, mwm@aps.anl.gov (Michael W. McDowell) writes:
> In article 5KL@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca, kwk2chow@descartes.uwaterloo.ca (KEVIN C.) writes:
>> (Thanks for the goals by Steve Smith) 
> I don't see why more people don't blame grant fuhr for the goal that smith 
> put in his own net, it's common to play the puck back to your own goalie when
> deep in your own end and under little or no pressure from the offensive team.
> If fuhr had been in position the puck would have never crossed the line.

From this account, it doesn't sound like you even saw the goal, Mike. Smith
came out from behind his own net and fired a breakout pass that hit Fuhr in the
back of the leg. Fuhr was backing up at the time and never saw what
happened. The puck went straight off Fuhr's leg and into the net. Fuhr never
had a chance. There was no play back to the goaltender, in fact Perry Berezan
of Calgary had just dumped it in and Smith was retrieving it. 

It was unfortunate that it happened; Smith is a nice guy and was only a rookie
at the time, and on his birthday too. But all the blame lies with him. Starting
in pee-wee coaches tell players never to make a cross-ice pass in front of 
their own net. Too much chance of having it intercepted, or hitting the 
goaltender, or whatever.

And to the people who say that Smith cost the Oilers the series, I can only
say that he certainly didn't cause the team to lose the other three games.
There was no reason for a powerhouse team like Edmonton to be tied late
in the third period of the 7th game of the second round. Everybody on the team
has to take responsibility for them even being in that situation.

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53851
Subject: Re: Potvin's new goalie mask
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <allan.734333484@swanlake>, allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan) writes:
> slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca writes:
> 
>>I was wtahcing RIGHT GUARD HOCKEY WEEK on TSN yesterday and they had
>>a feature on this guy that does a lot (most?) of the masks for NHL
>>goalies.  They talked about how they are made, what they are made of,
>>and the designs that are put on them, etc.
> 
>>The best one of all was one he never talked about, he just held it up.
>>It has the current Leafs crest on the chin and an awesome looking 
>>black panther on the forehead -- it *has* to be a new mask for Felix
>>Potvin, but he never said whose it was.
> 
> Are you sure this program was current? I know that Grant Fuhr
> had a black panther on the forehead of his mask when he played with
> the Leafs. 

It would seem logical that the mask is Potvins. His nickname is "The Cat", 
which would go a long ways towards explaining the panther. 

Of course, it could be an old story and the mask is Fuhrs, too.....

								Alan


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53852
From: v103r4g8@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (We will NOT cave in....GODS OF WAR, Def Leppard)
Subject: HELP HELP HELP


Does anyone have the NHL STANDINGS for March 28th? I need them IMMEDIATELY
for a project. Please post or email. THANKS.




*************************************************************************
                Andy Hillery --- School Of Architecture	  	
                State University of New York at Buffalo 
*************************************************************************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53853
From: schock@cpsc.ucalgary.ca (Craig Schock)
Subject: Re: Smiths birthday goal was LEAFS GO ALL THE WAY !!!

In article <C5JunA.4vH@cpsc.ucalgary.ca> layfield@cpsc.ucalgary.ca (Colin Layfield) writes:
>In article <C4wty9.40u@mcs.anl.gov> mwm@aps.anl.gov writes:
>>In article 5KL@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca, kwk2chow@descartes.uwaterloo.ca (KEVIN C.) writes:
>>> (Thanks for the goals by Steve Smith) 
>>I don't see why more people don't blame grant fuhr for the goal that smith 
>>put in his own net, it's common to play the puck back to your own goalie when
>>deep in your own end and under little or no pressure from the offensive team.
>>If fuhr had been in position the puck would have never crossed the line.
>>
>>Mike McDowell
>
>I have to disagree with you on this one.  It is anything BUT common.  In the
>4 or 5 years I have been watching hockey I have NEVER seen this happen EVER.
>
>I am not sure what league you have been watching.  :-)
>
>Anyone else agree with this?

Yes, Colin... I have to agree with you here...  I've put the puck in
my own net the same way Smith did... (only once, mind you :-) and it
was definitely my fault.  It is NOT a common play to play the puck the
way that Smith did.  

Luckily, for me...  when I did it... it was only a scrimmage :-)

Craig

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53854
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: Blues into playoffs, beat TB 6-5

By Dave Luecking Of The Post-Dispatch Staff

At 9:11 Thursday night, the scoreboard watchers at The Arena began to cheer.
Their cheer quickly turned into a roar, and finally, the sellout crowd of
17,816 rose as one to rock the old barn at 5700 Oakland Avenue in a salute to
the playoff-bound Blues.

The scoreboard had just flashed the news from Detroit -- Red Wings 5, Stars 3.
With the North Stars' loss, the Blues officially clinched fourth place and the
final playoff spot in the Norris Division. Good thing, because the Blues quit
playing.

They held a 5-1 lead over Tampa Bay when the Detroit-Minnesota final appeared
with 3 minutes 52 remaining in the second period. They promptly went to sleep
and barely held on for a 6-5 victory that nearly slipped away at the buzzer.
Tampa's Bob Beers tipped in a pass from Shawn Chambers, but officiating
supervisor John D'Amico and video goal judge Rich Schweigler ruled that the
shot had gone into the net after time had expired.

``I'm glad I didn't see it go in at the end," Blues coach Bob Berry said.

If the goal had counted, he'd have been more upset than he was by the Blues'
disappearance in the final 24 minutes. Holding on for the victory and making
the playoffs tempered Berry's anger.

``It wasn't pretty at the end," he said. ``We played 36, 37 great minutes, as
good as we played all year. It slipped away at the end. It shouldn't have, but
it did."

Still, the Blues won, prompting another ovation from the crowd at game's end.
Despite their shoddy effort in the third period and all the turmoil this
season, the Blues still made the playoffs. They'll meet the Chicago Blackhawks
in a best-of-seven Norris Division semifinal, beginning at noon Sunday at
Chicago Stadium.

The Blues finished the regular-season with a record of 37-36-11 for 85 points,
their fourth consecutive plus-.500 season. Minnesota finished three points
behind in fifth place, with a record of 36-38- 10 for 82 points. Tampa Bay,
which played spoiler last week by tying the Blues 2-2 at Tampa, ended its
first season with a record of 23-54-7 for 53 points.

The poor finish cast an unnecessary shadow over what should have been a joyous
Blues locker room. Instead, the mood was one of relief and some disappointment.

``It's a shame we let down," said Kevin Miller, one of three Blues to score
two goals. Brendan Shanahan and Bob Bassen were the others.
``There was no need for a letdown. If we'd have kept working, it would have
ended 6-2 and everyone would be happy."

Instead, a lot of players were happy just to make the playoffs.
``We won, and that's all that matters," said Brett Hull, scoreless and minus-3
for the night. ``Once we got up 4-0, it was really tough to play."

Some players didn't have a problem.

``Just because the score was announced, our line didn't quit," said Rich
Sutter, who played with Bassen and Miller. ``We still had a game to play. You
can't allow five goals like we did, that's not right.

``It was disappointing to see what was going on."

Bassen was almost frantic on the bench because of the Blues' effort. Somehow,
he missed the announcement of Minnesota's loss.

``I didn't know it was final," he said. ``I was kind of looking around on the
bench. I didn't realize it was a final for some reason. We're in the playoffs,
and that's great, but it's a little disappointing to play like we did at the
end."

The letdown was precisely the reason that Berry had instructed the scoreboard
operators to keep the Minnesota-Detroit score off of the board. The score
showed 0-0 until it first popped up with Detroit leading 4-2 in the third
period. The Blues already led 4-0 at the time.

``I told them I didn't want to see the score, I didn't want to know the score,"
Berry said. ``I felt we had to win the game, and that's the approach we took."

If Minnesota took a lead, Berry feared, the pressure of having to win might
bother the Blues. If Detroit led, he worried, the Blues might quit.

Until the announcement, the Blues played splendidly. Shanahan got the crowd
going at 10:44 of the first period, scoring his 50th of the season. Then,
Miller and Bassen took charge late in the period.

With the teams playing four on four, Miller broke in on left wing, deked
defenseman Roman Hamrlik and beat former Blues goalie Pat Jablonski with the
rebound of his own shot with 21.6 seconds remaining in the period.

Then, just 10.5 seconds later, Bassen rifled a long slap shot past Jablonski
after defenseman Rick Zombo intercepted a Tampa pass in the neutral zone.

Bassen made it 4-0 just 14 seconds into the second period, scoring on the 
rebound of Bret Hedican's shot. The goal gave him his first two-goal game of
the season and reminded him of a special friend.

Last year, Bassen befriended young Oliver Mulvihill, who died of a rare form
of cancer at age 6 on Feb. 23.

``I was thinking of my buddy Oliver," Bassen said. ``He's in heaven now, and
I know he was watching. I know he's happy."

Miller increased the Blues lead to 5-0 on a break-away goal set up by Zombo
at 11:09. Then, Steve Maltais broke Curtis Joseph's shutout just 18 seconds
later, making it 5-1.

Less than a minute after the North Stars' final was announced, Tim Bergland
scored and cut the lead to 5-2. But Shanahan scored his 51st, converting a pass
from Nelson Emerson with 21.3 seconds remaining in the  second period.

Then, it was all Lightning. Adam Creighton scored 40 seconds into the third
period, prompting Berry to rest the overworked Joseph. Guy Hebert allowed goals
to Shawn Chambers and Danton Cole in a span of 1:21 midway through the third
period.

The goals by Chambers and Cole made Shanahan's second goal stand up as the
winner. ``We were in there," Shanahan said. ``The game was over. We were in."

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53855
From: bks2@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (bryan.k.strouse)
Subject: NHL RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4-14-93



NHL RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4/14/93.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                  STANDINGS
      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE
 TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT
 
xPIT  56 21  7 119  xBOS  51 26  7 109  xCHI  46 25 12 104  xVAN  45 29  9  99
yWAS  42 34  7  91  yQUE  47 27 10 104  yDET  46 28  9 101  yCAL  42 30 11  95
yNJ   40 36  7  87  yMON  48 30  6 102  yTOR  44 28 11  99  yLA   39 34 10  88
yNYI  39 37  7  85  yBUF  38 35 10  86   STL  36 36 11  83  yWIN  39 37  7  85
 PHL  34 37 11  79   HAR  26 51  6  58   MIN  36 37 10  82   EDM  26 49  8  60
 NYR  34 38 11  79   OTT  10 70  4  24   TB   23 53  7  53   SJ   11 70  2  24

x - Clinched Division Title
y - Clinched Playoff Berth

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Boston Bruins    (51-26-7)   2   2   0   -   4
Ottawa Senators  (10-70-4)   0   1   1   -   2

1st period: BOS, Roberts 5 - (Juneau) 7:19
	    BOS, Wiemer 1 - (Juneau, Oates) 17:47

2nd period: BOS, Neely 11 - (Juneau, Murphy) 6:10
	    BOS, Hughes 5 - (Richer, Kimble) 7:55
	    OTT, Archibald 9 - (Rumble, Lamb) 11:37
	  
3rd period: OTT, Boschman 9 - (Kudelski) 5:10

Powerplay Opportunities-Bruins   0 of 2
			Senators 0 of 4

Shots on Goal-	Bruins    13  11  10  -  34
		Senators   5   9  12  -  26

Boston Bruins--Moog (36-14-3) (8 shots - 8 saves)  Blue (9:38 second) 
	       (18 shots - 16 saves)
Ottawa Senators--Sidorkiewicz (8-46-3) (27 shots - 23 saves)  Berthiaume
		 (6:36 third) (7 shots - 7 saves)

ATT-10,500

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Washington Capitals   (42-34-7)   0   0   2   -   2
New York Rangers     (34-38-11)   0   0   0   -   0

1st period: NONE

2nd period: NONE

3rd period: WAS, Bondra 36 - (Pivonka, Cavallini) 6:54
	    WAS, Bondra 37 - (Cote, Pivonka) 10:10

Powerplay Opportunities-Capitals 0 of 2
			Rangers  0 of 1

Shots on Goal-	Capitals  16  11  12  -  39
		Rangers    8   7   8  -  23

Washington Capitals--Tabaracci (7-11-0) (23 shots - 23 saves)
New York Rangers--Richter (13-17-3) (39 shots - 37 saves)

ATT-17,897

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

New York Islanders  (39-37-7)   2   1   1   0   -   4
Hartford Whalers    (26-51-6)   2   1   1   1   -   5

1st period: NYI, Ferraro 13 - (Malakhov, King) 1:29
	    NYI, Hogue 32 - (Thomas, Turgeon) 1:57
	    HAR, Yake 21 - (Poulin) 4:15
	    HAR, Yake 22 - (Nylander, Poulin) 16:44

2nd period: HAR, Verbeek 39 - (Cassels, Weinrich) (pp) 2:43
	    NYI, Thomas 35 - (King, Ferraro) 7:58

3rd period: HAR, Burt 5 - (Sanderson, Cassels) 13:41
	    NYI, Malakhov 14 - (Hogue) 17:45

Overtime:   HAR, Janssens 12 - (Poulin) 1:08

Powerplay Opportunities-Islanders 0 of 3
			Whalers   1 of 3

Shots on Goal-	Islanders  16   8   7   1  -  32
		Whalers     7  13   7   1  -  28

New York Islanders--Fitzpatrick (16-15-5) (28 shots - 23 saves)
Hartford Whalers--Lenaduzzi (1-0-1) (32 shots - 28 saves)

ATT-10,915

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Pittsburgh Penguins  (56-21-7)   2   3   1   0   -   6
New Jersey Devils    (40-36-7)   2   4   0   0   -   6

1st period: PIT, Daniels 5 - (Needham, Tippett) 4:14
	    NJD, C.Lemieux 29 - (Semak, Driver) 10:19
	    PIT, K.Stevens 55 - (Tocchet, Murphy) (pp) 12:40
	    NJD, Zelepukin 22 - (Driver, Niedermayer) 17:26

2nd period: PIT, M.Lemieux 68 - (Stevens, Tocchet) 1:42
	    NJD, Semak 36 - (C.Lemieux, Zelepukin) 2:27
	    PIT, McEachern 28 - (Jagr, Barrasso) 4:24
	    NJD, S.Stevens 12 - (Guerin, Pellerin) 5:45
	    PIT, M.Lemieux 69 - (sh) 12:40
	    NJD, Richer 37 - (Nicholls) 15:53
	    NJD, C.Lemieux 30 - (Semak, Zelepukin) 17:40

3rd period: PIT, Mullen 33 - (Jagr, M.Lemieux) 18:54

Overtime:   NONE

Powerplay Opportunities-Penguins 1 of 5
			Devils   0 of 3

Shots on Goal-	Penguins   9  11   8   2  -  30
		Devils    12  15   9   3  -  39

Pittsburgh Penguins--Barrasso (43-14-5) (39 shots - 33 saves)
New Jersey Devils--Billington (21-14-4) (30 shots - 24 saves)

ATT-14,796

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


\|||||/
-SPIKE-



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53856
From: layfield@cpsc.ucalgary.ca (Colin Layfield)
Subject: Re: Smiths birthday goal was LEAFS GO ALL THE WAY !!!

In article <C4wty9.40u@mcs.anl.gov> mwm@aps.anl.gov writes:
>In article 5KL@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca, kwk2chow@descartes.uwaterloo.ca (KEVIN C.) writes:
>> (Thanks for the goals by Steve Smith) 
>I don't see why more people don't blame grant fuhr for the goal that smith 
>put in his own net, it's common to play the puck back to your own goalie when
>deep in your own end and under little or no pressure from the offensive team.
>If fuhr had been in position the puck would have never crossed the line.
>
>Mike McDowell

I have to disagree with you on this one.  It is anything BUT common.  In the
4 or 5 years I have been watching hockey I have NEVER seen this happen EVER.

I am not sure what league you have been watching.  :-)

Anyone else agree with this?

 Colin Layfield            | "Religion and Sex are power plays,
                           |  Manipulate the people for the money they pay,
 The University of Calgary |  Selling Skin, Selling God
 Computer Science          |  The numbers look the same on their CREDIT CARDS!"
 layfield@cpsc.ucalgary.ca |                          - Queensryche


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53857
From: jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio)
Subject: Re: European expansion and our f*cked system


 
|> How long would they support teams that are run on Ranger-based 
|> corporate thinking (I use the term lightly).  (We don't need a good
|> product because these duffuses in NYC would fill the arena for Ottawa's
|> record every year......1940!! haha (sorry, had ta say it)).

Look how long the Maple Leafs and Nordiques used similar logic....  Not that
they fielded bad teams solely to field bad teams, but the Maple Leafs (and a
certain dead man who was in charge) were one of the cheapest teams in the
history of the sport.  Guess what-- they were immensely popular at the
gate.  The Nordiques have also done well for a team that had missed the
playoffs so many years in a row.

|> Look at British (or any European) soccer as an example (they never have fan
|> problems).

Ha!  Such humor!  They have MAJOR fan problems, namely that on occasion some of
them don't make it home from the match!  The soccer fans tend to be fanatical,
much like the Montreal fans who firebomb the players and coaches houses when
they play pathetically.
 
-JPC

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John P. Curcio 		          Go Bruins!		   Philips Laboratories
jpc@philabs.philips.com 			           345 Scarborough Road
(914) 945-6442               	 		     Briarcliff Manor, NY 10510 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53858
From: jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio)
Subject: Re: TV Schedule for Next Week


In article <Apr16.043426.69352@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU>, mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger) writes:

|> United States TV Schedule:
|> April 18   Devils/Islanders at Pittsburgh   1 EST  ABC  (to Eastern time zone)
|> April 18   St. Louis at Chicago             12 CDT ABC  (to Cent/Mou time zones)
|> April 18   Los Angeles at Calgary           12 PDT ABC  (to Pacific time zone)
|> April 20   Devils/Islanders at Pittsburgh   7:30   ESPN
|> April 22   TBA                              7:30   ESPN
|> April 24   TBA                              7:30   ESPN

Does anyone know if there will be alternate games in cities where local
broadcast rights are being protected?  I'd really love to see the Bruins a
couple times, and with this pro-Patrick bias shown by ESPN something tells me
that I will have to wait until the conference finals to see them :-}.

-JPC
 
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John P. Curcio 		          Go Bruins!		   Philips Laboratories
jpc@philabs.philips.com 			           345 Scarborough Road
(914) 945-6442               	 		     Briarcliff Manor, NY 10510 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53859
From: saz@hook.corp.mot.com (Scott Zabolotzky)
Subject: Re: the hawks WILL return to the finals!!!!!

In article <1qk0k4$itg@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu> cubrj@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Brian Johnson) writes:
>Well now that the hawks have won the division the road is a little
>easier for the playoffs. Let toronto and detroit beat the hell out of
>each other while Chicago sweeps st.louis. That just makes it easier in
>the second round with all the rest they will get and tor/det getting
>none. For the conf. champ they will have a hard time versus the division
>but that div. will be pretty battered also so the advantage goes to the
>Hawks again. Then bring pitt. and sure the Hawks will probably lose but
>its better to get that far and lose than to not go.
>
>brian
>

Hopefully, a miracle (o.k. not quite a miracle, but close!) will occur and
Pittsburgh will be elminated prior to the finals.  If they make it again, 
they will probably keep the Cup.  If they don't, it's the Hawks' turn!

GO BLACKHAWKS!!

CONGRATS TO JEREMY ROENICK FOR BEING ONLY THE 2ND HAWKS PLAYER TO POST 
BACK TO BACK 50 GOAL SEASONS!!

Scott


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53860
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: Re: the hawks WILL return to the finals!!!!!

In article <1qk0k4$itg@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu> cubrj@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Brian Johnson) writes:
>Well now that the hawks have won the division the road is a little
>easier for the playoffs. Let toronto and detroit beat the hell out of
>each other while Chicago sweeps st.louis. That just makes it easier in
                  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>brian
>
    Don't be so sure, the Blues played the Hawks pretty well this season,
and won twice at the Stadium. The Blues will give the Hawks a hard time.
This series is one of the best first round matchups, could go either way.
The Hawks will probably prevail in seven games.

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53861
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Thur, April 15, 1993

Philadelphia                     1 2 4--7
Buffalo                          0 3 1--4
First period
     1, Philadelphia, Recchi 52 (Galley, Lindros) 0:18.
Second period
     2, Philadelphia, Hawgood 11 (Dineen, Eklund) pp, 2:15.
     3, Philadelphia, Dineen 33 (McGill) sh, 5:40.
     4, Buffalo, Barnaby 1 (Hawerchuk, Smehlik) pp, 7:48.
     5, Buffalo, Wood 18 (LaFontaine, Ledyard) pp, 17:34.
     6, Buffalo, Mogilny 75 (Hawerchuk, Carney) pp, 18:56.
Third period
     7, Philadelphia, Eklund 11 (Dineen, Beranek) 4:42.
     8, Buffalo, Mogilny 76 (Errey, LaFontaine) 5:24.
     9, Philadelphia, Dineen 34 (Brind'Amour) pp, 6:44.
     10, Philadelphia, Dineen 35 (Brind'Amour, Galley) sh, 8:39.
     11, Philadelphia, Acton 8 (Dineen, Brind'Amour) 19:48.

Philadelphia: 7    Power play: 5-2   Special goals:  pp: 2  sh: 2  Total: 4
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Acton              1    0    1
Beranek            0    1    1
Brind'Amour        0    3    3
Dineen             3    3    6
Eklund             1    1    2
Galley             0    2    2
Hawgood            1    0    1
Lindros            0    1    1
McGill             0    1    1
Recchi             1    0    1

Buffalo: 4    Power play: 10-3
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Barnaby            1    0    1
Carney             0    1    1
Errey              0    1    1
Hawerchuk          0    2    2
LaFontaine         0    2    2
Ledyard            0    1    1
Mogilny            2    0    2
Smehlik            0    1    1
Wood               1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
Minnesota                        1 1 1--3
Detroit                          0 2 3--5
First period
     1, Minnesota, McPhee 18 (Ludwig) 1:23.
Second period
     2, Minnesota, Dahlen 34 (Courtnall, Gagner) pp, 0:31.
     3, Detroit, Drake 18 (Howe, Ogrodnick) 9:14.
     4, Detroit, Ysebaert 34 (Lidstrom, Howe) pp, 17:37.
Third period
     5, Detroit, Ciccarelli 41 (Coffey, Chiasson) pp, 0:32.
     6, Detroit, Kennedy 19 (Burr, Probert) 3:42.
     7, Detroit, Yzerman 58 (Ciccarelli, Gallant) 6:17.
     8, Minnesota, Dahlen 35 (Courtnall, Gagner) 19:11.

Detroit: 5    Power play: 4-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Burr               0    1    1
Chiasson           0    1    1
Ciccarelli         1    1    2
Coffey             0    1    1
Drake              1    0    1
Gallant            0    1    1
Howe               0    2    2
Kennedy            1    0    1
Lidstrom           0    1    1
Ogrodnick          0    1    1
Probert            0    1    1
Ysebaert           1    0    1
Yzerman            1    0    1

Minnesota: 3    Power play: 2-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Courtnall          0    2    2
Dahlen             2    0    2
Gagner             0    2    2
Ludwig             0    1    1
McPhee             1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
Edmonton                         0 0 0--0
Winnipeg                         1 2 0--3
First period
     1, Winnipeg, Shannon 20 (Steen, Davydov) pp, 2:08.
Second period
     2, Winnipeg, Selanne 76 (Olausson) 5:25.
     3, Winnipeg, Zhamnov 25 (Selanne) 19:42.
Third period
     No scoring.

Winnipeg: 3    Power play: 6-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Davydov            0    1    1
Olausson           0    1    1
Selanne            1    1    2
Shannon            1    0    1
Steen              0    1    1
Zhamnov            1    0    1

Edmonton: 0    Power play: 3-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------
Toronto                          1 1 0--2
Chicago                          0 2 1--3
First period
     1, Toronto, Baumgartner 1 (unassisted) 18:40.
Second period
     2, Chicago, Roenick 50 (Murphy, Chelios) 1:29.
     3, Toronto, Andreychuk 55 (Mironov, Lefebvre) 13:22.
     4, Chicago, Murphy 7 (Roenick, Chelios) pp, 19:05.
Third period
     5, Chicago, Matteau 15 (unassisted) 10:51.
Error: Power play goal mismatch. Assuming calc value.
Error: Team: Toronto  Calc: 0  Read: 1

Chicago: 3    Power play: 7-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Chelios            0    2    2
Matteau            1    0    1
Murphy             1    1    2
Roenick            1    1    2

Toronto: 2    Power play: 3-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Andreychuk         1    0    1
Baumgartner        1    0    1
Lefebvre           0    1    1
Mironov            0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
First period
     1, St Louis, Shanahan 50 (Brown, Felsner) 10:44.
     2, St Louis, Miller 23 (Bassen, Brown) 19:38.
     3, St Louis, Bassen 8 (Zombo) 19:48.
Second period
     4, St Louis, Bassen 9 (Hedican, Miller) 0:14.
     5, St Louis, Miller 24 (Zombo, Hedican) 11:09.
     6, Tampa Bay, Maltais 7(Hamrlik) 11:27.
     7, Tampa Bay, Bergland 3 (Hervey, Gilhen) 17:16.
     8, St Louis, Shanahan 51 (Emerson) 19:38.
Third period
     9, Tampa Bay, Creighton 19 (Bergland, Bergevin) 0:40.
     10, Tampa Bay, Chambers 10 (Zamuner, Cole) 10:37.
     11, Tampa Bay, Cole 12 (Beers, Bradley) 11:58.

St Louis: 6    Power play: 4-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bassen             2    1    3
Brown              0    2    2
Emerson            0    1    1
Felsner            0    1    1
Hedican            0    2    2
Miller             2    1    3
Shanahan           2    0    2
Zombo              0    2    2

Tampa Bay: 5    Power play: 3-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Beers              0    1    1
Bergevin           0    1    1
Bergland           1    1    2
Bradley            0    1    1
Chambers           1    0    1
Cole               1    1    2
Creighton          1    0    1
Gilhen             0    1    1
Hamrlik            0    1    1
Hervey             0    1    1
Maltais            1    0    1
Zamuner            0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
San Jose                         0 1 2--3
Calgary                          0 4 3--7
First period
     No scoring.
Second period
     1, San Jose, Garpenlov 22 (Odgers, Gaudreau) pp, 3:37.
     2, Calgary, Nieuwendyk 38 (MacInnis, Suter) pp, 5:26.
     3, Calgary, Ranheim 21 (Otto, Suter) 10:43.
     4, Calgary, Yawney 1 (Nieuwendyk, Roberts) 11:26.
     5, Calgary, Berube 4 (Paslawski, Skrudland) 13:45.
Third period
     6, San Jose, Wood 1 (Odgers, Kisio) 8:00.
     7, Calgary, Reichel 40 (unassisted) 9:26.
     8, Calgary, Roberts 38 (Musil, Paslawski) pp, 12:27.
     9, San Jose, Kisio 26 (unassisted) 13:10.
     10, Calgary, Paslawski 18 (Ashton, Stern) 16:16.

Calgary: 7    Power play: 4-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Ashton             0    1    1
Berube             1    0    1
MacInnis           0    1    1
Musil              0    1    1
Nieuwendyk         1    1    2
Otto               0    1    1
Paslawski          1    2    3
Ranheim            1    0    1
Reichel            1    0    1
Roberts            1    1    2
Skrudland          0    1    1
Stern              0    1    1
Suter              0    2    2
Yawney             1    0    1

San Jose: 3    Power play: 3-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Garpenlov          1    0    1
Gaudreau           0    1    1
Kisio              1    1    2
Odgers             0    2    2
Wood               1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
Vancouver                        1 2 5--8
Los Angeles                      2 3 1--6
First period
     1, Los Angeles, Robitaille 63 (Gretzky, Sandstrom) 1:39.
     2, Vancouver, Babych 3 (Craven, Nedved) pp, 9:43.
     3, Los Angeles, Sandstrom 25 (Gretzky, Robitaille) 10:06.
Second period
     4, Vancouver, Linden 32 (Ronning, Courtnall) pp, 0:54.
     5, Vancouver, Ward 22 (Hunter, Nedved) 1:24.
     6, Los Angeles, Gretzky 16 (Sandstrom, Robitaille) 6:57.
     7, Los Angeles, Zhitnik 12 (Kurri, Robitaille) pp, 14:02.
     8, Los Angeles, Millen 23 (Hardy) pp, 16:57.
Third period
     9, Vancouver, Ronning 27 (Dirk) 5:28.
     10, Vancouver, Ronning 28 (Courtnall, Linden) pp, 11:15.
     11, Vancouver, Linden 33 (Courtnall, Ronning) 11:27.
     12, Los Angeles, Donnelly 29 (Millen, Granato) pp, 14:35.
     13, Vancouver, Courtnall 31 (Ronning, Ratushny) 14:54.
     14, Vancouver, Ronning 29 (Linden, Diduck) en, 18:47.

Vancouver: 8    Power play: 6-3   Special goals:  pp: 3  en: 1  Total: 4
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Babych             1    0    1
Courtnall          1    3    4
Craven             0    1    1
Diduck             0    1    1
Dirk               0    1    1
Hunter             0    1    1
Linden             2    2    4
Nedved             0    2    2
Ratushny           0    1    1
Ronning            3    3    6
Ward               1    0    1

Los Angeles: 6    Power play: 10-3
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Donnelly           1    0    1
Granato            0    1    1
Gretzky            1    2    3
Hardy              0    1    1
Kurri              0    1    1
Millen             1    1    2
Robitaille         1    3    4
Sandstrom          1    2    3
Zhitnik            1    0    1

-----------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53862
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Goalie Mask Update


	Here are the results after three days of voting. Remember 3pts for 
1st, 2 for 2nd, and 1 for 3rd. Also, you can still turn in votes! And.. if
the guy isn't a regular goalie or he is retired, please include the team! 
Thanks for your time, and keep on sending in those votes!

Player                  Team                  Pts     Votes
-----------------------------------------------------------
1. Brian Hayward        San Jose              15        6
   Andy Moog            Boston                15        6
3. Curtis Joseph        St. Louis             11        5
4. Ed Belfour           Chicago               10        5
5. Gerry Cheevers       Boston (retired)       5        3 
   Manon Rheaume        Atlanta (IHL)          5        2
   Ron Hextall          Quebec                 5        2
8. Don Beaupre          Washington             4        2
-----------------------------------------------------------
Others receiving 1 vote: Artus Irbe (SJ), Tim Cheveldae (Det),
 Clint Malarchuck (Buf/SD,IHL), Grant Fuhr (Buf), Rick Wamsley 
 (Tor,ret), Jon Casey (Minn), John Vanbiesbrouck (NYR),
 Ken Dryden (Mon,ret), Bob Essensa (Win), Mike Vernon (Cal),
 Glenn Healy (NYI), Tommy Soderstron (???), Ray LeBlanc (USA).


-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53863
From: farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL Calder Cup Playoff schedule and results

1993 CALDER CUP PLAYOFF SCHEDULE AND RESULTS	
home team in CAPS		*=if necesary
=============================================

FIRST ROUND					
Springfield Indians vs Providence Bruins
Gm 1:	Springfield 3	PROVIDENCE 2	
Gm 2:	Springfield 5	PROVIDENCE 4
Gm 3:	4/16	Providence at Springfield

CD Islanders vs Adirondack Red Wings
Gm 1:	Last night, CDI at Adirondack
Gm 2:	4/17	CDI at Adirondack
Gm 3:	4/18	Adirondack at CDI
Gm 4:	4/21	Adirondack at CDI
Gm 5:	4/23	CDI at Adirondack	*
Gm 6:	4/24	Adirondack at CDI	*
Gm 7:	4/26	CDI at Adirondack	*

Baltimore Skipjacks at Binghamton Rangers
Gm 1:	4/16	Baltimore at Binghamton
Gm 2:	4/17	Baltimore at Binghamton
Gm 3:	4/23	Binghamton at Baltimore
Gm 4:	4/24	Binghamton at Baltimore
Gm 5:	4/26	Baltimore at Binghamton	*
Gm 6:	4/28	Binghmaton at Baltimore	*
Gm 7:	4/30	Baltimore at Binghamton	*

Utica Devils vs Rochester Americans
Gm 1:	4/16	Utica at Rochester
Gm 2:	4/17	Utica at Rochester
Gm 3:	4/20	Rochester at Utica
Gm 4:	4/22	Rochester at Utica
Gm 5:	4/24	Utica at Rochester	*
Gm 6:	4/26	Rochester at Utica	*
Gm 7:	4/28	Utica at Rochester	*

Moncton Hawks vs St John's Maple Leafs
Gm 1:	St John's 4	Moncton 2
Gm 2:	4/17	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax
Gm 3:	4/21	St John's at Moncton

Cape Breton Oilers vs Fredericton Canadiens
Gm 1:	Fredericton 4	Cape Breton 3	(2OT)
Gm 2:	4/16	Cape Breton at Fredericton	

Unfortunately the newspaper didnt list complete playoff skeds for
series that already began. Also, the paper has not listed final
standings so their posting might be delayed until early next
week (Hockey News).

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL and ECAC contact for rec.sport.hockey		Go USA Hockey!	   +	
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    + CONGRATS TO THE BOSTON BRUINS, 1992-93 ADAMS DIVISION CHAMPIONS      +
    + PHOENIX SUNS, 1992-93 PACIFIC DIVISION CHAMPIONS			   +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53864
From: bdown@vis.toronto.edu (Brian Down)
Subject: Re: Bridgman is out

slacelle@gandalf.ca (Stephane Lacelle) writes:

>The Ottwawa Senators fired Mel Bridgman at 1:00 PM today.
>Randy Sexton is gonna replace him.

Trashy move from a trashy organization. After the front
office stated that nobody would lose their job over the
Sens. poor performance, Bridgeman is gone within 24 hours
of the teams final game.

Yes...I know he screwed up letting the King's grab Loach.

Sexton's qualifications (aside from being cheap)??

	- he played some US college hockey,
	- he's pals with club president Bruce Firestone.

Just the kind of experience you need when trying to build
an expansion franchise. He'll probably be in the Hall of
Fame next year! :-)

This continues a tradition of front office gaffs:
- Paul Anka and the arena deal
- Denis Potvin and the GM postion
- Mike Bossy and the scoring coach.

How do people in Ottawa feel about how the club is being run??

>Stephane Lacelle				

Brian Down (bdown@vis.toronto.edu)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53865
From: klaty@atchafalaya.engin.umich.edu (Brad Alan Klaty)
Subject: Goalies


I've heard that you can score on Belfour by shooting high 
because he goes down a lot, and on Potvin by shooting high 
on him and then getting the rebound in because he plays so
deep in the net.  Any truth to these?


			Brad

A Wings fan, but no predictions.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53866
From: yatrou@INRS-Telecom.Uquebec.CA (Paul Yatrou)
Subject: Re: Stop predicting

In <1993Apr16.060010.10012@ncsu.edu> cdkaupan@eos.ncsu.edu (CARL DAVID KAUPANG) writes:


>It is really annoying to see all of these
>predictions on the Net.  Who really cares
>who you think will win?  Please stop with
>the predictions, we all know the Caps are
>going to win the Cup, so let it go at that.
>
>
>David Kaupang
>cdkaupan@eos.ncsu.edu

Yeah, but first they have to deal with the Devils,
who've had their number all year. I'm not saying
the Caps aren't a good team (they've been a thorn
on the Habs side for the past 10 years!!!), just
that they won't get past NJ...

Paul Yatrou
yatrou@inrs-telecom.uquebec.ca
(running my pool today, wish me luck!!!!!!!!!!!)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53867
From: dwarf@bcarh601.bnr.ca (W. Jim Jordan)
Subject: Re: Truly a sad day for hockey

Farewell, Minnesota fans.  Get stuffed, Dallas Stars.

As the North Stars fade to black, I hope that Minneapolis/St. Paul are
not long without an NHL team.  It just seems "right" that the hotbed of
amateur hockey in the USA should have an NHL team as well.  The loss of
the team is certainly not the fault of the fans (though the start of the
1989-90 season made it look real bad for a while).

I wish now that I kept the North Stars cap I bought at Maple Leaf
Gardens the morning after they eliminated Montreal in 1980.  (I got it
to spite the Montreal fans in the small town where I grew up.)  What a
glorious season that was for the North Stars!

     dwarf
--
W. Jim Jordan                           "I don't mean to tell you how to live
dwarf@x400gate.bnr.ca (Internet)         your life--that's what the TV's for--
I work for BNR; I do not speak for it.   but if I didn't believe in Jesus, I'd
                                         be going to hell."      - Peter Heath

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53868
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: Goalie Mask Update

In article <93289@hydra.gatech.EDU> gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak) writes:
>
>	Here are the results after three days of voting. Remember 3pts for 
>1st, 2 for 2nd, and 1 for 3rd. Also, you can still turn in votes! And.. if
>the guy isn't a regular goalie or he is retired, please include the team! 
>Thanks for your time, and keep on sending in those votes!

> Glenn Healy (NYI), Tommy Soderstron (???), Ray LeBlanc (USA).
                     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Soderstrom plays with Philly, but he doesn't have a moulded mask.
He's got the helmet and cage variety, in white.  Or at least that's
what he wore thirteen hours ago.

-- 
Valerie Hammerl			"Some days I have to remind him he's not 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu	Mario Lemieux."  Herb Brooks on Claude
acscvjh@ubms.cc.buffalo.edu	Lemieux, top scorer for the Devils, but 
v085pwwpz@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu  known for taking dumb penalties.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53869
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)
Subject: Re: AHL Season in review (off ice stuff)

In article <1993Apr16.001323.10308@news.clarkson.edu> farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy) writes:
>==================================================
>SENATORS SOLD
<stuff deleted>
>
>The Senators are currently in serious negotiations with Charlottetown
>New Brunswick and are expected to move there.
>==================================================

It has been announced that the Senators will move their AHL franchise to
Charlottetown, P.E.I. (Prince Edward Island), not New Brunswick.

Charlie Cook
charlie@calvin.cs.unb.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53870
From: yvon@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Yvon Lavoie)
Subject: Hot, Cold Streaks ???


Ok guys, I need a list of the teams who have been hot or cold during the
last 25 games.  Doesn't need to be accurate, a rough guess will do.  I'm
about to enter a playoff pool and I want to know who is hot going into
the playoffs.  Don't need to mention Pittsburgh.  They can't get any hotter
than they are now.


P.S. I need this by Sunday

Yvon Lavoie




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53871
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL playoff results (4/15)

GAME(S) OF 4/15
---------------
ADIRONDACK 6	CDI 2	(Adirondack leads series, 1-0)

=================================================			
FIRST ROUND					
Springfield Indians vs Providence Bruins
Gm 1:	Springfield 3	PROVIDENCE 2	
Gm 2:	Springfield 5	PROVIDENCE 4
Gm 3:	4/16	Providence at Springfield
Gm 4:	4/17	Providence at Springfield
Gm 5:	4/22	Springfield at Providence	*
Gm 6:	4/24	Providence at Springfield	*
Gm 7:	4/27	Springfield at Providence	*

CD Islanders vs Adirondack Red Wings
Gm 1:	ADIRONDACK 6	CDI 2
Gm 2:	4/17	CDI at Adirondack
Gm 3:	4/18	Adirondack at CDI
Gm 4:	4/21	Adirondack at CDI
Gm 5:	4/23	CDI at Adirondack	*
Gm 6:	4/24	Adirondack at CDI	*
Gm 7:	4/26	CDI at Adirondack	*

Baltimore Skipjacks at Binghamton Rangers
Gm 1:	4/16	Baltimore at Binghamton
Gm 2:	4/17	Baltimore at Binghamton
Gm 3:	4/23	Binghamton at Baltimore
Gm 4:	4/24	Binghamton at Baltimore
Gm 5:	4/26	Baltimore at Binghamton	*
Gm 6:	4/28	Binghmaton at Baltimore	*
Gm 7:	4/30	Baltimore at Binghamton	*

Utica Devils vs Rochester Americans
Gm 1:	4/16	Utica at Rochester
Gm 2:	4/17	Utica at Rochester
Gm 3:	4/20	Rochester at Utica
Gm 4:	4/22	Rochester at Utica
Gm 5:	4/24	Utica at Rochester	*
Gm 6:	4/26	Rochester at Utica	*
Gm 7:	4/28	Utica at Rochester	*

Moncton Hawks vs St John's Maple Leafs
Gm 1:	St John's 4	Moncton 2
Gm 2:	4/17	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax
Gm 3:	4/21	St John's at Moncton
Gm 4:	4/23	St John's at Moncton
Gm 5:	4/26	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax	*
Gm 6:	4/28	St John's at Moncton		*
Gm 7:	4/30	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax	*

Cape Breton Oilers vs Fredericton Canadiens
Gm 1:	Fredericton 4	Cape Breton 3	(2OT)
Gm 2:	4/16	Cape Breton at Fredericton	
Gm 3:	4/20	Fredericton at Cape Breton
Gm 4:	4/22	Fredericton at Cape Breton
Gm 5:	4/24	Cape Breton at Fredericton	*
Gm 6:	4/26	Fredericton at Cape Breton	*
Gm 7:	4/28	Cape Breton at Fredericton	*

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL and ECAC contact for rec.sport.hockey		Go USA Hockey!	   +	
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    + CONGRATS TO THE BOSTON BRUINS, 1992-93 ADAMS DIVISION CHAMPIONS      +
    + PHOENIX SUNS, 1992-93 PACIFIC DIVISION CHAMPIONS			   +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53872
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat


In article 9088@blue.cis.pitt.edu, jrmst8+@pitt.edu (Joseph R Mcdonald) writes:

>Jagr has a higher +/-, but Francis has had more points.  And take it from
>an informed observer, Ronnie Francis has had a *much* better season than
>Jaromir Jagr.  This is not to take anything away from Jaro, who had a 
>decent year (although it didn't live up to the expectations of some).

Bowman tended to overplay Francis at times because he is a Bowman-style
player.  He plays hard at all times, doesn't disregard his defensive
responsibilities and is a good leader.  Bowman rewarded him be increasing his
ice time.

Jagr can be very arrogant and juvenile and display a "me first" attitude.
This rubbed Bowman the wrong way and caused him to lose some ice time.

Throughout the year, Francis consistently recieved more ice time than
Jagr.  Althouhg I have never seen stats on this subject, I am pretty
sure that Jagr had more points per minute played that Francis.  When
you add to that Jagr's better +/- rating, I think it becomes evident
that Jagr had a better season- not that Francis had a bad one.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53873
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Goalie masks

In article <120666@netnews.upenn.edu> kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller) writes:
>My vote goes to John Vanbiesbrouck.  His mask has a skyline of New York
>City, and on the sides there are a bunch of bees (Beezer).  It looks
>really sharp.

Funny you should mention this; one time on HNIC Don Cherry pointed out
Vanbiesbrouck's mask.  He _hated_ it.  I think he said something to the effect
of:
"You see?  He was great last year; now he goes out and gets that dopey mask 
and he can't stop a beachball!"

You may or may not take Cherry seriously at all, but I cracked up when I heard
it.

I think Ed Belfour has the current best mask in the NHL btw.  I also like
Moog's, and I'll give Fuhr's new one an honourable mention, although I haven't
seen it closely yet (it looked good from a distance!).  What's also neat is
Chevaldae's in Detroit; they call him "Chevy" so he has two checkered flags
painted at the top as in an auto race.



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53874
From: drozinst@db.erau.edu (Drozinski Tim)
Subject: Re: Ulf and all...

layfield@cpsc.ucalgary.ca (Colin Layfield) writes:

>In article <1pdlksINNmq7@GIRAFFE.ZOO.CS.YALE.EDU> wuziyun%suned@cs.yale.edu (You wanna know?) writes:
>>
>>
>>Let me give my two cents worth in this whole thing:
>>
>>  I am very sick of Pittsburg fans(and they are my second favorite team) 
>>talk about how " why can't Bruins forget about Ulf Samuelsson when we have
>>forgotten all about Adam Graves"  Beside the obvious fact that Lemeuix's career
>>was never endangered by Graves' slash while Neely is still bother by his injury,
>>I think the most important reason is:
>>
>>        ADAM GRAVES HAS PLAYED CLEAN HOCKEY EVER SINCE!  WHILE ULF SAMULESSON
>>        CONTINUES TO PLAY DIRTY(YES, TRYING TO HIT A PLAYER WHERE HE'S INJURED
>>        IS DIRTY).  FANS HAVE CAN FORGET ABOUT ONE DIRTY PLAY BUT HOW CAN YOU
>>        FORGET ABOUT ULF SAMULESSON WHEN EVERYNIGHT, WHEN I WATCH HOCKEY HIGH
>>        LIGHTS, I GET REMINDED OF HOW DIRTY HE IS.

>Hitting a player when he's injured is dirty?  Can you explain this statement?
>Do you mean a player who was just injured on the ice(?) or do you mean a player
>who is playing hurt.  If a player is hurt he should not bother playing because
>I don't belive ANY PLAYER should be let up on just because they are playing
>hurt.

>I'm not an Ulf fan but at least I can spot the fact he is like Calgary's
>Theoren Fleury in the respect that part of his game is to really piss other
>players off as that's part of his job (But he lacks Ulf's size!).

I AM an Ulf (and Pgh) fan, and what pisses me off about the whole Adam Graves/
Ulf Samuesson debate is that Ulf plays hard-hitting hockey (nothing wrong with 
that) while Graves does what he does when the only way to win a game is to 
intentionally hurt someone (which bites!).

>Players that REALLY piss me off are the ones who insist on hitting from behind
>or try to go for the knees to injure the players.  This kind of garbage has
>got to go (I would really like to see Muni get pasted as he is one of the
>worst offenders).

I thought they had instituted all kinds of new rules this season to stop crap 
like that?!?  Is it just me, or does the officiating just still stink to high
heaven?  IMHO, if they could get rid of the existing refs, and institute a new
system with more than one ref on the ice to keep an eye on the trouble-makers
then a lot of these things would stop, and then the game would be ruled by the
finnesse players:  Mario, Selanne, Bure, Messier, et.al...

>Just my $0.02.

> Colin Layfield            | "Religion and Sex are power plays,
>                           |  Manipulate the people for the money they pay,
> The University of Calgary |  Selling Skin, Selling God
> Computer Science          |  The numbers look the same on their CREDIT CARDS!"
> layfield@cpsc.ucalgary.ca |                          - Queensryche


Tim Drozinski
Embry-Riddle Aero. Univ.
drozinst@erau.db.erau.edu


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53875
From: bks2@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (bryan.k.strouse)
Subject: NHL RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4-15-93



NHL RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4/15/93.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                  STANDINGS
      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE
 TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT   TM    W  L  T  PT
 
xPIT  56 21  7 119  xBOS  51 26  7 109  xCHI  47 25 12 106  xVAN  46 29  9 101
yWAS  42 34  7  91  yQUE  47 27 10 104  yDET  47 28  9 103  yCAL  43 30 11  97
yNJ   40 36  7  87  yMON  48 30  6 102  yTOR  44 29 11  99  yLA   39 35 10  88
yNYI  39 37  7  85  yBUF  38 36 10  86  ySTL  37 36 11  85  yWIN  40 37  7  87
 PHL  35 37 11  81   HAR  26 51  6  58   MIN  36 38 10  82   EDM  26 50  8  60
 NYR  34 38 11  79   OTT  10 70  4  24   TB   23 54  7  53   SJ   11 71  2  24

x - Clinched Division Title
y - Clinched Playoff Berth

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Minnesota North Stars  (36-38-10)   1   1   1   -   3
Detroit Red Wings       (47-28-9)   0   2   3   -   5

1st period: MIN, McPhee 18 - (Ludwig) 1:23
	
2nd period: MIN, Dahlen 34 - (Courtnall, Gagner) (pp) 0:31
	    DET, Drake 18 - (Howe, Ogrodnick) 9:14
	    DET, Ysebaert 34 - (Lidstrom, Howe) (pp) 17:37

3rd period: DET, Ciccarelli 41 - (Coffey, Chiasson) (pp) 0:32
	    DET, Kennedy 19 - (Burr, Probert) 3:42
	    DET, Yzerman 58 - (Ciccarelli, Gallant) 6:17
	    MIN, Dahlen 35 - (Courtnall, Gagner) 19:11

Powerplay Opportunities-North Stars 1 of 2
			Red Wings   2 of 4

Shots on GOal-	North Stars  10   9  11  -  30
		Red Wings     6  15   8  -  29

Minnesota North Stars--Casey (26-26-5) (29 shots - 24 saves)
Detroit Red Wings--Cheveldae (34-24-7) (30 shots - 27 saves)

ATT-19,749

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Philadelphia Flyers  (35-37-11)   1   2   4   -   7
Buffalo Sabres       (38-36-10)   0   3   1   -   4

1st period: PHL, Recchi 52 - (Galley, Lindros) 0:18

2nd period: PHL, Hawgood 11 - (Dineen, Eklund) (pp) 2:15
	    PHL, Dineen 33 - (McGill) (sh) 5:40
	    BUF, Barnaby 1 - (Hawerchuk, Smehlik) (pp) 7:48
	    BUF, Wood 18 - (LaFontaine, Ledyard) (pp) 17:34
	    BUF, Mogilny 75 - (Hawerchuk, Carney) (pp) 18:56

3rd period: PHL, Eklund 11 - (Dineen, Beranek) 4:42
	    BUF, Mogilny 76 - (Errey, LaFontaine) 5:24
	    PHL, Dineen 34 - (Brind'Amour) (pp) 6:44
	    PHL, Dineen 35 - (Brind'Amour, Galley) (sh) 8:39
	    PHL, Acton 8 - (Dineen, Brind'Amour) 19:48

Powerplay Opportunities-Flyers 2 of  5
			Sabres 3 of 10

SHots on Goal-	Flyers   6   7  13  -  26
		Sabres   8  19  18  -  45

Philadelphia Flyers--Soderstrom (20-17-6) (45 shots - 41 saves)
Buffalo Sabres--Fuhr (10 shots - 7 saves)  Hasek (11-10-4) (5:40 second) 
		(16 shots - 12 saves)

ATT-15,042

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Edmonton Oilers  (26-50-8)   0   0   0   -   0
Winnipeg Jets    (40-37-7)   1   2   0   -   3

1st period: WIN, Shannon 20 - (Steen, Davydov) (pp) 2:08
	
2nd period: WIN, Selanne 76 - (Olausson) 5:25
	    WIN, Zhamnov 25 - (Selanne) 19:42

3rd period: NONE

Powerplay Opportunities-Oilers 0 of 3
			Jets   1 of 6

SHots on GOal-	Oilers   7   8  16  -  31
		Jets    10  16  16  -  42

Edmonton Oilers--Ranford (17-38-6) (42 shots - 39 saves)
Winnipeg Jets--Essensa (33-26-6) (31 shots - 31 saves)

ATT-12,229

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Toronto Maple Leafs  (44-29-11)   1   1   0   -   2
Chicago BlackHawks   (47-25-12)   0   2   1   -   3

1st period: TOR, Baumgartner 1 - 18:40

2nd period: CHI, Roenick 50 - (Murphy, Chelios) 1:29
	    TOR, Andreychuk 55 - (Mironov, Lefebvre) 13:22
	    CHI, Murphy 7 - (Roenick, Chelios) (pp) 19:05

3rd period: CHI, Matteau 15 - 10:51

Powerplay Opportunities-Maple Leafs 1 of 3
			BlackHawks  1 of 7

Shots on Goal-	Maple Leafs  14   4   8  -  26
		BlackHawks   10  13  13  -  36

Toronto Maple Leafs--Potvin (25-15-7) (36 shots - 33 saves)
Chicago BlackHawks--Belfour (41-18-11) (26 shots - 24 saves)

ATT-17,856

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Tampa Bay Lightning   (23-54-7)   0   2   3   -   5
St. Louis Blues      (37-36-11)   3   3   0   -   6

1st period: STL, Shanahan 50 - (Brown, Felsner) 10:44
	    STL, Miller 23 - (Bassen, Brown) 19:38
	    STL, Bassen 8 - (Zombo) 19:48

2nd period: STL, Bassen 9 - (Hedican, Miller) 0:14
	    STL, Miller 24 - (Zombo, Hedican) 11:09
	    TBL, Maltais 7 - (Hamrlik) 11:27
	    TBL, Bergland 3 - (Harvey, Gilhen) 17:16
	    TBL, Shanahan 51 - (Emerson) 19:38

3rd period: TBL, Creighton 19 - (Bergland, Bergevin) 0:40
	    TBL, Chambers 10 - (Zamuner, Cole) 10:37
	    TBL, Cole 12 - (Beers, Bradley) 11:58

Powerplay Opportunities-Lightning 0 of 3
			Blues     0 of 4

SHots on GOal-	Lightning   5  12  14  -  31
		Blues      11  11   4  -  26

Tampa Bay Lightning--Jablonski (8-24-4) (22 shots - 16 saves)  Bergeron (0:00
		     third) (4 shots - 4 saves)
St. Louis Blues--Joseph (29-28-9) (18 shots - 15 saves)  Hebert (19:20 third)
	         (13 shots - 11 saves)

ATT-17,816

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

San Jose Sharks   (11-71-2)   0   1   2   -   3
Calgary Flames   (43-30-11)   0   4   3   -   7

1st period: NONE

2nd period: SJS, Garpenlov 22 - (Odgers, Gaudreau) (pp) 3:37
	    CAL, Nieuwendyk 38 - (MacInnis, Suter) (pp) 5:26
	    CAL, Ranheim 21 - (Otto, Suter) 10:43
	    CAL, Yawney 1 - (Nieuwendyk, Roberts) 11:26
	    CAL, Berube 4 - (Paslawski, Skrudland) 13:45

3rd period: SJS, Wood 1 - (Odgers, Kisio) 8:00
	    CAL, Reichel 40 - 9:26
	    CAL, Roberts 38 - (Musil, Paslawski) (pp) 12:27
	    SJS, Kisio 26 - 13:10
	    CAL, Paslawski 18 - (Ashton, Stern) 16:16

Powerplay Opportunities-Sharks 1 of 3
			Flames 2 of 4

Shots on Goal-	Sharks   5  11   9  -  25
		Flames  11  14   7  -  32

San Jose Sharks--Irbe (7-25-0) (32 shots - 25 saves)
Calgary Flames--Vernon (29-26-9) (25 shots - 22 saves)

ATT-19,532

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Vancouver Canucks   (46-29-9)   1   2   5   -   8
Los Angeles Kings  (39-35-10)   2   3   1   -   6

1st period: LAK, Robitaille 63 - (Gretzky, Sandstrom) 1:39
	    VAN, Babych 3 - (Craven, Nedved) (pp) 9:43
	    LAK, Sandstrom 25 - (Gretzky, Robitaille) 10:06

2nd period: VAN, Linden 32 - (Ronning, Courtnall) (pp) 0:54
	    VAN, Ward 22 - (Hunter, Nedved) 1:24
	    LAK, Gretzky 16 - (Sandstrom, Robitaille) 6:57
	    LAK, Zhitnik 12 - (Kurri, Robitaille) (pp) 14:02
	    LAK, Millen 23 - (Hardy) (pp) 16:57

3rd period: VAN, Ronning 27 - (Dirk) 5:28
	    VAN, Ronning 28 - (Courtnall, Linden) (pp) 11:15
	    VAN, Linden 33 - (Courtnall, Ronning) 11:27
	    LAK, Donnelly 29 - (Millen, Granato) (pp) 14:35
	    VAN, Courtnall 31 - (Ronning, Ratushny) 14:54
	    VAN, Ronning 29 - (Linden, Diduck) (en) 18:47

Powerplay Opportunities-Canucks 3 of  6
			Kings   3 of 10

Shots on Goal-	Canucks   8   6  16  -  30
		Kings    10  21  10  -  41

Vanocuver Canucks--Whitmore (18-8-4) (41 shots - 35 saves)
Los Angeles Kings--Stauber (23 shots - 17 saves)  Hrudey (17-21-6) (11:27
		   third) (6 shots - 5 saves)

ATT-16,005

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


\|||||/
-SPIKE-



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53876
From: Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Truly a sad day for hockey


Joel Alvstad writes:

>A fine 26 year history came to a close tonight, as the Minnesota North Stars, 
>or Norm's Stars (whichever you prefer) lost to the Red Wings by a score of
>5-3.  The Stars goals were scored by Mike McPhee and Ulf Dahlen, who netted
>two including the final one in franchise history, with less than a minute to
>play.

This is very sad indeed.  My condolences to the Minnesota fans who are
losing their team.

I fear that within the next decade or so the only professional sports team
left in Pittsburgh will be the Steelers.

We should always enjoy things when we can.  You never know when they'll
be taken away from us.

Mom.



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53877
From: twork@egr.msu.edu (Michael Twork)
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN

>Especially when the wings player hit the rut and went into the
boards injuring his shoulder and they blotted out the injury report.

The Wings player was Yves Racine, and he returned later in that same period.

Mike

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53878
From: cs902043@ariel.yorku.ca (SHAWN LUDDINGTON)
Subject: Re: 1993 NHL Draft

In article <93109.134719IO91748@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> Jon Carr <IO91748@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> writes:
>When is the draft this year?  And will there be any coverage?
>I know the upcomming NFL draft is on ESPN.
>
>Anyone got the details?
>
>Paul Kariya 1993 #1 Pick! (No. 2 perhaps?  He won't last long!) :-)
>
I don't know the exact coverage in the states.  In Canada it is covered
by TSN, so maybe ESPN will grab their coverage!  I don't know!

As for the picks
Ottawa picks #1 which means it is almost 100% that Alexander Daigle will 
go #1. He'll either stay or be traded in Montreal or Quebec.  IMO I would
take Kariya.  He should alot of leadership in the NCAA and so far in
the World Championships.  Daigle didn't show this for his junior team.

San Jose will then get Kariya.

Tampa Bay will either go for a russian Kozlov (I think that's it) or a 
    defenseman Rob Niedemeyer (probably spelt the last name wrong)

Because of expansion I won't go further but I will name other of the
blue chip prospects

   - Chris Gratton
   - Chris Pridham
   - a swedish player who I can't remember his name

Draft Order
-----------
1) Ottawa
2) San Jose
3) Tampa Bay
4) South Florida or Anahiem
5) South Florida or Anahiem
6) Hartford
7) Edmonton
8) Dallas
9) NY Rangers
10) Philadelphia

the 8th thru 10th picks could be wrong - I don't have the standings here
and am guessing 

(In my mind there are 8 top notch prospects in the draft, with Kariya 
 leading the way but not going #1)

Shawn - GO CAPS (two first round picks for the next three years - THANKS
                 ST.LOUIS or should I say RON CARON and SCOTT STEVENS)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53879
From: duncan@ (Nicholas Duncan)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here

In article <1993Apr21.144033.15925@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca>, golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
|> In article <MfpIRbO00WBLI1ispC@andrew.cmu.edu> "William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
|> >
|> >     As a person who has rarely even SEEN Don Cherry and doesn't know
|> >anything about him, I don't know whether it is just this area
|> >(Pittsburgh) of the USA that is "deprived" of his broadcasts or whether
|> >he's a Canadian thing altogether.  Seriously, what is he all about?  I
|> >know he was a coach at one time, and from the volume of posts about him,
|> >SOMEONE surely is getting a steady diet of him somehow, but my question
|> >is, what is the deal with him?  Secondly, are the comments of his that I
|> >read about on the net merely flame bait, or do people actually take him
|> >seriously?  I gotta tell you, from what I see, he really sounds like an
|> >ass.  Let me know - maybe I'm missing something.
|> >
|> 
|> For those of you who complain about Don Cherry, and wonder why he is
|> popular...
|> 
|> the reply is Dick Vitale and John Madden and Bobby Knight and
|> Joe Garagiola and Howard Cosell.
|> 
|> John Madden picks Gary Clark of the Redskins for his All-Madden team
|> a lot, over much better receivers...for much the same reasons Cherry
|> sings the praises of Doug Gilmour...a little guy with heart...yet one
|> doesn't see a string of American posts saying that John Madden has
|> lost his marbles.
|> 
|> Dick Vitale is always promoting this kid from this high school or
|> that college with outrageous statements.
|> 
|> Why should Americans expect that Canada would not have such characters
|> in relation to our greatest passion...which is hockey?   Canadians
|> are very similar to Americans...culturally our sports are just hockey
|> and curling, whereas with Americans it is football/basketball/baseball
|> and bowling.
|> 
|> Gerald

I'd like to add that I think Canadian hockey fans like Don because his kind of hockey (the hockey he promotes in his TV appearances) is the kind that they think used to get played in the old 6 team NHL. So there's a kind of nostagia for the old days, before expansion, the Soviet series, Gretzky and even Bobby Orr, when guys weren't afraid to take a hit, nobody floated and defensemen played defence. Who cares that that probably never really existed, the myth is still around in Canada and all the European in



fluence on the game has diminished it in some people's eyes.

Personally, I'd like to add before I get flamed, I love the fast-paced "European" game and think Don Cherry is a bit of an idiot. I have to say that I missed him when I was living in the States, though. He is entertaining, even if you end up throwing your popcorn at the screen when he's on.
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
         
I stand by all the misstatements that I've made.
		-- Vice President Dan Quayle to Sam Donaldson, 8/17/89

Me Too -- Nick Duncan <duncan@mprgate.mpr.ca>

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53880
From: stimpy@dev-null.phys.psu.edu (Gregory Nagy)
Subject: Re: ESPN UP YOURS .........

In article <C5u542.3CD@news.udel.edu> tmavor@earthview.cms.udel.edu writes:
>>
>>[Various justifiable rantings on ESPN coverage by several deleted]
>>
>
>The only way to change ESPN's thinking, if it is even possible, is to complain
>to them directly.  Anyone know there telephone # in Bristol, Ct?  

Heh... Try the rec.autos.sport FAQ. They are always calling ESPN to complain.
I'm sure you could find the number for ABC there too, as many west-coast 
viewers were compaining about how something as boring as hockey cut into
the Long Beach GP. =)

>
>I do find it hard to believe that ESPN doesn't think viewers will simply
>change the channel from a boring game....I know I did.  And then, when
>they didn't show the NYI-Wash overtime(s), I was livid!  If I wanted
>to watch baseball, I could have turned on the Phillies-Padres extra
>inning game....instead, I went to bed angry......I boycotted ESPN's
>morning Sportscenter today, I was still so incensed.

Were you (and several of the other people here it seems) asleep the day
"contracts" were explained? ASPN has a piece of paper saying it MUST
show that baseball game if it happens. Many businesses payedd money to
have their commercials run during a baseball game. This is a business,
not your own personal video servant.

>
>My wife says I shouldn't go to bed angry, but last nite.........GRRRRRRR!
>

Maybe you should put that anger into something positive. For example, I saw
ads for the new Dodge both on the ESPN and KBL broadcasts. Why not write to
Dodge saying that "thanks to the ads run during the STANLEY CUP PLAYOFFS, 
you will now concider their products in the future. They love to hear stuff
like that and in the future will be more willing to buy commercial time
for hockey games, giving ESPN (and other networks) more incentive to carry
games (just one example)

Come on people, as great as we think it is, Hockey does not leapfrog the
"big three" overight.

> 
>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>Tim Mavor		   |  "I am known by many names.......
>College of Marine Studies  |   some call me.........Tim."
>Univ. of Delaware	   |    
>Newark, DE 19716	   |  "You know much that is hidden, O' Tim!"
>tmavor@pandora.cms.udel.edu|  	Monty Python and the Holy Grail	---------------------------------------------------------------------
>



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53881
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: LIST OF TEE TIMES AT METROPOLITAN TORONTO GOLF COURSES FOR MONDAY

In article <1993Apr20.194441.23595@julian.uwo.ca> lee139@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (Steve Lee) writes:
>Woops!  This is rec.sport.hockey! Not rec.sport.golf!  Hope you check the
>newsgroup header next time before posting!

	Duh! He was making a joke about how long the Leafs would last in the
playoffs. (Y'know, hit the courses in the off season). Sheesh... People are
so quick to complain...


-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53882
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: NHLPA poll (partial stats/results)

In article <1993Apr20.124012.3383@mtroyal.ab.ca> caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca writes:
>>All these people who send in their polls should take a closer look at
>>NJD, they are a very deep team, with two very capable goalies, and
>>excellent forwards and defensemen.  Shooter in Richer, an all around do
>>it all in Todd, chef Stasny-master of a thousand dishes, power play


>Kevin Todd is an Oiler and has been one for months. How closely do you follow
>the Devils, anyway? Jeez....

	Sigh.
	This was written about the game NHLPA Hockey '93. Which does not
have precise up-to-date rosters. Why don't people think before they post?
Jeez...


-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53883
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

In article <1993Apr20.113953.18879@jarvis.csri.toronto.edu> leunggm@odin.control.utoronto.ca (Gary Leung) writes:
>In article <1993Apr20.151818.4319@samba.oit.unc.edu> Scott.Marks@launchpad.unc.edu (Scott Marks) writes:
>>>And of course, Mike Ramsey was (at one time) the captain in Buffalo prior to
>>>being traded to Pittsburgh.  Currently, the Penguins have 3 former captains
>>>and 1 real captain (Lemieux) playing for them.  They rotate the A's during the
>>>season (and even the C while Mario was out).  Even Troy Loney has worn the C
>>>for the Pens.
>>
>
>I think that Mike Foligno was the captain of the Sabres when he
>got traded to the Leafs. Also, wasn't Rick Vaive the captain of
>the Leafs when he got traded to Chicago (with Steve Thomas for
>Ed Olcyzk and someone). Speaking of the Leafs, I believe that
>Darryl Sittler was their captain (he'd torn the "C" off his
>jersey but I think he re-claimed the captaincy later on) when he
>was traded to the Flyers.
>
>Oh yeah, of course, Gretzky was the captain of the Oilers before
>he was traded wasn't he? 

Dale Hawerchuk and Troy Murray were both captains of the Jets
when they were traded.  (Murray this year in mid-season, Hawerchuk
a few years ago in the off-season.)

Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53884
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: If You Were Pat Burns ...

Mark D. Whitten <347NFET@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU> writes:

>If I were Pat Burns I'd throw in the towel. The wings dominated every
>aspect of the game.  Trying to mix up the lines is a dead end.

As the Rangers found out in last year's playoffs, it's too late to
try line-juggling at this point.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53885
From: htilney@vax.clarku.edu
Subject: Bruins - Klingon Connection?

I was wondering if any Star Trek TNG fans in this newsgroup knew of a
possible relationship between the Bruins' players Douris & Moog and the
Klingon names Duras and Worf (Son of Moog). I suppose it's a coincidence.

Just curious,

Bart

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53886
From: bittle@niktow.canisius.edu (Jason Bittle)
Subject: * Sabres are playing well...

But I have to agree.. Boston is a good team..  But streaky...  They put
together a great streak to capture first place in the Adams, but for what?

They have lost the home ice advantage for at least the first round, and might
not make it out of it.

I would love to see the Sabres win the first round, even though I bet on the
Bruins (a 12-pack).  

Oh well, perhaps I should start betting against the Sabres more often! ;-)



-- 
ciao,                             
Jason Bittle (bittle@canisius.edu) 
(a.k.a. Pillsbury Dough Boy )
Quote: "I compute... therefore, I. B. M."

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53887
From: cdash@moet.cs.colorado.edu (Charles Shub)
Subject: Thumbs WAY WAY WAY DOWN to ESPN

Tuesday, and the isles/caps game is going into overtime.
what does ESPN do.....

Tom Mees says,  "we are obligated to bring you baseball"

I hate to say this, but last year the coverage of the playoffs on
sports channel america (out in colorado) was vastly superior
to what espn is giving us this year.
-- 

charlie shub  cdash@cs.Colorado.EDU       -or-         (719) 593-3492     
on leave at the University of Iowa  cdash@cs.uiowa.edu (319) 335-0739

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53888
From: Patrick Walker <F1HH@UNB.CA>
Subject: Red Wings Goespel...

Detroit's going to beat Toronto in 6 or LESS!!!

 Granted, Gilmour should get the Hart Trophy, NOT Lemieux... Just
Look at what Gilmour did for Toronto.  When you think of Toronto,
who comes to mind, Gilmour, Andreychuk, Potvin...ah...did I mentio
n Gilmour?

Back to Detroit...  There really isn't a team that could stand up
to them if all the players on the team play to their potential,
no one could stop them.  Yzerman, Fedorov, Coffey, Lindstrom...
there's more firepower there than Pittsburgh... and they don't tri
p over their own skates!
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
  /------------/ Detroit over Toronto in 5     Patrick Walker
 / /--\------/   Detroit over Chicago in 6     University of New Bruns.
 ! !  !---/      Detroit over Vancouver in 6   Canada
 \ \__/ /        Detroit over Nords in 6       "Disco Still Sucks!"
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53889
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Subject: Re: Panther's President

In article <1993Apr20.180241.10263@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>The San Jose Sharks and Ottawa Senators are each on their second GM
>already...I'd be willing to wager that both the Sharks and Senators
>will probably see their 3rd GM's and perhaps their 4th, before we
>see the Panthers second.

Actually, fired-coach George Kingston was a third of the GM
triumvirate.  Now that the trio is now duo (Dean Lombardi and Chuck
Grillo), the Sharks are already on their 3rd "office of the GM". And a
4th is likely to happen before September; they'll either add the new
coach to the OofGM, or name a single GM. So your wager should be
amended to read that Sharks are likely to have their 5th GM before the
Panther's get their 2nd. Can't wait to see how the next season's NHL
Guide and Record Book lists the GM history of the Sharks.

Given the depth of next year's draft, the expansion draft rules, and
the reputation of their GMs, Anaheim and Miami look pretty good as the
first 90s expansion teams to win a Cup.  San Jose and Ottawa have
instability at the GM position, something that Philly, NYI, Edmonton,
and Calgary did not have when they won their first Cups. Pittsburgh
did, but they needed a quarter century.
-- 
Mike Eisler, mre@Eng.Sun.Com  ``Not only are they [Leafs] the best team, but
 their fans are even more intelligent and insightful than Pittsburgh's.  Their
 players are mighty bright, too.  I mean, he really *was* going to get his
 wallet back, right?'' Jan Brittenson 3/93, on Leaf/Pen woofers in
 rec.sport.hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53890
From: dwarf@bcarh601.bnr.ca (W. Jim Jordan)
Subject: Re: #77's?

In article <1r23on$4p6@bigboote.WPI.EDU> ching@bigwpi.WPI.EDU ("The Logistician") writes:
>I am in need of all of the players wearing #77 in the NHL.  I know now only
>of one, Ray Borque for the Bruins.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.

I believe that Phil Esposito was the first to wear #77 when he played
with the Rangers in the '70s.  This was the season that they put the
Rangers crest and "modern-style" numbers on the jerseys instead of the
"NEW YORK" or "RANGERS" block letters and two-colour numbers.  He took #77
because the Rangers already had a #7.

(Hockey Night in Canada made a big thing out of it, saying it was the
biggest uniform style change in a long time.  This was before Pittsburgh
and Vancouver changed their colours.)

     dwarf
--
W. Jim Jordan                           "I don't mean to tell you how to live
dwarf@x400gate.bnr.ca (Internet)         your life--that's what the TV's for--
I work for BNR; I do not speak for it.   but if I didn't believe in Jesus, I'd
                                         be going to hell."      - Peter Heath

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53891
From: chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Subject: Re: SHARKS REVIEW Part 5: Left Wings

nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:

>#8	LARRY DEPALMA		Season:	3rd
>Acquired:	'91-92, free agent from Minnesota
>Grade:		I (C-/D+)

>No netter/fan watching the Sharks, including me, knows where DePalma was at
>the end of the season; the Sharks appeared to still have his rights, but he
>wasn't in San Jose, he wasn't in Kansas City, and his name hasn't appeared on
>the waiver wire.

Sorry, Nelson, but you forgot to ask me. If you check the THN stats for
Kansas City, you'll find that Larry has been playing for the games, having
played in 8 games in the period covered in the stats between 3/26 and the
4/16 issue (1-3-4 with 13 PIM). Not exactly invisible.

>He then was sent down to
>Kansas City, walked out from there, and was suspended and later reinstated
>when it was revealed that he was injured; he then promptly disappeared from
>the watching eyes of Shark Bytes (as the mailing list is now known to Sharks
>officials) faithful, and neither the Sharks nor we miss him.

Well, having gotten to a chance to talk to him a few times, this isn't quite
accurate. He injured his back (a disk injury) and did one stupid thing,
which was to hide it from the Sharks and he tried to play through it because
he knew he was on the bubble. The Sharks then sent him to K.C., at which
point he disclosed the injury. Since he didn't disclose it, the Sharks and
he disagreed about the responsibility and he was suspended for not
reporting. That was eventually worked out, the Sharks re-instated him as
injured and put him into therapy, and when he was able to play then shipped
him down to K.C. He fully expects to play in the NHL again, although clearly
not with the Sharks (hiding injuries is a stupid no-no, beyond just a
no-no).

Very nice guy. Always hustled his butt off. He disappeared because he was
hurt. I expect he'll surface with another team at some point (probably
another expansion team), but is likely to be a bubble player for the rest of
his career. Has a good work ethic and is good at getting other players
motivated. Unfortunately, he played himself out of the Sharks future with a
bad judgement call.


>#20	JOHN CARTER		Season: 4th
>Acquired:	'91-92, free agent from Boston
>Grade:		I (B+/B)

> He
>is very unlikely to be back next season.

Always gave 110%, best work ethic on the club (except maybe Kisio), but
hustle isn't always enough. His future with the Sharks was made clear to me
one night against the Flames when he went behind the crease and tried to
hold Joel Otto against the board. He literally had one arm around Otto's
neck and another wrapped around Otto's stick arm. Otto casually turned
around and fed the puck in front of the crease for a goal, as though Carter
wasn't there. Hustle can only cover size so far.

The Sharks have told me, point blank, that he's gone for good (ditto HUbie
McDonough). He was one of the favorites of the staff, but as one said to me
"you have to make room for the kids". Carter, in fact, refused to report to
K.C. and has been suspended by the Sharks. That might be a defacto
retirement, but I haven't heard anything official. His only hope in hockey
now is the Gulls.

>#28	JEAN-FRANCOIS QUINTIN	Season: 1st
>Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
>Grade:		I (B+/B)

>I don't understand why the Sharks didn't let Quintin play any more than the
>14 games he played this season.

Because, at least from the games I saw him in, he was outmatched and looked
fairly lost on the ice. I think he shows potential, but I didn't think he
was quite ready to make the jump to the NHL.

> He should be a solid contender for regular duty next season.

Agreed (BTW, I still think a lot of your grades are more based on how you
wish they'd performed than how they actually performed. I wonder whether you
can really judge talent from radio and television, Nelson? I know I have
trouble, since you don't see the off-puck action. your views from home and
my views from the ice differ in numerous ways)

>#41	MARK BEAUFAIT		Season: 1st
>Acquired:	2nd round pick in 1991 supplemental draft
>Grade:		I (?)

>After a all-star season at Kansas City, Beaufait got a cup of coffey with the

Coffee. Coffey is with the Red Wings.

>#45	DODY WOOD		Season: 1st
>Acquired:	3rd round pick in 1991 entry draft
>Grade:		I (D+/D, although perhaps I shouldn't give a grade at all)

>I have been accused of knocking on Wood too much.

You? Nah... 

He was seriously unimpressive, even as a tough guy (his rep). However, as
few games as he had in a season that was at that point meaningless, I hate
to judge the talent too quickly. Butn in Dody's case, I"m tempted to make an
exception.

But I won't.

-- 
 Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= chuq@apple.com
   Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms =+=  GEnie: MAC.BIGOT =+= ALink:CHUQ 
  Minor League fans: minors-request@medraut.apple.com (San Jose Giants: A/1/9)
  San Francisco Giants fans: giants-request@medraut.apple.com (The Stick?NOT!)
   San Jose Sharks fans: sharks-request@medraut.apple.com (New seat: 127/TBD)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53892
From: Patrick Walker <F1HH@UNB.CA>
Subject: They guy who bad-mouthed Ulf...

Ditto...

If we allow people like him to continue to do what he does, it's a
shame.  People say that cheap shots and drawing penalties by fake-
ing is part of the game, I say "Bullsh-t!".  If he ever tried some
like that on a Yzerman, he'd would have to deal with Probert now
wouldn't he?  What Ulf does isn't even retaliatory!  There's now
way one could justify what he does and if they do they're fools.


 /----\==========/  Patrick Walker
/ /--\ =========/   University of New Brunswick
I I()I ======/      Canada
\ \--/ /            Detroit Fan Extraordinaire.
 \----/


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53893
From: Patrick Walker <F1HH@UNB.CA>
Subject: Did you really expect Toronto to go anywhere?  REALLY!

Detroit is a very disciplined team.  There's a lot of Europeans
in Detroit which would make the game fast, so Toronto would have
to slow the game down, which means drawing penalties, as a last
resort anyway.  Toronto will be a good team as soon as they get
more good players.  Toronto is just an average team, Detroit isn't
Ballard screwed Toronto when he was owner.  Everyone knows that.
and it's going to take time for Toronto to become a real force.
I expect Gilmour to be burnt out next year.  He can't pull the
whole team forever.

Patrick Walker
University of New Brunswick


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53894
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: ESPN sucks: OT or Baseball?  Guess which.

Showing a meaningless (relatively) baseball game over the overtime of
game that was tied up with less than 3 seconds left on the clock?
Gimme a break!  Where does ESPN get these BRILLIANT decisions from?

Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53895
From: stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber)
Subject: ESPN, the network with a heart...


     Dale Hunter ties the game, scoring his third goal of the game
with 2.7 seconds remaining in regulation.

     You could feel it coming on.

     "Due to contractual agreements, ESPN will be unable to carry
the rest of this game live, so that we may show you a worthless
early-season battle between those two pennant contenders, the 
Cleveland Indians and the California Angels.  When the winning
goal is scored, we WILL do the grave injustice of breaking into the
baseball game -- something reserved only for the deaths of Presidents
or the trading of Joe Montana to the Chiefs -- to show you the 
goal on instant replay.
     "Aren't you SO lucky to have national coverage of hockey?"

     It's HEIDI all over again, dammit!

Kevin L. Stamber
Purdue University
PENGUINS 7, DEVILS 0 -- ROLL TRAIN, ROLL!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53896
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: Thumbs WAY WAY WAY DOWN to ESPN

cdash@moet.cs.colorado.edu (Charles Shub) writes:
>Tuesday, and the isles/caps game is going into overtime.
>what does ESPN do.....
>
>Tom Mees says,  "we are obligated to bring you baseball"

We're probably stuck, as Mike Burger pointed out that the baseball
deal was made far in advance of the NHL contract.  WABC did the same
thing; they were thankful that the Devils were wiped out by 9:30,
because they had to switch over to Yankees baseball.  The proof of 
the reasons for this is left to the reader ...

It's too bad, but I wonder if ESPN is stuck with other US local team
coverage for their alternate games?  We got NESN's coverage of the
Bruins-Sabres with the Boston homers ... they were awful!!!  I've read
that Derek Sanderson is the colour analyst ... I wonder if he spent
his early years after hockey as an intern at PRAVDA before landing
this job?  *Everything* had to be twisted into something good to say
about the Bruin(s) involved ... not even Bill Wirtz's shills on SC
Chicago (Pat Foley, Dale Tallon) were this bad.  And just to be fair,
SC used to take their feed from ESN (Empire Sports Network), the Sabre
homers and they were horrible too ... but they were spacy.

From the CNN highlights, I hear Chris Cuthbert's voice from the CBC
coverage of the Habs-Nords series.  Too bad that we couldn't get it
on ESPN, with all due respect to the Sabres and the Bruins.

Mike Emrick is substituting on the Devils SCNY team for Gary Thorne.
Mike was the original Devils TV play-by-play announcer, by the way.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53897
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: The guy who bad-mouthed Ulf...

Patrick Walker <F1HH@UNB.CA> writes:
>
>If he ever tried some like that on a Yzerman, he'd 
>would have to deal with Probert now wouldn't he?

Do you realize how many smiles are crossing faces after you wrote that?
(-;

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53898
From: The Always Fanatical: Patrick Ellis <IO11330@MAINE.MAINE.EDU>
Subject: Re: 1993 NHL Draft

>San Jose will then get Kariya

    ya know that kind of funny cause I've seen Kariya on Campus
with a Sharks hat on.......



             Pat Ellis


P.S.  GO BRUINS    GO UMAINE BLACK BEARS    42-1-2       NUMBER 1......

                   HOCKEY EAST REGULARS SEASON CHAMPIONS.....
                   HOCKEY EAST TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONS>......
                   PAUL KARIYA, HOBEY BAKER AWARD WINNER.......
         NCAA DIV. 1 HOCKEY TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


                    M-A-I-N-E      GGGGOOOOOOO    BBBLLLUUEEEE!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53899
From: kozloce@wkuvx1.bitnet
Subject: ESPN Thumbs Up your $%#@*!!

Jesus Christ!!!

The score is now 6-0. The Pens are beating the shit out of the Devils who
gave up in the middle of the 2nd period. ESPN does something smart. The
announcer states "well folks this game is getting out of hand. Lets go to
the Islander/Capitals game." I celebrate as I was actually making progress in
my CS homework because I was so bored by the scheduled game.  I tear down and
throw on my jersey, Hunter scores I go ape shit 'cause this is the first
caps game I've been able to watch all season. And what does ESPN do? they
go back to the blowout that NJ hasn't a chance in hell of winning!
     The period ends and the sportscaster (CAPITOLS JUST TIED IT UP!! YES!!
oops excuse me =) goes into his penguin worship mode (Dont freak pens fans!
They are worthy of this! I'm so glad we wont have to play them as much next
year!) and here comes the 3rd period...what? its the blowout again. Oh they
were just waiting for the Cap/Isles to get out of intermission. Good
they've put a close game back on. Wait! WHATS THIS SHIT?!! THEY'RE SHOWING
THE BLOWOUT AGAIN!


AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG!

(Oh guess what the score is now 7-0 penguins! Switch games you $%&*#@!!!)

Holy shit they're changing games! ITS ABOUT GODDAMNED TIME!! Lets see if
they'll stay.

Later

I think this proves by $#%&* point. The Caps game goes into overtime but
"due to contractual obligations" they have to switch to the fucking baseball.
(Sorry for my language but im PISSED!) What the hell were they going to do
if their scheduled game went into overtime? ESPN get your head out of your
ass.

Now I know there are a lot 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53900
From: thomas@cmgm.stanford.edu (Thomas Kiefhaber)
Subject: Re: German audience is lunatic??

In article <1993Apr21.114335.7071@ousrvr.oulu.fi>, golf@phoenix.oulu.fi
(Jouko Kylmaoja) wrote:
> 
> I watched the game Germany-Czechs in WC today...and i was astonished about
> the behaviour of the German audience!
> The German team got a few penalties in the last period and the crowd went
> grazy! They threw coins, extra pucks and other trash into the rink...is
> that stupid or what?? I guess the Canadian referee (one of the
> Isostar-bros ;) gave the German team a penalty for that, but it didn't help
> much.
> I guess the Germans just are proud over their Nazi-Kill-'em-All-Everyone-
> But-Us-Germans-Sucks attitude...they just seem to have that kind of attitude
> in every possible sport (remember the European champs in Stockholm in soccer)
> It really pisses me off!
> I do not mean that every single German has this attitude that sucks, but 
> most of them seem to do...

I can understand your anger about the German audience. I mean, it was the
Finnish team they played and they were taking advantage of the ridiculous
penalties the Canadien ref called in the last period. The Germans got a
match penalty and a 10 minutes misconduct for practically nothing and
seconds after that the German goalie got two minutes for "delay of game"
for a shot that was deflected and went into the crowd. The resulting 5:3
skating advantage lead to the deciding goal at a point, when the Germans
were starting to come up strong.
I am also sick of the nationalism that is going on in German sports events.
If you watch for example a tennis Davis Cup match the players are often not
able to play for minutes, because the crowd is so obnoxious. But I have to
admit that this kind of nationalism is as strong or even stronger in most
other countries (you should go to the US and watch the way they present the
Olympics on television; or the soccer crowds in England; or the Finnish
spectators at nordic skiing events.....). I mean it makes me sick to see
all this nationalism all over the world and I would rather see the best
team/player win and get cheared at. I do not mind if my favorite team
looses to somebody that is better or plays more attractive and I have to
admit that in most sports the German national site is not my favorite team
to watch (the German soccer team is boring to watch, for example).
But, reading the above posting, I think that you are on the same level as
these crowds you are criticizing. It is easy to talk of (nearly all)
Germans as Nazis and nationalists; thats the kind of propaganda that all
ultraconservative people use against Germany. It is true that there is a
great danger of re-arising nationalism in Germany but from my experience
most of the people (at least of the people that i know) also regard this as
a big threat and are trying to demonstrate this attitude now. Why can't we
just look at people as human beeings and not try to put them into drawers
corresponding to their nationality (eg. all Russians are Communists; all
Americans are Capitalists; all Germans are Nazis, all Fins are hanging
around beeing drunk on ferries...). 
In my opinion, your comment shows the narrowness of your mind and that you
don't seem to be different from the Nazis you are talking about.

Thomas


"There's no time to hate, barely time to wait" (Jerry Garcia/Robert Hunter)

       

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53901
From: mjr4u@Virginia.EDU ("Matthew J. Rush")
Subject: Re: ESPN UP YOURS .........

Actually, I was angry when they went away from the Pens game.
Being a Pens fan in central Virginia is kinda tough.  I only
get to see them on ESPN, and when they play the Caps, cause
we're close enough to DC to get all the Caps games, so when
ESPN switched to the Caps, . . . AAAGGGHHH!

Matt

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53902
From: filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu (Geoff Filinuk)
Subject: Re: FLYERS:with & without Eric

In article <1993Apr20.211124.23075@btree.uucp>, terry@btree.uucp (Terry Whalen)
writes:
|>Path:
netnews.upenn.edu!newsserver.jvnc.net!howland.reston.ans.net!usc!news.se
ervice.uci.edu!network.ucsd.edu!btree!terry
|>From: terry@btree.uucp (Terry Whalen)
|>Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
|>Subject: Re: FLYERS:with & without Eric
|>Message-ID: <1993Apr20.211124.23075@btree.uucp>
|>Date: 20 Apr 93 21:11:24 GMT
|>References: <1993Apr19.030101.116104@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu>
|>Organization: Brooktree Corporation
|>Lines: 47
|>
|>In article <1993Apr19.030101.116104@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu> ksc2@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu
(KEVIN S. CARRAGHER) writes:
|>>The Philadelphia Inquirer posted the following stats:
|>>
|>>
|>>WITH LINDROS:
|>>
|>>    29-23-9
|>>    GOALS AGAINST AVERAGE: 3.49
|>>    GOALS SCORED AVERAGE: 4.27
|>>
|>>
|>>WITHOUT LINDROS:
|>>
|>>    7-14-2
|>>    GOALS AGAINST AVERAGE: 3.92
|>>    GOALS SCORED AVERAGE: 2.52
|>>
|>>
|>>I THINK THE DIFFERENCE IS OBVIOUS.  HE'S A DOMINANT PLAYER
|>>
|>>
|>>SKIP
|>
|>
|>Yes he is!
|>
|>He will become a major franchise player and bring the Flyers to the cup
|>in ............
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>...6 or 7 years
|>
	Will they name Lindros captain next year or Recchi.
Geoff

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53903
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: WC 93: Scores and standings, April 20


 1993 World Championships in Germany:
 ====================================

   Group A standings (Munich)          Group B standings (Dortmund)
   --------------------------          ----------------------------

              GP  W T L GF-GA +/- P                  GP  W T L GF-GA +/- P

   Canada      2  2 0 0  6-1  +5  4    Czech republic 2  1 1 0  6-1  +5  3
   Russia      2  1 1 0  6-4  +2  3    Finland        2  1 1 0  3-1  +2  3
   Italy       2  1 1 0  3-2  +1  3    Germany        2  1 0 1  6-5  +1  2
   Sweden      2  1 0 1  2-4  -2  2    USA            2  0 2 0  2-2   0  2
   --------------------------------    -----------------------------------
   Austria     2  0 0 2  2-5  -3  0    France         1  0 0 1  0-2  -2  0
   Switzerland 2  0 0 2  0-3  -3  0    Norway         1  0 0 1  0-6  -6  0

 
 April 18:  Italy - Russia        2-2       Norway - Germany          0-6
            Sweden - Austria      1-0       USA - Czech republic      1-1

 April 19:  Canada - Switzerland  2-0
            Russia - Austria      4-2       Finland - France          2-0

 April 20:  Sweden - Canada       1-4       Czech republic - Germany  5-0
            Switzerland - Italy   0-1       Finland - USA             1-1

 April 21:                                  Germany - France		15:30
            Italy - Sweden                  Czech republic - Norway	20:00

 April 22:  Switzerland - Russia            USA - France		15:30
            Austria - Canada                Norway - Finland		20:00

 April 23:  Switzerland - Austria           Germany - Finland		20:00

 April 24:  Russia - Sweden                 Czech republic - France	15:30
            Canada - Italy                  USA - Norway		20:00

 April 25:  Sweden - Switzerland            Finland- Czech republic  	15:30
            Russia - Canada                 Germany - USA		20:00

 April 26:  Austria - Italy                 France - Norway		20:00

 
 PLAYOFFS:
 =========

 April 27:	Quarterfinals
		A #2 - B #3						15:30
		A #3 - B #2						20:00

 April 28:	Quarterfinals
		A #1 - B #4						15:30
		A #4 - B #1						20:00

 April 29:	Relegation
		A #5 - B #6						15:30
		A #6 - B #5						20:00

 April 30:	Semifinals
		A #1/B #4 - A #3/B #2					15:30
		A #4/B #1 - A #2/B #3					20:00

 May 1:		Relegation						14:30
		Bronze medal game 					19:00

 May 2:		FINAL							15:00

--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53904
From: boora@kits.sfu.ca (The GodFather)
Subject: ABC: The Real Thing?


	Ok, it seems that everyone else in canada was treated to the 
REAL ABC telecast while only the people on ROGERS TV in Surrey BC 
were treated to two channels with Don "I stink as a Commentator" Whitman
doing the play-by-play.

	The GodFather.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53905
From: nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: Re: 1993 NHL Draft

In article <1993Apr20.184627.4585@newshub.ariel.yorku.ca> cs902043@ariel.yorku.ca (SHAWN LUDDINGTON) writes:

>As for the picks
>Ottawa picks #1 which means it is almost 100% that Alexander Daigle will 
>go #1. He'll either stay or be traded in Montreal or Quebec.  IMO I would
>take Kariya.  He should alot of leadership in the NCAA and so far in
>the World Championships.  Daigle didn't show this for his junior team.
>
>San Jose will then get Kariya.
>
>Tampa Bay will either go for a russian Kozlov (I think that's it) or a 
>    defenseman Rob Niedemeyer (probably spelt the last name wrong)

The last name is Niedermayer, as in New Jersey's Scott's last name, because
(you guessed it) they are brothers.  But Rob Niedermayer is a center, not
a defenseman.

I am not sure that the Sharks will take Kariya.  They aren't saying much, but
they apparently like Niedermayer and Victor Kozlov, along with Kariya.  Chris
Pronger's name has also been mentioned.  My guess is that they'll take
Niedermayer.  They may take Pronger, except that they already have too many
defensive prospects.

===============================================================================
GO CALGARY FLAMES!  Al MacInnis for Norris!  Gary Roberts for Hart and Smythe!
GO EDMONTON OILERS!  Go for playoffs next year!  Stay in Edmonton!
===============================================================================
Nelson Lu (claudius@leland.stanford.edu)
rec.sport.hockey contact for the San Jose Sharks

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53906
From: holger.ohlwein@ap.mchp.sni.de (Holger Ohlwein)
Subject: Re: Canada 3 Sweden 1 at the World Champioships

In article <20APR199319243244@venus.cc.hollandc.pe.ca>, white@venus.cc.hollandc.pe.ca (Take me Baby!) writes:
> 
> 	Today at the World Championships in Munich, Canada scored an 
> impressive 3-1 victory over the defending World Champs, Sweden. 
 
In the game *I* have seen yesterday in the Olympiahalle of Munich
Canada won 4-1 against Sweden! The last goal for Canada was at 19:59 in
the 3rd period. Maybe you shouldn't go and get you another beer 
before the game is over and then post imaginary results...

Holger

-- 
S I E M E N S    Holger Ohlwein   AP153   Otto-Hahn-Ring 6    8000 Muenchen 83
-------------    Tel: + 49 (89) 636-3746  Email: holger.ohlwein@ap.mchp.sni.de
N I X D O R F    Never put off till tomorrow what you can avoid all together.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53907
From: kirk@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (ANDREW KIRK)
Subject: Re: Goodbye, good riddance, get lost 'Stars

In article <9505@blue.cis.pitt.edu> gomer+@pitt.edu (Richard J Coyle) writes:
>In article <1993Apr19.232038.26593@julian.uwo.ca> kirk@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (ANDREW KIRK) writes:
>>First off, anyone accepted into the Western Business School is not a dork. 
>>Second, just because one person out of a country of 27 Million doesn't think
>>before he/she posts an article, does NOT mean that he/she is embarrasing
>>Canada. This network is for expressing what you feel are your thoughts. Just
>>because someone doesn't agree with you, this does not give you the right to
>>call them assholes. Anyways, the North Stars are SHIT!!!!!!!!!
>
>Actually, I think it does give people the privilege of calling folks
>like you assholes.   Although my own asshole might take offense at being
>grouped in with a bunch of losers like you.
>
>I've never heard of the Western Business School, anyhow.  Probably a
>chickenshit place.
>
>rick

Losers like us? You are the fucking moron who has never heard of the Western
Business School, or the University of Western Ontario for that matter. Why 
don't you pull your head out of your asshole and smell something other than
shit for once so you can look on a map to see where UWO is! Back to hockey,
the North Stars should be moved because for the past few years they have
just been SHIT. A real team like Toronto would never be moved!!!

Andrew--



-- 
Andrew Kirk
University of Western Ontario
London, Ontario
GO LEAFS GO!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53908
From: caine@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Lord Vader)
Subject: Trivia:  the Habs?


OK, I'm sure that this has been asked 100's of times before, but I
have wondered since I heard it...  Where the hell did the nickname
of the "Habs" come from for the Montreal Canadiens?

Thanks in advance,
Caine Schneider

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53909
From: willis@oracle.SCG.HAC.COM (Stan Willis)
Subject: 1992-93 NHL Regular Season Final Attendance Report


                        *** NATIONAL HOCKEY LEAGUE ***
                                 92-93 SEASON

                            HOME ATTENDANCE REPORT

 Each Qtr. represents 10 home games,   Qtr. 4 will have 11 home games.
 Neutral site games are not included.  S/O indicates the number of sell-outs.

Team
Name   Qtr. 1   S/O  Qtr. 2   S/O  Qtr. 3   S/O  Qtr. 4   S/O   Totals   Average
================================================================================
BOS    140,573   5   142,694   7   142,768   6   152,468   8    578,503   14,109
BUF    144,701   0   148,516   3   152,133   5   168,878   4    614,228   14,981
CAL    190,125   1   196,174   3   196,982   4   217,346   5    800,627   19,527
CHI    176,372  10   176,746   9   177,981  10   196,749  11    727,848   17,752
DET    196,330  10   196,670  10   197,228  10   217,167  10    807,395   19,692
EDM    139,038   0   149,422   2   152,831   2   165,384   2    606,675   14,796
HAR     92,994   0   110,670   2   108,651   0   122,123   0    434,438   10,596
LA     154,065   5   159,014   8   160,050  10   176,055  11    649,184   15,833
MIN    130,710   2   140,933   3   139,986   1   160,213   4    571,842   13,947
MON    168,097   8   169,671  10   168,784  10   190,186  11    696,738   16,993
NJ     127,053   0   124,011   2   145,856   2   163,050   1    559,970   13,657
NYI    114,706   1   108,502   1   123,167   3   139,946   0    486,321   11,861
NYR    178,200   7   179,990   6   182,000  10   199,337   8    739,527   18,037
OTT    104,713  10   105,000  10   104,602  10   115,330  11    429,645   10,479
PHI    172,372   4   172,967   3   172,613   2   190,520   5    708,472   17,279
PIT    160,379   6   161,475   8   161,280   6   177,705  10    660,839   16,118
QUE    149,452   3   147,911   3   147,394   2   168,830   8    613,587   14,965
SJ     110,890  10   110,374   8   110,120   7   121,745  10    453,129   11,051
STL    156,313   3   170,531   5   171,249   5   187,849   7    685,942   16,730
TB      97,269   5    99,621   6    99,611   4   114,059   9    410,560   10,013
TOR    155,500   4   157,779   9   157,014   8   172,888  11    643,181   15,687
VAN    144,120   0   154,184   4   157,094   6   176,751   8    632,149   15,418
WAS    153,209   0   163,563   1   161,479   2   171,711   2    649,962   15,852
WIN    131,072   0   135,902   1   133,414   1   154,956   2    555,344   13,544
 
     3,488,253     3,582,320     3,624,287     4,021,246     14,716,106
 
Avg.    14,534        14,926        15,101        15,231                  14,955

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53910
From: willis@oracle.SCG.HAC.COM (Stan Willis)
Subject: Kings playoff notes: Stauber, TV ratings, etc.

1992-93 Los Angeles Kings notes.
--------------------------------
Playoffs:
---------
*Stauber disturbed by third-man theme
by Rick Sadowski, Daily News

Barry Melrose's decision to stick Robb Stauber in the stands rather than in the
crease or even on the bench for the Stanley Cup playoffs does not sit well with
the rookie goaltender.

"I want to be a part of the team at the most crucial time of the year, the most
fun time of the year, and I'm not,"  Stauber said with some emotion Monday.  "I
think I have worked hard enough for that."

Stauber said he accepts Melrose's choice of Kelly Hrudey as the teams top goalie
in their playoff series with the Calgary Flames. Hrudey made 21 saves in Sundays
6-3 opening victory.

But Stauber clearly is upset with his sudden status as the No. 3 man behind Rick
Knickle.  Stauber had a 4-1-2 record and 2.98 goals-against average down the
stretch in the regular season and nearly wrestled the No. 1 job from Hrudey.

Knickle?  He won 2 of 3 decisions but had a bloated 5.26 average, twice was 
yanked from games (once for stomach cramps) and hasn't played since March 29.

Yet, when the series resumes Wednesday, Knickle will serve as Hrudey's backup
again and Stauber will have to satisfy his playoff hunger by munching on Olympic
Saddledome popcorn.

"If I'm supposedly close to being the starter or could have been the starter...I
dropped too. 3.  What happened to No. 2?"  Stauber wondered.  "Not that I'd be
happy with No. 2, but I feel I should at least be a part of this team in the
playoffs."

Perhaps Stauber eventually will get his chance, but Melrose apparently is not
convinced the 25-year old is capable of handling playoff pressure.

While insisting he is the Kings' "goalie of the future," Melrose said Stauber
flubbed all four of the big games he was asked to win this season.  They were,
according to Melrose: a 7-2 loss to San Jose on Dec. 26; An 8-3 loss to the New
York Rangers on Jan. 23; a 6-6 tie with Detroit on Feb. 11; an 8-6 loss to 
Vancouver on Thursday.

"Four times this season Robb could have emerged as the elite goalie, he could
have taken it away from Kelly Hrudey, and he didn't do it," Melrose said.  "An
elite goaltender has to carry the ball when you give it to him.  The mark of a
great goalie is that he isn't satisfied to be a backup."

"I'm not blaming Robb for the losses, but if you're going to be No. 1, you've
got to be able to walk your talk.  You've got to be able to play when everything
is on the line.  Robb Stauber has a great deal of ability, but maybe I expect
more from him than he does."

Ouch.  That remark stung Stauber.  He began the season 9-0-1, struggled when the
team hit a mid-season slump, didn't play for a month after Knickle was signed
off the San Diego Gulls roster, then came on at the end.

"I expect more from myself than anybody, including Barry Melrose," said Stauber,
a three-year star at the University of Minnesota who left school in 1989, only 
to have his development hampered by a string of serious injuries.

"What I've been through the last four years - two knee operations, a herniated
disk in my back, shoulder surgery - what more can I go through?  I obviously do
expect a lot from myself, otherwise I wouldn't be here."

"Anybody who would disagree with that doesn't know me.  I'm not saying Barry 
doesn't know me, but don't say I've been without expectations.  If anything, I'm
a perfectionist."

Stauber acknowledged he played poorly in the four games Melrose mentioned. "But 
even though I didn't play well, I get knocked down from maybe on to three? It's 
a bit of a jump," he said.  "You're almost No. 1, or if you play a good game 
you're No. 1 and if you don't you're No. 3?  Why does Jack Nicklaus shoot a 67 
and then a 75?  Can you explain that?  That's what barry wanted me to explain 
to him, why I didn't come through when he counted on me.  I don't know. What I 
do know is, it's a sport.  I'll be there."

Melrose's "goalie of the future" statement doesn't mean much to Stauber. "Before
you know it, I'll be 30 and there will be no future," he said.

------

*Game 1 of the Kings @ Flames playoff series drew a 4.2 Nielsen rating on ABC 
Channel 7 here in LA.  The Kings averaged a 2.1 Nielsen rating in the 10 regular
season games aired on Channel 5.

Around the NHL:
---------------
*San Jose fired Coach George Kingston, who lead the team to a 11-71-2 mark in 
their 2nd NHL season.  Kingston was 28-129-7 over the past 2 years with the
Sharks.

------

*Former Islander executive Bill Torrey was named as President of the expansion
Florida Panthers.  Bobby Clarke was named as the clubs General Manager.

*Last nights games:
-------------------
WIN  2 @ VAN  4 (VAN leads 1-0)
TOR  3 @ DET  6 (DET leads 1-0)

===============================================================================
Stan Willis (willis@empire.dnet.hac.com)
net contact: L.A. Kings

 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
      talk with the L.A. Kings Mailing List ...... kings@cs.stanford.edu
      to subscribe or unsubscribe: ....... kings-request@cs.stanford.edu
 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
===============================================================================

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53911
From: willis@oracle.SCG.HAC.COM (Stan Willis)
Subject: Re: Schedule...

In article <121411@netnews.upenn.edu> kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller) writes:
>In article <1qup1lINNotb@master.cs.rose-hulman.edu> swartzjh@RoseVC.Rose-Hulman.Edu writes:
>F**king *NO* hockey games televised nationally tonight!  What the hell is
>this???  Why the hell is ESPN showing some stupid baseball game, when
>baseball is not even three weeks into the season and hockey is in the
>playoffs???  No, wait, I know the answer: $$$$$$  But still!  It really
.
.
.

ESPN had the Houston Astros @ Chicago Cubs game scheduled for last night on the
west coast. 

Since the game was rained out, they showed the Toronto Maple Leafs at the
Detroit Red Wings game instead.

Stan Willis
net contact: LA Kings

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53912
From: Bjornar.Steinbakken@edb.uib.no
Subject: Re: #77's?

In article <1r23on$4p6@bigboote.WPI.EDU> ching@bigwpi.WPI.EDU ("The
Logistician") writes:
>
>I am in need of all of the players wearing #77 in the NHL.  I know now
only
>of one, Ray Borque for the Bruins.  Any help would be greatly
appreciated.

Paul Coffey of Detroit RedWings


Bjoernar Steinbakken


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53913
From: mvs1@cec2.wustl.edu (Michael Virata Sy)
Subject: Re: Red Wings Goespel...

	Don't forget Paul Ysebaert, ex-Devil.  He's a good team player.
Michael Sy
mvs1@cec2.wustl.edu
 			    /|______|\
                           ||||||||||||
                            \||||||||/  
                  .---.      )|||||/'   
                 /|||||\    /|||||/   
                /|||||||\  /|||||/     NEW JERSEY DEVILS
               /|||||||||\/|||||/      
              /||||||||||||||||/      
             /||||||||||||||||/     
            /||||||||||||||||/       
           /||||||/\||||||||/        
          /||||||/  \||||||/      
         ''''' .____/|||||/             
           ../|||||||||||'           
     /|./||||||||||||||'            
    /|||||'       '''                    
   //|\                               

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53914
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: WC 93: Results, April 20


 1993 World Championships in Germany:
 ====================================

 Group A results:

 SWEDEN - CANADA  1-4 (0-0,1-1,0-3)

 1st:
 2nd: CAN 0-1 Geoff Sanderson      (Kevin Dineen)                  7:24
      SWE 1-1 Patrik Juhlin        (Jan Larsson)                  15:23 (pp)
 3rd: CAN 1-2 Geoff Sanderson                                      5:54 (ps)
      CAN 1-3 Mike Gartner         (Greg Johnson,Adam Graves)     10:44 
      CAN 1-4 Rod Brind'Amour      (Shayne Corson)                19:59

            Shots on goal:    Penalties:    Attendance:     Referee:
 Sweden     10 15 12 - 37     4*2min        6,500           Rob Hearn (USA)
 Canada     10 13  6 - 29     6*2min

 Bill Ranford stopped 36 shots to lead Canada to a 4-1 victory in a very well
 played game.

 The first period started with a give away from a Canadian defenseman and
 Rundqvist came in alone on Ranford but couldn't put the puck over a sliding
 Ranford. Later on, Kevin Dineen had a great opportunity but Soderstrom 
 played very well too. Stefan Nilsson had a couple of great dekes and set up
 Jan Larsson but again Ranford came up big. Period ended scoreless but the edge
 to Sweden in creating more opportunities.
 Second period action saw Tommy Soderstrom making a GREAT save. Mark Recchi
 made a backhanded cross ice pass to Lindros, Eric one timed the puck but
 Soderstrom was there to make a glove hand save. At the 7-minute mark, Canada
 started applying pressure on the Swedes. Sanderson-Dineen-Brind'Amour worked
 hard and kept the puck in the Swedes' zone. Dineen gave the puck to Sanderson
 who skated around a screened Swedish defenseman, came in on Soderstrom and
 made a wrist shot that went it by Soderstrom's far post, 1-0 Canada.
 The Swedes picked up their game after that, and Peter Forsberg had a shot
 that hit Ranford's post (the inside), went parallel to the goal line and out.
 Then Gartner got a penalty and the Swedes a power play. Jan Larsson took
 a shot from the slot, Ranford gave a rebound to Larsson who saw Juhlin by
 the far post, passed the puck and Ranford was beat, 1-1.
 Third period started as the other periods, Swedes having most of the pressure
 but the Canadians always dangerous once they were close to the Swede goal.
 At 5:54, Canada created some great chances and Arto Blomsten was forced to
 cover the puck in the Swede goal crease since Soderstrom lost sight of it.
 That resulted in a penalty shot, since a defenseman can't cover the puck in 
 the goal crease. Geoff Sanderson took the penalty shot (his first ever, he
 explained afterwards), and he put it low on Soderstrom's stick side, close
 to the post. Excellent penalty shot to give Canada a go ahead goal.
 Canada increased the lead on a very suspect offside, Gartner volleyed a
 bouncing puck past Soderstrom to make it 3-1. The Swedes ran out of gas
 then and couldn't produce as good scoring chances as they had for 2,5 periods.
 The 4-1 goal came with only 1 second left, Rod Brind'Amour scoring on a
 rebound from Soderstrom, where the Swedish defense already had their minds
 in the dressing room.

 A very good game (the best in the WC so far?), with both goalies playing
 great. Soderstrom best player in Sweden, but Ranford even played better
 than Soderstrom, that tells you something about Ranford. Probably the best
 goalie in the world, were some comments after the game.
 Canada played a very disciplined defense, Ranford pointed out that it is
 easy to play well with a good defense. Lindros played A LOT and played well,
 Sanderson naturally game hero with two goals.

 The Forsberg-Naslund-Bergqvist line Sweden's best along with Larsson-Juhlin-
 Nilsson. Swedish defense played well, 197 cm 104 kg Peter Popovic had the
 task of neutralizing 192 cm 107 kg Eric Lindros, and managed this very well.
 Ranger defenseman Peter Andersson finally got to go to the WC, and considering
 that he landed in Germany just a few hours before the game, he played very
 well. Swedish coach Curt Lundmark was irritated after the game, partly because
 of the Swedes inability to score, and partly because of the linesman's mistake
 on the 1-3 goal.

 Lines information follows further below.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

 ITALY - SWITZERLAND  1-0 (0-0,1-0,0-0)

 1st:
 2nd: ITA 1-0 Orlando          15:47
 3rd:

 Penalties: ITA 10*2min, SWI 8*2min
 Referee: Anton Danko, Slovakia
 Attendance: 3,500

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Group B results:

 CZECH REPUBLIC - GERMANY  5-0 (0-0,3-0,2-0)

 1st:
 2nd: CZE 1-0 Kamil Kastak        1:51
      CZE 2-0 Jiri Dolezal       12:26
      CZE 3-0 Petr Hrbek         19:10
 3rd: CZE 4-0 Radek Toupal        8:28
      CZE 5-0 Josef Beranek      17:07

 Penalties: CZE 7*2min, GER 6*2min 1*5min 1*10min game penalty
 Referee: Darren Loraas, Canada
 Attendance: 10,200

 The Czechs were clearly better than the Germans, and the German crowd
 showed their discontent by throwing in stuff on the ice after a while.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

 FINLAND - USA  1-1 (0-0,1-0,0-1)

 1st:
 2nd: FIN 1-0 Jarkko Varvio      4:00
 3rd: USA 1-1 Ed Olczyk          4:26

 Penalties: FIN 7*2min, USA 6*2min
 Referee: Valeri Bokarev, Russia
 Attendance: 2,800

 I hope some Finns can provide information from this game (I didn't see the
 whole game). The Finns took the lead on a Jarkko Varvio slap shot from the
 blue line, and a soft goal for an unscreened Mike Richter.
 As far as the play in the second period goes, the Finns seemed to have the
 most control, so a 1-0 lead was warranted as I saw it.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

		   SWEDEN			   CANADA

 Goaltender:	30 Tommy Soderstrom		30 Bill Ranford

 Defense:	 8 Kenneth Kennholt		 5 Norm Maciver
		14 Fredrik Stillman		24 Dave Manson

		 3 Peter Popovic		25 Geoff Smith
		55 Peter Andersson		19 Brian Benning

		 7 Arto Blomsten		 6 Terry Carkner
		28 Roger Akerstrom		 3 Garry Galley

						 4 Derek Mayer

 Forwards:	29 Mikael Renberg		15 Dave Gagner
		 9 Thomas Rundqvist		27 Adam Graves
		34 Mikael Andersson		22 Mike Gartner

		19 Markus Naslund		20 Paul Kariya
		21 Peter Forsberg		88 Eric Lindros
		18 Jonas Bergqvist		 8 Mark Recchi

		 5 Patrik Juhlin		17 Rod Brind'Amour
		20 Jan Larsson			 9 Shayne Corson
		 4 Stefan Nilsson		11 Kevin Dineen

		22 Charles Berglund		10 Geoff Sanderson
		26 Michael Nylander		12 Greg Johnson
		(34 Andersson/18 Bergqvist)	14 Brian Savage

						16 Kelly Buchberger

--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53915
From: delarocq@eos.ncsu.edu (DERRELL EMERY LAROCQUE)
Subject: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!






   Tonight in Boston, the Buffalo Sabres blanked the Boston
Bruins 4-0 tonight in Boston. Looks like Boston can hang
this season up, because Buffalo's home record is awesome!!!!
This is great.. Buffalo fans might get to see revenge for
last year!!!!! :)
-- 
delarocq@eos.ncsu.edu


      
---------------------------------------------------------------------------   
1988,1989,1990,1991 AFC East Division Champions
1991,1992, AND 1993 AFC Conference Champions!!!!!!!!  :)

Squished the Fish ............... Monday Night Football, November 16, 1992..
SQUISHED THE TRASH TALKING FISH.. AFC CHAMPIONSHIP, JANUARY 17, 1992..

If you are a Buffalo Bills fan, email me at delarocq@eos.ncsu.edu
so we can talk all about the games, insight, etc.
If you are a Packers fan, let me know. I am interested in any news
out of Green Bay...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53916
From: bart@splunge.uucp (Barton Oleksy)
Subject: Re: LA ON ABC IN CANADA

plarsen@sanjuan (P Allen Larsen) writes:

>In article <boora.735182771@sfu.ca> boora@kits.sfu.ca (The GodFather) writes:
>>	Was the ABC coverage of the Kings/Flames game supposed to be the
>>way it was shown in BC with CBC overriding the ABC coverage?  When I flipped
>>to ABC, it was the same commentators, same commercials even.  My question
>>is:  Was this the real ABC coverage or did CBC just "black out" the 
>>ABC coverage for its own?
>>

>Yes, it's called simulcast.  In Canada, when a Canadian station and an 
>American station are showing the same thing whether a sporting event or
>Cheers on Thursday night, the Canadian signal is broadcast over the American
>station. They even do this during the Superbowl, which has the best commercials
>of any television.  What do we get here, dumb Canadian commercials, the same
>ones we've seen for that last year or so.

I'm in Edmonton, and while that's usually (or at least OFTEN) the case,
here we were "treated" to the actual ABC telecast of the Kings/Flames
game.  I'm with whoever said it earlier - Don Witless (er, Whitman) is
a poor commentator, and not just for hockey.  Normally, if the Oilers
were still playing (augh), I would turn off the sound and listen to 
the radio broadcast to get decent play-by-play announcing.

Bart, Edmonton

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53917
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Bay area media (Wings-Leafs coverage)

In <DREIER.93Apr19195132@durban.berkeley.edu> dreier@durban.berkeley.edu (Roland Dreier) writes:

>The San Francisco Bay area media is reporting tonight that the Detroit
>Red Wings beat the Toronto Maple Leafs 6-3.  Can someone who is not
>part of the media conspiracy against the Leafs tell me how the game
>really went (I am expecting a 4-0 win for the Leafs, shutout for
>Potvin, hat trick for Andreychuk and a goal and 3 assists for
>Gilmour).  If the Leafs really lost, how many penalties did whichever
>biased ref was at the game have to call against the Leafs to let the
>Red Wings win?

Ah yes.  California.  Did the San Francisco Bay area media report that
Joe Montana is rumoured to be the leading candidate to replace fired
San Jose Sharks coach George Kingston?  Apparently Montana is not only
coveted for his winning attitude, but as a playing coach he will be
expected to quarterback the powerplay.

Good thing those walls are so soft, eh Rollie?


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53918
From: njdevils@IASTATE.EDU (Cire Y. Trehguad)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

Anna Matyas (am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu) wrote:
: Michael Collingridge writes:
: >And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
: >resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
: >team captain trivia would be appreciated.
;
: Wasn't Ron Francis captain of the Whalers when he was traded to
: Pittsburgh?

  And Rick Tochett was the captain of the Flyers when traded to the Pens
recently...

Caleb

And let us not forget that the New Jersey Devils traded
captain Kirk Muller for Stephen Richer and Chorske

Man I hated that trade!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53919
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Wings take game one

In <1qvos8$r78@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu (David Vergolini) writes:

>  The Detroit Red Wings put a lot of doubter on ice tonight with a 6 - 3
>washing of the Toronto Maple Leafs.  All you Toronto fans have now seen the
>power of the mighty Red Wing offense.  Toronto's defense in no match for the
>Wing offense.  As for the defense, Probert, Kennedey and Primeau came out

Did they move Probert back to defense?  Why did I see him parking his ass
in front of Potvin all night?  Somebody is going to have to discipline
Probert if the Leafs want to win the series.  Perhaps a fresh Clark should
hit the ice at the end of a long Probert shift and straigten him out for
a while...


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53920
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 18

dstein@oak.math.ucla.edu (David Stein) writes:
>  What's going on?  The Russians and the Czechs are unable to beat easy
>opponents, and the Swedes beat Austria only 1:0?!?
>
 It's the "opening-game effect" maybe. Pros arrive late, nervousness for
 rookie WC players, and problems to get the lines clicking may make things
 hard to get it going against these "worse" nations.
 I'd guess that the better team you face in the opening game, the better
 it is, since the chances of an upset are greater then.

 Some other reasons why the "worse" teams are so tough to beat was presented
 by Hans "Virus" Lindberg (former coach in Switzerland).

 1) The "worse" teams (referring to France, Switzerland, Austria, Italy etc)
    have now usually world class goalies.

 2) Their defensive play have become much more disciplined, they take much
    less unnecessary penalties.

 3) They use four lines which makes it harder to make them "run out of gas."

 4) The ice quality in the German WC rinks is poor.

>  The only convincing winner was... Germany.  Wierd.
>
 Another weird thing was that the Czechs played entertaining hockey..
 err.. just kidding, David.

>p.s. Alex, I would like to see the Czech roster, including, if possible,
>the clubs from which the players come.  How many are "Finnish", "German", 
>or "Swiss"?
>
 Alex? That's a new name for me ;)

 OK, I forgot the Czech roster at home yesterday, but now I have it.
 I don't know the teams for all players, so I would appreciate if
 you guys could fill in the blanks for me (especially I think some
 of these players play in Finland).

 The Czech Republic
 ------------------

 Goaltenders:	 1. Petr Briza		(Finland somewhere, right?)
		 2. Roman Turek		Motor C. Budejovice

 Defense:	 3. Leo Gudas		?
		 4. Milos Holan		TJ Vitkovice
		 5. Drahomir Kadlec	?
		 6. Bedrich Scerban	Brynas, Sweden
		 7. Antonin Stavjana	HV 71, Sweden
		 8. Miroslav Horava	MoDo, Sweden
		 9. Ales Flasar		TJ Vitkovice
	
 Forwards:	10. Petr Rosol		?
		12. Kamil Kastak	HV 71, Sweden
		13. Richard Zemlicka	?
		14. Jiri Kucera		?
		16. Jan Caloun		HC Litvinov
		18. Petr Hrbek		?
		19. Tomas Kapusta	?
		20. Otakar Janecky	(Finland?)
		21. Roman Horak		Motor C. Budejovice
		22. Martin Hostak	MoDo, Sweden
		24. Radek Toupal	?
		26. Jiri Dolezal	?


 Staffan
--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53921
From: icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera)
Subject: Hockey & The Hispanic community


	Relying on Canadian tourists and transplanted Northeasterners to
support a team in Miami is crazy; espaecially when you have really deserving 
cities without a team such as San Diego & Milwaukee. I wish the Panthers or
whatever their name is well but if they can't sell to Hispanics, they're in
deep doo-doo. Already, there are rumors that Tampa may move to Milwaukee.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53922
From: icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera)
Subject: ABC coverage


	I loved the ABC coverage. The production was excellent. The appearance
was excellent. It had a sleek modern look. This was the first time I heard
Thorne & Clement & I thought they were great. My only request is to leave
Al Micheals out of this. He annoys me. 
	I'm hoping this leads to a regular-season contract. My guess would
be is that it will be roughly a weekly game from Feb.-April and then the 
playoffs. I envy you Canadians with your TSN & CBC. Maybe I'll get a dish
to pick up Canadian TV. How much are those things, BTW?

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53923
From: Karim Edvard Ahmed <ka0k+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Goodbye, good riddance, get lost 'Stars

>First off, anyone accepted into the Western Business School is not a dork. 
>Second, just because one person out of a country of 27 Million doesn't think
>before he/she posts an article, does NOT mean that he/she is embarrasing
>Canada. This network is for expressing what you feel are your thoughts. Just
>because someone doesn't agree with you, this does not give you the right to
>call them assholes. Anyways, the North Stars are SHIT!!!!!!!!!
> 
>C'mon Leafs...


Whoa there!  Lighten up, Andrew!  When I was referring to "you dorks at
the Western Business School", I was specifically referring to those
assholes writing obnoxious comments insulting the state and people of
Minnesota for no apparent reason.  Being Canadian, and one who has
friends who attended UWO, I personally don't want to be associated with
the idiots who wrote those messages.  One more thing, Andrew...until
this season, the Leafs have sucked pretty badly over the last umpteen
years (have they won the Cup during our lifetime?)...so the North Stars
haven't been the only "shit" team in the Norris.

-KEA 


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53924
From: filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu (Geoff Filinuk)
Subject: Selfish hockey fans..


	On Tuesday, when it was raining in Chicago, ESPN provided 
bonus hockey coverage.  Now it seems as though some fans are ticked off
that the NY-Wash OT was replaced with the Angels-?? game.  People must
realize that there are more baseball fans instead of hockey fans in the U.S  
The baseball game was scheduled to air and advertisers money was paid so
they can't skip the baseball game.  Why don't you people CHILL OUT
and enjoy whatever coverage you can get.

Geoff Filinuk

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53925
From: CCDB@MUSICA.MCGILL.CA (CCDB)
Subject: Habs Late

Quebec dominated Habs for first 2 periods and only Roy kept
this one from being rout, although he did blow 2nd goal.
Canadians showed up in third but Nords were playing dump &
pull back most of the time. Hextall made some good saves but
really this one was lost in first period when nords scored 3
& could have had 5, plus another 4 in 2nd. Canadians are dead
meat, they may take one or 2 but this one is over. Tee it up
Jacques, next time you might rest players & forget about 1st
place, welcome to the Adams division.

    Dennis

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53926
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Sun, April 18, 1993

New Jersey                       1 0 2--3
Pittsburgh                       2 3 1--6
First period
     1, Pittsburgh, Tocchet 1 (Stevens, Lemieux) pp, 1:40.
     2, New Jersey, Barr 1 (Guerin, Holik) 6:24.
     3, Pittsburgh, Lemieux 1 (Jagr, Ramsey) 9:33.
Second period
     4, Pittsburgh, Lemieux 2 (Stevens, Murphy) pp, 4:11.
     5, Pittsburgh, Francis 1 (Ramsey, Mullen) 12:57.
     6, Pittsburgh, Tippett 1 (Jagr, McEachern) 17:13.
Third period
     7, Pittsburgh, Jagr 1 (Samuelsson, Lemieux) pp, 8:35.
     8, New Jersey, Stevens 1 (Niedermayer, Driver) pp, 11:48.
     9, New Jersey, Stevens 2 (Semak, Niedermayer) 18:56.

Pittsburgh: 6    Power play: 8-3
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Francis            1    0    1
Jagr               1    2    3
Lemieux            2    2    4
McEachern          0    1    1
Mullen             0    1    1
Murphy             0    1    1
Ramsey             0    2    2
Samuelsson         0    1    1
Stevens            0    2    2
Tippett            1    0    1
Tocchet            1    0    1

New Jersey: 3    Power play: 8-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Barr               1    0    1
Driver             0    1    1
Guerin             0    1    1
Holik              0    1    1
Niedermayer        0    2    2
Semak              0    1    1
Stevens            2    0    2

-----------------------------------------
St Louis                         0 2 2--4
Chicago                          1 2 0--3
First period
     1, Chicago, Noonan 1 (Larmer, Brown) 8:17.
Second period
     2, St Louis, Brown 1 (Shanahan, Emerson) 3:12.
     3, Chicago, Noonan 2 (Roenick, Chelios) pp, 5:40.
     4, Chicago, Noonan 3 (Matteau, Sutter) 8:51.
     5, St Louis, Felsner 1 (McRae, Janney) 12:49.
Third period
     6, St Louis, Shanahan 1 (Brown, Hull) pp, 11:12.
     7, St Louis, Hull 1 (Emerson, Brown) pp, 11:29.

St Louis: 4    Power play: 4-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Brown              1    2    3
Emerson            0    2    2
Felsner            1    0    1
Hull               1    1    2
Janney             0    1    1
McRae              0    1    1
Shanahan           1    1    2

Chicago: 3    Power play: 7-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Brown              0    1    1
Chelios            0    1    1
Larmer             0    1    1
Matteau            0    1    1
Noonan             3    0    3
Roenick            0    1    1
Sutter             0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Los Angeles                      1 3 2--6
Calgary                          0 1 2--3
First period
     1, Los Angeles, Sydor 1 (Gretzky, Sandstrom) 0:16.
Second period
     2, Calgary, Suter 1 (Fleury) sh, 2:48.
     3, Los Angeles, Carson 1 (Shuchuk, Sydor) pp, 3:13.
     4, Los Angeles, Huddy 1 (Taylor, Rychel) 3:37.
     5, Los Angeles, McSorley 1 (unassisted) 6:36.
Third period
     6, Los Angeles, Millen 1 (Granato, Donnelly) 1:06.
     7, Calgary, Dahlquist 1 (Otto) 4:23.
     8, Calgary, Yawney 1 (MacInnis, Reichel) 8:47.
     9, Los Angeles, Carson 2 (Sandstrom, Robitaille) pp, 10:32.

Los Angeles: 6    Power play: 10-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Carson             2    0    2
Donnelly           0    1    1
Granato            0    1    1
Gretzky            0    1    1
Huddy              1    0    1
McSorley           1    0    1
Millen             1    0    1
Robitaille         0    1    1
Rychel             0    1    1
Sandstrom          0    2    2
Shuchuk            0    1    1
Sydor              1    1    2
Taylor             0    1    1

Calgary: 3    Power play: 8-0   Special goals:  sh: 1  Total: 1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Dahlquist          1    0    1
Fleury             0    1    1
MacInnis           0    1    1
Otto               0    1    1
Reichel            0    1    1
Suter              1    0    1
Yawney             1    0    1

-----------------------------------------
First period
     1, NY Islanders, Ferraro 1 (Flatley, Vaske) 5:56.
Second period
     No scoring.
Third period
     2, Washington, Hunter 1 (Elynuik, Krygier) 3:18.
     3, Washington, Hunter 2 (Khristich, Johansson) pp, 7:01.
     4, Washington, Khristich 1 (Pivonka, Johansson) pp, 15:25.

Washington: 3    Power play: 5-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Elynuik            0    1    1
Hunter             2    0    2
Johansson          0    2    2
Khristich          1    1    2
Krygier            0    1    1
Pivonka            0    1    1

NY Islanders: 1    Power play: 5-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Ferraro            1    0    1
Flatley            0    1    1
Vaske              0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Buffalo                          2 1 1 1--5
Boston                           0 2 2 0--4
First period
     1, Buffalo, Hannan 1 (unassisted) 2:32.
     2, Buffalo, LaFontaine 1 (Mogilny) 9:26.
Second period
     3, Boston, Juneau 1 (Neely, Oates) pp, 7:20.
     4, Boston, Neely 1 (Oates, Juneau) 14:42.
     5, Buffalo, Mogilny 1 (Hawerchuk, Smehlik) 19:55.
Third period
     6, Buffalo, Mogilny 2 (unassisted) 3:46.
     7, Boston, Neely 2 (Juneau, Oates) 15:44.
     8, Boston, Heinze 1 (Juneau) 17:00.
Overtime
     9, Buffalo, Sweeney 1 (Khmylev, Smehlik) 11:03.

Buffalo: 5    Power play: 3-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Hannan             1    0    1
Hawerchuk          0    1    1
Khmylev            0    1    1
LaFontaine         1    0    1
Mogilny            2    1    3
Smehlik            0    2    2
Sweeney            1    0    1

Boston: 4    Power play: 7-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Heinze             1    0    1
Juneau             1    3    4
Neely              2    1    3
Oates              0    3    3

-----------------------------------------
Montreal                         1 1 0 0--2
Quebec                           0 0 2 1--3
First period
     1, Montreal, Dionne 1 (Dipietro, Brunet) 5:52.
Second period
     2, Montreal, Bellows 1 (Muller, Desjardins) 9:58.
Third period
     3, Quebec, Rucinsky 1 (Lapointe, Sundin) pp, 18:31.
     4, Quebec, Sakic 1 (Lapointe) 19:12.
Overtime
     5, Quebec, Young 1 (Ricci, Duchesne) 16:49.

Quebec: 3    Power play: 4-1
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Duchesne           0    1    1
Lapointe           0    2    2
Ricci              0    1    1
Rucinsky           1    0    1
Sakic              1    0    1
Sundin             0    1    1
Young              1    0    1

Montreal: 2    Power play: 1-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bellows            1    0    1
Brunet             0    1    1
Desjardins         0    1    1
Dionne             1    0    1
Dipietro           0    1    1
Muller             0    1    1

-----------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53927
Subject: College Hockey All-Star Roster
From: bdhissong@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu

Could someone please post the rosters for the College Hockey All-Star game East
and West Rosters?  Thanks in advance.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53928
From: holger.ohlwein@ap.mchp.sni.de (Holger Ohlwein)
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 18

In article <1993Apr21.085435.6895@ericsson.se>, etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson) writes:
 
>  OK, I forgot the Czech roster at home yesterday, but now I have it.
>  I don't know the teams for all players, so I would appreciate if
>  you guys could fill in the blanks for me (especially I think some
>  of these players play in Finland).
> 
>  The Czech Republic
>  ------------------
> 
>  Goaltenders:	 1. Petr Briza		(Finland somewhere, right?)
					signed contract for EV Landshut, Germany
					for the 1993/94 season
 
>  Defense:	 3. Leo Gudas		?
					EC Hedos Muenchen, Germany
					since 1992. 

Holger 

-- 
S I E M E N S    Holger Ohlwein   AP153   Otto-Hahn-Ring 6    8000 Muenchen 83
-------------    Tel: + 49 (89) 636-3746  Email: holger.ohlwein@ap.mchp.sni.de
N I X D O R F    Never put off till tomorrow what you can avoid all together.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53929
From: icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera)
Subject: request for list of Boston Univ. players in NHL


	Being a proud BU alumnus, I'd like to get a list of BU players in 
the NHL so I can keep an eye on their progress. A lot of Terriers are
graduating this year so I hope to see them soon in the NHL. If somebody
could post or send me a list, I'd appreciate it. Please note if the player
graduated from here or not.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53930
From: Gibson.Bill@applelink.apple.com (Bill Gibson)
Subject: SHARKS:  Kingston Fired!!!

I just overheard that San Jose Coach George Kingston was officially
terminated today...  Maybe good news, maybe bad.  I kinda liked him, but he
seemed to lack a certain fire.


Bill Gibson                  : Gibson.Bill@applelink.apple.com
Chief Technical Sponge       : AppleLink:  GIBSON.BILL
Apple Computer, Inc.         : Just say: SHARKS!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53931
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Detroit-Toronto?

What's the deal?  c.s.h. has nothing on it yet.  Is it in OT, is it over,
what?  I want to know!  We all want to know!  Where's Roger when you need
him?!?!?!?!  :-)

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

	   "A cow is not a vegetarian dish."  -- Keith Keller, 1993

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53932
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Goalie mask poll

In article <93743@hydra.gatech.EDU> gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak) writes:
>Current votes for favorite goalie masks (3pts - 1st, 2pts - 2nd, 1pt - 3rd)
>Others receiving less than 4pts: Mike Vernon (Cal), Clint
> Glenn Healy (NYI), Toy Espo (???), Gilles Gratton (???),
		     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Is this Tony Esposito?  If memory serves me correctly, Chicago.  God I
hope I am right, otherwise I will never hear the end of it. ;-)

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

	   "A cow is not a vegetarian dish."  -- Keith Keller, 1993

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53933
From: mfoster@alliant.backbone.uoknor.edu (Marc Foster)
Subject: Final season CHL stuff

Here are the final stats for the CHL for the 1992-1993 season.

                       Central Hockey League

                       5840 S. Memorial Drive
                             Suite 205
                          Tulsa, OK  74145
                       Phone:  (918) 664-8881
                       Fax:    (918) 664-2215

Founder and President - Ray Miron
Commissioner - Monte Miron
Marketing Director - Jim Goodman
Information Director - Eric Kolb

Each team is owned by the league, with local intrests controlling day to
day operations.  Working agreements and NHL affiliations are up to each
team.

Each team has a $100,000 salary cap for 17 total players
(16 dress up).

Each team is limited to 11 visas, meaning at least 6 players must be
Americans (Ignore this rule if you are Tulsa, they only had 2 Americans
on the roster during the playoffs).

Teams play in Wichita, Tulsa, Oklahoma City, Memphis, Fort Worth, and Dallas.

Future expansion plans include Houston, San Antonio, Baton Rouge, Little Rock,
El Paso, Albuquerque, Tuscon, and Amarillo.  Austin is a possibility if Dallas
has to move.  Houston and San Antonio are in for this fall, with Baton Rouge
and Little Rock likely for 94-95.

TEAMS:
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
          Fort Worth Fire                 | Wichita Thunder
                                          |
Arena:    Tarrant Co. Conv. Cen. (11,342) | Kansas Coliseum (9,686)
Colors:   Red and Black                   | Blue , silver, and black
GM:       George Branum                   | Bill Shuck
Coach:    Pete Mahavolich                 | Doug Sheddan
Phone #:  (817) 335-FIRE                  | (316) 264-4625
Season Tix: $300 / $240                   | $250 / $170
Single Tix: $12 / $10                     | $9 / $6
Radio:                                    |
Announcers:                               |
                                          |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
          Dallas Freeze                   | Tulsa Oilers
                                          |
Arena:    Fair Park Coliseum (7,500)      | Civic Center (6,847)
Colors:   Teal and Black                  | Orange and Blue
GM:       Tom Koch                        | Jeff D. Lund
Coach:    Ron Flockhart                   | Gary Unger      Personal Guardians
Phone #:  (214) 421-PUCK                  | (918) 663-5888  ------------------
Season Tix: $300 / $240                   |                    Ray and Monte
Single Tix: $12 / $10 / $7                | $9 / $6                Miron
Radio:    KSKY-AM 660                     | KTRT-AM 1270
Announcers-Bruce LeVine                   | Jeff Brucculeri
           Mark Stone                     | Jeff Bowen
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
          Memphis River Kings             | Oklahoma City Blazers
                                          |
Arena:    Mid-South Coliseum (9,384)      | Myriad (13,399) & State Fair Arena 
Colors:   Gold and Black                  | Red, Yellow, and Black   (9,760)
GM:       Jim Riggs                       | Brad Lund                
Coach:    Steve Carlson                   | Mike McEwen
Phone #:  (901) 278-9009                  | (405) 235-PUCK
Season Tix:                               | $250 / $170
Single Tix: $9 / $6                       | $9 / $6
Radio:    KREC-AM 600                     | WWLS-AM 640
Announcers-Dave Woloshin                  | John Brooks
           Tom Stocker                    | Brian Barnhart
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

92-93 regular season standings
 
                           W  L OTL PTS   GF   GA   PIM  AVG ATTDNCE (% cap)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Oklahoma City Blazers.... 39 18  3   81  291  232  1561  7,827   64.2 %
Tulsa Ice Oilers......... 35 22  3   73  270  230  1430  5,547   81.0 %
Dallas Freeze............ 31 25  4   66  276  242  1604  4,427   59.0 %
Memphis RiverKings....... 26 27  7   59  253  272  1670  5,590   59.6 %
Fort Worth Fire.......... 24 29  7   55  252  288  1747  4,920   43.7 %
Wichita Thunder.......... 25 33  2   52  242  320  1876  4,474   46.2 %

Playoffs:  Tulsa defeated Dallas, 4 games to 3 (WLLWWLW)
           Oklahoma City defeated Memphis, 4 games to 2 (WWLLWW)

Levin Trophy Finals:  Tulsa defeated Oklahoma City, 4 games to 1 (WWLWW)

Playoff MVP:  Tony Fiore, Tulsa (special votes to Ray and Monte Miron)

Team vs. Team: 92-93
--------------------
                Dallas  Fort Worth  Memphis  Oklahoma City  Tulsa  Wichita
Dallas.......... -----     9-2-1     5-5-2       5-6-1      5-7-0   7-5-0
Fort Worth...... 3-7-2     -----     4-6-2       4-8-0      8-3-1   5-5-2
Memphis......... 7-4-1     8-3-1     -----       2-8-2      2-8-2   7-4-1
Oklahoma City... 7-4-1     8-3-1    10-2-0       -----      6-6-0   8-3-1
Tulsa........... 7-5-0     4-7-1    10-2-0       6-6-0      -----   8-2-2
Wichita......... 5-7-0     7-3-2     5-7-0       4-8-0      4-8-0   -----

       Power Play Statistics               Penalty Killng Statistics
             PPG  Opp  ShGA   Pct.               PPG Saves Opp  ShG   Pct.
Okla. City    70  275     2  25.45  Okla. City    58   241 299   16  80.60
Tulsa         72  291    12  24.74  Dallas        68   278 346   14  80.34
Dallas        64  286    10  22.37  Tulsa         77   276 353   16  78.18
Fort Worth    85  387    16  21.96  Wichita       75   235 310    5  75.806
Wichita       81  396    24  20.45  Memphis       83   260 343   12  75.801
Memphis       65  329    12  19.75  Fort Worth    76   237 313   13  75.71

Penalty Record
                                            10-Min  Game Gross        Oppn
             PIM  Avg.  Minor  Major  Bench   Misc  Misc  Misc  Match  PIM
Wichita     1876  31.3   433     84     20     22    24     0     3   1998
Fort Worth  1747  29.1   471     59     29     26    23     2     0   1911
Memphis     1670  27.8   480     56     28     28    13     1     1   1593
Dallas      1604  26.7   477     60      2     20    15     0     0   1534
Okla. City  1561  26.0   438     67     14     14    21     0     0   1609
Tulsa       1430  23.8   505     26      6     21     8     0     0   1243

Scoring By Period
            1st Period  2nd Period  3rd Period  Overtime  Shootout  Totals
              GF  GA      GF  GA      GF  GA     GF  GA    GF  GA   GF  GA
Dallas        76  82     106  82      90  74      0   1     4   3   276 242
Fort Worth    70  81      92 112      84  88      3   5     3   2   252 288
Memphis       66  88     101  89      82  88      2   3     2   4   253 272
Okla.City     98  87      82  71     108  71      1   1     2   2   291 232
Tulsa         99  58      92  83      76  86      3   1     0   2   270 230
Wichita       79  92      73 109      84 117      2   0     4   2   242 320

                          92-93 All-Star Team
                          -------------------

Position      First Team                    Second Team
--------      ----------                    -----------
Goaltender... Tony Martino, Tulsa           Robert Desjardins, Wichita (tie)
                                            Alan Perry, Oklahoma City (tie)

Defensemen... Dave Doucette, Dallas         Mike Berger, Dallas
              Guy Girouard, Oklahoma City   Tom Karalis, Tulsa

Center....... Carl Boudreau, Oklahoma City  Joe Burton, Oklahoma City

Left Wing.... Sylvain Fleury, Oklahoma City Doug Lawrence, Tulsa

Right Wing... Daniel Larin, Oklahoma City   Tom Mutch, Memphis (tie
                                            Sylvain Naud, Tulsa (tie)

Regular Season MVP:  Sylvain Fleury, Oklahoma City
Rookie of the Year:  Bobby Desjardins, Wichita
Leading Defenseman:  Dave Doucette, Dallas
Leading Goaltender:  Tony Martino, Tulsa

Scoring Leaders:
----------------
POINTS              Team  GP  G  A  PTS   GOALS             Team  GP  G
Fleury, Sylvain     OKC   59 48 53  101   Fleury, Sylvain   OKC   53 48
Lawrence, Doug      TUL   57 22 73   95   Larin, Daniel     OKC   48 43
Naud, Sylvain       TUL   58 39 48   87   Mutch, Tom        MEM   59 43
Mutch, Tom          MEM   59 43 38   81   Thibodeau, Ken    MEM   54 40
Hall, Taylor        TUL   58 35 45   80   Naud, Sylvain     TUL   58 39
Thibodeau, Ken      MEM   54 40 35   75   Taylor, Jason     DAL   60 38
Anchikoski, Wayne   DAL   57 35 37   72   
Boudreau, Carl      OKC   48 27 44   71   ASSISTS           Team  GP  A
Larin, Daniel       OKC   48 43 27   70   Lawrence, Doug    TUL   57 73
Taylor, Jason       DAL   60 38 32   70   Fleury, Sylvain   OKC   59 53
Dent, Ted           WCH   60 25 44   69   Naud, Sylvain     TUL   58 48
Sanderson, Mike     FTW   60 37 31   68   Doucette, Dave    DAL   50 46
Gatti, Dave         WCH   58 35 32   67   Hall, Taylor      TUL   58 45
Nobili, Mario       TUL   54 31 34   65   Girouard, Guy     OKC   60 45
Cyr, Keith          WCH   58 21 44   65 
D'Amario, Peter     MEM   60 28 35   63   PENALTY MINUTES   Team  GP PIM 
Johnston, Scot      MEM   51 23 40   63   Aubrey, Ron       FTW   28 237
Burton, Joe         OKC   55 35 26   61   Karalis, Tom      TUL   56 235
Simoni, Steve       OKC   56 33 28   61   Johnson, Craig    OKC   50 219
Hornak, Ernest      FTW   52 22 37   59   Neish, Greg       WCH   34 212
Fiore, Tony         TUL   37 23 35   58   Batten, John      MEM   29 210
Doucette, Dave      DAL   50 10 46   56   Taylor, Jason     DAL   60 210

LEADING GOALTENDERS (20 or more games)
                   TEAM GPI  MIN  GAA  W-L-OTL  EN SO   GA  Saves  Save Pct.
Martino, Tony       TUL  39 2182 3.66  23-13-2   0  2  133  1186   .899
Perry, Alan         OKC  40 2406 3.72  25-13-2   3  0  149  1304   .897
Zanier, Mike        DAL  40 2384 3.78  24-14-2   3  1  150  1223   .891
Mindjimba, Antoine  MEM  56 3097 4.15  26-21-6   4  1  214  1603   .882
Smith, Greg         DAL  21 1243 4.15   7-11-2   0  0   86   753   .897
Desjardins, Bobby   WCH  52 2849 4.63  21-26-2   6  1  220  1877   .895
Belley, Roch        FTW  33 1728 4.75  14-13-2   3  0  141   974   .874

Other Goalies       
                   TEAM GPI  MIN  GAA  W-L-OTL  EN SO   GA  Saves  Save Pct.
Flatt, Brian        TUL  11  488  3.44   4-3-1   1  1   28  274    .907
Krake, Paul         OKC  17 1029  3.50  13-3-1   0  0   60  583    .907
Loewen, Jamie       TUL  13  681  3.79   6-5-0   1  0   43  399    .903
Ocello, Matt        FTW   4  179  3.69   3-1-0   1  0   11  100    .901
Ocello, Matt        TUL   1   34  5.29   0-0-0   0  0    3   13    .813
(Totals)                  5  213  3.94   3-1-0   1  0   14  113    .890
Raymond, Eric       TUL   3  181  3.98   2-1-0   0  0   12   87    .879
O'Hara, Michael     FTW  18  911  4.28   6-6-2   0  0   65  559    .896
Vasko, Steve        MEM  15  535  5.16   0-6-1   4  0   46  235    .836
Trentadue, Rocco    FTW  17  746  4.99   1-9-3   3  0   62  365    .855
Trentadue, Rocco    OKC   2  120  6.50   0-2-0   0  0   13   93    .877
(Totals)                 19  866  5.20  1-11-3   3  0   75  458    .859
Harvey, Alain       WCH   5  240  5.50   2-2-0   2  0   22  126    .851
Gosselin, Yannick   WCH  10  345  6.43   2-3-0   0  0   37  227    .860
Gosselin, Yannick   OKC   1   60  5.00   1-0-0   0  0    5   26    .839
(Totals)                 11  405  6.22   3-3-0   0  0   42  253    .896
Caton, Murray       WCH   2  120  9.00   0-2-0   0  0   18   84    .824
McDonnell, Dan      TUL   1   34  8.83   0-0-0   0  0    5   24    .828
Sauer, E.J.         TUL   1   12 10.00   0-0-0   0  0    2    4    .667
Clark, Joel         WCH   2   48 10.00   0-0-0   0  0    8   29    .784
Wachter, Steve      WCH   2   24 12.50   0-0-0   0  0    5    6    .545


Marc Dee Foster, r.s.h contact for the CHL


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53934
From: njs@mrtoad.lahabra.chevron.com (n.j.spera)
Subject: Re: Upcoming TV schedule

In article <1r4af2$qve@hsdndev.harvard.edu>, nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219) writes:
|> Hey,guess what's coming to ESPN for a change? A playoff which doesn't
|> involve the Pens. Not that there is anything wrong with that...
|> 
|> ESPN games :
|> 
|> Thursday  Game3 Pens at Devils at 7:30(Gary Thorne and Bill Clement)
|> Saturday  Game4 Caps at NY Isles at 7:30(Tom Mees and John Davidson)
|> 
|> ABC game :
|> 
|> Sunday    Game4 Pens at Devils at 1:00 (Gary Thorne and Bill Clement)
|> 
    Only if you are in the eastern time zone - pacific will get the 
    Kings vs Calgary 

|> ESPN named its #2 broadcast team on Tuesday. It paired Tom Mees(play by
|> play) with John Davidson(analyst).
|> 
|> -PPV Mark

-- 
 Nancy J. Spera, IMT Division           # "If I didn't know for a fact that   P
 Chevron Petroleum Technology Co.       G  Elvis was working in a donut shop  E
 P.O. Box 446, La Habra, CA 90633-0446  O  in Beaver Falls, I'd swear he was  N
 Tel: (310) 694-7761  njs@chevron.com   # driving this truck." Scotty Baldwin S

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53935
From: reif@sun8.ruf.uni-freiburg.de (Berthold BENNY Reif)
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 18

etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson) writes:

>	
> Forwards:

>		13. Richard Zemlicka	?
              In the season 92/93 playing for EHC Freiburg/Germany

Benny.
--
   _ _ _                                                         _ _ _
 _I I I I    Benny Reif  email:reif@sun1.ruf.uni-freiburg.de    I I I I_
I I I I I_______________________________________________________I I I I I
I_I I I I    Disclaimer: this text reflects MY opinion,         I I I I_I

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53936
From: dvb@ick (David Van Beveren)
Subject: Re: Red Wings Goespel...

F1HH@UNB.CA (Patrick Walker) writes:
: Detroit's going to beat Toronto in 6 or LESS!!!
: 
:  Granted, Gilmour should get the Hart Trophy, NOT Lemieux... Just
: Look at what Gilmour did for Toronto.  When you think of Toronto,
: who comes to mind, Gilmour, Andreychuk, Potvin...ah...did I mentio
: n Gilmour?
: 

When you think of the NHL, who comes to mind? Gilmour? Gretzky? Mario?
.. ah... did I mention Mario? If you said Gretzky, you haven't really
been following along, have you. If you said Gilmour, you are a true
Maynard. 

I don't even think the selection of the HArt deserves serious discussion on
this group. It is a no-brainer.

dvb

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53937
From: phoenix@startide.ctr.columbia.edu (Ali Lemer)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

In article <13904.664.uupcb@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca> steven.kipling@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Steven Kipling)  writes:
> -=> Quoting Cire Y. Trehguad to All <=-
>CYT> : Michael Collingridge writes:
> : >And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
> : >resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
> : >team captain trivia would be appreciated.


Kelly Kisio was the captain of the Rangers when he left for San Jose.


-- Ali.

-- 
Ali "Procrastination" Lemer || "But not a real green || "Conjunction Junction,
Columbia University (NYC)   || dress, that's cruel." ||  What's your function?"
phoenix@ctr.columbia.edu    || -- Barenaked Ladies   ||  -- Schoolhouse Rock
***************** BE KIND TO ANIMALS...HUG A HOCKEY PLAYER! *******************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53938
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Habs Late

In article <21APR93.05114955.0057@VM1.MCGILL.CA> CCDB <CCDB@MUSICA.MCGILL.CA> writes:
>Quebec dominated Habs for first 2 periods and only Roy kept
>this one from being rout, although he did blow 2nd goal.
>Canadians showed up in third but Nords were playing dump &
>pull back most of the time.

Do you notice that _nobody_ on the team is willing to take charge?
A dominant defenceman would be nice....too bad Schneider got hurt.
He reminds me of Chris Chelios sometimes.  Speaking of Chelios, I 
wonder if Serge Savard feels like a moron for making that trade.
I also wish we still had Corson.

Rob Ramage on the ice is less useful than a Gatorade bottle on the 
bench.

Vincent Damphousse has decided to take a vacation, apparently.  I have
no idea why Demers is playing Denis Savard on the checking line with
Carbonneau.  Savard is skating well, and is one of the only dangerous
Canadiens in Quebec's zone with the puck.  Too bad nobody is in front
most of the time.

Do you also notice that in the defensive zone, not a single Nordique
gets knocked down?  It's disgusting.  We also have Lebeau (5'10", 172)
getting pasted at centre ice by Wolaninn (6'3", 205) with no reply
from the team, except to yell for a penalty.  Dammit, Denis Savard 
threw the best (only?) Montreal hit of the night when he knocked
Sundin off-balance.  When Denis Savard is your team's enforcer, there's
big trouble someplace...

>Hextall made some good saves but
>really this one was lost in first period when nords scored 3
>& could have had 5, plus another 4 in 2nd.

Aside from that second goal, Roy did stand on his head.  The third 
period at least provided something to look forward to.  Habs won the
period, IMO, and I guess somebody finally came along to smack them a
couple of times in the second intermission to remind them that a game
had started at 7:30.  Hopefully they play that way at home.  Roy made 
the saves (we'll ignore that second goal), so now it's up to the team.


--
dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca


P.S.  To all those Grant Fuhr doubters.....Buffalo 4, Boston 0.  
'nuff said.  And did somebody say Dale Hunter was a playoff choker?
I'd rethink that position :-)



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53939
From: joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm)
Subject: Bruins




Come on Boston, where the hell are you? Seven wins in a row and what, choke?

I'd much rather see the Bruins in the Wales Conference finals vs. Pitt than
Buffalo or Quebec, if only because it would be more interesting.  Not that
Buffalo or Quebec can't put up a good fight, but I'd much more enjoy a 7-0
pasteing of the Bruins than the Devils.  You have to feel for Terrerri(sp?).

Ah, well, maybe the Devils will pull it out, or maybe the Pens will lose in
the second round, but if not, I hope the Bruins are there to meet them.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53940
From: v003nnc3@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (MR. BUNGLE)
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

In article <1993Apr21.142357.14164@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca>, golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes...
>In article <1993Apr21.063836.4412@ncsu.edu> delarocq@eos.ncsu.edu (DERRELL EMERY LAROCQUE) writes:
>>
>>   Tonight in Boston, the Buffalo Sabres blanked the Boston
>>Bruins 4-0 tonight in Boston. Looks like Boston can hang
>>this season up, because Buffalo's home record is awesome!!!!
>>This is great.. Buffalo fans might get to see revenge for
>>last year!!!!! :)
> 
>I'm glad Grant Fuhr will never be as over-confident after two wins
>as you are...it takes four wins to defeat an opponent...each tougher
>to obtain than the previous one.  Buffalo is off to a good start...
>Fuhr is proving the Fuhr-bashers wrong, but Boston is an awfully
>good team.
> 
>Gerald

Awesome home record or not, you need to remember the 7th game last year at the
Aud.  I'd like to see some playoff games since I'm stuck in Buffalo at UB, but
I think Boston isn't giving up so easy.

mr. bungle

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53941
From: coulman@cs.Usask.CA (Randy Coulman)
Subject: WHL: Playoff Results - 04/18/93


Monday, April 12, 1993

Kamloops 4 @ Spokane 1 (Kamloops wins 3-0)

***
Western Final Matchup

Kamloops @ Portland
***

Tuesday, April 13, 1993

No games necessary.

Wednesday, April 14, 1993

No games necessary.

Thursday, April 15, 1993

No games scheduled.

Friday, April 16, 1993

Regina 2 @ Swift Current 7 (Series: 0-1)
Kamloops 3 @ Portland 6 (Series: 0-1)

Saturday, April 17, 1993

Kamloops 4 @ Portland 8 (Series: 0-2)

Sunday, April 18, 1993

Swift Current 5 @ Regina 2 (Series: 2-0)


WHL Playoff Scoring Leaders
April 18, 1993

Player                                   GP  G   A  Pts
-------------------------------------------------------
Jamie Black, Tacoma                       7   7  15  22
Andy Schneider, Swift Current             8   7  13  20
Valeri Bure, Spokane                      9   6  11  17
Allan Egeland, Tacoma                     7   9   7  16
Dean McAmmond, Swift Current              8   9   6  15
Jason Krywulak, Swift Current             8   6   9  15
Cam Danyluk, Medicine Hat                10   9   5  14
Todd Holt, Swift Current                  8   5   9  14
Tyler Wright, Swift Current               8   5   9  14
Mike Mathers, Kamloops                   10   5   9  14
Jeff Friesen, Regina                     11   5   9  14
Rick Girard, Swift Current                8   3  11  14


WHL Playoff Leading Goaltenders
April 18, 1993
(minimum 60 minutes)

Player                                   MP  GA  SO GAA
-------------------------------------------------------
Scott Langkow, Portland                 295  12  0 2.44
Milan Hnilicka, Swift Current           497  21  1 2.54
Trevor Robins, Brandon                  258  11  0 2.56
Steve Passmore, Kamloops                341  16  1 2.82
Mark Dawkins, Red Deer                  269  13  0 2.90


-- 
Randy A. Coulman, M.Sc.         |       ARIES Laboratory
Research Assistant              |       Department of Computational Science
                                |       University of Saskatchewan
coulman@cs.Usask.ca             |       Saskatoon, SK   S7N 0W0             

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53942
From: coulman@cs.Usask.CA (Randy Coulman)
Subject: Final Regular Season Individual Goalie Stats

I would appreciate it if someone could volunteer to verify the shots on goal
and save percentage numbers for me, so I can put these stats on the archive
site.  Contact me by mail if you want to volunteer.

Here are the individual goalie stats as of: Wed Apr 21 09:09:38 CST 1993

These stats include games up to and including the Sunday previous to the date
listed above.  They have been verified against what is printed in my newspaper
every Tuesday.  They don't print shots and save percentage numbers, so those
are not verified.  These stats are available by mail every weekday and
sometimes on weekends, if I'm in town and I can get late game results.  Just
send me a note if you would like to receive these stats by mail.

If you have any questions, comments or suggestions, let me know.

Randy

-------
MP = Minutes Played, GA = Goals against,
SO = Shutouts, GAA = Goals against average
W = Wins, L = Losses, T = Ties
SOG = Shots on Goal, SV = Save Percentage

 MP   GA SO   GAA  W  L  T  SOG   SV  TM Player
=======================================================
   1   0  0  0.00  0  0  0    0 1.000 WAS Byron Dafoe
  11   0  0  0.00  0  0  0    3 1.000 HAR Corrie D'Alessio
  40   1  0  1.50  0  0  0   19 0.947 MTL Frederick Chabot
  25   1  0  2.40  0  0  0   10 0.900 BOS Mike Bales
2781 116  2  2.50 25 15  7 1287 0.910 TOR Felix Potvin
4106 177  7  2.59 41 18 11 1879 0.906 CHI Ed Belfour
1322  64  1  2.90  9  8  4  596 0.893 BOS John Blue
 996  49  2  2.95  6  7  1  414 0.882 CHI Jim Waite
3702 186  4  3.01 43 14  5 1889 0.902 PIT Tom Barrasso
3890 196  1  3.02 29 28  9 2194 0.911 STL Curtis Joseph
1817  94  1  3.10 18  8  4  858 0.890 VAN Kay Whitmore
1429  75  0  3.15 11 10  4  716 0.895 BUF Dominik Hasek
3194 168  3  3.16 37 14  3 1354 0.876 BOS Andy Moog
1311  70  1  3.20 14  4  1  629 0.889 CAL Jeff Reese
3595 192  2  3.20 31 25  5 1813 0.894 MTL Patrick Roy
 168   9  0  3.21  1  1  1   87 0.897 HAR Mike Lenarduzzi
1193  64  0  3.22 13  4  2  522 0.877 DET Vincent Riendeau
1785  96  2  3.23 17  7  4  938 0.898 TOR Daren Puppa
3880 210  4  3.25 34 24  7 1898 0.889 DET Tim Cheveldae
3732 203  2  3.26 29 26  9 1805 0.888 CAL Mike Vernon
2655 146  1  3.30 22 20  2 1314 0.889 NYI Glenn Healy
3359 185  1  3.30 24 24  6 1726 0.893 BUF Grant Fuhr
2757 152  4  3.31 20 18  7 1519 0.900 NYR John Vanbiesbrouck
3282 181  1  3.31 27 23  5 1531 0.882 WAS Don Beaupre
3476 193  3  3.33 26 26  5 1683 0.885 MIN Jon Casey
3261 184  3  3.39 28 21  5 1620 0.886 VAN Kirk McLean
2672 151  2  3.39 19 21  3 1322 0.886 NJ  Chris Terreri
1433  81  1  3.39 17  5  1  686 0.882 MTL Andre Racicot
1939 110  0  3.40 18  9  4  947 0.884 QUE Stephane Fiset
2512 143  5  3.42 20 17  6 1329 0.892 PHI Tommy Soderstrom
1368  78  0  3.42 13  7  2  691 0.887 PIT Ken Wregget
 542  31  0  3.43  5  4  0  225 0.862 BOS Reggie Lemelin
2988 172  0  3.45 29 16  5 1525 0.887 QUE Ron Hextall
2253 130  0  3.46 17 15  5 1067 0.878 NYI Mark Fitzpatrick
3855 227  2  3.53 33 26  6 2119 0.893 WIN Bob Essensa
1601  96  0  3.60 15 10  2  777 0.876 WIN Jim Hrivnak
1596  97  1  3.65 10 12  5  803 0.879 MIN Darcy Wakaluk
1591  97  0  3.66  7 19  2  757 0.872 TB  Wendell Young
1163  71  0  3.66  8 10  1  573 0.876 TB  JC Bergeron
2389 146  2  3.67 21 16  4 1180 0.876 NJ  Craig Billington
1210  74  1  3.67  8  8  2  628 0.882 STL Guy Hebert
1302  80  2  3.69  8 12  0  664 0.880 WAS Rick Tabaracci
 664  41  0  3.70  5  6  0  344 0.881 BUF Tom Draper
 224  14  0  3.75  1  2  1  116 0.879 NYR Corey Hirsch
1769 111  1  3.76 13 11  5  932 0.881 PHI Dominic Roussel
2105 134  1  3.82 13 19  3 1184 0.887 NYR Mike Richter
 157  10  0  3.82  1  2  0   78 0.872 NYI Danny Lorenz
3753 240  1  3.84 17 38  6 2069 0.884 EDM Bill Ranford
1735 111  0  3.84 15  8  4  987 0.888 LA  Robb Stauber
2718 175  2  3.86 18 21  6 1545 0.887 LA  Kelly Hrudey
 154  10  0  3.90  0  2  1   66 0.848 QUE Jacques Cloutier
 867  57  0  3.94  5  9  1  499 0.886 HAR Mario Gosselin
 532  35  0  3.95  6  4  0  294 0.881 LA  Rick Knickle
2268 150  1  3.97  8 24  4 1197 0.875 TB  Pat Jablonski
2074 142  1  4.11  7 26  0 1250 0.886 SJ  Arturs Irbe
2656 184  0  4.16 16 27  3 1470 0.875 HAR Sean Burke
1338  93  0  4.17  9 12  2  763 0.878 EDM Ron Tugnutt
1326  95  0  4.30  2 17  1  743 0.872 OTT Daniel Berthiaume
 802  59  0  4.41  3  9  0  405 0.854 PHI Stephane Beauregard
3388 250  0  4.43  8 46  3 1711 0.854 OTT Peter Sidorkiewicz
  65   5  0  4.62  0  0  1   39 0.872 CAL Andrei Trefilov
1373 111  0  4.85  4 15  1  784 0.858 HAR Frank Pietrangelo
  73   6  0  4.93  0  0  1   34 0.824 WIN Mike O'Neill
  60   5  0  5.00  0  1  0   46 0.891 SJ  Wade Flaherty
2000 176  0  5.28  2 30  1 1220 0.856 SJ  Jeff Hackett
 930  86  0  5.55  2 14  1  559 0.846 SJ  Brian Hayward
 160  15  0  5.63  0  3  0   91 0.835 TOR Rick Wamsley
  20   2  0  6.00  0  0  0    7 0.714 WAS Olaf Kolzig
  90  10  0  6.67  0  2  0   44 0.773 OTT Darrin Madeley
 249  30  0  7.23  0  5  0  146 0.795 OTT Steve Weeks
  98  13  0  7.96  0  2  0   51 0.745 LA  David Goverde
  45   7  0  9.33  0  1  0   21 0.667 TB  David Littman

-- 
Randy A. Coulman, M.Sc.         |       ARIES Laboratory
Research Assistant              |       Department of Computational Science
                                |       University of Saskatchewan
coulman@cs.Usask.ca             |       Saskatoon, SK   S7N 0W0             

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53943
From: coulman@cs.Usask.CA (Randy Coulman)
Subject: Final Regular Season Team Goalie Stats

I would appreciate it if someone could volunteer to verify the shots on goal
and save percentage numbers for me, so I can put these stats on the archive
site.  Contact me by mail if you want to volunteer.

Here are the team goalie stats as of: Wed Apr 21 09:09:38 CST 1993

These stats include games up to and including the Sunday previous to the date
listed above.  They have been verified against what is printed in my newspaper
every Tuesday.  They don't print shots and save percentage numbers, so those
are not verified.  

If you have any questions, comments or suggestions, let me know.

Randy

-------
MP = Minutes Played, GA = Goals against,
SO = Shutouts, GAA = Goals against average
W = Wins, L = Losses, T = Ties
SOG = Shots on Goal, SV = Save Percentage

 MP   GA SO   GAA  W  L  T  SOG   SV  TM Player
=======================================================
4106 177  7  2.59 41 18 11 1879 0.906 CHI Ed Belfour
 996  49  2  2.95  6  7  1  414 0.882 CHI Jim Waite
--------------------------------------------------------------
5108 230  9  2.70 47 25 12 2296 0.900 CHI

 479  18  2  2.25  6  2  0  232 0.922 TOR Daren Puppa
2781 116  2  2.50 25 15  7 1287 0.910 TOR Felix Potvin
1665  87  1  3.14 13  9  4  823 0.894 TOR Grant Fuhr
 160  15  0  5.63  0  3  0   91 0.835 TOR Rick Wamsley
--------------------------------------------------------------
5097 241  5  2.84 44 29 11 2438 0.901 TOR

  25   1  0  2.40  0  0  0   10 0.900 BOS Mike Bales
1322  64  1  2.90  9  8  4  596 0.893 BOS John Blue
3194 168  3  3.16 37 14  3 1354 0.876 BOS Andy Moog
 542  31  0  3.43  5  4  0  225 0.862 BOS Reggie Lemelin
--------------------------------------------------------------
5096 268  4  3.16 51 26  7 2190 0.878 BOS

3702 186  4  3.01 43 14  5 1889 0.902 PIT Tom Barrasso
1368  78  0  3.42 13  7  2  691 0.887 PIT Ken Wregget
--------------------------------------------------------------
5083 268  5  3.16 56 21  7 2582 0.896 PIT

3890 196  1  3.02 29 28  9 2194 0.911 STL Curtis Joseph
1210  74  1  3.67  8  8  2  628 0.882 STL Guy Hebert
--------------------------------------------------------------
5110 278  2  3.26 36 36 11 2825 0.902 STL

1817  94  1  3.10 18  8  4  858 0.890 VAN Kay Whitmore
3261 184  3  3.39 28 21  5 1620 0.886 VAN Kirk McLean
--------------------------------------------------------------
5087 278  4  3.28 46 29  9 2449 0.886 VAN

1193  64  0  3.22 13  4  2  522 0.877 DET Vincent Riendeau
3880 210  4  3.25 34 24  7 1898 0.889 DET Tim Cheveldae
--------------------------------------------------------------
5088 280  4  3.30 47 28  9 2425 0.885 DET

  40   1  0  1.50  0  0  0   19 0.947 MTL Frederick Chabot
3595 192  2  3.20 31 25  5 1813 0.894 MTL Patrick Roy
1433  81  1  3.39 17  5  1  686 0.882 MTL Andre Racicot
--------------------------------------------------------------
5087 280  3  3.30 48 30  6 2522 0.889 MTL

1311  70  1  3.20 14  4  1  629 0.889 CAL Jeff Reese
3732 203  2  3.26 29 26  9 1805 0.888 CAL Mike Vernon
  65   5  0  4.62  0  0  1   39 0.872 CAL Andrei Trefilov
--------------------------------------------------------------
5120 282  3  3.30 43 30 11 2476 0.886 CAL

   1   0  0  0.00  0  0  0    0 1.000 WAS Byron Dafoe
 343  10  2  1.75  3  2  0  162 0.938 WAS Rick Tabaracci
3282 181  1  3.31 27 23  5 1531 0.882 WAS Don Beaupre
1421  83  0  3.50 13  9  2  681 0.878 WAS Jim Hrivnak
  20   2  0  6.00  0  0  0    7 0.714 WAS Olaf Kolzig
--------------------------------------------------------------
5085 286  3  3.37 43 34  7 2391 0.880 WAS

3476 193  3  3.33 26 26  5 1683 0.885 MIN Jon Casey
1596  97  1  3.65 10 12  5  803 0.879 MIN Darcy Wakaluk
--------------------------------------------------------------
5090 293  4  3.45 36 38 10 2489 0.882 MIN

1429  75  0  3.15 11 10  4  716 0.895 BUF Dominik Hasek
1694  98  0  3.47 11 15  2  903 0.891 BUF Grant Fuhr
1306  78  0  3.58 11  5  4  706 0.890 BUF Daren Puppa
 664  41  0  3.70  5  6  0  344 0.881 BUF Tom Draper
--------------------------------------------------------------
5104 297  0  3.49 38 36 10 2674 0.889 BUF

2655 146  1  3.30 22 20  2 1314 0.889 NYI Glenn Healy
2253 130  0  3.46 17 15  5 1067 0.878 NYI Mark Fitzpatrick
 157  10  0  3.82  1  2  0   78 0.872 NYI Danny Lorenz
--------------------------------------------------------------
5088 297  1  3.50 40 37  7 2470 0.880 NYI

1939 110  0  3.40 18  9  4  947 0.884 QUE Stephane Fiset
2988 172  0  3.45 29 16  5 1525 0.887 QUE Ron Hextall
 154  10  0  3.90  0  2  1   66 0.848 QUE Jacques Cloutier
--------------------------------------------------------------
5101 300  0  3.53 47 27 10 2536 0.882 QUE

2672 151  2  3.39 19 21  3 1322 0.886 NJ  Chris Terreri
2389 146  2  3.67 21 16  4 1180 0.876 NJ  Craig Billington
--------------------------------------------------------------
5080 299  4  3.53 40 37  7 2505 0.881 NJ 

2757 152  4  3.31 20 18  7 1519 0.900 NYR John Vanbiesbrouck
 224  14  0  3.75  1  2  1  116 0.879 NYR Corey Hirsch
2105 134  1  3.82 13 19  3 1184 0.887 NYR Mike Richter
--------------------------------------------------------------
5108 308  5  3.62 34 39 11 2826 0.891 NYR

2512 143  5  3.42 20 17  6 1329 0.892 PHI Tommy Soderstrom
1769 111  1  3.76 13 11  5  932 0.881 PHI Dominic Roussel
 802  59  0  4.41  3  9  0  405 0.854 PHI Stephane Beauregard
--------------------------------------------------------------
5107 319  6  3.75 36 37 11 2672 0.881 PHI

3855 227  2  3.53 33 26  6 2119 0.893 WIN Bob Essensa
 180  13  0  4.33  2  1  0   96 0.865 WIN Jim Hrivnak
 959  70  0  4.38  5 10  0  502 0.861 WIN Rick Tabaracci
  73   6  0  4.93  0  0  1   34 0.824 WIN Mike O'Neill
--------------------------------------------------------------
5084 320  2  3.78 40 37  7 2755 0.884 WIN

1591  97  0  3.66  7 19  2  757 0.872 TB  Wendell Young
1163  71  0  3.66  8 10  1  573 0.876 TB  JC Bergeron
2268 150  1  3.97  8 24  4 1197 0.875 TB  Pat Jablonski
  45   7  0  9.33  0  1  0   21 0.667 TB  David Littman
--------------------------------------------------------------
5088 332  1  3.92 24 53  7 2557 0.870 TB 

3753 240  1  3.84 17 38  6 2069 0.884 EDM Bill Ranford
1338  93  0  4.17  9 12  2  763 0.878 EDM Ron Tugnutt
--------------------------------------------------------------
5099 337  1  3.97 26 50  8 2836 0.881 EDM

1735 111  0  3.84 15  8  4  987 0.888 LA  Robb Stauber
2718 175  2  3.86 18 21  6 1545 0.887 LA  Kelly Hrudey
 532  35  0  3.95  6  4  0  294 0.881 LA  Rick Knickle
  98  13  0  7.96  0  2  0   51 0.745 LA  David Goverde
--------------------------------------------------------------
5100 340  2  4.00 39 35 10 2858 0.881 LA 

  11   0  0  0.00  0  0  0    3 1.000 HAR Corrie D'Alessio
 168   9  0  3.21  1  1  1   87 0.897 HAR Mike Lenarduzzi
 867  57  0  3.94  5  9  1  499 0.886 HAR Mario Gosselin
2656 184  0  4.16 16 27  3 1470 0.875 HAR Sean Burke
1373 111  0  4.85  4 15  1  784 0.858 HAR Frank Pietrangelo
--------------------------------------------------------------
5097 369  0  4.34 26 52  6 2851 0.871 HAR

1326  95  0  4.30  2 17  1  743 0.872 OTT Daniel Berthiaume
3388 250  0  4.43  8 46  3 1711 0.854 OTT Peter Sidorkiewicz
  90  10  0  6.67  0  2  0   44 0.773 OTT Darrin Madeley
 249  30  0  7.23  0  5  0  146 0.795 OTT Steve Weeks
--------------------------------------------------------------
5074 395  0  4.67 10 70  4 2656 0.851 OTT

2074 142  1  4.11  7 26  0 1250 0.886 SJ  Arturs Irbe
  60   5  0  5.00  0  1  0   46 0.891 SJ  Wade Flaherty
2000 176  0  5.28  2 30  1 1220 0.856 SJ  Jeff Hackett
 930  86  0  5.55  2 14  1  559 0.846 SJ  Brian Hayward
--------------------------------------------------------------
5077 414  1  4.89 11 71  2 3079 0.866 SJ 


-- 
Randy A. Coulman, M.Sc.         |       ARIES Laboratory
Research Assistant              |       Department of Computational Science
                                |       University of Saskatchewan
coulman@cs.Usask.ca             |       Saskatoon, SK   S7N 0W0             

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53944
From: georgeh@gjhsun (George H)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here

LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall) writes:

>Don got his nickname 'Grapes' but I'm not sure.  Don use to coach the
>Boston Bruins.  I don't know exactly when that was.  Could someone fill
>me in on this info?

I think that the name 'grapes' came because as coach (for the Bruins ?
or in the minors ?) he used to chew on grapes to keep from getting 
dehydrated during the games.  His dog Blue may have been named 
'cause he liked Labatts beer ... anyone know about that ?


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53945
From: dheath@superior.carleton.ca (David Heath)
Subject: Re: Grant Fuhr leads Sabres

In <1993Apr21.211038.12363@newshub.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca
(Deepak Chhabra) writes: 

>In article <1993Apr21.161633.25624@wuecl.wustl.edu>
jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes: 
>>  Buffalo is up 2-0 is the series with Boston, and the reason....Grant Fuhr ?
>>  Fuhr is playoff hungry, and he's proving once again why they call him
>>  money goaltender. Fuhr might not be one of the best goaltenders in the
>>  league anymore (Statistically at least), but he's proving that he can
>>  make the big save at the right time.
>>  The Leafs should have kept Fuhr, and probably would have had a chance 
>>  against powerhouse Detroit. But again.......where was Andreychoke in game 1?

>I applauded the Sabres for making the deal to get Fuhr, specifically because I
>thought it would help them win at least one playoff series.  However, I don't
>think the Leafs can be faulted either...there is nothing to say that Felix
>won't be winning playoff series by himself in years to come.  

I agree with Joseph.  Felix Potvin is a great goalie.  Besides,
I thought that the Leafs could only protect goalie in the up-coming
expansion draft.  If so, then it's better to get rid of one good
goalie and get a good forward in return.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53946
From: co398@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Theodore G. Benjamin)
Subject: Re: Radio stations


In messge 51890 on Mon Apr 19 15:46:40 1993, greanias@texas.mitre.org (Steve Greanias) wrote:

>        I do not have cable and on the nights the Caps don't 
>play, I would like to tune in other games.  Does anyone have a 
>list of the radio stations which broadcast the games for the NHL
>teams?

Here are the ones I can remember offhand:

     KDKA    1020 AM   Pittsburgh Penguins
     WABC     770 AM   New Jersey Devils
     WBBM     780 AM   Chicago Blackhawks
     WJM (?)  720 AM   Detroit Redwings
     KMOX    1120 AM   St. Louis Blues

Are the Flyers on 1210?
That's all I can think of.
-- 
 _|__                                Ted Benjamin
<_|__+     GO CARDS!!    GO CAVS!!   tedb@tyrell.msfc.nasa.gov
__|___>    GO BLUES!!    GO VOLS!!   (205) 544 - 9402
  |___     GO BROWNS!! (A 4-Line sig can cramp one's art.)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53947
From: gwittt@alleg.edu (Tom Gwitt)
Subject: Re: #77's?

In article <1r23on$4p6@bigboote.WPI.EDU> ching@bigwpi.WPI.EDU ("The  
Logistician") writes:
> 
> I am in need of all of the players wearing #77 in the NHL.  I know now  
only
> of one, Ray Borque for the Bruins.  Any help would be greatly  
appreciated.
> 
> Thanx.


Pierre Turgeon, formely of the Sabres and now of the Isles wears #77 (at  
least he did in Buffalo ...)
--
Tom Gwitt     gwittt@alleg.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53948
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: LET'S GO BUFFALO!

In article <AfpIKNm00WBLI1isJ1@andrew.cmu.edu>, "William K. Willis"
<ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> says:
>
>     You know, I never really appreciated them before!

Looks like Bob Errey's ring really sparkles in that locker room, and everyone
else wants one, too! :-)  Correct me if I'm wrong though, (just through
the net, not through e-mail, I don't need 100 rl's in my e-mail!) but wasn't
Boston down 2-0 vs. Buffalo last year?Boston lost 1 and 2 at home and won
3 and 4 in Buffalo.  Whoever wins game 3 will advance.  Simple as that!!! :-)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          PGH PENGUINS!!!    "We do what comes naturally!
Patrick Division Semi's  ALL TIME RECORD    You see now, wait for the
PENGUINS 7, Devils 0     SEASON WIN STREAK+ possibility, don't you see a
Penguins lead, 2-0       PLAYOFF WIN STREAK strong resemblance..."-DG '89

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53949
From: ua256@freenet.Victoria.BC.CA (Tom Moffat)
Subject: Pwter Forsberg


Can some on e give me some stats on Forsrg in the World Championships

If sao mail to ua256@freenet.victoria.bc.ca

-- 
Tom Moffat
Victoria B.C.
Canada

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53950
From: caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz)
Subject: Trivia question


While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash" that
Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had his
jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not positive.
Does anyone remember/know his name?  What has happened to him since?  What
about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?  Has this ever
happened before in a hockey game?   

Thanks,

Carol
Go Pens!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53951
From: gwittt@alleg.edu (Tom Gwitt)
Subject: Re: Buffalo Sabres

In article <1r8pc7$sa5@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu  
(David Vergolini) writes:
>   Ok, Buffalo fans.  I am a Red Wings fan, but am amazed at how the  
Sabres are
> beating up on the Bruins.  Is there any reason for this?  Is it Grant  
Fuhr or
> Mogilny and Lafontaine?  I would like to hear from you since I do not  
know much
> about the Sabres.
> 


Two words: Grant Fuhr.
--
Tom Gwitt     gwittt@alleg.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53952
From: keast@qucis.queensu.ca (Liam John Keast)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

In article <1993Apr23.102811.623@sei.cmu.edu> caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz) writes:
>
>While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash" that
>Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had his
>jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not positive.
>Does anyone remember/know his name?  What has happened to him since?  What
>about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?

That was Clint Malarchuk.  That was a very dangerous accident.  He could he
died right there on the ice.  However, he has played since  
but I don't know where he is now.  I think he is still playing but I'm
not positive.  He was a Sabre at the time.
I don't know who skated into him though.

>Has this ever happened before in a hockey game?   
>

I remember a couple of seasons before the Malarchuk incident Borje
Salming of Toronto fell down in the crease and someone skated into
his face.  That took a lot of stiches to fix.

>Thanks,
>
>Carol
>Go Pens!

Liam
Go Toronto (they'd better start going soon)!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53953
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

Just a side note, squid/octopi made their way to the ice in Buffalo.
I still don't understand why Buffalo, but maybe it's lucky.  :-)  btw,
they shovel them up from the ice here, using the shovel used to scoop
up the snow the zamboni leaves as it leaves the ice.  Although Blue
did give some technical directions on its removal, motioning with his
stick.  



-- 
Valerie Hammerl 	       John Sr. would lift Pat over the boards, grab 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu       his hand, and start running around the outside,
V085PWPZ@UBVMS.CC.BUFFALO.EDU  faster and faster.  "I wanted to learn how to 
get that feeling, and the only way was to learn how to skate."  P. LaFontaine

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53954
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: LET'S GO BUFFALO!

In article <ltdi2pINN7km@appserv.Eng.Sun.COM> mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler) writes:
>In article <93111.205214RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>>In article <AfpIKNm00WBLI1isJ1@andrew.cmu.edu>, "William K. Willis"
>><ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> says:
>>>
>>>     You know, I never really appreciated them before!
>>
>>Looks like Bob Errey's ring really sparkles in that locker room, and everyone
>>else wants one, too! :-)  Correct me if I'm wrong though, (just through
>
>No, Fuhr's 5 rings out sparkle Errey's. And doesn't Bob have 2 rings?

Regardless, they'd have to sparkle from the pressbox.  Errey's been
out a couple games with a hip injury.



-- 
Valerie Hammerl 	       John Sr. would lift Pat over the boards, grab 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu       his hand, and start running around the outside,
V085PWPZ@UBVMS.CC.BUFFALO.EDU  faster and faster.  "I wanted to learn how to 
get that feeling, and the only way was to learn how to skate."  P. LaFontaine

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53955
From: lmcmasc@noah.ericsson.se (Mauro Schena)
Subject: Stats

Does anyone have the player stats for games played up until
April 22,1993.

Mauro.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53956
From: mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger)
Subject: More TV Info

United States Coverage:
Sunday April 18
  N.J./N.Y.I. at Pittsburgh - 1:00 EDT to Eastern Time Zone
  ABC - Gary Thorne and Bill Clement

  St. Louis at Chicago - 12:00 CDT and 11:00 MDT - to Central/Mountain Zones
  ABC - Mike Emerick and Jim Schoenfeld

  Los Angeles at Calgary - 12:00 PDT and 11:00 ADT - to Pacific/Alaskan Zones
  ABC - Al Michaels and John Davidson

Tuesday, April 20
  N.J./N.Y.I. at Pittsburgh - 7:30 EDT Nationwide
  ESPN - Gary Thorne and Bill Clement

Thursday, April 22 and Saturday April 24
  To Be Announced - 7:30 EDT Nationwide
  ESPN - To Be Announced


Canadian Coverage:

Sunday, April 18
  Buffalo at Boston - 7:30 EDT Nationwide
  TSN - ???

Tuesday, April 20
  N.J.D./N.Y. at Pittsburgh - 7:30 EDT Nationwide
  TSN - ???

Wednesday, April 21
  St. Louis at Chicago - 8:30 EDT Nationwide
  TSN - ???




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53957
From: Chad Nicholas Hunter <ch3g+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: ESPN

I don't know if anyone has posted a message like this yet, but i'm
getting really sick of espn showing the last minute of a hockey
game, in which the score was just tied, and then cutting out and saying
"sorry we can't show you this we have to show baseball tonight" (not
even a game. a friggin HIGHLIGHT show).
gee, sure would have been nice to see the isles/caps in overtime.
I live in Pittsburgh (yes i'm a pens fan) where hockey gets a lot
of coverage.  i can only imagine how a caps fan residing in Texas
must feel.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53958
From: jwh@sei.cmu.edu (John Huber)
Subject: Re: Leafs Crushed Again; Blues Win; Flames Back.


In article <1993Apr22.220409.10862@wuecl.wustl.edu>, jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:
|> In article <vzhivov.735454735@cunews> vzhivov@alfred.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov) writes:
|> >
|> >The Blues, led by the best goalie in the NHL this season, Curtis
|> >Joseph, shut-out the Hawks 2-0. The Blues are playing like they did in
|> >'86 - clutch 'n grab, shoot the puck out. It's incredibly boring to
|> >watch, but if it works...
|> >
|>  Finally a non Blues fan agrees that Joseph is a great goalie. I think he
|> should win the Vezina this year or at least share it with Barrasso who also
|> has been shadowed by Mario's amazing performance.
|> 

I too think that Joseph has had a GREAT year and should be considered for the
Vezina.  I think Barrasso and Joseph should be the two strongest candidates
this year.  I don't believe ALL of the hype that Roy, Belfour and now Potvin
receive for their goaltending.  I do think that they are great in the nets,
but I would rather have Curtis, Tommy or Fuhr in the nets during this years
playoffs.  The big name tenders always seem to have a strong defense in front
of them and the goaltenders get the most credit.  I would rather face 25 shots
a game, than have to rely on Joseph saving 35, but if the goalie is going to
face 35 shots, I would rather have Joseph or Barrasso facing them.

-Jay

ps Go Quebec!!!  And I know that McLean and several others should be mentioned
as candidates for this years Vezina, but I am partial to Joseph and Barrasso
this season.


John W. Huber, Jr. - aka Jay   | Penguins - 1991,1992 Stanley Cup Champions
Software Engineering Institute | Pirates - 1990,1991,1992 NL East Champions
SEI 3409        (412) 268-3550 | MasterCraft - The ONLY boat for skiing

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53959
From: Harold Zazula <DLMQC@CUNYVM.BITNET>
Subject: Octopus in Detroit?

I was watching the Detroit-Minnesota game last night and thought I saw an
octopus on the ice after Ysebaert scored to tie the game at two. What gives?
(is there some custom to throw octopuses on the ice in Detroit?)
-------
Not Responsible -- Dain Bramaged!!

Harold Zazula
dlmqc@cunyvm.cuny.edu
hzazula@alehouse.acc.qc.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53960
From: jmd@cbnewsm.cb.att.com (joseph.m.dakes)
Subject: Re: Flyers [Re: This year's biggest and worst (opinion)...]

In article <1993Apr15.190132.29787@cbnewsh.cb.att.com>, seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr) writes:
> So in other words, if Roussel shuts out the Sharks and Soderstrom shuts out
> the Penguins, that's immaterial because it was the coaches decision? Come on,
> Joe, think about what you're saying! Who they played is VERY significant.
> Why they played them is what's irrelevent. A low GAA against good teams
> is better than a low GAA against bad teams in the context of comparing two
> goaltenders. A low GAA is better then a higher GAA. A low GAA against good
> teams is much, much better than a higher GAA against bad teams in the context
> of comparing two goaltenders.

Let's start over.  I'm not arguing about who is the better goaltender.  I'd
take Soderstrom right now.  What I am saying is that Roussel can be a #1
netminder.  The GAA difference is less than half a goal per game (less than
that after last night), their save percentages are close, and their records
are similar.  And with that, I just don't see how you can label Roussel as
the most disappointing player on the Flyers this season.

You say Soderstrom played against better competition.  That may very well
be, but there is no way of knowing how Roussel would have performed in
those games.  Besides, against the better scoring teams like Pittsburgh,
the defense is more keyed up than they are against San Jose.

> The same
> for Roussel in the Ranger game. Two real scoring chances, one he made a
> great play, the other he was saved by a mistake from the other player. If
> you were judging Roussel on that game alone, you have very little to go by.

But I'm not just judging Roussel on that game alone.  I've seen him play
for the past two seasons in Philly and before that in Hershey.  It's just
my opinion, but I think he's got what it takes.  Of course, I thought that
about Mark LaForest, too.  But I never did about Wendell Young.  So I'm
batting .500 in judging Hershey talent since the Hextall-era.

As for the Rangers game, you can say he was saved by a mistake by the
offensive player if you like.  But Rou had his leg in position to make the
save.  If he didn't, it wouldn't have mattered if the Rangers player didn't
get the puck up or not.  It would have been a goal.  On a breakaway that's
what the goalie wants to do, take away as much as possible and force the
shooter to beat him.

> But if you were to look at the 0-0 tie against the Habs, you saw a goalie
> stand on his head to get that shutout. THAT was a #1 goalie in action. Roussel
> doesn't have a game like that in him.

I seem to remember Roussel doing an excellent job against Pittsurgh on
opening night to give the Flyers a tie against the two-time defending
champs.  And not to take anything away from Soderstrom because he was
senational in that game agains the Habs.  But you can't tell me that a
Montreal player had an open net to shoot at some point during that game
and just flat out missed it.  Mistakes, both on offense and defense are
part of the game.  Or there'd never be shutouts.

Anyway, I'm happy the Flyers have both Soderstrom and Roussel and
I'm not going to argue about it anymore.  Besides, with the current
7-game winning streak and expectations soaring for next year, I
don't want to piss you off to the point that you don't sell me any
tickets next season:-).

                                         \ \
Joe Dakes                                 \/\
AT&T Microelectronics                      \/\
555 Union Boulevard                         \ \
Allentown, PA  18103                     LET'S GO FLYERS! 
alux1!jmd                                     \ \
jmd@aluxpo.att.com                             \ \__________
                                                \____/_//__/


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53961
From: lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico)
Subject: Re: Goalie masks


Tom Barrasso wore a great mask, one time, last season.  He unveiled it
at a game in Boston.  

It was all black, with Pgh city scenes on it.  The "Golden Triangle"
(Pgh's downtown area where the 3 rivers meet) graced the top, along
with a steel mill on one side and the Civic Arena (I think) on the 
other.   On the back of the helmet was the old Pens' logo (the really
fat little penguin with the blue scarf) the current (at the time) Pens
logo, and a space for the "new" (now current) logo.

Tommy had designed the mask, and his mother (an artist) painted it
for him.  

But while wearing the mask, the Pens got thumped by the Bruins.  The
very next game, Tommy was back to the old paint job.  A great mask
done in by a goalie's superstition.

Lori



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53962
From: nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: Re: Pens Info needed

In article <1993Apr16.074054.3124@jyu.fi> mikkot@romulus.math.jyu.fi (Mikko Tarkiainen) writes:

>Coaching news: 
>
>	       Alpo Suhonen (ex-Jets) to Jokerit (now verified), 
>               Boris Majorov (ex-Jokerit) to Tappara,
>	       Vasili Tichonov (ex-Assat) to San Jose Sharks 
>                                             (assistant coach),
>	       Sakari Pietila to Lulea (silver team in Elite-serien)

Wow.  So that's probably the reason why current assistant coach Drew Ramenda
hinted that he won't be back.  Thanks for the news, Mikko; can you (or any
of our Finnish netters) comment on Tichonov?

===============================================================================
GO CALGARY FLAMES!  Al MacInnis for Norris!  Gary Roberts for Hart and Smythe!
GO EDMONTON OILERS!  Go for playoffs next year!  Stay in Edmonton!
===============================================================================
Nelson Lu (claudius@leland.stanford.edu)
rec.sport.hockey contact for the San Jose Sharks

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53963
From: d_jaracz@oz.plymouth.edu (David R. Jaracz)
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

In article <93106.092246DLMQC@CUNYVM.BITNET> Harold Zazula <DLMQC@CUNYVM.BITNET> writes:
>I was watching the Detroit-Minnesota game last night and thought I saw an
>octopus on the ice after Ysebaert scored to tie the game at two. What gives?

No no no!!!  It's a squid!  Keep the tradition alive!  (Kinda like the
fish at UNH games....)

>(is there some custom to throw octopuses on the ice in Detroit?)
>-------
>Not Responsible -- Dain Bramaged!!
>
>Harold Zazula
>dlmqc@cunyvm.cuny.edu
>hzazula@alehouse.acc.qc.edu



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53964
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: TV Schedule for Next Week

In article <Apr16.043426.69352@yuma.ACNS.ColoState.EDU> mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger) writes:
>United States TV Schedule:

>April 18   Devils/Islanders at Pittsburgh   1 EST  ABC  (to Eastern time zone)
>April 18   St. Louis at Chicago             12 CDT ABC  (to Cent/Mou time zones)
>April 18   Los Angeles at Calgary           12 PDT ABC  (to Pacific time zone)
>April 20   Devils/Islanders at Pittsburgh   7:30   ESPN
>April 22   TBA                              7:30   ESPN
>April 24   TBA                              7:30   ESPN
>

A little supplement Basic Mike's info  :

For Sundday's opener on ABC, these are the announcing crews :

Devils/Isles at Pittsburgh - Gary Thorne(play-by-play),Bill Clement(color)
and Al Morganti roaming the halls outside the dressing rooms.
This telecast will primarily seen on the East Coast.

St.Louis at Chicago - Mike Emrick(play - by play),Jim Schoendfeld(color)
and Tom Mees roaming the halls.
This telecast will primarily be seen in the Midwest and parts of the South.

LA at Calgary - Al "Do You Believe in Mircales?" Michaels(play by play),
John Davidson(color) and Mark Jones as a roaming reporter.
This telecast will be seen in the Western USA.

Montreal's naitive,Jon Saunders will be hosting in the studio.

ABC will do "Up and Close and Personal" with Mario during Saturday's
Wide World of Sports(4:30EDT).

Sunday will be the first NHL playoff or regular network telecast in 13 years...
not counting those silly All-Star games on NBC for the last few years...

For Sunday's games,ABC will use 8 mikes(2 behind on the goal),super-super-slo-mo,
close-ups of player's faces at face-offs. ESPN/ABC will not be able to
use its new favorite toy,the ice-level shot, in Pittsburgh where too many
seats would have to removed to employ it...


In case of a blowout in progress in Pittsburgh,ABC will switch to Chicago
game but will come back to the Pittsburgh game for updates or if the game
gets closer(Ha!)..

ABC expects huge ratings(by hockey standards) since all 3 Top US TV-markets
are involved - NY metro area(NY Islanders/NJ Devils),Chicago(BlackHawks),
and LA(Kings).

Stay tuned,

Thanks Mike,

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53965
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: RUMOUR - Keenan signs with Rangers?


UPI Clarinet has just relayed a "scoop" from the Toronto Sun
(or was that Star?  I like the Star myself ...) that Iron Mike
Keenan has come to an agreement with the New York Rangers for
next season.  Interestingly, this comes the day after the Times
Sports had an editorial about how the Rangers need their own
Pat Riley ... who cares about what happens after next season?

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53966
From: gibson@nukta.geop.ubc.ca (Brad Gibson)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

In article <1993Apr16.160228.24945@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@hudson.UVic.CA writes:
>
>In article 9088@blue.cis.pitt.edu, jrmst8+@pitt.edu (Joseph R Mcdonald) writes:
>
>>Jagr has a higher +/-, but Francis has had more points.  And take it from
>>an informed observer, Ronnie Francis has had a *much* better season than
>>Jaromir Jagr.  This is not to take anything away from Jaro, who had a 
>>decent year (although it didn't live up to the expectations of some).
>
>Bowman tended to overplay Francis at times because he is a Bowman-style
>player.  He plays hard at all times, doesn't disregard his defensive
>responsibilities and is a good leader.  Bowman rewarded him be increasing his
>ice time.
>
>Jagr can be very arrogant and juvenile and display a "me first" attitude.
>This rubbed Bowman the wrong way and caused him to lose some ice time.
>
>Throughout the year, Francis consistently recieved more ice time than
>Jagr.  Althouhg I have never seen stats on this subject, I am pretty
>sure that Jagr had more points per minute played that Francis.  When
>you add to that Jagr's better +/- rating, I think it becomes evident
>that Jagr had a better season- not that Francis had a bad one.
>

  Actually, what I think has become more evident, is that you are determined to
  flaunt your ignorance at all cost.  Jagr did not have a better season than
  Francis ... to suggest otherwise is an insult to those with a modicum of
  hockey knowledge.  Save your almost maniacal devotion to the almighty
  plus/minus ... it is the most misleading hockey stat available.

  Until the NHL publishes a more useful quantifiable statistic including ice
  time per game and some measure of its "quality" (i.e., is the player put out
  in key situations like protecting a lead late in the game; is he matched up
  against the other team's top one or two lines; short-handed, etc), I would
  much rather see the +/- disappear altogether instead of having its dubious
  merits trumpeted by those with little understanding of its implications.

  Brad

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Brad K. Gibson                           INTERNET: gibson@geop.ubc.ca
  Dept. of Geophysics & Astronomy         
  #129-2219 Main Mall                      PHONE: (604)822-6722
  University of British Columbia           FAX:   (604)822-6047
  Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
  V6T 1Z4
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53967
From: alan@lancaster.nsc.com (The Hepburn)
Subject: Re: Hockey and the Hispanic community

In article <saross01.734885336@starbase.spd.louisville.edu>, saross01@starbase.spd.louisville.edu (Stacey A. Ross) writes:
|> In <C5I2s2.3Bt@odin.corp.sgi.com> rickc@wrigley.corp.sgi.com (Richard Casares) writes:
|> >You'll have a hard time selling any sport to a community that
|> >can't play it on account of availability or financial reasons.
|> >Hockey is pretty much a sport for the white and well off.
|> 
|> What?! White, yes. Well off, definitely not. Hockey season ticket owners have
|> the lowest average income of any of the four major North American sports.

Do you have a basis for this claim?  Try these stats (taken from Playboy Magazine
June 1989):

Percentage of pro football fans who have attended college:    39.7
Percentage of pro baseball fans who have attended college:    41.5
Percentage of pro basketball fans who have attended college:  39.9
Percentage of pro hockey fans who have attended college:      54.6

Percentage of pro football fans who earn more than $50K:      34.9
Percentage of pro baseball fans who make more than $50K:      22.7
Percentage of pro basketball fans who make more than $50K:    27.7
Percentage of pro hackey fans who make more than $50K:        44.0

|> 
|> And think of where the majority of hockey players come from. From a farm out
|> in Boondock, Saskatchewan or Weedville, Alberta.
|> 

The biggest advantage that kids from Boondock or Weedville have is the
availability of ice.  In the San Jose area we have a population of 800,000
and that population is served by 2 ice arenas.  In contrast, Kamloops,
British Columbia has a population of about 50,000 and has 5 rinks!  There
are also myriad ponds, pools, etc that freeze in the winter.  Down here
it's hard to find a kid without a bicycle; up there it's hard to find a kid
without a pair of skates.  And before you say "what does he know? He's from
California." let me say that I was born and raised in Trail, British Columbia,
a town of about 8,000 with lots of ice in the winter.  My father did radio
play by play for the local team, the Trail Smokeaters, who by  the way, were
the last Canadian team to win the World Championship (back in 1961).  I was
on skates almost as soon as I could walk, and have been playing recreational
hockey for about 35 years.

|> >When was the last time you saw a hockey league in the inner city.
|> >The insurance alone is a big enough barrier.
|> 
|> The inner city isn't the only place that is poor.
|> I think the biggest barrier to hockey in the inner city is... no ICE to play on.


Lack of ice is a big factor, but costs is a bigger factor.  Both my kids play for
the Santa Clara Valley Hockey Association and this season, which just ended,
cost me $75 per kid for membership in Hockey USA, plus $750 per kid for club
dues.  The Hockey USA fees cover excess medical insurance, and the club dues
cover ice time, officials, trophies, etc.  Other areas have similar fees, unless
the city government subsidises some of the costs, as Stockton does.

By the way; most ice arenas are located in what could be called the "inner city"
areas.  Eastridge and Vallco are exceptions ... Redwood City's rink is in an
industrial area on Bay Rd, near 101, Berkeley's is near Ashby and Martin Luther
King, Stockton's is in Oak Park, Sacramento's is in an older section of downtown
(I forget the name of the street), Fresno's is out on the edge of town, just west
of 99.  Santa Rosa's is a nice rink, but it's in an older section of town.
Dublin's is outside of town, off 580.  Most of the rinks are old, and expensive
to run, with huge electric bills and insurance premiums.  If you want to buy ice
time expect to pay around $100 per hour at any of these rinks.  Some of them
give you a 60 minute hour for your money; others give you a 50 minute hour and
include the resurfacing time in the fee.


-- 
Alan Hepburn           "A man doesn't know what he knows
National Semiconductor       until he knows what he doesn't know."
Santa Clara, Ca              
alan@berlioz.nsc.com                              Thomas Carlyle

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53968
From: wein1@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (david weinberg)
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

David



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53969
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: RUMOUR - Keenan signs with Rangers?

In article <1993Apr16.171347.784@news.columbia.edu> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>
>UPI Clarinet has just relayed a "scoop" from the Toronto Sun
>(or was that Star?  I like the Star myself ...) that Iron Mike
>Keenan has come to an agreement with the New York Rangers for
>next season.  Interestingly, this comes the day after the Times
>Sports had an editorial about how the Rangers need their own
>Pat Riley ... who cares about what happens after next season?
>

The rumour was basically everywhere in Toronto based on reports
that Keenan has told both San Jose and Philadelphia that he
was no longer interested in pursuing further negotiations with
either team. 

The Ranger announcement is supposed to happen tomorrow supposedly.

The Rangers have so many veterans that they had to get a coach
with "weight" and a proven record...and whom they know Messier respects.

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53970
From: jbrown@vax.cns.muskingum.edu
Subject: Blackhawks win!!! 

The Hawks win!!  Jermey Roenick scored his 50 th goal and the Hawks put the
Leafs in their place, the losers column.  If the Leafs can not even beat the
Hawks in a match that had little or no meaning I will hate to see them against
the Wings.  

Oh btw I laugh at rm, that jerky!!!

GO HAWKS!!!

JB

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53971
From: georgeh@gjhsun (George H)
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

Harold Zazula <DLMQC@CUNYVM.BITNET> writes:

>I was watching the Detroit-Minnesota game last night and thought I saw an
>octopus on the ice after Ysebaert scored to tie the game at two. What gives?
>(is there some custom to throw octopuses on the ice in Detroit?)

It is a long standing good luck Redwing's tradition to throw an octopus 
on the ice during a Stanley Cup game. They say it dates back to '52
at the Olympia when the Wings became the 1st team (I think) to sweep 
the cup in 8 games. A lot hardet to throw one from Joe Louis seats
than from the old Olympia balcony, though.

Funniest I ever saw was when some Tiger fans threw one on the field
during a Detroit/Toronto baseball game ...  I was living in California
and the folks I was watching with had never heard of hockey and were 
incredulous when I recognized the octopus BEFORE the camera closeup !!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53972
From: smorris@venus.lerc.nasa.gov (Ron Morris )
Subject: Re: Blackhawks win!!!

In <1993Apr16.140953.5025@vax.cns..edu>, jbrown@vax.cns.muskingum.edu writes...
>The Hawks win!!  Jermey Roenick scored his 50 th goal and the Hawks put the
>Leafs in their place, the losers column.  If the Leafs can not even beat the
>Hawks in a match that had little or no meaning I will hate to see them against
>the Wings.  
> 
>Oh btw I laugh at rm, that jerky!!!

I would appreciate it if you would not refer to Mr. Maynard by his
initials.  Thanks, see you in the Norris finals.

Ron

**********
"And one of my major goals is to leave the next president a new set
of things to worry about.  I'm getting bored reading the same problems
in the paper, decade after decade.  I want people to have to deal
with new problems."
                    ... President Bill Clinton   2-4-93

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53973
From: dreier@jaffna.berkeley.edu (Roland Dreier)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

In article <1qmtd1INNr1l@iskut.ucs.ubc.ca> gibson@nukta.geop.ubc.ca (Brad Gibson) writes:

   In article <1993Apr16.160228.24945@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@hudson.UVic.CA writes:
   >
   >In article 9088@blue.cis.pitt.edu, jrmst8+@pitt.edu (Joseph R Mcdonald) writes:
   >
   >>Jagr has a higher +/-, but Francis has had more points.  And take it from
   >>an informed observer, Ronnie Francis has had a *much* better season than
   >>Jaromir Jagr.  This is not to take anything away from Jaro, who had a 
   >>decent year (although it didn't live up to the expectations of some).
   >
   >Bowman tended to overplay Francis at times because he is a Bowman-style
   >player.  He plays hard at all times, doesn't disregard his defensive
   >responsibilities and is a good leader.  Bowman rewarded him be increasing his
   >ice time.
   >
   >Jagr can be very arrogant and juvenile and display a "me first" attitude.
   >This rubbed Bowman the wrong way and caused him to lose some ice time.
   >
   >Throughout the year, Francis consistently recieved more ice time than
   >Jagr.  Althouhg I have never seen stats on this subject, I am pretty
   >sure that Jagr had more points per minute played that Francis.  When
   >you add to that Jagr's better +/- rating, I think it becomes evident
   >that Jagr had a better season- not that Francis had a bad one.
   >

     Actually, what I think has become more evident, is that you are determined to
     flaunt your ignorance at all cost.  Jagr did not have a better season than
     Francis ... to suggest otherwise is an insult to those with a modicum of
     hockey knowledge.  Save your almost maniacal devotion to the almighty
     plus/minus ... it is the most misleading hockey stat available.

     Until the NHL publishes a more useful quantifiable statistic including ice
     time per game and some measure of its "quality" (i.e., is the player put out
     in key situations like protecting a lead late in the game; is he matched up
     against the other team's top one or two lines; short-handed, etc), I would
     much rather see the +/- disappear altogether instead of having its dubious
     merits trumpeted by those with little understanding of its implications.

Thank you for posting this.  As the person who first brought up the
fact that Jagr has a much higher +/- than Francis, I can assure you
that I brought it up as an example of the absurdity of +/-
comparisons, even on the same team.  I never, ever thought that anyone
would argue that Jagr's higher +/- actually reflected better two-way
play.

In my opinion, Francis's low +/- is purely a result of him being asked
to play against opponents top scorers at all times; the fact that he
can chip in 100 points while neutralizing the other team's top center
is a testament to how valuable he is, even if his +/- suffers.  On the
other hand, Jagr, for how big, fast and skilled he is, can't even get
90 points, no matter how inflated his +/- is.

(By the way, don't get me wrong -- I like Jagr.  He may be a lazy
floater, but he turns it on at exactly the right times -- like
overtime of playoff games).

--
Roland Dreier                                        dreier@math.berkeley.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53974
From: georgeh@gjhsun (George H)
Subject: Re: President Trophy winner missing playoffs ???

jstrangi@hora.seas.upenn.edu (Jim Strangio) writes:

>In article <13APR93.17376172.0059@VM1.MCGILL.CA> CCDB@MUSICA.MCGILL.CA (CCDB000) writes:

>When was the last time a President's Trophy winner fell to last place
>the following year?  A long time, I'd bet.
>--

Well I think it in 1969 the Montreal Canadians finished 1st (although
there was no President's cup in those days) and missed the playoffs 
in 1970. I do recall that the 1970 playoff picture wasn't decided until
the final day, when the NY Rangers defeated the RedWings. The tie-breaker was
the number of goals for (if I remember correctly), so the Rangers played
with an empty net for the entire game. Some Hab loyalists accused 
the Wings of 'throwing' the game to keep them out, but as I recall, 
Gordie and Delvecchio had the flu, so coach Sid Abel sat them out,
and the Rangers swarmed the RedWings most of the night. 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53975
From: gak@wrs.com (Richard Stueven)
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

It's in the FAQ.

have fun
gak

---
Richard Stueven       AHA# 22584 |----------| He has erected a multitude of new
Internet:            gak@wrs.com |----GO----| offices, and sent hither swarms
ATTMAIL: ...!attmail!gakhaus!gak |---SHARX--| of officers to harass our people,
Cow Palace:            107/H/3-4 |----------| and eat out their substance.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53976
From: cpc4@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (CONNIN PATRICK COLGAIN)
Subject: Keenan signs with the Rangers!!

Just heard on the news that Mike Keenan formerly of the Blackhawks, Flyers,
and General of a Siberian Prison has just signed to coach the Rangers.  The
Rangers, who won the President's Cup last year have slipped just a bit at the
end of the season and are destined to finish last behind the lowly Flyers.
The Flyers' fans are going to be disappointed on Keenans decision, because
they were very interested in him.  Oh well.

Go CAPS!!!!!!!

Connin
-- 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53977
From: farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL final standings

FINAL 1992-93 AMERICAN HOCKEY LEAGUE STANDINGS

NORTHERN DIVISION	W	L	T	PTS	GF	GA	LYF*
Providence Bruins	46	32	2	94	384	348	56
Adirondack Red Wings	36	35	9	81	331	308	84
Capital District Isles	34	34	12	80	280	285	75
Springfield Indians	25	41	14	64	282	336	94
New Haven Senators	22	47	11	55	262	343	--

SOUTHERN DIVISION	W	L	T	PTS	GF	GA	LYF
Binghamton Rangers	57	13	10	124#	392	246	91
Rochester Americans	40	33	7	87	348	332	86
Utica Devils		33	36	11	77	325	354	74
Baltimore Skipjacks	28	40	12	68	318	353	66
Hershey Bears		27	41	12	66	316	339	83
Hamilton Canucks	29	45	6	64	284	327	--

ATLANTIC DIVISION	W	L	T	PTS	GF	GA	LYF
St John's Maple Leafs	41	26	13	95	351	308	90
Fredericton Canadiens	38	31	11	87	314	278	96
Cape Breton Oilers	36	32	12	84	356	336	82
Moncton Hawks		31	33	16	78	292	306	74
Halifax Citadels	33	37	10	76	312	348	67

*- Last year's point total
#- League record total			

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53978
From: enolan@sharkbite.esd.sgi.com (Ed Nolan)
Subject: Devils and Islanders tiebreaker????

If the Islanders beat the Devils tonight, they would finish with
identical records.  Who's the lucky team that gets to face the Penguins
in the opening round?   Also, can somebody list the rules for breaking
ties.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53979
From: cbetz@radioman.cray.com (Charles Betz  {x66442 CF/ENG})
Subject: NHL team in Milwaukee


After reading some of the reports of possible NHL moves to Milwaukee or that
Milwaukee should have an NHL team, I thought I'd pass along a story I heard
recently.  This is second hand, so I don't know how true it is, but I have
no reason to doubt it either.

Bradley Center in Milwaukee is home to the Milwaukee Admirals minor leauge
hockey team.  The owner of the Admirals (sorry, I can't remember his name)
either owns or at least shelled out the majority of the funds to build the
Bradley Center.

Supposedly he was approached by the NHL about an expansion franchise, but 
turned it down because he thought the franchise fee of $50 million was too
high.

Like I said, I don't know whether this story is true or just a rumor, but if
it's true, don't look for an NHL team in Milwaukee anytime soon.  The Admirals
aren't going to be forced out of the building and you won't see an NHL club
and a minor league club in the same building, especially since the NBA's
Milwaukee Bucks play there as well.

Charlie Betz
Cray Research, Inc.   Chippewa Falls, WI
cbetz@romulus.cray.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53980
From: joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm)
Subject: Re: How to beat Pittsburgh!

In article <1993Apr15.214902.3372@guvax.acc.georgetown.edu> apanjabi@guvax.acc.georgetown.edu writes:
...
>>HOW TO BEAT PITTSBURGH???
...
>	III.Kevin Stevens
>		A.Fighting
>			1.Call Bob Probert
>			2.Call Tie Domi
>			3.Call my grandmother (She'd kick his ass)
> 

Yeah...I've seen you're grand mother...I bet she could.

Joseph Stiehm







Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53981
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: RUMOUR - Keenan signs with Rangers?

golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>
>The Ranger announcement is supposed to happen tomorrow supposedly.

Press conference at 1PM ...

>The Rangers have so many veterans that they had to get a coach with
>"weight" and a proven record...and whom they know Messier respects.

Interestingly, Keenan's co-coach (or is it his "Number One"?) on Team
Canada at the World Championships is Roger Neilsen.  

It'd be interesting if the Rangers call in the balance of Neilsen's
contract to be Keenan's assistant ...  Roger did do a very good job
with the mediocre players, just as he handled the Cinderella Canucks
of 10 years ago ... but his mistake was playing the Rangers like those
Canucks last May ...

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53982
From: "Terence M. Rokop" <tr2i+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Patrick Playoffs Look Like This

Jan Brittenson writes:

>last year. The Pens' weak spot is defense and goaltending -- if Boston

            ...

>   Boston doesn't have the guns of the Pens, but the Pens doesn't have
>the defense, goaltending, and discipline of Boston. Still, Boston can

Why do you say this?  As of now, the Pens and Bruins have played the
same number of games, and given up the same number of goals.  They are
tied for the third and fourth best defenses in the league, behind
Chicago first and Toronto second.  The Pens' weak spot is defense?  Only
by comparison to their offense, which is second in the league to
Detroit.  But the Pens are no weaker on defense and goaltending than the
Bruins are; that is, they are both very strong.



                                                Terry

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53983
From: mep@phoenix.oulu.fi (Marko Poutiainen)
Subject: Re: Finland/Sweden vs.NHL teams (WAS:Helsinki/Stockholm & NHL expansion)

: FINLAND:  
: 
: D-Jyrki Lumme.......20
: D-Teppo Numminen....20
: D-Peter Ahola.......13
: 
Well well, they don't like our defenders (mainly Lumme and Numminen)...

: C-Jari Kurri........25
: C-Christian Ruuttu..16
: 
Now, do YOU think that Ruuttu is only worth 16 ? I think it might be 20.

: R-Teemu Selanne.....27
: 
Compared to Kurri, Selanne's points are too high, lets make it 25 or 26.


: well in the Canada Cup and World Championships largely due to the efforts of
: Markus Ketterer (the goalie), 3-4 or the players listed above and luck. There's
: presumably a lot of decent players in Finland that wouldn't be superstars at
: the highest level but still valuable role players, however. My guess would be
: that the Finnish Canada Cup team would be a .500 team in the NHL.

Wow, now, it looks like you don't like our players? What about guys like:
Nieminen, Jutila, Riihijarvi, Varvio, Laukkanen, Makela, Keskinen and (even
if he is aging) Ruotsalainen? The main difference between finnish and North-
American players is, that our players tend to be better in the larger rink.
The Canadian defenders are usually slower that defenders in Europe. 
And I think that there was more in our success than Ketterer and luck (though
they helped). I think that the main reason was, that the team worked well
together.
--
***********************************************************************
* 'Howl howl gargle howl gargle howl howl howl gargle howl gargle howl* 
*  howl gargle gargle howl gargle gargle gargle howl slurrp uuuurgh'  *
*                                       -Prostetnic Vogon Jeltz       *
***********************************************************************
	-Marko Poutiainen
	 mep@phoenix.oulu.fi

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53984
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: ESPN2 - Tell us about it 

Geoff Filinuk (filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu) wrote:

: 	This comes indirectly from Al Morgani who works in the studio
: for ESPN hockey.
[Some text deleted]
: 	ESPN is under contractual obligation to show baseball and COULD NOT
: broadcast the OT of the hockey game.  Next year, ESPN2 will be introduced so 
: baseball fans can watch baseball and hockey fans can watch hockey.

I hadn't heard about this new ESPN2. When is this new network
supposed to start? Sounds great to me! (as long as my cable co.
offers it)

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53985
From: v120qldp@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (A REAL KNEEBITER)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

In article <1993Apr23.102811.623@sei.cmu.edu>, caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz) writes...
> 
>While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash" that
>Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had his
>jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not positive.
>Does anyone remember/know his name?  What has happened to him since?  What
>about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?  Has this ever
>happened before in a hockey game?   

It was Clint Malarchuk's neck cut by Uwe Krupp's skate.  I know it happened in
Buffalo, but I can't tell you against whom.

Krupp was defending an opposing attacker charging the net.

Malarchuk became the fourth goalie (behind Hasek, Puppa and Draper) after
suffering from Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder.  He's been playing in San Diego
for former Sabre coach Rick Dudley.

Krupp is now playing for the Islanders after the LaFontaine/Turgeon trade.

What do I win?  =)

---
Patrick Ferrel - v120qldp@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu   "I always said there was
State University of New York at Buffalo           something fundamentally wrong
                                                  with the Universe."
<aka> Jay Walker, WWIVnet 1@7659                            -- Arthur Dent

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53986
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Sabres/Bruins notes


 
It was unlikely, improbable.  For the Bruins, it was the stuff of
nightmares; for the Sabres, it was a taste of heaven.  
   For the first time since 1983, the Sabres have won the first three
games of a series.  Last time was a three games to none victory in a
best of five against the Canadiens.  It takes a little more work this
time.  The Sabres seem ready to put in the extra work.
   On the heels of a shutout, one that took away Boston's home ice
advantage, the Sabres came back with a four to three overtime win.  It
wasn't easy.  It wasn't always pretty.  It still worked.
   John Blue got the nod for Boston, supplanting Andy Moog as starting
goaltender.  Moog was pulled midway through game 2 on Tuesday.
Buffalo started with a goal by Mogilny, his fourth of the playoffs, on
the powerplay, with Boston's Don Sweeney and Gord Roberts in the box.
LaFontaine and Hawerchuk had the assists.  Goal number two was
Khmylev's first of the playoffs, a pretty goal scored when the Sabres
stole the puck and passed to an open and waiting Khmylev.  Smehlik and
Hannan assisted.  Determined not to be shut out, Boston tallied on a
shot by Ray Bourque on the powerplay, with Colin Patterson and Bob
Sweeney both in the box.  Period two was scoreless, a split of
penalties between the two clubs.  The third saw Boston's Smolinski get
his first, courtesy of Oates.  Buffalo resecured the lead two minutes
later, from former Bruin Bob Sweeney (Khmylev and Carney).  Neely tied
the game 3/4 of the way through the third, sending it into overtime.
Last year overtime meant a Bruin win.  Last night, it spelled sweet
revenge, as Buffalo scored with Ray Bourque in the penalty box, on a
tip in by Khmylev (Hawerchuk and LaFontaine) a minute into overtime.
Both teams finished with 34 shots.  
        Power-play conversions--Boston 5-1. Buffalo 7-2.
        Referee--Rob Shick.

Comments:  Shick pocketed the whistle in the third, allowing a lot of
clutching and grabbing.  Buffalo's penalty killing unit was fantastic
again.  Mogilny was checking.  Granted he missed once and instead
flung his body into the boards, but checking like this is a novel idea
to Mogilny.  The crowd was unbelievable.  I don't think I've ever
heard a crowd that loud in the Aud for a Sabres game (remember, I was
only five when they played for the cup.  I don't remember it and no
one took me to the games).  Doug Bodger, in a postgame interview,
noted that he tried to say something to Hawerchuk, but the crowd was
too loud, even though he was shouting.  It didn't seem to matter, as
most of the Sabres and even Muckler said it was great.  Yuri Khmylev
didn't seem to realize that he was the game's third star and didn't
skate out when his name was called.  Sweeney (2) and Fuhr (1) each
were out before Yuri made his appearance, sans jersey.  When asked in
an interview later whether he knew how big a goal that was, he
responed yes (ok, it was through an interpreter and he said more than
that, even more than the interpreter said, but I digress).  The
interviewer seemed to think just because he doesn't speak English, he
must not understand playoffs.  Uh-huh. 

-- 
Valerie Hammerl 	       John Sr. would lift Pat over the boards, grab 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu       his hand, and start running around the outside,
V085PWPZ@UBVMS.CC.BUFFALO.EDU  faster and faster.  "I wanted to learn how to 
get that feeling, and the only way was to learn how to skate."  P. LaFontaine

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53987
From: Bhullar@BLDG_HSC_CAMPUS (Raj BHULLAR)
Subject: Re: Montreal versue Quebec

In article <1r8p64$kj6@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu (David Vergolini) writes:

>  Did anyone see the Montreal - Quebec game yesterday?  It was tight right down
>to the last second of the third period.  In the overtime Roy and Hextall played
>like they were gods.
>  Ok, so Montreal won!  They deserved it after getting their first goal in
>overtime waved off because the puck was hit in with a high stick.  Their second
>goal in overtime was also replayed, but I could not tell if it was the Montreal
>player who kicked it in.  The puck definitely was not directed in by a stick.
>Anyways, Montreal is back into the series.







>                                                Dave Vergolini
>                                                Michigan State University
>                                                vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu
The replay clearly showed that the winning goal for Montreal went off the 
skate of the Quebec defenceman who was checking Kirk Muller in front of 
Hextall.
  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53988
From: chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Subject: Re: SHARKS: Jack Feirerra (was Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!)

gak@wrs.com (Richard Stueven) writes:

>On the other hand, I'm hard pressed to think of any other real mistakes
>Fereirra made.  Imagine indeed, but then again we have the benefit of
>hindsight.

Well, the "jettison for youth fast" strategy was his. Also in hindsight, it
didn't work all that well, but I think it was more because it left the
Sharks on a tightrope without a net, not that it was inherently flawed. It
was the injuries that caused us to fall.

>Let's say that in the view of the Sharks' upper management, the attempt
>to trade Kisio was a major factor in the decision to fire Feirerra.

From all indications, it wasn't the "major" factor, but the "last straw".
There were personality conflicts among Shark management, and disagreements
over how personnel were going to be handled (not just who was being traded
vs. kept, but who was being sent to KC. What Ferriera did, if rumors are
right, was not always what the folks behind the bench wanted or needed).

>I'm inclined to take exactly the opposite view:  they should have kept
>him...he's obviously the luckiest man in hockey!

I think if they'd kept Ferriera, they would have lost some of their other
management staff. Depending on which sources you trust, we might have lost
Grillo AND Lombardi AND Murdoch over the summer. Frankly, I want to keep
those three. (we may well ahve also lost Kingston, which, of course, is now
a moot point). 

The Sharks have been building an organizational staff that is highly
consensual and cooperative. Ferriera wanted to run things his way. There
were conflicts. Ferriera lost. That says nothing about his skills or
accomplishments -- at that level, a lot is personality and politics. 

I think he did some good things for the Sharks, but that he never fit in as
a "Shark person". I hope he succeeds beyond his wildest dreams down in
Anaheim, too, because it'll be good for hockey. (but I want the Ducks to be
doormats for a couple of years, so the Sharks succeeed first).

-- 
 Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= chuq@apple.com
   Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms =+=  GEnie: MAC.BIGOT =+= ALink:CHUQ 
  Minor League fans: minors-request@medraut.apple.com (San Jose Giants: A/1/9)
  San Francisco Giants fans: giants-request@medraut.apple.com (The Stick?NOT!)
   San Jose Sharks fans: sharks-request@medraut.apple.com (New seat: 127/TBD)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53989
From: rzuback@alumni.Lakeheadu.Ca
Subject: Re: Leafs v.s. Wings

I agree! Rob Shick sucks big time.  He did the same thing last night's game 
between Boston & Buffalo.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53990
From: rzuback@alumni.Lakeheadu.Ca
Subject: Re: POTVIN & HIS STICK

Nothing wrong with what Felix did.  The only problem was that he didn't Dino 
hard enough.  Next time Felix aim for the ankles!!!!!!!!!!

GO LEAFS.  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53991
From: steven.kipling@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Steven Kipling) 
Subject: Re: Buffalo Sabres

 -=> Quoting Bill Gregory to All <=-

 

 BG> hey I saw that game!  I thought the Sabres looked better that you
 BG> described. It's Boston that looked weak and unsure of themselves.  Even
 BG> if (big if) they (bruins) win the third game what's that going to
 BG> prove?  They be lucky!


     Well now the Sabres are up 3 - 0 in games, and its to
     bad that Boston isn't putting up more of a fight as
     that could have been the best series of the playoffs,
     I think Boston will come out smoking in the next
     two games and that Buffalo will end the series in
     game six back in Buffalo, and say, how about those Islanders?
     they are up 2 - 1 on the Capitals and will probably
     win the series, only to be clobbered by the Penguins who
     should eliminate the Devils in the next game.
     I cannot see (i'm sad to say) anyone beating the 
     Penguins this year (again) and they will take cup # 3 
     I'm afraid.  well talk to ya later.


Steve




... To find out a girl's faults, praise her to her girl friends.
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
                                                                                    

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53992
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

In article <1r8tgh$lfi@hsdndev.harvard.edu> nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219) writes:
>
>Harry and his buttkisser Milbury will never admit that they screwed up
>in a major way when they brought in one of the dumbest people in the
>business,Brian Sutter. Sutter's playoff record as the head coach in St.Louis
>speaks for itself. The Blues really have a chance to advance to the
>second round this year...
>

Grant Fuhr has done this to a lot better coaches than Brian Sutter...

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53993
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Hockey guest spots...

In article <22APR93.25499311.0068@VM1.MCGILL.CA> JBE5 <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA> writes:
>Manon Rheaume was on with Letterman in Sept. 1992.  Her English was
>so terrible that Letterman took cheap shots at her.  Although the shots
>were funny, they were uncalled for.
>

Well, on the contrary, I thought Dave was rather taken with her and her
accent..."(H)ockey is my passion"... 

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53994
From: smorris@venus.lerc.nasa.gov (Ron Morris )
Subject: Re: WJR in Boston

John Girash writes...
>For all those Red Wings fans in Boston, I thought I'd letcha know that (being
>desperate for news on the game) I tried to get WJR (AM 760) on my Walkman --
>and SUCCEEDED!  It was at night (about 10pm) & reception got better as it got

You can get WJR a LONG way away.  The problem is that, because of those
well known and beloved "contractual obligations", WJR will be doing
Tiger baseball instead of the Wings playoff games for probably half
the games the Wings could play.  For this series, I know tonight's
game and I believe games 5 and 6 (if necessay) will be bumped.

Ron

**********
"And one of my major goals is to leave the next president a new set
of things to worry about.  I'm getting bored reading the same problems
in the paper, decade after decade.  I want people to have to deal
with new problems."
                    ... President Bill Clinton   2-4-93

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53995
From: vallille@emr1.emr.ca (Roy Vallillee)
Subject: Sabre fans 

Yes, Yes, I can see it now >>>> all those Sabre fans FINALLY taking
their Sabre sweaters out of the moth balls and proudly wearing them.
After 9 years of playoff frustration and being up 3 games to nil
I guess it is a pretty good bet.    BUT there has not been a team
that has come back from an 0-3 deficit since 1975 - could this be
the year.   (Don't throw out the moth balls yet)

ROY

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53996
From: smorris@venus.lerc.nasa.gov (Ron Morris )
Subject: Re: Wings News and Playoff Thoughts

I wrote:
>>
>>I feel the jury is still out on Tim Cheveldae as a playoff goalie.
>>He was average in his first playoffs.  Last year, he had a horrible
>>start, but played great the last ten games after he was benched.
>>His GAA, even with the horrible start, was 2.5 last year.  This year,
>>I think he's going to play very well (he has to if Detroit is going
>>to win the cup).  He wasn't sharp in game 1, but he didn't have to be.
>>I thought he looked pretty good yesterday.
>>
Charles Hubbert writes...
>Great write up of the Wings/Toronto series thus far.  I agree with just
>about everything that you said, but Chevy shouldn't have let the shot from
>the right point in.  First goal, Mikorov, I think.  Other than that, the
>Wings are looking good, and Chevy is holding his own.  Not great, but maybe

Chevy has let in 2 or 3 soft goals so far, but they all didn't matter.
However, his recent history has been inconsistant play but comes up
big when it counts.  The score was 4-0 I think when the goal you mentioned
was scored.  In the third period when it looked like Toronto was coming
back, Chevy was exceptional.  I can see him as a Barraso style playoff
goalie:  inconsistant when there's nothing on the line,
but comes up big when really needed.  I guess we'll both find out.

Ron

**********
"And one of my major goals is to leave the next president a new set
of things to worry about.  I'm getting bored reading the same problems
in the paper, decade after decade.  I want people to have to deal
with new problems."
                    ... President Bill Clinton   2-4-93

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53997
From: colling@ann-arbor.applicon.slb.com (Michael Collingridge)
Subject: Re: Hockey guest spots...

In article 27867 of rec.sport.hockey sclark@epas.utoronto.ca 
(Susan Clark) asks:
>Hi guys....
>        I'm looking to answe a bit of trivia.  What hockeplayers have
>appeared on major talk shows on TV (i.e., Letterman, Carson/Leno,
>Arsenio, etc.....i.e. shows of a national nature--include Canadian equivalents
>if you can think of any)?  This can include NHL, Olympic, and World Champion-
>ship players.  I'm pretty sure I've seen Gretzky and Lemieux, but I was
>wondering if there were any others.....
>

I am not so sure about the celebrated players of the game, but Tod Hartje,
who played for Harvard in college and then went on to play in the AHL
(initially for Moncton and currently for Providence-- thanks to Daryl 
Turner for the update!) appeared on David Letterman's show about two
years ago now.

Tod has the distinction of being the first American born player to go 
and play in the former Soviet Union. This was arranged by Jets GM Mike 
Smith while Tod was playing in Moncton at about the time all those 
European players were coming over to North America to play in the NHL.

Tod spent a year playing in Russia and played with or against some of
the Russian players who have just entered the NHL in the last two years.
He wrote a book on his experiences called "Behind the Red Line" (check it
out!) and appeared on the Letterman show to talk about them.

-- Mike 

Note: I hope I have my facts straight. It has been a year since I
read Tod's book. I wanted to dig the book out to double check, but 
realized I lent it to a friend, and he hasn't returned the book yet! 
(Just wait 'til I get a hold of him...)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53998
From: pavalin@bnr.ca (Paul Valin)
Subject: Re: Montreal versue Quebec

In article <1r8p64$kj6@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu>, vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu
(David Vergolini) wrote:
> 
>Did anyone see the Montreal - Quebec game yesterday?  It was tight right down
>to the last second of the third period.  In the overtime Roy and Hextall played
>like they were gods.
>Ok, so Montreal won!  They deserved it after getting their first goal in
>overtime waved off because the puck was hit in with a high stick.  Their second
>goal in overtime was also replayed, but I could not tell if it was the Montreal
>player who kicked it in.  The puck definitely was not directed in by a stick.
>Anyways, Montreal is back into the series.
> 

The overhead replay pretty clearly showed that it was the Quebec 
defender who deflected the puck.  The re-play officials did not 
take nearly as much time to make this call as they did for the first 
non-goal, so it seemed pretty non-controversial.

I agree that it was a great game; good to see Roy and Damphousse back
into form.  Hopefully the sign of good things to come...
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Paul Valin                                     Tel: + 1 613 763 7394
Bell-Northern Research Ltd.                    Email: pavalin@bnr.ca
P.O. Box 3511, Station C
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada K1Y 4H7               'only my opinions...'

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 53999
From: "Matthew T. Keating" <mk55+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Bowman needs credit

During the first three games of the Pens-Devils series, I have been
impressed time and time again by the pure talent of the Pens.  Jagr,
MacEachern and Barrasso have been especially fun to watch.  But, one
element of this team which goes unnoticed seems to be Scotty Bowman.

Despite Brooks' lunatic comments, and despite the Devils' line changing
adantage in last night's game, Bowman has been able to keep his cool and
keep the Devils in the dark.  Granted, the hell-dwellers had the Pens
bottled up for a while last night, but Bowman was eventually able to
configure his line-up to get the job done.  His ability to throw out new
looks and strategies at a moments notice is incredible.

Bowman seems to have a terrific ability of reading his players on an
individual basis.  Last night, for instance, he realized that the speed
of Jagr, Straka, and MacEachern was throwing the Devils off balance.  As
a result, Straka received many more shifts than average; Jagr played
almost the entire game (he was always on the puck), and MacEachern
scored a goal, while complementing Jagr many times throughout the night.
His ability to commit to one player in crucial situations is
commendable, especially when a coach of such a talented team might
simply rely on the overall talent to dominate, and to bring about
success.

While no one can replace the genius and optimism of Badger Bob Johnson,
Bowman, in his own way, has made himself a permanent, though not clearly
seen, mark in  Pittsburgh. 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54000
From: duncan@ (Nicholas Duncan)
Subject: Where's Roger?

I really feel the need for a knowledgable hockey observer to explain this year's playoffs to me. I mean, the obviously superior Toronto team with the best center and the best goalie in the league keeps losing. What gives?

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
         
I stand by all the misstatements that I've made.
		-- Vice President Dan Quayle to Sam Donaldson, 8/17/89

Me Too -- Nick Duncan <duncan@mprgate.mpr.ca>

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54001
From: bks2@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (bryan.k.strouse)
Subject: NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4-22-93



NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR 4/22/93.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                  CONFERENCE SEMI-FINALS        BEST OF SEVEN
      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE
 
 NJ                  BUF   (leads 3-0)   STL   (leads 2-0)   WIN               
 PIT   (leads 3-0)   BOS                 CHI                 VAN   (leads 2-0)

 NYI   (leads 2-1)   MON                 TOR                 LA    (tied  1-1) 
 WAS                 QUE   (leads 2-1)   DET   (leads 2-0)   CAL              

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quebec Nordiques    (leads series 2-1)    1   0   0   0   -   1
Montreal Canadiens                        0   1   0   1   -   2

1st period: QUE, Sundin 1 - (Gusarov) 1:17
	 
2nd period: MON, Muller 1 - (Damphousse, Bellows) (pp) 1:30

3rd period: NONE

1 Overtime: MON, Damphousse 1 - (Bellows, Desjardins) (pp) 10:30

Powerplay Opportunities-Nordiques 0 of 4
			Canadiens 2 of 6

Shots on Goal-	Nordiques  12   4  14   5  -  35
		Canadiens  11  14  13  12  -  50

Quebec Nordiques--Hextall (2-1) (50 shots - 48 saves)
Montreal Canadiens--Roy (1-2) (35 shots - 34 saves)

ATT-17,679

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Pittsburgh Penguins  (leads series 3-0)   1   0   3   -   4
New Jersey Devils                         1   1   1   -   3

1st period: NJD, Guerin 1 - 1:03
	    PIT, McEachern 3 - (Straka) 9:36
	   
2nd period: NJD, Holik 1 - (S.Stevens) 16:32

3rd period: PIT, M.Lemieux 4 - (Murphy, Ramsey) 1:07
	    PIT, Taglianetti 1 - (Loney, Tippett) 7:05
	    PIT, Murphy 1 - (Francis, Tocchet) (pp) 9:31
	    NJD, Semak 1 - (Zelepukin) 9:44

Powerplay Opportunities-Penguins 1 of 4
			Devils   0 of 5

Shots on Goal-	Penguins   7  16  12  -  35
		Devils    16  11   5  -  32

Pittsburgh Penguins--Barrasso (3-0) (32 shots - 29 saves)
New Jersey Devils--Billington (0-1) (35 shots - 31 saves)

ATT-14,974

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Boston Bruins                        1   0   2   0   -   3
Buffalo Sabres  (leads series 3-0)   2   0   1   1   -   4

1st period: BUF, Mogilny 4 - (LaFontaine, Hawerchuk) (pp) 1:33
	    BUF, Khmylev 1 - (Smehlik, Hannan) 4:42
	    BOS, Bourque 1 - (Oates, Donato) (pp) 17;33

2nd period: NONE

3rd period: BOS, Smolinski 1 - (Oates) 13:28
	    BUF, B.Sweeney 2 - (Khmylev, Carney) 14:56
	    BOS, Neely 3 - (Oates, Shaw) 15:57

1 Overtime: BUF, Khmylev 2 - (Hawerchuk, LaFontaine) (pp) 1:05

Powerplay Opportunities-Bruins 1 of 5
			Sabres 2 of 7

Shots on Goal-	Bruins  11   8  15   0  -  34
		Sabres  12  11   8   3  -  34

Boston Bruins--Blue (0-1) (34 shots - 30 saves)
Buffalo Sabres--Fuhr (3-0) (34 shots - 31 saves)

ATT-16,325

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Washington Capitals                       1   1   1   0   -   3
New York Islanders   (leads series 2-1)   1   0   2   1   -   4

1st period: NYI, Thomas 1 - 16:37
	    WAS, Burridge 1 - (May, Cavallini) 18:58

2nd period: WAS, Carpenter 1 - (Ridley, Bondra) 6:18

3rd period: WAS, Elynuik 1 - (Carpenter, Ridley) 6:15
	    NYI, Thomas 2 - (Turgeon, King) 11:11
	    NYI, Turgeon 3 - (Thomas, Hogue) 19:17

1 Overtime: NYI, Ferraro 3 - (Hogue, Flatley) 4:46

Powerplay Opportunities-Capitals  0 of 2
			Islanders 0 of 4

Shots on Goal-	Capitals   10   8   6   1  -  25
		Islanders  10   6   8   6  -  30

Washington Capitals--Tabaracci (1-2) (25 shots - 21 saves)
New York Islanders--Healy (2-1) (30 shots - 27 saves)

ATT-14,180

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


\|||||/
-SPIKE-




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54002
From: leunggm@odin.control.utoronto.ca (Gary Leung)
Subject: Re: POTVIN and HIS STICK

In article <2346575PS380.9.0@sscl.uwo.ca> 2346575PS380@sscl.uwo.ca writes:
>Dino getting shots in front of the net, he should expect it.  This is playoff
>hockey where anything goes. You lose one game in the regular season, and it's
>not so bad. You lose a game in the playoffs and it's a difficult thing to
>overcome.  I've watched hockey (and played it too) for a number of years and
>I haven't seen one post-season game where the forward in front of the net 
>has not finished without any bruises on the back of his leg.  The Leafs are 
>not doing a good job in clearing the net and Potvin has been forced to take
>matters into his own hands.  I remember when Cicarelli used to play for the
>London Knights (OHL), he always was a nuisance in front of the net and the 
>goalies took exception to this.  He also complained (in this morning's paper)
>about what happened last night, but to me, it's a lot of bellyaching. His 
>team is up 2-0 and he complains about being whacked...I wonder what would
>happen if he tried to do the same thing in front of Billy Smith or a younger
>Ron Hextall? Seems Dino would need two artifical legs.  Dino should take it 
>as part of the game and thank his lucky stars that he's in the playoffs and
>has a good chance to go the finals.


Well, I agree that if you're going to stand in front of the net,
that you should expect to get hit and hacked at. In general, you
should expect to finish the game with some bruises. However,
there is a fine line between hacking at a guy (causing some pain
and discomfort) and blatantly attempting to injure another
player. Felix Potvin, IMO, crossed that line on Wednesday. That
two hander on Ciccarelli was way out of line. I lost a lot of
respect for Potvin because of that. It showed an immaturity. He
did not slash at Ciccarelli to simply try to remove him from the
slot area (a legal position for Dino to be in). Instead, he
slashed in an attempt to injure. It was out of shear frustration. As a
Leaf supporter (just a supporter, I'm not a Leaf fan really), I
was very disappointed.

You're right in mentioning Billy Smith and Ron Hextall (at least
in his Philly days). They both crossed that same line at times and
for that reason, many fans (and players) disliked them (that's
why their names always comes up as examples when we talk about
these issues). Let's hope that Felix doesn't do that again. I'd
hate to see anyone (even Dino --- although I admit I don't like
him very much) get seriously hurt from such careless (but
intentional) use of the stick.

Gary



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54003
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

In article <C5y0t6.Bqn@acsu.buffalo.edu> v120qldp@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (A REAL KNEEBITER) writes:
>In article <1993Apr23.102811.623@sei.cmu.edu>, caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz) writes...
>> 
>>While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash" that
>>Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had his
>>jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not positive.
>>Does anyone remember/know his name?  What has happened to him since?  What
>>about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?  Has this ever
>>happened before in a hockey game?   
>
>It was Clint Malarchuk's neck cut by Uwe Krupp's skate.  I know it happened in
>Buffalo, but I can't tell you against whom.
>
>Krupp was defending an opposing attacker charging the net.

It was NOT Krupp's skate.  Krupp was defending against Steve Tuttle,
of the Blues.  They both sort of tripped and fell toward Malarchuk,
and Tuttle's skate came perilously close to cutting (but actually just
missed) the jugular.  Malarchuk immediately fell to the ice, hands at
his neck, blood on the ice.
>
>Malarchuk became the fourth goalie (behind Hasek, Puppa and Draper) after
>suffering from Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder.  He's been playing in San Diego
>for former Sabre coach Rick Dudley.

He'd been suffering from it for over a decade.  He just wasn't
diagnosed for it until he didn't sleep for ten days and decided to
have some alcohol to help him sleep.  Unfortunately, he'd just been
put on ulcer medicine a few days earlier.  It's amazing he lasted as
long as he did.  OCD sufferers stop distinguishing the line between
reality and imagination, or fail to accept that something they've
checked is OK now.  For example, an OCD sufferrer can wash his hands
over and over and still think they're dirty.  He might check the oven
ten times to be sure it's turned off.  He might see a movie about
something and automatically assume the situation is the same for his
own life.  Malarchuk has dramatically decreased the medicine he takes,
but still needs it.  He went off it this past winter and had a bad OCD
episode and I think was in the hospital for a couple days.  (He felt
it slowed his reflexes, so he tried to go without).  In any event, he
is alive and well and living in San Diego, while playing with the
Gulls (IHL).  

>
>Krupp is now playing for the Islanders after the LaFontaine/Turgeon trade.

And Tuttle is no longer with the Blues, but I don't know where he is.
Possibly in the IHL, but you'd best ask a Blues fan.

-- 
Valerie Hammerl 	       John Sr. would lift Pat over the boards, grab 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu       his hand, and start running around the outside,
V085PWPZ@UBVMS.CC.BUFFALO.EDU  faster and faster.  "I wanted to learn how to 
get that feeling, and the only way was to learn how to skate."  P. LaFontaine

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54004
From: yadalle@cs.UAlberta.CA (Yadallee Dave S)
Subject: Oilers for sale??

Here's one from the mill.  The Oilers MIGHT move to Hamilton
where Porklington can get a free deal.

Given what Labour relations and Puck has been like, it WOULD be a sigh of relief.

This WAY w4e can can BOTH elements!!
--
Dave Shariff Yadallee (B. Sc.(Econ/Math) (U of Alberta 1990) )
( yadalle@amisk.cs.ualberta.ca) God Save the Queen, God Bless us All!Remember!
Jesus saves lives from eternal damnation!
Newfoundland, keep good old Clyde, VOTE LIBERAL!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54005
From: boudreau@athena.mit.edu (Carol V. Boudreau)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

In article <1993Apr23.102811.623@sei.cmu.edu>, caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz) writes:
|> 
|> While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash" that
|> Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had his
|> jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not positive.
|> Does anyone remember/know his name?  What has happened to him since?  What
|> about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?  Has this ever
|> happened before in a hockey game?   
|> 
|> Thanks,
|> 
|> Carol
|> Go Pens!

That would be Clint Malarchuck.  It was speculated at the time, that
the injury was so serious that had he been playing at the other end
of the rink at the time (he was playing in the same end as the
ambulence is parked), he never would have survived.  Ditto, if he
were playing anything other than a league with an ambulance on 
standby.

If you've seen video tape of the incident, it is amazing how much blood
there was.  It was literally spurting out all over the ice, as Clint
grabbed his neck and watched the puddle in horror.  

Amazingly enough, he made a full recovery, and played again in the
NHL.  He was getting on in years at the time of the incident anyway,
and didn't play for too long afterward.  Some people speculated that
he just couldn't get himself back together after the incident, and I
think he had a bunch of other personal problems dogging him afterward.
He did eventually get back to form, and played another year or so after
that, and then I believe he retired.

Anyone else?

-- 


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Carol Boudreau            #44                         a.k.a. The X-Terminator
boudreau@athena.mit.edu                           Go Flames!  Rock the Kings!
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54006
From: scialdone@nssdca.gsfc.nasa.gov (John Scialdone)
Subject: WAY-TO-GO-FERRARO!!!!

The Isles picked one hell-of-a-time to get their first win all year after being
down after 2 periods. The Caps seemed to have the game in hand playing steady
defense and getting great goaltending from Tabaracci. The Isles power play
philosophy continues to be dump-and-chase which, except for boardaholics like
Flatley, doesn't work against the Caps. I hope Al realizes this!! They have too
many talented finesse players, so why not carry the puck in and set-up??? If
last night's game is any omen, the Isles could be on their way to that ole
championship form; COMING from behind late in a game. My advice to the Caps is
to pounce on those Healy Rebounds. Flatley showed alot of heart by playing the
last period and overtime despite an almost swollen-shut left eye injury
suffered at the hands of Dale Hunter. Ray Ferraro has arrived just in time for
the playoffs showing the fiesty hustle that us Islander fans remember from an 
Italian from the past; JOHN TONELLI!!! It was Tonelli who won a similar game
against the PENS in game 5 on the 82 playoffs. The Isles scored two late third
period goals to send the game into OT tied at 3. In OT, Tonelli scored the game
winner to send the Isles to the next round. The Isles have lacked this tenacity
for years, but perhaps its BACK! It was good to see the Coliseum packed just
like the ole days!!! Good luck to the Isles the rest of the way!!!!!

John Scialdone
SCIALDONE@NSSDCA.GSFC.NASA.GOV

"""And the Home of the Brave"""  Jerry Garcia, Bob Weir, Vince Welnick
April 12, 1993: Opening Day, Candlestick Park



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54007
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: Wings will win


In article 735571987@vela.acs.oakland.edu, ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:

>gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:

Lots of debate about the virtues of Bryan Murray vs Pat Quinn as a GM
deleted.  Randy Graca seems to think Murray is the best GM in the league.
I think Quinn is one of several who are better.

>>Plus his team (Quinn's) has improved a much greater amount than Detroit since
>>he took over with them.
>
>How do you figure?  Both Vancouver and Detroit did the same thing last year:
>They both won their division, they had close to the same number of points,
>they both went down 3-1 in the first round of the playoffs before finally
>escaping in 7 games, and they both got knocked out in the second round by
>teams they should have been able to beat, with less talent.  (Specifically,
>if I remember correctly, third place teams).  How does this make Vancouver
>more improved?  Further, if I'm not mistaken, the Wings had more points than
>Vancouver at the end of this season (albeit not many). 

When Quinn took over Vancouver- several years ago, NOT LAST YEAR, they 
regularily missed the playoffs.  I can't recall if they missed the playoffs
the year before his hiring but they probably did.  Quinn has improved the
team from non-playoff calibre to a serious contender.

When Murray took over in Detroit, the were about a .500 team that was a
contender to win the Norris division and possibly even a Stanley Cup
contender.

So Quinn has improved his team more than Murray has since taking over as a GM.
Quinn is one example of a better GM than Murray.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54008
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: HABS WIN, HABS WIN!!!!!!!

In article <22APR93.25012157.0068@VM1.MCGILL.CA> JBE5 <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA> writes:
>Yahooooooooooooooooooooo!
>
>What a game, we finally beat those diques...and in O.T.!
>The Habs dominated this game and especially in O.T..

They _finally_ started going to the net!  See what happens when you 
create some traffic?  Muller deserves full marks (what a player!),
and Damphousse finally started skating.  Roy (thankyouthankyouthankyou)
was excellent.  Did you see that third period save on Young?  And the 
defense was taking out Quebec players in the zone.

Anybody else wonder if Hextall will feel like a dweeb when he finds 
out that the winning goal went in off his own D-man's skate?  Whatta
suck.  Although he _is_ playing really well.

>Life doesn't get better than this!!!!!!!!!

Sure it does.  On Sunday when the B's are golfing and the Habs are tied
2-2 you'll see what I mean! :-) :-)

>Nick

--
dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54009
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Bowman needs credit

In article <0fq1Vru00WBNA3L3pI@andrew.cmu.edu> "Matthew T. Keating" <mk55+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>During the first three games of the Pens-Devils series, I have been
>impressed time and time again by the pure talent of the Pens.  Jagr,
>MacEachern and Barrasso have been especially fun to watch.  But, one
>element of this team which goes unnoticed seems to be Scotty Bowman.
>

Bowman is in the Hockey Hall of Fame as a coach already...and unlike
Gil Stein...he didn't get their by stacking the Board of Directors! -)

>
>While no one can replace the genius and optimism of Badger Bob Johnson,
>Bowman, in his own way, has made himself a permanent, though not clearly
>seen, mark in  Pittsburgh. 

Bowman is the genius...Johnson isn't.  Bowman is a great coach...Johnson,
a very good one.  However, Bowman is really not a modern coach, and
Patrick's solution of having him only run the team on game days, and
delegate most of the day-to-day responsibity to the assistants is
a shrewd managerial decision on Patrick's part.  

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54010
From: dan@vicorp.com (Dan Gauthier)
Subject: Re: Where are all the Bruins fans???

In article <93113.010900RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu (Robbie Po) writes:
>I'm just wondering where all the Bruins fans are???  I mean they woofed it
>up with about 1,000,000 posts during the regular season saying that their
>fave team was going to kick everyone's @#$ in the playoffs and win the Stanley
Oh really?  I seem to remember this year's woofers consisting mainly of
yourself and Roger.  Boston fans were relatively quiet.

>Cup.  While I see nothing wrong with a little ranting and raving, I'm just
>curious why all the Boston faithful have stopped posting.  I mean I haven't
>even see just one little Boston fan post, 'cept for the Bruins fans that
>aren't cocky. ...

I guess the concept of a fan who is not cocky is something you couldn't
possible understand, eh?

>but I don't know, I'd sure like to see where all those Bruins fans are at :-)
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>** Robbie Po **          1993's STREAKERS   "We do what comes naturally!
>Patrick Division Semi's  -- PGH PENGUINS -- You see now, wait for the
>PENGUINS 4, Devils 3     1991, 1992 STANLEY possibility, don't you see a
>Penguins lead, 3-0       CUP CHAMPIONS :-)  strong resemblance..."-DG '89

Nah.  I doubt you really would.  You're just being a PROVOCATIVE SOB
as usual with a large stick up your but.  Of course, I mean that in the
nicest way.  :-)  

And just how much bragging did YOU do, "wobbie," on r.s.b.c after 
UMASS!!! beat your Quakers?

BTW.  Congratulations should go to the Sabres.  They are playing more
diciplined, and with more will to win.  They deserve it.

Dan,        dan@vicorp.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54011
From: horton@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Death before success)
Subject: Re: Leafs Crushed Again; Blues Win; Flames Back.

jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:

>In article <vzhivov.735454735@cunews> vzhivov@alfred.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov) writes:
>>
>>Joseph, shut-out the Hawks 2-0. The Blues are playing like they did in
>>'86 - clutch 'n grab, shoot the puck out. It's incredibly boring to
>>watch, but if it works...
>>

>road. I agree, it's very boring if you're not a Blues fan, but the Blues
>played two perfect road games.


Not boring is right!!! It is more likely to cause me to have a stroke!!
I had to listen to game two on the Blackhawk station and I don't think I
could take another call of "And JOSEPH makes a SPEcTACular saaaaaave".
Now I'm a Blues fan, but I don't want them to play "like" they played
in game two. Sure the result was fine, but the Blues match up very well
with the Hawks so they really don't need to treat them like the 86 Flames.
We don't need a "Monday Night Miracle" to have a chance to beat Chicago.
The Blues can do it on talent. At least over the hawks.

Rich h.--- Go BLUES!!

>  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
>  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
>  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
>  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
>  %     \    ________/                                                   *
>  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
>  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
>  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
>  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
>  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54012
From: mac18@po.CWRU.Edu (Michael A. Cornell)
Subject: Re: ESPN2 - Tell us about it


In a previous article, huot@cray.com (Tom Huot) says:

>Geoff Filinuk (filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu) wrote:
>
>: 	This comes indirectly from Al Morgani who works in the studio
>: for ESPN hockey.
>[Some text deleted]
>: 	ESPN is under contractual obligation to show baseball and COULD NOT
>: broadcast the OT of the hockey game.  Next year, ESPN2 will be introduced so 
>: baseball fans can watch baseball and hockey fans can watch hockey.
>
>I hadn't heard about this new ESPN2. When is this new network
>supposed to start? Sounds great to me! (as long as my cable co.
>offers it)

The USA Today says "late this year".  The question is, will hockey be moved to
ESPN2 permenantly, or will it be where they have a game of the week on
ESPN, and have a bunch of other games on ESPN2?


-- 
Mike Cornell     | "There are a great many people in the country today who,
mac18@po.cwru.edu|  through no fault of their own, are sane." -Monty Python
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Let's Go Flyers!  Stanley Cup in '94!  "OH! My brain hurts!"- Mr D. P. Gumby

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54013
From: gomer+@pitt.edu (Richard J Coyle)
Subject: Re: Pens fans reactions

In article <1993Apr22.102420.2694@sei.cmu.edu> sad@sei.cmu.edu (Susan Dart) writes:
>Amongst Penguins' fans there seems to be an inner calm that I've never
>experienced before this year with the Pens. The players and the fans have so
>much confidence in the team this year. We're savoring every game and saving
>our energy for the Stanley Cup.

That's not inner calm.  It's boredom, and it's being spoiled.  The Arena's
been as quiet as a church on many nights this year; too many of us just
take winning for granted.  It's been seemingly forever since the team
lost, and we've forgotten what it's like to feel real excitement and
surprise at victory.

While I'm glad to have the Pens doing so well, in some ways it was a better
high back when the Pens beat the Bruins two years ago, and the Rangers last
year. Too much of a good thing is not always good for you.

rick


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54014
From: gomer+@pitt.edu (Richard J Coyle)
Subject: Re: Lemieux's Getting the Hart... Jeez I hope not!

In article <22APR93.02956996.0062@UNBVM1.CSD.UNB.CA> F1HH@UNB.CA (Patrick Walker) writes:

(much mindless drivel deleted)

>Sorry to ramble.  As you can see I hate Mario.
>Pat Walker
>UNB

Question to you Canadian folk:  is this University of New Brunswick a
branch campus of the Western Business School?  Seems like the same sort
of rectal appendage belongs to both of them.

rick



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54015
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Oilers for sale??

In article <yadalle.735582909@cab117> yadalle@cs.UAlberta.CA (Yadallee Dave S) writes:
>Here's one from the mill.  The Oilers MIGHT move to Hamilton
>where Porklington can get a free deal.
>

The probability is that the Oilers are not going anywhere.

Pocklington has chosen this moment to make his "last" stand is
because he is at the moment of maximum advantage...the provincial
government is months away from a provincial election...it is
the moment when he has maximum power to convince Northlands
to give him a better arena deal or a better purchase price...
and it is before the NHL's new collective agreement with
the players which might involve some enhanced revenue-sharing.

Pocklington is many things...stupid is not one of them.

He can dictate terms...because other cities will pay his
price if Edmonton doesn't.

Edmonton has already fucked up its international airport, and
surrendered supremacy to Calgary, and over the next few years
Edmonton is going to take a hard hit from government cutbacks.
It will screw itself beyond recogniton if it manages to find
a way to lose its hockey team too...because Northlands wants
to continue to use the Oilers to subsidize horse racing.

However, in this case, about the long-term financial
viability of the Oilers, the fact is that Pocklington is basically 
right, regardless of who owns the team, and it is right to provoke
the crisis now, before the team accumulates millions of dollars
in losses, or becomes habitually uncompetitive because of lack
of money.

Sather has done his job...the Oilers are poised to be competitive
again very soon (Al Strachan, one of the most knowledgeble hockey
writers in Canada in a post-mortem of the Oilers season in
the Globe and Mail recently agrees with me.)

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54016
From: colling@ann-arbor.applicon.slb.com (Michael Collingridge)
Subject: Re: NHL ALLTIME SCORING LEADERS

>All time NHL leading goal scorers (* denotes active player):
>
>  1.  Gordie Howe          Det-Hfd                            801
>  2. *Wayne Gretzky        Edm-LA                             765
>  .
>  .
>  .
I wonder how many more years it will take Gretz to beat this one? ;-)

- Mike

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54017
From: sad@sei.cmu.edu (Susan Dart)
Subject: Re: ESPN


If ESPN pisses you off, call them - they do respond to calls. Last night I
called when they said they were cutting to baseball and we couldn't see the
sudden-death overtime for the BUffalo game. Apparently they received enough
calls so they waited for the overtime to finish before cutting away.

Their phone number is 203-585-2000

Susan Dart

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54018
Subject: Re: Wings News and Playoff Thoughts
From: kwolfer@eagle.wesleyan.edu

In article <1r8u6v$prv@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu>, twork@egr.msu.edu (Michael Twork) writes:
>>roots in Detroit.  He would be a valuable asset to the Wings and Perhaps the
>>Rangers could get a Zombo in return?
> 
>   
>  
> Wake up and smell the Norris!!  Rick Zombo was traded to the Blues for Vince
> Riendo (sp?) last season.  
> 
> - Mike
> 
Sorry Mike! What defensemen would the Wings be willing to give up for Beezer?
 
> 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54019
From: msanfrat@cs.ucsd.edu (Mike Sanfratello)
Subject: Re: Sabres-Bruins

In article <lte5tcINN7vr@appserv.Eng.Sun.COM> mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler) writes:
> [ ... ]
>
>I'm not a Buffalo fan, but I could get on their bandwagon if they
>win #3.
>-- 

Welcome aboard!  And, since I haven't seen this yet this year (but all
preceding years), let me say:

T H I S  C O U L D  'B'  T H E  Y E A R !                 (NOT!)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54020
From: gwittt@alleg.edu (Tom Gwitt)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

In article <1993Apr23.102811.623@sei.cmu.edu> caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol  
Jarosz) writes:
> 
> While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash"  
that
> Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had  
his
> jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not  
positive.
> Does anyone remember/know his name?

	Clint Malarchuk


  What has happened to him since?

	Assigned to San Diego Gulls at the being of the season I believe

  What
> about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?

It was Uwe Krupp and a Blues player, though Uwe's skate I beleive cut  
Clint.  He has since be traded to the Isles in the LaFontaine deal.

  Has this ever
> happened before in a hockey game? 

This is the only time I know of.  
> 

--
Tom Gwitt     gwittt@alleg.edu		GO SABRES!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54021
From: ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca)
Subject: Re: Wings will win

gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:


>In article 735571987@vela.acs.oakland.edu, ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:

>>gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:

[stuff deleted]

>When Quinn took over Vancouver- several years ago, NOT LAST YEAR, they 
>regularily missed the playoffs.  I can't recall if they missed the playoffs
>the year before his hiring but they probably did.  Quinn has improved the
>team from non-playoff calibre to a serious contender.

>When Murray took over in Detroit, the were about a .500 team that was a
>contender to win the Norris division and possibly even a Stanley Cup
>contender.

The last year before Bryan Murray took over, the Wings did not make the
playoffs.  While they had been considered a possible contender when Jacques
Demers first arrived, in his last two years they were, respectively,
embarrassed in the first round by Chicago, and then failed to make the 
playoffs (at a time, a might add, when there were only five teams in the
Norris).

It's true that Vancouver did not make the playoffs for many a year before 
Quinn came, but in those years the Smythe Division was a lot--I mean *a lot*--
tougher division than the Norris, also known as the "Snorris", division.
Vancouver had to play Edmonton and Calgary, both very legitimate Stanley
Cup contenders, eight times a year, while Detroit got to play such 
powerhouses as Toronto and Minnesota.  Now, Edmonton is hardly even a force
in the league, and the Smythe even has the mighty San Jose sharks, while
over this same period of time in which Vancouver was improving, so was 
everybody in the Norris (except St. Louis).  Detroit had to improve just
to keep up with the competition in their division.  They had to improve *a
lot* to get better than their competition in the Norris.

Bryan Murray inherited a team with very little talent.  For really good
players, they had Yzerman, Burr, and Probert, and that was about it.  (And
no doubt some will dispute whether Burr and Probert were that good). The
rest were either very green rookies or washed up veterans.  The only reason
they got as far as they did in the years before Murray came was due to the
coaching of Demers, who, at least at first, got every last ounce of effort
possible out of his team.  Then, even his coaching began to degrade.

>So Quinn has improved his team more than Murray has since taking over as a GM.
>Quinn is one example of a better GM than Murray.

There are a number of reasons why Detroit wasn't in as bad a shape standings
wise when Murray took over as Vanc. was when Quinn took over, some of which
I outlined above, but Murray did not have any better personnel to work with
at the outset than did Quinn, with the exception of Yzerman.  And one player
cannot alone make a team into a Stanley Cup contender, as I'm sure everyone
reading this will agree.  

We'll be able to see better which team is really the most improved when they
face each other in the conference final (assuming they don't get knocked out,
like last year).

>Gregmeister

--Randy


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54022
From: slutsky@tesla.njit.edu
Subject: Sports broadcasting on FM

I am curious to known if there are any professional sports teams whose
games are regularly broadcast on an FM station.  The only one I am
aware of is WYSP in Philadelphia who carries the Eagles' games.

If you respond to me I will summarize for the list.

Bruce Slutsky
slutsky@tesla.njit.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54023
From: sjg3@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (STEVEN JAY GIBBLE)
Subject: TV Coverage - NHL to blame!


    The tv coverage of the playoffs is fucking ridicules.  Overtime time games
    that are not shown?  What the hell kind of shit is this?  If that would
    have happened to the Flyers(if they were in the damn playoffs to begin
    with) while I was watching, I would have gone throught the roof!

    However, everybody is getting pissed off at ESPN, but they are not the
    ones to blame.  They have prior contracts that they just can't simply break
    whenever they want to.  The N.H.L. is to blame.  When they signed the
    deal with ESPN, they had to know of this.  They had to know shit like this
    would happen since they wouldn't have complete priority.  The N.H.L.
    should be feeling the heat that is being thrown at ESPN.  How can the
    N.H.L. do this to its fans? How dare they.  We are the ones that make the
    damn league exist and they can't even televise complete playoff games for us to
    watch!  They more I write about this, the more pissed off I get.  We must
    let the N.H.L. know that  we expect a little better than this.  If anybody
    out there knows how to go about doing this, let me and everybody else know.

    Well I had to get that off my chest and while I'm at it....

    Mario is the Michael Jordan of hockey.  All that fucker has to do is fall
    on the ice and the closet guy to him gets at least 2.  Last night in the
    3rd game between NJ and Pitt, he was being pushed while skating across the
    front of the goal while trying to get a shot off.  The guy on him was
    doing a good job, so he got off a weak shot, but then he decided to fall
    to the ice. Then the fucking ref(Van Helloamend?) called the guy for
    holding.  They replayed the play, and my roomate(who is clueless about
    hockey) wanted to know what the NJ guy did to get a call, because it was so fucking obvious the NJ player
    had both hands on his stick, and no, he did not trip him.  It is simple,
    Mario gets touched, he falls to the ice, automatic 2.  But the thing that
    really pissed me off is, Pitt scored the 3rd or 4th goal, I don't remember,
    on the resulting PP and
    eventually won 4-3.  His diving/calls makes a HUGE difference in the
    outcome of a game.

    They gotta stop the damn holding and interference that is so fucking
    obvious. That is not hockey.  It allows inferior players to bring down the
level of the better players, and allows inferior teams to beat better ones.
This has pissed me off for many years now, and it has improved somewhat.
However, during the playoffs and 3rd periods, the damn refs must misplace
their balls, because they sure don't make any calls that show that they got
any.

    All agreeing or disagreeing replies are welcomed.

    Steve

    

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54024
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: div. and conf. names

In article <1993Apr20.152107.19114@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:

>There are several problems with the way the game is being presented to the
>fans.  I feel that geographical names would enhance regional loyalties
>more than names honouring personages.

I think a compromise would work; namely honouring personages in 
Conference names, and using geographical references in the divisional 
names.  Although I still do not think the move will draw fans to the
game; IMO it's a cosmetic change that Bettman and the owners _hope_ 
will have an effect.  And it doesn't say much for the mentality of 
anybody it works on, either.  

>Another thing that bothers me is the points system.  Percentages, as used in
>the other major sports are clearly more informative.  When I look at the
>NHL standings the first thing I have to do is make a quick calculation to
>account for games in hand (which is almost always the case).  Some will
>object to percentages, claiming perhaps, that it is an "Americanization"
>of the sport

Surprise, I agree totally.  The points system is fine, if everybody at all
times has played the same number of games.  Since this is almost never the
case, winning percentage is the way to go.  I don't particularly care if it 
is an "American" thing either, if it works.  


--
dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54025
From: mosscropm@woods.ulowell.edu
Subject: Bleep! Bruins lose 4-3 in O.T.

Bleep! Bleep! Bleep!  The Bruins lost AGAIN in O.T.  I can't stand it!

Aside from frustrated ravings, I must give Buffalo credit: they are making good 
on most of their scoring opportunities, and are playing great defense.  Boston
players can't seem to get control of the puck anywhere near the Buffalo net
except for on rare occasions.  The Buffalo defense is also doing an excellent
job clearing away rebounds.  Fuhr is playing great when the big save is needed
but he's also getting plenty of help.
Boston has been playing rather well (better than would be indicated by the 
series score of 3-0) but is lacking that extra drive in the earlier part of the 
game.  As a result, Boston keeps leaving the ice at the end of the 1st period
2 goals down.  This MUST stop if Boston is to have any hope of winning a single
game (the outlook for the Bruin's advancement to the second round are quite
bleak).  IMHO, the Bruins NEED to score first.  If they can do that, they have
an excellent chance of winning, since they have outplayed the Sabres in the 
2nd and 3rd periods.

(The scary thing is that I'll be going to grad school in Buffalo next year.
   I'll never cheer for the Sabres... You can't convert me... ^:)


MTM3

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mike Mosscrop  --  Die hard Bruins fan
Dept. of Chemistry
UMass-Lowell
mosscropm@woods.ulowell.edu


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54026
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: Oilers for sale??

In article <yadalle.735582909@cab117> yadalle@cs.UAlberta.CA (Yadallee Dave S) writes:
>Here's one from the mill.  The Oilers MIGHT move to Hamilton
>where Porklington can get a free deal.
>
>Given what Labour relations and Puck has been like, it WOULD be a sigh of relief.
>



I heard yesterday that Pocklington was talking with folks at Copps
that afternoon (yesterday).  


-- 
Valerie Hammerl 	       John Sr. would lift Pat over the boards, grab 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu       his hand, and start running around the outside,
V085PWPZ@UBVMS.CC.BUFFALO.EDU  faster and faster.  "I wanted to learn how to 
get that feeling, and the only way was to learn how to skate."  P. LaFontaine

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54027
From: archer@elysium.esd.sgi.com (Archer (Bad Cop) Surly)
Subject: Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!

In <1993Apr22.212219.23130@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com> spiegel@sgi501.msd.lmsc.lockheed.com (Mark Spiegel) writes:

*In article <1993Apr21.234022.2880@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
*>
*>McGill/Hammond -> Johan Garpenlov.  Would you really rather have those two
*>instead of Johan?
*
*	By your logic then you enjoy having Falloon and Ozolinsh on 
*	injured reserve?
*

Falloon was hurt on a clean check.  He just fell poorly.  Same with Wilson.
I don't know about Ozolinsh.  A judo coach would do more for the Sharks 
injury situation than Bob Probert.

Actually, a judo/ju-jitsu coach could help add a really interesting 
wrinkle to anyone's game....

-- archer


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54028
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

In article <1r8tgh$lfi@hsdndev.harvard.edu>, nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark
Shneyder 432-4219) says:
>The Fat Lady is about to hit the first note...Okay,how about 3-0 deficits?
>The B's chances for a comeback are now less 1%(That's based on 7-game
>playoff format)...

Actually, that's based on the NHL's history of 7 games.  The statstical
odds of winning one straight game -- 50/50.  Two straight games -- 25%.  Three
straight games -- 12.5%, 4 straight games = 6.25%.  The odds of the Penguins
winning 14 straight games in the playoffs was 0.0061%.  Of course, this doesn't
include weighted average, but the Pens beating the Devils 3 straight (a weaker
team) along with beating the Rangers 3 straight (a much stronger team) has made
the act balanced out.  That's about right.  For Boston the odds of winning are
probably closer to 10% (with weighted average) since Buffalo's record isn't as
good and Boston has a stronger team.  Enough about my QBA probabilities though!
It's just goes to prove ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE, if you integrate that to Debbie
Gibson :-)

>>   Who do you think gets the start in game three? I hope it is going
>>to be Blue. If the team can rally around him, maybe Moog can too.

Moog gets about ***'s out of 5 for his performance from me.  I give Blue 4
starts.  Fuhr has been too tough.  Buffalo caught a hot goaltender just in
time...I mean, after all, Buffalo is 3 wins, 7 losses in their last 10.

>Harry Sinden's appearance outside of B's dressing room after Game 3
>was a pathetic site. He said something really retarded to cover Sutter's
>behind,"This game is not about winning or losing..". Harry,check the

It's very frustrating to lose, and you've gotta say something.  Actually
it's not about winning or losing, it is how you play the game.  But when the
competition is magnified to this level, 99.9% of the people only care about
who wins or loses :-)

>schedule! Your team is in the playoffs and about to go on a long summer
>vacation on Sunday morning!

I think Buffalo will win in 6 -- it's not like Boston is getting blown away.
They lost 2 OT games -- with a different bounce, they could easily be up 2-1.

>Harry and his buttkisser Milbury will never admit that they screwed up
>in a major way when they brought in one of the dumbest people in the
>business,Brian Sutter. Sutter's playoff record as the head coach in St.Louis
>speaks for itself. The Blues really have a chance to advance to the
>second round this year...

Good point here.  Chicago's in deep trouble tonight.  The 'Hawks have a bad
past history of winning the division and losing early.  When they don't finish
1st, they do okay.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          1993's STREAKERS   "We do what comes naturally!
Patrick Division Semi's  -- PGH PENGUINS -- You see now, wait for the
PENGUINS 4, Devils 3     1991, 1992 STANLEY possibility, don't you see a
Penguins lead, 3-0       CUP CHAMPIONS :-)  strong resemblance..."-DG '89

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54029
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: Where are all the Bruins fans???

In article <1993Apr23.171510.20581@vicorp.com>, dan@vicorp.com (Dan Gauthier)
says:
>>even see just one little Boston fan post, 'cept for the Bruins fans that
>>aren't cocky. ...

>I guess the concept of a fan who is not cocky is something you couldn't
>possible understand, eh?

My sig has nothing to do with cockiness.  What you put in your sig has nothing
to do with your article, as I learned back in the fall, the hard way.

>Nah.  I doubt you really would.  You're just being a PROVOCATIVE SOB
>as usual with a large stick up your but.  Of course, I mean that in the

You mean 'butt' don't you?  Not but :-)

>nicest way.  :-)

Sure you do -- what??????????

>And just how much bragging did YOU do, "wobbie," on r.s.b.c after
>UMASS!!! beat your Quakers?

Two points, one what does r.s.b.c. have to do with hockey?  Secondly, UMASS
beat my Quakers???  Hello!!!  Earth here, are you responding???  We're not in
the Atlantic 10 (or 8 whatever you wanna call it), we're in the Big 10 now!!!
The A-10 was too weak for my Lady Lions -- they had to go to a more challenging
conference.  It didn't pay off as the Big East showed them a thing or too, but
I still posted on a regular basis and tracked all the women's scores with
reviews throughout the tournament.  It wasn't a reason to stop posting. :-)

>BTW.  Congratulations should go to the Sabres.  They are playing more

It's not over yet -- if anyone has a chance to come back in 4 games, I think
Boston can do it, but I still see Buffalo winning in 6.

>diciplined, and with more will to win.  They deserve it.

Agreed -- they're playing tremendous hockey right now.  Congatualtions on three
straight Buffalo.  It could very easily be 2-1 Boston, but Buffalo has come up
tough and a little luck.  (You never see a penalty in OT that doesn't have both
sides involved in a playoff game.  Never never never!)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          1993's STREAKERS   "We do what comes naturally!
Patrick Division Semi's  -- PGH PENGUINS -- You see now, wait for the
PENGUINS 4, Devils 3     1991, 1992 STANLEY possibility, don't you see a
Penguins lead, 3-0       CUP CHAMPIONS :-)  strong resemblance..."-DG '89

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54030
From: cobra@chopin.udel.edu (KING COBRA)
Subject: Re: ESPN

In article <1993Apr23.134038.17094@sei.cmu.edu> sad@sei.cmu.edu (Susan Dart) writes:
>
>If ESPN pisses you off, call them - they do respond to calls. Last night I
>called when they said they were cutting to baseball and we couldn't see the
>sudden-death overtime for the BUffalo game. Apparently they received enough
>calls so they waited for the overtime to finish before cutting away.
>
>Their phone number is 203-585-2000
>
>Susan Dart


  Well I think whenever ESPN covers the game they do a wonderful job. But
   what I don't understand is that they cut the OT just show some stupid
   baseball news which is not important at all. Then I waited for the scores
   to comeon Sportscenter, but they talk about Baseball, basketball and 
   football. Then they showed Penguine highlight and went back to stupid
   basketball. Finally they showed a highlight of the OT goal but that
   was like 30 sec. I think they should give more attention to NHl during
   the playoffs then talking about boring basketball games..

   I guess it is NHL's fault too for leaving ESPN. Hope things improve
   by next season...

   COBRA


-- 


*******************************************************************************
**   ___  ____  ____  ____  ____  **                                         **

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54031
From: mckee@cs.Buffalo.EDU (Douglas McKee)
Subject: Ghost from Sweeney's past


Wow, this guy seems to be out to prove something to his old team, Boston.
Which Sweeney you ask...well, of course Bob Sweeney, the one that Boston
let Buffalo get a hold of (they still have 2 Sweeneys which makes things
slightly confusing).  Game winner in OT in game 1, and another
BIG goal (seconds after Fuhr made 3 point blank saves -> this is why
Grant has 5 rings!!!) to put Buffalo ahead in the 3rd.  Yes, Neely countered
a minute later, but hadn't this course of Buffalo going ahead after being
tied and shutting down another few great scoring opportunities, I
think Boston would have notched their first win of the series.

Well, the Sabres haven't made it to the end of this series yet, but
I certainly feel they've got Boston right were they want them...actually,
they've got them in a position that neither Buffalo nor Boston felt
that would come about.  One more astronomical game by Fuhr, a few more
heroics by the rest of the team (this is a team sport afterall) and I
think Borque, Neely, Jouneau (sp?), and Company are gonna be swinging
a new stick (Weather is perfect for golf season) real soon.  I'm not
gonna waiger anything on this, because I've seen some really strange
things happen in both pro and college hockey.

Talking about golf...was that a hockey swing, golf swing or baseball
swing that Hawerchuck used in the last shot of the game that Khmylev
deflected in for the BIG ONE?  The whole OT (all 1 minute of it!) was a
tesiment to Buffalo's ability to really be persistent and grind it out
in the end (something they weren't necessarily in the regular season).  The
Sabres pushed hard and forced Borque to blatently take down Bodger in
the opening seconds.  I don't normally like penalties being called in
such ultra-critical points, but this was BLATENT.  Finally, the Sabres
won a faceoff (they weren't that hot in this dept the rest of the game)
when LaFontaine scooped at the puck 3 times.  When Hawerchuck took his
shot (quite a boomer, but Blue stopped this one) he took a few steps
over to get his own rebound and slapped at it again, without setting
it up.  I didn't realize it went in until the announcer started screaming,
"They score, THEY SCORE!!!".  The best was seeing LaFontaine jumping
up and down, skating a little bit, jumping some more, and then skating
over to Brad May who he jumped on.

Doug McKee
mckee@cs.buffalo.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54032
From: gjp@sei.cmu.edu (George Pandelios)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry-New Pens Annoucer?


In article <C5wIuy.D88.1@cs.cmu.edu>, lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico) writes:
|> Don Cherry announcing Penguins games.  Yeah, and (to quote Pgh's
|> goofy mayor) I'm the Queen of Sheba.

Well, Your Majesty, ;^), couldn't you just picture it?  Cherry starts doing
his first post-game interview with Barrasso;  Tommy gives him that little look
(like somebody crapped on his shoe) and then proceeds to give Don a
tonsilectomy with his Sher-Wood.  Now that you could put on pay-per-view!

Hope you had a good laugh!

George
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
  George J. Pandelios				Internet:  gjp@sei.cmu.edu
  Software Engineering Institute		usenet:	   sei!gjp
  4500 Fifth Avenue				Voice:	   (412) 268-7186
  Pittsburgh, PA 15213				FAX:	   (412) 268-5758
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Disclaimer:  These opinions are my own and do not reflect those of the
	     Software Engineering Institute, its sponsors, customers, 
	     clients, affiliates, or Carnegie Mellon University.  In fact,
	     any resemblence of these opinions to any individual, living
	     or dead, fictional or real, is purely coincidental.  So there.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54033
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Goalie masks

In article <C5sqz3.EG8@acsu.buffalo.edu> hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl) writes:

>>[...] and I'll give Fuhr's new one an honourable mention, although I haven't
>>seen it closely yet (it looked good from a distance!).  

>This is the new Buffalo one, the second since he's been with the
>Sabres?  I recall a price tag of over $700 just for the paint job on
>that mask, and a total price of almost $1500.  Ouch.  

Yeah, it's the second one.  And I believe that price too.  I've been trying
to get a good look at it on the Bruin-Sabre telecasts, and wow! does it ever
look good.  Whoever did that paint job knew what they were doing.  And given
Fuhr's play since he got it, I bet the Bruins are wishing he didn't have it:)

--

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54034
From: wscott@physics.ubc.ca (Bill Scott)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz) writes:


>While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash" that
>Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had his
>jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not positive.
>Does anyone remember/know his name?  What has happened to him since?  What
>about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?  Has this ever
>happened before in a hockey game?   

>Thanks,

>Carol
>Go Pens!
    
    I remember reading an article in Reader's digest many moons ago
 about a similar incident. During a minor leaque game a player neck was
 cut when the opponent he was back-checking tripped and his skakes
 flew up. In this case the victim's mask proved a hinderance since
 his face was protected and so he didn't bother with the
 usually instinctive reaction to protect his face/neck. A quick        
 thinking coach saved his life by applying direct pressure and using
 snow to contract the blood vessels (from what I can remember).
     
     Bill Scott (wscott@physics.ubc.ca)
     Go Jets Go.....down but not out.  


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54035
From: John Michael Santore <jsbh+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Hockey guest spots...

>Hi guys....
>        I'm looking to answe a bit of trivia.  What hockeplayers have
>appeared on major talk shows on TV (i.e., Letterman, Carson/Leno,
>Arsenio, etc.....i.e. shows of a national nature--include Canadian equivalents
>if you can think of any)?  This can include NHL, Olympic, and World Champion-
>ship players.  I'm pretty sure I've seen Gretzky and Lemieux, but I was
>wondering if there were any others...

I saw Messier and Leetch shooting at a camera on Letterman(?).  I
could have been any show though, since I watch NONE of those late
night shows very regularly.
					-John Santore

Philadelphia Flyers in '93-'94! 

=============================================================================
 ____________________                                
/                    \                   "We break the surface tension 
\_________     ____   \                   with our wild kinetic dreams"
/             /    \   \                        -Rush, Grand Designs
\_______     /  (*) )   )
/           / /\___/   /                 Go Philadelphia Flyers!
\_____     / /        /
/         /  \_______/                   John Santore (jsbh@andrew.cmu.edu)
\________/   
          
Rush-Yes-King Crimson-Emerson, Lake and Palmer-Marillion-Genesis (w/ Gabriel)
=============================================================================

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54036
From: franjion@spot.Colorado.EDU (John Franjione)
Subject: Re: Where's Roger?

duncan@ (Nicholas Duncan) writes:

>I really feel the need for a knowledgable hockey observer to explain
>this year's playoffs to me. I mean, the obviously superior Toronto team
>with the best center and the best goalie in the league keeps losing.
>What gives?

Unfortunately, Roger is now over at r.s.baseball spewing his expertise
(i.e. being a dickhead).  I guess he is afraid of posting anything
here, because he knows what to expect.
-- 
John Franjione
Department of Chemical Engineering
University of Colorado, Boulder
franjion@spot.colorado.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54037
From: htilney@vax.clarku.edu
Subject: RE: Don Cherry - Color Man for Pens Next year?

Isn't he the guy who took shots at Jagr and Ulf in a recent Sports
Illustrated? I'm not familiar with Cherry's work, and maybe he's known
for sarcasm, but I'd have to wonder about him doing commentary for the Pens.

Bart

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54038
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

In article <C5y3xD.Dox@acsu.buffalo.edu> hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl) writes:
>
>And Tuttle is no longer with the Blues, but I don't know where he is.
>Possibly in the IHL, but you'd best ask a Blues fan.
>
  Steve Tuttle was traded from the Blues to TB in the before the start of this
season along with Pat Jablonski, for future considerations. He played for
Milwaukee of the IHL, then got traded from TB to QUE along with Michel Mongeau.
He's currently playing with Halifax of the AHL.

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54039
From: clare@ssd.kodak.com (Bill Clare 726-9419)
Subject: Ulf crushes Valeri Zelepukin

That more or less says it.  I flicked the Penguins game on briefly and saw
Ulf cross-check Valeri in the face.  I am wondering if Don Cherry is going to
go off on this at all in coach's corner.

billc
-- 
Bill Clare, Eastman Kodak Company	Internet: clare@bissun.kodak.com
m/c 35416 --  901 Elmgrove Road		Phone:    (716) 726-9419
Rochester, New York 14653-5416
Any opinions expressed herein belong to me and not to my employer.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54040
From: pkester@hooville.mitre.org (Peter Kester)
Subject: Re: ESPN's (lack of) coverage

In article <1993Apr20.174439.7627@philabs.philips.com> jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio) writes:
>The worst thing is that this is exactly what I did last year.  I had the Rangers
>on MSG, and the two different games on SCNY and SCA on at the same time.  Yes,
>I'd rather have SC cover it, just for the amount of coverage.
>
So this year you had a game on SCNY, a game on SCA, a game on ESPN,
and if the Rangers hadn't crashed and burned, you would have had a
game on MSG.  What are you complaining about?

I seem to recall last year everyone complaining about SC coverage.  I
even remember Orioles' games being shown in the DC area instead of
hockey.  And what about when SC failed to show the conclusion of other
games because its feature game was over?  Sound familiar?

This year I'm getting twice the coverage.  I can see all the Caps
games *plus* the games ESPN shows.  I think it's great that hockey is
back on ESPN.  IMHO, they're doing a great job especially considering
the baseball contract they have to work around.

--

Peter Kester
pkester@mitre.org

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54041
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: POTVIN and HIS STICK

In article <2346575PS380.9.0@sscl.uwo.ca> 2346575PS380@sscl.uwo.ca writes:
>In article <1r68fs$fhc@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> hallg@yangtze.egr.msu.edu (The Terminator) writes:
>>From: hallg@yangtze.egr.msu.edu (The Terminator)
>>Felix Potvin deserves to have the sh&$ kicked out of him.  If there is anyone
>>that he should be hitting with his stick, its his pussy defensemen who can't
>>seem to move big Dino Ciccerelli (5'10" 180 lbs) out from in front of the net.
>>
>>Obviously Toronto has realized that they are overmatched by the Wings and must
>>rely on trying to antagonize the superior Red Wings with cheap shots.  I prefer
>>to watch hockey than seeing shots of Felix Potvin slashing and spearing Dino
>>Ciccerelli standing in front of the net.  HE HAS EVERY RIGHT TO STAND IN
>>FRONT OF THE NET, JUST NOT IN THE CREASE!

Yes, he does.  BUT, the goalie sure as hell doesn't want him there!  When
I played roller hockey (boy do I miss those days) as a goalie, I would
scream at my defense to clear guys out of the slot.  I don't care if he's
in the crease or not, get him the hell away from me so I can see the ball!
(Yes, roller hockey, remember)  And if there was nobody around to clear
the slot, then I'd do it myself by pushing the offending player--*hard*. 
I *hate* people in my way when I'm the goalie, and I am sure Felix does
too.  I should say that I didn't see the incident, so if Potvin really
swung the stick big time, then that's not right, but he can move people
out of the way.  He's a player on the ice too, you know.  :-)

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!
     In this corner				LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
     Weighing in at almost every weight imaginable . . . 
     Life, and all that surrounds it.		     -- Blues Traveler, 1993

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54042
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Where's the knowledgeable observer?

In <franjion.735590256@spot.Colorado.EDU> franjion@spot.Colorado.EDU (John Franjione) writes:

>duncan@ (Nicholas Duncan) writes:

>>I really feel the need for a knowledgable hockey observer to explain
>>this year's playoffs to me. I mean, the obviously superior Toronto team
>>with the best center and the best goalie in the league keeps losing.
>>What gives?

>Unfortunately, Roger is now over at r.s.baseball spewing his expertise
>(i.e. being a dickhead).  I guess he is afraid of posting anything
>here, because he knows what to expect.

It is indeed nice to have fans that are concerned about the dearth of
disputatious dissertation linked to my hiatus.  Have simply been too
damned busy lately to keep you lads and lassies entertained.  You can
be sure, however, that I will somehow manage to find time to woof if 
the Leafs give just cause. 

And let's all try to keep people's names (especially mine) out of the
subject headers.  I, for one, neither seek nor enjoy such a cheap form
of notoriety.

One thing you can be assured of, however, is this: the Leafs are the
best of all the teams in the league that have allowed 12 goals in 2 
games.


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54043
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: Pens fans reactions

Richard J Coyle (gomer+@pitt.edu) wrote:

: That's not inner calm.  It's boredom, and it's being spoiled.  The Arena's
: been as quiet as a church on many nights this year; too many of us just
: take winning for granted.  It's been seemingly forever since the team
: lost, and we've forgotten what it's like to feel real excitement and
: surprise at victory.

At least last night there was some excitement. The Pens 
didn't have it wrapped up before the game was half over like 
the previous two games. I'm not sure if NJ just rose up and 
played better or if the Penguins just started to play down 
somewhat. Probably it was somewhere in between. New Jersey 
seemed much more aggressive last night in the Pens end. They 
did much more swarming around, which at least kept an 
element of suspense in the game. No question that Billington 
helped make it more interesting also. Claude Lemieux didn't 
help the cause any though, with his ejection early in the 
game. So, who's going to start in the Devils goal for the 
"final" game Sunday? ;-) Sorry. I couldn't help myself.

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54044
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: Bowman needs credit

Gerald Olchowy (golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca) wrote:

: Bowman is the genius...Johnson isn't.  Bowman is a great coach...Johnson,
: a very good one.  However, Bowman is really not a modern coach, and
: Patrick's solution of having him only run the team on game days, and
: delegate most of the day-to-day responsibity to the assistants is
: a shrewd managerial decision on Patrick's part.  

IMHO Bowman is the perfect coach for this group of players at 
this time. Johnson was the perfect coach two years ago for his 
group of players. I would say we have been very lucky here in 
Pittsburgh that the order these coaches came in was this one. 
(Excluding the unfortunate circumstances which brought about the 
change.) With the immense talent on the Penguins roster this 
year, a tougher Bowman keeps the egos in check. Johnson on the 
other hand, was able to inspire the younger, inexperienced players 
to new heights. Both coaches have / had different strengths. Both 
of which came at exactly the right time. 

Another person also mentioned that Bowman is the perfect coach 
for this time since nobody can argue with his decisions. How can 
you argue with the coach with the best record in hockey anyway? 
Playing for a great coach like that demands respect which also 
keeps the egos in check. 

Just a couple of ideas.

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54045
From: aubin@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Jean Paul Aubin)
Subject: Stats

Hello,

Could someone tell me if and where i could find faceoff stats for the
91/92 season and later on the 92/93 (i think its to early to get it now).

Thanks a lot

JP

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54046
From: brifre1@ac.dal.ca
Subject: Re: Trivia question

In article <1993Apr23.102811.623@sei.cmu.edu>, caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz) writes:
> 
> While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash" that
> Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had his
> jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not positive.
> Does anyone remember/know his name?  What has happened to him since?  What
> about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?  Has this ever
> happened before in a hockey game?   
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Carol
> Go Pens!

It was Clint Malarchuk

Whatever happened to him, anyway?

Barfly
Go *sigh* Leafs *cry*

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54047
From: John Michael Santore <jsbh+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Goalie mask poll update 4/22/93

> Now here this:  Anyone voting for John Blue for best goalie mask poll will be
> shot on site, no questions asked ;-)

> But c'mon.. it's a black mask, with yellow paint along the opening..  how
> totally plain vanilla!  eeuu..

Heh, someone mentioned Tommy Soderstrom (Flyers) for the besk mask poll
too (in the mentioned below part).  All he has is a plain white helmet
with a big cage.
I found this pretty amusing.

					-John Santore

Philadelphia Flyers in '93-'94!

=============================================================================
 ____________________                                
/                    \                   "We break the surface tension 
\_________     ____   \                   with our wild kinetic dreams"
/             /    \   \                        -Rush, Grand Designs
\_______     /  (*) )   )
/           / /\___/   /                 Go Philadelphia Flyers!
\_____     / /        /
/         /  \_______/                   John Santore (jsbh@andrew.cmu.edu)
\________/   
          
Rush-Yes-King Crimson-Emerson, Lake and Palmer-Marillion-Genesis (w/ Gabriel)
=============================================================================

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54048
From: tmenner@sei.cmu.edu (Thomas Menner)
Subject: Hockey Equip. Recommendations?

Hey man! -

Having spent the past season learning to skate and having played a
couple of sessions of mock hockey, I'm ready to invest in hockey
equipment (particularly since I will be taking summer 'hockey
lessons').  However, I am completely and profoundly ignorant when it
comes to hockey equipment.  I've checked out local stores and looked
at catalogs, but I was hoping to solicit opinions/suggestions before
actually plunking down any money.  Having played football in high
school and college I at least have that equipment as a basis for
comparison.  But for example what are the advantages/disadvantages to
different kinds of shoulder pads and pants/girdles?  Are there any
notoriously bad or unsafe brands or styles?  etc.  So any suggestions
or comments would be greatly appreciated.


Tom Menner    	   	     	  I    When you're swimming in the creek
Software Engineering Institute	  I    And an eel bites your cheek,
Carnegie Mellon University   	  I    That's a moray!
Pittsburgh, PA	   	     	  I    	    - Fabulous Furry Freak Bros.




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54049
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: ESPN's (lack of) coverage

pkester@hooville.mitre.org (Peter Kester) writes:
>jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio) writes:
>>The worst thing is that this is exactly what I did last year.
>>Yes, I'd rather have SC cover it, just for the amount of coverage.
>>
>So this year you had a game on SCNY, a game on SCA, a game on ESPN,
>and if the Rangers hadn't crashed and burned, you would have had a
>game on MSG.  What are you complaining about?

The problem is that (by no fault of ESPN) ongoing games are not
covered 'til the final horn sounds.  With two channels, SCNY and SCA,
late-finishing games (up to Pacific time) and overtimes elsewhere will
kick in at the end of local coverage.  If SCNY is blocked by the Mets,
there is still some hockey on SCA (SCNY Plus).

With an ESPN 2, the current situation would be alleviated.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54050
From: spiegel@sgi501.msd.lmsc.lockheed.com (Mark Spiegel)
Subject: Re: SHARKS:  Kingston Fired!!!

In article <1993Apr23.063205.26192@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>In article <1993Apr22.212219.23130@iscnvx.lmsc.lockheed.com> spiegel@sgi501.msd.lmsc.lockheed.com (Mark Spiegel) writes:
>>In article <1993Apr21.234022.2880@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>
>>	I said Gund will have to open his *CHECKBOOK*, I didn't say give up
>>	any draft picks or promising talent.  If we could have gotten
>>	Murphy for the $2M great, but I agree the Sharks shouldn't give
>>	up young talent or early round draft picks.  I listed Chelios et al
>>	only to indicate the *TYPE* of player I think the Sharks need to pick 
>>	up.  The rules on signing free agents less than 30 years old puts
>>	a big restriction on what the Sharks can pick up.  However, I do
>>	believer they need to pick up some players who will add toughness
>>	to the team.
>
>But you have to remember that you're unlikely to get any real quality free
>agents who do not require compensation.  The Sharks tried, with Makarov, who
>was probably the top of the class among non-compensation free agents, but even
>he probably wouldn't have helped too much.
>
	Don't expect to get top quality, just some toughness.  I don't
	view Makarov as a player who would add toughness.

>>>Size hopefully won't be much of a worry next year.  Alexander Cherbayev and
>>>Michal Sykora have agreed to multi-year contracts, and it appears that Mike
>>>Rathje will also sign soon.  All three are pretty big.
>>
>>	Size alone isn't enough.  We all know how much fear Kolstad (6-6)
>>	struck in the eyes of opponents NOT!
>
>Well, Rathje and Sykora are both highly touted prospects, unlike Kolstad...
>And Cherbayev was initially supposed to play for the Russian WC Team.  (Anybody
>know what happened there?)  That means that he's likely to be good enough.
>

	Nelson, you're confusing skill and toughness.


>>>McGill/Hammond -> Johan Garpenlov.  Would you really rather have those two
>>>instead of Johan?
>>
>>	By your logic then you enjoy having Falloon and Ozolinsh on 
>>	injured reserve?
>
>By your logic then you think that if the Sharks had kept McGill and Hammond
>that you can guarantee that Falloon and Ozolinsh wouldn't have gotten hurt?
>(Think again; there was a chance that McGill would have caused Ozolinsh to get
>stuck at KC, and as you know, Hammond is worthless, and McGill is almost
>worthless.)
>
>>>Well, Wilson, maybe, but I don't think Falloon and Ozolinsh were really
>>>injured on cheapshots.
>>
>>	who said they were?   
>
>If they weren't then, I don't see any justification that having McGill and
>Hammond around would prevent their injuries.  If the injuries of Falloon and
>Ozolinsh were purely accidental, then what could McGill and Hammond have done
>to prevent them?
>
	Hey, get off the McGill/Hammond thing.  I'm no fan of either. My
	point is that last year the Sharks had toughness that was missing
	this year.  This year we had more skill, I'm all for that, but
	if your skill players keep getting beat up and injured they
	can't do you much good.  Whether it's a cheap shot or not you
	can't let the other teams push you around.  The 1992-93 Sharks
	simply got pushed around to much.  Other teams knew this.
	They knew they could aggressively check the Sharks and not
	pay for it.   Adding some players in the off season who will
	add some toughness to the team will help insure that next
	season other teams will be more hesistant to vigorously 
	check our skill players, or to take cheap shots.  It doesn't
	guarantee no injuries (nothing does), but it's something the
	Sharks can do to reduce the number of injuries.  

	mark

 just say

 #####  #     #    #    ######  #    #   #####           ____                  
#     # #     #   # #   #     # #   #   #     #            -_ --__             
#       #     #  #   #  #     # #  #    #                    \    --_          
 #####  ####### #     # ######  ###      #####                \      -_        
      # #     # ####### #   #   #  #          #                |       \       
#     # #     # #     # #    #  #   #   #     #    __________ /         \_____ 
 #####  #     # #     # #     # #    #   #####  ___________ /            \_____
______________________________________________________________________________
Mark Spiegel  spiegel@lmsc.lockheed.com   Cow Palace:108/K/8  Epicenter: ?



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54051
Subject: Re: Hockey guest spots...
From: Paul H. Pimentel <PP3903A@auvm.american.edu>

Two years ago Mark Messier appeared on David Letterman the summer he signed wit
h the Rangers.  I remember he and Mike Gartner taking slapshots at the camera,
 one finally was a bullseye and the screen went blank.  It was funny if you saw
 it, I guess.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54052
From: joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm)
Subject: Re: Lemieux's Getting the Hart... Jeez I hope not!

In article <22APR93.02956996.0062@UNBVM1.CSD.UNB.CA> F1HH@UNB.CA (Patrick Walker) writes:
>Who should get the Hart?
...
>Mario.  Jesus NO!  It's bad enough for me just to utter the word
> without being extremely sick and pissed off.  They guy's a luber
...
>ten minutes now... Give me a f--king break with this Mario is the
>best player ever.  What!  Did Gretzky die?  I wish Bobby Clarke
...
>Not that I condone violence, but I'll make an exception for Mario.
>But if Mario is going to complain about being hit, someone should
>give him and Scotty something REAL to complain about.
>Sorry to ramble.  As you can see I hate Mario.
>Pat Walker
>UNB

	"Why don't you kill him Beav"

	"Well...I dunnow Eddie...I might get in trouble"

	"Here's a gun Beav, shoot him, Beav"

	"Well...ok Eddie"

BLAM BLAM

	Wally: "You're in trouble now Beave"






Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54053
From: joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm)
Subject: Re: Ranger Fans?????

In article <1993Apr22.101356.1@eagle.wesleyan.edu> kwolfer@eagle.wesleyan.edu writes:
...
>
>As far as the Stanley Cup goes I think there's only one team that can test
>Pittsburgh and that's Detroit.  This would be the most entertaining and hard
>fought series.  Mario is amazing!
>
>Kurt

That is if Mario makes it.

Pat Walker sounds like the type that would bring an AK-47 to a game
and take pot shots at Mario. ("stand STILL...dam sunavbich...HMFF")


Joseph Stiehm

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54054
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: ESPN

In article <0fq0VIC00WB8RQ019D@andrew.cmu.edu> ch3g+@andrew.cmu.edu (Chad Nicholas Hunter) writes:
>I live in Pittsburgh (yes i'm a pens fan) where hockey gets a lot
>of coverage.  i can only imagine how a caps fan residing in Texas
>must feel.

	Or a Caps fan residing in Atlanta, where they DONT EVEN TELL
THE F&@(*@CKING PLAYOFF SCORES ON THE NEWS!!!!!

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54055
From: cal2d@csissun11.ee.Virginia.EDU (Craig Allen Lorie)
Subject: Re: Devils and Islanders tiebreaker????

According to the hockey gurus over at ESPN, should the Islanders win tonite
the two teams will have the same record, but the Devils will be playing the
Penguins.  This is because the Islanders have won the season series against
the Devils.  I think the rules for deciding a tie breaker include:

1.  season series
2.  goals against
3.  goals for

in this order (correct me if I'm wrong).  Anyone have anything to add?

Craig

Go Islanders!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54056
From: mjr4u@Virginia.EDU ("Matthew J. Rush")
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

d_jaracz@oz.plymouth.edu  writes:
> In article <93106.092246DLMQC@CUNYVM.BITNET> Harold Zazula <DLMQC@CUNYVM.BITNET> writes:
> >I was watching the Detroit-Minnesota game last night and thought I saw an
> >octopus on the ice after Ysebaert scored to tie the game at two. What gives?
> 
> No no no!!!  It's a squid!  Keep the tradition alive!  (Kinda like the
> fish at UNH games....)
> 
Actually, the way I understand it, it is an octapus.
Apparently, a number of years ago, a fan threw an octapus on
the ice and the announcer said "Octapi will not occupy the ice"
or something like that, and it's happened ever since.  The fans
cheer those who pick up the dead octapus with their hands, and
boo those who use a shovel.

Matt at UVA

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54057
From: v128r82w@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Ralph L d'Ambrosio)
Subject: Re: Devils and Islanders tiebreaker????

In article <C5LDI2.77u@odin.corp.sgi.com>, enolan@sharkbite.esd.sgi.com (Ed Nolan) writes...
>If the Islanders beat the Devils tonight, they would finish with
>identical records.  Who's the lucky team that gets to face the Penguins
>in the opening round?   Also, can somebody list the rules for breaking
>ties.
I am not sure about the tie breaker rules. However, I think if the Islanders win
(Oh God, Please, Please let them win), the Islanders win the series against 
NJ and advances to third.

********************************************************************************
Of course no one asked me, I always interject my opinions on maters I have no
concern over.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Go Islanders!!!!! (I mean come on, the Jets were bad enough
Go Jets for '93

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54058
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat


In article 1qmtd1INNr1l@iskut.ucs.ubc.ca, gibson@nukta.geop.ubc.ca (Brad Gibson) writes:

<In response to a debate about who has has a better season- Jagr of Francis>

I think Jagr did he probably had a better point per minute ice time- stats
don't exist to properly analyze this and he had a substancially better +/-.


>  Actually, what I think has become more evident, is that you are determined to
>  flaunt your ignorance at all cost.  Jagr did not have a better season than
>  Francis ... to suggest otherwise is an insult to those with a modicum of
>  hockey knowledge.  Save your almost maniacal devotion to the almighty
>  plus/minus ... it is the most misleading hockey stat available.
>
>  Until the NHL publishes a more useful quantifiable statistic including ice
>  time per game and some measure of its "quality" (i.e., is the player put out
>  in key situations like protecting a lead late in the game; is he matched up
>  against the other team's top one or two lines; short-handed, etc), I would
>  much rather see the +/- disappear altogether instead of having its dubious
>  merits trumpeted by those with little understanding of its implications.

+/- is a useful statistic.  If a player is on the ice when his team scores a
lot of goals and only allows a few goals, he must be doing something right.
It is especially useful to compare between teammates- as they play for the
same team and should have roughly similar +/- ratings if they are equally
good players.  It can be adjusted- with varying degrees of success to compare
between players on different teams.

I agree it would be nice for the NHL to keep more statistics- but how useful
are the ones that you suggest??  Total ice time would be very useful- it is
a missing stat in Jagr vs Francis arguments from before.  Somehow measuring
the quality of ice time as you suggest would be useless.  It would be a
better stat for evaluating coaching- ie are the players given quality ice
time actually their talented ones?  A very good player could be given low
amounts of quality ice time because of team depth or a stupid coach who
doesn't recognize his talent and a very bad player could be given lots of
quality ice time because of a lack of team depth or a stupid coach that
thinks he is an effective player.  This stat would be much more flawed than
+/- and almost no conclusions could be drawn regarding player talent.

+/- is a useful stat.  It is quite useful in evaluating player talent.
You are the one displaying ignorance because of your unwillingness to see
that being on the ice when goals are scored but not when they are allowed
is a very positive thing- and should be evaluated as such.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54059
From: klaty@procyon.engin.umich.edu (Brad Alan Klaty)
Subject: Re: POTVIN and HIS STICK


So if Potvin can pound on Dino, what happens when Dino pounds 
on him?  If Dino gets his legs slashed, can he slash Potvin
in return?  This year at a UM-LSSU hockey game, a UM player
was called for a slash when he hit the goalie's glove with
his stick.  Is that slashing, while hitting someone's ankles
isn't?  How do the refs know what to call?  Do the goalies
get more liberties than other players?


				Brad

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54060
From: joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm)
Subject: Re: Hockey guest spots...

sclark@epas.utoronto.ca (Susan Clark) writes:
> I'm looking to answer a bit of trivia.  What hockeplayers have
> appeared on major talk shows on TV [...examples deleted...]
> I'm pretty sure I've seen Gretzky and Lemieux, but I was
> wondering if there were any others...

Michael J. Fox was on Letterman about a year ago (or two) during the 
playoffs as a celebrity hockey player for the Bruins.  While he's not
exactly a NHLer he did mention that the Bruins wanted to break Ulfie's
legs (or something like that) in response to the Neely incident.  It
was quite amusing, as one of the few Letterman viewers who actually knew
what he was talking about.  Anybody know who the Pens celebrity hockey
player is?  Michael Douglas (aka Michael Keaton)?

Joseph Stiehm

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54061
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

What sadist brought up this vein about Malarchuk?  When I saw what
happened I wanted to throw up, and at the same time I was devastated,
since I thought that Malarchuk wouldn't survive.  BTW, I believe he picked
up an alcohol problem after (before?) the incident.

To radically change the subject, the Caps must be having nightmares about
the Isles in overtime in the playoffs.  Have they *ever* beaten the
Islanders in a playoff OT game?  This is lunacy.  The Caps are such a
sorry team in the playoffs, they consistently choke against opponents who
they should be beating.  Losing two OT games in a row is not coincidence,
it's evidence of the choke factor.

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!
     In this corner				LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
     Weighing in at almost every weight imaginable . . . 
     Life, and all that surrounds it.		     -- Blues Traveler, 1993

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54062
From: LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall)
Subject: Re: Where's Roger?

In article <franjion.735590256@spot.Colorado.EDU>
franjion@spot.Colorado.EDU (John Franjione) writes:
 
>Unfortunately, Roger is now over at r.s.baseball spewing his expertise
>(i.e. being a dickhead).  I guess he is afraid of posting anything
>here, because he knows what to expect.
>--
>John Franjione
>Department of Chemical Engineering
>University of Colorado, Boulder
>franjion@spot.colorado.edu
 
 
 
 Hey, we could start a new game on the net.  It's called 'Where's Roger?'
It's similiar to 'Where's Waldo?' but instead of finding Waldo in a picture
of people, we try to find Roger in a newsgroup on the net.
 I predict that he'll be in r.s.basketball.pro next.
 
 
 
Laurie Marshall
Wayne State University
Detroit, Michigan
Go Wings!!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54063
From: joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm)
Subject: Re: TV Coverage - NHL to blame!

In article <1993Apr23.164919.43442@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu> sjg3@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (STEVEN JAY GIBBLE) writes:
...
>    Mario is the Michael Jordan of hockey.  All that fucker has to do is fall
>    on the ice and the closet guy to him gets at least 2.  Last night in the
>    3rd game between NJ and Pitt, he was being pushed while skating across the
>    front of the goal while trying to get a shot off.  The guy on him was
>    doing a good job, so he got off a weak shot, but then he decided to fall
>    to the ice. Then the fucking ref(Van Helloamend?) called the guy for
>    holding.  They replayed the play, and my roomate(who is clueless about
>    hockey) wanted to know what the NJ guy did to get a call, because it was so fucking obvious the NJ player
>    had both hands on his stick, and no, he did not trip him.  It is simple,
>    Mario gets touched, he falls to the ice, automatic 2.  But the thing that
>    really pissed me off is, Pitt scored the 3rd or 4th goal, I don't remember,
>    on the resulting PP and
>    eventually won 4-3.  His diving/calls makes a HUGE difference in the
>    outcome of a game.
...
>    All agreeing or disagreeing replies are welcomed.
>
>    Steve





We must have been watching two different games.   The Devil had one hand on
Mario's elbow and pulling the elbow caused Mario to fall so the call was
appropriate.

Using clueless people to substantiate your claims doesn't give me a lot of
confidence in your call either.  Next time consider getting a second opinion
from a clueful observer.  Or maybe all those available disagreed.







Joseph Stiehm







Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54064
From: mblumens@itsmail1.hamilton.edu (Mary Blumenstock)
Subject: Re: Ranger Fans?????

>In article <1993Apr22.101356.1@eagle.wesleyan.edu> kwolfer@eagle.wesleyan.edu writes:
>I for one am happy about the Ranger's hiring of Keenan.  It's too bad that they
>

I agree that Keenan is an excellent choice.  Did you see Mike
Lupica's column in Sunday's news?  My sentiments exactly.  I
think he just may be the one to instill some hunger and fire
into their hearts next season.  Either that or he's going to 
be kicking alot of butt!

>Reading through most of these hockey news I don't see many Ranger fans writing.   

I'm here, but am new to this group and have been keeping fairly
quiet (you know, doing the "lurking" thing).  I don't have a
sense how many Rangers fans there are on the list either.  I 
am a die-hard Ranger fan (I guess I have to be - I sat in the
Garden throughout the Penguins' - led by Mario's 5 goals - decimation 
of them on 4/9), but am sick at the abundance of talent that has
been totally untapped, and the lack of heart displayed this
season.

>
>I have some final questions about the way the team was handled in that last
>dreadful stretch.
>
>1. Knowing they needed offensive help from the blueline, why didn't we see Mike
>Hurlbut, who played pretty well when he was called up when Leetch first went
>down?
>

Hurlbut was injured for quite a while.  I'm not sure, but I
think he may have recovered in time for the playoff run, and
if so, like you, question why he wasn't used.

>
>>2. Why????!!!!! is Joe Kocur playing every night?  He is not Bob Probert who is
>>tough but also can play.
>>

I believe Kocur was used, in many instances, for his intimidation 
factor.  Granted, he seemed to get an awful lot of ice time for 
that reason alone, but you have to realize that when a team is
not doing any REAL physical intimidation (I'd like to have a nickel 
for every time J.D. said 'They've got to take the body more'), 
you've got to at least have some illusions ;-(

>3. How come Paul Broten is relegated to street clothes for the end of the
>season.  At least he plays with some heart and character, draws penalties and
>plays 110% when he's on the ice.  Was he in the doghouse for some reason?

I agree and I don't know.

>4. Joe Cirella?????!!!!  Enough said!
>

Sorry, I don't agree with you here.  I think Joey C. did a good
job filling in when he was asked to.  I can't imagine that it's
easy going from near 0 ice time to being a full timer.  I don't
seem to remember him turning the puck over at the blue line too
much, or failing to clear the zone.  He worked hard, and at
least didn't make any rookie mistakes.  As he said himself in an
interview, he can only give what he has.  and he did.  

>
>Ranger fans may be suffering but we're some of the most loyal, unlike Islander
>fans who only show up when the team wins.
>

Absolutely.  I think attendance at the Garden was better on the
last day of the season, than any average night for the
Islanders.

> 
>>fought series.  Mario is amazing!
>

The man is awesome.  In a way, I'm enjoying the playoffs more,
now that the Rangers aren't in them.  I can really appreciate
all the glory Mario is getting without 'hating' him because he's
on the opposing team.  He deserves it all, as far as I'm
concerned.

		- Mary

===============================================================
Mary Blumenstock               mblumens@itsmail1.hamilton.edu
Hamilton College 
Clinton, N.Y.                    GO RANGERS!! (next year...)



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54065
From: jennifer@netcom.com (Jennifer!)
Subject: Re: TV Coverage - NHL to blame!

sjg3@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (STEVEN JAY GIBBLE) writes:


>    The tv coverage of the playoffs is fucking ridicules.  Overtime time games
>    that are not shown?  What the hell kind of shit is this?  If that would
>    have happened to the Flyers(if they were in the damn playoffs to begin
>    with) while I was watching, I would have gone throught the roof!

For those of you who read TV Guide, there's an article in next week's
SPORTSVIEW concerning the NHL and major network broadcasting. Pretty
interesting.

- Jennifer


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54066
From: jbarrett@aludra.usc.edu (Jonathan Barrett)
Subject: Re: Where's the knowledgeable observer?

maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:

>One thing you can be assured of, however, is this: the Leafs are the
>best of all the teams in the league that have allowed 12 goals in 2 
>games.


>-- 

>cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
>                                           "So many morons...
>rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Roger, you should check your facts before posting! The Kings have 
conceded 12 goals in 2 games. 

Jon



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54067
From: allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan)
Subject: Re: Ulf and all...

drozinst@db.erau.edu (Drozinski Tim) writes:

>As if an aluminum stick being taken to Ulf's head is gonna solve the problem
>with violence in the sport of hockey.  How the hell can you say the guy is
>a goon and justify it, with your back-assward mentality?  Saying that hurting
>a player will solve anyone's problems is asinine.  New rules and a new 
>referee system need to be instituted.  Right now, too many of the real goons
>get away with too much, because the ref is watching the play (or supposed to be:I've seen Koharski and Van Hellemond, to name a few, with their heads up their  asses on a few calls) rather than keeping an eye on the goofballs behind the 
>play.  Even if the linesmen were able to call all penalties, it would be an
>improvement.

Unfortunately, that is the way the league is heading... You can't fight,
so the only way to retaliate against someone is with a cheap shot when
the ref isn't looking. Ulf has brought this to a high level... Players
stuck in the past (like Neely) who prefer fights to cheap shots
are at a disadvantage in the new system.

Lets face it, A cheap shot (like high sticking) is a very effective
method... It is easier to hide from the refs, has a better chance of
causing injury, and you can draw people into fights that way. I don't
like it, but that's the way the league is going.

By the way, there was a rather good hit by Ulf in the last Penguin-Devil
game. Managed to hit the NJ player in the face with a stick. (Must have been a
legal hit... After all, Ulf is a clean player and is allowed to do
things like that.)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54068
From: allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan)
Subject: Oiler's rumour - Team moving? Press conference next week


I heard a story on the local sports news broadcast in Edmonton.
Oiler owner Peter Pocklington will be holding a press conference
next week. While the exact details are not known, it is believed
to concern the Oiler's future.

Rumour has it that Pocklington signed a tentative lease arrangement
with Copps Collesium in Hamilton. During the press conference,
Pocklington may announce the deal. It is quite possible that
the deal may simply be a way to force Edmonton Northlands to
renegotiate the Oiler lease on the stadium.

Northlands has offered to buy the Oilers for $65 million earlier,
but the offer was rejected immediately by Pocklington.

As for me, my opinion is divided... Edmonton has been fairly
supportive of the Oilers. Even though they're a small market
team, they had many sellouts in the 80s. Even with the problems
that the team had this year, they still brought in more fans
than many teams in larger cities did. On the other hand, if
the team does move, there is no place more deserving than
Hamilton. Of course, how would that affect the grand
realignment scheme of Bettman? 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54069
From: c5ff@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (COOK  Charlie)
Subject: NHL Summary parse results for games played Tue, April 20, 1993

NY Islanders                     1 1 2 0 1--5
Washington                       0 2 2 0 0--4
First period
     1, NY Islanders, Turgeon 1 (King, Thomas) 13:14.
Second period
     2, Washington, Hunter 3 (Johansson, Miller) 6:33.
     3, NY Islanders, Turgeon 2 (Thomas, Vaske) 12:36.
     4, Washington, Hunter 4 (Johansson, Carpenter) pp, 16:51.
Third period
     5, NY Islanders, Hogue 1 (unassisted) 3:31.
     6, Washington, Khristich 2 (Cavallini, Bondra) 7:16.
     7, NY Islanders, Ferraro 2 (Flatley, Hogue) 14:50.
     8, Washington, Hunter 5 (Johansson, Khristich) pp, 19:57.
First overtime
     No scoring.
Second overtime
     9, NY Islanders, Mullen 1 (Ferraro, Flatley) 14:50.

NY Islanders: 5    Power play: 5-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Ferraro            1    1    2
Flatley            0    2    2
Hogue              1    1    2
King               0    1    1
Mullen             1    0    1
Thomas             0    2    2
Turgeon            2    0    2
Vaske              0    1    1

Washington: 4    Power play: 5-2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bondra             0    1    1
Carpenter          0    1    1
Cavallini          0    1    1
Hunter             3    0    3
Johansson          0    3    3
Khristich          1    1    2
Miller             0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
Montreal                         0 0 1--1
Quebec                           3 0 1--4
First period
     1, Quebec, Leschyshyn 1 (Kamensky, Sakic) pp, 4:19.
     2, Quebec, Young 2 (Lapointe) 11:41.
     3, Quebec, Young 3 (Lapointe, Duchesne) 13:56.
Second period
     No scoring.
Third period
     4, Montreal, Bellows 2 (Odelein) 11:05.
     5, Quebec, Lapointe 1 (Ricci) en, 19:23.

Quebec: 4    Power play: 2-1   Special goals:  pp: 1  en: 1  Total: 2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Duchesne           0    1    1
Kamensky           0    1    1
Lapointe           1    2    3
Leschyshyn         1    0    1
Ricci              0    1    1
Sakic              0    1    1
Young              2    0    2

Montreal: 1    Power play: 1-0
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Bellows            1    0    1
Odelein            0    1    1

-----------------------------------------
New Jersey                       0 0 0--0
Pittsburgh                       2 4 1--7
First period
     1, Pittsburgh, McEachern 1 (Francis, Taglianetti) 15:09.
     2, Pittsburgh, Lemieux 3 (Samuelsson, Barrasso) sh, 17:41.
Second period
     3, Pittsburgh, Tocchet 2 (Stevens, Samuelsson) 3:48.
     4, Pittsburgh, Jagr 2 (Francis, Ramsey) 12:39.
     5, Pittsburgh, Stevens 1 (Francis, Murphy) pp, 15:43.
     6, Pittsburgh, McEachern 2 (Daniels, Mullen) 16:56.
Third period
     7, Pittsburgh, Mullen 1 (Francis, Barrasso) 17:42.

Pittsburgh: 7    Power play: 4-1   Special goals:  pp: 1  sh: 1  Total: 2
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Barrasso           0    2    2
Daniels            0    1    1
Francis            0    4    4
Jagr               1    0    1
Lemieux            1    0    1
McEachern          2    0    2
Mullen             1    1    2
Murphy             0    1    1
Ramsey             0    1    1
Samuelsson         0    2    2
Stevens            1    1    2
Taglianetti        0    1    1
Tocchet            1    0    1

New Jersey: 0    Power play: 5-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------
Buffalo                          2 1 1--4
Boston                           0 0 0--0
First period
     1, Buffalo, Presley 1 (unassisted) sh, 4:27.
     2, Buffalo, Wood 1 (Moller, Sweeney) pp, 8:07.
Second period
     3, Buffalo, Mogilny 3 (Lafontaine) 5:03.
Third period
     4, Buffalo, Hawerchuk 1 (Carney, Smehlik) pp, 14:48.

Buffalo: 4    Power play: 4-2   Special goals:  pp: 2  sh: 1  Total: 3
Scorer            G    A   Pts
---------------  ---  ---  ---
Carney             0    1    1
Hawerchuk          1    0    1
Lafontaine         0    1    1
Mogilny            1    0    1
Moller             0    1    1
Presley            1    0    1
Smehlik            0    1    1
Sweeney            0    1    1
Wood               1    0    1

Boston: 0    Power play: 5-0
No scoring

-----------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54070
From: ee152fcs@sdcc15.ucsd.edu (Bjorn Karlsson)
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 20

In article <1993Apr21.073134.5117@ericsson.se> etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson) writes:
>
> 1993 World Championships in Germany:
> ====================================

Is there any games being shown here in the US from the WC???

Thanks

mc



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54071
From: Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: ABC coverage


Gerald Olchowy writes:

>Clement, although he has a pleasant personality (aggravatingly pleasant
>in my opinion), is a terrible
>analyst, because he is almost alway wrong...the prototypical example
>being New Jersey's first goal last Sunday.
> 
>I grew up with Dick Irvin doing color beside Danny Gallivan...I knew
>did Irvin, Dick Irvin was a friend of mine...Bill Clement you aren't
>any Dick Irvin.
> 
>As long as the teams involved do not include the US national team or
>the New York Rangers, I'd take John Davidson over Bill Clement any
day.

Personality means something to me.  That is exactly why I like Clement
(and Emrick).  On the other hand, JD is a pompous, bull-headed, arrogant
know-it-all.  He's a real turn-off (which is exactly what I do when he's
on).  One complaint I do have about Clement is that he sometimes talks
too much.  If I wanted that I'd listen to Tim McGarver doing a baseball
game.

Mom.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54072
From: mikkot@romulus.math.jyu.fi (Mikko Tarkiainen)
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 18

In article <1993Apr21.085435.6895@ericsson.se> etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson) writes:

OK, here is my try:

> The Czech Republic
> ------------------
>
> Goaltenders:	 1. Petr Briza		(Finland somewhere, right?)
				        Lukko, Finland
					(look at the colors of his mask)
					              
> Defense:	 3. Leo Gudas		?
				        ex-JyPHT, Finland, now in Germany
					Excellent defenseman

>		 5. Drahomir Kadlec	?
					HIFK, Finland

>		14. Jiri Kucera		?
				        Tappara, Finland

>		19. Tomas Kapusta	?
					HPK, Finland

>		20. Otakar Janecky	(Finland?)
					Jokerit, Finland
	
>		24. Radek Toupal	?
				        HPK, Finland

>		26. Jiri Dolezal	?
				        JyPHT, Finland, no new contract
					JyPHT owns his player rights

All of these Czechs (Kadlec, Dolezal not anymore) are very good hockey
players. It is a big surprise that Hlinka selected Dolezal. 
"Dole" had a bad season in JyPHT and that's why they didn't make
a new contract. The other Czech we had, Jiri Jonak, got fired also.

There are lots of Czechs playing in Finland. Darius Rusnak, Igor Liba,
Sejba, Svoboda, ...


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54073
From: golf@phoenix.oulu.fi (Jouko Kylmaoja)
Subject: German audience is lunatic??

I watched the game Germany-Czechs in WC today...and i was astonished about
the behaviour of the German audience!
The German team got a few penalties in the last period and the crowd went
grazy! They threw coins, extra pucks and other trash into the rink...is
that stupid or what?? I guess the Canadian referee (one of the
Isostar-bros ;) gave the German team a penalty for that, but it didn't help
much.
I guess the Germans just are proud over their Nazi-Kill-'em-All-Everyone-
But-Us-Germans-Sucks attitude...they just seem to have that kind of attitude
in every possible sport (remember the European champs in Stockholm in soccer)
It really pisses me off!
I do not mean that every single German has this attitude that sucks, but 
most of them seem to do...

	Jokke Kylmaoja
	golf@phoenix.oulu.fi


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54074
From: delarocq@eos.ncsu.edu (DERRELL EMERY LAROCQUE)
Subject: A few words of advice to the Stars Hater....






    I have some advice for you, and some thoughts about
your hatred of the Minnesota North Stars:

1. A real team like Toronto would not be moved, you are right,
   just eliminated from the playoffs first round!
2. Why stay in Minnesota when you can go to a college in
   Western Ontario and actually take classes on map-reading
   and the Artistry of BSing specifically set up for just you.
3. Why should anyone love the Stars, when hating the Leafs
   is so much better?
4. Oh, I'm sorry.. well, maybe you can't understand my
   big words.. next time I'll limit my vocabulary to words
   like "get real team now" and "do not waste our time"
5. Respond to this article. I love to laugh at your humor,
   even though it it unintentional. I got a BIG kick out of
   GO LEAFS GO.... go where? HOME, I think!! :)
-- 
delarocq@eos.ncsu.edu


      
---------------------------------------------------------------------------   
1988,1989,1990,1991 AFC East Division Champions
1991,1992, AND 1993 AFC Conference Champions!!!!!!!!  :)

Squished the Fish ............... Monday Night Football, November 16, 1992..
SQUISHED THE TRASH TALKING FISH.. AFC CHAMPIONSHIP, JANUARY 17, 1992..

If you are a Buffalo Bills fan, email me at delarocq@eos.ncsu.edu
so we can talk all about the games, insight, etc.
If you are a Packers fan, let me know. I am interested in any news
out of Green Bay...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54075
From: lmcmasc@noah.ericsson.se (Mauro Schena)
Subject: Bruins

Could anyone post the game summary for the Sabres-Bruins game.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54076
From: "William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: LET'S GO BUFFALO!


     You know, I never really appreciated them before!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54077
From: cobra@chopin.udel.edu (KING COBRA)
Subject: RE: ESPN UP YOURS .........



In article <1993Apr20.214505.6925@wkuvx1.bitnet> kozloce@wkuvx1.bitnet writes:
>Jesus Christ!!!
>
>The score is now 6-0. The Pens are beating the shit out of the Devils who
>gave up in the middle of the 2nd period. ESPN does something smart. The
>announcer states "well folks this game is getting out of hand. Lets go to
>the Islander/Capitals game." I celebrate as I was actually making progress in
>my CS homework because I was so bored by the scheduled game.  I tear down and
>throw on my jersey, Hunter scores I go ape shit 'cause this is the first
>caps game I've been able to watch all season. And what does ESPN do? they
>go back to the blowout that NJ hasn't a chance in hell of winning!
>     The period ends and the sportscaster (CAPITOLS JUST TIED IT UP!! YES!!
>oops excuse me =) goes into his penguin worship mode (Dont freak pens fans!
>They are worthy of this! I'm so glad we wont have to play them as much next
>year!) and here comes the 3rd period...what? its the blowout again. Oh they
>were just waiting for the Cap/Isles to get out of intermission. Good
>they've put a close game back on. Wait! WHATS THIS SHIT?!! THEY'RE SHOWING
>THE BLOWOUT AGAIN!
>
>
>AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG!
>
>(Oh guess what the score is now 7-0 penguins! Switch games you $%&*#@!!!)
>
>Holy shit they're changing games! ITS ABOUT GODDAMNED TIME!! Lets see if
>they'll stay.
>
>Later
>
>I think this proves by $#%&* point. The Caps game goes into overtime but
>"due to contractual obligations" they have to switch to the fucking baseball.
>(Sorry for my language but im PISSED!) What the hell were they going to do
>if their scheduled game went into overtime? ESPN get your head out of your
>ass.
>
>Now I know there are a lot 



 First of all I think when ESPN covers the game they do a wonderful job, but
 last night I felt the same way. I really hate watching Devils/Pens game. 
 Everyone knows that Devils are going to get their ass kicked, why even 
 bother showing them. I was so bored and these ESPN people don't seem to have
 any brain. After the Sundays and last night games, they are still going to 
 show Devils/Pens on THU and SUN. WHat the hell are they thinking about? I 
 think if they keep it up like this NHL will never get a major network contract.
 I'd rather see Caps/Isls game which is more exciting. 

 Now I just hope all baseball games are rained out on ESPN so atleast
 we can get diffrent hockey games. 

  



*******************************************************************************
**   ___  ____  ____  ____  ____  **                                         **
**  /    /   / /___/ /___/ /___/  **   Experience is what makes a person     **
** /___ /___/ /___/ / \_  /   /   **   make new mistakes instead of old      **
**                                **   one.                                  **
** E-mail: cobra@chopin.udel.edu  **                                         **
**                                **                                         **
*******************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54078
From: mse@cc.bellcore.com (25836-michael evenchick(F113))
Subject: Re: #77's?

In article <1r23on$4p6@bigboote.WPI.EDU>, ching@bigwpi.WPI.EDU ("The Logistician") writes:
|> 
|> I am in need of all of the players wearing #77 in the NHL.  I know now only
|> of one, Ray Borque for the Bruins.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.
|> 
|> Thanx.
|> 
|> -- 
|> ------------------------THE LOGISTICIAN REIGNS SUPREME!!!----------------------
|> |									      |
|> |   GO BLUE!!!   GO TIGERS!!!   GO PISTONS!!!   GO LIONS!!!   GO RED WINGS!!! |
|> -------------------------------ching@wpi.wpi.edu-------------------------------

Pierre Turgeon of the Islanders

Mike

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54079
From: Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Wirtz is a weenie

from Dean:
>>In other TV news, the Penguins announced yesterday that they will have 3
>>fewer broadcast TV games, and will have 22(!) games on some sort of
>>subscription / pay-per-view system. Yuck.
> 
>This is incorrect.  This year the Pens had 61 games on "free" TV and 6
>games on PPV.  Next year they will have 62 games on free TV and 22 on 
>a subscription basis.  
> 
>You actually get 1 more free game than last year, and there will be no
>more "radio-only" games.

Yes, you're right. After going home and reading the paper, I got the
full details. That's what I get for making a post based on WDUQ's news.
I should know by now they get just about every sports related item wrong.

Ralph


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54080
From: "William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Don Cherry - help me out, here


     As a person who has rarely even SEEN Don Cherry and doesn't know
anything about him, I don't know whether it is just this area
(Pittsburgh) of the USA that is "deprived" of his broadcasts or whether
he's a Canadian thing altogether.  Seriously, what is he all about?  I
know he was a coach at one time, and from the volume of posts about him,
SOMEONE surely is getting a steady diet of him somehow, but my question
is, what is the deal with him?  Secondly, are the comments of his that I
read about on the net merely flame bait, or do people actually take him
seriously?  I gotta tell you, from what I see, he really sounds like an
ass.  Let me know - maybe I'm missing something.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54081
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage

In article <116084@bu.edu> icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera) writes:
>
>	I loved the ABC coverage. The production was excellent. The appearance
Antonio,you weren't alone.

ABC ratings were very good. I was schocked to hear that ABC's telecast
was the fifth most watched sporting event over the weekend. National
rating came out to a very respectable 3.3. Top-29 Nielsen markets were
at 2.9. In Boston,the game scored lower at 2.4 but it had some competion
from local sports teams.
Quite frankly, I expected ABC's ratings to be under 2.0. But I'm happy
to be proven wrong!

Well,well...Sometimes it pays off clicking away on your cable-tv remote
control.:-) And if you happen to be a hockey fan,you could just stumble
upon a playoff hockey game...

ESPN picked up Detroit-Toronto game on Monday night because the only
night game in MLB was being rained out in Chicago. You have to give
ESPN credit for switching to Detroit's FOX-50 coverage and having Bill
Clement at a Pittsburgh's TV station(WATE?) for intermission analysis.
Maybe,ESPN people were giddy over perliminary over-night ABC ratings
for Sunday's telecast and thought it was a good idea to feature the
Norris division showdown rather than a monster truck competion.
Good move,ESPN!


-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54082
From: tmavor@earthview.cms.udel.edu (Tim "Gun for Hire" Mavor)
Subject: Re: ESPN UP YOURS .........

>
>[Various justifiable rantings on ESPN coverage by several deleted]
>

The only way to change ESPN's thinking, if it is even possible, is to complain
to them directly.  Anyone know there telephone # in Bristol, Ct?  

I do find it hard to believe that ESPN doesn't think viewers will simply
change the channel from a boring game....I know I did.  And then, when
they didn't show the NYI-Wash overtime(s), I was livid!  If I wanted
to watch baseball, I could have turned on the Phillies-Padres extra
inning game....instead, I went to bed angry......I boycotted ESPN's
morning Sportscenter today, I was still so incensed.

My wife says I shouldn't go to bed angry, but last nite.........GRRRRRRR!

 
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Tim Mavor		   |  "I am known by many names.......
College of Marine Studies  |   some call me.........Tim."
Univ. of Delaware	   |    
Newark, DE 19716	   |  "You know much that is hidden, O' Tim!"
tmavor@pandora.cms.udel.edu|  	Monty Python and the Holy Grail	---------------------------------------------------------------------


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54083
From: leventhal@cs.bgsu.edu (Laura Leventhal)
Subject: Info - world hockey championships

Does anyone have any information about the world hockey championships and
specifically about the US team?  Game summaries and/or stats would be
greatly appreciated!!  USA Today reported that the US beat the Czech
Republic, but that was the limit of the story.

Thanks
Laura

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54084
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: ABC coverage

In article <9491@blue.cis.pitt.edu> shah@pitt.edu (Ravindra S Shah) writes:
>
>Exactly.  That is my biggest complaint about the coverage so far.
>Follow that damn puck!
>

If ESPN/ABC is going to stick with one-sided Pens-Devils series(and it
looks like they will continue with it on Thursday night), I'd rather
watch pretty women in the stands than non-action on the ice where a
slow,aging NJ team being taken out to lunch by a dynamic Pens squad.

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54085
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: ESPN sucks: OT or Baseball?  Guess which.

In article <C5tC87.Aty@ccu.umanitoba.ca> umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner) writes:
>Showing a meaningless (relatively) baseball game over the overtime of
>game that was tied up with less than 3 seconds left on the clock?
>Gimme a break!  Where does ESPN get these BRILLIANT decisions from?
>

It's called 'contractual obligations' with Major League Baseball.
I would've liked to see the OT of the Isles-Caps game, but I understand
where ESPN is coming from. ESPN is committed to a single telecast a night
and everything after that is a bonus.

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54086
From: LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall)
Subject: Re: Trivia:  the Habs?

In article <C5tI1C.9sy@news.cso.uiuc.edu>
caine@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Lord Vader) writes:
 
>
>
>OK, I'm sure that this has been asked 100's of times before, but I
>have wondered since I heard it...  Where the hell did the nickname
>of the "Habs" come from for the Montreal Canadiens?
>
>Thanks in advance,
>Caine Schneider
 
 
 
 The answer is in the FAQ for this group.  nough said.
 
 
 
Laurie Marshall
Wayne State University
Detroit, Michigan
Go Wings!!!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54087
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: Schedule...

In article <lt8dl1INN2u2@appserv.Eng.Sun.COM> mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler) writes:
>But only in NY,NJ, Philadelphia, and Chicago. Everywhere else, the only
>reason SportsChannel was available was for local baseball broadcasts.
>And local baseball pre-empted the NHL playoffs. Thus far into this

Good point. Not only baseball but local NBA basketball games took
precedence over any SCA's NHL playoff coverage.

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54088
From: LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall)
Subject: Re: Red Wings Goespel...

In article <1993Apr21.040956.12823@wuecl.wustl.edu>
mvs1@cec2.wustl.edu (Michael Virata Sy) writes:
 
>
>        Don't forget Paul Ysebaert, ex-Devil.  He's a good team player.
 
      And Dino Ciccarelli and Ray Sheppard and so on and so on.....
 
    : )
 
Laurie Marshall
Wayne State University
Detroit, Michigan
Go Wings!!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54089
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Wings will win

In article <ragraca.735586800@vela.acs.oakland.edu> ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca) writes:
>
>It's true that Vancouver did not make the playoffs for many a year before 
>Quinn came, but in those years the Smythe Division was a lot--I mean *a lot*--
>tougher division than the Norris, also known as the "Snorris", division.
>Vancouver had to play Edmonton and Calgary, both very legitimate Stanley
>Cup contenders, eight times a year, while Detroit got to play such 
>powerhouses as Toronto and Minnesota.  Now, Edmonton is hardly even a force
>in the league, and the Smythe even has the mighty San Jose sharks, while

Them thar's fighting words...hardly a force...geez...miss the playoffs
once in 15 years, and even after making the final four 3 times in the
last five years, and everyone thinks its doomsville.

>over this same period of time in which Vancouver was improving, so was 
>everybody in the Norris (except St. Louis).  Detroit had to improve just
>to keep up with the competition in their division.  They had to improve *a
>lot* to get better than their competition in the Norris.
>
>Bryan Murray inherited a team with very little talent.  For really good
>players, they had Yzerman, Burr, and Probert, and that was about it.  (And
>no doubt some will dispute whether Burr and Probert were that good). The
>rest were either very green rookies or washed up veterans.  The only reason
>they got as far as they did in the years before Murray came was due to the
>coaching of Demers, who, at least at first, got every last ounce of effort
>possible out of his team.  Then, even his coaching began to degrade.
>

Fedorov, Primeau, Kozlov, Lidstrom, Sillinger, Konstantinov, Drake,
Kennedy, Racine, and Cheveldae were already in the pipeline due to
Devellano...Murray inherited these guys...in addition to Yzerman,
Probert, Carson, Chiasson, etc.

>There are a number of reasons why Detroit wasn't in as bad a shape standings
>wise when Murray took over as Vanc. was when Quinn took over, some of which
>I outlined above, but Murray did not have any better personnel to work with
>at the outset than did Quinn, with the exception of Yzerman.  And one player
>cannot alone make a team into a Stanley Cup contender, as I'm sure everyone
>reading this will agree.  
>

No...Quinn had far less...Murray took over Detroit at a time to 
take advantage of all of Devellano's good drafting...if Devellano
had not given in to Demers request to make the Oates trade, he might
still be GM.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54090
From: jack.petrilli@rose.com (jack petrilli)
Subject: Bruins

On April 23,  mckee@cs.Buffalo.EDU (Douglas McKee) wrote:

M(--> were doomed to 4'th in the division.  I'm still not convinced the
M(--> Sabres will win this series (I've lived in Buffalo all my life, and
M(--> these last 10 years have been playoff Hell), but I'm just sitting
M(--> back, crossing my fingers and hoping the offense can keep scoring

Have no fear, Doug, the Bruins are toast. Statistically, only 2 teams 
in **all** the Stanley Cup series ever played have come back to win. 
And it couldn't have happened to a nicer team, with all the crowing 
from Boston fans I've had to endure over the last month. 

Take heart, Bruins fans. At least you finished first in the Adams 
<sinister chuckle>.

- Jack

 * Laugh and the world thinks you're an idiot.
---
   RoseReader 2.10  P003814 Entered at [ROSE]
   RoseMail 2.10 : RoseNet<=>Usenet Gateway : Rose Media 416-733-2285

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54091
From: jack.petrilli@rose.com (jack petrilli)
Subject: Bruins

On April 23,  wuziyun%suned@cs.yale.edu (You wanna know?) wrote:

W --> 
W --> SEE! The Providence Bruins lost the first two games at home and came back to
W -->      tie the series on the road, there may be hope for the Bruins yet!

Toast. They're toast. (And I know how much you want me to eat these 
words, but it ain't gonna happen.) Are the golf courses in the Boston 
area in playable condition yet?

- Jack

 * Acid consumes 47 times its weight in life!
---
   RoseReader 2.10  P003814 Entered at [ROSE]
   RoseMail 2.10 : RoseNet<=>Usenet Gateway : Rose Media 416-733-2285

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54092
From: jack.petrilli@rose.com (jack petrilli)
Subject: HABS WIN, HABS WIN!!!

On April 23,  JBE5 <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA> wrote:

J<--> 
J<--> Yahooooooooooooooooooooo!
J<--> 
J<--> What a game, we finally beat those diques...and in O.T.!
J<--> The Habs dominated this game and especially in O.T..

You realize that we dominated game 1 also and should be ahead in this 
series 2 - 1?

J<--> Glorieux were plagued by bad luck; the puck wouldn't bounce their
J<--> way.  But in O.T. they got their lucky break, the winning goal
J<--> went off Gusarov's skate.  Thank you Lord!!!!!!

And it's about time! We hit 2 posts in this overtime and 1 post in 
game 1's overtime. Let's hope that **we** start getting some luck for 
a change.

He played well in this game but Roy's inconsistency still makes me 
nervous. Otherwise, I'd say we're going to win this series, no sweat. 
It's all up to Patrick Roy to provide **consistent** goaltending.

J<--> And those damn Bruins lost in O.T., their down 3-0.  Congratulations
J<--> Buffalo!!
J<--> 
J<--> Life doesn't get better than this!!!!!!!!!

Agreed. <g> 

- Jack

 * Tagline Bad or Missing  NO CARRIER
---
   RoseReader 2.10  P003814 Entered at [ROSE]
   RoseMail 2.10 : RoseNet<=>Usenet Gateway : Rose Media 416-733-2285

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54093
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: Hockeytipset 93 avgjort



	         Hockey-tipset, V}ren 1993:
	         ==========================

 *#*#*#*#* Vinnare av Hockey-tipset 1993... Per Bengtson!!! Grattis! *#*#*#*#*

 Slutst{llning:		1. Per Bengtson		15
			2. Lars Andersson	13
			3. Anders Engwall	11
			4. Staffan Axelsson	10
			   Patrik ]sander	10
			6. Hannu L A Hietanen	 9
			   Ingvar Khan		 9
			8. noran@cs.tut.fi	 8
			   Jan Stein		 8
			   Roger Wennstr|m	 8
			11.Lars Thore Aarhus	 7
			   Fredrik Nissen	 7
			   Marek Repinski	 7
			   Lars Wiklund		 7
			15.Lennart Hedenstr|m	 6

 Vinnare och lycklig {gare av en FBK-mugg {r allts} Per Bengtson,
 kometen som ledde hockeytipset 92 vid halvtid men som sedan fick
 ge vika f|r Anders Engwall i slutspurten.

 De tre f|rsta lyckades pricka in den viktiga fr}ga 1.4 SM-guld till Bryn{s.
 Kanske var det v{l sv}rt att tippa slutspelet ocks} men man ser att
 om den j{mna finalen mellan Lule} och Bryn{s ist{llet hade slutat till
 Lule}s f|rdel, s} hade det varit samma vinnare i alla fall.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 H{r f|ljer de korrekta svaren. Siffran inom parentes anger hur m}nga
 som hade tippat detta. * anger Per Bengtsons vinnande rad.


	1. Elitserien

	1.1 Tippa den slutgiltiga tabellen.

	 1. V{ster}s            (7)
	 2. Bryn{s              (2)	*
	 3. Malm|               (4)
	 4. F{rjestad           (5)
	 5. MoDo                (6)
	 6. Lule}               (6)	*
	 7. Leksand             (2)	*
	 8. Djurg}rden          (2)	*

        - - - - - - - - - -
	 9. HV 71              (11)	*
	10. R|gle              (12)	*

	
	1.2 Vilka 4 av de 8 kvartsfinalisterna g}r vidare till semifinal?

	    Djurg}rden          (4)
	    Lule}               (9)
	    Bryn{s              (6)	*
	    Malm|              (13)	*

	1.3 Vilka 2 lag m|ts i final?

	    Lule}               (5)
	    Bryn{s              (4)	*

	1.4 Vilka blir Svenska M{stare 92/93?   (3p)

	    Bryn{s              (4)	*

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

	2. Allsvenskan

	   1. V{stra Fr|lunda  (11)	*
	   2. Huddinge          (3)	*
				
	  - - - - - - - - - - -

	   3. Bj|rkl|ven        (5)
	   4. AIK               (5)	*

	  - - - - - - - - - - -

	   9. Team G{vle        (1)
	  10. Boden             (0)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54094
From: <JOLD@vma.cc.nd.edu>
Subject: New Div. 1 NCAA teams

It was great to hear that UMass is bringing back hockey!  It reminded me that a
couple of years ago there was talk that both Bimidgi (sp?) and Mankato State
trying to upgrade their programs to Div. 1 status.  I also seem to remember
that they had some trouble with new NCAA rule about just who was allowed to
compete at the Div. 1 level.  Was that ever resolved?  Also, I was just
wondering if there is ANY college hockey east of Colorado (Alaska excepted).
With the new popularity of hockey on the west coast, I would expect there to
be some interest building at the collegiate levels too. Anyone heard anything?
                      James Old, e-mail JOLD@vma.cc.nd.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54095
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

In article <1993Apr21.063836.4412@ncsu.edu> delarocq@eos.ncsu.edu (DERRELL EMERY LAROCQUE) writes:
>
>   Tonight in Boston, the Buffalo Sabres blanked the Boston
>Bruins 4-0 tonight in Boston. Looks like Boston can hang
>this season up, because Buffalo's home record is awesome!!!!
>This is great.. Buffalo fans might get to see revenge for
>last year!!!!! :)

I'm glad Grant Fuhr will never be as over-confident after two wins
as you are...it takes four wins to defeat an opponent...each tougher
to obtain than the previous one.  Buffalo is off to a good start...
Fuhr is proving the Fuhr-bashers wrong, but Boston is an awfully
good team.

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54096
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Bruins

In article <1993Apr21.124053.29722@exu.ericsson.se> lmcmasc@noah.ericsson.se writes:
>Could anyone post the game summary for the Sabres-Bruins game.

Grant Fuhr rules! -).

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54097
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Subject: Re: SHARKS: Jack Feirerra (was Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!)

In article <1993Apr23.063737.26286@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>In article <lte43kINN7ul@appserv.Eng.Sun.COM> mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler) writes:
>I don't think trading Kisio was intrinsically a mistake; however, trading him
>for a 3rd round pick would be; he should have been worth a lot more than a
>3rd round pick for a playoff team.  In fact, I would intimate that the offers
>the Sharks got this year for Kisio were way greater than just a 3rd round pick.

Hindsight's 20-20. Nobody expected Kisio to have his 2nd best career year.

>>Besides, without Kisio, the Sharks would have tanked even earlier in
>>the season, and Gund might have gotten a little more serious
>>about getting Joe Murphy, a guy who definitely would be around
>>3 - 5 years from now when the Sharks do make the playoffs.
>
>What else could be done?  The Gunds offered $2 million for Murphy, but the
>Oilers wanted prospect(s), which the Sharks declined to give, which I think is
>correct.

I didn't mean to imply that Gund's offer wasn't enough.  Gund's offer
was the right $, but too late in the season.  $2M offered in November
lets Sather buy a replacement for Murphy *this* season and make the
playoffs *this* year. $2M in March doesn't help Sather with his
immediate objectives, doesn't help with long term objectives (only a
prospect or draft pick does, and no way should the Sharks do that).
However, getting back to what-if games, had Kisio been traded to
Chicago last year, then the Sharks go 0 for October, and maybe Gund
panicks sooner in November. And here's another what-if twist: Chicago
would have had Kisio this season; they *never* go after Murphy in the
first place because Kelly is having his *best* season (bigger guys in
Chicago). So Gund has no competition. So Ferriera, Sather, and Keenan
all look like geniuses.

A broken fax machine, and Ferriera, Keenan, and maybe Kingston
(and maybe even Green) lose their jobs. Kind of makes you
shiver doesn't it. :-)

Bottomline, for every black scenario any of you can concoct for
Kisio leaving, I can concoct an equally bright one.

>>If the Kisio-fiasco was the cause of Ferierra's down fall, I hope
>>it wasn't because he tried to trade Kisio, but because he screwed it
>>up. Nonetheless, I'm sorry Ferierra and Kingston are gone, and I wish Gund
>>would follow.
>
>And what have the Gunds done exactly that caused you to wish that they were
>gone? ...

Are you serious?
	- Let Ferierra go,
	- fire Kingston (these last two basically mean that
		Sharks are starting over again in terms of the
		timetable to capture the Cup. As I've stated
		frequently: 5 out 6 expansion teams had the same GM
		from inception through Cup season)

	- broadcast more home games than away games
	- broadcast very few road Pacific and Mountain time games
	- jack up my ticket prices from $27 to $38 in two years (not that I'm
		going to pay 120 bucks for 3 seats. I'll probably next to the
		virtual 107 folks)

	- not tell me my priority #
	- not let me sell my priority #
	- in order for me to get the free jacket, force me to order my tickets
		for next season before I get to select my section

	- not let me park at the new arena after paying for their
		privileged parking lot (which was sometimes full when
		I got there) for 2 straight years.

I've been a loyal ticket holder, since day 1 (literally) in spring of
'90 when the team was announced.  and I'm not getting that loyalty
returned. Wirtz treats his fans far better by comparison. And
Pocklington with his cheap tix is the best owner of all.

>GO EDMONTON OILERS!  Go for playoffs next year!  Stay in Edmonton!

I know one isn't suppose to make negative comments on signatures, but
what did us Oiler fans do to you to deserve the "Stay in Edmonton"
part? I'd never wish the Kings to leave metro-LA; it's too much fun
watching the Shark's beat them.
-- 
Mike Eisler, mre@Eng.Sun.Com  ``Not only are they [Leafs] the best team, but
 their fans are even more intelligent and insightful than Pittsburgh's.  Their
 players are mighty bright, too.  I mean, he really *was* going to get his
 wallet back, right?'' Jan Brittenson 3/93, on Leaf/Pen woofers in
 rec.sport.hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54098
From: LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here

In article <MfpIRbO00WBLI1ispC@andrew.cmu.edu>
"William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
 
>
>
>     As a person who has rarely even SEEN Don Cherry and doesn't know
>anything about him, I don't know whether it is just this area
>(Pittsburgh) of the USA that is "deprived" of his broadcasts or whether
>he's a Canadian thing altogether.  Seriously, what is he all about?  I
>know he was a coach at one time, and from the volume of posts about him,
>SOMEONE surely is getting a steady diet of him somehow, but my question
>is, what is the deal with him?  Secondly, are the comments of his that I
>read about on the net merely flame bait, or do people actually take him
>seriously?  I gotta tell you, from what I see, he really sounds like an
>ass.  Let me know - maybe I'm missing something.
>
 
 Well, here in Detroit we get to see and hear Don Cherry quite regularly.
The Detroit area picks up Hockey Night in Canada from CBC (ch 9) in
Windsor where we see Don Cherry's Coaches Corner between periods. We
also get to see Don Cherry's Grapevine just before the game. The
Grapevine is a hockey talk show where Don talks to a player or coach
about what else: Hockey.  It's actually a pretty good show and Don
isn't as annoying as he is on Coaches Corner.  I think this is were
Don got his nickname 'Grapes' but I'm not sure.  Don use to coach the
Boston Bruins.  I don't know exactly when that was.  Could someone fill
me in on this info?
  A local radio station here in Detroit (WLLZ) talks to Don every Tuesday
morning.  Personally, I've had my fill of Donny!  He really pisses me off
sometimes.  During the Detroit-Toronto game Monday night on CBC, Don gave
high praise to Doug Gilmour, saying he was a two-way player and not
just a designated goal scorer and that he is probably the best player
in the game because of that.  That's fine and I agree that Gilmour
is a good two-way player BUT he said the EXACT same thing about Yzerman
about a month ago on a local radio talk show.  What gives?
  It seems like he just has a set speech that he changes when he goes from
city to city.
  Don Cherry:  'I think <insert star player name for city that he is in>
              is the best two-way player in the league today.'
 
  There have been other times (can't remember exactly what he said) that he
basically changed his opinions to match the audience he was talking to.
  Someone here on the net said something about how Don criticized Mario
Lemieux but when the time comes for Don to broadcast the Cup playoffs
from the Civic Center (Yes, I think the Pens will make it out of the
Wales Conference) Don will apologize left and right for his remarks about
Lemieux.  In my opinion, he is an ass.  And I won't change my opinion
if I'm in a different city.
  Sorry, if this didn't answer your question better but I just had to get
this off my chest.
 
Laurie Marshall
Wayne State University
Detroit, Michigan
Go Wings!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54099
From: bart@splunge.uucp (Barton Oleksy)
Subject: Re: Oilers for sale??

yadalle@cs.UAlberta.CA (Yadallee Dave S) writes:

>Here's one from the mill.  The Oilers MIGHT move to Hamilton
>where Porklington can get a free deal.

>Given what Labour relations and Puck has been like, it WOULD be a sigh of 
>relief.

>This WAY w4e can can BOTH elements!!

Well, Dave, I would have to disagree with you there.  Satan himself could
own the team, and I'd be happy as long as the Oilers stayed in Edmonton.
Selfish, but true.  I don't want to see the Oilers move, no matter who
their owner is.

Bart, bart@splunge.uucp  or  barto@nait.ab.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54100
From: Mamatha Devineni Ratnam <mr47+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Atlanta's ABC affiliate SUCKS!!!!!


I knew, despite the lack of a full game telecast last week, it was still
too much hockey for Atlanta. Atlanta's ABC has declined to pick up any
playoff games till May9. And even when they show the games on MAy9 and May16,
they will continue to skip the first half hour of the telecast. I know this
is still a better situation compared to rest of Georgia, Alabama, etc., but
it is still pretty annoying. At least in PIttsburgh, we had a network preemptionchannel which showed all netwoork shows prempted by the local affiliate.


I asked them what their problem was. I told them that a local 1.9 rating was
not that bad considering it was the first NHL game shown after a long time
without much promotion. Besides, their syndicated programming in the afternoon
is usually low rated. So what did they have to lose by showing NHL playoffs.
She told me that they had contractual obligations. I asked her if golf
was shown oin ABC, would contractual obligations come in the way. And how come
contractual obligations didn't come in the way of last week's telecast? She
then couldn't give me a coherent answer.


Also, I added that Atlanta had one of the highest neutral site game
attendances and that the demographics were good. I think ABC and other networks
should begin to tie their high rated programs like Roseanne in with
 thier sports programming.
I hope that everyone in Atlanta who reads this bboard calls WSB 2 and complain
bitterlyt about this. Tell them you will stop watching their news telecasts
since they seem to be very unprofessional in handling this situation.

The lady did not seem to settle on a single reason. Sometimes, the reason
is low ratings. Then another time, she says contractual obligations.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54101
From: bpenrose@morgan.ucs.mun.ca (Brian Penrose)
Subject: Re: Trivia question

In article <1993Apr23.102811.623@sei.cmu.edu> caj@sei.cmu.edu (Carol Jarosz) writes:
>
>While watching the Penguins/Devils game last night, I saw the "slash" that
>Barrasso took on the neck.  This brought to mind the goaltender who had his
>jugular vein cut by a skate.  I think he was a Sabre, but I'm not positive.
>Does anyone remember/know his name?  What has happened to him since?  What
>about the player whose skate cut the goalie?  Name?  Info?  Has this ever
>happened before in a hockey game?   
>
>Thanks,
>
>Carol
>Go Pens!

His name is Clint Malarchuk.  I'm not sure what he does now but I've heard
he's an extra in slasher films.

--Brian


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54102
From: Mamatha Devineni Ratnam <mr47+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Atlanta sportsbars



OK. I know I look pretty desperate on this bboard. I think I have posted
3 or 4 messages already on the issue of NHL telecats over the last few weeks.
But, hey. I am pretty desperate. What I am interested is not just a
sportsbar with multiple screens so thast I can watch the game on one
of those silent screens. Are there any hockey oriented bars in this area.
Or does some Patrick division or Adams division fan have a satellite dish?
I don't mind paying an admission fee, if necessary.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54103
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here

In article <MfpIRbO00WBLI1ispC@andrew.cmu.edu> "William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>
>     As a person who has rarely even SEEN Don Cherry and doesn't know
>anything about him, I don't know whether it is just this area
>(Pittsburgh) of the USA that is "deprived" of his broadcasts or whether
>he's a Canadian thing altogether.  Seriously, what is he all about?  I
>know he was a coach at one time, and from the volume of posts about him,
>SOMEONE surely is getting a steady diet of him somehow, but my question
>is, what is the deal with him?  Secondly, are the comments of his that I
>read about on the net merely flame bait, or do people actually take him
>seriously?  I gotta tell you, from what I see, he really sounds like an
>ass.  Let me know - maybe I'm missing something.
>

For those of you who complain about Don Cherry, and wonder why he is
popular...

the reply is Dick Vitale and John Madden and Bobby Knight and
Joe Garagiola and Howard Cosell.

John Madden picks Gary Clark of the Redskins for his All-Madden team
a lot, over much better receivers...for much the same reasons Cherry
sings the praises of Doug Gilmour...a little guy with heart...yet one
doesn't see a string of American posts saying that John Madden has
lost his marbles.

Dick Vitale is always promoting this kid from this high school or
that college with outrageous statements.

Why should Americans expect that Canada would not have such characters
in relation to our greatest passion...which is hockey?   Canadians
are very similar to Americans...culturally our sports are just hockey
and curling, whereas with Americans it is football/basketball/baseball
and bowling.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54104
From: jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM (Jason Cockroft)
Subject: Re: Bowman needs credit

>However, Bowman is really not a modern coach, and
>Patrick's solution of having him only run the team on game days, and
>delegate most of the day-to-day responsibity to the assistants is
>a shrewd managerial decision on Patrick's part.  

I would argue Gerald, that Bowman is the first "modern" coach.
Bowman's Canadiens were the first NHL team to have a weight-room
in the 70s.  He is the first coach I have seen, that manipulates
the press into spreading false game plan rumours.  (During important games
listen to the pre-game interview will Bowman and compare that to
what is on the ice!)  I agree Bowman is a master of the lineups. 
Remember last year in the SC when he benched Jagr only to set him free 
in OT.  When Jagr banged in the winning goal I thought this was
trademark Bowman and also a sign of a modern coach!

I am left asking "What is a modern coach if not Bowman?"

-jake.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54105
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Nords 3 - Habs 2 in O.T. We was robbed!!

In article <1993Apr20.163027.28425@jarvis.csri.toronto.edu> yaska@eecg.toronto.edu (Yaska Sankar) writes:

>>>Paul Stewart is the worst and most biased ref. presently in the NHL.
>>>WE WAS ROBBED!!!!

>>No.  Patrick Roy is the reason the game was lost, and Ron Hextall is the
>>reason Quebec won. 

>I don't buy this at all. Roy was the reason the game was tied... and that
>would *not* have been the case had Dionne kept his cool. 
>Roy stood on his 
>head for the first 15 minutes of the game when the Nords were rushing from 
>end-to-end. Kamensky's mini-break after the tying goal and the first shot by 
>Young in OT were both excellent chances stopped by Roy. Roy outplayed 
>Hextall for most of the game, but Roy becomes the villain and Hextall 
>the hero because Roy's team didn't make full use of their opportunities.

Whoa.  What you are effectively doing is implying that if a player plays
really well, he 'stores up' mistakes that can be used at a later time.  Ths
is not so.  Roy is the 'villain', as you so succinctly put it, because he
allowed a very cheap goal.  If you think Roy outplayed Hextall, perhaps you
should get a tape of the game and watch the first 7-8 minutes of the third
period.  NHL goaltenders _make_ some great saves.  If they did not, they
would not be in the NHL in the first place.  I do not expect any particular
goalie to be able to make the great saves all of the time, even though they
are occasionally required.  However, when it comes to a routine shot like
Sakic's, especially at such a crucial time in a game, I don't think there 
are any legitimate excuses. 

>Hextall, on the other hand, had a lot of lucky bounces 
>[description of lucky bounces.....]
>Hextall wasn't particularly brilliant on those plays ... 

I am not arguing that Hextall was brilliant.  I am arguing is that a
relatively weak wrist shot from the outside of the circle shold not result 
in a goal. 

> ... but it was just the 1 goal. The timing stank, but against
>an explosive team like Quebec, they gave them 1 opportunity too many with
>a powerplay that was totally unnecessary.

In a one-goal game with less than a minute to go there is no such thing as
'just the 1 goal'.  I have not defended Dionne for taking the penalty
either...in fact I think it was a boneheaded move.  But it led to _one_ goal
only, and Montreal had a _two_ goal lead.  My main concern is the second 
goal.

>This most certainly was a team loss... Leclair missed his opportunities,
>as did Bellows and Brunet. Dionne took a bad penalty. Damphousse and Lebeau
>were *silent*. Carbonneau and Savard were a step behind all night. Roy gave
>up the bad goal. Roy, by no means, can be singled out for this loss.

What you say about the skaters is absolutely true.  But realize that the 
game was effectively *won*.  You could watch any hockey game (in fact, you
could watch any sporting event period) and spend hours discussing the 'what
if's' w.r.t. missed opportunities.  They are not important when the final
result is decided.  If I get the time soon, I'll watch the game again and
email you a list of lucky Montreal bounces and a list of Quebec offensive
screwups.  Montreal was _leading_ with a minute to go.  The goalie
is the last line of defence, and I will grant that extra attention is
focussed on him, sometimes without justification.  But Roy gave up a *lousy*
goal, and a team cannot afford such a goal.

>>Roy looked like a player in an industrial league on Sakic's shot.

>And Hextall didn't on Dionne's goal? Please. 

WHO CARES?  Of what value is it to justify one lousy play with a totally
unrelated lousy play?  I could do a Hextall critique if you'd like.  But if
you're going to assess his performance, keep in mind that he made the key
saves at the key times.

>Roy is paid big money because
>that is his value compared to other goalies ... and he still is in the top 5

For the record, I did not say that Roy was not one of the top goaltenders in
the league.  In fact, I agree that he is.

>The Montreal media is the quickest to heap praise and then hurl derogatory
>comments against the Habs. They are no better than uninformed fans.
                            
I assume you are referring to me.  However, I have pointed out that I think
the loss can be blamed on Roy.  I have not said he sucks, nor do I think I've
made any other 'derogatory comments'.  If you regard objective
(and informed, FYI) observations as derogatory, I really can't help you. 

--
dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54106
From: wang@mte.ncsu.edu (Cheng Wang)
Subject: Re: Buffalo Sabres

In article <1r8pc7$sa5@msuinfo.cl.msu.edu> vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu (David
Vergolini) writes:
>  Ok, Buffalo fans.  I am a Red Wings fan, but am amazed at how the Sabres are
>beating up on the Bruins.  Is there any reason for this?  Is it Grant Fuhr or
>Mogilny and Lafontaine?  I would like to hear from you since I do not know
much
>about the Sabres.
>
>
>
>
>
>                                                Dave Vergolini
>                                                Michigan State University
>                                                vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu
>
Pure and Simple, Grant Fuhr is money.  He has been awesome in the playoffs,
especially last night.  But Mogilny has been scoring well, and his russian
friend Kymlev (sp?) has also done well.  But Fuhr is the biggest reason they
are winning, and the difference between this year's team and previous years.

Bill Perry


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54107
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: Ulf and all...

Allan Sullivan (allan@cs.UAlberta.CA) wrote:

: Unfortunately, that is the way the league is heading... You can't fight,
: so the only way to retaliate against someone is with a cheap shot when
: the ref isn't looking. Ulf has brought this to a high level... Players
: stuck in the past (like Neely) who prefer fights to cheap shots
: are at a disadvantage in the new system.

: Lets face it, A cheap shot (like high sticking) is a very effective
: method... It is easier to hide from the refs, has a better chance of
: causing injury, and you can draw people into fights that way. I don't
: like it, but that's the way the league is going.

: By the way, there was a rather good hit by Ulf in the last Penguin-Devil
: game. Managed to hit the NJ player in the face with a stick. (Must have been a
: legal hit... After all, Ulf is a clean player and is allowed to do
: things like that.)

Are there any ex NHL hockey players out there who might care to
comment on this and end this ridiculously long discussion?

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54108
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: Ulf crushes Valeri Zelepukin

Bill Clare 726-9419 (clare@ssd.kodak.com) wrote:
: That more or less says it.  I flicked the Penguins game on briefly and saw
: Ulf cross-check Valeri in the face.  I am wondering if Don Cherry is going to
: go off on this at all in coach's corner.

And that was the ONLY infraction of this type in the game. 
Come on! Wake up! Geez He's not the only player who does this
sort of thing. I think we were kind of lucky. The game was not
really all that "chippy" considering the state NJ is in about
now.

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54109
From: dvb@ick (David Van Beveren)
Subject: Re: TV Coverage - NHL to blame!

sjg3@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (STEVEN JAY GIBBLE) writes:
: 

[ a whole lot of completely ignorant stuff about Pitt. ]

Give this guy a drug test, and some Ridalin whale you are at it.

dvb

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54110
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Subject: Re: Wash/Isl OT game

In article <1993Apr23.091337@staff.dccs.upenn.edu> filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu (Geoff Filinuk) writes:
>	GET OFF ESPN'S BACK AND STOP POSTING ARTICLES ON THIS SUBJECT!!!
>There have been to many f****n complainers about this game that it's making me
>sick.

Generally I agree with you. However, (1) last night ESPN cut away to Baseball
Tonite, which looks like SportsCenter tailored to baseball, and they cut
away at 7:40 pacific. That's quite a contract they have there. (2) if
ESPN couldn't deliver, they should have had a transistion plan to
let SportsChannel pick up the slack.

Nonetheless, it is ultimately the fault of the US-American public that regular
season baseball has precedence over playoff hockey in the U.S.
Support your team; support your game.

Somebody in r.s.h. had an excellent idea that we should write Chrysler
to thank them for supporting hockey with their ads and that we would
consider their products. Here's an equally excellent idea, watch
baseball for 10 minutes (I know I'm asking a lot, but that's what spew
bags are for), write down who is advertising, and write them letters
complaining that they are supporting baseball to your displeasure and
that you won't consider buying their products because of it.
-- 
Mike Eisler, mre@Eng.Sun.Com  ``Not only are they [Leafs] the best team, but
 their fans are even more intelligent and insightful than Pittsburgh's.  Their
 players are mighty bright, too.  I mean, he really *was* going to get his
 wallet back, right?'' Jan Brittenson 3/93, on Leaf/Pen woofers in
 rec.sport.hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54111
From: gjd4n@Virginia.EDU ("Gregory J. Demme")
Subject: Re: Trivia question

  The goalie to whom you refer is Clint Malarchuk.  He was at
that time playing with the Sabres.  His team immediately prior
to that was the Washington Capitals.  While he did recover and
continue to play, I do not know his present whereabouts.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54112
From: mjr4u@Virginia.EDU ("Matthew J. Rush")
Subject: Bernie Nicholls - What a man!

Just some thoughts:

I don't usually like to post simply to make fun of a player,
but this time I couldn't resist.  During the Pens-Devils game
last night, second period, I think Kevin Stevens was in the
penalty box, Nicholls punched Kjell Samuellson in the face,
then raised his stick like a two handed sword to defend
himself!  All Kjell could do, at 8'7" and 355 pounds, was laugh!

And speaking of Swedish Penguins defensemen, Ulf is getting a
little out of hand lately.  His cheap shots are getting more
frequent and more violent.  As everybody in the Meadowlands
except for the officials could see last night, he rammed the
butt of his stick down one of the Devil's throat.  I've always
supported the argument "he does his job by being irritating,"
but he's starting to push it over the edge IMHO.  Of course,
Holik's chop to Barrasso's neck wasn't too sportsmanlike either.
It seems that he was following the "The only way to beat the
Penguins is to injure them" philosophy.

As my Modern Drama professor pointed out to me the other day,
Jagr was stoned pretty well Tuesday night, and last night as
well, although the 30 seconds he danced around the Devils end
was pretty exciting.

Matt at UVA

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54113
From: popovich@cs.columbia.edu (Steve Popovich)
Subject: Re: Truly a sad day for hockey

"Mom" writes:
>I fear that within the next decade or so the only professional sports team
>left in Pittsburgh will be the Steelers.

Perish the thought...but you know, you may be right, at least as far
as MAJOR LEAGUE professional sports teams go.  They all seem to be
becoming BIG MONEY games, much more so than at any previous time.  To
think that if I am ever able to move back home several years from now,
all that may be there is an AHL team, at best...SIGH.

The interesting thing is that the NHL is also expanding, at the same
time as it is dramatically increasing the amount of money needed to
operate a team.  This would seem to indicate that there's a BIG
shake-out about to occur in the next few years, unless player salaries
can somehow be brought under control.  Frankly, I don't see how the
NHL's current drive for expansion is supportable under its current
operating conditions.  If revenue sharing AND a salary cap don't come
into the NHL soon, look out.
	-Steve

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54114
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Subject: Re: ESPN2 - Tell us about it

In article <1993Apr23.094308.6503@walter.cray.com> huot@cray.com (Tom Huot) writes:
>I hadn't heard about this new ESPN2. When is this new network
>supposed to start? Sounds great to me! (as long as my cable co.
					^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>offers it)
^^^^^^^^^^^

Hopefully EPSN will use the lesson given by the master: Ted Turner.
The season Ted introduced TNT, many cable co.'s refused to put it on,
saying that, gee we get enough old movies, miniseries, etc. on TBS,
USA, AMC, WGN, WOR, why do we need another one? This was in the fall.
Come spring, Ted fixed their little red wagons good. The previous
spring, NBA playoffs wore on TBS, now they were on TNT (and still are).
And everyone gets TNT now.

So, ESPN should put NFL football and baseball on ESPN2, and leave
hockey on ESPN. And if cable co.'s play games and drop ESPN
in favor of ESPN2, ESPN should alternate baseball and football between
channels every week.

But, do the ESPN guys collectively have the gonads of the Turner guy?
-- 
Mike Eisler, mre@Eng.Sun.Com  ``Not only are they [Leafs] the best team, but
 their fans are even more intelligent and insightful than Pittsburgh's.  Their
 players are mighty bright, too.  I mean, he really *was* going to get his
 wallet back, right?'' Jan Brittenson 3/93, on Leaf/Pen woofers in
 rec.sport.hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54115
From: ingo@sunee.uwaterloo.ca (Electroholic)
Subject: Re: LIST OF TEE TIMES AT METROPOLITAN TORONTO GOLF COURSES FOR MONDAY

In article <1993Apr20.194441.23595@julian.uwo.ca> lee139@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (Steve Lee) writes:
>
>In article <C5spEC.EuC@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber) writes:
>
>>Kevin L. Stamber
>>Purdue University
>>...and Phil Kirzyc (The Kielbasa Kid) will roam the Arena for interviews.
>
>
>Woops!  This is rec.sport.hockey! Not rec.sport.golf!  Hope you check the
>newsgroup header next time before posting!
>
>Steve

	If the Leaf's play like they did in game one they're going to need
these!  Watching that game _really_ hurt!



					Cheers!
						i.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|  ingo@sunee.uwaterloo.ca                   | The more violent the body     |
|  iwweigel@descartes.uwaterloo.ca           | contact of the sports you     | 
|  ingo@electrical.watstar.uwaterloo.ca      | watch, the lower your class.  |
|  iwweigele@electrical.watstar.uwaterloo.ca |         -- Paul Fussell       |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If the University of Waterloo had on opinion, this probably wouldn't be it...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54116
From: jbrown@vax.cns.muskingum.edu
Subject: ESPN cares less about hockey

ESPN is pathetic, I have been watching everybody complain about ESPN's coverage
and I agree with all of you.  Might I suggest that we are getting all worked up
over nothing.  We ALL knew that ESPN's coverage was going to suck.  I mean have
you ever watched during the regular season Sportscenter coverage of hockey? It
sucks, I mean really sucks!!!  ESPN does not know hockey if it shot them in the
ass.  I was really pissed of about last night, coverage.  I go to school in Ohio
I *know* the Indians suck, so why show them?  If I were Bill Clement I would
shoot myself.

Anyway after I calmed down after I realized that they were not going to show
overtime of the Caps Isles game I thought to myself I knew that this was going
to happen, in fact I remerbed myself praying that at least they would keep even
the boring Devils game.

Overall I think ESPN does not care if they show hockey or not and I firmly
belive that they have know respect for the fans. ie *because of contract       
obligations*, screw you ESPN.

Praise be to all hockey fans who put up with this shit!

GO HAWKS!!!

JB

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54117
From: rick@emma.tfbbs.wimsey.bc.ca (Rick Younie)
Subject: stats for hockey pool

I'm the keeper of the stats for a family hockey pool and I'm looking
for daily/weekly email servers for playoff stats.  I've connected with
the servers at J.Militzok@skidmore.EDU and wilson@cs.ucf.edu.  I'm
still sorting these two out.

Are there others?  Email please as my site doesn't get this group.

Thanks.

Rick
--
 rick@emma.panam.wimsey.bc.ca
 rick@emma.tfbbs.wimsey.bc.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54118
From: steven.kipling@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Steven Kipling) 
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

 -=> Quoting Cire Y. Trehguad to All <=-
CYT> : Michael Collingridge writes:
 : >And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
 : >resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
 : >team captain trivia would be appreciated.
 CYT> ;
 CYT> : Wasn't Ron Francis captain of the Whalers when he was traded to
 CYT> : Pittsburgh?

 CYT> And Rick Tochett was the captain of the Flyers when traded to the Pens
 CYT> recently...

 CYT> Caleb

 CYT> And let us not forget that the New Jersey Devils traded
 CYT> captain Kirk Muller for Stephen Richer and Chorske

 CYT> Man I hated that trade!


        Well as for team captains being traded
        in there first year in the NHL the
        Edmonton Oilers traded their captain
        Ron Chiperfield to the Quebec Nordique
        right at the trading deadline for 
        Goaltender Ron Lowe
        In their second year of existence
        The Edmonton Oilers again right at the trade 
        deadline traded their captain, this time 
        B.J. McDonald to the Vancouver Canucks
        along with the rights to winger Ken 
        Berry for Garry Lariviere and the rights 
        to Lars Gunner Petterson 
        
        as for more captain trivia, the next Edmonton
        captain was Lee Fogilin who was later traded to
        the Buffalo Sabres, after him was Wayne Gretzky
        who was traded to L A, then came Kevin Low who
        only this year was traded to the N Y Rangers
        so that every captain the Edmonton Oilers have had
        has been traded.

        The present captain is Craig McTavish and we'll
        just have to wait and see.


        well talk to you later

        Steve


... Answers: $1, Short: $5, Correct: $25, dumb looks are still free.
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
                                                                                                                  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54119
From: malinich@bucknell.edu (Tom Malinich)
Subject: Montreal Canadiens

Are there any Montreal Canadiens fans out there who can let me the radio
station(s) which are playing the playoff series (including short wave radio
frequencies)?  Lewisburg, PA (home of Bucknell University) is definitely
not a hockey town! 

Please send responses to malinich@bucknell.edu

Thanks!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54120
From: icop@csa.bu.edu (Antonio Pera)
Subject: Re:WJR in Boston


	In the Boston area, you can hear the Rangers on WFAN and the Devils
on WABC, the Whalers on WTIC and the Red Wings on WJR. This of course is in
addition to the Bruins who are currently on WEEI but may move to WHDH because
the fools at WEEI are owned by the Celtics and thus will show them over the
Bruins every time there is a conflict. You can also get WBAL Baltimore but
I don't think they have hockey. BTW, I once got a station from Indiana that
had Fort Wayne Comets games.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54121
From: ccohen@pitt.edu (Caleb N Cohen)
Subject: Re: ESPN sucks: OT or Baseball?  Guess which.

In article <C5tC87.Aty@ccu.umanitoba.ca> umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca writes:
: >Showing a meaningless (relatively) baseball game over the overtime of
: >game that was tied up with less than 3 seconds left on the clock?

What actually happened.  After the Pens game, i turned to ESPN and the game
was nearly at the end of regular, then the phone rang.  I turened off the 
TV - later when i turned it back on, the Indians were on...  Then a
little later, the hockey games was on again, then the baseball game...
what was actually on - not that it matters any more, but some hockey was
in deed on...



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54122
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: Goodbye, good riddance, get lost 'Stars

In article <DT642B1w165w@sms.business.uwo.ca> s4lawren@sms.business.uwo.ca (Stephen Lawrence) writes:
>        Goodbye Minnesota,...you never earned the right to have an NHL 
>franchise in the first place!
>Whatta weird town!!!!!

	Whatta ass!!!!!


-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54123
From: Young-Soo Che <yc25+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: NHLPA poll (partial stats/results)

All these people who send in their polls should take a closer look at
NJD, they are a very deep team, with two very capable goalies, and
excellent forwards and defensemen.  Shooter in Richer, an all around do
it all in Todd, chef Stasny-master of a thousand dishes, power play
captain-Stevens.  Take a look at the numbers, or play with them and see
for yourselves.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54124
From: lange@reg.triumf.ca (THREADING THE CANADIAN TAPESTRY)
Subject: Detroit Playoff Tradition

Way back in the early years (~50's) it took 8 wins to garner the Stanley Cup. 
Soooooo, a couple of local fish mongers (local to the Joe Louis Arena, that is)
started the tradition of throwing an octopi onto the ice with every win.  After
each victory, one leg would be severed before the octopus found its way to the
ice.  (They are dead by the way.)  It was a brilliant marketing strategy to
shore up the demand for one of their least popular products.

Hope this helps.

J. Lange


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54125
From: d_jaracz@oz.plymouth.edu (David R. Jaracz)
Subject: Re: Peter Forsberg

In article <19930423112743.cvincent@poolman.ucs.mun.ca> cvincent@morgan.ucs.mun.ca  (Carl Vincent) writes:
>In Article <1993Apr23.020006.583@spang.Camosun.BC.CA> "ua256@freenet.Victoria.BC.CA (Tom Moffat)" says:
>> 
>> Can some on e give me some stats on Forsrg in the World Championships
>> 
>> If sao mail to ua256@freenet.victoria.bc.ca
>> 
>> -- 
>> Tom Moffat
>> Victoria B.C.
>> Canada
>> 
>Here are the top point getters in the World Jr Hockey Championships:	
>   
>                  G   A  P  
>Forsberg,SWE      7  24 31 <<I am SOOO glad I have both these guys on my
>Naslund,SWE      13  11 24 <<rotisserrie team.  But then again, w/ Mario,
>Vyborny,CZE-SLO   6   9 15   Bure, Gretzky, Neely, P. Turgeon, Damphousse,
>Sundstrom,SWE    10   4 14   Lebeau and Juneau, dunno how much time
>Lehtinen,FIN      6   8 14   they'll get.. :) :) :)
> 



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54126
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: Re: Octopus in Detroit?

Valerie S. Hammerl (hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu) wrote:
: In article <1993Apr17.062622.25380@news.clarkson.edu> farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy) writes:

: >In fact, the tradition has been passed down to their affiliate
: >in Adirondack. In Gm 6 of last yr's finals, an 8 legged creature was
: >hurled onto the frozen pond and landed right at the feet of ref
: >Lance Roberts.

: It may have been passed to Toronto, but I've even seen an octopus at
: the Aud -- last year's Bruins-Sabres game.  I knew all about the
: Detroit version, but seeing at the Aud was a bit puzzling.  :-)

I don't think it's puzzling a bit. It's called "unoriginality".

(no, i'm not bitter :)

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54127
From: bks2@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (bryan.k.strouse)
Subject: NHL PLAYOFFS RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4-20-93



NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR 4/20/93.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                  CONFERENCE SEMI-FINALS        BEST OF SEVEN
      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE
 
 NJ                  BUF   (leads 2-0)   STL   (leads 1-0)   WIN               
 PIT   (leads 2-0)   BOS                 CHI                 VAN   (leads 1-0)

 NYI   (tied  1-1)   MON                 TOR                 LA    (leads 1-0) 
 WAS                 QUE   (leads 2-0)   DET   (leads 1-0)   CAL              

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

New Jersey Devils                         0   0   0   -   0
Pittsburgh Penguins  (leads series 2-0)   2   4   1   -   7

1st period: PIT, McEachern 1 - (Francis, Taglianetti) 15:09
	    PIT, M.Lemieux 3 - (U.Samuelsson, Barrasso) (sh) 17:41

2nd period: PIT, Tocchet 2 - (K.Stevens, U.Samuelsson) 3:48
	    PIT, Jagr 2 - (Francis, Ramsey) 12:39
	    PIT, K.Stevens 1 - (Francis, Murphy) (pp) 15:43 
	    PIT, McEachern 2 - (Daniels, Mullen) 16:46

3rd period: PIT, Mullen 1 - (Francis, Barrasso) 17:42

Powerplay Opportunities-Devils   0 of 5
			Penguins 1 of 4

Shots on Goal-	Devils    12  11  13  -  36
		Penguins  13  10   4  -  27

New Jersey Devils--Terreri (0-2) (23 shots - 17 saves)  Billington (0:00 third)
	     	   (4 shots - 3 saves)
Pittsburgh Penguins--Barrasso (2-0) (36 shots - 36 saves)

ATT-16,164

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

New York Islanders   (series tied 1-1)   1   1   2   0   1   -   5
Washington Capitals                      0   2   2   0   0   -   4

1st period: NYI, Turgeon 1 - (King, Thomas) 13:14

2nd period: WAS, Hunter 3 - (Johansson, Miller) 6:33
	    NYI, Turgeon 2 - (Thomas, Vaske) 12:36
	    WAS, Hunter 4 - (Johansson, Carpenter) (pp) 16:51

3rd period: NYI, Hogue 1 - 3:31
	    WAS, Khristich 2 - (Cavallini, Bondra) 7:16
	    NYI, Ferraro 2 - (Flatley, Hogue) 14:50
	    WAS, Hunter 5 - (Johansson, Khristich) (pp) 19:57

1 Overtime: NONE

2 Overtime: NYI, Mullen 1 - (Ferraro, Flatley) 14:15

Powerplay Opportunities-Islanders 0 of 5
			Capitals  2 of 5

Shots on Goal-	Islanders  14  17   8  13   9  -  61
		Capitals    6   9  11  14   5  -  45

New York Islanders--Healy (1-1) (45 shots - 41 saves)
Washington Capitals--Tabaracci (1-1) (61 shots - 56 saves)

ATT-15,421

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Montreal Canadiens                       0   0   1   -   1
Quebec Nordiques    (leads series 2-0)   3   0   1   -   4

1st period: QUE, Leschyshyn 1 - (Kamensky, Sakic) (pp) 4:19
	    QUE, Young 2 - (Lapointe) 11:41
	    QUE, Young 3 - (Lapointe, Duchesne) 13:56

2nd period: NONE

3rd period: MON, Bellows 2 - (Odelein) 11:05
	    QUE, Lapointe 1 - (Ricci) (en) 19:23

Powerplay Opportunities-Canadiens 0 of 1
			Nordiques 1 of 2

Shots on Goal-	Canadiens   8  10  15  -  33
		Nordiques  18  14   6  -  38

Montreal Canadiens--Roy (0-2) (37 shots - 34 saves)
Quebec Nordiques--Hextall (2-0) (33 shots - 32 saves)

ATT-15,399

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Buffalo Sabres  (leads series 2-0)   2   1   1   -   4
Boston Bruins                        0   0   0   -   0

1st period: BUF, Presley 1 - (sh) 4:27
	    BUF, Wood 1 - (Houlder, B.Sweeney) (pp) 8:07

2nd period: BUF, Mogilny 3 - (LaFontaine) 5:03
	   
3rd period: BUF, Hawerchuk 1 - (Carney, Smehlik) (pp) 14:48

Powerplay Opportunities-Sabres 2 of 4
			Bruins 0 of 5

Shots on Goal-	Sabres   9   8   8  -  25
		Bruins  14  12   8  -  34

Buffalo Sabres--Fuhr (2-0) (34 shots - 34 saves)
Boston Bruins--Moog (0-2) (10 shots - 7 saves)  Blue (5:03 second) (15 shots -
	       14 saves)

ATT-14,448

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


\|||||/
-SPIKE-




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54128
From: loh@fraser.sfu.ca (Keith Meng-Wei Loh)
Subject: Re: ESPN cares less about hockey

jbrown@vax.cns.muskingum.edu writes:

>ESPN is pathetic, I have been watching everybody complain about ESPN's coverage
>and I agree with all of you.  Might I suggest that we are getting all worked up
>over nothing.  We ALL knew that ESPN's coverage was going to suck.  I mean have
>you ever watched during the regular season Sportscenter coverage of hockey? It
>sucks, I mean really sucks!!!  ESPN does not know hockey if it shot them in the
>ass.  I was really pissed of about last night, coverage.  I go to school in Ohio
>I *know* the Indians suck, so why show them?  If I were Bill Clement I would
>shoot myself.

I hope this makes you feel better, but the overtime between the Isles and
the Caps was GREAT!!! 


Hang in there. :) 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54129
From: chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Subject: Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!

nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:

>And Cherbayev was initially supposed to play for the Russian WC Team.  (Anybody
>know what happened there?)

Yeah, they finally came to agreement on a contract. As soon as the ink was
dry, he suddenly decided Kansas City was a neat place to be. (ergo, the
"want to play for the national team" was a bargaining chip).

-- 
 Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= chuq@apple.com
   Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms =+=  GEnie: MAC.BIGOT =+= ALink:CHUQ 
  Minor League fans: minors-request@medraut.apple.com (San Jose Giants: A/1/9)
  San Francisco Giants fans: giants-request@medraut.apple.com (The Stick?NOT!)
   San Jose Sharks fans: sharks-request@medraut.apple.com (New seat: 127/TBD)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54130
From: kfrank@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Kevin D Frank)
Subject: Re: Area-code for Edmonton, Alberta, CANADA...

Believe it or not, we DO have phone books, but the current information does
not include an area code for Edmonton Alberta.

I would not be so hostile towards others for asking simple questions...

"I would rather appear stupid than open my moutha nd remove all doubt."
							-Mark Twain

-- 
	"If you assult someone you get 5 years--In hockey, 5 minutes.
			Is this a great sport or what?!"

Kevin D. Frank					kfrank@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54131
From: Bhullar@BLDG_HSC_CAMPUS (Raj BHULLAR)
Subject: Buffalo Sabres

Can the Sabres win two more games against the Bruins?

I think game three in Buffalo will be the most important of the
series.  If the Sabres lose that game, the party will be over.  It will 
be hello next year.

The key for the remaining games in the series will be whether Fuhr can
keep up his brillliant goaltending and if Mogilny can continue skate by 
the Bruins.  He has shown demonstrated excellent speed.

Finally, the Sabres appear to have shown up for the post season.






Sabres/Bills Fan      

   

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54132
From: Mark D. Whitten <347NFET@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: If You Were Pat Burns ...

If I were Pat Burns I'd throw in the towel. The wings dominated every
aspect of the game.  Trying to mix up the lines is a dead end.  Murray
has too many combinations to counter with. My prediction is wings in 5.

Mark
Let's Go Wings!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54133
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: Grant Fuhr leads Sabres

  Buffalo is up 2-0 is the series with Boston, and the reason....Grant Fuhr ?
  Fuhr is playoff hungry, and he's proving once again why they call him
  money goaltender. Fuhr might not be one of the best goaltenders in the
  league anymore (Statistically at least), but he's proving that he can
  make the big save at the right time.
  
  The Leafs should have kept Fuhr, and probably would have had a chance 
  against powerhouse Detroit. But again.......where was Andreychoke in game 1 ?

  I can see the huge smile on Gerald's face after Fuhr's performance.
 
  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54134
From: gballent@hudson.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Roger Maynard

Does anyone recieve annoying email from Roger Maynard whenever they post an
article telling them to leave him alon and stop posting to the group??
These emails are filled with insults- more than are usual in Roger's posts
and have little if any hockey info.
I have recieved two in the last 2 days.
I am just wondering if I am special or Roger trys to bully everyone who
disagrees with him.

Gregmeister

Obligatory hockey comment:

It is highly unlikely that the Maple Leafs will even get out of their
division.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54135
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: Goodbye, good riddance, get lost 'Stars

In article <1993Apr21.070706.21059@julian.uwo.ca> kirk@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (ANDREW KIRK) writes:
>Back to hockey,
>the North Stars should be moved because for the past few years they have
>just been SHIT. A real team like Toronto would never be moved!!!

	Well, if SHIT means going to the Stanley Cup finals a couple years
ago, I'd rather be shit than a leaf fan.

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54136
From: kerryy@bnr.ca (Kerry Yackoboski)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here

In article <MfpIRbO00WBLI1ispC@andrew.cmu.edu>, "William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
|> 
|>      As a person who has rarely even SEEN Don Cherry and doesn't know
|> anything about him, I don't know whether it is just this area
|> (Pittsburgh) of the USA that is "deprived" of his broadcasts or whether
|> he's a Canadian thing altogether.  Seriously, what is he all about?  I
|> know he was a coach at one time, and from the volume of posts about him,
|> SOMEONE surely is getting a steady diet of him somehow, but my question
|> is, what is the deal with him?  Secondly, are the comments of his that I
|> read about on the net merely flame bait, or do people actually take him
|> seriously?  I gotta tell you, from what I see, he really sounds like an
|> ass.  Let me know - maybe I'm missing something.

I asked him, and Don Cherry denies being Roger Maynard and he denies
any knowledge of Usenet. :-)

He did concede that Roger is the best two way poster on the net today.
His defense is as good as his offence.... :-)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54137
From: 35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca
Subject: Re: Area-code for Edmonton, Alberta, CANADA...

In article <1993Apr22.232317.6924@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>, kfrank@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Kevin D Frank) writes:
> I'm trying to get ahold of the directory assistance operator in Edmonton, but
> I need the area code to do so.  If you know it, please e-mail me directly as
> I have little time to scan through all the posts.
> 
> Much appreciated!!!

Geez, I didn't realize things were so bad at Ohio State that they can't
afford phone books, or even operators.

This is probably Clinton's fault, isn't it...8^)

403.

Paul Badertscher
35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54138
From: 35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca
Subject: CBC: Canadian for ESPN.

Hooray, I hear on TSN that the Jets have won a game, Selanne
getting a hat-trick!

Of course, here in GOD'S COUNTRY (read Ontario!) I couldn't
see that game, nor any other in the VAN-WPG series so far,
because our beloved CBC figures no one out here cares about
this series (which has looked pretty competitve so far...

On Monday and Wednesday nights, CBC could have shown the Toronto-
Detroit game, done the news, then picked up Winnipeg-Vancouver.
They didn't.  Tonight?  You guessed it, Toronto-Detroit, the
news (not the end of the Jets game), then Calgary-LA.

SO, if it's "Hockey Night in Canada", why can't this Ontarian see
one of the two series with two Canadian teams?  Is this too much to
ask?

Paul Badertscher
35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54139
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: Jets/Canucks - Jets hold on, win 5-4

Teemu Selanne had 3 goals, Keith Tkachuk had one, and Luciano Borsato
scored a rare Jets shorthanded goal as the Jets held on to beat the
Canucks 5-4, and close the series to 2-1.  Trevor Linden and Pavel
Bure had two goals each for the Canucks in a losing cause.

Selanne came out of a two game goal scoring slump, scoring two powerplay
goals, and one on a nice breakaway pass from Darrin Shannon.

Hard work paid off tonight for the Jets, and if the Jets continue to
exhibit this strong work effort, they can make a series of it. (I woofed
last year when we were up 3-1...I ain't going to do THAT again.  I'll
have to be quietly happy with a solid performance.  ;)

Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54158
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Devils and Islanders tiebreaker????

In article <C5LFA4.E10@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> cal2d@csissun11.ee.Virginia.EDU (Craig Allen Lorie) writes:
>According to the hockey gurus over at ESPN, should the Islanders win tonite
>the two teams will have the same record, but the Devils will be playing the
>Penguins.  This is because the Islanders have won the season series against
>the Devils.  I think the rules for deciding a tie breaker include:
>
>1.  season series
>2.  goals against
>3.  goals for
>
>in this order (correct me if I'm wrong).  Anyone have anything to add?
>

I thought it was 1) wins 2) goals for.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54159
From: fgiraffe@well.sf.ca.us (Frank Giraffe)
Subject: Re: SHARKS: Jack Feirerra (was Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!)


>        - broadcast more home games than away games
>        - broadcast very few road Pacific and Mountain time games
>        - jack up my ticket prices from $27 to $38 in two years (not that
I'm
>                going to pay 120 bucks for 3 seats. I'll probably next to
the
>                virtual 107 folks)
>        - not tell me my priority #
>        - not let me sell my priority #
>        - in order for me to get the free jacket, force me to order my
tickets
>                for next season before I get to select my section
>        - not let me park at the new arena after paying for their

Grrrr, let's start a whole 'nother topic on show bad the sharks are doing on
these things. I swear that ALL of my partial plan games were televised (I
know, I'm exaggerating, but...).
In order:
-the new ticket prices suck
-wait 'till people try to park at games next year. Public transit? Yeah
right, I'd love to take caltrain for 3 hours to see a 3 hour game.

Shelling out hundreds of dollars for partial season plans for two years
doesnt mean anything to the sharks, as I get to pick my seats after the dead
rise from their graves to claim their seats! :-)
-Frank
-- 
>Frank Giraffe- fgiraffe@well.sf.ca.us - {apple,pacbell,ucbvax}!well!fgiraffe
>As the noose of narco-militarism tightens 'round our necks, we worry about
>  burning flags and pee in jars at work to keep our jobs.  -- Jello Biafra

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54160
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here

In article <MfpIRbO00WBLI1ispC@andrew.cmu.edu> "William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
>     As a person who has rarely even SEEN Don Cherry and doesn't know
>anything about him, I don't know whether it is just this area
>(Pittsburgh) of the USA that is "deprived" of his broadcasts or whether
>he's a Canadian thing altogether.  Seriously, what is he all about?  I

He's a Canadian "thing". Former coach of the Boston Bruins and Colorado
Rockies. From the summaries that get posted I gather that his ongoing beef
this year has been the conventional wisdom that Canadian hockey is doomed
to be second or third rate behind the perceived emergence of the U.S.
and European programs.

>know he was a coach at one time, and from the volume of posts about him,
>SOMEONE surely is getting a steady diet of him somehow, but my question
>is, what is the deal with him?  Secondly, are the comments of his that I

After he left the Rockies, he got a job with CBC's Hockey Night in Canada
and hasn't looked back since. Actually, he did work for CBC at least
on playoff season after the Rockies were eliminated.

>read about on the net merely flame bait, or do people actually take him
>seriously?  I gotta tell you, from what I see, he really sounds like an

I'd say it's a combination of flame bait and serious journalism. The closest
thing you'll find to Cherry in the U.S. is Stan Fischler, a self-described
hockey maven. The similarities are that they both say things that get
people upset. The difference is that Cherry knows the game and Fischler
doesn't.

>ass.  Let me know - maybe I'm missing something.

Don's a character. If he were completely rational and noncontroversial
he wouldn't have a job. By some definitions, he could be called an ass.
But then some people feel the same about Mike Lang, another character that
I wish would get wider exposure (only one national telecast last year).
-- 
Mike Eisler, mre@Eng.Sun.Com  ``Not only are they [Leafs] the best team, but
 their fans are even more intelligent and insightful than Pittsburgh's.  Their
 players are mighty bright, too.  I mean, he really *was* going to get his
 wallet back, right?'' Jan Brittenson 3/93, on Leaf/Pen woofers in
 rec.sport.hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54161
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Goalie mask poll update 4/21/93

Current votes for favorite goalie masks (3pts - 1st, 2pts - 2nd, 1pt - 3rd)

Player                    Team                 Pts       Votes
--------------------------------------------------------------
1. Ed Belfour             Chicago              31         14
2. Andy Moog              Boston               30         13
3. Curtis Joseph          St. Louis            26         11 
   Brian Hayward          San Jose             26         10 
5. Ron Hextall            Quebec               16          8
6. Gerry Cheevers         Boston (retired)     11          6 
7. John Vanbeisbrouck     NY Rangers           10          4
   Grant Fuhr             Buffalo              10          4 
9. Mike Richter           NY Rangers            6          3
10. Manon Rheaume         Atlanta (IHL)         5          2
11. Don Beaupre           Washington            4          2
    Ken Dryden            Montreal (retired)    4          2
--------------------------------------------------------------
Others receiving less than 4pts: Mike Vernon (Cal), Clint
 Malarchuk (Buf/SD,IHL), Tommy Soderstrom (Phil), Ray LeBlanc (USA),
 Artus Irbe (SJ), Tim Cheveldae (Det), Sean Burke (NJ),
 Rick Wamsley (Tor,ret), Jon Casey (Minn), Bob Essensa (Win),
 Glenn Healy (NYI), Toy Espo (???), Gilles Gratton (???),
 Rod Stauber (LA), Gump Worsley (???), Pat Jablonski (TB),
 Grant Fuhr (Tor), Felix Potvin (Tor), Stephane Beauregard (Win),
 Mark Fitzpatrick (NYI), Chico Resch (NYI)


Can someone please tell me which teams the (???) play(ed) for? Thanks.

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54162
From: slegge@kean.ucs.mun.ca
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains 

ST>         as for more captain trivia, the next Edmonton
ST>         catain was Lee Fogilin who was later traded to
ST>         the Buffalo Sabres, after him was Wayne Gretzky
ST>         who w   traded to L A, then came Kevin Low who
ST>         nly this year was traded to the N Y Rangers
 
Wasn't Mark Messier Captain of the oilers before Kevin Lowe?
But, of course, he was traded as well -- so your point of every
Oilers captain being traded is still true.
 
Stephen Legge
SLEGGE@kean.ucs.mun.ca


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54163
From: cdash@moet.cs.colorado.edu (Charles Shub)
Subject: ESPN really sucks big time


so all us hockey/automobile racing fans all know exactly where we stand
	ESPN delays the martinsville race by a day for the NFL draft
	ESPN shows baseball instead of the overtime of a NHL playoff game

	gimme a break, guys

=>  >>Does anyone know why this race is tape delay? Especially until Monday???
=>  >Is this the weekend for the NFL draft?
=>  >If so, postponing the race for a day is
=>  >a real slap in the face for racing fans.
=>  I'm afraid you're right (as usual). As I recall they've been doing this
=>  ever since they started covering the draft live. I wish they could work
=>  out some kind of a deal with somebody else such as TNN to get the race
=>  on live, but I guess ESPN isn't much into sharing. It also clarifies
=>  where auto racing stands on their priority list (as if we didn't already
=>  know ;-)
-- 

charlie shub  cdash@cs.Colorado.EDU       -or-         (719) 593-3492     
on leave at the University of Iowa  cdash@cs.uiowa.edu (319) 335-0739

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54164
From: tvartiai@vipunen.hut.fi (Tommi Vartiainen)
Subject: Re: Finland/Sweden vs.NHL teams (WAS:Helsinki/Stockholm & NHL expansion)

In <1993Apr16.195754.5476@ousrvr.oulu.fi> mep@phoenix.oulu.fi (Marko Poutiainen) writes:

>: FINLAND:  
>: 
>: D-Jyrki Lumme.......20
>: D-Teppo Numminen....20
>: D-Peter Ahola.......13
>: 
>Well well, they don't like our defenders (mainly Lumme and Numminen)...

About 25 is correct for Numminen and Lumme.


>: R-Teemu Selanne.....27
>: 
>Compared to Kurri, Selanne's points are too high, lets make it 25 or 26.

No, Kurri's points are too low. 27 for Kurri and 28 for Sel{nne.

>: well in the Canada Cup and World Championships largely due to the efforts of
>: Markus Ketterer (the goalie), 3-4 or the players listed above and luck. There's
>: presumably a lot of decent players in Finland that wouldn't be superstars at
>: the highest level but still valuable role players, however. My guess would be
>: that the Finnish Canada Cup team would be a .500 team in the NHL.

>Wow, now, it looks like you don't like our players? What about guys like:
>Nieminen, Jutila, Riihijarvi, Varvio, Laukkanen, Makela, Keskinen and (even
>if he is aging) Ruotsalainen? The main difference between finnish and North-
>American players is, that our players tend to be better in the larger rink.
>The Canadian defenders are usually slower that defenders in Europe. 
>And I think that there was more in our success than Ketterer and luck (though
>they helped). I think that the main reason was, that the team worked well
>together.


That's true. Game is so different here in Europe compared to NHL. North-ame-
ricans are better in small rinks and europeans in large rinks. An average
european player from Sweden, Finland, Russian or Tsech/Slovakia is a better 
skater and  puckhandler than his NHL colleague. Especially defenders in NHL
are mainly slow and clumsy. Sel{nne has also said that in the Finnish Sm-league
game is more based on skill than in NHL. In Finland he couldn't get so many 
breakaways because defenders here are an average much better skaters than in
NHL. Also Alpo Suhonen said that in NHL Sel{nne's speed accentuates because
of clumsy defensemen.

I have to admit that the best players come from Canada, but those regulars
aren't as skilful as regulars in the best european leagues. Also top europeans
are in the same level as the best north-americans.(except Lemieux is in the
class of his own). 

Tommi

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54165
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: RUMOUR - Keenan signs with Rangers?

In article <1993Apr16.185823.6310@news.columbia.edu> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>
>Interestingly, Keenan's co-coach (or is it his "Number One"?) on Team
>Canada at the World Championships is Roger Neilsen.  
>

But ultimately their hockey philosophies are like night and day...
Keenan believes in pressuring the opposition and taking the
initiative (within the limits of his system)...while Roger
has a reactive hockey philosophy...which is why Messier will
be able to and has played for Keenan, but thought Roger's way
was a sure loser.

>It'd be interesting if the Rangers call in the balance of Neilsen's
>contract to be Keenan's assistant ...  Roger did do a very good job
>with the mediocre players, just as he handled the Cinderella Canucks
>of 10 years ago ... but his mistake was playing the Rangers like those
>Canucks last May ...
>

Roger is a great assistant coach...but considering what must be bad
blood between Nielson and Messier, it would be a mistake to bring
him back even in that role.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54166
From: gomer+@pitt.edu (Richard J Coyle)
Subject: Re: Goodbye, good riddance, get lost 'Stars

In article <1993Apr21.070706.21059@julian.uwo.ca> kirk@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (ANDREW KIRK) writes:
>Losers like us? You are the fucking moron who has never heard of the Western
>Business School, or the University of Western Ontario for that matter. Why 
>don't you pull your head out of your asshole and smell something other than
>shit for once so you can look on a map to see where UWO is! Back to hockey,
>the North Stars should be moved because for the past few years they have
>just been SHIT. A real team like Toronto would never be moved!!!

Not only have I not heard of the Western Business School, or the University
of Western Ontario, I've never even wondered if there WAS a western
Ontario.  And judging by the quality of the posts coming from there, I'm
still not sure that the place exists.

Perhaps I should be impressed, though, since it appears that grade school
children in that area have access to the Internet.

rick

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54167
From: mckinzie@schaefer.math.wisc.edu (Mark McKinzie)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here

"William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:


>     As a person who has rarely even SEEN Don Cherry and doesn't know
>anything about him, I don't know whether it is just this area
>(Pittsburgh) of the USA that is "deprived" of his broadcasts or whether
>he's a Canadian thing altogether.  Seriously, what is he all about?  I
>know he was a coach at one time, and from the volume of posts about him,
>SOMEONE surely is getting a steady diet of him somehow, but my question
>is, what is the deal with him?  Secondly, are the comments of his that I
>read about on the net merely flame bait, or do people actually take him
>seriously?  I gotta tell you, from what I see, he really sounds like an
>ass.  Let me know - maybe I'm missing something.

From his Topps "rookie" year (as coach) card (74-75):
"For the past couple of seasons, Don has been the highly-successful
 coach of the Rochester Americans of the AHL, but he is getting his
 first shot at an NHL job with the Bruins.  Named Coach of the Year
 in the AHL the last two years, and he aims to make the Bruins a
 rough team again, as they were a couple of years back.  Although
 he played 16 seasons of professional hockey, Don never played a
 regular-season NHL game.  He did appear in one playoff game for
 Boston in 1956-57.  Don's brother, Dick, played two seasons in the
 NHL with Boston and Philadelphia."



-- 
Mark McKinzie          |    Listen, if they're going to buy lunch boxes,
mckinzie@math.wisc.edu | they might as well buy David Cassidy lunch boxes.
UW Dept. of Mathematics|
Madison, WI 53706      |                  -David Cassidy-

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54168
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Hockey Draft Final Standings

Here are the final stadings for the USENET Hockey Draft.  Congratulations
to this year's winner, Dave Wessels of Victoria, B.C., who parlayed his
initial 1000 points into 1575.9 points!

Thanks to all 262 teams for entering the biggest USENET Hockey Draft ever!
I hope to hear from you all again this September, for the 7th Annual draft.

It has been my pleasure running the draft, and I hope you all had fun.

	- Andrew

USENET Hockey Draft Standings
Week 28

Posn	Team				Total	Pts	Cash	Last Posn

1.	Dave Wessels                    1575.9	1574	1.9	(1)
2.	Gilles Carmel                   1539.0	1538	1.0	(3)
	Bob Hill                        1539.0	1515	24.0	(2)
4.	Seppo Kemppainen                1515.2	1468	47.2	(4)
5.	The Awesome Oilers              1513.0	1458	68.6	(5)
6.	Hillside Raiders                1503.0	1496	7.0	(6)
7.	Mak "The Knife" Paranjape       1500.0	1469	31.0	(7)
8.	Jan Stein                       1492.3	1457	35.3	(8)
9.	this years model                1488.6	1471	17.6	(9)
10.	Tapio Repo                      1486.6	1467	19.6	(10)
11.	Rangers Of Destiny              1486.0	1444	42.0	(10)
12.	The Underachievers              1459.1	1449	10.1	(13)
13.	FRANK'S BIG FISH                1457.0	1435	22.0	(12)
14.	Go Flames                       1448.3	1408	40.3	(15)
15.	On Thin Ice                     1444.3	1412	32.3	(14)
16.	Mopar Muscle Men                1441.7	1438	3.7	(17)
17.	littlest giants                 1439.6	1404	35.6	(16)
18.	Lindros Losers                  1427.7	1426	1.7	(18)
19.	DIE Penguin Bandwaggoners       1412.2	1392	20.2	(19)
20.	Samuel Lau (Calgary, Alberta)   1401.9	1397	4.9	(20)
21.	Boomer's Boys                   1374.2	1374	0.2	(21)
22.	Delaware Wombats                1372.3	1371	1.3	(23)
23.	General Accounting Office       1365.9	1345	20.9	(22)
24.	Migods Menschen                 1365.6	1334	31.6	(24)
25.	Wellsy's Buttheads DEC NH       1363.6	1311	52.6	(25)
26.	Fife Flyers                     1356.4	1325	31.4	(27)
27.	Rocky Mountain High             1352.8	1351	1.8	(26)
28.	Dave Snell                      1346.0	1321	25.0	(29)
29.	Fluide Glacial                  1341.0	1323	18.0	(30)
30.	Gerald Olchowy                  1337.7	1304	33.7	(28)
31.	Gaoler                          1317.2	1306	11.2	(31)
32.	SmegHeads                       1316.3	1316	0.3	(32)
33.	Neural Netters                  1309.3	1298	11.3	(35)
34.	The Young And The Skateless     1307.9	1265	42.9	(33)
35.	Sam & His Dogs                  1297.6	1286	11.6	(34)
36.	Artic Storm                     1293.3	1254	39.3	(37)
37.	Youngbucs                       1293.0	1238	101.7	(36)
38.	Soft Swedes                     1284.9	1238	46.9	(38)
39.	Simmonac                        1280.8	1260	20.8	(46)
40.	Milton Keynes Kings             1271.8	1269	2.8	(40)
41.	Jeff Horvath                    1266.6	1261	5.6	(39)
42.	Legion of Hoth                  1265.8	1250	15.8	(45)
43.	Le Fleur de Lys                 1264.3	1239	25.3	(43)
44.	Yan The Man Loke                1263.7	1263	0.7	(44)
45.	Kuehn Crushers                  1258.1	1213	45.1	(41)
46.	Hamster from Hoboken            1254.7	1246	8.7	(41)
47.	Streaks                         1249.8	1195	54.8	(49)
48.	Brian Bergman                   1249.3	1226	23.3	(50)
49.	The Finnish Force               1248.5	1226	22.5	(47)
50.	Grant Marven                    1239.9	1237	2.9	(53)
51.	ice legion                      1239.8	1211	28.8	(48)
52.	Goaldingers                     1237.0	1215	22.0	(51)
53.	T C OverAchievers               1231.9	1229	2.9	(52)
54.	Randy Coulman                   1226.2	1221	5.2	(62)
55.	Bozrah Bruins                   1225.2	1180	45.2	(54)
56.	Skriko Wolves                   1223.4	1218	5.4	(57)
57.	buffalo soldiers                1223.0	1168	62.1	(59)
58.	Houdini's Magicians             1221.3	1203	18.3	(56)
59.	Steven And Mark Dream Team      1219.1	1216	3.1	(64)
60.	Real Bad Toe Jam                1216.9	1168	48.9	(55)
61.	rec.sport.hockey choices        1216.3	1215	1.3	(58)
62.	bemybaby                        1216.2	1162	54.2	(60)
63.	LAMP LIGHTERS                   1213.9	1208	5.9	(63)
64.	LIPPE                           1212.9	1199	13.9	(61)
65.	Phil and Kev's Karma Dudes      1205.8	1205	0.8	(69)
66.	Doug Bowles                     1203.0	1183	20.0	(72)
67.	Bloom County All Stars          1202.3	1198	4.3	(67)
68.	Tom                             1202.1	1189	13.1	(66)
69.	Indianapolis Bennies            1197.8	1177	20.8	(65)
70.	Bruins                          1196.1	1196	0.1	(68)
71.	smithw                          1195.0	1174	21.0	(70)
72.	AIK Exiles                      1188.5	1154	34.5	(77)
73.	Iowa Hockeyes                   1188.3	1172	16.3	(71)
74.	Frank Worthless                 1186.3	1180	6.3	(76)
75.	The Great Pumpkin               1183.4	1129	54.4	(73)
76.	NON!                            1182.4	1166	16.4	(74)
77.	shooting seamen                 1180.1	1180	0.1	(75)
78.	Invisible Inc                   1178.1	1177	1.1	(78)
79.	Brad Gibson                     1174.2	1147	27.2	(79)
80.	Cougarmania                     1170.8	1146	24.8	(80)
81.	John Zupancic                   1170.1	1143	27.1	(84)
82.	David Wong                      1166.0	1111	66.1	(83)
83.	garryola                        1165.7	1156	9.7	(85)
84.	Gary Bergman Fan Club           1163.1	1158	5.1	(86)
	Staffan Axelsson                1163.1	1148	15.1	(87)
86.	Kortelaisen Kovat               1158.0	1103	164.1	(81)
87.	Chocolate Rockets               1154.5	1152	2.5	(90)
88.	PLP Fools                       1153.1	1153	0.1	(82)
89.	The Kamucks                     1152.0	1097	76.1	(97)
90.	Chubby Checkers                 1150.3	1134	16.3	(88)
	KODIAKS                         1150.3	1149	1.3	(93)
92.	Derrill's Dastardly Dozen       1150.1	1128	22.1	(89)
93.	Ken DeCruyenaere                1147.0	1142	5.0	(91)
94.	Fisher Dirtbags                 1146.7	1146	0.7	(92)
95.	Neil Younger                    1145.2	1131	14.2	(106)
96.	BSC Oranienburg                 1144.1	1137	7.1	(96)
97.	No Namers                       1138.0	1083	58.2	(94)
98.	Arsenal Maple Leafs             1137.8	1134	3.8	(98)
99.	The Campi Machine               1137.0	1082	65.3	(95)
100.	Mombasa Mosquitos               1131.1	1125	6.1	(100)
101.	Bjoern Leaguen                  1130.0	1127	3.0	(103)
102.	Ellis Islanders                 1123.6	1116	7.6	(99)
103.	Zachmans Wingers                1122.8	1073	49.8	(101)
104.	King Suke                       1120.1	1120	0.1	(108)
105.	Larry                           1116.8	1105	11.8	(109)
106.	VoteNoOct26                     1115.8	1084	31.8	(111)
107.	Bloodgamers                     1115.1	1073	42.1	(112)
	Het Schot Is Hard               1115.1	1097	18.1	(110)
109.	Hurricane Andrew                1114.6	1107	7.6	(107)
110.	Dirty White Socks               1114.4	1071	43.4	(104)
111.	Wormtown Woosbags               1114.0	1059	72.6	(105)
112.	Bruce's Rented Mules            1111.9	1100	11.9	(112)
113.	Oklahoma Stormchasers           1111.3	1083	28.3	(116)
114.	Teem Kanada                     1111.0	1095	16.0	(114)
115.	Edelweiss                       1110.9	1108	2.9	(102)
116.	Frank's Follies                 1110.2	1086	24.2	(115)
117.	Pond Slime                      1109.7	1109	0.7	(118)
118.	SPUDS                           1108.6	1096	12.6	(117)
119.	PSV Dartmouth                   1097.1	1090	7.1	(119)
120.	Kokudo Keikaku Bunnies          1096.3	1056	40.3	(124)
121.	Blue Talon                      1095.3	1082	13.3	(121)
122.	Stanford Ice Hawks              1094.2	1066	28.2	(122)
123.	Timo Ojala                      1088.3	1088	0.3	(125)
124.	Mark Sanders                    1088.1	1077	11.1	(120)
125.	Aye Carumba!!!                  1087.9	1084	3.9	(123)
126.	Dirty Rotten Puckers            1087.2	1086	1.2	(128)
127.	garys team                      1087.1	1070	17.1	(133)
128.	Cluster Buster                  1084.6	1077	7.6	(127)
129.	Haral                           1083.3	1076	7.3	(126)
130.	Apricot Fuzzfaces               1081.3	1058	23.3	(129)
131.	Gary Bill Pens Dynasty          1078.6	1059	19.6	(132)
132.	Seattle PFTB                    1077.9	1055	22.9	(135)
133.	Nesbitt                         1077.1	1076	1.1	(131)
134.	The Lost Poots                  1076.7	1070	6.7	(130)
135.	Le Groupe MI                    1076.2	1046	30.2	(137)
136.	Arctic Circles                  1075.6	1038	37.6	(134)
137.	Late Night with David Letterman 1074.0	1074	0.0	(136)
138.	Wembley LostWeekenders          1071.3	1071	0.3	(145)
139.	Wild Hearted Sons               1068.9	1064	4.9	(143)
140.	Dree Hobbs                      1066.4	1053	13.4	(149)
141.	Closet Boy's Boys               1066.0	1018	48.0	(142)
142.	Scott Glenn                     1065.2	1055	10.2	(139)
143.	GO BRUINS                       1064.2	1058	6.2	(138)
144.	Andy Y F WONG                   1063.5	1042	21.5	(145)
	Book 'em Danno's Bushbabies     1063.5	1053	10.5	(148)
146.	McKees Rocks Rockers            1062.1	1057	5.1	(147)
147.	boutch 92-93                    1062.0	1042	20.0	(144)
148.	team gold                       1060.7	1044	16.7	(141)
149.	Goddess Of Fermentation         1056.2	1026	30.2	(151)
150.	convex stars                    1055.6	1050	5.6	(153)
151.	Flying Kiwis                    1055.1	1046	9.1	(140)
152.	Einstein's Rock Band            1054.0	1054	0.0	(154)
153.	Dr Joel Fleishman               1053.7	1050	3.7	(165)
154.	Tim Rogers                      1053.1	1045	8.1	(152)
155.	MY TEAM                         1053.0	998	174.8	(159)
156.	Tap                             1052.5	1052	0.5	(156)
157.	Sundogs                         1052.4	1052	0.4	(166)
158.	Buttered Waffles                1052.0	1006	46.0	(157)
159.	GO HABS GO                      1051.0	1043	8.0	(150)
160.	Princeton Canucks               1050.0	995	124.2	(155)
161.	Hubert's Hockey Homeboys        1049.6	1049	0.6	(157)
162.	Satan's Choice                  1047.5	1033	14.5	(164)
163.	Bob's Blues                     1046.8	1000	46.8	(160)
164.	Les Nordiques                   1045.0	990	60.4	(162)
165.	Pierre Mailhot                  1044.6	1042	2.6	(167)
166.	furleys furies                  1041.6	1038	3.6	(161)
167.	Slap Shot Marco                 1039.8	988	51.8	(168)
168.	HUNTERS & COLLECTORS            1038.4	996	42.4	(162)
169.	The Dreamers                    1038.0	983	63.7	(173)
170.	San Jose Mahi Mahi              1036.8	1005	31.8	(169)
171.	Jeff Nimeroff                   1034.8	986	48.8	(171)
172.	East City Jokers                1034.0	979	69.1	(174)
173.	The Leafs Rule!!!!              1033.8	1008	25.8	(170)
174.	Darse Billings                  1033.7	999	34.7	(178)
175.	Flowers                         1033.0	978	113.6	(177)
176.	Daryl Turner                    1030.4	1028	2.4	(175)
177.	LANA Inc                        1030.3	1003	27.3	(180)
178.	riding the pine                 1028.7	1008	20.7	(176)
179.	Spinal Tap                      1027.4	986	41.4	(181)
180.	Stimpy ADG Zeta                 1027.0	1006	21.0	(172)
181.	Chappel's Chumps                1024.0	1000	24.0	(179)
182.	Big Bad Bruins                  1023.5	1005	18.5	(184)
183.	Enforcers                       1022.1	994	28.1	(183)
184.	Mike Mac Cormack Sydney NS CAN  1022.0	967	107.2	(186)
	JimParker                       1022.0	967	179.0	(182)
186.	Bulldogs                        1020.4	997	23.4	(187)
187.	Yellow Plague                   1019.2	1005	14.2	(195)
188.	Jeff Bachovchin                 1018.7	972	46.7	(184)
189.	Absolut Lehigh                  1017.9	1009	8.9	(189)
190.	voyageurs                       1015.7	1013	2.7	(188)
191.	Republican Dirty Tricksters     1010.0	955	66.0	(190)
192.	Ninja Turtles                   1009.3	1008	1.3	(196)
193.	Dr.D And The S.O.D.             1009.1	992	17.1	(192)
194.	Henry's Bar B Q                 1008.7	1008	0.7	(191)
195.	Bunch of Misfits                1007.8	984	23.8	(193)
196.	Robyns Team                     1007.0	977	30.0	(194)
197.	Cobra's Killers                 1006.7	975	31.7	(202)
198.	Cherry Bombers                  1005.2	1004	1.2	(203)
199.	Kuta Papercuts                  1003.5	985	18.5	(200)
200.	Great Expectations              998.3	996	2.3	(201)
	Acadien                         998.3	980	18.3	(198)
202.	DARMAN'S Dragons                994.3	966	28.3	(199)
203.	Team Melville                   993.9	947	46.9	(197)
204.	Killer Apes                     990.3	966	24.3	(205)
205.	Kaufbeuren Icebreakers          988.6	951	37.6	(206)
206.	Jayson's Kinky Pucks            987.9	961	26.9	(204)
207.	Roger Smith                     987.6	948	39.6	(208)
208.	Firebirds                       980.9	977	3.9	(209)
209.	IKEA Wholesale                  980.7	979	1.7	(211)
210.	Umpire 4 life                   980.1	969	11.1	(207)
211.	Those 1st few weeks hurt!       980.0	925	55.9	(210)
212.	Outlaws                         975.0	920	164.9	(212)
213.	400 Hurricane                   973.1	941	32.1	(223)
214.	Frack Attack                    972.3	945	27.3	(219)
215.	Believe it or dont              970.1	949	21.1	(215)
216.	Todd's Turkeys                  967.9	966	1.9	(219)
217.	Thundering Herd                 966.0	911	163.6	(214)
218.	Knee Injuries                   965.4	955	10.4	(217)
219.	The 200 Club                    962.8	956	6.8	(213)
220.	fred mckim                      962.0	907	93.0	(222)
221.	Crazy Euros                     961.9	944	17.9	(218)
222.	Creeping Death                  959.3	938	21.3	(216)
223.	Ryan's Renegades                956.9	906	50.9	(221)
224.	pig vomit                       953.3	952	1.3	(224)
225.	Ice Strykers                    952.0	897	105.4	(225)
	dayton bomber                   952.0	952	0.0	(228)
227.	CDN Stuck in Alabama            951.3	941	10.3	(227)
228.	Fighting Geordies               950.0	895	141.6	(226)
229.	Cafall and Crew                 947.3	909	38.3	(229)
230.	Ship's Way                      942.7	934	8.7	(235)
231.	Zipper Heads                    941.9	908	33.9	(232)
232.	Chris of Death                  941.0	886	83.6	(230)
233.	Banko's Beer Rangers            940.2	936	4.2	(232)
234.	Swillbellies                    939.7	921	18.7	(231)
235.	Oz                              934.0	899	35.0	(237)
236.	Laubsters II                    931.0	876	201.6	(236)
237.	Ninja Bunnies                   928.9	884	44.9	(239)
238.	Great Scott                     928.0	873	73.3	(240)
239.	Joliet Inmates                  927.8	882	45.8	(238)
240.	NY Flames                       923.8	916	7.8	(234)
241.	SANDY'S SABRES                  917.7	913	4.7	(243)
242.	Widefield White Wolves          910.9	874	36.9	(241)
243.	Florida Tech Burgh Team         909.3	860	49.3	(246)
244.	The Ice Holes                   908.7	906	2.7	(242)
245.	South Carolina Tiger Paws       903.0	848	78.4	(245)
	Daves Team                      903.0	871	32.0	(244)
247.	Mudville Kings                  900.6	873	27.6	(250)
248.	Redliners                       898.9	883	15.9	(252)
249.	roadrunners                     898.5	880	18.5	(249)
250.	For xtc                         898.2	890	8.2	(248)
251.	Leos Blue Chips                 894.4	884	10.4	(247)
252.	New Jersey Rob                  891.7	891	0.7	(251)
253.	Pat Phillips                    891.1	881	10.1	(253)
254.	Stewart Clamen                  869.6	868	1.6	(254)
255.	Demon Spawn                     868.0	843	25.0	(255)
256.	Sunnyvale Storm                 815.2	815	0.2	(256)
257.	Allez les Blues                 803.0	748	476.9	(257)
258.	Up For Sale Hockey Club         785.0	762	23.0	(258)
259.	Petes Picks                     783.0	728	168.5	(259)
260.	RINACO                          780.0	725	114.0	(260)
261.	Brenz Revenge                   705.0	701	4.0	(261)
262.	Dinamo Riga                     658.0	603	571.6	(262)
-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54169
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Hockey Draft final point totals

Here are the final point totals for players chosen in the USENET Hockey Draft.
Note that only 114 players scored more than 55 points (the minimum cost)
although 254 different players were chosen.

	- Andrew

Points	Team	Player
160	PIT	Mario_Lemieux
148	BUF	Pat_LaFontaine
142	BOS	Adam_Oates
137	DET	Steve_Yzerman
132	WPG	Teemu_Selanne
132	NYI	Pierre_Turgeon
127	BUF	Alexander_Mogilny
127	TOR	Doug_Gilmour
125	LA	Luc_Robitaille
123	PHI	Mark_Recchi
114	QUE	Mats_Sundin
111	PIT	Kevin_Stevens
110	VAN	Pavel_Bure
109	PIT	Rick_Tocchet
107	CHI	Jeremy_Roenick
106	STL	Craig_Janney
105	QUE	Joe_Sakic
102	BOS	Joe_Juneau
101	STL	Brett_Hull
100	CGY	Theoren_Fleury
100	PIT	Ron_Francis
99	TOR	Dave_Andreychuk
97	MTL	Vincent_Damphousse
97	DET	Dino_Ciccarelli
97	WPG	Phil_Housley
96	BUF	Dale_Hawerchuk
94	STL	Brendan_Shanahan
94	MTL	Kirk_Muller
94	PIT	Jaromir_Jagr
93	MIN	Mike_Modano
91	NYR	Mark_Messier
89	HFD	Geoff_Sanderson
88	MTL	Brian_Bellows
88	CGY	Robert_Reichel
87	LA	Jari_Kurri
87	NYI	Steve_Thomas
87	DET	Sergei_Fedorov
87	DET	Paul_Coffey
86	TB	Brian_Bradley
86	PHI	Rod_Brind'Amour
85	WSH	Peter_Bondra
85	PIT	Larry_Murphy
85	HFD	Andrew_Cassels
85	VAN	Cliff_Ronning
82	WSH	Mike_Ridley
82	LA	Tony_Granato
82	QUE	Steve_Duchesne
82	HFD	Pat_Verbeek
82	BOS	Ray_Bourque
81	CGY	Gary_Suter
81	NJ	Claude_Lemieux
80	MTL	Stephan_Lebeau
79	NJ	Alexander_Semak
79	WSH	Kevin_Hatcher
79	MIN	Russ_Courtnall
79	WSH	Dale_Hunter
78	QUE	Mike_Ricci
78	SJ	Kelly_Kisio
78	STL	Jeff_Brown
77	QUE	Owen_Nolan
77	VAN	Murray_Craven
77	VAN	Geoff_Courtnall
76	NYR	Tony_Amonte
76	NYI	Derek_King
76	MIN	Dave_Gagner
75	PHI	Eric_Lindros
75	CGY	Joe_Nieuwendyk
75	NYI	Benoit_Hogue
74	TOR	Nikolai_Borschevsky
74	WSH	Michal_Pivonka
74	MIN	Ulf_Dahlen
73	LA	Jimmy_Carson
73	NJ	Stephane_Richer
73	CHI	Chris_Chelios
73	STL	Nelson_Emerson
72	WPG	Alexei_Zhamnov
72	BOS	Dmitri_Kvartalnov
72	VAN	Trevor_Linden
72	WPG	Thomas_Steen
71	VAN	Petr_Nedved
70	PIT	Joe_Mullen
70	CHI	Steve_Larmer
69	LA	Mike_Donnelly
68	QUE	Andrei_Kovalenko
68	NYR	Mike_Gartner
67	WSH	Dmitri_Khristich
66	WSH	Al_Iafrate
66	DET	Ray_Sheppard
66	SJ	Johan_Garpenlov
65	TOR	Glenn_Anderson
65	HFD	Zarley_Zalapski
65	LA	Wayne_Gretzky
65	NYR	Adam_Graves
64	NJ	Valeri_Zelepukin
63	OTT	Norm_Maciver
63	PHI	Kevin_Dineen
62	DET	Steve_Chiasson
62	DET	Paul_Ysebaert
62	PHI	Garry_Galley
61	PIT	Shawn_McEachern
60	MTL	Mike_Keane
60	WPG	Darrin_Shannon
60	NYI	Pat_Flatley
60	NJ	Bernie_Nicholls
60	QUE	Scott_Young
59	LA	Rob_Blake
59	PHI	Brent_Fedyk
57	CHI	Steve_Smith
57	WSH	Pat_Elynuik
57	NJ	Scott_Stevens
57	CGY	Sergei_Makarov
57	WPG	Fredrik_Olausson
56	VAN	Greg_Adams
56	TB	John_Tucker
54	CHI	Christian_Ruuttu
54	CHI	Brent_Sutter
54	CGY	Al_MacInnis
54	NYR	Sergei_Nemchinov
53	HFD	Terry_Yake
53	NYR	Darren_Turcotte
52	NYI	Vladimir_Malakhov
52	VAN	Dixon_Ward
52	LA	Tomas_Sandstrom
51	BOS	Stephen_Leach
51	HFD	Patrick_Poulin
51	WPG	Keith_Tkachuk
50	NYI	Jeff_Norton
50	MTL	Denis_Savard
50	TOR	John_Cullen
50	WSH	Sylvain_Cote
49	NYR	Ed_Olczyk
49	STL	Kevin_Miller
49	BOS	Dave_Poulin
49	VAN	Anatoli_Semenov
49	PHI	Pelle_Eklund
49	WPG	Evgeny_Davydov
48	MTL	Gilbert_Dionne
48	NJ	John_MacLean
48	QUE	Martin_Rucinsky
48	LA	Alexei_Zhitnik
48	EDM	Petr_Klima
48	EDM	Doug_Weight
47	EDM	Shayne_Corson
46	EDM	Craig_Simpson
45	WSH	Kelly_Miller
45	EDM	Dave_Manson
44	CHI	Michel_Goulet
44	MTL	Mathieu_Schneider
43	DET	Bob_Probert
43	CGY	Paul_Ranheim
43	OTT	Sylvain_Turgeon
42	MIN	Mark_Tinordi
41	OTT	Bob_Kudelski
41	DET	Niklas_Lidstrom
41	OTT	Brad_Shaw
41	EDM	Todd_Elik
41	BOS	Vladimir_Ruzicka
40	MIN	Mike_McPhee
40	NYR	Esa_Tikkanen
40	TOR	Dave_Ellett
40	NJ	Peter_Stastny
39	LA	Corey_Millen
39	NJ	Bobby_Holik
39	BUF	Yuri_Khmylev
39	TB	Adam_Creighton
39	TOR	Wendel_Clark
38	VAN	Sergio_Momesso
38	NYR	Alexei_Kovalev
37	TOR	Rob_Pearson
37	QUE	Valery_Kamensky
37	CHI	Dirk_Graham
36	NYR	Brian_Leetch
36	EDM	Zdeno_Ciger
35	TOR	Peter_Zezel
35	BOS	Ted_Donato
33	MIN	Neal_Broten
33	HFD	Mikael_Nylander
33	PHI	Josef_Beranek
33	CHI	Stephane_Matteau
32	EDM	Scott_Mellanby
32	DET	Keith_Primeau
32	BUF	Wayne_Presley
32	NYI	Brian_Mullen
32	PHI	Dmitri_Yushkevich
32	MTL	Gary_Leeman
31	BUF	Richard_Smehlik
31	BOS	Steve_Heinze
31	TOR	Dmitri_Mironov
30	CHI	Brian_Noonan
28	WSH	Bob_Carpenter
28	SJ	Pat_Falloon
27	STL	Igor_Korolev
27	TB	Mikael_Andersson
27	NYI	Ray_Ferraro
26	BUF	Petr_Svoboda
26	OTT	Mark_Lamb
26	NYR	James_Patrick
25	MTL	Benoit_Brunet
24	NYI	Scott_LaChance
24	TOR	Bill_Berg
23	EDM	Martin_Gelinas
23	WPG	Sergei_Bautin
23	EDM	Kevin_Todd
21	NYI	David_Volek
21	NYI	Darius_Kasparaitis
21	TB	Roman_Hamrlik
21	MIN	Brent_Gilchrist
20	NYR	Phil_Bourque
20	DET	Jim_Hiller
20	PHI	Andrei_Lomakin
20	HFD	Yvon_Corriveau
19	BUF	Donald_Audette
18	BOS	Cam_Neely
17	CHI	Joe_Murphy
17	SJ	Mark_Pederson
16	PIT	Martin_Straka
15	NYR	Peter_Andersson
13	NJ	Janne_Ojanen
13	OTT	Tomas_Jelinek
12	MIN	Bobby_Smith
11	TB	Steve_Kasper
10	SJ	Ray_Whitney
9	HFD	Robert_Petrovicky
9	BUF	Viktor_Gordijuk
8	TOR	Joe_Sacco
8	QUE	Mikhail_Tatarinov
8	SJ	Peter_Ahola
7	CHI	Rob_Brown
7	BOS	Glen_Murray
6	MIN	Brian_Propp
6	HFD	Tim_Kerr
5	WSH	Reggie_Savage
5	LA	Robert_Lang
5	STL	Vitali_Prokhorov
5	DET	Viacheslav_Kozlov
5	EDM	Shaun_Van_Allen
4	BOS	Jozef_Stumpel
4	MIN	Dan_Quinn
4	PIT	Bryan_Fogarty
3	MTL	Olav_Petrov
3	TB	Stan_Drulia
2	NJ	Claude_Vilgrain
2	WSH	Jason_Woolley
0	QUE	Peter_Forsberg
0	WSH	Brian_Sakic
0	WSH	Randy_Burridge
0	MTL	Patrick_Kjellberg
0	OTT	Alexei_Yashin
0	EDM	Dean_McAmmond
0	CGY	Cory_Stillman
0	TB	Brent_Gretzky
0	BUF	Jason_Dawe
0	VAN	Igor_Larionov
0	CHI	Sergei_Krivokrasov
-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54170
From: kirchner@Informatik.TU-Muenchen.DE (Robert Kirchner)
Subject: Re: German audience is lunatic??



In article <1993Apr21.114335.7071@ousrvr.oulu.fi>, golf@phoenix.oulu.fi (Jouko Kylmaoja) writes:
|> I watched the game Germany-Czechs in WC today...and i was astonished about
|> the behaviour of the German audience!
|> The German team got a few penalties in the last period and the crowd went

It was not just those penalties. Most of all it was the penalty the referee didn't
call on the Czechs right before their first goal.

|> grazy! They threw coins, extra pucks and other trash into the rink...is
|> that stupid or what?? I guess the Canadian referee (one of the
|> Isostar-bros ;) gave the German team a penalty for that, but it didn't help
|> much.
|> I guess the Germans just are proud over their Nazi-Kill-'em-All-Everyone-

Don't you think it's quite silly to call it a Nazi attitude, when some people 
throw coins on the ice? Hey, I don't approve the behavior of these guys,
especially not in a WC game, but I can't see any reason for using the word 'Nazi'
in this connection. 
  
|> But-Us-Germans-Sucks attitude...they just seem to have that kind of attitude
|> in every possible sport (remember the European champs in Stockholm in soccer)

Soccer hooligans are not just a German problem (remember the world cup in Italy).
Again: there's a big difference between throwing coins and smashing shop-windows
or fighting with other so-called 'fans', who come to a WC just to see if the
Dutch or the English or the Germans are the best bruisers.
Which other sports are you talking about? I don't think soccer is 'every possible
sport'.

|> It really pisses me off!
|> I do not mean that every single German has this attitude that sucks, but 
|> most of them seem to do...

How many Germans do you know? Do you think 200 out of 10000 is 'most of them'? 
If you hear about some white policemen beating a black man in the US, what do you
think about the Americans? 'Most of them' like beating blacks?

|> 
|> 	Jokke Kylmaoja
|> 	golf@phoenix.oulu.fi
|> 



Robert

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54171
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

In article <C5uE6G.J83@acsu.buffalo.edu> v003nnc3@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (MR. BUNGLE) writes:

>[...] I'd like to see some playoff games since I'm stuck in Buffalo at UB, but
>I think Boston isn't giving up so easy.
>
No, Boston probably won't go down easy, but if the Sabres hadn't won
game one Buffalo would have been out in four.

And what problem are you having with playoff games here in
Buffalo???!!!??? There's the Sabres-Bruins, Quebec-Montreal, and
whatever ESPN and ABC show, and on opposite nights there's
Toronto-Detroit and whatever ESPN(/ABC) shows.  More hockey than a
good chunk of North America, either side of the border.  It's
wonderful, and there are thousands of folks who'd kill to be in your
shoes, coverage-wise.




-- 
Valerie Hammerl 	       John Sr. would lift Pat over the boards, grab 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu       his hand, and start running around the outside,
V085PWPZ@UBVMS.CC.BUFFALO.EDU  faster and faster.  "I wanted to learn how to 
get that feeling, and the only way was to learn how to skate."  P. LaFontaine

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54172
From: neath@brazil.psych.purdue.edu (Ian Neath)
Subject: Re: Final Regular Season Individual Goalie Stats

What about including points?  Probably no goals (at least against
opponents) but there have been several assists given.

--
      Ian Neath        | There are four kinds of people in this world:
neath@psych.purdue.edu | cretins, fools, morons and lunatics - U. Eco

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54173
From: mashumka@fish.Princeton.EDU (Mark Andrew Shumka)
Subject: Canucks score

HELP!  I'm stuck here at a computer in New Jersey and have no access to
a radio or TV.  Could someone kindly post the score of the Canucks-Jets
game?  Thanks in advance.

Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54174
Subject: Camera work on televised games
From: yecx@vax5.cit.cornell.edu

Is it just me or is the camera work on some of these games really sad??  I
can't remember how many times during the Penguins-Devils game they showed some
guy (without the puck) being checked in the corner while the puck was being
fired on goal.  In fact, I think they even missed one goal completely because
they were showing two guys holding each other in the corner.

Now the last time I watched a football game, they didn't show the lineman going
at it while the running back turned the corner for a touchdown . . . . 

Is it just me??	

Greg


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54175
From: paul@fugu.Data-IO.COM (Paul Brownlow)
Subject: Re: SHARKS REVIEW Part 5: Left Wings

In article <1r2e9d$1nd@apple.com>, chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach) writes:
|> nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
|> >#45	DODY WOOD		Season: 1st
|> >Acquired:	3rd round pick in 1991 entry draft
|> >Grade:		I (D+/D, although perhaps I shouldn't give a grade at all)
|> 
|> >I have been accused of knocking on Wood too much.
|> 
|> You? Nah... 
|> 
|> He was seriously unimpressive, even as a tough guy (his rep). However, as
|> few games as he had in a season that was at that point meaningless, I hate
|> to judge the talent too quickly. Butn in Dody's case, I"m tempted to make an
|> exception.
|> 
|> But I won't.

Wood played most of his junior career in Seattle.  He was one
of the leading scorers on a mediocre team when he was traded away in
1992.  He rarely lost a fight and was one of the toughest players in
the WHL.

However, I was extremely surprised when he was drafted, especially in
the third round.  He certainly didn't look like NHL material...
-- 
Paul Brownlow				|         Visualize 
Data I/O Corp.  Redmond, WA		|	   Whirled
paul@data-io.com			|	    Peas
					|

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54176
From: paul@fugu.Data-IO.COM (Paul Brownlow)
Subject: Re: 1993 NHL Draft

In article <1993Apr20.184627.4585@newshub.ariel.yorku.ca>, cs902043@ariel.yorku.ca (SHAWN LUDDINGTON) writes:
|> Tampa Bay will either go for a russian Kozlov (I think that's it) or a 
|>     defenseman Rob Niedemeyer (probably spelt the last name wrong)

Rob Niedermayer is a forward (center, I think) with the WHL Medicine Hat
Tigers.  His brother, Scott, is a defenseman (now with the NJ Devils).
-- 
Paul Brownlow				|         Visualize 
Data I/O Corp.  Redmond, WA		|	   Whirled
paul@data-io.com			|	    Peas
					|

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54177
From: matthew@wavefront.wti.com (Matt Coohill)
Subject: ESPN f*ck up


	Okay... here's some gripe"ing" (?griping?... whatever).

	(I live in Santa Barbara... for reference... I think)

	Okay, ABC showed the Kings/Flames... fine... YAWN.

	ESPN (through a fortunate rainout of a baseball game) showed the
  Red Wings/Toronto game... cool.

	But I SWEAR that the advertisements all week long had said that
  ESPN would show Pitt/NJ on Tuesday and Bos/Buff on Thursday.

	I raced home from work early (4:30 Pacific) to catch the game, but
  ALAS, it was the Boston/Buffalo game and then they promised that they would
  show the Pitt/NJ game on Thursday.  OVERNIGHT they changed their mind.

	I didn't mind THAT MUCH.  I watched the game (hockey is MUCH better
  than NO hockey).  During the game their were no video highlights from the
  Patrick division.  What the hell was going on?  At least they should show
  video highlights of the other games (especially the NYI/Caps game that was
  so close).  My father (lives in Bowling Green, Kentucky [Bumbf*ck, Egypt])
  got to watch the Pens game on ESPN.  I just don't get it.

	The biggest problem is that Buffalo or Boston fans who didn't want
  to see the Pittsburgh/New Jersey game 2, will turn on their TVs on Thursday
  and see the Pittsburgh/New Jersey game 3 instead of the Buffalo/Boston game
  3.  At least, in my case, I just had to wait 2 more days to see my game.

	If I were a big Boston or Buffalo fan and I missed the game on
  Tuesday due to false advertising on the part of ESPN, I'd be mad as
  hell.

	Oh well... hopefully we'll get better coverage next year OR
  SOMETHING.

Matt Coohill

P.S.  The announcers for the Buffalo/Boston were the worst that I have
	ever heard (as far emotion goes).  They had the enthusiasm of
	"Droopy Dog".  I hope for better on Thursday.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54180
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

It is meaningless to compare one player's plus/minus statistic with
another players' out of the context of the role and the playing time
of the players involved.    

To compare Jagr's and Francis's plus/minus is ridiculous and absurd...

Gerald


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54181
From: nichols@spss.com (David Nichols)
Subject: Re: Detroit Playoff Tradition

In article <16APR199314443969@reg.triumf.ca> lange@reg.triumf.ca (THREADING THE CANADIAN TAPESTRY) writes:
>Way back in the early years (~50's) it took 8 wins to garner the Stanley Cup. 
>Soooooo, a couple of local fish mongers (local to the Joe Louis Arena, that is)
>started the tradition of throwing an octopi onto the ice with every win.  After
>each victory, one leg would be severed before the octopus found its way to the
>ice.  (They are dead by the way.)  It was a brilliant marketing strategy to
>shore up the demand for one of their least popular products.
>
>Hope this helps.
>
>J. Lange
>

Local to the Joe Louis Arena? You mean local to Olympia Stadium, where
Red Wings games were played until fairly recently (early 80s comes to
mind). As far as I know, the rest of the post is basically correct. If
what you meant by local was simply Detroit and I'm being incredibly
picky, okay, sorry about that.

--
 David Nichols        Senior Statistical Support Specialist         SPSS, Inc.
 Phone: (312) 329-3684     Internet:  nichols@spss.com     Fax: (312) 329-3657
*******************************************************************************
 Any correlation between my views and those of SPSS is strictly due to chance.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54182
From: atkinsj@reis59.alleg.edu (Joshua Atkins)
Subject: Re: Goalie Mask Update

In article <C5L3EC.F2v@acsu.buffalo.edu> hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie  
S. Hammerl) writes:
> In article <93289@hydra.gatech.EDU> gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)  
writes:
> >
> >	Here are the results after three days of voting. Remember 3pts for 
> >1st, 2 for 2nd, and 1 for 3rd. Also, you can still turn in votes! And..  
if
> >the guy isn't a regular goalie or he is retired, please include the  
team! 
> >Thanks for your time, and keep on sending in those votes!
> 
> > Glenn Healy (NYI), Tommy Soderstron (???), Ray LeBlanc (USA).
>                      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> 
> Soderstrom plays with Philly, but he doesn't have a moulded mask.
> He's got the helmet and cage variety, in white.  Or at least that's
> what he wore thirteen hours ago.
> 
Yeah but Soderstrom's mask has always appeared to be a lot bigger than the  
average helmet-and-cage variety.  It has a certain appeal on its own

josh


> -- 
> Valerie Hammerl			"Some days I have to remind him  
he's not 
> hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu	Mario Lemieux."  Herb Brooks on Claude
> acscvjh@ubms.cc.buffalo.edu	Lemieux, top scorer for the Devils, but 
> v085pwwpz@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu  known for taking dumb penalties.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54183
From: lee139@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (Steve Lee)
Subject: STOP MAYNARD BASHING!!!! (was Re: Roger Maynard)

In article <1993Apr16.213024.8698@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@hudson.UVic.CA writes:
>Does anyone recieve annoying email from Roger Maynard whenever they post an
>article telling them to leave him alon and stop posting to the group??
>These emails are filled with insults- more than are usual in Roger's posts
>and have little if any hockey info.
>I have recieved two in the last 2 days.
>I am just wondering if I am special or Roger trys to bully everyone who
>disagrees with him.
>
>Gregmeister
>

You can't be serious!  I and many of my colleagues have not received any
bad e-mails from Roger, in fact, Roger happens to have answered most if not
all of my hockey questions and curiosities, so before you start flaming
at me or Roger, better re-consider your nasty attitude towards Roger and the
like!


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Lee      *      University of Western Ontario      *      London, Canada 
                      lee139@obelix.gaul.csd.uwo.ca          
_______________________________________________________________________________


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54184
From: rhirji@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca (Rahim Hirji)
Subject: Re: Flames Question

In article <C5HtrB.ICE@ccu.umanitoba.ca> clhawth@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Timothy Chesley) writes:
>I heard a little while back that Gary Roberts would be returning to play
>in Calgary's last regular season game.  Can anybody confirm this??
>He'll be a big help to the Flames in the playoffs and may change my
>playoff pool strategy.


Roberts played in last night game against the Sharks and got a goal (38th)
and an assist.

This definitely bolsters Calgary's chances in the playoffs.


							Rahim Hirji


 
-- 
				     |  Rahim Hirji
 Life is what happens while you are  |  Actuarial Science
 making other plans		     |  rhirji@descartes.uwaterloo.ca
				     |  University of Waterloo

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54185
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: TV Schedule for Next Week

jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio) writes:
>mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger) writes:
>
>|> United States TV Schedule:
>|> April 18   Devils/Islanders at Pittsburgh   1 EST  ABC
>|> April 18   St. Louis at Chicago             12 CDT ABC
>|> April 18   Los Angeles at Calgary           12 PDT ABC

Okay, here's the down side of the ESPN deal: no additional coverage.
With a split contract, SCA could have at least gotten at leftovers
like Canucks-Jets, Caps-whoever and Red Wings-Leafs (or whoever else
is playing).

>|> April 20   Devils/Islanders at Pittsburgh   7:30   ESPN
>|> April 22   TBA                              7:30   ESPN
>|> April 24   TBA                              7:30   ESPN
>
>Does anyone know if there will be alternate games in cities where
>local broadcast rights are being protected?

For our area (Islanders-Devils), it's likely to be the Bruins, since
the other Adams series is Montreal-Quebec.  I'd prefer the latter
myself ...

I'm under the impression that the ABC deal overrides the local deals,
but if St. Louis at Chicago pops up we'll know ...

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54192
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: Bruins-Pens: the Ulf-Neeley fight

Oh, excuse me for wasting the bandwidth, but I was referring to 
the original incident, not the recent skirmish which occurred
this past month. 

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54193
From: scialdone@nssdca.gsfc.nasa.gov (John Scialdone)
Subject: CUT Vukota and Pilon!!!

I have been to all 3 Isles/Caps tilts at the Crap Centre this year, all Isles
wins and there is no justification for Vukota and Pilon to play for the Isles.
Vukota is absolutely the worst puck handler in the world!! He couldn't hit a
bull in the ass with a banjo!! Al must remember a few years back when Mick 
scored 3 goals in one period against the Caps in a 5-3 Isles win. I was there
and was astonished as was the rest of the crowd. Wake-up Al!!! Years later he's
gotten worse. He's a cheap shot artist and always ends up getting
stupid/senseless penalties. I think he would make a good police officier!!!

As for Pilon, he can't carry the puck out to center ice by himself. He either
makes a bad pass resulting in a turnover, or he attempts to bring the puck 
towards the neutral zone and skates right into an opposing skater. He can't
stay on his skates with most forwards or centers. He either falls down or 
committs a penalty. Call up somebody from Capital District AL!!!!!

As far as the playoffs, the Isles are as difficult to figure out as the Caps.
Two good teams with talent but so inconsistent. They should meet in the first
round. The Isles seem to play up to the level of their competition so they
should play well against Jersey tonite. It'll probably be another tight 1-goal
game as the last 20 games hve been for the Isles. I wish when the get a lead
they could continue to pour it on instead of settling back into a defensive
shell and letting the opposition get back in the game. Al MUST understand he
can't do with this team what he did with the 80-83 Isles. maybe Al should got
to. Where is Bobby Nystrom?? Clark Gilles?? John Tonelli?? These are the kind
of young minds we need behing the bench!!    FIRE AL!!!!

John Scialdone
SCIALDONE@NSSDCA.GSFC.NASA.GOV

**********When your ship comes in, first man takes the Sail********************



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54194
From: rbeskost@adam.East.Sun.COM (Richard Beskosty - Sun BOS Systems Product Assurance)
Subject: Re: Goalie mask poll

In article 93158@hydra.gatech.EDU, gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak) writes:
> 
> 	Here is an update on the Goalie mask poll...
> 	First, since so many people gave me their 3 best, I decided to
> give 3 pts for their favorite, 2 pts for 2nd, 1 for 3rd. If you e-mailed
> a response with only one, I gave it 3 pts. Please feel free to send me
> your 2 other favorites, if you only sent one before. 
> 	Also, votes are still welcome! Any mask you like will do, as I 
> have received votes for players not in the NHL. Please mention what team
> they play for, though.
> 	So here are the up-to-date results so far:
> 
> 


My vote goes to Andy Moog 1st, Belfour 2nd, Vanbiesbrouck 3rd

The Bruin's are hot at just the right time !!!!!


rich beskosty

rbeskost@east.sun.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54195
From: richard@amc.com (Richard Wernick)
Subject: Re: Ulf and all...

You should be ashamed to call yourself an Ulf Samuelson fan. Anybody who plays
the way he does, does not belong in the NHL. There have been cheap shot artists
through the history of the game, but a lot of them have been talanted players.
Bobby Clarke, Kenny Linsemen, Pie McKenzie, Chris Chelios etc.. but nobody has been
out right as dirty a cheapshot coward as Ulf. Violence in hockey has got to be curbed
and players like (Should have been a Women) Samuelson don't belong. When players
like Ulf, who's main purpose is to injure the better players in the league is allowed
to continue, and the league won't stop it, the players should. A Christian Pro 1000
aluminum stick directed at his ugly head should do the trick nicely. If the Bruins get
a chance to meet Pittsburgh in the near future, you can bet Neely will have his day.
The sight of watching Ulf turtle up like the coward he is, is worth almost as much as a
Stanely Cup. This wimp of a player almost ruined the career of one the best right wingers
in the game. If you are to remove Ulf Samuelson from the lineup, the Penguins would not
even notice he's gone. He's an eyesore on the game of hockey.


Rich




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54196
From: williac@govonca.gov.on.ca (Chris Williams)
Subject: Re: STOP MAYNARD BASHING!!!! (was Re: Roger Maynard)

In <1993Apr16.225806.10680@julian.uwo.ca> lee139@gaul.csd.uwo.ca (Steve Lee) writes:

>In article <1993Apr16.213024.8698@sol.UVic.CA> gballent@hudson.UVic.CA writes:
>>Does anyone recieve annoying email from Roger Maynard whenever they post an
>>article telling them to leave him alon and stop posting to the group??
>>These emails are filled with insults- more than are usual in Roger's posts
>>and have little if any hockey info.
>>I have recieved two in the last 2 days.
>>I am just wondering if I am special or Roger trys to bully everyone who
>>disagrees with him.
>>
>>Gregmeister
>>

>You can't be serious!  I and many of my colleagues have not received any
>bad e-mails from Roger, in fact, Roger happens to have answered most if not
>all of my hockey questions and curiosities, so before you start flaming
>at me or Roger, better re-consider your nasty attitude towards Roger and the
>like!


>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Steve Lee      *      University of Western Ontario      *      London, Canada 
>                      lee139@obelix.gaul.csd.uwo.ca          
>_______________________________________________________________________________

Speaking of Roger, where is his comments from last nights game. You have
to admit he can make a nothing game sound like it was game 7 of the
Stanley Cup finals.
Roger pushes the Leafs so much it even bothers me, a long time supporter
but he does have a good overall idea of the game.
Wow I just gave R.M a compliment, guess I better stop it with the Rye +
Water before I give him another..



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54197
From: daniell@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Daniel Lyddy)
Subject: Re: Bruins vs Canadiens:

In article <1993Apr16.213513.7683@rose.com> jack.petrilli@rose.com (jack petrilli) writes:
>So I don't know what you mean by parity; Boston never was, is not now, 
>and never will be as good an organization as the Montreal Canadiens.
>

Never was?  Probably.  Is not now?  Debatable.  What other valid test can
you think of besides the final standings or divisional playoff winner?  What
do you propose, a worthless vote like they do in college football?  What a
joke!

>You Boston fans make me laugh: you're going crazy based on a very 
>recent Boston domination over Montreal in the playoffs. I mean how 
>many cups has Boston won compared to Montreal's 23? And who do you 
>think is going to win the **next** cup between the 2 teams? Montreal 
>or Boston? You know Sinden's going to find some way of screwing up 
>even this good Boston team. He'll fire Suter or trade away a vital 
>star. (Admittedly, his last few trades have been good ones but how 
>long before his luck runs out and he starts making Esposito-for-
>Ratelle type trades again?) 
>

If I remember right, Brad Park was also involved in that trade.  He wasn't
all that bad a hockey player.

But let's look at some of Sinden's trades over the years:

??? for Rick Middleton (Rangers).  I don't know who Sinden gave up for Middle-
ton, so I'll call this one a +.

Barry Pederson for Cam Neely (Canucks).  +++.  Any questions?

Greg Hawgood for Vladimir Ruzicka (Oilers). ++.  Didja see that one Rosie
roofed against Roy in last year's playoffs?

Courtnall/Ranford for Andy Moog (Oilers).  A wash.  Moog is a good goaltender,
Ranford burned Boston in the Finals in his first year, and Courtnall always
seems to get his points.  Anyone in Vancouver care to comment on Courtnall
as a defensive liability?

Ken Linseman for Dave Poulin (Flyers) ++.  Any more questions?

Janney/Quintal for Adam Oates (Blues).  ++.  Janney is an enormous talent and
a personable guy, the the Bruins play in Adam's Division.  Enough said?

So,even if you count the Esposito/Vadnais/Ratelle/Park/I don't remember who 
else (Joe Zanussi?) trade as a double minus, Harry the Horse trader comes
out on top.  I submit that the Bruins are always good because of Harry, not
in spite of him.

BTW, do you really think the Habs will bounce back next season.  I'll bet 
they finish fourth or fifth in the Conference, behind any of the following:
Pittsburgh, Quebec, Boston, Washington, Islanders.  Someone correct me if
these five teams will not be in Montreal's conference.

In summary, things look bleak for the Habs, at least in the near future.  I
suspect that the next team from La Belle Province to win the Cup will be
that team that Lindros didn't want to play for.

>I admit that I've been suffering lately with the Boston gets hot while 
>Montreal swans in the playoffs type years. But I **do** have the sure 
>knowledge that the Montreal braintrust will keep plugging away until 
>they hit the right formula for yet another cup. Whereas if I were a 
>Boston fan, I'd have this kind of despair that as long as Harry Sinden 
>is running the show, the Bruins will always be good but **never** 
>good enough.
>
>- Jack

-- 
Dan Lyddy    daniell@cory.berkeley.edu    University of California at Berkeley

My Two Favorite Hockey Teams:  1) The Boston Bruins
                               2) Whoever's playing Pittsburgh

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54198
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

Brad Gibson (gibson@nukta.geop.ubc.ca) wrote:

[Much text deleted]

:   plus/minus ... it is the most misleading hockey stat available.

Not necessarily the most misleading, but you are right, it definitely
needs to be taken in the proper perspective. A shining example is
if you look at the Penguins individual +/-, you will find very few minuses.
That only makes common sense, since they didn't lose many games.

:   Until the NHL publishes a more useful quantifiable statistic including ice
:   time per game and some measure of its "quality" (i.e., is the player put out
:   in key situations like protecting a lead late in the game; is he matched up
:   against the other team's top one or two lines; short-handed, etc), I would
:   much rather see the +/- disappear altogether instead of having its dubious
:   merits trumpeted by those with little understanding of its implications.

Unfortunately, you will need to keep a ridiculous number of stats to
really come up with a statistic which really shows a player's value.
Let's just enjoy the game and not overanalyze it. (like I'm doing now,
excuse me!)

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54199
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: plus minus stat

Gerald Olchowy (golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca) wrote:
: It is meaningless to compare one player's plus/minus statistic with
: another players' out of the context of the role and the playing time
: of the players involved.    

: To compare Jagr's and Francis's plus/minus is ridiculous and absurd...

: Gerald

Thank you for putting this in perspective!

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54200
From: boora@kits.sfu.ca (The GodFather)
Subject: RANGERS ARE AN EMBARRASSMENT

	I can't believe that the NY Rangers would force its 
players to go to Binghamtom to play in the AHL playoffs instead
of letting them represent their countries in the World Championships.

Anderrson and Zubov are waiting for the NHL to make a decision to this,
while Kovalev has given in and gone down to the minors.

The Rangers are a disgrace.

ps. it has been reported that Neil Smith was very much against
the hiring of Mike Keenan. How long will Smith be in NY for?

		the GodFather.
`

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54201
From: yadalle@cs.UAlberta.CA (Yadallee Dave S)
Subject: Re: Oilers for sale??

bart@splunge.uucp (Barton Oleksy) writes:

>yadalle@cs.UAlberta.CA (Yadallee Dave S) writes:

>>Here's one from the mill.  The Oilers MIGHT move to Hamilton
>>where Porklington can get a free deal.

>>Given what Labour relations and Puck has been like, it WOULD be a sigh of 
>>relief.

>>This WAY w4e can can BOTH elements!!

>Well, Dave, I would have to disagree with you there.  Satan himself could
>own the team, and I'd be happy as long as the Oilers stayed in Edmonton.
>Selfish, but true.  I don't want to see the Oilers move, no matter who
>their owner is.

>Bart, bart@splunge.uucp  or  barto@nait.ab.ca

I too am of the same  sentiment Bart, but realistically, this town DOESN'T WANT TO pay for 
quality player and hence we are loosing these people left, right and center.
Labour is also responsible for their boycott Pocklington movement.
I would like the Oilers to stay, but realistically, given this situation, it's 
bye-bye Oilers.
--
Dave Shariff Yadallee (B. Sc.(Econ/Math) (U of Alberta 1990) )
( yadalle@amisk.cs.ualberta.ca) God Save the Queen, God Bless us All!Remember!
Jesus saves lives from eternal damnation!
Newfoundland, keep good old Clyde, VOTE LIBERAL!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54202
From: v057p7nk@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Andrew W Korbut)
Subject: Re: Ulf crushes Valeri Zelepukin

In article <C5xx27.G32@newsserver.pixel.kodak.com>, clare@ssd.kodak.com (Bill Clare 726-9419) writes...
>That more or less says it.  I flicked the Penguins game on briefly and saw
>Ulf cross-check Valeri in the face.  I am wondering if Don Cherry is going to
>go off on this at all in coach's corner.

Nah, Cherry will only spew if Ulf was nailing "a good Canadian boy".

What an idiot... if this is the heart and soul of Canadian patriotism, 
then someone needs a new hobby...

 Dr.D [The Devils Advocate]        "Drinkin' & women & guns don't mix..."
 v057p7nk@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu
 awkorbut@acsu.buffalo.edu                      - Mark Arm

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54203
From: jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio)
Subject: NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 23 APRIL 1993




NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 23 APRIL 1993:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                  CONFERENCE SEMI-FINALS        BEST OF SEVEN
      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE
  
 NJ                  BUF   (leads 3-0)   STL   (leads 3-0)   WIN               
 PIT   (leads 3-0)   BOS                 CHI                 VAN   (leads 2-1)

 NYI   (leads 2-1)   MON                 TOR                 LA    
 WAS                 QUE   (leads 2-1)   DET   (leads 2-1)   CAL   (tied  2-1)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Detroit Red Wings (lead series 2-1)    0   1   1   -   2
Toronto Maple Leafs                    2   0   2   -   4

Dave Andreychuk scored his first two playoff goals for Toronto and Felix
Potvin stopped 34 of 36 Red Wing shots as the Maple Leafs won their first
win in the series.

First period-- 1, Toronto, Andreychuk 1 (Foligno,Gilmour), 4:21.  2, Toronto,
  Andreychuk 2 (Gilmour), 7:37.

Second period-- 3, Detroit, Fedorov 2 (Coffey,Sheppard), 1:20 (pp).

Third period-- 4, Toronto, Clark 1 (Gilmour,Mironov), 4:44 (pp).  5, Toronto,
  Pearson 1 (Clark,Cullen), 9:32.  6, Detroit, Chiasson 2 (Konstantinov,
  Fedorov), 14:14.

Shots on goal-- Detroit 9-19-8--36.  Toronto  13-8-12--33.  Power-play
  opportunities-- Detroit 1 of 5; Toronto 1 of 8.  Goalies-- Detroit,
  Cheveldae, 2-1 (33 shots-29 saves).  Toronto, Potvin, 1-2 (36-34).
  A--15,720.

Referee-- Mark Faucette.  Linesmen-- Kevin Collins, Brian Murphy.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Chicago Blackhawks                   0   0   0   -   0
St. Louis Blues (lead series 3-0)    1   1   1   -   3

Curtis Joseph blanked the Blackhawks for the second straight game and Brett
Hull scored a goal and added an assist to lead the Blues to a 3-0 series lead.
Chicago hasn't scored in 131:09 of play since Brian Noonan's hat-trick goal in
game 1.

First period-- 1, St. Louis, Janney 1 (Hull,Brown), 16:53 (pp).

Second period-- 2, St. Louis, Hull 3 (Miller), 12:31.

Third period-- 3, St. Louis, Emerson 1 (Felsner,Shanahan), 16:44.

Shots on goal-- Chicago 9-12-13--34.  St. Louis 7-13-4--24.  Power-play
  opportunities-- Chicago 0 of 4; St. Louis 1 of 7.  Goalies-- Chicago,
  Belfour, 0-3 (24 shots-21 saves).  St. Louis, Joseph, 3-0 (34-34).
  A--17,985.

Referee-- Dan Marouelli.  Linesmen-- Randy Mitton, Shane Heyer.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Vancouver Canucks (lead series 2-1)    1   2   1   -   4
Winnipeg Jets                          3   0   2   -   5

Teemu Selanne broke out of his mini-slump with a hat trick, including the
game-winner, to lead the Jets to a 5-4 victory.  Trevor Linden and Pavel Bure
each scored twice for the losing Canucks.

First period-- 1, Winnipeg, Tkachuk 1 (Housley), 3:52.  2, Winnipeg, Selanne 1
  (Housley,Shannon), 7:01 (pp).  3, Vancouver, Bure 2, 18:29.  4, Winnipeg,
  Selanne 2 (Shannon,Housley), 19:57 (pp).

Second period-- 5, Vancouver, Linden 2 (Ronning,Lumme), :14.  6, Vancouver,
  Linden 3 (Adams,Slegr), :59 (pp).

Third period-- 7, Winnipeg, Borsato 1 (Steen), 2:53 (sh).  8, Winnipeg,
  Selanne 3 (Shannon), 9:35.  9, Vancouver, Bure 3 (Babych,Lidster), 15:52.

Shots on goal-- Vancouver 18-9-10--37.  Winnipeg 13-8-8--29.  Power-play
  opportunities-- Vancouver 1 of 8; Winnipeg 2 of 6.  Goalies-- Vancouver,
  McLean, 2-1 (29 shots-24 saves).  Winnipeg, Essensa, 1-2 (37-33).
  A--15,569.

Referee-- Kerry Fraser.  Linesmen-- Gord Broseker, Dan Schachte.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Calgary Flames (lead series 2-1)    2   1   2   -   5
Los Angeles Kings                   0   1   1   -   2

(Boxscore tomorrow)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Saturday, 24 April 1993:

     Washington at NY Islanders (NY Islanders lead series 2-1), 7:40pm EST
     Boston at Buffalo (Buffalo leads series 3-0), 7:40pm EST
     Quebec at Montreal (Quebec leads series 2-1), 8:10pm EST

Sunday, 25 April 1993:

     Pittsburgh at New Jersey (Pittsburgh leads series 3-0), 1:10pm EST
     Chicago at St. Louis (St. Louis leads series 3-0), 1:10pm EST
     Calgary at Los Angeles (Calgary leads series 2-1), 3:10pm EST
     Detroit at Toronto (Detroit leads series 2-1), 7:10pm EST
     Vancouver at Winnipeg (Vancouver leads series 2-1), 9:10pm EST


-JPC


-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John P. Curcio 		          Go Bruins!		   Philips Laboratories
jpc@philabs.philips.com 			           345 Scarborough Road
(914) 945-6442               	 		     Briarcliff Manor, NY 10510 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54204
From: Ryan J. Thieme <33CWDTR@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Thumbs up to ESPN


In article <1993Apr20.032017.5783@wuecl.wustl.edu>, jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph
Charles Achkar) says:
>
> It was nice to see ESPN show game 1 between the Wings and Leafs since
>the Cubs and Astros got rained out. Instead of showing another baseball
>game, they decided on the Stanley Cup Playoffs. A classy move by ESPN.
>
>
It was a classy move.  But it looks like ESPN is going to devote most of
the coverage to the Pens.  On Tuesday night, they continued to broadcast
the Pen-Devil game even though Pittsburgh had the game well in control.
Granted they did show some "bonus" coverage of the Caps and Isles but
they cut away from the close game, which went into double ot, to update
us on the fifth goal of the rout.
Thursday was a good game even if it was the second straight game between
the pens and devils.  IMHO they should program some variety into the
telecasts.(Yes I know the game shown on saturday is between the B's and
Sabres, probably throwing a bone to us Bruin fans.)
And what about the Cambell conference?  I'd like to see a game in the
Norris or Smythe.  Why not have back to back nights of National
Hockey Night?

Just a thought.

Ryan
>  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
>  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    %
>  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    *
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54205
From: e8l6@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (Rocket)
Subject: NHL Playoff leaders with +/- & Penalty mins as of April 22, 1993



    Player       Team   GP  G   A  Pts +/- PIM

    M.Lemieux    PIT     3   4   2   6   2   0
    Francis      PIT     3   1   5   6   5   4
    Oates        BOS     3   0   6   6   1   2
    Yzerman      DET     2   3   2   5   3   0
    Coffey       DET     2   0   5   5   1   0
    D.Hunter     WAS     3   5   0   5  -4  10
    Mogilny      BUF     3   4   1   5   3   4
    Thomas       NYI     3   2   3   5   6   0
    Lapointe     QUE     3   1   4   5   2   2
    Johansson    WAS     3   0   5   5  -1   4
    Carson       LA      2   4   0   4   0   2
    Brown        STL     2   1   3   4   1   2
    Fleury       CAL     2   1   3   4   0  19
    G.Courtnall  VAN     2   1   3   4   3   2
    Flatley      NYI     2   0   4   4   3   2
    MacInnis     CAL     2   0   4   4  -1   4
    Ferraro      NYI     3   3   1   4   2   2
    McEachern    PIT     3   3   1   4   4   8
    Neely        BOS     3   3   1   4   1   4
    Turgeon      NYI     3   3   1   4   5   0
    Bellows      MON     3   2   2   4   0   0
    Jagr         PIT     3   2   2   4   3   0
    Khmylev      BUF     3   2   2   4   3   0
    Khristich    WAS     3   2   2   4   0   2
    Hawerchuk    BUF     3   1   3   4   0   2
    Hogue        NYI     3   1   3   4   3   2
    Juneau       BOS     3   1   3   4   0   6
    K.Stevens    PIT     3   1   3   4   1   6
    L.Murphy     PIT     3   1   3   4   2   0
    LaFontaine   BUF     3   1   3   4   2   0
    Ramsey       PIT     3   0   4   4   3   4
    Smehlik      BUF     3   0   4   4   4   2
    Noonan       CHI     2   3   0   3   0   0
    Gilmour      TOR     2   2   1   3  -1  12
    Hull         STL     2   2   1   3   0   0
    Otto         CAL     2   2   1   3   2   2
    Reichel      CAL     2   2   1   3   0   0
    Bure         VAN     2   1   2   3   2   0
    Drake        DET     2   1   2   3   2   0
    Linden       VAN     2   1   2   3   4   2
    Nieuwendyk   CAL     2   1   2   3  -1   2
    Roberts      CAL     2   0   3   3  -2   4
    Young        QUE     3   3   0   3   3   0
    B.Sweeney    BUF     3   2   1   3   2   4
    S.Stevens    NJ      3   2   1   3  -2   4
    Tocchet      PIT     3   2   1   3   0   2
    Carpenter    WAS     3   1   2   3   0   6
    J.Mullen     PIT     3   1   2   3   2   2
    Ronning      VAN     2   2   0   2   4   0
    Suter        CAL     2   2   0   2   0   4
    Yawney       CAL     2   2   0   2   3   4
    Adams        VAN     2   1   1   2   2   0
    Chiasson     DET     2   1   1   2  -1   4
    Craven       VAN     2   1   1   2   2   2
    Cullen       TOR     2   1   1   2  -1   0
    Dahlquist    CAL     2   1   1   2   2   4
    King         WIN     2   1   1   2   2   2
    Racine       DET     2   1   1   2   6  14
    Rychel       LA      2   1   1   2   1  19
    Shanahan     STL     2   1   1   2   0   4
    Sheppard     DET     2   1   1   2   2   0
    Sydor        LA      2   1   1   2   0   4
    Barnes       WIN     2   0   2   2   1   2
    Emerson      STL     2   0   2   2   0   0
    Gill         TOR     2   0   2   2  -2   0
    Granato      LA      2   0   2   2   1   4
    Gretzky      LA      2   0   2   2  -3   0
    Housley      WIN     2   0   2   2  -2   0
    Janney       STL     2   0   2   2   0   0
    King         NYI     2   0   2   2   4   6
    Kozlov       DET     2   0   2   2   1   2
    Sandstrom    LA      2   0   2   2  -4   4
    Shuchuk      LA      2   0   2   2  -1   2
    Vaske        NYI     2   0   2   2   1   0
    Damphousse   MON     3   1   1   2   0   0
    Elynuik      WAS     3   1   1   2  -1   0
    Guerin       NJ      3   1   1   2   0   4
    Hannan       BUF     3   1   1   2   2   8
    Holik        NJ      3   1   1   2   1   4
    Muller       MON     3   1   1   2   0   0
    Sakic        QUE     3   1   1   2   0   0
    Semak        NJ      3   1   1   2  -2   0
    Sundin       QUE     3   1   1   2   1   2
    Taglianetti  PIT     3   1   1   2   3   6
    Tipett       PIT     3   1   1   2  -1   6
    Barasso      PIT     3   0   2   2   0   2
    Bondra       WAS     3   0   2   2   1   0
    Carney       BUF     3   0   2   2   3   4
    Cavallini    WAS     3   0   2   2   0   2
    Desjardins   MON     3   0   2   2   0   0
    Duchesne     QUE     3   0   2   2   1   2
    Niedermayer  NJ      3   0   2   2  -1   2
    Ricci        QUE     3   0   2   2   3   2
    Ridley       WAS     3   0   2   2  -1   0
    U.Samuelsson PIT     3   0   2   2   4   6
    Blake        LA      1   0   1   1   2   0
    Borschevsky  TOR     1   0   1   1   0   0
    Zelepukin    NJ      1   0   1   1  -2   0
    B.Mullen     NYI     2   1   0   1  -2   0
    Burr         DET     2   1   0   1  -1   2
    Domi         WIN     2   1   0   1   2   4
    Fedorov      DET     2   1   0   1   2   2
    Felsner      STL     2   1   0   1   1   0
    Howe         DET     2   1   0   1   4   2
    Huddy        LA      2   1   0   1   1   0
    Kurri        LA      2   1   0   1  -2   2
    Lefebvre     TOR     2   1   0   1   0  12
    Lidstrom     DET     2   1   0   1  -1   0
    Lowry        STL     2   1   0   1   1   2
    McSorley     LA      2   1   0   1  -3  12
    Millen       LA      2   1   0   1   2   4
    Mironov      TOR     2   1   0   1  -1   2
    Numminen     WIN     2   1   0   1  -2   0
    Paslawski    CAL     2   1   0   1  -1   0
    Steen        WIN     2   1   0   1  -4   0
    Ysebaert     DET     2   1   0   1   0   0
    Anderson     TOR     2   0   1   1  -2   2
    Berube       CAL     2   0   1   1   1  15
    Chelios      CHI     2   0   1   1  -1   2
    Ciccarelli   DET     2   0   1   1   1  14
    Clark        TOR     2   0   1   1   0   6
    Dahl         CAL     2   0   1   1   2   6
    Dipietro     MON     2   0   1   1   0   0
    Donnelly     LA      2   0   1   1   1   2
    Ellett       TOR     2   0   1   1  -3   0
    Gallant      DET     2   0   1   1   1   4
    K.Brown      CHI     2   0   1   1   1   0
    Kennedy      DET     2   0   1   1   1   0
    Larmer       CHI     2   0   1   1   0   0
    Matteau      CHI     2   0   1   1  -1   2
    McLean       VAN     2   0   1   1   0   0
    McRae        STL     2   0   1   1   1   2
    Murzyn       VAN     2   0   1   1   2   0
    Musil        CAL     2   0   1   1   0   5
    Pearson      TOR     2   0   1   1  -1  21
    Primeau      DET     2   0   1   1   1  20
    Probert      DET     2   0   1   1   0   6
    Ranheim      CAL     2   0   1   1   2   0
    Robitaille   LA      2   0   1   1  -4   2
    Roenick      CHI     2   0   1   1  -1   0
    Selanne      WIN     2   0   1   1  -2   0
    Shannon      WIN     2   0   1   1   4   0
    Skrudland    CAL     2   0   1   1   2  10
    Sutter       CHI     2   0   1   1  -1   0
    Taylor       LA      2   0   1   1   1   0
    Zhitnik      LA      2   0   1   1  -2   2
    Barr         NJ      3   1   0   1   0   6
    Bourque      BOS     3   1   0   1  -2   2
    Burridge     WAS     3   1   0   1  -2   0
    Dionne       MON     3   1   0   1   0   0
    Heinze       BOS     3   1   0   1   0   0
    Leschyshyn   QUE     3   1   0   1   1   4
    Presley      BUF     3   1   0   1   0   0
    Rucinsky     QUE     3   1   0   1   1   2
    Smolinski    BOS     3   1   0   1  -1   2
    Wood         BUF     3   1   0   1  -1   4
    Brunet       MON     3   0   1   1   0   0
    Daniels      PIT     3   0   1   1   1   0
    Donato       BOS     3   0   1   1  -5   0
    Driver       NJ      3   0   1   1  -3   4
    Gusarov      QUE     3   0   1   1   2   0
    Houlder      BUF     3   0   1   1   0   0
    K.Samuelsson PIT     3   0   1   1   2   0
    Kamensky     QUE     3   0   1   1   1   4
    Krygier      WAS     3   0   1   1   0   4
    Loney        PIT     3   0   1   1   2   0
    May          WAS     3   0   1   1   1   2
    Miller       WAS     3   0   1   1  -3   0
    Odelein      MON     3   0   1   1   0   0
    Pivonka      WAS     3   0   1   1  -1   0
    Shaw         BOS     3   0   1   1  -2   4
    Straka       PIT     3   0   1   1   0   0
    Belanger     MON     1   0   0   0   0   0
    Chorske      NJ      1   0   0   0   0   0
    Druce        WIN     1   0   0   0   0   0
    Eagles       WIN     1   0   0   0   0   0
    Errey        BUF     1   0   0   0   0   4
    Ewen         MON     1   0   0   0   0   0
    Foligno      TOR     1   0   0   0   0  16
    Goulet       CHI     1   0   0   0   0   0
    Grimson      CHI     1   0   0   0   0   2
    Hughes       BOS     1   0   0   0   0   2
    Kovalenko    QUE     1   0   0   0   0   2
    Leeman       MON     1   0   0   0   0   0
    McLlwain     TOR     1   0   0   0  -2   0
    Osbourne     TOR     1   0   0   0  -1   2
    Richer       NJ      1   0   0   0  -4   0
    Roberge      MON     1   0   0   0   0   0
    Schneider    MON     1   0   0   0   0   0
    Watters      LA      1   0   0   0   1   4
    Weimer       BOS     1   0   0   0  -1   4
    Andreychuk   TOR     2   0   0   0  -2   2
    Ashton       CAL     2   0   0   0  -1   2
    Babych       VAN     2   0   0   0   2   2
    Baron        STL     2   0   0   0   0   6
    Bassen       STL     2   0   0   0   0   4
    Baumgartner  TOR     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Bautin       WIN     2   0   0   0  -2   2
    Belfour      CHI     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Berg         TOR     2   0   0   0  -1   4
    Billington   NJ      2   0   0   0   0   0
    Blue         BOS     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Borsato      WIN     2   0   0   0  -2   0
    Bozon        STL     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Butcher      STL     2   0   0   0   2   0
    Cheveldae    DET     2   0   0   0   0   2
    Conacher     LA      2   0   0   0   2   0
    Corkum       BUF     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Diduck       VAN     2   0   0   0   2   2
    Dirk         VAN     2   0   0   0   0   2
    Erickson     WIN     2   0   0   0  -1   0
    Essensa      WIN     2   0   0   0   0   2
    Gilbert      CHI     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Graham       CHI     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Hardy        LA      2   0   0   0  -1  10
    Hedican      STL     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Hrudey       LA      2   0   0   0   0   0
    J.Lemieux    CHI     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Johansson    CAL     2   0   0   0  -1   0
    Joseph       STL     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Kasatonov    NJ      2   0   0   0  -2   0
    Kennedy      WIN     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Konstantinov DET     2   0   0   0   1   4
    Krushelnyski TOR     2   0   0   0  -2   0
    Lidster      VAN     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Lumme        VAN     2   0   0   0   2   4
    Macoun       TOR     2   0   0   0  -1   6
    Marchment    CHI     2   0   0   0   1   6
    Miller       STL     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Momesso      VAN     2   0   0   0  -1   2
    Moog         BOS     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Muni         CHI     2   0   0   0  -1   0
    Murphy       CHI     2   0   0   0  -1   4
    Murray       CHI     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Nedved       VAN     2   0   0   0  -2   2
    Olausson     WIN     2   0   0   0  -1   2
    Pearson      QUE     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Potvin       TOR     2   0   0   0   0   6
    Quintal      STL     2   0   0   0  -1   0
    Ramage       MON     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Ri.Sutter    STL     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Rouse        TOR     2   0   0   0  -2   0
    Russell      CHI     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Ruuttu       CHI     2   0   0   0   1   0
    S.Richer     BOS     2   0   0   0  -1   0
    S.Smith      CHI     2   0   0   0  -2   4
    Sandlak      VAN     2   0   0   0  -2   0
    Semenov      VAN     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Stern        CAL     2   0   0   0  -1  26
    T.Hunter     VAN     2   0   0   0   0   2
    T.Sweeney    BOS     2   0   0   0   0   0
    Terreri      NJ      2   0   0   0   0   0
    Tkachuk      WIN     2   0   0   0  -3  10
    Ulanov       WIN     2   0   0   0  -1   4
    Valk         VAN     2   0   0   0   0   2
    Vernon       CAL     2   0   0   0   0   2
    Wilson       STL     2   0   0   0   0   4
    Zezel        TOR     2   0   0   0  -2   2
    Zhamnov      WIN     2   0   0   0  -1   0
    Zombo        STL     2   0   0   0  -1   4
    Albelin      NJ      3   0   0   0  -1   0
    Anderson     WAS     3   0   0   0  -1   0
    Audette      BUF     3   0   0   0  -1   4
    Bodger       BUF     3   0   0   0   3   0
    Brisebois    MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    C.Lemieux    NJ      3   0   0   0  -4  17
    Carbonneau   MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Cavallini    QUE     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Cote         WAS     3   0   0   0  -3   0
    D.Sweeney    BOS     3   0   0   0  -2   4
    Daigneault   MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Dalgarno     NYI     3   0   0   0  -3   0
    Daneyko      NJ      3   0   0   0  -1   2
    Douris       BOS     3   0   0   0  -3   0
    Fetisov      NJ      3   0   0   0  -5   0
    Finn         QUE     3   0   0   0  -1   0
    Fitzgerald   NYI     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Foote        QUE     3   0   0   0   1   0
    Fuhr         BUF     3   0   0   0   0   2
    G.Roberts    BOS     3   0   0   0  -1   4
    Haller       MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Hatcher      WAS     3   0   0   0  -1   2
    Healy        NYI     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Hextall      QUE     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Hough        QUE     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Iafrate      WAS     3   0   0   0  -2   0
    Jennings     PIT     3   0   0   0   0   4
    Jones        WAS     3   0   0   0  -2   5
    Kasparaitis  NYI     3   0   0   0   0   4
    Keane        MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Kimble       BOS     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Krupp        NYI     3   0   0   0   2   2
    Kvartalnov   BOS     3   0   0   0   0   2
    LeClair      MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Leach        BOS     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Lebeau       MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Ledyard      BUF     3   0   0   0  -3   4
    Loiselle     NYI     3   0   0   0  -1   2
    MacLean      NJ      3   0   0   0  -4   4
    Malakov      NYI     3   0   0   0   1   2
    May          BUF     3   0   0   0   0   4
    McKay        NJ      3   0   0   0   0  16
    Nicholls     NJ      3   0   0   0  -4   4
    Nolan        QUE     3   0   0   0   1   2
    Norton       NYI     3   0   0   0   3   0
    Patterson    BUF     3   0   0   0  -1   2
    Pilon        NYI     3   0   0   0   1  22
    Poulin       BOS     3   0   0   0  -4   0
    Roy          MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Savard       MON     3   0   0   0   0   0
    Simon        QUE     3   0   0   0  -1   2
    Stapleton    PIT     3   0   0   0   1   0
    Stastny      NJ      3   0   0   0  -1   2
    Sutton       BUF     3   0   0   0   2   0
    T.Green      NYI     3   0   0   0  -3   0
    Tabaracci    WAS     3   0   0   0   0   4
    Vukota       NYI     3   0   0   0  -1   2
    Wesley       BOS     3   0   0   0   1   0
    Wolanin      QUE     3   0   0   0   1   4
-- 

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-                                                                           -
-    Maurice Richard                                                        -

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54206
From: chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Subject: Re: SHARKS: Jack Feirerra (was Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!)

mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler) writes:

>I've been a loyal ticket holder, since day 1 (literally) in spring of
>'90 when the team was announced.  and I'm not getting that loyalty
>returned.

Well, so are we, and we see it completely different than you. Guess it's a
matter of perspective.

-- 
 Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= chuq@apple.com
   Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms =+=  GEnie: MAC.BIGOT =+= ALink:CHUQ 
  Minor League fans: minors-request@medraut.apple.com (San Jose Giants: A/1/9)
  San Francisco Giants fans: giants-request@medraut.apple.com (The Stick?NOT!)
   San Jose Sharks fans: sharks-request@medraut.apple.com (New seat: 127/TBD)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54207
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: Blues shutout Hawks again, lead series 3-0

4/23/93    BLUES SHUTOUT HAWKS AGAIN, LEAD SERIES 3-0
-----------------------------------------------------
It was a great atmosphere last night at the St. Louis Arena as Joseph and
the Blues shutout the Hawks for the second consecutive game. People were
cheering the Blues long before face-off time, and they kept going for the
entire game. My friends and I went out celebrating until the early morning
hours with some of the players. Here's a game summary from the St. Louis
Post-Disptach. Enjoy...

By Dave Luecking
Of The Post-Dispatch Staff:

At 10:24 p.m. Friday night, The Arena crowd of 17,965 paid homage to Blues
goalie Curtis Joseph. The fans began bowing, their arms extended, taking the
the lead from a fan who held a sign that read ``Only God Saves More Than
Joseph."  It was a fitting tribute to Joseph, who has brought the Blues to
the verge of a surprising sweep.

Joseph recorded his second successive shutout Friday, blanking the Blackhawks
3-0 in Game 3 of the Norris Division semifinals and giving the Blues a 3-0
lead in the best-of-seven series.

The Blackhawks haven't scored against Joseph since the 8:51 mark of the second
period of Game 1. Joseph has shut out the Blackhawks for 151 minutes 9 seconds,
a Blues record. Jacques Plante held the previous record of 146:28, set in the
first round of the 1969 playoffs against the Philadelphia Flyers, one of only
two series the Blues have sweeped in their history.

The Blues can wrap up their first sweep since 1969 with a victory in Game 4,
a nationally televised game that begins at noon Sunday. The Blues have had
only two sweeps in franchise history, both in 1969, when they swept
Philadelphia and Los Angeles en route to the Stanley Cup finals.

The shutout Friday was easier than on Wednesday in Game 2 when Joseph had to
make 47 saves. This time, the Blues held the shots down to 34, and the
Blackhawks couldn't touch Joseph.

Well, they touched Joseph, numerous times, shoving him and pushing him at 
every opportunity to try to get him off his game. But Joseph and the Blues
were unfazed, dishing out their own punishment along the way.

The Blues' grinders -- Bob Bassen, Rich Sutter, Kevin Miller and Dave Lowry --
wore down the Blackhawks, taking the visitors from Chicago off their game.
The grinders set the stage for the glamour boys, the gifted playmakers and
scorers, who made the most of their opportunities.

Craig Janney, Brett Hull and Nelson Emerson scored, getting one goal in each
period. Hull assisted on Janney's first-period power play goal after two unwise
Chicago penalties. Checker Miller set up Hull's goal in the second period, and
rookie Denny Felsner assisted for Emerson, who scored at 16:44 of the final 
period.

Blues fans jumped to their feet in celebration of that goal and began yelling
``Sweep. Sweep. Sweep." They also taunted Chicago goalie Ed Belfour 
``Bell-Four. Bell-Four." They also chanted ``Na, na-na-na, hey-hey good bye."

Such talk is a tad premature. There's still one game left, but the Blues are
on a roll. They have the Blackhawks on their heels.

The Blues set the tone early on Friday with two crunching hits in the first
minute of play. Rich Sutter leveled Bryan Marchment, and Brendan Shanahan
dumped Steve Smith at center ice.

Chicago tried to retaliate, but Troy Murray's decision to run into Joseph
backfired. Referee Dan Marouelli gave him a roughing penalty.

The Blues didn't get a shot on goal on the power play, and they survived a
scare after Chicago killed the penalty when Rick Zombo gave the puck away to
Steve Larmer. Joseph stopped Larmer's shot and everything else Chicago threw
at him in the first period. The 'Hawks ignored the scouting report on Joseph
about shooting high and continued to shoot low, where Joseph's butterfly
style is deadly.

Rookie Bret Hedican picked up three consecutive penalties midway through the
period -- two for hooking and one for holding -- but Chicago got only two
shots on goal, as many as Miller. The Blues' penalty killer twice stole the
puck and just missed on good scoring chances against Belfour.
 
Marouelli began calling penalties on the Blackhawks to even things up.
He caught Brent Sutter hooking Shanahan four seconds after Hedican's third
penalty. He called Marchment for elbowing Janney along the boards at 14:58,
and gave the Blues a two-man advantage 1:07 later when Christian Ruuttu
slashed Shanahan.

The Blues worked around the puck on the ensuing power play, and Hull got it
where he likes it -- in the high slot. Hull's shot hit Belfour's right
shoulder, and the puck bounced precariously close to the goal line. Belfour
dived back to cover, but the puck squirted loose to Janney, who poked it into
the net at 16:53 for his first goal of the playoffs.

The Blues continued their relentless hitting as the period ended, and the
Blackhawks lost their composure. Joe Murphy tripped Ron Wilson with two seconds
remaining in the period, and after time had expired Smith upset the Blues by
shooting the puck into the Blues' bench.

Chris Chelios made a move toward Joseph as the teams left the ice, and
Marouelli slapped him with a 10-minute misconduct. Chicago survived the Blues'
power play, but the loss of Chelios hurt. He didn't return until the midway
point of the period, and within three minutes of his return, Hull had increased
the Blues' lead to 2-0, deflecting in Miller's crisp pass.

Try as they might, the Blackhawks couldn't get to Joseph, who stopped
everything they could throw at him. He stopped 12 shots in the second period
and 13 more in the third. Chicago also hit the goalpost twice.

Emerson's goal put the game away. He went hard to the net and redirected
Felsner's pass.

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54208
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: ESPN2 - Tell us about it

In article <1r997l$3fc@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> mac18@po.CWRU.Edu (Michael A. Cornell) writes:
>
>The USA Today says "late this year".  The question is, will hockey be moved to
>ESPN2 permenantly, or will it be where they have a game of the week on
>ESPN, and have a bunch of other games on ESPN2?
>

Yes and No. ESPN2 will be launched as early in September. Cap Cities
are currently working with cable companies to ensure a good start-up
base needed for a launch for any brand new cable service.

The problem ESPN2 faces is the TCI-Cablevision connection in the
merger of their Prime and SportsChannel networks. Prime SportsChannel
will try to wrestle away NHL from ESPN in the off-season. Also,TCI
and Cablevision have control a large number of cable systems around the
country with a total of 15 million subscribers. TCI-Cablevision will
do their best that ESPN2 never gets off the ground successfully. And the
NHL's value will suddenly skyrocket in this cable war between Prime SC
and ESPN. NHL is more vital to the survival of a regionalized Prime
SportsChannel since they virtually have no national major league sports
contracts and only cover local NHL/NBA/MLB sports teams.

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54218
From: seth@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (peter.r.clark..jr)
Subject: FLYERS notes 4/16


The FLYERS blew a 3-0 lead over the Buffalo Sabres in the second period, but
Kevin Dineen's 7th career hat trick powered them to their 7th consecutive win,
7-4 over the Sabres who have now lost 7 in a row. Alexander Mogilny led the
comeback scoring his 75th and 76th goals of the season which tied the game at
3 in the 2nd period and 4 in the 3rd. Tommy Soderstrom stopped 41 of 45 shots
on goal to improve his own record to 20-17-6 as he was tested by Mogilny and
LaFontaine all night.

Roster move:

Andre Faust was once again recalled from Hershey, Shawn Cronin was a healthy
scratch.

Lines:

Eklund-Lindros-Recchi
Beranek-Brind'Amour-Dineen
Lomakin-Butsayev-Conroy
Faust-Acton-Brown

Galley-Bowen
Yushkevich-Hawgood
Carkner-McGill

Tommy Soderstrom

Game Summary:

Say, if anybody from Buffalo is reading this, where did you people get that
woman who sang the anthems? We had to turn down the volume!

The FLYERS defense started out the game showing everybody why the FLYERS have
been shutting teams out lately by holding the Sabres to only 8 shots in the
first period. They then showed everybody why they will be playing golf Sunday
when they gave up 37 shots in the last two periods. Maybe Tommy told them that
he was getting bored back there...

Mark Recchi opened the scoring so fast that if you blinked you missed it. After
Buffalo won the faceoff and dumped, Tommy wrapped the puck around the boards
to Eric 1/2 way up on his left. Eric dropped it to Galley, and he sent it ahead
to Recchi steaming out of the zone. Mark skated into the center circle, passed
the puck to himself through the legs of Richard Smehlik, skated around him and
in on Fuhr. Smehlik was pulling at him all the way through the zone with his
stick, Recchi drifted right, drifted back left, and slid the puck back to the
right past Fuhr for a 1-0 FLYERS lead at 0:18. It was so beautiful Eric and
Garry should turn down their assists :-).

The FLYERS kept the pressure on Fuhr for a while after that, but he was strong
and kept the FLYERS from doing further damage. The game then became a defensive
struggle for a while. The Sabres got the first chance on the power play when
Terry Carkner took a boarding minor at 10:26 for crunching Dale Hawerchuk into
the boards in the FLYERS zone. LaFontaine got the only scoring chance, and not
a terribly good one, as the FLYERS smothered the Sabres power play. Mogilny got
a post after it was over. The 25th consecutive penalty kill for the FLYERS.

Keith Carney took a holding penalty at 13:31 for taking down Mark Recchi to
give the FLYERS a power play. The best penalty killing team in the league
didn't allow the FLYERS a shot on goal, although the FLYERS did create a
good scoring chance for Lindros who partially fanned on his shot. Towards
the end of the period the play started going end to end, but everybody kept
missing the net. Greg Hawgood took an interference penalty at 18:19 to give
the Sabres another power play, but they couldn't get anything going and the
fans expressed their displeasure, particularly when they iced the puck. Shots
were 8-6 Buffalo after the FLYERS had led 6-2 at one point.

Mike Emrick interviewed FLYERS president Jay Snider between periods. Jay was
disappointed to not make the playoffs, but not discouraged. This was considered
a rebuilding year after *The Trade* and he seemed very happy with the way the
season went. When asked if he agonized over *The Trade* he said that it was
Russ Farwell's trade and not his, that it only was an issue for him and Ed
Snider as far as the money. But yes, there was some agonizing, and they'd do
it all over again. When asked how the coaching situation would be handled for
next year he said that it's Russ' call, and Russ will evaluate things at the
end of the season. He feels that they're 3 years away from a shot at the Cup.
He expects to get into the playoffs next year, have a shot at a division title
the following year, and a shot at the finals the year after that. This based
on the current level of play and anticipated improvements over the summer.

He's very happy with the re-alignment (he called it "outstanding"). Happy with
the current expansion, feels that the talent pool is big enough with the unflux
of Europeans, but feels that they must make sure existing franchises are stable.
Seemed to like the idea of playing in the Olympics (booo) but said that there
was a definite split among owners and that this certainly would only happen in
four years if there was a consensus.

The Sabres gave the FLYERS their second power play of the game when Brad May
took a tripping penalty at 0:51 of the second. The FLYERS had a little trouble
getting started, but eventually did. Hawgood took a pass as he was moving
throug the neutral zone and handed the puck to Eklund just outside the Sabres
blue line along the right boards. Eklund carried into the zone nad passed
across to Dineen who tried a one timer from between the blue line and the
top of the left circle. He half fanned on it, and sent the puck trickling
through the slot. Fuhr didn't know where it was, though, and Hawgood won the
race to it and flipped it into essentially an open net at 2:15.

Then Mogilny on a breakaway. He slipped through two FLYERS at the blue line
and went in on Soderstrom. He went with the backhander, but Soderstrom was
all over it.

The FLYERS then took some bad discipline type penalties that really hurt them.
Viacheslav Butsayev took a double minor for roughing and high sticking when
Barnaby got under his skin and drew one minor, then according to Gary Dornhoefer
took a dive to get the other (there was no video) at 4:22. The Sabres coudln't
get started. Ryan McGill poked at the puck just after a Sabre carried into the
FLYERS zone, and after a bunch of people poked at it Dineen emerged with it and
headed the other way. It started out a 1 on 1, but Brind'Amour hustled ahead to
make it a 2 on 1 and back off the defenseman. Dineen let it rip from the top
of the right circle to make it 3-0 FLYERS at 5:40. That was all for Fuhr, John
Muckler sent in Dominik Hasek to take over.

But the Sabres still had lots of power play time. Again they took some time to
just get into the FLYERS zone, and when they finally did the FLYERS were all
over them. Boos began to ring through the building. But they finally got through
Soderstrom on an ugly goal. Smehlik took a shot from the top of the zone that
missed and kicked out to Hawerchuk in the slot. Hawerchuk tried a backhander as
he skated towards the goal line to the right as Galley dove down to block it.
Mistake #1, he should have let Soderstrom handle the backhander and worried
about A) the rebound or B) Barnaby who was camped behind the goal line right
next to the net. Well, the rebound dropped right next to Soderstrom, and
mistake #2, Galley just laid there and watched Barnaby get THREE hacks at the
puck before he finally pushed it through the goalie. He didn't even swing his
stick out to try and knock the puck away. With the goal, at 7:48, two streaks
end for the FLYERS. 150:28 of shutout hockey, and 27 straight penalty kills.

Lindros put them right back on the power play at 8:36 with a high sticking
minor, I think it was Barnaby again. This time the Sabres were able to get
set up quickly, but couldn't get too much quality on goal. The Sabres continued
to keep the puck in the FLYERS end for a while after the power play ended.
Things evetually settled down, but then the other very bad penalty. McGill
allowed Barnaby to get under his skin and slashed his stick just before a
faceoff. The gloves were dropped, and McGill started pounding the crap out of
him. But during the fight, he gave Barnaby a head butt with his helmet, and
that meant a match penalty. 2 for slashing, 5 fighting and 5 for the major,
7 minutes of power play time for the Sabres at 14:15, Barnaby only got 5.

The FLYERS were keeping them at bay for a while, but there was only so long
they could do that. After a couple of good Sabre chances, Audette handed to
Ledyard at the point, and Ledyard sent a drive that was knocked down by
Soderstrom. LaFontaine whacked at the bouncing puck from the left side of
the net, and knocked it over to Randy Wood at the right. Soderstrom had
moved over to play LaFontaine, and since Yushkevich and Carkner were waving
at the puck instead of picking up men, Wood just slid it into the empty net
at 17:34 to close the FLYERS lead to 3-2. LaFontaine was actually trying to
put it on net, but half fanned on it and got a break.

The FLYERS then got some shorthanded pressure in the Sabres zone, but Hasek
was strong. Finally it was Keith Carney passing ahead to Hawerchuk into the
neutral zone, and Hawerchuk sent a good backhand pass to Mogilny at the FLYERS
blue line. Another mini-breakaway for Mogilny, he elected to shoot from the
left circle, and he threaded the needle to get it just inside the far post at
18:56 for his 75th of the season. Ironically, the youth hockey tip between
the 1st and second period was Tommy Soderstrom talking about cutting off
angles...

That was all in the 2nd, shots were 19-7 Sabres.

Into the 3rd period, and Pelle EKlund blew a golden opportunity to get the
FLYERS the lead back. A 2 on 1, Acton with the puck, he dropped to Eklund in
the slot, and Eklund held the puck as he slid through the left circle until
he had almost no angle at all to shoot from. When he finally did shoot, he
hit the far post. That was still during the carryover power play time.

Than an incredible almost goal. Randy Wood skated around Recchi and Hawgood
untouched into Soderstrom. Soderstrom goes down, Wood pokes the puck under
Soderstrom, and a black object hits the back of the net. Red light comes on,
horn sounds, crowd cheers. But up to the video replay booth, for some strange
reason, and in the meantime Emrick and Dornhoefer try to figure out what they
could be reviewing. Well, it turns out that it was the taped up stick blade
that went into the net, not the puck. Emrick mentions that one of the criteria
for scoring a goal is that the puck must go into the net...

Dave Hannan then took out Recchi and got a holding minor at 2:35. The FLYERS
could not get anything going at all. They finally got set up 1/2 way through,
but were kept on the perimeter. As time ran out, Beranek stripped the puck
from a Sabre in the offensive zone along the right boards and passed it across
to Eklund at the top of the left circle. Eklund saw Dineen heading at the net
just inside the right circle and passed through to him. Dineen fumbled the pass,
but twice directed it at Hasek, and Eklund swooped in and chipped the bouncing
puck over the goalie for his 11th at 4:42. 4-3 FLYERS.

But the Sabres came right back. LaFontaine picked up the puck in his offensive
left corner and slid it to Bob Erry behind the FLYERS net. Erry started to skate
out, but then just dropped the puck back to nobody behind the net. Mogilny flew
in, skated around, and stuffed it through Soderstrom's 5 hole for his 76th at
5:24 to tie the game at 4.

Then Hawerchuk took a retaliatory roughing penalty at 5:55. The FLYERS set up
in the Sabres zone, and stayed there. Off a faceoff high in the Sabres zone in
the middle. While Brind'Amour wrestled for the puck, Dineen snuck through the
line and wristed a perfect shot low to Hasek's glove side at 6:44.

Play started to go back and forth until Hawgood took a roughing penalty at 8:19.
The FLYERS dumped the puck into the Sabres zone. Brind'Amour and Ledyard went
after it, and Rod got the puck. He backed away from the right boards, skated
to the right faceoff dot, and passed between his legs to Dineen crashing
through the slot all by himself. Dineen waited patiently and lifted it over
the blocker of Hasek for a 6-4 FLYERS lead at 8:39. 3rd hat trick of the season
for Dineen, 7th of his career, 2nd shorthanded goal of the game for him 35th
of the season.

Then Carney took a tripping penalty at 9:02 to kill the rest of the Sabres
power play. Not much action on the 4 on 4, and the Sabres got most of the
chances on the FLYERS resulting power play.

Play went end to end for quite a while after that and both goalies had to
make some big saves. The Sabres weren't able to pull Hasek as time was running 
out as the FLYERS wouldn't allow any consistant possession for the Sabres.
Finally as time was running out Ken Sutton misplayed the puck in his own left
corner and Brind'Amour stripped it away from him. He pulled away and found
Dineen on the other side of the left circle, and Dineen found Acton at the
right of Hasek. He slid the puck between two Sabres defenders, and Acton
chipped it back to the far side of Hasek for his 8th of the season at 19:48
on his 35th birthday. That was all the scoring, shots were 18-13 Buffalo,
and the ice was showered with plastic drinking mugs handed out before the
game.

So another strong game from Tommy Soderstrom who hadn't been tested much
in his last couple of starts. Kevin Dineen has a career high 6 point night
(unless he had a better night earlier in the season, but I don't think so).
The FLYERS longest winning streak in 3 years, 30 goals for only 11 against
with three shutouts. Eric Lindros is 8th in league with 33 even strength goals
despite missing 23 games with injury. 4 points out of 4th, clinched 5th place
since the Rangers lose the tie breaker.

A couple misc notes:

Forget the Mike Keenan rumors, there will be a press conference tommorrow to
announce that he will be head coach of the New York Rangers next year.

In the last notes I mentioned that Garry Galley won the Barry Ashbee Award,
but I failed to mention that the award is for the best defenseman.

The Times of Trenton has reported that "a preeminent specialist from Oklahoma"
has looked over Tommy Soderstrom's medical record and determined that no
further tests are necessary in the near future.

Same paper had a blurb about Bill Dineen being asked about whether or not he
expected to be back next year. His response was that he wants to come back,
he feels he did a good job this year, but that he would cheerfully accept a
role scouting if Farwell didn't want him back.

FLYERS team record watch:

Eric Lindros:

41 goals, 33 assists, 74 points

(rookie records)
club record goals:			club record points:
Eric Lindros	40 1992-93		Dave Poulin	76 1983-84
Brian Propp	34 1979-80		Brian Propp	75 1979-80
Ron Flockhart	33 1981-82		Eric Lindros	74 1992-93
Dave Poulin	31 1983-84		Ron Flockhart	72 1981-82
Bill Barber	30 1972-73		Pelle Eklund	66 1985-86

Mark Recchi:

52 goals, 69 assists, 121 points.

club record goals:			club record points:
Reggie Leach	61 1975-76		Mark Recchi	121 1992-93*
Tim Kerr	58 1985-86,86-87	Bobby Clarke	119 1975-76
Tim Kerr	54 1983-84,84-85	Bobby Clarke	116 1974-75
Mark Recchi	52 1992-93		Bill Barber	112 1975-76
Rick Macliesh	50 1972-73		Bobby Clarke	104 1972-73
Bill Barber	50 1975-76		Rick Macliesh	100 1972-73
Reggie Leach	50 1979-80

*More than 80 games.

FLYERS career years:

Player		Points	Best Prior Season
Mark Recchi	121	113 (90-91 Penguins)
Rod Brind'Amour	84	77 (91-92 FLYERS)
Garry Galley	62	38 (84-85 Kings)
Brent Fedyk	59	35 (90-91 Red Wings)

That's all for now...

pete clark jr - rsh FLYERS contact and mailing list owner


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54219
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: Ulf and all...

Richard Wernick (richard@amc.com) wrote:
: You should be ashamed to call yourself an Ulf Samuelson fan. Anybody who plays
: the way he does, does not belong in the NHL. There have been cheap shot artists
: through the history of the game, but a lot of them have been talanted players.
: Bobby Clarke, Kenny Linsemen, Pie McKenzie, Chris Chelios etc.. but nobody has been
: out right as dirty a cheapshot coward as Ulf. Violence in hockey has got to be curbed
: and players like (Should have been a Women) Samuelson don't belong. When players
: like Ulf, who's main purpose is to injure the better players in the league is allowed
: to continue, and the league won't stop it, the players should. A Christian Pro 1000
: aluminum stick directed at his ugly head should do the trick nicely. If the Bruins get
: a chance to meet Pittsburgh in the near future, you can bet Neely will have his day.
: The sight of watching Ulf turtle up like the coward he is, is worth almost as much as a
: Stanely Cup. This wimp of a player almost ruined the career of one the best right wingers
: in the game. If you are to remove Ulf Samuelson from the lineup, the Penguins would not
: even notice he's gone. He's an eyesore on the game of hockey.


: Rich


Thank you for your extremely lucid and well thought out observation.
Now when you get back on your medication, please let us know how you
are feeling. 
Thank you,
--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54220
From: huot@cray.com (Tom Huot)
Subject: Re: Goodbye, good riddance, get lost 'Stars

Stephen Lawrence (s4lawren@sms.business.uwo.ca) wrote:
:         Goodbye Minnesota,...you never earned the right to have an NHL 
: franchise in the first place!
:         Hope you enjoy your Twin city wide mania for HIGH SCHOOL HOCKEY
: (hey, by the way my old pee wee team is having a reunion in Regina, care 
: to come up and film the event?)
:         Yee haa Golden Gophers
: Whatta weird town!!!!!

: s4lawren@sms.business.uwo.ca (Stephen Lawrence)
: Western Business School  --  London, Ontario

This is the second posting of this kind from an idiot at a business 
school in Canada. What is your problem up there anyway? Is this what 
they teach you in business school in Canada?
--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Tom Huot        			       
huot@cray.com 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54221
From: jfp001@acad.drake.edu
Subject: Re: Goalie Mask Update

In article <93289@hydra.gatech.EDU>, gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak) writes:
> 
> 	Here are the results after three days of voting. Remember 3pts for 
> 1st, 2 for 2nd, and 1 for 3rd. Also, you can still turn in votes! And.. if
> the guy isn't a regular goalie or he is retired, please include the team! 
> Thanks for your time, and keep on sending in those votes!
> 
> Player                  Team                  Pts     Votes
> -----------------------------------------------------------
> 1. Brian Hayward        San Jose              15        6
>    Andy Moog            Boston                15        6
> 3. Curtis Joseph        St. Louis             11        5
> 4. Ed Belfour           Chicago               10        5
> 5. Gerry Cheevers       Boston (retired)       5        3 
>    Manon Rheaume        Atlanta (IHL)          5        2
>    Ron Hextall          Quebec                 5        2
> 8. Don Beaupre          Washington             4        2
> -----------------------------------------------------------
> Others receiving 1 vote: Artus Irbe (SJ), Tim Cheveldae (Det),
>  Clint Malarchuck (Buf/SD,IHL), Grant Fuhr (Buf), Rick Wamsley 
>  (Tor,ret), Jon Casey (Minn), John Vanbiesbrouck (NYR),
>  Ken Dryden (Mon,ret), Bob Essensa (Win), Mike Vernon (Cal),
>  Glenn Healy (NYI), Tommy Soderstron (???), Ray LeBlanc (USA).
> 

C'mon, Tommy Soderstrom is having a fine rookie (I think he's a rookie)
season with the Flyers. I'm sure most of you knew that already, but just
in case. 

John P.
jfp001@acad.drake.edu
A longtime, but realistic Ranger fan who's willing to admit that the Rangers
sucked big-time this year. They don't even deserve the luxury of a nice
golf course with a warm breeze. God, talk about underachievers!
Mike Keenan - we're waiting for you!
> 
> -- 
> GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
> GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
> GO HORNETS!  ||
> GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54222
From: nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: SHARKS REVIEW Part 3: Defensemen (21-45)

#21	PETER AHOLA		Season: 2nd
Acquired:	'92-93, trade with Pittsburgh for future considerations
Grade:		I (B)

It is way too early to tell about Ahola, who was acquired probably because the
Penguins figured that they would lose him in the expansion draft.  Ahola had
only played 50 games this season (I think it's actually less; the San Jose
Mercury News may be in err here), 20 of them with the Sharks.  In the games he
has played, he appeared quite solid defensively, although he hasn't been
spectacular, and his offense isn't anything to write home about (8 points);
it's even possible that the trade may be for future considerations which turn
out to be ... Peter Ahola.

#24	DOUG WILSON		Season: 16th
Acquired:	'91-92, trade with Chicago for RW Kerry Toporowski and
		2nd round pick in '92 entry draft
Grade:		I (B)

I have often been accused of overly down on Wilson; I may have had too high
expectations for him, but his legs, knees, et al., are giving out.
Nevertheless, when he was playing, he exhibited a strong shooting and
playmaking abilities, even if he has lost a step on defense, which,
unfortunately, he demonstrated this year as well, as at times he was slow to
catch the opponent forwards, and his offensive output was only good enough for
2nd place on the team (20 points in 42 games).  But next year, which may be
Wilson's last, if he can stay healthy, he can still be a contributor.

#29	DEAN KOLSTAD		Season:	2nd
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		I (C-/D+)

It's probably somewhat unfair for me to judge Kolstad on just a handful of
games (forgetting exact number, but no more than 15), but at age 25 he's
quickly running out of time if he wants to make it to the NHL.  In those games,
he did not impress anyone; after generating 7 shots in the first period of
the first game he played, he scored just 2 points in his tenure up here with
the Sharks, and was even less impressive defensively, as he appeared awkward
with his movement and was prone to giveaways.  He needs to make a leap in
his level of performance to have any chance of making the team.

#38	PAT MACLEOD		Season: 2nd
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		I (?)

MacLeod was on the roster a lot longer than Kolstad, but it appears to my
memory that he played less than Kolstad, because the Sharks were reluctant to
use him, but were even more reluctant to send him to the minors, figuring that
he wouldn't clear waivers; in fact, he has played the past 4-5 weeks with
Kansas City, but is still technically there on a rehabilitation assignment,
a "rehab assignment" that will include him playing in the Turner Cup playoffs.
Since he has played so little, I can't even give a tentative grade on him, but
he demonstrated last year excellent offensive skills but terrible defensive
skills.

#41	TOM PEDERSON		Season: 1st
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		I (B+)

Called up in the middle of the season when the defensive corps was decimated
by injuries, Pederson impressed many Sharks fan here on net, including yours
truly.  He demonstrated very good offensive skills, scoring 20 points in
43 games.  However, his size (5' 9", 165 lbs.) is of concern, and soon after
he began to shine offensive did teams begin to push him around physically,
on both sides of the ice, although he had appeared fearless in his approach.
But to be successful, he probably needs to bulk up to have a fighting chance
on surviving against some of the bigger players in the league.

#45	CLAUDIO SCREMIN		Season: 1st
Acquired:	'91-92, from Minnesota in dispersal draft
Grade:		I (D+/D)

He played all of ~5 games in the league this year, but was thoroughly
umimpressive, just as he was at the end of last season; again, it may be a
small sample, but just as in the case of Kolstad, Scremin, at age 25, is
quickly running out of time.  He was not a contributor on either offense or
defense in the games he played with the Sharks.  The only notable thing that
will go down in Scremin's entry of league stats is probably the fact that he
was once traded for now Capitals goaltender Don Beaupre.

===============================================================================
GO CALGARY FLAMES!  Al MacInnis for Norris!  Gary Roberts for Hart and Smythe!
GO EDMONTON OILERS!  Go for playoffs next year!  Stay in Edmonton!
===============================================================================
Nelson Lu (claudius@leland.stanford.edu)
rec.sport.hockey contact for the San Jose Sharks

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54223
From: e8l6@jupiter.sun.csd.unb.ca (Rocket)
Subject: Dear Montana@pinetree.org  Re: Hockey Pool



   Hi there, I can't seem to get mail to you. Can you tell me your entire
adress, or even your dotted decimal address?

   (ie. 131.202.3.10)

   Thanks,
           rocket@calvin.cs.unb.ca 

-- 

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-    Maurice Richard                                                        -

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54224
From: schock@flip.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (Craig-Richard Schock)
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains

In article <1993Apr22.121035.3394@mtroyal.ab.ca>  writes:
> >And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
> >resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
> >team captain trivia would be appreciated.
> 
> Brad McCrimmon was the captain of the Flames when he was traded to Detroit
> following the 1989-90 season. This was during the off-season though.
> 
> There's countless examples of captains being traded, I'm sure.

Yeah... I think that the Flames and the Flyers traded Captains once... Mel  
Bridgeman for Brad Marsh.

Craig

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54225
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Re: ESPN2 - Tell us about it

nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219) writes:
>
>The problem ESPN2 faces is the TCI-Cablevision connection in the
>merger of their Prime and SportsChannel networks. Prime SportsChannel
>will try to wrestle away NHL from ESPN in the off-season. Also, TCI
>and Cablevision have control a large number of cable systems around the
>country with a total of 15 million subscribers. TCI-Cablevision will
>do their best that ESPN2 never gets off the ground successfully. And the
>NHL's value will suddenly skyrocket in this cable war between Prime SC
>and ESPN. NHL is more vital to the survival of a regionalized Prime
>SportsChannel since they virtually have no national major league sports
>contracts and only cover local NHL/NBA/MLB sports teams.

Note that this ominous prospect is fueled by the fact that various SC
and Prime outlets are wholly or partly owned by local NHL owners.
When/If Cablevision VP Chuck Dolan's purchase of the Islanders goes
through, the Islanders will be back solidly in the SCNY fold (their
original owners were, and they've remained due to a lucrative TV
contract).  The Flyer Snyders own the Philadelphia SC as well as the
Prism pay channel.  There are six teams affiliated with regional SC's,
another half dozen affiliated with Prime outlets, and other locals
like HTS and NESN who have barter arrangements.  With all this
cross-ownership, I was surprised that ESPN got the deal this 
season!!

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54226
From: rzuback@alumni.Lakeheadu.Ca
Subject: Leafs Revenge!

Tonight will see the Toronto Maple Leafs, as some have guessed, come out 
hitting!  The "Buds" will grind Detroit into the ground and walk away with 
home ice advantage for the remainder of the series... which given a shift to 
Toronto, will not last long.  (Keep in mind this is only a predicition).  
Wendall will have to get into the game however otherwise Probert will 
dominate on the physical front.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54227
From: jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio)
Subject: Re: NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 23 APRIL 1993

In article <1993Apr24.131127.17461@philabs.philips.com> jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio) writes:

>NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 23 APRIL 1993:
>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>                  CONFERENCE SEMI-FINALS        BEST OF SEVEN
>      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE

> NYI   (leads 2-1)   MON                 TOR                 LA    
> WAS                 QUE   (leads 2-1)   DET   (leads 2-1)   CAL   (tied  2-1)
                                                                     ^^^^^^^^^^

O.K. people, so it's not tied.  I meant leads 2-1........  Shoot me if you
must.

-JPC

-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John P. Curcio 		          Go Bruins!		   Philips Laboratories
jpc@philabs.philips.com 			           345 Scarborough Road
(914) 945-6442               	 		     Briarcliff Manor, NY 10510 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54228
From: farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: College hockey all-star game roster

Someone asked about the rosters for the college hockey senior all-star
shrine game held in Orono, Maine earlier this month: 

WEST
Derek Plante		MINN-DULUTH	(west MVP of the game)
Greg Johnson		N DAKOTA		
Bryan Smolinski		MICH ST
Fred Knipscheer		ST CLOUD STATE
Chris Campbell		WISCONSIN-SUPERIOR
Glenn Lang		UW-SUPERIOR
Chris Bergeron		MIAMI
Joe Cook		MIAMI
Jamie Erb		BEMIDIJI
Brett Harkins		BOWLING GREEN
David Roberts		MICHIGAN
Todd Trettier		UW-STEVENS POINT
John Young		MICH TECH
Brett Hauer		MINN-DULUTH
Pat Neaton		MICHIGAN
Barry Richter		WISCONSIN
Mike Smith		LSSU
Chris Valicevic		ST MARY'S
Shaun Gravistin		AK-ANCHORAGE	(goalie)
Tom Newman		MINNESOTA	   "
Bryan Schoen		DENVER		   "
Ron Mason		MICH ST		(coach)
Steve Nelson		UW-SUPERIOR	  "
Jim Knapp		MINN-DULUTH	  "

EAST
Jack Duffy		YALE
Chris Foy		N'EASTERN
Scott Meehan		MASS-LOWELL
Aaron Miller		VERMONT
Kevin O'SUllivan	BU
Chris Potter		CONNECTICUT
Ray Alcindor		MIDDLEBURY
Greg Carvel		ST LAWRENCE
Bob Cowan		PROVIDENCE
Steve Dubinksy		CLARKSON
Dan Gravelle		MERRIMACK
Ryan Hughes		CORNELL
Mark Kauffman		YALE
Matt Mallgrave		HARVARD
Chris McGee		BABSON
Scott McNair		RIT
Jim Montgomery		MAINE
David Sacco		BU
Chris Rogles		CLARKSON	(goalie)   (East's MVP of the game)
Garth Snow		MAINE		   "
Grant Wood		HAMILTON	   "
Brian Durocher		BROWN		(coach)
Shawn Walsh		MAINE   	   "
Bruce Marshalll		CONNECTICUT	   "


These are the original rosters. There may have been a few changes
for the actual game (guys not being able to participate or whatever).

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54229
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL Playoff results, Thurs/Fri

AHL PLAYOFF SCORES-- FIRST ROUND	(home team in CAPS)
================================

GAMES PLAYED ON THURS, 4/22
-------------------------
Rochester 4	UTICA 3		(OT)
		
GAMES PLAYED ON FRI, 4/23
--------------------------
Binghamton 8	BALTIMORE 3
MONCTON 5	St John's 4	(OT)
Springfield 4	PROVIDENCE 2

===================================================================
SERIES STATI (plural of status? :)
----------------------------------
Adirondack defeated CDI, 4-0
Springfield leads Providence, 3-2
Binghamton leads Baltimore, 2-1
Rochester leads Utica, 3-1
St John's leads Moncton, 3-1
Cape Breton leads Fredericton, 3-1
			
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54230
From: yadallee@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Dave Shariff Yadallee)
Subject: Re: Oiler's rumour - Team moving? Press conference next week

allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan) writes:

-
- I heard a story on the local sports news broadcast in Edmonton.
- Oiler owner Peter Pocklington will be holding a press conference
- next week. While the exact details are not known, it is believed
- to concern the Oiler's future.
-
- Rumour has it that Pocklington signed a tentative lease arrangement
- with Copps Collesium in Hamilton. During the press conference,
- Pocklington may announce the deal. It is quite possible that
- the deal may simply be a way to force Edmonton Northlands to
- renegotiate the Oiler lease on the stadium.
-
- Northlands has offered to buy the Oilers for $65 million earlier,
- but the offer was rejected immediately by Pocklington.
-
- As for me, my opinion is divided... Edmonton has been fairly
- supportive of the Oilers. Even though they're a small market
- team, they had many sellouts in the 80s. Even with the problems
- that the team had this year, they still brought in more fans
- than many teams in larger cities did. On the other hand, if
- the team does move, there is no place more deserving than
- Hamilton. Of course, how would that affect the grand
- realignment scheme of Bettman?
-

  Following up on this, the provincial government has been asked by the
Opposition to block any deal that Pocklington is offering to Hamilton.  The
government said that Pock is going nowhere!

  Why don't I believe the government?  Wasn't it Pocklington who wanted to be
Tory leader 9 years ago?

Dave Shariff Yadallee (B. Sc.(Econ/Math) (U of Alberta 1990) )
(yadallee@ersys.edmonton.ab.ca) God Save the Queen, God Bless us All!Remember!
Jesus saves lives from eternal damnation!
Newfoundland, keep good old Clyde, VOTE LIBERAL!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54231
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: Calder Cup schedule

FULL 1993 CALDER CUP PLAYOFF SCHEDULE AND RESULTS	
home team in CAPS		*=if necesary

FIRST ROUND					
Springfield Indians vs Providence Bruins
Gm 1:	Springfield 3	PROVIDENCE 2	
Gm 2:	Springfield 5	PROVIDENCE 4
Gm 3:	Providence 3	SPRINGFIELD 2
Gm 4:	Providence 9	SPRINGFIELD 0		
Gm 5:	Springfield 4	PROVIDENCE 2
Gm 6:	4/24	Providence at Springfield	
Gm 7:	4/27	Springfield at Providence	*

CD Islanders vs Adirondack Red Wings
Gm 1:	ADIRONDACK 6	CDI 2
Gm 2:	ADIRONDACK 5	CDI 3
Gm 3:	Adirondack 3	CDI 0
Gm 4:	Adirondack 3	CDI 1
(ADIRONDACK WINS SERIES, 4-0)

Baltimore Skipjacks at Binghamton Rangers
Gm 1:	Baltimore 4	BINGHAMTON 3	
Gm 2:	BINGHAMTON 6	Baltimore 2
Gm 3:	Binghamton 8	BALTIMORE 3
Gm 4:	4/24	Binghamton at Baltimore
Gm 5:	4/26	Baltimore at Binghamton	
Gm 6:	4/28	Binghmaton at Baltimore	*
Gm 7:	4/30	Baltimore at Binghamton	*
		
Utica Devils vs Rochester Americans
Gm 1:	Utica 3		ROCHESTER 2	(OT)
Gm 2:	ROCHESTER 9	Utica 3
Gm 3:	Rochester 6	UTICA 4
Gm 4:	Rochester 4	UTICA 3		(OT)
Gm 5:	4/24	Utica at Rochester	
Gm 6:	4/26	Rochester at Utica	*
Gm 7:	4/28	Utica at Rochester	*

Moncton Hawks vs St John's Maple Leafs
Gm 1:	St JOHN'S 4	Moncton 2	(at Halifax)
Gm 2:	ST JOHN'S 3	Moncton 2	(at Halifax)
Gm 3:	St John's 6	MONCTON 5
Gm 4:	MONCTON 5	St John's 4	(OT)
Gm 5:	4/26	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax	
Gm 6:	4/28	St John's at Moncton		*
Gm 7:	4/30	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax	*

Cape Breton Oilers vs Fredericton Canadiens
Gm 1:	FREDERICTON 4	Cape Breton 3	(2OT)
Gm 2:	Cape Breton 5	FREDERICTON 2
Gm 3:	CAPE BRETON 3	Fredericton 0	
Gm 4:	CAPE BRETON 6	Fredericton 5 	(OT)
Gm 5:	4/24	Cape Breton at Fredericton	
Gm 6:	4/26	Fredericton at Cape Breton	*
Gm 7:	4/28	Cape Breton at Fredericton	*
(note about this series: the AP reports that CB has won this
 series 4-1, but in the original schedule, Game 5 wasn't supposed
 to be until tonight and I only have the Oilers as being up 3-1)

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54232
From: brifre1@ac.dal.ca
Subject: Re: POTVIN and HIS STICK

In article <122521@netnews.upenn.edu>, kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller) writes:
>>>>I prefer
>>>to watch hockey than seeing shots of Felix Potvin slashing and spearing Dino
>>>Ciccerelli standing in front of the net.  HE HAS EVERY RIGHT TO STAND IN
>>>FRONT OF THE NET, JUST NOT IN THE CREASE!
> 
> Yes, he does.  BUT, the goalie sure as hell doesn't want him there!  When
> I played roller hockey (boy do I miss those days) as a goalie, I would
> scream at my defense to clear guys out of the slot.  I don't care if he's
> in the crease or not, get him the hell away from me so I can see the ball!
> (Yes, roller hockey, remember)  And if there was nobody around to clear
> the slot, then I'd do it myself by pushing the offending player--*hard*. 
> I *hate* people in my way when I'm the goalie, and I am sure Felix does
> too.  I should say that I didn't see the incident, so if Potvin really
> swung the stick big time, then that's not right, but he can move people
> out of the way.  He's a player on the ice too, you know.  :-)
> 
> --
>     Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
> 	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!
>      In this corner				LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
>      Weighing in at almost every weight imaginable . . . 
>      Life, and all that surrounds it.		     -- Blues Traveler, 1993
I have to agree wholeheartedly with this view.  I don't like to see stickwork,
but you have to clear players away from in front.  My personal favorite move
(I'm a goalie too) is to give the offeding player a good whack on the back
of their skates when the ref isn't looking.  Makes 'em go down like a ton of
bricks, but doesn't cause injuries unless they don't know how to fall (I'm 
talking about hitting the blades here, not the foot).  It also makes the 
player you hit and anyone who sees really mad and apt to take a stupid
retaliation penalty.  Unfortunately, it also leaves your blocker out of 
position for a short time...I don't do this if a shot is likely on the short
side.  Hmm....maybe I should mail Potvin this method (in French and with
helpful diagrams, of course).  It sure would be nice to see Ciccerelli (who
I have a great deal of respect for, BTW, he's not a big guy, but he plays
huge!) fall on his back a few times!  :-)

Barfly

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54233
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: They're real and they're spectacular

"They're real and they're spectacular", the Blues shutout the Blackhawks in
consecutive playoff games. 

If the Blues sweep the Hawks on Sunday, I will launch a broom onto the ice
in the last seconds of the game. "Not that there's anything wrong with that."

Curtis Joseph has been the "master of his own domain", and the Hawks have
been shooting the puck like a bunch of "chuckers". Not even "Superman" could
play any better in goal. Joseph must have been eating his "cereal."

"It's like a sauna in here" said a spectator about the hot atmosphere and
the wild crowd at the Arena.

It was "very refreshing" to see the Blues "double-dip" the Hawks.

The Hawks goons tried to "pick" on Hull, Janney, and Joseph but the Blues
checking line "nipped" those Hawks real well.

The fat "Yoyoma" will sing on Sunday, and the Hawks will head to the "beach".
The Hawks' trip back to Chicago will feel like a long "journey from Milan
to Minsk"

Enjoy Sunday's game with some Junior Mints and wash them down with a Snapple.

Just a little fun.

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54239
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: Stan Fischler, 4/22

In article <1993Apr24.181145.17567@news.columbia.edu> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>
>* Roger Neilson is not property ... among other rumours, he's now
>the #1 candidate to coach the Flyers, and will bring along Colin
>Campbell as his assistant.
>

This would be dumb move of the nineties...Lindros is big and strong...
but why give him a ball and chain on one leg and an anchor on the
other to drag along.

>* Compuware is actively scouting Phoenix for a new team in 94-95 [hey,
>Nick and Jimmy ... buy the Devils and fix them here, please! --- gld].
>

Not if Pocklington gets there first! (-...actually, if Pocklington
doesn't get a better deal, he would probably go to Hamilton...taking
the team out of Canada would get the whole country mad at him...
taking the team to Hamilton wouldn't get anybody mad at him that 
isn't mad at him already...and would make him a lot of friends
in Southern Ontario...so many that the whining of the stupid politicians in
Edmonton and the fickle spoiled fans wouldn't be noticed at all.
Edmonton would wallow in anonymnity.

Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54240
From: allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan)
Subject: Don's nickname "grapes" (was Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here)

georgeh@gjhsun (George H) writes:

>LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall) writes:

>>Don got his nickname 'Grapes' but I'm not sure.  Don use to coach the
>>Boston Bruins.  I don't know exactly when that was.  Could someone fill
>>me in on this info?

>I think that the name 'grapes' came because as coach (for the Bruins ?
>or in the minors ?) he used to chew on grapes to keep from getting 
>dehydrated during the games.  His dog Blue may have been named 
>'cause he liked Labatts beer ... anyone know about that ?

According to "Quotations from Chairman Cherry", Don was playing in
Springfield. He and another player had to pay some fines; the other
player had his paid off, but not Don didn't want to.

Don called the other player a "teacher's Pet", and the other player
replied "Ah, that's just sour grapes".

Don't know how accurate that is, but that's what's printed.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54241
From: gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare)
Subject: Stan Fischler, 4/16 (Keenan stuff!)


* The Keenan hiring is precipitated by the loss of an anticipated $5M
in playoff revenue and fears of losing season ticket-holders (!), plus
Paramount chief Stan Jaffe's chip against the Flyers over l'Affaire
Lindros last autumn.  Add to this that Neilsen might return as an
assistant coach [Gerald, what'd I say earlier today??], and Roger
conferred with Jaffe on the hiring.  This hiring by Jaffe went over
the head of MSG, Inc. (Par. subsidiary) head Bob Gutkowski and over
the head and the protests of Pres./GM Neil Smith.

* MSG is making the announcement on Saturday to get back at the
Islanders for making the playoffs (i.e., steal the press).

* Flyers owner Ed Snyder is livid and beside himself over this.

* Keenan will make up to $900,000/yr.

* Gary Bettman has appointed an independent consul to look at
Gil Stein's admission into the Hall of Fame.

* New crease colours, rather than blue?

* The Oilers will charge to eat in the Press Room next year.

gld
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Je me souviens ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gary L. Dare
> gld@columbia.EDU 			GO  Winnipeg Jets  GO!!!
> gld@cunixc.BITNET			Selanne + Domi ==> Stanley

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54242
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Playoff pool rule revision

Well, I will have to change the scoring on my playoff pool.  Unfortunately
I don't have time right now, but I will certainly post the new scoring
rules by tomorrow.  Does it matter?  No, you'll enter anyway!!!  Good!

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54243
From: brifre1@ac.dal.ca
Subject: Leafs win! (thank you Potvin)

It's about time the boys got it together!!
They were outworked and outplayed by the Wings in the first two games.
But Burns must have kicked their behinds cause they sure came out in full
gear (or is that high gear?) in game 3.  Except for a 10-15 minute stretch
in the 2nd period, they outskated and outworked the Wings.  Please don't
flame this statement 'cos you know it's true!  I have to admit that 
goaltending was the key.  Potvin kept the Leafs ahead during the sleepy
stretch the Leafs went through in the 2nd.  He also kept the rebounds to a
minimum, something that cost Cheveldae 2 goals.  Clark even looked like
he had stopped moping (first star!), although I still don't know why he
was so flat in games 1 and 2.

If the Leafs play the same style and can keep the pace they had in game
3, they may actually have a chance of winning this series (a slim chance, 
but a chance....I'm no RM.....where is he anyways? haha).

Barfly

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54244
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL Leafs Back Home?

Apparently, the public workers' strike in St John's, Newfoundland is over.
The strike has, since mid-January, forced the St John's Maple Leafs hockey
team to play their home games in other cities such as Toronto, Cornwall
and Charlottetown. They have been playing their playoff home games
in Halifax, Nova Scotia. Leafs' management said that they COULD
return to St John's for the second round.

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54245
From: ua256@freenet.Victoria.BC.CA (Tom Moffat)
Subject: Interview guests


Have you ever noticed that after a hockey player has been interviewed
in between periods on a tv game. That they usually get a goal or
an assist. can you explain this or is it that they usually talk 
to stars more than regular players which explains the hight 
percentage of results after.

Just wondering how everybody else thinks about this or if they dont 
care about this trivial nonsense.
ttyl  Tom
-- 
Tom Moffat
Victoria B.C.
Canada

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54246
From: randolin@polisci.umn.edu (Robert Andolina)
Subject: Sabres-Bruins

Buffalo fans:

Some people in the discussion group, as well as "commentator Al" on ESPN, 
believe that game 3 is critical for the Sabres.  HELLOOOO!!!!! The Sabres 
are AHEAD 2 games to 0, not behind.  As a life-long Sabres fan, I am well 
aware of their ability to choke, but let's not exaggerate that.  As long as 
the Sabres win one of the next 2 games (be it game 3 OR game 4), they are 
still in good shape (ahead 3 games to 1), with game 6 to be played at 
Buffalo.  If they lose games three AND four, then start worrying.  Game 3 is 
critical for Boston, not Buffalo.



Rob Andolina
randolin@polisci.umn.edu




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54247
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

In article <1993Apr21.142357.14164@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>Fuhr is proving the Fuhr-bashers wrong, but Boston is an awfully
>good team.
>

Yeh,but :

1.Biran Sutter's playoff record as the head coach in St.L wasn't very
impressive. His Blues teams were eliminated very early in the playoffs.
It doesn't look like this trend will change with the Bruins.

2. Bruins have never come back to win after falling behind 2-0 in their
entire 68-year history. It doesn't look like Buffalo will just lose
their next two games at the Aud with the way Fuhr has been standing on
his head.

Basically,the Bruins will be on the golf course by next weekend.
Also,it seems like the whole Boston area has gone baseball crazy after
an incredibly great start by the Red Sox(best record in their major
leagues as of now). I would say that 70% of the callers to the Bruins'
flagship station(SportsRadio 590) are talking about the Red Sox,about
15% are yapping about the Patriots' upcoming draft,10% are on the Celtics
and about 5% are on the Bruins.
Somehow,no one around here is really schocked the way Bruins are folding
early.

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54248
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Upcoming TV schedule

Hey,guess what's coming to ESPN for a change? A playoff which doesn't
involve the Pens. Not that there is anything wrong with that...

ESPN games :

Thursday  Game3 Pens at Devils at 7:30(Gary Thorne and Bill Clement)
Saturday  Game4 Caps at NY Isles at 7:30(Tom Mees and John Davidson)

ABC game :

Sunday    Game4 Pens at Devils at 1:00 (Gary Thorne and Bill Clement)

ESPN named its #2 broadcast team on Tuesday. It paired Tom Mees(play by
play) with John Davidson(analyst).

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54249
From: ac291@Freenet.carleton.ca (W. Jon Shaib)
Subject: Some Play-offs Thoughts


Well, we're almost halfway through the first round, and so far things are
good in general:

  1. The 2 teams that I hate most: Chicago and "Basten" are down 3 zip.
     (even though there is a possibility either can still win their
      series, yet this ego-thrashing and arrogance-smashing by the
      underdogs (St. Louis and Buffalo) is so rewarding).
  2. Montreal is at this stage in a team's life where they are not good
     enough to go all the way, yet too good to be able to get some
     (really) good draft picks... :-(
  3. Is it just me, or does anyone out there also think that this year
     the cup final should be played between 2 teams from the WALES?
  4. Is it just because they're playing Montreal that I find the diques
     arrogant ***'s, or are they really?
  5. Smythe-what???? I'm really getting sick of seeing Douggie and Wendel
     night in and night out... We should see some Canucks/Jets/Flames
     action...!
  6. Don Cherry is an ******* alright, but hey... so are our politicians...
  
ObLeafsJoke:  Q. what do you get when you cross a maple leaf and a 
                groundhog?
              A. Six more weeks of crummy hockey!
------------------------------------------------------------------
L8R, dudes...
GO HABS GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jon Shaib  ac291@carleton.freenet.ca
---------------------------------------------------------------------------


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54250
From: spiegel@sgi413.msd.lmsc.lockheed.com (Mark Spiegel)
Subject: Re: 1993 NHL Draft

In article <1993Apr20.184627.4585@newshub.ariel.yorku.ca> cs902043@ariel.yorku.ca (SHAWN LUDDINGTON) writes:
>In article <93109.134719IO91748@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> Jon Carr <IO91748@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> writes:
>>When is the draft this year?  And will there be any coverage?
>>I know the upcomming NFL draft is on ESPN.
>>
>>Anyone got the details?
>>
>>Paul Kariya 1993 #1 Pick! (No. 2 perhaps?  He won't last long!) :-)
>>
>I don't know the exact coverage in the states.  In Canada it is covered
>by TSN, so maybe ESPN will grab their coverage!  I don't know!
>
>As for the picks
>Ottawa picks #1 which means it is almost 100% that Alexander Daigle will 
>go #1. He'll either stay or be traded in Montreal or Quebec.  IMO I would
>take Kariya.  He should alot of leadership in the NCAA and so far in
>the World Championships.  Daigle didn't show this for his junior team.
>
>San Jose will then get Kariya.
>
>Tampa Bay will either go for a russian Kozlov (I think that's it) or a 
>    defenseman Rob Niedemeyer (probably spelt the last name wrong)
>
	The Sharks appear to be leaning toward picking Rob
	Niedermayer, a center (his brother Scott (?) is a defenseman
	picked by NJ a couple years ago).  They brought him in for a
	physical/tryout a week or so ago. From what I have read
	Niedermayer is the best skater in the draft, plays BOTH
	offense and defense, and isn't afraid of physical play.
	Defensively the Sharks are looking pretty good in terms of
	defense prospects (Rathje, Sykora, Ragnarsson), and our
	centers (Kisio et al) are getting old.

	With all of the small players the Sharks have I justs CAN't
	see them picking yet another small player like Kariya, he'd
	just get bashed by the oppposition and get a separated 
	shoulder.

	mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54251
From: hallg@lead.egr.msu.edu (The Terminator)
Subject: Re: ESPN

In article <randolin.3.735424986@polisci.umn.edu>, randolin@polisci.umn.edu (Robert Andolina) writes:
|> The thing that confuses me most about ESPN is that they decided to show the 
|> Penguins and Devils again on Thursday night.  Being that both of the first 
|> two games were dominated by Pitt., you would think that they would show a 
|> different game.  This is in addition to the fact that they should show other 
|> games just for the sake of fair exposure.

ESPN must have some very poor marketing people.  They are only concerned with
featuring players (i.e. Mario) than featuring good competitive hockey.

|> Also, some of you should know that (as far as I can tell) ESPN is not going 
|> to show Campbell conference games regularly in the first two rounds.  I 
|> believe that they are only going to show Campbell games in the first two 
|> rounds as those series wear on (games 6 & 7, or perhaps games 5, 6, 7). 

I've heard that this is because most of their market is East Coast and hence
would prefer the Wales stuff.  Also, don't expect Canadian teams on ESPN.

In summary, if you want to see a network that provides good hockey coverage, 
watch CBC from Canada.  They may be biased toward Canadian teams, but they
don't treat the viewers like idiots, they provide nice updates, and Don Cherry
will always provide a few laughs.



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54252
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Keenan signs with the Rangers!!

In article <1993Apr16.175300.98134@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu> cpc4@ns1.cc.lehigh.edu (CONNIN PATRICK COLGAIN) writes:
>Just heard on the news that Mike Keenan formerly of the Blackhawks, Flyers,
>and General of a Siberian Prison has just signed to coach the Rangers.  The
>Rangers, who won the President's Cup last year have slipped just a bit at the
>end of the season and are destined to finish last behind the lowly Flyers.
>The Flyers' fans are going to be disappointed on Keenans decision, because
>they were very interested in him.  Oh well.

At least we got somebody the Flyers wanted ;-)

Is this really true?  I have not been keeping up with any news.  If it is,
what's the deal with Neil Smith?  Is he gone, too?

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54253
From: kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller)
Subject: Re: Devils and Islanders tiebreaker????

In article <C5LFA4.E10@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU> cal2d@csissun11.ee.Virginia.EDU (Craig Allen Lorie) writes:
>According to the hockey gurus over at ESPN, should the Islanders win tonite
>the two teams will have the same record, but the Devils will be playing the
>Penguins.  This is because the Islanders have won the season series against
>the Devils.  I think the rules for deciding a tie breaker include:
>
>1.  season series
>2.  goals against
>3.  goals for
>
>in this order (correct me if I'm wrong).  Anyone have anything to add?

I think that they go to divisional records before goals, but I could be
wrong, too.

--
    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!

            "When I want your opinion, I'll give it to you." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54254
From: formeza@panix.com (The Owl)
Subject: Re: Hockey Cards For Sale

In <C5H92x.Dtw@panix.com> formeza@panix.com (The Owl) writes:

In case anyone missed it, I'm reposting this and I'm also selling some other
stuff.

>I would like to sell a few of my Hockey Cards sets:

>1990-91 Upperdeck Hockey Low #'s Sets $45

>This is the first Upperdeck Hockey Set made. Important rookie cards in it are:
>Mogilny, Roenick, Belfour, Recchi, Stevens, Jagr, Nolan, Nedved, Ricci, 
>Sundin, Modano, Richter and others! The Beckett price is $42, but I'm
>Charging $45 to cover the Shipping and Packaging.

I've sold one, but I still have 2 left for sale. I also realize that $45 is
alot of money, especially if you don't normally collect cards. So if enough
people are interested, I'll break up the set into team sets. I'm not sure
how much for each. It would be nice to just sell them for $3 each, but then
the people who get the Whalers and Devils (Note, I'm not bagging on these teams
its just that they don't have alot of good rookie cards in this set) would
be subsidizing the people who want Chicago or Pittsburgh. So I'll have to make
it varialble pricing. But most of them should be about $2 or $3 dollars.


>1991-92 Score Pinnacle (Candian) Sets $45

>This is a very nice set, premium quality cards. Has second year cards of the
>players above, plus Bure, Potvin, Falloon, and Lindros ($15 value) second year
>cards,and the following rookie cards: Lidstrom Kamensky, Zelepukin, Roussel,
>Konstantinov. Beckett Price is $50, but I have alot of these.

>1991-92 Upperdeck Czechoslovakian Set $60

>This is a 100 card set of the 92 World Junior Tournament. Meant for sale in
>Czechoslovakia, but didn't sell well there, and some of it filtere back in
>to the US. The cards are Bilingual. Has Lachance, Kovalev, and Straka Rookies.
>If your interested, please e-mail me. Thanks

Ok someone asked for this one, but he's from Canada, if he can get me the
money in US funds then its his, if not, the first person who writes in will
be the alternate.

Also I would like to sell 2 Upperdeck Pavel Bure rookie cards (note these
are not in the UD low #'s set mentioned above). $16 each. They are $15 in
the book, but the $1 goes for postage, packaging and insurance.

And if there is something you want that you don't see, e-mail me, I may have
it or may be able to get  it for you.

Thanks,
>The Owl
>Ted Formeza
>formeza@sun.panix.com



































Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54255
From: golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy)
Subject: Re: ESPN cares less about hockey

In article <1993Apr21.111312.5054@vax.cns.muskingum.edu> jbrown@vax.cns.muskingum.edu writes:
>ESPN is pathetic, I have been watching everybody complain about ESPN's coverage
>and I agree with all of you.  Might I suggest that we are getting all worked up
>over nothing.  We ALL knew that ESPN's coverage was going to suck.  I mean have
>you ever watched during the regular season Sportscenter coverage of hockey? It
>sucks, I mean really sucks!!!  ESPN does not know hockey if it shot them in the
>ass.  I was really pissed of about last night, coverage.  I go to school in Ohio
>I *know* the Indians suck, so why show them?  If I were Bill Clement I would
>shoot myself.
>
>Anyway after I calmed down after I realized that they were not going to show
>overtime of the Caps Isles game I thought to myself I knew that this was going
>to happen, in fact I remerbed myself praying that at least they would keep even
>the boring Devils game.
>
>Overall I think ESPN does not care if they show hockey or not and I firmly
>belive that they have know respect for the fans. ie *because of contract       
>obligations*, screw you ESPN.
>
>Praise be to all hockey fans who put up with this shit!
>
>GO HAWKS!!!
>

This is the price hockey fans have to pay for the mistake of leaving
ESPN 5 or 6 years ago...it will take time to correct for that mistake.

But returning to ESPN was the correct decision last year...by next
time, we may have the potential for Sportschannel and ESPN to really
compete to offer better coverage and be forced to deliver on it.
 
Gerald

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54256
From: ferguson@cs.rochester.edu (George Ferguson)
Subject: What's up in Rochester???


Here we are with the Sabres up 2-0 to the Bruins and the Sabres' farm
team, the Rochester Amerks, on their way to the Calder Cup (urp!) and
what kind of hockey coverage are we getting? The same Penguins/Devils
every other day crap that everyone else gets. What's worse, the
SportsChannel coverage of the Islanders appears to be blocked out,
since we got CBA basketball last night, if you can believe it.  I
assume the Sabres are demanding the SC blackout, not ESPN, since we
are, unbelievably, usually considered part of the Islanders territory
(MSG coverage of the Rangers is blacked out here). This despite being
a solid seven hours plus from Long Island.

Does anyone know what GRC is doing, besides putting their satellite
dish up their ass and screwing my reception of channels 8, 10, and 13?
Did Empire demand a fortune for the games? What about the games on
Fox37 (or whatever number it is there in Buffalo)? Has anyone phoned
to complain (besides me)?

George

-- 
George Ferguson                 ARPA: ferguson@cs.rochester.edu
Dept. of Computer Science       UUCP: rutgers!rochester!ferguson
University of Rochester         VOX:  (716) 275-2527
Rochester  NY  14627-0226       FAX:  (716) 461-2018

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54257
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Grant Fuhr leads Sabres

In article <1993Apr21.161633.25624@wuecl.wustl.edu> jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar) writes:
>  Buffalo is up 2-0 is the series with Boston, and the reason....Grant Fuhr ?
>  Fuhr is playoff hungry, and he's proving once again why they call him
>  money goaltender. Fuhr might not be one of the best goaltenders in the
>  league anymore (Statistically at least), but he's proving that he can
>  make the big save at the right time.
>  The Leafs should have kept Fuhr, and probably would have had a chance 
>  against powerhouse Detroit. But again.......where was Andreychoke in game 1?

I applauded the Sabres for making the deal to get Fuhr, specifically because I
thought it would help them win at least one playoff series.  However, I don't
think the Leafs can be faulted either...there is nothing to say that Felix
won't be winning playoff series by himself in years to come.  

Anyway, does anybody else find it ironic that Fuhr is up against Moog? (or at
least he was until a guy named Alex showed up....:-) )


--

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54258
From: ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca)
Subject: Re: Radio stations

co398@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Theodore G. Benjamin) writes:


>In messge 51890 on Mon Apr 19 15:46:40 1993, greanias@texas.mitre.org (Steve Greanias) wrote:

>>        I do not have cable and on the nights the Caps don't 
>>play, I would like to tune in other games.  Does anyone have a 
>>list of the radio stations which broadcast the games for the NHL
>>teams?

>Here are the ones I can remember offhand:

>     KDKA    1020 AM   Pittsburgh Penguins

Lori, the regular Penguins poster here on rec.sport.hockey, indicated to me
via e-mail that on the nights that Pirates baseball and Penguins playoff 
games coincide, the Pens will be covered on WDVE FM (102.5).

>     WABC     770 AM   New Jersey Devils
>     WBBM     780 AM   Chicago Blackhawks
>     WJM (?)  720 AM   Detroit Redwings
      ^^^^     ^^^^
This is WJR in Detroit and it's 760 AM. However, as I neglected to mention in
my earlier response to this thread,  on the nights when the Tigers baseball
games coincide with the Wings' playoff games, the Wings will be carried on
WLLZ FM (98.7).

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54259
From: msanfrat@cs.ucsd.edu (Mike Sanfratello)
Subject: Re: ESPN Thumbs Up your $%#@*!!

In article <1993Apr20.214505.6925@wkuvx1.bitnet> kozloce@wkuvx1.bitnet writes:
>AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG!
>
>(Oh guess what the score is now 7-0 penguins! Switch games you $%&*#@!!!)
> [...]

and guess which game ESPN is showing in my area on Thursday - yep,
Pens-Devils.  There are so many other interesting series, who cares
about Mario???

mike

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54260
From: sclark@epas.utoronto.ca (Susan Clark)
Subject: Re: If You Were Pat Burns ...

	Borchevsky is 5'9" and Gilmour is 5'11"...I think Gilmour slightly
outweighs Borchevsky.  Andreychuk is also about 5'11", I think.

Susan
teeheehee...oops!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54261
From: cobra@chopin.udel.edu (KING COBRA)
Subject: Re: ESPN f*ck up

In article <1428@wavefront.wti.com> matthew@wavefront.wti.com (Matt Coohill) writes:
>
>	ESPN (through a fortunate rainout of a baseball game) showed the
>  Red Wings/Toronto game... cool.
>
>	But I SWEAR that the advertisements all week long had said that
>  ESPN would show Pitt/NJ on Tuesday and Bos/Buff on Thursday.
>
>	I raced home from work early (4:30 Pacific) to catch the game, but
>  ALAS, it was the Boston/Buffalo game and then they promised that they would
>  show the Pitt/NJ game on Thursday.  OVERNIGHT they changed their mind.
>

  What the hell are U talking about? ESPN showed Pens/Devils game as advertised.
  BUt the morons at ESPN should know that Pens will kick Devils ass and the
  game will be boring. I'd rather see Boston/Buffalo game which seems to be
  an exciting series since noone had expected Buffalo to get past the first
  round. 

  Well let's hope they change their mind on THU's game and show some other
  game. The Pens series is really getting boring. I want to see some 
  exciting game no matter who wins. If NHL wants a major network contract
  then they better put some brains in ESPN people.

  



*******************************************************************************
**   ___  ____  ____  ____  ____  **                                         **
**  /    /   / /___/ /___/ /___/  **   Experience is what makes a person     **
** /___ /___/ /___/ / \_  /   /   **   make new mistakes instead of old      **
**                                **   one.                                  **
** E-mail: cobra@chopin.udel.edu  **                                         **
**                                **                                         **
*******************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54262
From: allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan)
Subject: Don Cherry - Coach's Corner summary - April 21, 1993




Here's a summary of Don Cherry's Coach's Corner from April 21, 1993.
The game being broadcast in my region was LA and Calgary, although
I think it was filmed during the Toronto-Detroit game that night.

(Warning... Anti-fighting people may want to skip this post.)

Topics
------

Don's Tie, Grant Fuhr, Penalties, Wings vs Leafs, Fighting, Dale Hunter.

Episode Summary
---------------

This episode began with the camera zoomed in on Don's tie. Don was
pointing out the characters on the tie... Bugs Bunny, Foghorn Leghorn,
and Yosemite Sam (who Don called Lanny Macdonald.)

Ron Maclean began by mentioning that Don was almost evicted from a
hotel where he was watching the previous night's games, because of
all the yelling and cheering he was doing over the play of Hunter
and Fuhr.

Don began to praise Fuhr, calling him the "greatest goalie", and
said that he's winning the series against Boston all by himself.
He then showed clips from earlier episodes (Nov. 14, Jan. 16) when
Fuhr was still with the Leafs, and Don advised "Don't Trade Fuhr!"

Don went on to predict that if Buffalo gets by Boston, it would
be Fuhr who wins the series. Muckler took a lot of heat for the
trade, but Don feels Muckler's been vindicated.

The next topic involved how playoff games are being ruined by
too many penalty calls. He showed a clip from a Winnipeg-Vancouver
game, where Domi hit a Vancouver player, and was given a 2 min. penalty.
Ron said that it was called a penalty because his stick was involved,
but Don stuck with the opinion that it was a good hit, with Domi
hitting the Vancouver player with his shoulder. Don: "Its sad what
they're doing for hockey... a 5 minute penalty for a nosebleed."

Next, they went to the playoff series between Detroit and Toronto.
People in Detroit were calling Wendel Clarke "Wendy" for not fighting.
However, Don pointed out that Probert was not fighting either.

This lead Don into a tirad about fighting and stickwork, and how
banning fighting leads to more high sticking: "It's like college
hockey... The little wee guy with the visor is brave as anybody.
That's why you're seeing so much stickwork. Because they know you
won't drop your gloves and give them a shot. The rules are made
by people who don't know what's going on in hockey".

The final topic Don discussed was Dale Hunter. Don pointed out
that he was leading the league in goals, and showed a clip
of Hunter from a previous game. When he was younger, Hunter was
taught to "play to win", which differs from today's idea of
just letting kids have fun.

At then end of the episode, they showed a clip from a coach's
corner, with the tape on fast forward, so that Don sounded like
one of the chipmunks.

Rating
------
Typical anti-fighting posturing, not too much humour, but some
good quotes.

I'd give it a 7.0 out of 10.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   \  \                   |Allan Sullivan (allan@cs.ualberta.ca)
    \  \                  |Department of Computing Science,
     \  \_______          |University of Alberta, Edmonton, Alberta, Canada.
      \    ###  \     _   |---------------------------------------------------
       \___###___\   (_)  |My opinions are mine and mine alone.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It is amazing how much can be accomplished if no one cares who gets the
 credit..."          - U. of A. Golden Bears Hockey Motto (C. Drake)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
        

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54263
From: allan@cs.UAlberta.CA (Allan Sullivan)
Subject: Don Cherry - Coach's Corner summary - April 23, 1993




Here's a summary of Don Cherry's Coach's Corner from April 23, 1993.
It was taken from a tape delay of a Vancouver-Winnipeg game, but
it was filmed during the Toronto-Detroit game that night. I think
it was also shown during the Calgary-LA game. 

(Warning... Anti-fighting people may want to skip this post.)

Topics
------

Don's Tie, Doug Gilmour, Wings/Leafs, Quebec/Montreal, Boston/Buffalo,
Wendel Clark, Fighting and Stickwork.

Episode Summary
---------------

Once again, the episode started with a shot of Don's tie... This
was a different tie than last time. Don pointed out some of the
characters on the tie, but gave them different names... Felix the
Cat (Sylverster), Maclean (Daffy Duck), etc.

Ron Maclean asked Don what he thought of the current Wings-Leafs
game. Don thought it was good. Burns told the Leaf players "They
won in their building, we're going to win in ours".

Don then began to praise Gilmour again. Don pointed out that Gilmour
has never got less than 2 points or a goal in any game since he
got 5 points in a game against St. Louis.  (Don also claims that
he gave a lot of encouragement to Gilmour, which was partly responsible
for his good play.) Several clips were then shown of Gilmour
from the series... A hit on Constantinov, and a pass to Andrewchuk
resulting in a goal.

On the game itself, the Wings were taking a lot of penalties in
the first period. The Wings have enough talent to score short handed
however, and when the Leafs get a power play, Coach Burns tells
the Leaf players "Don't let them score on you".

Ron brought up the previous Quebec-Montreal game. [Note: Montreal
won that game in overtime, despite having a possible game winner
disqualified because it was batted in with a high stick.] Don
thought the high stick was obvious, even without the use of
instant replay.

On the Buffalo-Boston series [Note: Buffalo is currently winning
the series 3-0], Don gave full credit to Goaltender Grant Fuhr.
Fuhr should be getting 1/2 the team's playoff checks for his
play.

Wendel Clarke has recently been criticized for his performance
during the Detroit-Toronto series. Don defended him, by saying
that he can't play the way he should, because of the league's
new rules. "This used to be a rough and tough league... Now its
all hack and slash." Don lays the blame on Gil Stien for the
problems.

Don's opinions on fighting and stickwork are shared by Wings
GM and coach Bryan Murray. A clip from a news conference by Murray
was shown, in which Murray made statements claiming the elimination
of fighting increases stickwork. Don also read a newspaper article
in which Murray makes the following statements: "Players don't fight
because they're afraid of getting thrown out of the game as instigator.
Instead, they settle grudges by getting their sticks and slicing
each other. Is this what the fans want to see? I guarantee there
wouldn't be as many slashes if fighting were kept in the game."

Don warned league commisioner Gary Bettman to "smarten up" with
fighting in hockey. He went on to say that before, there used
to be one guy cut with a high stick in a series. Now, with no fights,
someone gets cut every period.

Rating
------
Typical anti-fighting posturing, but here Don's opinion is supported
by Murray.

I'd give it a 7.0 out of 10.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54264
From: cobra@chopin.udel.edu (KING COBRA)
Subject: Re: ESPN

In article <randolin.3.735424986@polisci.umn.edu> randolin@polisci.umn.edu (Robert Andolina) writes:
>The thing that confuses me most about ESPN is that they decided to show the 
>Penguins and Devils again on Thursday night.  Being that both of the first 
>two games were dominated by Pitt., you would think that they would show a 
>different game.  This is in addition to the fact that they should show other 
>games just for the sake of fair exposure.
>
>Also, some of you should know that (as far as I can tell) ESPN is not going 
>to show Campbell conference games regularly in the first two rounds.  I 
>believe that they are only going to show Campbell games in the first two 
>rounds as those series wear on (games 6 & 7, or perhaps games 5, 6, 7). 
>
>Also, does anyone have info on ABC coverage for this Sunday (4/25)?
>
>

  ESPN had an advertise for Pens/Devils game 4. I don't know what the hell
  they are trying to do, especially against NFL draft. Well I guess there goes
  the NHL ratings for Sundays game.

>
>Robert Andolina
>randolin@polisci.umn.edu
>



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54272
From: chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Subject: Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!

snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols) writes:

>In article <1r1v5n$klh@morrow.stanford.edu> steve@sep.Stanford.EDU (Steve Cole) writes:
>>I think the three-headed GM's guiding principle was to keep veterans
>>in favor of youngsters only if they offered a "significant" advantage.

>Doesn't sound like a bad strategy to me.

No, and in fact, that was Ferreira's original strategy, which the troika
proceeded to simply continue to implement. There wasn't exactly a radical
shift in policy when he was ousted (something people seem to forget). The
only real question is whether they did it as well as Ferreira could have if
he stayed, or whether the basic strategy was flawed (since Ferreira has been
quoated as saying he's going to do something different in Anaheim with the
Ducks, my guess is that it wasn't as good in practice as it was on paper,
and he's tweaking it a bit second time around). One also has to wonder
whether the strategy would have been a lot better if we hadn't had those
injuries, and whether we're complaining about the weather because an
earthquake collapsed the root cellar.

>Of course, Ferreira had also traded a number of veterans with marginal
>contributions before he was fired, so it's not clear that this would have
>been different.  Besides, they *were* marginal contributors.

Let's also NOT FORGET that Ferreira came *THIS* close to trading Kelly
Kisio, which, if the rumors I've heard are true, was over the strong
objections of other aspects of Shark management and probably had a lot to do
with both his ouster and the three-headed, consensus oriented GM.

Imagine, for a second, where the Sharks would be today if that fax machine
hadn't jammed.

>With or without Mullen, they weren't going to be a playoff team; what good
>does it do them to hang onto a player who'd rather be elsewhere?  

Especially an unhappy player that isn't playing as well because of it. Not
that I'd accuse Mullen of tanking, but his motivation simply wasn't there,
and that kind of thing can affect the team.

>>An example from this season, Skriko was brought in on a trial basis
>>but not kept, because of his age. I thought he was a decent
>>contributor worth keeping around.

>>The youth movement has its advantages; look at Gaudreau who
>>might still be in KC if more veterans had been kept around. But
>>you have to find the right balance.

>Right balance for what?  That's the issue.  

Exactly. At the time they let Skriko go, we hadn't yet had the major injury
bugs that killed us later. I'd much rather have Skriko around than someone
like Dean Kolstad, but at that point, that wasn't the choice. And since the
choice was more one of Skriko vs. someone like John Carter, I think the
right choice was made for that time period.

-- 
 Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= chuq@apple.com
   Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms =+=  GEnie: MAC.BIGOT =+= ALink:CHUQ 
  Minor League fans: minors-request@medraut.apple.com (San Jose Giants: A/1/9)
  San Francisco Giants fans: giants-request@medraut.apple.com (The Stick?NOT!)
   San Jose Sharks fans: sharks-request@medraut.apple.com (New seat: 127/TBD)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54273
From: anthonyp@sco.COM (Anthony Picilaidis)
Subject: NHL Draft


 
I believe the NHL Draft is on or the June 18th weekend.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54274
From: machnik@ctron.com (Michael C. Machnik)
Subject: goalie stats

In article <1r3smf$67m@access.usask.ca>, coulman@cs.Usask.CA (Randy
Coulman) writes:
Path:
ctron-news.ctron.com!noc.near.net!uunet!utcsri!newsflash.concordia.ca!mi
izar.cc.umanitoba.ca!access.usask.ca!cs.Usask.CA!coulman
From: coulman@cs.Usask.CA (Randy Coulman)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
Subject: Final Regular Season Individual Goalie Stats
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 93 12:27:59 EDT
Organization: University of Saskatchewan
Lines: 103
Sender: coulman@skorpio (Randy Coulman)
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <1r3smf$67m@access.usask.ca>
Reply-To: coulman@cs.Usask.CA
NNTP-Posting-Host: skorpio.usask.ca

I would appreciate it if someone could volunteer to verify the shots on goal
and save percentage numbers for me, so I can put these stats on the archive
site.  Contact me by mail if you want to volunteer.

Here are the individual goalie stats as of: Wed Apr 21 09:09:38 CST 1993

These stats include games up to and including the Sunday previous to the date
listed above.  They have been verified against what is printed in my newspaper
every Tuesday.  They don't print shots and save percentage numbers, so those
are not verified.  These stats are available by mail every weekday and
sometimes on weekends, if I'm in town and I can get late game results.  Just
send me a note if you would like to receive these stats by mail.

If you have any questions, comments or suggestions, let me know.

Randy

-------
MP = Minutes Played, GA = Goals against,
SO = Shutouts, GAA = Goals against average
W = Wins, L = Losses, T = Ties
SOG = Shots on Goal, SV = Save Percentage

 MP   GA SO   GAA  W  L  T  SOG   SV  TM Player
=======================================================
   1   0  0  0.00  0  0  0    0 1.000 WAS Byron Dafoe
  11   0  0  0.00  0  0  0    3 1.000 HAR Corrie D'Alessio
  40   1  0  1.50  0  0  0   19 0.947 MTL Frederick Chabot
  25   1  0  2.40  0  0  0   10 0.900 BOS Mike Bales
2781 116  2  2.50 25 15  7 1287 0.910 TOR Felix Potvin
4106 177  7  2.59 41 18 11 1879 0.906 CHI Ed Belfour
1322  64  1  2.90  9  8  4  596 0.893 BOS John Blue
 996  49  2  2.95  6  7  1  414 0.882 CHI Jim Waite
3702 186  4  3.01 43 14  5 1889 0.902 PIT Tom Barrasso
3890 196  1  3.02 29 28  9 2194 0.911 STL Curtis Joseph
1817  94  1  3.10 18  8  4  858 0.890 VAN Kay Whitmore
1429  75  0  3.15 11 10  4  716 0.895 BUF Dominik Hasek
3194 168  3  3.16 37 14  3 1354 0.876 BOS Andy Moog
1311  70  1  3.20 14  4  1  629 0.889 CAL Jeff Reese
3595 192  2  3.20 31 25  5 1813 0.894 MTL Patrick Roy
 168   9  0  3.21  1  1  1   87 0.897 HAR Mike Lenarduzzi
1193  64  0  3.22 13  4  2  522 0.877 DET Vincent Riendeau
1785  96  2  3.23 17  7  4  938 0.898 TOR Daren Puppa
3880 210  4  3.25 34 24  7 1898 0.889 DET Tim Cheveldae
3732 203  2  3.26 29 26  9 1805 0.888 CAL Mike Vernon
2655 146  1  3.30 22 20  2 1314 0.889 NYI Glenn Healy
3359 185  1  3.30 24 24  6 1726 0.893 BUF Grant Fuhr
2757 152  4  3.31 20 18  7 1519 0.900 NYR John Vanbiesbrouck
3282 181  1  3.31 27 23  5 1531 0.882 WAS Don Beaupre
3476 193  3  3.33 26 26  5 1683 0.885 MIN Jon Casey
3261 184  3  3.39 28 21  5 1620 0.886 VAN Kirk McLean
2672 151  2  3.39 19 21  3 1322 0.886 NJ  Chris Terreri
1433  81  1  3.39 17  5  1  686 0.882 MTL Andre Racicot
1939 110  0  3.40 18  9  4  947 0.884 QUE Stephane Fiset
2512 143  5  3.42 20 17  6 1329 0.892 PHI Tommy Soderstrom
1368  78  0  3.42 13  7  2  691 0.887 PIT Ken Wregget
 542  31  0  3.43  5  4  0  225 0.862 BOS Reggie Lemelin
2988 172  0  3.45 29 16  5 1525 0.887 QUE Ron Hextall
2253 130  0  3.46 17 15  5 1067 0.878 NYI Mark Fitzpatrick
3855 227  2  3.53 33 26  6 2119 0.893 WIN Bob Essensa
1601  96  0  3.60 15 10  2  777 0.876 WIN Jim Hrivnak
1596  97  1  3.65 10 12  5  803 0.879 MIN Darcy Wakaluk
1591  97  0  3.66  7 19  2  757 0.872 TB  Wendell Young
1163  71  0  3.66  8 10  1  573 0.876 TB  JC Bergeron
2389 146  2  3.67 21 16  4 1180 0.876 NJ  Craig Billington
1210  74  1  3.67  8  8  2  628 0.882 STL Guy Hebert
1302  80  2  3.69  8 12  0  664 0.880 WAS Rick Tabaracci
 664  41  0  3.70  5  6  0  344 0.881 BUF Tom Draper
 224  14  0  3.75  1  2  1  116 0.879 NYR Corey Hirsch
1769 111  1  3.76 13 11  5  932 0.881 PHI Dominic Roussel
2105 134  1  3.82 13 19  3 1184 0.887 NYR Mike Richter
 157  10  0  3.82  1  2  0   78 0.872 NYI Danny Lorenz
3753 240  1  3.84 17 38  6 2069 0.884 EDM Bill Ranford
1735 111  0  3.84 15  8  4  987 0.888 LA  Robb Stauber
2718 175  2  3.86 18 21  6 1545 0.887 LA  Kelly Hrudey
 154  10  0  3.90  0  2  1   66 0.848 QUE Jacques Cloutier
 867  57  0  3.94  5  9  1  499 0.886 HAR Mario Gosselin
 532  35  0  3.95  6  4  0  294 0.881 LA  Rick Knickle
2268 150  1  3.97  8 24  4 1197 0.875 TB  Pat Jablonski
2074 142  1  4.11  7 26  0 1250 0.886 SJ  Arturs Irbe
2656 184  0  4.16 16 27  3 1470 0.875 HAR Sean Burke
1338  93  0  4.17  9 12  2  763 0.878 EDM Ron Tugnutt
1326  95  0  4.30  2 17  1  743 0.872 OTT Daniel Berthiaume
 802  59  0  4.41  3  9  0  405 0.854 PHI Stephane Beauregard
3388 250  0  4.43  8 46  3 1711 0.854 OTT Peter Sidorkiewicz
  65   5  0  4.62  0  0  1   39 0.872 CAL Andrei Trefilov
1373 111  0  4.85  4 15  1  784 0.858 HAR Frank Pietrangelo
  73   6  0  4.93  0  0  1   34 0.824 WIN Mike O'Neill
  60   5  0  5.00  0  1  0   46 0.891 SJ  Wade Flaherty
2000 176  0  5.28  2 30  1 1220 0.856 SJ  Jeff Hackett
 930  86  0  5.55  2 14  1  559 0.846 SJ  Brian Hayward
 160  15  0  5.63  0  3  0   91 0.835 TOR Rick Wamsley
  20   2  0  6.00  0  0  0    7 0.714 WAS Olaf Kolzig
  90  10  0  6.67  0  2  0   44 0.773 OTT Darrin Madeley
 249  30  0  7.23  0  5  0  146 0.795 OTT Steve Weeks
  98  13  0  7.96  0  2  0   51 0.745 LA  David Goverde
  45   7  0  9.33  0  1  0   21 0.667 TB  David Littman

-- 
Randy A. Coulman, M.Sc.         |       ARIES Laboratory
Research Assistant              |       Department of Computational Science
                                |       University of Saskatchewan
coulman@cs.Usask.ca             |       Saskatoon, SK   S7N 0W0             

--
Mike Machnik           machnik@blue.ctron.com    nin15b34@merrimack.edu
Cabletron Systems, Inc.                                  *HMN* 11/13/93

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54275
From: atwoodc@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (Charles Atwood)
Subject: ESPN bashing!

I agree thouroughly!!  Screw the damn contractual agreements!
Show the exciting hockey game.  They will lose
fans of ESPN (of which I have been one for quite a while) quickly 
with decisions like this.
Just my $.02

Chuck "ESPN f***ed up this time" Atwood
atwoodc@csugrad.cs.vt.edu
Virginia Tech Computer Science Department


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54283
From: cuorg@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu (Orazio Guagliano)
Subject: Re: Schedule...

In article <1993Apr20.233724.26553@news.columbia.edu> gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler) writes:
>>gld@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Gary L Dare) writes:
>>>I can't believe that ESPN is making SportsChannel America look good.
>>
>>But only in NY,NJ, Philadelphia, and Chicago. Everywhere else, the only
>>reason SportsChannel was available was for local baseball broadcasts.
>
>Yes, a point well-taken ... however, even in areas that finally got
>some games, there's something nagging in the back of your skull when
>the network that has the national rights in its pocket says on its
>sports news, "There's an awesome overtime going on in Quebec City,
>and we'll *try* to get you an update through the show ..." when you
>know that it's on a satellite's feedhorn somewhere up there ...


  Listen guys you can talk about this the whole playoffs.  I'm here in a
small town in southern Illinois at school.  I'm from Canada and I know
that cbc and tsn have games on every night,  all you have to do is go to
a bar with a satellite.  I have watched both games between Mon Que and
toronto and detroit,  not to mention Van vs Winn and with cbc.  They
show all goals from every game that evening so I haven't missed a goal
all playoffs.  Well have to go boy leafs are on Ciao.

Roger Guagliano
Eastern Illinois University


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54284
From: drozinst@db.erau.edu (Drozinski Tim)
Subject: Re: Ulf and all...

jpc@philabs.philips.com (John P. Curcio) writes:

>In article <1qmpfa$qna@alpha.db.erau.edu> drozinst@db.erau.edu (Drozinski Tim) writes:

>>I AM an Ulf (and Pgh) fan, and what pisses me off about the whole Adam Graves/
>>Ulf Samuesson debate is that Ulf plays hard-hitting hockey (nothing wrong with 
>>that) while Graves does what he does when the only way to win a game is to 
>>intentionally hurt someone (which bites!).

>Jeesus... I never thought I'd see the day when I defended a Ranger....

>You obviously don't watch much hockey if you think that Graves is a
>goon.  He is one of the hardest working Rangers (check that-- THE
>hardest working Ranger).  He had 36 goals this year (not bad for a
>checking type of player), and showed up for every single game this
>season (unlike that stiff Messier).  He is fearless, and throws CLEAN
>checks.  He will also stand up to someone after he hits them, not like
>that pussy Oaf.

Exactly my point.  If you'd watch games more closely, you'd see a lot 
of goons going after him.  Ulf is one of the main reasons why less physical 
players for Pgh are left alone.  Ulf plays rough hockey, but only when 
other players are putting the rush on Mario or Jagr.  If you want to say anyone
on the Penguins is a cheap shot or a goon, say it's Jennings or Caufield.  Don'tslander a good defenseman because your favorite players can't beat the Pens
even when they take dives (like Gartner) to try for the cheap penalties.

>As for his slash of Lemieux, fine.  It was a cheap shot.  It is the
>exception, not the rule.  I bet you think Mike Gartner is a goon
>because of the time that he slashed the hell out of Oaf's arm last
>year, right?  After all, he did get a suspension for it...

Hey, that's fine!  If a player does something stupid, he should be penalized
including Ulf.  Or Mario (you're not likely to see that happen) or anyone else for that matter.  It's pointless to say any one person is a cheap-shot goon,     because you'll see EVERYONE take a cheap shot now and then, especially if you'resomeone who is shadowed as much as Ulf is.

>-JPC

>-- 
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>John P. Curcio 		          Go Bruins!		   Philips Laboratories
>jpc@philabs.philips.com 			           345 Scarborough Road
>(914) 945-6442               	 		     Briarcliff Manor, NY 10510 



********************************************************************************Tim Drozinski
drozinst@db.erau.edu
"Chew electric death, snarling cur!"   Spaceman Spiff


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54285
From: drozinst@db.erau.edu (Drozinski Tim)
Subject: Re: Ulf and all...

"William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:

>Richard Wernick writes:

><stuff deleted> ... If the Bruins get to meet Pittsburgh in the near
>future, you can bet Neely will have his day.  The sight of watching Ulf
>turtle up like the coward he is, is worth almost as much as a Stanley
>Cup. ... <stuff deleted>

How much do you watch and follow hockey?  The Pens and Bruins will be in the
same division next season, which will give Neeley plenty of opportunity
to whine about Ulf.
>     All I can say is, I'm glad that you are satisfied with seeing Ulf
>"turtle up" as a substitute for the Stanley Cup, because that's as close
>as the Bruins are going to come to the Stanley Cup for a while. 

********************************************************************************Tim Drozinski
drozinst@db.erau.edu
"Chew electric death, snarling cur!"    Spaceman Spiff


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54286
From: farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: Re: Selfish hockey fans..

: In article <1993Apr21.131501@staff.dccs.upenn.edu> filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu (Geoff Filinuk) writes:
: >
: >	On Tuesday, when it was raining in Chicago, ESPN provided 
: >bonus hockey coverage.  Now it seems as though some fans are ticked off
: >that the NY-Wash OT was replaced with the Angels-?? game.  People must
: >realize that there are more baseball fans instead of hockey fans in the U.S  
: >The baseball game was scheduled to air and advertisers money was paid so
: >they can't skip the baseball game.  Why don't you people CHILL OUT
: >and enjoy whatever coverage you can get.

Well, partly because I, as an ardent fan of both sports, would rather
see Game 3 of the NHL playoffs than Game 3 of 162 of the MLB
season (even if the bb game involves the Red Sox).	

ESPN may have had contractual obligations. I understand that part.
But it's a bit inaccurate to call us "selfish" just because we want
to watch the watch the game we love. Am I, as a baseball fan, "selfish"
when I get pissed a CBS for showing approximately one game per month?
I don't think so.

While, ESPN may have contractual obligations, we, as their consumers,
have a right to voice our displeasure with how they are serving us.
There's certainly nothing wrong with that.

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


		

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54287
From: drozinst@db.erau.edu (Drozinski Tim)
Subject: Re: Ulf and all...

joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm) writes:



>>the way he does, does not belong in the NHL. There have been cheap shot artists
>>through the history of the game, but a lot of them have been talanted players.
>>Bobby Clarke, Kenny Linsemen, Pie McKenzie, Chris Chelios etc.. but nobody has been
>>out right as dirty a cheapshot coward as Ulf. Violence in hockey has got to be curbed
>>and players like (Should have been a Women) Samuelson don't belong. When players
>>like Ulf, who's main purpose is to injure the better players in the league is allowed
>>to continue, and the league won't stop it, the players should. A Christian Pro 1000
>>aluminum stick directed at his ugly head should do the trick nicely. If the Bruins get
>>a chance to meet Pittsburgh in the near future, you can bet Neely will have his day.
>>The sight of watching Ulf turtle up like the coward he is, is worth almost as much as a
>>Stanely Cup. This wimp of a player almost ruined the career of one the best right wingers
>>in the game. If you are to remove Ulf Samuelson from the lineup, the Penguins would not
>>even notice he's gone. He's an eyesore on the game of hockey.
>>
>>
>>Rich



>Rich, pull your head out of your ass.

>Joseph Stiehm


As if an aluminum stick being taken to Ulf's head is gonna solve the problem
with violence in the sport of hockey.  How the hell can you say the guy is
a goon and justify it, with your back-assward mentality?  Saying that hurting
a player will solve anyone's problems is asinine.  New rules and a new 
referee system need to be instituted.  Right now, too many of the real goons
get away with too much, because the ref is watching the play (or supposed to be:I've seen Koharski and Van Hellemond, to name a few, with their heads up their  asses on a few calls) rather than keeping an eye on the goofballs behind the 
play.  Even if the linesmen were able to call all penalties, it would be an
improvement.

********************************************************************************Tim Drozinski
drozinst@db.erau.edu
"Chew electric death, snarling cur!"    Spaceman Spiff









Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54288
From: jae2001@andy.bgsu.edu (Jason Ehas)
Subject: Re: ESPN Thumbs Up your $%#@*!!

In article <1993Apr20.214505.6925@wkuvx1.bitnet>, kozloce@wkuvx1.bitnet
wrote:
> I think this proves by $#%&* point. The Caps game goes into overtime but
> "due to contractual obligations" they have to switch to the fucking baseball.
> (Sorry for my language but im PISSED!) What the hell were they going to do
> if their scheduled game went into overtime? ESPN get your head out of your
> ass.
> 
> Now I know there are a lot 

Hey American Hockey fans,

As a hockey fan I can sympathize with thefrustration that you feel.  The
problem is that other Americans don't give a shit about hockey.  They view
it as a bunch of Canadians with bad accents and missing teeth beating the
shit out of each other on a patch of ice when it is too warm now in
two-thirds of the US to see the stuff naturally.  On the other hand
BASEBALL is the *gasp**swoon**sigh* "NATIONAL PASTTIME".  BASEBALL is so
romanticized in the US that you are supposed to forget that other sport
exist after April 1 and before November 1.  I feel that since ESPN shows 5+
BASEBALL games a week they should be able to show an OT hockey game instead
of the opening innings of a BASEBALL game.  Hell, the game is going to last
2hrs 45mins, so what if you miss the first 1 1/2 hrs?  And I am an Indians
fan!  Show the end of what you started, then switch!  But then, I'm a
hockey fan, what do I know?  BASEBALL is the all mighty sport.

Jason
jae2001@andy.bgsu.edu
GO Whalers!  Pick well!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54289
From: gibson@nukta.geop.ubc.ca (Brad Gibson)
Subject: Re: USENET Hockey Draft Final Standings

In article <C5un02.Gq5@idacom.hp.com> andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott) writes:
>Here are the final stadings for the USENET Hockey Draft.  Congratulations
>to this year's winner, Dave Wessels of Victoria, B.C., who parlayed his
>initial 1000 points into 1575.9 points!
>
>Thanks to all 262 teams for entering the biggest USENET Hockey Draft ever!
>I hope to hear from you all again this September, for the 7th Annual draft.
>
>
>USENET Hockey Draft Standings
>Week 28
>
>Posn	Team				Total	Pts	Cash	Last Posn
>
>1.	Dave Wessels                    1575.9	1574	1.9	(1)
>79.	Brad Gibson                     1174.2	1147	27.2	(79)
>262.	Dinamo Riga                     658.0	603	571.6	(262)

  An interesting note ... I have absolutely no recollection who was on my team.
  I picked all my players about 2 weeks before the start of the season, and
  then never touched the roster again.  I got wrapped up in my own "money" pool
  and decided not to get involved at all with the USENET pool (sorry Andrew
  btw).  The only thing I remember about my team is that I had Joe Sacco and
  maybe John MacLean.  Maybe Francis and Kevin Stevens as well.  Out of
  curiousity I checked the final standings today on r.s.h., only to find to my
  amazement that with absolutely no input, the initial team still managed to
  finsh 79th!  I'm not sure what that implies for those who finished below me
  :)

  Ciao.
  Brad Gibson

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Brad K. Gibson                           INTERNET: gibson@geop.ubc.ca
  Dept. of Geophysics & Astronomy         
  #129-2219 Main Mall                      PHONE: (604)822-6722
  University of British Columbia           FAX:   (604)822-6047
  Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
  V6T 1Z4
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54290
From: Andy <2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
Subject: Re: ? Octopus


In article <16BB6EA2A.LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu>, LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu
(Laurie Marshall) says:
>
>In article <C5ssL4.EBs@spk.hp.com>
>filipows@spk.hp.com (Dennis Filipowski) writes:
>
>>
>
>  Door attendants at the Joe Louis Arena have been checking fans for
>octopuses (sp?), as they are NOT allow in the Arena.  I want to know
>where these people are hiding these octopuses.  Everytime I've been to
>the Joe they checked my purse and that's the only place I can think of
>putting one.  Any other Wings fans out there know of ways to sneak
>these octopuses into the Joe?

You mean they don't strip-search you and do cavity  checks!? THE FOOLS!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54291
From: scialdone@nssdca.gsfc.nasa.gov (John Scialdone)
Subject: Pilon BITES!!!!

Do the Isles have another defenseman to insert into the line-up besides
Pilon??? Once again, last night's STUPID penalty put the Isles in a hole for the
remainder of regulation and 2 minutes into overtime!!! Even though the Isles
nearly survived Pilon's blunder in regulation, it was the most inopportune time
for a 5-minute major penalty. Instead of confronting Cote as he came across the
blueline, Pilon backed up and swiped at Cote's nose with his stick. Al Arbour
can't be serious to think Pilon is the guy to have out there with the game on
the line??? I heard Scott LaChance is out till later in the series, but there
must be someone else!!! Bring back the BAMMER, Dave Langevin!!!!

*******************************LETS GO ISLANDERS********************************

John Scialdone
SCIALDONE@NSSDCA.GSFC.NASA.GOV

"""I've been gambling hereabouts, for 10 good solid years""" JG/RH



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54292
From: mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger)
Subject: TEAM POOL STANDINGS

O.K., only one series is done.  But I need to post something.

By the way, the Islanders just scored.


Rank Team Name                  Points   Final 4
  1. roland_behunin                  5   CAL-6 QUE-7 QUE-7 
  2. Milton_Keynes_Kings             0   DET-6 PIT-5 PIT-5 
     Barfly                          0   TOR-6 BOS-7 TOR-6 
     Dean's                          0   DET-5 PIT-5 PIT-7 
     Oz                              0   LAK-6 BOS-6 LAK-6 
     Garry                           0   TOR-6 BOS-6 BOS-4 
     Brian_Bergman                   0   DET-6 PIT-6 DET-6 
     Mopar_Muscle_Men                0   CHI-5 PIT-6 PIT-5 
     BH's_Last_Place_Picks           0   CHI-5 PIT-6 PIT-5 
     Dave_Wessels                    0   VAN-7 PIT-6 PIT-5 
     Sam_&_His_Dogs                  0   DET-6 PIT-5 PIT-5 
     Ye_Ding                         0   DET-6 PIT-5 PIT-6 
     Tampere_Stars                   0   CHI-6 PIT-6 PIT-6 
     The_Mighty_Hedgehogs_Of_Myllyp  0   CHI-6 BOS-6 BOS-6 
     Homesick_Hawaiian               0   VAN-7 PIT-6 PIT-5 
     Killer_Kings                    0   CHI-6 WAS-6 CHI-6 
     Puggy_Greybeards                0   DET-5 PIT-5 PIT-5 
     Ottawa_Bearcats                 0   TOR-5 PIT-6 TOR-6 
     Andrew_Kirk                     0   TOR-6 PIT-6 PIT-5 
     Muller_n_Walker                 0   DET-6 PIT-6 PIT-6 
     Excalibur                       0   DET-6 PIT-4 PIT-6 
     Rednecks_from_Hockey_Hell       0   DET-7 BOS-5 BOS-5 
     The_@$%@#$%_Rangers_of_1940     0   CHI-6 PIT-7 PIT-6 
     Jeff_Phelps                     0   DET-6 PIT-6 PIT-5 
     Arctic_Circles                  0   DET-6 PIT-6 PIT-4 
     Sludge                          0   DET-6 PIT-6 DET-6 
     The_Logistician                 0   DET-6 PIT-6 DET-7 
     Hillside_Raiders                0   CHI-6 BOS-6 BOS-7
     Danielle                        0   CHI-5 QUE-7 QUE-7
     Stanias_Stars                   0   CHI-6 BOS-7 BOS-6
     BloodHook                       0   DET-5 PIT-5 PIT-5
     Gilles_Carmel                   0   CHI-6 PIT-7 PIT-7
     Pasi_Fr{nti                     0   LAK-7 PIT-5 PIT-6
     Evan_Pritchard                  0   VAN-6 PIT-6 PIT-5
     Skriko_Wolves                   0   DET-7 PIT-5 PIT-5
     Rangers_Blow                    0   CAL-7 PIT-6 PIT-4
     Sean                            0   DET-5 PIT-5 PIT-6
     Schott_Shooters                 0   CHI-6 PIT-5 PIT-5
     Gary_Shiff                      0   TOR-4 PIT-6 PIT-4
     Mike_Burger                     0   DET-7 PIT-6 DET-7
     Darse                           0   DET-6 PIT-6 PIT-6



*******************************************************************************
*  Mike Burger                    *  My Canada includes, Quebec, Ontario,     *
*  mmb@lamar.colostate.edu        *  the Maritimes, the Prairies, and Florida *
*  A Beginning Computing TA Stud  *  four months a year.                      *
*  over 500 students served       *    --Royal Canadian Air Farce             *
*******************************************************************************
*      University of Michigan - 1990  --  Colorado State University - 199?    *
*******************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54293
From: BGK2 <BGK2@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA>
Subject: HABS TIE SERIES AT 2 !!!!!!!

YAHOOOOOOOOO!

The Habs tied this sucker at 2 and the teams now head for Quebec
City to play game 5.  BTW, final score was Habs 3-Nords 2.

The score might be a bit misleading.  The Habs dominated the game
from the 5:00 mark of the first and then on.  The score should have
been 8-2 if it weren't for some miraculous save from a Ron Hextall
(bastard!).  He's the reason the score was as close.  Habs winning
goal was scored by Benoit Brunet at 1:07 of the 3rd.

Roy had an OK game.  He made the first save (one way or another)
and the defense was there to clear any rebounds.

This just in, ESPN radio reports that the Bruins lost 6-5 in OT.
YAHOOOOOOOOOOO!!!  Those suckers got what they deserved.

Life is just great!!!! Now if my finals would go just as well!

Nick (I'll take off my town crier hat now)

---
 The Czar of Mainframe Computing
 <BGK2@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA>
 McGill University


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54294
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: Re: Jets/Canucks - Jets hold on, win 5-4

In article <C6067p.Lsp@news.cso.uiuc.edu> epritcha@s.psych.uiuc.edu ( Evan Pritchard) writes:
>
>	I will also be happy will a good performance.  We played OK in
>Vancouver, but much better last night, as the 'big' guys were going
>for the Jets.  

Yep, though my reasons for being relatively quiet are simple...last year
I woofed when we went up 3-1 on the Canucks...and look where it got me.  :)
>
>	By the way, did Domi play last night?  I didn't notice him
>on the ice.  

Domi got tossed in the 2nd with a high-sticking major.  He had been
playing with Kris King and Stu Barnes...and it was this line that was
arguably the best in the first two games.

>
>	I am very glad to have found some places in Champaign,
>Illinois that have satillite dishes to pick up the CBC Vancouver feed.
>And I'm also glad to have found some other hockey fans, some Jets and
>some Canucks fans, to watch the game with.  
>
Definitely a good thing...every little cheer helps, Evan.  :)
Good thing the net doesn't need a voice to operate...I won't have one
Sunday night when I get home, I hope.  White noise here we come!  ;)

>
One thing, I WILL say though...Vancouver can KEEP Steve Armitage and
John Garrett as a broadcast team...those two are BAD, especially when
you are spoiled by Don Wittman.  (At least four or five times, Steve called
Barnes Selanne.  Whoops! :)

Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54295
From: vzhivov@superior.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov)
Subject: Sabres!!! Sweep.

It's over - the Sabres came back to beat the Bruins in OT 6-5 tonight
to sweep the series. A beautiful goal by Brad May (Lafontaine set him
up while lying down on the ice) ended it. Fuhr left the game game with
an injured shoulder and Lafontaine was banged up as well; however, the
Sabres will get a week's rest so injuries should not be a problem.

Montreal edged Quebec 3-2 to square their series, which seems to be
headed for Game 7. The Habs dominated the first two periods and were
unlucky to only have a 2-2 tie after 40 minutes. However, an early
goal by Brunet in the 3rd won it.

The Islanders won their 3rd OT game of the series on a goal by Ray
Ferraro 4-3; the Caps simply collapsed after taking a 3-0 lead in the
2nd. The Isles' all-time playoff OT record is now 28-7.

- Vlad the Impaler

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54296
From: RRHAMMER@vm.cmp.ilstu.edu
Subject: And you think ESPN shafted you?

Like many others I too was watching the Caps/Isles game when the went
to the baseball game.  I too was pissed.  How could they interupt such
an important game.  I understand about contracts, but you would think they
would have a clause in the contract concerning important games!
Anyway,  us BLUES (and Hawks) fans got shafted worse!  While everyone
in the U.S. and watched the game on ABC.  However those of us who live in
the central Illinois area were subjected to watching the Arthritus(?)
Telethon.  The area that was most affected by the telecast did not get
to see the game except through HAWK VISION.  This game, had it been
televised, would have been the first home Hawks game shown in the area
since 1980.  This television BULL*&%$ has got to stop.  We are not only
being deprived of seeing games, due to skyrocketing ticket prices, but
we are also being deprived of watching them on TV.
 PEACE,
 HAMMER
 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54297
From: RRHAMMER@vm.cmp.ilstu.edu
Subject: Pierre Turgeon a stud!

Being a a BLUES fan I don't get to see much else from around the league
with the exception of Hockey Night on ESPN.  I can't get the BLUES games
where I go to school, thus I don't get to see a whole lot of other teams
play except for the Hawks.  But last night I got to catch a glimpse of
the Caps/Isles game.  It occurred to me that Turgeon is a stud on skates.
His moves are quick and brilliant.  You NY fans should be proud.
P.S. Who won the game (Caps/Isles)?
 
Peace,
Hammer
 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54298
From: lzuo@byron.u.washington.edu (Joseph)
Subject: Great comeback for Sabres, despit changing goalie !

Bufflo Sabres has just finished their great four wins over Boston. All
Sabres players contribute to those great wins but those talent players
including Mogily, Fuhr, Kemhlev and Lafontin impressed me most. Their 
skills showed the art of sport, not like the garbage speech from the
coach's corner.

Go ! Make hocky popular, make hocky more exciting but less violent ! 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54299
From: jwodzia@fadel.uucp (john wodziak)
Subject: Re: Ranger Fans?????

kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Keith Keller) writes:
>kwolfer@eagle.wesleyan.edu writes:

>>Reading through most of these hockey news I don't see many Ranger fans writing.   
>
>We're here, talking about hockey.  We don't go away like some team's fans
>when the Rangers bite the big one.

Yeah I think we're used to it by now. (even if some of us do change our
.sigs to root for our second favorite teams :-)

>
>>I'm new to this system and a big hockey fan and a long suffering(1940)
>Ranger > fan.  But remember suffering builds character!!
>
>I don't care!  I want my f*cking Stanley Cup!!!!!  Before I die!  AARGH!!!

I'll be happy if they win it before I get out of school. (the way it's going
I may be here saying Piled Higher and Deeper before long)

>
>
>>Ranger fans may be suffering but we're some of the most loyal, unlike Islander
>>fans who only show up when the team wins.
>This has been observed many times.  It's true, definitely.

I have a feeling that alot of people out there may not like this statement
but......
by far the worst "band  wagon" fans are the PIT fans (at least at the present).
Case in Point -- I know a guy who just came to Hockey Hell(TM) from Pitt U.
Him - "How 'bout the Pens? The're F-ing awesome"
Me - "Yeah but beating up on the Devils doesn't mean alot. Wait until
	they meet Boston and/or Detroit in the Playoffs start."
Him - "When do the Playoffs start?"
Me - "Uhhhh. They started a week ago."

I'm not saying that this is true of all the Waddlers fans but there seems to 
be alot of them floating around who really know nothing about hockey except
that they're newly beloved Waddlers are the best team in the game right now
and when they're not the best team those fans will disappear into the woodwork.

John
Flames >> dev/null
Serious comments welcomed.
"Eat the Rich"

> 
>>As far as the Stanley Cup goes I think there's only one team that can test
>>Pittsburgh and that's Detroit.  This would be the most entertaining and hard
>>fought series.  Mario is amazing!
>
>--
>    Keith Keller				LET'S GO RANGERS!!!!!
>						LET'S GO QUAKERS!!!!!
>	kkeller@mail.sas.upenn.edu		IVY LEAGUE CHAMPS!!!!
>
>	   "A cow is not a vegetarian dish."  -- Keith Keller, 1993


In Hockey Hell...............jwodzia@eng.clemson.edu............John R. Wodziak
The _REAL_ Black and Gold   |In Memorium: #7 Alan Kulwicki 1954-1993   | Space
Will Triumph over those who |A Polish Yankee Mechanical Engineer,      | for 
are Pretenders to the Crown.|1992 Winston Cup Champion & a great Person| Rent!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54300
From: jwodzia@fadel.uucp (john wodziak)
Subject: Re: Where are all the Bruins fans???

Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>I'm just wondering where all the Bruins fans are???  I mean they woofed it
>up with about 1,000,000 posts during the regular season saying that their
>fave team was going to kick everyone's @#$ in the playoffs and win the Stanley
>Cup.  While I see nothing wrong with a little ranting and raving, I'm just
>curious why all the Boston faithful have stopped posting.  I mean I haven't
>even see just one little Boston fan post, 'cept for the Bruins fans that
>aren't cocky.  Well, maybe they're all out on the golf course or something,
>but I don't know, I'd sure like to see where all those Bruins fans are at :-)

Still here. Just doing a little sobbing in our beer so we're to busy to
post :-)

Seriously I think I caught a .sig curse from Nelson :-)
First the $%@#$%$ Rangers and $50 now the B's......
Hmmm....How bout dem Whalers? (No offense to steveg or others)




In Hockey Hell...............jwodzia@eng.clemson.edu............John R. Wodziak
The _REAL_ Black and Gold   |In Memorium: #7 Alan Kulwicki 1954-1993   | Space
Will Triumph over those who |A Polish Yankee Mechanical Engineer,      | for 
are Pretenders to the Crown.|1992 Winston Cup Champion & a great Person| Rent!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54301
From: njs@mrtoad.lahabra.chevron.com (n.j.spera)
Subject: Re: ESPN UP YOURS .........

In article <1993Apr21.174430.24039@Virginia.EDU>, mjr4u@Virginia.EDU ("Matthew J. Rush") writes:
|> Actually, I was angry when they went away from the Pens game.
|> Being a Pens fan in central Virginia is kinda tough.  I only
|> get to see them on ESPN, and when they play the Caps, cause
|> we're close enough to DC to get all the Caps games, so when
|> ESPN switched to the Caps, . . . AAAGGGHHH!
|> 
|> Matt

Not nearly as angry as I was to have set the VCR yesterday only to get
home to find the Bruins VS Buffalo - that's what I get for reading the
TV section and not the sports section for what game will be aired.

-- 
 Nancy J. Spera, IMT Division           # "If I didn't know for a fact that   P
 Chevron Petroleum Technology Co.       G  Elvis was working in a donut shop  E
 P.O. Box 446, La Habra, CA 90633-0446  O  in Beaver Falls, I'd swear he was  N
 Tel: (310) 694-7761  njs@chevron.com   # driving this truck." Scotty Baldwin S

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54302
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: Radio stations


Add Boston's WEEI-590AM as the Bruins' flagship station. You probably won't
pick it up anywhere outside of Boston since it's only a 5,000 watt
station. The Bruins also have network stations in all 6 New England
states.

This could be the Bruins' last year on 'EEI which also happens to be an
all-sports radio station. The problem is that the Bruins are not too happy
being moved over to a different station(WMEX 1150AM) whenever there
is a the same-night conflict with the NBA's Boston Celtics. This happened
28 times during the course of the regular season.(The Celtics own financially
troubled WEEI). The Bruins might resurface on WHDH 850 next year. Stay
tuned.

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54303
From: steven.kipling@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Steven Kipling) 
Subject: Re: #77's?

 -=> Quoting The Logistician to All <=-

 

 TL> I am in need of all of the players wearing #77 in the NHL.  I know now
 TL> only of one, Ray Borque for the Bruins.  Any help would be greatly
 TL> appreciated. 
 TL> Thanx.



      Hi there Logistician, is not Paul Coffey wearing
      # 77 for the Detroit Red Wings?
      That is the only other one (besides Borque) that I can think of
      hope it helps.


      Steve






... WARNING!  Removal of this tagline prohibited by law!
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54304
From: steven.kipling@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Steven Kipling) 
Subject: Re: ESPN broadcastsssss

 -=> Quoting Cire Y. Trehguad to All <=-


 CYT> Hey I am in Iowa and I do not mind ESPN showing the PITT/NJD games.
 CYT> At least I get to see the DEVILS...even if they are gettin there ass
 CYT> kicked Perhaps they will score and even win a game or two

 CYT> GO DEVILS


I am sorry to tell you this, but
I don't think the devils will win
a game against Pittsburg, the 
Penguins have so many scoring threats
that you shut down one and another
will kill you
It's too bad but I must conclude that the Penguins will
win their third stanley cup in a row.
I hope someone will beat them, but I just cannot see it
happening.


S t e v e





... Backup not found: (A)bort (R)etry (P)anic
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
                                                            

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54305
From: steven.kipling@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Steven Kipling) 
Subject: Re: Hey, What about teh C

 -=> Quoting Greg Rogers to All <=-
 GR> Hi all,
 GR> Due to living in the Bay Area, I as unable to see Vancouver's victory
 GR> over the Jets last night.  I know the score, but that rarely describes
 GR> the game. Could someone please post a brief sonapsis (sp?) of waht
 GR> happened.  How well did each team play?  Were the cannucks deserving of
 GR> the victory? 
 GR> Also, could some kind soul please email me the end of season,
 GR> individual player stats?

 GR> Greg

 GR> -- Vancouver for the cup (in a virtual reality)--



            I am sorry to tell you this Greg, but in all
            reality, we cannot see Vancouver winning the
            cup.  They have a rrally good chance to come
            out of the Smythe Division, and a chance to make 
            it to the finals, but no one is capable this year
            of beating the Penguins, they have too many
            scoring threats. I would love to be proven wrong, but
            I must conclude that the Pens will win cup 3 this year.


            Steve




... Mondays are a rotten way to spend a 7th of your life.
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
                          

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54306
From: steven.kipling@freddy.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca (Steven Kipling) 
Subject: Re: Test...Please ignore

 -=> Quoting Ohandley@betsy.gsfc.nasa. to All <=-

 Oh> From: ohandley@betsy.gsfc.nasa.gov
 Oh> Newsgroups: rec.sport.hockey
 Oh> Subject: Test...Please ignore
 Oh> Message-ID: <1993Apr21.180741@betsy.gsfc.nasa.gov>
 Oh> Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1993 22:07:41 GMT
 Oh> Reply-To: ohandley@betsy.gsfc.nasa.gov

 Oh> This is a test.....Please ignore.


 Oh> =======================================================================
 Oh> ========
 Oh> =======================================================================
 Oh> ========


      OK I will ignore this message
      since it is only a test.
      wow, Montreal just scored to go up
      1 - 0 in game 4 of their series, oh sorry
      I was supposed to ignore this message wasn't I


      bye for now.


      Steve




... DONT YOU DARE READ THIS TAGLINE!!!!!!!
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
                                                      

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54307
From: b859zah@utarlg.uta.edu (George M. Smiley)
Subject: Re: ESPN really sucks big time

cdash@moet.cs.colorado.edu (Charles Shub) writes...
> 
>so all us hockey/automobile racing fans all know exactly where we stand
>	ESPN delays the martinsville race by a day for the NFL draft
>	ESPN shows baseball instead of the overtime of a NHL playoff game
> 
>	gimme a break, guys
>

What really irritated me was that they kept switching back and forth
between baseball and hockey after they stated that they couldn't show
the overtime period. I turned back to ESPN around 11 and it was hockey.
Great, I pulled up a chair and watched, then the first overtime period 
ended and they went back to baseball before coming back to hockey
something like 30 minutes later. Are they trying to alienate both
hockey and baseball viewers at the same time. As for Martinsville,
I wonder why they even bothered to sign up for it when they it was
no secret that it coincided with the draft. Why not let TNN broadcast
it ?


George

>charlie shub  cdash@cs.Colorado.EDU     

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54308
From: chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Subject: Re: SHARKS REVIEW Part 5: Left Wings

paul@fugu.Data-IO.COM (Paul Brownlow) writes:

>Wood played most of his junior career in Seattle.  He was one
>of the leading scorers on a mediocre team when he was traded away in
>1992.  He rarely lost a fight and was one of the toughest players in
>the WHL.

Wood is fairly small for an enforcer-type. I mean, Fleury does a pretty good
job and isn't that large, but Dody is no Fleury. 

Having been witness to three or four of his fights closeup, he simply isn't
ready to fight at an NHL level (assuming that it's his role, which is ALL he
really showed us in his few games up from K.C. -- if he can pass, shoot or
skate, I never saw much of it). All he has is a right fist, which isn't bad,
but at the NHL level, the other players are smart enough to grab the thing
before he can land anything significant. Once you control that hand, he's a
fish flopping on the beach and the other player can do just about anything
he wants to him. His entire strategy seemed to be keep the hand out of reach
until he found an opening -- and I never once saw him find an opening worth
talking about. He got neutralized quickly, and stomped on a couple of times.

Unless he shows some new tricks in camp, he'll be on my "career minor
leaguer" list. Since this was his first taste of the NHL, I expect the
Sharks gave it to him so he'd KNOW what he'd have to work on off-season. He
needs to get stronger, he needs to get more speed and he needs to show some
versatility as something else than a simply goond, because he wasn't
particularly good as a goon.

-- 
 Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= chuq@apple.com
   Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms =+=  GEnie: MAC.BIGOT =+= ALink:CHUQ 
  Minor League fans: minors-request@medraut.apple.com (San Jose Giants: A/1/9)
  San Francisco Giants fans: giants-request@medraut.apple.com (The Stick?NOT!)
   San Jose Sharks fans: sharks-request@medraut.apple.com (New seat: 127/TBD)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54309
From: jsmilla@emory.edu (Joshua S. Millard)
Subject: Islanders win Third in OT

Don't know who scored, but the Isles (28-7 franchise record in
playoff OT games) took game four by a score of 4-3 for their
third consecutive OT win over the Capitals tonight at Uniondale.
If you know, please post who scored for a Isles fan living in
Atlanta:Hockey Hell.

Lord Stan's a Uniondale Man!  GO ISLES!

JSM.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54358
From: ketolain@messi.uku.fi (Jarkko Ketolainen)
Subject: WC/Finland

Disaster! Finland was beaten by Czech 1-3 (0-0,1-1,0-2).
Finland will be 4th of pool B and will most certainly meet Canada in the
quarter final on wednesday 28th. Lack of scoring skills has
been the major problem of team Finland throughout the tournament.
Briza (goalie)  was the MVP of  the Czech team and Tikkanen was the 
MVP of the Finnish team. 

Jarkko #14

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54359
From: wihervaa@messi.uku.fi (Mikko Wihervaara)
Subject: Re: WC/Finland

ketolain@messi.uku.fi (Jarkko Ketolainen) writes:

>Disaster! Finland was beaten by Czech 1-3 (0-0,1-1,0-2).
>Finland will be 4th of pool B and will most certainly meet Canada in the
>quarter final on wednesday 28th. Lack of scoring skills has
>been the major problem of team Finland throughout the tournament.
>Briza (goalie)  was the MVP of  the Czech team and Tikkanen was the 
       ^^^^^^^^ 
>MVP of the Finnish team. 

In four of the five games Finns have played, the goalie has been chosen
the best player of the opposing team. (In the fifth, the finnish goalie, 
Ketterer was elected the best Finn) Has this to do with the goalies 
having good days in these games, or are the finnish players just lousy
scorers???

Anyway, quite few goals have been scored in these games in generally
(the exception of course being Canada vs. Italy).  It looks like the
goalies are getting too good.  Is this due to their equipment getting
bigger, so they cover more (their gloves, e.g. seem to be much bigger
now than they were some years ago).

Anybody know if the rules on goalie equipment has changed this way????


Mikko Wihervaara  
 
>Jarkko #14
-- 
T{m{ on nyt t{mm|nen testi
sigun kai piti olla muutamarivinen
nyt viel{ pari 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54360
From: willis@oracle.SCG.HAC.COM (Stan Willis)
Subject: Kings regular season schedule/results

1992-93 Los Angeles Kings Schedule/Results

TV:
---
2 preseason games, 82 of 84 regular season and all playoffs on TV.

 (PT)= Prime Ticket, (5) = KTLA Channel 5, (7) = ABC Channel 7 - playoffs

Radio:
------
All regular and preseason games broadcast on the Kings radio network.

 Southern California 	XTRA -  690am (flagship)
 Simi Valley		KWNK -  670am 
 Ankorage, Alaska	KBYR -  700am
 El Centro		KAMP - 1430am
 Fairbanks, Alaska	KIAK -  970am
 Hemet/Temecula		KHSJ - 1320am
 Lancaster/Palmdale	KAVL -  610am
 Palm Desert		KNWZ - 1270am
 Paso Robles		KPRL - 1230am
 Reno, Nevada		KPLY - 1270am
 Sacramento		KSAC - 1240am
 San Luis Obispo	KKAL - 1280am
 Santa Clarita		KBET - 1220am
 Las Vegas, Nevada 	KENO - 1460am

Preseason:
----------
September/October:
18 LA  3 vs VAN 3 @ Vancouver   - 12,357 (0-0-1,  1 pt)
20 LA  5 vs PIT 2 @ Portland    -  6,124 (1-0-1,  3 pts) (PT)
23 LA  3 vs PIT 3 @ Tacoma      -  ?     (1-0-2,  4 pts)
24 LA  2 vs NYR 7 @ San Diego   -  8,099 (1-1-2,  4 pts) (PT)
26 LA  2 vs NYR 6 @ Phoenix     -  8,977 (1-2-2,  4 pts)
27 LA  4 vs SJ  2 @ Sacramento  -  7,950 (2-2-2,  6 pts)
30 LA  2 vs VAN 5 @ The Forum   - 10,250 (2-3-2,  6 pts)
03 LA  8 vs SJ  8 @ The Forum   - 12,005 (3-3-2,  8 pts)
      --       --
Total 29       36

Regular Season:
---------------
October:
06 LA  5 @  Calgary      4 (OT) - 19,461 ( 1- 0- 0,   2 pts) (PT)
08 LA  3 vs Detroit      5      - 16,005 ( 1- 1- 0,   2 pts) (PT)
10 LA  6 vs Winnipeg     3      - 14,509 ( 2- 1- 0,   4 pts) (PT)
13 LA  2 vs San Jose     1      - 14,320 ( 3- 1- 0,   6 pts) (PT)
15 LA  4 vs Calgary      0      - 15,133 ( 4- 1- 0,   8 pts) (PT)
17 LA  8 vs Boston       6      - 16,005 ( 5- 1- 0,  10 pts) (PT)
20 LA  2  @ Calgary      6      - 19,169 ( 5- 2- 0,  10 pts)  (5)
23 LA  2  @ Winnipeg     4      - 12,924 ( 5- 3- 0,  10 pts) (PT)
24 LA  5  @ Minnesota    5      - 15,174 ( 5- 3- 1,  11 pts)  (5)
27 LA  4  @ NY Islanders 3      - 10,259 ( 6- 3- 1,  13 pts) (PT)
29 LA  3  @ Boston       8      - 14,448 ( 6- 4- 1,  13 pts) (PT)
31 LA  7  @ Hartford     1      -  9,244 ( 7- 4- 1,  15 pts)  (5)
      --                --                -----------------
Oct.  51                46                 7- 4- 1,  15 pts

November:
05 LA  5 vs New Jersey   2      - 14,592 ( 8- 4- 1,  17 pts) (PT)
07 LA  5 vs Buffalo      2      - 16,005 ( 9- 4- 1,  19 pts) (PT)
08 LA 11  @ San Jose     4      - 11,089 (10- 4- 1,  21 pts) (no tv)
10 LA  4  @ Winnipeg     4      - 12,831 (10- 4- 2,  22 pts) (PT)
12 LA  7 vs Vancouver    4      - 15,486 (11- 4- 2,  24 pts) (PT)
14 LA  6 vs Edmonton     2      - 16,005 (12- 4- 2,  26 pts) (PT)
16 LA  3  @ Vancouver    6      - 15,896 (12- 5- 2,  26 pts) (PT)
17 LA  0  @ San Jose     6      - 11,089 (12- 6- 2,  26 pts) (PT)
19 LA  4 vs Chicago      1      - 16,005 (13- 6- 2,  28 pts) (PT)
21 LA  6 vs Toronto      4      - 16,005 (14- 6- 2,  30 pts) (PT)
25 LA  3  @ Edmonton     1      - 13,636 (15- 6- 2,  32 pts) (no tv)
27 LA  5  @ Detroit      3      - 19,875 (16- 6- 2,  34 pts) (PT)
28 LA  2  @ Toronto      3      - 15,720 (16- 7- 2,  34 pts) (PT)
      --                --                -----------------
Nov.  61                42                 9- 3- 1,  19 pts
Year 112                88

December:
01 LA  6  @ Chicago      3      - 16,292 (17- 7- 2,  36 pts) at Milwaukee (PT)
03 LA  5 vs Pittsburgh   3      - 16,005 (18- 7- 2,  38 pts) (PT)
05 LA  7 vs Hartford     3      - 16,005 (19- 7- 2,  40 pts) (PT)
08 LA  5 vs Montreal     5      - 12,276 (19- 7- 3,  41 pts) at Phoenix (PT)
10 LA  4 vs Quebec       5      - 15,221 (19- 8- 3,  41 pts) (PT)
12 LA  6 vs St Louis     3      - 16,005 (20- 8- 3,  43 pts) (PT)
15 LA  2 vs Tampa Bay    3      - 15,753 (20- 9- 3,  43 pts) (PT)
18 LA  5  @ Edmonton     5      - 15,257 (20- 9- 4,  44 pts)  (5)
19 LA  3  @ Calgary      5      - 20,214 (20-10- 4,  44 pts) (PT)
22 LA  2 vs Vancouver    6      - 16,005 (20-11- 4,  44 pts) (PT)
26 LA  2  @ San Jose     7      - 11,089 (20-12- 4,  44 pts)  (5)
29 LA  2 vs Philadelphia 10     - 16,005 (20-13- 4,  44 pts) (PT)
31 LA  0  @ Vancouver    4      - 16,150 (20-14- 4,  44 pts) (PT)
      --                --                -----------------
Dec.  49                62                 4- 7- 2,  10 pts
Year 161               150

January:
02 LA  5 vs Montreal     5      - 16,005 (20-14- 5,  45 pts) (PT)
06 LA  3 vs Tampa Bay    6      - 16,005 (20-15- 5,  45 pts) (PT)
08 LA  3  @ Winnipeg     6      - 14,036 (20-16- 5,  45 pts)  (5)
10 LA  5  @ Chicago      4      - 17,705 (21-16- 5,  47 pts)  (5)
12 LA  3  @ Ottawa       2      - 10,500 (22-16- 5,  49 pts) (PT)
14 LA  1  @ New Jersey   7      - 13,586 (22-17- 5,  49 pts) (PT)
16 LA  2 vs Winnipeg     5      - 16,005 (22-18- 5,  49 pts) (PT)
19 LA  5  @ Edmonton     4      - 16,686 (23-18- 5,  51 pts) (PT)
21 LA  4 vs Vancouver    5      - 16,005 (23-19- 5,  51 pts) (PT)
23 LA  3 vs NY Rangers   8      - 16,005 (23-20- 5,  51 pts) (PT)
26 LA  7 vs San Jose     1      - 16,005 (24-20- 5,  53 pts) (PT)
28 LA  1 vs Calgary      2      - 16,005 (24-21- 5,  53 pts) (PT)
30 LA  2 vs Chicago      2      - 16,005 (24-21- 6,  54 pts) (PT)
      --                --                -----------------
Jan.  44                57                 4- 7- 2,  10 pts
Year 205               207

February:
02 LA  2  @ Quebec       3      - 14,843 (24-22- 6,  54 pts) (PT)
03 LA  2  @ Montreal     7      - 17,164 (24-23- 6,  54 pts) (PT)
09 LA  3 vs Edmonton     6      - 16,005 (24-24- 6,  54 pts) (PT)
11 LA  6 vs Detroit      6      - 16,005 (24-24- 7,  55 pts) (PT)
13 LA  3 vs Washington  10      - 16,005 (24-25- 7,  55 pts) (PT)
15 LA  3 vs Vancouver    0      - 16,005 (25-25- 7,  57 pts) (PT)
17 LA 10  @ Minnesota    5      - 14,911 (26-25- 7,  59 pts) (PT)
18 LA  2  @ Chicago      7      - 17,597 (26-26- 7,  59 pts) (PT)
20 LA  3  @ Washington   7      - 17,812 (26-27- 7,  59 pts) (PT)
22 LA  5  @ Tampa Bay    2      - 10,425 (27-27- 7,  61 pts) (PT)
25 LA  0  @ St Louis     3      - 13,473 (27-28- 7,  61 pts) (PT)
27 LA  2 vs Toronto      5      - 16,005 (27-29- 7,  61 pts) (PT)
      --                --                -----------------
Feb.  41                61                 3- 8- 1,   7 pts
Year 246               268

March:
02 LA  6 vs Calgary      2      - 16,005 (28-29- 7,  63 pts) (PT)
04 LA  8 vs Ottawa       6      - 16,005 (29-29- 7,  65 pts) (PT)
06 LA  6 vs Edmonton     1      - 16,005 (30-29- 7,  67 pts) (PT)
09 LA  3  @ NY Rangers   4      - 18,200 (30-30- 7,  67 pts) (PT)
11 LA  3  @ Pittsburgh   4      - 16,164 (30-31- 7,  67 pts) (PT)
13 @ Philadelphia - Postponed after 1 period (1-1) due to weather. Resch for 4/1
14 @ Buffalo      - Postponed due to weather.  Rescheduled for 3/15.
15 LA  4  @ Buffalo      2      - 13,799 (31-31- 7,  69 pts) (PT)
16 LA  8 vs Winnipeg     4      - 16,005 (32-31- 7,  71 pts) (PT)
18 LA  7 vs NY Islanders 4      - 16,005 (33-31- 7,  73 pts) (PT)
20 LA  3 vs St Louis     2      - 16,005 (34-31- 7,  75 pts) (PT)
24 LA  2  @ Vancouver    6      - 16,150 (34-32- 7,  75 pts)  (5)
26 LA  4  @ Edmonton     1      - 17,503 (35-32- 7,  77 pts)  (5)
28 LA  3  @ Winnipeg     3      - 15,566 (35-32- 8,  78 pts) (PT)
29 LA  9  @ Detroit      3      - 19,875 (36-32- 8,  80 pts)  (5)
31 LA  5  @ Toronto      5      - 15,720 (36-32- 9,  81 pts) (PT)
      --                --                -----------------
Mar.  71                47                 9- 3- 2,  20 pts
Year 317               315

April:
01 LA  3  @ Philadelphia 1      - 17,380 (37-32- 9,  83 pts) (PT) rescheduled
03 LA  0 vs Minnesota    3      - 16,005 (37-33- 9,  83 pts) (PT)
06 LA  3 vs Calgary      3      - 16,005 (37-33-10,  84 pts) (PT)
08 LA  2 vs San Jose     1      - 16,005 (38-33-10,  86 pts) (PT)
10 LA  3  @ San Jose     2 (OT) - 11,089 (39-33-10,  88 pts) (PT)
13 LA  4  @ Vancouver    7      - 16,150 (39-34-10,  88 pts) (PT)
15 LA  6 vs Vancouver    8      - 16,005 (39-35-10,  88 pts) (PT)
      --                --                -----------------
Apr.  21                25                 3- 3- 1,   7 pts
Year 338               340                39-35-10,  88 pts -  3rd Smythe, 
                                                              11th overall

Playoffs:
---------
April:
18   @ Calgary - 12:00 noon (7)
21   @ Calgary -  6:30 pm (PT)
23  vs Calgary -  7:30 pm (PT)
25  vs Calgary - 12:00 noon (7)**
*27  @ Calgary -  6:30 pm (PT)
*29 vs Calgary -  7:30 pm (PT)

May:
*01  @ Calgary -  6:30 pm (PT)

all times listed are Pacific Time.
*if necessary.
** may be shown on ABC, if televised by Prime Ticket, time is 7:30 pm.
===============================================================================
Stan Willis (willis@empire.dnet.hac.com)
net contact: L.A. Kings

 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
      talk with the L.A. Kings Mailing List ...... kings@cs.stanford.edu
      to subscribe or unsubscribe: ....... kings-request@cs.stanford.edu
 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
===============================================================================

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54361
From: nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu)
Subject: Possible Canadian WC Team?

This is an all-point team for the Canadian NHLers who are not playoff bound...

GOALIES
Bill Ranford, Edmonton
Sean Burke, Hartford
Peter Sidorkiewicz, Ottawa

DEFENSEMEN
Zarley Zalapski, Hartford
Norm MacIver, Ottawa
Garry Galley, Philadelphia
Greg Hawgood, Philadelphia
Dave Manson, Edmonton
Mark Tinordi, Minnesota

CENTERS
Mark Messier, N. Y. Rangers
Geoff Sanderson, Hartford
Brian Bradley, Tampa Bay
Rod Brind'Amour, Philadelphia

LEFT WINGS
Adam Graves, N. Y. Rangers
Chris Kontos, Tampa Bay
Patrick Poulin, Hartford
Shayne Corson, Edmonton

RIGHT WINGS
Pat Verbeek, Hartford
Russ Courtnall, Minnesota
Mike Gartner, N. Y. Rangers
Kevin Dineen, Philadelphia

===============================================================================
GO CALGARY FLAMES!  Al MacInnis for Norris!  Gary Roberts for Hart and Smythe!
GO EDMONTON OILERS!  Go for playoffs next year!  Stay in Edmonton!
===============================================================================
Nelson Lu (claudius@leland.stanford.edu)
rec.sport.hockey contact for the San Jose Sharks

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54364
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Stan Fischler, 4/24

In <1993Apr25.170303.19486@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:

>Wayne made his own bed...choosing McNall over Sather and hockey
>destiny...he should sleep in it instead of whining.  Ego got

Absolute nonsense.  The decision that was made was Pocklington's.  He chose 
20 mill over Gretzky.  If Gretzky wasn't upset about not being able to win
a cup in LA then I submit that he wasn't worth the 20 mill.

>the best of him...he thought the supporting cast in Edmonton
>didn't matter...that he was the show himself.

How do you know what he thinks (or thought)?  The only "thought" that I
can see that you have revealed is your own.  You don't like Gretzky.
Big deal.

>Now, my only complaint about Lemieux is that he dives too much...
>but last year Patrick convinced him twice to accept Bowman and hockey
>destiny, rather than his ego.

The real purpose of diving is not merely an attempt to draw a penalty.  What
the player is trying to do is make the checkers keep their distance so the
ref won't be fooled.  I can't imagine why anyone would expect someone like
Lemieux to change his game.  Why don't you pick on 1 dimensional over-rated
type like Hull and Salami. 


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                   ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54365
From: farenebt@logic.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL Playoff results

AHL PLAYOFF SCORES-- FIRST ROUND	(home team in CAPS)
================================

GAMES PLAYED ON TUES, 4/20
-------------------------
Rochester 6	UTICA 4
Fredericton at Cape Breton

SERIES STATI (plural of status? :)
----------------------------------
Adirondack leads CDI, 3-0
Providence tied w/Springfield, 2-2
Binghamton tied w/Baltimore, 1-1
Rochester leads Utica, 2-1
St John's leads Moncton, 2-0
Cape Breton tied w/Fredericton, 1-1

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54366
From: fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu (FRANK MICHAE SALVATORE)
Subject: NC Caps/Isles Fans


Caps/Isles Fans,

Anyone interested in catching the games from Nassau
Coliseum (hopefully there will be another) can catch
the game at North Carolina's Original Sports Bar in
Chapel Hill.  I'm pretty sure they carry HTS as well.
They had all three games on at the same
time last night.  This is the only place I know to
catch all of the Stanley Cup action.

Frank Salvatore
fmsalvat@eos.ncsu.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54367
From: Mamatha Devineni Ratnam <mr47+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Pens fans reactions



I am sure some bashers of Pens fans are pretty confused about the lack
of any kind of posts about the recent Pens massacre of the Devils. Actually,
I am  bit puzzled too and a bit relieved. However, I am going to put an end
to non-PIttsburghers' relief with a bit of praise for the Pens. Man, they
are killing those Devils worse than I thought. Jagr just showed you why
he is much better than his regular season stats. He is also a lot
fo fun to watch in the playoffs. Bowman should let JAgr have a lot of
fun in the next couple of games since the Pens are going to beat the pulp out of Jersey anyway. I was very disappointed not to see the Islanders lose the final
regular season game.          PENS RULE!!!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54478
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Playoff Pool game 2 standings

Here are the standings after game 2 of each of the divisional semi-final
series.

	- Andrew

USENET Hockey Playoff Draft Standings

Posn	Team				Pts	Rem	Last Posn

1.	Sneddon Scorers                 77	25	(1)
2.	Arctic Circles                  75	25	(75)
	Northern Lights                 75	25	(33)
	Threepeat                       75	25	(19)
5.	fighting amish                  74	25	(161)
	Team Elvis                      74	25	(11)
7.	chris roney                     73	25	(33)
	Myers Marauders                 73	25	(--)
	the dead ducks                  73	25	(11)
10.	Les Poteux                      72	25	(--)
	Sludge                          72	25	(75)
	Paige Faults                    72	25	(33)
	Sam & His Dogs                  72	25	(33)
	The Borg                        72	25	(2)
	Hurricane Andrew                72	25	(4)
	Lewey's Lakers                  72	25	(102)
	Einstien's Punk Band            72	25	(9)
18.	Homesick Hawaiian               71	25	(4)
	Test Department                 71	25	(11)
	Samuel Lau (Calgary, Alberta)   71	25	(127)
	Mopar Muscle Men                71	25	(33)
	Jerky Boys                      71	24	(4)
	GB Flyers                       71	25	(19)
24.	Neural Netters                  70	25	(102)
	give you money monday           70	25	(9)
	Bill McGreer                    70	25	(--)
	Fugazi                          70	25	(33)
	Detroit Homeboy                 70	25	(11)
	Bloom County All-Stars          70	25	(54)
	DehraDun Maawalis               70	25	(75)
31.	Great Expectations              69	25	(4)
	PURDUE RICKS PENS               69	25	(19)
33.	frank's little wankers          68	25	(33)
	Jan Stein                       68	25	(33)
	Allez les Blues                 68	25	(--)
	Goaldingers                     68	25	(75)
	suds                            68	25	(19)
	weenies                         68	25	(33)
	A.P. BURY                       68	25	(19)
	Bruce's Rented Mules            68	25	(4)
41.	Mind Sweepers                   67	25	(33)
	Mike Burger                     67	25	(11)
	Go Flames                       67	25	(--)
	garryola                        67	25	(33)
	The Mulberry Maulers            67	25	(75)
	LIPPE                           67	25	(102)
	Flamming Senators               67	25	(19)
	Big Bay Bombers                 67	25	(102)
	Milton Keynes Kings             67	25	(33)
50.	Seppo Kemppainen                66	25	(19)
	Freddy Beach Rockets            66	25	(--)
	The Campi Machine               66	25	(19)
	j's rock'em sock'ems            66	25	(75)
	Sean Forbes                     66	25	(19)
	Tapio Repo                      66	25	(11)
	zachmans wingers                66	25	(19)
	Zipper Heads                    66	25	(11)
	Canadian Gladiators             66	25	(75)
59.	Teem Kanada                     65	25	(33)
	New Zealand Leafs               65	25	(54)
	Tiger Chung Lees                65	25	(54)
	Rangers Of Destiny              65	25	(33)
	make beliefs                    65	25	(54)
	Dave Wessels                    65	25	(2)
	Norway Killerwhales             65	25	(54)
66.	Force 25                        64	25	(75)
	trevor's triumph                64	25	(75)
	Commitments                     64	25	(141)
	Skate or Die                    64	25	(19)
	Dog's Hog's                     64	25	(33)
	Delaware Destroyers             64	25	(33)
	Craig team                      64	25	(11)
	Rangers Blow                    64	25	(54)
	Debbie Bowles                   64	25	(19)
	Mak Paranjape                   64	25	(141)
	Comfortably Numb                64	25	(127)
	Loaded Weapons                  64	25	(54)
	Rob Del Mundo                   64	25	(54)
	Robarts Research Rebels         64	25	(54)
	Fuzzfaces Galore                64	25	(19)
	Houdini's Magicians             64	25	(54)
	La Coupe Stainless              64	25	(141)
83.	Cluster Buster                  63	25	(33)
	Lets Go Pandas                  63	25	(102)
	Tequila Shooters                63	25	(141)
	Steves Superstars               63	25	(102)
	Reksa fans of Oulu              63	25	(127)
	Habs Playing Golf               63	25	(75)
	Chris Stevens                   63	25	(--)
	On Thin Ice                     63	25	(102)
	Oakville Brothers               63	25	(33)
	Jason team                      63	25	(102)
	smithw                          63	25	(102)
94.	Anson Mak                       62	25	(173)
	Skriko Wolves                   62	25	(102)
	all the kane's men              62	25	(75)
	Danielle Leblanc                62	25	(127)
	Team Awesome                    62	25	(19)
	weasels                         62	25	(141)
	Alf's All-Stars                 62	25	(75)
	Zippety Doodah                  62	25	(75)
	Kramer George and Jerry         62	25	(75)
	Rev's Rebels                    62	25	(75)
	Yan Loke                        62	25	(75)
	Lamp Lighters                   62	25	(102)
	littlest giants                 62	25	(75)
	Mr Creosote                     62	25	(75)
108.	oceanweavers                    61	25	(161)
	Great Scott                     61	25	(141)
	Bobby Schmautz Fan Club         61	25	(127)
	IceMachine                      61	25	(102)
	Hat Trick Mike                  61	25	(--)
	The promise land                61	25	(33)
	Daves knee jerk picks           61	25	(102)
	Doug Bowles                     61	25	(102)
	Holsteins SFB                   61	25	(54)
	Lemon Pepper Grizzly Bears      61	25	(54)
	Flying pigs                     61	25	(127)
	Les Raisins                     61	25	(102)
	RENEB                           61	25	(102)
	Gilles Carmel                   61	25	(102)
122.	Boops Bets                      60	25	(127)
	Timo Ojala                      60	25	(127)
	Rednecks from Hockey Hell       60	25	(33)
	gee man                         60	25	(127)
	FRACK ATTACK                    60	25	(54)
	triple X                        60	25	(127)
	Ulfie's 16 brothers             60	25	(--)
	buffalo soldiers                60	25	(54)
	Shigella                        60	25	(102)
	Ottawa Bearcats                 60	25	(127)
	Whiters                         60	25	(141)
	Monica Loke                     60	25	(102)
	Lance Hill The Boston Bruins Fa 60	25	(33)
135.	Mann Mariners                   59	24	(141)
	New Jersey Rob                  59	25	(102)
	Frasses Faceplants              59	25	(141)
	Doug Mraz                       59	25	(102)
	Muller n Walker                 59	25	(54)
	High Stickers                   59	25	(141)
	Legzryx                         59	25	(161)
	Beer Makes Me An Expert         59	25	(75)
	Gail Hiebert                    59	25	(127)
	Dean Martin                     59	25	(161)
145.	marcs maulers                   58	25	(127)
	brians bloodletters             58	25	(75)
	Van Isle Colonists              58	25	(141)
	Charlie Cook                    58	25	(--)
	Bjorkloven                      58	25	(54)
	Schott Shooters                 58	25	(102)
	Bjoern Leaguen                  58	25	(75)
	The Eradicators                 58	25	(141)
	Lord Stanley's Favourites       58	25	(141)
	But Wait Theres more            58	25	(127)
	Stacey Ross                     58	25	(141)
156.	Heikki Salmi                    57	25	(54)
	The Ice Kickers                 57	25	(75)
	Chapman Chaps                   57	25	(161)
	The ^&#@$#$% Rangers of 1940    57	25	(54)
	The Underwriters                57	25	(54)
	beam team                       57	25	(176)
	Dave Hiebert                    57	25	(75)
	Canuck Force                    57	25	(176)
	Evan Pritchard                  57	25	(161)
	Controversy Warriors            57	25	(54)
	JFZ Dream Team                  57	25	(141)
167.	San Jose Mahi Mahi              56	25	(141)
	go go gagit                     56	25	(161)
	goddess of fermentation         56	25	(54)
	bure's blur                     56	25	(141)
	Louisiana Psycho Killers        56	25	(141)
	East City Jokers                56	25	(102)
	Tampere Salami                  56	25	(176)
	JOE'S A CRAK HEAD               56	25	(102)
	Grant Marven                    56	25	(75)
	Mark And Steve Dreaming Again   56	25	(75)
	Pens Dynasty                    56	25	(161)
178.	Chip n Dale                     55	25	(189)
179.	Cherry Bombers                  54	25	(161)
	Brian Bergman                   54	25	(189)
	The Goobmeister                 54	25	(75)
	Oz                              54	25	(141)
	Arm & Hammer                    54	25	(161)
	gax goons                       54	25	(176)
	Daryl Turner                    54	25	(102)
186.	E.I.S                           53	25	(141)
	BOSSE                           53	25	(75)
	Myllypuro Hedgehogs             53	25	(161)
	Chapman Sticks                  53	25	(176)
	Hillside Raiders                53	25	(185)
	Knights on a Power Play         53	25	(173)
192.	Eldoret Elephants               52	25	(185)
	Sparky's Select                 52	25	(176)
	Sluggo's Hosers                 52	25	(173)
	butt ends                       52	25	(176)
196.	lisa's luggers                  51	25	(197)
	Stanias Stars                   51	25	(161)
198.	Ken De Cruyenaere               49	25	(176)
199.	Gary Shiff                      48	25	(--)
200.	JUKURIT                         47	25	(176)
201.	Montys Nords                    45	25	(192)
	Jane's World                    45	25	(185)
	Rolaids Required                45	25	(189)
	Martin's Gag                    45	25	(194)
205.	Equipe Du Jour                  44	25	(196)
206.	Arsenal Maple Leafs             41	18	(194)
	the ALarmers                    41	25	(185)
208.	Killer Kings                    38	25	(192)
-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54479
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Goalie mask poll update 4/22/93


	Curtis Joseph and Ray LeBlanc have made some big moves in the
poll recently. Hextall has shown some strong movement as well. Kirk
McLean and Tom Barrasso (I can't see why) have been added to the list
recently. Keep sending in those votes.

Current votes for favorite goalie masks (3pts - 1st, 2pts - 2nd, 1pt - 3rd)

Player                    Team                 Pts       Votes
--------------------------------------------------------------
1. Ed Belfour             Chicago              32         15
   Curtis Joseph          St. Louis            32         13 
3. Andy Moog              Boston               30         13
4. Brian Hayward          San Jose             26         10 
5. Ron Hextall            Quebec               16          8
6. Grant Fuhr             Buffalo              12          5 
7. Gerry Cheevers         Boston (retired)     11          6 
8. John Vanbeisbrouck     NY Rangers           10          4
9. Ray LeBlanc            USA Olympic           7          3
10. Mike Richter          NY Rangers            6          3
11. Manon Rheaume         Atlanta (IHL)         5          2
12. Don Beaupre           Washington            4          2
    Ken Dryden            Montreal (retired)    4          2
--------------------------------------------------------------
Others receiving less than 4pts: Mike Vernon (Cal), Clint
 Malarchuk (Buf/SD,IHL), Tommy Soderstrom (Phil), Tom Barrasso (Pit),
 Artus Irbe (SJ), Tim Cheveldae (Det), Sean Burke (NJ),
 Rick Wamsley (Tor,ret), Jon Casey (Minn), Bob Essensa (Win),
 Glenn Healy (NYI), Tony Espo (Chi), Gilles Gratton (Bos),
 Rod Stauber (LA), Gump Worsley (Mtl/NYR), Pat Jablonski (TB),
 Grant Fuhr (Tor), Felix Potvin (Tor), Stephane Beauregard (Win),
 Mark Fitzpatrick (NYI), Chico Resch (NYI), Kirk McLean (Van)

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54507
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: WC 93: Scores and standings, April 25


 1993 World Championships in Germany:
 ====================================

  Group A standings (Munich)            Group B standings (Dortmund)
  --------------------------            ----------------------------

             GP  W T L  GF-GA +/-  P                  GP  W T L  GF-GA +/-  P

  Canada      5  5 0 0  31- 4 +27 10    Czech republic 5  4 1 0  17- 4 +13  9
  Sweden      5  3 0 2  17-14  +3  6    Germany        5  4 0 1  20-12  +8  8
  Russia      5  2 1 2  15-12  +3  5    USA            5  2 2 1  14-10  +4  6
  Switzerland 5  2 0 3  11-14  -3  4    Finland        5  2 1 2   7- 7   0  5
  ----------------------------------    -------------------------------------
  Italy       4  1 1 2   7-19 -12  3    Norway         4  0 0 4   1-13 -12  0
  Austria     4  0 0 4   3-21 -18  0    France         4  0 0 4   6-19 -13  0

 
 April 18:  Italy - Russia        2-2       Norway - Germany          0-6
            Sweden - Austria      1-0       USA - Czech republic      1-1

 April 19:  Canada - Switzerland  2-0
            Russia - Austria      4-2       Finland - France          2-0

 April 20:  Sweden - Canada       1-4       Czech republic - Germany  5-0
            Switzerland - Italy   0-1       Finland - USA             1-1

 April 21:                                  Germany - France          5-3
            Italy - Sweden        2-6       Czech republic - Norway   2-0

 April 22:  Switzerland - Russia  0-6       USA - France              6-1
            Austria - Canada      0-11      Norway - Finland          0-2

 April 23:  Switzerland - Austria 5-1       Germany - Finland         3-1

 April 24:  Russia - Sweden       2-5       Czech republic - France   6-2
            Canada - Italy       11-2       USA - Norway              3-1

 April 25:  Sweden - Switzerland  4-6       Finland- Czech republic   1-3
            Russia - Canada       1-3       Germany - USA             6-3

 April 26:  Austria - Italy                 France - Norway		20:00

 
 PLAYOFFS:
 =========

 April 27:	Quarterfinals
		Sweden - USA						15:30
		Russia - Germany					20:00

 April 28:	Quarterfinals
		Canada - Finland					15:30
		Italy/Switzerland - Czech republic			20:00

 April 29:	Relegation
		A #5 - B #6						15:30
		A #6 - B #5						20:00

 April 30:	Semifinals
		A #1/B #4 - A #3/B #2					15:30
		A #4/B #1 - A #2/B #3					20:00

 May 1:		Relegation						14:30
		Bronze medal game 					19:00

 May 2:		FINAL							15:00

--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54508
From: ritt1@ac.dal.ca
Subject: Re: Lemieux's Getting the Hart... Jeez I hope not!

In article <22APR93.02956996.0062@UNBVM1.CSD.UNB.CA>, Patrick Walker <F1HH@UNB.CA> writes:
 
> By the way, I am Canadian, play a little, and watched
> Hockey night In Canada, (Never Missed a Show!)

Well that's really great Pat.  I guess since you've played a little you thereby 
qualify as an expert.  Especially since you watch all the games on t.v.  All 
that qualifies you as is a armchair quarterback or a coach potato

> Not that I condone violence, but I'll make an exception for Mario.
Pat Walker

Again just further evidence as to what kind of an expert you are.  Truly a 
stupid statement.  Mario is definately one of the best players to play the game.
I'm not saying he is the best to ever play the game, but he should come to
mind when that question is asked.  Let's face it, he just returns from 
radiation therapy with around a dozen games left, overtakes Lafontaine for the
scoring lead and then buries him!!!!  No, I guess he just got lucky.
Speaking of Lafontaine, now there's a guy who should be considered for the
Hart trophy as well, certainly one of the better players in the league this
year. 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54509
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: PLAYOFFS STATS through Sunday 4/25

Stanley Cup Playoff stats through games played Sunday, April 25 1993
--------------------------------------------------------------------

Top 20 Point Scorers
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  1    9  0   9  0  0  0  0   4 CAN BOS  C 12  Adam Oates
  2    8  5   3  4  0  2  0   0 USA STL RW 16  Brett Hull
  3    7  6   1  2  0  0  0   6 RUS BUF RW 89  Alexander Mogilny
  3    7  4   3  1  1  0  0   4 CAN PIT  C 66  Mario Lemieux
  3    7  3   4  2  1  0  0  19 CAN CAL RW 14  Theoren Fleury
  3    7  2   5  1  0  0  0  12 CAN TOR  C 93  Doug Gilmour
  3    7  1   6  0  0  0  0   0 CAN DET  D 77  Paul Coffey
  3    7  1   6  0  0  0  0   0 USA BUF  C 16  Pat LaFontaine
  9    6  4   2  0  0  2  0   4 CAN NYI  C 20  Ray Ferraro
  9    6  3   3  0  0  1  0   2 RUS VAN RW 10  Pavel Bure
  9    6  3   3  1  0  1  0   0 RUS BUF LW 13  Yuri Khmylev
  9    6  3   3  1  0  1  0   6 CAN VAN RW 16  Trevor Linden
  9    6  2   4  1  0  0  0   2 CAN BUF  C 10  Dale Hawerchuk
  9    6  2   4  1  0  2  0   0 USA STL  C 15  Craig Janney
  9    6  2   4  2  0  0  0   6 CAN BOS  C 49 *Joe Juneau
  9    6  2   4  0  0  0  1   6 CAN CAL  C 25  Joe Nieuwendyk
  9    6  1   5  0  0  0  0   4 CAN STL  D 21  Jeff Brown
  9    6  1   5  0  0  1  0   4 CAN PIT  C 10  Ron Francis

Top 10 Goal Scorers
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  1    7  6   1  2  0  0  0   6 RUS BUF RW 89  Alexander Mogilny
  2    8  5   3  4  0  2  0   0 USA STL RW 16  Brett Hull
  2    5  5   0  3  0  1  0  14 CAN WAS  C 32  Dale Hunter
  4    7  4   3  1  1  0  0   4 CAN PIT  C 66  Mario Lemieux
  4    6  4   2  0  0  2  0   4 CAN NYI  C 20  Ray Ferraro
  4    5  4   1  0  0  1  0   6 CAN TOR LW 14  Dave Andreychuk
  4    5  4   1  1  0  0  0   4 CAN BOS RW  8  Cam Neely
  4    4  4   0  2  0  0  0   2 USA LA   C 12  Jimmy Carson
  4    4  4   0  0  0  2  0   0 USA QUE RW 48  Scott Young

Top 10 Assist Scorers
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  1    9  0   9  0  0  0  0   4 CAN BOS  C 12  Adam Oates
  2    7  1   6  0  0  0  0   0 CAN DET  D 77  Paul Coffey
  2    7  1   6  0  0  0  0   0 USA BUF  C 16  Pat LaFontaine
  4    7  2   5  1  0  0  0  12 CAN TOR  C 93  Doug Gilmour
  4    6  1   5  0  0  0  0   4 CAN STL  D 21  Jeff Brown
  4    6  1   5  0  0  1  0   4 CAN PIT  C 10  Ron Francis
  4    5  0   5  0  0  0  0   0 USA WIN  D  6  Phil Housley
  4    5  0   5  0  0  0  0   4 SWE WAS  D  6  Calle Johansson
  4    5  0   5  0  0  0  0   8 CAN CAL  D  2  Al MacInnis

Top 10 Power-play Goal Scorers
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  1    8  5   3  4  0  2  0   0 USA STL RW 16  Brett Hull
  2    5  5   0  3  0  1  0  14 CAN WAS  C 32  Dale Hunter
  3    7  3   4  2  1  0  0  19 CAN CAL RW 14  Theoren Fleury
  3    7  6   1  2  0  0  0   6 RUS BUF RW 89  Alexander Mogilny
  3    6  2   4  2  0  0  0   6 CAN BOS  C 49 *Joe Juneau
  3    5  2   3  2  0  0  0   6 CAN STL LW 19  Brendan Shanahan
  3    4  4   0  2  0  0  0   2 USA LA   C 12  Jimmy Carson
  3    4  2   2  2  0  0  0   2 TCH CAL  C 26  Robert Reichel
  3    4  3   1  2  0  1  0   2 FIN WIN RW 13 *Teemu Selanne
  3    3  2   1  2  0  1  0   6 CAN MON LW 25  Vincent Damphousse

All the Short-handed Goal Scorers
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  1    7  3   4  2  1  0  0  19 CAN CAL RW 14  Theoren Fleury
  1    7  4   3  1  1  0  0   4 CAN PIT  C 66  Mario Lemieux
  1    4  3   1  0  1  1  0   4 USA CAL  C 29  Joel Otto
  1    4  2   2  0  1  0  0   6 USA CAL  D 20  Gary Suter
  1    3  2   1  1  1  0  0  23 RUS DET  C 91  Sergei Fedorov
  1    2  1   1  0  1  0  0  10 CAN BOS  C 19  Dave Poulin
  1    1  1   0  0  1  0  0   4 CAN WIN  C 38  Luciano Borsato
  1    1  1   0  0  1  0  0   2 CAN DET LW 11  Shawn Burr
  1    1  1   0  0  1  0  0   2 CAN STL LW 10  Dave Lowry
  1    1  1   0  0  1  1  0   0 USA BUF RW 18  Wayne Presley

Top 10 Game-winning Goal Scorers
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  1    8  5   3  4  0  2  0   0 USA STL RW 16  Brett Hull
  1    6  4   2  0  0  2  0   4 CAN NYI  C 20  Ray Ferraro
  1    6  2   4  1  0  2  0   0 USA STL  C 15  Craig Janney
  1    4  4   0  0  0  2  0   0 USA QUE RW 48  Scott Young
  5    6  3   3  0  0  1  0   2 RUS VAN RW 10  Pavel Bure
  5    6  1   5  0  0  1  0   4 CAN PIT  C 10  Ron Francis
  5    6  3   3  1  0  1  0   0 RUS BUF LW 13  Yuri Khmylev
  5    6  3   3  1  0  1  0   6 CAN VAN RW 16  Trevor Linden
  5    5  4   1  0  0  1  0   6 CAN TOR LW 14  Dave Andreychuk
  5    5  5   0  3  0  1  0  14 CAN WAS  C 32  Dale Hunter

Top 5 Point Scoring Defensemen
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  3    7  1   6  0  0  0  0   0 CAN DET  D 77  Paul Coffey
  9    6  1   5  0  0  0  0   4 CAN STL  D 21  Jeff Brown
 19    5  0   5  0  0  0  0   0 USA WIN  D  6  Phil Housley
 19    5  0   5  0  0  0  0   4 SWE WAS  D  6  Calle Johansson
 19    5  0   5  0  0  0  0   8 CAN CAL  D  2  Al MacInnis

Top 4 Rookie Point Scorers
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  9    6  2   4  2  0  0  0   6 CAN BOS  C 49 *Joe Juneau
 33    4  3   1  0  0  1  0   8 USA PIT  C 15 *Shawn McEachern
 33    4  3   1  2  0  1  0   2 FIN WIN RW 13 *Teemu Selanne
 33    4  0   4  0  0  0  0   2 TCH BUF  D 42 *Richard Smehlik

Top 5 Penalty Minute Leaders
Rnk  Pts  G   A PG SG GW EN PIM Cty Tm  Ps  #  Player
---  --- -- --- -- -- -- -- --- --- --- -- --  ------
  1    1  0   1  0  0  0  0  26 CAN DET LW 55  Keith Primeau
  2    3  2   1  1  1  0  0  23 RUS DET  C 91  Sergei Fedorov
  3    0  0   0  0  0  0  0  22 CAN NYI  D 47  Richard Pilon
  4    2  1   1  0  0  0  0  21 CAN TOR RW 12  Rob Pearson
  4    1  1   0  0  0  0  0  21 CAN WIN RW 20  Tie Domi

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54510
From: hunter@nsslsun.nssl.uoknor.edu (Steve Hunter)
Subject: Minnesota Shame?

I'm a hockey fan from way back, and maintain an interest as best I can
here in the hockey hinterlands (Oklahoma).  I'm hoping I can get a
reading from some of you about the move of the North Stars to Dallas.

I've been under the impression that Minnesota was one of, or possibly,
THE hockey state in the U.S.  So why is the team moving to a city in
Texas?  Is it that the owner is a greedy, self-serving profiteer, or
were the Stars really not making a profit?  Or was the city or whoever
owned the arena doing some price gouging?

As much as I'd like to see the NHL only a 3 hour drive from me, I
can't help but feel for the people in Minnesota, unless they truly
didn't support the team.  

Opinions, please.

Steve Hunter
National Weather Service
NEXRAD radar group
Norman, OK



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54511
From: jca2@cec1.wustl.edu (Joseph Charles Achkar)
Subject: BLUES: Playoff stats through first round

BLUES PLAYOFF SCORING THROUGH END OF NORRIS SEMIFINALS 
------------------------------------------------------

PS #   NAME                GP   G   A  Pts.   +/-  PIM  PP  SH  GW  EN
-- --  ----                --  --  --  ----   ---  ---  --  --  --  --
RW 16  Brett Hull           4   5   3    8    +2    0   4   0   2   0
 C 15  Craig Janney         4   2   4    6    +1    0   1   0   2   0
 D 21  Jeff Brown           4   1   5    6    +1    4   0   0   0   0
LW 19  Brendan Shanahan     4   2   3    5     0    6   2   0   0   0 
 C  7  Nelson Emerson       4   1   2    3    +1    2   0   0   0   0
RW  9 *Denny Felsner        4   1   1    2    +2    2   0   0   0   0 
LW 10  Dave Lowry           4   1   0    1    +2    2   0   1   0   0
LW 17  Basil McRae          4   0   1    1    +1    2   0   0   0   0
LW 14  Kevin Miller         4   0   1    1    -1    2   0   0   0   0
RW 23  Rich Sutter          4   0   0    0     0    2   0   0   0   0
 C 28  Bob Bassen           4   0   0    0    -1    6   0   0   0   0
LW 36 *Philippe Bozon       4   0   0    0     0    0   0   0   0   0
 C 18  Ron Wilson           4   0   0    0    -2    4   0   0   0   0
 D  5  Garth Butcher        4   0   0    0    +1    2   0   0   0   0
 D 33  Stephane Quintal     4   0   0    0    +1    0   0   0   0   0
 D 44 *Bret Hedican         4   0   0    0     0    8   0   0   0   0
 D 34  Murray Baron         4   0   0    0    -1    8   0   0   0   0
 D  4  Rick Zombo           4   0   0    0    -1    10  0   0   0   0
 G 31  Curtis Joseph        4   0   0    0     0    0   0   0   0   0
 D  6  Doug Crossman        0   0   0    0     0    0   0   0   0   0
 C 22  Ron Sutter           0   0   0    0     0    0   0   0   0   0
RW 38 *Igor Korolev         0   0   0    0     0    0   0   0   0   0
RW 39  Kelly Chase          0   0   0    0     0    0   0   0   0   0
 D  2  Curt Giles           0   0   0    0     0    0   0   0   0   0
 G 29 *Guy Hebert           0   0   0    0     0    0   0   0   0   0

*  Rookie

GOALTENDING
-----------
                   GP  Min.   GA    Avg.   W   L   EN  SO  SA  SAVE%
31  Curtis Joseph   4  251     6    1.43   4   0    0  2   140 .957 
29 *Guy Hebert      0   00     0    0.00   0   0    0  0   00   --- 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Team Totals        4  251     6    1.43   4   0    0  2   140 .957 

SO -- Shutouts ; SA -- Shots Against.

Goals                 13        6 
1st Period            4         1 
2nd Period            3         4 
3rd Period            5         1 
Overtime              1         0 
Power-play goals      7/29      1/24 
Short-handed goals    1         0 
Empty-net goals       0         0 
Shots                 97        140 

  %*%*%*%**%*%%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*
  *   __  ______________         ____________________________________    % 
  %   \ \_)____________/         A L L E Z   L E S   B L U E S  ! ! !    * 
  *    \    __________/          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~    % 
  %     \    ________/                                                   *
  *      \   _______/                  Joe Ashkar                        % 
  %       \  \                         Contact for the Blues             *
  *        \  \  SAINT LOUIS           jca2@cec1.wustl.edu               % 
  %        (___)             BLUES                                       * 
  *%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*%*% 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54512
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: WC 93: Results, April 25


 1993 World Championships in Germany:
 ====================================

 Group A results:

 SWEDEN - SWITZERLAND  4-6 (0-3,3-1,1-2)

 1st: SWI 0-1 Manuele Celio 1                                         3:21
      SWI 0-2 Patrick Howald 1                                       11:37
      SWI 0-3 Patrick Howald 2   (Sven Leuenberger)                  16:00
 2nd: SWE 1-3 Peter Andersson 1  (Michael Nylander)                   2:47 (pp)
      SWI 1-4 Roman Waeger 1     (Martin Rauch,Sven Leuenberger)      8:53 (pp)
      SWE 2-4 Jonas Bergqvist 3  (Markus Naslund)                     9:08
      SWE 3-4 Jan Larsson 1      (Patrik Juhlin)                     18:50
 3rd: SWE 4-4 Mikael Renberg 2   (Thomas Rundqvist,Peter Andersson)   7:49
      SWI 4-5 Roman Waeger 2                                          9:07
      SWI 4-6 Felix Hollenstein 1 (Sven Leuenberger,Thomas Vrabec)   11:29

              Shots on goal:   Penalties:   Attendance:   Referee:
 Sweden        5 20 18 - 43    4*2min       6,000         Rob Hearn, USA
 Switzerland  10  6  7 - 23    5*2min

 Switzerland beat Sweden in a WC for the first time since 1950, and the Swiss
 now have a small chance of reaching the quarterfinals (if Austria beats
 Italy tonight).

 The Swiss took the lead after Hakan Ahlund made an incredibly stupid drop
 pass at his own blue line, and Celio came in alone with Soderstrom and beat
 Tommy to the stick side. The Swedes continued to make mistakes as Howald
 was allowed to skate in between the Swedish D and put the puck past Tommy
 to make it 0-2. 0-3 was a nice one, Howald entered the Swedish zone, slammed
 on the breaks, and his shot went in by Tommy's far post. One of the lousiest
 periods I've seen Sweden play this year.
 Second period saw a new Swedish team, and the Swiss had to ice the puck many
 times. On a pp, Nylander skated in from the boards, Pavoni made the initial
 save, but Peter Andersson scored on the rebound.  Then a power play goal
 from the Swiss, a slap shot from the blue line hit two players on the way
 to the goal and past Soderstrom also. Jonas Bergqvist made it 2-4 after a
 nice pass from Naslund behind the goal. Jan Larsson reduced the lead to 3-4
 just before the end of 2nd period, on a pp skated in unattacked in front of
 the goal, and put the puck through Pavoni's 5-hole. 
 Third period, Sweden equalized on a slap shot from Renberg that trickled
 through Pavoni's 5-hole. Then, another defensive mistake by the Swedes,
 Waeger was allowed to skate around the Swedish goal unattacked and from close
 range could make it 4-5. Hollenstein then scored 4-6 on a 2-on-1 break away,
 and put it top shelf with no chance for Soderstrom.

 Switzerland:

 Goaltender:  20 Reto Pavoni  (28 Renatio Tosio)
 Defense:     26 Rick Tschumi, 2 Martin Steinegger
              16 Sven Leuenberger, 5 Martin Rauch
               7 Sandro Bertaggia, 17 Patrick Sutter
              31 Samuel Balmer
 Forwards:    22 Alfred Luthi, 11 Felix Hollenstein, 25 Roman Waeger
              23 Gil Montandon, 12 Roberto Triulzi, 10 Patrick Howald
              35 Christian Weber, 18 Andreas Ton, 24 Joerg Eberle
              15 Bruno Erni, 13 Thomas Vrabec, 29 Manuele Celio
 
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

 RUSSIA - CANADA  1-3 (0-2,1-1,0-0)

 1st: CAN 0-1 Kevin Dineen 1     (Garry Galley)                       4:28
      CAN 0-2 Paul Kariya 2      (Eric Lindros)                      12:20 (pp)
 2nd: CAN 0-3 Eric Lindros 10    (Paul Kariya,Shayne Corson)          9:40
      RUS 1-3 Valeri Karpov 2    (?)                                 16:24
 3rd:

 Penalties: RUS 2*2min 1*5min, CAN 5*2min
 Referee: Anton Danko, Czech republic
 Attendance: 8,600

 Russia probably made their best game of the tourney, but yet there wasn't
 enough to win against the effective Canadians.

 Galley took a slap shot that found Dineen by the far post, and Dineen just
 deflected the puck past Trefilov in the Russian goal. Then a power play
 goal, after a couple of deflections Eric Lindros found Kariya alone by the
 far post, and Kariya put the puck high over a sliding Trefilov.
 Russia won the shots in the first period 12-5, and they had the most of
 the scoring opportunities, but they just couldn't score.
 Second period saw Lindros scoring his 10th (!!) goal of the WC. Kariya
 entered the Russian zone, slammed on the break to get past his defenseman,
 then made a nice pass to Corson who just got the stick on the puck to
 deflect it to Lindros who one-timed the puck.
 The Russians then finally got their goal, Karpov broke in from the side
 and made a slap shot in Tugnutt's top right hand corner.
 
 Player of the game in Canada was voted Paul Kariya, and for Russia Valeri
 Karpov. I agree, the difference in this game was Lindros and Kariya, and
 in part also Tugnutt. Kariya had a far better game now than vs the Swedes,
 and he was very impressive. Kariya got the place in the line with Lindros
 after Mike Gartner went out with a rib-injury early in the first period.

 Lindros, BTW, lead the point scoring with 14 pts (9+5) before this game,
 7 pts ahead of the next player! i.e. double as much as the next player
 (among those Kariya with 1+6). Amazing!

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Group B results:

 FINLAND - CZECH REPUBLIC  1-3 (0-0,1-1,0-2)

 1st:
 2nd: CZE 0-1  Petr Hrbek 2           11:04
      FIN 1-1  Mika Alatalo 1         17:51
 3rd: CZE 1-2  Jiri Dolezal 3          5:04
      CZE 1-3  Martin Hostak 2        19:45 (en)

 Penalties: FIN 8*2min, CZE 9*2min
 Referee: Vincent Moreno, Switzerland
 Attendance: 4,300

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

 GERMANY - USA  6-3 (5-0,0-0,1-3)

 1st: GER 1-0  Raimond Hilger 2        7:12
      GER 2-0  Gerd Truntschka 3      11:16
      GER 3-0  Ernst Kopf 3           11:55
      GER 4-0  Michael Rumrich 3      16:06
      GER 5-0  Benoit Doucet 1        18:45
 2nd:
 3rd: USA 5-1  Derek Plante 1          4:06
      GER 6-1  Dieter Hegen 5          6:57
      USA 6-2  Craig Johnson 1         7:30
      USA 6-3  Rob Gaudreau 3         13:07

 Penalties: GER 7*2min, USA 10*2min
 Referee: Valeri Bokarev, Russia
 Attendance: 11,000

--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54513
From: bks2@cbnewsi.cb.att.com (bryan.k.strouse)
Subject: NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR GAMES PLAYED 4-21-93



NHL PLAYOFF RESULTS FOR 4/21/93.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                  CONFERENCE SEMI-FINALS        BEST OF SEVEN
      PATRICK              ADAMS              NORRIS              SMYTHE
 
 NJ                  BUF   (leads 2-0)   STL   (leads 2-0)   WIN               
 PIT   (leads 2-0)   BOS                 CHI                 VAN   (leads 2-0)

 NYI   (tied  1-1)   MON                 TOR                 LA    (tied  1-1) 
 WAS                 QUE   (leads 2-0)   DET   (leads 2-0)   CAL              

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Toronto Maple Leafs                       0   1   1   -   2
Detroit Red Wings    (leads series 2-0)   1   3   2   -   6

1st period: DET, Lidstrom 1 - (Yzerman, Coffey) (pp) 4:06

2nd period: DET, Fedorov 1 - (sh) 0:43
	    DET, Yzerman 2 - (Coffey, Chiasson) (pp) 8:06
	    DET, Yzerman 3 - (Coffey, Sheppard) 17:40
	    TOR, Mironov 1 - (Gill, Gilmour) 19:10

3rd period: TOR, Gilmour 2 - (Anderson) 4:32
	    DET, Ysebaert 1 - (Kozlov) 5:51
	    DET, Drake 1 - (Kozlov, Kennedy) 18:33

Powerplay Opportunities-Maple Leafs 1 of 8
			Red Wings   2 of 7

Shots on Goal-	Maple Leafs  10   7  13  -  30
		Red Wings    16  11   3  -  30

Toronto Maple Leafs--Potvin (0-2) (30 shots - 24 saves)
Detroit Red Wings--Cheveldae (2-0) (30 shots - 28 saves)

ATT-19,875

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

St. Louis Blues     (leads series 2-0)   2   0   0   -   2
Chicago BlackHawks                       0   0   0   -   0

1st period: STL, Hull 2 - (Brown, Janney) (pp) 7:38
	    STL, Lowry 1 - (sh) 13:53

2nd period: NONE

3rd period: NONE

Powerplay Opportunities-Blues      1 of 5
			BlackHawks 0 of 6

Shots on Goal-	Blues        9   3   5  -  17
		BlackHawks  16  19  12  -  47

St. Louis Blues--Joseph (2-0) (47 shots - 45 saves)
Chicago BlackHawks--Belfour (0-2) (17 shots - 15 saves)

ATT-17,339

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Los Angeles Kings  (series tied 1-1)   1   0   3   -   4
Calgary Flames                         0   5   4   -   9

1st period: LAK, Carson 3 - 1:11

2nd period: CAL, Otto 1 - (Roberts, MacInnis) 5:02
	    CAL, Yawney 2 - (Dahlquist, Ranheim) 8:02
	    CAL, Reichel 1 - (Fleury) (pp) 10:52
	    CAL, Nieuwendyk 1 - (Roberts, Musil) 13:47
	    CAL, Otto 2 - (Dahl) (sh) 19:37

3rd period: LAK, Carson 4 - (Granato, Shuchuk) 5:34
	    CAL, Reichel 2 - (Fleury, MacInnis) (pp) 7:23
	    CAL, Paslawski 1 - (Roberts, Nieuwendyk) 8:14
	    CAL, Fleury 1 - (MacInnis, Nieuwendyk) (pp) 10:37
	    LAK, Rychel 1 - (Blake) 11:56
	    LAK, Kurri 1 - (Gretzky, Zhitnik) (pp) 15:22
	    CAL, Suter 2 - (Skrudland, Berube) 19:15

Powerplay Opportunities-Kings  1 of 7
			Flames 3 of 6

SHots on Goal-	Kings   14   8   9  -  31
		Flames   9  16  15  -  40

Los Angeles Kings--Hrudey (1-1) (40 shots - 31 saves)
Calgary Flames--Vernon (1-1) (31 shots - 27 saves)

ATT-19,477

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Winnipeg Jets                           0   1   1   -   2
Vancouver Canucks  (leads series 2-0)   1   1   1   -   3

1st period: VAN, Ronning 2 - (Courtnall, Linden) 11:37

2nd period: VAN, Courtnall 1 -  6:05
	    WIN, Domi 1 - (King, Barnes) 6:48

3rd period: WIN, Numminen 1 - (Housley, Selanne) (pp) 0:30
	    VAN, Bure 1 - (Adams, Craven) 4:01

Powerplay Opportunities-Jets    1 of 4
			Canucks 0 of 3

Shots on Goal-	Jets      6  10   6  -  22
		Canucks  14   9   9  -  32

Winnipeg Jets--Essensa (0-2) (32 shots - 29 saves)
Vancouver Canucks--McLean (2-0) (22 shots - 20 saves)

ATT-15,729

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


\|||||/
-SPIKE-




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54514
From: ketolain@messi.uku.fi (Jarkko Ketolainen)
Subject: question/goalie's equipment

Have the rules for goalies' equipment changed? It seems that e.g. glove
has become bigger and bigger all the time (and pads too), and the goalies are
wearing "over size" jerseys. Am I dreaming? If you watch old photos or
films let say about ten years back, I think the difference is quite obvious.
Who is an expert on this, please let me know. (Or have the goalies become
bigger?)

Jarkko #14 (trouble in scoring?)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54515
From: stompkin@tuba.calpoly.edu (The Edge)
Subject: Re: KINGS EVEN SERIES AT 2. STAUER SHINES!!

In article <1rfbldINN1qe@abyss.West.Sun.COM> dvb@ick (David Van Beveren) writes:
>
>vzhivov@superior.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov) writes:
>[Game 3 report deleted]
>:it (bad ref'ing) won't affect this
>: series, which should only go two more games, all things being equal.
>
>Wrong.
>
>The Kings just put on an exibition of hustle, team play and consistent 
>pounding and took it back to Calgary with the series tied at 2 games each.
>The final score was 3-1, with the third goal an empty-netter at 19:54 of
>the third (Conacher).
>
>This is not an official game report, just my observations from the stands.
>
>1. Melrose made a wise decision and put Stauber back in goal. Robb had
>   something to prove, and he did in stopping 28 of 29 while facing a 
>   fierce Calgary attack. There were numerous 'highlight film' saves.
>
>2. Kings third and fourth lines rose to the occasion, playing rough while
>   avoiding bad penalties. Warren Rychel scored the game-winner early in the
>   second period. (Rookie defenseman Alexi Zhitnik scored the first from the 
>   blue line late in the first.)
>
>
>3. Dave Taylor is awesome. He suffered a broken nose partway through the
>   second pariod, checked from behind into the boards by Roberts, who got
>   5 and a game. He came back late in the third, and was on the ice when
>   Conacher scored the empty netter. 

Actually it was in the third period, his return did bring a spark to the
crowd, and to the players, who played awesome defense in the third.

>
>4. The Kings go-to guys still are not producing. No goals from Kurri, Granato,
>   Sandstrom or Robitaille, who have a total of 10 points between them. 

You forgot about Gretzky.  If any of these guys start scoring, the Kings
will be unstoppable, if they continue the great defensive work as well.

>
>5. McCreary sucks. He called McSorely for high sticking someone who was already
>   on the ice, and Sandstrom for high sticking when he himself was already on
>   the ice. He missed many flagrant stick penalties, including one from Flame
>   goalie Jeff Reese who followed Granato out to almost the blue line where he
>   cross-checked him. He called the game very inconsistently, with a series of
>   ticky-tack penalties in the first and almost none in the third. Can't the
>   NHL supply decent officiating?
>
>6. I was sitting directly across the ice from Ron and Nancy Reagan. When the
>   empty netter was scored, Nancy leapt out of her seat with both fists high
>   in the air. Way to go Nancy!
>
>
>This series is still too close to call. Tuesday's game may be the deciding
>one. I expect King might put Vernon back in, even though Reese had two good
>games in LA. Reese has historically been good in LA. This was only the second
>time he lost there. This move would be good for the Kings, since Vernon is 
>such a sieve. I am sure that Stauber will get the call for the Kings.

Stauber will be in net on Tuesday.  Hopefully he will provide another
stellar performance and earn the name Robb "Stopper" Stauber.

>
>The firswt two lines of the Kings have to wake up. While it is great to see,
>you cannot depend on Pat Conacher and Warren Rychel for all of your offense.
>I expect Sandstrom, Granato and Gretzky might be put back together on a line
>like they were early in the season. This would leave Kurri, Carson and Luc
>as the second. On paper, these two lines look powerful. Let's see if they
>can make it real.

I believe this is how they are...I know it is Gretzky and Sandstrom, but he
has been putting a number of people on left.  Also the Carson, Robataille
Kurri line once ignited, will light the fire of the other lines.
(Hopefully!)
>
>GO KINGS!
>
>dvb
>
>
>

It is evident that the scoring drought is getting to Luc, after his slight
breakaway in the third (I think) he was steamed on the bench, this emotion
might help him break his streak.  Also, I have noticed Blake has had a few
really good chances to score, but has fanned, or shot wide.  Is the injury
still affecting him?  


The E
    D
    G
    E

stompkin@tuba.calpoly.edu


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54516
From: etxmarr@eos.ericsson.se (Marek Repinski)
Subject: Re: Ettans nya indelning

In article <1993Apr22.134632.23686@eua.ericsson.se>, euaaen@eua.ericsson.se (Anders Engwall) writes:
(...)
|> Om jag f|rst}tt saken r{tt f}r vi:
|> 
|> NORRA - Kiruna, Boden, Pite}, Skellefte}, CRIF, V{nn{s,
|>         Husum, \stersund, Antj{rn, Sundsvall/Timr}
|> V[STRA - Mora, G{vle, Avesta, Uppsala, K|ping, Arvika,
|>          Grums, \rebro + tv} lag fr}n v{stra kvalserien (vilka?)
|> \STRA - Arlanda, V{sby, Vallentuna, \ster}ker, Danderyd/T{by,
|>         AIK, Hammarby, S|dert{lje, T{lje, Huddinge,
|>         Nyk|ping, Roma
|> S\DRA - Vita H{sten, M|lndal, Bor}s, V{stervik, Hanhals,
|>         Troja/Ljungby, M|rrum, Pantern + tv} lag fr}n
|>         s|dra kvalserien 
(...)
|> F|r det f|rsta {r det principiellt fel att man har {ndrat
|> premisserna f|r uppflyttning i efterhand. F|r det andra kan
|> man ju undra varf|r just \stersund och V{stervik skall f} en fri-
|> sl{ng. Ja, i fallet \stersund {r det solklart en fix f|r
|> ovan n{mnda problem med norrgruppen, men V{stervik? [r det
|> m}nne f|r att Nyk|ping skall slippa spela i s|der, vilket
|> de klagat |ver? Vad tror ni man s{ger i exempelvis Tierp, som
|> kom 3:a i |stra kvalet?
|> 
|> Kommentarer?

Att man skulle bli tvyngen att {ndra premisserna kunde man inte lista
ut p} f|rhand. Huvudsak att man inte flyttar *ner* fel lag.
\stersund var en solklar fix som sagt, men V{stervik!! Att det beror p}
Nyk|ping tror jag inte p}, man kunde ju lika g{rna "flytta ner" Roma
till s|dra (iaf om man g}r efter bredgraderna). Mest r{ttvist vore att
l}ta Tierp och V{stervik g|ra upp, men d} skulle Roma/Nyk|pinks vara
eller inte vara i |stra ocks} avg|ras. Vad skulle de s{ga om det?
Det st|rsta felet med }rets indelning {r *exakt* samma som f|rra }ret,
fast v{rre. DET [R INTE R[TVIST INDELAT, sportligt sett. Vallentuna var
en match fr}n att g} upp till Allsvenskan f|rra }ret ist{llet gick 
G{vle upp. Tror ni n}n av dem lyckas lika bra i }r?
AIK, HIF, SSK och HIK ska sl}ss om tv} platser!! Om man hadde placerat
dessa i var sin division skulle de vara sj{lvklara favoriter till en
plats i Allsvenskan, men nu m}ste tv} ge vika. Var finns r{ttvisan i det?
:-( Jag har h|rt att HIK har l{mnat in en protest till f|rbundet ang{ende
indelningen i |stra.
Mitt f|rslag vore att l}ta 3:orna i varje division kvalspela om tv}
platser i Allsvenskan och efter jul skulle man kunna sl} ihop de fyra
divisionerna till tv}, en s|der och en norr. P} s} s{tt bestraffas inte
ett lag som kommer fr}n en trakt d}r det finns m{nga bra lag.

En kul grej som jag |nskar att man inf|rde {r att l}ta vinnaren i
Allsvenskan f} spela i SM-slutspelet. Det skulle bli en extra krydda till
division ett ishockeyn om lagen k{nde att de var "inom r{ckh}ll" till
SM-bucklan. Det skulle kanske p} sikt ocks} kunna minska skillnaderna
mellan lag i elitserien och division ett. Vad s{js?

|> -- 
|> Anders Engwall				Email: Anders.Engwall@eua.ericsson.se
|> ELLEMTEL Utvecklings AB			Voice: +46 8 727 3893
|> lvsj, Sweden				Fax: +46 8 727 42 20
|> "Hll dom, som brygger puns ock ger pyanlektionor." -- C.A. Tolln, 1899

-- 


/Marek


-------------------------------------------------------------------
Marek.Repinski@eos.ericsson.se | "Man skall inte anv{nda fr{mmande      
     Ericsson Telecom AB       |  ord om man har en adekvat inhemsk
   System Design Division      |  vokabul{r disponibel"
        - Sweden -             |    Gunnar Emanuel Str{ng (1906-92)

Gur pbbxvr jnf va Fjrqvfu, vg jbag uryc jvgu EBG-13

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54517
From: catcher@netcom.com (Paul W. Francisco)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER (***QUITE LONG***)

In article <1993Apr26.002033.22710@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>In <1993Apr25.224654.23092@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> phoenix@startide.ctr.columbia.edu (Ali Lemer) writes:
>>I'm not even going to bother to reply to your ranting post; the letter is 
>>addressed to Gary Bettman, not you. He can reply as he wishes.
>
>Not so.  Your post is addressed to all.  I quote:

As she said, the letter is addressed to Bettman.  The post (which, though
having pretty much the same content, is an entirely different entity) was
addressed to all.  When she puts the letter in the mail I doubt it will
say "To: All".  I figure she wanted to let people here see what was in it
since it is a topic that interests a lot of folks here.  That's an entirely 
different purpose than sending the letter to Bettman.

Unfortunately...

>And I guess I let you know didn't I?

>You do NOT represent a *large* body of hockey fans by any standard you care
>to use to define "large".  65 people constitutes nothing more than a tiny 
>group of fanatics and is in no way representative of "a large body of hockey
>fans on the Internet" let alone of "one of the largest computer networks in 
>the world." 

The "largest computer networks in the world" phrase is a definition of 
the Internet, not a group as a whole that she claims to represent.  As
for the business of whether or not it is large, it is large compared
to say, the number of folks on r.s.h. who are sending a letter to thank
him for changing the names, at least to this point.  And just for my
own curiosity I thought I'd look up the "official" definition of large
in the dictionary.  It reads:

large - 1.  having more than usual power, capacity, or scope.    
        2.  exceeding most other things of like kind in quantity or size.

Now I have no idea how many letters Bettman may have gotten on the issue
or how many people may have signed them.  65 people may be up there, 
thereby validating definition 2.  I would also wager that the geographical
range of signatures is quite large, which would give it a large scope.

>He might be impressed by the size of the list of names.

Why would he be impressed with this unless it were "large"? 

I am of course assuming that you actually agree with what you are writing
and are not simply trying to be a pain about the whole issue to hear
yourself speak.  

I personally don't know whether or not I agree with the letter.  I have
very mixed emotions about it.  I like the names as they are, and don't
think they make it that difficult to learn the game, but there might be
a shred of validity to the change.  

-- 
Paul W. Francisco        	    In the shadow an angel cries...
catcher@netcom.com                      - Front Line Assembly

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54518
From: catcher@netcom.com (Paul W. Francisco)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER & Roger's Response

Again I assume this is not just flame bait by Roger, but actually a
truly held opinion.  

In article <1993Apr26.004705.24794@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>I would say that the letter clearly implies representation of the views of
>a group that I belong to.  And I don't share those views.  And I don't
>believe that the majority of posters on r.s.hockey share those views. 
>And so I have no intention of allowing them to simply "go ahead" without
>making my feelings on the subject clear.

Thanks.  For speaking for all those who didn't feel it was important
enough to say something themselves.  

I wouldn't say that the letter clearly implies representation of the
views of a group that you belong to.  It represents a subset (that you
don't belong to) of a larger group (which you do, if only because this
isn't a moderated group).

Look, there are several ways to state an opposing viewpoint.  Three
that come to mind are as follows:

1) Say it subtly.  Result: it may not be clear.
2) Say it directly yet politely.  Result: probably it will spark some 
   interesting conversation.
3) Say it directly and obnoxiously.  Result: validity goes right out
   the window.

>I would agree that unwarranted use of said term is entirely immature.

You realize that anything you say can, and most certainly will, be
used against you.

-- 
Paul W. Francisco        	    In the shadow an angel cries...
catcher@netcom.com                      - Front Line Assembly

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54519
From: bbeagan@cmsa.gmr.com (Brian D. Beagan)
Subject: Re: Wings; Ogrodnick


In article QfpfQaK00Vot4BpEdD@andrew.cmu.edu, Mike Molloy <mmaq+@andrew.cmu.edu> () writes:
>I haven't seen any mention of Ogrodnick yet in the box scores.
>
>Does anyone know if he's playing?
>
>Mike


He's been out, but he isn't injured.  He played well when he was put into the lineup at the end of the season - Murray has to sit somebody out, though.  If the Red Wings hadn't played as well as they did in the first game, he may have been in the second.  Why should Murray juggle players when the Wings are dominating Toronto like they are?

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54520
Subject: Re: SHARKS REVIEW Part 5: Left Wings
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <1r4jsk$24v@apple.com>, chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach) writes:
> paul@fugu.Data-IO.COM (Paul Brownlow) writes:
> 
>>Wood played most of his junior career in Seattle.  He was one
>>of the leading scorers on a mediocre team when he was traded away in
>>1992.  He rarely lost a fight and was one of the toughest players in
>>the WHL.
> 
> Wood is fairly small for an enforcer-type. I mean, Fleury does a pretty good
> job and isn't that large, but Dody is no Fleury. 

And Fleury is no enforcer. An agitator for sure, but Fleury never has and never
will have a fight, which seems to be what you're saying Wood is. 

The closest Fleury ever came to fighting was a game two years ago against
Los Angeles. There was a scrum and McSorley pinched Fleury's head under his
arm. Fleury dropped his gloves and gave McSorley a weak shot to the side of the
head. McSorely, knowing a good thing when he saw one, popped Fleury one right
between the eyes. End of fight. Fleury got ten stitches for his trouble.

The only player I can ever see Theo fighting is Cliff Ronning, and even then
he'd be giving up two inches and 10-15 pounds. :-)

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54521
Subject: Re: Don Cherry - help me out, here
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <1993Apr21.213100.17414@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca>, golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
> In article <1993Apr21.160212.9413@adobe.com> snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols) writes:
>>In article <1993Apr21.144033.15925@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:
>>>John Madden picks Gary Clark of the Redskins for his All-Madden team
>>>a lot, over much better receivers...for much the same reasons Cherry
>>>sings the praises of Doug Gilmour...a little guy with heart...yet one
>>>doesn't see a string of American posts saying that John Madden has
>>>lost his marbles.
>>
>>Maybe because John Madden doesn't pretend that his All-Madden team is the
>>team of the best players.  Maybe because John Madden doesn't feel the need
>>to denigrate players he doesn't choose for his All-Madden team.  Maybe
>>because Madden actually demonstrates some knowledge about football when he
>>broadcasts a game.
>>
> 
> Don Cherry doesn't denigrate players except those who dive, showboat,
> wield their sticks as weapons while hiding behind visors, or
> deliberating attempt to injure or aggravate the injuries of others.

Not always true. In fact, in the case of Doug Gilmour, he actually praises them.

Europeans that do those things are scum in Cherry's opinion. Canadian kids
that do them are "tough, just like a real Canadian". 

Ulf Samuelsson cheap shots Mark Messier's ribs and Don wants Ulf's head. Doug
Gilmour breaks Tomas Sandstrom's arm and Don says Sandstrom had it coming. 
Methinks Don is either very confused or just a bigot. Most likely the latter.

I used to like Don Cherry. I thought he was great. But I'm starting to see
his true colors (redneck) and the more I see of them, the more I think he's
just an asshole.

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54522
Subject: Makarov
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <1993Apr21.234022.2880@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU>, nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>  
> I *don't* think the Sharks should dig into the free agent market.  Most of
> the "good" free agents will require quite a bit of compensation, and set the
> Sharks back as far as player development goes; remember, the Sharks were
> unwilling to give up player(s) in addition to the $2 million they offered for
> Joe Murphy, and I think that's a good approach.  They tried to sign Sergei
> Makarov before this season because Makarov wouldn't have required compensation.

Matching the Makarov offer was the only real mistake Dave King has made this
year. I have to wonder about the intelligence of signing a 33-year old who
is obviously on the downside of his career to a 4-year $2 million contract. 
Risebrough matched the offer on King's request and Makarov has spent the last
quarter of the season in the press box because his work ethic just plain
stinks. Not to mention that he's lost a step and can no longer get himself
into position to make the nifty passes. 

I think Makarov will be available for free this offseason to anybody who agrees
to pay his contract. He's ineffective in Calgary, but he might be able to help
a team like San Jose, with their shortage of talent. If there's no takers, and
Makarov doesn't show improvement in training camp, I think the Flames will just
bite the bullet and buy out Makarov's contract and release him. With his
current attitude, he is a detriment to the team.

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54523
Subject: More Hart trophy stuff....
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <1r4bkvINN5nm@abyss.West.Sun.COM>, dvb@ick (David Van Beveren) writes:
>  
> When you think of the NHL, who comes to mind? Gilmour? Gretzky? Mario?
> .. ah... did I mention Mario? If you said Gretzky, you haven't really
> been following along, have you. If you said Gilmour, you are a true
> Maynard. 
> 
> I don't even think the selection of the HArt deserves serious discussion on
> this group. It is a no-brainer.

While I agree that Lemieux deserves the Hart, it is far from a "no-brainer". 
The Hart trophy goes to the player most valuable to his team, not to the best
player in the league. So your above arguement is really worthless. 

The Pens without Mario are still a damn good hockey team. The Leafs without 
Gilmour would have been fighting Tampa Bay for the 3rd pick. 

Like I said, Mario deserves it, IMHO. But it is a very close race and a 
Gilmour victory would not surprise me. I dislike Doug Gilmour with a passion, 
but I must concede that he is extremely valuable to the Leafs.

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54524
From: ballb@reis56.alleg.edu (Brett Ball)
Subject: Re: Ranger Fans?????

In article <1993Apr22.101356.1@eagle.wesleyan.edu>  writes:
> I for one am happy about the Ranger's hiring of Keenan.  It's too bad  
that they
> didn't hire him when Smith fired Nielsen, maybe he could of staightened  
out the
> babies on this team and made the playoffs.  What this team needs is a  
little
> fire under their butts!!
> 
> Reading through most of these hockey news I don't see many Ranger fans  
writing.   
> I'm new to this system and a big hockey fan and a long suffering(1940)  
Ranger
> fan.  But remember suffering builds character!!
> 
> I have some final questions about the way the team was handled in that  
last
> dreadful stretch.
> 
> 1. Knowing they needed offensive help from the blueline, why didn't we  
see Mike
> Hurlbut, who played pretty well when he was called up when Leetch first  
went
> down?
> 
> 2. Why????!!!!! is Joe Kocur playing every night?  He is not Bob Probert  
who is
> tough but also can play.
> 
> 3. How come Paul Broten is relegated to street clothes for the end of  
the
> season.  At least he plays with some heart and character, draws  
penalties and
> plays 110% when he's on the ice.  Was he in the doghouse for some  
reason?
> 
> 4. Joe Cirella?????!!!!  Enough said!
> 
> Ranger fans may be suffering but we're some of the most loyal, unlike  
Islander
> fans who only show up when the team wins.
> 
> As far as the Stanley Cup goes I think there's only one team that can  
test
> Pittsburgh and that's Detroit.  This would be the most entertaining and  
hard
> fought series.  Mario is amazing!
> 
> Kurt

I think Joe Kocus should play every night.   He is a big physical guy, and  
he gets the fans into the game with some big hits.  (both checks and  
fists)  Its a big advantage to get the crowd going.  Plus, he helps  
protect the other players.  Notice there are very few fights when Kocur is  
on the ice unless he is it.  I have seen people start to go after essa  
Tikkanen, only to go slinking away when Kocur steps in.  I think he is big  
asset, but should be third line, and special situation only play.
> 
> 
> 
> 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54525
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: Re: SHARKS REVIEW Part 7: the Trades

nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>
>Acquired:	C Marcus Thuresson, from N. Y. Islanders
>For:		RW Brian Mullen
>Grade:		I (B-/C+)
>
>It is not known yet what the impact, overall, of this trade would be, as
>Thuresson is not yet under contract to the Sharks, and does not appear to be
>ready to become so anytime soon.  Mullen, meanwhile, has had a productive
>(somewhat) season with the Islanders.  Thuresson, however, does not appear to
>be a big scorer at all; if my memory is right, he had just 2 points in just
>11 games in the Swedish elite league in '91-92.  This season, I didn't notice
>his name frequently at all in Staffan's reports, and he didn't make the
>national team either; it does not appear to be a good sign.

 Marcus Thuresson had 6 goals, 10 assists, 16 points and 22 PIM in 31 games
 this season for Leksand in the Swedish elite league. This was only 10th
 in point scoring for Leksand.

 Marcus (born May 31 1971, Ht 185 cm, Wt 85 kg) is relatively young so he
 might still start producing, but I think the Sharks may have done a bad
 trade here.

 Staffan

--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54526
From: galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin)
Subject: Re: And you think ESPN shafted you?

In article <16BB7BF12.RRHAMMER@vm.cmp.ilstu.edu> RRHAMMER@vm.cmp.ilstu.edu writes:
>Like many others I too was watching the Caps/Isles game when the went
>to the baseball game.  I too was pissed.  How could they interupt such
>an important game.  I understand about contracts, but you would think they
>would have a clause in the contract concerning important games!
>Anyway,  us BLUES (and Hawks) fans got shafted worse!  While everyone
>in the U.S. and watched the game on ABC.  However those of us who live in
>the central Illinois area were subjected to watching the Arthritus(?)
>Telethon.  The area that was most affected by the telecast did not get
>to see the game except through HAWK VISION.  This game, had it been
>televised, would have been the first home Hawks game shown in the area
>since 1980.  This television BULL*&%$ has got to stop.  We are not only
>being deprived of seeing games, due to skyrocketing ticket prices, but
>we are also being deprived of watching them on TV.
> PEACE,
> HAMMER
> 

I'm familiar with the telethon situation (an individual on CompuServe
was also victimized and was equally pissed).  That was a local
television station contract which could not be broken.  For that item,
I strongly suggest you call that affiliate and vent your anger on
them.  (Supposedly one station had told my friend that they have
received hundreds of angry calls which will translate into far less
incentive to pre-empt hockey telecasts in future.  The contract was
written when the pathetic WLAF was in that time slot.)

-Tom Galvin         galvint@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54527
From: galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin)
Subject: Re: ESPN f*ck up

In article <1428@wavefront.wti.com> matthew@wavefront.wti.com (Matt Coohill) writes:
>
>	Okay... here's some gripe"ing" (?griping?... whatever).
>
>	(I live in Santa Barbara... for reference... I think)
>
>	Okay, ABC showed the Kings/Flames... fine... YAWN.
>
>	ESPN (through a fortunate rainout of a baseball game) showed the
>  Red Wings/Toronto game... cool.
>
>	But I SWEAR that the advertisements all week long had said that
>  ESPN would show Pitt/NJ on Tuesday and Bos/Buff on Thursday.
>
>	I raced home from work early (4:30 Pacific) to catch the game, but
>  ALAS, it was the Boston/Buffalo game and then they promised that they would
>  show the Pitt/NJ game on Thursday.  OVERNIGHT they changed their mind.
>
>[rest deleted]

    ESPN never committed (and I never saw advertised) to a particular
Thursday game.  They had originally scheduled Bos-Buf, and that was
somehow leaked on this net, but to my knowledge ESPN never publicly
released a schedule until Monday when they announced Pitt-NJ Thursday
and Boston-Buffalo Saturday.

-Tom Galvin         galvint@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54528
From: galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin)
Subject: Re: ESPN

In article <randolin.3.735424986@polisci.umn.edu> randolin@polisci.umn.edu (Robert Andolina) writes:
>The thing that confuses me most about ESPN is that they decided to show the 
>Penguins and Devils again on Thursday night.  Being that both of the first 
>two games were dominated by Pitt., you would think that they would show a 
>different game.  This is in addition to the fact that they should show other 
>games just for the sake of fair exposure.

NESN owns the rights to Bruin telecasts.  I suspect that NESN was only
going to sell one telecast to ESPN (remember, ESPN only owns exclusive
rights to the FINALS, not the entire playoffs).  Since ESPN bought the
SCA contract, there are less wrangles to untie with showing the Devils
and Penguins.

>
>Also, some of you should know that (as far as I can tell) ESPN is not going 
>to show Campbell conference games regularly in the first two rounds.  I 
>believe that they are only going to show Campbell games in the first two 
>rounds as those series wear on (games 6 & 7, or perhaps games 5, 6, 7). 
>

I think the same broadcast rights factor comes into it.  Plus they
have no way of fitting western game times into their current schedule
unless the NHL was willing to make a western club move up their game.
I think the NHL got as much as it could when it shuffled the deck for ABC.

>Also, does anyone have info on ABC coverage for this Sunday (4/25)?
>
>

Same exact coverage as last week:  Pit-NJ game 4 in the east, Chi-StL
in the central, LA-Cgy in the mountains and west.

>
>Robert Andolina
>randolin@polisci.umn.edu
>

-Tom Galvin      galvint@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54529
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Subject: Re: Habs Late

In article <1993Apr21.165801.10243@newshub.ists.ca> dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra) writes:
>Vincent Damphousse has decided to take a vacation, apparently.  I have

My respect for the power of the hockey gods is preventing me from
commenting on the above, and for commenting on whether the guy
Damphousse was traded for is on vacation or not. Perhaps Roger
(demonstrably in contempt of the hockey gods and paying for it) dares a
comment or two?
-- 
Mike Eisler, mre@Eng.Sun.Com  ``Not only are they [Leafs] the best team, but
 their fans are even more intelligent and insightful than Pittsburgh's.  Their
 players are mighty bright, too.  I mean, he really *was* going to get his
 wallet back, right?'' Jan Brittenson 3/93, on Leaf/Pen woofers in
 rec.sport.hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54530
From: mre@teal.Eng.Sun.COM (Mike Eisler)
Subject: Re: LET'S GO BUFFALO!

In article <93111.205214RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
>In article <AfpIKNm00WBLI1isJ1@andrew.cmu.edu>, "William K. Willis"
><ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu> says:
>>
>>     You know, I never really appreciated them before!
>
>Looks like Bob Errey's ring really sparkles in that locker room, and everyone
>else wants one, too! :-)  Correct me if I'm wrong though, (just through

No, Fuhr's 5 rings out sparkle Errey's. And doesn't Bob have 2 rings?
-- 
Mike Eisler, mre@Eng.Sun.Com  ``Not only are they [Leafs] the best team, but
 their fans are even more intelligent and insightful than Pittsburgh's.  Their
 players are mighty bright, too.  I mean, he really *was* going to get his
 wallet back, right?'' Jan Brittenson 3/93, on Leaf/Pen woofers in
 rec.sport.hockey

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54531
From: bson@gnu.ai.mit.edu (Jan Brittenson)
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

In article <1r49s8$q8b@hsdndev.harvard.edu> nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219) writes:

 > Bruins have never come back to win after falling behind 2-0 in
 > their entire 68-year history.

   Which doesn't mean much since the statistics are mostly based on
the 5-game playoff format. But, yes, it looks dark for the B's. What a
disappointment.

   Still, I think the problem is mental. They needed the saves Blue
came up with, perhaps he can offer something to mentally rally around.

   Who do you think gets the start in game three? I hope it is going
to be Blue. If the team can rally around him, maybe Moog can too.

--
						-- Jan Brittenson
						   bson@gnu.ai.mit.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54532
From: jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM (Jason Cockroft)
Subject: Re: Pens fans reactions


>I'm really impressed with Bowman's coaching tactics - he's had an answer for
>every move that Brooks has thrown at the Pens.
>
>Susan Dart

Such as?

-jake. 


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54533
From: jbarrett@aludra.usc.edu (Jonathan Barrett)
Subject: Re: Flames Final: Kings Destroyed

vzhivov@superior.carleton.ca (Vladimir Zhivov) writes:

>Flames final score:

>Calgary 9 - L.A. 4

>Things are back to where they belong. Gretzky didn't play. Kelly
>Hrudey is his old self again. Let's hope the Flames put the old-timers
>away ASAP.

>- Vlad the Impaler

Yes, these last couple of months the Kinngs have failed to show up in about
one game in five. Presumably last night was that one game in five. 

Jon

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54534
From: gak@wrs.com (Richard Stueven)
Subject: SHARKS: Jack Feirerra (was Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!)

In article jgl@apple.com, chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach) writes:
>snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols) writes:
>
>>Of course, Ferreira had also traded a number of veterans with marginal
>>contributions before he was fired, so it's not clear that this would have
>>been different.  Besides, they *were* marginal contributors.
>
>Let's also NOT FORGET that Ferreira came *THIS* close to trading Kelly
>Kisio, which, if the rumors I've heard are true, was over the strong
>objections of other aspects of Shark management and probably had a lot to do
>with both his ouster and the three-headed, consensus oriented GM.
>
>Imagine, for a second, where the Sharks would be today if that fax machine
>hadn't jammed.

On the other hand, I'm hard pressed to think of any other real mistakes
Fereirra made.  Imagine indeed, but then again we have the benefit of
hindsight.

Let's say that in the view of the Sharks' upper management, the attempt
to trade Kisio was a major factor in the decision to fire Feirerra.
I'm inclined to take exactly the opposite view:  they should have kept
him...he's obviously the luckiest man in hockey!  (Wonder what
sacrifice he made to the Muse of Fax?  (His job, I guess.))

have fun
gak

---
Richard Stueven       AHA# 22584 |----------| He has erected a multitude of new
Internet:            gak@wrs.com |----GO----| offices, and sent hither swarms
ATTMAIL: ...!attmail!gakhaus!gak |---SHARX--| of officers to harass our people,
Cow Palace:            107/H/3-4 |----------| and eat out their substance.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54535
From: gp2011@andy.bgsu.edu (George Pavlic)
Subject: Re: Lemieux's Getting the Hart... Jeez I hope not!

In article <22APR93.02956996.0062@UNBVM1.CSD.UNB.CA>, Patrick Walker
<F1HH@UNB.CA> wrote:
> 
> Who should get the Hart?
> Gretzky, not in a million years.  At least not this year.
>   He hasn't played all year.
> Yzerman, though it would be nice, I don't think he'll get it, he's
>  consistent, but not well known.  (Thought he should be!)
> Mario.  Jesus NO!  It's bad enough for me just to utter the word
>  without being extremely sick and pissed off.  They guy's a luber
> I think he should become a stuntman after he retires.  Jeez, he ha
> s enough expericene falling down.  Oope!  Stick didn't come anywhe
> re near me, gotta fall, got to get a penalty against the other
> team!  It's the annual "whine-a-thon" with today's host, Jerry
> Lewis  By the way, I am Canadian, play a little, and watched
> Hockey night In Canada, (Never Missed a Show!), not one of these,
> Well, a, my home team is in the finals, and I was a hockey fan for
> ten minutes now... Give me a f--king break with this Mario is the
> best player ever.  What!  Did Gretzky die?  I wish Bobby Clarke
> and the Broadstreet Bullies were still around, they'd know what
> to do with a whouse like Mario!
> They'd bounce him around like the puck.
> Not that I condone violence, but I'll make an exception for Mario.
> But if Mario is going to complain about being hit, someone should
> give him and Scotty something REAL to complain about.
> Sorry to ramble.  As you can see I hate Mario.
> Pat Walker
> UNB

You, along with Mario Lemieux, must be from another planet.  The only
difference is that Lemieux comes from the one with Geo. Washington, Abe
Lincoln (and many other great men and women of this world) whereas you come
from the one with David Koresh.  Yeah, Mario is good at drawing penalties,
but wouldn't you try do something (you do claim to play) to give your team
an advantage?  I don't remember Lemieux getting any diving penalties this
year, whereas many others did.  Finally, Mario has NEVER complained about
being hit.  He knows it's part of the game; he gets back by dishing out an
even bigger hit to the same guy or just scoring a few goals (or setting
them up.)  Don't you have any compassion for a man who has gone through so
much in his life?

George

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54536
From: ummak027@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Anson Sen Sau Mak)
Subject: Re: #77's?

In article <1r23on$4p6@bigboote.WPI.EDU> ching@bigwpi.WPI.EDU ("The Logistician") writes:
>
>I am in need of all of the players wearing #77 in the NHL.  I know now only
>of one, Ray Borque for the Bruins.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.
>
>Thanx.
>
>-- 
>------------------------THE LOGISTICIAN REIGNS SUPREME!!!----------------------
>|									      |
>|   GO BLUE!!!   GO TIGERS!!!   GO PISTONS!!!   GO LIONS!!!   GO RED WINGS!!! |
>-------------------------------ching@wpi.wpi.edu-------------------------------

Pierre Turgeon of NYI, and Paul Coffey of Detorit are both #77. 

Hope this help.

Anson

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54537
From: Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Pens fans reactions


Terence Rokop writes:

>Richard J Coyle writes:
> 
>>That's not inner calm.  It's boredom, and it's being spoiled.  The Arena's
>>been as quiet as a church on many nights this year; too many of us just
>>take winning for granted.  It's been seemingly forever since the team
>>lost, and we've forgotten what it's like to feel real excitement and
>>surprise at victory.

>I don't really agree with this.  But it is an entirely different "high,"
>at any rate.  The first Cup the Pens won, I didn't think about anything
>else; I just watched Mario and all skate the thing around the ice.  Now
>it seems to be more of a question whether or not, thirty years from now,
>young hockey fans (may there be millions!) will still ask us what it was
>like to watch this team.  That's what they are playing for now.  But I
>was still as nervous as ever when the Devils were blasting shots at
>Barrasso in the final seconds of game three, so the fun is far from over
yet.

I'm not bored either.  Most people I know say that winning the second Cup
was better than the first but to me nothing will ever top that first one.
But I'm every bit as excited this year and I am experiencing that inner calm
to which Susan originally referred.  Inner calm is not boredom.

As far as the arena in general being boring, well Richard's got that right.
It's been that way all season.  I attribute it to a lot of new fans who
just don't have the same spirit and knowledge as long-time fans.  At
last Tuesday's game, I overheard a man express surprise that a
goaltender can get an
assist.

Anyone who follows sports with regularity knows that anything can happen
at any time.  I'm confident in the Pens but I'm also not stupid enough to
think for one minute that it's impossible for New Jersey to blow them out
of this series.  I doubt that will happen but it's possible.  Bored?  Uh-uh.
Spoiled?  Not in the least.  Forgot what excitement is like?  Living through
that amazing streak wasn't exciting?!  I don't take a darned thing for
granted.  God, look at Chicago...

And I see no problem with quietly savoring all of this anyway.  It isn't gonna
last forever and I intend to enjoy it while I can.  

Mom.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54538
From: gritter@cs.purdue.edu (Carl Gritter)
Subject: NHL ALLTIME SCORING LEADERS


Here are the NHL's alltime leaders in goals and points at the end of
the 1992-3 season. Again, much thanks to Joseph Achkar.

Carl

Notes: An active player is a player that has scored at least one
point the past season.  The points leaders follow the goal leaders.
If you find any mistakes, please send me email.
-------------------------------------------------------------------

All time NHL leading goal scorers (* denotes active player):

  1.  Gordie Howe          Det-Hfd                            801
  2. *Wayne Gretzky        Edm-LA                             765
  3.  Marcel Dionne        Det-LA-NYR                         731
  4.  Phil Esposito        Chi-Bos-NYR                        717
  5.  Bobby Hull           Chi-Wpg-Hfd                        610
  6. *Mike Gartner         Wsh-Min-NYR                        583
  7.  Mike Bossy           NYI                                573
  8.  Guy Lafleur          Mtl-NYR-Que                        560
  9.  Johnny Bucyk         Det-Bos                            556
 10.  Maurice Richard      Mtl                                544
 11.  Stan Mikita          Chi                                541
 12.  Frank Mahovlich      Tor-Det-Mtl                        533
 13. *Michel Goulet        Que-Chi                            532
 14. *Jari Kurri           Edm-LA                             524
 15.  Bryan Trottier       NYI-Pit                            520
 16.  Gilbert Perreault    Buf                                512
 17.  Jean Beliveau        Mtl                                507
 18.  Lanny McDonald       Tor-Col-Cgy                        500
 19.  Jean Ratelle         NYR-Bos                            491
 20.  Norm Ullman          Det-Tor                            490
 21. *Dino Ciccarelli      Min-Wsh-Det                        485
 22.  Darryl Sittler       Tor-Phi-Det                        484
 23. *Mario Lemieux        Pit                                477
 24. *Glenn Anderson       Edm-Tor                            459
 25.  Alex Delvecchio      Det                                456
 26. *Mark Messier         Edm-NYR                            452
 27. *Dale Hawerchuk       Wpg-Buf                            449
 28.  Rick Middleton       NYR-Bos                            448
 29. *Steve Yzerman        Det                                445
 30. *Peter Stastny        Que-NJ                             444
 31.  Rick Vaive           Van-Tor-Chi-Buf                    441
 32. *Joe Mullen           StL-Cgy-Pit                        433
 33.  Yvan Cournoyer       Mtl                                428
 34. *Dave Taylor          LA                                 427
 35.  Steve Shutt          Mtl-LA                             424
 36. *Denis Savard         Chi-Mtl                            423
 37.  Bill Barber          Phi                                420
 38. *Brian Propp          Phi-Bos-Min                        413
 39.  Gary Unger           Tor-Det-StL-Atl-LA-Edm             413
 40.  Rod Gilbert          NYR                                406
 41. *Steve Larmer         Chi                                406
 42. *John Ogrodnick       Det-Que-NYR                        402
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Other active players:
     *Bernie Nicholls      LA-NYR-Edm-NJ                      397
     *Pat LaFontaine       NYI-Buf                            386
     *Brian Bellows        Min-Mtl                            382
     *Dave Andreychuk      Buf-Tor                            373
     *Tim Kerr             Phi-NYR-Hfd                        370
     *Bobby Smith          Min-Mtl                            357
     *Brett Hull           Cgy-StL                            356
     *Luc Robitaille       LA                                 353
     *Mike Foligno         Det-Buf-Tor                        351
     *Dave Christian       Wpg-Wsh-Bos-StL-Chi                340
     *Paul Coffey          Edm-Pit-LA-Det                     330
     *Brent Sutter         NYI-Chi                            325
     *Pat Verbeek          NJ-Hfd                             318
     *Ron Francis          Hfd-Pit                            311
     *Cam Neely            Van-Bos                            292
     *Ray Bourque          Bos                                291
     *Bob Carpenter        Wsh-NYR-LA-Bos-Tor                 285
     *Brent Ashton         Van-Col-NJ-Min-Que-Det-Wpg-Bos-Cgy 284
     *Doug Gilmour         Stl-Cgy-Tor                        277
     *Rick Tocchet         Phi-Pit                            277
     *Kevin Dineen         Hfd-Phi                            275
     *Tomas Sandstrom      NYR-LA                             273
     *Dale Hunter          Que-Wsh                            269
     *Ryan Walter          Wsh-Mtl-Van                        264
     *Brian Mullen         Wpg-NYR-SJ-NYI                     260
     *Ed Olczyk            Chi-Tor-Wpg-NYR                    260
     *Kirk Muller          NJ-Mtl                             258
     *Joe Nieuwendyk       Cgy                                257
     *Jimmy Carson         LA-Edm-Det                         254

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

All time NHL scoring leaders (* denotes active player):

  1. *Wayne Gretzky        Edm-LA                             765 1563 2328
  2.  Gordie Howe          Det-Hfd                            801 1049 1850
  3.  Marcel Dionne        Det-LA-NYR                         731 1040 1771
  4.  Phil Esposito        Chi-Bos-NYR                        717  873 1590
  5.  Stan Mikita          Chi                                541  926 1467
  6.  Bryan Trottier       NYI-Pit                            520  890 1410
  7.  Johnny Bucyk         Det-Bos                            556  813 1369
  8.  Guy Lafleur          Mtl-NYR-Que                        560  793 1353
  9.  Gilbert Perreault    Buf                                512  814 1326
 10.  Alex Delvecchio      Det                                456  825 1281
 11.  Jean Ratelle         NYR-Bos                            491  776 1267
 12. *Mark Messier         Edm-NYR                            452  780 1232
 13.  Norm Ullman          Det-Tor                            490  739 1229
 14. *Peter Stastny        Que-NJ                             444  777 1221
 15.  Jean Beliveau        Mtl                                507  712 1219
 16. *Dale Hawerchuk       Wpg-Buf                            449  763 1212
 17.  Bobby Clarke         Phi                                358  852 1210
 18. *Paul Coffey          Edm-Pit-LA-Det                     330  871 1201
 19. *Denis Savard         Chi-Mtl                            423  769 1192
 20. *Jari Kurri           Edm-LA                             524  666 1190
 21. *Mario Lemieux        Pit                                477  697 1174
 22.  Bobby Hull           Chi-Wpg-Hfd                        610  560 1170
 23.  Bernie Federko       StL                                369  761 1130
 24.  Mike Bossy           NYI                                573  553 1126
 25. *Michel Goulet        Que-Chi                            532  590 1122
 26.  Darryl Sittler       Tor-Phi-Det                        484  637 1121
 27. *Mike Gartner         Wsh-Min-NYR                        583  524 1107
 28.  Frank Mahovlich      Tor-Det-Mtl                        533  570 1103
 29. *Ray Bourque          Bos                                291  806 1099
 30. *Dave Taylor          LA                                 427  635 1062
 31.  Denis Potvin         NYI                                310  742 1052
 32.  Henri Richard        Mtl                                358  688 1046
 33. *Steve Yzerman        Det                                445  595 1040
 34. *Bobby Smith          Min-Mtl                            357  679 1036
 35.  Rod Gilbert          NYR                                406  615 1021
 36. *Glenn Anderson       Edm-Tor                            459  559 1018
 37.  Lanny McDonald       Tor-Col-Cgy                        500  506 1006
 38.  Rick Middleton       NYR-Bos                            448  540  988
 39.  Dave Keon            Tor-Hfd                            396  590  986
 40. *Ron Francis          Hfd-Pit                            311  675  986
 41. *Bernie Nicholls      LA-NYR-Edm-NJ                      397  580  977
 42. *Brian Propp          Phi-Bos-Min                        413  561  974
 43.  Andy Bathgate        NYR-Tor-Det-Pit                    349  624  973
 44.  Maurice Richard      Mtl                                544  421  965
 45.  Larry Robinson       Mtl-LA                             208  750  958
 46. *Dino Ciccarelli      Min-Wsh-Det                        485  472  957
 47. *Steve Larmer         Chi                                406  517  923
 48. *Joe Mullen           StL-Cgy-Pit                        433  486  919
 49.  Bobby Orr            Bos-Chi                            270  645  915
 50.  Brad Park            NYR-Bos-Det                        213  683  896
 51.  Butch Goring         LA-NYI-Bos                         375  513  888
 52.  Bill Barber          Phi                                420  463  883
 53.  Dennis Maruk         Cal-Cle-Wsh-Min                    356  521  877
 54.  Ivan Boldirev        Bos-Cal-Chi-Atl-Van-Det            361  505  866
 55.  Yvan Cournoyer       Mtl                                428  435  863
 56.  Dean Prentice        NYR-Bos-Det-Pit-Min                391  469  860
 57.  Ted Lindsay          Det-Chi                            379  472  851
 58.  Tom Lysiak           Atl-Chi                            292  551  843
 59. *Dale Hunter          Que-Wsh                            269  570  839
 60.  John Tonelli         NYI-Cgy-LA-Chi-Que                 325  511  836
 61.  Jacques Lemaire      Mtl                                366  469  835
 62. *Larry Murphy         LA-Wsh-Min-Pit                     203  631  834
 63. *John Ogrodnick       Det-Que-NYR                        402  425  827
 64. *Doug Wilson          Chi-SJ                             237  590  827
 65. *Doug Gilmour         Stl-Cgy-Tor                        277  548  825
 66.  Red Kelly            Det-Tor                            281  542  823
 67.  Pierre Larouche      Pit-Mtl-Hfd-NYR                    395  427  822
 68.  Bernie Geoffrion     Mtl-NYR                            393  429  822
 69.  Steve Shutt          Mtl-LA                             424  393  817
 70. *Phil Housley         Buf-Wpg                            242  575  817
 71.  Wilf Paiment         KC-Col-Tor-Que-NYR-Buf-Pit         356  458  814
 72.  Peter McNab          Buf-Bos-Van-NJ                     363  450  813
 73. *Brian Bellows        Min-Mtl                            382  428  810
 74. *Dave Andreychuk      Buf-Tor                            373  436  809
 75.  Pit Martin           Det-Bos-Chi-Van                    324  485  809
 76. *Pat LaFontaine       NYI-Buf                            386  421  807
 77.  Ken Linesman         Phi-Edm-Bos                        256  551  807
 78.  Gary Unger           Tor-Det-StL-Atl-LA-Edm             413  391  804
 79.  Ken Hodge,Sr         Chi-Bos-NYR                        328  472  800
 80. *Neal Broten          Min                                249  547  796
 81.  Wayne Cashman        Bos                                277  516  793
 82.  Rick Vaive           Van-Tor-Chi-Buf                    441  347  788
 83.  Borje Salming        Tor-Det                            150  637  787
 84.  Jean Pronovost       Pit-Atl-Wsh                        391  383  774
 85.  Peter Mahovlich      Det-Mtl-Pit                        288  485  773
 86. *Dave Christian       Wpg-Wsh-Bos-StL-Chi                340  430  770
 87.  Rick Kehoe           Tor-Pit                            371  396  767
 88.  Rick MacLeish        Phi-Hfd-Pit-Det                    349  410  759
 89. *Thomas Steen         Wpg                                240  511  751
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Other active players:
     *Al MacInnis          Cgy                                185  555  740
     *Luc Robitaille       LA                                 353  371  724
     *Mike Foligno         Det-Buf-Tor                        351  367  718
     *Brent Sutter         NYI-Chi                            325  389  714
     *Mark Howe            Hfd-Phi-Det                        192  520  712
     *Kirk Muller          NJ-Mtl                             258  433  691
     *Tim Kerr             Phi-NYR-Hfd                        370  304  674
     *Adam Oates           Det-StL-Bos                        167  490  657
     *Randy Carlyle        Tor-Pit-Wpg                        148  499  647
     *Ryan Walter          Wsh-Mtl-Van                        264  382  646
     *Pat Verbeek          NJ-Hfd                             318  313  631
     *Brent Ashton         Van-Col-NJ-Min-Que-Det-Wpg-Bos-Cgy 284  345  629
     *Bob Carpenter        Wsh-NYR-LA-Bos-Tor                 285  337  622
     *Brian Mullen         Wpg-NYR-SJ-NYI                     260  362  622
     *Ed Olczyk            Chi-Tor-Wpg-NYR                    260  358  618
     *Kelly Kisio          Det-NYR-SJ                         215  402  617
     *Brett Hull           Cgy-StL                            356  247  603
     *Rick Tocchet         Phi-Pit                            277  324  601
     *Dan Quinn            Cgy-Pit-Van-StL-Phi-Min            232  367  599
     *Scott Stevens        Wsh-StL-NJ                         132  462  594
     *Tomas Sandstrom      NYR-LA                             273  320  593
     *Tom Fergus           Bos-Tor-Van                        235  346  581
     *Dave Babych          Wpg-Hfd-Van                        120  460  580
     *Mike Ridley          NYR-Wsh                            230  348  578
     *Laurie Boschman      Tor-Edm-Wpg-NJ-Ott                 225  350  575
     *Keith Acton          Mtl-Min-Edm-Phi                    224  350  574
     *Murray Craven        Det-Phi-Hfd                        205  365  570
     *Kevin Dineen         Hfd-Phi                            275  290  565
     *Rob Ramage           Col-StL-Cgy-Tor-Min-TB             139  423  562
     *Mike Krushelnyski    Bos-Edm-LA-Tor                     234  319  553
     *Gary Suter           Cgy                                124  428  552
     *Pierre Turgeon       Buf-NYI                            218  324  542
     *Troy Murray          Chi-Wpg                            217  324  541
     *Cam Neely            Van-Bos                            292  241  533
     *Geoff Courtnall      Bos-Edm-Wsh-StL-Van                246  274  520
     *Vincent Damphousse   Tor-Edm-Mtl                        195  320  515
     *Jimmy Carson         LA-Edm-Det                         254  259  513
     *Peter Zezel          Phi-StL-Wsh-Tor                    182  328  510
     *Guy Carbonneau       Mtl                                207  302  509
     *Mark Osborne         Det-NYR-Tor-Wpg                    202  301  503
     *Chris Chelios        Mtl-Chi                            108  394  502
     *Dave Poulin          Phi-Bos                            195  301  496
     *Ray Ferraro          Hfd-NYI                            230  263  493
     *Russ Courtnall       Tor-Mtl-Min                        208  284  492
     *Joe Nieuwendyk       Cgy                                257  234  491
     *John MacLean         NJ                                 241  248  489
-- 





Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54539
From: au021@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Roland Behunin)
Subject: Now if ESPN wanted to show a good game...


They could put on a Quebec-Montreal game.

Talk a bout areivalry!
opps rivalry..

roland
-- 
Roland

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54540
From: chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Subject: Re: 1993 NHL Draft

cs902043@ariel.yorku.ca (SHAWN LUDDINGTON) writes:

>As for the picks
>Ottawa picks #1 which means it is almost 100% that Alexander Daigle will 
>go #1. He'll either stay or be traded in Montreal or Quebec.

I dunno about hat. I have friends up there on GEnie who are now saying that
Ottawa's gone soft on Daigle and is thinking hard about Pronger. Daigle has
shown an Attitude the latter part of this season many folks havne't liked,
and after coming back from his (second) multi-game suspension for being
stupid, he's really tanked in his performance. His stock is dropping like a
rock. 

Also remember that a lot of teh "draft 1st" stuff comes from the assumption
he'll be traded to Quebec for lots of prospects. It's not clear that 
Quebec would really be willing to pay a lot for him given his current
status. He's still first round, but I don't consider him a first pick lock
by any means at this point.

It's also possible that the Senators are posturing to try to bring down his
signing price, since Daigle has been taking some Lindros lessons during thos
suspensions.

>IMO I would
>take Kariya.  He should alot of leadership in the NCAA and so far in
>the World Championships.  Daigle didn't show this for his junior team.

>San Jose will then get Kariya.

No. Kariya won't go in the first three, for a very simple reason: he's not
leaving college, and I don't believe ANY of the expansion teams are going to
use a first for someone who won't be around for another year or two, not
when there is equally good (or almost as good) stuff available that can make
an immediate impact. San jose seems to be leaning heavily towards
Niedermayer for that reason. Kariya could go 6th or 7th, unless a team can
convince him to leave school early (which I doubt).


My cut on things as they stand today:

>Draft Order
>-----------
>1) Ottawa (60% Daigle, if not, 40% Pronger)
>2) San Jose 80% Niedermayer, unless Ottawa skips Daigle. Then it's open.
	(it depends on if the Sharks can get a deal for him. I don't
	believe they draft him to keep him).
>3) Tampa Bay (whoever Ottawa doesn't take, or maybe Koslov)

-- 
 Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= chuq@apple.com
   Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms =+=  GEnie: MAC.BIGOT =+= ALink:CHUQ 
  Minor League fans: minors-request@medraut.apple.com (San Jose Giants: A/1/9)
  San Francisco Giants fans: giants-request@medraut.apple.com (The Stick?NOT!)
   San Jose Sharks fans: sharks-request@medraut.apple.com (New seat: 127/TBD)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54541
From: chuq@apple.com (Chuq Von Rospach)
Subject: Re: SHARKS: Kingston Fired!!!

spiegel@sgi413.msd.lmsc.lockheed.com (Mark Spiegel) writes:

>  Gaetz may or may not be back next
>	year, but in either event the Sharks have to pick up others.

Gaetz won't be back. There's been rumors he was officially released right at
the end of the season when his contract expired, but I haven't seen
confirmation. It was clear from my talks with the Sharks doctors that he
wasn't going to make it for a while, and the Sharks would have to sign him
to a contract, which given his problems competing at the IHL level this
spring, doesn't make sense. 

-- 
 Chuq "IMHO" Von Rospach, ESD Support & Training (DAL/AUX) =+= chuq@apple.com
   Member, SFWA =+= Editor, OtherRealms =+=  GEnie: MAC.BIGOT =+= ALink:CHUQ 
  Minor League fans: minors-request@medraut.apple.com (San Jose Giants: A/1/9)
  San Francisco Giants fans: giants-request@medraut.apple.com (The Stick?NOT!)
   San Jose Sharks fans: sharks-request@medraut.apple.com (New seat: 127/TBD)


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54542
From: sesrock@andy.bgsu.edu (Stuart Esrock)
Subject: Re: Bruins

joe13+@pitt.edu (Joseph B Stiehm) writes:
> 
> Come on Boston, where the hell are you? Seven wins in a row and what, choke?

Ah well, another Brian Sutter team is ground into the dirt with intensity
during the regular season and then is burned out by playoff time.
Yah Fuhr has been awesome so far, but really you'd think Sutter would have
learned his lesson about pushing his team too far during the regular season.

Stuart Esrock   Bowling Green State U.   "How bout them Blues!!!"

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54543
From: galvint@cs.nps.navy.mil (thomas galvin)
Subject: Re: Camera work on televised games

In article <1993Apr22.105352.18235@vax5.cit.cornell.edu> yecx@vax5.cit.cornell.edu writes:
>Is it just me or is the camera work on some of these games really sad??  I
>can't remember how many times during the Penguins-Devils game they showed some
>guy (without the puck) being checked in the corner while the puck was being
>fired on goal.  In fact, I think they even missed one goal completely because
>they were showing two guys holding each other in the corner.
>
>Now the last time I watched a football game, they didn't show the lineman going
>at it while the running back turned the corner for a touchdown . . . . 
>
>Is it just me??	
>
>Greg
>

ESPN has been trying various things to get away from the
follow-the-puck concept of televising hockey games.  One of the main
problems with hockey is that it is very difficult to show everything
that is going on -- more happens away from the puck than in any other
sport except maybe football and they can do iso's on football players
to be shown between plays.

The problem of course is that sometimes you get something worthwhile,
other times you get burned.

-Tom Galvin        galvint@taurus.cs.nps.navy.mil


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54544
From: sesrock@andy.bgsu.edu (Stuart Esrock)
Subject: Re: Joseph and Blues Shut down WartHAwks Blues up 2-0

cr292@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Jim Schenk) writes:
> 
> One last point, Darryl Sutter is getting badly out coached by Bob Berry.  The
> madder Darryl gets the more he reminds me of Brian.  The Hawks are
> quickly loosing thier focus, I don't think the Blues will win in 4 but you
> never know

Not to Sutter bash or anything since I idolized them as players....
you sure would think the Sutters would learn something about burning out their
teams in the regular season.....just too much intensity during the regular 
season.  I earlier posted a note about Brian and got to thinking after I read
this item.....gee both Sutters won their divisions and now both have lost 
home ice advantage and are getting smoked in their opening series in the
playoffs.  Kind of makes you wonder.......

Bottom line....man it is great to be smoking the WartHawks!!!!!
Agreed Jim.....this has been damn sweet, so far.  About the only thing
that comes close to this is shutting up all the Maple Laugh fans....Detroit
has completely kicked their asses so far.  But, I will stick with the
Blues for providing the best playoff tonic so far.

Stuart Esrock  Bowling Green State U.  "Go you Blues!!!"

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54545
From: <MWEINTR@auvm.american.edu>
Subject: Playoff consecutive loss record?

With the recent demise of the Chicago Blawkhawks (much to my delight) I
noticed their 8 (?) game playoff losing streak (4 to the Pens last year, and
now 4 to the Blues) and I am wondering what the NHL record for consecutive
losses is, if there even is one...

I'm pretty sure that the Hawks have at least a 9 game losing  streak, since
they've had to have lost a series since their last championship (whenever that
was)

Basically, I need something else to rag on my Hawks-fan friend with :)

Mike, the insomniaced
---
***Yes-Rush-Marillion-Emerson, Lake and Palmer-Genesis-Dream Theater***
* Mike Weintraub, aka Jvi on IRC   ________.sig Quote du Jour________ *
* mweintr@american.edu            |"Life is like a scissors-paper-   |*
* jedi@wave.cerf.net              | stone game, none of the answers  |*
* The American University         | is always right, but sometimes   |*
* Washington, DC                  |_each one is"__Neil Peart, Rush___|*
***Go Philadelphia Phillies and Vancouver Canucks (3 down, 13 to go)***

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54546
From: maszakj@pell1l5.alleg.edu (Jonathan Maszak)
Subject: Re: Lemieux's Getting the Hart... Jeez I hope not!

In article <22APR93.02956996.0062@UNBVM1.CSD.UNB.CA> Patrick Walker  
<F1HH@UNB.CA> writes:
> Who should get the Hart?
> Gretzky, not in a million years.  At least not this year.
>   He hasn't played all year.
> Yzerman, though it would be nice, I don't think he'll get it, he's
>  consistent, but not well known.  (Thought he should be!)
> Mario.  Jesus NO!  It's bad enough for me just to utter the word
>  without being extremely sick and pissed off.  They guy's a luber
>  to ramble.  As you can see I hate Mario.
> Pat Walker
> UNB	

i'm not going to bother reprinting your pathetic excuse for a post. Mario  
fan, or not you have to respect what he can do with a blade. as for the  
hart trophy, i guess winning the scoring title after being out twenty-four  
days with CANCER, then leading his team to the presidents trophy and  
breaking the win streak record in the process shouldn't even qualify him  
for the award. maybe next year he'll tend a few games when barrasso needs  
a rest. be realistic, mario has earned every one of his accolades and  
deserves all the attention that he gets. lose the jealous attitude and you  
may start enjoying hockey at its finest
				-maze

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54547
From: ncjlog@atmos.washington.edu (Neal Johnson)
Subject: Belfour and Roenick, playoff Houdinis?


 Have Belfour and Roenick done another disappearing act at chips are 
 down time?  When I saw them it looked like the Blackhawks' defense
 might carry them along way in the playoffs.  

 Well they held St. Louis to 17 shots in game 2 and lost.

 Looks like maybe Keenan had (has) some insight to me.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54548
Subject: Re: Ranger Fans?????
From: kwolfer@eagle.wesleyan.edu


In article <1993Apr22.171734.9534@alleg.edu>, ballb@reis56.alleg.edu (Brett Ball) writes:
> In article <1993Apr22.101356.1@eagle.wesleyan.edu>  writes:
>> I for one am happy about the Ranger's hiring of Keenan.  It's too bad  
> that they
>> didn't hire him when Smith fired Nielsen, maybe he could of staightened  
> out the
>> babies on this team and made the playoffs.  What this team needs is a  
> little
>> fire under their butts!!
>> 
>> Reading through most of these hockey news I don't see many Ranger fans  
> writing.   
>> I'm new to this system and a big hockey fan and a long suffering(1940)  
> Ranger
>> fan.  But remember suffering builds character!!
>> 
>> I have some final questions about the way the team was handled in that  
> last
>> dreadful stretch.
>> 
>> 1. Knowing they needed offensive help from the blueline, why didn't we  
> see Mike
>> Hurlbut, who played pretty well when he was called up when Leetch first  
> went
>> down?
>> 
>> 2. Why????!!!!! is Joe Kocur playing every night?  He is not Bob Probert  
> who is
>> tough but also can play.
>> 
>> 3. How come Paul Broten is relegated to street clothes for the end of  
> the
>> season.  At least he plays with some heart and character, draws  
> penalties and
>> plays 110% when he's on the ice.  Was he in the doghouse for some  
> reason?
>> 
>> 4. Joe Cirella?????!!!!  Enough said!
>> 
>> Ranger fans may be suffering but we're some of the most loyal, unlike  
> Islander
>> fans who only show up when the team wins.
>> 
>> As far as the Stanley Cup goes I think there's only one team that can  
> test
>> Pittsburgh and that's Detroit.  This would be the most entertaining and  
> hard
>> fought series.  Mario is amazing!
>> 
>> Kurt
> 
> I think Joe Kocus should play every night.   He is a big physical guy, and  
> he gets the fans into the game with some big hits.  (both checks and  
> fists)  Its a big advantage to get the crowd going.  Plus, he helps  
> protect the other players.  Notice there are very few fights when Kocur is  
> on the ice unless he is it.  I have seen people start to go after essa  
> Tikkanen, only to go slinking away when Kocur steps in.  I think he is big  
> asset, but should be third line, and special situation only play.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>This is fast becoming a game without the goons.  I admit Kocur may get the
fans into the game but surely they would rather see Broten taking a pass from
Kovalev and scoring a breakaway goal to put the Rangers up 3 (magic #) goals in
the third period, rather than seeing Kocur take another stupid penalty and the
Rangers giving up another powerplay goal! 

The Rangers need another top flight center who can take the pressure off
Messier and the first line.  Nemchinov is a perfect third line center.

So who goes Beezer or Richter?

Kurt
 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54549
Subject: Binghampton Rangers Playoff Games
From: kwolfer@eagle.wesleyan.edu

Does anyone know if MSG will televise any of the Binghampton Rangers playoff
games.  Even taped replays would be nice?




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54550
From: stamber@rainbow.ecn.purdue.edu (Kevin L. Stamber)
Subject: Re: Pens Broadcasters

In article <Mfqk2O200awN0sskQm@andrew.cmu.edu>, Nathan Robert Peters <np22+@andrew.cmu.edu> writes:
> 	Rumor has it here in Pittsburgh that there is going to be a Penguins
> broadcasting change before next season.  According to the rumor, the KBL
> leadership (the company the broadcasts the Pen's games) wants to limit
> loved broadcaster Mike Lange to radio only and hire Don Cherry as his
> broadcast partner.  This would mean Paul Stiegerwald would be fired
> (good riddance).   
> 
> 	Does anyone know anything about this?  Lange is a fun broadcaster to
> listen to, and Pens games wouldn't be the same without him.  Also I hear
> Cherry doesn't have high opinions of Lemieux, Ulf Sammuelsson, or
> Jaromir Jagr.  How is he supposed to broadcast their games?
> 
     I believe that the large number of digits on his paycheck (and
it would not be binary) would help Don to be a fan of Ulf!, Jaro, and
Mario.
> 
> Nate Peters - Lifetime Penguins fan (even from before they were the best)

Kevin L. Stamber
Purdue University
Top 10 reasons the Pittsburgh Penguins won the Patrick Division:
3. A strong desire to get THE CUP back to your neighborhood
   Eat 'n' Park -- where there's always something special cooking!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54551
From: The Always Fanatical: Patrick Ellis <IO11330@MAINE.MAINE.EDU>
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

I'm personally expecting Moog.  Blue played fairly decent (alright
spectacular at times) in his 1/2 a game but Moog has the experience.
What Did Blue have going for him, nothing, What would happen in a Tie
game, the prssure is then on the Goal tender to insure that you keep the
puck out (at the very least until your team scores)  Blue didn't face that
kind of pressure on Tuesday.  The Bruins will come out storming that
is for sure.  I really think that this series is up to Buffalo, Boston
(except for two bad passes in game one) really hasn't played that bad
,  As a believer is statistics, you know that your going to get the
puck by fuhr sooner or later, just keep shooting.  There game plan is
sound but they need to take the lead first, and control the tempo.....

               IMHO
                      Pat Ellis

P.S.  GO BRUINS    GO UMAINE BLACK BEARS    42-1-2       NUMBER 1......

                   HOCKEY EAST REGULARS SEASON CHAMPIONS.....
                   HOCKEY EAST TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONS>......
                   PAUL KARIYA, HOBEY BAKER AWARD WINNER.......
         NCAA DIV. 1 HOCKEY TOURNAMENT CHAMPIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


                    M-A-I-N-E      GGGGOOOOOOO    BBBLLLUUEEEE!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54552
From: yadalle@cs.UAlberta.CA (Yadallee Dave S)
Subject: Re: Oilers for sale??

golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:

>The probability is that the Oilers are not going anywhere.

  Gerald, look at what happened to the Stars; they are off to Dallas.


>Pocklington has chosen this moment to make his "last" stand is
>because he is at the moment of maximum advantage...the provincial
>government is months away from a provincial election...it is
>the moment when he has maximum power to convince Northlands
>to give him a better arena deal or a better purchase price...
>and it is before the NHL's new collective agreement with
>the players which might involve some enhanced revenue-sharing.

Gerald, the Alberta election is slated fou 7 June, unless something RE?ALLY goes 
wrong this time!!  Pocklington could end up being THE embarassment of Klein
if he goes ahead with his 'ultimatum'.


>Pocklington is many things...stupid is not one of them.

Gerald,  people still have an axe to grind with this guy.  I CANNOT see him staying for long.

>He can dictate terms...because other cities will pay his
>price if Edmonton doesn't.

But the people in Edmonton won't budge, trust me on this one.

>Edmonton has already ****** up its international airport, and
>surrendered supremacy to Calgary, and over the next few years
>Edmonton is going to take a hard hit from government cutbacks.
>It will screw itself beyond recogniton if it manages to find
>a way to lose its hockey team too...because Northlands wants
>to continue to use the Oilers to subsidize horse racing.

Northlands won't budge ccording to one of the board members, Bruce Campbell.

>However, in this case, about the long-term financial
>viability of the Oilers, the fact is that Pocklington is basically 
>right, regardless of who owns the team, and it is right to provoke
>the crisis now, before the team accumulates millions of dollars
>in losses, or becomes habitually uncompetitive because of lack
>of money.

I haven't heard anything, BUT attendance at the Coliseum was the lowest this 
year.  HINT!!HINT!!  Remeber what I said about a personal vendetta?

>Sather has done his job...the Oilers are poised to be competitive
>again very soon (Al Strachan, one of the most knowledgeble hockey
>writers in Canada in a post-mortem of the Oilers season in
>the Globe and Mail recently agrees with me.)

Gerald, don't blame Sather.  This battle between the peole and Pocklington
started in 1986 and got WORST when Pocklington sold Gretzky.  

There were days when you can shake the hand of Pocklington when he was
respectalbe( I use to do so in 1982 - 1983 season) , but those days are GOE!!

>Gerald

BTW, when following up, please delete name of posting writer.
--
Dave Shariff Yadallee (B. Sc.(Econ/Math) (U of Alberta 1990) )
( yadalle@amisk.cs.ualberta.ca) God Save the Queen, God Bless us All!Remember!
Jesus saves lives from eternal damnation!
Newfoundland, keep good old Clyde, VOTE LIBERAL!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54553
From: v128r82w@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (Ralph L d'Ambrosio)
Subject: Re: Leafs now favoured

In article <1993Apr26.020100.29640@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca>, maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes...
>Once again the Leafs overcame the Red Wings in what was possibly the
>most exciting game played yet in this playoff year.  Potvin was solid
>and Wendel completely dominated Probert.  Gilmour, as usual, was the
>best player on the ice.  And to those who claim that Andreychuk fades
>in the playoffs, please take note:  Andreychuk is averaging a goal a
>game. 
> 
>3 stars
> 
>Andreychuk - 2 goals
>Wendel     - all over Probert
>Probert    - all over everyone else
> 
>Todd Gill also played an excellent game.
> 
>We can't say enough about Doug Gilmour.  When he is right, all is well.
>Gilmour brings to mind Davey Keon from the previous Leaf dynasty.
> 
>Predictions so far on track:
> 
>NYI over Buffalo and Leafs over LA Kings.
> 
>Leafs over NYI in the final.

I can't let this pass.
*If* the Islanders get past Pitts. (Assuming the Isles beat the Caps, God 
Willing), them I'm sorry, the Isles will crush the Leafs.
Flame shields up.

********************************************************************************
Of course no one asked me I always interject my opinions on matters I have no 
concern over 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Go Islanders!!!!!! (3 down, 1 to go)
Go Jets for '93
********************************************************************************


> 
> 
>-- 
> 
>cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
>                                           "So many morons...
>rm                                                 ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54554
From: mikkot@romulus.math.jyu.fi (Mikko Tarkiainen)
Subject: Re: Pens Info needed

In article <1993Apr16.171319.13467@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU> nlu@Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Nelson Lu) writes:
>In article <1993Apr16.074054.3124@jyu.fi> mikkot@romulus.math.jyu.fi (Mikko Tarkiainen) writes:
>
>>Coaching news: 
>>	       Vasili Tichonov (ex-Assat) to San Jose Sharks 
>Wow.  So that's probably the reason why current assistant coach Drew Ramenda
>hinted that he won't be back.  Thanks for the news, Mikko; can you (or any
>of our Finnish netters) comment on Tichonov?

The first time I heard this piece of news was on the post game radio
interview here in Jyvaskyla. That was the bronze medal game in the 
SM-liiga which Tichonov's team Porin Assat (the Aces of town Pori:)
lost.  Vasili, the son of Victor Tichonov (the famous Soviet coach),
said that for a long time the Sharks have been persuading him to
take the assistant coach post. But he wants to be the head coach where
ever he goes. He definitely won't be coaching Assat anymore (after
three? seasons). I don't know why.

Vasili is a good coach I believe. Assat was a good team, produced many
players to our national team. Assat wasn't a skilled team (IMHO) but
they had the fighting spirit. After all, they butchered Jokerit in the
playoffs and gave hard time to TPS, the champs. But Assat wasn't
consistent, only when they were in the right mood they could beat any
team in the SM-liiga.

I am not 100% sure about the deal with the Sharks. As I said, he wants
to be the head coach. But he and the Sharks are going to negotiate and
decide during the WC. I doubt that he will be the head coach but
maybe they'll do some compromise.

Could somebody post more information about Vasili? I know he was coaching
in the former Soviet league; teams, results? His character as a coach?


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54555
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: Devils and Islanders tiebreaker????

In article <C5LDI2.77u@odin.corp.sgi.com>, enolan@sharkbite.esd.sgi.com (Ed
Nolan) says:
>If the Islanders beat the Devils tonight, they would finish with
>identical records.  Who's the lucky team that gets to face the Penguins
>in the opening round?   Also, can somebody list the rules for breaking
>ties.
      As I recall, the Penguins and Devils tied for third place last year
with identical records, as well.  Poor Devils -- they always get screwed.
Yet, they should put a scare into Pittsburgh.  They always do!  Pens in 7.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          PGH PENGUINS!!!    "It won't be easy, but it
Contact for the '93-'94  '91 STANLEY CUP    will have greater rewards.
Penn State Lady Lions    '92 CHAMPIONS      Mountains and Valleys are
rap115@psuvm.psu.edu     11 STRAIGHT WINS!  better than nothing at all!"

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54556
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: Goodbye, good riddance, get lost 'Stars

In article <DT642B1w165w@sms.business.uwo.ca>, s4lawren@sms.business.uwo.ca
(Stephen Lawrence) says:
>        Goodbye Minnesota,...you never earned the right to have an NHL
>franchise in the first place!
>        Hope you enjoy your Twin city wide mania for HIGH SCHOOL HOCKEY
>(hey, by the way my old pee wee team is having a reunion in Regina, care
>to come up and film the event?)
>        Yee haa Golden Gophers
>Whatta weird town!!!!!
   --Minnesota definitely deserves an NHL franchise!!!  You'll see the
Minnesota Whalers pretty soon, so fear not Minnesota fans.  No Norm Green,
'cept for the team color (sorry, bad pun!)

   --What a difference two years makes!  Minnesota finished 29-37-14 in 1992
and made the finals.  They finish with a better record at  38-38-10 thi year
and move to Dallas.  Every team in the playoffs has a winning record!!!
Finally!!!  It's about time, NHL!!!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          PGH PENGUINS!!!    "It won't be easy, but it
Contact for the '93-'94  '91 STANLEY CUP    will have greater rewards.
Penn State Lady Lions    '92 CHAMPIONS      Mountains and Valleys are
rap115@psuvm.psu.edu     11 STRAIGHT WINS!  better than nothing at all!"

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54557
From: Robert Angelo Pleshar <rp16+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Bernie Nicholls - What a man!

from Matthew Rush:
>but he's starting to push it over the edge IMHO.  Of course,
>Holik's chop to Barrasso's neck wasn't too sportsmanlike either.
>It seems that he was following the "The only way to beat the
>Penguins is to injure them" philosophy.

It's pretty obvious that Holik's hitting Barrasso was an accident. He
was even apologizing for it immediately before the Penguins all jumped
on him.

Ralph


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54562
From: howarth@sbctri.sbc.com (David Howarth)
Subject: Re: Hawks

In article <122779@netnews.upenn.edu>, ldecock@mail.sas.upenn.edu (Luke
DeCock) wrote:
> 
> The only player the Hawks have lost because they screwed up is Peluso. The
> hapless Blues lost Stevens and gave away Oates. Okay, so the Blues won this

You must be kidding, right? In losing Stevens the Blues got Shanahan and
kept
Joseph. Then they traded Oates for Janney. As a Hawks fan you have got to
respect those "hapless" names. 8^) Lets see, who scored the game winning
overtime goal in the 4th game???


> Luke DeCock
> ldecock@mail.sas.upenn.eu

     /\   David Howarth                              howarth@sbctri.sbc.com
    ///\   Southwestern Bell Technology Resources Inc.
   ///  \   Advanced Technology Laboratory
  ///    \   1010 Pine, Rm 635  St. Louis,  MO.  63101 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54563
From: leunggm@odin.control.utoronto.ca (Gary Leung)
Subject: Fuhr Deserves Credit (Was: Sabres sweep (Fuhr's role))

In article <1revcrINNeij@shelley.u.washington.edu> lzuo@byron.u.washington.edu (Joseph) writes:
>In article <randolin.6.735770247@polisci.umn.edu> randolin@polisci.umn.edu (Robert Andolina) writes:
>>Many people have suggested that Fuhr's play is the only reason that the 
>>Sabres beat the Bruins.  While Fuhr was a critical factor, I would not 
>>overlook the fact that the Sabres finally got some scoring from people other 
>>than Mogilny and LaFontaine (Khmylev, Sweeney, Hawerchuck, etc.).  Indeed, 
>>LaFontaine played hurt and didn't score many goals.  Also, the team played 
>>better defense (although not great) than in the regular season.  Fuhr 
>>deserves a lot of credit, but not all of it.
>>
>>Robert A.
>
>I agree with this. I also think Fuhr's contribution for Sabres's win is just
>the same as many palyers in the team. Mogilny had six goals in four games
>including two goals for the great comeback in the final win after Fuhr had
>left. The key for Sabres's win over Boston is whole team's strong commitment
>as an underdog and all their talent players including Mogilny and Fuhr.
>

I think that Grant Fuhr deserves more credit than that!
While it's true that the entire Sabres team played very well, I
still believe that if it wasn't for Grant Fuhr, the series would
now be tied 2-2. He virtually stole games 1 and 3 for the Sabres.
In both of these games, Fuhr stood on his head to give the Sabres
the chance to win. Especially in game 3, Fuhr made a series of
huge stops in the third period when the score was tied 2-2. 
Even in game 2 when the Sabres won 4-0, the score seemed to
indicate that the Sabres dominated. However, if it hadn't been
for Fuhr, the Sabres wouldn't have been up (2-0 I think it was)
through the 2nd period and the Bruins wouldn't have had to open
up the game (thereby allowing Mogilny to score the third goal on
a breakaway to salt away the game).  There
is no doubt in my mind that Fuhr was the critical factor in the
victory. 

In my opinion, Neely, Oates and Juneau played as well as
LaFontaine, Mogilny and Hawerchuk. The Sabres did get
extraordinary efforts from Hannan, Sweeney, Wood, and Khmylev
(compared to that of the Bruins checkers). However, the Bruins defense
, IMO, played better than the Sabres defense (the Sabres have Ken Sutton
playing a regular shift afterall ;-)
The difference in the series was Fuhr, who outplayed Andy Moog. 

Gary

Go Sabres!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54564
From: phoenix@startide.ctr.columbia.edu (Ali Lemer)
Subject: Re: Minnesota Shame?

In article <C62xpu.MD3@constellation.ecn.uoknor.edu> hunter@nsslsun.nssl.uoknor.edu (Steve Hunter) writes:
>I'm a hockey fan from way back, and maintain an interest as best I can
>here in the hockey hinterlands (Oklahoma).  I'm hoping I can get a
>reading from some of you about the move of the North Stars to Dallas.
>
>I've been under the impression that Minnesota was one of, or possibly,
>THE hockey state in the U.S.  So why is the team moving to a city in
>Texas?  Is it that the owner is a greedy, self-serving profiteer, or
>were the Stars really not making a profit?  Or was the city or whoever
>owned the arena doing some price gouging?
>
>Opinions, please.


Well, as a hockey fan, I think it's terrible. It's one thing to say, "Hey, 
let's give a hockey team to cities that don't have one!" -- that's fine. It's
entirely another to say, "Okay, let's take a team from a thriving hockey town
and move it!" 

Of course, none of us will ever know the real inside story, but
from what I know, a group of Minneapolis businessmen told Green repeatedly that
they would purchase the remaining 3600 (?) season tickets to get to the 10,000
level that Green wanted, yet he refused every time. It's pretty obvious that he
was determined to get out of Minneapolis at any cost and use the season tickets
thing as an excuse. 

I was fortunate enough to get to the penultimate game, and
the fans were great! People were tailgating and playing roller hockey in the
parking lot before the game, the attendance was so full as to have SRO, and the
whole atmosphere in the Centre was terrific. Minnesota IS Hockey, USA. How the
NHL can so blithely let the major league team from there move away is beyond 
me. I only hope they get a new team soon.

Just my $0.02.


-- Ali.

-- 
Ali "Procrastination" Lemer || "I gave [NHL Commissioner Gary Bettman] a puck
Columbia University (NYC)   || once. He spent the rest of the day trying to 
phoenix@ctr.columbia.edu    || open it." -- Pat Williams, GM, Orlando Magic
***************** BE KIND TO ANIMALS...HUG A HOCKEY PLAYER! *******************

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54704
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER (***QUITE LONG***)

In article <1993Apr26.054446.29764@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> phoenix@startide.ctr.columbia.edu (Ali Lemer) writes:
>
>Hey, everyone, didja hear that? We're "fanatics" now! Cool! Can we get our
>own 1400-acre compound, replete with weapon and ammo caches? Who wants a
>barbeque?
>
>
>-- Ali.

I can't believe sh*t like this gets any attention in this group during
the playoffs.

Ali,you're a blabbering moron. At least you could've waited 'till
the end of the playoffs to start your dumb letter campaign.

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54705
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: AHL playoff results (concrete)

Well, I got the scores for Sat's games...

AHL PLAYOFF SCORES-- FIRST ROUND	(home team in CAPS)
================================
		
GAMES PLAYED ON SAT, 4/24
-------------------------
BALTIMORE 3	Binghamton 1
ROCHESTER 3	Utica 2
SPRINGFIELD 4	Providence 3
		
===================================================================
SERIES STATI (plural of status? :)
----------------------------------
Adirondack defeated CDI, 4-0
Springfield defeated Providence, 4-2
Binghamton tied w/Baltimore, 2-2
Rochester defeated Utica, 4-1
St John's leads Moncton, 3-1
Cape Breton defeated Fredericton, 4-1
			
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54706
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: Calder Cup Playoff schedule

FULL 1993 CALDER CUP PLAYOFF SCHEDULE AND RESULTS	
home team in CAPS		*=if necesary

FIRST ROUND					
Springfield Indians vs Providence Bruins
Gm 1:	Springfield 3	PROVIDENCE 2	
Gm 2:	Springfield 5	PROVIDENCE 4
Gm 3:	Providence 3	SPRINGFIELD 2
Gm 4:	Providence 9	SPRINGFIELD 0		
Gm 5:	Springfield 4	PROVIDENCE 2
Gm 6:	SPRINGFIELD 4	Providence 3
(SPRINGFIELD WINS SERIES, 4-2)

CD Islanders vs Adirondack Red Wings
Gm 1:	ADIRONDACK 6	CDI 2
Gm 2:	ADIRONDACK 5	CDI 3
Gm 3:	Adirondack 3	CDI 0
Gm 4:	Adirondack 3	CDI 1
(ADIRONDACK WINS SERIES, 4-0)

Baltimore Skipjacks at Binghamton Rangers
Gm 1:	Baltimore 4	BINGHAMTON 3	
Gm 2:	BINGHAMTON 6	Baltimore 2
Gm 3:	Binghamton 8	BALTIMORE 3
Gm 4:	BALTIMORE 3	Binghamton 1	
Gm 5:	4/26	Baltimore at Binghamton	
Gm 6:	4/28	Binghmaton at Baltimore	
Gm 7:	4/30	Baltimore at Binghamton	*
		
Utica Devils vs Rochester Americans
Gm 1:	Utica 3		ROCHESTER 2	(OT)
Gm 2:	ROCHESTER 9	Utica 3
Gm 3:	Rochester 6	UTICA 4
Gm 4:	Rochester 4	UTICA 3		(OT)
Gm 5:	ROCHESTER 3	Utica 2
(ROCHESTER WINS SERIES, 4-1)

Moncton Hawks vs St John's Maple Leafs
Gm 1:	St JOHN'S 4	Moncton 2	(at Halifax)
Gm 2:	ST JOHN'S 3	Moncton 2	(at Halifax)
Gm 3:	St John's 6	MONCTON 5
Gm 4:	MONCTON 5	St John's 4	(OT)
Gm 5:	4/26	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax	
Gm 6:	4/28	St John's at Moncton		*
Gm 7:	4/30	Moncton vs St John's at Halifax	*

Cape Breton Oilers vs Fredericton Canadiens
Gm 1:	FREDERICTON 4	Cape Breton 3	(2OT)
Gm 2:	Cape Breton 5	FREDERICTON 2
Gm 3:	CAPE BRETON 3	Fredericton 0	
Gm 4:	CAPE BRETON 6	Fredericton 5 	(OT)
Gm 5:	Cape Breton won

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54707
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: WC 93: Scores and standings, April 22


 1993 World Championships in Germany:
 ====================================

  Group A standings (Munich)            Group B standings (Dortmund)
  --------------------------            ----------------------------

             GP  W T L  GF-GA +/-  P                  GP  W T L  GF-GA +/-  P

  Canada      3  3 0 0  17- 1 +16  6    Czech republic 3  2 1 0   8- 1  +7  5
  Russia      3  2 1 0  12- 4  +8  5    Finland        3  2 1 0   5- 1  +4  5
  Sweden      3  2 0 1   8- 6  +2  4    USA            3  1 2 0   8- 3  +5  4
  Italy       3  1 1 1   5- 8  -3  3    Germany        3  2 0 1  11- 8  +3  4
  ----------------------------------    -------------------------------------
  Switzerland 3  0 0 3   0- 9  -9  0    France         3  0 0 3   4-13  -9  0
  Austria     3  0 0 3   2-16 -14  0    Norway         3  0 0 3   0-10 -10  0

 
 April 18:  Italy - Russia        2-2       Norway - Germany          0-6
            Sweden - Austria      1-0       USA - Czech republic      1-1

 April 19:  Canada - Switzerland  2-0
            Russia - Austria      4-2       Finland - France          2-0

 April 20:  Sweden - Canada       1-4       Czech republic - Germany  5-0
            Switzerland - Italy   0-1       Finland - USA             1-1

 April 21:                                  Germany - France          5-3
            Italy - Sweden        2-6       Czech republic - Norway   2-0

 April 22:  Switzerland - Russia  0-6       USA - France              6-1
            Austria - Canada      0-11      Norway - Finland          0-2

 April 23:  Switzerland - Austria           Germany - Finland		20:00

 April 24:  Russia - Sweden                 Czech republic - France	15:30
            Canada - Italy                  USA - Norway		20:00

 April 25:  Sweden - Switzerland            Finland- Czech republic  	15:30
            Russia - Canada                 Germany - USA		20:00

 April 26:  Austria - Italy                 France - Norway		20:00

 
 PLAYOFFS:
 =========

 April 27:	Quarterfinals
		A #2 - B #3						15:30
		A #3 - B #2						20:00

 April 28:	Quarterfinals
		A #1 - B #4						15:30
		A #4 - B #1						20:00

 April 29:	Relegation
		A #5 - B #6						15:30
		A #6 - B #5						20:00

 April 30:	Semifinals
		A #1/B #4 - A #3/B #2					15:30
		A #4/B #1 - A #2/B #3					20:00

 May 1:		Relegation						14:30
		Bronze medal game 					19:00

 May 2:		FINAL							15:00

--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54708
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: WC 93: Results, April 22


 1993 World Championships in Germany:
 ====================================

 Group A results:

 RUSSIA - SWITZERLAND  6-0 (2-0,1-0,3-0)

 1st: RUS 1-0  Alexei Yashin 1          5:23
      RUS 2-0  Alexei Yashin 2         16:45
 2nd: RUS 3-0  Ilia Biakin 1            7:13
 3rd: RUS 4-0  Andrei Khomutov 3        3:47
      RUS 5-0  Ilia Biakin 2            4:13
      RUS 6-0  Sergei Sorokin 1        13:50

 Penalties: RUS 7*2min 1*5min game penalty, SWI 9*2min
 Referee: Rob Hearn, USA
 Attendance: 3,500

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

 CANADA - AUSTRIA  11-0 (6-0,2-0,3-0)

 1st: CAN  1-0  Shayne Corson 1         9:51
      CAN  2-0  Rod Brind'Amour 2      10:24
      CAN  3-0  Paul Kariya 1          12:42
      CAN  4-0  Gerry Galley 1         18:23
      CAN  5-0  Eric Lindros 2         19:11
      CAN  6-0  Rod Brind'Amour 3      19:46
 2nd: CAN  7-0  Eric Lindros 3          0:31
      CAN  8-0  Eric Lindros 4          8:50
 3rd: CAN  9-0  Brian Savage 1         13:37
      CAN 10-0  Brian Benning 1        16:26
      CAN 11-0  Geoff Sanderson 3      17:55

 Penalties: CAN 2*2min, AUT 2*2min
 Attendance: 7,500

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 USA - FRANCE  6-1 (3-1,1-0,2-0)

 1st: FRA 0-1  Antoine Richer 1         5:02
      USA 1-1  Adam Burt 1              8:32
      USA 2-1  Rob Gaudreau 1          18:15
      USA 3-1  Jeff Lazaro 1           18:29
 2nd: USA 4-1  Adam Burt 2             10:54
 3rd: USA 5-1  Shjon Podein 1           8:03
      USA 6-1  Rob Gaudreau 2          16:25

 Penalties: USA 3*2min, FRA 2*2min
 Referee: Darren Loraas, Canada
 Attendance: 1,511

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

 FINLAND - NORWAY  2-0 (0-0,0-0,2-0)

 1st:
 2nd:
 3rd: FIN 1-0  Juha Riihijarvi 1        4:16
      FIN 2-0  Kari Harila 1           12:37

 Penalties: FIN 5*2min, NOR 7*2min
 Referee: Sven-Erik Sold, Sweden
 Attendance: 3,600

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 The best goal scorers:

 Eric Lindros		CAN	4
 Rod Brind'Amour	CAN	3
 Dieter Hegen		GER	3
 Andrei Khomutov	RUS	3
 Geoff Sanderson	CAN	3
 Ilia Biakin		RUS	2
 Adam Burt		USA	2
 Viacheslav Bykov	RUS	2
 Jiri Dolezal		CZE	2
 Mike Gartner		CAN	2
 Rob Gaudreau		USA	2
 Patrik Juhlin		SWE	2
 Frank Pajonkowski	FRA	2
 Bernd Truntschka	GER	2
 Jarkko Varvio		FIN	2
 Alexei Yashin		RUS	2

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Some WC stats:

 *  Fastest goal in a WC game after first face-off:

    10 seconds:	    Steve Larmer, Canada  1991 in a game vs Sweden (ended 3-3)
                    Boris Michailov, USSR   1978

 *  Most consecutive WC games without a loss:

    47:   USSR    1978-85
    38:   USSR    1963-68
    37:   Canada  1937-49
    35:   USSR    1985-90
    27:   Canada  1950-54

--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54709
From: b_hart@odin.dev.macsch.com (Bill Hart)
Subject: Re: If Oilers go to Hamilton


In article <1993Apr26.023650.16749@spang.Camosun.BC.CA>, ua256@freenet.Victoria.BC.CA (Tom Moffat) writes:
|>
|>
|>If the Oilers move to Hamilton what division will they play in .
|>-- 
|>Tom Moffat
|>Victoria B.C.
|>Canada
|>
As a guess, Hamilton would be put into the Midwest, with either
Winnipeg or Dallas moving to the Pacific.

Bill
b_hart@macsch.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54710
From: Karim Edvard Ahmed <ka0k+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Minnesota Shame?

>I've been under the impression that Minnesota was one of, or possibly,
>THE hockey state in the U.S.  So why is the team moving to a city in
>Texas?  Is it that the owner is a greedy, self-serving profiteer, or
>were the Stars really not making a profit?  Or was the city or whoever
>owned the arena doing some price gouging?


Norman Green claims that he has lost money over the last three years
that he has owned the team.  When he bought the team, it seemed kind of
obvious that he was going to have to deal with a few years in the red,
before the team started making a profit again.  He gave the impression
that he was willing to do so.  He claimed two years ago that the team
needed to average only 8000+ fans per game in order to pull a profit,
but this season the team averaged 12000+ fans, despite increasd ticket
prices.  I think the team's attendence and play was clearly in an upward
trend, which leaves me dumbfounded as to how he could ignore that in
deciding to move.  He was even offered the many concessions he rudely
demanded, such as guaranteed season ticket sales, cheap rent at the
other two arenas in town, etc.

Oh well, I guess the bottom line is $$$.  Green wanted immediate huge
returns in Dallas, and wasn't willing to wait another year or so in MN. 
Dallas gave Green a pretty stellar deal to play there (although I feel
Minnesota's was quite reasonable), and he also has some cronies down
there as well.  All this means, is that Minnesota is without an NHL team
for a year or two.  Too bad for the NHL.

KEA 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54711
From: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner)
Subject: Re: Winnipeg vs. Vancouver

In article <C63p9q.205@unixhub.SLAC.Stanford.EDU> grogers@ravel.SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Greg Rogers) writes:
>>> MKR@stud.hsn.no (MORTEN KRISTIANSEN) writes:
>>>
>>>Read this all you Canucks fan out there!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>>>Winnipeg are going to kick Vancouvers butts so badly they are not going to
>>>be able to sit down for weeks.
>>>And no this is NOT a joke.
>>>A prediction before the fourth game in Winnipeg:
>>>
>>>Winnipeg 6 Vancouver 2  (2-0,1-2,3-0)
>>>Selanne, Steen score a couple of goals each!!!
>>>
>>>Winnipeg to win Stanley cup playoffs.>>
>>
>>
>>To all you Jets Fanatics...Ha ha ha.
>>To normal Jets Fans...It was a pretty good fourth game. More physical
>>play than I've seen in the first three games.>
>>
>>These moronic posts that have continued throughout the year about how
>>the Jets will cremeate the Canucks and Selanne will smash Bure into the
>>boards is so full of *%it. Why don't you take a cue fromm Daryl and just
>>wait 'till its over before you make more of a fool of yourself???>
>>
>>I'm not going to predict anything about the Canucks. They are up 3-1 and
>>are coming back home, but I'm not going swing any *%it around until the
>>series is wrapped up.
>>
>>Tony
>
>Bravo Tony,
>
>I too am sick of all the mindless, fanatical, blind faith Jets fans who could 
>prpbably predict the end of the world more accurately than the coutcome of a
>playoff series.
>
>Now I will admit that I am a mindless, fanatica, blind faith Canucks fan.
>But unlike those from Winterpeg, I do not need to vent my spleen upon the 
>world as to how great my team is.  I know, I have confidence in them, and
>that's enough.
>
>Granted, the Jets finished the season hot, and the Canucks were having trouble,
>but Vancouver has built themselves a reputation for being a playoff team.  
>Just ask any Flames fan.  They may not win every series, but they alway fight
>to the end.  I'll admit that last year was not great, but if they combine
>the work ethic of the past with the new tallent of the present, they will
>be tough to beat (note: I did not say they would pummel every team they meet 
>and destroy the greatest player playing today).
>
>Now, like any Canucks fan, I would love to see them take the cup.  I feel
>they have a good chance to make it out of the Smythe, and a 50-50 shot at
>Detroit (I can't see them losing to St. Louis).  If Pittsburgh makes it to
>the cup, I'd have to put my money on them (Yes even if they're facing the
>Canucks).  If Buffalo, Montreal, or Quebec beat Pittsburgh, I'd choose the
>winner of Vancuover and Detroit to take the cup.
>
>Oh, and one parting note for the Jets fans: Just how many times has 
>Winnepeg made it to the finals? 8')
>
>Go Canucks
>
>Greg
>
Devorski unfortunately helped to taint an otherwise brilliant display
by MacLean.  The Canucks tied up the Jets so tightly that I thought that
they were mailing them.

BTW, Greg...next time, don't fall asleep in geography class, it's pretty
sad when a fellow in Norway can spell Winnipeg properly and a guy in
North America can't.

One more thing...how LONG has Vancouver been in the NHL?  How many
championships do they have?  

Oh yeah...and I CAN go to the Arena and see not one, not two, but
*six* championship banners hanging from the rafters.  3 Stanley Cup
banners, and 3 Avco Cup banners.  My NHL guide says that Vancouver has
won the Cup once (as many times as the rockin' town of Kenora has won it!)

Daryl Turner : r.s.h contact for the Winnipeg Jets 
Internet: umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca  
FidoNET: 1:348/701 -or- 1:348/4  (please route through 348/700)
Tkachuk over to Zhamnov, up to Sel{nne, he shoots, he scores! 
The Jets win the Cup!  The Jets win the Cup!
Essensa for Vezina!  Housley for Norris!  Sel{nne for Calder!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54712
From: admiral@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Steve C Liu)
Subject: Caps postseason fortunes

Okay, the Caps AGAIN are about to break out the golf clubs but before they
do, does anyone have the history of the Washington Capitals' futility
record in the playoffs? I remember that Terry's first year was the first
year that the Caps finally made it to the third round but before under
Brian, I noticed that every other year the Caps got to the second round
and the years in between they didn't make it past the first round. Is this
trend continuning? 
The Admiral, a hopeless Caps fan.
P.S. We still remember that 3 OT loss to the Islanders! Aurggghhhhhhhhh!
____________________________________________________________________________
|Admiral Steve C. Liu          Internet Address: admiral@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu|
|1993 World Champions  - Baltimore Orioles - Why Not? - Series in the Yards|
|         1992-1993 Stanley Cup Champions -  Washington Capitals           |
|*****The Bangles are the greatest female rock band that ever existed!*****|
|   This sig has been brought to you by... Frungy! The Sport of Kings!     |
|"My God man, drilling holes through his head is not the answer!" Dr. McCoy|
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54714
From: mblumens@itsmail1.hamilton.edu (Mary Blumenstock)
Subject: FAQ for this group

Could someone please tell me how I can access the FAQ for this
group?  I'm relatively new, and would like to read it, but
although I've seen it mentioned, I've yet to see it posted.  Is
it archived somewhere or does someone post it to the group on a
regular basis?  or, is it distributed on-demand?  I'd appreciate
any help anyone can give me.  

Thanks in advance.

			- Mary

p.s.  Please respond via email as the articles expire within 24
hours on my mail system, and I don't always get a chance to read
everything.  Thanks.


===============================================================
Mary Blumenstock               mblumens@itsmail1.hamilton.edu

                  GO RANGERS!!!!  
                     (...next year, of course ;-()


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54715
From: chuck@mks.com (Chuck Lownie)
Subject: Re: Leafs vs Wings

In article <94233@hydra.gatech.EDU> gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak) writes:
>In article <1993Apr22.133739.11317@mks.com> chuck@mks.com (Chuck Lownie) writes:
>>Potvin by the way has played very well.  He kept Toronto in the game
>>last night during those 5 penalties in the first period by making great
>>saves, but they did end up getting to him in the second.
>
>	The guy has a GAA of 6.00 in the playoffs, and he's "played very
>well"??? Hahahahahaa. What a joke.
>

Did you watch the games????


-- 





Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54716
From: chuck@mks.com (Chuck Lownie)
Subject: Re: Leafs vs Wings

In article <16BB89B12.LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu> LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall) writes:
>In article <1993Apr22.133739.11317@mks.com>
>chuck@mks.com (Chuck Lownie) writes:
>>In last nights game Toronto received FIVE penalties, Detroit none.  If
>>--
>>
> 
> Which game were you watching?  Didn't you see the third period when
>the Wings had 2 penalties called on them and then a delayed penalty?
>The Leafs had a 2 man advantage for about a minute and a 1 man advantage
>for another minute or two and the Leafs still couldn't score.
>  And I wonder how the Leafs scored a powerplay goal if, according
>to you, they never had a powerplay.
>  In the Detroit paper today, it said there were 40 penalties called in
>last night's game. And you're saying Detroit had none of those penalties?
>I'm guessing you only watched the first period. I have to admitt the Leafs
>did get alot of penalties in that period where as the Wings didn't get
>many if any at all (Haven't looked at the box scores yet).  But, the
>ref more than made up for it in the third period.
> 
>Laurie Marshall
>Wayne State University
>Detroit, Michigan
>Go Wings!!!

My apologies for the typo - I meant the Wings had 5 power plays in the
first period and the Leafs none.  

As well, my point isn't that the refs were biased, just that they were
calling a lot of penalties, which works to the benefit of the Wings.

Having the ref call a whole bunch of penalties against one team then
calling a bunch against the other to "make up for it" takes a lot away
from what could have been a great game.



-- 





Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54717
From: hechel@vms.huji.ac.il
Subject: switzerland at WC93

what did happen to the swiss team ? last year they reached the semi-final
and now after 3 matches no points and even no goals !!
after the 0:1 against Italy it seems they lost any hope and were
overrun 0:6 by the russian team.
now it seems that they have to work hard not to be relegated to the
B-level. does anybody know if this WC is the qualification tournement for
the olympic games '94 in Lillehammer or are some teams already
qualified for them.

hopp schwiiz
           daniel

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54718
From: reiniger@ug.cs.dal.ca (Darren Reiniger)
Subject: Re: CBC: Canadian for ESPN.

In article <1993Apr24.011729.1@uwovax.uwo.ca> 35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca writes:
>Hooray, I hear on TSN that the Jets have won a game, Selanne
>getting a hat-trick!
>
>Of course, here in GOD'S COUNTRY (read Ontario!) I couldn't
>see that game, nor any other in the VAN-WPG series so far,
>because our beloved CBC figures no one out here cares about
>this series (which has looked pretty competitve so far...
>
>On Monday and Wednesday nights, CBC could have shown the Toronto-
>Detroit game, done the news, then picked up Winnipeg-Vancouver.
>They didn't.  Tonight?  You guessed it, Toronto-Detroit, the
>news (not the end of the Jets game), then Calgary-LA.
>
>SO, if it's "Hockey Night in Canada", why can't this Ontarian see
>one of the two series with two Canadian teams?  Is this too much to
>ask?
>
>Paul Badertscher
>35002_2765@uwovax.uwo.ca

 I'd like to echo these sentiments.  This is the worst coverage I can 
 ever remember seeing on CBC.  As soon as the game ends, I can count to 30,
 and by that time, they've signed off the air.  No post game interviews,
 no updating of late scores, nothin'.  TSN is really putting CBC to 
 shame.  I only hope the later round coverage improves, I mean, who
 really wants to see CBC PrimeTime News instead of hockey.

 My $.02,
  Darren

-- 
 Darren Reiniger                   reiniger@ug.cs.dal.ca || arishem@ac.dal.ca
 Centre For Marine Geology, Dalhousie University, Halifax, N.S., Canada
| People who wonder where this generation is going should remind themselves   |
| where it came from in the first place.                                      |

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54719
From: dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca (Deepak Chhabra)
Subject: Re: Stewart homered the Wings!!

In article <andy.bgsu.edu-250493225109@m248-100.bgsu.edu> andy.bgsu.edu (Ryan ) writes:

(Roger Maynard) wrote:
 
>> Once again the Leafs overcame the Red Wings in what was possibly the
>> most exciting game played yet in this playoff year.

Perhaps it was the most exciting game played yet that YOU have seen.  For
most of us who watch teams around the league with interest and objectivity, 
it was *nowhere* *near* the most exciting game...

>Paul Stewart called *the* single worst game I've seen this year.  
>Federov's major was obvious, and I don't dispute it.  However, Chaisson's 
>penalty shouldn't even have been a penalty, let alone a major and a
>game misconduct.  The 5-minute+ game misc. call is for high sticking only. 
>There is no "blood" penalty.  Just because  Chaisson barely touched the 
>poor sap, and he hit the dasher and bled profusely doesn't mean it is a 
>penalty. 

Unfortunately, the instant replay is not used on hits.  At first, I
immediately thought "5 and a game" because the hit _looked_ much more severe
from an intent-to-injure perspective than it was.  After seeing the replay,
I'd say it deserved 2-4 minutes for boarding (it was careless any way you 
slice it).  If Stewart had replay, I do not think Chaisson would have gotten
5 and the game.

>In the second period, behind Potvin, Probert had the puck, and was
>going to get out front, and was _tackled!_  I couldn't believe the no-call.

This no-call was bullshit, I agree. I admire Stewart for letting them go, but
Probert *looked* *up* saying where the hell is the penalty?  I've never
seen Probert whine either (he doesn't need to).  Now, if Probie
decides to put Wendel through the boards, he's probably gone, right?

>I don't remember who (on the Leafs) touched the puck 
>on Racine's shot towards the end of the game (43.2 seconds left), but Stewart
>called it out of play, last touched by Detroit.  Everybody in the Garden,
>including the Linesmen knew it.  Yzerman protested, but Stewart just 
>laughed, and really "homered" the Wings.

This was also bullshit.  But once again, no replay.  It was Rouse, btw. I'm
really pissed that the linesmen didn't correct the call either....it's b.s.
when the officials refuse to admit they made a mistake.  

>But, when it all comes down to it, [Wings played like shit.....]

Yes.  The calls you describe should not have the difference in a Detroit
loss.  I picked the Leafs to win Game 3 on emotion and adrenalin, but the
Wings have no excuses for Game 4.  They should be the superior team.

The call that pissed me off the most was Anderson getting 4 for putting his
stick in somebody's eye.  That was _the_ most dangerous stick infraction I
have seen in a long time, and everybody in the damn league _knows_ he's an
asshole when it comes to stickwork.  Four lousy minutes.  Bullshit call. 
Murray should send the tape in.  Or a Wing should hammer the living shit out
of him.

--
dchhabra@stpl.ists.ca

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54720
From: white@venus.cc.hollandc.pe.ca (Take me Baby!)
Subject: Canada 5-0 after preliminary round at World Champioships


	Team Canada defeated Russia 3-1 to finish the priliminary 
round unbeaten at 5-0. Scoring for the Canadians were Kevin Dineen of 
the Flyers, Eric Lindros also of the Flyers and Paul Cariya of the 
Maine Black Bears. Cariya has put on quite a show at the Worlds. He is 
sure to be drafted in the top 3 this summer at the NHL entry draft.

	Canada defeated Italy 11-2 and Austria 11-0 before meeting the 
Russians on Sunday. The Canadians now face Finland in the Quarter -
finals on Tuesday.


Kevin White
white@cc.hollandc.pe.ca
Holland College
Ch'town PEI Canada


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54721
From: jake@rambler.Eng.Sun.COM (Jason Cockroft)
Subject: Leafs: What happened?

How did the Leafs turn it around??? 


I couldn't get the Leaf games on the weekend in CA.

Did the Leaf defense wise up overnight?
Did the Leafs get in the slot or 
was it just "fluke" goals in a goalie duel? 
Did the Wings turn off the jets or muscle?  
What gives here?

I caught game 1 on satellite.  I figured my Leafs were washed.
This is a _major_ turnaround.   Very few predicted this. 
How, how, how did it happen?   

Wing and Leaf perspectives welcomed!


-jake.



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54722
From: MLINDROOS@FINABO.ABO.FI (Marcus Lindroos INF)
Subject: Re: Caps moving ?????

In <berger.735512230@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu> berger@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu writes:

> I've heard rumors recently from reliable sources that Abe Polin, the
> moron who owns the Washington Capitals is looking to move the team
> after this season or next.  Milwaukee was mentioned as the team's
> potential destination.  The person who told me this is strongly
> affiliated with the NHL and has been extremely accurate in the past
> with news of this sort.  Does anyone know if this is so or has
> heard anything of the sort?  With Baltimore's AHL team gone, that would
> leave the area with only an ECHL franchise in Baltimore- not good.
> Thanks
> 
>    David

WHY!!! DC/Baltimore is one of the top media markets (=the only thing the NHL
seems to care about these days), they've been doing far better than the NBA
Bullets at the gate for the last five years. The team has been a perennial
contender and fan support has been good to excellent . . . Why should Pollin
move to city that's five times smaller but has as many teams in other pro
sports. I don't get it...  
 
> -- 
> 
> 					David

MARCU$

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54723
From: mmilitzo@scott.skidmore.edu (matthew militzok)
Subject: 1992 - 1993 FINAL NHL PLAYER STATS

If you are interested in receiving the final player stats for
the 1992-1993 NHL Season as well as playoff box scores, stats and
scores/updates...
then e-mail my stat server

mmilitzo@skidmore.edu

the subject of the message must be:	STATS

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54724
From: golf@phoenix.oulu.fi (Jouko Kylmaoja)
Subject: Finland-Norway in WC

	Finns had to do their best last night when they played against Norway
in world champs. After two periods the score was still 0-0. This game was 
quite much similar to the first game Finland played  (against France).
The norwegian goalie was very good and a bit lucky, too. In the third period
Juha Riihij{rvi scored 1-0 from a rebound, the time was around 5 mins or so.
The second goal was scored by Kari Harila, who shot straight from a faceoff
behind the Nowwegian goalie. Saku Koivu, the 18-year-old center got his first
point of this tournament. Saku Koivu played very well througout the game and he
was awarded the best player of the game- prize. Despite the fact that he is
quite small in size he handles the puck very well and is a fast skater. 
I think that we will hear from this guy in the future.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54725
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER (***QUITE LONG***)

In <catcherC630J6.87F@netcom.com> catcher@netcom.com (Paul W. Francisco) writes:

>As she said, the letter is addressed to Bettman.  The post (which, though
>having pretty much the same content, is an entirely different entity) was
>addressed to all.  When she puts the letter in the mail I doubt it will
>say "To: All".  I figure she wanted to let people here see what was in it
>since it is a topic that interests a lot of folks here.  That's an entirely 
>different purpose than sending the letter to Bettman.

And it is a damn good thing that she did post it since she claims to represent
people in rec.sport.hockey.

>Unfortunately...

>The "largest computer networks in the world" phrase is a definition of 
>the Internet, not a group as a whole that she claims to represent.  As

Her sole purpose in mentioning the net, as Steve Gallichio has already 
pointed out, is to lend weight to her points through association with the
internet.  There is no other reason to mention the internet.  This is 
misrepresentation and if the internet was a private corporation Alison
would be leaving herself wide open to all kinds of civil suits.

>for the business of whether or not it is large, it is large compared
>to say, the number of folks on r.s.h. who are sending a letter to thank
>him for changing the names, at least to this point.  And just for my

This is not a letter.  It is a petition claiming to represent a large
proportion of rec.sport.hockey users, and by implication, a significant
number of internet users.  65 names can in no way be considered a 
"large" proportion of rec.sport.hockey which, while we have no way of
counting actual readership, is accessible to hundreds of thousands of
people.  65 persons is no more than a fly's fart in a windstorm.
 
>own curiosity I thought I'd look up the "official" definition of large
>in the dictionary.  It reads:

>large - 1.  having more than usual power, capacity, or scope.    
>        2.  exceeding most other things of like kind in quantity or size.

Gee.  You looked up "large" in the dictionary?  What next?  Two syllable 
words?

>Now I have no idea how many letters Bettman may have gotten on the issue
>or how many people may have signed them.  65 people may be up there, 
>thereby validating definition 2.  I would also wager that the geographical
>range of signatures is quite large, which would give it a large scope.

Let me suggest that the only place you are likely to envy the magnitude of 
65 is when you are looking for ways to beef up your IQ scores.

>>He might be impressed by the size of the list of names.

>Why would he be impressed with this unless it were "large"? 

As I said, he *might* be impressed by the size of the list of names.  But 
it would have to be considerably larger.  But even this definition does
not account for the original context from which you lifted this sentence.

>I personally don't know whether or not I agree with the letter.  I have
>very mixed emotions about it.  I like the names as they are, and don't
>think they make it that difficult to learn the game, but there might be
>a shred of validity to the change.  

Well then what the hell is your point?  You don't really know if you have
an opinion about the hockey issue but you do know that you don't like me.  
Is that it?


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                 ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54726
From: Anna Matyas <am2x+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Pens fans reactions


Susan Dart writes:

>Amongst Penguins' fans there seems to be an inner calm that I've never
>experienced before this year with the Pens. The players and the fans have so
>much confidence in the team this year. We're savoring every game and saving
>our energy for the Stanley Cup.

That's a good way to put it.  It's a quiet confidence.  I don't feel like
I have to defend this team anymore. 

The Devils are a puzzle to me.  They have long been one of the few teams
I always dreaded playing.  Their D isn't quite what it used to be but they
still usually play us pretty tough.  I just can't figure it out.  At least
last night they mounted an attack.

>	2. Watching some of the Devils players being interviewed, I could
>	   see in their faces and eyes, that they really don't have any
>	   confidence. They are left speechless when asked what more they
>	   can to do to beat the Pens. They act as though they know it's
>	   a hopeless task.

Bernie Nichols was interviewed after Game 2 on the late news.  He was
shaking his head in disbelief over Barrasso, saying that Tommy is like
another defenseman out there and how difficult it is playing against him.
Then he got this far-away look on his face, his voice started trailing
off and he said, "It just isn't right...it just isn't fair..." and he
tried to muster a smile.

>I'm really impressed with Bowman's coaching tactics - he's had an answer for
>every move that Brooks has thrown at the Pens.

As far as coaching goes, a Pens/Islanders match-up should be pretty good.

One guy I feel sorry for in all of this so far is Chris Terreri.  I'm sure
Tom Barrasso knows how he feels.  For so long Tommy would look up and not
have a teammate in sight.  Terreri's teammates really left him out in the
cold in the first two games.

Mom.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54727
Subject: Flames Final Stats and Playoff News
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

News:
=====
For the first time all season, the Flames are now injury-free. The only player
remaining on the limp is center Carey Wilson who, even when healthy, is not 
a major part of the team. 

Trent Yawney did not score a goal all season until the last regular season
game against San Jose. He potted his first of the year in that game, and has
also scored goals in both Game 1 and Game 2 against Los Angeles. 

Thoughts on Game 1:
==================

The Flames played horribly in dropping the first game of their series with
Los Angeles 6-3 on Sunday afternoon. They seemed more interested in throwing
big hits than in scoring goals. They physically dominated the Kings, but that
was the only area they dominated in. The game plan was to rush the net and 
try and take advantage of a young, inexperienced L.A. defence and the shaky
Kings goaltending, but those plans fell by the wayside while the Flames
conducted a steady march to the penalty box. Particularily stupid was Theoren
Fleury taking a five minute major and a game misconduct for slamming Warren
Rychel's face into the dasher while Rychel was on his knees. 

Goaltender Mike Vernon played well and could not really be faulted for the
loss, despite his well-publicized poor record in afternoon games. He got
very little support from his defence in clearing the front of the net and 
sweeping away rebounds. In fact, Marty McSorley's goal actually went in off
Chris Dahlquist's skate in front of the net. 

Thoughts on Game 2:
==================

The Flames came back strong in the second game, evidently aware of the
potentially fatal consequences of losing both the first two games on home ice.
The first period was fairly even, with the edge going to the Kings. But Calgary
came out strong in the second period and simply dominated the Kings, scoring
five goals to take a lead they never relinquished en route to a 9-4 win. 

The deciding factors in this game were faceoffs and special teams. Calgary
dominated on faceoffs as they did in Game 1, but they were able to make better
use of the won faceoffs in this game than they did in the first one. Calgary
also went 3-for-5 on the powerplay while L.A. only went 1-for-8 and gave up
a shorthanded goal to Joel Otto. L.A.'s powerplay goal also came late in the
game with the outcome already decided. The Kings' powerplay failed them when
they needed it most, in the 1st and 2nd periods. 

The Flames lost RW Greg Paslawski with a suspected shoulder injury when he
was leveled by Alexei Zhitnik right after scoring Calgary's 7th goal. Charlie
Huddy left the game for the Kings with a groin injury. 

The game was marred by stupidity in the last minute. First, Craig Berube of
Calgary took a five-minute major for fighting plus a game misconduct for
instigating when he went after Tony Granato for no apparent reason. Granato
drew a minor for some strange reason. (Turtling perhaps). This was followed
30 seconds later by Warren Rychel drawing a major, minor, and game misconduct
for hitting Frank Musil in the face with his stick and then instigating a
fight. Musil got a fighting major for some similarily strange reason. Hardy and
Yawney went toe-to-toe and both got double minors. (Gregson thought that Musil 
turtling amounted to fighting, but that Yawney and Hardy throwing punches at 
each other was just roughing? Where's this guy from.....)
 
Upcoming games:
==============
Friday April 23, at L.A.
Sunday April 25, at L.A.
Tuesday April 27, home to L.A. 
Thursday April 29, at L.A. (if necessary)
Saturday May 1, home to L.A. (if necessary)

Injuries:
========
C  Carey Wilson, indefinite with recurring knee injuries (Dec 10)

1992-93 Calgary Flames final regular season statistics.
========================================================

#   Pos.  Name                  GP     G      A     Pts     +/-    PIM
===============================================================================
14  RW    Theoren Fleury        83     34     66    100     +14     88
26  C     Robert Reichel        80     40     48     88     +25     54
20  D     Gary Suter            81     23     58     81     -1     112
10  LW    Gary Roberts          58     38     41     79     +32    172
25  C     Joe Nieuwendyk        79     38     37     75     +9      52
42  RW    Sergei Makarov        71     18     39     57      0      40
 2  D     Al MacInnis           50     11     43     54     +15     61
29  C     Joel Otto             75     19     33     54     +2     150
28  LW    Paul Ranheim          83     21     22     43     -4      26
23  RW    Greg Paslawski        73     18     24     42     +3      12
22  RW    Ron Stern             70     10     15     25     +4     207
15  LW    Brent Ashton          58     10     13     23     +11     52
11  LW    Chris Lindberg        62      9     12     21     -3      18
34  D     Roger Johansson       77      4     16     20     +13     62
18  D     Trent Yawney          63      1     16     17     +9      67
 3  D     Frank Musil           80      6     10     16     +28    131
39  C     Brian Skrudland       39      7      7     14     +4      65
16  LW    Craig Berube          77      4      8     12     -6     209
 7  D     Michel Petit          35      3      9     12     -5      54
 4  D     Kevin Dahl            61      2      9     11     +9      56
33  C     Carey Wilson (I)      22      4      7     11     +10      8
 5  D     Chris Dahlquist       74      3      7     10      0      66
21  D     Alexander Godynyuk    27      3      4      7     +6      19
19  RW    Todd Harkins          15      2      3      5     -4      22
12  LW    Paul Kruse            27      2      3      5     +2      41
35  G     Jeff Reese            26      0      4      4      0       4
 6  D     Greg Smyth            35      1      2      3     +2      95
30  G     Mike Vernon           64      0      2      2      0      42
27  RW    Thomas Forslund        6      0      2      2      0       0
??  C     Shawn Heaphy           1      0      0      0      0       2
??  LW    Patrick Lebeau         1      0      0      0      0       0
 1  G     Andrei Trefilov        1      0      0      0      0       2

#   Name             GP   Min.   GAA   W  L  T   EN  SO GA   SA    Save% 
============================================================================
30  Mike Vernon      64   3732   3.27  29 26 9   4   2  203  1799   .888
35  Jeff Reese       26   1311   3.26  14  4 1   0   1   71   631   .889
 1  Andrei Trefilov   1     65   4.62   0  0 1   0   0    5    39   .872
===========================================================================
    Team Totals      84   5119   3.30  43 30 11  4   3  283  2469   .886

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54728
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: Oiler's rumour - Team moving? Press conference next week

In <1993Apr26.143902.24502@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca> golchowy@alchemy.chem.utoronto.ca (Gerald Olchowy) writes:

>So what's stopping Pocklington from going to a bank and borrowing $41
>million dollars to pay off his Treasury Branch loans...I was reading

According to the recent TSN report Peter Puck is not paying any interest
on the Treasury Branch loans.  That's a lot of green.

>somewhere than Pocklington business have gross revenues of about
>$500 million per year...I don't think he would have much problem
>"borrowing from his VISA to pay off his Mastercard" if he wanted to.

Again, according to TSN, virtually everything that Peter Puck has already 
has liens against it.  Of course we can't really be sure of this. 

>Pocklington is at the point of maximum advantage right now...and
>he is basically right in that Northlands (which is a creature of the
>City of Edmonton) must give him a better deal in the era of escalating
>salaries.  Northlands and the city benefitted as much as he did during
>the eighties from the Oilers...and wealth generated by the Oilers
>success was shared...but the finanical viability of small market teams
>has radically changed in the space of a couple of years, and for
>the Oilers to remain viable and competitive, they need much more of
>the revenue stream from concessions, parking, and building advertising
>as most every other professional sports franchise in North America
>has.  What was once a fair agreement that shared the wealth is now
>Northlands sucking the blood out of the Oilers franchise.

The Oiler rationale regarding the renegotiation of player contracts is
that a deal is a deal.  Sather has spouted this repeatedly.  Pocklinton
has a contract with Northlands until 1999.  A deal is a deal.  Perhaps
if he included the income he has received from his sale of assets (players
such as Gretzky) and the income he has received in expansion fees with
his revenues he wouldn't be losing money.  He has admitted pulling this
money out of the Oiler franchise to put into his other businesses. 

>The Oilers have paid several times over what the Coliseum cost to
>build, and bring Edmonton prestige and recognition throughout the
>world that is essentially priceless...to nickel-and-dime the Oilers
>just so Northlands can use revenue sucked out of the Oilers to 
>subsidize their horse-racing operations is insanity.

I think that Pocklington has received ample provincial subsidization.  
I can't really blame him for going after municipal subsidization but 
he is certainly not entitled to it.  Pocklington has "sucked" revenue
out of the Oilers in order to prop up his failing business interests.
Pocklington is not to be trusted.  I doubt very much that any Oiler
team will ever again make the playoffs under Pocklington's stewardship.
As soon as a player shows himself to be a competent NHL'er and expects
to be paid accordingly he is shipped off for younger players and or
draft picks.


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                 ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54729
Subject: Another travesty at the Joe Louis
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

(Detroit, April 21)

Most knowledgable observers once again watched in shock as the Detroit Red
Wings again beat the best goaltender in the world six times en route to 
another easy victory over the best team in the NHL. 

For the best goaltender in the world, Felix Potvin, six was a bad number as
he surrendered six goals and collected six minutes in penalties in reponse
to the goon tactics employed by the inferior Red Wings team. 

								Alan

P.S. We told you this would happen, Roger. Didn't we? I love it.....

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54730
Subject: Re: Nords 3 - Habs 2 in O.T. We was robbed!!
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

 In article <18APR93.25909598.0086@VM1.MCGILL.CA> JBE5 <JBE5@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA> writes:
>Aargh!
>
>Paul Stewart is the worst and most biased ref. presently in the NHL.
>He called a total of 4 penalties on the Habs and one on the Nordiques.
>The Nords' penalty came in O.T.  Stewart, being an ex-Nordique himself,
>was looking to call penalties on the Habs while letting the Nords
>get away with murder...WE WAS ROBBED!!!!

If my powerplay was as bad as Montreal's, I'd be thanking Stewart for calling
as few penalties as possible. Quebec's powerplay is lethal and it is to their
advantage to have a penalty-filled game where they can clean up with their
superior powerplay. 

Montreal really lost that game (and game 2) because Patrick Roy is well on
his way to having another one of his trademark awful playoffs. The man is
truly overrated. Quebec has scored six goals on Roy and four, perhaps five, 
were quite stoppable. 

								Alan


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54731
Subject: Re: WC 93: Results, April 18
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

In article <1r1439$c9t@access.digex.net>, steveg@cadkey.com (Steve Gallichio) writes:
> What is the policy regarding players and the minor league playoffs versus WC?
> I know that the Rangers are holding back Kovalev, Zubov, and Andersson for
> Binghamton, but I also know that the Whalers wanted Michael Nylander to play
> for Springfield, while Nylander wanted to play for Sweden. The Whalers allowed
> the NHL to decide, and the NHL chose the WCs. How does this differ from the
> Rangers and Oilers? Did the Whalers have to go through the league, or could
> they have forced Nylander to play in Springfield?

As long as a player is under contract to an organization, he is obligated to
play only where that organization tells him to play or gives him permission
to play. The Rangers are certainly within their rights to force Zubov and
Andersson to report to Binghampton. 

It certainly does reflect a lack of class on the part of the Ranger 
organization, however. Is having Binghampton win the Calder Cup really more
important to them than keeping their players happy? 

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54732
Subject: Re: NHL Team Captains
From: caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca

>And, while we are on the subject, has a captain ever been traded, 
>resigned, or been striped of his title during the season? Any other 
>team captain trivia would be appreciated.

Brad McCrimmon was the captain of the Flames when he was traded to Detroit
following the 1989-90 season. This was during the off-season though.

There's countless examples of captains being traded, I'm sure.

								Alan

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54733
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER & Roger's Response

In <1993Apr26.054703.29827@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> phoenix@startide.ctr.columbia.edu (Ali Lemer) writes:

>Gee, what a coincidence. He doesn't share my views. Perhaps that's why his
>name is not on the list to accompany the letter! Maybe I should write a 
>disclaimer at the end: "Mr. Bettman, nota bene: Roger Maynard does NOT
>agree with this letter!" I know he'd be so worried, otherwise!

You wouldn't have to put my name at the bottom if you simply appended a 
standard disclaimer that the opinions expressed in your petition in no
way claim to represent the views of either rec.sport.hockey or the internet
as a whole.  You have surely seen these disclaimers appended to the postings
of many who work for companies and post on the net.  The disclaimers, clever
though some of them may be, are there for a reason.

 
-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                 ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54734
From: rskirsky@athena.qualcomm.com (Ray Skirsky)
Subject: Re: Where's Roger?

Speaking of Roger and ilk, whatever happened to good ol' gln?  I had him in
my kill file since last year's playoffs and now that I've moved to a new
news reader which doesn't have kill files, I find that he's gone.  I must
admit, however, that unlike gln, Roger seems to know something about the game
as long as the subject doesn't touch on the Leafs.

Ray Skirsky 
rskirsky@qualcomm.com

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54735
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER & Roger's Response

In <catcherC6317q.8LB@netcom.com> catcher@netcom.com (Paul W. Francisco) writes:

>I wouldn't say that the letter clearly implies representation of the
>views of a group that you belong to.  It represents a subset (that you
>don't belong to) of a larger group (which you do, if only because this
>isn't a moderated group).

And you can bet that I wouldn't be the only one not belonging to the
moderated group if it was moderated by an anally-retentive little
dullard like yourself. 

>Look, there are several ways to state an opposing viewpoint.  Three
>that come to mind are as follows:

I hardly need you to presume to lecture me on how to communicate my points
of view.  This "posting" that you have made is the second on the subject of
the NHL letter and you have yet to communicate your opinion on the matter.
Instead you content yourself with flaming me.

>3) Say it directly and obnoxiously.  Result:

Result:
Moronic little busy bodies like yourself take advantage of a perceived
opportunity to post rules for others to live by. 

>You realize that anything you say can, and most certainly will, be
>used against you.

Well if using it "against" me means you are going to post something of
significance then by all means go ahead.  I insist.  Otherwise why don't
you just go back to sleep or do whatever it is that you do when you are 
all by yourself...

-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                 ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54736
From: neath@brazil.psych.purdue.edu (Ian Neath)
Subject: Re: Why Blues Pulverized Chicago WeenieHawks

sesrock@andy.bgsu.edu (Stuart Esrock) writes:

2) Hitting....Hawks tried to outmuscle Blues but could not do it.
Instead, Blues matched Hawks hit for hit and crunched the shit out of
them in game #4.....Scud line, Shanahan, Butcher, and Zombo particularly
took turns bashing favorite targets like Chelios.

3) Skating.....when the Hawks tried to outskate Blues, they could not do
that either.  Nelson Emerson finally showed up and skated circles around
flat footed Chicago defense.....Hedican, Felsner, Ron Wilson and others
also proved that with old cement skaters like Goulet and Keith Brown,
Blues could lap Chicago in a 400 M relay race.


     I agree with #2 but you are wrong about #3.  In fact, the only
     point where the Hawks in any way matched the Blues was when
     they quit trying to outmuscle and instead tried to outskate
     the Blues.  They scored and took the lead.  Too bad it was
     Game 4 and they then took some stupid penalties.  When the
     Hawks skated, they outskated the Blues and took control.


--
      Ian Neath        | There are four kinds of people in this world:
neath@psych.purdue.edu | cretins, fools, morons and lunatics - U. Eco

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54737
From: lor@cbnewsk.cb.att.com (edward.lor)
Subject: Re: Caps postseason fortunes

In article <1rhddoINN4l9@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu> admiral@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Steve C Liu) writes:
>Okay, the Caps AGAIN are about to break out the golf clubs but before they
>do, does anyone have the history of the Washington Capitals' futility
>record in the playoffs? I remember that Terry's first year was the first
>year that the Caps finally made it to the third round but before under
>Brian, I noticed that every other year the Caps got to the second round
>and the years in between they didn't make it past the first round. Is this
>trend continuning? 
This is not a trend. The Caps were done. Goneso in five games, and it saves
us Caps fans a lot of pain.

I mean, it would be more painful if the Caps were up 3-1, watching them 
tumbled when they need ONE MORE WIN to clinch the series. How many times
have they done that in their history?

1985 up 2-0 in a five game series against the Isles, lost 3 straight
1987 up 3-1 against the Isles, lost 3 straight
1992 up 3-1 against the Pens, lost 3 straight

In other words, when they were about to clinch with 3 games to go, they 
were a pitiful 2-9, the lone wins being 

1) a sweep of Philly in 1984
2) the 1990 win against the Rangers in the Patrick finals, the ONLY TIME 
they managed to get out of the division.

Actually, Saturday's blown lead wasn't anything new. We all know the Caps
are famous lead blowers in crucial playoff games. Examples:

1) game 4 against the Isles, 1985, led 4-2 after two, lead series 2-1,
gave up 4 goals in the 3rd period, including the game winning goal in the
last minute. After that goal, Bobby Carpenter botched a penalty shot.
Series tied 2-2, lost game 5 a few days later.

2) game 4 against the Rangers, 1986, led series 2-1, led by 2 in the 3rd 
period, blew it. Lost game in OT and three consecutive games.

3) game 6 against Pittsurgh, 1992, led series 3-2, led by 2 in 2nd period.
Blew it and the series.

4) game 3 against Isles, 1993, series tied 1-1, led by 2 after 2. Blew it.

5) game 4 against Isles, 1993, trailed series 2-1, led by 3 in 2nd period.
Blew it again.

When they were leading by 3 in game 4, I said to myself: "if they blew this
lead, the series is OVER". They have lost all the momemtum. The Islanders
believe they can come back no matter what the score is.

I am still waiting for a Cap goalie who can carry the team, who can 
completely shut down the opposition when they are hanging on their dear 
lives in a crucial game.

>The Admiral, a hopeless Caps fan.
>P.S. We still remember that 3 OT loss to the Islanders! Aurggghhhhhhhhh!
Well, some teams such have it and some teams just don't. When the Caps
were frustrated year in year out by the Islanders, I was thinking "wait
until Potvin/Bossy/Trottier/Smith retire". Well, they retired (even though
Trottier was still able to haunt the Caps on a Pens uniform), yet another
generation of Islanders were still doing the same thing. Well, I guess 
it has nothing to do with the players.

-- 
                                          Edward Lor
                                          lor@cbnewsk.att.com
                                          

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54738
From: howarth@sbctri.sbc.com (David Howarth)
Subject: Re: Winnipeg vs. Vancouver

In article <C63p9q.205@unixhub.SLAC.Stanford.EDU>,
grogers@ravel.SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Greg Rogers) wrote:
> 
> I feel
> they have a good chance to make it out of the Smythe, and a 50-50 shot at
> Detroit (I can't see them losing to St. Louis).  

Gee, they lost to St. Louis twice this year. Maybe you should have your
eyes checked. 8^)

> Go Canucks
> 
> Greg

Go Blues....the Rodney Dangerfield team....They get no respect....except
in Chicago mabee...

     /\   David Howarth                              howarth@sbctri.sbc.com
    ///\   Southwestern Bell Technology Resources Inc.
   ///  \   Advanced Technology Laboratory
  ///    \   1010 Pine, Rm 635  St. Louis,  MO.  63101 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54739
From: howarth@sbctri.sbc.com (David Howarth)
Subject: Re: Maybe next year Hawks

In article <1993Apr26.125444.5073@vax.cns.muskingum.edu>,
jbrown@vax.cns.muskingum.edu wrote:
> 
> Belfour played well, but I hardly saw any offense from any hawk.  What I want
> to know is where was Roenick.  

As far as I can tell, he was right next to Bassen!

Don't you guys love it when people like me come out of the woodwork...8^)

     /\   David Howarth                              howarth@sbctri.sbc.com
    ///\   Southwestern Bell Technology Resources Inc.
   ///  \   Advanced Technology Laboratory
  ///    \   1010 Pine, Rm 635  St. Louis,  MO.  63101 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54740
From: dpapp@muskwa.ucs.ualberta.ca (Papp Denis)
Subject: Regular season 93/94 pool

1993-1994 NHL Hockey Pool
By
Denis Papp and Chris Stoochnoff
 
Rules:
 
- Pick 17 players (3 LW, 3 C, 3 RW, 3 LD, 3 RD, 2 Goalies)
  You may pick ANY 17 players from any team.
 
- Points for players are as follows:
        - 1 point per goal
        - 1 point per assist
        - 1 point per 10 PIM
 
- Points for goalies are as follows:
        - 2 points per win
        - 1 point per tie
        - 1 point per assist
        - 1 point per 5 PIM
        - 2 points per shutout
        - 100 points per goal
 
Entries:
 
-Entries can be sent (by mail or ascii text file) to Chris Stoochnoff or Denis
Papp on Hard Wired BBS (434-7996). 
-Due date for entries is the first day of regular season play. After that,
no more entries will be accepted (unless it is just slightly late. If that is
the case, there will be a small penalty applied to the team).
-internet users can send email to dpapp@muskwa.ucs.ualberta.ca
 
Prizes:
 
Prizes have not yet been considered. They could range from nothing to free
time on Hard Wired BBS or even something else (if you have any suggestions...
please feel free to put your two cents worth in).
 One idea is to get whoever is willing to to submit an equal amount of
money, and that will go to be the prize money.  The prize money will
go to the top team who has submitted to the prize pool.  A list
of all people who submit money will be posted, as well as those who
didnt - if it is done this way. 
Cost:
 
The cost... ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!!! There is absolutely no fee for this pool.
 
Note:
 
-If you have any questions, please feel free to send them to Denis Papp or
myself (Chris Stoochnoff). The players positions (ie. Brett Hull is Right
Wing) will be decided by the year book I will be using. So, if you do not
know a certain players position, or you are not completely sure what position
he plays, then ask me and I'll tell you.
 
-And for a great time, call the Hard Wired BBS at (403)-434-7996 (this will be
the location where the pool standings will be displayed).
 
Internet Users:
 
-To contact Denis Papp, just email (dpapp@muskwa.ucs.ualberta.ca). Standings
will be distributed by email as well.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54741
From: sclark@epas.utoronto.ca (Susan Clark)
Subject: Re: Leafs: What happened?

Hi guys....

What happened?
	1.  Potvin didn't let six goals by.
	2.  Wendel and Andreychuk woke up.
	3.  Home ice and LOTS of yelling in the Gardens gave the Leafs
		the emotional edge.
	4.  Refs calls (especially last night) tended to favour Leafs.

	A couple of comments:

	1.  On Gilmour:  Just because the guy isn't one of the three
	stars doesn't mean he was not leading the team.  Someone posted
	the playoff point total and he's in something like fifth or sixth
	place....plus, he walked away with the Molson cup (given for
	accumulating points from the three star selection) during the
	regular season.

	2.  On the officiating:  I've heard gripes from both ends on this
	one.  Emotions are very high in this series;  the rivalry is
	one of the stronger ones I know of.  I do have to agree that the
	officiating last night was pro-Leaf in general (except for whoever
	missed that slash on Gilmour's hand).

	3.  In general:  I STILL think Detroit has one of the better
	chances vs. Pittsburgh (though I think the Leafs would do better
	against the Blues....but not as well if they made it out of the
	division). Problem is, I like both these teams, though I'm
	supporting the Leafs on the underdog principle.  D

	By the way...Gilmour tiring out is a lot like Bob Probert not
		playing aggressive hockey....
	By the way....I'm not any sort of expert, nor do I claim to be.
		I just like watching a good matchup.


	tee hee hee...ooops!
	Susan



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54742
From: maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard)
Subject: Re: More Hart trophy stuff....

In <1993Apr26.162805.1534@adobe.com> snichols@adobe.com (Sherri Nichols) writes:

>In article <1993Apr24.010132.3405@mtroyal.ab.ca> caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca writes:
>>The Hart trophy goes to the player most valuable to his team, not to the best
>>player in the league. So your above arguement is really worthless. 

>Personally, I always thought that "most valuable to his team" was silly.
>Why should the best player in the league be penalized because he plays on a
>team with other good players?  Why should a lesser player be picked solely
>because he's the best player on a weak team?   Wouldn't the weaker team be
>helped even more by the best player in the league?  Doesn't the presence of
>the best player in the league make the other players on the team look
>better, too?

The Hart Trophy was orginally awarded in a time where people did not think
in terms of who was the "best" player, rather in terms of who was the most
valuable to the team.  And "valuable to his team" was not, and should not
be, considered synonymous with "best".  We are talking about a time when
honour and attitude, not measurable skills, were the most important assets
a player brought to his team, his league and his sport.  This was before
the onslaught of professionalism which has clearly denigrated what was 
formerly the foremost peacetime pursuit of glory.

The Hart Trophy is not a prize.  It is an honour.


-- 

cordially, as always,                      maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca 
                                           "So many morons...
rm                                                 ...and so little time." 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54743
From: jab55062@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (The World Reknown Jason Boskey)
Subject: Re: Blues sweep Hawks

While I will first congratulate the Blues for their victory, I think it must
be realized that the primary reason the Blues were able to win was Curtis   
Joseph.  When a goalkeeper gets hot, there is little an opposing team can do.
Joseph should be given the entire city of St. Louis, because otherwise there 
would probably be a game 6 scheduled.  

As for the game on Sunday.  The Blues caught a few breaks, without a doubt.
One was the Referee constantly watching the Blackhawks, looking for reasons to
give them penalties.  Second, The Blues first goal resulted because the puck
hit the linesman as the Blackhawks attempted to clear.  No linesman, no shot
for Brett(I can redirect anything)Hull to redirect.  On another of St. Louis'
goals, Belfour was tripped from behind as he went to make the save by someone
who didn't belong in the crease, which means it was a St. Louis player.
Finally, the overtime goal was caused because someone kept Belfour from getting back to the crease.  No goalie, no way to stop the shot.

I congratulate St. Louis for beating the Hawks.  It will be a shame to see
Bryan Murray finally advance to the Campbell Conference Finals because Joseph
won't be able to stop the powerful Red Wing attack.


____________________________________________________________________________
|The World Reknown Jason Boskey           | Mail: Bosk@uiuc.edu            |
|Known throughout the World as The Bosk   |"Christ, you know it ain't easy,|
|All Rights Reserved, All Lefts Enhanced  |You know how hard it can be,    |
|-----------------------------------------|The way things are goin'        |
|"Here they come spinning out of the turn"|They're gonna crucify me"       |
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54744
From: mmb@lamar.ColoState.EDU (Michael Burger)
Subject: TEAM POOL - Standings

Standings reflecting 2 completed series in Round 1:

    Participant                Points   Final 4
 1. roland_behunin                  5   CAL-6 QUE-7 QUE-7 
    Dave_Wessels                    5   VAN-7 PIT-6 PIT-5 
 3. Barfly                          0   TOR-6 BOS-7 TOR-6 
    Dean's                          0   DET-5 PIT-5 PIT-7 
    Oz                              0   LAK-6 BOS-6 LAK-6 
    Garry                           0   TOR-6 BOS-6 BOS-4 
    Brian_Bergman                   0   DET-6 PIT-6 DET-6 
    Mopar_Muscle_Men                0   CHI-5 PIT-6 PIT-5 
    BH's_Last_Place_Picks           0   CHI-5 PIT-6 PIT-5 
    Milton_Keynes_Kings             0   DET-6 PIT-5 PIT-5 
    Sam_&_His_Dogs                  0   DET-6 PIT-5 PIT-5 
    Ye_Ding                         0   DET-6 PIT-5 PIT-6 
    Tampere_Stars                   0   CHI-6 PIT-6 PIT-6 
    The_Mighty_Hedgehogs_Of_Myllyp  0   CHI-6 BOS-6 BOS-6 
    Homesick_Hawaiian               0   VAN-7 PIT-6 PIT-5 
    Killer_Kings                    0   CHI-6 WAS-6 CHI-6 
    Puggy_Greybeards                0   DET-5 PIT-5 PIT-5 
    Ottawa_Bearcats                 0   TOR-5 PIT-6 TOR-6 
    Andrew_Kirk                     0   TOR-6 PIT-6 PIT-5 
    Muller_n_Walker                 0   DET-6 PIT-6 PIT-6 
    Excalibur                       0   DET-6 PIT-4 PIT-6 
    Rednecks_from_Hockey_Hell       0   DET-7 BOS-5 BOS-5 
    The_@$%@#$%_Rangers_of_1940     0   CHI-6 PIT-7 PIT-6 
    Jeff_Phelps                     0   DET-6 PIT-6 PIT-5 
    Arctic_Circles                  0   DET-6 PIT-6 PIT-4 
    Sludge                          0   DET-6 PIT-6 DET-6 
    The_Logistician                 0   DET-6 PIT-6 DET-7 
    Hillside_Raiders                0   CHI-6 BOS-6 BOS-7 
    Danielle                        0   CHI-5 QUE-7 QUE-7 
    Stanias_Stars                   0   CHI-6 BOS-7 BOS-6 
    BloodHook                       0   DET-5 PIT-5 PIT-5 
    Gilles_Carmel                   0   CHI-6 PIT-7 PIT-7 
    Pasi_Fr{nti                     0   LAK-7 PIT-5 PIT-6 
    Evan_Pritchard                  0   VAN-6 PIT-6 PIT-5 
    Skriko_Wolves                   0   DET-7 PIT-5 PIT-5 
    Rangers_Blow                    0   CAL-7 PIT-6 PIT-4 
    Sean                            0   DET-5 PIT-5 PIT-6 
    Schott_Shooters                 0   CHI-6 PIT-5 PIT-5 
    Gary_Shiff                      0   TOR-4 PIT-6 PIT-4 
    Mike_Burger                     0   DET-7 PIT-6 DET-7 
    Darse                           0   DET-6 PIT-6 PIT-6


*******************************************************************************
*  Mike Burger                    *  My Canada includes, Quebec, Ontario,     *
*  mmb@lamar.colostate.edu        *  the Maritimes, the Prairies, and Florida *
*  A Beginning Computing TA Stud  *  four months a year.                      *
*  over 500 students served       *    --Royal Canadian Air Farce             *
*******************************************************************************
*      University of Michigan - 1990  --  Colorado State University - 199?    *
*******************************************************************************


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54745
From: pjotr@ludd.luth.se (Peter Sj|str|m)
Subject: Re: WC/Finland

In <1993Apr25.220033.7284@math.ucla.edu> dstein@oak.math.ucla.edu (David Stein) writes:

>Jarkko Ketolainen writes:

>>Disaster! Finland was beaten by Czech 1-3 (0-0,1-1,0-2).
>>Finland will be 4th of pool B and will most certainly meet Canada in the
>>quarter final on wednesday 28th.

>  Look at the situation positively... the Finns can now kick Canada out! :-)

	They did last world cup and eventually lost tp Sweden in the final!

		/Peter

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54746
Subject: Re: Wings News and Playoff Thoughts
From: kwolfer@eagle.wesleyan.edu

In article <1993Apr23.010100.28651@mtu.edu>, kcsmith@mtu.edu (Smith) writes:
>>
>>I don't think he's shown that he's good enough to carry Detroit to the Cup.
>>The team may be good enough to reach the finals, but Cheveldae is their 
>>Achilles Heel.  You *must* have goaltending in the playoffs, and 
>>Cheveldae looks like an overmatched 2nd or 3rd stringer (which he probably
> 
> I guess I don't know of too many 2nd or 3rd string goalies that could post
> over 30 wins in a season.  Chevy has done that the past two seasons playing 
> behind a defense that is not exactly the best in the league.  His 34 wins 
> this year were not all against Toronto and for those who look at Vincent Rien.
> stats and think he should be starting, take a look at the teams he played
> against (teams like San Jose, Ottawa, and TB) any NHL goalie could post a decent
> record playing teams like that night in and night out.
> 
>>is).  Look for Detroit management to remedy the situation in the offseason.
> 
> I really don't see this happening.  If they didn't think Cheveldae could do the
> job they would of traded for somebody this year, after all why wait until next
> year when there were goalies available this year.
> 
>>Hey, I may be wrong, but after watching him kick rebound after rebound into
>>the high slot, I don't think he can carry them in the tough games (i.e.
>>those not against Toronto).
> 
> Better to kick out rebounds than to let goals in.
>>
>>If St. Louis gets past Chicago, watch for Joseph to carry the Blues past
>>an otherwise vastly superior Red Wings club.
>>
> Joseph is hot, but so are the Wings.  They have scored six goals in both of
> their games so far with Toronto, supposively one of the leagues best defenses.
> I guess if they end up playing for the Norris title we'll see what happens.
> 
>>
> 
>> Dr.D [The Devils Advocate]        "Drinkin' & women & guns don't mix..."
>> v057p7nk@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu
>> awkorbut@acsu.buffalo.edu                      - Mark Arm
> 
> 
> kcs
> 
> Wings in '93, or hopefully by '94.


As far as Cheveldae is concerned, he is a decent goalie.  The most logical
trade in the offseason to me would be between Detroit and NY Rangers.  I'm sure
if Beezer would be traded he would enjoy the opportunity to go back to his
roots in Detroit.  He would be a valuable asset to the Wings and Perhaps the
Rangers could get a Zombo in return?  Beezer got a few good years in him and
the opportunity to get a fresh start would energize his play.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54747
From: jack.petrilli@rose.com (jack petrilli)
Subject: hawks lose (yawn)

On April 25,  maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) wrote:

M --> 
M --> Look for the Leafs, led by a healthy Doug Gilmour and a confidence-restored
M --> Felix Potvin to do the Blues in 6.  The Leafs will have 3 more games with the
M --> Wings and that should give Joseph a few extra days to pass those horshoes.
M --> 

HA! Roger the dodger is back! (on the bandwagon, that is.)

- Jack

 * Please Tell Me if you Don't Get This Message
---
   RoseReader 2.10  P003814 Entered at [ROSE]
   RoseMail 2.10 : RoseNet<=>Usenet Gateway : Rose Media 416-733-2285

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54748
From: vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu (David Vergolini)
Subject: Montreal versue Quebec

  Did anyone see the Montreal - Quebec game yesterday?  It was tight right down
to the last second of the third period.  In the overtime Roy and Hextall played
like they were gods.
  Ok, so Montreal won!  They deserved it after getting their first goal in
overtime waved off because the puck was hit in with a high stick.  Their second
goal in overtime was also replayed, but I could not tell if it was the Montreal
player who kicked it in.  The puck definitely was not directed in by a stick.
Anyways, Montreal is back into the series.







                                                Dave Vergolini
                                                Michigan State University
                                                vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54749
Subject: Re: Where are all the Bruins fans???
From: kwolfer@eagle.wesleyan.edu

In article <93113.010900RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>, Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu> writes:
> I'm just wondering where all the Bruins fans are???  I mean they woofed it
> up with about 1,000,000 posts during the regular season saying that their
> fave team was going to kick everyone's @#$ in the playoffs and win the Stanley
> Cup.  While I see nothing wrong with a little ranting and raving, I'm just
> curious why all the Boston faithful have stopped posting.  I mean I haven't
> even see just one little Boston fan post, 'cept for the Bruins fans that
> aren't cocky.  Well, maybe they're all out on the golf course or something,
> but I don't know, I'd sure like to see where all those Bruins fans are at :-)
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ** Robbie Po **          1993's STREAKERS   "We do what comes naturally!
> Patrick Division Semi's  -- PGH PENGUINS -- You see now, wait for the
> PENGUINS 4, Devils 3     1991, 1992 STANLEY possibility, don't you see a
> Penguins lead, 3-0       CUP CHAMPIONS :-)  strong resemblance..."-DG '89


Here in the middle of Connecticut there are plenty of Bruin Fans, many who have
let me know in no uncertain terms that the Rangers choked down the stretch.  I
think the Bruins are doing the same exact thing the Rangers did, they're
playing too tight!!  Who's responsibility is it to check Mogilny?  He has
gotten off a number of quality shots on goal of which there are many rebounds
which are not being cleared by the B's defense.  It's too bad the B's might not
get the opportunity to play Pittsburgh again.  I would really enjoy seeing
Ulfie get beat up by Neely.  We all hate Ulfie, but would love him on are
team!!


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54750
From: andrew@idacom.hp.com (Andrew Scott)
Subject: USENET Hockey Draft winning team (regular season)

I was asked to post the team log of this year's winning team in the regular
season draft.  Here 'tis:

%begin Dave_Wessels
...reading team 'Dave_Wessels' from database
%log all

Team log:

Name			Team	Points	Value	Bought	Week	Sold	Week
Trevor Linden           VAN	72	72.0	78.8	pre	70.4	10
Cliff Ronning           VAN	85	85.0	74.6	pre	97.8	6
Robert Reichel          CGY	88	88.0	58.9	pre	51.4	8
Pat Verbeek             HFD	82	82.0	63.0	pre	64.3	7
Pat Falloon             SJ	28	28.0	62.7	pre	46.8	7
John MacLean            NJ	48	48.0	55.0	pre	27.5	7
Eric Lindros            PHI	75	75.0	55.0	pre	105.0	6
Rick Tocchet            PIT	109	109.0	81.2	pre	106.9	9
Greg Adams              VAN	56	56.0	63.0	pre	93.8	8
Mike Ricci              QUE	78	78.0	60.3	pre	79.8	6
Joe Juneau              BOS	102	102.0	55.0	pre	110.9	6
Kevin Hatcher           WSH	79	79.0	57.4	pre	54.6	6
Teemu Selanne           WPG	132	132.0	55.0	pre	109.2	6
Pavel Bure              VAN	110	110.0	77.5	pre	108.9	8
Dixon Ward              VAN	52	52.0	55.0	pre	61.2	7
Russ Courtnall          MIN	79	79.0	60.7	6	84.6	14
Darren Turcotte         NYR	53	53.0	60.7	6	72.1	14
Christian Ruuttu        CHI	54	54.0	61.9	6	52.2	13
Petr Nedved             VAN	71	71.0	59.3	6	84.5	12
Petr Klima              EDM	48	48.0	65.3	6	--	--
Tony Granato            LA	82	82.0	56.0	6	75.6	12
Steve Duchesne          QUE	82	82.0	88.7	6	92.2	13
Alexander Mogilny       BUF	127	127.0	103.8	6	118.8	14
Ray Sheppard            DET	66	66.0	55.0	7	63.0	15
Steve Larmer            CHI	70	70.0	64.9	7	79.7	17
Vincent Damphousse      MTL	97	97.0	64.9	7	94.5	15
Tony Amonte             NYR	76	76.0	63.0	7	63.0	16
Brendan Shanahan        STL	94	94.0	55.0	8	--	--
Corey Millen            LA	39	39.0	55.0	8	48.9	16
Johan Garpenlov         SJ	66	66.0	55.0	8	55.9	15
Kelly Kisio             SJ	78	78.0	63.0	8	72.3	15
Pat Elynuik             WSH	57	57.0	57.0	9	56.7	16
Benoit Hogue            NYI	75	75.0	61.6	10	74.3	20
Pat Flatley             NYI	60	60.0	55.0	11	59.9	18
Rod Brind'Amour         PHI	86	86.0	74.1	12	81.0	19
Michal Pivonka          WSH	74	74.0	55.0	12	--	--
Joe Mullen              PIT	70	70.0	55.0	12	--	--
John Cullen             TOR	50	50.0	55.0	13	55.7	19
Stephane Richer         NJ	73	73.0	55.0	13	61.8	19
Jeff Norton             NYI	50	50.0	64.0	14	56.3	20
Glenn Anderson          TOR	65	65.0	55.0	14	--	--
Ray Bourque             BOS	82	82.0	65.6	14	--	--
Bernie Nicholls         NJ	60	60.0	72.8	14	67.8	20
Andrew Cassels          HFD	85	85.0	56.0	14	--	--
Dmitri Kvartalnov       BOS	72	72.0	82.1	15	--	--
Tomas Sandstrom         LA	52	52.0	59.7	15	43.6	22
Joe Sakic               QUE	105	105.0	109.6	15	--	--
Rob Blake               LA	59	59.0	59.5	16	--	--
Derek King              NYI	76	76.0	68.3	16	70.9	22
Michel Goulet           CHI	44	44.0	55.0	16	45.4	23
Mike Modano             MIN	93	93.0	90.5	17	--	--
Dmitri Khristich        WSH	67	67.0	55.0	18	--	--
Alexander Semak         NJ	79	79.0	62.6	19	--	--
Nikolai Borschevsky     TOR	74	74.0	69.3	19	--	--
Mike Donnelly           LA	69	69.0	70.5	19	--	--
Jeff Brown              STL	78	78.0	69.1	20	--	--
Thomas Steen            WPG	72	72.0	55.0	20	--	--
Kevin Dineen            PHI	63	63.0	55.5	20	--	--
Mario Lemieux           PIT	160	160.0	134.9	22	--	--
Wayne Gretzky           LA	65	65.0	55.0	23	--	--
You have 1.9 cash points.

As of week 28, your team is placed 1 (of 262 teams).
-- 
Andrew Scott                    | andrew@idacom.hp.com
HP IDACOM Telecom Operation     | (403) 462-0666 ext. 253

During the Roman Era, 28 was considered old...

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54751
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: BLUES SWEEP BLACKHAWKS!

In article <93115.191211RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>, Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
says:
>(Michael Virata Sy) says:
>>Michael Sy
>>mvs1@cec2.wustl.edu (DEVILS CONSULTANT)
>>And HOW 'BOUT THOSE DEVILS!  4-1 over the Penguins.  HAHAHAHAHAHAH!
>

>Attention all Penguins fans:  If The Pens  win game 5,  show some laughter
>in that e-mail box address listed above.  Thanks! :-)
>

Attention Penguins fans once again, apparently 99.999% of you understand that
this was just a joke (Hence the :-) next to it) but one idiot on here doesn't
as he got pissed at me and sent me two hate e-mails telling me that this is
wrong.  I have no intentions of sending e-mail to anyone should the Pens win
tonight, and I really do not expect/do not intend to lead any of you to send
this poster e-mail either.  It was NOT a serious request.  If you didn't know
that (which you probably did) then don't do it.  Thanks.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
** Robbie Po **          1993's STREAKERS   "We do what comes naturally!
Patrick Division Semi's  -- PGH PENGUINS -- You see now, wait for the
Devils 4, PENGUINS 1     1991, 1992 STANLEY possibility, don't you see a
Penguins lead, 3-1       CUP CHAMPIONS :-)  strong resemblance..."-DG '89

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54752
From: Robbie Po <RAP115@psuvm.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: Caps postseason fortunes

In article <1rhddoINN4l9@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu>, admiral@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu (Steve
C Liu) says:
>Okay, the Caps AGAIN are about to break out the golf clubs but before they
>do, does anyone have the history of the Washington Capitals' futility
>record in the playoffs? I remember that Terry's first year was the first

Don't give up so soon.  A lot of Burgh fans didn't give up at 3-1 last year.
You gotta believe!  (Hard as that may seem)  With the Caps with the #1 power
play in the playoffs and #1 penalty killing (according to Mike Lange) all
the Caps have to do is make sure it doesn't go OT...as that was Boston's and
Chicago's demise.  OT can be a curse.


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54753
From: "William K. Willis" <ww1a+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Where are all the Bruins fans???

Good point - there haven't even been any recent posts about Ulf! 
Secretly, I'm convinced that he's responsible for the Bs being down 3-0
to Buffalo, somehow.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54754
From: vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu (David Vergolini)
Subject: Buffalo Sabres

  Ok, Buffalo fans.  I am a Red Wings fan, but am amazed at how the Sabres are
beating up on the Bruins.  Is there any reason for this?  Is it Grant Fuhr or
Mogilny and Lafontaine?  I would like to hear from you since I do not know much
about the Sabres.





                                                Dave Vergolini
                                                Michigan State University
                                                vergolin@euler.lbs.msu.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54755
From: Andy <2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
Subject: Re: CBC: Canadian for ESPN.

In article <C63tEF.63C@cs.dal.ca>, reiniger@ug.cs.dal.ca (Darren Reiniger) says:
>
> I'd like to echo these sentiments.  This is the worst coverage I can
> ever remember seeing on CBC.  As soon as the game ends, I can count to 30,
> and by that time, they've signed off the air.  No post game interviews,
> no updating of late scores, nothin'.  TSN is really putting CBC to
> shame.  I only hope the later round coverage improves, I mean, who
> really wants to see CBC PrimeTime News instead of hockey.
>
> My $.02,
>  Darren

This was a concession to Mansbridge and CBC News, they argued that if you're
going to play  havoc with the schedule, you should  at least make sure that
Prime Time is aired as soon as possible. News got a commitment that the
post-game show would be scrapped and that the network would go to PTN within
one minute or so of the game  ending.

As for the earlier comments about CBC being "Ontariocentric" frankly
the no doubleheader decison goes both ways, people in the West cant  see
the Leafs  and people in Central Canada can't see the Jets game. The
reason for the decision was CBC's feeling they couldn't sell advertising
for six hours of hockey in  one night.

 As for who wants to see news over hockey, a lot of people. CBC always gets
plenty of complaints about juggling the news schedule.



>
>--
> Darren Reiniger                   reiniger@ug.cs.dal.ca || arishem@ac.dal.ca
> Centre For Marine Geology, Dalhousie University, Halifax, N.S., Canada
>| People who wonder where this generation is going should remind themselves
>|
>| where it came from in the first place.
>|

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54756
From: Mamatha Devineni Ratnam <mr47+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Real FAns



There was a discussion about how real fans were ones who respect their teams
no matter ow bad they are. That's bullshit. Anyone who would follow the
Pens or the Pirates in parts of the early eighties on a devoted basis are
losers. It's OK to follow and be concerned about your home team. But
to  give them respect even when it is clear the management and the players suck
should not be required of a true fan.A  true fan would follow the team in
troubled times to the extent that they could discuss how to improve the team.

When I visit PIttsburgh, I'll refuse to go to a Pirates game since I think
the management has given PIttsburgh a team which could have been much better
even if they couldn't sign Barry Bonds. Lert's say the Pens start doing to
their own team what the Oilers have done this year and what the Whalers have
done in recent years, I would be hard pressed to show much enthusiasm for the
team. I'll still follow it and bitch about it. But I won't waste my
money on mediocre teams.

-P{ravin Ratnam

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54757
From: umward10@news.cc.umanitoba.ca (Derek Ward)
Subject: Re: Winnipeg vs. Vancouver

David Downie (dave@downie.commerce.ubc.ca) wrote:
: 
: Speaking of Paddock--what's he doing slagging Sandlak?  If Sandlak puts  
: his mind to it, he can be a physical presence and waking him up might be a  
: real mistake.

	Isn't Sandbag out with an injury now anyways?  Perhaps Paddock
meant to say that Momesso was the cheap short artist.  After all, that
would make more sense.

--
  ___   ___  ___   ___                     _  _  ___   ______
 / ./  /_   /__/  /_   /_./   | | Wpg   __// |_   |    \ 
/_/   /__  /  \  /__  /  \    | |      |__/  |_   |  __/     in '93!
umward10@ccu.umanitoba.ca <-> Computer Science <-> U of Manitoba 

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54758
From: ballb@carr113.alleg.edu (Brett Ball)
Subject:  Re:NHL letter

If you wanted to send your own letter to the NHL where would you send it?
Brett E. Ball

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54759
From: gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine)
Subject: Re: Winnipeg vs. Vancouver


In article G2o@ccu.umanitoba.ca, umturne4@ccu.umanitoba.ca (Daryl Turner) writes:

>Oh yeah...and I CAN go to the Arena and see not one, not two, but
>*six* championship banners hanging from the rafters.  3 Stanley Cup
>banners, and 3 Avco Cup banners.  My NHL guide says that Vancouver has
>won the Cup once (as many times as the rockin' town of Kenora has won it!)

Don't let this confuse anybody.  The Winnipeg Jets have never won the
Stanley Cup (or even come that close).  These Stanley Cup championships
go back a LONG way to about the turn of the century.  The Winnipeg
Victorias won one or more of these Cups- the Jets didn't win any of
them.

Can you think of anything more irrelevant to argue about a playoff
series going on today than who won more Stanley Cups around the turn
of the century??

Lets face facts.  The Canucks are leading the series 3-1.  The Canucks
dominated the Jets in their season series.  The Canucks did better in
the regular season than Winnipeg.  Who is the better team?  I think
that the facts show that Vancouver is better than Winnipeg.

Gregmeister

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54760
From: jgold@chopin.udel.edu (Jonathan Goldstein)
Subject: Re: The Amazin' Isles!!!!!!

WATCH OUT PITSBURGH HERE COME THE ISLES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



They said we wouldn't make the playoffs and we came in third
They said the Caps would beat us and they're not going to
They say that Pitsburgh has a 1:1 ratio of winning the cup but We'll prove them
wrong.


L E T S   G O    I S L A N D E R S!!!!!!!  Bring it back home





-- 
            //////////   /////////   //      //
                  //       //     //   // /   //
                 //        //     //   //  /  //
                //         //     //   /    / //

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54761
From: ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca)
Subject: Re: Don Cherry-New Pens Annoucer?

lli+@cs.cmu.edu (Lori Iannamico) writes:


>In an article published in this morning's Pittsburgh Post Gazette,
>KBL (the Pgh. cable sports channel) President Bill Craig has 
>confirmed that he has had preliminary talks with the Mouth of
>the North, Don Cherry.  Craig said he is interested in hiring Cherry
>as color commentator and for post game duties.

>Others being considered for the open broadcasting jobs are current
>Pens announcers Mike Lange and Paul Steigerwald (Craig spoke to
>both yesterday), KBL's Stan Savaran and Guy Junker, ESPN's Mike
>Emrick, MN broadcaster Doug McCloud, and TSN's Jim Hughson.

>KBL and the Penguins have just inked a new deal, giving KBL all 
>TV and radio rights to Pens games.  Plans are that KBL would like
>to have an entire night of hockey, starting with a 7:00 pre-game
>show and running to a post game show that would sign off about 11:00
>(depending upon length of the game).

>Don Cherry announcing Penguins games.  Yeah, and (to quote Pgh's
>goofy mayor) I'm the Queen of Sheba.

Considering how often and how badly he has slammed the Pens on Coach's 
Corner on Hockey Night in Canada, it would surprise me as well.  But then,
people will do anything for money, won't they?


>Lori
>Contact for the Penguins
>lli+@cs.cmu.edu

--Randy


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54762
From: ragraca@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Randy A. Graca)
Subject: Re: Wings will win

gballent@vancouver.UVic.CA (Greg  Ballentine) writes:


>In article 116@orasis.vis.toronto.edu, bdown@vis.toronto.edu (Brian Down) writes:
>>
[stuff deleted]

>For example, look at Pat Quinn of the Canucks (I am not saying
>that he is the best GM - merely a better one than Murray - and
>one I am very familiar with).

>He traded:
>Garth Butcher (a good player) and Dan Quinn (not in the NHL anymore)
>to St Louis for Cliff Ronning, Geoff Courtnall, Sergio Mommesso and
>Robert Dirk   - too good to be true right

I think this goes along with a comment you made in an earlier post -
namely, Quinn taking advantage of a major league bonehead for a GM
in St. Louis.  This trade was an absolutely stupid trade for St. Louis,
and it was not the only stupid trade that this guy made.  We can give
Quinn credit for being an opportunist here.

[stuff about other trades deleted]

>Plus his team has improved a much greater amount than Detroit since
>he took over with them.

How do you figure?  Both Vancouver and Detroit did the same thing last year:
They both won their division, they had close to the same number of points,
they both went down 3-1 in the first round of the playoffs before finally
escaping in 7 games, and they both got knocked out in the second round by
teams they should have been able to beat, with less talent.  (Specifically,
if I remember correctly, third place teams).  How does this make Vancouver
more improved?  Further, if I'm not mistaken, the Wings had more points than
Vancouver at the end of this season (albeit not many). 

>Gregmeister

--Randy


Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54763
From: Andy <2893684@QUCDN.QueensU.CA>
Subject: Re: If Oilers go to Hamilton

In article <1993Apr26.023650.16749@spang.Camosun.BC.CA>,
ua256@freenet.Victoria.BC.CA (Tom Moffat) says:
>
>If the Oilers move to Hamilton what division will they play in .

And won't they have to change their name to the "Steelers" or something.
The only significant deposits of oil around Hamilton are those caused by
the tire fire a  few years back.

Then again if the NBA can have the Utah Jazz or the L.A. Lakers (think about
it, what lakes are in L.A.) then I guess the NHL can have the Hamilton Oilers.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54764
From: Mike D'Amico <miked77@bnr.ca>
Subject: Senators sign top draft picks

Reports in Ottawa today say that the Senators have come to a verbal
agreement with last seasons first pick and 2nd overall choice Alexei
Yashin on a 5 year deal. As well the Senators have signed their second
round pick Chad Penney who is currently playing for the Sault Ste. Marie
Greyhounds in the Ontario Junior league playoffs.

Mike D'Amico
BNR
Ottawa, Ontario

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54765
From: yatrou@INRS-Telecom.Uquebec.CA (Paul Yatrou)
Subject: Re: Stewart homered the Wings!!

In <andy.bgsu.edu-250493225109@m248-100.bgsu.edu> andy.bgsu.edu (Ryan ) writes:

>  Paul Stewart called *the* single worst game I've seen this year.
> Federov's major was obvious, and I don't dispute it.  
>However, Chaisson's penalty shouldn't even have been a penalty, let alone
> a major and a game misconduct.
>

I don't "notice" refs and linesmen until the playoffs come around, and
yes I have to agree that Stewart called the *two* worst games I've seen
so far (Mtl-Quebec game 1, and last nights Toronto-Detroit game).

What's the scoop on this guy? Is he the latest incarnation of
KERRY FRASER??? Just because you are boneheadedly stubborn doesn't
make you a good ref!!! Making the right call does...

My votes for:
Best Ref: Van Hellemond
Most Improved: Koharski
Worst: Paul Stewart

(Oops, I don't really want to start a best/worst ref thread so don't
follow up ;-)

Paul Yatrou.

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54766
From: "Carl D. Lovejoy" <cl3d+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: Re: Don Cherry-New Pens Annoucer?

>KBL and the Penguins have just inked a new deal, giving KBL all 
>TV and radio rights to Pens games.  Plans are that KBL would like
>to have an entire night of hockey, starting with a 7:00 pre-game
>show and running to a post game show that would sign off about 11:00
>(depending upon length of the game).
> 
>Don Cherry announcing Penguins games.  Yeah, and (to quote Pgh's
>goofy mayor) I'm the Queen of Sheba.
> 
>Lori
>Contact for the Penguins
>lli+@cs.cmu.edu

    Well I was watching Hockey Hotline last night and Stan said that the
station (KBL) had been recieving calls all day concerning this subject. 
And the verdict was that almost exclusively NOBODY wanted that load
mouth, know it all blow hard, former Bruin whiner, Ulf Hating, scum
sucking, Pr*ck of missery in Pittsburgh on a permanent basis.  That's
not exactly what Stan said;  I did do a bit of interpriting.


The CMU Kiddie

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54767
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER (***QUITE LONG***)

[obnoxious name-calling deleted]

	Ok, who wants rm off of here? I say we get his net privleges revoked.
	Any seconds?

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54768
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER (***QUITE LONG***)


	Roger,

	    SHUT UP.

 	Thank you.

-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54769
From: Mark@tdkt.kksys.com (MARK STEIGER)
Subject: Minnesota Shame?

SH>I'm a hockey fan from way back, and maintain an interest as best I can
  >here in the hockey hinterlands (Oklahoma).  I'm hoping I can get a
  >reading from some of you about the move of the North Stars to Dallas.

SH>I've been under the impression that Minnesota was one of, or possibly,
  >THE hockey state in the U.S.  So why is the team moving to a city in
  >Texas?  Is it that the owner is a greedy, self-serving profiteer, or
  >were the Stars really not making a profit?  Or was the city or whoever
  >owned the arena doing some price gouging?

SH>As much as I'd like to see the NHL only a 3 hour drive from me, I
  >can't help but feel for the people in Minnesota, unless they truly
  >didn't support the team.

SH>Opinions, please.

I used to work for the Stars.  Minnesota supported the team to an
extent.  When I was there, we had quite afew sellouts (This was the
season after the cup run and during the finals).  Norm's main bitch was
that there wasn't enough luxury suites.  And, the ones he had were not
always full.  He wanted more boxes and wanted them full.  He was just
asking for too much from people that could go and see other hockey games
at High Schools for $5 or college for about $10 that would probably be
better.

Mark

  QMPro 1.01 41-6393  Radioactive cats are very, very HOT!

 * Origin: Origin Line Not Defined In GOEDIT (1:282/4018)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54770
From: farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu (Droopy)
Subject: Springfield Indians/AHL office

Here is something crossposted from the AHL mailing list:			

In a discussion between me and Chris Lerch, the subject of Springfield's 
1st round upset of the Providence Bruins
came up. Chris basically raised the possibility that the AHL 
hierarchy is biased in favor of the Indians. He noted that the offices
for the league are in Spring. and many ex-Indians are working for the AHL.
Furthermore, he also informed me that back a few years ago in the Cup 
finals between Roch and Spring, that the Amerks charged favoritism by the office
and that:

"...there were little questionable things liket he AHL president and
staff attending all games with the Springfield brass, including sitting
in their box for the game in Springfield and, according to the Rochester
media, openly cheering for Springfield."

Certainly this is something that is quite serious if any of this
is true. I don't know if this is anything more than whining on the
part of the Amerks (they have pulled this sort of crap against the
Wings before) but if true, this is somthing that seriously raises
questions about President Jack Butterfield's leadership.

BTW- This was posted with the permission of Chris

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    + Bri Farenell			farenebt@craft.camp.clarkson.edu   +
    + AHL, ECAC and Boston Bruins contact for rec.sport.hockey		   +
    + Adirondack Red Wings, Calder Cup Champs: '81  '86  '89  '92	   +
    + Clarkson Hockey, ECAC Tournament Champs: '66  '91  '93		   +
    + Glens Falls High Hockey, NY Division II State Champs: '90  '91       +
    + AHL fans: join the AHL mailing list: ahl-news-request@andrew.cmu.edu +
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54771
From: filinuk@staff.dccs.upenn.edu (Geoff Filinuk)
Subject: Wash/Isl OT game


	This comes indirectly from Al Morgani who works in the studio
for ESPN hockey.

	The management of ESPN was reluctant to leave the Pitt-NJ game 
(even though the outcome was certain) because of fear of the Wash-Ny game 
going to overtime.  When the Caps scored with :02 left to tie the game, Al said
he heard many people say f**K .!#$%.  
	ESPN is under contractual obligation to show baseball and COULD NOT
broadcast the OT of the hockey game.  Next year, ESPN2 will be introduced so 
baseball fans can watch baseball and hockey fans can watch hockey.

	GET OFF ESPN'S BACK AND STOP POSTING ARTICLES ON THIS SUBJECT!!!
There have been to many f****n complainers about this game that it's making me
sick.

Geoff Filinuk

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54772
From: golf@phoenix.oulu.fi (Jouko Kylmaoja)
Subject: WC, pool A

210493
Italy-Sweden 2-6 (0-1,1-2,1-3)
                       W D L             
	Canada      2  2 0 0  6-1  4
	Sweden      3  2 0 1  8-6  4
	Russia      2  1 1 0  6-4  3
 	Italy	    3  1 1 1  5-8  3
	----------------------------
	Austria	    2  0 0 2  2-5  0
	Switzerland 2  0 0 2  0-3  0

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54773
From: gtd597a@prism.gatech.EDU (Hrivnak)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER (***QUITE LONG***)

In article <1993Apr26.054446.29764@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> phoenix@startide.ctr.columbia.edu (Ali Lemer) writes:
>Ali "Procrastination" Lemer || "I gave [NHL Commissioner Gary Bettman] a puck
>Columbia University (NYC)   || once. He spent the rest of the day trying to 
>phoenix@ctr.columbia.edu    || open it." -- Pat Williams, GM, Orlando Magic
>***************** BE KIND TO ANIMALS...HUG A HOCKEY PLAYER! *******************

	Nice sig. Like the change. 
	BTW: Could you post the names of the people who are going to be on the
letter? I (and I'm sure others) would like to know if we are included. If I'm
not I want to be! Roger is a fool!

	
-- 
GO SKINS!    ||"Now for the next question... Does emotional music have quite
GO BRAVES!   ||   an effect on you?" - Mike Patton, Faith No More 
GO HORNETS!  ||
GO CAPITALS! ||Mike Friedman (Hrivnak fan!) Internet: gtd597a@prism.gatech.edu

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54774
From: tervio@katk.Helsinki.FI (TERVI| MARKO J)
Subject: Re: switzerland at WC93

In article <1993Apr23.113132.690@vms.huji.ac.il> hechel@vms.huji.ac.il writes:


>  does anybody know if this WC is the qualification tournement for
>the olympic games '94 in Lillehammer or are some teams already
>qualified for them.

>hopp schwiiz
>           daniel

The top 11 teams of this tournament will play in the Olympics next year.
The last team of this tournament, top two of pool B (Great Britain and 
Poland) and the winner of pool C (Latvia) will play for the last Olympic 
spot next fall.
  However, if next year's hosts Norway were to finish 12th (which would be 
no surprise), then it's the 11th team of pool A that will have to play in 
the qualification tournament.  

    Marko Tervio

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54775
From: bm562@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Richard L. Trionfo)
Subject: Re: Caps moving ?????


   Why would Pollin want to move the Caps, because I think he
owns the Cap Centre.  I know they don't sell out all of their 
games, but they draw a lot more than the Bullets.  If you
had the situation that Abe had, would you move if you were
guaranteed that anyone who went to the games would have to 
park at the stadium, because there has been nothing within
a half mile, until the recent construction in
the area.
   Can they win a game in OT again.
       Rich
-- 
  "You've read the hat, now see the movie."
                   -Imus in the morning 
  "A blurb? You're a blurb!"
                   -Seinfeld

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54776
From: nhmas@gauss.med.harvard.edu (Mark Shneyder 432-4219)
Subject: Re: BUFFALO 4, Boston 0: Defense!!

In article <BSON.93Apr22060320@nutrimat.gnu.ai.mit.edu> bson@gnu.ai.mit.edu (Jan Brittenson) writes:
>
>   Which doesn't mean much since the statistics are mostly based on
>the 5-game playoff format. But, yes, it looks dark for the B's. What a
>disappointment.

The Fat Lady is about to hit the first note...Okay,how about 3-0 deficits?
The B's chances for a comeback are now less 1%(That's based on 7-game
playoff format)...

>   Who do you think gets the start in game three? I hope it is going
>to be Blue. If the team can rally around him, maybe Moog can too.
 
He got the start but the headlines on all Boston local TV sportscats
said it all : "Sutter Blue It!". And he did.

Harry Sinden's appearance outside of B's dressing room after Game 3
was a pathetic site. He said something really retarded to cover Sutter's
behind,"This game is not about winning or losing..". Harry,check the
schedule! Your team is in the playoffs and about to go on a long summer
vacation on Sunday morning!

Harry and his buttkisser Milbury will never admit that they screwed up
in a major way when they brought in one of the dumbest people in the
business,Brian Sutter. Sutter's playoff record as the head coach in St.Louis
speaks for itself. The Blues really have a chance to advance to the
second round this year...

-PPV Mark

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54777
From: fswbl@aurora.alaska.edu
Subject: RE: Regular season 93/94 pool

THIS IS WHAT I CAME UP WITH USING THE FINAL REGULAR SEASON STATS FOR THE
92/93, WHICH YOU CAN FIND IN THE APRIL 22, 1993 EDITION OF THE USA TODAY!
TRY IT OUT AND SEE WHAT YOU COME UP WITH.....

 1. ADAM OATES           C    BRUINS     145 PTS
 2. TEEMU SELANNE       RW    JETS       136 PTS
 3. ALEXANDER MOGILNY   RW    SABRES     131 PTS
 4. PAVEL BURE          RW    CANUCKS    116 PTS
 5. VINCENT DAMPHOUSSE  LW    CANADIANS  106 PTS
 6. DAVE ANDREYCHUK     LW    MAPLELEAFS 104 PTS
 7. PHIL HOUSLEY        RD    JETS       103 PTS
 8. PAUL COFFEY         RD    REDWINGS    94 PTS
 9. SERGEI FEDOROV       C    REDWINGS    94 PTS
10. ANDY MOOG            G    BRUINS      86 PTS
11. AL INFRATE          RD    CAPITIALS   82 PTS
12. PATRICK ROY          G    CANADIANS   76 PTS
13. AL MACINNIS         LD    FLAMES      60 PTS
14. DENNIS SAVARD        C    CANADIANS   59 PTS
15. CALLE JOHANSSON     LD    CAPITALS    50 PTS
16. YURI KHMYLEV        LW    SABRES      41 PTS
17. RICHARD SMEHLIK     LD    SABRES      36 PTS
------------------------------------------------
    TOTAL POINTS                        1519 PTS

MOST VALUABLE PLAYER: ADAM OATES
ROOKIE OF THE YEAR: TEEMU SELANNE
MOST IMPROVED PLAYER: VINCENT DAMPHOUSSE
DEFENSEMAN OF THE YEAR: PHIL HOUSLEY
GOALIE OF THE YEAR: PATRICK ROY

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54778
From: LMARSHA@cms.cc.wayne.edu (Laurie Marshall)
Subject: Re: Another travesty at the Joe Louis

In article <1993Apr22.114213.3391@mtroyal.ab.ca>
caldwell8102@mtroyal.ab.ca writes:
 
>(Detroit, April 21)
>
>Most knowledgable observers once again watched in shock as the Detroit Red
>Wings again beat the best goaltender in the world six times en route to
>another easy victory over the best team in the NHL.
>
>For the best goaltender in the world, Felix Potvin, six was a bad number as
>he surrendered six goals and collected six minutes in penalties in reponse
>to the goon tactics employed by the inferior Red Wings team.
>
>                                                                Alan
>
>P.S. We told you this would happen, Roger. Didn't we? I love it.....
 
 
 
 
 
 Where is Roger anyway?  Haven't heard from him in awhile.  He must
be out on the golf course waiting for the Leafs to join him any day
now. : )
 
 
 
Laurie Marshall
Wayne State University
Detroit, Michigan
Go Wings!!!!

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54779
From: twork@egr.msu.edu (Michael Twork)
Subject: Re: Wings News and Playoff Thoughts

>roots in Detroit.  He would be a valuable asset to the Wings and Perhaps the
>Rangers could get a Zombo in return?

  
 
Wake up and smell the Norris!!  Rick Zombo was traded to the Blues for Vince
Riendo (sp?) last season.  

- Mike




Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54780
From: hallg@lead.egr.msu.edu (Gregory Hall)
Subject: Re: Wings News and Playoff Thoughts


|> As far as Cheveldae is concerned, he is a decent goalie.  The most logical
|> trade in the offseason to me would be between Detroit and NY Rangers.  I'm sure
|> if Beezer would be traded he would enjoy the opportunity to go back to his
|> roots in Detroit.  He would be a valuable asset to the Wings and Perhaps the
|> Rangers could get a Zombo in return?  Beezer got a few good years in him and
|> the opportunity to get a fresh start would energize his play.
|> 

Only problem is that Zombo was traded to St. Louis last year for goalie
Vincent Riendeau.

I think that while Chevy is not among the elite class of goalies, he is
adequate given the offensive firepower of the Wings.

Greg

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54896
From: roney@selkirk.sfu.ca (Chris J. Roney)
Subject: Re: Hey, What about teh Cannucks?

grogers@slacvx.slac.stanford.edu (Greg Rogers) writes:

>Hi all,

>Due to living in the Bay Area, I as unable to see Vancouver's victory over
>the Jets last night.  I know the score, but that rarely describes the game.
>Could someone please post a brief sonapsis (sp?) of waht happened.  How well
>did each team play?  Were the cannucks deserving of the victory?


    Well, in my opinion the Canucks played a really strong game. I was
especially pleased by a very strong game from Linden - I think he
could be a key to success for them this year.  Defensively, they
really had a strong game.  Hardly heard Selanne's name all night.
Craven also played one of his best games since coming over.  With a
few exceptions, they really didn't let the high-flying Jets do much
high-flying.  I thought the Jets defence looked overmatched by the
Canucks forwards - they will have to improve on that if they want to
make this a series.

    In short, it was a great start!

-- 
Chris Roney  (e-mail chris_roney@sfu.ca)

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54897
From: loh@fraser.sfu.ca (Keith Meng-Wei Loh)
Subject: Canucks 3-2 over Winnipeg

	The Jets gave the Canucks another run for their money in an almost
identical game to the first of the series but once again came up short as
Vancouver outscored Winnipeg 3-2.
	The pattern of the first game was repeated tonight, with the Canucks
scoring quickly and then going to sleep in the second period, only to stave
off a Jet comeback with opportune goals from their greater talent. The Jets
looked more dangerous in this one but it didn't make a difference in the 
numbers that counted: goals.
	Vancouver's big line produced again, with centre Cliff Ronning and
left winger Geoff Courtnall scoring in the first and in the second to 
boost the Canucks to a 2-0 lead on giveaways by the suspect Jet defence of
Bautin and Ulanov. Mental lapses by the defence and goal-scoring talent
in opportune areas made the difference in all three Canuck goals.
	However, as in the first game, the Jets worked hard to take the
game to the Canucks in the second period. The Jets dominated the second,
checking hard and penetrating the Vancouver zone without being challenged
by a Canuck team that wanted to pack it in early. 
	The hard work paid off late in the second, when Tie Domi caught
Vancouver goalie Kirk McLean by surprise with a sharp angle shot to make
the score 2-1. 
	Domi's goal gave the Jets new life as they began to take the rush
to the Canuck's collapsing defence. The Canucks were unwilling to do 
anything but let McLean take shots and clear the rebounds. The Jets were
allowed to set up and make plays.
	Both goalies made standup saves as the play picked up considerably.
McLean made three great saves in the second off a dancing Teammu Selanne
while Essensa was rocked by a Pavel Bure drive. Selanne looked dangerous
on the rush as the Jets pressed a series of attacks into the Canuck
zone. The Canucks, on the other hand, looked like they were offering four
checking lines in an effort to preserve their slim lead.
	A series of minor penalties at the end of the second period
resulted in a one man advantage for the Jets in the early third. The
Jet's Tempo Numminen drove a puck from the point through McLean's
legs and into the net to tie the game at 2-2.
	The Canuck's discordant play picked up where it left off.
This was characterized by long lead passes that either never connected
or were picked off by the Jets and individual rushes into a tight
Winnipeg defence that were never supported.
	However, as in the first and second Canuck goals, a Jet defensive
lapse (re: bonehead play) stalled the Winnipeg comeback. With the faceoff
in the Winnipeg zone, Pavel Bure was left to stand in the crease with
no Jet defender anywhere near him. Bure, who had been invisible in the
game up to that point, took a rebound and managed to roof it with a 
backhand even though he was off balance. 
	By then it was too late for the Jets to come back. Essensa made it
to the bench with one minute to go but the extra attacker did nothing
for their attack. Canucks 3, Winnipeg 2.
	Next game is Friday at Winnipeg with the Jets in the hole by two games.
- 30 -



Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 54900
From: hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu (Valerie S. Hammerl)
Subject: Re: NHL LETTER (***QUITE LONG***)

In article <1993Apr25.222739.16828@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca> maynard@ramsey.cs.laurentian.ca (Roger Maynard) writes:
>In <1993Apr25.214053.21752@sol.ctr.columbia.edu> phoenix@startide.ctr.columbia.edu (Ali Lemer) writes:
>
>
>>Dear Mr. Bettman -
>
(Ali's letter deleted for brevity)

>[...] (Roger's acid-laced response removed)
>Maybe we should get together and establish some kind of mandatory maturity
>level to keep some of this stuff off of the air.

Roger,
Your responses might just exclude you from sharing your opinions,
then.  You see, the same rights Ali has to mail her letter to the NHL
are the same ones that let you post replies that mow her down like
wheat at harvest-time.  She never said she represented the entire
internet or the entire group rec.sport.hockey.  She has every right to
state her opinion along with those of the fifty or sixty or
hundred-odd folk who've agreed to allow her to list their names on the
bottom of it.  You may not agree with it.  Fine.  I really don't care
enough about the name change to care.  Your name isn't attached to it,
so why moan and complain?  If you felt her words were leading, well,
you're free to feel that way and take exception, but manners never
hurt.  I personally disagree and feel her generalizations were fine
(I have the right to think and say that, too).  Ali's under no
compunction to change a single word.  Now, while you're free to
disagree with every word she wrote, to tear apart her character is
uncalled for.  I'm posting this as a form of public reprimand.  If you
tear down Ali's integrity and character publicly, you'll get chastised
publicly in return.  Would it have been so hard to say, "Ali, please
be a bit more specific in your description, the way I've read it
indicates you're stating my view also, and that's simply not true.
I'd really like to see a disclaimer noting that you don't mean the
entire internet or the entire r.s.h. group attached to it, despite
your intent to list names at the bottom.  Thanks.  Cordially as
always," &c.  Calling her a moron and an asshole just reduces the
weight of your words and the opinions of their author in the eyes of
myself, and possibly others.  

Oh, and Ali, nice to see someone standing up for something, even if
it's not something I personally advocate.  :-)







-- 
Valerie Hammerl 	       John Sr. would lift Pat over the boards, grab 
hammerl@acsu.buffalo.edu       his hand, and start running around the outside,
V085PWPZ@UBVMS.CC.BUFFALO.EDU  faster and faster.  "I wanted to learn how to 
get that feeling, and the only way was to learn how to skate."  P. LaFontaine

Newsgroup: rec.sport.hockey
Document_id: 55022
From: etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se (Staffan Axelsson)
Subject: WC: Scores and standings, April 18


 1993 World Championships in Germany:
 ====================================

	Group A standings (Munich)	Group B	standings (Dortmund)
	--------------------------	----------------------------

	           GP  W T L GF-GA P	              GP  W T L GF-GA P

	Sweden      1  1 0 0  1-0  2	Germany        1  1 0 0  6-0  2
	Italy       1  0 1 0  2-2  1 	Czech republic 1  0 1 0  1-1  1
	Russia      1  0 1 0  2-2  1	USA            1  0 1 0  1-1  1
	Canada      0  0 0 0  0-0  0	Finland        0  0 0 0  0-0  0
	Switzerland 0  0 0 0  0-0  0	France         0  0 0 0  0-0  0
	Austria     1  0 0 1  0-1  0	Norway         1  0 0 1  0-6  0

 
 April 18:  Italy - Russia    2-2           Norway - Germany      0-6
            Sweden - Austria  1-0           USA - Czech republic  1-1

 April 19:  Canada - Switzerland					15:30
            Russia - Austria                Finland - France		20:00

 April 20:  Sweden - Canada                 Czech republic - Germany	15:30
            Switzerland - Italy             Finland - USA		20:00

 April 21:                                  Germany - France		15:30
            Italy - Sweden                  Czech republic - Norway	20:00

 April 22:  Switzerland - Russia            USA - France		15:30
            Austria - Canada                Norway - Finland		20:00

 April 23:  Switzerland - Austria           Germany - Finland		20:00

 April 24:  Russia - Sweden                 Czech republic - France	15:30
            Canada - Italy                  USA - Norway		20:00

 April 25:  Sweden - Switzerland            Finland- Czech republic  	15:30
            Russia - Canada                 Germany - USA		20:00

 April 26:  Austria - Italy                 France - Norway		20:00

 
 PLAYOFFS:
 =========

 April 27:	Quarterfinals
		A #2 - B #3						15:30
		A #3 - B #2						20:00

 April 28:	Quarterfinals
		A #1 - B #4						15:30
		A #4 - B #1						20:00

 April 29:	Relegation
		A #5 - B #6						15:30
		A #6 - B #5						20:00

 April 30:	Semifinals
		A #1/B #4 - A #3/B #2					15:30
		A #4/B #1 - A #2/B #3					20:00

 May 1:		Relegation						14:30
		Bronze medal game 					19:00

 May 2:		FINAL							15:00

--
 ((\\  //| Staffan Axelsson            
  \\  //|| etxonss@ufsa.ericsson.se    
\\_))//-|| r.s.h. contact for Swedish hockey  

